The HPforGrownups Humongous Bigfile

The Humongous Bigfile: all you need to know about HPforGrownups

VERSION 1.3.5 -- 29 May 03

* * *

Enter stranger and take heed
Of information that you'll need.
For those who wish our trust to earn
Must take the time to read and learn.
And if you're prone to flames and flaws
You must regard our tips and laws
Friend, you can be sure, below,
Of finding all you yearn to know.

* * *

"And there'll be little flags on the hoods, with HB on them -"
"- for Humongous Bighead," said Fred.
Everyone except Percy and Mrs. Weasley snorted into their pudding.
--Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban

1. INTRODUCTION [GO]
1.1 Welcome Message [GO]
1.2 Getting Started: Finding Your Way Around HPFGU [GO]
1.3 How to Receive Messages [GO]
1.4 Default settings and spam [GO]
1.5 Legal issues [GO]
1.6 List Administration [GO]
1.7 On-list Messages from the HPFGU List Administrators [GO]
1.8 Off-list messages to individuals from the HPFGU List Administrators [GO]
1.9 List Discipline [GO]
1.10 What not to do in your first post [GO]
1.11 How to get help [GO]

2. GENERAL COURTESY, "NETIQUETTE" AND HPFGU-SPECIFIC CONVENTIONS/POLICIES [GO]
2.1 General behaviour notes so you don't look like a Death Eater [GO]
2.2 Use the right list for the right kind of post (OT posting) [GO]
2.3 Proper Subject Headers [GO]
2.4 Quoting and snipping extraneous material from quoted replies [GO]
2.5 Subject-specific Prefixes for certain topics [GO]
2.6 Combining multiple short posts [GO]
2.7 Distinguish opinion & fact; If stating canon fact, give references [GO]
2.8 Banned Topics [GO]
2.9 Spelling, Punctuation and Grammar (and Proofreading!) [GO]

3. HOW TO PARTICIPATE FULLY IN HPFGU [GO]
3.1 HPFGU-OTChatter, our off-topic and chat list [GO]
3.2 Regional HPFGU groups [GO]
3.3 Weekly Sunday Chat [GO]
3.4 HPFGU Contests [GO]
3.5 Ongoing Polls [GO]

4. COMMON ABBREVIATIONS & SHORTHAND [GO]
4.1 General internet [GO]
4.2 HP fandom-specific [GO]
4.3 Fanfiction-specific [GO]
4.4 HPFGU-specific [GO]

5. VERY FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS (VFAQ) [GO]

6. GROUP RESOURCES, FILES AND ARCHIVES [GO]
6.1 The Files Section [GO]
6.2 The Archives Group [GO]
6.3 HPFGU's accumulated wisdom: Fantastic Posts and where to Find Them [GO]

7. OTHER AREAS OF ONLINE HARRY POTTER FANDOM [GO]
7.1 The HP Lexicon [GO]
7.2 Other Grownup YahooGroups [GO]
7.3 Websites [GO]
7.4 Fanfiction Websites [GO]
7.5 Fanfiction YahooGroups [GO]

8. ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS [GO]

_______________________THE HUMONGOUS BIGFILE_______________________

1. INTRODUCTION

1.1 Welcome Message

* * *

We expect that you will fully understand the beauty of the softly humming computer with its shimmering screen, the delicate power of energy that can creep through human nerves, bewitching the mind, ensnaring the senses... we can teach you how to bottle words, brew theories, even stopper boredom...

* * *

Welcome to Harry Potter (HP) for Grownups, also known as HPFGU and HP4GU, a mailing list-based community hosted by Yahoo!Groups. Before you jump on your Firebolt and owl us your burning questions, amazing new discoveries and incipient morsels of wisdom, we highly recommend (actually, we require) that you read this document, which answers almost every question about HPforGrownups you might have. Yep, it's a few pages long, but you've probably read over 1400 pages of Harry Potter, as well as sat through two and a half hours of movie. This is much more worthwhile! (Kidding, folks...) You can go straight from the Table of Contents to each individual item by clicking on the underlined [GO] to the right of the item -- this will only move you around within this document. All external URLs (i.e. http://www.hpfgu.org.uk/) are hyperlinked in full.

HPFGU members are a diverse group of adults who love in-depth, thought-provoking and fun discussions of the Harry Potter books (and the movies, merchandising and other aspects of the HP phenomenon). While there is no age requirement to join the group, you should note that most of our members are over 18. Mature teenagers may enjoy the group, but we cannot, for legal reasons, accept members under the age of 13. Remember -- our members are parents, teachers, professionals, businesspeople, academics and people from many countries, some of whom speak English as a second or third language, making it imperative that all members use correct English (see below [GO] for spelling, punctuation and grammar guidelines, as well as [GO] acceptable internet abbreviations like BTW, IIRC, etc.). We are a large group (over 3000 members), and we usually post between 50 and 150 messages a day.

We think that the discussion here is of a higher quality than you'd find on other Harry Potter lists. We *know* we have more rules than others. This is not a coincidence. The reason HPFGU has survived without degrading into meaningless drivel and the reason that the older members stick around without getting tired of the repetition is because we have these rules to keep the list running smoothly. They are for everyone's benefit -- if you don't appreciate that now, you'll come to appreciate it soon.

The ever-increasing popularity of Harry Potter among children and grownups alike means that we expect our membership to continue to grow as anticipation of future books and movies mounts.

To ensure that new members adjust quickly to our rules, and to prevent the possible embarrassment of violating a list rule in their very first post, posts from all new HPFGU members must be approved by a List Administrator (either a List Elf or List Poltergeist (See 1.6, "List Administration" for a list of them) before being released to the list at large. This approval or rejection process is accomplished very quickly as we have a large number of people approving and rejecting messages. When a post is rejected, Yahoo sends it back to the author for revision in accordance with our list rules. This system of Moderated Status has been a resounding success, and has kept our standards high and list volume manageable. The feedback we receive about this system from our members, new and old, is overwhelmingly positive.

We encourage all of our new members to keep an eye on the email accounts they used to register with HPFGU, as this is where you will receive notification of any problems concerning any of your posts. Also, remember that if your post does not appear right away, you should give it time, then check your email account. Do not simply keep sending your message over and over.

Please note that our other lists, HPFGU-Movie, -OTChatter and -Announcements, do not have this introductory period, though all messages to HPFGU-Announcements must be approved as it is a Moderated List.

Please understand that this policy is by no means designed to discourage our new members from participating in our group. Each new member brings his or her unique point of view to the community, and it is this diversity of perspective, experience and personality that keeps the list exciting, interesting and fresh. We hope all of you will offer your insights and contribute to our discussions.

1.2 Getting Started: Finding Your Way Around HPFGU

HPforGrownups is a YahooGroup-based community. Yahoo! Groups was formed when Yahoo took over eGroups in March 2001, and is a mailing list service -- but with a twist. Unlike traditional listserves, you can read YahooGroups messages on the web as well.

HPFGU has four main groups -- HPforGrownups (the "Main List") is for book-related discussion only; HPFGU-Movie, for all things movie-related; HPFGU-Announcements for announcements of new sites, merchandise, etc.; and HPFGU-OTChatter for off-topic discussion of just about anything.

We also have the HPFGU-Convention list, which is planning our first conference, various regional groups such as HPFGU-NewYork, HPFGU-London, HPFGU-Germany, HP4GU-GreatLakes, HP4GU-Florida and many others. HPforGrownups-Chatscripts contains the transcripts of some of our older Sunday Chat sessions plus chat instructions, and HPforGrownups-Archives contains the searchable archived messages prior to our move to eGroups (YahooGroups' predecessor). All these groups can be found through the HPFGU homepage, at http://www.hpfgu.org.uk/.

You'll note that some of the groups have "HPFGU-" at the front, while others have "HP4GU-" or even "HPforGrownups-". We're sorry -- they were created by a variety of people and are not standardised. Oops. Our bad.

Links to these groups can be found at the group's homepage, http://www.hpfgu.org.uk/.

1.3 How to Receive Messages

You can read group messages in several different ways.

A) By email: messages are sent to your inbox and the subjects are prefixed "[HPforGrownups]" (or [HPFGU-OTChatter] for OTChatter, etc.). You can probably sort them into folders if you're using a decent email application which supports this function -- notably, AOL Mail does not. You hit "reply" or send email to "HPforGrownups@yahoogroups.com" to post. Remember, we often generate more than 100 mails a day. Be warned!

B) Digest: you can also opt to receive digests of list discussion. Each digest is a long email containing 25 posts. The subject heading of each digest email will be something like "Digest Number 432134." Replying to something contained in a digest email is identical to replying to a regular email, except that you MUST change the subject heading from "Digest Number 432134" to "Lupin's underwear" (or whatever), or you will receive bubotuber pus through your email.

C) Web View: many people like to read the messages on the individual list websites. This has the advantage of not clogging up your inbox, but the disadvantage that you can't download all the posts and then go off-line to read them. You go to "Messages" on each individual site and read them from there. It's fairly self-explanatory. However, if you are *particularly* irritated by pop-up and banner advertising, text-only email might be better for you.

D) Special Announcements: This is like webview, except with the advantage that we can send emergency emails to your mailbox. Actually, the List Administrators prefer that people are on "Special Announcements", and will sometimes work their way through the list, turning people from Web View to Special Announcements. The List Administrators will use the Special Announcements feature responsibly. We will only send messages as Special Announcements in the case of critically important ADMIN messages. Examples of this would be if a flame war erupts on the list, if we receive a cease-and-desist order from Warner Bros., Yahoo or someone else and have to move the group, or in a similar emergency.

E) A Quick Note About Posts Disappearing Into The Ether: Please note that sometimes posts sent to the lists disappear into the ether. We call these posts "Eaten By Yahoomort". If your post does not appear within 24 hours (and, if you are on Moderated Status, if you do not receive a note to edit it) please re-send it. Unfortunately, at this time, there is no way to retrieve a post sent from webview that has been Eaten By Yahoomort. Sorry. *burp/cackle*

F) Bouncing Ferrets/Members: If you suddenly stop getting email from the lists, and/or you receive an unsubscription message from YahooGroups, you may be "bouncing", which here means "email being sent to your account is being returned to sender". Apart from yelling at your email provider, the only thing you can do is to email the List Administrators at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/Admin%20Files/mods@hpfgu.org.uk and ask them to send out an automated reactivation message for your Yahoo account.

1.4 Default settings and spam

The default setting on YahooGroups allows people to add you to their groups without your permission. This is being abused by owners of lists of disrepute, if you catch our meaning. To change this setting:

1) Go to http://groups.yahoo.com/myprefs

2) Click on the [Email Preferences] box, which is roughly in the middle of the page (if this doesn't show up as a link, you're already there). Click "Options" (far-right), and then uncheck the top box. You can uncheck the bottom box as well, but then you'll never get any group invitations and people will be unable to invite you to groups if you're having difficulty adding yourself.

If you have any questions, feel free to email the List Administrators directly at HPforGrownups-Owner@yahoogroups.com -- Yahoo Support is not the most accessible or responsive of support areas.

1.5 Legal Issues

By posting on any of the HPFGU lists, you agree to adhere to the Yahoo Terms of Use located at http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/. As part of that agreement, you grant Yahoo certain licenses as regards your posts. Further, in so posting, you also grant the HPFGU LIst Administrators the license to use, distribute, reproduce, modify, adapt and publicly display such post(s) for the purposes of providing and promoting the various HP4GU groups and sites.

It is a violation of U.S. law and the Yahoo TOU (http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/) to upload, post, email, transmit or otherwise make available any Content that infringes any patent, trademark, trade secret, copyright or other proprietary rights ("Rights") of any party; The HPFGU List Administrators have determined that links to electronic texts (etexts) of any Harry Potter book and any file containing the audio versions of the books or the movie(s) may violate the Yahoo TOU, and have banned uploading or posting any such links on all HPFGU lists; any individual who posts such a link (without prior permission from the List Administration, at hpforgrownups-owner@yahoogroups.com) will be placed on moderated status on the list where the link is posted. Further, any post which contains substantial portions of any article or book is likewise banned; links to any article, picture, book or journal are permitted.

If you have any questions, please contact the List Administrators at hpforgrownups-owner@yahoogroups.com.

1.6 List Administration

List Administration is now handled by a team of about thirty elves and poltergeists, who are listed as "moderators" in the Members section of this list. Go HERE to see the list, or, here they are with their snazzy titles:

Ali Hewison (Merry Elf), Amanda (Amandageist), Amy Z (Amygeist, ex-moderator), Barb Purdom (Babsgeist), Carole Estes (Carolegeist), David Frankis (Davey Elf), Debbie Duncan (Debby Elf), Dicentra Spectabilis (Dicey Elf), Elkins (Elkigeist, ex-moderator), Eloise Herisson (Weezy Elf), Gwendolyn Grace (Gwenny Elf), Heidi Tandy (Heidy Elf, currently on maternity leave), Jen Faulkner (Jenny Elf), Jim Ferer (ex-Jimmy Elf), Joy (ex-Joysie Elf and Help Desk Diva), Joywitch (Curmudgeon), Judy Shapiro (Judey Elf), Kelley Thompson (Kelley Elf, ex-moderator), Kimberly Moon (Moony Elf), Luke (Lukey Elf), Marina Frants (Filky Elf), Mary Ann (Dizzy Elf, Assistant Birthday Elf), Michelle Apostolides (ex-Shelly Elf), Mike Grey (Aberforth's Goat), Paul Kippes (technoGeist), Pip Downs (Pippy Elf), Pippin (Peppy Elf), Porphyria (Ashey Elf, on sabbatical), Saitaina (Saity Elf), Sheryll (Rylly Elf, The Birthday Elf), Simon (ex-Simey Elf, Dr. Branford), Steve Vander Ark (Keeper of the Lexicon), and Tabouli (Tooly Elf).

In the past, this team was divided into three subgroups – list elves, poltergeists, and a small subgroup called, confusingly enough, Moderators. Most of you have met at least one list elf – these are the folks who welcome you to the list, answer your questions, check the messages submitted by the moderated members, etc. Poltergeists perform various technical or administrative tasks, like throwing water balloons and sticking gum into keyholes. The Moderators were a small subgroup of the administrative team who made all the overall policy decisions. However, we have recently come to the collective realization that this sort of hierarchical structure is simply not viable. Following a lengthy discussion and self-evaluation of the entire administrative structure, the Moderator subgroup has been disbanded. Their responsibilities are now shared across the entire team, which is working on reorganizing the administrative infrastructure of the HPfGU community.

In addition, two of of our geists and one of our elves have also chosen to step down from the team. We raise our goblets to the tremendous contributions made by all of these former list administrators: John (queerasjohn), Catherine (catorman), Ebony (selah_1977, Ebby Elf), Jen P (jenp_97, a geist), Jenny (jenny_ravenclaw, also a geist), Parker (harpdreamer), Jim Flanagan (jamesf991), Neil (FlyingFordAnglia), Cindy (cindysphynx), and most especially to our Founding Mother, Penny Linsenmayer (plinsenmayer).

All of the elves and poltergeists are approachable and welcome comments, questions, and chocolate. You can contact the Elves and Geists together at hpforgrownups-owner@yahoogroups.com.

1.7 On-list Messages from the HPFGU List Administrators

1) ADMIN messages are issued from the List Administration Team. They always have the prefix "ADMIN" in the subject line. ADMINs must be obeyed. When the List Administrators say in an ADMIN that something is off-topic, a banned topic, or should be on another list, listen to them. As stated above, the rules are the foundations on which HPFGU is built and abiding by them allows everyone to concentrate on the real reason we're here: our love for the books.

Members should not query an ADMIN message on-list. HPFGU, like many communities, discourages making community policy in a public forum as this tends to be divisive. If you have a question, comment, complaint or criticism of an ADMIN message or any policy, please contact the Elves and Geists at HPforGrownups-owner@yahoogroups.com.

"Water balloons" are informal communications from Geists which are *not* individually approved by the List Administrators and should therefore not be deemed "official communications". Geists throw these when they feel that an unofficial note would be more appropriate than an official elf note or Howler. Situations where this would occur include when a member does something not technically in violation of the letter of list rules, but contradictory to their spirit, or where the Geist can see that someone is heading down a road which could lead to an on-list gaffe. Think of them as admonishments from a kindly grandmother or a quick tap on the shoulder and whisper in the ear from a good friend.

Remember that Elves and Poltergeists are also list members themselves, and can and do post on list threads of interest to them. When they are speaking as themselves and not in an official capacity, their theories and threads are fair game for debate. When they are speaking for themselves, they will usually sign off with their own name and not "For the HPFGU Administrative Team." 1.8 Off-list messages to individuals from Elves and Geists

Most times when a rule is broken, the perpetrator of the heinous crime will receive an off-list personal email from a member of the HPFGU staff. Here are the different types of personal messages you may get from the Elves and Geists.

1) Howlers are issued by one member of the team on behalf of the entire team. They are formal official reprimands to a list member when policy has been broken or disregarded. They are sent offlist.

2) "Elf notes" are sent offlist by List Elves, and are not as severe or as formal as Howlers. These are used in situations where the policy infraction was neither glaring nor dangerous, and a Howler would have been excessive.

3) As above, an off-list water balloon is not a formal communication of list policy; it is *not* the same as a Howler. But, like any piece of advice, it's a good idea to heed it. 1.9 List Discipline

We have a fairly simple policy of list discipline. If you violate one of our list rules, you will probably get a polite reminder, unless there has been an ADMIN message about that on the same day, in which case you may get a Howler. Common mistakes include:
* Subject: "Digest Number 263"
* Subject: "Snape's Cape" if it's actually about Hermione's teeth
* Sending multiple short replies (in which case you will be asked to combine your messages)
* Purely introductory messages ("Hi, my name is MonoMione and I'm new here!")
* Asking a question which is in the VFAQ ([GO]), like "When is the next book coming out?".
* Asking if we know when Book 5 is coming out. The answer is "no". Trust us, when it's announced, you'll *know*. So will the VFAQ [GO].
* Posting OT messages to the main list.

If you persist in your naughtiness, and you are not in the introductory Moderated Status period, you may be placed on Moderated Status. This means that all of your posts must be approved by the List Administrators before they are released to the list. This works through a semi-automated Yahoo process. You will be notified if you are placed on Moderated Status. Once on Moderated Status, you can get off it again if you post for a reasonable length of time in a consistent, considerate manner, following the list rules.

Immediate Howlers and/or Moderated Status can be achieved by sending spam to the lists, being particularly abusive or doing anything which could be construed as "illegal". If you accidentally or unknowingly send viruses to the list, we will place you on Moderated Status until you have the problem under control, and will attempt to contact you about the virus.

1.10 What not to do in your first post

In your first post, you should keep in mind the following things:

* Never, ever, *ever* send a solely introductory post to the main list. (We really mean this.) These are OT and, as such, should go to OTChatter. If one person jumps in with a "Hey, I'm Hermione2164 and I'm from Wisconsin!", it will (trust us, we've seen it) descend into "Hey, Hermione2164, my cousin Phyllida lives in Madison, do you know her?" and equal OTness and e-Howlers start to fly. However, you are welcome to tack a small "Hi, I'm Hermione2164 and I'm new! Love this group!" or something similar onto the bottom of a more substantial post.

We really do want to get to know you. Heck, we'd love to meet up with you somewhere. But we want to do the getting-to-know you over on OTChatter and leave the main list free for book discussion.

* Do not ask a straightforward and obvious canon question like "What is the name of Harry's fat cousin?" (the term "canon" refers to anything published by J.K. Rowling, and to a slightly lesser extent online chats or other sources where JKR has publicly stated something). Our members like to discuss interesting and thought-provoking ideas about canon, not serve as research assistants. Please consult your copies of the books for easy answers. If your books were accidentally used as kindling at the local book-burning festival, consult the HP Lexicon, (http://www.i2k.com/~svderark/lexicon). The search box in the back messages section (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hpforgrownups/messages) can also be helpful as another new member may have asked a similar question. Also, the VFAQ has many commonly-answered questions (http://www.hpfgu.org.uk/vfaq).

If you still can't find the answer, please ask your List Elf. If s/he doesn't know the answer, go ahead and ask on-list. Please request that replies be sent to you privately off-list, however, as lots of us love to answer people's factual questions but very few of us like to read the other 499 answers which would make the list look like this:

Message 42345
"Dudley."

Message 42346
"His name is Dudley."

Message 42350
"Dudley."

Message 42351
"Dudley. Oops, I'd better not write a one-liner or the Elves and Geists will come
and turn me into a toad. Well, it's two lines now. Hahahahaha!"

Message 42355
"Dudley."

Message 42356
"Dudley, aka Diddydums, aka A Pig in a Wig."

Message 42358
"Petunia."

Message 42359
"Dudley."

Message 42361
"Harry's fat cousin is named Dudley."

Message 42362
"Dudley, you twit. Haven't you even read the books?"

* HPFGU has been around for several years. We have analysed almost every aspect of every book. That means that, yes, we noticed the gleam in Dumbledore's eye at the end of GoF, and yes, we know JKR said that Mrs Figg who looked after Harry is Arabella Figg from the end of GoF. The VFAQ (Very Frequently Asked Questions file [GO]) deals with many of these incontrovertibly-answered questions, and if you ask them again, people and even goats may respond with funny, snide posts which may embarrass you.

That said, we encourage people to bring up questions which have been discussed in the past. For substantive questions where there is no really incontrovertible evidence ("I think Harry is right for Hermione and not Ron, and here's why" or "I think there can only be 200 students at Hogwarts"), you should post to the list ONLY after reading the VFAQ [GO] and our substantive Fantastic Posts and Where To Find Them [GO] documents on the topic concerned.

* Always sign your post at the bottom, even if it is with a pseudonym or pen-name, so people know whom they are quoting.

* Please don't be offended if your post is returned to you for editing. This is quite normal, as we realise that there are many rules to keep in mind. Similarly, your post may be approved but a Mod may add a "Mod Note" at the bottom. This doesn't mean it's a Bad Post -- just that the Mod wanted to make a note of something (like "An older thread on this can be found starting at message number 346343" or "Though this post is on-topic, please remember when replying that OT subject matter should be sent to HPFGU-OTChatter").

1.11 How to get help

Simple. Email your personal List Elf, who will have contacted you within a couple of days after you joined. If you're an older member or you somehow slipped through the cracks, email us to request an Elf. The Mods and Elves can be reached at HPforGrownups-Owner@yahoogroups.com.

Please, *use* these resources. The List Elves love getting mail. Contact them with *anything* you're not sure about. Technical problems. Book questions. Legal issues. If they don't know, they can find out for you. Really, email us!

2. GENERAL COURTESY, "NETIQUETTE" AND HPFGU-SPECIFIC CONVENTIONS/POLICIES

HPFGU is a community of adults. Keep this in mind and you'll see that our rules make sense. We observe common netiquette, but also have a few quirks that we think make our community particularly worthwhile. If you want to be a valued member of the community, you'll need to observe them.

2.1 General behaviour notes so you don't look like a Death Eater

This should be obvious: no flaming, no obscenity, no defamation, no netspeak (using "2" for "to", "4" for "for", etc.) no doing anything illegal. This includes copyright violations such as posting (or posting a link to) the text of the books, claiming someone else's work as your own, etc. If in doubt, *ask* the List Administrators.

If you disagree with someone's message, no matter how strongly, remember to respect the other person's right to his or her own opinion. If you do wish to argue against the post, do so gently, by building up your own case, rather than just knocking down the other person's. And never attack your fellow group members (name calling, personal remarks, etc). The List Administrators will have to step in and call a halt to the whole thread.

2.2 Use the right list for the right kind of post (OT posting)

We have four main lists. Each of them is for a different kind of post:

1) HPforGrownups: the book-discussion ONLY list.
2) HPFGU-Movie: for any movie discussion, even if comparing it to the books.
3) HPFGU-Announcements: for announcements of new sites, merchandise, et al.
4) HPFGU-OTChatter: for off-topic and all other posts.

There are quite a few other subsidiary lists, like regional lists, the HPFGU-Convention list, the Archives list and others, which can be found at the HPFGU home page, http://www.hpfgu.org.uk/.

Please note that HPforGrownups is not affiliated in any way with the "Harry Potter for Grownups" YahooGroup.

2.3 Proper Subject Headers

We are a high-volume list. It is imperative that people are able to skim through topics, choosing what they want to read and what they want to skip. Therefore, all posts to all lists must have accurate, descriptive subject headers.

Sometimes a thread will veer away from its original subject -- a conversation about Harry's eyes and their significance could easily move on to how important Lily will be in the series. So, change the subject line:

Original thread: "Harry's green eyes"
New thread: "Lily's importance (was: Harry's green eyes)".

This way, everyone can follow the threading pattern and move threads with you.

2.4 Quoting and snipping extraneous material from quoted replies

Another result of being a high-volume list is that sometimes it's hard to figure out which message people are replying to unless they quote a bit of it above their own comments. See the example below (note that you don't have to type "From, Subject, Message" in the body of your message, and that points of interest are numbered in [square brackets]):

________________________
From: Vevelia Experienced-Listie
Subject: Harry's eyes
Message:

Anal P. Lardbottom said, [1]

> Harry's eyes are irrelevant. They are, after all, only eyes.
> Let's not forget that JKR said, in the 13 Dec Scholastic Chat,
> that there was no significance in them. [2]

I agree. Harry's eyes have *nothing* to do with the plot, and are, in fact, a sign that he is a troll. I base this on GoF, chapter 65, where Hagrid says "'Arry, your eyes is like a troll's." (Ch. 64, p. 813, US hardback ed.) [3]

Anal also said, [4]

> Another example of this is in PoA Chapter 47, where Snape tells
> Harry that "green is the colour of Slytherin, Potter." I think this means
> that Harry is going to have to deal with the Slytherins before long.

I agree to an extent. Since the Slytherins are supposed to be all evil anyway, though, I don't think his eyes have much to do with this. Just my two knuts.

Dirk Hardslab said (paraphrase), [5]

[Harry's eyes are irrelevant -- see 13 Dec Scholastic chat]

I agree. In fact, this is a particularly strong argument because not only is it in canon (despite Hagrid's questionable reliability as a source) but in a chat as well.

~ Vevelia Experienced-Listie [6]
________________________

Notes:
[1] See how Vevelia handily shows that the post she is replying to is Anal's.
[2] Note her use of those pointy brackets (the > marks) at the beginning of each line to signify quoted text. Some email programs also use <<quoted material>> or "quoted material".
[3] Vevelia has kindly referenced a chapter and page number. While this is not always necessary, it is often useful and good form.
[4] Showing that she's still responding to Anal's post
[5] Since Vevelia is paraphrasing, Dirk has probably been excessively wordy, and Vevelia could find no other way to concisely quote Dirk's message. Note also how she has shown that she's now replying to Dirk's post.
[6] It's always good form to sign your messages with your name or pseudonym.

Remember -- do NOT leave the entire message you are replying to as quoted material. This is likely to get you hit with an Avada Kedavra.

2.5 Subject-specific Prefixes for certain topics

Because many members wish to skip certain types of discussion or material entirely, we have four subject-specific prefixes, which are placed in front of the subject of a message. They are:

SHIP: (relation)shipping material, which deals with romantic relationships between the characters. You may only discuss SHIPs on the main list if you are using canon to support your arguments. If you want to say "I hope Harry and Ginny get together in the end," you should post this on OTChatter.

FF: Fan Fiction (fanfic), stories written by fans in the HP universe. Discrete quotes, plotline summaries or other references from fanfic may be used to support a canon point on the main list, with a FF: prefix, provided the post otherwise complies with our posting rules. Discussion of fan fiction as a concept (relationship to canon, legality and so forth) in relation to HP is also permitted on the main list, with the FF: prefix, but note that discussion of fanfic in general or of particular fan fiction stories should go to OTChatter (or, preferably, an appropriate non-HPFGU fan fiction list or site [GO]).

TBAY: Theory Bay (TBAY) is a presentation style for canon-based posts using fictionalized settings or extended metaphors. Such messages must remain on the whole rooted in canon and must be marked with the TBAY prefix. It's all explained in detail in the Hypothetic Alley document ( http://www.hpfgu.org.uk/faq/hypotheticalley.html) and in an administrative message (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/41876).

FILK: A filk is a humorous set of words (canon-related) set to a well-known (we hope!) song. They are allowed on the main list, and examples abound at the HP Filks homepage, run by group member Caius Marcius. http://home.att.net/~coriolan/hpfilks.htm

So, some possible subjects could read:

SHIP: Canon justifications for L/S
FF: Redeemable Draco of Fanfic: Why it works in Canon
TBAY: George and LOLLIPOPS
FILK: It's a Jolly Holiday With Harry

See the "Common Abbreviations & Shorthand" section for a full explanation of fandom terminology. [GO]

2.6 Combining multiple short posts

In order to keep post numbers down, please combine several shorter messages into one larger one. Obviously, the subject line will have to change, so you may end up with something like:

"[HPforGrownups] SHIP: N/P forever! - Hagrid's coat - McGonagall's bra - The importance of goats in HP"

This is just fine -- but remember, if you're replying to only one of the topics contained in such a post, you should make sure the subject reflects that!

2.7 Distinguish opinion & fact; If stating canon fact, give references

It's very important to distinguish between your own opinions and canon fact. For instance, "Bagman is *such* a Death Eater", stated in a factual manner, appears like it is actually said somewhere in the books or by JKR somewhere, when in fact it's just an opinion.

If you are stating fact from the canon or from an interview, you should say where it is from -- something as simple as "GoF, chapter 15" or a URL to an interview.

We also very much encourage people to "speak from the I" when stating their opinions. This means that you should use phrases like "I think", "I feel", "I believe" rather than making outright statements. For example, instead of writing "Draco will be a Death Eater", write "I feel that Draco's background and actions so far in canon show that he is likely to become a Death Eater". This not only encourages people to challenge others' opinions rather than the person themself, but also makes people remember that there is a real live person sitting behind that computer screen and email address.

2.8 Banned Topics

Certain topics just have something about them that stirs up the blood of many on our lists. Muggle politics is one of them, and is frequently reached by talking about Wizard politics. Parallels are fine (Ministries, Departments, etc.) but comparisons of, say, Ann Widdecombe/Laura Bush/Hillary Clinton/Clare Short and Voldemort are not permitted. Discussions about the Holocaust often arise from discussions about Voldemort's reign of terror. Discussion of historical parallels is perfectly fine, including historical parallels to WWII in the HP series, but please avoid discussion of the Holocaust alone and specifically. Similarly, talking about religion is often a flashpoint -- particularly Richard Abanes' book "Harry Potter and the Bible" (discussion of which is banned on HPFGU). Book-banning is of course on-topic, as are discussions about religion as it pertains to HP canon, but just be careful. Avoid blanket statements like "Christians believe"/"Pagans believe"/"Witches believe"/"HP fans believe". It's simply not fair or accurate to generalise about groups like that, and it's inevitable that the List Administrators will have to step in and call a halt to it.

If you have a question based on some of these topics, please contact the List Administration or your personal List Elf, ideally before sending your question or comment to the lists -- HPforGrownups-Owner@yahoogroups.com contacts all List Elves and Geists, so please feel free to use that address.

2.9 Spelling, Punctuation and Grammar (and Proofreading!)

This is the section where we sound like a bunch of compulsive, boring English teachers. Ha. We're not -- some of us have even been known to misspell a word every now and again. However, please write in an adult style. Bear in mind that HPFGU members come from many countries, and some speak English as a second or third language, making it imperative that all members use correct English.

This includes using capital letters at the beginning of sentences, periods at the end, and commas in the middle to show phrasing. Question marks end questions, don't they? Oh, and please restrain yourself from using too many exclamation marks. They make you look overly-excitable. And there's NEVER a need for more than one exclamation mark at the end of a sentence. "!!!!!!!" will get you smacked very hard by a large broomstick.

* Never use all lower case letters or, worse still, all CAPITAL LETTERS. It is a major no-no, visually jarring and using all caps is considered SHOUTING!

* There are several conventions to give emphasis to your words. Some people LIKE to capitalise the odd word, some *far* prefer asterisks, others _much_ prefer underlining (bear in mind some people use underlines for _Book_Titles_). It's entirely up to you.

* NEVER, EVER, *EVER* use netspeak. Some common abbreviations (see below [GO]) are fine (the BTW, IIRC, AFAIK type) but using numbers for words ("2" for "to", "4" for "for", "l8r" for later) and single letters for words ("u" for "you", "r" for "are", "b" for "be") are not. They make you look exceedingly juvenile. Don't do it.

* Spell characters' names correctly. It's "Hermione" not "Hermoine", "McGonagall" not "McGonagal" or "McGongle" or anything else. Nothing (apart from netspeak) makes you look sillier faster than repeatedly misspelling characters' names.

* On a similar theme, feel free to abbreviate long names to a single letter (i.e. HRH or HHR for Harry, Hermione and Ron, or SS for Severus Snape) but make sure we can guess from the context whether your D stands for Dumbledore or Draco, etc. Unless you mean to be derogatory about the characters, please don't use "Dumble", "D'dore" or "Voldy"...some people believe that they can look silly and juvenile if used in an otherwise serious post.

* If you're used to forums where speed is important (chat rooms, role playing games, etc.), it's easy to fall out of the habit of proofreading. Here, however, your post will be as relevant in five minutes (or, usually, even in five hours) as it is now.

* Please write with paragraphs, separating each of them with an empty line (like this section). This "white space" makes it so much easier on the eyes, as it is exceedingly straining to read long blocks of unbroken text. However, please do not include large amounts of unbroken white space at the top of your emails -- this wastes time and bandwidth for everyone.

* Consider how your post will be viewed by others. Is the tone of the post angry -- or could it be perceived that way by others? Bear in mind that sarcasm is *extremely* difficult to convey in a text-based medium like email. If you are at all dubious about the tone of your post, leave it overnight and come back to it in the morning.

Before hitting the 'send' button, please take a few minutes to look over your post and correct any typos, spelling/punctuation errors, or problems with sentence structure or capitalization. This will make it much easier to read and help in getting across your point. An automated spell checker might be of assistance to some people; while this catches some errors, it will not catch the difference between "form" and "from", "walking" and "waking", etc.

If you have a disability which makes either formatting or posting difficult for you, we have a volunteer Disability Team who are happy to help work out the best and easiest way for you to participate in our community. If you think you could benefit from their help, please contact them via the List Administration at hpforgrownups-owner@yahoogroups.com.

3. HOW TO PARTICIPATE FULLY IN HPFGU

HPforGrownups really *is* a fully-fledged community of users. Many of us have even met up in real life! We find a wonderful sense of community in our members, and here's how to join it in force:

3.1 HPFGU-OTChatter, our off-topic and chat list

When OTChatter was created, there were almost as many OT posts going to the main list as there were actual book discussion posts. Hence, OTChatter, the off-topic and fandom list, was born. It's for talking about *anything* (be wary of banned or controversial topics above, though -- [GO] to a list of them), from the Lord of the Rings to ill relatives to car crashes to food and drink. It is almost as high-volume as the main list, though, so make sure you are prepared for the email onslaught :)

3.2 Regional HPFGU groups

We have various regional groups such as HPFGU-NewYork, HPFGU-London, HP4GU-GreatLakes, HP4GU-Florida and many others. Check the List of Regional Groups for a complete list (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/links/Regional_HPfGU_Lists_000999973547/)

3.3 Weekly Sunday Chat

We have a weekly chat on Sundays from roughly 2pm US Eastern (7pm GMT, 11am Left Coast).

To get to the party, go to any Yahoo Chat Room (for example the one on our main list), then type "/join hp:1" (without the quotation marks).

You can also use CheetaChat (for PCs) or miChat (for Macs). Upgrades for these programs can be found here.

3.4 HPFGU Contests

Keep an eye out for list announcements from Joywitch about our regular quizzes and contests. You can view past Contests (Logic Puzzles, Crosswords, etc.) by going to the Contest Page. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/HP4GU%20Contest
Please remember that all contest entries *must* be sent to http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/Admin%20Files/HPSmarty@aol.com and not posted to the list.

3.5 Ongoing Polls

We almost always have member polls in progress, so please take a look at the Polls section on both the Main List and OTChatter:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/polls
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-OTChatter/polls

4. COMMON ABBREVIATIONS & SHORTHAND

4.1 General internet

BTW: By the way

LOL: Laughing out loud

ROFL: Rolling on the floor laughing

ROFLMAO: Rolling on the floor laughing my ass off

LMAO: Laughing my ass off

IMO: In my opinion

IMHO: In my humble opinion

IMNSHO: In my not so humble opinion

AFAIK: As far as I know

JK or J/K: Just kidding

IIRC: If I recall correctly

OTOH: On the other hand

FILK: Song parodies using words/scenes from HP's world

PoV or POV: Point of view

{g}: Grin (note: the curly brackets shown here are often replaced with triangular ones or ::double colons::)

{bg}: Big grin

{eg}: Enormous/evil grin

{vbg}: Very big grin

{vbeg}: Very big evil grin

! as in Evil!Draco, Dead!Ron, Clever!Neville: From the early days of the internet, the exclamation mark is sometimes pronounced "bang", and used to attribute a characteristic to a character. Evil!Draco is evil, Dead!Ron is, surprisingly, dead.

Many people use emoticons/smilies to show emotions. To properly read these, tilt your head to the left as you come to them. This list is by no means exhaustive, as people are constantly coming up with new symbols.

Smiling
:)
:-)
Frowning
:(
:-(
Winking
;)
;-)
Laughing
:D
:-D
Sticking tongue out
:P
:-P

Japanese/anime style smilies (read the right way up) are also popular, and include O_O (eyes bugging out in shock), ^_^ (smiling), o_O (one eye bugging out in bewilderment), and ;_; (crying).

4.2 HP fandom-specific

HP: Harry Potter

PS: Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone (the British title for the first book in the series)

SS: Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (the American title for the first book in the series)

PS/SS: Used to refer to both PS and SS at the same time when the specific edition is not important.

CoS or COS or CS: Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (the second book in the series)

PoA or POA or PA: Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (the third book in the series)

GoF or GOF or GF: Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (the fourth book in the series)

OoP or OOP or OP: Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (the fifth book in the series)

FB or FBAWTFT: Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them (one of the Comic Relief schoolbooks from 2001)

QTTA or QTA: Quidditch Through The Ages (the other Comic Relief schoolbook from 2001)

Jo or JKR: Joanne Kathleen Rowling (better known as J.K. Rowling, the author of the Harry Potter series)

DADA: Defence against the Dark Arts

MoM or MOM: Ministry of Magic

CoMC or COMC: Care of Magical Creatures

MWPP: Moony, Wormtail, Padfoot & Prongs (The Marauders)

4.3 Fanfiction-specific terms

[NB: The fanfiction works listed below can all be found at Schnoogle, one of FictionAlley's "houses".]

PoU or POU: Harry Potter and the Paradigm of Uncertainty, (fanfic) by Lori Summers

ASA: A Sirius Affair (fanfic), by Penny Linsenmayer and Carole Estes

TSTNE: The Show That Never Ends, (fanfic) by Lori Summers

DD: Draco Dormiens, (fanfic) by Cassandra Claire

DS: Draco Sinister, (fanfic) by Cassandra Claire

DV: Draco Veritas, (fanfic) by Cassandra Claire

TIP: Trouble In Paradise, (fanfic) by Ebony Thomas, AKA AngieJ

PL: Paradise Lost, (fanfic) by Ebony Thomas, AKA AngieJ

SOT: Harry Potter and the Song of Time, (fanfic) by Queer as John, AKA Crazy Ivan

SOC: A Surfeit of Curses, (fanfic) by Heidi Tandy

DDO: Dracaena Draco, (fanfic) by Al

TOT: Time of Trial (fanfic) by Al

PS: Not Philosoper's Stone here, but Harry Potter and the Psychic Serpent, (fanfic) by Barb Purdom

ToGI or TOGI: Harry Potter and the Time of Good Intentions, (fanfic) by Barb Purdom

TP: Harry Potter and the Triangle Prophecy, (fanfic) by Barb Purdom

Canon: JKR's work: comprises all the books, including the schoolbooks, and sometimes online chats with JKR herself.

Fanon: Common conventions in the fanfiction community -- for instance, redeemable Draco, or gay Justin Finch-Fletchley.

Shipper: This term (from fanfiction) stands for "relationshipper". It means a fan who hopes to see a romantic relationship between two particular characters. It is accompanied by the characters' names or initials, separated by a slash. For example, an H/H or Harry/Hermione shipper is a fan who wants Harry and Hermione to get together. R/H is for Ron and Hermione; H/G is for Harry and Ginny. D/H is usually Draco/Hermione, while H/D is Harry/Draco.

Slash: Another fanfiction term, which refers to romantic relationships between two characters of the same sex

Het: The opposite of slash: romantic relationships between characters of the opposite sex.

FITD: 'Farmer in the Dell' theory: A loves B, but B loves C, but C loves D…

OBHWF: One big, happy Weasley family

HGTG: Hero (or Harry) gets the girl.

OC: Original Character: i.e. one created by a fanfic author

OOC: Out Of Character: a character acting in a way not supported by canon. Some people think this applies to Slut!Draco and Gangster!Harry. (Weirdos. -Ed.)

AU: Alternate Universe: a story taking place in an alternate Potterverse: for instance, one where Harry was sorted into Slytherin and not Gryffindor.

Mary Sue: A blatant self-insertion into a character by the author. In HP, often the bubbly vivacious blonde American Transfer student who is so perfect and outdoes everyone and redeems Draco and wins Harry and defeats Voldemort and who everybody wants to Avada Kedavra.

4.4 HPFGU-specific

For a complete list of the various acronyms like L.O.O.N., S.C.H.A.B.B., C.R.A.B. and L.O.L.L.I.P.O.P.S., see our Inish Alley file.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/database?method=reportRows&tbl=13

5. VERY FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS (VFAQ)

HPforGrownups has put together a list of Very Frequently Asked Questions. Please read them before posting, and especially before saying "look what I found in this book!"

They can be found at www.hpfgu.org.uk/vfaq

6. GROUP RESOURCES, FILES AND ARCHIVES

6.1 The Files Section

Many things can be found in the Files Section, which is larger than Mad-Eye Moody's trunk. (20MB, to be exact.) These include pictures, photos of various things, including list members, film locations and possible geographic locations for places in the books. There is also some assorted material in the OTChatter Files Section.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-OTChatter/files

6.2 The Archives Group

HPforGrownups-Archives contains all the messages which would not fit in the Messages Section of YahooGroups, including messages from our old Yahoo Club. Thanks to Paul Kippes for the wwwizardry involved :)

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups-Archives

6.3 HPFGU's accumulated wisdom: Fantastic Posts and where to Find Them

HPFGU's Fantastic Posts series of FAQ-based topical essays can be found at http://www.hpfgu.org.uk/faq They cover a wide range of topics, from JKR to the HP world to the characters, books and fans. All members should read them -- they're witty, entertaining and informative (low-calorie too! -Ed.).

7. OTHER AREAS OF ONLINE HARRY POTTER FANDOM

The online HP fandom is wide and mainly child-focussed. However, we at HPFGU know of many places where Grownups And Other Mature People are in the majority. You may find some names you recognise!

7.1 The HP Lexicon  http://www.i2k.com/~svderark/lexicon/

The Lexicon is produced by a member of HPFGU and is perhaps the most complete resource to the Harry Potter books apart from JK Rowling. It deals only with facts from the books and interviews, and not speculation. It's a truly fantastic work and should be read by every fan.

7.2 Other YahooGroups

SnapeFans (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SnapeFans) -- for fans of everyone's favourite Potions Master. (Note: is not currently accepting new members)

Harry Potter Anonymous (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hpanonymous) -- General discussion list; has recently become active with new members.

7.3 Websites

The Leaky Cauldron  http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/
A news site for everything HP, contributed to by various HPFGUers including Melissa A. and Heidi Tandy.

The Goat Pad  http://www.geocities.com/aberforths_goat/
A great tool for searching all the transcripts of JKR interviews that are posted online, by everybody's favorite Typing Poltergoat.

What's In A Name  http://www.theninemuses.net/hp/
Harry Potter name etymology by the wonderful Priscilla Spencer

Warner Bros Official HP Site  http://harrypotter.warnerbros.com/home.html
The Official Site: get randomly assigned a wand and semi-randomly Sorted into a House. Requires a high-end browser and Flash plugin.

7.4 Fanfiction Websites

* Fanfiction.net (http://www.fanfiction.net/) is one of the largest fanfiction archives available. It houses all genres of fan fiction, and has a very large HP section, including many quality stories. However, be warned: it is a large archive and there is no provision in place there to screen out the many stories of dubious quality.

* FictionAlley (http://www.fictionalley.org/) is the largest HP fanfiction site on the internet. FictionAlley screens submitted stories so that quality is what you would expect of fanfiction written by adults, and includes fanfic of all pairings, unlike some other sites, which only host Harry/Ginny, Ron/Hermione, Sirius/Remus, etc. There is also the excellent FictionAlley Park, a message board where you will probably find quite a few HPFGU people.

* SugarQuill (http://www.sugarquill.net/) is primarily for fics pairing Ron with Hermione and Harry with Ginny, though adamantly *not* Harry/Hermione or Draco/Hermione. They also have some non-Harry-Hermione-Ron-Ginny fics, including ones based on Sirius Black and Remus Lupin.

* Azkaban's Lair: (http://www.slashcity.org/~nezad/AzkabanLair.htm) This is an adult-only site dedicated to collecting stories pairing Remus Lupin with Sirius Black. Stories range from all-audience fics to stories with explicit scenes, and occur along any point in the timeline.

* Werewolf Registry: (http://www.werewolfregistry.net/) This is a primarily adult-oriented site collecting all manner of stories starring or featuring Remus Lupin. The Werewolf Registry also features a linked EZBoard system to review stories or discuss the books, characters, and off-topic issues.

7.5 Fanfiction YahooGroups

* HP_Fanfiction (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Fanfiction) -- run by HPFGUers Shay and Yael, HP_FF is a great place to go for beta readers (who proofread your fic before you post it), comments, and some great fics!

* HP_Paradise (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Paradise) -- Paradise is a list dedicated to fics by several HPFGU listies, and fics are often released there before they are put up elsewhere.

* ParadigmOfUncertainty (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ParadigmOfUncertainty) -- a list for discussion of fics by HPFGUers (past and present) Lori Summers, Cassandra Claire, Penny Linsenmayer and Carole Estes.

* Cassie_and_Rhysenn (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cassie_and_rhysenn) -- a list for discussion of fics by HPFGUers Cassandra Claire and Rhysenn.

* Psychic_Serpent (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Psychic_Serpent) -- for discussion of "Harry Potter and the Psychic Serpent" and its sequels, "The Time of Good Intentions" and "The Triangle Prophecy", as well as the prequel to Psychic Serpent, "The Lost Generation," all by HPFGUer Barb Purdom.

* hpslash (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hpslash) and its sister, hpslash-fic, is for discussion and distribution of stories about same-sex pairings within the HP universe. Members must verify they are over 18 before joining, as the fics range greatly in terms of tastes, ratings and types of pairings.

Note that while hpslash and Azkaban's Lair are the only dedicated slash groups/sites on this brief list, many other sites and groups we list here are slash-friendly, including Fanfiction.net, FictionAlley, HP_Paradise and Cassie_and_Rhysenn.

8. ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS

Contact the list admins at HPforGrownups-Owner@yahoogroups.com if you have a comment, question or criticism about this file, or a question not answered here. Many contributions and blatant nickings (and edits...) have come from various sources, including the wonderful HPFGU List Elves, Poltergeists and Members Like You. This file has been brought to you by the letter ÿ and the number ∞.