From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Fri Apr 1 09:40:52 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2005 09:40:52 -0000 Subject: UPDATE FOR MEG, 1st April Message-ID: Would one of you passing elves pick this up and take over to MEG? ****************************************************************** PROGRESS ON CATALOGUING PROJECT AS AT 1st April 2005 In the last update, I said that the group had catalogued 57131 posts in total at the end of March, including the old Yahoo Club, and had reached post 42800 on the main list. The overall catalogued number should have read 49316 - apologies. The new statistics, as of 1st April are: 50369 posts catalogued in total 27922 posts rejected in total (55.4%) 1053 posts catalogued in March We have currently reached post 44000 on the main list. The group currently has 26 members. The coding progress has slowed almost to a halt during March as the group carried out a complete review of all the posts so far categorised. This is now approximately 50% complete, and although it will continue until all sections are done, some group members are also slowly starting to catalogue again. We are going forward in a chastened mood, being very careful not to over-code posts and mindful of the various new definitions of categories which have emerged during our review. All are agreed, however, that it was/is a worthwhile thing to have done, even though it has slowed us down considerably. On the technical front, one task has been completed from our to-do list last month - the decision to reduce the number of headings used in the category list, to ensure catalogue searches did not time out before completing. This was undertaken by Carolyn as part and parcel of our review exercise. There are now only two levels of heading in which it is possible to place posts. The two other tasks - the list of technical requirements for the server the catalogue will require (action - Paul); and an undertaking to produce the next iteration of the UI design by March 24th (action - Tim), unfortunately have not yet happened. However, there have been active discussions on methods of funding the server longer term, and consideration of some third party software which may (or may not) be useful in speeding up the design of the front end UI. ******************************************************************* From ewetoo at gmail.com Fri Apr 1 14:01:55 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2005 00:01:55 +1000 Subject: netty problems Message-ID: <91d14f3205040106015a8faad4@mail.gmail.com> I'll not be very active over the next few days, as my new broadband connection is having major fits, and i can't get help from the ISP. Somehow it broke down today and the configuration I used refuses to work, so I've changed it and in the process changed the problem. As this process affects my security, i won't be presenting a big target while i fix the problem. Hope to be back with you all soon. a very frustrated networking penguin. -- Emacs is an alright OS, but it lacks a decent editor. From willsonkmom at msn.com Fri Apr 1 17:07:39 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2005 17:07:39 -0000 Subject: For All Time Message-ID: The Time section is done. 1.2.9 Timelines 5 posts 1.2.9.1 Dating the Books 16 posts 1.2.9.1.1 Significant Dates 12 posts 1.2.9.3 Comparing Muggle and WW timeline 0 posts 1.2.9.4 Timing Controversies 37 posts Assigning posts to codes, I can do...organizing a catalogue, that's another story. Given the low numbers, are all these codes justified? Would one big "Timing Issues" do for the whole thing? Keep in mind there are lots of posts out there which deal with time, but also have better headings.(Shrieking Shack II, Godrick's Hollow, etc.) If we are keeping these as they are, I suggest: Omit 1.2.9.3. Change 1.2.9.1.1 to Significant days/dates Change 1.2.9.4 to Timing Controversies and Inconsistencies Thoughts? Kathy W. From ewetoo at gmail.com Sat Apr 2 01:44:14 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2005 11:44:14 +1000 Subject: back again Message-ID: <20050402014413.GA13512@gmail.com> That was a quick emergency :) All's well again, until something else breaks... Hi to Meg, hope all this isn't too terrifying! -- When all you have are foxes, everything looks like a henhouse. From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sat Apr 2 17:10:24 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Sat, 02 Apr 2005 17:10:24 -0000 Subject: Time after Time Message-ID: I finished reviewing the Time Travel and Time Turner categories. I have a thought. Could we combine them for now? Time Travel now has 59 posts, and Time Turner has 54. The total is 101 as some of them are coded to both. Many of them which are coded only to one mirror others in the other category. We could actually cut out a few more if we combined them. In doing the Time Travel category, I rejected 46 posts and uncoded Time on 9. A few were mistakes which could lead to confusion. A few just said "I hate time travel." or "JKR does it differently than Bob Smith (or whoever)." and nothing else of substance. Since there was so much repetition, I only kept posts that were original, explained things well, or were insightful or amusing. And I couldn't resist keeping the one that said "Welcome to the group, Catlady.' for posterity. It was a valid post aside from that as well. I got rid of every "if Harry could go back and save Buckbeak, why not _______? fill in the blank: Cedric, his parents...) and added nothing else, and every answer that said Beaky didn't die and added nothing else. I am forseeing that we will get a lot of the same thing in the future, as I have personally participated in way too many of these threads. Unless JKR brings back time travel in the future (ouch), I don't see this category growing by a whole lot. Most of it will be repetition, with several dozen well-written explanations kept. We are approaching the time I joined the group, and I remember those discussions vividly! I was going to go through each category and kind of come up with a list of the types of posts in each, but I am getting a "cannot display page" right now. It happens. I'll try again tomorrow. Until then, something to think about. Ginger, pointing Sean to message 126972. (giggle, giggle) From ewetoo at gmail.com Sat Apr 2 17:24:59 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Sun, 3 Apr 2005 03:24:59 +1000 Subject: catalogue site down again? Message-ID: <20050402172459.GA22755@gmail.com> please tell me it's not my stupid router again -- When all you have are foxes, everything looks like a henhouse. From ewetoo at gmail.com Sat Apr 2 18:46:00 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Sun, 3 Apr 2005 04:46:00 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Time after Time In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050402184600.GB12402@gmail.com> On Sat, Apr 02, 2005 at 05:10:24PM -0000, quigonginger wrote: > Ginger, pointing Sean to message 126972. (giggle, giggle) I think that's actually quite good, but you should have put the choruses in between the verses :) -- When all you have are foxes, everything looks like a henhouse. From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sat Apr 2 19:06:00 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sat, 02 Apr 2005 19:06:00 -0000 Subject: Connection/dates&time/Hogwarts'/Time travel/Yahoo response Message-ID: Sean: please tell me it's not my stupid router again Ginger: I am getting a "cannot display page" right now. It happens. I'll try again tomorrow. Carolyn The site is ok as far as I can see; sorry you are both having such connection problems; please email Paul direct if it continues. Maybe he was fixing something. PS Ginger, I keep forgetting to ask - how's your back? Hope you are ok now. ******************************* Kelly: Side note: What's up with the backslashes? Seems to be an issue with a lot of apostrophes in the category list (an unnecessary escape character, perhaps?), but it's really going overboard here. :) And not to be a pedant (oh, who am I kidding), but shouldn't it be Hogwarts', not Hogwart's? Carolyn: I really don't know why those appear - they turn up whenever I edit the categories listing. I've tried deleting, but they come back. And indeed you are right, Hogwarts' it should be. I'll change it. Kelly: Final side note: I've come across post #18792 (Red Flags, Red Herrings) and its replies while reviewing several categories. I personally think it belongs only in 1.2.7.6 Forshadowing, clues, & misdirection, rather than the billion codes it currently holds. It's a list-type post, theorizing what details might be clues, and really doesn't contribute anything substantial to the subcategories discussed. Would anyone be opposed to my changing it as such? Carolyn: Not at all. I think I know the one you mean. Good idea to prune it hard. ****************** KathyW: The Time section is done. Would one big "Timing Issues" do for the whole thing? If we are keeping these as they are, I suggest: Omit 1.2.9.3. Change 1.2.9.1.1 to Significant days/dates Change 1.2.9.4 to Timing Controversies and Inconsistencies Thoughts? Carolyn: My suggestion would be to combine: 1.2.9 Timelines 5 posts 1.2.9.1 Dating the Books 16 posts 1.2.9.3 Comparing Muggle and WW timeline 0 posts into one section (1.2.9), but keep the other two as separate subheads: 1.2.9.1.1 Significant Dates 12 posts (re-number to 1.2.9.1) 1.2.9.4 Timing Controversies 37 posts (re-number to 1.2.9.2) and also make the changes to the name that you propose. Anyone disagree? ******************* Ginger (on Time of another sort): I finished reviewing the Time Travel and Time Turner categories. I have a thought. Could we combine them for now? Time Travel now has 59 posts, and Time Turner has 54. The total is 101 as some of them are coded to both. Carolyn: I don't have a problem with this suggestion - ok with everyone else?? Ginger: And I couldn't resist keeping the one that said "Welcome to the group, Catlady.' for posterity. It was a valid post aside from that as well. Carolyn: Hope we don't miss the total classic one from a newbie 'Where is this canon? I would like to read it.' Ginger: Unless JKR brings back time travel in the future (ouch), I don't see this category growing by a whole lot. Most of it will be repetition, with several dozen well-written explanations kept. We are approaching the time I joined the group, and I remember those discussions vividly! Carolyn: Oh my...you haven't seen Talisman's contributions, evidently. Begin to tremble.... ********************** People may have noticed some more changes to the Group site - you can now collapse the messages into a simple format list, and sort them by date order first or last. Incidentally, I had a reply from the person at Yahoo who asked me to contact them: Hi Carolyn, Thanks very much for contacting me. I can assure you that people here are listening, which is why you have seen some of the changes occur since the launch of the new site. We will continue to look closely at the feedback coming in from our customers in the coming days and weeks in order to make service improvements. We apologize for the Customer Care incident. It was an error which should now be corrected. As you can imagine, providing quality Customer Care for millions of users on a free service can be challenging. We are always working to improve it, and this was a case where we fell short. I'll pass your feedback along to the team. While I cannot guarantee changes will be made, they will definitely be considered. Thank you very much for taking the time to write in. James --- CarolynWhite2 at aol.com wrote: > >On or around March 29, 2005 07:38 AM James wrote > this: # > >Carolyn, > >I work at Yahoo! and would love to pass along your > feedback to the Yahoo! > Groups folks >before you decide to move your group. > Please contact me at > _backpackerjaime-zawodnyblog at yahoo.com_ > (mailto:backpackerjaime-zawodnyblog at yahoo.com) > > James > > Thankyou for reaching out and trying to make some > contact. We are feeling > profoundly alienated by Yahoo right now, although > some changes were made > overnight last night to the new groups look - again, > without any consultation or > acknowledgement of errors, but it is a start. > > The message number search feature was put back, as > were the message numbers > on the posts. They also fixed the 'Next' and > 'Previous' buttons, so they > worked in the correct directions. However, all this > was after we had received the > 'customer service' reply pasted below. As a > response document it is about > the worst I have ever seen - someone should have a > few things explained to > them. > > The cumulative changes which were asking for are > also pasted below, for > consideration by the Groups team. Basically, what we > feel is that Groups have not > understood the nature of these communities at all > (or ours at any rate), and > are possibly misled by the many chat sites that > Yahoo hosts. Although, of > course, chat goes on in our messages too, what we > are also driven by is research > and in-depth discussion. We want to refer to > complicated concepts and > messages going back years. > > From this point of view, what we really want fixed > is the search features, > which are totally lamentable - especially > considering that it is search > facilities that yourselves (and Google) primarily > compete on in the marketplace. On > a personal basis, I am currently running a vast > project to index our archive > content (approx 130000 messages and expected to be > 200000 by the end of > 2005). > > We are probably trying to do things that Yah!Groups > are not set up to do, > and therefore must find an alternative host > eventually, but the ugliness and the > high-handedness of the way this was handled has got > us all thinking a lot > more actively about that right now. If these new > changes had not been made > last night, individuals were going to start sending > messages to your investor > relations people and escalate the matter. > > Carolyn > > ******************* > 'CUSTOMER SERVICE' MESSAGE > > >>Hello, > > Thank you for writing to Yahoo! Groups. > > We appreciate your feedback regarding service > changes made to Yahoo! > Groups. We understand that some users may be > inconvenienced by some > of the changes we make, but our intentions are > always to improve the > overall quality of service for all of our users > while continuing to > offer you a compelling free service. > > These service changes are final and no exceptions > will be granted. > We apologize for any inconvenience this has caused > you and > appreciate your continued support of Yahoo! Groups. > > Should you have other inquiries, please feel free to > write again and > we'll be more than happy to assist you. > > Thank you again for contacting Yahoo! Customer Care. > > Regards, > > Sam<<< > ************** > > WISH LIST > > Rather than seeming "streamlined", it's now bloated > -- too much 'white > space' / extreme waste of screen space. > > Restore message numbers on the Messages index. [NOW > DONE] > > Restore search by message number. [NOW DONE] > > Messages index -- allow for viewing most recent > messages at bottom as > it was before. > > Messages index -- Allow for viewing only message > subjects instead of > brief bit of message itself. > > Reverse "Next" and "Previous": When reading > messages, "Next" should > go to the most recent message numerically -- i.e., > when reading 12345, > "Next" should go to 12346, not 12344. On Messages > page, "First" and > "Previous" should refer to earlier messages in the > archive as before. [NOW > DONE] > > When reading an individual message, clicking on > Message Index was > better before when it brought up the index > beginning with the chosen > message and going forward chronologically. > > Allow for viewing "My Groups" without icons -- page > used to be nicely > compact, now bloated. > > Allow for altering color of the 'white box' on home > page, Messages > page, when viewing individual messages. > > Members list should default sort alphabetically by > email address, > rather than by date joined -- better yet, allow > groups / individuals > to choose their own defaults. > > Members list should default to "Simple" rather than > "Expanded". > > OTHER ITEMS > > Message search feature - should be able to search > delimited blocks of > message, by date or post number, otherwise takes too > long to search a very large > archive > > Moderators - our group requires more moderator > positions as it is very large > [17000 members] > > New members - it would be useful to be able to set > new members to an > automatic 'no posting' period when they first > joined > > From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sat Apr 2 19:10:09 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Sat, 02 Apr 2005 19:10:09 -0000 Subject: Out of Time Message-ID: Now that I got back on the site, here's the promised breakdown of each category. Keep in mind that these are very broad generalizations, and that each post may cover more than one category, but I only ticked the dominant one of each. Also 12 overlap, and I took them as seperate posts as they are in 2 places at once (ooh, time travel). Literary (includes critique of PoA, comparing JKR to Sci-fi, discussions of physics and explanations of how it all works): Time Travel: 26 Time Turner: 16 Characters who may be/have been/will be doing time traveling/turning: Time Travel: 7 Time Turner: 6 H/H's adventure (includes the Map and who knew about the adventure): Time Travel: 12 Time Turner: 13 Can (or should) time be changed? Time Travel: 12 Time Turner: 6 Hermione's use throughout the year and its effects on her (note: this does not include JKR's use of foreshadowing, which is in the Literary category): Time Travel: 2 Time Turner: 13 I think you see what I meant that the two were so intertwined as to be one, and that we may as well combine them. Ginger, who never knew any other part of Drunken Sailor than what she filked. But then, she is in a very landlocked part of the world (over 1400 miles from the nearest ocean). Glad you approved anyway, Sean. ;o) From kakearney at comcast.net Sun Apr 3 04:49:09 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 04:49:09 -0000 Subject: 3.16.2 School Motto review Message-ID: Here's a quick little review before I dive into the school population debate. 3.16.2 School Motto ------------------- Originally: 18 Now: 16 Could we change this to "School Motto and Coat of Arms"? There were several posts discussing the coat of arms independently of the motto. Most of these were also coded to 1.2.13.3 Heraldry, but I agree with whoever placed these here that the motto and coat of arms go hand in hand. At least, if I were interested in the Hogwarts coat of arms, I'd think to look under Hogwarts rather than Symbolism. Other than that, this one contained exactly what I expected: discussion of the translation of the motto. But please, don't stick any posts here that simply ask, "What does 'Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus' mean?" (this is where the two rejects came). -Kelly From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sun Apr 3 18:50:13 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 18:50:13 -0000 Subject: Update, Sunday April 3rd Message-ID: PROGRESS To date, we have coded 50529 posts, and rejected 28058 (55.5%). This week with just Sean and I coding, we did 408 posts. 46 out of 105 review sections are now completed. SELF-SERVICE POST ALLOCATION I've created a new table in the database section which shows everyone's current allocation of posts for coding. To save having to wait for me to respond, you can now take a new chunk of posts and fill in the detail on this table - add 'yes' when your section is done. This way you can take as many posts as you feel like doing in one go. Note the numbers in the far left column are to force the ranking to display correctly. Just add extra records as required. However, Boyd, as you are unable to view this website, please let me know as usual when you want posts and I will enter them on the table for you. Carolyn Faced with a week which combines a pope's funeral, a general election announcement and a bloody royal wedding.. Satisfyingly tasteless pope satire at this site. *Don't* visit if you are easily offended: http://www.deadbrain.co.uk/news/article_2005_04_02_3819.php From stevejjen at earthlink.net Mon Apr 4 03:45:26 2005 From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese) Date: Mon, 04 Apr 2005 03:45:26 -0000 Subject: Chapter Review Summary PS, COS, POA Message-ID: PS/SS original posts: 704 PS/SS now: 540 COS original: 436 COS now: 315 POA original: 1197 POA now: 860 Just a few parting thoughts on chapter coding: 1) For the Shrieking Shack chapters in POA and the graveyard chapters in GOF, my suggestion is to code posts discussing the entire event (timeline, actions across several chapters, significance of the event, etc.) to the Shrieking Shack-POA and Graveyard headings. Events taking place within only one chapter can still be coded that way. And I left a few posts coded to a couple of chapters. Example: The Lupin transformation scene was typically discussed looking at why he didn't take his potion in Cat, Rat and Dog and his actual transformation in Dementor's Kiss. 2) It's a good idea to double-check the chapter if unsure about an event. It took a long time to sort out the last five chapters of POA because of mis-codings, and these sections will surely get unwieldy if we're sloppy and don't review again for awhile. 3) I'll upload a Word.doc this week with events to code to each individual chapter. Hopefully this will be a handy guide for everyone to print out and refer to quickly when determining the correct chapter, and also to see the history of events already coded to each one. All for now! GOF review to follow in the near future since we're past vacations, school events, etc. for the moment. Jen From paul-groups at wibbles.org Mon Apr 4 12:17:45 2005 From: paul-groups at wibbles.org (kippesp) Date: Mon, 04 Apr 2005 12:17:45 -0000 Subject: Confirming your IP for the firewall Message-ID: I've already emailed this directly to some. But if you're still having problems accessing the Catalog, visit this page from the HPFGU server. We're having DNS issues with hpfgu, so the normal address doesn't work. http://209.124.81.133/myip.php From willsonkmom at msn.com Tue Apr 5 15:42:07 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Tue, 05 Apr 2005 15:42:07 -0000 Subject: Connection/dates&time/Hogwarts'/Time travel/Yahoo response In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Carolyn: > My suggestion would be to combine: > > 1.2.9 Timelines 5 posts > 1.2.9.1 Dating the Books 16 posts > 1.2.9.3 Comparing Muggle and WW timeline 0 posts > > into one section (1.2.9), but keep the other two as separate > subheads: > > 1.2.9.1.1 Significant Dates 12 posts (re-number to 1.2.9.1) > 1.2.9.4 Timing Controversies 37 posts (re-number to 1.2.9.2) > > and also make the changes to the name that you propose. Anyone > disagree? > KathyW OK, Can you merge those 3. Shall we call them: Timelines/Dating the Books or just Timelines? Would I then go into our reviewing database and change the definitions and insert new numbers/names? Will all the appropriate posts slide into the new section by themselves or will I have to go in and prod them? (Will I need a prose portal?) And 1.2.9.2 will get new name. Kathy W. who is not very active on this list this week, planning an Eagle Court of Honor for my son on Saturday. (beaming proudly) From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Tue Apr 5 18:56:43 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Tue, 05 Apr 2005 18:56:43 -0000 Subject: dates&time In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "potioncat" wrote: > > > KathyW > OK, Can you merge those 3. Shall we call them: Timelines/Dating the > Books or just Timelines? Would I then go into our reviewing database > and change the definitions and insert new numbers/names? Will all > the appropriate posts slide into the new section by themselves or > will I have to go in and prod them? (Will I need a prose portal?) > > And 1.2.9.2 will get new name. > > Kathy W. who is not very active on this list this week, planning an > Eagle Court of Honor for my son on Saturday. (beaming proudly) All done, both on database and our reviewing database. All you need to do is go in and adjust the definition in the review DB. For the record, you ended up with: 19 posts in 1.2.9 12 posts in 1.2.9.1 37 posts in 1.2.9.2 Hope that was correct. Carolyn wondering vaguely what an Eagle Court of Honor might be.. and reduced to turning on the news in 2 second bursts to limit the damage to my sanity. Not only have they had to move the royal wedding to Saturday, but (OMG) also shift the start of the Grand National by three quarters of an hour (a major spring racing event). Well, as one newspaper headline had it, he is the 'prince who gave up his kingdom for a horse'.... Another paper today speculated 'what else could possibly go wrong?', with a picture of a massive meteorite speeding towards Windsor Town Hall. I'd leave the country, except my favourite destination might be an even worse choice this week. From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Tue Apr 5 20:34:01 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Tue, 05 Apr 2005 20:34:01 -0000 Subject: Chapter Review Summary PS, COS, POA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "Jen Reese" wrote: > > 3) I'll upload a Word.doc this week with events to code to each > individual chapter. Hopefully this will be a handy guide for > everyone to print out and refer to quickly when determining the > correct chapter, and also to see the history of events already coded > to each one. > Jen, you've done a great job on these chapters. Feel free to clip us round the ear, or even slap us upside the head in future if we don't follow the new rules. Yes, please post your list as a Word doc in the files section. I'll also paste it into the appropriate section in the big definition files that I keep up to date each week. Eventually, they will be a complete compendium of the discussions so far on each category. However, I agree that having your list separately available will be very handy. Carolyn From stevejjen at earthlink.net Wed Apr 6 01:45:46 2005 From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese) Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 01:45:46 -0000 Subject: Uploading Chapter Coding Guide in File Section In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Carolyn: > Jen, you've done a great job on these chapters. Feel free to clip us > round the ear, or even slap us upside the head in future if we don't > follow the new rules. Jen: Thanks! Hmmm...punishment is not only acceptacle but encouraged...might be useful... > Yes, please post your list as a Word doc in the files section. I'll > also paste it into the appropriate section in the big definition > files that I keep up to date each week. Eventually, they will be a > complete compendium of the discussions so far on each category. > However, I agree that having your list separately available will be > very handy. Done. GOF will be a separate doc. And my disclaimer: "Please note not all possible discussion topics are included with each chapter. This document merely reflects the posts coded up to this point and can be revised as needed." Jen From ewetoo at gmail.com Fri Apr 8 00:47:26 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2005 10:47:26 +1000 Subject: the saga continues Message-ID: <20050408004726.GA8905@gmail.com> Slowly dragging myself through this batch. I'm going to go back to 100-sized batches, 200 is bad for my morale. I have a question of relevance: I have a large thread here about how much we all love Sirius and what Harry sees in him. I have a greedy instinct to kill them all but I'm already up to 56 rejects and have temporarily lost my nerve. It must have been that massive survey thread that kept reappearing for days after I thought'I'd killed it. -- When all you have are foxes, everything looks like a henhouse. From paul-groups at wibbles.org Fri Apr 8 03:43:02 2005 From: paul-groups at wibbles.org (kippesp) Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 03:43:02 -0000 Subject: Catalog down...reason unknown Message-ID: My internet connection isn't working tonight. But a kindly neighbor has an open network. I'll check the status in the morning. But right now I'm not up for a 45 minute chat with some idiot in India who will have me unplug, plug, and reboot only to confirm it really is down. From ewetoo at gmail.com Fri Apr 8 05:46:26 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2005 15:46:26 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Catalog down...reason unknown In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050408054626.GB8905@gmail.com> On Fri, Apr 08, 2005 at 03:43:02AM -0000, kippesp wrote: > > > My internet connection isn't working tonight. But a kindly neighbor > has an open network. I'll check the status in the morning. But right > now I'm not up for a 45 minute chat with some idiot in India who will > have me unplug, plug, and reboot only to confirm it really is down. Oh..it's working here...spooky.. -- When all you have are foxes, everything looks like a henhouse. From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Fri Apr 8 07:57:12 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 07:57:12 -0000 Subject: Sirius & Harry posts In-Reply-To: <20050408004726.GA8905@gmail.com> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, ewe2 wrote: > Slowly dragging myself through this batch. I'm going to go back to 100-sized > batches, 200 is bad for my morale. > > I have a question of relevance: I have a large thread here about how much we > all love Sirius and what Harry sees in him. I have a greedy instinct to kill > them all but I'm already up to 56 rejects and have temporarily lost my nerve. > It must have been that massive survey thread that kept reappearing for days > after I thought'I'd killed it. > Hi Sean Wondered whether you were still there... The problem is that no one has yet touched the Sirius category (I wonder why). So, the only approach is to delete stuff that is repetitious or irrelevant within the thread you are dealing with right now. Anne might be able to comment on how she is treating the Harry aspect of it. I think I am due to pick up on the batch of posts immediately after this, so I will see what I make of it. Carolyn From kking0731 at gmail.com Fri Apr 8 11:21:43 2005 From: kking0731 at gmail.com (snow15145) Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 11:21:43 -0000 Subject: Sirius & Harry posts In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Carolyn: The problem is that no one has yet touched the Sirius category (I wonder why). So, the only approach is to delete stuff that is repetitious or irrelevant within the thread you are dealing with right now. Snow: Actually I have half of the Sirius category read and sorted into projected areas such as; rejects (adds nothing new or totally reiterated in the next post), drop code (mere mention, not the subject point), and possible sub-categories. The first sub-cat I would propose that would benefit other large categories as well would be a marauders code, much like the trio dynamics code. I have found several instances when the subject of the post speaks of the marauders collectively such as, the prank and the shrieking shack in POA. Also parallels between the trio and the marauders and which houses the marauders are in according to their personality. These posts don't dwell on any particular person but give points of view on each of the marauders or the majority of them. The other sub- categories may not be necessary; I'll wait to comment on those after reading the other half of the main heading. Snow From willsonkmom at msn.com Fri Apr 8 11:46:42 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (Kathy Willson) Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2005 07:46:42 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Sirius & Harry posts References: Message-ID: Snow: The first sub-cat I would propose that would benefit other large categories as well would be a marauders code, much like the trio dynamics code. Snow Kathy W. Just from coding in general, I'd agree. I've coded too many posts to all 4 individuals when the post was really about the lump of them. I should back to coding/reviewing on Tuesday. Kathy W (What, you didn't notice I wasn't?) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-Catalogue/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: HPFGU-Catalogue-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Fri Apr 8 11:47:13 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 11:47:13 -0000 Subject: Sirius & Harry posts In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "snow15145" wrote: > > Carolyn: > > The problem is that no one has yet touched the Sirius category (I > wonder why). So, the only approach is to delete stuff that is > repetitious or irrelevant within the thread you are dealing with > right now. > > Snow: > > Actually I have half of the Sirius category read and sorted into > projected areas such as; rejects (adds nothing new or totally > reiterated in the next post), drop code (mere mention, not the > subject point), and possible sub-categories. The first sub-cat I > would propose that would benefit other large categories as well would > be a marauders code, much like the trio dynamics code. I have found > several instances when the subject of the post speaks of the > marauders collectively such as, the prank and the shrieking shack in > POA. Also parallels between the trio and the marauders and which > houses the marauders are in according to their personality. These > posts don't dwell on any particular person but give points of view on > each of the marauders or the majority of them. The other sub- > categories may not be necessary; I'll wait to comment on those after > reading the other half of the main heading. > > Snow Kathy, I'd completely forgotten you'd stepped forward to do this one, sorry! I thought it was still unallocated, should have checked. On a Marauders' code - A) If the post is about parallels between them and the kids (or anyone), I think the existing 1.2.10.5 Generational parallels between characters is the right category to use. B) If we have a Marauders' Dynamics code, then it should purely be about the relationships between MWPP, but it probably should not include the Shrieking Shack/Prank incidents. Is this too complicated/too fine a distinction for people to remember? On Sean's question about Sirius & Harry - is this a category you have separated out as yet? Carolyn From quigonginger at yahoo.com Fri Apr 8 14:57:04 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 14:57:04 -0000 Subject: tables and reviewing Message-ID: Howdy-Hi, everyone! Carolyn, I have a question. It is probably stupid, but what the heck. I finished my posts for coding and went into the database and edited myself as "yes" under "done". So far so good. Now for my question: Am I supposed to delete it or leave it? Also, how do I get new ones? Do I just see what the last ones were and take a bunch? I went ahead and gave myself a new section to review. I am taking 3.16.8 through 3.17.2. That's the one with pets through TWT. I put my name in the database. And I did it all by myself. (Have a cookie, Ginger. Why, thank you.) I am getting the hang of this computer stuff after all. I must say that coding is a lot easier now that I have done some reviewing. It's nice just to read it once or twice and get the gist of it and not have to go over and over it in case I missed a fleeting reference that before I would have coded. Live and learn. Ginger, suddenly eating pickles (but not pg) From kking0731 at gmail.com Fri Apr 8 15:32:44 2005 From: kking0731 at gmail.com (snow15145) Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 15:32:44 -0000 Subject: Sirius & Harry posts In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Carolyn: Kathy, I'd completely forgotten you'd stepped forward to do this one, sorry! I thought it was still unallocated, should have checked. Snow: No problem, I wouldn't want your headache oops I mean job :-) Carolyn: On a Marauders' code - A) If the post is about parallels between them and the kids (or anyone), I think the existing 1.2.10.5 Generational parallels between characters is the right category to use. Snow: Do you mean to code these posts only to parallels and not to cross code to the individuals as well? These posts have 1.2.10.5 ticked as well as trio dynamics and each of the marauders by name so I thought it would be easiest to follow suit and tick a marauder code rather than the three or four individuals that have also been ticked. Carolyn: B) If we have a Marauders' Dynamics code, then it should purely be about the relationships between MWPP, but it probably should not include the Shrieking Shack/Prank incidents. Is this too complicated/too fine a distinction for people to remember? Snow: I suppose I viewed this code, the marauders, more from a collectively speaking aspect than a dynamics of the marauders viewpoint. I feel that when I am reading the category heading about Sirius that I would expect to find topics that basically discuss him, `Dead Sexy Sirius' and the like. If the post is about at least three of the four marauders and goes into what part each played in the prank for instance, I would like them to be under a specific area heading and not under the main subject heading of Sirius, Lupin, Pettigrew and James. When and if the thread veers off to only speaking of one or two of the marauders, I would then tick it off to the individual. There are also posts on what animagus each become that involve the group collectively, which would be better addressed under a group heading of the marauders, again if we are cross coding to the individuals involved as well as the subject matter of animagus. I hope I've explained my viewpoint better this time around. Snow From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Fri Apr 8 15:42:35 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 15:42:35 -0000 Subject: tables and reviewing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "quigonginger" wrote: > > Howdy-Hi, everyone! > > Carolyn, I have a question. It is probably stupid, but what the > heck. I finished my posts for coding and went into the database and > edited myself as "yes" under "done". So far so good. Now for my > question: Am I supposed to delete it or leave it? Also, how do I get > new ones? Do I just see what the last ones were and take a bunch? Ginger, you did the right thing; easy isn't it ... I think for now leave the entry that you've put 'yes' against, and start a new one for the next bunch of posts you want to do. Make a note of the last group allocated to whoever, and start yours with the very next post. You can allocate yourself as many as you'd like - don't hold back.. If the list gets too unweildy, I'll remove some of the earlier entries once they are done, but for now, everyone should just start another line on the table. Remember to add a number in the far left column if you need to. This forces the table to rank in the right order - yet another defeat for Yahoo!Mort (a good idea of Paul's). > > I went ahead and gave myself a new section to review. I am taking > 3.16.8 through 3.17.2. That's the one with pets through TWT. I put > my name in the database. And I did it all by myself. (Have a cookie, > Ginger. Why, thank you.) I am getting the hang of this computer > stuff after all. Great..certainly won't be stopping anyone taking new sections to do. I'm still ploughing through Voldemort. > > I must say that coding is a lot easier now that I have done some > reviewing. It's nice just to read it once or twice and get the gist > of it and not have to go over and over it in case I missed a fleeting > reference that before I would have coded. Live and learn. > > Ginger, suddenly eating pickles (but not pg) Hm. Cookies and pickles. Oh well. Yes, the review has been essential. Painful, but really useful for future coding. The thing is not to forget everyone's carefully written new descriptions, and to stick to any new rules (eg Jen's chapter topics; your SHIP guidelines). Carolyn From kakearney at comcast.net Fri Apr 8 21:18:31 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 21:18:31 -0000 Subject: tables and reviewing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > I went ahead and gave myself a new section to review. I am taking > 3.16.8 through 3.17.2. That's the one with pets through TWT. I put > my name in the database. And I did it all by myself. Hmm, I thought I had all of 3.16. I'm listed as such in the Wizarding World database, but not in the Review Allocations database. Well, I'm still wading through the admission process and school population at the moment, so Ginger, if you want to steal those last three in 3.16, go ahead. Just change it from me to you in the database so I don't forget. -Kelly From kking0731 at gmail.com Fri Apr 8 22:24:08 2005 From: kking0731 at gmail.com (snow15145) Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 22:24:08 -0000 Subject: Another Question Message-ID: Something else I forgot to ask about; the chapter review summaries and questions. I have come across three so far under the Sirius heading and questioned if they should actually be there until the thread stems off to the degree of talking about Sirius only. These review questions are equivalent to a multi post that is directed to more than one topic. I would suggest giving the reviewed chapter summaries either their own heading, treating them like a multi post or only coding them to the book's chapter they are referencing, the last example being my personal preference. Quite a few initially answered posts to these chapter review questions answer to most or all of the questions submitted, which I would also place with the original chapter post. Again, once the thread veers off to only answering a question concerning the individual I would then tick only to the individual's heading. Just my suggestion Snow From kakearney at comcast.net Sat Apr 9 02:16:39 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Sat, 09 Apr 2005 02:16:39 -0000 Subject: access to catalogue Message-ID: Is the catalogue down at the moment? I can't seem to get in, but the problem may be on my end, since my internet was down yesterday. New IP, maybe. I've visited the myip site, and humbly await admittance, if this is indeed the problem. -Kelly From ewetoo at gmail.com Sat Apr 9 02:53:49 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2005 12:53:49 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] access to catalogue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050409025349.GG8905@gmail.com> On Sat, Apr 09, 2005 at 02:16:39AM -0000, corinthum wrote: > Is the catalogue down at the moment? I can't seem to get in, but the > problem may be on my end, since my internet was down yesterday. New > IP, maybe. I've visited the myip site, and humbly await admittance, > if this is indeed the problem. Must be you, I'm not having a problem. -- When all you have are foxes, everything looks like a henhouse. From ewetoo at gmail.com Sat Apr 9 03:03:29 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2005 13:03:29 +1000 Subject: 44101-44300 done Message-ID: <20050409030329.GH8905@gmail.com> 67 rejects, mostly due to surveys, "Sirius is Great!" posts, and way too much dross (mostly due to "Why I think Sirius is Great!"). Honourable mention goes to #44198, OT, but quite funny. A few more Marauders references. I take your point about using the 1.2.10.4 cat, Carolyn, but I wonder if a pertinent theme (ie the Trio making a different choice to the Marauders) isn't going to come up at some point, which is a slightly different matter. I think we should keep our eye on this one anyway. Taking 44401-44500 (table edited to indicate this). -- When all you have are foxes, everything looks like a henhouse. From paul-groups at wibbles.org Sat Apr 9 04:55:54 2005 From: paul-groups at wibbles.org (kippesp) Date: Sat, 09 Apr 2005 04:55:54 -0000 Subject: Catalog IP address Message-ID: I think my IP has changed... 67.174.174.185 From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sat Apr 9 13:00:22 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sat, 09 Apr 2005 13:00:22 -0000 Subject: Databases/Chapter summaries/MWPP Message-ID: Ginger: > I went ahead and gave myself a new section to review. I am taking > 3.16.8 through 3.17.2. That's the one with pets through TWT. I put > my name in the database. And I did it all by myself. Kelly: Hmm, I thought I had all of 3.16. I'm listed as such in the Wizarding World database, but not in the Review Allocations database. Carolyn: Apologies - this is my fault. I wasn't careful enough in updating the Review Allocations DB when Kelly said she would do the Hogwarts section. If you don't mind Ginger finishing off the section Kelly, I've changed 3.16.8/3.16.9/3.17.1/3.17.2 to Ginger in both DBases now. Hope there are no further glitches. I would do away with having a two DB saying the same thing, but it still seems sort of useful to have the Review Allocations DB as it is shorter - but we can ditch it if people want, to avoid having to update two tables whenever people choose a review section. ************* KathySnow: Something else I forgot to ask about; the chapter review summaries and questions. I have come across three so far under the Sirius heading and questioned if they should actually be there until the thread stems off to the degree of talking about Sirius only. Carolyn: I would agree that the chapter summary responses should mainly be with the chapter, unless they are significantly about something else, in this case, Sirius. ********* MWPP.... Well, where do people want me to put this code? Under Group Dynamics? Just think of all the sections that need to be gone through to make sure the right stuff ends up here. Votes? Carolyn From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sat Apr 9 13:23:49 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2005 06:23:49 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: tables and reviewing In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050409132349.40572.qmail@web60502.mail.yahoo.com> Kelly: Hmm, I thought I had all of 3.16. I'm listed as such in the Wizarding World database, but not in the Review Allocations database. Well, I'm still wading through the admission process and school population at the moment, so Ginger, if you want to steal those last three in 3.16, go ahead. Just change it from me to you in the database so I don't forget. Ginger: Kelly, I am so sorry for nabbing your stuff. It looked empty in the one database (RA), and I didn't check the other (WW). It is edited in the other one now, (actually, it was when I checked, so it must do it by itself somehow). Actually, now that I checked the WW database, I see Laurasia is down for the Time travel section that I took as it was empty in the RA table. Apologies to Laurasia too. Geesh, I still have a lot to learn about double checking. Take care all, Ginger --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sat Apr 9 13:55:19 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sat, 09 Apr 2005 13:55:19 -0000 Subject: tables and reviewing/time travel In-Reply-To: <20050409132349.40572.qmail@web60502.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, Ginger wrote: > > Ginger: Kelly, I am so sorry for nabbing your stuff. It looked empty in the one database (RA), and I didn't check the other (WW). It is edited in the other one now, (actually, it was when I checked, so it must do it by itself somehow). > > Actually, now that I checked the WW database, I see Laurasia is down for the Time travel section that I took as it was empty in the RA table. Apologies to Laurasia too. > > Geesh, I still have a lot to learn about double checking. > Carolyn: Jeez, three mistakes in as many days. It is not your fault, but mine Ginger. There are obviously some discrepancies between the two tables. Hope we have picked them all up now, but if people could check *both* tables each time they allocate themselves a review section, that's probably a good idea. Sorry'n all that. Bad week. From stevejjen at earthlink.net Sat Apr 9 17:38:24 2005 From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese) Date: Sat, 09 Apr 2005 17:38:24 -0000 Subject: Another Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Snow: Something else I forgot to ask about; the chapter review summaries and questions. I have come across three so far under the Sirius heading and questioned if they should actually be there until the thread stems off to the degree of talking about Sirius only. These review questions are equivalent to a multi post that is directed to more than one topic. I would suggest giving the reviewed chapter summaries either their own heading, treating them like a multi post or only coding them to the book's chapter they are referencing, the last example being my personal preference. Jen: I agree we need to house the chapter summaries together coded to the chapter (or chapters) being addressed. There's no reason to overcode here, when there's a simple place to put them and direct people to. Most of the summaries cover so many questions they could easily be coded to about 15 different items, but it won't make them accesible that way. I view them as having historical value more than anything else and as such, they don't need to be viewed all over the catalogue. Two knuts and all. From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sun Apr 10 17:02:51 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2005 17:02:51 -0000 Subject: UPDATE, Sunday 10th April Message-ID: PROGRESS We have coded 50883 posts and rejected 28215 of them (55.4%). With three people coding we did 354 posts this week. On the review, we have now done 48 out of 105 sections. Hm.. progress is obviously rather slow. Perhaps we should all make an effort to get back into coding this coming week? Please see the coding database I have created to see the posts you were allocated, erm, a long time ago. If you are not on the DB, please feel free to allocate yourself a chunk of posts.. Carolyn From willsonkmom at msn.com Mon Apr 11 11:55:09 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2005 11:55:09 -0000 Subject: Back to Work Message-ID: I've changed the definition of the 3 timeline codes in the database. How do I change it in the catalogue itself? I've also signed up to code. I thought I'd do a batch, then review "characters' ages." Kathy W. From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Mon Apr 11 12:53:21 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2005 12:53:21 -0000 Subject: Back to Work In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "potioncat" wrote: > > I've changed the definition of the 3 timeline codes in the database. > How do I change it in the catalogue itself? > > I've also signed up to code. I thought I'd do a batch, then > review "characters' ages." > > Kathy W. Kathy - I'll go through and transfer all the updated definitions into the live database sometime soon. Thanks for starting to do some coding again..ahem, *not many* people are doing anything at the moment. Carolyn From kakearney at comcast.net Mon Apr 11 20:40:37 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2005 20:40:37 -0000 Subject: Graveyard scene Message-ID: Jen, Does the new 1.2.8.9 Graveyard re-birth (GoF) category include discussion about what Voldemort's plan was if the kill-Harry part went as planned? For example, whether he was going to send his DEs to Hogwarts via portkey? Or does it cover exclusively the rebirth sequence? -Kelly From stevejjen at earthlink.net Tue Apr 12 12:59:57 2005 From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese) Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 12:59:57 -0000 Subject: Graveyard scene In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Does the new 1.2.8.9 Graveyard re-birth (GoF) category include > discussion about what Voldemort's plan was if the kill-Harry part went > as planned? For example, whether he was going to send his DEs to > Hogwarts via portkey? Or does it cover exclusively the rebirth > sequence? > > -Kelly This is a hard one. Since I haven't moved any posts from the Graveyard chapters, I'm not sure what's in there and how far the discussion goes. Besides the 'LV's agenda' category, I can't really think of another place to put a thread like you mentioned except the Graveyard scene. Since it's total speculation on something we know is non- canon....Guess I'd vote for 1.2.8.9 Graveyard. Anyone else? Jen From kakearney at comcast.net Tue Apr 12 13:18:16 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 13:18:16 -0000 Subject: Graveyard scene In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Me: > > Does the new 1.2.8.9 Graveyard re-birth (GoF) category include > > discussion about what Voldemort's plan was if the kill-Harry part > went > > as planned? For example, whether he was going to send his DEs to > > Hogwarts via portkey? Or does it cover exclusively the rebirth > > sequence? Jen: > Besides the 'LV's agenda' category, I can't really think of another > place to put a thread like you mentioned except the Graveyard scene. > Since it's total speculation on something we know is non- > canon....Guess I'd vote for 1.2.8.9 Graveyard. Anyone else? Yes, Voldemort's agenda has already been ticked. The thread originated with discussion of the Cup portkey, and the various programming it might have had, and so I was placing the posts under The Third Task and portkeys. However, once it veered into possible return trip discussion, it got much more vague, since we're now discussing something that would have taken place in Priori Incantatem had things gone according to plan, but of course didn't. I'm strongly leaning towards using 1.2.8.9, since the post really is discussing Voldy's hypothetical agenda during that scene, unless there are any objections. -Kelly From ewetoo at gmail.com Tue Apr 12 13:37:55 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 23:37:55 +1000 Subject: speaking of odd threads... Message-ID: <20050412133755.GA677@gmail.com> Does anyone know what House Sirius was in?! I've no idea and there's a whole thread here fighting over whether he was a Slytherin or a Gryffindor. It never seems to have been cleared up... -- When all you have are foxes, everything looks like a henhouse. From willsonkmom at msn.com Tue Apr 12 13:53:26 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (Kathy Willson) Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 09:53:26 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] speaking of odd threads... References: <20050412133755.GA677@gmail.com> Message-ID: There is a quote (from the world chat?) from JKR that places all the Marauders in Gryffindor. Although there is some controversy about the wording and some readers feel Pettigrew's House is uncertain. Kathy W. ----- Original Message ----- From: ewe2 To: HPFGU-Catalogue Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2005 9:37 AM Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] speaking of odd threads... Does anyone know what House Sirius was in?! I've no idea and there's a whole thread here fighting over whether he was a Slytherin or a Gryffindor. It never seems to have been cleared up... -- When all you have are foxes, everything looks like a henhouse. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-Catalogue/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: HPFGU-Catalogue-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quigonginger at yahoo.com Tue Apr 12 15:07:25 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 08:07:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] speaking of odd threads... In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050412150725.69697.qmail@web60506.mail.yahoo.com> ewe2 wrote: Does anyone know what House Sirius was in?! I've no idea and there's a whole thread here fighting over whether he was a Slytherin or a Gryffindor. It never seems to have been cleared up... Ginger here: According to the tattered yellow pages before me (printout of the World Book Day Chat): Sirius Riddle: What houses were Sirius Black, Remus Lupin, James Potter, and Remus Lupin (sic) in? Everyone tells me they were in Gryffindor, but I won't believe it unless I hear it from Ms. Rowling herself! JK Rowling says: This is JK herself saying they were indeed in Gryffindor. This is, as Kathy mentioned, why there is dispute about Peter. Lupin is mentioned twice. I personally assume that JKR glanced at the question and assumed he meant the Mauraders. Odd threads, indeed. I am reviewing one in the "other schools" section about how there must be a school, or at least a wizarding population, in Texas. Animals down there squirt blood out of their eyes. Not to mention Armadillos. Ginger, who means the armadillos to be a seperate thought, not connected to the sentance before. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pip at etchells0.demon.co.uk Tue Apr 12 17:04:13 2005 From: pip at etchells0.demon.co.uk (bluesqueak) Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 17:04:13 -0000 Subject: speaking of odd threads... In-Reply-To: <20050412150725.69697.qmail@web60506.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Ginger wrote: > Odd threads, indeed. I am reviewing one in the "other schools" section about how there must be a school, or at least a wizarding population, in Texas. Animals down there squirt blood out of their eyes. Not to mention Armadillos. > Amanda's photos of some giant Texas creepy-crawly that looked *exactly* like a Blast Ended Skrewt certainly convinced me - but sadly, she posted them on OT Chatter rather than the main list. Pip ::sliding gently back into the bottom of the teacup for another snooze:: From willsonkmom at msn.com Wed Apr 13 13:28:38 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 13:28:38 -0000 Subject: Coding and Physical types Message-ID: Is everyone else finding coding to be easier now having gone through the review process? More time is spent thinking about the meaning of the post and less on checking every little reference. Not only that, I think I've rejected about three quarters of the posts I've read. Not sure if that's good or bad. I've come across discusions on physical descriptions and possible meanings. For the time being I've put it under 3.4.3 Physical types and metabolism but it sort of fits under 3.4.6 grooming. Only it isn't either. It's a case of how does beauty/ugly fit with magic or expectations. Or "what do the different types of noses mean?" I'm sure at some point there will be/was a discussion about hair color/magic and height/magic. Any thoughts? Carolyn, I'm going to do a batch of 100 codes then go review characters' ages. Unless there is a different heading you'd rather I do. Kathy W. From kakearney at comcast.net Wed Apr 13 15:42:00 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 15:42:00 -0000 Subject: Coding and Physical types In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Kathy wrote: > I've come across discusions on physical descriptions and possible > meanings. For the time being I've put it under 3.4.3 Physical types > and metabolism but it sort of fits under 3.4.6 grooming. Only it isn't > either. It's a case of how does beauty/ugly fit with magic or > expectations. Or "what do the different types of noses mean?" I'm > sure at some point there will be/was a discussion about hair > color/magic and height/magic. I know we're trying not to overcode, but I don't see anything wrong with two or three codes on a post, if it needs it. For your example, I'd say 3.4.3 and 3.8.1 Magic ability combined describe the post pretty accurately. And I agree, coding is much easier now that I'm glossing over details and just looking for main topics. Although I'm still probably keeping some stuff that is repetitive, since repetition is easier to verify during review than during coding. -Kelly From kakearney at comcast.net Wed Apr 13 15:54:16 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 15:54:16 -0000 Subject: Use character code or not? Message-ID: To those of you reviewing the huge character codes (i.e. Harry, Snape, etc.), should I use a character code when a specific event involving that character is being discussed? For example, a thread discussing Snape's reaction to Sirius' appearance in GOF The Parting of Ways. Just code to the chapter, or add Snape and Sirius codes as well? -Kelly From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Wed Apr 13 19:06:03 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 19:06:03 -0000 Subject: Graveyard scene/Blondes/Character's ages& codes/Dormice Message-ID: Kelly: Does the new 1.2.8.9 Graveyard re-birth (GoF) category include discussion about what Voldemort's plan was if the kill-Harry part went as planned? I'm strongly leaning towards using 1.2.8.9, since the post really is discussing Voldy's hypothetical agenda during that scene, unless there are any objections. Carolyn: I'm ok with coding it to Voldie's agenda and 1.2.8.9. Once I get to that post under the agenda heading, I'll have made a decision about whether to keep it on repetition or other grounds. ****************** KathyW: I've come across discusions on physical descriptions and possible meanings. For the time being I've put it under 3.4.3 Physical types and metabolism but it sort of fits under 3.4.6 grooming. Only it isn't either. It's a case of how does beauty/ugly fit with magic or expectations. Or "what do the different types of noses mean?" I'm sure at some point there will be/was a discussion about hair color/magic and height/magic. Carolyn: Is this the 'JKR doesn't like blondes' discussion that comes up from time to time?? Always thought it a bit odd, since she is blonde. I agree your choice of codes sounds alright, unless it gets into one of the moral arguments about appearances vs true character. ************ KathyW: Carolyn, I'm going to do a batch of 100 codes then go review characters' ages. Unless there is a different heading you'd rather I do. C- no, I thought you were doing that section anyway. Could you double check that you are listed as such in both review DB?? ******************* Kelly: To those of you reviewing the huge character codes (i.e. Harry, Snape, etc.), should I use a character code when a specific event involving that character is being discussed? For example, a thread discussing Snape's reaction to Sirius' appearance in GOF The Parting of Ways. Just code to the chapter, or add Snape and Sirius codes as well? Carolyn: I would add the character code, and leave it the brave reviewer to sort out. Only way forward, alas. ********** Pip ::sliding gently back into the bottom of the teacup for another snooze:: C- Now where is Dot, our resident ecologist? She'd know all about the hibernation habits of dormice. From kking0731 at gmail.com Thu Apr 14 01:04:38 2005 From: kking0731 at gmail.com (snow15145) Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2005 01:04:38 -0000 Subject: Use character code or not? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "corinthum" wrote: > > To those of you reviewing the huge character codes (i.e. Harry, Snape, > etc.), should I use a character code when a specific event involving > that character is being discussed? For example, a thread discussing > Snape's reaction to Sirius' appearance in GOF The Parting of Ways. > Just code to the chapter, or add Snape and Sirius codes as well? > > -Kelly Hi Kelly, It appears to me as though these threads start out as a chapter type discussion and veer off to a particular character(s) in that scene and eventually cultivate to just the character themselves. If the post were discussing everyone involved during that scene, I would only code to the chapter but if it veers off strongly to a particular character(s) analysis, I would code to that character(s) as well as the chapter. In this particular example, if the post were discussing both Sirius and Snape's point of view during this scene, I would code to both of the characters plus the chapter to keep it in that chapter code as well. Hope that helps and/or makes sense Snow From spotthedungbeetle at hotmail.com Thu Apr 14 11:52:37 2005 From: spotthedungbeetle at hotmail.com (dungrollin) Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2005 11:52:37 -0000 Subject: Graveyard scene/Blondes/Character's ages& codes/Dormice In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Pip > ::sliding gently back into the bottom of the teacup for another > snooze:: > > C- Now where is Dot, our resident ecologist? She'd know all about the > hibernation habits of dormice. She's limbering up for the 100m deadline hurdles, (the object being to avoid meeting any deadline in your 100m lane without undue show of energy, extra points for good sailing style, showy near-misses penalised). I believe there are a number of species of periodical dormice, which, unlike their cicadid namesakes, have a variable periodicity, and emerge after any prime number of days/weeks/months*. Correct identification is almost impossible without detailed dental records, though tea-drinking habits can be used to rule out a number of cryptic species. Dot * Tempusfugit & Glisglis (2003) argued that with only three interacting behavioural rules a chaotic pattern of emergence could be displayed, such that contact with the dominant parasitoid (as yet undescribed, but for the moment coded HPfGU-cat, specimens deposited in YAHOO coll.) is almost perpetually avoided. They were attacked vociferously in a number of high-ranking journals, yet their basic premise remains to be discredited. From quigonginger at yahoo.com Thu Apr 14 12:18:01 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2005 05:18:01 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Coding and Physical types In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050414121801.7664.qmail@web60501.mail.yahoo.com> Kathy W: Is everyone else finding coding to be easier now having gone through the review process? Ginger: Oh yes! Lots easier, and more fun too! Kathy W. : I've come across discusions on physical descriptions and possible meanings. For the time being I've put it under 3.4.3 Physical types and metabolism but it sort of fits under 3.4.6 grooming. Only it isn't either. It's a case of how does beauty/ugly fit with magic or expectations. Or "what do the different types of noses mean?" I'm sure at some point there will be/was a discussion about hair color/magic and height/magic. Ginger: Now this raised a question for me. I was thinking of the posts I have seen about beauty and ugliness as a stereotype. Good Lily is pretty. Bad Petunia is horse-faced. That sort of thing. I was going to recommend the stereotypes category if applicable, but I checked its definition, and now I'm not sure if I quite understand it. Is this what it is talking about? Anyone? I'm not really sure. Ginger, the Eternally Confused, who agrees with everything Dot said in the last post, even though she (Ginger) didn't understand a word of it. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From elfundeb at comcast.net Sat Apr 16 05:07:42 2005 From: elfundeb at comcast.net (Debbie) Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2005 01:07:42 -0400 Subject: Reader Response and ESE! Message-ID: <003201c54242$38b94d70$1102a8c0@your4105e587b6> I'm finally finished with 1.2.4, Authorial Intent, Reader Response & Subversive Readings and all of its subcategories. 1.2.4 has been reduced from 588 (plus about 15 posts that Carolyn and/or Sean sneaked into the category after I started chopping, plus the posts I axed from Authorial Intent before the merge) to 280 - more than 50%. The good news is that I cut nothing from the last 20 or so, meaning that the late add-ons really did belong here. Only subcategory worth a mention is 1.2.4.4. ESE! I cut it down from 94 to 84, but the real problem with this category is not that it's too fat; it's too lean. Lots of ESE Lupin, but Pippin's original post is missing. Likewise Elkins' Minerva McGonagall Is Ever So Evil. In fact, a high percentage of the posts are defenses which begin with "so many posters are claiming that [name any character] will turn out to be evil." Yet the actual accusations are not there. How do we fix this? Should we try? The category looks oddly incomplete. I'm going back to coding for the time being (especially now that the taxes are done), that is as soon as I remember whether my tool of choice is a machete or an axe. Debbie -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ewetoo at gmail.com Fri Apr 15 06:47:04 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2005 16:47:04 +1000 Subject: argh Message-ID: <91d14f32050414234712e17fce@mail.gmail.com> I've just discovered that gmail isn't getting my emails from my home machine due to timeouts, so I've been blissfully unaware they haven't been getting around (I seem to have one problem after another). If the original comes in, this is to let you all know, it's gmail's fault not mine :) So once again (assuming gmail's own interface can get this through): 44401-44500 24 rejects Call me suspicious, but do I detect a posting trend in the List? If you mention Sorting, Houses, or Teachers, it must be about how Snape really isn't a Slytherin. There's more to it than that, it seems any excuse is valid to OT back to our apparently consuming Snape passion. I wish I could say there was more of interest in this batch but sadly there is only one thing: I urge you all to read and sing along to #44422, and if you are unfamiliar with the tune go here: http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00004SWBH/qid=1113451794/sr=2-1/ref=sr_2_11_1/026-9628998-0025218 and click on Lobachevsky, track 5, disc 2 to be enlightened (if you have a recent version of realplayer this will be useless as it's using the old realone .ra format. Grrr.). As I'm currently reading Bill Bryson's 'A Short History of Nearly Everything' with its colourful history of scientific skullduggery, this is more than appropriate, it is a joy. Taking on 44701-44800 as marked. -- Emacs is an alright OS, but it lacks a decent editor. From quigonginger at yahoo.com Fri Apr 15 12:50:11 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2005 12:50:11 -0000 Subject: review of the review (3.16.whatever-3.17.2) Message-ID: Just to start on a happy note, isn't it thrilling that our posts are now rightside up? Now to the review. Everyone comfy? Pets: Was 31, now 20. Rejected 4 that were repeats, uncoded 5 nothing new, and 2 mistakes (wondering why Neville was allowed to bring a toad when the letter said cat or rat or owl) Uniforms: Was 21, now 17. I rejected 1 as nothing new, and uncoded 3 that were part of multiposts and added nothing new. Terms/Holidays: Was 30, now 18. Rejected 3 nothing new, 3 OT, and uncoded 5 nothing new, and 1 that I think was clicked by mistake. Other Wizarding Schools: Ginger pauses, and offers Carolyn a nice cup of tea, makes sure she has completly swallowed and set the cup safely on the desk. Was 227, now 84. 62 rejects, 81 uncoded. Ginger pauses and passes Carolyn the smelling salts. The definition of the category reads: "For discussions about where children go before Hogwarts, or if they don't get admitted to it, or if they live in another country, plus post-Hogwart education theories." JKR has said in interviews that Magical children are homeschooled, that all Magical British children go to Hogwarts, and that there is no University system in the WW. Most of the conversations go something like: "I think there are Wizard primary schools." "JKR said there weren't." x3 posts "I think there are anyway." "JKR said no." x3 posts "Hi, I'm a newbie. Does anyone know where kids go before Hogwarts?" repeat ad infinitum. I kept some of the better theories involving small dame schools, tutoring (usually Draco) and things like that, but got rid of the "is not, is too" stuff. The same for post-ed. I kept indepth apprenticeship posts, but dropped "I think they just go out and learn as they work." posts. There were many. I was amused at one person who thought that it would be impossible for Molly to homeschool as she wouldn't have time because she has all those kids. The tricky part of this category was deciding which posts had gone too far OT. There was a lot of discussion about schools in other countries. I kept the ones that figured out how many schools there may be in other parts of the world, and what they might teach-basicly anything that tied into canon. I rejected anything that said, "I think there are wizards where I live." and followed it with what could well be a cut and paste from the local tourism board. One thing I noticed a lot (quite a bit of the uncoding) was that posts that mentioned Durmstrang and/or Beaubatons, even in passing, were coded here. Most were coded to their own categoried as well. If they were just mention in passing, I dumped my code. For some reason, people tend to code stuff about Hogwarts here. Hmm. There were also a lot of good, indepth posts about other topics, in which someone wondered where Wizards learned specific things. There were also a ton coded to both this and admittance to Hogwarts that I thought fit better there. I'd say all in all, about 1/3 of the rejects were "JKR said..." posts. I have to say I was more lenient in what I kept here than in any other category I have reviewed. And I'm still trying to get over those Texas animals that squirt blood out of their eyes. Finally, Triwizard Tournament: Was 44, now 38. Rejected 1 that was a repeat, uncoded 5 that mentioned it only in passing (including one that thought book 5 was supposed to be HP and the TWT). I have assigned myself posts 44901-45000. I think that adds up to 100 posts, but I keep thinking my maths may be off. Ginger, who can't believe she is still awake! From quigonginger at yahoo.com Fri Apr 15 13:03:41 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2005 13:03:41 -0000 Subject: another moment of confusion Message-ID: When you look at "mistakes/perpetuating mistakes" it says to reject things that we know now that weren't known at the time (eg the "married couple" to whom Sirius refered). How far do we take that? And what effect does it have on predictions? For example, there are a TON of "Who will die in book 5" posts. We now know who it was. (sniff) so these go under predictions, right? The entire 4th man Avery ship sank, but that's still good to code, right? What kinds of things do we reject? Ginger, the Eternally Confused From stevejjen at earthlink.net Fri Apr 15 19:49:17 2005 From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese) Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2005 19:49:17 -0000 Subject: another moment of confusion In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "quigonginger" wrote: > > When you look at "mistakes/perpetuating mistakes" it says to reject > things that we know now that weren't known at the time (eg the "married > couple" to whom Sirius refered). > > How far do we take that? And what effect does it have on predictions? > > For example, there are a TON of "Who will die in book 5" posts. We now > know who it was. (sniff) so these go under predictions, right? > > The entire 4th man Avery ship sank, but that's still good to code, > right? > > What kinds of things do we reject? > > Ginger, the Eternally Confused Jen: I'm wondering this, too. I haven't rejected many with this code, but just yesterday I debated over a post saying "how do we know Snape was ever picked on in school?" Now, it's still subjective in some poster's eyes, but I thought the Pensieve scene made it clear that on at least *one* occasion, Snape was indeed picked on. So I rejected that under perpretrating mistakes. Am I putting my own bias on that one? The post didn't add much else so I would have rejected it anyway. But I wanted to use something other than my fave, "Adds nothing new" and this looked like a legitimate opportunity. Jen with no answers, just more questions... From kakearney at comcast.net Fri Apr 15 20:07:04 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2005 20:07:04 -0000 Subject: another moment of confusion In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ginger wrote: > > When you look at "mistakes/perpetuating mistakes" it says to > reject > > things that we know now that weren't known at the time (eg > the "married > > couple" to whom Sirius refered). > > > > How far do we take that? And what effect does it have on > predictions? And Jen added: > I'm wondering this, too. I haven't rejected many with this > code, but just yesterday I debated over a post saying "how do we > know Snape was ever picked on in school?" Now, it's still subjective > in some poster's eyes, but I thought the Pensieve scene made it > clear that on at least *one* occasion, Snape was indeed picked on. > So I rejected that under perpretrating mistakes. > > Am I putting my own bias on that one? The post didn't add much else > so I would have rejected it anyway. But I wanted to use something > other than my fave, "Adds nothing new" and this looked like a > legitimate opportunity. Now me: I'll echo the confusion on this one. I use it only for posting mistakes, i.e. the poster should have known the detail at the time he or she posted. I've mentioned before that I don't think we should toss well-developed theories (or even not-perfectly-developed) theories based on the fact that subsequent books proved them wrong, because these theories are part of the history of this list. Someone may want to look up Fourth Man even knowing it was wrong. -Kelly From ewetoo at gmail.com Fri Apr 15 22:55:56 2005 From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2) Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2005 08:55:56 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: another moment of confusion In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <91d14f3205041515555e00d46@mail.gmail.com> On 4/16/05, corinthum wrote: > Now me: > > I'll echo the confusion on this one. I use it only for posting > mistakes, i.e. the poster should have known the detail at the time he > or she posted. I've mentioned before that I don't think we should > toss well-developed theories (or even not-perfectly-developed) > theories based on the fact that subsequent books proved them wrong, > because these theories are part of the history of this list. Someone > may want to look up Fourth Man even knowing it was wrong. > > -Kelly If it's in the VFAQ, or JKR has ruled it out, I think it's fair to reject: Fourth Man is quite valid to keep around, but insisting that Sirius is in Slytherin is not. -- Emacs is an alright OS, but it lacks a decent editor. From elfundeb at comcast.net Fri Apr 15 23:21:09 2005 From: elfundeb at comcast.net (elfundeb at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2005 23:21:09 +0000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: another moment of confusion Message-ID: <041520052321.24607.42604C64000C2ECE0000601F22007374780D0A0B029A00040A@comcast.net> Kelly: > > I'll echo the confusion on this one. I use it only for posting > mistakes, i.e. the poster should have known the detail at the time he > or she posted. I've mentioned before that I don't think we should > toss well-developed theories (or even not-perfectly-developed) > theories based on the fact that subsequent books proved them wrong, > because these theories are part of the history of this list. Someone > may want to look up Fourth Man even knowing it was wrong. Sean: <> Two thoughts: (1) JKR is so inconsistent, and corrects herself so often, that it's hard to know what she's ruled out. She's probably reliable when it comes to Sirius' house, but in my view the Weasleys' ages are still wholly unsettled. So I'd err on the side of caution, remembering that what one person thinks is settled is, to someone else, an invitation to speculation. (2) Even assuming JKR definitively said Sirius was not a Slytherin, I'd keep a well presented post arguing that MWPP represented the four Hogwarts houses, or one that argues well that Sirius has Slytherin traits. I would, however, toss unsupported assertions or predictions, and mindless repetition, in the trash. So, I'm with Kelly on this one. Debbie whose has computer lost its internet connection again -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From stevejjen at earthlink.net Sat Apr 16 03:20:01 2005 From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese) Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2005 03:20:01 -0000 Subject: CW: Do we still notify on-list? Message-ID: Can you tell the date we've finished a batch of codes by looking at the database (for your weekly update), or do we still need to inform you on-list? Jen, done with 42101-42200 and grabbed another batch. From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sat Apr 16 14:24:34 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2005 07:24:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: another moment of confusion In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050416142434.19798.qmail@web60504.mail.yahoo.com> ewe2 wrote: If it's in the VFAQ, or JKR has ruled it out, I think it's fair to reject: Fourth Man is quite valid to keep around, but insisting that Sirius is in Slytherin is not. Ginger: Thank you (and Deb, Kelly and Jen too!) This makes sense now. Basicly, if someone says "I think this will happen." Or "According to my theory, this would be so." then we keep it (assuming it holds to standards). But if they say "I think Remus' middle name was Harry." then we kick it out as JKR has stated it was John. So, in other words, if it is part of list history, we keep it, if it is something that came as a result of poor reading or mind altering substances, it goes out. Not that some good theories may not have had mind altering substances involved. Any more thoughts? Ginger, who thinks she may as well keep The Eternally Confused as a moniker. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Plan great trips with Yahoo! Travel: Now over 17,000 guides! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sat Apr 16 16:48:02 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2005 16:48:02 -0000 Subject: Dormice/ESE!/DBase/Ginger the slasher/perpetrating mistakes Message-ID: Dot: I believe there are a number of species of periodical dormice, which, unlike their cicadid namesakes, have a variable periodicity, and emerge after any prime number of days/weeks/months*. Carolyn: An interesting thesis. Other researchers, such as Kneasy et al. (2003, 2004) have also pointed to a change in global list environment threatening their habitat. However, some species (particularly those exhibiting tannin-stained molars), have evolved a highly-unusual defensive strategy through association with larger mammals such as canus lupus. As far as can be determined, humans intent on eradicating the litter of papers generated by dormice nests quickly become prey for the larger scavenger. Recent sightings of canus lupus in the wastelands of YAHOO primary coll. may indicate re-emergence of the species, as it scents new canon in the air. **************** Debbie: Only subcategory worth a mention is 1.2.4.4. ESE! I cut it down from 94 to 84, but the real problem with this category is not that it's too fat; it's too lean. Lots of ESE Lupin, but Pippin's original post is missing. Likewise Elkins' Minerva McGonagall Is Ever So Evil. In fact, a high percentage of the posts are defenses which begin with "so many posters are claiming that [name any character] will turn out to be evil." Yet the actual accusations are not there. How do we fix this? Should we try? The category looks oddly incomplete. Carolyn: Should we be putting the actual ESE! theories here? I have got Pippin's first post under ESE!Lupin (and indeed, many precursors to it - she had her teeth into him from waaaaaay back). Similarly we have ESE!McGonagall. It could get very big. Perhaps we should reserve it for the idea of suggesting various characters are ESE!, ie a subset of subversion. Or, simply have only one post there - the one that coined it (does that exist?) ********* Jen: Can you tell the date we've finished a batch of codes by looking at the database (for your weekly update), or do we still need to inform you on-list? Carolyn: No need to post here, I can look at the list in the database, which I am also continuing to keep in hard copy in case of any slip ups by Yahoo. ****************** Ginger: Other Wizarding Schools: Ginger pauses, and offers Carolyn a nice cup of tea, makes sure she has completly swallowed and set the cup safely on the desk. Was 227, now 84. 62 rejects, 81 uncoded. Ginger pauses and passes Carolyn the smelling salts. I have to say I was more lenient in what I kept here than in any other category I have reviewed. And I'm still trying to get over those Texas animals that squirt blood out of their eyes. Carolyn: Really, no apologies needed...the question is, do we now have permission to reject almost anything else on the subject?? & does Amanda breed these things under her porch?? Or just thwack 'em? Good training for being an HPfGU mod, either way. I have assigned myself posts 44901-45000. I think that adds up to 100 posts, but I keep thinking my maths may be off. Ginger, who can't believe she is still awake! Carolyn: Another heroic job.. and the math is a bit like working out how old you are. You have to remember to include the 12 months between being born and being 1 year old...at least I do, on the nasty occasions when I have to own up. ********* Ginger: When you look at "mistakes/perpetuating mistakes" it says to reject things that we know now that weren't known at the time (eg the "married couple" to whom Sirius refered). Kelly: I'll echo the confusion on this one. I use it only for posting mistakes, i.e. the poster should have known the detail at the time he or she posted. Sean: If it's in the VFAQ, or JKR has ruled it out, I think it's fair to reject: Fourth Man is quite valid to keep around, but insisting that Sirius is in Slytherin is not. Debbie: So I'd err on the side of caution, remembering that what one person thinks is settled is, to someone else, an invitation to speculation. (2) Even assuming JKR definitively said Sirius was not a Slytherin, I'd keep a well presented post arguing that MWPP represented the four Hogwarts houses, or one that argues well that Sirius has Slytherin traits. I would, however, toss unsupported assertions or predictions, and mindless repetition, in the trash. Ginger: So, in other words, if it is part of list history, we keep it, if it is something that came as a result of poor reading or mind altering substances, it goes out. Not that some good theories may not have had mind altering substances involved. Carolyn: Yes, we've had this discussion a few times now. It is hard to be definitive. I always chuck things based on wrong canon, like the idiot I found the other day who was insisting it was the basilisk that killed Tom Riddle's parents, not Tom. However, I'd get a bit upset chucking out the wonderful Avery theories; apart from anything else, they are not all completely disproved. Since we know nothing very much about Avery, who's to say what back history might be revealed subsequently? The grain of truth in their fabulous inventiveness is that he *does* behave like an abject neurotic hysteric, as does Peter on occasion.. all grist to the mill if she is exploring cowardice and terror and why people betray others. I am also with Debbie on keeping a well-argued MWPP post sorting them into different houses, firstly because we still don't quite know about Peter, and secondly because we may also find out that the Sorting Hat asked similar questions of Sirius (and maybe Lupin) as it did of Harry when he was sorted - ie, they would do well in Slytherin (or another house). I suppose I am saying I reject very little on the mistakes code. I tend to mostly use 'adds nothing new' - which gets a lot of exercise. Carolyn From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Sat Apr 16 17:27:15 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 03:27:15 +1000 Subject: argh again Message-ID: <20050416172715.GG22228@4dot0.net> 'cuse this test: desperately trying to get any email sent to yahoo without resorting to the web dungeon. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Sat Apr 16 18:32:12 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 04:32:12 +1000 Subject: another moment of desperation... Message-ID: <91d14f320504161132f0aadb4@mail.gmail.com> I've been forced to use this addy again, since my home addy refuses to post properly. One more time with feeling: On Sat, Apr 16, 2005 at 07:24:34AM -0700, Ginger wrote: > Ginger: Thank you (and Deb, Kelly and Jen too!) > This makes sense now. Basicly, if someone says "I think this will happen." > Or "According to my theory, this would be so." then we keep it (assuming it > holds to standards). But if they say "I think Remus' middle name was > Harry." then we kick it out as JKR has stated it was John. Just to reiterate: you have to take JKR's word as an author, even if she is as sneaky as Christie. If she says the Marauders were in Gryffindor, we have to accept that, otherwise nothing is inaccurate theory and we keep everything. You may prefer canon as the last resort; like Talisman, I believe some questions will never be answered by canon nor JKR, but I can always be wrong. > So, in other words, if it is part of list history, we keep it, if it is > something that came as a result of poor reading or mind altering substances, > it goes out. Not that some good theories may not have had mind altering > substances involved. For instance TBAY. The cookies are frankly suspicious and the tea is definitely laced with something. There's too much giggling. And I could rule out half the SHIPs, but again, until a definite pronouncement is made (however obvious it is to right-thinking people), we must let those poor deluded H/H shippers have their day. > Any more thoughts? > > Ginger, who thinks she may as well keep The Eternally Confused as a moniker. I may as well be called The Permanently Disconnected, I've had to change my email for Yahoo lists _again_ because of smtp problems. My isp holds the world land speed record for being slower than tortoises and hasn't even taken my money for almost a month now. Getting answers out of them seems a hopeless task. Sean. -- Emacs is an alright OS, but it lacks a decent editor. From kakearney at comcast.net Sun Apr 17 01:57:55 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 01:57:55 -0000 Subject: Graveyard scene Message-ID: I can't seem to get through more than five posts without consulting the group, can I? Anyway, the culprit this time is post 40443, where Pippin mentions parallels between the graveyard scene and historical anti-Semitic ritual murders. I really have no clue where to put this one (besides the obvious 1.2.8.9 Graveyard re-birth (GoF)). Authorial intent? -Kelly From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sun Apr 17 12:31:46 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 12:31:46 -0000 Subject: Graveyard scene In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "corinthum" wrote: > > I can't seem to get through more than five posts without consulting > the group, can I? > > Anyway, the culprit this time is post 40443, where Pippin mentions > parallels between the graveyard scene and historical anti-Semitic > ritual murders. I really have no clue where to put this one (besides > the obvious 1.2.8.9 Graveyard re-birth (GoF)). Authorial intent? > > > -Kelly Hm, Pippin's grip on history and horror is always so reliably unpleasant. I think I might add 1.1.1.1 Religious influences. Carolyn From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sun Apr 17 13:08:01 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 06:08:01 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Dormice/ESE!/DBase/Ginger the slasher/perpetrating mistakes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20050417130801.66028.qmail@web60502.mail.yahoo.com> Carolyn: An interesting thesis. Other researchers, such as Kneasy et al. (2003, 2004) have also pointed to a change in global list environment threatening their habitat. However, some species (particularly those exhibiting tannin-stained molars), have evolved a highly-unusual defensive strategy through association with larger mammals such as canus lupus. As far as can be determined, humans intent on eradicating the litter of papers generated by dormice nests quickly become prey for the larger scavenger. Recent sightings of canus lupus in the wastelands of YAHOO primary coll. may indicate re-emergence of the species, as it scents new canon in the air. Ginger attempts a translation: Kneasy quit cuz sum uv us'ns are kinda dum, 'n' Pip ain't been heared from much cuza that too, but Grey Wolf done wrote a few posts, and that's cool. **************** Carolyn: Really, no apologies needed...the question is, do we now have permission to reject almost anything else on the subject?? & does Amanda breed these things under her porch?? Or just thwack 'em? Good training for being an HPfGU mod, either way. Ginger: I would think that anything debating what JKR has said should be pretty darn interesting and well-thought out if we are going to add it to the category. Anyone finding a canon point that would discredit JRK's statements would be fine, but personal opinion has been done to death to the point that the carcass is filing for overtime pay. Even the vultures are bored with it. The same can go for any mention of Bill's penfriend from Brazil. He's there. We know it. Enough. I'd say, in short, unless new canon or a new find in canon brings on any reason, this subject is generally as full as it gets. It may not hurt to browse a few posts if you are tempted to add to it. Carolyn: Another heroic job.. and the math is a bit like working out how old you are. You have to remember to include the 12 months between being born and being 1 year old...at least I do, on the nasty occasions when I have to own up. Ginger: (blushes at the thanks): I have no trouble remembering how old I am. The first Superbowl was played when I was 7 months old, so in any given year, I turn whatever number the Superbowl was. ********* Carolyn: Yes, we've had this discussion a few times now. It is hard to be definitive. I always chuck things based on wrong canon, like the idiot I found the other day who was insisting it was the basilisk that killed Tom Riddle's parents, not Tom. Ginger, blushing deeper: Erm, that's the thread I had in mind when I asked the question. I kept posts that noted the canonical similarities between basilisk death and AK death. I kept some of the beginning statements, and chucked the back and forth 'snot-'stoo. I rejected the point where I think you may have picked it up, where they were discussing how the basilisk could have gotten from Hogwarts to Little H. through the pipes. "Could not. Could too. They have pipes there. Duh, but not from Scotland to England. How else do they get their water? Duh, seperate lakes." Should I go back and whack more? Or leave it for the person who next reviews basilisk and AK to decide? Ginger, wondering if she should continue her education. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sun Apr 17 13:21:51 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 06:21:51 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: another moment of desperation... In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050417132151.47124.qmail@web60507.mail.yahoo.com> Sean, the Permanently Disconnected (I had read that as Discontented, which is probably true too) said: For instance TBAY. The cookies are frankly suspicious and the tea is definitely laced with something. There's too much giggling. And I could rule out half the SHIPs, but again, until a definite pronouncement is made (however obvious it is to right-thinking people), we must let those poor deluded H/H shippers have their day. Ginger: I think TBAY should be kept for posterity, perhaps only under the TBAY category and under the acronyms if the theory doesn't pan out. It was a fun place to be in its glory days. Well stocked bar, and tasty cookies to boot. I am in total agreement with you on ships, except that I think H/H should be kept in the permanent file as a warning to future posters on the perils of wishful thinking. Now watch, just because I said that, Ron will run off with a Quidditch groupie and Harry will catch Herm on the rebound. And they'll all live happily ever after. Oh, yes, and Ginny will invent a reconsitituted soul potion, save Snape from the dementors, and they will live next door to H/H and Neville and his wife, Fleur, who will be finished with shallow guys by then. Bill will become a tiger animagus and keep Remus company during that time of the month, and they will stop over to Ginny's for tea on Remus' good days. Ginger, who will never be JKR, and the world rejoices. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Plan great trips with Yahoo! Travel: Now over 17,000 guides! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From willsonkmom at msn.com Sun Apr 17 19:02:50 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 19:02:50 -0000 Subject: Dormice/ESE!/DBase/Ginger the slasher/perpetrating mistakes In-Reply-To: <20050417130801.66028.qmail@web60502.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > Carolyn: > An interesting thesis. Other researchers, such as Kneasy et al. > (2003, 2004) have also pointed to a change in global list environment > threatening their habitat. However, some species (particularly those > exhibiting tannin-stained molars), have evolved a highly-unusual > defensive strategy through association with larger mammals such as > canus lupus. As far as can be determined, humans intent on > eradicating the litter of papers generated by dormice nests quickly > become prey for the larger scavenger. Recent sightings of canus lupus > in the wastelands of YAHOO primary coll. may indicate re-emergence of > the species, as it scents new canon in the air. > > > Ginger attempts a translation: > > Kneasy quit cuz sum uv us'ns are kinda dum, 'n' Pip ain't been heared from much cuza that too, but Grey Wolf done wrote a few posts, and that's cool. > Potioncat: Thanks for the translation, Ginger. Now, how can we get them back? Will the new canon be enough? I've coded a number of posts about the location of the common rooms. Some had to do with why the locations are secret and some with actual locations. It's a good thing you actually removed the little box or I would have coded to Houses. Instead I put some in passwords and some into layout of Hogwarts. Now it feels very wrong to have more than 2 codes to a post! Kathy W...trying to avoid responding to the troll on the main site. And knowing not everyone thinks he's a troll. From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sun Apr 17 19:16:47 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 19:16:47 -0000 Subject: UPDATE, Sunday 17th April Message-ID: PROGRESS 51538 posts coded to date, 28484 rejected (55.2%). With a surprising turnout of 8 people coding this week, we did 655 posts...well, it's double last week's score :( There are now 49 of the 105 review sections done. Carolyn Wondering how Potioncat distinguishes between trolls on the main list From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Sun Apr 17 21:25:55 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 07:25:55 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: another moment of desperation... In-Reply-To: <20050417132151.47124.qmail@web60507.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20050417132151.47124.qmail@web60507.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050417212555.GD20194@4dot0.net> On Sun, Apr 17, 2005 at 06:21:51AM -0700, Ginger wrote: > I think TBAY should be kept for posterity, perhaps only under the TBAY > category and under the acronyms if the theory doesn't pan out. It was a fun > place to be in its glory days. Well stocked bar, and tasty cookies to boot. I sigh with relief when I see a TBAY post 'cos it's a one-tickker :) Perhaps owing to our limited mental capacities it is necessary that such simple categories exist. > I am in total agreement with you on ships, except that I think H/H should be > kept in the permanent file as a warning to future posters on the perils of > wishful thinking. Yes. With 'HA HA Duh Freddy!' written in big block letters at the top. > Now watch, just because I said that, Ron will run off with a Quidditch > groupie and Harry will catch Herm on the rebound. And they'll all live > happily ever after. Except for Snape, whose new job is to clean the Dept. of Mysteries floors, and report every three hours for his anti-fur serum. > Oh, yes, and Ginny will invent a reconsitituted soul potion, save Snape from > the dementors, and they will live next door to H/H and Neville and his wife, > Fleur, who will be finished with shallow guys by then. Bill will become a > tiger animagus and keep Remus company during that time of the month, and > they will stop over to Ginny's for tea on Remus' good days. Meanwhile Bill and Charlie have formed the Dragon Excavators, a successful if a little frightening company with the added bonus that if you don't pay up for their services your're dragon scat. Gred and Forge bought out Microsoft in a hostile takeover and XP actually works but still trys to catch you out with joke BSOD's and fake email viruses. > Ginger, who will never be JKR, and the world rejoices. Sean, who should be coding!!! -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sun Apr 17 21:33:14 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 21:33:14 -0000 Subject: Coding TBAYs In-Reply-To: <20050417212555.GD20194@4dot0.net> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, ewe2 wrote: > On Sun, Apr 17, 2005 at 06:21:51AM -0700, Ginger wrote: > > > I think TBAY should be kept for posterity, perhaps only under the TBAY > > category and under the acronyms if the theory doesn't pan out. It was a fun > > place to be in its glory days. Well stocked bar, and tasty cookies to boot. Sean replied: > I sigh with relief when I see a TBAY post 'cos it's a one- tickker :) Perhaps > owing to our limited mental capacities it is necessary that such simple > categories exist. > Carolyn: Erm, I am not sure TBAY is a simple as this. Although the single TBAY code might be sufficient if the post is only in that style and not really to the point about anything much, more likely it should attract some other codes, depending on the theory being discussed. ::worry:: From willsonkmom at msn.com Sun Apr 17 21:45:48 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 21:45:48 -0000 Subject: Reader Response and ESE! In-Reply-To: <003201c54242$38b94d70$1102a8c0@your4105e587b6> Message-ID: Debbie said: Lots of ESE Lupin, but Pippin's original post is missing. Likewise Elkins' Minerva McGonagall Is Ever So Evil. Potioncat: This made me nervous, so I went back and looked. I did the McGonagall review and we did add an ESE!McGonagall heading. Elkin's ESE!Minerva is there. Porphyria has a few posts too. A troll is any obnoxious person I don't agree with. I am well aware that what I find obnoxious, others may find clever, and vice versa. It is however, only my opinion that counts and I do wish people would quit feeding the troll! Maybe I should just quit reading the main list until after the HBP comes out. That would of course, give me more time to review and code... From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Sun Apr 17 22:08:16 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 08:08:16 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Coding TBAYs In-Reply-To: References: <20050417212555.GD20194@4dot0.net> Message-ID: <20050417220816.GE20194@4dot0.net> On Sun, Apr 17, 2005 at 09:33:14PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > > Carolyn: > Erm, I am not sure TBAY is a simple as this. Although the single TBAY > code might be sufficient if the post is only in that style and not > really to the point about anything much, more likely it should > attract some other codes, depending on the theory being discussed. I think you'll find that in the majority of cases, either you put it down to the general TBAY cat, or you code for anything up to 4 or 5 theories on *most* TBAY posts. Even 3 is too much. And as TBAY is really a kind of commentary on the theories rather than really advancing the theories themselves (examples please if you disagree), that's appropriate. I'm more concerned that we don't have a clever/stupid category for Voldemort as he really is exhibiting signs of Evil Overlord Syndrome. Joking aside, there IS a thread of intellectual superiority in the Potterverse which JKR ruthlessly exploits, and perhaps it's worth a cat? > ::worry:: Chinese worry balls on standby! (New Red Dwarf DVD yay :) -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Sun Apr 17 22:24:42 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 08:24:42 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Reader Response and ESE! In-Reply-To: References: <003201c54242$38b94d70$1102a8c0@your4105e587b6> Message-ID: <20050417222442.GG20194@4dot0.net> On Sun, Apr 17, 2005 at 09:45:48PM -0000, potioncat wrote: > A troll is any obnoxious person I don't agree with. I am well aware > that what I find obnoxious, others may find clever, and vice versa. It > is however, only my opinion that counts and I do wish people would quit > feeding the troll! Maybe I should just quit reading the main list until > after the HBP comes out. There, there, I told the kids off :) -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Mon Apr 18 16:39:20 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 16:39:20 -0000 Subject: Coding TBAYs In-Reply-To: <20050417220816.GE20194@4dot0.net> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, ewe2 wrote: > On Sun, Apr 17, 2005 at 09:33:14PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > > > > Carolyn: > > Erm, I am not sure TBAY is a simple as this. Although the single TBAY > > code might be sufficient if the post is only in that style and not > > really to the point about anything much, more likely it should > > attract some other codes, depending on the theory being discussed. Sean: > I think you'll find that in the majority of cases, either you put it > down to the general TBAY cat, or you code for anything up to 4 or 5 theories > on *most* TBAY posts. Even 3 is too much. And as TBAY is really a kind of > commentary on the theories rather than really advancing the theories > themselves (examples please if you disagree), that's appropriate. > Carolyn: Um, I do disagree (with examples). TBAY is far more than a commentary, it is advancing theories in another style mostly. It is really important that these posts get filed with the relevant theories, not left in a style category where no one will find them. I took a look at the end of the current TBAY collection, at those you had coded like this: 44792, 44800 These are about GARBAGESCOW and Percy 43161, 43166, 432221 These are about FIRST MEMORY FRIEND 43232 This is about Fred & George and PRATTLESNAKE 44258 This is actually about Crouch Sr and Big Bangs & ambushes Apologies, but we need to agree the right approach here. Carolyn Hoping JKR kills Lupinlore off in HBP. From willsonkmom at msn.com Mon Apr 18 16:50:11 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (Kathy Willson) Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 12:50:11 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Coding TBAYs References: Message-ID: Carolyn: Hoping JKR kills Lupinlore off in HBP. Potioncat: I'll be disappointed if she doesn't. But I won't burn my books. Finished my coding batch. Working on ages. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Mon Apr 18 18:10:00 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 04:10:00 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Coding TBAYs In-Reply-To: References: <20050417220816.GE20194@4dot0.net> Message-ID: <20050418181000.GG19327@4dot0.net> On Mon, Apr 18, 2005 at 04:39:20PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > Carolyn: > Um, I do disagree (with examples). > > TBAY is far more than a commentary, it is advancing theories in > another style mostly. It is really important that these posts get > filed with the relevant theories, not left in a style category where > no one will find them. Well this is the problem: do we treat TBAY differently as a category or not? You seem to be saying no we can't. If that's so then why set TBAY apart? Let's remove TBAY as a category unto itself, and concentrate on its content. As a Listee I've never seen TBAY as anything else but its own thing and I can bet you most Listees (except perhaps the TBAYers themselves) take one look at a TBAY heading and move on, deciding it's a game specific to TBAYers. Now you can beg to differ, but I'm merely expressing in code my attitude in the List world, and have to draw the line somewhere. Just from your examples, only the top two led to any non-TBAY thread, and while you chose TBAY posts that only referenced one or two major subjects, most TBAY posts reference many more, which violates our attempt at keeping our codes focussed. > Carolyn > Hoping JKR kills Lupinlore off in HBP. Surely this attitude of LL is getting beyond List parameters. Otherwise you can say anything you like as long as it's got a bit of canon loosely attached. LL has a right to his opinion, I just don't accept it in the List. Claims of "I have a right to disagree" are giving him legitimacy that he doesn't deserve. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Mon Apr 18 18:57:54 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 18:57:54 -0000 Subject: Coding TBAYs In-Reply-To: <20050418181000.GG19327@4dot0.net> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, ewe2 wrote: > On Mon, Apr 18, 2005 at 04:39:20PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > > Carolyn: > > Um, I do disagree (with examples). > > > > TBAY is far more than a commentary, it is advancing theories in > > another style mostly. It is really important that these posts get > > filed with the relevant theories, not left in a style category where > > no one will find them. Sean: > Well this is the problem: do we treat TBAY differently as a category or not? > You seem to be saying no we can't. If that's so then why set TBAY apart? Let's > remove TBAY as a category unto itself, and concentrate on its content. Carolyn: The reason we have the TBAY category, and why it is down in the Admin section, is because there were some early posts in TBAY style before the decision was made to ask posters to put TBAY in the subject head. We also wanted to make sure we captured all the posts in that style, so that those that don't like it can exclude them from their searches if they like, or conversely, those that like them can pull up the whole lot if they want. That doesn't mean that the posts should not also be coded for their content in each case. As a > Listee I've never seen TBAY as anything else but its own thing and I can bet > you most Listees (except perhaps the TBAYers themselves) take one look at a > TBAY heading and move on, deciding it's a game specific to TBAYers. Now you > can beg to differ, but I'm merely expressing in code my attitude in the List > world, and have to draw the line somewhere. Well, I don't agree. IMO, TBAY is an interesting way of continuing discussions in another style, and certainly it would make a large hole in the development of some theories to leave them out of a run of posts on a particular theme. However, the header code is there for those who want to hop skip and jump past them if they want. I'm sorry you don't like them, but cataloguing is about dealing with all the stuff on the list, not taking sides. I dutifully code up SHIPping, and worse... As to whether most posters want to avoid them, I just don't think you can make such generalisations. The catalogue will be used by all sorts of people who have never encountered the style before. Some will love it, others won't, just as when they first started appearing. > > Just from your examples, only the top two led to any non-TBAY thread, and > while you chose TBAY posts that only referenced one or two major subjects, > most TBAY posts reference many more, which violates our attempt at keeping our > codes focussed. I looked at the posts which you had coded just with the TBAY code, to see what else might be required. The suggestions I made would cover them I think - two or three codes. For others, whilst we need to be minimal in our approach, at the same time if a TBAY post really deserves more codes than that, it should get them. All we are trying to avoid from now on is coding things or characters which are *not* the main point of the post - the 'everything that moves' trap that we'd all fallen into. Carolyn From boyd.t.smythe at fritolay.com Mon Apr 18 22:39:03 2005 From: boyd.t.smythe at fritolay.com (Smythe, Boyd T {FLNA}) Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 17:39:03 -0500 Subject: A Prediction Message-ID: Yes, you heard it here first: I will complete the annoyingly repetitive, often humorous, occasionally insightful category of Predictions--today! That's right, not only will I have uncoded many, but I will have recoded many posts placed in the wrong subcategories! Golly, I'm nearly breathless in anticipation! [insert mental picture of halftime extravaganza featuring Kool & the Gang, the Boston Pops and the entire cast of Cats circa 1987] Great show, y'all! While they clear the stage again, let's check on that bit of scrying...and there it is! Yes, my prediction has come true. Better call Guinness--or better yet send me a beer (or three). Predictions now includes the following codes/#posts: 1.12 **Predictions [0 posts] 1.12.1 ****Book 4/GOF [0 posts] 1.12.1.1 ******Predictions/with canon [12 posts] 1.12.1.2 ******Predictions/no canon [62 posts] 1.12.2 ****Book 5/OOP [0 posts] 1.12.2.1 ******Predictions/with canon [241 posts] 1.12.2.2 ******Predictions/no canon [322 posts] 1.12.3 ****Book 6/HBP [0 posts] 1.12.3.1 ******Predictions/with canon [13 posts] 1.12.3.2 ******Predictions/no canon [37 posts] 1.12.4 ****Book 7 [0 posts] 1.12.4.1 ******Predictions/with canon [50 posts] 1.12.4.2 ******Predictions/no canon [149 posts] 1.12.4.3 ******Final showdown, Harry vs Voldy [70 posts] 1.12.5 ****Future lives of characters after Book 7 [0 posts] 1.12.5.1 ******Predictions/with canon [12 posts] 1.12.5.2 ******Predictions/no canon [57 posts] And that adds up to 1,025 in total. Here are a few good ones: "I've always imagined that, at the end, Voldemort will be stripped of his powers (by Harry, of course) and become more human, literally, by morphing back into a gray-haired Tom Riddle. Then, once Tom Riddle is a Muggle, there are all sorts of fun ways to kill him. :-) How about a nice, medieval public beheading in the middle of Hogsmeade square?" "Love is strong enough to overcome AK as Harry Potter proves. I think that to cast AK it takes pure hatred - and only pure love can beat it! Yet... No counter-curse, not a charm, not a jinx/anti-jinx, not a hex... What about a blessing, given with pure love by a kiss onto child's forehead? Mothers do that all the time." "So why not kill [Harry], and if you're going to do it, I say chapter one final book. Scare the hell out of everyone (on the train maybe, on the muggle motorway on the way to King's cross - not protected... dead). Then defeat Voldemort through that. The total outrage of this loveable, strong, brave, little soldier's untimely demise would surely galvenise the wizarding world and force them to accept the return of 'you know who' as real (although this will probably happen before book seven)." And my current favorite: "Perhaps instead of killing Voldemort he'll be imprisoned in the body of a flobberworm for all eternity. Perhaps Hermione will capture him in an unbreakable jar and keep him on a shelf next to Rita Skeeter." A few things seem to give us all trouble with this section. Thus, _Predictions FAQ_ Q: Do I code to predictions mundane things like guesses about who will die that are not based on canon? A: Only if it's *extremely* novel or about books 6 or 7. Most everything normal has been predicted by post 40,000 for OOP. So the rest are 'Adds Nothing New' unless they are amusing or defend using interesting canonical arguments. Q: Do I code to predictions guesses about who will end up shipping? A: No. Those are Ships. Q: What is canon? A: Must at least be defended by canon-influenced logic to qualify as 'with canon.' Q: Where do I code a prediction that doesn't say which book? A: Most of the time, these are about the next book to be released (currently OOP where we're coding, soon to be HBP). A few are really open-ended; code these to each subsequent book if you must. Q: What if this prediction didn't come true in OOP? A: Code it anyway for posterity. Q: Should I cross code to all of the subjects of the prediction? A: Please be sparing, especially if it's a prediction without canon. Well, now I am going to trade in my crystal ball and tea leaves for some time with my kids, whom I predict will be happy to see me again. --boyd From stevejjen at earthlink.net Tue Apr 19 00:55:38 2005 From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese) Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 00:55:38 -0000 Subject: Coding TBAYs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Sean: > As a Listee I've never seen TBAY as anything else but its own thing and I can bet you most Listees (except perhaps the TBAYers themselves) take one look at a TBAY heading and move on, deciding it's a game specific to TBAYers. Now you can beg to differ, but I'm merely expressing in code my attitude in the List world, and have to draw the line somewhere. Jen: Oh no! I hope that's not how most listees react to TBAY, 'cause most of the ones I've coded up so far are chock full of canon discussion. There are a few throwaways of course, just as there are in any thread. Some with in-jokes and the like. But the most prolific Tbay'ers were also some of the most insightful & analytical writers. I don't think we can code based on our own generalizations about the list. We've all got 'em. It's being a detached observer and coding for content. We may never agree on style of writing, that's for sure. Carolyn: IMO, TBAY is an interesting way of continuing discussions in another style, and certainly it would make a large hole in the development of some theories to leave them out of a run of posts on a particular theme. However, the header code is there for those who want to hop skip and jump past them if they want. I'm sorry you don't like them, but cataloguing is about dealing with all the stuff on the list, not taking sides. I dutifully code up SHIPping, and worse... Jen: Lots worse. The theory on Peter and Bertha's love child--can't even remember the plotline but there was some canon analysis going on. The proselytizers, the child-abuse zealots (won't name names here), the alchemy aficionados (that's me!)--unless the point of the post has been said a million different ways prior, or it is totally based on personal opinion, or full of mistakes, then it has a right to be coded up for content. Of course, all this is personal opinion. In the end, Miss Havisham has the final say, no? From quigonginger at yahoo.com Tue Apr 19 12:44:00 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 05:44:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Coding TBAYs In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050419124400.97319.qmail@web60510.mail.yahoo.com> Carolyn: Hoping JKR kills Lupinlore off in HBP. Ginger: I read that Lupin the first time. I'm with you now. Potioncat: I'll be disappointed if she doesn't. But I won't burn my books. Finished my coding batch. Working on ages. Ginger starts strumming a calming serenade to what she can remember of the theme to Mr Ed. A troll is a troll, And, on the whole, A troll is a soul you can't control. So take a stroll, and set this goal: Ignore the Dunderhead! Ginger, wondering about certain other posters who she is about to tackle now --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Plan great trips with Yahoo! Travel: Now over 17,000 guides! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From willsonkmom at msn.com Tue Apr 19 13:08:18 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (Kathy Willson) Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 09:08:18 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Coding TBAYs References: <20050419124400.97319.qmail@web60510.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Ginger starts strumming a calming serenade to what she can remember of the theme to Mr Ed. A troll is a troll, And, on the whole, A troll is a soul you can't control. So take a stroll, and set this goal: Ignore the Dunderhead! Ginger, wondering about certain other posters who she is about to tackle now KathyW. Oh, that's great. You have to put it in the filk section! I'll be humming it all day. Laughter "is" the best medicine! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From spotthedungbeetle at hotmail.com Tue Apr 19 14:36:57 2005 From: spotthedungbeetle at hotmail.com (dungrollin) Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 14:36:57 -0000 Subject: Dormice and so on In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Carolyn: > An interesting thesis. Other researchers, such as Kneasy et al. > (2003, 2004) have also pointed to a change in global list environment threatening their habitat. However, some species (particularly those exhibiting tannin-stained molars), have evolved a highly-unusual defensive strategy through association with larger mammals such as canus lupus. As far as can be determined, humans intent on eradicating the litter of papers generated by dormice nests quickly become prey for the larger scavenger. Recent sightings of canus lupus in the wastelands of YAHOO primary coll. may indicate re-emergence of the species, as it scents new canon in the air. > Not, of course, to be confused with Lupinus doctrinus, a particularly invasive and allelopathic species of bindweed, which is partly responsible for the environmental changes to which you allude. In fact, I recently observed a fine specimen of Feles potio becoming rather agitated by the weed and the toxins it secretes, though the soothing strains of a Zingiber sp. from a nearby modem appear to have had a calming influence. Amusingly enough, a specimen of Fimum volvens (or should that be Fimus? - not a million miles from here) became so distressed that this morning she wrote a long paper on this very subject, which ended with a petulant withdrawal from the whole ecosystem. Unfortunately (or perhaps, fortunately) her computer crashed as she was putting the finishing insults to it, and in the light of the song of the Zingiber, she is reconsidering. Grumpily. Dot Who was wondering how the sociologist, biologist and mathematician were all so damn sure it was definitely a sheep. From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Tue Apr 19 16:00:34 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 16:00:34 -0000 Subject: Yahoo privacy button.. Message-ID: Picked up this on Hogs Head this pm, which you might like to action; I certainly did. Carolyn Yahoo is now using something called "Web Beacons" to track Yahoo Group users around the net and see what you're doing and where you are going similar to cookies. Yahoo is recording every website and every group you visit. Take a look at their updated privacy statement: http://privacy.yahoo.com/privacy About half-way down the page, in the section on cookies, you will see a link that says web beacons. Click on the phrase web beacons. That will bring you to a paragraph entitled "Outside the Yahoo Network."In this section you'll see a little "click here to opt out"link that will let you "opt-out" of their new method of snooping. Once you have clicked that link, you are exempted. Notice the "Success" message on the top of the next page. Be careful because on that page there is a "Cancel Opt-out" button that, if clicked, will *undo** the opt-out. From arrowsmithbt at btconnect.com Tue Apr 19 16:56:08 2005 From: arrowsmithbt at btconnect.com (Barry Arrowsmith) Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 17:56:08 +0100 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Dormice and so on In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <305299f86882f3d336c1ff11a2450395@btconnect.com> > > Dot > Who was wondering how the sociologist, biologist and mathematician > were all so damn sure it was definitely a sheep. > It wasn't, the biologist knew that straightaway, being well aware that real black sheep lurk on Welsh mountains keeping a wary eye open for stunted tenors in wellington boots. The sociologist was unaware that it was in fact a prime example of a sub-adult Equus asinus, but since like most social scientists he couldn't find his ass with a map and ground approach radar, it was the first one he'd seen. The biologist thought better than to enlighten him as it is a well-documented behavioural trait for social scientists to embed themselves head first in the rear end of said beasts whenever one comes into their possession. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 820 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Tue Apr 19 18:09:45 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2005 04:09:45 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Yahoo privacy button.. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050419180945.GA13653@4dot0.net> On Tue, Apr 19, 2005 at 04:00:34PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > Picked up this on Hogs Head this pm, which you might like to action; > I certainly did. Ta Carol, they're always trying this on, and they wonder why google gets all the attention. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Tue Apr 19 18:19:39 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2005 04:19:39 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Dormice and so on In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050419181939.GB13653@4dot0.net> On Tue, Apr 19, 2005 at 02:36:57PM -0000, dungrollin wrote: > > Dot > Who was wondering how the sociologist, biologist and mathematician > were all so damn sure it was definitely a sheep. It is not well known that penguins often disguise themselves as sheep to infiltrate the mainland, where fish are oddly plentiful and there are none of those nasty sharks to worry about. Oft-told stories about the black sheep that turned white and the white turned black are possibly explained by this phenomenon of hasty sheep-disguise which are likely responsible for the odd practice of some sheep to spend rather too much time in the duck pond. Beware the wet sheep: he isn't merely admiring your aquarium. Sean (penguin of doooom) -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From spotthedungbeetle at hotmail.com Thu Apr 21 09:03:07 2005 From: spotthedungbeetle at hotmail.com (dungrollin) Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 09:03:07 -0000 Subject: Dormice and so on In-Reply-To: <305299f86882f3d336c1ff11a2450395@btconnect.com> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, Barry Arrowsmith wrote: > > > > Dot > > Who was wondering how the sociologist, biologist and mathematician were all so damn sure it was definitely a sheep. > > > > It wasn't, the biologist knew that straightaway, being well aware > that real black sheep lurk on Welsh mountains keeping a wary eye > open for stunted tenors in wellington boots. > > The sociologist was unaware that it was in fact a prime example of > a sub-adult Equus asinus, but since like most social scientists he > couldn't find his ass with a map and ground approach radar, it was the first one he'd seen. The biologist thought better than to > enlighten him as it is a well-documented behavioural trait for social scientists to embed themselves head first in the rear end of > said beasts whenever one comes into their possession. Dot: Thanks for the clarification. Presumably the mathematician was too busy working out whether any quasitropic hedroid is indeed diatonically sub-similar to itself to look out of the window at the real world, and simply took the sociologist's word for it. Incidentally, I ran across this list of Rules for Good Writing: http://www.noggs.dsl.pipex.com/la/rules.htm I particularly liked this one: 65. Let P(x) be the probability of reader x being impressed by displays of mathematical pseudery. Then it can be shown that, for all x except those in a set of Lebesgue measure zero, P(x) = 1 + e^i(pi) where e is the base of natural logarithms, pi is the ratio of the circumference of a circle to its diameter, and i^2 = -1. From quigonginger at yahoo.com Thu Apr 21 11:42:51 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 04:42:51 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Dormice and so on In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050421114252.10952.qmail@web60510.mail.yahoo.com> > > Dot > > Who was wondering how the sociologist, biologist and mathematician were all so damn sure it was definitely a sheep. Ginger knows: If it is fat and wooly, it is either a sheep or a politician. The difference is determined by which side of the verb "fleece" they appear on. As it did not approach the train promising a free utpoia whilst picking their pockets, it was safe to conclude it was a sheep. What I want to know is how, from that distance, they knew it was black and not ebony or charcoal or some such shade. Ginger, pondering "Wingardium Leviosa" today. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From willsonkmom at msn.com Thu Apr 21 12:30:59 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (Kathy Willson) Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 08:30:59 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Dormice and so on References: <20050421114252.10952.qmail@web60510.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Ginger, pondering "Wingardium Leviosa" today. Kathy W. You wish and flick and I'll hum the theme to Mr. Ed. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-Catalogue/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: HPFGU-Catalogue-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quigonginger at yahoo.com Thu Apr 21 13:04:52 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 06:04:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Dormice and so on In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050421130452.29345.qmail@web60510.mail.yahoo.com> Ginger, pondering "Wingardium Leviosa" today. Kathy W. You wish and flick and I'll hum the theme to Mr. Ed. Ginger again: Is it just me, or did we exchange personalities this last week? Actually, I'm not planning to attack anyone, just pondering levity. In all forms. If a club is needed, well, then it is needed. Otherwise a group will suffice. In the meantime, we can toggle. Cheers, Ginger, who will do some actual work around here tonight. Promise. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From willsonkmom at msn.com Thu Apr 21 15:00:40 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 15:00:40 -0000 Subject: I have a question Message-ID: The door to the catalogue office opens. Potioncat clanks in. She is wearing ill fitting, rusty armour( obviously British made) and is carrying a long, cracked lance. Her visor clangs shut and she pushes it up with a grimace. Miss Carolyn Havisham jumps up, "Where have you been?" "Lost in a Good Book," is the answer as her visor clangs shut again. Dropping the lance she pulls off her helmet. "One moment I'm jousting with windmills and the next I'm questing after some beast and the next I'm fighting with someone named LL Hades. I came back for some relaxing coding." "It's about time!" "Don't I know it! And I've been gleefully thinking that as bad as "characters' ages" section is, at least I don't have to muddle through the "Weasley age gaps" section. That one was already done by another Kathy..."She pauses, "Wasn't it?" So, my question is, according to the Allocation Database, I have the Weasley Age Gap Issue as well. Is that correct? If it is, I'll work on it before the more general one. And after reading "Lost in a Good Book" I'll never think of "Great Expectations" the same way! From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Thu Apr 21 18:21:19 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 18:21:19 -0000 Subject: I have a question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "potioncat" wrote: > > Miss Carolyn Havisham jumps up, "Where have you been?" > > "Lost in a Good Book," is the answer as her visor clangs shut again. Miss Havisham chuckles evilly - 'I'll be setting an exam on the Crimean War shortly!' She beams round at the stupified catalogue office.. > > "Don't I know it! And I've been gleefully thinking that as bad > as "characters' ages" section is, at least I don't have to muddle > through the "Weasley age gaps" section. That one was already done by > another Kathy..."She pauses, "Wasn't it?" > > So, my question is, according to the Allocation Database, I have the > Weasley Age Gap Issue as well. Is that correct? If it is, I'll work > on it before the more general one. Erm, yes, I thought you were going to do it - the thing is, it used to be part of the character's ages, and needs sorting. I just checked the dbses and yes, you were right, it is in one db and not the other, whoops (again). I've fixed that now. In my view, 1.2.12 (calculating character's ages) should maybe be a subset of 1.2.10, characterisation, whereas 1.2.12.1 (Weasley age gaps) should maybe be a subset of 1.2.11.1 (Weasleys), except that would make it a level 5 head. Maybe all of 1.2.12.1 should just be folded into 1.2.11.1 and left for KathyK to sort out ... > > And after reading "Lost in a Good Book" I'll never think of "Great > Expectations" the same way! I enjoyed her sort out of Heathcliffe best I think. Carolyn From quigonginger at yahoo.com Thu Apr 21 21:21:40 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 21:21:40 -0000 Subject: A thought for the future Message-ID: As long as I have traded personalities with a tactful person, I may as well make a suggestion that has been on my mind. I was thinking of Hans and his Character Discussions. Like filks, people either enjoy them or skip them alltogether. We have a seperate category for filks, why not one for the character discussions? It could be under religious influences. Then when we get to that series, we could just code it to that category, and maybe to the person being discussed, and it would save a lot of time. The devotees would have the series in one convenient spot. Their own little treasure trove, if you will, and those who prefer to skip those posts would be able to do so easily. His other posts would, of course, be coded as any other post would be. I'm sure Hans would feel special, his fans would be saved from a tedious search, and it would facilitate faster coding. Thoughts? Ginger, always trying. Usually very trying. From willsonkmom at msn.com Thu Apr 21 23:09:17 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 23:09:17 -0000 Subject: A thought for the future In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ginger wrote: > I was thinking of Hans and his Character Discussions. Like filks, > people either enjoy them or skip them alltogether. We have a seperate > category for filks, why not one for the character discussions? It > could be under religious influences. Then when we get to that series, > we could just code it to that category, and maybe to the person being > discussed, and it would save a lot of time. Potioncat: That sounds like a great idea to me. I never read his posts, although I sometimes scan the comments that follow. It is a specific fan-base/anti- fan base. Does anyone know Stickbook? I've gotten several off-list e-mails from him/her concerning some of the recent unpleasantness. Sounds like someone who has been around this group a long time, but I don't recall reading any posts by the person. KathyW From quigonginger at yahoo.com Fri Apr 22 06:37:14 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 23:37:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: A thought for the future In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050422063714.8535.qmail@web60510.mail.yahoo.com> Potioncat: Does anyone know Stickbook? I've gotten several off-list e-mails from him/her concerning some of the recent unpleasantness. Sounds like someone who has been around this group a long time, but I don't recall reading any posts by the person. Ginger: Stickbook has been around for quite a while, but I only recall him/her as a filk writer. I don't believe we've ever e-mailed, which is odd as I keep in contact with a few filkers/fans. (Yes, I get fan mail. I love this list!) Ginger, headed to the cataloging tool. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quigonginger at yahoo.com Fri Apr 22 09:09:15 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2005 09:09:15 -0000 Subject: Error report 2.6.1.1 Message-ID: Ginger pops her head up over her screen. Miss Carolyn? There seems to be a typo on 2.6.1.1. The acronym is DITCH PUGS: Draco Is The Centre of Harry Potter Universe-Go Slytherin!! In the list it is written DITCH PLUGS. Unfortunately, I had to reject the post. It came after a fun discussion of the subject, which ended in a "A said 'Blah'. B thought A was smug. A apologized. B apologized back," bunch of rejected posts, and the original poster apologized for starting the whole thing- and then gave it an acronym. But they all lived happily ever after, which happens when people are polite, as they were. As it should be. Ginger, who found an amusing tagline: I don't think of myself as "moderated", I consider myself "under constant supervision for the good of society". From stevejjen at earthlink.net Fri Apr 22 15:39:00 2005 From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese) Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2005 15:39:00 -0000 Subject: Error report 2.6.1.1 & Hans In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > But they all lived happily ever after, which happens when people are > polite, as they were. As it should be. > > Ginger, who found an amusing tagline: I don't think of myself > as "moderated", I consider myself "under constant supervision for the > good of society". Jen: Lol, wish a few people of the Lupinus doctrinus bindweed variety would be moderated for the good of society (thanks Dung, for a perfectly marvelous post bringing this "invasive and allelopathic species" to our attention ). Or at the very least, could they cultivate a sense of humor like the person above? On another note, Ginger mentioned adding a category for Hans' character studies. I remember reading in our archives some discussion about how to code his posts. Some people felt a separate category might provide undue encouragement, if I'm remembering right. Personally, I like Ginger's idea. We have some precedent for this with Peg's essays on sins/virtues. I mean, there's not an actual category with her *name* on it, but we could do what Ginger suggested with a cetegory under 'religious influences' where Hans and a few other similar posts could be housed. I'm for it. Jen, thoroughly enjoying Potioncat's rebellious streak this week ;). From elfundeb at comcast.net Fri Apr 22 18:19:15 2005 From: elfundeb at comcast.net (Debbie) Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2005 18:19:15 -0000 Subject: MD/TBAY/Hans/Fforde In-Reply-To: Message-ID: A Magic Dishwasher question, for all you MD experts. What are, or should be, the boundaries of MD? I tend to think of the theory as what was in Pip's two original posts; however, it seems to have taken on a life of its own, so that any theory involving a ProActive! Dumbledore becomes trapped in the dishwasher's gleaming steel maws. Does it all belong there? Does it matter if the theory was written by a member of the MDDT defense team (or a chief opponent of the theory)? I'm muddling along as best I can, but thought that the MD experts among us could help. Carolyn: > The reason we have the TBAY category, and why it is down in the Admin > section, is because there were some early posts in TBAY style before > the decision was made to ask posters to put TBAY in the subject head. > We also wanted to make sure we captured all the posts in that style, > so that those that don't like it can exclude them from their searches > if they like, or conversely, those that like them can pull up the > whole lot if they want. A second reason to capture TBAYs into a discrete category is that many of them read like a story, and I admit to occasionally coding an otherwise OT post to TBAY to avoid missing part of that story (which doesn't mean that every TBAY post has value regardless of its canonicity) or, in one case, because it was too humorous to ignore. Ginger: > I was thinking of Hans and his Character Discussions. Like filks, > people either enjoy them or skip them alltogether. We have a seperate > category for filks, why not one for the character discussions? It > could be under religious influences. Then when we get to that series, > we could just code it to that category, and maybe to the person being > discussed, and it would save a lot of time. The devotees would have > the series in one convenient spot. Their own little treasure trove, if > you will, and those who prefer to skip those posts would be able to do > so easily. What devotees? I started reading his posts when he started the Weasley body part analogies for sheer amusement value. But, yes, Rosicrucianism should have its own little category under Religious Influences where all his posts can be enshrined so that us Stoned! Harry enthusiasts can skip right over them. Potioncat: > > And after reading "Lost in a Good Book" I'll never think of "Great > > Expectations" the same way! > Miss Havisham responded: > I enjoyed her sort out of Heathcliffe best I think. Oh, so *that's* where to find his anger management class? Was I reading the wrong Fforde? Debbie whose elfin status precludes her from commenting on certain trolls of the Lupinus doctrinus bindweed variety From quigonginger at yahoo.com Fri Apr 22 18:37:48 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2005 11:37:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: MD/TBAY/Hans/Fforde In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050422183748.82758.qmail@web60510.mail.yahoo.com> Debbie whose elfin status precludes her from commenting on certain trolls of the Lupinus doctrinus bindweed variety Ginger: I hope our growlings haven't put you in a bind (weed or otherwise). Or put you in the middle, or in any uncomfortable situation. I'm sure earplugs and/or muzzles come with the teatowels. Uncomfortable, I'm sure, but I respect you for your integrity. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-Catalogue/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: HPFGU-Catalogue-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Fri Apr 22 19:49:13 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2005 19:49:13 -0000 Subject: Lots, scroll down.. Message-ID: Boyd: Yes, you heard it here first: I will complete the annoyingly repetitive, often humorous, occasionally insightful category of Predictions--today! C - ain't he just a star? Hope everyone has read and memorised his FAQ on how to deal with predictions from now on... ******** Jen: ...unless the point of the post has been said a million different ways prior, or it is totally based on personal opinion, or full of mistakes, then it has a right to be coded up for content. Of course, all this is personal opinion. In the end, Miss Havisham has the final say, no? C - purrs happily at the thought of unlimited power..but Jen sums up the coding rules very neatly. ********** Dot: Incidentally, I ran across this list of Rules for Good Writing: http://www.noggs.dsl.pipex.com/la/rules.htm C - As a hassled editor, I took grim enjoyment in this one: 10. If you possibly can, without obscuring the essential thrust of what you are trying to say, and without misleading by excessive and patently unjustifiable oversimplification, avoid sentences of such inordinate length and complexity of construction as would overtax the comprehension and/or attention of the average reader, as these are by their nature a particularly difficult medium in which to sustain a good prose style, and best attempted only by such coruscating and inimitable masters of the genre as Mr Bernard Levin, and even by him only when at the height of his by no means inconsiderable intoxication with the exuberance of his own notorious verbosity. ********* Ginger: I was thinking of Hans and his Character Discussions. Like filks, people either enjoy them or skip them alltogether. We have a seperate category for filks, why not one for the character discussions? It could be under religious influences. Jen: I remember reading in our archives some discussion about how to code his posts. Some people felt a separate category might provide undue encouragement, if I'm remembering right. Carolyn: Well-remembered Jen. Early on, I made a similar suggestion to Ginger in that I thought Hans should be coralled in his own awful category, but I thought it should be under alchemy. Barry objected and said it gave him too much prominence. I wasn't sure back then, but as Hans' posts have progressed, I have come to agree that he is so completely off his rocker that he shouldn't really be given that kind of prominence. I would prefer to put them under alchemy, cross-coded to religious influences, and leave them for people to come across. If you want to create a sub- code Rosicrucianism under religious influences (like Wicca), I don't mind, just as long as it isn't called Hans. Jen: We have some precedent for this with Peg's essays on sins/virtues. Carolyn: The Peg category may not survive as such. The good n'evil categories have not yet been sorted through (everyone nervously avoiding them (I tell you, I'll do 'em with a flame thrower one of these days). Once they are sorted, there will probably be a lot more than Peg in each category. ******** Ginger: There seems to be a typo on 2.6.1.1. The acronym is DITCH PUGS: Draco Is The Centre of Harry Potter Universe-Go Slytherin!! In the list it is written DITCH PLUGS. C - I'll correct it, of course, but wasn't clear whether you had actually kept the post naming the acronym, and whether it was all a mistake anyway? Do we need to keep it?? ********** Debbie: A Magic Dishwasher question, for all you MD experts. What are, or should be, the boundaries of MD? Carolyn: The actual MDDT main posts include Pip's rebuttal after the publication of OOP, not just the original two spying game posts. The boundaries in my view are the actual threads weaving out from the three main posts (see my original list of them back in the archives here). I don't think *all* discussion of DD's agenda should be coded to MD, only if the MD posts are specifically referenced. But if the posts are written by any of MDDT, I think that it is likely they belong with MD, unless they are on another subject altogether. Later, the argument about MD breaks out again and again, and that should get coded to the theory. ********* Debbie: Oh, so *that's* where to find his anger management class? Was I reading the wrong Fforde? Carolyn: No, it's the Well of Lost Plots, the third book, chapter 12 - 'Shut up!' yelled Havisham, and Heathcliff was instantly quiet. I looked around. His agent was cowering under a briefcase and the rest of the cast were hiding beneath the oak table. There was a pause. 'What's going on?' I hissed. 'ProCath attack' murmured Havisham, reloading her pistol in the sudden quiet. 'Support of the young Catherine and hatred of Heathcliff run deep in the bookworld...' ...'I'm still leaving this appalling book, ' retorted Heathcliff, who was back on full obnoxious form again. 'No you're not,' replied Havisham. 'You just try and stop-' Miss Havisham, who was fed up with pussyfooting around and hated men like Heathcliff with a vengeance, grasped him by the collar and pinned his head to the table with a well-placed gun barrel pressed painfully into his neck. 'Listen here,' she said, her voice quavering with anger, 'to me, you are worthless scum... (to be continued..) ********* Debbie whose elfin status precludes her from commenting on certain trolls of the Lupinus doctrinus bindweed variety Ginger: I hope our growlings haven't put you in a bind (weed or otherwise). Or put you in the middle, or in any uncomfortable situation. Carolyn: (sweetly) isn't that what elves are for ? (see Kneasy, passim..) From kakearney at comcast.net Fri Apr 22 23:44:43 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2005 23:44:43 -0000 Subject: Lots, scroll down.. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Aaah, Carolyn, you can't do that! Catalogue office allusions are one thing, but direct quotes? That qualifies as a spoiler. :) Now how am I going to trust you to keep me in the dark come HBP release time? -Kelly, seemingly keeping pace with Kathy in her Fforde consumption; just finished book 2. From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Sat Apr 23 01:11:28 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 11:11:28 +1000 Subject: 44701-44800 batch Message-ID: <20050423011128.GA11789@4dot0.net> done 26 rejects Much of this was taken up with the "It was all a dream" ending theory, recently popular again. The arguments haven't changed, and still looks unlikely. Pleased to see that #44763 also puts forward that JKR is channelling Christie. Also an interesting number of posts regarding the significance of Harry's green eyes, which surprised me so early in the List given the topic has only recently been given more prominence. And for yuks #44782, which has me wondering who's giving the treatment to Hermione. Taking 45501-45600 on. Sean. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Sat Apr 23 01:14:22 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 11:14:22 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Lots, scroll down.. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050423011422.GB11789@4dot0.net> On Fri, Apr 22, 2005 at 11:44:43PM -0000, corinthum wrote: > > > > > Aaah, Carolyn, you can't do that! Catalogue office allusions are one > thing, but direct quotes? That qualifies as a spoiler. :) > > Now how am I going to trust you to keep me in the dark come HBP > release time? > > -Kelly, seemingly keeping pace with Kathy in her Fforde consumption; > just finished book 2. I've only started book one :( -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sat Apr 23 13:14:18 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 06:14:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Lots, scroll down.. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20050423131418.53412.qmail@web60502.mail.yahoo.com> C: I wasn't sure back then, but as Hans' posts have progressed, I have come to agree that he is so completely off his rocker that he shouldn't really be given that kind of prominence. I would prefer to put them under alchemy, cross-coded to religious influences, and leave them for people to come across. If you want to create a sub- code Rosicrucianism under religious influences (like Wicca), I don't mind, just as long as it isn't called Hans. Ginger: Off his rocker? More like off his rocker, rolled off the porch steps and bounced to the end of the driveway. However, this is only my opinion, and, as such is a perfectly valid one, equal in every way to that of Hans, which is perfectly valid in its own right as his opinion, due to the fact that all opinions are all equal and must be respected by all members of our little community, in respect to the rules as set forth by our august, if half naked, ruling body to assure that all who enter our realm enjoy the same equal rights as everyone else, even if they have removed themselves from their front porch furniture. Hmm, not only am I not channeling Potioncat anymore, I've started channeling Lupinlore, and seem to have been influenced to write long sentances. Wonder from whence that came? Anyway, since we have to code them, and we don't want to encourage anyone, the Rocrutsian (or whatever) category sounds good to me. As long as I don't have to learn to pronounce it. Or spell it. C (re: DITCH PUGS)- I'll correct it, of course, but wasn't clear whether you had actually kept the post naming the acronym, and whether it was all a mistake anyway? Do we need to keep it?? Ginger: Oops, sorry. I didn't keep it. It came after the conversation about it and only named what had been said. I don't think it will come up again as an acronym. Maybe put it on probation? Ginger, glad to be back to her unPC self __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sat Apr 23 14:14:29 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 14:14:29 -0000 Subject: funny post Message-ID: For a laugh, read 45198. It's amazing what some can come up with if they get out of their teacup. Ginger, who changed her screen to purple for excitement in her life. Sad part is, it worked. From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sat Apr 23 15:38:43 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 15:38:43 -0000 Subject: help! Message-ID: OK, maybe the exclamation point was extreme, but I have a post for which I didn't know what code to use. I finally (after scrolling several times the length of the list) settled on 3.4.7. Does anyone have a better suggestion? I'll copy it here to save you time. It's #45448 (that's for my benefit). Thanks, Ginger the Bewildered I always thought that the wizarding community is much smaller and more tightly knit than our own world. If you think about it, since there is only one wizarding middle/high school in all of Britain, that means that every witch and wizard in Britain knows every other witch and wizard in Britain as well as you and I knew people we went to school with. Better, in fact - there would be no moving around and changing schools, so they would go to the same school for all 7 years (barring expulsion), *and* it's a boarding school, so everybody sees each other at every meal, on weekends, etc. They would know people 7 years older and 7 years younger, plus names of kids whose tenure overlapped their siblings, and even their parents and children. They would all hear the same school legends of former students. It's not like the silly remark people often make (at least here in the US): "Oh, you're from England? Do you know Bob?" People in the British wizarding community *would* be likely to know each other. It appears from Malfoy's statements that it is possible for a wizarding family to send a child to a foreign school. This would have the effect of having that child enter the British wizarding community as an adult. He would be less well-known among the Hogwarts graduates who form the majority of that society, although that could be an advantage, since his peers would never have seen the stupid things he did in school. Take Fudge, for example. He doesn't seem like a distant politician; he seems more like a guy you knew in school - because most people in the WW *did* go to school with him. I believe that Lily and James are well known so early in adulthood simply because everybody goes to the same school. We know that James played Quidditch, which only 28 students in any given year have the opportunity to do, and the sport is wildly popular, so this would automatically have put him in the spotlight. As his girlfriend, Lily would also be well-known even if she never did anything else to get noticed (and I suspect she did). Frank Longbottom may have had a spotlight position at Hogwarts as well. (Do we know of anything yet? Prefect? Class clown? Know-it-all? I regretfully don't have my books with me, and I don't recall any tidbits about his school days.) If so, he would have had a social advantage as soon as he and his classmates - who all knew him - graduated and started contributing to society. From kking0731 at gmail.com Sat Apr 23 21:22:29 2005 From: kking0731 at gmail.com (snow15145) Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 21:22:29 -0000 Subject: help! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "quigonginger" wrote: > > OK, maybe the exclamation point was extreme, but I have a post for > which I didn't know what code to use. I finally (after scrolling > several times the length of the list) settled on 3.4.7. Does anyone > have a better suggestion? I'll copy it here to save you time. > It's #45448 (that's for my benefit). > > Thanks, Ginger the Bewildered Snow: I would think class system 3.2.6 would be appropriate because the post appears to be talking about social standings and possibly 3.2.2 relationship with muggle world because the post draws on that parallel initially. KathySnow From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sun Apr 24 10:23:48 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 10:23:48 -0000 Subject: Totally OT... Message-ID: Picked up this recently (Barry did you catch it on Guido's site??): http://www.kontraband.com/show/show.asp?ID=2201&rtn=index-topten Political/religious satire alert: usual caveats apply, don't click if easily offended. Carolyn ..who can't stand much more of our general election campaigning.. From arrowsmithbt at btconnect.com Sun Apr 24 10:45:02 2005 From: arrowsmithbt at btconnect.com (Barry Arrowsmith) Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 11:45:02 +0100 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Totally OT... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <00761faf89309c52460df52889479e31@btconnect.com> Yep. Odd you should ask because I sent you a mail (plus one other) about it yesterday. Sounds as if you didn't receive it for some reason. Guido has become a must read in the current electoral excesses. For those who like that sort of thing: www.5thnovember.blogspot.com I've been looking at other parts of the Kontraband site - some are just boringly crude, but I love the adverts. Might make me change my mind about K. Minogue (not a particular favourite, too manufactured and calculating for my taste). B. On 24 Apr 2005, at 11:23, carolynwhite2 wrote: > > Picked up this recently (Barry did you catch it on Guido's site??): > > http://www.kontraband.com/show/show.asp?ID=2201&rtn=index-topten > > Political/religious satire alert: usual caveats apply, don't click if > easily offended. > > Carolyn > .who can't stand much more of our general election campaigning.. > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > ? To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-Catalogue/ > ? > ? To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > HPFGU-Catalogue-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com > ? > ? Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 1608 bytes Desc: not available URL: From elfundeb at comcast.net Mon Apr 25 12:03:08 2005 From: elfundeb at comcast.net (Debbie) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 08:03:08 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Lots, scroll down.. References: Message-ID: <002201c5498e$bf374020$1102a8c0@your4105e587b6> Ginger: I hope our growlings haven't put you in a bind (weed or otherwise). Or put you in the middle, or in any uncomfortable situation. I'm sure earplugs and/or muzzles come with the teatowels. Uncomfortable, I'm sure, but I respect you for your integrity. Debbie: Why, thank you. 'Tis a mark of the list-elves' enslavement not to discuss the listees' personnel files, but I is taking good notes and bringing them back to the kitchen. And sometimes I covers my face so nobody can see how much I wants to laugh. Or cry. Carolyn: If you want to create a sub- code Rosicrucianism under religious influences (like Wicca), I don't mind, just as long as it isn't called Hans. Debbie: I like this solution, as it keeps his posts out of the main Alchemy category. In the end, I doubt anyone should have an eponymous category, not even Elkins. Ginger: For a laugh, read 45198. It's amazing what some can come up with if they get out of their teacup. Debbie: Some of the replies are even funnier. And here's another from my batch, 45257, which just goes to show that canon can be found to support just about anything. And I've come across a couple of posts discussing Fridwulfa, including a priceless post by Eric Oppen, 45268. Does she need a category? I used the generic "Giants". Debbie off to purchase some more Fforde -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quigonginger at yahoo.com Sun Apr 24 12:24:32 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 05:24:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: help! In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050424122432.1586.qmail@web60501.mail.yahoo.com> Thank you! I'll do that. I was truely befuddled. Ginger __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Sun Apr 24 18:26:17 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 04:26:17 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Totally OT... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050424182616.GA21865@4dot0.net> On Sun, Apr 24, 2005 at 10:23:48AM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > > > Picked up this recently (Barry did you catch it on Guido's site??): > > http://www.kontraband.com/show/show.asp?ID=2201&rtn=index-topten > > Political/religious satire alert: usual caveats apply, don't click if > easily offended. > > Carolyn > ..who can't stand much more of our general election campaigning.. The British election has been largely (deliberately?) invisible over here (Oz), so this is a good heads up for me, as well as the Guido site. Mind you our Illustrious Leader is O.S. so maybe he's giving Tony tips...eurghhh. Is it only coincidence that the latest dr who has a certain place blown up? Sean (It wasn't me) Penguin. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Sun Apr 24 18:52:23 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 18:52:23 -0000 Subject: UPDATE, Sunday 24th April Message-ID: PROGRESS We have coded 52160 posts to date, and rejected 28709 of them (55%). This week, with 7 people coding, we did 622 posts. CODING ERRORS Some reject/non-reject status decisions need to be made on: Sean: 44787, 43785 & 2942 Talisman: 5835 Laurasia: 28613 Doug: 36199 Debbie: 42953 CATEGORY CHANGES 2.6.1.1 DITCH P(L)UGS removed 2.14.4.1 Fridwulfa added Question re Rosicrucianism - what is it's precise relationship with alchemy? Ie, should it be a sub-category of religious influences, or of alchemy? From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Mon Apr 25 00:44:13 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 10:44:13 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] UPDATE, Sunday 24th April In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050425004413.GB21865@4dot0.net> On Sun, Apr 24, 2005 at 06:52:23PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > Sean: 44787, 43785 & 2942 Fixed the first two, but disagree strongly on 2942. Believe you can't make a one-line reply with no canon categorizable no matter how fruitful the ensuing discussion. Sean (How was I to know) Penguin. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Mon Apr 25 07:13:47 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 07:13:47 -0000 Subject: UPDATE, Sunday 24th April In-Reply-To: <20050425004413.GB21865@4dot0.net> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, ewe2 wrote: > On Sun, Apr 24, 2005 at 06:52:23PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > > > Sean: 44787, 43785 & 2942 > > Fixed the first two, but disagree strongly on 2942. Believe you can't make a > one-line reply with no canon categorizable no matter how fruitful the ensuing > discussion. > Disagree about what? Why didn't you just reject it? These mis-codes that I pick up from time to time are simply posts that are showing that they have both a reject code and some other non-reject code. They should be one or the other. I don't even look at the post in question, just list the numbers for people to fix. Carolyn From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Mon Apr 25 09:35:56 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 19:35:56 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: UPDATE, Sunday 24th April In-Reply-To: References: <20050425004413.GB21865@4dot0.net> Message-ID: <20050425093556.GD21865@4dot0.net> On Mon, Apr 25, 2005 at 07:13:47AM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > Disagree about what? Why didn't you just reject it? > > These mis-codes that I pick up from time to time are simply posts that > are showing that they have both a reject code and some other non-reject > code. They should be one or the other. I don't even look at the post in > question, just list the numbers for people to fix. My mistake. I assumed they were there for my reconsideration, but I haven't been thinking too clearly lately. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From kakearney at comcast.net Mon Apr 25 12:56:01 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 12:56:01 -0000 Subject: Disappearing group? Message-ID: Is anyone else having trouble accessing this group? I have my Yahoo Groups home bookmarked, and usually get here through there. But recently, this group has been vanishing from my list of groups. Generally, if I click on the list of groups and flip between simple and expanded view, it eventually reappears in the list. Anyone else seeing this bizarre behavior? -Kelly, who will return to cataloguing once current hectic work project is completed on Tuesday From willsonkmom at msn.com Mon Apr 25 13:03:34 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (Kathy Willson) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 09:03:34 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Disappearing group? References: Message-ID: Kelly asked: Is anyone else having trouble accessing this group? I have my Yahoo Groups home bookmarked, and usually get here through there. Potioncat: Several groups are disappearing, temporarily. I haven't had any trouble getting into the catalogue itself. There's a new Nel question on the main list. Posts by several members of the catalogue staff are cited. Kneasy and Kathy Snow are the two I remember. KathyW -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quigonginger at yahoo.com Mon Apr 25 13:15:25 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 06:15:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Disappearing group? In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050425131525.3467.qmail@web60501.mail.yahoo.com> Kelly asked: Is anyone else having trouble accessing this group? I have my Yahoo Groups home bookmarked, and usually get here through there. Ginger: Not here, but I've been having a problem getting on TOC. I suspect foul play. Or maybe fowl play. When in doubt, blame the chickens. Ginger __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From willsonkmom at msn.com Mon Apr 25 14:23:26 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 14:23:26 -0000 Subject: Weasley Age Gaps Message-ID: I'm working on the Weasley age gaps which sometimes includes the possible Missing Weasley and/or the Ron is a 7th son Weasley. Most of these seem to fit better in the Group Dynamics/Weasley family than in the "how old is______?" catagory. In some cases that would mean adding the code for dynamics. Thoughts, anyone? Kathy K., what do you think? I'm leaning toward the age gap heading to be about the ages of the characters rather than possible scenarios of what might have been. More thoughts? So far I've marked over half to be removed from the heading or rejected completely. But I think I'll glance through the ones being kept to further weed out the duplicated ideas. Along that line, did we already decide that I don't need every Weasley name to be coded along with the age gap code? Some posts are only about Bill and Charlie, some include everyone in the house. Right now, most are only the age gap. A few have more to say about a character and in that case the character is coded. Kathy W: who can't keep up with her own kids' ages much less a pack of Weasleys! The corned beef is easier, no one likes it. From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Mon Apr 25 21:58:13 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 21:58:13 -0000 Subject: Weasley Age Gaps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "potioncat" wrote: > > I'm working on the Weasley age gaps which sometimes includes the > possible Missing Weasley and/or the Ron is a 7th son Weasley. Most of > these seem to fit better in the Group Dynamics/Weasley family than in > the "how old is______?" catagory. In some cases that would mean > adding the code for dynamics. > > Thoughts, anyone? Kathy K., what do you think? > > I'm leaning toward the age gap heading to be about the ages of the > characters rather than possible scenarios of what might have been. > > More thoughts? Carolyn: Erm, isn't this what I said a few days ago: >>In my view, 1.2.12 (calculating character's ages) should maybe be a subset of 1.2.10, characterisation, whereas 1.2.12.1 (Weasley age gaps) should maybe be a subset of 1.2.11.1 (Weasleys), except that would make it a level 5 head. Maybe all of 1.2.12.1 should just be folded into 1.2.11.1 and left for KathyK to sort out ...<< > > So far I've marked over half to be removed from the heading or > rejected completely. But I think I'll glance through the ones being > kept to further weed out the duplicated ideas. > > Along that line, did we already decide that I don't need every > Weasley name to be coded along with the age gap code? Some posts are > only about Bill and Charlie, some include everyone in the house. > Right now, most are only the age gap. A few have more to say about a > character and in that case the character is coded. > Carolyn: I wouldn't code all the Weasleys individually on these posts. PS - all my Yah groups were ducking in and out of sight all day, no idea what the problem has been. Could make a pope joke, but suppose I better not. From willsonkmom at msn.com Mon Apr 25 22:22:00 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (Kathy Willson) Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 18:22:00 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Weasley Age Gaps References: Message-ID: ----- Original Message ----- From: carolynwhite2 To: HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, April 25, 2005 5:58 PM Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Weasley Age Gaps --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "potioncat" ...> wrote: > > I'm working on the Weasley age gaps which sometimes includes the > possible Missing Weasley and/or the Ron is a 7th son Weasley. Most of > these seem to fit better in the Group Dynamics/Weasley family than in > the "how old is______?" catagory. In some cases that would mean > adding the code for dynamics. > > Thoughts, anyone? Kathy K., what do you think? > > I'm leaning toward the age gap heading to be about the ages of the > characters rather than possible scenarios of what might have been. > > More thoughts? Carolyn: Erm, isn't this what I said a few days ago: >>In my view, 1.2.12 (calculating character's ages) should maybe be a subset of 1.2.10, characterisation, whereas 1.2.12.1 (Weasley age gaps) should maybe be a subset of 1.2.11.1 (Weasleys), except that would make it a level 5 head. Maybe all of 1.2.12.1 should just be folded into 1.2.11.1 and left for KathyK to sort out ...<< Kathy W. Oops, sorry, I was only talking about 1.2.12.1 Weasley age gaps. within it are how old are Charlie and Bill? And how big is the gap? And why don't Molly and Arthur have more kids between Bill&Charlie and Percy. Is is family planning (or lack thereof) or a dastardly DE attack? With posts about birth control, infertility, depression...etc., etc. I actually thought you were kidding about giving it all to Kathy K. I've marked ones for elimination. Some that are worth keeping might fit just as well in the dynamics. So, should I cull the list (1.2.12.1) and let Kathy K consider how the keepers fit with the Weasley code of 1.2.11.1? In re-reading this, I think yes, my review confirms your view that it would be a subset of Weasleys or possibly even just within Weasleys. KathyW -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From willsonkmom at msn.com Tue Apr 26 13:39:23 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2005 13:39:23 -0000 Subject: Weasley Age Gaps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Kathy W before: > I've marked ones for elimination. Some that are worth keeping might fit just as well in the dynamics. So, should I cull the list (1.2.12.1) and let Kathy K consider how the keepers fit with the Weasley code of 1.2.11.1? Kathy W now I took action on the Weasley Age Gap posts 1.2.12.1: Was 109 now 36. Some of these are only coded to the one heading, some have other codes as well. Many of these are already coded to Weasleys. In that number I completely rejected a little over 20 posts. Why don't we leave it be until I sort out 1.12.1 Calculating Characters' Ages? That way, whatever we do with ages will be consistent. Because many of the Gap posts were also coded to Characters Ages, the numbers for that have dropped too. 1.2.12 was 204 now 185. There are probably enough Weasly Age Gap posts now. If you come across any while coding, only code if it is about calculating the age gap and is a very good post. Any that have to do with whether Arthur was working too hard and wasn't in the mood or Molly's possible post-partum depression and not in the mood, or the war with LV and no one was in the mood...well, make your best judgement call. Kathy W. From quigonginger at yahoo.com Wed Apr 27 13:55:12 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2005 13:55:12 -0000 Subject: Magic Quill? Message-ID: Hi folks! What are we doing with Magic Quill posts? I didn't find it under magical items, and I was wondering if it would be under Hogwarts Admitance or Magical Writing (which seems more for owl post posts). The post I found asks about the quill itself. Why it was made. How it was made. How it works. I know there will be a ton of these posts. Is there a category that I missed? Or should we start one? Ginger, "Support Levitated Objects!" From kakearney at comcast.net Wed Apr 27 20:58:38 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2005 20:58:38 -0000 Subject: Magic Quill? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "quigonginger" wrote: > > Hi folks! What are we doing with Magic Quill posts? I didn't find it > under magical items, and I was wondering if it would be under Hogwarts > Admitance or Magical Writing (which seems more for owl post posts). > The post I found asks about the quill itself. Why it was made. How it > was made. How it works. I know there will be a ton of these posts. > > Is there a category that I missed? Or should we start one? > > Ginger, "Support Levitated Objects!" I think this should go in what is currently the Admission Process/School Population category. I'm in the midst of reviewing this category; it's pretty large, and I'm probably going to break it into two categories. I can see why they were lumped together, since many school population arguments are based on admission selectivity ideas, but I think it will be more organized to separate the two, and double- code where necessary. I had to take a brief hiatus from coding/reviewing due to a project at work, but that just concluded itself and I'll try to finish reviewing this category this week. I'll let you know then if the Quill deserves its own category. -Kelly From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Thu Apr 28 05:29:49 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:29:49 +1000 Subject: KITCHEN SINK? Message-ID: <20050428052949.GB28190@4dot0.net> Seems there is another MAGIC DISHWASHER variant here, but very minor since Ginger and I are the only coders for it so far. Ref #45498 and #45503. It appears to be a Neville-related proof that Dumbledore is not an unthinking Dishwasher!Dumbledore. Another of JKR's little moral points perhaps? -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Thu Apr 28 05:46:31 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:46:31 +1000 Subject: Seventh Son stuff Message-ID: <20050428054631.GC28190@4dot0.net> How come the Seventh Son theory doesn't have its own acronym, even though it's part of 3 other acronyms and seems to be a constant preoccupation of TBAY Imperious!Arthur arguments? Does it deserve a category of its own under Arthur? -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Thu Apr 28 09:30:59 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 19:30:59 +1000 Subject: 45501-45600 done Message-ID: <20050428093059.GD28190@4dot0.net> 25 rejects Further to my previous posts of today, there is an emerging trend of the 'seventh son' and even 'second daughter' theories being increasingly depended upon by other theories, notably the Auror!Weasley and Imperious!Weasley favoured by TBAY at the time (Oct 2002). Shaky stuff IMHO. #45549 sums up one poster's feelings in an apt filk: "TBAYers must not try not to over-theory us". There are also some spooky predictions about the Prophecy turning up, way before one was even mooted (#45584 is pretty good). There were a number of apparently short-lived acronyms coined in this batch: DRAINSNAKE, ICE CREAM, but also some more well-known ones, VICTIM and I GOT YOUR PARALLELISM, MISTER (from the rather scorching trials of TBAYer Cindy). Someone who kept track of these threads might be able to tell me how they've panned out since OotP arrived. Taking 46001-46100. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From quigonginger at yahoo.com Thu Apr 28 11:37:43 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 04:37:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050428113743.10943.qmail@web30207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> ewe2 wrote: How come the Seventh Son theory doesn't have its own acronym, even though it's part of 3 other acronyms and seems to be a constant preoccupation of TBAY Imperious!Arthur arguments? Does it deserve a category of its own under Arthur? Ginger: Just hazzarding a guess, but I would bet that it is because it is a part of so many other theories. I don't think Seventh Son is ever just by itself. There is usually something else related. And it almost always includes making Ron a Seer. In answer to your other post about KITCHEN SINK, I think a lot of those small ones will just have 2 or 3 posts max. If they didn't catch on, they are never referred to again. I forget how they all panned out. I used to lurk in the Royal George before Hurricane Jo, but there were so darn many that I don't remember half of them. Ah, the 'BAY; what I wouldn't give to be at the bar, Odgen's in hand, listening to the masters at work. I guess it was too good to last. Ginger, waxing nostalgic. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Thu Apr 28 13:14:52 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 23:14:52 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: <20050428113743.10943.qmail@web30207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20050428113743.10943.qmail@web30207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050428131452.GB19537@4dot0.net> On Thu, Apr 28, 2005 at 04:37:43AM -0700, Ginger wrote: > Ginger: Just hazzarding a guess, but I would bet that it is because it is a > part of so many other theories. I don't think Seventh Son is ever just by > itself. There is usually something else related. And it almost always > includes making Ron a Seer. In my last batch SST (Seventh Son Theory) and SDT (Second Daughter Theory) made up at least a quarter of the posts, and they were all standalone. This isn't counting the TBAY theories on top of that. The Missing Weasley Child has been around for ages, and would count under the same category too. And since we're able to talk about SST in such a way, should it not be a category then? > In answer to your other post about KITCHEN SINK, I think a lot of those > small ones will just have 2 or 3 posts max. If they didn't catch on, they > are never referred to again. I forget how they all panned out. I used to > lurk in the Royal George before Hurricane Jo, but there were so darn many > that I don't remember half of them. Ah, the 'BAY; what I wouldn't give to > be at the bar, Odgen's in hand, listening to the masters at work. I > guess it was too good to last. I think KITCHEN SINK was an earlier version of MAGIC DISHWASHER. At least the TBAYers at this point were still using Dishwasher!Dumbledore w/o the MAGIC part. And what happened to TBAY? Was Hurricane Jo so destructive that it was simply given up? Or were the major players bored with it? May I point out parenthetically that I never disliked TBAY as much as regarded it as a world unto itself. Even now when I understand more about its inner workings, I still think it was an unusual private game played out in public, and not necessarily as authoritative as some people appear to think. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From willsonkmom at msn.com Thu Apr 28 13:28:52 2005 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 13:28:52 -0000 Subject: Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: <20050428131452.GB19537@4dot0.net> Message-ID: Sean wrote: > In my last batch SST (Seventh Son Theory) and SDT (Second Daughter Theory) > made up at least a quarter of the posts, and they were all standalone. This > isn't counting the TBAY theories on top of that. The Missing Weasley Child has > been around for ages, and would count under the same category too. And since > we're able to talk about SST in such a way, should it not be a category then? Potioncat: Just a reminder, don't code it to Weasley Age Gap. There was a lot of 7th son there. Ginger: Ah, the 'BAY; what I wouldn't give to > > be at the bar, Odgen's in hand, listening to the masters at work. I > > guess it was too good to last. >Sean: And what happened to TBAY? Was Hurricane Jo so destructive that it was > simply given up? Or were the major players bored with it? Potioncat: What does happen to the better posters? Very few hang around. I know, at some point it's all been said too many times. But does anyone think some of these authors will re-appear after HBP? From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Thu Apr 28 13:33:03 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 23:33:03 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: References: <20050428131452.GB19537@4dot0.net> Message-ID: <20050428133303.GC19537@4dot0.net> On Thu, Apr 28, 2005 at 01:28:52PM -0000, potioncat wrote: > Potioncat: Just a reminder, don't code it to Weasley Age Gap. There > was a lot of 7th son there. No, I've been a good penguin and avoided that. > Potioncat: > What does happen to the better posters? Very few hang around. I know, > at some point it's all been said too many times. But does anyone > think some of these authors will re-appear after HBP? I hope so, but surely TBAY was a bit of an institution, I'm surprised it just folded like that. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From quigonginger at yahoo.com Thu Apr 28 13:47:06 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 06:47:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050428134706.64091.qmail@web30215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Sean wrote: > In my last batch SST (Seventh Son Theory) and SDT (Second Daughter Theory) > made up at least a quarter of the posts, and they were all standalone. This > isn't counting the TBAY theories on top of that. The Missing Weasley Child has > been around for ages, and would count under the same category too. And since > we're able to talk about SST in such a way, should it not be a category then? Potioncat: Just a reminder, don't code it to Weasley Age Gap. There was a lot of 7th son there. Ginger: Sean, I am pretty sure we are coding consecutive numbered sections. The one I did had a ton of 7th Son stuff, but it was tied to I/Arthur or the like. Perhaps it did stand on its own later. When I left off, people were arguing if I/Arthur would work without 7th Son and vice versa (or something like that). Maybe if it has branched out we should give it its own. Does it still tie in to Seer!Ron? On another topic: >Sean: And what happened to TBAY? Was Hurricane Jo so destructive that it was > simply given up? Or were the major players bored with it? Potioncat: What does happen to the better posters? Very few hang around. I know, at some point it's all been said too many times. But does anyone think some of these authors will re-appear after HBP? Ginger: I'd give my eye teeth (which are actually still intact!) to have Captain Cindy, The Elkins, Eileen, the MDDT, and others like that back. Pippin is still among us, but I haven't seen her at the George drinking her odd red-coloured liquid in a coon's age. To be honest, I expected TBAY to pick up after the debris was hauled away. After OoP came out, there were a few forays into the arena, but many just didn't get it. Plus, after 4 books, the world was wide open. Now it has been narrowed down. Once upon a time, I said offlist (was it to Potioncat? It was someone who joined up at the time of OoP) that TBAY would come alive again, and we'd have ringside seats. I also stated once upon a time that there was no way on God's Green Earth that Darth Vader was Luke's father. The list has changed since then. We've doubled, and, as with all things which are a sum of their parts, we've evolved. Unfortunately, we seem to have lost our BAY. Ginger, thanking Kelly (?) (bad memory, like a steel seive) for the advise on the quill. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Thu Apr 28 14:07:03 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 14:07:03 -0000 Subject: Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: <20050428131452.GB19537@4dot0.net> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, ewe2 wrote: > > I think KITCHEN SINK was an earlier version of MAGIC DISHWASHER. At least the > TBAYers at this point were still using Dishwasher!Dumbledore w/o the MAGIC > part. And what happened to TBAY? Was Hurricane Jo so destructive that it was > simply given up? Or were the major players bored with it? May I point out > parenthetically that I never disliked TBAY as much as regarded it as a world > unto itself. Even now when I understand more about its inner workings, I still > think it was an unusual private game played out in public, and not necessarily > as authoritative as some people appear to think. > KITCHEN SINK was/is nothing of the sort. It isn't even really a theory. There was an anti-MD Snape theory called PRESSURE COOKER dreamt up by the Faith contingent some time after SPYING GAME I & II were published, and someone (Eloise I think) said jokingly one point that they now had everything but the kitchen sink. This is an apposite Brit colloquialism meaning 'everything but the rubbish, the dregs'. Sean, please note the post numbers we have now got to - we are already into second-round arguments about MD. If MD is referred to, the reference is to the whole theory, from post 39662 onwards. The actual MD acronym was not coined until post 39751 - see Grey Wolf's post 39854 for an explanation. The reference to mysterious agenda's in the acronym are Dumbledore's and Voldie's, you can't separate that bit out. And I think you are missing the point about TBAY completely. It is (IMO) a fascinating **style** that some people adopted to try and explain their theories. In as far as it advanced particular theories, it is as valid as any other style of posting. 'Authoritative' is completely the wrong adjective to use about it; no post on this ridiculous list is 'authoritative' about anything! There are still quite a lot of the original TBAYers around the list (eg Pippin) but it's not a game worth playing unless a group wants to join in. Like most other interesting aspects of HPfGU it's been driven off the board by the terminally brain dead. There never were any barriers to joining in, apart from making the effort to understand and read, and experiment. Sure, there are lots of in- jokes, but is that a crime? It's what happens when people get to know each other on and offlist. So what? Why does everything always have to be plain vanilla, understandable by the dullest wits in the universe... Carolyn ..getting heated, and eyeing up that length of rope. From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Thu Apr 28 14:19:07 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2005 00:19:07 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: <20050428134706.64091.qmail@web30215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20050428134706.64091.qmail@web30215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050428141907.GD19537@4dot0.net> On Thu, Apr 28, 2005 at 06:47:06AM -0700, Ginger wrote: > Ginger: Sean, I am pretty sure we are coding consecutive numbered sections. > The one I did had a ton of 7th Son stuff, but it was tied to I/Arthur or the > like. Perhaps it did stand on its own later. When I left off, people were > arguing if I/Arthur would work without 7th Son and vice versa (or something > like that). Interesting, I haven't come across that. Noone on my batch seemed to worry about that connection, it seemed a given for Imperious!Arthur and even Auror!Arthur not to mention Imperious!Molly. > Maybe if it has branched out we should give it its own. Does it still tie > in to Seer!Ron? No, they seem more concerned with the Missing Child as the basis for the above theories and not Seer!Ron. In fact SST seems to have morphed with MCT (Missing Child Theory) as the platform for speculation that Molly/Arthur had previous Auror jobs and the killing of the child sent them into hiding. Often with the rider that Bill and Charlie know or suspect this. > The list has changed since then. We've doubled, and, as with all things > which are a sum of their parts, we've evolved. Unfortunately, we seem to > have lost our BAY. Perhaps then, like all good ideas, it ran its course. And it really took great enthusiasm on the part of the players to keep it going for so long. Anyway, how would TBAY play against the huge S/N ratio the List has now? -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Thu Apr 28 14:59:08 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2005 00:59:08 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: References: <20050428131452.GB19537@4dot0.net> Message-ID: <20050428145908.GE19537@4dot0.net> On Thu, Apr 28, 2005 at 02:07:03PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > KITCHEN SINK was/is nothing of the sort. It isn't even really a > theory. There was an anti-MD Snape theory called PRESSURE COOKER > dreamt up by the Faith contingent some time after SPYING GAME I & II > were published, and someone (Eloise I think) said jokingly one point > that they now had everything but the kitchen sink. This is an > apposite Brit colloquialism meaning 'everything but the rubbish, the > dregs'. I refer you again to #45498 where the acronym is spelt out. I'm quite aware of what the colloquial 'kitchen sink' means, it did filter down here to us colonials. In any case it looks very much like a theory, and related to DISHWASHER, even in the negative sense. Personally I don't see any dichotomy in the characterization of DD anyway, in fact I think it strengthens DD's position. > Sean, please note the post numbers we have now got to - we are > already into second-round arguments about MD. If MD is referred to, > the reference is to the whole theory, from post 39662 onwards. The > actual MD acronym was not coined until post 39751 - see Grey Wolf's > post 39854 for an explanation. The reference to mysterious agenda's > in the acronym are Dumbledore's and Voldie's, you can't separate that > bit out. Don't understand what relevance this has, but anyway... > And I think you are missing the point about TBAY completely. It is > (IMO) a fascinating **style** that some people adopted to try and > explain their theories. In as far as it advanced particular theories, > it is as valid as any other style of posting. 'Authoritative' is > completely the wrong adjective to use about it; no post on this > ridiculous list is 'authoritative' about anything! That's not the impression I got, and you can scream 'wrong wrong wrong' at the top of your voice as much as you like. My impression is that TBAY was as much intimidating as admired. I never said it wasn't valid, but it certainly wasn't easy to join in. Not everyone had that skill, not everyone wanted to build theories on top of each other and destroy them. The trouble with TBAY was that it was too successful as an entertainment and a focus in itself, and discussion around it tended to focus on acronyms and positions it presented. That's as 'authoritative' as anything gets on the List, apart from canon itself. Much easier to talk about what TBAY said than to add to TBAY yourself. I doubt a quarter of the List at the time even made head or tail of TBAY let alone felt qualified to make a contribution. So as a "style" it was singularly unsuccessful, as a "focus" it was wildly so. I'm oddly reminded of Monty Python takeoffs of "serious" BBC investigative-type current-affairs programmes. Yes, TBAY were the Monty Python of the List. It all makes sense now. > There are still quite a lot of the original TBAYers around the list > (eg Pippin) but it's not a game worth playing unless a group wants to > join in. Like most other interesting aspects of HPfGU it's been > driven off the board by the terminally brain dead. There never were > any barriers to joining in, apart from making the effort to > understand and read, and experiment. Sure, there are lots of in- > jokes, but is that a crime? It's what happens when people get to know > each other on and offlist. So what? Why does everything always have > to be plain vanilla, understandable by the dullest wits in the > universe... Now you're getting paranoid and more than a bit elitist, if I may say so. Us idiots are quite happy for you to put on the TBAY show, just don't expect us to do any different than before. We never stopped you in the first place. Lampooning people because they didn't join in is silly. > Carolyn > ..getting heated, and eyeing up that length of rope. Any last requests? Sean -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Thu Apr 28 16:07:19 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 16:07:19 -0000 Subject: TBAY In-Reply-To: <20050428145908.GE19537@4dot0.net> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, ewe2 wrote: > On Thu, Apr 28, 2005 at 02:07:03PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > > > KITCHEN SINK was/is nothing of the sort. It isn't even really a > > theory. Sean: > I refer you again to #45498 where the acronym is spelt out. I'm quite aware of > what the colloquial 'kitchen sink' means, it did filter down here to us > colonials. In any case it looks very much like a theory, and related to > DISHWASHER, even in the negative sense. Personally I don't see any dichotomy > in the characterization of DD anyway, in fact I think it strengthens DD's > position. Carolyn: #45498 is by Pippin, who doesn't support MD at all, quite the opposite. Also, filling in the acronym had been an ongoing joke since Marina first made the comment in #45348. First Eloise (#45374), then Pippin (#45390), then Pip (#45401) all couldn't think of anything. Finally Pippin made something up, which survived one post; it's not a serious theory - PRESSURE COOKER was the one they were all really discussing. Sean: > That's not the impression I got, and you can scream 'wrong wrong wrong' at the > top of your voice as much as you like. My impression is that TBAY was as much > intimidating as admired. I never said it wasn't valid, but it certainly wasn't > easy to join in. Not everyone had that skill, not everyone wanted to build > theories on top of each other and destroy them. The trouble with TBAY was that > it was too successful as an entertainment and a focus in itself, and > discussion around it tended to focus on acronyms and positions it presented. Carolyn: You continue to sound as though it is somehow wrong for there to be anything whatsoever on the list that can't be followed by a two year old. And the acronyms used in TBAY were widely and consistently used in non-TBAY style posts, as is seen in the run of posts referred to above. People ducked in and out of the style as it pleased them. There was no rule you had to respond in TBAY format to points raised in those posts, and lots of people didn't. You comment that 'the trouble with TBAY..' as though that is some finally agreed verdict by most people. This isn't the case, many people enjoyed it then, and continue to do so now, and would like to see it return. You didn't, you are entitled to your view, but don't try and make it sound like a consensus. Much easier to talk about what TBAY said than to add to TBAY yourself. > I doubt a quarter of the List at the time even made head or tail of TBAY let > alone felt qualified to make a contribution. So as a "style" it was singularly > unsuccessful, as a "focus" it was wildly so. I'm oddly reminded of Monty > Python takeoffs of "serious" BBC investigative-type current-affairs > programmes. Yes, TBAY were the Monty Python of the List. It all makes sense > now. Carolyn: Again, you are making assumptions that you can't prove and which are irrelevant. There is no correlation between the number of people who do or don't like a style and whether it is 'successful' as you term it. You could use such a criteria if you were running some kind of marketing campaign, where the objective was for the maximum number of people to understand a sales message, but that is not the point of contributions on HPfGU. Every post is a personal take on the series, and if some people do not understand what someone has said that in no way invalidates what has been written. And Monty Python is the wrong analogy to use if you are wanting to criticise apparently elitist writing, since those shows and their scripts have now become completely entrenched as part of the cult history of satire. > > > Now you're getting paranoid and more than a bit elitist, if I may say so. Us > idiots are quite happy for you to put on the TBAY show, just don't expect us > to do any different than before. We never stopped you in the first place. > Lampooning people because they didn't join in is silly. Carolyn: I was not part of the list during the main TBAY period, only towards the end, just post-OOP. I don't think I've ever posted in TBAY style on the main list, once or twice maybe some posts edged towards it. As I've said above, no one was obliged to respond in that style, but denigrating the people who did just because you personally find it difficult to follow is not helpful. My opinion, which I will not retract, is that the list is a duller and poorer place without TBAY. > > > Carolyn > > ..getting heated, and eyeing up that length of rope. > > Any last requests? > > Sean ..why yes, Sean, that as you are standing there with the noose around your neck, that you listen respectfully as MD is read out to you, in order for you to atone for your sins and beg forgiveness in the hereafter. From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Thu Apr 28 16:54:06 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2005 02:54:06 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: TBAY In-Reply-To: References: <20050428145908.GE19537@4dot0.net> Message-ID: <20050428165406.GF19537@4dot0.net> On Thu, Apr 28, 2005 at 04:07:19PM -0000, CarolynWhite2 wrote: > ..why yes, Sean, that as you are standing there with the noose around > your neck, that you listen respectfully as MD is read out to you, in > order for you to atone for your sins and beg forgiveness in the > hereafter. I was going to respond in kind but realized it would only encourage you. I'd like to see TBAY back myself, but I doubt it will return. In some ways I see TOC as a successor and perhaps the TBAYers could be coaxed to set up camp there. As for MD, I don't doubt DD is an orchestrator of many of the events of HP, but I'm uncertain of his reach. MD has already had to be altered, and I fear if DD is not the all-knowing all-puppeteer revealed by book seven or even book six that MD loses much of its force thereby. And isn't it so with so-called Overlords of all stripes that their force is only as great as the belief of their underlings? -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From kakearney at comcast.net Thu Apr 28 17:24:55 2005 From: kakearney at comcast.net (corinthum) Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 17:24:55 -0000 Subject: Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: <20050428134706.64091.qmail@web30215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I think the problem with Seventh Son is that it means different things in different contexts. It started, and its namesake derives from, Seer! Ron arguments stating that stating that IF the Weasly age gap could be explained by a missing child, then that would connect Ron to a Seer stereotype (these posts are all in Seers and Ron now). But it's often used to simply refer to the idea that there IS a missing Weasly child. This in turn is often offered as support for Imperious!Arthur. So where would a Seventh Son category go? Seers? Weasleys? Ron? Arthur and/or Molly? -Kelly From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Thu Apr 28 18:07:40 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2005 04:07:40 +1000 Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Seventh Son stuff In-Reply-To: References: <20050428134706.64091.qmail@web30215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050428180739.GG19537@4dot0.net> On Thu, Apr 28, 2005 at 05:24:55PM -0000, corinthum wrote: > > > I think the problem with Seventh Son is that it means different things > in different contexts. It started, and its namesake derives from, Seer! > Ron arguments stating that stating that IF the Weasly age gap could be > explained by a missing child, then that would connect Ron to a Seer > stereotype (these posts are all in Seers and Ron now). But it's often > used to simply refer to the idea that there IS a missing Weasly child. > This in turn is often offered as support for Imperious!Arthur. > > So where would a Seventh Son category go? Seers? Weasleys? Ron? > Arthur and/or Molly? Missing Child Theory would cover it IMHO. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying! From quigonginger at yahoo.com Fri Apr 29 13:59:38 2005 From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger) Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2005 13:59:38 -0000 Subject: trouble with the site or me? Message-ID: Hi. Is anyone else having trouble with the site? I click, and a) nothing happens b) it displays the message, but won't display the left-hand side c) it won't display anything except the "page cannot be displayed" note d) it works fine (not complaining, just listing for completeness.) If I click it again (sometimes up to 4 times) it will finally do what I want it to do. It was odd. From 2:00am to about 6:30am it worked just fine, then from about 6:30 to 7:30 it went all odd on me. Is it me or it? BTW, I had a slew of "who's gonna die in 5" posts. Rejected an entire thread that was of the "ooh, I hope it isn't Hagrid. I just love him" variety. Kept a bunch from another thread that were either well thought out or good character analyses. It seems like I hit a spell on the list where there wasn't a lot of creative thinking. Also, the "I heard a very reliable rumour" that turns out to be rubbish frenzy has started. I feel we will have a lot of rejects in the near future. Ginger, who had a good tag line, but forgot it. From carolynwhite2 at aol.com Fri Apr 29 14:48:55 2005 From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2) Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2005 14:48:55 -0000 Subject: trouble with the site or me? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "quigonginger" wrote: > Hi. Is anyone else having trouble with the site? > It was odd. From 2:00am to about 6:30am it worked just fine, then > from about 6:30 to 7:30 it went all odd on me. Is it me or it? > > Ginger, who had a good tag line, but forgot it. Carolyn: 15.48 UK time - ok this side of the pond.. From ewe2 at 4dot0.net Sat Apr 30 07:26:21 2005 From: ewe2 at 4dot0.net (ewe2) Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2005 17:26:21 +1000 Subject: Hurrah Message-ID: <20050430072620.GB24732@4dot0.net> Just wanted to thank Carolyn for Jasper FForde: anyone who can characterize a Richard III performance in terms of Rocky Horror is going to be read to death. I love his names for characters: Jack Schitt is my favourite. Good thing I ordered the next three books. Sean. -- Windows XP: like KDE, only more annoying!