3.8 Magic

[carolynwhite2]

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "dungrollin" 
<spotthedungbeetle at h...> wrote:
> 

So what should I do with squibs? Should all the mentions of Petunia
possibly being a squib be coded to Petunia *and* squibs, even though
they don't discuss squibs at all? I don't really want them in
squibs, but if you say they should stay, they shall.

Carolyn:
This is tricky, and we will have to agree what to do on a category by 
category basis.

On Petunia and squibs. I would not cross code to squibs unless the 
post was a substantive discussion about this possibility and what it 
might mean - passing mentions don't count.

*******************************

3.8 Magic (19 posts which have now disappeared, but I've still got a
list of them) where nowt should be coded.

Most of these can be removed to other categories, however, a few
discuss Magic vs Muggle technology and include limitations on magic,
how magic affects muggle technology and magic as technology in the
WW. Limits on Magic will go to general properties and types of
magic, magic vs/as/interfering with technology into Wireless and
other wizarding technologies. Ok?

There were three posts on how magic is viewed in the Bible and the
Talmud – with *absolutely no* reference to HP whatsoever (17962,
17993 and 18036), which I don't quite know what to do with.
Presumably 3.8.2 Gen. Prop. & types of magic cross-coded to
religious influences – though it's a bit of an abuse of 3.8.2 (but
see below).

Carolyn:
This was me the other day, rapidly removing posts from level 2 
categories to places of safety. I made some quick, on-the-hoof 
decisions about where to put them, please feel free to query them and 
change the coding.

The limits on magic ones, I wondered if some of them should belong 
under 3.3.6 Rules & ethics for using magic ?

The religious ones can be safely sent to 1.1.1.1 or 1.1.1.3 I think. 
Although they are not about HP at all, as I recall, they were very 
detailed lists of references, and presumably of interest to someone 
wanting to research banning HP for religious reasons. I just left 
them cross-coded to a magic category for a second opinion on this - 
over to you.


**********************
3.8.1 Magical ability (395)

"Post about what magical ability is, how it manifests itself, how
wizards use it to make things happen"

<snip>
- The End of Magic. The idea (which resurfaces from time to time)
that Harry can only defeat Voldy by causing magic to disappear from
the world completely. (There must be a better place to put them than
here.)
<snip>

I'd like to uncheck all those which make references to magical
ability/development of a character with no discussion or back-up
from canon (of which there are some). Those which discuss it in
depth – was Pettigrew really capable of pulling off the stunt with
the finger? Is Neville a Great wizard labouring under the handicap
of an OTT memory charm? etc – would stay.

Carolyn:
Have no problem with your decisions here, but agree 'End of Magic' 
needs it's own code, and not in this section. The only possible 
option would appear to be Dumbledore, since Harry doesn't have a plan 
himself, and it's not likely to be one of Voldy's !

Boyd - what do you think about this?

On the Pettigrew or Neville magic ability, I think they belong with 
character rather than here, even if they are in-depth discussions. 
Having just sorted through the Peter ones myself over the last few 
days, I know exactly what they contain, and feel sure about it for 
him anyway.

Debbie - what do you think about Neville?

**********************************
3.8.1.1 Squibs (80)

"This topic could overlap with 3.5.2 (Purebloods & half bloods);
remember to code also to individual characters discussed"

Many mentions of squibs but little discussion. If I'm nice, I could
prune it to 55 or so; if I'm *really* ruthless I could get it down
to 30 (see above about cross-coding).

Carolyn:
I am unhappily aware of this anomaly. Does anyone think that a good 
deal of 3.5 Bloodlines and Inheritance should actually be put with 
3.8.1 Magical ability? It is quite a sort out, but I would rather do 
it than fudge the issue.

Also, confession to make - I used to use 3.2.5 Medals, awards & 
titles for discussions about 'what is a warlock' before we created 
3.5.2.1. Those posts need transferring to the new, correct heading. 
My bad.

*******************
3.8.2.1 Ancient Magic (69)

"What is it, examples of"

Almost all posts in this category are also coded to one of the
following:
1.3.5.1 Godric's Hollow/Death of Lily & James
3.5.4 Blood protection
3.8.2 General properties & types of magic

Seems to be quite tempting to add Ancient Magic to discussions of
the first two, so stuff discussing Lily's sacrifice or Harry's
protection at the Dursleys' I'd like to take out of this category
(leaving in 1.3.5.1 and 3.5.4). I think it should really be a subset
of 3.8.2 (Gen. Properties and types of magic) – so general
discussions about magic go into 3.8.2, and only those which
significantly discuss ancient magic in itself (rather than just
mention it) get coded under 3.8.2.1.

Carolyn:
I like the idea of having a cleaner 'ancient magic' category as you 
suggest - but note that it is already a sub-category of 3.8.2. 
However, we probably need to amend another category title to stop the 
confusion happening again in the future. What we could do is change:

3.5.4 to read 'Blood protection at Privet drive/Lily's sacrifice'

This would stop this element of the discussion getting lost within 
1.3.5.1. - after all, is 3.5.4 really about anything else??

**********************
3.8.2.2 Life Debts (83)

"What obligations these impose, how they come about"

Well there's a lot of "What if x owes y a life debt!" I'd like to
cut it down to discussion of them (i.e. the James/Snape one and the
Harry/Pettigrew one) rather than speculation about others. There may
be one or two well-argued theories which hinge on non-canonical life-
debts or how they work, which can stay. If I wanted to find out
about life-debts (according to the definition above) I wouldn't want
to find speculation that Voldy owed Lily because of blah blah blah.
Sound reasonable?

Carolyn:
Yes, I can imagine that this needs a real clear out. I have seen one 
or two posts directly speculating on the nature of life debts as an 
independent topic, and hope you find them in there.

I would be quite strict with the canonical referenced ones, for the 
same reason above on magical ability - it is largely a character 
discussion issue.

******************

3.8.3 Wands (303, down to 215) done.

However, new rules:
<snip>

Carolyn: sounds good to me!