From quigonginger at yahoo.com  Mon May  1 01:52:37 2006
From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger)
Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 01:52:37 -0000
Subject: animagi and other spells
Message-ID: <e33pl5+sf3r@eGroups.com>

Well, I did animagi.  What a category!  Such funny posts.  Such 
insightful posts.  Such repetition.  Was 435, now 181, and I was 
generous.

I also did Confundus (was 3, now 2), Shield Charm (was 9, now 5) and 
Serpensortia (was 3, now 2).  I have put myself down for Expeliarmus, 
but I am out of steam for the night.

Toodles, Ginger






From elfundeb at comcast.net  Tue May  2 12:07:46 2006
From: elfundeb at comcast.net (Debbie)
Date: Tue, 02 May 2006 12:07:46 -0000
Subject: Beings are done
Message-ID: <e37i2i+okqu@eGroups.com>

Final report on 2.14 - Beings.  Once 997 posts (I don't have totals 
by subcategory), the current totals are now as follows:
 
2.14.1 House Elves - 196
2.14.1.1 ENSLAVEMENT - 2
2.14.1.2 SUPPRESSED - 1
2.14.1.3 Dobby - 97
2.14.1.4 Winky - 42
2.14.1.5 Kreacher - 0, but that won't last
2.14.2 Centaurs - 23
2.14.2.1 Firenze - 5
2.14.3 Goblins - 23
2.14.4 Giants - 17
2.14.4.1 Fridwulfa - 3
2.14.5 Vampires - 61
2.14.6 Werewolves - 65
2.14.7 Veela - 35
2.14.8 Trolls - 1
 
Total:  571 (was 997)

Every category went down significantly except for poor Fridwulfa, 
who started out at zero and ended up with three posts (I felt sorry 
for her, I guess).
 
Except for the characters (Dobby, Winky, Fridwulfa), I generally 
kept only posts that discussed the particular category as a group 
(e.g., folkloric origins and how JKR has adapted the legends to her 
own use, how the group acquired its place in the WW, their unique 
characteristics, etc.)  
 
The character categories include only posts about that individual as 
a character; posts that use a characteristic of the character to 
generalise about the group were coded only to the group. 
 
Werewolves:  I kicked out all the "when a werewolf transforms" out; 
I moved a few (less than 5) to Lycanthropy and I hope Ginger will 
forgive me (to ensure I wasn't just undoing her work, I didn't move 
any that identified Ginger as coder).  I also kicked out the 
Homorphus Charm and Wolfsbane posts (as a rule, anyway).  OTOH, I 
left all the silver hand posts alone.  Dock me 5 points for lack of 
consistency, but one could at least argue that how to kill a 
werewolf is not a symptom of lycanthropy.  (I'm a lawyer; I can 
argue anything! ;-))  I'll revise the category description to cross-
reference the other categories, especially Lycanthropy.
 
Vampires:  Not surprisingly, this was mostly about our favorite 
Potions Master.  Because I've already created the Snape assignment 
list, I didn't make any changes to that category, even when a post 
was clearly appropriate to Vampire!Snape (or not about Snape at 
all).  Also, here's the post that apparently kicked it all off.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/1188

Was this Pippin's first post?

I am now feverishly awaiting the signal to get started on Snape, but 
can take on something else in the meantime if necessary. 
 
Debbie
proudly wearing her S.P.U.G. (Society for the Protection of Ugly 
Goblins) badge
 
 
 
 
 






From quigonginger at yahoo.com  Tue May  2 12:24:50 2006
From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger)
Date: Tue, 2 May 2006 05:24:50 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Beings are done
In-Reply-To: <e37i2i+okqu@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20060502122450.77438.qmail@web30201.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


Debbie <elfundeb at comcast.net> wrote:    Werewolves:  I kicked out all the "when a werewolf transforms" out; 
I moved a few (less than 5) to Lycanthropy and I hope Ginger will 
forgive me (to ensure I wasn't just undoing her work, I didn't move 
any that identified Ginger as coder).  I also kicked out the 
Homorphus Charm and Wolfsbane posts (as a rule, anyway).  OTOH, I 
left all the silver hand posts alone.  Dock me 5 points for lack of 
consistency, but one could at least argue that how to kill a 
werewolf is not a symptom of lycanthropy.  (I'm a lawyer; I can 
argue anything! ;-))  I'll revise the category description to cross-
reference the other categories, especially Lycanthropy.

  Ginger:
  Not a problem.  I'll assume that they belong there.  Since it's less than 5, I won't worry about it.
   
  Ginger, wondering:
  Is there anyone else in HPfGU that *isn't* a lawyer?  

		
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From kakearney at gmail.com  Wed May  3 03:34:31 2006
From: kakearney at gmail.com (corinthum)
Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 03:34:31 -0000
Subject: Veritaserum and another survey
Message-ID: <e398c7+almv@eGroups.com>

3.8.4.3 Veritaserum
------------------------
Originally: 84
Now: 46
  
All you ever wanted to know about veritaserum...  How does it work? 
Does it uncover absolute truth or only truth as someone remembers it?
 When is it ethical or legal to use it?  Can it overcome Memory
Charms?  How reliable is it?

There were tons of "Why didn't ____ use Veritaserum on ____ to
corroborate/disprove his/her story/alibi/excuse?"  I kept the good
responses to these questions, but please leave the questions out. 
Discussions concentrating of the wizard court system without
discussing any specifics of veritaserum should stay out of this
category as well.  Also, the lie detector/sodium penthanol
it's-not-100%-accurate-so-not-admissible-in-court analogy has been
used to death, so no more of those.  

*****

And on a different note, I'm heading out on one last survey at the end
of the month, through mid-August.  Perhaps I can try to steal back the
Most Prolific Coder title from Ginger.  I'm not sure if any major
changes need to be made to my offline version of the database; there
have been a few category changes since my last update, and of course
I'll need the newest version of the giant posts-with-codes sql file. 
Anything else, Paul or Carolyn?

-Kelly







From stevejjen at earthlink.net  Sat May  6 01:48:00 2006
From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese)
Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 01:48:00 -0000
Subject: Dementia at 38?
Message-ID: <e3gv8g+9oih@eGroups.com>

I could swear I sent a post to this group last night, but didn't see 
it today. Sooo...here goes again in shortened form:

At the moment I can't use the computer much because of a repetitive 
motion injury in my wrists/elbows from working at the library and, um, 
presumably from using the computer too much. :)

I still have approx. 100 posts left in Characterization and will pick 
away at those over the next week or so, but don't know if I'll be able 
to help with Snape right away. I'll be back, though! All this started 
in early April and I'm definitely seeing some improvement and expect 
it to be more rapid after starting physical therapy next week. I'll 
keep you guys posted.

Jen, missing her on-line life and not even reading posts at the moment 
to avoid the temptation of starting 'just a little one' and ending up 
with an essay.







From quigonginger at yahoo.com  Sat May  6 02:56:58 2006
From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger)
Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 19:56:58 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Dementia at 38? and update
In-Reply-To: <e3gv8g+9oih@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20060506025658.35741.qmail@web30202.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Jen Reese <stevejjen at earthlink.net> wrote:
  I could swear I sent a post to this group last night, but didn't see 
it today. Sooo...here goes again in shortened form:

At the moment I can't use the computer much because of a repetitive 
motion injury in my wrists/elbows from working at the library and, um, 
presumably from using the computer too much. :)
   
  Ginger:
  It's not just you- if you have noticed on the main list that there have been extremely few posts yesterday, it's because all Yahoo groups have had a problem.  At least that's what I was told.  I was talking offlist to another listee and we both had sent posts that didn't appear on the list.  She had the sense to save hers.  She said she had the problem with other lists and had been told that it was a Yahoo thing.
   
  Hope your wrists/elbows feel better soon.   As long as I'm wishing you well, I hope all your body parts are fully and happily functional.
   
  As long as I'm here....
  I did Experiarmus, was 17, now 11; Ridikkulus, was 2, now 2; and Accio, was 52, now 33.  I also put myself down for the one above Accio.  Which one that is escapes me now...dementia at 39 5/6?  (Holding on that 40 thing).  Nah, just an intellectual interlude.  We return you now to your regularly scheduled schedule.
   
  Ginger, who registers for college tomorrow.  Gack!

		
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From carolynwhite2 at aol.com  Sat May  6 21:03:03 2006
From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2)
Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 21:03:03 -0000
Subject: Waving white flag...
Message-ID: <e3j2u7+n1kj@eGroups.com>

Dear All

Have to confess I am not sure when I am going to contribute much in 
the near future.. I'm working 12-14hr days at the moment, not my 
idea of fun at all, but inescapable until I get this new dept into 
some sort of shape.

Would any of you like to step into the breach, and do some 
organising? I am conscious you would like to get on with Snape, and 
need me to do some setting up on the dbase. Could one of you post 
exactly what sections you want, and I'll do that at least?

I won't disappear, and can do straightforward things, but I just 
can't keep my eyes open late at night long enough to think and make 
decisions.. so sorry.

Another job that needs doing is updating the word files with the 
decisions we've made, and the reasons for them..

Decided it was best to admit to the situation, than keep promising 
myself I'll do some tonight, this weekend, next week...

Kelly- best to contact Paul direct to arrange update of dbase when 
you are about to embark this summer. 

Carolyn
..feeling very sad letting you all down like this, so near the 
finish line






From quigonginger at yahoo.com  Mon May  8 08:06:34 2006
From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger)
Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 08:06:34 -0000
Subject: Waving white flag...
In-Reply-To: <e3j2u7+n1kj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e3mu6a+fp39@eGroups.com>

Carolyn:
> Another job that needs doing is updating the word files with the 
> decisions we've made, and the reasons for them..

Ginger:
I'm not sure how much help this will be, but I went back to 5 Dec and 
went through all the posts and cut and pasted everything that I 
thought might be what you wanted for file thingies and put them in 
order according to how they appear in the category list.  

I put the message number with each entry so if it is confusing, 
whoever is going to actually update the files could go back and 
look.  I also divided my list into the three sections of the 
catalogue, and added a "general" section at the end for a discussion 
that covered several areas.  I put the corrolating numbers to the 
catalogue in bold type before each group of posts so they would be 
easier to spot.

I have no idea how to update the actual files, but maybe this would 
help someone who can do this sort of thing. 

Since it is very long, I'll send it in sections.

Hope this helps, Ginger







From quigonginger at yahoo.com  Mon May  8 08:09:40 2006
From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger)
Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 08:09:40 -0000
Subject: section 1 of the stuff I pasted
Message-ID: <e3muc4+s396@eGroups.com>

Just a note before you begin.  The stuff I said I put in bold doesn't 
go to this e-mail in bold.  Sorry about that.  Ginger

SECTION 1:  TEXT ANALYSIS

1.1.1.1 Religious influences
Jen (2502):
I reviewed the subsections of Religious Influences, Wicca, Redemption 
and Lambasting. Started at around 400+ posts and now down to 200. The 
only recommendation I have is rolling Wicca into religious influences 
if that's acceptable. There were only 19 posts I kept for that 
category and most of them discussed Christianity and other religions 
anyway. As for debates which need to be coded carefully in the 
future, Christian vs. secular discussions regarding the references to 
Christmas and Easter have been overdone. I chopped several threads 
which were repeats. 

Carolyn (2505):
Jen: The only recommendation I have is rolling Wicca into religious 
influences if that's acceptable. There were only 19 posts I kept for 
that category and most of them discussed Christianity and other 
religions anyway. 

C: I'll do that. Doesn't sound like it's worth keeping the separate 
category 

1.1.2 Morality vs. Immorality
Debbie (2485):
1.1.2 Morality vs. Immorality 335/136 
1.1.2.1 Following/Breaking Rules 150/87 
1.1.2.2 Responsibility 32/16 
1.1.2.3 Respect/disrespect for authority 63/38 
1.1.2.4 Rashness and Anger 125/41 
1.1.2.5 Jealousy 104/50 1.1.2.6 Pride 34/19 
1.1.2.7 Revenge 23/17 
1.1.2.8 Justice 99/66 
1.1.2.9 Contrition and Forgiveness 46/26 

The main category now includes only general discussions of morality 
in the series and posts on one or another of the Seven Deadly 
Sins/Seven Heavenly Virtues that don't have their own subheads. The 
others are self-explanatory; I generally removed all the Snape's 
Anger/Ron's Jealousy etc. posts unless they had a broader point to 
make. 

1.1.8 Bravery and Courage
Carolyn (2488):
Well, I am very glad that Debbie had done the morality section, as it 
is certainly not my expert area and I was definitely dreading it. To 
compensate I have finally finished section 1.1.8/1.1.8.1, which I 
started months ago. Have to say it consists mainly of examples of 
various characters' courage or cowardice, and at one point I was 
going to take them all out. If I had, there would have been no 
section. So, dubiously, I went through pruning here and there, 
removing obvious glitches etc. Net result is: 1.1.8 Started with 98, 
finished with 81 1.1.8.1 Started with 97, finished with 78 There were 
only about 20 posts cross-coded to both I found, to my surprise. 

1.2.11.8 MWPP
Ginger (2515):
I finished MWPP, but it was only a slight reduction. It started with 
166 posts and ended with 121. Not up to my usual standards, I'm 
afraid. There was a lot of talk about which house(s) the guys were 
in. I kept a lot of it even though we now know that they were Gryffs 
because there was some good insight into the characters. The same 
holds for parallels between the guys and the trio and/or Neville. 
Since there were a lot of differing opinions (all of them valid), I 
was hard pressed to get rid of too much as there wasn't a lot of 
repitition. 







From quigonginger at yahoo.com  Mon May  8 08:11:04 2006
From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger)
Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 08:11:04 -0000
Subject: section 2 of the stuff I pasted
Message-ID: <e3mueo+o6lp@eGroups.com>

SECTION 2:  CHARACTER ANALYSIS

2.2.7 and 2.2.8 James and Lily Potter
Kathy Snow (2526):
LILY 2.2.8 519 posts initially, now 242 
******************************** 
2.2.8.1 FOUL SLAVERY (Females Offer Unlimited Levity: Save Lily And 
Voldemort Eagerly Rewards You!) One post in this category that could 
be blended into 2.2.8.2 ********************************* 
2.2.8.2 Too EWW & variants (not really an acronym) Inish Alley does 
not carry a simplified definition of the theory so I'll try to sum it 
up This acronym was somewhat spawned from the Lollipops theory and 
grew to various degrees of EWW. The TEWW EWW starts off with 
Voldemort rewarding Snape by killing James and Harry and placing Lily 
under Imperious. The acronym evolves to the Even EWWWer theory that 
Voldemort wanted Lily for himself for strategic purposes that 
involved Lily bearing his son. But the worst-case scenario was 
Voldemort saving Lily for himself for lustful purposes, which was 
aptly named sooo EWWer its in the SEWERrrrrrr. 22 posts initially now 
15 due to mere mention of the acronym 
*************************************** 
2.2.8.3 MAKE ME BARF (Lily was spared for Pettigrew "Monstrous 
Activity: Keeping Evil Men Entertained By Allocating Rescued 
Females") This category only has 2 posts both of which could also be 
melted into 2.2.8.2 or Peter-Gets-The-Girl 
*************************************** 
2.2.8.4 AGGIE No posts yet and I couldn't find an acronym meaning at 
Inish Alley *************************************** 
2.2.8.5 SOPPY CHARM (Sacrifice of Purity. Perfect? Yes. Contrived? 
Hardly a Reasoned Move) Two posts that basically ponder whether 
Lily's sacrifice was nothing more than pure love but by way of a 
charm. __________________________________________________________ 
JAMES 2.2.7 This category started with 399 posts its now 254 
*********************************** 
2.2.7.1 JOBS SUCK, BUT HOW ELSE ("James Once Befriended Snape; 
Snape's Unfortunate Curiousity Killed Buddiness Until Tournament 
because Harry Overcame Wrath. Evil Lupin Simply Erroneous and 
Dumbledore's Overarching Eternal Scheme Ought Not Engineer Losing 
Innocence to Voldemort's Extinction.") One post with this acronym and 
I doubt it will see any more. ************************************ 
2.2.7.2 UP JAB (SIC) (Ugly Potter James Awful Bully (Snapes Innocence 
Crucified) No posts yet! *********************************** 
2.2.7.3 (SHH) JAM TAKES BIBS (Squib Harry Hated) James Allowed 
Marvolo To Avada Kedavra Evans's Son But It Backfired Severely) No 
posts yet! __________________________________________________________ 
Quite a few of the posts were removed from the categories due to mere 
mention of the character. There were 70 posts that were rejected 
because they added nothing new or were repetitive views of theories 
that had gone out the window. I did keep at least one of the posts 
from each theory whether or not it could still be feasible i.e. 
Voldemort was Lily's father. Some posts, usually short ones, got the 
axe because they were reiterated in the next post and didn't affect 
any other categories. I removed James and Lily from posts that were 
also under Godric's Hollow/Death of James and Lily; as we agreed back 
in July that it was not necessary to have all three ticked when the 
post reflected the night the Potter's died. 

I would still recommend that a new subcategory be formed for Lily and 
her many lovers, including the LOLLIPOPS of her heart, to capture all 
these types of posts in one area. There are only 53 to date but we 
haven't even started OOP, I'm positive there will be many more. Then 
again we could use the Too EWW & variants category to encompass all 
the little devils that supposedly loved Lily. I believe it would be 
an advantage to have them neatly in one folder instead of helter 
skelter under the main heading. 

I would also like to reiterate my initial proposal to move Lily's 
sacrifice under Lily. Its more user friendly I would think, since 
they are posts that concern Lily, a user would expect to find them 
under her main heading. 

2.5.1 Harry
Anne (2503):
On or about June 20, 2005 there were a total of 2,481 posts in all 
Harry Potter categories combined; 2,376 of which were in 2.5.1 Harry 
Potter. As I began reviewing, a number of others were added as the 
coders brought us up to the release of OoP. Today, there are a total 
of 1,398 posts in all Harry categories; a net reduction of 978. 
Today the Harry categories stand thus: 
2.5.1 Harry Potter -- 134 
2.5.1.0 ANOTHER HARRY -- 0 
2.5.1.1 BIC LIGHTER -- 0 
2.5.1.2 HARD SHIPWRECK -- 2 
2.5.1.3 SHARK ATTACK -- 1 
2.5.1.4 Harry's character traits/maturation -- 444 
2.5.1.4.1 ASTONISHED -- 1 
2.5.1.4.2 CHIMPANZEE -- 1 
2.5.1.4.3 PASHMINAS -- 1 
2.5.1.5 Harry's training, protection, powers -- 312 
2.5.1.5.1 Harry's eyes -- 42 
2.5.1.5.2 Harry's scar -- 50 
2.5.1.5.3 Harry's dreams -- 49 
2.5.1.5.4 Stoned!Harry -- 50 
2.5.1.5.5 PHILOSOPHER'S STONE -- 2 
2.5.1.5.6 DRIBBLE -- 0 
2.5.1.6 Harry versus LV & DEs -- 158 
2.5.1.6.1 BALDERDASH -- 11 
2.5.1.6.2 HELP & LACERATE -- 1 
2.5.1.6.3 TIME TURNER -- 0 
2.5.1.6.4 Time turner!Harry theories -- 6 
2.5.1.7 Harry's parentage/ancestry -- 128 
2.5.1.7.1 HIS SWORD -- 5 
RECOMMENDATIONS: ----------------- 2.5.1 Harry Potter: We need to get 
these out of here because we can't have posts in third level 
categories. Today, when I looked at what was left in here, I noticed 
they do seem to have somthing in common (but I'm having trouble 
putting it into words). They all seem to look at Harry as a literary 
construct, or from "outside" the story, in contrast to the other 
categories. This also holds true for the acronyms just below (2.5.1.0 
to 2.5.1.4). They examine the character of Harry Potter from the 
point of view of literary archetypes, or his astrological 
chart/Meyers Briggs letters or Enneagram. They examine his behavior 
in terms of whether rule-breaking is good for the kiddies to read, or 
in terms of what's needed for plot construction, or look for 
symbolism in his name, wand or handwriting. They look at him from the 
point of view of the author or a literary critic. 

Er... to sum up, I think we can empty 2.5.1 into a new level 4 
category called "Harry as literary construct/type." What do people 
think, am I making sense? Can anyone think up a better name? 

2.5.1.4 Harry's character traits/maturation: I'm worried about the 
fact that there are 444 posts in here and OoP still to be coded. I 
could go through these again and look for repetition (it was hard to 
remember what was in here after a while). I could look for some 
subcategories I could pull out (though I had trouble trying to do 
this before as I seemed to get loads of overlap). I am actually 
planning on giving this a second look anyway, but I wanted to get 
this report out first, unless Carolyn has another assignment for 
me. ;) I also recommend adding a subcategory called "Harry in OoP" to 
catch all the debate about his crankiness in that book. 

2.5.1.5 Harry's training, protection, powers: At 312 posts, this 
might also be a little full; however, there is probably much less 
repetition here. Actually, for OoP, Harry's scar and Harry's dreams 
will take up a lot of what's new. I recommend adding a category for 
Occlumency before beginning OoP. 

2.5.1.6.4 Time turner!Harry theories: There are only six posts in 
here. As I recall, Carolyn created this category to quarantine these 
becaue they irked her. Sorry, Miss, but I don't think they really 
deserve a category of their own -- it only draws *more* attention to 
them, anyway. Recommend folding them back into 2.5.1.6. 

**All category numbers above refer to the categories as they now 
stand.** However, they do need to be changed because we can't have 
any posts in 2.5.1 at all. 

Here is what I think they should be changed to: 
RECOMMENDED NEW CAT. NUMBERS: 
2.5.1 Harry Potter *[to be emptied into 2.5.1.1]* 
2.5.1.1 Harry as literary construct/type *[or -- suggestions?]* 
2.5.1.1.1 ANOTHER HARRY 
2.5.1.1.2 BIC LIGHTER 
2.5.1.1.3 HARD SHIPWRECK 
2.5.1.1.4 SHARK ATTACK 
2.5.1.2 Harry's character traits/maturation 
2.5.1.2.1 ASTONISHED 
2.5.1.2.2 CHIMPANZEE 
2.5.1.2.3 PASHMINAS 
2.5.1.2.4 Harry in OoP *[possibly more subcategories here?]* 
2.5.1.3 Harry's training, protection, powers 
2.5.1.3.1 Harry's eyes 
2.5.1.3.2 Harry's scar 
2.5.1.3.3 Harry's dreams 
2.5.1.3.4 Stoned!Harry 
2.5.1.3.5 PHILOSOPHER'S STONE 
2.5.1.3.6 DRIBBLE 
2.5.1.3.7 Occlumency 
2.5.1.4 Harry versus LV & DEs 
2.5.1.4.1 BALDERDASH 
2.5.1.4.2 HELP & LACERATE 
2.5.1.4.3 TIME TURNER *[Time turner!Harry theories folded back into 
2.5.1.4]* 
2.5.1.5 Harry's parents/ancestry <--changed "parentage;" it was :P 
2.5.1.5.1 HIS SWORD 

Carolyn (2505):
Anne: Er... to sum up, I think we can empty 2.5.1 into a new level 4 
category called "Harry as literary construct/type." What do people 
think, am I making sense? Can anyone think up a better name? 

C: Anne, that's fine. I've created exactly the same sort of section 
for Voldemort. 

Anne: 2.5.1.6.4 Time turner!Harry theories: There are only six posts 
in here. As I recall, Carolyn created this category to quarantine 
these becaue they irked her. Sorry, Miss, but I don't think they 
really deserve a category of their own -- it only draws *more* 
attention to them, anyway. Recommend folding them back into 2.5.1.6. 

C: Okey doke. Again, have a TTT section for Voldemort for the same 
reason! Probably the same posts.. 

Anne: So, Carolyn -- shall I do some more work on Harry's character 
traits/maturation before you change any category numbers, or shall I 
do something else? 

C: Will implement all your new category numbers and suggestions when 
I have a moment this week - going back to work tomorrow alas :( 
Suggest you wait until I have done that before doing any final 
shifting/fine-tuning of categories if you can bear to look at them 
all again. 


2.10.4 Barty Crouch Jr.
Debbie (2545):
Crouch Jr. Report (2.10.4). So here it is: 
Was: 589 Now: 333 Plus two acronyms (FORLORN BARTEMIUS and 
BABEMEISTER), unchanged at 1 and 2 posts, respectively It's fair to 
say that we don't need any more posts on why Crouch taught Harry to 
resist the Imperius Curse. I did my best to cull down the others, 
too, but there was a surprising variety of angles to examine Crouch 
from, and Elkins used them all. 

2.14 (and subcats) Beings
Debbie (2545):
Goblins (2.14.3): I peeked into the Beings category I signed up for 
(all 997 of them) and took a preliminary look at the Goblins. Since 
there were only 37 posts, I also peeked at 3.2.4 (Money and Banking; 
Gringotts; taxes) and I suspect there's quite a bit of overlap. I 
can't recall if that category has been done yet (I think not) but I 
propose to move the posts relating to "why did the WW put the Goblins 
in charge of the money?" posts over to 3.2.4 unless they also touch 
on some questions relating to Goblins' abilities, natures, etc. Sound 
good? And I'd be willing to offer to do 3.2.4 as well, if it's not 
done, for consistency. (There's also the subsidiary benefit of being 
able to read the posts on taxes. <g>) 

Trolls (2.14.8): Ahem! According to Fantastic Beasts and Where to 
Find Them, in 1811 Grogan Stump, the newly appointed MoM, decreed 
that to be a "being" sufficient intelligence was needed to understand 
the laws of the magical community. "Troll representatives were 
questioned in the absence of goblins and judged not to understand 
anything that was being said to them; they were therefore classified 
as "beasts" despite their two-legged gait." I therefore petition to 
remove 2.14.8 to the "beasts" category. However, to relieve any added 
burden on the Beasts reviewer, I reviewed this category first (all 3 
posts!) and reduced them to 1 post. 

Can you tell I'm putting off attacking the house elves (750 of the 
997 beings posts) as long as possible? 

Ginger (2546):  replying about Goblins:
Funnily enough, I reviewed that category just this last week. I had 
just finished the 3.2.1 category and figured since they were related 
I'd just go on to that since I have that section. 
I remember cutting several posts that were also coded to goblins. 
3.2.4 was 228 and is now 137. I consider myself done with it. If you 
want to check it out and add things that aren't in there, go ahead. 
Everything I cut about Gringotts was cut due to repetition, so 
anything you don't see there and want to add is "something new".
 

Dot (2547):
Ginger ? I've gone through all those posts, and the ones that had 
your name on as reviewer I assumed must have been banished to that 
colloportused box at the bottom of the lake ? you know, the one with 
all the chains and padlocks, with the 24/7 mermaid guard... So I 
didn't touch them. (You did the purebloods/halfbloods bit as well, 
didn't you? Anything reviewed by you I didn't touch, which, you're 
right, turned out to be all of them.) In the end, I decided that 
the "Can squibs/muggles make potions" posts would be best off left 
cross-coded to squibs and potions. (But definitely not in magical 
ability). Anyone complaining? Good. I'm not quite sure about the "can 
Muggles use magical items" stuff though. We don't actually have a 
code for Muggles, do we? Though we do have one for magical items. I 
might just leave them in there. 

 
Debbie (2549):
I made a rash proposal to move posts from Goblins (2.14.3) to 3.2.4 
(Money and Banking; Gringotts; > taxes) to which Ginger replied : 

> Funnily enough, I reviewed that category just this last week. I had 
just finished the 3.2.1 category and figured since they were related 
I'd just go on to that since I have that section. > > I remember 
cutting several posts that were also coded to goblins. 3.2.4 was 228 
and is now 137. I consider myself done with it. If you want to check 
it out and add things that aren't in there, go ahead. Everything I 
cut about Gringotts was cut due to repetition, so anything you don't 
see there and want to add is "something new". 

Debbie: I went back to the Goblins, cut them down from 37 to 23, and 
decided not to move anything to Money and Banking. Much simpler that 
way. 

Ginger (2623) responding to Debbie:
Debbie:
1. The functions of various government agencies (Werewolf Registry, 
Werewolf Support Services) and whether they help or repress 
werewolves). Some of these posts are cross-coded to a government 
subcategory, but I'm inclined to leave them here.

2. What is the meaning of "full moon", when does it occur, and when 
when werewolves transform, how long they remain werewolves? Some of 
these posts are in Lycanthropy, some not. Many (but not all) of 
these posts are discussions of Lupin's transformation in POA ch. 20 
and whether it is a flint. I'm inclined to say these posts should 
be under Lycanthropy.

Ginger: 
I did lycanthropy. You are right. There are a lot of posts there 
about full moon times. I think *when* a werewolf transforms (from or 
to) is a vital aspect of the illness, and does indeed belong there. 
Whether or not it belongs in Werewolves is, of course, your call. 
Should you wish to trim it, I don't think you'll remove a lot from 
the catalogue as a whole, just from your category. 
I also did MOM departments, and there were a few mentions of the 
werewolf divisions. As I recall, it was a sparse category to begin 
with. On those posts, I'd recommend saving anything original that 
isn't coded somewhere else as I don't recall seeing very much in the 
govt cats.

Debbie (2644):
Final report on 2.14 - Beings. 

Once 997 posts (I don't have totals by subcategory), the current 
totals are now as follows: 2.14.1 House Elves - 196 
2.14.1.1 ENSLAVEMENT - 2 
2.14.1.2 SUPPRESSED - 1 
2.14.1.3 Dobby - 97 
2.14.1.4 Winky - 42 
2.14.1.5 Kreacher - 0, but that won't last 
2.14.2 Centaurs - 23
2.14.2.1 Firenze - 5 
2.14.3 Goblins - 23 
2.14.4 Giants - 17 
2.14.4.1 Fridwulfa - 3 
2.14.5 Vampires - 61 
2.14.6 Werewolves - 65 
2.14.7 Veela - 35 
2.14.8 Trolls - 1 

Total: 571 (was 997) Every category went down significantly except 
for poor Fridwulfa, who started out at zero and ended up with three 
posts (I felt sorry for her, I guess). Except for the characters 
(Dobby, Winky, Fridwulfa), I generally kept only posts that discussed 
the particular category as a group (e.g., folkloric origins and how 
JKR has adapted the legends to her own use, how the group acquired 
its place in the WW, their unique characteristics, etc.) The 
character categories include only posts about that individual as a 
character; posts that use a characteristic of the character to 
generalise about the group were coded only to the group. 

Werewolves: I kicked out all the "when a werewolf transforms" out; I 
moved a few (less than 5) to Lycanthropy and I hope Ginger will 
forgive me (to ensure I wasn't just undoing her work, I didn't move 
any that identified Ginger as coder). I also kicked out the Homorphus 
Charm and Wolfsbane posts (as a rule, anyway). OTOH, I left all the 
silver hand posts alone. Dock me 5 points for lack of consistency, 
but one could at least argue that how to kill a werewolf is not a 
symptom of lycanthropy. (I'm a lawyer; I can argue anything! ;-)) 
I'll revise the category description to cross- reference the other 
categories, especially Lycanthropy. 

Vampires: Not surprisingly, this was mostly about our favorite 
Potions Master. Because I've already created the Snape assignment 
list, I didn't make any changes to that category, even when a post 
was clearly appropriate to Vampire!Snape (or not about Snape at all).

2.16 Spirits
Ginger: (2626):
Spirits is now done. There are now 433 posts, with Dementors being 
the biggest category at 152. 
Kiss posts remain under dementors. Talking about the legality of the 
kiss is still under Azkaban and Dementors, where I think it should 
be, and there is a lot of crossover, with posts discussing both, but 
that's ok. They fit. 







From quigonginger at yahoo.com  Mon May  8 08:12:09 2006
From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger)
Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 08:12:09 -0000
Subject: section 3 of the stuff I pasted
Message-ID: <e3mugp+qlat@eGroups.com>

SECTION 3:  WIZARDING WORLD

3.2.2 Relationship with the Muggle World
Ginger (2583):
"relationship with the Muggle World". It started as 554 posts, and 
now has been hacked to.... only 335. Really. That's all I could hack 
out of it. It is such a wide category that there was little 
repetition (oh, a few threads about how Muggleborns find Diagon Alley 
and why Muggles let the kids attend Hogwarts), but a lot of posts 
that really didn't belong there. 

My suggestion: I propose we rename the category "Garbage Scow for 
every blessed post ever written in which the word 'Muggle' appears". 

OK, I'm kidding. It would be nice in the future if we drew a 
distinction, though. For example: if a post talks about how a young 
wizard would go about getting a Muggle drivers' license, then it 
belongs there; if it only mentions that the age for Apparation is the 
same as the age at which British Muggles get their licenses, then it 
does not. 

Now on to the serious suggestion. In tackling this massive category, 
I divided the posts into 4 categories: 

Family (includes Muggle-born students and mixed marriages), 
Culture (indludes technology, dress, language, education...), 
History/Politics (includes government, but not the Political 
Comparisons, which is already a sub-category), and 
Other. 

Other is a really wide category. I propose that we make these sub-
categories, in addition to the PC category (which I now have to re-
review as there were many posts that I put there whilst weeding the 
main category). If we did that, Other would just be the main heading. 
The posts would stand as follows: 
Main: 49 
Family: 63
Culture: 121 
History/Politics: 107 
Political Comparisons: about 50 at this time, but still to be re- 
reviewed. Should only change by a few. 

Ginger (2602) :
Yes, I want both H/P and PC. They are a bit similar, but there is 
enough difference and enough posts to merit both sections. 

Basicly, H/P is about the relationship with the MW in the fictional 
setting, and PC is about how it compares to actual RL stuff. 

H/P covers things like comparing the Apparation age to that of 
driving age, how a Wizard would go about getting a license to drive a 
Muggle car, the ethics of obliviation...things like that. 

The PC category is mostly comparisons of the WW situation to Hitler, 
Northern Ireland...things like that.

3.2.5 Medals/Awards/Titles (reference to 3.5.2.1 Witches, Warlocks 
etc)
Ginger (2546):
I reviewed 3.2.5 (titles, awards, whatever) and noticed that a lot of 
the posts looked familiar. Then I realized that DD has a lot of 
titles and that Warlock, Mugwump and Wizard are among them. Having 
reviewed the category of "differences between warlocks, wizards, 
etc." (now 12, was 137 million), I found that a lot of those posts 
actually do fit in both categories. I culled greatly in 3.2.5, and 
just kept those that talked about how these apply to DD and his 
titles, plus a couple of interesting (?) posts giving definitions. 
I propose we henceforth make ourselves aware of the existance of both 
categories and resolve to choose one or the other when coding. Save 
the ones about DD for 3.2.5, and those that are just definitions for 
the other. Groovy?

3.3.6 Rules and Ethics
Ginger (2588):
I finished 3.1 through 3.3. Just one note: I added a definition under 
3.3.6 (rules and ethics for using magic). 

There seemed to be some confusion as to what it means when a 
person "can" do something. I added in the definition to check 3.8.0 
(JKR's rules). Asking if someone if physically capable of using magic 
to do something in JKR's world goes under 3.8.0. Asking if it is 
permissable is under 3.3.6. Sometimes they do overlap. 

Oh, yes... under 3.3.5 (underage magic) we have quite enough posts 
along the lines of "Why did Harry get in trouble for the pudding when 
________ didn't get in trouble for __________?", at least as it 
involved book 1-4 canon. I'm sure there will be a lot said about the 
Dementors in book 5. 

I did some shifting around in the govt. section, but I think some of 
those categories may have been added later as it was mostly in early 
posts. Also (did I say "just one note?") please watch in the 3.3.1 
through 3.3.4 sections. They do overlap quite a bit, so please try to 
code to that which applies "best" rather than all or several. 

3.8.1 Magical Ability
Dot (2536):
But I did finish going through Magical Ability. Now, the content of 
this category bears almost no relation to the definition. I've made 
some changes, but not all of them, because I want some advice on 
whether we need new categories, and whether some posts can be chucked 
into already-existing categories. 

This is how it currently stands: Of 367 posts... 

138 shouldn't have been in this category for one reason or another 
(mostly because they should be in WW genetics or barely mentioned 
magical ability at all, e.g. the Philip Nel question on class), and 
have been (or rather, are being) uncoded. 
8 of these were assigned to no other category and will therefore 
rejected as `adds nothing new' (I checked they really did add nothing 
new). 

Leaving 229, of which: 
106 refer to the magical ability of specific characters 
Harry: 33 ? all of which will be uncoded since they're already under 
Harry's protection/ training/ powers. (Those that aren't coded there 
I'll just uncode, since I assume Anne doesn't want me chucking posts 
back in that she's chucked out). 
Dumbledore: 5 ? to be uncoded since they're already under DD's 
abilities. 
The DE's (Peter Pettigrew, Barty Crouch Jnr et al): 10 
Hagrid: 5 
Ron: 4 
Neville: 15 
Fleur: 1 
Sirius: 3 
Lockhart: 1 
Lupin: 1 
Snape: 1 
Fudge: 1 
Draco: 6 
The Weasley family: 2 
Voldemort/Tom Riddle: 15 
Multiple characters: 3 
I reckon all discussions of a character's magical ability should stay 
with the character, (DD and Harry already have their own codes for 
that), and indeed dimly remember Miss saying something along those 
lines when I started the review an embarrassingly long time ago. And 
the same would go for house elves and centaurs. Since the multiple 
character comparisons of magical ability can't (or shouldn't) be 
coded to all characters, I'll leave them in here for now, unless 
anyone has a better suggestion.) 

Continuing: - 
8 refer to the identity of the muggle/squib who will exhibit magical 
ability late in life (do we need a code for this? There aren't many 
posts yet, but it's a recurring topic.) - 
9 on how important Magical power is in casting/resisting 
unforgivables (should I put them under unforgivables?) - 
11 refer to house elves' magical ability (I'd keep them with house 
elves) - 
1 refers to Centaurs' magical ability (to stay with centaurs) - 
9 on the powers Voldy transferred to Harry at GH (is there a 
convenient code for this? I can't find one that isn't very general.) -
 
32 on whether muggles/squibs can make potions, what are the 
differences between wizards and muggles, can muggles use magical 
objects (broomsticks etc). 

The 32 posts on whether muggles/squibs can make potions, can muggles 
use magical objects (broomsticks etc), and what are the differences 
(genotype/phenotype) between wizards and muggles: I'd like to put 
them (some may already be coded there) into WW lifespans, genetics 
and population estimates. I don't think anyone's reviewed it yet ? is 
that right? There really are an awful lot of posts resulting from 
JKR's foolish comment about the magical gene being dominant, since it 
gives the impression that she might know what she's talking about, so 
the lucky reviewer may decide to split the category further. Yes/no? 

14 posts I've filed under `Misc', since they don't seem to fit in 
this category, but it's not immediately obvious where they should be. 
I need to spend a bit longer musing over the much-changed category 
list, I think. 

The remaining 53 posts, are actually about "what magical ability is, 
how it manifests itself, and how wizards use it to make things 
happen," which is the definition in the catalogue. 

Ginger (2541)- replying to Dot (2536): 
Correct as usual, Your Leaderness. I have finished it and believe me, 
any (and I mean ANY) posts that are not in that category right now 
have been banished by a strong charm. That category was a fright. 
(Was 206, now 134.) Many posts were over my head, so I kept those 
that didn't repeat what someone else had said. <shudder>

Dot (2551):
I decided to rev up the chainsaw in the end, so I won't bother you 
all by asking questions. Magical ability was three-hundred-and-far-
too-many, and is now 64. It will go down to 58 when I get my late 
bloomer code. 27 posts were rejected altogether, (pats self on back). 

New definition: "Not for relative ability of characters (leave under 
character codes), strictly: what magical ability is, how it manifests 
itself, how wizards use it to make things happen" 


3.8.4.1 Memory Charms
Debbie (2572) responding to Kelly:
> I'm about to start reviewing 3.8.4.1 Memory Charms, and I wanted to 
do > a little planning in advance. Do you think MemoryCharmed!Neville 
> should be a category to itself, under 2.5.4 Neville Longbottom, or 
> should I keep those in this category? A quick scan shows that 99% 
of > the posts here discuss Neville. 

My vote is to keep all speculation about whether Neville was Memory 
Charmed under 2.5.4. It would be nice to have a subcategory, but we 
could probably live without one for now. 

> Also, Debbie, did you toss out a lot of Neville-related posts as 
Adds > Nothing New? Plenty of the posts here don't have the Neville 
code, > and I'm hoping that's because you kicked them out, and I can 
do the > same. :) 

At 345 posts, 2.5.4 is already chock full of Memory Charms of every 
description. I say toss them out of 3.8.4.1 unless they talk about 
the operation or effects of the charm itself. 



Kelly (2597):
I finally finished reviewing 3.8.4.1 Memory Charms. I made the 
decision, with the input of the group, that all the posts under 3.8.4 
Spells, potions & incantations will be ones focusing on the magical 
process itself, not the resulting characterizations and plotlines 
associated with them. 

In this particular case, that means that MemoryCharmed!Neville and 
all its variants shall remain under Neville, Longbottom torture, a 
few dozen acronyms, and whatever other character codes are deemed 
necessary, but for my purposes they went in the trash. Must admit, 
though, it was slightly traumatic for me to place the Still Life with 
Memory Charm and Memory Charm Symposium posts in my discard pile. :-) 
That conversation was one of the first ones I ever read on this list 
(and one of the resons why it took me so long to finish this review; 
it's so easy to be distracted by an Elkins thesis). 

3.8.4.1 Memory Charms --------------------- Originally: 169 Now: 38 
Mechanism, process, regulations, morality, etc. of memory charms. 
Only put character-specific posts (e.g. Neville, Harry, Bertha 
Jorkins) here if the discussion is centering on the specific 
mechanism of the memory charm. So, for example, a discussion of 
whether Neville has been memory charmed (or any variant thereof) and 
why and by who does not belong here, but a discussion of whether a 
memory charm could produce the specific symptoms that Neville shows 
can.

3.8.4.2 Wolfsbane
Kelly (2625):
3.8.4.2 Wolfsbane Potion
------------------------
Originally: 59
Now: 44

Discussion of the potion... what's in it, how it works, required
dosage, inventor, side effects, etc.  Removed a few passing reference
posts and a few that were discussing events (specifcially, Shrieking
Shack II) with mention of the potion only as a plot device.

Regarding overlap with lycanthropy and werewolves, I think this
category was already pretty well distinguished from those two.  There
were a few posts cross-coded both here and in Lyncanthropy which
discussed possible reasons why Lupin's tranformation seemed delayed on
the SSII night, e.g. whether it was a side effect of regular Wolfsbane
use, or whether that was normal behavior for a werewolf.  I think
these can comfortably stay in both categories, so I left them alone.


3.8.4.3 Vertiaserum
Kelly (2646):
3.8.4.3 Veritaserum ------------------------ Originally: 84 Now: 46 

All you ever wanted to know about veritaserum... How does it work? 
Does it uncover absolute truth or only truth as someone remembers it? 
When is it ethical or legal to use it? Can it overcome Memory Charms? 
How reliable is it? There were tons of "Why didn't ____ use 
Veritaserum on ____ to corroborate/disprove his/her 
story/alibi/excuse?" I kept the good responses to these questions, 
but please leave the questions out. Discussions concentrating of the 
wizard court system without discussing any specifics of veritaserum 
should stay out of this category as well. Also, the lie 
detector/sodium penthanol it's-not-100%-accurate-so-not-admissible-in-
court analogy has been used to death, so no more of those. 

3.15 Geography
Kelly (2559):
Quiet around here, isn't it? Let's liven things up with a little 
magical geography. This should complete the 3.15 categories. 

The description for the main Geography/Location of WW Places category 
states that these codes are reserved for discussion of where these 
places may be located and should not be used for discussion of 
incidents that took place there. I allowed a little leeway in this 
respect when I could think of nowhere else to move the discussion. 
For example, discussion of who owns the Riddle House is still in the 
Riddle House subcategory. However, discussion of the protection on 
the Dursleys' house definitely does not belong in the Privet Drive 
category, since there are other codes devoted to that discussion. 

Also, Carolyn, when I reviewed 3.15.14 The Leaky Cauldron an eon or 
so ago, I asked that it be combined with 3.15.2 Diagon Alley, since 
the former is a tiny category that often overlaps the latter. Is that 
still possible, or was there specific disagreement? 

Below, I've listed the main discussions found in each category. 
However, the definition for each is just "Where is ___ located, with 
respect to real geography and with respect to other Potterverse 
locations? What are it's physical attributes?" Okay, on to the 
stats.. 

3.15.3 The Burrow ----------------- Originally: 44 Now: 38 Where in 
the UK is Ottery St.Catchpole? Where is the Burrow in relation to the 
town? What does the house look like (to either witches/wizards or 
Muggles)? 

3.15.4 Godrics Hollow --------------------- Originally: 67 Now: 45 
Where is it? Is it a house or town or whatever? (now known, but it's 
a relatively small category, so I kept these). What happenned to the 
house/land post-Voldy? What is the muggle to wizard ratio there? NOT 
for other Godric-related discussion (etymology, ancestry, etc) or 
confrontation night discussion. Definitely don't need any more one- 
or two-liners suggesting it's in Wales based on Hagrid's fell-asleep-
over-Surrey quote in PS/SS. 49473 Magic space/geography in general 

3.15.5 Little Whinging/Privet Drive ----------------------------------
- Originally: 37 Now: 14 Where is Little Whinging? NOT for discussion 
of the protections on the Dursleys' house (use 3.5.4 Blood protection 
at Privet Drive/Lily's sacrifice) 

3.15.6 Riddle House ----------------------------------- Originally: 
20 Now: 19 With one exception, all the posts here were speculation on 
the current owner of the Riddle House. Not really a geography 
discussion, but as I could think of no better place to move these 
posts, I left them here. 

3.15.7 Malfoy Manor ----------------------------------- Originally: 8 
Now: 6 Right now, just a discussion of what qualifies as a manor. 

3.15.8 Azkaban ----------------------------------- Originally: 9 Now: 
7 Where is Azkaban? 

3.15.9 MoM ----------------------------------- Originally: 18 Now: 3 
Where are the Ministry of Magic offices located? NOT for other MoM-
related discussions, e.g. who works/worked there, government 
structure, DE connections, etc. 

3.15.10 Hogmeade ----------------------------------- Originally: 30 
Now: 23 Where is Hogsmeade in relation to Hogwarts? How is it 
protected from Muggles? What does it mean to be "all-wizard"? 

3.15.11 Durmstrang ----------------------------------- Originally: 74 
Now: 50 Where is Durmstrang located? I think every Eastern European 
and northern Asian country is hypthesized at least once, many 
accompanied by well-researched geographic and linguistic arguments, 
so don't add any more guesses unless really original and well-
written. I weeded out some repetition, as well as the glaring 
geographical errors (a surprising number of people place Albania and 
Bulgaria near the Arctic circle, or at least in northern Europe). On 
a side note, I trashed post number 20401 on the grounds that any post 
that includes the entire text of a Daily Digest in it doesn't deserve 
consideration, even if it contains a brilliantly researched, life-
changing dissertation. :) (it didn't). 

3.15.13 Forbidden Forest ----------------------------------- 
Originally: 18 Now: 9 Where is the Forest in relation to the Hogwarts 
grounds? How large is it? Discussion of the forest as an entity (e.g. 
how dangerous is it?). There were a lot of "do werewolves really live 
there?" discussions; I kept those that discussed the nature of the 
forest, but removed those that strayed too far into discussion of 
werewolves themselves. 

3.15.13 Beauxbatons ----------------------------------- Originally: 
14 Now: 10 Where in France is Beauxbatons located? 

Carolyn (2563):
Kelly:
Also, Carolyn, when I reviewed 3.15.14 The Leaky Cauldron an eon or so
ago, I asked that it be combined with 3.15.2 Diagon Alley, since the
former is a tiny category that often overlaps the latter.  Is that
still possible, or was there specific disagreement?

Carolyn:
Sorry to have overlooked this, no problem and now done.

Kelly:
3.15.6 Riddle House
-----------------------------------
Originally: 20
Now: 19

With one exception, all the posts here were speculation on the current
owner of the Riddle House.  Not really a geography discussion, but as
I could think of no better place to move these posts, I left them
here.

Carolyn:
I think this is the right decision. There really isn't anywhere else
for them.








From quigonginger at yahoo.com  Mon May  8 08:13:18 2006
From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (quigonginger)
Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 08:13:18 -0000
Subject: section 4 of the stuff I pasted
Message-ID: <e3muiu+aang@eGroups.com>

GENERAL

Carolyn (2492):
As I plod on through the Voldemort posts, I realise that we have 
created rather a lot of sections with similar content. Under WW we 
have: 3.5.3 Heirs, rules of inheritance 3.5.3.1 Ancestors/descendants 
Under Harry we have: 2.5.1.7 Harry's parentage/ancestry Under 
Voldemort we have: (A1) Slytherin family ancestry (b2) 
plan/objectives A great many of these posts are about whether or not 
Harry and Voldie are related, with much repetition of the (alleged) 
ancestors/descendants printing mistake, and many assertions that 
Voldie's principal aim was/is to destroy the heir of Gryffindor 
(James/Harry). Not quite sure what to do about this overlap, as there 
are good reasons for maintaining the sections under the various 
headings, and not having just one heading (where would it go - under 
plot?). 

Ginger (2495) responding to Carolyn: 
You think there are a lot there now? You should have seen it several 
weeks ago. 3.5.3 was 88, now 36 and 3.5.3.1 was 81, now 65. And, yup, 
there's still a lot of repetition. I really trimmed it as ruthlessly 
as I dared. Although, I'm sure less Ruth could be applied if one 
wanted to. 
The categories you mentioned do all seem to fit together, although 
touching on different aspects of things. Such is our grand history. 
In the categories I reviewed, there is enough non-Harry/Voldie/James 
stuff to merit a category for each, but they would be very small 
ones. 
I remember quite a lot of what I rejected as repetitious from my cats 
was also coded to Harry's ancestory. I'm sure a lot of what was kept 
was as well. 
With an eye to the future, I can see that anc/dec will have a lot of 
non-Harry additions with the Black family tree discussions, and the 
heirs will have a lot of who gets #12 GP talk, so maybe they could be 
non-Harry/Voldie/James in nature and stand alone. Of course, there is 
a lot of overlap, as always.

Anne (2497):
 At the Harry Potter end of things, the 2.5.1.7 category seems to be 
justified. It overlaps with 3.5.3.1 and the Voldy categories 
somewhat, but also contains lots of other stuff including speculative 
ties to G. Gryffindor, DD, Weasleys and probably others, as well as 
discussions of Harry's actual parents and grandparents. Overlap 
happens all over the catalogue -- I think it's unavoidable. Coding 
furiously to finish up here. I am removing HP codes completely from 
many posts. I'm trying to get through them all earlier than I'd 
planned, because I want to save a little time to review "Harry's 
character traits/maturation" which is swelling alarmingly and which I 
suspect could be trimmed even more. I think a let too many posts slip 
in there because I wasn't sure if the old familiar discussions were 
things I coded into the category alread or whether I just remembered 
them from reading the list. Otherwise, things seem to be working out. 
I am ending up with more than 100 posts in a general 2.5.1 Harry 
Potter category. If I really can't find a home for them (they'd 
probably require several discrete categories with 1 to 10 posts each; 
a waste of space, I think), it might be easiest to insert 2.5.1.8 
Harry Potter/miscellaneous to dump all those posts into. 

Anne (2500):
> I'm noticing that a lot of the Weasley posts share coding with > 
parenting and child development. Is anyone around who did that 
section? > I was just wondering if both codes would be appropriate, 
or if > parenting was mostly a Weasley section anyway. > > Kathy W > 
Well, there are certainly plenty of Harry-related posts in there, 
too. And, if they're mostly about how someone treated Harry as 
opposed to about Harry himself, then they are NOT also still coded to 
Harry anymore. 

Debbie (2501):
> > I'm noticing that a lot of the Weasley posts share coding with > 
> parenting and child development. Is anyone around who did that 
section? > > I was just wondering if both codes would be appropriate, 
or if > > parenting was mostly a Weasley section anyway. 

Debbie, shaking the cobwebs out of her brain: That section *does* 
sound a bit familiar. IIRC, the posts were heavy on the Weasleys, but 
that's not surprising since Molly is the primary mother image in the 
series (of the live ones, anyway). In particular, I think the thread 
you've been working on was heavily focused on Molly's parenting 
style. I think the double coding is appropriate. (Weasleys should 
have lots of sibling dynamic posts that wouldn't be in the parenting 
category, right?) 

Anne: > Well, there are certainly plenty of Harry-related posts in 
there, too. > And, if they're mostly about how someone treated Harry 
as opposed to > about Harry himself, then they are NOT also still 
coded to Harry anymore. 

Debbie: There are also a number of Malfoy and Dursley posts in the 
parenting section, as well as posts about Harry's father figures, and 
probably some others I've forgotten by now.






From carolynwhite2 at aol.com  Wed May 10 18:01:06 2006
From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2)
Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 18:01:06 -0000
Subject: OT: a eulogy to American food
Message-ID: <e3t9p2+77po@eGroups.com>

First, Ginger..you are one hell of a star. I will paste things into the 
Word files pronto. Thankyou.

But, to while away my commute I am currently immersed in a biography of 
one of your turn of the century poets, Edna St Vincent Millay. I was 
greatly struck by a rave she wrote about American food to a sniffy 
foodie in Paris, and wondered if such comestibles still existed 
alongside MacDonalds?

'In your travels, cher Madame, did you ever taste the lobsters that 
come from the waters off the coast of my home state, Maine? Broiled or 
boiled and served with melted, fresh country butter, they are 
unforgettable. Did you have fish chowder, made of haddock, Maine 
potatoes, onions, salt pork and rich milk?'

'Were you ever introduced to Boston Baked Beans? I mean the kind baked 
in an old-fashioned crock. We cook them slowly and for long hours in 
the oven and serve them sometimes with such brown bread that can be 
found in no other part of the world. Did you ever have Cherrystones or 
Little Necks; and did you ever, by chance, taste a Provincetown clam 
pie made of the deep-sea Quahogs and a liberality of olive oil and 
garlic, cooked by one of the Portuguese fishermen who had hauled in the 
clams himself? Were oyster-crabs and whitebait ever set  crisp before 
you? Did you taste soft-shell crabs, lightly sauteed, or drink the 
juice of a soft-shell clam? I must say I have never met their like over 
here. And were you ever a happy member of an old-fashioned clam-bake on 
a secluded New England beach?

'Then what of the other American dishes that are seldom to be met with 
elsewhere on the gastronomic globe? There's the shad roe and the shad 
itself, both broiled; sweet corn and sweet potatoes; pumpkin pie and 
deep-dish blueberry pie; diamond-back terrapin done as the Baltimoreans 
do it in a rich Madeira stew, or as the Philadelphians do it with egg-
yolks, cream and sweet-butter in a lordly dish? Then there's the 
Philadelphia Pepperpot which as tripe in it, and that same city's 
surprising mixiture of tripe and oysters. There's the Creole Jambalaya 
of New Orleans made with savory rice and shrimps almost as big as your 
French ecrivisses.

We have also our native blueberries. And there's our cranberries and 
our beach-plums which I used to gather on Cape Cod. We make delicious 
preserves from them. Oh there are many other products and dishes native 
to states and regions of my country. If you have never tasted them, ma 
chere, you cannot in all fairness have judged American cuisine..'

A rather fine defence !
Carolyn









From elfundeb at comcast.net  Thu May 11 02:23:55 2006
From: elfundeb at comcast.net (Debbie)
Date: Thu, 11 May 2006 02:23:55 -0000
Subject: Snape and  American food
In-Reply-To: <e3t9p2+77po@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e3u77r+pef1@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "carolynwhite2" 
<carolynwhite2 at ...> wrote:
>
> Dear All
> 
> Have to confess I am not sure when I am going to contribute much 
in 
> the near future.. I'm working 12-14hr days at the moment, not my 
> idea of fun at all, but inescapable until I get this new dept into 
> some sort of shape.

Sending my owl with much chocolate, yet aware that that sort of 
dementor doesn't really go away until the job is done.  We need you 
back!

> Would any of you like to step into the breach, and do some 
> organising? I am conscious you would like to get on with Snape, 
and 
> need me to do some setting up on the dbase. Could one of you post 
> exactly what sections you want, and I'll do that at least?

Ok, I've checked the archives, and the consensus seems to be on 
these 8 categories (with commentary culled from various posts):

1.Severus Snape ? general character studies; examining his character 
from within the story -- e.g. is he emotional, evil,
nasty, poetic, prejudiced?  

2.Young Snape & MWPP - Discussions of Snape at school with James, 
Sirius, Lupin and Peter including analyses of Shrieking Shack I

3.Who is Snape working for?  - Analyses of motives for Snape working 
for either Voldemort or Dumbledore or both, including possible 
changes of allegiance, and analyses of Shrieking Shack II and 
Graveyard rebirth

4.Snape & love - All theories about who he may have loved ranging 
from Lily, through Mrs Norris, Florence, Bellatrix and Narcissa
 
5.Vampire/bat/animagus!Snape - Allegations that Snape is some kind 
of animagi or half-human creature

6. Snape + Harry

7. Snape + teaching style 

8. Snape as a literary construct/character - what's his function in 
the narrative? Is he a Byronic hero? Things like that, looking from 
without.

Plus the "pro" and "anti" categories, as described by Anne:
we have Pro and Anti categories which we code the posts of people 
who are very obviously arguing from a, well, Pro or Anti standpoint 
(in addition to other relevant Snape code(s))

And some additional relevant instructions --
Jen: 
When we start coding
> Snape, there may be sections clicked
> like 'characterization'; 'character development'; or 'originality
> and use of stereotypes'. I suppose the best thing to do is convert
> these to one of the two Snape characterization codes, whichever is
> most fitting. It seems redundant to keep both sets of codes.

I should have added: if the post talks about
characterization in general and uses Snape as a specific example
within the post, then a general characterization code and one 
specific
to Snape would not be redundant. 

Anne:
The acronyms end up as subcodes below the categories where they best
fit. So, LOLLIPOPS would be a subcode of Snape & Love -- and if a 
post was all about LOLLIPOPS, you would code it to that category 
only.
If it was also about other love theories for Snape, you'd code for
that also (assuming it's worth coding for the other sections at all,
of course). 

Now on to more important things --


> But, to while away my commute I am currently immersed in a 
biography of 
> one of your turn of the century poets, Edna St Vincent Millay. I 
was 
> greatly struck by a rave she wrote about American food to a sniffy 
> foodie in Paris, and wondered if such comestibles still existed 
> alongside MacDonalds?

In a word, yes.  My son prefers lobster to McDonald's.  


diamond-back terrapin done as the Baltimoreans 
> do it in a rich Madeira stew, or as the Philadelphians do it with 
egg-
> yolks, 

I have to admit I've never seen turtle on a menu anywhere though I 
don't live far from Baltimore . . . are they endangered?  Nor have I 
seen Quahog pie, though I've never been to Provincetown so it may be 
served there.  But the rest of it is alive and well and, for the 
most part, delicious (I can't vouch for Philadelphia Pepperpot).  

Debbie









From quigonginger at yahoo.com  Thu May 11 13:48:11 2006
From: quigonginger at yahoo.com (Ginger)
Date: Thu, 11 May 2006 06:48:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] OT: a eulogy to American food
In-Reply-To: <e3t9p2+77po@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20060511134811.85630.qmail@web30210.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

First off, thanks for the praise.  Glad it helped.
   
  Secondly, American food.
   
  I am over 1000 miles from the nearest ocean, and I really don't care for the local fish (walleye, perch) but I do love lobster.  Our locally eaten water-inhabiting delicacy is lutefisk.  There's a large Norweigan population here, and they eat it at Christmas.  For more info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lutefisk.  The entry by Garrison Keeler, who is our regional spokesperson, is pretty much dead on.  There's even a song called O, Lutefisk, to the tune of O, Christmas Tree.  It contains the lines:
  A dog came by and sprinkled you
  You taste yust like a worn-out shoe, 
  But Lutefisk, come Christmas day
  I'm going to eat you any vay.
  (Those aren't typos, that's the Norsk accent.)
   
  I have never eaten it myself, but I would be remiss if I didn't mention it as our regionally most famous dish.
   
  Out here on the Great Plains, it's pretty much meat'n'potatoes.  Nothing fancy, just throw some gravy on it.  Salads?  That ain't food, that's what food eats.  And bread.  There's got to be a plate of bread on the table with every meal.  Even if you're serving sandwiches.  You've got to sop up the gravy with something.  And don't forget the pickled...eggs, watermelon, beets, herring, ... you name it, we pickle it.  Even cucumbers.
   
  About the only thing we have that's original is buffalo, which aren't really buffalo at all.  They are actually bison.  There's a difference.  No one knows what it is, so we just call them buffalo anyway.  The meat tastes pretty much like beef, but without the fat and cholesteral.  Very healthy.  
   
  Church potlucks are the pinnacle of our dining experience.  Keeler has books about that.  Being a large Scandinavian/German area, we are predominately Lutheran (motto:  We met n we et.  If we couldna et, we wouldna met.)   All our salads contain jell-o (my friend Ruth only makes it in the proper liturgical colour of the season- that's the sign you're a *real* Lutheran.  Standing joke in the Lutheran community.) and our hot dishes have cream of mushroom soup, aka "Lutheran binder".  Tuna hot dish, tater tot hot dish- every pot luck has them.  Some people put peas in them, others think "that's just too frivilous, then, don't you know".  And someone brings the Swedish meatballs, which are meatballs without any spices.  (That's a general description of all our food.  Ketchup is a bit over the top for us.)  And don't forget the lefse.  Riced potatoes, flattened into something that looks like a very flat tortilla.  Good with butter and sugar.  Good homemade lefse is hard to
 find.  But worth it.  
   
  To wash it all down- coffee.  Everyone drinks coffee.  Well, except me.  I can't stand the stuff.  Even kids drink it, with tons of sugar.  But it's got to be strong.  Death in the Pot.  If you can see the bottom, it's too weak.  If your spoon stands in it, it's good, but only if your spoon disolves in 30 seconds or less, otherwise, it's too weak.  Pull the spoon out right quick, then, dear.  No sense getting wasteful on the cutlery.  It's a bit spendy, there, then, don't you know.
   
  So that's the North Dakota/ Minnesota menu.  At least as we present it.  In real life, we eat at McDonald's.  After seeing the ode to Lutefisk, wouldn't you?
   
  Ginger, who has become Norsk by osmossis after living here so long.

		
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From carolynwhite2 at aol.com  Sat May 13 14:03:48 2006
From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2)
Date: Sat, 13 May 2006 14:03:48 -0000
Subject: Snape and  American food
In-Reply-To: <e3u77r+pef1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e44p04+3klu@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "Debbie" <elfundeb at ...> wrote:

> Sending my owl with much chocolate, yet aware that that sort of 
> dementor doesn't really go away until the job is done.  We need you 
> back!
> 

Owl gratefully received. Am stockpiling industrial quantities. I 
think it was the man upstairs who defined the four main food groups 
as nicotine, alcohol, caffeine and chocolate..

Just for reference, in case anyone is tempted: don't simultaneously 
take on 1)20 worried and frightened staff; 2)high profile industry 
engagement programme; 3)top-level strategic review; 4)major high-
roller project with previously unknown organisation.

> 
> Ok, I've checked the archives, and the consensus seems to be on 
> these 8 categories (with commentary culled from various posts):
> 

Right, done the new categories. This is what you've got (the ones 
marked * previously existed):

2.4.1.1 Snape & Love*
2.4.1.2 Snape transfigured* (old Vampire!Snape now a subcat)
2.4.1.3 ESE!Snape*
2.4.1.4 Good!Snape*
2.4.1.5 Who is Snape working for (*some acronyms shifted here but 
they need checking for relevance)
2.4.1.6 Character studies (new)
2.4.1.7 Young Snape & MWPP (new)
2.4.1.8 Snape & Harry (new)
2.4.1.9 Snape & teaching style (new)
2.4.1.10 Snape as a literary construct (new)

Personally, I think that the Good! and ESE! Snape will prove 
unworkable, but lets see what emerges.


> 
> Now on to more important things --
>  
> In a word, yes.  My son prefers lobster to McDonald's.  
 
> I have to admit I've never seen turtle on a menu anywhere though I 
> don't live far from Baltimore . . . are they endangered?  Nor have 
I  seen Quahog pie, though I've never been to Provincetown so it may 
be served there.  But the rest of it is alive and well and, for the 
> most part, delicious (I can't vouch for Philadelphia Pepperpot).  
> 
> Debbie
>

I have had Maine lobster myself and very good it was too, but I've 
not sampled the other delights. Isn't there an American turtle 
species that is an aggressive menace, and taking over the waterways 
here in the UK as a result of escapees? Maybe it's that one!

Carolyn







From stevejjen at earthlink.net  Sun May 14 19:47:14 2006
From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese)
Date: Sun, 14 May 2006 19:47:14 -0000
Subject: Waving white flag...
In-Reply-To: <e3j2u7+n1kj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e481g2+1vld@eGroups.com>

> Dear All
> 
> Have to confess I am not sure when I am going to contribute much in
> the near future.. I'm working 12-14hr days at the moment, not my 
> idea of fun at all, but inescapable until I get this new dept into 
> some sort of shape. <snipping>

> Decided it was best to admit to the situation, than keep promising 
> myself I'll do some tonight, this weekend, next week...

> Carolyn
> ..feeling very sad letting you all down like this, so near the 
> finish line.


Ack, our fearless leader. Ginger and Debbie put together the Snape 
stuff (thanks guys), but what does this mean long-term? Is the 
database ready for a launch this summer when the categories are 
reviewed or is that part still up in the air?

I'm getting to the point of being able to contribute more again, 
it's just....well, it's hard not to wonder if this spells the end of 
the project. I'm wondering how feasible it will be without you as 
the link between the tech guys, the mods, etc. I don't think I'm 
overestimating your leadership contributions here!!!

If everything is in place and it's just a matter of finishing up the 
review then everything sounds a go. Or we can always keep picking 
away at things, even start coding again, and see if you whip that 
office into shape as you did ours and have more time?

Jen, stealing a few squares of chocolate and hoping Carolyn is too 
busy to notice.






From carolynwhite2 at aol.com  Mon May 15 16:55:53 2006
From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2)
Date: Mon, 15 May 2006 16:55:53 -0000
Subject: Waving white flag...
In-Reply-To: <e481g2+1vld@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e4abqp+eedm@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "Jen Reese" <stevejjen at ...> 
wrote:

> Ack, our fearless leader. Ginger and Debbie put together the Snape 
> stuff (thanks guys), but what does this mean long-term? Is the 
> database ready for a launch this summer when the categories are 
> reviewed or is that part still up in the air?
> 
> I'm getting to the point of being able to contribute more again, 
> it's just....well, it's hard not to wonder if this spells the end 
of 
> the project. I'm wondering how feasible it will be without you as 
> the link between the tech guys, the mods, etc. I don't think I'm 
> overestimating your leadership contributions here!!!
> 
> If everything is in place and it's just a matter of finishing up 
the 
> review then everything sounds a go. Or we can always keep picking 
> away at things, even start coding again, and see if you whip that 
> office into shape as you did ours and have more time?
> 
> Jen, stealing a few squares of chocolate and hoping Carolyn is too 
> busy to notice.
>

Jen, OY, smack! My need is greater than yours...

Never fear earthlings, have not deserted you and will continue to 
coordinate and poke people in the ribs. Just cannot get near any 
cataloguing myself for a while.. Please scream at me, on and offlist 
if you need things setting up on the database and I will do it. Work 
continues to plod forwards with the tech personages - they will get 
there, eventually.

As the debate on TOC shows, the catalogue is fast becoming a record 
of the high points in HPfGU, a record of inspired madness that Jo can 
only run away from in disbelief and horror. Haaaaa haaa ...fades 
maniac laughter

Miss Havisham in full tog.









From elfundeb at comcast.net  Mon May 15 23:56:51 2006
From: elfundeb at comcast.net (Debbie)
Date: Mon, 15 May 2006 23:56:51 -0000
Subject: Waving white flag...
In-Reply-To: <e4abqp+eedm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e4b4g3+uns9@eGroups.com>

Miss Havisham:
> Never fear earthlings, have not deserted you and will continue to 
> coordinate and poke people in the ribs. Just cannot get near any 
> cataloguing myself for a while.. Please scream at me, on and 
offlist 
> if you need things setting up on the database and I will do it. 
Work 
> continues to plod forwards with the tech personages - they will 
get 
> there, eventually.

Am greatly relieved I don't have to volunteer to liaise in the 
interim.  While I think I could have managed liaising with myself, I 
confess to not having a clue as to what our tech people are doing to 
prepare for the rollout, and I might not understand if they laid it 
out in in simple English.

But I can help do my part to get ready, and therefore have signed up 
to do the first block of Snape.

Debbie
owling Jen some chocolates, too






From ewetoo at gmail.com  Tue May 16 07:49:10 2006
From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2)
Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 17:49:10 +1000
Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Re: Waving white flag...
In-Reply-To: <e4abqp+eedm@eGroups.com>
References: <e481g2+1vld@eGroups.com> <e4abqp+eedm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <91d14f320605160049pde3766ftcef5aed40b7dc79f@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/16/06, carolynwhite2 <carolynwhite2 at aol.com> wrote:

> Never fear earthlings, have not deserted you and will continue to
> coordinate and poke people in the ribs. Just cannot get near any
> cataloguing myself for a while.. Please scream at me, on and offlist
> if you need things setting up on the database and I will do it. Work
> continues to plod forwards with the tech personages - they will get
> there, eventually.

hurrah. i cannot tell when i will be in some semi-permanent internet
position that doesn't require resetting my database permissions every
second day which is why i have been wery wery qwiet. OTOH i will be
heading to the northern hemisphere sometime in the next month, so
perhaps the facilities of the centre of civilization will permit this.

> As the debate on TOC shows, the catalogue is fast becoming a record
> of the high points in HPfGU, a record of inspired madness that Jo can
> only run away from in disbelief and horror. Haaaaa haaa ...fades
> maniac laughter
>
> Miss Havisham in full tog.

turns up maniacal giggling...perhaps we can give these characters
enough life of their own to go after Jo, demanding answers to the
conundrums of their personalities. then Kneasy can play Inquisitor,
surrounded by the howling mass of Snapes, Hermiones, Mrs Fitches, and
a Dementor or two to keep the peace.

bwaha...bwahahahaha...

expressing my penguinistical nature.

-- 
Emacs is an alright OS, but it lacks a decent editor.



From stevejjen at earthlink.net  Wed May 17 14:30:24 2006
From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese)
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 14:30:24 -0000
Subject: Waving white flag...
In-Reply-To: <e4abqp+eedm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e4fc20+qi3a@eGroups.com>

Miss Havisham in full tog:

> Never fear earthlings, have not deserted you and will continue to 
> coordinate and poke people in the ribs. Just cannot get near any 
> cataloguing myself for a while.. Please scream at me, on and offlist 
> if you need things setting up on the database and I will do it. Work 
> continues to plod forwards with the tech personages - they will get 
> there, eventually.
> 
> As the debate on TOC shows, the catalogue is fast becoming a
> record of the high points in HPfGU, a record of inspired madness
> that Jo can only run away from in disbelief and horror. Haaaaa 
> haaa ...fades  maniac laughter


Oh good, that's all I needed to hear. Just wasn't sure exactly what 
you meant by taking a break, to what extent, etc., etc.

Ewe2 is back! *waves* 

Jen, giving back the pilfered chocolate thanks to Debbie's munificence 
and making note to self that Miss Havisham *always* knows when someone 
is stealing her chocolate.






From carolynwhite2 at aol.com  Sat May 20 08:49:41 2006
From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2)
Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 08:49:41 -0000
Subject: Attention troops! IT developments..
Message-ID: <e4ml75+33jd@eGroups.com>

Friends, Romans and countrymen etc.. Tim has got the beginnings of a 
website to show us! Yes, really. Visit this link:

http://213.199.145.32/HPfGUCatalogueT1/

Now, the set up is very embryonic, and there is much development 
still to be done. It is also running off a very old version of the 
catalogue at the moment. Tim and Paul are updating that with the most 
current version right now.

Tim has listed the following additional problems:

1) The layout isn't quite consistent across browsers
2) The page explaining the category headings isn't done
3) The stats (most popular search term, most browsed section, etc) on
the right column of the frontpage are not hooked up to data
4) I've not yet taken on board our discussions about browse / search 
(so to browse an entire category you leave the search tem box empty)

Nevertheless, please have a play with it and post your thoughts here. 
It's a big step forward for this monumental project I think, and huge 
thanks to Tim for working away at it all this time.

Carolyn







From ewetoo at gmail.com  Sat May 20 15:00:12 2006
From: ewetoo at gmail.com (ewe2)
Date: Sun, 21 May 2006 01:00:12 +1000
Subject: [HPFGU-Catalogue] Attention troops! IT developments..
In-Reply-To: <e4ml75+33jd@eGroups.com>
References: <e4ml75+33jd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <91d14f320605200800i72ef04dew5d075ef9c03d7890@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/20/06, carolynwhite2 <carolynwhite2 at aol.com> wrote:
> Friends, Romans and countrymen etc.. Tim has got the beginnings of a
> website to show us! Yes, really. Visit this link:
>
> http://213.199.145.32/HPfGUCatalogueT1/
>
> Now, the set up is very embryonic, and there is much development
> still to be done. It is also running off a very old version of the
> catalogue at the moment. Tim and Paul are updating that with the most
> current version right now.
>
> Tim has listed the following additional problems:
>
> 1) The layout isn't quite consistent across browsers
> 2) The page explaining the category headings isn't done
> 3) The stats (most popular search term, most browsed section, etc) on
> the right column of the frontpage are not hooked up to data
> 4) I've not yet taken on board our discussions about browse / search
> (so to browse an entire category you leave the search tem box empty)
>
> Nevertheless, please have a play with it and post your thoughts here.
> It's a big step forward for this monumental project I think, and huge
> thanks to Tim for working away at it all this time.
>
> Carolyn

ah found it. ooh pretty!

-- 
Emacs is an alright OS, but it lacks a decent editor.



From stevejjen at earthlink.net  Sat May 20 19:03:35 2006
From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese)
Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 19:03:35 -0000
Subject: Attention troops! IT developments..
In-Reply-To: <e4ml75+33jd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e4np67+o9id@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "carolynwhite2" 
<carolynwhite2 at ...> wrote:
>
> Friends, Romans and countrymen etc.. Tim has got the beginnings of a 
> website to show us! Yes, really. Visit this link:
> 
> http://213.199.145.32/HPfGUCatalogueT1/


WOW! That's inspiring enough to get back to work ;). Thanks to Tim for 
all the hard work. And Paul, too. I'm still not clear who does what 
but *think* Tim designed the page and Paul hosts all of it on his 
server.

The links look ideal to me so a person can visit hpfgu, a catalogue 
dicussion group separate from hpfgu (good idea), and then a help 
section, which at the moment takes you back to our group but when 
completed will be a search index? Oh, and also an 'entries explained' 
link--what will that one be in the end?

I'm *really* impressed, it's more information than I was imagining and 
I especially liked the "10 most popular posts" section, that's a nice 
touch. 

Jen






From kelley_thompson at sbcglobal.net  Sat May 20 22:08:09 2006
From: kelley_thompson at sbcglobal.net (Kelley)
Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 22:08:09 -0000
Subject: Attention troops! IT developments..
In-Reply-To: <e4ml75+33jd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e4o409+tle5@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "carolynwhite2" 
<carolynwhite2 at ...> wrote:
>
> Friends, Romans and countrymen etc.. Tim has got the beginnings 
> of a website to show us! Yes, really. Visit this link:
> 
> http://213.199.145.32/HPfGUCatalogueT1/

A huge 'wow!' from me, too!  I spent a good bit of time and had such 
a blast wandering through it; it's so much more than I was imagining!
Absolutely fantastic, just gorgeous. I'm so excited about this, just 
can't wait for the unveiling.  My great thanks to Tim and Paul, too!

--Kelley







From kking0731 at gmail.com  Sat May 20 23:30:02 2006
From: kking0731 at gmail.com (snow15145)
Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 23:30:02 -0000
Subject: Attention troops! IT developments..
In-Reply-To: <e4np67+o9id@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e4o8pq+bugc@eGroups.com>



This design was a bit different than what I had expected, it's a lot 
better. Although it is at an infancy level the concept is very good. I 
especially liked the suggestive topics at the end of a post, which I 
assume would be the other category topics that we checked when 
reviewing the post (?) 

Great job to Tim and Paul! The catalog is finally starting to look like 
a reality. Like Jen said, it gives you inspiration to get back to work 
on it so we may all enjoy the fruits of our labor. Can't wait to see 
the public's opinion
I'm sure we will finally get some new discussion 
on the main list once they've had the chance to delve into the backlog 
of posts that we've sorted. I know when I first started cataloging many 
of the old posts started me thinking in a new way. 

Again many thanks to the technically minded people in the group!

KathySnow 








From elfundeb at comcast.net  Mon May 22 12:14:20 2006
From: elfundeb at comcast.net (Debbie)
Date: Mon, 22 May 2006 12:14:20 -0000
Subject: Snape and IT Developments
Message-ID: <e4s9us+ub4o@eGroups.com>

The proto-catalogue website looks lovely, and much better than I had 
pictured it.  Kudos to Tim & Paul.

I guess that means I should be busy whipping Snape into shape.  So 
far I've done the first 100 (um, that's not quite accurate; I've 
*read* the first 100 posts) and in the interest of developing a 
consistent approach to the categorization, I'm going to ask some 
questions before I go further:

1.  Is the goal to remove every post from 2.4.1, the main Snape 
category?  There are a few posts, such as the etymology ones, that 
I'd be fine with leaving there (or we could move them to 
categorization, which is the best match)?

2.  2.4.1.4 Good!Snape, 2.4.1.3 ESE!Snape.  I assume these are the 
places to implement Talisman's idea.  I had thought that these 
categories would be in addition to other relevant categories.  
However, it seems to be a separate topic in and of itself.  In 
addition, there are *lots* of acronyms under these categories, 
especially the ones that address the question "why did Snape leave 
the DEs?" which *assume* based on the then-existing canon that Snape 
was at that time on DD's side.  So the first question is whether 
this section should be for posts that argue one or the other?  
Should the "why did Snape leave the DEs" posts (and there are *lots* 
of posts on this topic) be buried here or go someplace else? Coding 
acronym'd theories only to the acronyms would help but if so, I 
wonder about burying the pre-acronym discussion in the general Good!
Snape category.   

3.  A couple of big issues back then concerned Snape's task at the 
end of GoF and, if he was returning to spying, how he was going to 
explain away his dealings with Quirrell.  There isn't really a good 
place for these (except maybe Good!Snape which will already be big 
enough) unless there's a general Spy!Snape cateogry.  We could 
broaden 2.4.1.5 Who is Snape working for? (which is essentially a 
spying question) to a Spy!Snape category to include this.

4.  I have included in 2.4.1.9 Snape and Teaching Style all of the 
posts about Snape's relationship with students other than Harry, on 
the theory that his interaction with them, in or out of class, is in 
his capacity as a teacher.  We also have all those "why did he want 
the DADA position" posts which might go here as well.  Perhaps this 
should be called simply Teacher!Snape.

Ideas, anyone?  I will forge ahead with the second batch of 100 and 
skip over the problematic posts until I hear a consensus.

Thanks,

Debbie








From annemehr at yahoo.com  Tue May 23 22:16:24 2006
From: annemehr at yahoo.com (annemehr)
Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 22:16:24 -0000
Subject: Snape and  American food (okay, just Snape)
In-Reply-To: <e44p04+3klu@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e501jo+umvh@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "carolynwhite2" 
<carolynwhite2 at ...> wrote:
 
> Right, done the new categories. This is what you've got (the ones 
> marked * previously existed):
> 
> 2.4.1.1 Snape & Love*
> 2.4.1.2 Snape transfigured* (old Vampire!Snape now a subcat)
> 2.4.1.3 ESE!Snape*
> 2.4.1.4 Good!Snape*
> 2.4.1.5 Who is Snape working for (*some acronyms shifted here but 
> they need checking for relevance)
> 2.4.1.6 Character studies (new)
> 2.4.1.7 Young Snape & MWPP (new)
> 2.4.1.8 Snape & Harry (new)
> 2.4.1.9 Snape & teaching style (new)
> 2.4.1.10 Snape as a literary construct (new)
> 
> Personally, I think that the Good! and ESE! Snape will prove 
> unworkable, but lets see what emerges.
> 

Hi, all...

I have a kid with a health problem, and until it's better resolved, 
I'm not really going to be here.  I did check in because I got 
Carolyn's IT alert.

Anyway, what happened to the independent Pro and Anti Snape 
categories?  Aren't we having those after all?

Anne
looking forward to checking the interface out soon, I hope








From spotthedungbeetle at hotmail.com  Fri May 26 11:27:44 2006
From: spotthedungbeetle at hotmail.com (dungrollin)
Date: Fri, 26 May 2006 11:27:44 -0000
Subject: stuff
Message-ID: <e56ong+8503@eGroups.com>

Oh my...

http://redwing.hutman.net/~mreed/

I recognise myself in at least 50% of them. 

Yeah. So... um. 
Site looks lovely! 
I'm gonna finish Beasts, at some point. 
Honest. 







From kakearney at gmail.com  Sat May 27 01:45:12 2006
From: kakearney at gmail.com (corinthum)
Date: Sat, 27 May 2006 01:45:12 -0000
Subject: SQL database file
Message-ID: <e58av8+aq4i@eGroups.com>

Anyone with behind-the-scenes access,

Sorry to pester, I know Paul has internet connectivity issues and
Carolyn's life sounds even more hectic than mine, but I was wondering
if I could get a copy of the current sql database file.  I've gone
through all the files on my computer, and verified that my offline
version of the catalogue is still fully functional; I just need the
updated database file and I can code while at sea.  I'm leaving this
Tuesday at o-dark thirty, so would it be possible to get it by then?

Thanks!
Kelly   









From carolynwhite2 at aol.com  Sat May 27 10:46:42 2006
From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2)
Date: Sat, 27 May 2006 10:46:42 -0000
Subject: SQL database file
In-Reply-To: <e58av8+aq4i@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e59ami+msnh@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "corinthum" <kakearney at ...> 
wrote:
>
> Anyone with behind-the-scenes access,
> 
> Sorry to pester, I know Paul has internet connectivity issues and
> Carolyn's life sounds even more hectic than mine, but I was 
wondering
> if I could get a copy of the current sql database file.  I've gone
> through all the files on my computer, and verified that my offline
> version of the catalogue is still fully functional; I just need the
> updated database file and I can code while at sea.  I'm leaving this
> Tuesday at o-dark thirty, so would it be possible to get it by then?
> 
> Thanks!
> Kelly
>

Kelly, I am still here, waving I hope not drowning. I have sent high 
alert message to Paul to get the database to you.

Cheers
Carolyn






From kakearney at gmail.com  Tue May 30 05:26:20 2006
From: kakearney at gmail.com (corinthum)
Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 05:26:20 -0000
Subject: SQL database file
In-Reply-To: <e59ami+msnh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e5gl1s+nbcm@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "carolynwhite2"
<carolynwhite2 at ...> wrote:
>
> --- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "corinthum" <kakearney@> 
> wrote:
> >
> > Anyone with behind-the-scenes access,
> > 
> > Sorry to pester, I know Paul has internet connectivity issues and
> > Carolyn's life sounds even more hectic than mine, but I was 
> wondering
> > if I could get a copy of the current sql database file.  I've gone
> > through all the files on my computer, and verified that my offline
> > version of the catalogue is still fully functional; I just need the
> > updated database file and I can code while at sea.  I'm leaving this
> > Tuesday at o-dark thirty, so would it be possible to get it by then?
> > 
> > Thanks!
> > Kelly
> >
> 
> Kelly, I am still here, waving I hope not drowning. I have sent high 
> alert message to Paul to get the database to you.
> 
> Cheers
> Carolyn

Paul sent me the link to the file, but I can't seem to download it
properly (when I try to extract the file, it comes up invalid). 
Seeing that I leave in a few hours, I guess I'll have to take a coding
vacation.  I'll check in again when I get back.

-Kelly








From carolynwhite2 at aol.com  Tue May 30 16:36:35 2006
From: carolynwhite2 at aol.com (carolynwhite2)
Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 16:36:35 -0000
Subject: SQL database file
In-Reply-To: <e5gl1s+nbcm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <e5hsaj+6ch5@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Catalogue at yahoogroups.com, "corinthum" <kakearney at ...> 
wrote:

> 
> Paul sent me the link to the file, but I can't seem to download it
> properly (when I try to extract the file, it comes up invalid). 
> Seeing that I leave in a few hours, I guess I'll have to take a 
coding
> vacation.  I'll check in again when I get back.
> 
> -Kelly
>

Kelly
Hope you got the email with further explanation of how to download?

Carolyn






From willsonkmom at msn.com  Wed May 31 11:32:52 2006
From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat)
Date: Wed, 31 May 2006 11:32:52 -0000
Subject: Let's Celebrate!
Message-ID: <e5jut4+cp1p@eGroups.com>

Potioncat stands in the middle of the Catalogue Office and takes a 
critical look at her cobweb encased desk. Gazing around the room she 
can see that real Life is claiming more of everyone's time, work has 
slowed and the buzzing chatter about old posts is rarely heard. The 
crew looks weary.

She considers what has been done and what remains. The last of the 
unwanted categories are almost completed. Snape is about to be 
tackled, in a way not even the fandom could imagine. Best of all, 
there is a bright new Catalogue sitting in our office. It won't be 
long before our secret mission will be revealed to the greater list. 
You know what that means? It's time to party!

Potioncat reaches into her pocket and takes out the company credit 
card. She is sure that when Miss Havisham gave her permission to have 
the event catered, she intended to give the card to Potioncat. It's 
perfectly fine that Potioncat slipped it out of the filing cabinet. 
Surely, with all she has to attend to, Miss Havisham did not need to 
approve the expense. We have something to be proud of! We have 
something to celebrate!

Potioncat takes out the Floo Directory and begins her search. First a 
call to House-Elves-for-Hire. The office needs a good cleaning. Next, 
a caterer. We'll skip the budget companies. Only the best for this 
party. There's Enchanted Evenings, Fairy Fiestas, Charming Canapes, 
Magical Mystery Tours. That's a thought, maybe we could hire a dinner 
cruise! We'll need music too.

Potioncat taps the desk with a pencil and sneezes at the dust. Hmm. 
Wonder who would like to help plan this event? Who will help with 
decorations? It has to be done right and done with class!