Two True Confessions, Too Big for Our Britches, and To be Continued...

[Risti]

Hi there!
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When I joined, I wasn't sure how much I was actually
going to participate, and how much I was going to
lurk, but I decided to send this out tonight, and get
a few ideas out rather then just sitting here waiting
for someone else to suggest them. As I sat down, as
has happened in the past when I sit down to right down
a 'simple' structure outline for a community, ideas
I'd never thought of before suddenly come to mind, and
before you know it, I have something that resembles
more of a report then a friendly email.  Well, let me
just say that I intend it as the latter, and feel free
to completely shoot down any ideas I present, not
matter how long I ramble on about them.



Two True Confessions.  

First of all, I haven't posted to any HP4GU lists
since August.  I honestly have barely looked at them. 
Not because I didn't like OotP(which I did) or because
I don't have any theories(which I do) but because this
fall I went back to university, and the only place
that I've let out HP thought is on my LJ and to my
friends in chats. I do have several posts half written
however, and Christmas break is in just over a
week...(I should mention that since someone tipped me
off to them, I have scanned through some of the recent
Chatter posts to get an idea of what's going on.)

Secondly, I have to admit this, since I've been
feeling guilty ever since I realized what I did, I
never read the list rules until after I'd posted more
then once to the list.  The over-eager(and familiar
with yahoo!groups) newbie I was last august, I clicked
on the 'post' link before I even checked my email for
what I figured would be the standard 'Welcome to
HP4GU' message.  I did eventually read it though. 
More then once in fact.

Too Big for Our Britches?

When I first came to HP4GU, coming from a background
where serious book discussion was done on websites and
community/role playing was done through email, I
wondered why on earth this discussion was taking place
through an email group which noticably produced huge
amounts of daily emails, rather then on a web board of
some type.  However, I shrugged, checked 'special
announcements only' as suggested, and began reading
through messages, trying to find the original starting
posts of some ideas, and of course, sending out my
own.

As I was on the list for awhile, I began to realize
why 'the list' was indeed a list.  First of all, it
had a history, and having been involved as a member
and moderator several other lists that took the
journey that was Yahoo Taking Over
Everything(onelist-egroup-yahoogroup, and also a few
yahoo!clubs) I understood that it was really just
easiest to go with the flow.  It hadn't started out a
huge list, it started with a relatively small group of
adults who liked Harry Potter.

I also began to see the element which I believe is
both the best point and worst point of the list.  In
order to read what you were really interested in, you
had to usually at least skim through what everyone
else was interested in as well.  This is HP4GU's best
point because it forces readers to broaden their
horizons, and become passionate about issues that they
never thought they'd be interested in.  It is the
worst point because 'what everyone else wants to talk
about' is often what you've already heard a million
times, and the system of the list and yahoomort as he
is can make it almost impossible to find what you are
looking for.

The point of restating what most of you probably
already know?  I think it's time to consider the idea
of moving to a messageboard/web forum type of
structure. (Should mention that whizbang also
suggested this this afternoon) Perhaps I'm just making
stuff up, but I thought I'd found some corner on some
page around the group that suggested that a long while
back, this idea has been brought up.  It seems like
the kind of idea that would be brought up every once
and awhile(and perhaps more often to that, in helpful
'suggestions' to the admin team that the majority of
list members don't see when they send their own
'original' idea to you).  

While I'll admit, I don't know the typical size for a
yahoo group, from my experience they are usually
measured in terms of hundreds of members rather than
thousands.(At least in groups that focus on whole
group discussion rather than just an information/news
group)  With the growth after OotP, and expected surge
again after the PoA movie, we are now measuring in
terms of ten thousands(ok, perhaps a slight
exageration, but after the movie...)  It just seems to
me that it's no wonder that people get lost on the
list, when you compare the structure to the size.

I know, however, that there are several advantages to
the current structure.  First of all, alot of people
like email, myself included.  In fact, had my home
email server not been so unstable over the last year,
I probably would have switched over to individual
emails at some point.  Email comes to you, rather than
you having to go to it, and can make it technically
easier to reply for those who do it from their email
account. (For those, like myself, who do it primarily
through the post button, it's not any easier, in fact,
can be harder.)

Secondly, from a technical standpoint, it's easier to
run.  Correct me if I'm wrong, as the list I moderated
was set up slightly different from this one, but the
only 'technical' duties of the admin team in terms of
normal usage is approving moderated posts, taking
members off moderated status(or back on when needed),
deleting innappropriate posts, and the setting up and
interaction between list elves and newbies. (Please
don't get me wrong.  I'm not trying to suggest that
all you lovely people on the admin team sit around and
do nothing.)  A messageboard, while I've never been
involved in administrating one, I can only imagine
takes more effort,(or maybe it doesn't, correct me if
I'm wrong).  Even as I first thought of this idea, I
could see people like Heidi and others involved in
various aspects of FAP and other boards running around
and calling me mad for even suggesting this idea.

Thirdly, it's free.  No money involved.  Definately a
major perk.

Finally, as mentioned before, there is the fact that
unlike a messageboard, where topics may be
seperated(although they don't need to be...), and in
any case people only see one link rather then a page
full pointing to the same discussion, you are forced
to at least skim through ideas that you may not have
looked at otherwise.

So those are the pros of the email system.  The pros
of the messageboard system?  Many of those features of
the email system can be worked into messageboards, at
least to my limited knowledge, correct me if I am
wrong.

Email notification for every new post/reply can be set
as default on some boards, and possibly even email
posting, although that may be more complicated.

I believe through modern scripting technologies that I
admittedly know very little of, some
messageboards/forum set ups don't require much every
day technical work, at least not beyond what list
elves already do. Like I said though, I know very
little about this, so feel free to laugh in my face.

There are free messageboards/servers out there, but
they all have bandwidth regulations which would
quickly be a problem for a group this size. Costs
could be split between a group this size to be quite
small, but those types of assumptions never seem to
really work out.

A Board could be set up so that all discussion threads
are in one forum, although as said before, that would
still only be one link to skim over rather than seeing
many links to individual replies to topics like the
canon behind R/Hr or Latin Grammer in the Wizarding
World.

Beyond that, I also believe that some messageboard
systems have the option of keeping posters on
moderated status, where their posts need to be
approved before seen.

The biggest advantage I see a forum system having
is the organization of posts.  Particularily if the
board adopted the parent/child system(I think that's
what it's referred to-like I said, techno-plebe) where
you have the option of either replying to the thread
in general, or to a reply(to drift from the original
topic slightly).  

As I've been writing this(which has taken awhile) I've
noticed the discussion about replies and posts being
ignored completely.  I know I've felt this in the
past.  I think this type of set up would make it
easier for at least replies to current threads to be
seen.  It would also help with the discussion of
attribution problems.

The search engines available in newer MB's from what
I've seen would run alot smoother then the yahoo one. 
It would also be nice to have the feature to look up
all posts by a particular person, as we all have the
habit of saying 'as I've explained many times before
in my theory on ____..."  We all tend to repeat
ourselves because of how hard it is to look up old
discussions.

I could go on and on about various arguments, but
since I'm really just arguing in a circle, I think
I'll try to conclude this, since I have another idea
I'd like to send out. (I'm going to send that out in a
seperate email though)  Again, I'd like to say that
despite the length of this, and all the arguments I
gave, this is only a suggestion.  Feel free to pick it
apart and discard it.  I'll readily admit that I don't
know enough about what goes on behind the scenes to
know if this would make things easier or harder in the
long run.  However, we are getting big, and we have to
realize that that is probably only going to continue. 
I don't see this group getting smaller unless it self
destructs(which is scary, but always possible) or the
series is finished.  So I'm curious, what does
everyone think of this idea?

~Risti

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