ADMIN: Possible Threat to the HPFGU Family of Lists

[Tom Wall]

This is obviously a touchy situation, so please feel free to chide 
me for what I'm about to do, but naturally...

I have a few questions about this message, and the, er, situation 
that we seem to have here.


Admin Team:
> For the past several months, we (the List Administration Team) 
have 
> been handling the disruption of several of the HP lists by an 
> individual or individuals, and it has gotten to a point which we 
> feel to be harassment. 

Tom:
Now, I could be wrong, but I feel confident that the ADMIN team has 
an idea as to the identity of this/these person/persons, since you 
guys take pains to point out that you aren't going to mention names.

Is there any *reason* that he/she/they could be irritated with the 
lists? Is this an irritation with the HPfGU family of lists, or is 
it an irritation with a subset of that group, like, say, the MDDT or 
the Moderator team?

In other words, what is the nature of the problem? Can it be solved? 
And has this person or people tried to solve the problem in other 
ways? Do you think that this is a 'last resort' kind of threat, or 
are we talking about something that will be ongoing?

Is it possible to satisfy this person by meeting the demands? I 
mean, what are the demands? Are they demands to be annointed High 
HPfGU Overlord, or something a little more moderate? What does this 
person want?


ADMIN:
> In addition, a threat has been made offlist 
> to at least one member of the current admin team, and we are 
> concerned that harassment of list members may have extended to 
> others beyond admin team members. 

Tom:
I understand that posting a person's *name* here might not be such a 
good idea, but I don't see why we couldn't know more about the 
nature of this threat.

What was the threat? I mean, are we talking a second attempt to 
delete the main lists? Are we talking about attempts to *ruin* the 
community? 

Or is it something more pithy, like, a threat to change the color-
scheme to something horrid? Have any members or Moderators been 
*personally* threatened? Have there been threats of hacking into 
accounts and so forth?


ADMIN:
> The action was not specified; however, one of our auxiliary HPFGU 
> lists was recently deleted by Yahoo, and the sender of this e-mail 
> apparently took credit for that action, implying that "Terms of 
Use 
> violations" were reported. 

Tom:
Well, er, was that group, um, that is to say, is it the case that 
the group was in violation of anything?

I mean, I don't think that Yahoo would do anything without first 
checking to see if the group was in some sort of violation, right? 
So, somehow, a cursory examination of said group must've proved some 
violation, at least so that there wasn't too much room for doubt. I 
understand that you guys didn't get anything before hand, but did 
Yahoo send an after-the-fact explanation of their actions?

Is there a dialogue ongoing?

Obviously the group that was deleted wasn't any of the main lists, 
or the FAQ list (which I'm on and naturally checked immediately) or, 
I'm assuming, was it the Mods' own private discussion list for Mod-
type-stuff. Right? I mean, all of these groups seem to adhere to the 
criteria quite handily.

So, er, what's an *auxiliary* list, anyways? Why did we have it in 
the first place? What was it for? Since it was affiliated with 
HPfGU, who were/are the members of that list?

The Yahoo Terms of Service and Guidelines are fairly clear, and I 
know that you guys have some serious legal expertise - which you've 
applied to these documents before. So, *if* the group that was 
deleted was actually in violation, perhaps it would be appropriate 
to ask...

Why did the Mod Team have an "auxiliary" list - that might've been 
in violation of Yahoo's terms of service - affiliated with HPfGU at 
all?

I mean, that is to say that now Yahoo might be watching HPfGU a 
little more carefully, right? 

Are there any *other* guidelines or Terms of Service that we're in 
violation of somehow? If so, can we fix that? That is to say that if 
HPfGU *was* in violation somehow, then I think that it's of 
paramount importance to correct this oversight by making *totally* 
sure that we're not in violation of anything else.

Admin Team:
> As our experience with the auxiliary group showed, Yahoo does not 
> give notice before they delete a group. While it might seem 
> incredible that they would delete a group with nearly 90,000 posts 
> and three-plus years of history without investigating the details 
of 
> an accusation, we have to be cautious, and beg Yahoo to listen to 
> both sides of the story if a complaint is made.

Tom:
Again, what was that group for, if it had 90,000 posts? Who's on 
that group? What was the group's URL?


Admin Team:
> It has taken our time, energy, and enthusiasm away from 
> our proper tasks: the fostering and running of these lists. And 
> until this situation is resolved, some of our time must continue 
to 
> be devoted to dealing with it. So we ask your continuing patience 
> and understanding, while we do everything we can to protect this 
> family of lists.

You got it.

-Tom