[HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Importance of Being Flint

[LeeMunLim03 at aol.com]

In a message dated 3/31/03 12:26:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, 
suzloua at hotmail.com writes:

> 
> Firstly, my apologies to Amy Z. I think it was my post that started off 
> most of the arguing you were referring to; although I was trying to write 
> it in a friendly debate sense, I can see some of my sarcastic comments may 
> have come off as hostile arguing. It's my sense of humour, and I have 
> enough trouble IRL with people miscontruing what I say - I should know 
> better than to push it in text, where I don't have body language and tone 
> of voice to soften the blow. Sorry anyone else who was offended by my 
> comments - the majority of the reasoning behind my argument is simply 
> playing devil's advocate to Kyle, I like discussing stuff like this and it 
> wasn't intended to get nasty.


I think it got nasty now its more of a discussion!!

> 
> Secondly, Felicia, you didn't half make me giggle when you said Petra Pan's 
> (in my opinion very good) post was too long when it was about a quarter of 
> the length of my original Importance of Being Flint one!!
> 
> Disclaimer in place, I must dust off my soap box and share the wonder of my 
> opinion with you all again :)
> 
> Kyle said:
> Now I think we can make a difference but why do you 
> say we can't when if we have our voices heard then they will bend over 
> backwards for us!!   I just don't want to see harry potter go the way of 
> Terminator with Arnold Scazanagger, Alien and the rest of the movies that 
> have sequals!!
> 
> Now, as I keep saying, I do admire your gusto - to quote a wise man, I 
> completely disagree with what you say but would fight to the death for your 
> right to say it - and it's nice to see you are such a fan of the HP movies 
> (to me, they really are just an enhancement of the books, not a separate 
> and equally good series), but some of your arguments confound me. 
> Especially since you've picked here Terminator 2 and Aliens, Alien 3, and 
> Alien Resurrection (I know T3 is being made, but since no-one's seen it 
> yet, I don't count it). T2 and Aliens are, along with the Godfather part 
> II, generally agreed to be some of the very few sequels that are far better 
> than their predecessors. You don't want the HP series to get better as time 
> goes on?? ~scratches head in confusion~


Yes I do want Harry Potter to get better with time!!  But why change the 
cast!!!  I didnt know Alien Resurrection did well at the box office and I 
sure am not going to see Terminator for the script anymore since two of the 
main cast have either left or can't be there (drug problem)!!  I heard Joss W
headon did the script or something and I think he needs to stick with Buffy 
and Angel until he gives us something more tasty!!

> 
> I said:
> That said, I *really* hope they don't cut the Boggart lesson...
> Kyle replied:
> First response they could!!!
> 
> ~pulls out hair~
> 
> Gah! I know that, sweetie! I'm well aware that they could cut all my 
> favourite scenes, and I'm starting to feel I should get "I WANT TO KEEP 
> QUIDDITCH" tattooed on my forehead, I've said it so often. I'm just 
> pointing out the fact that they can do more or less everything they want.


But why do you say who cares if flint is not in the movie!!  Big Question 
Mark???

> 
> I said:
> I have faith in him that it will be a 
> >worthwhile film - I'm just doubtful as to how well it well stand up to my 
> >vision of PoA in my head.
> He said:
> Me too but remember the director also wants to be faithful to the loyal 
> fanbase as well.
> 
> You say "the director". I'm taking that as one of three interpretations:
> a) Chris Columbus wants to be faithful to the loyal fanbase.
> b) Alfonso Cuaron wants to be faithful to the loyal fanbase.
> c) Directors in general want to be faithful to the loyal fanbase of any 
> sequels to beloved movies.


It doesnt seem that way with Alfonso that he wants to stay loyal to the fan 
base!  I had an image of Pettigrew as small and bald not big ass and tall!!

> 
> a) Columbus DID say that remaining faithful to the book was very important 
> to him, but Columbus isn't directing PoA (how sad... ~vbg~)
> b) Cuaron made no such promise. He's just here to make a good movie.
> c) It's not an unwritten rule. Or a written rule. It was Columbus' own 
> principals that came into play - we cannot reasonably expect Cuaron to play 
> by Columbus' rules.


No we can't but we can raise our voices and be heard and possiably change the 
script!!  Its not too late now but every day we don't do anything its going 
to get harder and harder.  Since there well on their way of making the 
movie!!  

> 
> He said:
> True but it seems its becoming more and more a kids film!!  Which is 
> baaaaaadddddd !!!
> I say:
> Well, to be honest, "becoming" brings to mind the words "horse" "door" 
> "after" and "bolted". The books were just written by JKR for JKR - if 
> anyone else wanted to buy them, more power to them. She never intended them 
> as books for adults or kids - they were just seen as kids books by 
> Scholastic and Bloomsbury, and marketed thus. WB, knowing the majority of 
> the fanbase lay in the under 16 demographic, marketed the films similarly. 
> I think this is why a lot of adults have trouble with the movies - they are 
> really made for the kids. It bothers us the way everything is slapdash and 
> the delightful strands of plot are squished up - kids for the most part 
> couldn't care less, they want the more the better. I mean, the entire 
> Polyjuice thing in CoS is pointless when you look at it - they found out 
> NOTHING, except that Malfoy wasn't behind it. (Or did they find out the 
> Chamber had been opened before? No, they learned that in the hospital. That 
> Myrtle had died, maybe? Oh, I can't remember.) But simply by introducing 
> it, she'd set up a little mention of boomslang skin in GoF ( you mean 
> Potter skinny dipping episode in the Prefects bathroom??) that could be 
> slipped in innocently enough and set up the Polyjuice ending. This is just 
> one random example of the sneakiness in the books that is lost in the 
> films.


What sneakiness. Please explain

> 
> 
> Anyway.
> 
> <<snip stuff about Pee Wee Herman, which Meliss9900 at aol.com answered much 
> better than me>>
> 
> Kyle said:
> No but I still want the same cast!!!  I think the Goblet will do better 
> then 
> the rest but by that time the movies will have sucked (tom the innkeeper is 
> 
> being played by someone else now!!)
> I say:
> I don't really understand why you are backing these particular horses. 
> (What do you mean horses???)  I can see your point on the HRHD thing, 
> because I agree, I want them to stay too - but Tom the one line Innkeeper? 
> Marcus "Look at my teeth not my acting" Flint? Do you seriously believe 
> that the change of actor from "whoever played him in PS" to "Whoever's 
> playing him in PoA" will affect the film that badly? Maybe the actor who 
> played Tom didn't want to do it again. Maybe he died. Maybe he's busy. We 
> can't blame WB for EVERYTHING. (Tempting though, huh?!)


Yes its very tempting to blame them for everything!!!  Well okay Tom the 
innkeeper is a mote point but I am just worried who is next!!  It starts with 
the little people then the big people!!

> 
> I said:
> (which I don't think woudl be SUCH a bad thing - PS and CoS sucked compared 
> to the books, but they weren't unwatchable)
> Kyle said:
> You thought the movies sucked!!  I loved the movies and  I thought the 
> chamber wasnt going to be a good one but it was excellent!!
> I say:
> Don't get me wrong, as movies they are okay, but they aren't a very good 
> representation of the books, nor are they a very good ambassador to the 
> non-HP world.


Well we can open a whole pandora's box about wiccans not liking the movie!!  
My parents even told me wicca's don't like the movie since they say it doesnt 
really represeant them!!  Well movies and books are a little different but 
the same as well!  I mean I thought I wouldnt like the Chamber but then its 
my bias when I read the books!!  I feel if I didnt read the books I wouldnt 
have had those angry feelings and then when I watched it I loved it!!  Deep 
down I guess I wanted to see it!!  

> 
> 
> Kyle said:
> I dont think they are different but I think its like  Luke Skyewalker can't 
> 
> spell it!  Okay now in the middle of filming lets change the cast since  
> Radcliffe and company are leaving and there really not happy anymore.  
> Remember this is a business!  Your not always going to be happy in what you 
> 
> do!  I don't think the kids  are our personal property but just think what 
> would happen if Rupert, Dan or Emma decided to quit???
> 
> I say:
> Luke Skywalker? Huh? Do you mean that Mark Hamill hasn't done much acting 
> since Star Wars, or that they changed Luke Skywalker? Because they didn't 
> change him... ~confused~


No I am saying why change the cast since you already have your cast!!!!

> If you're referring to the current trilogy, they are prequels. Luke hasn't 
> been born yet. And if you mean that they changed *Anakin* Skywalker from 
> Jake Lloyd to Hayden Christiansen in Ep2, they kinda had to - the films are 
> set ten years apart, he had to become 19 in two or three years.


If we are talking about the trilogys now thats a whole different ball game!!  
Remember you really dont need Mark Hamill since he wasnt born yet when Hayden 
Christiansein played him!

> 
> As far as "remembering this is a business" - well, I'm sorry, but you are 
> really starting to worry me now. They're just children. How on earth can 
> you say they should be miserable to entertain us for a couple of hours?

I dont remember saying they need to be miserable but, but!!  What I am trying 
to say is yes there children but on the other hand there also actors Think 
now and then and Apt Pupil  How many people are going to say well in this 
scene the wormer brothers are swimming in the lake skinny dipping and the 
girls come and steal there clothes!!!  This is acting where there always 
emotional naked and sometimes physically naked!  I think that is 
uncomfortable but its the business their in!  My point is there not always 
going to like what they do in the acting business but they have to remember 
its a weird artistic business!!  If you boss asked you to remove you clothes 
would you do it!!  Proalby not but in the acting business they are habutially 
asked to remove their clothes and be miserable or not comfortable!!

 > 
> If they don't want to do it, they shouldn't have to. No I agree with you 
> but they are in the business and sometimes they are not going to like what 
> they have to do I didnt like drawing nudes but Now I think its okay so 
> bring on the nudes as well as clothed models!!  You are essentially talking 
> about denying them the right to choose just to make you happy. And that's a 
> horrible attitude to have. I'm not trying to be harsh, here, I just want 
> you to hear what you're saying.
> 
> I said:
> >" they have to stay or we won't go see the film!"
> >Hmmm. Do you really think they'll care if they aren't in it? Not *their* 
> >problem. 
> He said:
> No its not but on the other hand do you really think the last film is going 
> 
> to be as hot as the first and 2nd one???  If they care about there fans 
> they 
> will still.  
> I say:
> One might say if their fans care about them, they'd support their 
> decisions... What exactly do you mean by "hot", by the way? I mean, are we 
> talking Hansel ("he's so hot right now" hehe)?


No not hansel but what I am trying to say is you dont even know about the 4th 
installment of the Never Ending Story, so Harry Potter may become that!

> 
> 
> He said:
> Well I think it does becuase Harry Potter is a runaway train but if they 
> hear 
> enough voices they will bend over backwards for us!!  Since  people think 
> there isnt going to be much we can do okay I am resigned to the fact Harry 
> Potter is going to sh(t in a  hand basket! 
> 
> They will bend over backwards? No offence, but I think you are being a 
> little naive. They might shift a little if the fandom really DID go into 
> action, but the WB execs are rich, powerful men. They don't bend over 
> backwards for their mothers, never mind us.

Well every dog has its day!!!  Or the other example maybe David and Golitah 
the Giant!!


> Re: McKellen
> He said:
> I think he was since a article said he was shooting X-Men one day and off 
> the 
> to the Lord of the Rings the next!!  Its stressful being in the 
> entertainment 
> business.
> 
> Perhaps it meant he was shooting X2 and follow-up reshoots for TTT or ROTK 
> at the same time? I'm pretty sure he was in NZ for all the time he was 
> shooting LOTR. Or maybe it meant he finished shooting X-Men and hopped on a 
> plane to NZ and started on LOTR the next day, or vice-versa? As I said, NZ 
> and California are a good eleven hours from each other. To make one of your 
> principals fly back and forth two and three times a week isn't good 
> business sense for either production - I really think you should 
> double-check that. Common sense dictates they wouldn't work that way.


Thats what I read and Marlu Henna From Evening Shade and Taxi would be at her 
dying mothers side and go back the next moring to work in hollywood then come 
back to her mothers side at night in Philly!!!

> 
> Kyle said:
> Well I do admit that sequels can do good but I am very worried about Harry 
> Potter and company!!  If the recast Tom the innkeeper is Dudley next???
> 
> You missed my point somewhat. I was saying that on the whole sequels DO 
> suck, but it's because the original idea that made the first film so 
> sh*t-hot is subverted over the series. In the case of adaptations, it can 
> be that the original book has no sequel - hence Jurassic Park and The Lost 
> World doing ridiculously well at the box office and JPIII more or less 
> sinking without trace (although the fact that we're used to amazing CGI now 
> could have something to do with it - maybe one of those mad Stephen King 
> spin-offs might have been a better example).
> 
> As far as comparing Tom and Dudley - check your books. How many canon 
> mentions does Tom have compared to little Duddikins? You really can't put 
> the two together.


Well I think I can since Dudley is always in the books with his parents!!  
Someone said well Draco doesnt have to be in the Goblet of Fire as much so 
Felton can leave??  Plus in the 5th book The Dursleys will have a bigger 
role!

> 
> 
> Kyle said re WB and the powers that be:
> I think there more interested in the money not our the loyal fanbase
> I throw up my hands in joy and shout:
> He sees the light!!


But you don't!!  I mean lets raise our voices before its too late!!  They 
already have some of the movie done but not all!!  If we do our damnest to 
get wood and Flint back in we can but no one wants to!!  They just want the 
movies made!

> 
> Kyle said:
> ><<Why have the same cast for Lord of the Rings but not Harry 
> >Potter???  Why is that a problem???  >>
> I said:
> >Because LOTR was shot back to back. Harry is being shot, released, shot, 
> >released, shot...etc. The cast all signed up for 1 long movie cut into 
> >three parts - the HP cast didn't.
> He said:
> Well they should of done it that way but didnt!!
> I shrug and say:
> Tough nuggies, really. Too late now.


Its never too late!!!  If we raised our voices high and long enough we could 
change the script a little bit!!!  But no one wants to!!

> 
> He said:
> why then is Elijah wood still recognized as a child actor???  He was a 
> nominaee for a kids award and his now 23 or 24 maybe younger but an adult! 
> 
> I take it you are referring to a Kids Choice award or something? They are 
> chosen by kids, not specifically for children only. One might argue that 
> the Oscars are an "adult" award, so what business did Haley Joel Osment 
> have being nominated for Best Supporting Actor? What about Beauty and the 
> Beast for Best Picture? etc etc.


I have to disagree with you on that one!!  Any actor in the Oscars can win an 
award regardless of age!!  Think Jessica Tandy Dead and she got the award!!!  
How on earth is she going to enjoy the fruits of her labor if she is dead!!  
Elijah Wood is still considered a child actor!!  He didnt want the Kids 
Choice Award anyway.  How many shows are adult themed in the Kids Choice 
awards??  I dont remember!!  I am sure the movie Hannibal wasnt at the Kids 
Choice Awards !!

> 
> Kyle said:
> I would stay in Harry Potter until the end!! 
> 
> Bully for you. I'd do the same. They don't want to - maybe, just maybe they 
> know better than we do? Since they are actually living it, and we're just 
> imagining?


Yep



Kyle said:
> 
> Why does the director think or Steve Kloves think having the same cast 
> will be not good!!!!!!  
> 
> Oh lordy. They do! They want to keep them! It's the kids themselves who 
> want to leave, not the directors! And Steve Kloves? He's a writer - they 
> rank just above coffee boy on a film set.

Not what I heard!!  I heard Dan said the director or powers that be may not 
want him back!!!  I also heard that Rupert says he want to possiably stay 
until the 6th movie comes out!


> 
> Kyle then said something I found pretty amusing:
> If Harry Potter gets to be real big I think the adults will be stuck as 
> well 
> but again you never know!!
> 
> Sorry, I just had to mention this bit. IF HARRY POTTER GETS TO BE REAL 
> BIG??? Are you kidding me?!?! :) 


Huh???  If your saying its real big then why do you think the adult actors 
career's will continue after the movie!

> 
> 
> Susan
> wondering if we'll have WB-sponsored clothes and HP bread when Harry gets 
> to be real big, if he's currently quite small - unless you meant 
> height-wise :D
> 
> 
> No I mean the movies!!  There was WB stores but they want out of business!!
> 
> 
> 
> Kyle Longbottom 
> 
> Hufflepuff Prefect


I am not mad at you susan!!

Just blooooodddddddyyy Frustrated!! 




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