Snape and DD in GoF/missing scene/setup for OOTP

[lupinlore]

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "cubfanbudwoman" 
<susiequsie23 at s...> wrote:

<SNIP>
> 
> As for how this scene portrayed DD, I do think that in going along 
> with Snape's suggestion, especially in light of McGonagall's 
*firm* 
> suggestion that doing so meant using Harry as bait, DD knew he was 
> manipulating more than a little bit.  I think we get his 
> *acknowledgment* of that in the dormitory-with-Harry scene near 
the 
> end.  DD there states, "I put you in *terrible* danger this year, 
> Harry."  Not exactly an apology, but definitely an admission.  He 
did 
> not say, "This magical binding contract put you in terrible 
danger;" 
> he said, "*I* put you in terrible danger."

Well, there is also the factor of the "missing scene" mentioned by 
artslynda in post# 11476.

Artslynda:

One scene that didn't make it into the final cut of the movie that I 
think should have been kept was the one (shown on the "making of" 
specials, etc.) where DD tells Harry he can no longer protect him, 
and Harry said, "If you can't, then who can?" (or words to that 
effect). That bit explains DD's actions in the trophy room and his 
uneasiness at other times -- he was terrified because Harry was 
being made a pawn in some kind of game.

Now Lupinlore:

This is a very interesting point.  I wonder where that scene was 
supposed to go?  If it went sometime BEFORE the "decision" scene 
with Snape, McGonagall, and Dumbledore (and by the way, did anybody 
else think that Newell was trying to give an eerie echo of the trio 
with having those three together having a heart-to-heart?) then it 
might indicate that Dumbledore, in addition to talking things over 
with Snape, had also talked things over with *Harry*.  Dumbledore 
could easily have had such a talk with Harry at any point between 
the arrival of the Hogwarts Express and the name coming out of the 
goblet, i.e. he could have been warning Harry that Voldemort and his 
followers were accelerating their plans and that events might well 
slip out of Dumbledore's control.  That would reduce the level of 
manipulation involved, since he would not be using Harry as a pawn 
but would be going ahead, very reluctantly, with a policy he had 
already warned Harry he might have to pursue.

I would point out that the "decision" scene also contrasts somewhat 
with the later scene where Harry overhears Dumbledore trying to 
browbeat Fudge into calling off the tournament.  I mean, if letting 
Harry compete is totally a ploy by Dumbledore, why is he trying to 
get the tournament called off?  I understand that he wants to 
protect all of the participants, but if he has control over Harry's 
(and for that matter, Cedric's) participation why would he not just 
defy the rules as Minerva wishes him to and announce that things 
have become much too dangerous and murky and that he is withdrawing 
the Hogwarts participants and urging Karkaroff and Madam Maxime to 
follow suit?

Maybe (and I'm spinning my wheels wildly here) we are supposed to 
believe that Dumbledore is concerned about Harry's (and Cedric's) 
feelings and he's worried that if he just forbids Harry to 
participate without providing some face-saving device that Harry 
will be permanently ostracized from the student body (i.e. he'll 
forever afterwards be the big baby who snuck his name into the 
Goblet and then had to be rescued by Dumbledore overriding the 
rules).  He may also be concerned that if the ministry insists upon 
the "binding contract" they might try to persecute Harry for 
embarassing them if some face-saving device can't be found (and 
after all subsequent events prove he would be right in his reading 
of the Ministry's likely reaction).

And maybe Kloves and Newell, in a tradition to which JKR herself is 
not a stranger, just weren't being completely coherent.




> 
> Anyway, I think this scene -- DD's response to McGonagall & Snape -
- 
> is at least part of why I was a little upset that I didn't get the 
> sense from Gambon!DD that he truly loved & cared about Harry (esp. 
in 
> contrast to MM) *at this point.*  Now, later in the movie, 
especially 
> in the dormitory scene, I felt that Gambon!DD matched *my* (may 
not 
> be others') sense of a DD who cares about & loves Harry very much.
> 

True.  I do think, by the way, that Dumbledore's "I'm sorry," in the 
dormitory was in way of an apology.  I mean, he could easily have 
said "I'm sorry, but I had no choice."  By leaving it simply at "I'm 
sorry," I think an apology is being offered, rather awkwardly (and 
one of the nicest things about the scene is that Dumbledore seems 
rather awkward and unsure of himself, even to the point of starting 
the conversation with a pointless comment about the bed curtains).  
I think the rather tentative caress he gives Harry at the end of the 
scene is also meant to convey an awkward sense of apology.

But the other reason I think the "I'm sorry" is an awkward apology 
is that it sets things up so nicely for OOTP.  Taking Dumbledore 
altogether as he's presented in GoF (the puzzling matter of 
the "decision" scene aside), we have a man who has watched, 
fearfully, as Harry has been put in danger.  By the end of the movie 
he is unnerved by events and sorry for his decisions.  The stage is 
now set for fifth year, where Dumbledore will be fiercely determined 
to keep Harry safe (i.e. NOT to have a repeat of last year, thank 
you very much) and to protect Harry from emotional burdens (i.e. to 
make up for letting him bear so much last year).  I think that 
Dumbledore's specific emphasis on "this year" in the scene (i.e. 
NOT "I put you in terrible danger" but "I put you in terrible danger 
THIS YEAR") may be a subtle bit of foreshadowing, as well.  In that 
sense, I think Kloves has helped JKR out quite a bit, in that he has 
prepared the way for OOTP!Dumbledore much better than JKR herself 
did.


Lupinlore