From montavilla47 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 03:05:39 2009
From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 03:05:39 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2e11e+9gct@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2ejq3+j226@eGroups.com>

Montavilla47:
> > I've never heard anyone say a bad word about the actor who plays
> > Neville Longbottom, but I don't find him at all like Neville 
> > physically. Neville is also described as blond and "moon-faced".
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> You mean "round-faced", right :-)? And I don't remember Neville's hair color ever being mentioned :-). 

Montavilla47:
It may have been "round-faced," but I remember it as "moon-faced." 
I'm pretty sure he's described as blond at some point, but I could be
wrong.

I do know that in PoA, Harry imagines Peter Pettigrew as looking like
Neville, so that might have been where I picked up the blond thing.

Zanooda:
However, this is different - the boy *did* look the part when he was cast. You never know with the kids. Who could have predicted that Matthew Lewis would grow up tall and handsome :-)? I'm sure if he was tall, slim and handsome as a kid, many of us (me included) would consider him miscast, even if he played the part as well as he does. He wouldn't be convincing, that's all. Yes, now he has to wear a fat suit and fake teeth, but it's all right. 

Montavilla47:
I'm not sure about the fat suit, but he was wearing fake teeth from
the beginning.  

He originally tried out for the part of Harry and physically, he and 
Daniel Radcliffe weren't that different in the first film.  Now, of course,
he's much taller than Daniel.

But in how he "read" to the director, he must have been much more
suited to Neville.



> > montavilla47 wrote:
> 
> > - she might have benefited from better costuming and a lighter 
> > tint to her hair
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Yes, and I also noticed in the pictures that she looks better with her hair hanging down. Why did they make her wear a pony-tail in the movie?


Montavilla47:
I keep wondering why they made her wear that weird hat.


> > montavilla47 wrote:
> 
> > With practically no lines or scenes, just how was Poesy 
> > supposed to convey that?
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> They do it to all secondary characters, don't they? It's always funny to read how some kid was chosen from thousands others to play some part, and then in the movie he has nothing to play. What's the point in chosing the most talented kid, if he only has two words to say in the movie?
> 

Montavilla47:
I know.  I wonder what was so terrible about the PoA Patil twins.  They
were both really cute and they were actually twins.  Why did there need
to be a big casting search to replace them?

At least with Luna they gave her a few good scenes.  And they found 
the perfect girl to play her.

I also thought that Cho was really delightful with that Scottish 
accent.  My nephew, however, declared her not nearly hot enough
for his tastes.







From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 03:47:23 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 03:47:23 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2ejq3+j226@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2em8b+gupi@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "montavilla47" <montavilla47 at ...> wrote:

> I do know that in PoA, Harry imagines Peter Pettigrew as 
> looking like Neville, so that might have been where I 
> picked up the blond thing.



zanooda:

LOL! I don't think Peter was ever called blond either, but this really doesn't matter.



> montavilla47 wrote:

> I'm not sure about the fat suit


zanooda:

Yeah, me neither, I read about it in an interview, but the source was not very reliable.



> Montavilla47:

> I keep wondering why they made her wear that weird hat.


zanooda:

Weren't all Beauxbatons girls wearing those hats? I thought it was part of their uniform. But you are right, hair is one of Fleur's main assets, why hide it :-)?



> montavilla47:

> I know. I wonder what was so terrible about the PoA Patil 
> twins. They were both really cute and they were actually twins.  


zanooda:

Oops, I didn't even notice two Patil twins in PoA :-). I only remember Parvati at Lupin's boggart lesson - very cute indeed. I'll need to watch the movie again to look for the second twin :-). 





From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 03:56:33 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 03:56:33 -0000
Subject: DH actors
In-Reply-To: <a12a35909075d65ecedfa780dc1984c7@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <h2emph+n8s8@eGroups.com>

Bill Nighy will be in DH, but it's unknown which character he is playing. They believe it's Scrimgeour, but the actor didn't actually say anything definitive:

http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2009/6/30/bill-nighy-as-rufus-scrimgeour-for-harry-potter-and-the-deathly-hallows






From bgrugin at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 01:43:08 2009
From: bgrugin at yahoo.com (bgrugin)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 01:43:08 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2ejq3+j226@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2h3bc+47rc@eGroups.com>

> Zanooda:
> However, this is different - the boy *did* look the part when he was cast. You never know with the kids. Who could have predicted that Matthew Lewis would grow up tall and handsome :-)? I'm sure if he was tall, slim and handsome as a kid, many of us (me included) would consider him miscast, even if he played the part as well as he does. He wouldn't be convincing, that's all. Yes, now he has to wear a fat suit and fake teeth, but it's all right. 
> 
> Montavilla47:
> I'm not sure about the fat suit, but he was wearing fake teeth from
> the beginning.  
> 
> He originally tried out for the part of Harry and physically, he and 
> Daniel Radcliffe weren't that different in the first film.  Now, of course,
> he's much taller than Daniel.
> 
> But in how he "read" to the director, he must have been much more
> suited to Neville.
> 
> 
> 


Musical Betsy here:
Here's a link to a recent interview with Matthew Lewis, in which he mentions the fat suit he wears.  He also talks about auditioning for the role, in which he states that he wasn't auditioning for any one part - he didn't care what part he played, he just wanted to be in the movie.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/herocomplex/2009/06/harry-potter-countdown-matthew-lewis-is-neville-longbottom.html





From lizzy1933 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 04:30:34 2009
From: lizzy1933 at yahoo.com (Lizzie Mae Lilly)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 04:30:34 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2em8b+gupi@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2hd5a+pdl2@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "zanooda2" <zanooda2 at ...> wrote:
>

> 
> > montavilla47:
> 
> > I know. I wonder what was so terrible about the PoA Patil 
> > twins. They were both really cute and they were actually twins.  
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Oops, I didn't even notice two Patil twins in PoA :-). I only remember Parvati at Lupin's boggart lesson - very cute indeed. I'll need to watch the movie again to look for the second twin :-).
>

They're together at the Yule Ball being treated very rudely by Harry and Ron.

Lizzie





From montavilla47 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 04:53:15 2009
From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 04:53:15 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2hd5a+pdl2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2hefr+ilo@eGroups.com>

> > > montavilla47:
> > 
> > > I know. I wonder what was so terrible about the PoA Patil 
> > > twins. They were both really cute and they were actually twins.  
> > 
> > 
> > zanooda:
> > 
> > Oops, I didn't even notice two Patil twins in PoA :-). I only remember Parvati at Lupin's boggart lesson - very cute indeed. I'll need to watch the movie again to look for the second twin :-).
> >
> 
> They're together at the Yule Ball being treated very rudely by Harry and Ron.
> 
> Lizzie


Montavilla47:
That was in GoF and those were different actors..  In PoA, they are 
standing together when the kids are getting their Hogsmeade 
instructions from McGonagall.




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 05:03:22 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 05:03:22 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2hefr+ilo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2hf2q+g7g9@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "montavilla47" <montavilla47 at ...> wrote:

> In PoA, they are standing together when the kids are 
> getting their Hogsmeade instructions from McGonagall.


zanooda:

Thanks! I'll be sure to pay attention next time I watch PoA :-).





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 16:08:08 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 16:08:08 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2hefr+ilo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2im18+teck@eGroups.com>

Lizzie wrote:
> > They're together at the Yule Ball being treated very rudely by Harry and Ron.
> > 
> > Lizzie
> 
> 
> Montavilla47:
> That was in GoF and those were different actors..  In PoA, they are 
> standing together when the kids are getting their Hogsmeade 
> instructions from McGonagall.
>
Carol responds: I don't remember that scene. At any rate, IMDb lists Parvati as being played by Sitara Shah, but Padma isn't listed.

http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0304141/

Carol, who was thinking that Parvati was in the first two films, too, but can't find her listed




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul  2 16:25:23 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:25:23 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2hd5a+pdl2@eGroups.com>
References: <h2em8b+gupi@eGroups.com> <h2hd5a+pdl2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <00d701c9fb31$b5cb2b10$21618130$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Lizzie Mae Lilly
Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 12:31 AM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps

 



> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Oops, I didn't even notice two Patil twins in PoA :-). I only remember
Parvati at Lupin's boggart lesson - very cute indeed. I'll need to watch the
movie again to look for the second twin :-).
>

They're together at the Yule Ball being treated very rudely by Harry and
Ron.

Lizzie



The Patil Twins are standing right next to each other in Defense against the
dark arts before the boggart ever comes out, in fact, they are rarely filmed
not right next to each other even if one has nothing to say in the scene. 

 

The Yule ball was GOF not POA.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul  2 16:33:18 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:33:18 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2hefr+ilo@eGroups.com>
References: <h2hd5a+pdl2@eGroups.com> <h2hefr+ilo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <00dc01c9fb32$d4089a80$7c19cf80$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of montavilla47


Montavilla47:
That was in GoF and those were different actors.. In PoA, they are 
standing together when the kids are getting their Hogsmeade 
instructions from McGonagall.



They basically had two Indian girls that walked as a pair in the first three
films but are un-credited until POA, then only Parvatti gets credit as she
is addressed directly. For unknown reasons, two girls, unrelated and
definitely not twins, are cast for the final four films.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul  2 16:37:19 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:37:19 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2im18+teck@eGroups.com>
References: <h2hefr+ilo@eGroups.com> <h2im18+teck@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <00e101c9fb33$62e46950$28ad3bf0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol




Carol responds: I don't remember that scene. At any rate, IMDb lists Parvati
as being played by Sitara Shah, but Padma isn't listed.

http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0304141/

Carol, who was thinking that Parvati was in the first two films, too, but
can't find her listed.

::::::::::::

That's because the Yule Ball is in GOF :-D and those girls are Ron & Harry's
dates, so I'm quite sure you've seen that scene ;-)

Many of the kids where in the first 3 - 4 films "representing" characters
from the books, if they were not addressed by other characters and did not
speak they were not credited. Since the original kids where really
look-alike extras some parts where re-cast when the characters actually had
to speak.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From lizzy1933 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 22:01:29 2009
From: lizzy1933 at yahoo.com (Lizzie Mae Lilly)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 22:01:29 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <00e101c9fb33$62e46950$28ad3bf0$@com>
Message-ID: <h2janp+nn81@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:
>
>> 
> That's because the Yule Ball is in GOF :-D and those girls are Ron & Harry's
> dates, so I'm quite sure you've seen that scene ;-)
> 
>  
> 
> md
> 

I'm soooo embarrassed!

Lizzie
who should think before she types




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 22:30:54 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 22:30:54 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <00e101c9fb33$62e46950$28ad3bf0$@com>
Message-ID: <h2jceu+j6g4@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> > Carol responds: I don't remember that scene.
 
> That's because the Yule Ball is in GOF :-D and those girls 
> are Ron & Harry's dates, so I'm quite sure you've seen 
> that scene ;-)


zanooda:

I think Carol meant the scene in PoA where the first (pre-GoF) Patil twins stand together - the scene both of us don't remember :-). You guys made me so curious, I'll go right now and try to find this scene in PoA :-). How could I miss the second girl, LOL?







From willsonkmom at msn.com  Thu Jul  2 22:52:38 2009
From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 22:52:38 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2c2cj+4qpg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2jdnm+d1mk@eGroups.com>

 
> Montavilla47:

> 
> But I don't think we were settling with Staunton.  She's a terrific
> actress, either comic or dramatic.  To see her in a dramatic role, 
> I would suggest "Vera Drake," although the subject matter (pre-
> legal abortions) may be objectionable to some.
> 
> For comic roles, she was great in "Sense and Sensibility."


Potioncat:
Staunton is a wonderful actress. I'd recommend "Vera Drake" too. I'm anti-abortion and I was amazed that I could feel such sympathy for an abortionist. (For the record, I'm against abortion, but don't really want it banned at this time.)

She was funny in S&S...also very good in "Cranford." Oddly enough, of the roles I've seen, she was the most attractive as Umbridge. That surprised me given how very plain she was as Vera.




From bgrugin at yahoo.com  Fri Jul  3 02:15:12 2009
From: bgrugin at yahoo.com (bgrugin)
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 02:15:12 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2jceu+j6g4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2jpjg+t4g7@eGroups.com>

> --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child of Midian" <md@> wrote:
> 
> > > Carol responds: I don't remember that scene.
>  
> > That's because the Yule Ball is in GOF :-D and those girls 
> > are Ron & Harry's dates, so I'm quite sure you've seen 
> > that scene ;-)
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> I think Carol meant the scene in PoA where the first (pre-GoF) Patil twins stand together - the scene both of us don't remember :-). You guys made me so curious, I'll go right now and try to find this scene in PoA :-). How could I miss the second girl, LOL?
>


MusicalBetsy here:
I just finished watching PoA, and sure enough, there are twins in that movie!  Both in the Boggart scene and when they are leaving to go to Hogsmeade.  I guess they just didn't feel that those twins were good enough actors for GoF, huh?  

Although I still don't consider PoA my favorite HP movie, my 6-year-old loves this movie, especially where there are "2 Harrys and 2 Hermiones" (her words)!.  Weird, eh?  I would have thought the dementors would be too scary for someone that young (but GoF and OoP are too scary for her).

MusicalBetsy, who has to admit she was more than willing to take her daughter up on the idea of watching PoA tonight, just so she could look for twins!




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul  3 04:22:52 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 04:22:52 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2jpjg+t4g7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2k12s+o810@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "bgrugin" <bgrugin at ...> wrote:

> I just finished watching PoA, and sure enough, there are twins
> in that movie!


zanooda:

I saw the two girls, but I don't think they are twins, not identical in any case :-). I paused them a few times, and I don't see too much resemblance, especially when they give their permission forms to Filch (or was it McGonagall?). The girls also look different to me at the very end, when Harry gets the Firebolt - one of them is standing on the right from Harry and Ron, next to that mysterious black kid, and the second one is opposite Harry, next to Percy and behind the twins. They look a little more similar in Lupin's class, but still, I can't see that they are identical :-).  






From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul  3 04:25:52 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 04:25:52 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2jdnm+d1mk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2k18g+e04p@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "potioncat" <willsonkmom at ...> wrote:


> She was funny in S&S...also very good in "Cranford." 


zanooda:

I only saw her in "Nanny McPhee", but she sure was funny there too :-)!




From bgrugin at yahoo.com  Fri Jul  3 14:50:32 2009
From: bgrugin at yahoo.com (bgrugin)
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 14:50:32 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2k12s+o810@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2l5ro+427s@eGroups.com>

> 
> zanooda:
> 
The girls also look different to me at the very end, when Harry gets the Firebolt - one of them is standing on the right from Harry and Ron, next to that mysterious black kid, and the second one is opposite Harry, next to Percy and behind the twins. >


MusicalBetsy:
Yeah, who is that black kid?  He even has lines!  I didn't remember him from before.  At first I thought he was Dean, but that's someone else, isn't it?  Was he in any of the other movies?




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul  3 16:22:04 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 16:22:04 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2l5ro+427s@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2lb7c+61hu@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "bgrugin" <bgrugin at ...> wrote:

> Yeah, who is that black kid?  He even has lines!  I didn't 
> remember him from before


zanooda:

Well, they say (Carol does, anyway, she even knows his name :-)) that this kid won some kind of essay competition where the winner is given a small part in the movie. I think it was really unfair to invent a new character for someone with a lot to say, when the established characters are not given enough material to play. Dean, for example, didn't have one single line to say in PoA, and he is a permanent book/movie character. 


> bgrugin wrote:

> At first I thought he was Dean, but that's someone else, 
> isn't it? 


zanooda:

Of course it's not Dean. Dean is the one who is tall and good-looking :-). Here is his last picture (from HBP), standing together with Ginny and Luna on board Hogwarts Express:

http://storeimgs.com/show.php/34599_harrypottercelebutopia12.jpg.html


Love Arnold on Ginny's shoulder :-). 






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul  3 16:27:12 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 16:27:12 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <00e101c9fb33$62e46950$28ad3bf0$@com>
Message-ID: <h2lbh0+3mk9@eGroups.com>

> Carol responds: I don't remember that scene. At any rate, IMDb lists Parvati as being played by Sitara Shah, but Padma isn't listed.
> 
> http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0304141/
> 
> Carol, who was thinking that Parvati was in the first two films, too, but can't find her listed.
> 
> ::::::::::::
> 
> That's because the Yule Ball is in GOF :-D and those girls are Ron & Harry's dates, so I'm quite sure you've seen that scene ;-)
> 
> Many of the kids where in the first 3 - 4 films "representing" characters from the books, if they were not addressed by other characters and did not speak they were not credited. Since the original kids where really look-alike extras some parts where re-cast when the characters actually had to speak.
>
Carol responds:

Sorry to be vague. I'm not talking about the Yule Ball, which I know is in GoF. I'm talking about the scene in PoA where the twins ostensibly appear together. I specifically mentioned Sitara Shah, who is credited as Parvati in PoA, not Shefali Chowdbury, who plays Parvati in GoF, OoP, and HBP. (Padma is not listed for PoA, at least not on the IMDb; she's played by Afshan Azad in GoF through HBP.)

I remember Parvati and her cobra Boggart that turns into a Jack-in-the Box, but I don't remember Padma at all in PoA or any earlier films. Parvati didn't speak, but she was addressed by name (by Lupin). Maybe that was sufficient to earn a credit.

Carol, wondering why the parts were recast if Padma was already present and the girls were really twins (seems unfair not to credit her when the twin who plays Parvati is credited!)




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul  3 16:29:21 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 16:29:21 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2jceu+j6g4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2lbl1+6igj@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier: I don't remember that scene.
>  
> > That's because the Yule Ball is in GOF :-D and those girls are Ron & Harry's dates, so I'm quite sure you've seen that scene ;-)
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> I think Carol meant the scene in PoA where the first (pre-GoF) Patil twins stand together - the scene both of us don't remember :-). <snip>

Carol responds:

Right.

Carol, who may occasionally confuse DH and HBP but knows PoA from GoF!




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul  3 17:01:53 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 17:01:53 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2lb7c+61hu@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2ldi1+vqvp@eGroups.com>

<bgrugin@> wrote:
> 
> > Yeah, who is that black kid?  He even has lines!  I didn't  remember him from before
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Well, they say (Carol does, anyway, she even knows his name :-)) that this kid won some kind of essay competition where the winner is given a small part in the movie. I think it was really unfair to invent a new character for someone with a lot to say, when the established characters are not given enough material to play. Dean, for example, didn't have one single line to say in PoA, and he is a permanent book/movie character. 

Carol responds:

I'm just going by what I found on the IMDb. The kid's name is Ekow Quartey and he's credited as "Boy 1." Why they would give an unimportant, unnamed character lines that make him seem more knowledgeable than known characters like Seamus Finnegan (who asks what a Grim is--something that Book!Seamus would certainly know) is beyond me. 

I must have found the info about the essay contest in the IMDb message boards, but I don't have time to go back through them now, especially since most of the posters are adolescents who use texting abbreviations. Wonder if any of them can actually spell "two" (or distinguish it from "to" and "too").
 
> > bgrugin wrote:
> 
> > At first I thought he was Dean, but that's someone else, isn't it? 
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Of course it's not Dean. Dean is the one who is tall and good-looking :-). Here is his last picture (from HBP), standing together with Ginny and Luna on board Hogwarts Express:
> 
> http://storeimgs.com/show.php/34599_harrypottercelebutopia12.jpg.html
> 
> 
> Love Arnold on Ginny's shoulder :-).
>
Carol:
Dean is standing in the shadows in the photo. If you hadn't told me he was there, I'd never have seen him! But Dean (Alfie Enoch) has lines in most or all of the films, and he's one of Harry's roommates, so he's pretty easy to spot in the films. IIRC, he's in the PoA scene where the boys eat the candies that cause them to make animal sounds (but Harry accidentally eats a pepper imp instead and has steam blowing out of his ears). Oddly, I don't remember any of his lines.

Carol, who is no fan of Boy 1 and wishes that his lines had either been eliminated (especially the one about catching smoke in your bare hands) or assigned to named characters from the book




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul  3 23:58:12 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 23:58:12 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2ldi1+vqvp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2m5uk+tms6@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> I must have found the info about the essay contest in the 
> IMDb message boards, but I don't have time to go back through them 


zanooda:

The essay part can easily be true, actually, because some time ago I saw an announcement on Leaky about some contest to win a small part in DH. It seems they do things like that :-). 


> Carol:

> Dean is standing in the shadows in the photo. If you hadn't 
> told me he was there, I'd never have seen him!



I chose this photo only because it is the most recent one and because I liked Arnold the pygmy puff :-). But I'm sure there are plenty of Dean pictures out there. I don't know if the boy he can act, but I find him very nice-looking, and I was disappointed not to see him in the Shell cottage scenes for DH when they were shot some time ago. 

Carol, did you see the rest of the pictures that were posted together with Luna/Ginny/Dean :-)? There were two Snapes there. In case you didn't see, here they are:

http://storeimgs.com/show.php/34627_harrypottercelebutopia40.jpg.html

http://storeimgs.com/show.php/34629_harrypottercelebutopia42.jpg.html


zanooda, who is not much interested in new HBP pictures and videos now that the movie will be out so soon :-).







From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul  4 00:11:21 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Sat, 04 Jul 2009 00:11:21 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2lbh0+3mk9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2m6n9+ie3d@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> Carol, wondering why the parts were recast if Padma was 
> already present and the girls were really twins 


zanooda:

I still say they are not twins :-). Am I the only one who thinks so :-)? As for the fact that the girls were recast - they seem to change actors rather often, don't they? We had at least two Angelinas Johnson already, right? And we have a new Pansy Parkinson in HBP :-). So it's not something unusual :-).





From charober at sympatico.ca  Sat Jul  4 17:37:03 2009
From: charober at sympatico.ca (charober at sympatico.ca)
Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 17:37:03 +0000
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Rupert Grint Interview - Daily Mail
In-Reply-To: <h28ofp+s8j6@eGroups.com>
References: <h28ofp+s8j6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <SNT111-W342F2B7EF6D85531283E7FB32D0@phx.gbl>


Thanks for the interview Steve.  I enjoyed reading it.

 

Rupert Grint has way too much talent to drive an ice cream truck.  ;)  I'd be heartbroken if I never got to see him in anything again.  I was when it looked like Emma was quitting the series.  My mom and I enjoyed her in The Tales of Desperaux.  I recommend it if you haven't seen it.  

 

Charlotte, who is plowing through OOTP to prepare for the new movie.
 


To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
From: bboyminn at yahoo.com
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:48:41 +0000
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Rupert Grint Interview - Daily Mail







If you are a Rupert Grint fan, you'll enjoy this interview.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-1195468/Acting-come-end-Harry-Potter-finishes-Rupert-Grint-magic-stopping.html?ITO=1490

This is probably Rupert most candid and intelligent interviews, and it is accompanied by some great photos of Rupert. 

He talks about some of the extravagances he has spent his money on. Some of which involves his love of motor sports, or at least cars, that we can assume he inherited from his father. 

He talks about his future in acting.

What it was like to be swept up in the whole Harry Potter mania. 

And what it was like to meet the First Lady Michelle Obama. 

Again, informative and intelligent, one of his best interviews. 

While the interview isn't credited, he or she is obviously very skilled.

Steve/bboyminn










[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From charober at sympatico.ca  Sat Jul  4 17:54:45 2009
From: charober at sympatico.ca (charober at sympatico.ca)
Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 17:54:45 +0000
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2lbh0+3mk9@eGroups.com>
References: <00e101c9fb33$62e46950$28ad3bf0$@com> <h2lbh0+3mk9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <SNT111-W181408B5620CADB03F633B32D0@phx.gbl>


Carol responds:

I remember Parvati and her cobra Boggart that turns into a Jack-in-the Box, but I don't remember Padma at all in PoA or any earlier films. Parvati didn't speak, but she was addressed by name (by Lupin). Maybe that was sufficient to earn a credit.

Carol, wondering why the parts were recast if Padma was already present and the girls were really twins (seems unfair not to credit her when the twin who plays Parvati is credited!)

 

 

Charlotte responds:

Actually, Parvat does speak in POA, though the one line (more like word) she says is "Riddikulus!" to change the snake!Boggart into a Jack-in-the-box.  Then again, she can't be too memorable when her acting skills aren't fully used in that one scene.  At least making that one vocal sound would suffice to earn a credit.  







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Sun Jul  5 16:01:12 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Sun, 05 Jul 2009 16:01:12 -0000
Subject: Harry Potter the atheist
Message-ID: <h2qio8+8vi7@eGroups.com>

In a recent article Daniel Radcliffe said he was an atheist and a fan of Richard Dawkins. This delighted me because I'm a atheist too and as much as I like the Harry Potter books I like Richard Dawkins's books even more. See:

http://www.examiner.com/x-2044-Atheism-Examiner~y2009m7d4-Harry-Potters-Daniel-Radcliffe-is-an-atheists-and-respects-Richard-Dawkins  

 Eggplant 






From willsonkmom at msn.com  Sun Jul  5 16:53:34 2009
From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat)
Date: Sun, 05 Jul 2009 16:53:34 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2m5uk+tms6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2qlqe+eti2@eGroups.com>

-Zanooda:
 There were two Snapes there. In case you didn't see, here they are:
> 
> http://storeimgs.com/show.php/34627_harrypottercelebutopia40.jpg.html
> 
> http://storeimgs.com/show.php/34629_harrypottercelebutopia42.jpg.html
> 
> 
> zanooda, who is not much interested in new HBP pictures and videos now that the movie will be out so soon :-).

Potioncat:
In the first one, I get a very strong feeling that Rickman is thinking, "Wait a moment, am I playing Judge Turpin or Professor Snape?

But the second one---that is just how I pictured the room (well, maybe I expected a few more books.) 


Potioncat, still interested in photos because I haven't gotten to actually see very many.





From kpagan1 at msn.com  Sun Jul  5 16:31:47 2009
From: kpagan1 at msn.com (Kathy)
Date: Sun, 05 Jul 2009 16:31:47 -0000
Subject: Harry Potter the atheist
In-Reply-To: <h2qio8+8vi7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2qkhj+agd3@eGroups.com>

Eggplant wrote:
>
> In a recent article Daniel Radcliffe said he was an atheist
and a fan of Richard Dawkins. This delighted me because I'm a
atheist too and as much as I like the Harry Potter books I like
Richard Dawkins's books even more. See:
http://www.examiner.com/x-2044-Atheism-Examiner~y2009m7d4-Harry-Potters-Daniel-Radcliffe-is-an-atheists-and-respects-Richard-Dawkins
>


Hi Eggplant,
I think your Subject line is misleading. Dan Radcliffe may or
may not be an atheist, but that does not suggest Harry Potter
is an atheist. In fact HP's creator, JKR has been very eloquent
about her religious beliefs. I've attended several HP conventions
& lectures where that theme is researched and documented by
astute authors such as John Granger and many others. The topic
always generates interesting discussions.

Many devout Christians (such as myself) just love the HP stories
and universe, and adore the genius of JKR. And I totally respect
and appreciate the talent of Daniel R without sharing his views.

After reading that article,  I just really wanted it mentioned
that there are minority fringe elements in every quarter, please
don't paint us all with the same brush.

Thank you,
Kathy




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul  5 19:08:27 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Sun, 05 Jul 2009 19:08:27 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2qlqe+eti2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2qtnb+7s2v@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "potioncat" <willsonkmom at ...> wrote:

> But the second one---that is just how I pictured the room 


zanooda:

Yeah, but I didn't expect any windows with blinds somehow, only with curtains :-). OTOH, maybe I'm wrong and it should be a normal Muggle house.




From willsonkmom at msn.com  Sun Jul  5 19:25:07 2009
From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat)
Date: Sun, 05 Jul 2009 19:25:07 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2qtnb+7s2v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2qumj+aoeg@eGroups.com>

 
> zanooda:
> 
> Yeah, but I didn't expect any windows with blinds somehow, only with curtains :-). OTOH, maybe I'm wrong and it should be a normal Muggle house.

Potioncat:
Actually, the kitchen was a bit of a surprise. I didn't expect it to be visible. I thought there was a door. While it does look very much (to my mind) what a row house type kitchen from the 60s might look like; you're right, it doesn't look like a wizard's kitchen. Although, an old bachelor like Snape might not bother changing the kitchen around for the few months a year he lives there.

Come to think of it, you wouldn't expect to find fairy-made wine in there, would you?





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul  6 01:43:58 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 01:43:58 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2m5uk+tms6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2rksu+9h8b@eGroups.com>

zanooda wrote:
> Carol, did you see the rest of the pictures that were posted together with Luna/Ginny/Dean :-)? There were two Snapes there. In case you didn't see, here they are:
> 
> http://storeimgs.com/show.php/34627_harrypottercelebutopia40.jpg.html
> 
> http://storeimgs.com/show.php/34629_harrypottercelebutopia42.jpg.html
> 
> zanooda, who is not much interested in new HBP pictures and videos now that the movie will be out so soon :-).


Carol responds:

No, I didn't see them. Those are great, thank you!--especially the one of Snape and Bellatrix (who looks a little too attracted to him to be faithful to the book) Where did you find them? I have Google and Yahoo alerts for HP news, but I didn't see these.

Carol, who can't wait to see the Spinner's End scene





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul  6 01:58:59 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 01:58:59 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2m6n9+ie3d@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2rlp3+p051@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> > Carol, wondering why the parts were recast if Padma was 
> > already present and the girls were really twins 
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> I still say they are not twins :-). Am I the only one who thinks so :-)? As for the fact that the girls were recast - they seem to change actors rather often, don't they? We had at least two Angelinas Johnson already, right? And we have a new Pansy Parkinson in HBP :-). So it's not something unusual :-).
>
Carol:

I'm just basing my question about their being twins on other people's posts. I haven't watched PoA again to look for them (never noticed "Padma" in previous viewings, though, and I'm sure I would have if they were identical).

But my question is *if* they are really twins, why recast them? Parvati seems to be able to act reasonably well. I know that WB sent out a casting call for twins to play the part in GoF, so I'm guessing that they aren't really twins and they wanted girls who looked more alike. (Apparently, they settled for unrelated girls who could act and could pass as sisters rather than identical twins who couldn't act. didn't hundreds of girls try out for the parts?)

As for why they recast Angelina and Pansy, I don't know that, either. Maybe the original actresses couldn't manage the filming schedule or they tried out and weren't good enough for the slightly expanded roles. In the case of the kid who played Colin Creevey in CoS (and was perfect for the part), he seems to have changed too much, so they wrote in a new character called Nigel in his place. At least the same actors are still playing Draco, Seamus, Dean, and, especially, Neville and HRH. I think they'll have the same Crabbe and Goyle, too, at least for HBP. Jamie Waylett (Crabbe) got into some kind of trouble a while back. Hope it wasn't serious and he's back for Junior DE!Crabbe in DH2.

Carol, feeling oddly nervous now that HBP is almost here




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul  6 02:09:16 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 02:09:16 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2qlqe+eti2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2rmcd+ng3n@eGroups.com>

Potioncat wrote:
> In the first one, I get a very strong feeling that Rickman is thinking, "Wait a moment, am I playing Judge Turpin or Professor Snape?
<snip>

Carol responds:

I had a similar reaction to the first photo in the smaller version, but in the enlarged version he looks more grimly worried than evil. Maybe he's reacting to the news before Narcissa and Bellatrix arrive--both the needless deaths of the Muggles on the bridge and the increased danger that Harry is in now that he's being billed as the Chosen One.

But the audience will probably think that he's evil. I read a review today (in Variety) which said that Snape reveals his true colors in HBP. Um, has the reviewer read the books? I think not. 

BTW, his clothes look black rather than blue in these photos. Must just have been the lighting in the Unbreakable Vow photo that made it look blue.

Carol, who keeps making typos and hopes she caught them all!




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul  6 03:45:18 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 03:45:18 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2rksu+9h8b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2rs0e+10k66@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
 
> No, I didn't see them. Those are great, thank you!--
> especially the one of Snape and Bellatrix (who looks 
> a little too attracted to him to be faithful to the book) 
> Where did you find them? 


zanooda:

They were on Leaky, but I gave a link to some other site, because  TLC had some kind of maintenance that day and I couldn't access it. Here is the link to that Leaky article:

http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2009/7/2/new-photos-of-snape-at-spinners-end-luna-and-ginny-and-dean-brown-with-quibbler-more

There are a few more pictures there, but the two I posted are the only ones with Snape in them :-). 

There was also an announcement that they cast some guy named Guy Henry to play Thicknesse in DH :-).




From CatMcNulty at comcast.net  Mon Jul  6 15:17:39 2009
From: CatMcNulty at comcast.net (Cat)
Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 15:17:39 -0000
Subject: Is WB desperate?
Message-ID: <h2t4ij+h1mh@eGroups.com>

Is it my imagination or does anyone smell the reek of WB desperation?  The Publicity department is working overtime (more than previous HP movies?) ... there have been an avalanche of interviews, contests, and promos (print & TV)lately ... LOTS of promotional activity meant to rejuvinate interest in HBP.  

I know that I am still going to see HBP but I'm just not as excited as I usually am a week before a new HP movie opens. 
Shoot, I drove 10 hours just to take my nephew to the midnight opening of GoF! 

Could WB be trying to make-up for having made that horrible decision to delay the opening of the movie? And now they they are in a flop sweat because of that decision? (I am still ticked because of it)

I know that Summit productions is VERY happy that they(WB) did it because "Twilight" really benefited from that decision! Now, don't get me wrong, I think that Twilight would have been a tremendous success anyway. I just wonder how many Harry fans went to see Twilight to soften the blow of being HP-deprived? ... I did and I'm not a hormonal teenaged girl.

Just Wondering,
Cat




From Englishlady at gmail.com  Mon Jul  6 16:52:50 2009
From: Englishlady at gmail.com (Aryn Culbertson)
Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 09:52:50 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Is WB desperate?
In-Reply-To: <h2t4ij+h1mh@eGroups.com>
References: <h2t4ij+h1mh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dc3be0ab0907060952w5ccc8c04gae14c9dd05af0aa2@mail.gmail.com>

Hallo Cat,
   Remember this ole English Kat? So you have seen Twilight? And still
excited to see HP6? I have a ticket to see the 10am showing of the film @
this posh new Gold Classic Cinema (cost me a fortune, but they highly doubt
anyone else will be in the theatre so hey may be my own private viewing).
The Cinema is one of only two of it's kind in the Country, at least that's
what they say. The seats are this new type & the Theatres are only 40 per
Theatre. So am rather excited, but the BEST part, NO CHILDREN!!! YEAH!!!

Chat soon.. Hopefully you remember that you & I have chatted before.. quite
a while ago, but it was nice..

Cheeres, Aryn (aka Kat)

On 06/07/2009, Cat <CatMcNulty at comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> Is it my imagination or does anyone smell the reek of WB desperation? The
> Publicity department is working overtime (more than previous HP movies?) ...
> there have been an avalanche of interviews, contests, and promos (print &
> TV)lately ... LOTS of promotional activity meant to rejuvinate interest in
> HBP.
>
> I know that I am still going to see HBP but I'm just not as excited as I
> usually am a week before a new HP movie opens.
> Shoot, I drove 10 hours just to take my nephew to the midnight opening of
> GoF!
>
> Could WB be trying to make-up for having made that horrible decision to
> delay the opening of the movie? And now they they are in a flop sweat
> because of that decision? (I am still ticked because of it)
>
> I know that Summit productions is VERY happy that they(WB) did it because
> "Twilight" really benefited from that decision! Now, don't get me wrong, I
> think that Twilight would have been a tremendous success anyway. I just
> wonder how many Harry fans went to see Twilight to soften the blow of being
> HP-deprived? ... I did and I'm not a hormonal teenaged girl.
>
> Just Wondering,
> Cat
>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul  6 17:01:28 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian)
Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 13:01:28 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Is WB desperate?
In-Reply-To: <h2t4ij+h1mh@eGroups.com>
References: <h2t4ij+h1mh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <005a01c9fe5b$6740d170$35c27450$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Cat
Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 11:18 AM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Is WB desperate?

Is it my imagination or does anyone smell the reek of WB desperation? The
Publicity department is working overtime (more than previous HP movies?) ...
there have been an avalanche of interviews, contests, and promos (print &
TV)lately ... LOTS of promotional activity meant to rejuvinate interest in
HBP. 

:::::::::::::::::::

I noticed too, that they are spending a lot of money on a film that should
have a  built-in $400,000,000 + audience. My best guesses, it?s been 2 years
since OOTP, the prior largest gap was 18 months. It?s been 2 years since the
last book, with no more to come. OOTP had the DH bump, they both came out on
top of each other raising the Pottermania. Also, they screwed and pissed off
fans and they know damned well there?s opening-weekend boycott groups and
they want to entice people to opening weekend. They are also, no doubt,
hoping that the unimaginable PG rating (how is this tamer than the last
three, the book was the darkest, most violent and let?s not forget all the
sexual innuendo) I?m thinking they are hoping parents feel more comfortable
bringing smaller kids the first time rather than seeing it themselves first.

Also, WB has not had the year it had last year by any stretch and Watchmen
wasn?t the ? billion dollar smash they had hoped for, so the entire year is
riding on HBP. We are seeing it twice the second and third week it?s out,
the first is just my wife and I so we can actually watch the film. We bring
the kids to the second one so the constant distraction of divvying out candy
and popcorn and constant bathroom trips don?t ruin it for us.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From CatMcNulty at comcast.net  Mon Jul  6 23:17:27 2009
From: CatMcNulty at comcast.net (Cat)
Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 23:17:27 -0000
Subject: Is WB desperate?
In-Reply-To: <dc3be0ab0907060952w5ccc8c04gae14c9dd05af0aa2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <h2u0m7+rse3@eGroups.com>

Hey Kat!!!!

Great to hear from you! I hope all is going well for you and yours!
The Gold Clasic Cinema ... only 40 seats ... no children ... sounds fantastic! An almost private showing for adults ... WoW! I am jealous! :-) 

The best theatre showing experience I have had was when 4 friends and I were the only ones at a mid-day showing of GoF and it was closed captioned. It was great to be able to read faint dialogue and the words to "Dance Like A Hippogriff"...great fun!

I did see "Twilight"... I was curious. A friend recommended the book and I was wondering how they would translate it to screen. Luckily it was when school was in session so I didn't have to deal with screaming, giggling and squealing teens. All-in-all it was okay, BUT definitely NOT anywhere in the same league with Harry Potter movies nor is the original literary source as compelling and addictive as JKR's work. 

I am looking forward to HBP BUT I'm just not as silly-excited as I have been in the past. After the long wait it better be terrific! I guess I'm still resentful of WB's manipulation and broken promises, all for the sake of $. 

8 Days to Go!
Cat

 



--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, Aryn Culbertson <Englishlady at ...> wrote:
>
> Hallo Cat,
>    Remember this ole English Kat? So you have seen Twilight? And still
> excited to see HP6? I have a ticket to see the 10am showing of the film @
> this posh new Gold Classic Cinema (cost me a fortune, but they highly doubt
> anyone else will be in the theatre so hey may be my own private viewing).
> The Cinema is one of only two of it's kind in the Country, at least that's
> what they say. The seats are this new type & the Theatres are only 40 per
> Theatre. So am rather excited, but the BEST part, NO CHILDREN!!! YEAH!!!
> 
> Chat soon.. Hopefully you remember that you & I have chatted before.. quite
> a while ago, but it was nice..
> 
> Cheeres, Aryn (aka Kat)
> 
> On 06/07/2009, Cat <CatMcNulty at ...> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Is it my imagination or does anyone smell the reek of WB desperation? The
> > Publicity department is working overtime (more than previous HP movies?) ...
> > there have been an avalanche of interviews, contests, and promos (print &
> > TV)lately ... LOTS of promotional activity meant to rejuvinate interest in
> > HBP.
> >
> > I know that I am still going to see HBP but I'm just not as excited as I
> > usually am a week before a new HP movie opens.
> > Shoot, I drove 10 hours just to take my nephew to the midnight opening of
> > GoF!
> >
> > Could WB be trying to make-up for having made that horrible decision to
> > delay the opening of the movie? And now they they are in a flop sweat
> > because of that decision? (I am still ticked because of it)
> >
> > I know that Summit productions is VERY happy that they(WB) did it because
> > "Twilight" really benefited from that decision! Now, don't get me wrong, I
> > think that Twilight would have been a tremendous success anyway. I just
> > wonder how many Harry fans went to see Twilight to soften the blow of being
> > HP-deprived? ... I did and I'm not a hormonal teenaged girl.
> >
> > Just Wondering,
> > Cat
> >
> >  
> >
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>





From CatMcNulty at comcast.net  Tue Jul  7 00:12:18 2009
From: CatMcNulty at comcast.net (Cat)
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 2009 00:12:18 -0000
Subject: Is WB desperate?
In-Reply-To: <005a01c9fe5b$6740d170$35c27450$@com>
Message-ID: <h2u3t2+43rs@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:
> I noticed too, that they are spending a lot of money on a film that should
> have a  built-in $400,000,000 + audience. My best guesses, it's been 2 years since OOTP, the prior largest gap was 18 months. It's been 2 years since the last book, with no more to come. OOTP had the DH bump, they both came out on top of each other raising the Pottermania. Also, they screwed and pissed off fans and they know damned well there's opening-weekend boycott groups and they want to entice people to opening weekend.

Cat Writes:
I agree. HP fans not like being de-valued and dismissed. WB has definitely bitten the hands that feed them and they will suffer for it. I am going to be very interested in the opening weekend earnings and I wonder how much of an impact the boycott is going to have.

md continues:
>They are also, no doubt, hoping that the unimaginable PG rating (how is this tamer than the last three, the book was the darkest, most violent and let's not forget all the sexual innuendo) I'm thinking they are hoping parents feel more comfortable bringing smaller kids the first time rather than seeing it themselves first.> 

Cat Writes:
I  wonder if they think that ploy will work?

md continues:
> Also, WB has not had the year it had last year by any stretch and Watchmen wasn't the ? billion dollar smash they had hoped for, so the entire year is riding on HBP.> 

Cat writes:
I'm not feeling sorry for them in the least!

md continues:
>We are seeing it twice the second and third week it's out, the first is just my wife and I so we can actually watch the film. We bring the kids to the second one so the constant distraction of divvying out candy and popcorn and constant bathroom trips don't ruin it for us.
> 
> md
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Cat writes:
I think that is an excellent plan. When I took my niece and 2 nephews to see OotP ... I missed a bunch because the youngest nephew kept talking and to make several bathroom trips. Needless to say, I went back to see the show alone so I could really enjoy it.

Cat 





From Mhochberg at aol.com  Tue Jul  7 06:00:17 2009
From: Mhochberg at aol.com (Mhochberg at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 2009 02:00:17 -0400
Subject: Casting mis-steps
Message-ID: <8CBCCDF562A6FE5-B08-AC@webmail-me06.sysops.aol.com>

There are a total of 42 high quality photos. Here is the link to the collection.

http://tinyurl.com/kpjojm

The photos are amazing. Lots of detail in the costumes and sets.

The files are big, many over 1 MB but oh such fun to study!

It took me? a while to track them down but it was well worth it.

---Mary


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From no.limberger at gmail.com  Tue Jul  7 13:27:49 2009
From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger)
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 06:27:49 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Is WB desperate?
In-Reply-To: <h2t4ij+h1mh@eGroups.com>
References: <h2t4ij+h1mh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <7ef72f90907070627r4c5684c0m674fca2728d70ee8@mail.gmail.com>

>Cat wrote:
>Is it my imagination or does anyone smell the reek of WB desperation?
>The Publicity department is working overtime (more than previous HP
>movies?) ... there have been an avalanche of interviews, contests, and
>promos (print & TV)lately ... LOTS of promotional activity meant to
>rejuvinate interest in HBP.

No.Limberger responds:
I'd have to say that WB does appear to be spending a lot more money
on advertising and promoting HBP than previous HP films.  I suspect
several reasons for this:
1. WB knows that it's decision to delay the release of the film from
November, 2008 to July, 2009 upset the HP fan base.
2. A full two years have elapsed since the final HP book was published,
as well as the last HP film, OotP.
3. The addition of a scene that is not part of the original book may
also upset the fan base.

All I can say is that I'm looking forward to seeing the film next week
and hope that it will be good.

-- 
"Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!"


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul  7 16:44:27 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 2009 16:44:27 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <8CBCCDF562A6FE5-B08-AC@webmail-me06.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <h2vu1b+50mj@eGroups.com>

Mary wrote:
>
> There are a total of 42 high quality photos. Here is the link to the collection.
> 
> http://tinyurl.com/kpjojm
> 
> The photos are amazing. Lots of detail in the costumes and sets.
> 
> The files are big, many over 1 MB but oh such fun to study!
> 
> It took me? a while to track them down but it was well worth it.

Carol responds:

Thanks very much! I just noticed that the shot of Snape reacting to the Daily Prophet stories occurs in the daytime (the clock says 4:26 or something like that--I closed that window and can't recheck) and daylight shows through the blinds. The visit from Bellatrix and Narcissa probably occurs later the same night (around midnight in the book, and the room is darker in the shot of a dazed Snape and staring Bellatrix). It's interesting that he appears to have both an electric light and (unlit) candles on the hearth behind him. Maybe it's magical "eckeltricity," or maybe he magically steals electricity from the Muggles so he doesn't have to pay the bill. I've never seen an oil lamp in that shape; the shade is pointing downward. Or maybe it's just a blunder on the part of the set designers, like the Victrolas and electric trains in PoA. I agree with whoever said that the blinds should be drapes. Wizards don't use Venetian blinds that we know of. Looks as if Snape has made no effort (except the bookshelves) to convert his father's shabby 1960s Muggle house to his needs. I do hope the producers include at least one of the hidden doors in the bookshelves, which have to be Snape's doing. I don't think his mother would have dared to make such changes given his father's temper. And is that a skylight over his head?  Odd--isn't it a two-story house?

Carol, wishing that the set designers had studied the scene a little more carefully, getting all the details right rather than half of them





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul  7 16:56:41 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 2009 16:56:41 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2vu1b+50mj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h2vuo9+k48k@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> 
> Thanks very much! I just noticed that the shot of Snape reacting to the Daily Prophet stories occurs in the daytime (the clock says 4:26 or something like that--I closed that window and can't recheck) and daylight shows through the blinds. <snip> I agree with whoever said that the blinds should be drapes. Wizards don't use Venetian blinds that we know of. Looks as if Snape has made no effort (except the bookshelves) to convert his father's shabby 1960s Muggle house to his needs. <snip>

Carol again:

Responding to myself--sorry1 Make that 4:32 (went back and rechecked). I forgot to mention that our spy apparently keeps Wizard binoculars (used by Hagrid in CoS) on his mantelpiece (not hearth--what was I thinking?). Nice touch. I don't suppose they're omnioculars or whatever that term was in GoF--a spy can't stop for replays or he might miss something!

BTW, to speak for a moment like a high school girl, they've made Cormac McLaggen cute! I have a feeling that boy will earn himself some fangirls. I guess they couldn't have Emma Watson kissing or being kissed by a boy who wasn't good looking.

Carol, happy that they didn't put Snape in Muggle clothes at Spinner's End (though, of course, that topcoat or whatever it's called should be a robe)




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  8 00:44:53 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Wed, 08 Jul 2009 00:44:53 -0000
Subject: Casting mis-steps
In-Reply-To: <h2vuo9+k48k@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h30q65+p01j@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:


> BTW, to speak for a moment like a high school girl, they've made
> Cormac McLaggen cute! 


zanooda:

Is it Neville who serves drinks at Sluggy's party? If so, it seems that Neville is a house-elf substitute in all the movies - he gives gillyweed to Harry and finds the RoR instead of Dobby, and now he works as a waiter at that party instead of the elves, LOL.





From ckc at rochester.rr.com  Wed Jul  8 01:33:47 2009
From: ckc at rochester.rr.com (CK Campbell)
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 21:33:47 -0400
Subject: Musical
In-Reply-To: <h30q65+p01j@eGroups.com>
References: <h2vuo9+k48k@eGroups.com> <h30q65+p01j@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <5BF8B88277204D1C8FBF1876236EFEDE@ckc>

 I don't remember anyone mentioning this before, but if you haven't seen it,
go to youtube and search for "A Very Potter Musical."  It is a fan-made,
unofficial, full-length, student performed musical.  It is hilarious.  I
thought I'd strain a muscle laughing.  It is posted in 23 parts (Act 1 has
14, Act 2 has 9).  It will take a while to watch, but it's worth it.

CK




From Pjmiller60 at aol.com  Fri Jul 10 18:25:06 2009
From: Pjmiller60 at aol.com (treeshahmom280)
Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 18:25:06 -0000
Subject: Premiere Fashions
Message-ID: <h38122+fmgv@eGroups.com>

Want to ask what folks thought of the "red carpet" clothes the trio were wearing.  Emma, despite the rain in London looked really nice, I didn't really see what Rupert was wearing, but I want to know if anyone else agrees with me that Dan's grey suit was horribly mis-fitted and the pink shirt and tie didn't help (in London) He wore the same thing yesterday in New York and it wasn't improved by a new shirt and tie.  Dan's usually a much snappier dresser than this.

I don't often post, just usually have fun reading what all is discussed, but this time I just had to ask.

Thanks!

Trish in ABQ (who is hoping that her local Century theatre emails her today about a pre-screening after entering the trivia online question contest in the Alibi...)






From stephab67 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 11 17:12:25 2009
From: stephab67 at yahoo.com (stephab67)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:12:25 -0000
Subject: Premiere Fashions
In-Reply-To: <h38122+fmgv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3ah5p+hnbi@eGroups.com>

Steph wrote:
I really liked Emma's dress, I thought it looked great on her.  It's funny how she managed to stay mostly dry while Dan and Rupert got drenched. Emma's dress in New York was also great, totally different look, though - leather halter top with a cream skirt.  I saw a picture of the same dress on a model and it actually looked much better on Emma, probably because she isn't scrawny like the model.

As for Rupert, he was actually wearing a black suit with a dress shirt and tie!  I think that's a first for him at a premier.  In New York he a blue suit with a t-shirt underneath.  He looked terrific both days, though, except for the boots he wore in New York.  

I agree with you about Dan's suit in London, although I just didn't like the clasp on the jacket or the color of his shirt.  The suit itself was OK.  I didn't like the shiny gray suit he wore in New York.

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "treeshahmom280" <Pjmiller60 at ...> wrote:
>
> Want to ask what folks thought of the "red carpet" clothes the trio were wearing.  Emma, despite the rain in London looked really nice, I didn't really see what Rupert was wearing, but I want to know if anyone else agrees with me that Dan's grey suit was horribly mis-fitted and the pink shirt and tie didn't help (in London) He wore the same thing yesterday in New York and it wasn't improved by a new shirt and tie.  Dan's usually a much snappier dresser than this.
> 
> I don't often post, just usually have fun reading what all is discussed, but this time I just had to ask.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Trish in ABQ (who is hoping that her local Century theatre emails her today about a pre-screening after entering the trivia online question contest in the Alibi...)
>





From md at exit-reality.com  Sat Jul 11 17:50:45 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 13:50:45 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Premiere Fashions
In-Reply-To: <h3ah5p+hnbi@eGroups.com>
References: <h38122+fmgv@eGroups.com> <h3ah5p+hnbi@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000a01ca0250$1dcace30$59606a90$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of stephab67

I agree with you about Dan's suit in London, although I just didn't like the
clasp on the jacket or the color of his shirt. The suit itself was OK. I
didn't like the shiny gray suit he wore in New York.



???????????????????????????????????????/////////////////////////////////::::
::::::::::::::::::::::::{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

 

Well, at least he was dressed. When my daughter was looking for Harry Potter
photo's for her notebook montage, I accidently let her use my computer with
no safety on, well, some photos showed a little more than a ten-yr-old needs
to see.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From d2dmiles at yahoo.de  Sun Jul 12 17:37:29 2009
From: d2dmiles at yahoo.de (Miles)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 19:37:29 +0200
Subject: Nice preview of the new HBP film
Message-ID: <15B7176DFB8348B8BAA70599BED64E1F@miles>

Hello,

I think this was not mentioned before (if so, just forget about this mail):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ug78GFUP96Q

Many scenes I haven't seen yet, looks really promising.

Miles




From md at exit-reality.com  Sun Jul 12 18:18:56 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 14:18:56 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Nice preview of the new HBP film
In-Reply-To: <15B7176DFB8348B8BAA70599BED64E1F@miles>
References: <15B7176DFB8348B8BAA70599BED64E1F@miles>
Message-ID: <001201ca031d$38735d60$a95a1820$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Miles



Hello,

I think this was not mentioned before (if so, just forget about this mail):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ug78GFUP96Q

Many scenes I haven't seen yet, looks really promising.

Miles

:::::::::::::::::::::

There's a 14 minute one on Verizon on Demand, probably on Comcast and others
as well.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From wildirishrose at fiber.net  Mon Jul 13 01:58:36 2009
From: wildirishrose at fiber.net (wildirishrose01us)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 01:58:36 -0000
Subject: Premiere Fashions
In-Reply-To: <h38122+fmgv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3e4cc+lrm9@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "treeshahmom280" <Pjmiller60 at ...> wrote:
>
> Want to ask what folks thought of the "red carpet" clothes the trio were wearing.  Emma, despite the rain in London looked really nice, I didn't really see what Rupert was wearing, but I want to know if anyone else agrees with me that Dan's grey suit was horribly mis-fitted and the pink shirt and tie didn't help (in London) He wore the same thing yesterday in New York and it wasn't improved by a new shirt and tie.  Dan's usually a much snappier dresser than this.
> 
> I don't often post, just usually have fun reading what all is discussed, but this time I just had to ask.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Trish in ABQ (who is hoping that her local Century theatre emails her today about a pre-screening after entering the trivia online question contest in the Alibi...)



Marianne:

I posted on the other group HPFGU-OTChatter about the state of Daniel's suits and Emma's dress.

The suit in London was horrible looking and the one on Letterman wasn't much better.  Maybe it was the same suit.  Does Daniel have a wardrobe person to help dress him?  Or maybe his mother could give him a few tips.

The suits make him look so uncomfortable.  Stiff, like he'd break in half if he bent over.  Couldn't he get away with wearing some nice pants, a buttondown shirt, and a comfortable jacket.  It would make him look better.  Or maybe I'm not up-to-date on how one dresses at a London premier.

I didn't like Emma's dress.  It looked too low cut.  But I didn't get a good look at it.  Does anyone have a link to her picture?  Oh dear.  Now I sound like Auntie Muriel commenting about Ginny's too lowcut dress at the wedding.  

Marianne
The Fall Won't Kill You
The Landing Will




From siskiou at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 02:42:15 2009
From: siskiou at gmail.com (Susanne)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 19:42:15 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Premiere Fashions
In-Reply-To: <h3e4cc+lrm9@eGroups.com>
References: <h38122+fmgv@eGroups.com> <h3e4cc+lrm9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <1751215517.20090712194215@gmail.com>



Hi,

Sunday, July 12, 2009, 6:58:36 PM, wildirishrose at fiber.net wrote:


> The suits make him look so uncomfortable. 
> Stiff, like he'd break in half if he bent over. 

I definitely agree about Dan's suits. He *does*
look very stiff and uncomfortable in them.
And why do they have to be so..., shiny?
And a few sizes too small, or something.


-- 
 
Best regards,
 Susanne                           mailto:siskiou at gmail.com




From SnowyHome at aol.com  Mon Jul 13 18:33:05 2009
From: SnowyHome at aol.com (Cathy)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:33:05 -0000
Subject: Premiere Fashions
In-Reply-To: <h38122+fmgv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3ful1+ava8@eGroups.com>


Hi Everyone,

  I'm new here. I didn't get to see the UK premiere and I missed Emma on Letterman which I wanted to see. I enjoy her interviews more than the other cast members. Interesting that she will be going to college here in the States.  I did see Dan's interview. Did anyone notice how super fast he spoke. I'm wondering if he was nervous though I've never seen him quite this fast before. 

  Are members going to the see the movie Wednesday when it opens. I may wait until Friday but I imagine each day this week will be mobbed.

Cathy





From kelley_thompson at sbcglobal.net  Mon Jul 13 18:48:45 2009
From: kelley_thompson at sbcglobal.net (Kelley)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:48:45 -0000
Subject: Emma on Letterman (was Re: Premiere Fashions)
In-Reply-To: <h3ful1+ava8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3fvid+hge0@eGroups.com>

Cathy:
> I'm new here. I didn't get to see the UK premiere and I missed
> Emma on Letterman which I wanted to see. 


Hi, Cathy, welcome.  Just by the by, her spot on Letterman's
on youtube:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fH3uyvnqh7k

She is just delightful.  :-)

--Kelley




From bboyminn at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 13 18:52:52 2009
From: bboyminn at yahoo.com (Steve)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:52:52 -0000
Subject: Premiere Fashions
In-Reply-To: <h38122+fmgv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3fvq4+7pom@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "treeshahmom280" <Pjmiller60 at ...> wrote:
>
> Want to ask what folks thought of the "red carpet" clothes the trio were wearing. ...I want to know if anyone else agrees with me that Dan's grey suit was horribly mis-fitted ...  Dan's usually a much snappier dresser than this.
> 
> I don't often post, just usually have fun reading what all is discussed, but this time I just had to ask.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
>

bboyminn:

I'm wondering if Dan wasn't wearing 'vintage' suits? That is, used suit he bought from a second hand shop because he likes the old trendy styles. 

Notice that he rarely wears a straight forward suit. There is usually something odd about it like a trim on the collar, or some odd method of buttoning. 

I think he likes to dress 'eclectic', in non-standard non-traditional non-modern suits. And for someone with tastes like that, suits are few and far between. 

Though I'm sure he can afford to have suits custom made in any shape, style, or fit he wants, but he doesn't seem that extravagant with his money. So, I'm guessing 'vintage' suits.

Steve/bboyminn




From brian at rescueddoggies.com  Mon Jul 13 23:04:03 2009
From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 20:04:03 -0300
Subject: HBP -NINE days to go for fans
Message-ID: <4A5BBD63.3040301@rescueddoggies.com>

HBP -NINE days to go for Gryffindor fans

Fans with enough courage to stand up to WB and not lie down while they 
kick us and lie to us -it's only NINE days to go.
Miss the crowds!  Miss giving WB their opening week headlines. 
Show them we matter.
JULY 22nd - ONCE ONLY - NO TO OTHER WB FILMS

So what if we don't make a real difference.  At least some of us have 
some self-respect

BRIAN  (brigrove on fanfiction.net)




From Pjmiller60 at aol.com  Tue Jul 14 21:04:55 2009
From: Pjmiller60 at aol.com (treeshahmom280)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 21:04:55 -0000
Subject: I got to see the prescreening last night
Message-ID: <h3irtn+fp2r@eGroups.com>

And there is nothing to be nervous about.  Yes, "The Other Minister" is missing (just Londoners being terrorized by the Death Eaters as smoke around London), the funeral for DD is missing (We still have Fawlkes flying around the castle at the end) Harry wasn't cursed on the astronomy tower(he is merely "safe" underneath and watching from below) but we do have all the suspense, action, "romance" and visual movie we expect. One of my favorite scenes is Harry and Hermione together (Hermione is casting her little birds spell...)very well done.  

Enough before I spoil it all for the rest of you.  My 9 year old and I had seats in the 2nd row (not our choice, but at least we were there...)and both loved it!  DO NOT BOYCOTT Warner Brothers, go see it and enjoy it.

Trish in ABQ (who has to thank the Weekly Alibi for giving her the screen passes and the very attractive paper wrist band in order to get in the theatre!)




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 14 21:10:02 2009
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 14:10:02 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] I got to see the prescreening last night
Message-ID: <329424.85656.qm@web63404.mail.re1.yahoo.com>


Trish:

> And there is nothing to be nervous
> about.? Yes, "The Other Minister" is missing (just
> Londoners being terrorized by the Death Eaters as smoke
> around London), the funeral for DD is missing (We still have
> Fawlkes flying around the castle at the end) Harry wasn't
> cursed on the astronomy tower(he is merely "safe" underneath
> and watching from below) but we do have all the suspense,
> action, "romance" and visual movie we expect. One of my
> favorite scenes is Harry and Hermione together (Hermione is
> casting her little birds spell...)very well done.? 
> 
> Enough before I spoil it all for the rest of you.? My
> 9 year old and I had seats in the 2nd row (not our choice,
> but at least we were there...)and both loved it!? DO
> NOT BOYCOTT Warner Brothers, go see it and enjoy it.
> 
> Trish in ABQ (who has to thank the Weekly Alibi for giving
> her the screen passes and the very attractive paper wrist
> band in order to get in the theatre!)
> 
Sheryll:

I saw it last night as well. 

I wasn't fond of the change to the Astronomy tower scene, though most of the omissions/changes worked for me.

The costumers should be fired for keeping Dumbledore in that tacky bathrobe and for now giving poor Minerva the horrid black outfit with pointy shoulders. Ugh.

Still, there were some very nice surprises. I've never been fond of Michael Gambon as Dumbledore, as I didn't think he showed the whimsical side. However, he does bring a touch of humour to this movie and, IMO, does it well.

Sheryll


      __________________________________________________________________
Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people. Go to Yahoo! Answers and share what you know at http://ca.answers.yahoo.com



From bboyminn at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 14 21:27:50 2009
From: bboyminn at yahoo.com (Steve)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 21:27:50 -0000
Subject: Premier Fashions - Dan's Suits
Message-ID: <h3it8m+ktd8@eGroups.com>

For a nice look at the range of suits Dan wears, check out this
link.

http://www.contactmusic.com/photos.nsf/main/daniel_radcliffe_5322068

The first picture is a pretty straight forward black suit, and
seems pretty nice, though his shoes are a bit odd.

Picture three is of the silver gray suit with the black trim
on the collar and in these photos, it looks pretty nice.

In the fifth photo we have a good shot of Dan at the London
premier. A light cocoa brown suit with a single clasp like
button on the front. In this photo, again, the suit looks
pretty good.

Since fashion in general and specifically Dan's suits had been
discussed, I thought I would add this link to give everyone a
clear picture of the suits in question.

Just passing it along.

Steve/bboyminn




From graynavarre at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 14 22:47:32 2009
From: graynavarre at yahoo.com (Barbara Key)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 15:47:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Premier Fashions - Dan's Suits
In-Reply-To: <h3it8m+ktd8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <745099.40294.qm@web30106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

All I could think of when viewing those first two pictures, was, please, someone feed that poor boy. He looks very underweight.
?
Barbara

--- On Tue, 7/14/09, Steve <bboyminn at yahoo.com> wrote:


From: Steve <bboyminn at yahoo.com>
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Premier Fashions - Dan's Suits
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 5:27 PM








For a nice look at the range of suits Dan wears, check out this
link.

http://www.contactm usic.com/ photos.nsf/ main/daniel_ radcliffe_ 5322068

The first picture is a pretty straight forward black suit, and
seems pretty nice, though his shoes are a bit odd.

Picture three is of the silver gray suit with the black trim
on the collar and in these photos, it looks pretty nice.

In the fifth photo we have a good shot of Dan at the London
premier. A light cocoa brown suit with a single clasp like
button on the front. In this photo, again, the suit looks
pretty good.

Since fashion in general and specifically Dan's suits had been
discussed, I thought I would add this link to give everyone a
clear picture of the suits in question.

Just passing it along.

Steve/bboyminn
















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From Englishlady at gmail.com  Wed Jul 15 10:08:14 2009
From: Englishlady at gmail.com (Aryn Culbertson)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 03:08:14 -0700
Subject: Opinions of HPHBP (Possible Spoilers)
Message-ID: <dc3be0ab0907150308x46deec9fu163cf79ded0d2b34@mail.gmail.com>

Hallo,

   Spoiler Alert (Possible)















   Just returned from the "Midnight" showing of the film. (WestCoast,
Pacific NorthWest area). The film was absolutely wonderful. Acting wonderful
as usual.
Only one issue mainly. The NOT have the Funeral in the film was NOT helpful
to the film at all, seemed to be the main complaint within the attending
audience. The film just did NOT end correctly. And the films are becoming
way to Americanised by filming the students of Hogwarts while at school in
non-school uniforms too much. It just would not occur that much at an
English school. Other than that, the film was done well indeed considering
the time constraints.

Cheeres!!!


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From macboysmom at comcast.net  Wed Jul 15 16:06:41 2009
From: macboysmom at comcast.net (Leeann McCullough)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 16:06:41 -0000
Subject: Opinions of HPHBP (Possible Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <dc3be0ab0907150308x46deec9fu163cf79ded0d2b34@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <h3kuqh+ij1p@eGroups.com>

Spoiler Space:













I too saw the midnight show, as I'm sure many, many others did. I gave it an "O" for outstanding. All the midnight shows in my area sold out and one theater added a 3am show. Not sure about the status of that one. I guess the boycot didn't work.

Anyway, the only thing that is bothering me is what happened at the Burrow at Christmas. My son (16) and I have been trying to figure out what the purpose of that scene was. Any thoughts?

Leeann




>Snip:
> Only one issue mainly. The NOT have the Funeral in the film was NOT helpful
> to the film at all, seemed to be the main complaint within the attending
> audience. The film just did NOT end correctly. And the films are becoming
> way to Americanised by filming the students of Hogwarts while at school in
> non-school uniforms too much. It just would not occur that much at an
> English school. Other than that, the film was done well indeed considering
> the time constraints.
> 
> Cheeres!!!
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>





From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Wed Jul 15 16:30:38 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 16:30:38 -0000
Subject: JK Rowling a year in the life
Message-ID: <h3l07e+mkqc@eGroups.com>

People in the USA may be interested that on Thursday July 16 at 8pm ABC will air a documentary called "JK Rowling a year in the life".

 Eggplant





From bboyminn at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 15 20:55:16 2009
From: bboyminn at yahoo.com (Steve)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 20:55:16 -0000
Subject: Harry Potter - GROSS
Message-ID: <h3lfnk+mukl@eGroups.com>

Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince is gross, grosser than
any previous movie.

It is so gross that it took in ??22 million at the first night
Wednesday midnight showing, beating 'The Dark Knight's Wednesday
gross of US$18 million. Of course, that is just USA gross intake.

Look like another blockbuster.

Steve/bluewizard 




From macboysmom at comcast.net  Wed Jul 15 21:08:15 2009
From: macboysmom at comcast.net (Leeann McCullough)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 17:08:15 -0400
Subject: I got to see the prescreening last night
Message-ID: <220A49665109458883FA13BEA830F2C8@DENCOMPUTER>

Trish:
And there is nothing to be nervous about. Yes, "The Other Minister" is missing (just Londoners being terrorized by the Death Eaters as smoke around London), the funeral for DD is missing (We still have Fawlkes flying around the castle at the end) Harry wasn't cursed on the astronomy tower(he is merely "safe" underneath and watching from below) but we do have all the suspense, action, "romance" and visual movie we expect. One of my favorite scenes is Harry and Hermione together (Hermione is casting her little birds spell...)very well done. 

Enough before I spoil it all for the rest of you. My 9 year old and I had seats in the 2nd row (not our choice, but at least we were there...)and both loved it! DO NOT BOYCOTT Warner Brothers, go see it and enjoy it.

Trish in ABQ (who has to thank the Weekly Alibi for giving her the screen passes and the very attractive paper wrist band in order to get in the theatre!)



Leeann Now:

I also saw the show at midnight with my 3 son's and 2 of their friends. I am in a large metro area with many theaters and all that I checked last night were sold out. I'm happy about that...don't boycott please. 

I enjoyed the movie, but have one question:

What was the scene at the burrow at Christmas about (Bellatrix and Fenrir)? I didn't really understand why they would have put that in. All I can figure is that it showed how readily Harry chased them and how Ginny showed no hesitation in following Harry.

I look forward to hearing everyone's opinion on the movie on the whole and that scene in particular.

Leeann



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From Pjmiller60 at aol.com  Wed Jul 15 22:43:20 2009
From: Pjmiller60 at aol.com (treeshahmom280)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 22:43:20 -0000
Subject: I got to see the prescreening last night
In-Reply-To: <220A49665109458883FA13BEA830F2C8@DENCOMPUTER>
Message-ID: <h3lm28+dgt0@eGroups.com>

Leeann and all,

I was wondering about that scene too.  Obviously the book tells nothing of the Burrow being burned up, so I didn't understand it either.  Was it to make us seriously afraid of Fenrir, or to introduce him into the plot so that when he bites Bill in DH that non-book readers figure out who he is?  My 9 year old son was whispering to me and asking who it was (he's just started reading COS) and I quickly explained that Fenrir was the werewolf who bit Lupin (or am I wrong on that score?) 

The other scene I was wondering about was when Harry and DD are on the island and the infieri are attacking Harry.  Book does not have Harry being pulled into the water and struggling underwater.  They just fight on the land before DD conjures the fire.  Also, the apparating in and out of Hogwarts astronomy tower (when we all know that they apparate back to Madam Rosemerta's and fly back to Hogwarts on broomstick) was a little odd (though covered well with DD's comment about getting to do what you want when you are headmaster....)

Seeing Slughorn as a poofy armchair was actually pretty funny.  But refresh my memory, as I am at work without a copy of HBP at hand, but did Neville really serve drinks at the Christmas party since he "couldn't get into the Slug Club?" Neville was a little underused in this film I think.  Luna's voice sounded less airy and light like in OoTP too.  Am I being nit picky? And Mr. Weasley just looked old and worn out at Christmas prior to the attack on the Burrow (slouchy in his chair while Harry, Ron And Ginny are sitting with all the sweets...)Yeah, I am being nit picky.  I just need to stop and go see it again, this time not in the second row!

Interested in hearing everyone's opinion.

Trish in ABQ (whose 9 year son is still wearing the paper wristband we got at the pre-screening.  It's become a bit of a status symbol for him at his summer day camp program!!) 









From brian at rescueddoggies.com  Wed Jul 15 22:51:08 2009
From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 19:51:08 -0300
Subject: Opinions of HPHBP (Possible Spoilers)
Message-ID: <4A5E5D5C.5000500@rescueddoggies.com>

If the boycott didn't work then next time a big film producer kicks us 
in the teeth, I don't want to hear ONE complaint from anyone who didn't 
stand up for us fans this time.

Brian  (a fan with a few principles left)



From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 16 01:37:01 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 21:37:01 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS
In-Reply-To: <h3lfnk+mukl@eGroups.com>
References: <h3lfnk+mukl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <005801ca05b5$eaf5b0b0$c0e11210$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Steve
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 4:55 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS

 

  

Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince is gross, grosser than
any previous movie.
::::::::::::::::::::::

So goes the new trend of announcing release dates and advertising them, then
suddenly pulling films at the last minute and making audience wait 6 - 8
months and thereby exaggerating the anticipation.

Major logic flaws in the screenplay, btw, Harry under the floor, conscious
and mobile as DB dies and burning the Burrow in the middle of the film makes
no sense at all.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 02:40:34 2009
From: dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com (dumbledore11214)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 02:40:34 -0000
Subject: HBP SPOILERS
Message-ID: <h3m3v2+kmci@eGroups.com>

SPOILERS
SPOILERS
SPOILERS
SPOILERS
SPOILERS
SPOILERS

So we went to see it today in IMAX. I liked it a lot, changes and all, although there were some things I did not enjoy much as well, but definitely thumbs up for the movie in general from me.

So things I liked :

Loved, loved loved Trio's acting. I enjoyed Dan's acting since GoF and I feel he only gets better, IMO of course. I think he did humor extremely well, and I felt his chemistry with Ron and Hermione was terrific. Definitely to me it is one of the most touching friendship in literature and films.

I absolutely LOVED how the romance was done. And while I do not feel that movie in general was better than the book (none of them come even close as far as I am concerned, but I like them anyway), I think romance is one thing that JKR can take notes from the filmmakers how to develop. Harry and Ginny - beatiful, NOT in your face chess monster, UGH and with enough subtle touches IMO and same thing with Ron and Hermione.

I really really enjoyed Tom Felton's acting.  Besides not caring for Draco as a character, I did not care for actor as well, I felt that the only thing he could do was scowl and I was like whatever, just go away.

The guy did something that **book** could not do, he actually made me feel somewhat sorry for Draco. He definitely gets applauds from me, I actually felt that he was feeling despair on the tower.

I loved chemistry between Dan and Michael Gambon, I actually never had a problem with his as Dumbledore and in fact while I of course never wished for Richard Harris to die, I felt that PoA was a perfect place to switch Dumbledores, to my taste Harris would have been way too magestic while Harry starts to see Dumbledore as human being and fallible one at that since PoA.

I actually really loved Narcissa's acting, one scene and she portrayed mother's despair perfectly to me.

What I sort of did not like.

Well, it all relates to changes of course. While filmmakers made me love the product overall, as far as I am concerned it strays further and further away from the books.

I mean, eh, not that I would have cared for Snape's long recitation in Spinner's End and of course they did not have much time, but um, how about some of it, few sentences, maybe?

Say, instead of this idiotic attack on the Burrow, which was added why exactly? Oh I know! To stress that Tonks as auror, well that she cannot act like one?

I also dislike in general how they effectively cutting out ANY ties Harry has with the past. Marauders? Oh who cares. Snape telling the Prophecy? Oh dear, does it matter at all?

Actually was ridiculously pleased about one change - that Snape does not get to walk Harry into Great Hall.

I mean, I think I can tolerate it because JKR puts youngsters on the front seat, but really, give this amazing adult actors something more to do? A little more?

Was scratching my head about Harry standing there and not trying to attack DE when he is not immobilized.

Absense of the funeral actually did not bother me as much as I thought it would be.

Alla






From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 03:21:42 2009
From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 20:21:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HBP SPOILERS
Message-ID: <523449.24513.qm@web59810.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>

all in all I liked it I am glad we got to see more snape.?
I think Draco's character was a bit stiff. But everyone else was believeable enough. I wouldn't mind seeing it again and I am sure I will.
Love,Red

--- On Wed, 7/15/09, dumbledore11214 <dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com> wrote:

From: dumbledore11214 <dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com>
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HBP SPOILERS
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2009, 7:40 PM

SPOILERS
SPOILERS
SPOILERS
SPOILERS
SPOILERS
SPOILERS

So we went to see it today in IMAX. I liked it a lot, changes and all, although there were some things I did not enjoy much as well, but definitely thumbs up for the movie in general from me.

So things I liked :

Loved, loved loved Trio's acting. I enjoyed Dan's acting since GoF and I feel he only gets better, IMO of course. I think he did humor extremely well, and I felt his chemistry with Ron and Hermione was terrific. Definitely to me it is one of the most touching friendship in literature and films.

I absolutely LOVED how the romance was done. And while I do not feel that movie in general was better than the book (none of them come even close as far as I am concerned, but I like them anyway), I think romance is one thing that JKR can take notes from the filmmakers how to develop. Harry and Ginny - beatiful, NOT in your face chess monster, UGH and with enough subtle touches IMO and same thing with Ron and Hermione.

I really really enjoyed Tom Felton's acting.? Besides not caring for Draco as a character, I did not care for actor as well, I felt that the only thing he could do was scowl and I was like whatever, just go away.

The guy did something that **book** could not do, he actually made me feel somewhat sorry for Draco. He definitely gets applauds from me, I actually felt that he was feeling despair on the tower.

I loved chemistry between Dan and Michael Gambon, I actually never had a problem with his as Dumbledore and in fact while I of course never wished for Richard Harris to die, I felt that PoA was a perfect place to switch Dumbledores, to my taste Harris would have been way too magestic while Harry starts to see Dumbledore as human being and fallible one at that since PoA.

I actually really loved Narcissa's acting, one scene and she portrayed mother's despair perfectly to me.

What I sort of did not like.

Well, it all relates to changes of course. While filmmakers made me love the product overall, as far as I am concerned it strays further and further away from the books.

I mean, eh, not that I would have cared for Snape's long recitation in Spinner's End and of course they did not have much time, but um, how about some of it, few sentences, maybe?

Say, instead of this idiotic attack on the Burrow, which was added why exactly? Oh I know! To stress that Tonks as auror, well that she cannot act like one?

I also dislike in general how they effectively cutting out ANY ties Harry has with the past. Marauders? Oh who cares. Snape telling the Prophecy? Oh dear, does it matter at all?

Actually was ridiculously pleased about one change - that Snape does not get to walk Harry into Great Hall.

I mean, I think I can tolerate it because JKR puts youngsters on the front seat, but really, give this amazing adult actors something more to do? A little more?

Was scratching my head about Harry standing there and not trying to attack DE when he is not immobilized.

Absense of the funeral actually did not bother me as much as I thought it would be.

Alla





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From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 03:25:23 2009
From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 20:25:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS
Message-ID: <438798.80847.qm@web59809.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>

?Who ever said that filming was logical?
I thought for the amount of time give that they had and I am sure they had to switch a few things it was good. Don't frown upon it till you give it a chance.?

Love,Red

--- On Wed, 7/15/09, Child Of Midian <md at exit-reality.com> wrote:

From: Child Of Midian <md at exit-reality.com>
Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2009, 6:37 PM

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Steve
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 4:55 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS

 

? 

Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince is gross, grosser than
any previous movie.
::::::::::::::::::::::

So goes the new trend of announcing release dates and advertising them, then
suddenly pulling films at the last minute and making audience wait 6 - 8
months and thereby exaggerating the anticipation.

Major logic flaws in the screenplay, btw, Harry under the floor, conscious
and mobile as DB dies and burning the Burrow in the middle of the film makes
no sense at all.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 03:31:56 2009
From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 20:31:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS
Message-ID: <483799.55318.qm@web59811.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>

I liked it and I'll probable go and see it several times.?

Love,Red

--- On Wed, 7/15/09, Steve <bboyminn at yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Steve <bboyminn at yahoo.com>
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2009, 1:55 PM

Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince is gross, grosser than
any previous movie.

It is so gross that it took in ??22 million at the first night
Wednesday midnight showing, beating 'The Dark Knight's Wednesday
gross of US$18 million. Of course, that is just USA gross intake.

Look like another blockbuster.

Steve/bluewizard 



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From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 16 03:52:30 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 23:52:30 -0400
Subject: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW
In-Reply-To: <438798.80847.qm@web59809.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
References: <438798.80847.qm@web59809.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001301ca05c8$d7da81a0$878f84e0$@com>

            The title of HBP has hard time remaining relevant in the film
adaptation. Seems almost like an afterthought, in fact, if it wasn't based
on a book people would likely be scratching their  heads as to why the
entire "half blood prince" plot exist and it seems like there so much more
important things to be dealt with.

            As with the past two HP films, HBP suffers from massive
information cramming and short, quickly cut scenes that propel the film
forward while dizzying the viewer. This gave The Order of the Phoenix a
roller-coaster feel, it doesn't work quite as well with the less
action-filled story line of HBP. 

            From the beginning the viewer suddenly gets the impression he
Ginny is an important character where she was just background before. It
seems weird, having a fourth wheel and not nearly as naturally integrated as
in the book where Harry and Ginny are mostly separate from Harry, Ron and
Hermione. On the positive side, you get the genuine sense that these two are
in love, on the negative you have absolutely no idea why.

            The Hermione jealousy towards Ron and Pansy is also abrupt and
unlike Harry and Ginny, there's no scenes showing that they have an
attraction. 

            The focus of the plot is not the Half Blood Prince, but Harry
getting a memory from the returning Professor Slughorn, resolving a missing
piece of the puzzle as to how Voldemort has survived death. Slughorn taught
Tom Riddle and Riddle asked him about something called a Horcrux, but what
information Riddle got Slughorn gave is unknown to Dumbledore. Turns out
Horcruxes are the key to Voldemort being immortal, and that he likely
attempted to create seven, including the diary Harry already destroyed and a
ring whose destruction as caused severe damage to Dumbledore's hand.

            The story progresses with Ron taking over as quiditch keeper,
and professing his feelings for Hermione without realizing it. Draco Malfoy
is working on a cabinet in the room of requirement that will allow death
eaters to enter the castle, while he fails miserably at assassinating
Dumbledore. 

            Once again, there's pointless changes, like Luna not Tonks
finding Harry on the train under the cloak, petrified by Malfoy. This fails
because it shows the Order is not watching him like in the book, all the
adults are gone and Harry is truly alone. The scene explaining why Harry
knows a beazor will save Ron for poisoning is gone, yet Harry does it as
Slughorn sits down and watches the student slowly die on his floor rather
than try to help or get help. Also there is no rational for Harry simply
watching Dumbledore die. He KNOWS Snape made an unbreakable vow to help
Malfoy, yet when Snape tells him to stay put and do nothing he listens and
watches then feels guilty (as he could not in the book as Dumbledore
petrified him, both to protect him and to likely make sure he wouldn't feel
as if he could have done something. Then NO ONE challenges the death eaters
as they leave the castle. Some idiot decided that the battle at Hogwarts at
the end of the planed 5hr Deathly Hallows to be seen in a year and a half
means they can't fight four death eaters at the end of HBP. Instead they
attach the burrow half-way through, but Bill isn't there and doesn't get bit
leaving no way of gracefully having that part in DH. 

            The Funeral scene, apparently filmed but cut (Radcliff made a
specific reference to the scene and all the past characters being in it.)
really leaves a void of closure at the end of the film. 

            That's not to say the movie is terrible for all its flaws and
there are flaws that will leave both the film follower and the book-reader
scratching their heads, it packs a heavy emotional punch. During the attack
on the Weasley's Harry darts out through a circle of fire to get to
Bellatrix (remember this is weeks after Sirius's death) and Ginny literally
runs through the fire to go after him. Hermione does send the birds after
Ron, which was apparently not in the early screening, and the moments
between the Harry and Hermione as they watch Ron and Ginny pair up with
other people. 

            All in all it's an entertaining film with deep emotional
resonance, excellent effects, lots of Humor and excellent acting, but it's
like 20 pounds of story in a 10 pound bag. A better approach truly might
have been to trim these films to a simpler, less hurried, busy story and
film the extra for extended Blu-Ray release later. What we get instead is an
attempt to crowbar as much in as humanly possible and with an 8 month delay
one would have hoped the parts that don't work would have been realized by
someone and fixed. Either way this is what fans get, a deeper, genuine film
that falls short on logic in some places and feels like a highlight real.

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 16 04:13:57 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 00:13:57 -0400
Subject: HPB Confession
In-Reply-To: <001301ca05c8$d7da81a0$878f84e0$@com>
References: <438798.80847.qm@web59809.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <001301ca05c8$d7da81a0$878f84e0$@com>
Message-ID: <000601ca05cb$d6fceb80$84f6c280$@com>

My plans to boycott opening week of HBP backfired due to scheduling. I just
found out Friday that my in-laws were going way for nearly two weeks so they
wouldn't be there to watch the children so my wife and I could go, for the
second week (our initial plan was to go second week and take the kids the
third week.) Then, at the last minute my mother said she would be taking the
children on Wednesday leaving it the only day for three weeks we would have
someone to watch the kids, so we went to a 2:40 matinee on opening day. 

 

The theater had it on 4 - 6 screens (DLP, so no film, as many screens as
they want) so the theater was only about 2/3 full, we had excellent seats,
giant screen, lots of elbow room. 

 

Next week we take the kids.

 

md___



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 04:17:16 2009
From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 21:17:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HPB Confession
Message-ID: <248018.5303.qm@web59814.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>

at least you didn't have a moaning kid in the backseat that you had to tell to be quiet every now and again - he started getting louder toward the end of the movie.
What does everyone think of ?the raiting? Should have it ?been maybe PG-13? I thought it should have.
Love,Red
(I should have gone to the 12:30 showing.) Or waited till later in the month.?

--- On Wed, 7/15/09, Child Of Midian <md at exit-reality.com> wrote:

From: Child Of Midian <md at exit-reality.com>
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HPB Confession
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2009, 9:13 PM

My plans to boycott opening week of HBP backfired due to scheduling. I just
found out Friday that my in-laws were going way for nearly two weeks so they
wouldn't be there to watch the children so my wife and I could go, for the
second week (our initial plan was to go second week and take the kids the
third week.) Then, at the last minute my mother said she would be taking the
children on Wednesday leaving it the only day for three weeks we would have
someone to watch the kids, so we went to a 2:40 matinee on opening day. 

 

The theater had it on 4 - 6 screens (DLP, so no film, as many screens as
they want) so the theater was only about 2/3 full, we had excellent seats,
giant screen, lots of elbow room. 

 

Next week we take the kids.

 

md___



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 16 04:31:22 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 00:31:22 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HPB Confession
In-Reply-To: <248018.5303.qm@web59814.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
References: <248018.5303.qm@web59814.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001101ca05ce$45f8de20$d1ea9a60$@com>

Even the four teenagers next to me were pretty well behaved. 

 

I thought the book was PG-13 but the Inferi were tame, all intact and not
human or corpse-like, nor explained (another screw-up!) Malfoy's wounds were
hidden under his shirt and there was no sex, no real violence, and no
swearing. What was there to make it PG-13 but intensity? 

 

md

 

who wishes they'd have made a pg-13 film to match the book.

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Lady of Imladris



had to tell to be quiet every now and again - he started getting louder
toward the end of the movie.
What does everyone think of  the raiting? Should have it  been maybe PG-13?
I thought it should have.
Love,Red
(I should have gone to the 12:30 showing.) Or waited till later in the
month. 





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 04:35:56 2009
From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 21:35:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HPB Confession
Message-ID: <479848.87789.qm@web59801.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>



--- On Wed, 7/15/09, Child Of Midian <md at exit-reality.com> wrote:

From: Child Of Midian <md at exit-reality.com>
Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] HPB Confession
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2009, 9:31 PM

Even the four teenagers next to me were pretty well behaved. 

 

I thought the book was PG-13 but the Inferi were tame, all intact and not
human or corpse-like, nor explained (another screw-up!) Malfoy's wounds were
hidden under his shirt and there was no sex, no real violence, and no
swearing. What was there to make it PG-13 but intensity? 

 

md

 

(I guess I've always been a stickler for ratings. I'm kind of old fashioned.).I also think parents should keep their kids quiet and if they can't take themout of the theater. There are other people trying to enjoy the movie.?
Love,Red






      

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 16 05:51:47 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 01:51:47 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HPB Confession
In-Reply-To: <479848.87789.qm@web59801.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
References: <479848.87789.qm@web59801.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <002901ca05d9$81c84bb0$8558e310$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Lady of Imladris




(I guess I've always been a stickler for ratings. I'm kind of old
fashioned.).I also think parents should keep their kids quiet and if they
can't take themout of the theater. There are other people trying to enjoy
the movie. 
Love,Red

 


::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

I'm not really sure what you mean. First, it's a PG film for children,
adults should got at night when people aren't bringing kids if they don't
want to risk some noise. When I went to the 25th anniversary of The Exorcist
and they let a woman with 5 kids under 10 in the theater then I think they
should not have been there at all, the theater should not have let them in
and the parents should have known better. However, there were several rowdy
kids at the matinee of Star Wars I, and they were just enjoying the film as
kids, at a kid time. If I'd have gone to a night show, it would have been
different.

As for a "stickler for ratings" I don't know what you mean. The ratings
board goes by rules of how much violence, how excessive and explicit - well
there was nearly none, sex, none, adult language, none, nudity, none. So
what is the MPAA to do, say "hey, it's a bit scary in a gore-free way." It
was rated, Parental Guidance, and that is all that kids should need.

md



 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From bboyminn at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 06:43:49 2009
From: bboyminn at yahoo.com (Steve)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 06:43:49 -0000
Subject: John Hurts as Ollivander?
Message-ID: <h3mi75+ckui@eGroups.com>

This is probably old news to most, but I was wondering if
John Hurt is going to reprise his role as Ollivander in the
last two movies?

Steve/bluewizard




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 16 07:20:32 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 03:20:32 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] John Hurts as Ollivander?
In-Reply-To: <h3mi75+ckui@eGroups.com>
References: <h3mi75+ckui@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <003a01ca05e5$e7a80b80$b6f82280$@com>

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000457/

 

Yes.

 

md

 

::::::::::::::::::::::::;

  

This is probably old news to most, but I was wondering if
John Hurt is going to reprise his role as Ollivander in the
last two movies?

Steve/bluewizard



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 12:31:13 2009
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 05:31:13 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Children in theatres
Message-ID: <814850.77711.qm@web63404.mail.re1.yahoo.com>


Red:
> (I guess I've always been a stickler for ratings. I'm kind
> of old
> fashioned.).I also think parents should keep their kids
> quiet and if they
> can't take themout of the theater. There are other people
> trying to enjoy
> the movie. 
> 
> 
md: 
> I'm not really sure what you mean. First, it's a PG film
> for children,
> adults should got at night when people aren't bringing kids
> if they don't
> want to risk some noise. When I went to the 25th
> anniversary of The Exorcist
> and they let a woman with 5 kids under 10 in the theater
> then I think they
> should not have been there at all, the theater should not
> have let them in
> and the parents should have known better. However, there
> were several rowdy
> kids at the matinee of Star Wars I, and they were just
> enjoying the film as
> kids, at a kid time. If I'd have gone to a night show, it
> would have been
> different.
> 
Sheryll:

Most theatres in large cities, at least here in Canada, have special screening of films for parents with very young children. They're generally held on a slow weekday afternoon. That said, if a child isn't old enough to sit quietly through a film, it's unfair to other moviegoers to bring that child to a screening held later in the day that will be primarily attended by adults, many of whom are paying babysitters so they can enjoy a movie without kids.

I used to work in a movie theatre. I remember a lady bringing a 5 year old in to see the movie The Ring for a late evening screening. Because the rating here was 18A (under 18 must be accompanied by an adult) the only thing I could do was caution her that the film was inappropriate for a child that age. Her response? "Oh, he'll sleep through the movie."!

There was a small child at our screening of HBP last night but the parents removed the child from the room every time it started to fuss, for which I was very grateful. Much more considerate than the woman in front of us who didn't turn off her cell phone!

Sheryll


      __________________________________________________________________
Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new Internet Explorer? 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free! at http://downloads.yahoo.com/ca/internetexplorer/



From bonsaikathy at gmail.com  Thu Jul 16 14:37:55 2009
From: bonsaikathy at gmail.com (ac4lb)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 14:37:55 -0000
Subject: Harry Potter - GROSS
In-Reply-To: <005801ca05b5$eaf5b0b0$c0e11210$@com>
Message-ID: <h3ne03+org5@eGroups.com>

 Major logic flaws in the screenplay, btw, Harry under the floor, conscious
> and mobile as DB dies and burning the Burrow in the middle of the film makes
> no sense at all.
> 
>  
> 
> md
> 

I'll completely agree. There was little logic to the changes and add ons and stuff they left out. The movie for me really only basically had anything to do with the story. Although I thought there was some very humorous moments, I was quite disappointed in the Harry/Ginny and Ron/Hermoine storyline and the feeling of the whole movie being really disjointed. Harry would not have stood under the floor watching and done nothing with all that was going on. The burrow scene at Christmas made 0 sense. Sorry for me this is my least favorite HP movie. I was really pretty disappointed. 

Kathy




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 16 16:16:30 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 12:16:30 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Children in theatres
In-Reply-To: <814850.77711.qm@web63404.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
References: <814850.77711.qm@web63404.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <004f01ca0630$c75454b0$55fcfe10$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Sheryll Townsend





There was a small child at our screening of HBP last night but the parents
removed the child from the room every time it started to fuss, for which I
was very grateful. Much more considerate than the woman in front of us who
didn't turn off her cell phone!

Sheryll

__________________________________________________________



Which is my point, it's up to the adult to control the child. However, that
said, there is no place for children in an R or 18A film and in the US
owners have the right to refuse admittance. Many theaters will not allow
children of any age into evening shows of R rated films. That said, the
first film I took my oldest daughter too was The Tiger Movie, and my oldest
sits quietly for almost anything. OTOH, my younger daughter could sit for
ten minutes for Hanna Montana (which is her favorite thing in the world
aside from shoes and purses) while the ten year old sat quiet with me in the
next theater and watched Star Trek. Either way, I expect the child to be
controlled by the parent, period. I also expect little kids in a film like
Harry Potter or Narnia, and to get excited and possibly make some noise.
They're kids after all. Of course, that said, WTF is wrong with people
bringing kids to see The Ring or The Exorcist? 

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From iluvoz2 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 12:41:53 2009
From: iluvoz2 at yahoo.com (*BARB*)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 12:41:53 -0000
Subject: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW
In-Reply-To: <001301ca05c8$d7da81a0$878f84e0$@com>
Message-ID: <h3n76h+a0so@eGroups.com>

md wrote:
> <snip>
> All in all it's an entertaining film with deep emotional
> resonance, excellent effects, lots of Humor and excellent
> acting, but it's like 20 pounds of story in a 10 pound
> bag. A better approach truly might have been to trim these
> films to a simpler, less hurried, busy story and film the
> extra for extended Blu-Ray release later. What we get
> instead is an attempt to crowbar as much in as humanly
> possible and with an 8 month delay one would have hoped
> the parts that don't work would have been realized by
> someone and fixed. Either way this is what fans get, a
> deeper, genuine film that falls short on logic in some
> places and feels like a highlight real.


BArb:
My thoughts too....I think they spent too much time with
all the romance and left out important things in the book.
It felt uneven and if I had not read the books I would have
been lost most of the time.

They also left out them trying to find out who the half
blood prince was and its importance for the end.
 (in the book Snape wants the book from Harry and he goes
into the room of requirement to get it and then don't they
fight with Malfoy and one of his buddies dies and Harry
saves Malfoy?? it catches on fire right??)

I really missed not having the funeral, battle in the castle
and DD using the spell on Harry, your right he would have
fought them to the end to save DD.

Yea I thought Tonks found Harry in the book, why the change?

Anyway it doesn't change my love for the movie, I will love
them no matter how they transfer them from book to movie but
I do hope the last one follows the book better, wonder if JK
Rowling has to approve the script??

BArb



From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 19:26:47 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 19:26:47 -0000
Subject: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW
In-Reply-To: <h3n76h+a0so@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3nutn+i366@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "*BARB*" <iluvoz2 at ...> wrote:


> They also left out them trying to find out who the half
> blood prince was and its importance for the end.
> (in the book Snape wants the book from Harry and he goes
> into the room of requirement to get it and then don't they
> fight with Malfoy and one of his buddies dies and Harry
> saves Malfoy?? it catches on fire right??)


zanooda:

In HBP Harry goes into the room of requirement not to get the book, but to hide it from Snape. In DH Harry goes into the room to find the diadem, not the book :-). He then saves Draco and the room burns :-). I didn't go to watch the movie, but is it true that Harry didn't see any diadem in the room of requirement? If true, I wonder how he will find it in DH...





From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 16 19:53:23 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 15:53:23 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW
In-Reply-To: <h3nutn+i366@eGroups.com>
References: <h3n76h+a0so@eGroups.com> <h3nutn+i366@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <008401ca064f$1455a2a0$3d00e7e0$@com>

They left several things from the books that really should be needed for DH,
all I can think of is that they decided on work-arounds early meaning they
just said, hey, let's just change it for no real reason. Mostly think, I
believe, that the movie audience is too dumb and slow to recall one movie
from the other. Most likely they'll just make it stupid, Harry will go to
Hogwarts to find the Diadem, get attacked by Malfoy and Co. and chase them
into the room and find it by accident during the battle, probably fall on
Crabbe's head or something stupid like that. 

 

md

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of zanooda2




zanooda:

In HBP Harry goes into the room of requirement not to get the book, but to
hide it from Snape. In DH Harry goes into the room to find the diadem, not
the book :-). He then saves Draco and the room burns :-). I didn't go to
watch the movie, but is it true that Harry didn't see any diadem in the room
of requirement? If true, I wonder how he will find it in DH...



 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 16 20:42:14 2009
From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 13:42:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW
Message-ID: <560798.61841.qm@web59809.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>



--- On Thu, 7/16/09, Child Of Midian <md at exit-reality.com> wrote:

From: Child Of Midian <md at exit-reality.com>
Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, July 16, 2009, 12:53 PM

They left several things from the books that really should be needed for DH,
all I can think of is that they decided on work-arounds early meaning they
just said, hey, let's just change it for no real reason. Mostly think, I
believe, that the movie audience is too dumb and slow to recall one movie
from the other. Most likely they'll just make it stupid, Harry will go to
Hogwarts to find the Diadem, get attacked by Malfoy and Co. and chase them
into the room and find it by accident during the battle, probably fall on
Crabbe's head or something stupid like that. 



<<<<I have to agree with you on the movie audience there I ask most people if they read the books and most just say no. To them Half Blood Prince is just another action flick say like Transformers Two or any other.?
Love,>>>>>>Red


      

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From juli17 at aol.com  Thu Jul 16 21:47:00 2009
From: juli17 at aol.com (julie)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 21:47:00 -0000
Subject: My review of HBP (SPOILERS!!)
Message-ID: <h3o74k+k3de@eGroups.com>

My review of HBP...
SPOILERS!!

S
p
o
i
l
e
r

S
p
a
c
e



The Good:
1. Lots of humor, easily the most laugh-out-loud moments of all the Harry Potter movies. I especially enjoyed Harry high on Felix Felicis, and the first Potions class (Hermione's hair, LOL!). 
2. Great CGI and effects, an overall great look to the movie.
3. Acting was great all around. Jim Broadbent, like Imelda Stauton in OotP, embodies the character he plays (Slughorn) despite little physical resemblance to the description in the books. Tom Felton especially did a nice job portraying Draco's disquiet with--and eventual anguish over--his given task. 
The Trio is greatly improved, especially Dan, IMO, who really emodies Harry in this movie. Alan Rickman is fabulous as movie!Snape (and I've come to view the movie versions of the adults in HP as separate in most cases from the book versions, given that they are almost all decades older than they should be, often physically dissimilar, and generally lacking the visible signs of seriously damaged pysches--Snape's often barely controlled hatred/fury, Sirius's emotional outbursts, Lupin's passive/aggressive words and actions--as the book characters). Helena Carter is a treat as Bellatrix (and the exception, as she does embody the book character to me).
4. The added bit with Slughorn telling Harry the story about Lily and the fish, which was very touching.
5. The opening scene showing Muggle London being affected by Voldemort's rise to power, and then Harry in the London cafe. I know the cafe scene was a bit random (not to mention that Harry is away from Privet Drive and its protective wards), but I think it set the tone for Harry's character in the movie, a boy on the cusp of becoming a man, ready to assert his independence. Not to mention his appeal to the opposite sex ;-)
6. Ginny. I think. She is another character markedly different from the book version. In the movie she is quieter, calmer (downright rock-steady in fact), and lacking the slightly mean edge of the book!Ginny. Less tigress, more, er, doe. Hmm. Yet I still don't see any real connection or passion (emotionally speaking!) between Harry and Ginny, in the books or movies.

The not so good:
1. The end, from the Tower to the final credits. In the Tower scene I was fine with Harry staying below during the confrontation, not because he deeply trusted Snape, but because he trusted Dumbledore's judgment (and was keeping his word to Dumbledore). I did think it was odd that Harry didn't confront Snape and the DEs as they headed down from the Tower, but only chased them afterward. But the real annoyance was how the four DEs faced no opposition whatsoever, from Aurors, professors, or students. Not one single person impeded their escape! Bellatrix even had time to blow out the (deserted) Great Hall's windows! I'm not one to demand lots of fighting action in a movie, but it really needed to happen here, IMO. The scene made little sense without it. And instead we have the whole school standing outside raising their lit wands at Dumbledore's passing like they are at a rock concert or about to sing "Kumbayah."
Then there is the final scene with Harry and Hermione talking on the Tower, and Ron inexplicably loitering nearby instead of standing with them (??). It was all very anticlimatic. Let's just shoot the breeze for a bit, and then watch Fawkes fly away at the appropriate moment (appropriate in that the Trio was there to watch him--Ron having finally gotten off his butt to join Harry and Hermione--not appropriate to the plot, as why didn't Fawkes fly away the moment Dumbledore died, or at the moment he was entombed, or some other actual significant moment?).
I wouldn't have minded no funeral if it didn't add anything to the movie, but it would have added a lot, IMO. It would have ended the movie on a poignant note, rather than a very flat note.
2. I didn't expect the movie to lavishly follow the book, but I would have liked to see more about the main storyline from HBP, which was about, you know, the Half Blood Prince, as well as more Tom Riddle. As it was we got nothing about Merope and Tom's heritage, the very thing that drove him to become Voldemort. And no clue, nor any interest from the Trio, as to who the Half Blood Prince is/was. Snape does announce his identity during the brief confrontation with Harry after he's killed Dumbledore, and no doubt Snape can reason that Harry's prodigious performance in 6th year Potions, and Harry's use of Sectumsempra against Draco (the first mentioned and the latter shown in the movie) could only have been possible if Harry had possession of his old Potions book, but the revelation has little impact (what in the movie would make the audience who hadn't read the book care?).
3. Some of the scenes were a bit choppy, including the cave scene, and the final confrontation between Harry and Snape. In the latter scene, some actual cuts were made, including the "I am not a coward!" line. It hurt the flow a bit.

The "huh?" moments:
1. The Burrow attack. Not sure why this was even included, except to show Ginny's devotion to Harry, and to show that Tonks and Lupin are an established couple (skipping all the leading up parts from the book, understandable with time constraints). We also get to see Bellatrix flexing her psychotic muscles, and Fenrir in action, though there is never any mention in the movie that he is a werewolf as I recall (why not?). 
2. The Sectumsempra scene. Interesting that Harry and Draco are trading nonverbal curses (learned presumably in Snape's DADA class, though we never see Snape teaching DADA), and Harry throws the Sectumsempra curse without Draco first throwing a Crucio curse. And when Snape shows up he merely gives Harry a venemous glare and Harry runs away. No demand for the HBP potions book, no punishment for Harry ever mentioned (and Draco didn't even Crucio first!), no follow up at all except for the Trio and Ginny agreeing that the Potions book has to be hidden away so Harry can't use any spells from it again (and Ginny hides it, not Harry).  
3. The scene in DD's office where they discuss horcruxes, and Harry touches the ring. It moves for him, and Harry does that little neck stretching thing from OotP (that indicated he is being influenced by Voldemort). DD then jumps around his desk and stares at Harry's scar, giving the impression (to me anyway) that he has just realized Harry's scar is a horcrux. Did anyone else interpret this scene the same way? Foreshadowing for Deathly Hallows, methinks.

Good things to come:
I've already heard of several cuts scenes/moments, and they seem like odd cuts to me, being either pivotal lines or poignant moments that could have added a lot to the movie. A good part of the Harry/Snape confrontation at the end was apparently cut, including the above-mentioned "I am not a coward!" line, as well as Snape saying "It's over" after killing Dumbledore. And the mutual exchange between Harry and Dumbledore, "I'm not worried, I'm with you (sir, Harry)." Plus an exchange between Luna and the vampire Sanguini at Slughorn's party. Lots to look forward to on the DVD (or could there even be a Director's cut? Please, please!).

Grade:
Overall, I give the movie a "B." I don't think it will go down as my favorite. I really think it would have been an "A" movie if there had been more focus on the Tom Riddle backstory/Half Blood Prince storyline, and less on the romantic subplots (even though there were some very funny moments there). The movie could have ratchited up the tenision-and earned a PG13 rating for impending dread--as befitting the penultimate lead-in to Deathly Hallows. 

All IMO, of course. I will be seeing the movie at least once more on the big screen, when it comes out on IMAX (July 25 in Southern Cal), and I am always open to revising my opinion after a second viewing, where I often catch things I previously missed. 




From lkotur at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 00:21:22 2009
From: lkotur at yahoo.com (Damit Lazarus)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 00:21:22 -0000
Subject: Children in theatres
In-Reply-To: <814850.77711.qm@web63404.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <h3og62+ote4@eGroups.com>





Sheryll:

> There was a small child at our screening of HBP last night but the >parents removed the child from the room every time it started to >fuss, for which I was very grateful. Much more considerate than the >woman in front of us who didn't turn off her cell phone!
>


I remember the first Harry Potter movie I went to with my wife and daughter.  We were waiting in the queue about the 20th in line and there was a young boy at the front of the line, dressed in wizard robes with a very tall pointy hat.  I jokingly said to my wife, "I hope he doesn't sit in front of me." Well the mother heard me and got really upset and started berating me and her son started getting really obnoxious and they just would not shut up.  The other people in line were starting to show signs of disgust with the pair. After about 5 minutes or so, I asked a little girl behind us if I could borrow her wand.  With wand in hand, I got the pair's attention and with a flourish of the wand and rapidly pointing it at the pair, I proclaimed, "Avada Kedavra". There was a moment of stunned silence. The people in line cheered and applauded. The young boy screamed and ran out of the theater with his mother in tow. The people in line thanked me and we all watched the movie in peace.  Well, looking back maybe the Killing Curse was a bit much, but it is only fantasy, isn't it.

Damit Lazarus




From tfaucette6387 at charter.net  Fri Jul 17 02:26:40 2009
From: tfaucette6387 at charter.net (anne_t_squires)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 02:26:40 -0000
Subject: Children in theatres
In-Reply-To: <h3og62+ote4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3onh0+ek68@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Damit Lazarus" <lkotur at ...> wrote:
>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sheryll:
> 
> > There was a small child at our screening of HBP last night but the >parents removed the child from the room every time it started to >fuss, for which I was very grateful. Much more considerate than the >woman in front of us who didn't turn off her cell phone!
> >
> 
> 
> I remember the first Harry Potter movie I went to with my wife and daughter.  We were waiting in the queue about the 20th in line and there was a young boy at the front of the line, dressed in wizard robes with a very tall pointy hat.  I jokingly said to my wife, "I hope he doesn't sit in front of me." Well the mother heard me and got really upset and started berating me and her son started getting really obnoxious and they just would not shut up.  The other people in line were starting to show signs of disgust with the pair. After about 5 minutes or so, I asked a little girl behind us if I could borrow her wand.  With wand in hand, I got the pair's attention and with a flourish of the wand and rapidly pointing it at the pair, I proclaimed, "Avada Kedavra". There was a moment of stunned silence. The people in line cheered and applauded. The young boy screamed and ran out of the theater with his mother in tow. The people in line thanked me and we all watched the movie in peace.  Well, looking back maybe the Killing Curse was a bit much, but it is only fantasy, isn't it.
> 
> Damit Lazarus
>
Anne Squires

I love, love, love that story.  I wish I had the courage to do something like that.  I went to see HBP yesterday.  There was a crying infant in the theater who cried and screamed for most of the first half of the film.  Finally, finally, finally the person who had brought the child left and, thank Merlin, did not return.  When they were walking out I was able to discern that the child, however old, was a tiny bundle wrapped in a blanket---- so I'm thinking the baby was extremely young.  While the baby was crying I kept trying to tell myself to just ignore it; but, it was very hard to do so.  I blame both the parent, or babysitter or whoever that was who brought an infant to a movie and I also blame the theater personnel for allowing someone to bring an infant into the theater.  I am thinking of contacting the theater manager about it.  It's so hard to get lost in a film when there is a baby loudly screaming its head off.  The reason I didn't do anything at the time was because:

1.  I am a coward and extremely non-confrontational.
2.  It was a stadium style theater that was packed full of people.  I was sitting many rows away from the crying infant and kept thinking someone closer to the problem would maybe say something.
3.  I thought about getting up and finding a manager; but I didn't want to miss a second of the movie.  
4.  I kept thinking, "Any moment now that obnoxious person and their baby will surely get up and go away."

Anyway, I liked the film as much as I could considering.  I going to see it again tonight at another theater.

Anne Squires





From jillily3g at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 02:36:42 2009
From: jillily3g at yahoo.com (Beth)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 02:36:42 -0000
Subject: Things that make you go "Duh" [Was: Harry Potter - GROSS]
In-Reply-To: <h3lfnk+mukl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3oo3q+tb7s@eGroups.com>

And it keeps climbing according to this:
http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssTechMediaTelecomNews/idUSN1644626120090716

But my favorite quote is from the head of the Film-Company-That-Shall-Not-Be Named:
"Quite simply, we owe this record-breaking opening to the remarkable fans who have stood by us and who stood in line to be among the first to see 'Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince,'" Warner Bros President and Chief Operating Officer Alan Horn said in a statement.

Happy to be unremarkable,
Beth




From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 03:18:20 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 03:18:20 -0000
Subject: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW
In-Reply-To: <h3nutn+i366@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3oqhs+p9b1@eGroups.com>

> zanooda:
>
In DH Harry goes into the room to find the diadem, not the book :-). He then saves Draco and the room burns :-). I didn't go to watch the movie, but is it true that Harry didn't see any diadem in the room of requirement? If true, I wonder how he will find it in DH...
>


Joann:

My thought is that it will be Ginny who saw the diadem, and so she will go with him in into the RoR in DH. Given how much they added with Ginny in this movie, they're going to want to add her more to DH. It's not necessary that Ron and Hermione are there. Also, Ron and Hermione can be off in the chamber of secrets while H/G find the diadem.

Joann(who loved the movie!)




From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 03:54:27 2009
From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 20:54:27 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Children in theatres
Message-ID: <301185.8624.qm@web59805.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>


> 


I remember the first Harry Potter movie I went to with my wife and daughter..? We were waiting in the queue about the 20th in line and there was a young boy at the front of the line, dressed in wizard robes with a very tall pointy hat.? I jokingly said to my wife, "I hope he doesn't sit in front of me." Well the mother heard me and got really upset and started berating me and her son started getting really obnoxious and they just would not shut up.? The other people in line were starting to show signs of disgust with the pair. After about 5 minutes or so, I asked a little girl behind us if I could borrow her wand.? With wand in hand, I got the pair's attention and with a flourish of the wand and rapidly pointing it at the pair, I proclaimed, "Avada Kedavra". There was a moment of stunned silence. The people in line cheered and applauded. The young boy screamed and ran out of the theater with his mother in tow. The people in line thanked me and we all
 watched the movie in peace.? Well, looking back maybe the Killing Curse was a bit much, but it is only fantasy, isn't it.

Damit Lazarus



I often wish how nice it would be to use the Avada Kedavera curse on several people I work with at work. (I know that's mean of me to think)?


      

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From iluvoz2 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 02:38:30 2009
From: iluvoz2 at yahoo.com (*BARB*)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 02:38:30 -0000
Subject: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW
In-Reply-To: <h3nutn+i366@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3oo76+8n8r@eGroups.com>

> *BARB* <iluvoz2@> wrote:
> > <snip> (in the book Snape wants the book from Harry
> > and he goes into the room of requirement to get it
> > and then don't they fight with Malfoy and one of his
> > buddies dies and Harry saves Malfoy?? it catches on
> > fire right??)
>
> zanooda:
> In HBP Harry goes into the room of requirement not to
> get the book, but to hide it from Snape. In DH Harry
> goes into the room to find the diadem, not the book :-).
> He then saves Draco and the room burns :-). <snip>


-Geeze, you're right... it was DH wasn't it...

Sometimes I wish I hadn't even read the books, the movies
would make more sense  LOL

Has there ever been a movie made from a book that followed
the book without changing anything?

I am going to see the movie again and try not to judge it
by the book.

BArb



From cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com  Fri Jul 17 05:43:16 2009
From: cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com (Cassandra Wladyslava)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 01:43:16 -0400
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
Message-ID: <d0874c890907162243m4d720f3eh357a7a833895c1b4@mail.gmail.com>

 Well, I went to see the HBP movie on opening day.  Like many others, there
were things I was happy about, things I wasn't happy about, and things that
just confused me.


S
P
O
I
L
E
R

S
P
A
C
E


What I liked:

The humor.  There were quite a few moments that gave me a hearty giggle.  I
loved the part where Harry drinks the Felix Felicis, especially the
"pincers" part.  I also loved the part where Ron eats the love potion laced
chocolates.  The Won Won/Lavender scenes were great as well.

The acting.  I think it's gotten better.  I was especially pleased with Tom
Felton.

Bellatrix.  Absolutely superb performance.   I actually didn't like her much
in the books, but now she's one of my favorite characters.

There were other parts too, but those stick out in my mind.

What I didn't like:

The fact that they (literally, I believe) say that Voldemort's Horcruxes
could be ANYTHING.  I know they didn't have time to do the whole "He
collects valuable trophies, like something from each of the founders of
Hogwarts" storyline, but they could've indicated that Voldemort would've
stuck his soul in something more valuable than "just" a book or "just" a
ring.  Maybe they'll figure it out in DH?  I hope so.

Narcissa Malfoy's hair.

I didn't like the way the did "The Cave".  In the book, the scene where
Harry is force-feeding DD the poison was always disturbing and
heart-wrenching to me.  I understand that they were catering to a certain
audience, but I was still disappointed.

I also thought Dumbledore should've been weaker from the poison when they
got back to the Astronomy Tower.   If he had been weak, his losing his want
to a 6th year student would've made more sense to me.  I also didn't like
the "You are no assassin" (or whatever he says) line. "You are not a killer"
has more impact, I think.

The beginning of the bathroom fight.  I liked the way it was done in the
book much better.  I always found that to be a very sweet, human moment when
Harry realizes that Draco is actually, well, human before Draco sees him in
the mirror and attacks him.

I was also upset that the "I am not worried. I am with you." parts weren't
there.

A trivial thing, but I don't think Dumbledore ever wore his glasses @_ at .

The ending was.....meh.  I wish they had included the funeral or at least
done something to give the film more closure.   As it was, the ending was
very anticlimatic.

How the "Half-Blood Prince" plot seemed to be nothing more than an after
thought.


What confused me:



Any guesses?


The attack on The Burrow.   I don't think I need to say more than that.


Overall I liked the movie, but it definately isn't my favorite.


~Cassie~


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From valerie.flowe at verizon.net  Fri Jul 17 06:09:57 2009
From: valerie.flowe at verizon.net (Valerie Flowe)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 02:09:57 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <d0874c890907162243m4d720f3eh357a7a833895c1b4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d0874c890907162243m4d720f3eh357a7a833895c1b4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c8f0e84b9fcd129d25150aea859756cb@verizon.net>

>  S
>  P
>  O
>  I
>  L
>  E
>  R
>
>  S
>  P
>  A
>  C
>  E
>
> I saw the movie at midnight...all 16 screens were playing it and sold 
> out...Wow! I was glad to see that the HP franchise is alive and 
> kicking. I thought for sure the delay would've made the average fair 
> weather HP fan go elsewhere. Apparently not!
My first reaction to the film was that I loved it! I felt like this was 
the movie that kept the most to the book (well, aside from HP1, maybe). 
Here are my pros and cons:

> PROs:
> - Draco...wow! I thought he was amazing. When he stomped on Harry?s 
> face ?That?s for my father!? = disturbing. Loved the unraveling of his 
> character; his crying, his facial expressions. Well done, Tom Felton!!
> - Ditto for Slughorn. Though I would?ve liked to have seen him with a 
> big belly and mustache as in the book, but otherwise his acting was 
> awesome! Loved the added scene of the fish. Now I can't even remember 
> how H got Sluggo to hand over the memory, in the book?
> - Harry with the Felix scene...Dan is a funny comedic actor! Harry 
> never gets to be silly in these films/books, ya know!
> - Hermione/Emma: Not overreacting...yay! Love it when she was drunk on 
> butterbeer!
> - Child and Teen Tom Riddle. Wow!!! Both of them had that innocent, 
> handsome exterior, yet creepy, sinister underlying feel to them. Great 
> choice of actors!
> - A bit too much focus on the snogging, but I love the exchange 
> between Harry and Ron about the ?soft skin?!
> - Ron/Rupert with the love potion...lol!
> - McGonegal: ?Take Weasley with you; he looks too happy!? LOL! They 
> said she was ill. She did look fragile. Maybe that?s why they didn?t 
> have the Deatheaters stun her in that Hogwarts fight scene??
> - Horcruxes. I think the interchange between Harry and Slughorn 
> adequately explained the horcruxes.
> - Sectumsempra: Wow! I?m surprised they left that in. In some ways it 
> was not as horrific as I pictured in my head while reading. I really 
> imagined that Draco was almost cut in 2. This looked almost like 
> bullet wounds. I suppose if it was as gory as in the book it would've 
> warranted a PG13. I remember feeling sick to my stomach reading that 
> scene in the book. But having Draco lying in the pool of blood/water 
> while Snape healed him, and the look on Harry?s face...wow...powerful~
> - Luna...awesome! Loved the spectraspecs and her tiered dress at the 
> Xmas party. I'm looking forward to the cut scene with Sanguini...Luna 
> has some witty comment in the book which I can't quite remember...
> - Love how Dumbledore asked about Harry & Hermione?s relationship 
> ?Just curious!? Cute...
> - Special effects of bridge twisting = pretty amazing.
> - Bellatrix ? wonderfully horrible as always! Love how she so 
> disrespectfully is stomping on the tables in the great hall, and all 
> the candles get blown out. The look on Draco's face was one of shock 
> and fear as he realizes just how deep he's gotten in with these evil 
> people. I always felt Draco was a pampered, light-weight bully. But 
> this was big-time 'grown-up' evil.
> - Glad they mentioned Regulus! Thought they might leave that out.
> - Foreshadowing of last book as Harry asks D ?Did you know at the 
> time?...?that I had just met the darkest wizard of all time? No...if I 
> had..?? Shows Dumbledore?s fallibility.
> (by the way how DID D hear about Tom Riddle in the orphanage? Just 
> part of D?s secret intuition of all things magical?)
> - Weasley Shop: Have to see it again and in slo-mo to catch it all! 
> Umbridge gag gift?! Did you see it? I missed it. Brilliant addition; 
> you just know the twins would invent that!
> - Fawkes flying away at the end was very poignant, as was D sleeping 
> in his frame in his office.
> Rickman?s line delivery was brilliant as always. Don?t remember if he 
> made that comment in the book to D about what if he didn?t want to do 
> it anymore, and D replied that he had already agreed to it or 
> something like that. Or was that more foreshadowing of Snape?s 
> innocence in DH?? I thought Snape gesturing for Harry to keep quiet 
> while he was hiding under the tower, was way too much of a giveaway of 
> Snape's ultimate goodness. Harry doesn't realize till the very end of 
> the series that Snape is a good guy after all and has been in cahoots 
> with D this whole time.
> - Also loved the Burrow perspective. The sets just seemed so ?real? in 
> this movie. More in-depth, detailed. I mean, they always were, but the 
> details were brilliant in this one. For example the vanishing cabinet 
> was truly beautiful. I pictured just a black box, not an ornate 
> cabinet. Repeatedly showing Draco testing out the cabinet with the 
> apple, and the bird actually worked better in film than in book in 
> explaining how this was a magical transport for Deatheaters.
>
> CONS:
>     - Narcissa: I thought she was unattractive. Didn't like the 
> Cruella de Ville hair! I think Movie-Lucius would?ve picked a hotter 
> wife!
>     - I agree that the cave scene was a bit anti-climactic. The ?it?s 
> my fault? over Ariana was a bit too subtle; I expected D to be more 
> crazed, agonzied, doubled over, etc.
>     - Inferi were creepy though! Everyone in the theatre jumped!
>     - Whole burrow burning scene...not necessary imo. Was that just to 
> introduce us to Fenrir? Or introduce us to Jenny & Harry?s mutual 
> attraction and protectiveness??
>     - There wasn?t much talk of Sirius?s death or Harry depressed over 
> it. He was all ready to go on a date with some chick?? I wish they'd 
> left in the whole scene w/Tonks rescuing him on the train (instead of 
> Luna!) and Harry thinking that Tonks was in love w/Sirius. Harry 
> inheriting Sirius?s estate and Kreacher??
>     - I hate how they threw the Lupin/Tonks relationship in as an 
> afterthought. ?Sweetheart?? For those who hadn?t read the book it?d be 
> like ?huh????  But then again my biggest pet peeve with the movies is 
> that they skimp on the backstory. Which to me is what makes the whole 
> HP series so rich. There are all these layers of story, which all tie 
> in to the present. For example in the book Harry thought for a time 
> that Lily might be the HBP since Slughorn was raving about how 
> wonderful she was in potions.
> - The revelation of Snape being the HBP was anti-climactic. But then 
> again it sort of was in the book as well.
> - Did they make it clear that the locket was a horcrux? The book and 
> ring, yes. But I really am bummed that they skipped the Gaunts/Merope 
> backstory. It would?ve helped explain Voldemort?s connection to 
> Slytheryn. I think that was pretty critical to show Voldemort?s 
> decline into madness and evil. He was p.o?d that his dad ditched his 
> mom, so he went back and killed him and his grandparents, remember? 
> That?s pretty darn evil! Plus it displays the similarities between 
> Harry & Voldie (both orphans, abused) But one chose the path of 
> darkness and one the path of light. Classic theme of good vs. evil.
> - I thought Ginny and Harry?s kiss was too mellow. Though it was 
> sweet/coy when G said ?you can choose to leave that hidden here too, 
> if you?d like!? But I would?ve liked to see her run into his arms 
> after the game and kiss him; Ron freaking out ?Ahhh, my sis just 
> kissed my bf!!?
> - Beginning scene: I would?ve preferred the Dursley scene rather than 
> the waitress picking up Harry scene.
> -I agree with everyone else that it was stupid to have H hiding under 
> the stairs. How hard would it be to film him under the invisibility 
> cloak, immobilized? Same way he was on the train in the beginning?
> - The ending was a tad anti-climactic, but then again it was like the 
> book (similar to the GoF and OotP endings). But as many mentioned, the 
> funeral, with the casket going up in flames, would've been much more 
> powerful.
>
> OK...that?s my analysis!
> V~




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 14:08:42 2009
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 07:08:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Children in theatres
Message-ID: <999176.91526.qm@web63404.mail.re1.yahoo.com>


> Anne Squires:
> 
> I love, love, love that story.? I wish I had the
> courage to do something like that.? I went to see HBP
> yesterday.? There was a crying infant in the theater
> who cried and screamed for most of the first half of the
> film.? Finally, finally, finally the person who had
> brought the child left and, thank Merlin, did not
> return.? When they were walking out I was able to
> discern that the child, however old, was a tiny bundle
> wrapped in a blanket---- so I'm thinking the baby was
> extremely young.? While the baby was crying I kept
> trying to tell myself to just ignore it; but, it was very
> hard to do so.? I blame both the parent, or babysitter
> or whoever that was who brought an infant to a movie and I
> also blame the theater personnel for allowing someone to
> bring an infant into the theater.? I am thinking of
> contacting the theater manager about it.? It's so hard
> to get lost in a film when there is a baby loudly screaming
> its head off.? The reason I didn't do anything at the
> time was because:
> 
> 1.? I am a coward and extremely non-confrontational.
> 2.? It was a stadium style theater that was packed
> full of people.? I was sitting many rows away from the
> crying infant and kept thinking someone closer to the
> problem would maybe say something.
> 3.? I thought about getting up and finding a manager;
> but I didn't want to miss a second of the movie.? 
> 4.? I kept thinking, "Any moment now that obnoxious
> person and their baby will surely get up and go away."
> 
> Anyway, I liked the film as much as I could
> considering.? I going to see it again tonight at
> another theater.
> 
Sheryll:

Seriously, don't hesitate to go out and complain to a manager. Yes, you'll miss a bit of the movie. But any good theatre manager will offer you passes to come back and see the movie again for free. That's what they're there for, to make sure you have a good viewing experience. 

No one should have to struggle to enjoy a film that they paid good money to see and theatre managers know that. :)

Sheryll, who used to work at a movie theatre


      __________________________________________________________________
Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now
http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com.



From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 17 15:20:17 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:20:17 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <d0874c890907162243m4d720f3eh357a7a833895c1b4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d0874c890907162243m4d720f3eh357a7a833895c1b4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <003901ca06f2$17371aa0$45a54fe0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Cassandra Wladyslava




S
P
O
I
L
E
R

S
P
A
C
E


I also thought Dumbledore should've been weaker from the poison when they
got back to the Astronomy Tower. If he had been weak, his losing his want
to a 6th year student would've made more sense to me. I also didn't like
the "You are no assassin" (or whatever he says) line. "You are not a killer"
has more impact, I think.

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

I think they were playing to the fact that Dumbledore was planning on dying
when he came back, revealed in DH. Regardless of what Draco did it was still
up to Snape to kill Dumbledore before the curse in his hand could. Either
way he didn't lose his wand to a sixth year, he didn't fight back on
purpose, he wanted Draco to feel like he was in control, wanted to force him
to make the decision to kill or not. It was one of things in that scene that
DIDN'T bother me.

The only thing that bothered me was Harry listening to Snape, completely
out-of-character.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From marion11111 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 16:41:30 2009
From: marion11111 at yahoo.com (marion11111)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 16:41:30 -0000
Subject: Children in theatres
In-Reply-To: <814850.77711.qm@web63404.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <h3q9jq+m65v@eGroups.com>

 
> Sheryll:
> 
> Most theatres in large cities, at least here in Canada, have special screening of films for parents with very young children. They're generally held on a slow weekday afternoon. That said, if a child isn't old enough to sit quietly through a film, it's unfair to other moviegoers to bring that child to a screening held later in the day that will be primarily attended by adults, many of whom are paying babysitters so they can enjoy a movie without kids.
> 
> I used to work in a movie theatre. I remember a lady bringing a 5 year old in to see the movie The Ring for a late evening screening. Because the rating here was 18A (under 18 must be accompanied by an adult) the only thing I could do was caution her that the film was inappropriate for a child that age. Her response? "Oh, he'll sleep through the movie."!
> 
> There was a small child at our screening of HBP last night but the parents removed the child from the room every time it started to fuss, for which I was very grateful. Much more considerate than the woman in front of us who didn't turn off her cell phone!
> 

marion now:
Years back, I went to a Sharon Stone thriller.  It was a matinee, but rated R and I think we all know how Sharon Stone movies tend to go.  A mom and (I assume) grandma were right behind me with a girl of about 7 years.   Just a few minutes into the film, Sharon Stone's character gets into a bathtub and moves her hand down and begins to moan.  The little girl behind me asks "What's she doing?"  I actually turned fully around because I wanted to hear THAT answer.  They just shushed the child.




From marion11111 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 17:20:17 2009
From: marion11111 at yahoo.com (marion11111)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 17:20:17 -0000
Subject: HBP SPOILERS
In-Reply-To: <h3m3v2+kmci@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3qbsh+ga4a@eGroups.com>

Nothing like a new movie to bring the lurkers out, eh?  I've been posting on another HP site that has some member overlap, so sorry Maudlers, here I go again.

In general, I'm OK with changes and omissions in these movies.  I wish the director would include all my favorite scenes (Luna so funny at the Christmas party, etc.), but I can live with it.  What really disappointed me was the ending to this movie.  I thought it was just bad moviemaking to end like that. They needed an action sequence with the Death Eaters running through the grounds being chased by Order members or teachers or anybody, for heaven's sake!  We're supposed to be on the edge of our seats wondering if they'll get away and then waiting for the next movie to see what happens.  We should feel just how much Harry and Snape hate each other.  Harry should not calmly take instructions from Snape to be quiet on the Tower.

Clearly, this director can make a good, tense, action sequence.  He did it at the Burrow, so why not at the end where an action scene belongs.  It was very anti-climatic.  When I read the book, I seriously feared for Draco's life and expected he and Snape to go into hiding with the other Death Eaters.  Here, I thought they might just stroll off the grounds and go get an early breakfast somewhere.

Alla - you wondered where the adult actors were, so did I.  Maybe they get paid by the hour so they cut them down as much as possible?  The next movie is about the trio almost exclusively, this one should have still been about the Order, Harry's place in the grand scheme, and all the politics and intrique that go into  the rise of a maniac leader.  I really saw this book as a suspense thriller with lots of clues and surprises and mysteries to solve.  I thought this was a very mature book and an absolute cliffhanger. Not much of this in the movie.

On the plus side - I was amazed at how good Tom Felton was in this role. I guess he's never had a chance to shine before and I thought he more than did this justice.  I didn't initially like the casting of Broadbent, but he was wonderful.  As others have said, the younger Voldemorts were perfect.  I'm sure Ginny will have a bigger role in the next movie than she does in the book seeing as Bonnie Wright is turning out to be a very good actor. I still find the Katie Bell scene to be one of the creepiest things I've seen and more so in the movie than the trailers.  There's an image for nightmares.

Do you suppose they downplayed the battle in order to keep the PG rating?  I wondered also if that's why DD said assassin instead of killer and the horror of the sectumsempra was understated.






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 17:24:15 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 17:24:15 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <c8f0e84b9fcd129d25150aea859756cb@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <h3qc3v+9naj@eGroups.com>

Note: Don't read this post if you don't want spoilers. (I've already been "spoiled" by too many clips, previews, and reviews!)

Valerie Flowe wrote:
<snip>
> Now I can't even remember how H got Sluggo to hand over the memory, in the book? <snip>

Carol responds:

He keeps secretly refilling the bottles of mead(?) under the table after Aragog's funeral so that Slughorn is good and drunk, in the sappy-sentimental stage, and then he takes advantage of Slughorn's feeling of guilt of Lily's death. Something about Lily's eyes, which, of course, we see again later in DH (the book).


Valerie:
> They said she was ill. She did look fragile.  Maybe that's why they didn't have the Deatheaters stun her in that Hogwarts fight scene??
<snip>

Carol responds:
Who is ill, McGonagall or Dame Maggie Smith? (It wasn't DEs who Stunned McGonagall; it was Aurors in OoP, the whole point being that she was absent when Harry needed an Order member to talk to. The filmmakers considered that scene expendable, along with the much more important information that Snape sent the Order members to the MoM. Was that information conveyed in HBP, or are movie viewers who haven't read the books still in the dark about it?)

They ostensibly didn't have the Order members fighting the DEs in HBP because it would duplicate DH--odd reasoning considering that their ridiculous and uncanonical attack on the Burrow duplicates DH. (Is the Burrow magically repaired or are the Weasleys homeless for the duration of the film?)

Valerie:
> Luna has some witty comment in the book which I can't quite remember... <snip>

Carol responds:

Are you talking about her (to me) hilarious line about the Aurors being involved in the Rotfang conspiracy, a plot to bring down the Ministry using a combination of Dark Magic and gum disease? I wouldn't call that line witty (well, it's witty on JKR's part, not Luna's). It's more a reflection of the ridiculous things that "Daddy" tells Luna and Luna believes. (The filmmakers should have left it in but I've heard that they didn't.)

Valerie:
> (by the way how DID D hear about Tom Riddle in the orphanage? Just part of D's secret intuition of all things magical?)

Carol responds:
The magical book that records the names of all the witches and wizards born in a particular year must have told him. I assume that's how they find out where the Muggle-borns live as well (little Severus says in DH that they're visited by Hogwarts staff members rather than being sent owls), and how DD knew to address the letters to Harry to "the cupboard under the stairs" and the hut on the rock and so forth. (It's magic!) 

Valerie:
> > Rickman's line delivery was brilliant as always. Don't remember if he made that comment in the book to D about what if he didn't want to do it anymore, and D replied that he had already agreed to it or  something like that. Or was that more foreshadowing of Snape's  innocence in DH?? 

Carol responds:
Yes, it's foreshadowing, but it's in the books as well. In HBP, Hagrid overhears part of the conversation and repeats it to HRH (he thinks that Snape is just overworked; Harry, of course, puts the worst spin on it). In DH ("The Prince's Tale"), we get the whole conversation. (Odd that Snape doesn't want to do it any more even though he must know that the Unbreakable Vow could kill him. He'd rather die than kill DD as DD wants him to. Must have been terrible to be forced to make that choice!)

Valerie:
I thought Snape gesturing for Harry to keep quiet while he was hiding under the tower, was way too much of a giveaway of Snape's ultimate goodness.<snip>

Carol:
Well, since they apparently haven't indicated that he sent the Order and they're making a big deal (from the clips I've seen) about Harry's hatred of Snape, they need some sort of hint that the "murderer" and "coward" is really neither. (Apparently, Snape removes the curse from the opal necklace in the film as in the book, but do they indicate that he, not Madam Pomfrey, saves Katie Bell? (They do show him saving Draco, apparently, but since Draco is a junior DE and he's taken the Unbreakable Vow, that only shows his skill in fighting the Dark Arts without revealing his loyalties. It also *ought* to serve as a hint that he invented both Sectumsempra and its countercurse, but apparently not. It's, IMO, a bad decision to have the boys using nonverbal curses (and not even a hint that Snape is trying to teach them to Harry in DADA class but Harry isn't listening).

Carol responds:
> > - Did they make it clear that the locket was a horcrux? The book and ring, yes.

Carol responds:
I don't understand the question. You're the one who saw the movie! But in the book it's clear that both Harry and DD thought that the locket was a Horcrux until the note from RAB (which they'd better have retained in the film!) fell out, at which point he knew that RAB had taken the real Horcrux.

BTW, forgive my asking, but why is your whole post in brackets as if you're quoting yourself? Makes it very hard to read.

And one more question for anyone who's seen the film. In at least one of the trailers, it sounds as if DD in the cave is shouting "hocus pocus!" Please tell me he's not really using that Muggle magic spell! What is he really saying, can anyone tell?

Carol, who plans to see the film in a week or two when the crowds are smaller






From marion11111 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 17:58:43 2009
From: marion11111 at yahoo.com (marion11111)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 17:58:43 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h3qc3v+9naj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3qe4j+7ee6@eGroups.com>



> Carol aks:
> 
> 
> And one more question for anyone who's seen the film. In at least one of the trailers, it sounds as if DD in the cave is shouting "hocus pocus!" Please tell me he's not really using that Muggle magic spell! What is he really saying, can anyone tell?
> 
> Carol, who plans to see the film in a week or two when the crowds are smaller
>

marion responds:

I couldn't hear *anything* he was saying in that cave.  It was very mumbly and I was straining to hear if he said "my fault, etc."  I think I heard some of that, but it might be my imagination since I expected to hear it.  I didn't notice a "hocus pocus," but like I said it was pretty hard to make out that he was saying anything.  I imagine that people who haven't read the books didn't notice much at all and certainly wouldn't assume any significance to what was said.  His mumbling seemed more for effect than plot development.

As far as the end battle mimicking the battle in DH, that's two movies away.  There shouldn't be a battle in part one, just part two.  For goodness sake, there was a battle in every Star Wars and I don't think the audience got bored with it.






From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 17 18:16:00 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 14:16:00 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h3qe4j+7ee6@eGroups.com>
References: <h3qc3v+9naj@eGroups.com> <h3qe4j+7ee6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001e01ca070a$a394b620$eabe2260$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of marion11111
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 1:59 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood
Prince

 

::::::::::::::::::::::::
As far as the end battle mimicking the battle in DH, that's two movies away.
There shouldn't be a battle in part one, just part two. For goodness sake,
there was a battle in every Star Wars and I don't think the audience got
bored with it.

;;;;;;;;;;;;::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

It was a bad call, no doubt. They decided that there was no action mid-way
through the film and for a 2:33 film they thought they needed action mid-way
through to keep the audience's attention. It was a bad call. The battle in
the middle made NO SENSE. The Borrow had aurrors, spells, etc. just like
Hogwarts, that's why Harry was safe there!!! They idea that the death eaters
could just wonder in anytime and set the place on fire was dumb. Plus, there
was no rhyme or reason for the attack. OTOH, the battle at Hogwarts makes
perfect sense, and the idea that no one knows Dumbledore is dead until all
the smoke clears is very dramatic. 

 

Picture this: The battle is over, people are wondering confused at what just
happened, Harry stumbles over to where Dumbledore fell, kneels, realizes the
reality and Faux's Lament begins as others slowly creep towards, Ginny sees
it and doesn't gasp or cry, simply, instinctively runs to comfort Harry.
Fade out / fade in to the sun setting low in the sky the next day, the
funeral begins and the camera sweeps through the familiar crowd and settles
on Hagrid, bearing DD's coffin on his shoulder. He walks past Harry, who
looks away, then quickly get's up and walks away, Hermione and Ron follow,
Ginny goes to get up, Mrs. Weasely holds her back (we now know Mrs. Weasely
is not letting Ginny join them.) With the funeral in the background the trio
climb up a high hill where Harry sat with Hedwig in Chamber of Secrets
over-looking the lake and their they make plans for the future. The coffin
is sealed, faux flies off, Ginny watches Harry in pain as her mother holds
her arm firmly, Harry, Ron & Hermione make a pact to begin the quest for the
horcruxes. The sun sets with a final shot of Faux flying into the darkness.
Credits roll.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 17 19:45:45 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 15:45:45 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <001e01ca070a$a394b620$eabe2260$@com>
References: <h3qc3v+9naj@eGroups.com> <h3qe4j+7ee6@eGroups.com> <001e01ca070a$a394b620$eabe2260$@com>
Message-ID: <001001ca0717$2d112120$87336360$@com>

My sweetened condensed review for the internet spots with word length
restrictions.

 

"The Half Blood Prince" should be called "The Half Cocked Film." Books
aside, the film leaps, jumps and bounces about from darkness to glee in
artistic, engaging and dramatically potent form, but in the end may leave
the viewer scratching their heads.

 

Fans of the books KNOW what's going on, moviegoers may be a bit confused as
the why things happen. For one, the film opens with Ginny and Harry madly in
unspoken love as Ginny snogs Dean Thomas anyway, and Hermione is suddenly
infatuated with Ron - sure, there has been tension between hem since
puberty, but jealousy seems a bit of a stretch all of a sudden (in the books
it's more of a slow brewing issue.) 

 

Without too many spoilers, ask yourself: how and why does Harry know what
and for what use a Beazor is and why does his potions master (not Snape now)
sit and watch a student die when the solution should be clear to him? Why is
there no defenses at the Weasely house if they are in dire danger, why no
Order members standing guard, no spells around the property and why do the
Death Eaters attack? (hint, it's not in the book at all!!! so there's no
answer.) Why does Dumbledore take Harry to the Burrow at the beginning of
the film (it makes sense in the book, here, no reason.) Why does Harry take
orders from Snape at the end without question? Why does no one challenge
four Death Eaters running amok in Hogwarts and setting Hagrid's hut ablaze?

 

The movie is fast, humorous, entertaining and a wonder to watch, both
emotionally and visually. I buy the characters, the motivations, the special
effects, everything almost. just not the logical flaws that made me scratch
my head all the way home.

 

            I do hope they shot a lot of scenes that will someday make up an
extended DVD /  Blu-Ray version. The film is so close to being the perfect
Potter film, but forgets the audience isn't stupid.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 20:12:41 2009
From: dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com (dumbledore11214)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 20:12:41 -0000
Subject: HBP SPOILERS
In-Reply-To: <h3qbsh+ga4a@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3qlvp+glm0@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "marion11111" <marion11111 at ...> wrote:
>
> Nothing like a new movie to bring the lurkers out, eh?  I've been posting on another HP site that has some member overlap, so sorry Maudlers, here I go again.
> 
> In general, I'm OK with changes and omissions in these movies.  I wish the director would include all my favorite scenes (Luna so funny at the Christmas party, etc.), but I can live with it.  What really disappointed me was the ending to this movie.  I thought it was just bad moviemaking to end like that. They needed an action sequence with the Death Eaters running through the grounds being chased by Order members or teachers or anybody, for heaven's sake!  We're supposed to be on the edge of our seats wondering if they'll get away and then waiting for the next movie to see what happens.  We should feel just how much Harry and Snape hate each other.  Harry should not calmly take instructions from Snape to be quiet on the Tower.

Alla:

Long time no see :-) I mean, I rarely post here, but as you said new movie and all, but I have not seen you on OTC either.

Yes in general I am ok with changes in the movie, of course this is all keeping in mind that I consider ALL movies as just sketches of the books at best, the illustrations to them.

Yes, I would love a cliffhanger, but I guess they did not want to keep audience in suspense for too long. Nobody fighting DE WAS annoying IMO. Well, I never really got that Movie!Harry and Snape REALLY hate each other, so I guess why start now lol. When Book!Harry swears to fight Snape if he will come across him in his quest I feel his hatred soooo much, when Movie!Harry tells Hermione that it was always Snape, it did not feel to me as burning hatred much. Not that I think Dan could not do it, as I said I feel that his acting improved very much and he is totally capable of doing it. I just do not think he was required by director to do so.


Marion: 
> Clearly, this director can make a good, tense, action sequence.  He did it at the Burrow, so why not at the end where an action scene belongs.  It was very anti-climatic.  When I read the book, I seriously feared for Draco's life and expected he and Snape to go into hiding with the other Death Eaters.  Here, I thought they might just stroll off the grounds and go get an early breakfast somewhere.

Alla:

LOL.

Marion:
> Alla - you wondered where the adult actors were, so did I.  Maybe they get paid by the hour so they cut them down as much as possible?  The next movie is about the trio almost exclusively, this one should have still been about the Order, Harry's place in the grand scheme, and all the politics and intrique that go into  the rise of a maniac leader.  I really saw this book as a suspense thriller with lots of clues and surprises and mysteries to solve.  I thought this was a very mature book and an absolute cliffhanger. Not much of this in the movie.

Alla:

The key to enjoying the adaptation movie IMO is to lower your expectations as much as possible :). Mine were low, so I enjoyed it a lot hehe. I did not as much wonder where adults were, I mean they were not present much at all in all other movies and at least Dumbledore, Slugghorn and Snape got some time, but I was annoyed how they portrayed the snippets that they did. I do wish though we would have the movie where adults are doing more, I do.

Marion:
> On the plus side - I was amazed at how good Tom Felton was in this role. I guess he's never had a chance to shine before and I thought he more than did this justice.  I didn't initially like the casting of Broadbent, but he was wonderful.  As others have said, the younger Voldemorts were perfect.  I'm sure Ginny will have a bigger role in the next movie than she does in the book seeing as Bonnie Wright is turning out to be a very good actor. I still find the Katie Bell scene to be one of the creepiest things I've seen and more so in the movie than the trailers.  There's an image for nightmares. <SNIP>

Alla:

Yes as I said before I loved Tom's acting and as I did not say before I thought Slugghorn was perfect too. And as I also did not say before I thought Bonnie was great as well hehe. I really liked how consistently IMO they developed Ginny, how they started to show her with the Trio a bit more since GoF. My favorite scene with Ginny was when she sees Harry walking in Great hall and she is asking why he is always covered in blood. That was just poignant to me.







From montavilla47 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 20:30:52 2009
From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 20:30:52 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <001001ca0717$2d112120$87336360$@com>
Message-ID: <h3qn1s+j83n@eGroups.com>

md wrote:
> Fans of the books KNOW what's going on, moviegoers may be a bit confused as
> the why things happen. For one, the film opens with Ginny and Harry madly in
> unspoken love as Ginny snogs Dean Thomas anyway, and Hermione is suddenly
> infatuated with Ron - sure, there has been tension between hem since
> puberty, but jealousy seems a bit of a stretch all of a sudden (in the books
> it's more of a slow brewing issue.) 

Montavilla47:

The Ron/Hermione stuff is less out of the blue than the Harry/Ginny stuff.  But,
you know, love can be like that, and I don't think it's going to be that hard for
movie-only fans to get.

md wrote:
> Without too many spoilers, ask yourself: how and why does Harry know what
> and for what use a Beazor is and why does his potions master (not Snape now)
> sit and watch a student die when the solution should be clear to him? 

Montavilla47:
The problem of Slughorn watching stupidly as Ron is dying is a holdover from
the book.  He was no more helpful then.  

Harry finding the bezoar is a logical problem in the film, since we haven't 
heard about that trick since PS/SS, and we don't have Harry reading that 
fun, snarky little tip in the Potions book.  And, it takes him forever to find
it, unlike in the book, when he was able to go straight to it.

Plus, we then get one of those scenes where other actors have to *tell*
us what happened.  It reminds me of that clumsy moment in PS/SS when
we learn that Harry made the Quidditch team from Nearly Headless Nick.


md:
> Why is
> there no defenses at the Weasely house if they are in dire danger, why no
> Order members standing guard, no spells around the property and why do the
> Death Eaters attack? (hint, it's not in the book at all!!! so there's no
> answer.) Why does Dumbledore take Harry to the Burrow at the beginning of
> the film (it makes sense in the book, here, no reason.) 

Montavilla47:
What puzzles me is that Dumbledore sort of drops him off in the middle of
a marsh a good distance away from the Burrow--and doesn't bother to tell
anyone that Harry is going to show up.  Leaving the Chosen One vulnerable 
to any random attack by DEs.

Also, later on, the Trio are allowed to wander into the burned-out wand 
shop without even Hagrid's lackluster guarding or use of the invisibility 
cloak.

md:
>Why does Harry take
> orders from Snape at the end without question? Why does no one challenge
> four Death Eaters running amok in Hogwarts and setting Hagrid's hut ablaze?

Montavilla47:
In the film, Harry has no reason *not* to take Snape's orders.  There's hardly
any tension between the two of them, and the key conflict for Harry (Snape 
telling Voldemort the prophecy) is never revealed.

What bothers me is how badly staged and unsuspenseful the moment is
when Snape arrives.  That was, to my mind, the very best moment of the 
book.  I was convinced on first reading that Snape would somehow save 
the day.  And, although I never believed that Snape was acting on his own
in killing Dumbledore, that moment really threw me.  In a good way. :)

But in the film, there's practically no tension at all in the scene--although
there's a bit of tension between Draco and Dumbledore.  I didn't get the 
sense that Snape was making a difficult decision, or any kind of a decision
at all.  

I didn't feel that Dumbledore *needed* help at that point, either.  So, if 
he didn't want Snape to kill him, he'd have snapped his fingers or called 
Fawkes or something.  He didn't seem weak, as he had in the book, and
which made Snape's action seem all the more terrible.

Also, I don't recall Harry ever questioning Dumbledore about Snape's
loyalty.  I liked that they included Lupin's argument about trusting 
Dumbledore's judgment, but the scene between Harry and Dumbledore
was much more dramatic and important and wish we could have had 
that.  

But I hesitate to say I would have sacrificed the Lupin scene, because 
I liked it so much.  Anything with Lupin is good and it established the 
Tonks/Lupin relationship (along with the moment at the door when
she calls him "sweetheart") far better than the book did.


md:
> The movie is fast, humorous, entertaining and a wonder to watch, both
> emotionally and visually. I buy the characters, the motivations, the special
> effects, everything almost. just not the logical flaws that made me scratch
> my head all the way home.

Montavilla47:
I agree with that, mostly.  There was a point when I felt that the film was
dragging, but I don't recall exactly when.  It was sometime after the 
burrow attack.  I liked the teen romance stuff.  That was all pretty cute and
fun.  And I loved how sympathetic Harry and Hermione were with each
other.

Visually, I got a bit tired of muted "blueness" of the color palette.  Harry's
skin tone was so pale that he started to look like Edward Cullen.  

Also, I really missed some of the original musical themes.  





From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 17 21:44:43 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 17:44:43 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h3qn1s+j83n@eGroups.com>
References: <001001ca0717$2d112120$87336360$@com> <h3qn1s+j83n@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000c01ca0727$cbc89680$6359c380$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of montavilla47
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:31 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood
Prince

 


Montavilla47:
The problem of Slughorn watching stupidly as Ron is dying is a holdover from
the book. He was no more helpful then. 

Harry finding the bezoar is a logical problem in the film, since we haven't 
heard about that trick since PS/SS, and we don't have Harry reading that 
fun, snarky little tip in the Potions book. And, it takes him forever to
find
it, unlike in the book, when he was able to go straight to it.

Plus, we then get one of those scenes where other actors have to *tell*
us what happened. It reminds me of that clumsy moment in PS/SS when
we learn that Harry made the Quidditch team from Nearly Headless Nick.



md:

In the book we have the narrators guidance, and we KNOW that Harry knows to
look for the beazor, in the film we do not have these things so the scene
makes no sense. We know Harry is on the Quidditch team because McGonagall
Marches him over to Wood and announces she's found him a seeker, hardly from
Nearly Headless Nick.

 


md:
> Why is
> there no defenses at the Weasely house if they are in dire danger, why no
> Order members standing guard, no spells around the property and why do the
> Death Eaters attack? (hint, it's not in the book at all!!! so there's no
> answer.) Why does Dumbledore take Harry to the Burrow at the beginning of
> the film (it makes sense in the book, here, no reason.) 

Montavilla47:
What puzzles me is that Dumbledore sort of drops him off in the middle of
a marsh a good distance away from the Burrow--and doesn't bother to tell
anyone that Harry is going to show up. Leaving the Chosen One vulnerable 
to any random attack by DEs.

Also, later on, the Trio are allowed to wander into the burned-out wand 
shop without even Hagrid's lackluster guarding or use of the invisibility 
cloak.



md:

I love that, it makes no sense whatsoever.

 

Montavilla47:
In the film, Harry has no reason *not* to take Snape's orders. There's
hardly
any tension between the two of them, and the key conflict for Harry (Snape 
telling Voldemort the prophecy) is never revealed.



md:

Harry and Snape had "tension" since the first film, that doesn't have to be
new to the movie. Also, Harry heard Snape and Draco, he knows of the
unbreakable vow, he knows Snape must stand by Draco, so yes, he has TONS of
reasons not to trust or listen to snape.

I didn't feel that Dumbledore *needed* help at that point, either. So, if 
he didn't want Snape to kill him, he'd have snapped his fingers or called 
Fawkes or something. He didn't seem weak, as he had in the book, and
which made Snape's action seem all the more terrible.

md:

It wasn't a point of needing help. In the book Dumbledore knew Harry would
only take his orders so far, Dumbledore knew Harry would not let Snape kill
him and would, the minute he was dead, run out and confront as many
death-eaters as stood before him. Why not film the scene that way:

Dumbledore:

Harry, quick, your cloak!

/petrifies Harry/

Then it all makes perfect sense, Harry has to watch, can't do a thing about
it and we all get, book-readers or not, the Dumbledore is protecting. 


md

.

 
<http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=3597161/grpspId=1705020948/msgId
=16470/stime=1247862692/nc1=3858794/nc2=5522124/nc3=5741391> 





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Fri Jul 17 22:23:44 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:23:44 -0000
Subject: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW.
In-Reply-To: <008401ca064f$1455a2a0$3d00e7e0$@com>
Message-ID: <h3qtlg+jou0@eGroups.com>

 "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> They left several things from the books
> that really should be needed for DH

Well of course they did, but have a little mercy. Put yourself in the place of the screenwriter, you've got to condense about 18 hours (the time of the audio book) into 2 and a half hours. Unless you the screenwriter can figure out how to overcome the space time continuum you are going to have to omit some absolutely wonderful stuff. That's just the way it is.

A mediocre book doesn't have that problem. The Godfather book was OK but nothing spectacular; The Godfather movie was a great work of art.

I admit that was very unusual, the book is almost always far far better than the book, but if a movie can be half as good as a great book that is a triumph.

 Eggplant         







From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Fri Jul 17 22:39:06 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:39:06 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <003901ca06f2$17371aa0$45a54fe0$@com>
Message-ID: <h3quia+ardd@eGroups.com>

"Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> I also thought Dumbledore should've been weaker
> from the poison when they got back to the Astronomy Tower.
 
Yes I agree with you, Dumbledore was a little too perky.

> I also didn't like the "You are no assassin" (or whatever he says) line. "You are not a killer" has more impact, I think.

On that I disagree, I think that small departure from the book was an improvement. 

 Eggplant
 





From ckc at rochester.rr.com  Sat Jul 18 01:30:31 2009
From: ckc at rochester.rr.com (CK Campbell)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 21:30:31 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <d0874c890907162243m4d720f3eh357a7a833895c1b4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d0874c890907162243m4d720f3eh357a7a833895c1b4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA1CB6518EDB4457B2B79EDF9233D43A@ckc>

 
>A trivial thing, but I don't think Dumbledore ever wore his glasses @_ at .

He did.  When Harry came up to his office the first time, Dumbledore was
reading with his glasses on.  Then we see them at the end, perched on top of
his book.

CK




From md at exit-reality.com  Sat Jul 18 02:08:36 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:08:36 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW.
In-Reply-To: <h3qtlg+jou0@eGroups.com>
References: <008401ca064f$1455a2a0$3d00e7e0$@com> <h3qtlg+jou0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <003301ca074c$a8dfd230$fa9f7690$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of eggplant107





> They left several things from the books
> that really should be needed for DH

Well of course they did, but have a little mercy. Put yourself in the place
of the screenwriter, you've got to condense about 18 hours (the time of the
audio book) into 2 and a half hours. Unless you the screenwriter can figure
out how to overcome the space time continuum you are going to have to omit
some absolutely wonderful stuff. That's just the way it is.
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Actually, I've adapted books to screenplays, nothing that's been sold to
this point, but I've done it. I know EXCACTLY what it entails.

The clues, the information on the horcruxes was and is more important than
making up new scenes. Also, as I pointed out before, they've overlooked a
huge audience that would love to see a LOTR situation where 45 - 60 minutes
of footage could be added to an extended edition Blu-Ray latter and would
make the studio hundreds of millions.

What I liked about the screenplays for the first 3 films is that they
streamlined the films in such a way that the left-out information was
missed, but as they moved to the last three films they seemed to take
highlights from the books and stitch it together rather than reimagining the
story in for the screen. 

As for 18 hrs to read the book aloud, I can read the book to myself in half
that time, and the book can take 20 pages to cover what takes 30 seconds of
screen time. I'm a writer and an English / literature teacher, words are my
life, it's what I do and what I understand better than anything else. That's
just the way it is.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From marion11111 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 02:31:00 2009
From: marion11111 at yahoo.com (marion11111)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 02:31:00 -0000
Subject: HBP SPOILERS
In-Reply-To: <h3qlvp+glm0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3rc54+mvip@eGroups.com>


> 
> Alla:
> 
> Long time no see :-) I mean, I rarely post here, but as you said new movie and all, but I have not seen you on OTC either.
> 


marion:
Hi Alla! {waves}  At your Harry Potter movie, did you get to see the trailer for the Percy Jackson movie?  Happy me.  We'll have to discuss this over at OTC or has it already been discussed?




From tonks_op at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 02:32:49 2009
From: tonks_op at yahoo.com (Tonks)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 02:32:49 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <d0874c890907162243m4d720f3eh357a7a833895c1b4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <h3rc8h+dsm9@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, Cassandra Wladyslava <cassandra.wladyslava at ...> wrote:
>
> S
> P
> O
> I
> L
> E
> R
> 
> S
> P
> A
> C
>> 
> What I didn't like: 
> 
> Narcissa Malfoy's hair.

Tonks:

What was up with that? I forgot if we saw her in #5, but she is blond like Draco and her husband. What was that half color hair.. Uck... and I don't think that she is as old as she looked there. She looked like a 60 year old woman who was turning grey... like me. But even my hair isn't like that!

I didn't like the beginning. DD picks Harry up outside on the street, when death eaters are all about and Harry should be staying at home. I guess WB was too cheap to pay the actors who play Harry's family. I missed the part where Harry says "it is safe to be out here tonight?", and DD says, "yes, because you are with me" which matches up nicely with the other part that they didn't do after the cave when Harry tells DD not to worry, and DD says "I am not worried, I am with you".  

And again they have Bella on the tower, when she was never there in the books. I don't understand why they didn't have Harry under the cloak as in the books and then have him under the cloak and unable to move instead of in that weird place under the tower. And I agree that the funeral with the fire and phoenix flying away would have more impact.

Over all, it was good, but not the emotional impact I would have expected. Maybe they wanted to water it down for the younger children.

Tonks_op
who saw it twice now, but fell alseep though part of the second run. It has been a long week, with little sleep. Willl see it again next week with someone else, hopefully well rested this time. 






From islandgirl012775 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 03:00:14 2009
From: islandgirl012775 at yahoo.com (Cheryl Hafer)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 20:00:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h3quia+ardd@eGroups.com>
References: <h3quia+ardd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <874188.99837.qm@web31002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I will have to agree with eggplant!!? I was hoping they would provide more info regarding lilly and snape!! I thought that was big or at least for me




________________________________
From: eggplant107 <eggplant107 at hotmail.com>
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 6:39:06 PM
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince

? 
"Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> I also thought Dumbledore should've been weaker
> from the poison when they got back to the Astronomy Tower.

Yes I agree with you, Dumbledore was a little too perky.

> I also didn't like the "You are no assassin" (or whatever he says) line. "You are not a killer" has more impact, I think.

On that I disagree, I think that small departure from the book was an improvement. 

Eggplant






      

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From valerie.flowe at verizon.net  Sat Jul 18 03:03:46 2009
From: valerie.flowe at verizon.net (Valerie Flowe)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 23:03:46 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood
 Prince
In-Reply-To: <h3qc3v+9naj@eGroups.com>
References: <h3qc3v+9naj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <4e2524c034fd7ab7dd5b3053b754b285@verizon.net>


On Jul 17, 2009, at 1:24 PM, Carol wrote:
> Note: Don't read this post if you don't want spoilers. (I've already 
> been "spoiled" by too many clips, previews, and reviews!)
>
>  Valerie:
> They said she was ill. She did look fragile. Maybe that's why they 
> didn't have the Deatheaters stun her in that Hogwarts fight scene??
>  <snip>
>  Carol responds:
>  Who is ill, McGonagall or Dame Maggie Smith? (It wasn't DEs who 
> Stunned McGonagall; it was Aurors in OoP, the whole point being that 
> she was absent when Harry needed an Order member to talk to. The 
> filmmakers considered that scene expendable, along with the much more 
> important information that Snape sent the Order members to the MoM. 
> Was that information conveyed in HBP, or are movie viewers who haven't 
> read the books still in the dark about it?)
> Valerie: - I heard that Maggie Smith had been ill.
Obviously I need to go back and read OotP and HBP. I was thinking that 
during that whole "I'm the Half Blood Prince" "Fight Back you coward!" 
scene that McGonegal got hit by a spell. Wrong book; sorry!
>
>  BTW, forgive my asking, but why is your whole post in brackets as if 
> you're quoting yourself? Makes it very hard to read.
> Valerie: Hmmm, must be a Mac vs. PC thing. I'm on a Mac and don't see 
> any brackets. Sorry it's difficult to read.

>  And one more question for anyone who's seen the film. In at least one 
> of the trailers, it sounds as if DD in the cave is shouting "hocus 
> pocus!" Please tell me he's not really using that Muggle magic spell! 
> What is he really saying, can anyone tell?
> Valerie: I'll have to see it a 3rd time now to find out! I'm sure he 
> didn't say Hocus Pocus though!




From valerie.flowe at verizon.net  Sat Jul 18 03:58:43 2009
From: valerie.flowe at verizon.net (Valerie Flowe)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 23:58:43 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood
 Prince
In-Reply-To: <h3qn1s+j83n@eGroups.com>
References: <h3qn1s+j83n@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <1429db135d36c44fcf68d24e33c5cec2@verizon.net>

On Jul 17, 2009, at 4:30 PM, montavilla47 wrote:
>  Montavilla47:
> <snip> Visually, I got a bit tired of muted "blueness" of the color 
> palette. Harry's
>  skin tone was so pale that he started to look like Edward Cullen.
Val: LOL!!! He did have porcelain-like skin in this movie.
> Just re-watched COS tonight to see how much that Tom Riddle (Christian 
> Coulson, I think his name is) resembled the HBP teen Riddle. Not so 
> much but there is so much time between the 2 films that it doesn't 
> really matter.
But it was amazing how bright everything was in that film. Diagon Alley 
was veritably sunny!
>  Montavilla47:
>  Also, I really missed some of the original musical themes.
> Val:
> Yes, the music didn't really stand out much at all, to my 
> recollection. But maybe I was too focused on the visuals.




From wildirishrose at fiber.net  Sat Jul 18 05:48:27 2009
From: wildirishrose at fiber.net (wildirishrose)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 23:48:27 -0600
Subject: HBP
Message-ID: <35754AFF49884852BC5AD2FC04154D69@Marianne>

My son and I just saw the HBP tonight.  This is the first HP movie that I've seen on the big screen.  Every other one has been on DVD, and I've only seen them now and then.  I liked it the movie.  Some parts of it cracked me up.

I  wish they'd gave Ron more movie time.  With the exception of Lavender he was pretty much in the background.  Like somebody said for the ending.  Why wasn't Ron standing with the other two during the last conversation of the movie.  It irritated me.  Why didn't they have Ron say that they'd go with Harry looking for Horcruxes.  I think he was the one in the book that said that.

I don't understand why they added the burning of the Burrow.  I thought it was sweet how Tonks refered to Lupin as Sweetheart.  I don't know who plays Tonks, but she is very pretty.

As for Bellatrix.  I do like her, but I think she's in serious need of some mental health treatment.  Say a stay in St. Mungo's.  :o)  I was startled by how she acts a little too sexy for a witch.  She'd give Snape a run for his money.  In fact she could liven up Snape's life a little bit.

And I've grown to like Snape.  I used to think of him as a evil person.  He's not evil.  He's grumpy, ambitious and loyal to Dumbldore to the end.

I'm going to see it again, and my son wants to see it again.  The first thing he said to me as we were walking out was "Are you going to buy me the DVD?"  I told him that when it came out I would buy it for him.

Marianne

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From stevejjen at earthlink.net  Sat Jul 18 17:49:10 2009
From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 17:49:10 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h3qn1s+j83n@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3t1um+ebc6@eGroups.com>

Montavilla47:
> But in the film, there's practically no tension at all in the scene-> - although there's a bit of tension between Draco and Dumbledore.  > I didn't get the sense that Snape was making a difficult decision,
> or any kind of a decision at all.  
> 
> I didn't feel that Dumbledore *needed* help at that point, either. 
> So, if he didn't want Snape to kill him, he'd have snapped his 
> fingers or called Fawkes or something.  He didn't seem weak, as he 
> had in the book, and which made Snape's action seem all the more 
> terrible.

Jen: I left the movie puzzled by the death scene because it felt off.  Dumbledore not appearing sick or frail was a big negative fo the dramatic tension.  Snape's lack of anguish/hatred right before the AK was also a letdown for the final moment.  Then DD said his please like 'pass the salt, Severus' - no begging, no possibility of doubt in Snape.  

One minor niggling point was also Dumbledore using the term 'assasain' rather than 'killer' when he addressed Draco.  It was such a small thing yet it took away from the moment for me.  I started thinking James Bond or hired hit men rather than a young boy/man making the most pivotal decision of his life.  

Anyway, I liked big chunks of the movie, particular Felton's acting and Broadbent's portrayl of Slughorn as a little more anguished and a little less bon vivant than in the book.  What was missing was feeling totally entranced by the movie as I've felt during the other ones.  Maybe it's because I know the ending now?  Not sure.  

I'll still see it again!

Jen




From stevejjen at earthlink.net  Sat Jul 18 17:57:25 2009
From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 17:57:25 -0000
Subject: HBP SPOILERS
In-Reply-To: <h3rc54+mvip@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3t2e5+lr0r@eGroups.com>

> marion:
> Hi Alla! {waves}  At your Harry Potter movie, did you get to see the
> trailer for the Percy Jackson movie?  Happy me.  We'll have to
> discuss this over at OTC or has it already been discussed?

Jen: I didn't know they were making a movie of this series!  Will it be a movie for each book or one big movie? Our big preview before HBP was 'New Moon', which is the one I'm looking forward to now.  (I guess OTC is best for discussing other movies; I'll watch over there for follow up posts.)








From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 18:51:57 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 18:51:57 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <4e2524c034fd7ab7dd5b3053b754b285@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <h3t5kd+uhhv@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> >  BTW, forgive my asking, but why is your whole post in brackets as if you're quoting yourself? Makes it very hard to read.

> > Valerie: Hmmm, must be a Mac vs. PC thing. I'm on a Mac and don't see any brackets. Sorry it's difficult to read.

Carol again:

I don't think it's a Mac thing but I can't be sure since I use a PC! But I think it might have something to do with posting from your e-mail rather than the site.

At any rate, it would help a lot if you'd skip a space between your words and those of the person you're quoting and make sure to label whose words are whose. <smile> (We all forget those things sometimes, I realize. I've caught myself not snipping properly a couple of times lately on the main list.)

Carol, looking forward to the answer to the hocus pocus riddle!




From dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 21:37:41 2009
From: dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com (dumbledore11214)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 21:37:41 -0000
Subject: HBP SPOILERS
In-Reply-To: <h3t2e5+lr0r@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3tfb5+r9it@eGroups.com>

> > marion:
> > Hi Alla! {waves}  At your Harry Potter movie, did you get to see the
> > trailer for the Percy Jackson movie?  Happy me.  We'll have to
> > discuss this over at OTC or has it already been discussed?
> 
> Jen: I didn't know they were making a movie of this series!  Will it be a movie for each book or one big movie? Our big preview before HBP was 'New Moon', which is the one I'm looking forward to now.  (I guess OTC is best for discussing other movies; I'll watch over there for follow up posts.)
>


Alla:

Marion, I hope "happy you" means that you were really happy? Please, please do tell on OTC. I would love to see this movie and no I do not remember it had been discussed, and I want to know what you thought about the last book.

And no, I have not seen previews to it or New Moon, probably because I saw it at IMAX they showed preview to Christmas Carol UGH.




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 19:02:35 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 19:02:35 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <35754AFF49884852BC5AD2FC04154D69@Marianne>
Message-ID: <h3t68b+gb6c@eGroups.com>

Marian wrote:
<snip>
> 
> I don't understand why they added the burning of the Burrow.  I thought it was sweet how Tonks refered to Lupin as Sweetheart.  I don't know who plays Tonks, but she is very pretty. <snip>

Carol responds:
Her name is Natalia Tena. I came across this interview with her this morning (use the tinyurl if the long one breaks):

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/herocomplex/2009/07/harry-potter-countdown-natalia-tena-weighs-in-tonks-mullet.html

http://tinyurl.com/kqb4dn

Interestingly, she's read the books (unlike Michael Gambon and, of all people, Alan Rickman!). She was puzzled by the Burrow scene, too, and she's in it! (She thinks that possibly it's there to indicate her romance with Lupin; her changed hair color is unexplained, which, IMO, is just stupid. If she's with him and happy, her hair should be pink!)

Anyway, she sounds like a bright and lively young woman. BTW, she talks about her "mullet" haircut. Can someone from Britain please explain to me what a mullet is?

Carol, hoping you enjoy the interview




From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Sat Jul 18 19:26:44 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 19:26:44 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <001001ca0717$2d112120$87336360$@com>
Message-ID: <h3t7lk+6ma6@eGroups.com>

 "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> ask yourself: how and why does Harry know what
> and for what use a Beazor is

Harry learned that his very first day at Hogwarts, both the book Harry and the movie Harry.

> and why does his potions master (not Snape now)
> sit and watch a student die when the solution
> should be clear to him? 

Because Harry is not the type who panics in a crisis and Slughorn was.

> Why does Harry take orders from Snape
> at the end without question? 

Because seconds before Dumbledore specifically asked Harry to get Snape. and he really did look like he had a plan and was going to help. That's what I would have thought if I hadn't read the book.

 Eggplant






From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 22:17:15 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 22:17:15 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h3t68b+gb6c@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3thlb+jmll@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> BTW, she talks about her "mullet" haircut. Can someone from 
> Britain please explain to me what a mullet is?


zanooda:

I'm not from Britain, but it's a haircut with short sides and front and a long back :-). Here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mullet_(haircut)

I don't want to write more, because two of my previous posts on other topics didn't get through ;-(. Hope this one does :-).




From dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 21:35:04 2009
From: dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com (dumbledore11214)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 21:35:04 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince SPOILERS for DH book
In-Reply-To: <h3t1um+ebc6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3tf68+t88q@eGroups.com>

> Jen: I left the movie puzzled by the death scene because it felt off.  Dumbledore not appearing sick or frail was a big negative fo the dramatic tension.  Snape's lack of anguish/hatred right before the AK was also a letdown for the final moment.  Then DD said his please like 'pass the salt, Severus' - no begging, no possibility of doubt in Snape.  


Alla:

You know what's funny Jen? I totally agree with you about the death scene, but it so did not bother me and I think (although I may change my mind), what I learned about it in DH is a reason for that.

Let me try to explain. I cried when I read this scene in HBP, I mean, it was so sad as far as I was concerned, sick Dumbledore with enemies around him, trying to save Draco and here comes Snape.

I suppose since I now know that Dumbledore planned his death well in advance this scene lost poignancy for me, you know?

I am not trying to argue anything, I am just trying to explain how I felt in light of new information in the book.

I mean, now to me it did not matter whether Dumbledore looks sick or not, since one way or another this is what he wanted and voula here comes Snape to finish up the plan. I guess to me it now does not matter swat whether Dumbledore looks frail or not.

Does it make sense? I mean it is not faithful to the book, but it does not change how I feel about the scene.

There is of course Snape's anguish one way or another, which he still feels, but since when do I care about Snape's anguish, hehe.


Jen:
> One minor niggling point was also Dumbledore using the term 'assasain' rather than 'killer' when he addressed Draco.  It was such a small thing yet it took away from the moment for me.  I started thinking James Bond or hired hit men rather than a young boy/man making the most pivotal decision of his life.  <SNIP>

Alla:

This WAS bizarre to me too.
 





From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 21:17:56 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 21:17:56 -0000
Subject: SPOILER!!! HBP REVIEW.
In-Reply-To: <h3qtlg+jou0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3te64+2uju@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "eggplant107" <eggplant107 at ...> wrote:

> > "Child Of Midian" <md@> wrote:
 
> > They left several things from the books
> > that really should be needed for DH


> Well of course they did, but have a little mercy. Put 
> yourself in the place of the screenwriter, you've got 
> to condense about 18 hours (the time of the audio book) 
> into 2 and a half hours. 


zanooda:

You are right about that, but I guess what md meant in answering my question was that by omitting information about the Horcruxes the movie-makers created problems for themselves for the next movie :-). Harry didn't see the diadem in RoR and he didn't see the locket and the cup in the memories, so how is he supposed to find out how they look (in the case of the diadem - where it's hidden) in DH? Wouldn't it be better if they skipped some unnecessary scenes (the waitress, for example :-)) and showed more of the Horcruxes?





From kennyg1864 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 19:44:02 2009
From: kennyg1864 at yahoo.com (kennyg1864)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 19:44:02 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
Message-ID: <h3t8m2+4cth@eGroups.com>

Just saw the movie last night, and:

1. I'd heard beforehand that the DE battle was cut from the script, due to the Hogwarts battle in the 7th movie.

a. Well first of all, that battle is going to be in the *second half* of the 7th movie, which is almost two years away.  It's not like anyone in 2011 will complain "hey we already saw this", since presumably the final Battle of Hogwarts is going to be quite bombastic and prolonged.  Not likely to be confused with the quick Stunning spells etc of four DE's.

b. More important, we had *multiple* scenes of Draco fixing the Vanishing Cabinet, and...for what?  To have witnesses to Dumbledore's death?  So they could... commit two acts of vandalism?  *Way* too much buildup for such a small payoff.  Instead, the director could have dropped one of Draco's VC scenes in favor of a minute or so of "below Tower" curses and screaming.  As filmed, there seemed to be no reason for Draco to go to such lengths to bring DE's to Hogwarts.

2. Why change DD's Petrificus curse to DD ordering Harry to wait below?

a. I suppose it was to show how much Harry trusted DD but (1) Harry already demonstrated this in the Cave and (2) it was awkward to have Harry watching 5 or 6 DE's against 1 DD.  More dramatic to have Harry immobilized (and invisible), unable to help.

b. Not to mention that in the book, DD taking a moment to immobilize Harry was *the* only reason that Draco got the drop on DD.  Without this, there was no way (in the WW) that Draco could have done so.

On a totally unrelated note, I am grateful once again that the actress who portrayed Narcissa was pregnant before the filming of OoTP began, as it allowed Helena Bonham Carter to play Bellatrix instead of her.  HBC's looks are so much better suited to play BL, and she is so perfectly manic in that role.

Other than the two WTF parts above, I thought this was an excellent movie.  It felt more like an "interesting mainstream film" and less like a "fantasy school movie".  The scenes had more "real" moments that the average moviegoer could relate to, instead of just enjoyment by HP fans.  

Don't get me wrong--I've loved all the movies (well except for #3); I just thought this one had a wider appeal.  Partly because our little wizards and witches are growing up and dealing with adult feelings...

kennyg1864, who was glad to see a few people at the 10:20 pm showing who were older than he was 





From md at exit-reality.com  Sat Jul 18 22:52:52 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 18:52:52 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h3t7lk+6ma6@eGroups.com>
References: <001001ca0717$2d112120$87336360$@com> <h3t7lk+6ma6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001501ca07fa$7b8f7ca0$72ae75e0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of eggplant107



"Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> ask yourself: how and why does Harry know what
> and for what use a Beazor is

Harry learned that his very first day at Hogwarts, both the book Harry and
the movie Harry.

> and why does his potions master (not Snape now)
> sit and watch a student die when the solution
> should be clear to him? 

Because Harry is not the type who panics in a crisis and Slughorn was.

> Why does Harry take orders from Snape
> at the end without question? 

Because seconds before Dumbledore specifically asked Harry to get Snape. and
he really did look like he had a plan and was going to help. That's what I
would have thought if I hadn't read the book.

Eggplant

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Hermione mentioning it in class on Harry's first day at Hogwarts 6 years
earlier is not enough to make me think "hey, Harry should remember the
beazor from six years ago when Hermione said it, because Harry ALWAYS
remembers EVERYTHING Hermione says in class."

 

My thing with Slughorn is that that I didn't hear Harry saying "get madam
Pomfrey!" or "Get help! Quick!" while searching. Or even, "Professor! Do you
have a beazor?" You need the scene earlier to know how Harry knows he could
even find a beazor there, only that explains why he doesn't ask Slughorn for
it. Sorry, but I think you're applying your vast knowledge of the stories
and not looking at it at all from the POV of the casual film-goer who only
sees each film once or twice and doesn't read the books.

 

Harry doesn't trust Snape, knows he's working with Malfoy and states earlier
that even Dumbledore makes mistakes It all adds up to Harry SHOULD NOT trust
or listen to Snape.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Sat Jul 18 23:57:42 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 19:57:42 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h3t8m2+4cth@eGroups.com>
References: <h3t8m2+4cth@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002c01ca0803$8a14e630$9e3eb290$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of kennyg1864





b. Not to mention that in the book, DD taking a moment to immobilize Harry
was *the* only reason that Draco got the drop on DD. Without this, there was
no way (in the WW) that Draco could have done so.

On a totally unrelated note, I am grateful once again that the actress who
portrayed Narcissa was pregnant before the filming of OoTP began, as it
allowed Helena Bonham Carter to play Bellatrix instead of her. HBC's looks
are so much better suited to play BL, and she is so perfectly manic in that
role.

Other than the two WTF parts above, I thought this was an excellent movie.
It felt more like an "interesting mainstream film" and less like a "fantasy
school movie". The scenes had more "real" moments that the average moviegoer
could relate to, instead of just enjoyment by HP fans. 

Don't get me wrong--I've loved all the movies (well except for #3); I just
thought this one had a wider appeal. Partly because our little wizards and
witches are growing up and dealing with adult feelings...



:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::??????????????????????/////////////////////
//////////////////)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))(((((((((((((((((((
(((((((((((((\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\?????????????????????????:::
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

I never read it that Draco got the "drop" on DD, but especially knowing what
is disclosed in DH, DD let Draco get the "drop" on him because he wanted the
confrontation, wanted Draco to make a choice. He had shared all the memories
with Harry, got Slughorn's info and taken Harry to find the one Horcrux he
knew where it was hidden. At that point DD knew his time was almost up and
he wanted Draco to make a choice and he was happy with the choice and ready
for Snape to do what he had promised both DD and Malfoy's mother.

The same Director showed DD pushing Harry back to keep him from attacking
Voldy in OOTP, would have fit perfect for him to petrify Harry in HBP in the
same casual manner.

No idea why Draco's mom looked like his grandmother, absolutely worse
costuming and hair in all the films.

I loved #3, think it's the best of all the films, not the most faithful, but
as a stand-alone-film, as a film-not-a-book it's the best by far.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From ekrdg at verizon.net  Sun Jul 19 01:35:24 2009
From: ekrdg at verizon.net (Kimberly)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 21:35:24 -0400
Subject: Moved to tears...
Message-ID: <596F08DC735C471E82FD32533053A4D6@KimberlyPC>

I just got back from seeing HBP and absolutely LOVED it!!  The only thing I would have liked differently was to have the funeral or more of the Fawkes scene at the end.  I also would have liked to have seen the "I am not worried, I am with you" exchange between Harry and Dumbledore.  

I cried from the beginning on the cave scene to the after part with the trio at the tower.  I admit I didn't just cry I sobbed.  Dumbledore isn't even one of my favorite characters but having been so invested in the series for so long must have taken a toll.  I was sad for Dumbledore, for Harry, but also for Draco....I was amazed at how much depth Tom Felton added just by his facial expression.   I was upset for how torn he was and the anguish he was going through.  I didn't get that so strongly in the books.  I was also sad for Snape, knowing now what his motives were and why he had to AK Dumbledore, I could see his personal struggle and it just moved me to tears.   

The romance aspect?   I didn't expect to see so much of the Cormac/Hermione/Ron stuff... I really enjoyed that as well as the whole Hermione/Ron/Lavender triangle.  When Hermione started crying at the Christmas party and the whole scene after that with the birds was wonderfully acted.  She has grown so much as an actress!   I thought all of the acting for the movie was brilliantly done.  (My least favorite was Slughorn...just not what I pictured although he was "okay".)

Kimberly
"The man who doesn't read good books has no advantage over the man who can't read them."
- Mark Twain

http://www.martinherbfarms.com 
http://martinfarms.blogspot.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From kennyg1864 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 19 02:23:37 2009
From: kennyg1864 at yahoo.com (kennyg1864)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 02:23:37 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <002c01ca0803$8a14e630$9e3eb290$@com>
Message-ID: <h3u039+dsc0@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> I never read it that Draco got the "drop" on DD, but especially knowing what is disclosed in DH, DD let Draco get the "drop" on him because he wanted the confrontation, wanted Draco to make a choice. 

Good point--I had forgotten about that in DH.  I remembered only Harry's realization (on the Astronomy Tower) that DD had wordlessly done the PT curse on Harry, and IHHO that was delay/distraction for Draco to do Expelliarmus.  As usual DD was one step ahead...

kennyg1864, who agrees about Cissy's hair, and wonders why Cissy wasn't made as "Aryan" as Lucius or Draco, and thinks their family portrait must suffer as a result :P




From ckc at rochester.rr.com  Sun Jul 19 03:56:29 2009
From: ckc at rochester.rr.com (CK Campbell)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 23:56:29 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h3u039+dsc0@eGroups.com>
References: <002c01ca0803$8a14e630$9e3eb290$@com> <h3u039+dsc0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <EC27FF2F187E4B57957F04EC742BDB86@ckc>

> who agrees about Cissy's hair, 

Maybe she was going brunette with worry.

CK




From md at exit-reality.com  Sun Jul 19 04:39:24 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 00:39:24 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <EC27FF2F187E4B57957F04EC742BDB86@ckc>
References: <002c01ca0803$8a14e630$9e3eb290$@com> <h3u039+dsc0@eGroups.com> <EC27FF2F187E4B57957F04EC742BDB86@ckc>
Message-ID: <001001ca082a$e49689c0$adc39d40$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of CK Campbell
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 11:56 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)

 

  

> who agrees about Cissy's hair, 

Maybe she was going brunette with worry.

CK

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Bride of Frankenstein's Monster.

 

UGH,

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Sun Jul 19 05:24:43 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 05:24:43 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince.
In-Reply-To: <001501ca07fa$7b8f7ca0$72ae75e0$@com>
Message-ID: <h3uamr+v92t@eGroups.com>

 "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> Hermione mentioning it in class on Harry's
> first day at Hogwarts 6 years earlier is not
> enough to make me think "hey, Harry should
> remember the beazor from six years ago 

If first years are expected to know about Beazors it's not unreasonable to expect Harry, a sixth year, to know too.

> My thing with Slughorn is that that I didn't
> hear Harry saying "get madam Pomfrey!" or
> "Get help! Quick!" 

Harry did say "Professor do something!" both in the book and the movie. Slughorn however did nothing, not because he was a bad person but because he was paralyzed with panic. Harry however is always at his best and his mind the clearest is such situations. He quickly realized that Slughorn would be no help at all and further conversation with him would be pointless and only distract him from doing what needed to be done.

> Or even, "Professor! Do you have a beazor?"  

The man was the Potions Master of Hogwarts; of course he had a Beazor!

> Harry SHOULD NOT trust or listen to Snape.

But even at that late date the very ill Dumbledore told Harry that only Snape can help him, and when Snape shows up he gestures to Harry to be quiet, which is just what somebody who planed to attack the Death Eaters and save Dumbledore would do. I've read the book but if I hadn't I would have been taken in by the movie Snape too.

 Eggplant  





From md at exit-reality.com  Sun Jul 19 06:54:25 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 02:54:25 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince.
In-Reply-To: <h3uamr+v92t@eGroups.com>
References: <001501ca07fa$7b8f7ca0$72ae75e0$@com> <h3uamr+v92t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000601ca083d$c119c800$434d5800$@com>

I humbly disagree with your entire post.

 

md

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of eggplant107





But even at that late date the very ill Dumbledore told Harry that only
Snape can help him, and when Snape shows up he gestures to Harry to be
quiet, which is just what somebody who planed to attack the Death Eaters and
save Dumbledore would do. I've read the book but if I hadn't I would have
been taken in by the movie Snape too.



 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From stevejjen at earthlink.net  Sun Jul 19 12:49:46 2009
From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 12:49:46 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince SPOILERS for DH book
In-Reply-To: <h3tf68+t88q@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3v4pa+sl13@eGroups.com>

> Alla:
> 
> You know what's funny Jen? I totally agree with you about the death
> scene, but it so did not bother me and I think (although I may
> change my mind), what I learned about it in DH is a reason for that.
> 
> Let me try to explain. I cried when I read this scene in HBP, I 
> mean, it was so sad as far as I was concerned, sick Dumbledore with
> enemies around him, trying to save Draco and here comes Snape.
> 
> I suppose since I now know that Dumbledore planned his death well
> in advance this scene lost poignancy for me, you know?

Jen: I get what you're saying here.  I have two Dumbledores in my head, the one through HBP and the one post-DH.  The Dumbledore saying 'please' all calm-like and satisfied in the movie remnded me of how he's portrayed by the end of the series.  I just wanted the director to take me back to the other DD!  The one who, once upon a time, I believed to be self-sacrificing and begging Snape for something unknown.

Ah well, you can't go back and maybe Yates knows that.  Maybe he planned the death scene with Dumbledore's full story in mind because his full story is already known.  Although how much of Dumbledore's backstory will be in the DH movies is difficult to decipher now.  The cave scene doesn't make it clear that he's a man suffering for his past deeds. ??

Alla:
> There is of course Snape's anguish one way or another, which he
> still feels, but since when do I care about Snape's anguish, hehe.

Jen: LOL, still not one little shread of caring?  







From dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 19 13:58:13 2009
From: dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com (dumbledore11214)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 13:58:13 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince SPOILERS for DH book
In-Reply-To: <h3v4pa+sl13@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3v8pl+pda7@eGroups.com>

> Jen: <SNIP>.
> 
> Ah well, you can't go back and maybe Yates knows that.  Maybe he planned the death scene with Dumbledore's full story in mind because his full story is already known.  Although how much of Dumbledore's backstory will be in the DH movies is difficult to decipher now.  The cave scene doesn't make it clear that he's a man suffering for his past deeds. ??


Alla:

Yeah I think it is quite possible that death scene was planned with knowledge of what's gonna happen later. But yeah it is everybody's bet what of Dumbledore's story would be left in. I mean, if people who never read the books will not say prophecy what prophecy, then I can totally imagine that the answer to question about Arianna would be what Arianna. Sigh.



> 
> Alla:
> > There is of course Snape's anguish one way or another, which he
> > still feels, but since when do I care about Snape's anguish, hehe.
> 
> Jen: LOL, still not one little shread of caring?
>


Alla:

No dearest, I am sorry. I will tell you this in the last book there were two places where I came dangerously close to feeling some sort of pity for him. When Harry talks about him, Snape and Riddle as lost boys, that was one moment and "look at me" COULD have been such moment. Had Snape as I said would have added after that 'I was wrong, Potter, you are not your father". It would not have erased all the disgust I felt about how he treated Harry, but it certainly would have made me feel pity for him as somebody who expressed remorse, etc.

Since he did not, all I felt is joy that he died and Harry's kids and any other kids in Hogwarts who had a nerve to be related to those he despised would not have to endure him.

But now, I am not even sure that these two moments will be in the movies anyway.

As I said though, Tom Felton made me feel pity for Draco. That was a shock by itself hehe.

Alla




From brian at rescueddoggies.com  Sun Jul 19 13:52:30 2009
From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 10:52:30 -0300
Subject: Movie review
Message-ID: <4A63251E.4060100@rescueddoggies.com>

I discovered that I didn't HAVE to boycott the first week of Half Blood 
Prince here in Argentina, the government did it for me! 
We are in the middle of a declared medical emergency with swine flu and 
they are so scared of masses of people congregating to see it that they 
delayed the release until NEXT Thursday.  Personally I can't see that 
delaying it a week or so is going to make much difference.
Having heard so much about it, I did manage to procure a pirate copy 
(they sell pirate movies openly in the streets here) without having to 
pay for it.  (I don't have kids so I don't have to worry about what I'm 
teaching them as Warner Brothers says I should.  Even if I did have 
kids, as Warner Brothers thinks dishonesty is okay when it suits them, 
why should I worry about them?) - Their actions changed my mind about 
pirate movies - I never used to buy them on moral grounds, I do now.

ANYHOW - MOVIE REVIEW
I have to be honest, I was so disappointed by the movie that I wouldn't 
even bother seeing it if it was for the fact that I want to see the 
Millenium Bridge destroyed in 3D.
To be fair to Warner Brothers, I found the sixth book boring and 
pedestrian, so to me, it seems like that Warner Brothers have made it 
like the book in that respect.
It was amusing in places, but there was too much which didn't make sense 
or I just didn't like.
The attack on the bridge (years before it was built), didn't look that 
great (which is why I want to see it in 3D)
Harry using sectumsempra on Draco without Draco attempting the Crucio first.
The attack on the Burrow
Dumbledore not petrifying Harry to stop him trying to save him
Pointless entry of deatheaters into Hogwarts for a non-existent final battle
Missing the attack on Bill and Fleur's declaration of love for him - 
Molly coming to terms with Fleur was a great moment in the book
Missing Dumbledore's funeral and the attempt to make Harry into a 
Ministry puppet.
Hey!  They even missed U-NO-POO!

Emma Watson claims that she's a "book purest" and stood up to WB when 
they wanted Hermione to say things she felt were out of character.  All 
I can say is that she must be alone.  Harry's action in the bathroom 
with Draco and not trying to help as DD is murdered are so Out Of 
Character that I wonder if Dan read or understood the book!

And the romance?  The Ron and Lavender bit was done okay, though nowhere 
near as funny as reviews had led me to expect.
The scenes to establish that Harry is with Ginny before he gets together 
with her were clumsy, the questions by Dumbledore and Hermione comparing 
her hurt seeing Ron (with Lavender) with how Harry feels seeing Ginny 
comes across as forced and spoils what otherwise is a very nice original 
scene.
We hardly see Harry with Ginny at all once they are supposedly together 
and the less said about the kiss the better.  Less is more?
While they (mainly Emma) captured some of the angst of teenage 
relationships, I'd have to say WHAT romance?

Up to now, with the exception of POA, I've enjoyed each movie more than 
the last.  In fact I thought the movies did more to make the characters 
human and emotionally real than JKR ever did. After the drama of 
Phoenix, I hoped for something better, but, like the book, this movie 
seems like a filler.
Up to now, I've bought all the double DVDs.  If I buy this one at all, 
it will be simply to make the collection complete and for no other reason

Brian



From secretwindow-jd1 at sbcglobal.net  Sun Jul 19 12:54:02 2009
From: secretwindow-jd1 at sbcglobal.net (maria)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 05:54:02 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: DH Movies (was Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince SPOILERS for DH book)
Message-ID: <609816.90607.qm@web83005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>



I heard there is two more movies yet to come....2 for the
Deathly Hallows.


 MJ(RIP 6/25/09)~Maria















From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 19 17:55:12 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 17:55:12 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <001501ca07fa$7b8f7ca0$72ae75e0$@com>
Message-ID: <h3vmm0+6apo@eGroups.com>

md wrote:
> Hermione mentioning it in class on Harry's first day at Hogwarts 6 years earlier is not enough to make me think "hey, Harry should remember the beazor from six years ago when Hermione said it, because Harry ALWAYS remembers EVERYTHING Hermione says in class."

Carol responds:
Hermione didn't mention it (though she had her hand up and knew the answer). Snape did, in both the film and the book. It was part of that memorable first Potions lesson. Viewers who've read the books or seen the films should, in theory, remember the bezoar from SS/PS. But the point is emphasized in the book--the HBP's snidely clever "just shove a bezoar in their mouths" causes Harry to remember that first lesson (teenage Snape reinforcing the adult Snape though Harry doesn't know it). Harry's cheating in Potions by handing Slughorn a bezoar (and being rewarded for his cheek) instead of understanding Golpolott's Law and creating the antidote to a mixed poison is the reason is the reason that Book!Slughorn happens to have a bezoar in his bag. So the logic of the scene is evidently missing along with the irony that Snape and the HBP (Snape again) together taught Harry what he needed to save Ron. (And Harry doesn't always remember everything Hermione says in class any more than he remembers what the teachers say (unless it's Trelawney predicting his death). His mind is usually elsewhere.

Carol responds:
I still haven't seen the film so I don't know whether the scene works as written, and it's hard to know what a person who hasn't read the books would think of it--whether it works for those viewers, I mean.
>  
md: 
> Harry doesn't trust Snape, knows he's working with Malfoy and states earlier that even Dumbledore makes mistakes It all adds up to Harry SHOULD NOT trust or listen to Snape.

Carol responds:
I'd put "knows" in quotation marks there as I assume that Snape is protecting Draco and trying to find out what he's doing in the film just as in the book. However, I know from a clip that film!Harry tells Slughorn that he doesn't trust Snape (I guess the filmmakers are trying to partially cover the absence of Harry's heated discussion with DD at the end of OoP), but beyond the overhearing (and misunderstanding) of the conversation with Draco, what reason (other than mutual dislike) does movie!Harry have for *distrusting* as opposed to disliking Snape? (I realize that they omitted his sending the Order to the MoM in OoP, which I think is an unfortunate oversight.)

It looks to me as if movie!Snape removes the curse from the opal necklace and saves Draco, as in the book. If they've also including DD's references to Snape saving DD from the ring curse and Katie Bell from the cursed necklace (both of which show which side he's really on), I suppose they're counting on the Spinner's End scene to make him look evil and treacherous.

At any rate, I haven't yet seen the film, but it seems to me that having Harry hide under the stairs (or whatever) and obeying Snape is a mistake, out of character for Harry, less dramatic than the original, etc. And I disagree with Alla about a weakened Dumbledore being unnecessary to the scene--it showed the potency of that horrible potion and it made the moment more gut-wrenching for Harry and the reader and probably for Snape as well. His revulsion at having to kill Dumbledore should match Harry's in having to feed DD the potion in the first place.

I think part of the problem is that neither Rickman nor Gambon has read the books. If they had, they'd understand how that scene is *supposed* to be played and protest against the rewriting of it.

Carol, glad that she knows about the uncanonical moments before seeing the film because otherwise they might spoil it for her




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 19 18:18:05 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 18:18:05 -0000
Subject: Movie review
In-Reply-To: <4A63251E.4060100@rescueddoggies.com>
Message-ID: <h3vo0t+m76v@eGroups.com>

Brian wrote:
<snip>
> Up to now, with the exception of POA, I've enjoyed each movie more than the last.  In fact I thought the movies did more to make the characters human and emotionally real than JKR ever did. After the drama of Phoenix, I hoped for something better, but, like the book, this movie seems like a filler. <snip>

Carol responds:

I can't speak for the film yet, but I certainly don't regard HBP the book as filler, probably because I'm a Snape fan. "Spinner's End" gave me a thrill of horror like nothing else before it because I knew that Snape was swearing to commit some deed he didn't want to commit or die. I loved getting the background on young Snape (I was pretty sure that he was the HBP long before the revelation). Both the cave scene and the tower scene were riveting and I was torn to pieces wanting to believe that Snape was good but feeling that perhaps I'd been wrong, in which case JKR had "betrayed" (misled) me. I liked the glimpses of young Riddle and the Gaunts in the Pensieve, too (most of them chopped from the movie). I didn't think it was at all pedestrian. I'm trying to think of moments I *didn't* like and all I can think of is the "chest monster" and Harry's so quickly getting over his guilt and shock for performing Sectumsempra on Draco. Okay, anything in HBP with Ginny in it annoys me, but I thought the book was brilliant in both the American and the British slang sense.

Naturally, I had high hopes for the film and still hope that at least some of my favorite moments, especially those involving Snape, will be preserved. (I'll just have to imagine Narcissa as youngish, beautiful, and blonde, playing helpless maiden to Snape's knight in monk's clothing).

Carol, who understands that all of us have different perspectives and not trying to persuade Brian to like the book





From dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 19 18:53:04 2009
From: dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com (dumbledore11214)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 18:53:04 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince SPOILERS for DH
In-Reply-To: <h3vmm0+6apo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3vq2g+q39g@eGroups.com>

Carol:
<SNIP>
And I disagree with
Alla about a weakened Dumbledore being unnecessary to the scene--it showed the
potency of that horrible potion and it made the moment more gut-wrenching for
Harry and the reader and probably for Snape as well. His revulsion at having to
kill Dumbledore should match Harry's in having to feed DD the potion in the
first place. <SNIP>


Alla:

I did not say that it was unnecessary to the scene. Of course it is necessary to the scene in the book for all the reasons you described and to be faithful to the book it could have been there. I am sure JKR still wants us to sympathize with Dumbledore in this scene, she just cannot convince this reader and viewer to do so anymore.


I said that in light of new information in DH scene lost its poignancy for me and to me it does not matter anymore whethere Dumbledore looks sick or not. I was feeling a lot of sympathy for him in part because he was in so much pain. All this sympathy is now gone. Even if his body is shown to be suffering in the book I still see a man who IMO methodically and mercilessly enlisted unwilling man  to do his bidding for him. Thus in the book I still see Dumbledore who is in his mind extremely satisfied that his plan came to the fruition. To me all that filmmakers did was to materialize Dumbledore as he is imagining himself in his mind if that makes sense.

JMO,

Alla




From md at exit-reality.com  Sun Jul 19 19:42:39 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 15:42:39 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h3vmm0+6apo@eGroups.com>
References: <001501ca07fa$7b8f7ca0$72ae75e0$@com> <h3vmm0+6apo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <006401ca08a9$13603d90$3a20b8b0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto


md: 
> Harry doesn't trust Snape, knows he's working with Malfoy and states
earlier that even Dumbledore makes mistakes It all adds up to Harry SHOULD
NOT trust or listen to Snape.

Carol responds:
I'd put "knows" in quotation marks there as I assume that Snape is
protecting Draco and trying to find out what he's doing in the film just as
in the book. 

""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""

In both book and film Snape knows Draco is to kill DD, the how is the only
question. There are 2 scenes in the film where Harry states he doesn't trust
Snape and backs it up by stating that DD has made mistakes before. He hears
Snape very clearly tell Draco he's taken the Vow to protect him and Harry
knows the price to break that vow is death, so Harry knows at the tower that
Snape must first look after Malfoy or die himself. He also knows from the
conversation between Draco and DD that Draco must kill DD or die, so he
knows that Snape must make sure Draco succeeds or he will die from the vow.
EITHER WAY, HARRY KNOWS so it makes no sense that he listens to Snape or
stands there idly. The writer and director screwed up.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Sun Jul 19 20:54:32 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 20:54:32 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince.
In-Reply-To: <h3vmm0+6apo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h40168+evpb@eGroups.com>

"Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:


> I realize that they omitted his sending
> the Order to the MoM in OoP, which I think
> is an unfortunate oversight.)

I don't see what's so important about having that in the OoP movie, it tells us nothing about Snape's character. Voldemort's plan was to
trick Harry to go to the ministry, but when Snape showed up Harry was
already caught by Umbrage so Snape figured the plan had failed, it probably never occurred to him that Harry would manage to escape and make it all the way to the ministry. With the plan canceled anyway it couldn't hurt to tell the Order of the Phoenix what Harry said, in fact he had to if he wanted to remain a spy. Dozens of people heard Harry talk to Snape about padfoot and sooner or later The Order would hear about it and wonder why Snape didn't tell them immediately.

So if Snape was a spy for Voldemort he would tell the Phoenix order what Harry said, if Snape was not a bad guy and spy he'd tell the order too, so we learn nothing.

 Eggplant







From cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 20:56:43 2009
From: cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com (Cassandra Wladyslava)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:56:43 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood 
	Prince
In-Reply-To: <006401ca08a9$13603d90$3a20b8b0$@com>
References: <001501ca07fa$7b8f7ca0$72ae75e0$@com> <h3vmm0+6apo@eGroups.com>
	 <006401ca08a9$13603d90$3a20b8b0$@com>
Message-ID: <d0874c890907191356k7547fb3dj9444d07004f921a3@mail.gmail.com>

md wrote:
 Hermione mentioning it in class on Harry's first day at Hogwarts 6 years
earlier is not enough to make me think "hey, Harry should remember the
beazor from six years ago when Hermione said it, because Harry ALWAYS
remembers EVERYTHING Hermione says in class."
Carol responds:
Hermione didn't mention it (though she had her hand up and knew the answer).
Snape did, in both the film and the book. It was part of that memorable
first Potions lesson. Viewers who've read the books or seen the films
should, in theory, remember the bezoar from SS/PS. <snip>

Cassie (Me):

Actually, people who have seen the first movie may not know about the
bezoar.  That scene was extended on the VHS/DVD (and when it was put on TV,
I think).


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From SnowyHome at aol.com  Sun Jul 19 19:29:09 2009
From: SnowyHome at aol.com (Cathy)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 19:29:09 -0000
Subject: The Acting in HBP (and Kelley's welcome)
In-Reply-To: <h3fvid+hge0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h3vs65+9k53@eGroups.com>


  
> Kelley posted:
> Hi, Cathy, welcome.  Just by the by, her spot on Letterman's
> on youtube:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fH3uyvnqh7k> 
> She is just delightful.  :-)
> 

Hi Kelley,

  Thanks for the welcome and the youtube link! Very appreciated.
I saw Emma on our Dishnet BBCA Jonathon Rose show (I think that is his name). She was "delightful" there too!

  After seeing HBP, I thought her acting was even better than in the other films. She has realy grown as an actress. I'm not sure Rupert can play roles different in type than Rob; but I'm sure Daniel and Emma will be able to take on many different roles. I also had always missed Richard Harris as Dumbledore; but in HBP, I thought Michael Gambon was just wonderful! It also gave Draco a chance to do more and I think he was up to it. I always enjoy Luna's acting.... so natural! Snape,of course, is brilliant as usual I thought.

  I loved the movie. I think it may be my favorite mainly because of all the love I saw in Dumbledore this time. 

Cathy









From harriedwith2angels at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 19 22:25:01 2009
From: harriedwith2angels at yahoo.com (Doreen)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 22:25:01 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <d0874c890907191356k7547fb3dj9444d07004f921a3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <h406ft+kpbs@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, Cassandra Wladyslava <cassandra.wladyslava at ...> wrote:
>
> Carol responds:
> Hermione didn't mention it (though she had her hand up and knew the answer).
> Snape did, in both the film and the book. It was part of that memorable
> first Potions lesson. Viewers who've read the books or seen the films
> should, in theory, remember the bezoar from SS/PS. <snip>
> 
> Cassie (Me):
> 
> Actually, people who have seen the first movie may not know about the
> bezoar.  That scene was extended on the VHS/DVD (and when it was put on TV,
> I think).
> 

Doreen:
People who have seen HBP should know about the bezoar.  Harry visits Slughorn as he's finishing a potions class with younger students.  Bezoar is mentioned as a poison antedote right before the students are dismissed, while Harry is in the classroom.  I remember it distinctly as I thought to myself, "Ah, that's how Harry will know to use it with Ron later."  I think they even showed Slughorn putting it away in his potions kit.  All this bezoar talk is funny as it is in the 6th movie.  Hope this helps!





From kelley_thompson at sbcglobal.net  Sun Jul 19 23:09:56 2009
From: kelley_thompson at sbcglobal.net (Kelley)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 23:09:56 -0000
Subject: The Acting in HBP (and Kelley's welcome)
In-Reply-To: <h3vs65+9k53@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h40944+lbkn@eGroups.com>


Cathy: 
> Thanks for the welcome and the youtube link! Very
> appreciated. 

Kelley:
Oh, you're most welcome. :)

Cathy:
> I saw Emma on our Dishnet BBCA Jonathon Rose show (I 
> think that is his name). She was "delightful" there 
> too!

Kelley:  Haha, I believe it.
 
Cathy:
> After seeing HBP, I thought her acting was even better 
than in the other films. She has realy grown as an actress. 
I'm not sure Rupert can play roles different in type than 
Rob; but I'm sure Daniel and Emma will be able to take on 
> many different roles. 

Kelley:
Yes, it's really something watching how they've each 
progressed from movie to movie...


Cathy:
> I also had always missed Richard Harris as Dumbledore; 
but in HBP, I thought Michael Gambon was just wonderful! 

Kelley:
That's good to hear (I haven't seen it yet, holding off
to see it with a friend); I haven't been crazy about how
Gambon portrays Dumbledore, so yes, glad to hear this.

Cathy:
> <snip> I loved the movie. I think it may be my favorite
> mainly because of all the love I saw in Dumbledore this
> time. 

Kelley:
Wow, okay, very good; sounds like he's finally really 
doing Dumbledore.  Good deal.





From md at exit-reality.com  Sun Jul 19 23:31:30 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 19:31:30 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h406ft+kpbs@eGroups.com>
References: <d0874c890907191356k7547fb3dj9444d07004f921a3@mail.gmail.com> <h406ft+kpbs@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000901ca08c9$0b4413a0$21cc3ae0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Doreen





Doreen:
People who have seen HBP should know about the bezoar. Harry visits Slughorn
as he's finishing a potions class with younger students. Bezoar is mentioned
as a poison antedote right before the students are dismissed, while Harry is
in the classroom. I remember it distinctly as I thought to myself, "Ah,
that's how Harry will know to use it with Ron later." I think they even
showed Slughorn putting it away in his potions kit. All this bezoar talk is
funny as it is in the 6th movie. Hope this helps!

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

 

It was so obvious that even people who have seen it two and three times
didn't catch it . I know I was absolutely paying no attention to what the
lesson was about. Would have been easier just to have Harry read it in the
book and answer it in class like in the book.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From lizzy1933 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 02:43:55 2009
From: lizzy1933 at yahoo.com (Lizzie Mae Lilly)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 02:43:55 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h3t68b+gb6c@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h40llb+q3d7@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
>
> 
> Interestingly, she's read the books (unlike Michael Gambon and, of all people, Alan Rickman!).

Whenever I read that quote from Gambon's interview, I feel compelled to jump to Alan's defense!  He has indeed read the books; admitted as much from the beginning and in a recent interview talked about reading DH.

I have no idea why Gambon made such a stupid statement except I've read he's quite the jokester and enjoys sending up the press.

Lizzie




From vincentjh at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 05:39:45 2009
From: vincentjh at yahoo.com (vincentjh)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 05:39:45 -0000
Subject: The Acting in HBP (and Kelley's welcome)
In-Reply-To: <h3vs65+9k53@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h40vv1+hvpe@eGroups.com>

Cathy posted:

>   After seeing HBP, I thought her acting was even better than in the other films. She has realy grown as an actress. I'm not sure Rupert can play roles different in type than Rob; but I'm sure Daniel and Emma will be able to take on many different roles. I also had always missed Richard Harris as Dumbledore; but in HBP, I thought Michael Gambon was just wonderful! It also gave Draco a chance to do more and I think he was up to it. I always enjoy Luna's acting.... so natural! Snape,of course, is brilliant as usual I thought.



Agreed that Emma is much improved in HBP. Her eyebrows are under control now.

By the way, Rupert has played roles very different from Ron (or Rob, as you called him). His acting has been limited by the scripts of HP movies but that doesn't mean he's limited as an actor. He was an introvert in Driving Lessons and was quite convincing. Also has two new films coming up. One is an action/comedy type of thing with Bill Nighy. I have no idea what his character is like. Another is an Irish teen flick called Cherry Bomb. There are some clips on youtube: 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBZ8mTtoI9I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BTpxFfFy8Ng

-VJH




From brian at rescueddoggies.com  Mon Jul 20 13:37:22 2009
From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 13:37:22 -0000
Subject: HP6 - GROSS - in perspective
Message-ID: <h41rui+a6e7@eGroups.com>

After the outstanding results of the first day and night, the results for the first few days, while good, aren't the spectacular success some in this group have wanted to portray.

The important 3 day weekend US takings were $79.5 million an increase of only 3 1/2% on Order of the Phoenix ($77m) two years ago, while overall takings for all movies increased b over 10% in last year alone.

And to quote the New york Times... "It should be noted that many people interested in going to the movies over the weekend didn't have much choice but to see "Half-Blood Prince." A huge number ? 4,325 theaters ? showed the film, many on multiple screens, and Hollywood got out of Harry Potter's way almost entirely; the only other movie to open over the weekend was the Fox Searchlight romance "(500) Days of Summer," in 27 theaters.

In other words, once the fanatics had all gone in the first 24 hours, giving WB their headlines, the full 3 day weekend results were rather less spectacular even with the advantage of no competition and much greter hype and pre-launch promotion than I remember for any previous HP film.

To be fair to Warner Brothers (why?) their 5 day results showed an increase of around 13-14% compared to OOP two years ago and they lacked the income from IMAX.
But even this hardly warrants the headline "The boy wizard's box office powers are stronger than ever."

Perhaps the boycott by many fans with principles (we AREN'T fair-weather fans as one poster here called us) made an impact after all.

Although Warner Brothers have probably ruined some things in the seventh book by the inept way they adapted the sixth, I really hope that they give us two incredible and spectacular films to finish the series and do justice to the books and their incredible base of loyal fans.

Brian




From jamiesonwolf at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 14:34:36 2009
From: jamiesonwolf at gmail.com (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 14:34:36 -0000
Subject: My review of Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince
Message-ID: <h41v9s+m192@eGroups.com>

Hey all,

I thought I'd post my review of HP and the HBP. I've kept it spoiler free for those of you who haven't seen the movie yet (of which I'm sure there are very few people who haven't seen it yet LOL) 

Cheers,
Jamieson



I saw Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince today; I'm pretty sure that I'm still in shock.

For those that haven't read the books, here is the quick run down of the movie. Harry Potter must help Dumbledore with a grave task this year. He must help Dumbledore procure a memory of the teenaged Voldemort.

If Harry succeeds, they will know more about their enemy and defeat him. If he doesn't succeed, Voldemort will win.

But there is more going on this time around. A wizarding war has begun and the damage and destruction has spread to the Muggle world. Neither Muggle nor Wizard or Witch is safe. Everything is in turmoil.

Harry also discovers an old potions book that used to belong to the Half-Blood Prince. Who is the Half-Blood Prince and will the book be more of a hindrance to Harry than a helping hand?

Will Harry get the memory from the new potions master, Professor Slughorn? Will they solve the mystery of Voldemort's past? Will he be able to confess his feelings towards Ginny, Ron's younger sister?

Will they succeed? And at what cost?

Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince is, by far, the best movie out of the series. David Yates has built upon his already considerable skill and gone above and beyond with Half-Blood Prince. Though his direction of Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix was superb, Half-Blood Prince is even better.

Yates and Steve Knowles, the screenwriter, have taken what it perhaps the most difficult and clunky of the books in the series and transformed The Half-Blood Prince into something streamlined and beautiful.

The book was incredible but the flashbacks, while a good literary device, would have felt laborious and repetitive in visual format. Knowles has taken a book that goes all over the place (hormones, a country at war, dark wizards, love, secrets revealed, questions unanswered) and transformed it into something that is funny, touching, dark and emotionally moving. No mere feat, I assure you.

And the performances in Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince were incredible. Watson, Radcliffe and Grint are developing into incredible actors with great comedic and dramatic timing. Most notable, however, are Michael Gambon as Dumbledore and Alan Rickamn as Snape.

Both actors are downplaying their characters this time around, giving us more subtle, quiet performances that are incredibly powerful because of their quietness. Rickman as Serverus Snape is not as angry this time around but no less evil. Dumbledore is far more grim and serious and we can see the weight of the world on his shoulders.

However, I should mention that Freddie Stroma as Cormac McLaggen, Jessie Cave as Lavender Brown and Tom Felton as Draco Malfoy really make the movie. Though they are smaller rolls, they really shone in this movie and made it more than it could have been.

I was also surprised by how incredibly funny the film was. Yates and Knowles really know how to balance out the dark with the comedic and there were quite a few parts that had me snorting into my popcorn. I found this surprising as the book itself had an incredible dark and antsy tone to it. They took the movie in a direction I didn't think possible and pulled it off incredibly well.

The effects were amazing, the acting incredible, the pace lightning fast, making for an excellent film. But be warned: this is not the warm Harry Potter we were introduced to in Harry Potter and the Philosophers Stone. Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince shows us the series at it's most dark and grim. But it is necessary to prepare us for what is to come.

This is without a doubt my favourite in the series of films so far. I know that I'm going to have to go and see it a few more times just to take it all in.

After watching Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince, I can believe that magic, real magic, truly does exist. 




From brian at rescueddoggies.com  Mon Jul 20 14:25:05 2009
From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 14:25:05 -0000
Subject: HBP SPOILERS
In-Reply-To: <h3qbsh+ga4a@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h41uo1+e834@eGroups.com>


--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "marion11111"
<marion11111 at ...> wrote:
>
> I'm sure Ginny will have a bigger role in the next movie
than she does in the book seeing as Bonnie Wright is turning
out to be a very good actor. I still find the Katie Bell scene
to be one of the creepiest things I've seen and more so in the
movie than the trailers.  There's an image for nightmares.
>


I completely agree.  Bonnie Wright has talent which is sadly
under-exposed in the films, though we can't blame WB for that,
JKR underused Ginny completely - she was a cardboard cutout
character in the books, which is why so many fans found it
hard to see her end up with Harry.

I also agree with you on Tom Felton and on the great Katie
Bell scene.

Brian



From jamiesonwolf at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 14:41:35 2009
From: jamiesonwolf at gmail.com (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 14:41:35 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h3t8m2+4cth@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h41vmv+ugvh@eGroups.com>

kennyg1864 <kennyg1864 at ...> wrote:
> Just saw the movie last night, and:
>
> 1. I'd heard beforehand that the DE battle was cut from
the script, due to the Hogwarts battle in the 7th movie.
>
> a. Well first of all, that battle is going to be in the
*second half* of the 7th movie, which is almost two years
away.  <snip>
>
> b. More important, we had *multiple* scenes of Draco
fixing the Vanishing Cabinet, and...for what?  To have
witnesses to Dumbledore's death?  So they could... commit
two acts of vandalism?  *Way* too much buildup for such a
small payoff. <snip>
>
> 2. Why change DD's Petrificus curse to DD ordering Harry
to wait below?
>
> a. I suppose it was to show how much Harry trusted DD but
(1) Harry already demonstrated this in the Cave and (2) it
was awkward to have Harry watching 5 or 6 DE's against 1 DD.
More dramatic to have Harry immobilized (and invisible),
unable to help.
>
> <snip>


Jamieson:
I agree with most of these points, but it made me think of
the only WTF moment that I'm still pondering...the whole
burning of the Burrow scene.

Now, it was a GREAT scene and if I hadn't read the books it
fits right in with everything, but it was the only moment
watching the film where I was like: What? What are they
doing? What the heck?

Now, my husband, who hasn't read the books, didn't mind the
scene at all. In fact I'd have to agree with him that it fit
right in with the movie and was done seamlessly; it didn't
feel like a scene they'd just tacked on.

But still, I'm left wondering why they added it. Perhaps
because the movie needed a bit more action? Still not sure.

Great movie though.

Cheers,
Jamieson



From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 17:35:37 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 17:35:37 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h41vmv+ugvh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h429t9+f3h0@eGroups.com>


> Jamieson:
> I agree with most of these points, but it made me think of
> the only WTF moment that I'm still pondering...the whole
> burning of the Burrow scene.
>
>snip
>
> I'm left wondering why they added it. Perhaps
> because the movie needed a bit more action? Still not sure.


Joann:
I've been wondering about this myself. One of the(many)interviews I read recently said they felt the needed this scene. What does the scene accomplish?

1. Remus and Tonks-the fact that they are a couple
2. Harry and Ginny-almost first kiss and Ginny putting herself in danger for Harry
3. Mr. Weasley telling Harry about the vanishing cabinet. 
4. A sense of danger around the corner at all times.

It was a good scene. I liked it. They could have had Remus and Tonks at the burrow in the beginning, and H/G almost kiss at Hogwarts. I'm thinking the action was the main reason. 

It was strange however, that it was snowing at Hogwarts, but not at the burrow, and warm enough for Ginny to run around outside in a robe. I wonder about the choice to put her in a robe. 

Were there any interviews where someone stated why they thought they needed that scene?

Joann
who noticed on her second viewing yesterday Slughorn mentioning the bezoar in front of Harry and then putting it away in his trunk.





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 19:24:02 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 19:24:02 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince SPOILERS for DH
In-Reply-To: <h3vq2g+q39g@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42g8i+45rh@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> <SNIP>
> And I disagree with Alla about a weakened Dumbledore being unnecessary to the scene--it showed the potency of that horrible potion and it made the moment more gut-wrenching for Harry and the reader and probably for Snape as well. His revulsion at having to kill Dumbledore should match Harry's in having to feed DD the potion in the first place. <SNIP>
> 
> 
> Alla:
> 
> I did not say that it was unnecessary to the scene. Of course it is necessary to the scene in the book for all the reasons you described and to be faithful to the book it could have been there. I am sure JKR still wants us to sympathize with Dumbledore in this scene, she just cannot convince this reader and viewer to do so anymore.
> 
> I said that in light of new information in DH scene lost its poignancy for me and to me it does not matter anymore whethere Dumbledore looks sick or not. I was feeling a lot of sympathy for him in part because he was in so much pain. All this sympathy is now gone. Even if his body is shown to be suffering in the book I still see a man who IMO methodically and mercilessly enlisted unwilling man  to do his bidding for him. Thus in the book I still see Dumbledore who is in his mind extremely satisfied that his plan came to the fruition. To me all that filmmakers did was to materialize Dumbledore as he is imagining himself in his mind if that makes sense.

Carol responds:

I see. Sorry I misunderstood you. Strange, isn't it, how such a powerful scene in the book (it tore me to pieces on first reading) loses its power once we know for sure that DD planned it all (and still wants Snape to kill him even after the Elder Wand has literally gone out the window). I still feel sorry for Snape, though, and I still feel some compassion for DD (and more for Harry) in the cave scene.

But I'd like viewers of the film (those who haven't read the books) to feel the full impact of the scene as readers of HBP experienced it, whether they think that Snape is a traitor and murderer (the intended reaction of both JKR and the filmmakers, presumably) or hope that Snape is really Dumbledore's man, acting on his orders (as Book!Hagrid actually suggests before he realizes that DD is actually dead).

Anyway, sometimes a scene played out on the screen more or less as written in the book its based on can create an emotional impact even though we know what's going to happen. ("Fly, you fools!" in "Fellowship of the Ring," for example, though, of course, there's no way to replicate the grief and horror I felt when I first read that scene at age fifteen. But for moviegoers who hadn't read the book--or seen previews with Gandalf the White, it must have been devastating.)

Of course, if our feelings about the character have changed as dramatically as yours for DD have done, I suppose it makes no difference how well the scene is written or performed. For me, that scene is a precursor to the tragedy of Snape's death (and the Elder Wand fiasco, but I won't go there.) And it also explains *Harry's* feelings, especially his continued hatred of and desire for revenge against Snape, all of which makes the truth more poignant when its revealed in DH. Dumbledore's weakness and helplessness make "Severus, please!" more terrible for *him,* and, of course, make Snape seem all the more evil. And all of that is taken away--in part because neither Rickman nor Gambon has bothered to read the books, so neither knows how the scene is supposed to play out.

Obviously, of course, it can never have the full impact of the written scene for those who have read the books, but it's unfair, IMO, to deprive filmgoers who haven't read the books of the opportunity to feel as we did in the year or so that we waited for DH to come out. The tower scene was primarily responsible for the suspense and even dread that many of us felt, not to mention the heightened pro-Snape, anti-Snape tension on the list. (I'm sure that it's hard for them to remain completely unspoiled as we were, but still, the revelations in DH ought to be properly set up.)

Carol, who thinks that she would have cried over the tower scene if it had been depicted as it is in the book despite knowing what's to come and disappointed that she won't get the opportunity to find out




From stevejjen at earthlink.net  Mon Jul 20 19:39:16 2009
From: stevejjen at earthlink.net (Jen Reese)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 19:39:16 -0000
Subject: My review of Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h41v9s+m192@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42h54+nuf3@eGroups.com>

Jamieson:
> Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince is, by far, the best movie 
> out of the series. David Yates has built upon his already 
> considerable skill and gone above and beyond with Half-Blood 
> Prince. Though his direction of Harry Potter and the Order of the
> Phoenix was superb, Half-Blood Prince is even better.
> 
> Yates and Steve Knowles, the screenwriter, have taken what it 
> perhaps the most difficult and clunky of the books in the series 
> and transformed The Half-Blood Prince into something streamlined
> and beautiful.

Jen: This isn't meant to be a quibble with your opinion, just an alternative.  OOTP was the best movie to me because Kloves *wasn't* the screenwriter.  He likes to give lines to other characters. He develops the children almost to the exclusion of the adults.  He favors Hermione over Ron.  Kloves never developed the animosity between Snape and Harry to the level it needs to be for the series.  In this movie, Kloves gives short shrift to the Dumbledore-Snape relationship as well as the Half-blood Prince & Riddle backstories(like he made the Marauders a background moment in POA). I'm sorry he's back to adapt DH.  

Jamieson: 
> The book was incredible but the flashbacks, while a good literary 
> device, would have felt laborious and repetitive in visual format.
> Knowles has taken a book that goes all over the place (hormones, a 
> country at war, dark wizards, love, secrets revealed, questions
> unanswered) and transformed it into something that is funny,
>  touching, dark and emotionally moving. No mere feat, I assure you.


Jen: The flashbacks are a more important part of HBP than the movie makes clear. The core of the series is Voldemort & Harry's mysterious relationship.  There's nothing in the HBP movie about why LV chose the Horcruxes he did so that Harry might gather clues for the future; nothing about how Riddle's family background & the Salazar Slytherin connection drove LV to feel both superior and obsessed with his immortality.  Voldemort's story is gutted.

The romance is funny & poignant.  It was a big part of HBP.  But if you're adapting a huge book into a movie, the critical elements need to be the foundation instead of an afterthought.

Jamieson: 
> And the performances in Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince were
> incredible. 

Jen: I agree. Felton and Broadbent particularly impressed me, along with Jessie Cave and the Trio.  Unfortunately, Rickman and Gambon didn't get a chance to act out the best moments of Snape and Dumbledore. 




From kennyg1864 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 19:34:52 2009
From: kennyg1864 at yahoo.com (kennyg1864)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 19:34:52 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h429t9+f3h0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42gss+ajrj@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "coolbeans3131" <coolbeans3131 at ...> wrote:

> Joann:
> I've been wondering about this myself. One of the(many)interviews I read recently said they felt the needed this scene. What does the scene accomplish?
> 3. Mr. Weasley telling Harry about the vanishing cabinet. 

I missed that...yet *another* cabinet reference in the movie, that builds our anticipation for...what?  4 or 5 DE's in the castle, who break some windows and burn down Hagrid's Hut?  If that same vandalism had been a *capper* to a short-but-frenzied wand-battle in the hallways, now *that* would have been more fitting--a final bit of evil from Bellatrix & co.  

Wonder if the battle was in the script, and cut from the final version (or not filmed)?  Either way, bad choice on the part of the director, IMHO.


> It was strange however, that it was snowing at Hogwarts, but not at the burrow, 

Hogwarts is in Scotland, the Burrow at the English southern coast*, so that kind of weather could happen, esp. late fall/early spring.

* http://www.hp-lexicon.org/atlas/gazetteer/gazetteer-o.html#ottery_st_catchpole


> Joann
> who noticed on her second viewing yesterday Slughorn mentioning the bezoar in front of Harry and then putting it away in his trunk.

Missed that too...nice foreshadowing.  In the book, wasn't it a quiz question (or a HBP note in Harry's potions book)?  For this one critical moment, Harry actually used his Potions knowledge, and saved Ron--although in retrospect it's surprising it didn't occur to Slughorn to do the same thing.


kennyg1864, who wonders what else Harry "lost" in the Room of Requirement






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 20:19:49 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 20:19:49 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <006401ca08a9$13603d90$3a20b8b0$@com>
Message-ID: <h42jh5+5aqd@eGroups.com>

md earlier: 
> > Harry doesn't trust Snape, knows he's working with Malfoy and states earlier that even Dumbledore makes mistakes It all adds up to Harry SHOULD NOT trust or listen to Snape.
> 
Carol earlier:
> I'd put "knows" in quotation marks there as I assume that Snape is protecting Draco and trying to find out what he's doing in the film just as in the book. 

md again: 
> In both book and film Snape knows Draco is to kill DD, the how is the only question. There are 2 scenes in the film where Harry states he doesn't trust Snape and backs it up by stating that DD has made mistakes before. He hears Snape very clearly tell Draco he's taken the Vow to protect him and Harry knows the price to break that vow is death, so Harry knows at the tower that Snape must first look after Malfoy or die himself. He also knows from the conversation between Draco and DD that Draco must kill DD or die, so he knows that Snape must make sure Draco succeeds or he will die from the vow. 

Carol:
Yes, but you said that *Harry* knows that Snape is working with Draco, or at least that's how I read your post. That's why I said that I'd put "knows" in quotation marks. He doesn't know (any more than Draco or the audience members who haven't read the books) that Snape is DDM.

Harry only *thinks* that Snape is helping Draco with his mission when in fact he's trying to figure out what Draco is up to (he doesn't know about the Vanishing Cabinet) and discourage him from being too reckless (as in trying to use the opal necklace). Of course, Snape knows that Draco is supposed to kill Dumbledore, and, yes, he's made an Unbreakable Vow to protect Draco (and, as Snape doesn't tell Draco, at least not in the book, to "do the deed" so Draco won't have to and for a variety of other reasons). But Draco (in the book) thinks that Snape is trying to "steal his glory," and Harry seems to share that view. Whatever evil deed "Malfoy" is trying to do for Voldemort, Snape, he thinks, is trying to help him do it. So I'm just saying that Harry doesn't *know* what Snape is up to. He only thinks he does.

I agree, however, that what he thinks he knows gives him a more than plausible reason not to trust Snape. And in the book, that information (while countered by the lives Snape saves, which Harry, hating Snape and wanting to believe him guilty, ignores) is intensified by the discovery, crucial to the books, that Snape was the eavesdropper--how they'll cover that omission in DH is anybody's guess!).

However, I'm not sure that Harry's knowing that Snape has to protect Draco or die from the Unbreakable Vow is the same as knowing that Snape has to actually "do the deed." In the book, the fresh discovery that Snape was the eavesdropper adds to the emotional intensity and irrationality of Harry's hatred and makes DD's freezing him all the more necessary. Imagine the carnage and confusion if Snape had entered the tower while Harry was fighting Death Eaters.

But in the film, as far as I can tell, Harry doesn't "know" anything about Snape. He only overhears and misunderstands the conversation between Snape and Draco.

md:
EITHER WAY, HARRY KNOWS so it makes no sense that he listens to Snape or stands there idly. The writer and director screwed up.

Carol:

Although I haven't seen the film, I entirely agree with you, not because Harry "knows" that Snape is working with Draco but because he *thinks* he is. Even without the additional motivation to distrust Snape provided by Trelawney's revelation that Snape was the eavesdropper, Harry has always hated Snape. He knows that he's a former DE (revealed in GoF, film and book) and that he's protecting Draco. He *thinks* that he's helping Draco do whatever he's trying to do, which Harry knows by the time Snape shows up (at least in the book) is kill Dumbledore. There's no way that Harry would stand there and watch DEs threatening DD (or did they leave that out?) or Draco's pitiful attempts to kill him, even before Snape shows up to shush him, and he certainly wouldn't have obeyed Snape.

I'm not arguing that the scene was well handled. Far from it. I agree that the writer and director messed up badly, not only because the scene is out of character for both Harry and Snape but also because it diminishes the dramatic impact of the original.

Carol, whose point was simply that Harry didn't *know* what Snape was up to; he only thought he did
>




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 20:29:18 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 20:29:18 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince.
In-Reply-To: <h40168+evpb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42k2u+j8sv@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> > I realize that they omitted his sending the Order to the MoM in OoP, which I think is an unfortunate oversight.)

Eggplant: 
> I don't see what's so important about having that in the OoP movie, it tells us nothing about Snape's character. <snip>

Carol again:
Nothing? It tells us (and should tell Harry) that Snape is a loyal Order member who risked discovery by LV in sending the other Order members to save Harry and friends. Can you imagine what LV would do to Snape if he discovered that he'd alerted Sirius and company to Harry's danger? Snape thwarted his plan. Harry was just about to hand the Prophecy Orb over to Lucius Malfoy (in both the book and the film) when the Order showed up.

And not revealing that Snape sent them leaves moviegoers with no explanation of how the Order members knew that Harry and his friends were in danger. It's a plot hole.

Carol, noting that Snape did *not* think that the MoM plan was canceled (he informed the Order that Harry had not returned from the forest, sending them to the MoM, but went into the forest to search for Harry and Hermione just in case something else had happened





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 20:40:28 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 20:40:28 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h40llb+q3d7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42kns+nvhm@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> > Interestingly, she's read the books (unlike Michael Gambon and, of all people, Alan Rickman!).

Lizzie responded: 
> Whenever I read that quote from Gambon's interview, I feel compelled to jump to Alan's defense!  He has indeed read the books; admitted as much from the beginning and in a recent interview talked about reading DH. <snip>
>
Carol responds:

That's what I thought, too, until I read the Gambon interview. Now I'm not so sure that Gambon is mistaken (or joking, as you suggest). Surely, if Alan Rickman had read HBP, he would object to the way the tower scene is handled in the film.

Of course, if Gambon *is* joking, it's very irresponsible of him to make such misleading statements.

Do you by any chance have a link to that Rickman interview stating that he's read the books? If so, I'd greatly appreciate it if you'd provide it.

Carol, not knowing what to believe at this point and wondering why Rickman would agree to such an illogical, out-of-character scene if he has indeed read the books




From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Mon Jul 20 20:43:52 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 20:43:52 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h42jh5+5aqd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42ku8+p80n@eGroups.com>

Md:
> In both book and film Snape knows Draco is to
> kill DD, the how is the only question.

No, in the movie all Harry knows is that Snape made an unbreakable vow to protect Draco. So when Snape gestures to Harry to keep quiet while he sneaks upstairs it would be natural to think he intended to save both Draco and Dumbledore from the other Death Eaters; that's what I would have thought was about to happen if I hadn't read the book. And even in the book all Harry knows is that Snape is to finish Draco's task if he fails; he figures that task must be something bad but he isn't sure exactly what it is. 

 Eggplant 





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 20:44:34 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 20:44:34 -0000
Subject: The Acting in HBP (and Kelley's welcome)
In-Reply-To: <h40vv1+hvpe@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42kvi+5e7v@eGroups.com>

VJH wrote:
> Agreed that Emma is much improved in HBP. Her eyebrows are under control now. <snip comments on Rupert's acting that I agree with>

Carol responds:
What about her high-pitched voice (suggesting hysteria) and her tendency to talk too fast? (Bear in mind that I still haven't seen the film and can't judge for myself except from clips that seem to show that she hasn't overcome these faults. IMO, of course.)

Carol, who thought that Rupert was delightful in "Driving Lessons" and thinks that he's the best actor of the three young leads







From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 20:58:41 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 20:58:41 -0000
Subject: HP6 - GROSS - in perspective
In-Reply-To: <h41rui+a6e7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42lq1+up4j@eGroups.com>

Brian:
> Perhaps the boycott by many fans with principles (we AREN'T fair-weather fans as one poster here called us) made an impact after all.

Carol responds:
If we agree not to call you a "fair-weather fan" (I don't recall reading that term here, but I don't doubt your word), can you agree not to call the rest of us "unprincipled" just because we don't feel a need to boycott Warner Brothers? (I happen not to have seen it yet because I never see a hugely popular movie when it first comes out, but I see no sense in boycotting it the first week and seeing it later. Why not refuse to see it at all and let the rest of us enjoy it--or not, as the case may be?)

It's rather like calling Harry and Ron "unprincipled" because they weren't up in arms about House-Elf rights like Hermione and spew, erm, S.P.E.W. We all have our causes. Fighting Warner Brothers just because they delayed a film I wanted to see doesn't happen to be one of them.

I do wish that they'd taken the time to improve the film and add some scenes that they appear to have cut unnecessarily, and I'm not at all happy about the added Burrow scene or the handling of Dumbledore's death, but it's par for the course for Warner Brothers, a money-making machine. We saw that same side of them in their alliance with JKR against Lexicon!Steve, as if his little book would in any way have harmed their profits.

I understand that it's important to you, but other members of this list have every right to attend the movie whenever they like without being attacked for their decision.

Carol, who hates name-calling and finger-pointing of any sort





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 21:15:28 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 21:15:28 -0000
Subject: My review of Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h41v9s+m192@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42mpg+l3nv@eGroups.com>

Jamieson wrote:
> 
<snip>
> And the performances in Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince were incredible. Watson, Radcliffe and Grint are developing into incredible actors with great comedic and dramatic timing. Most notable, however, are Michael Gambon as Dumbledore and Alan Rickamn as Snape.
> 
> Both actors are downplaying their characters this time around, giving us more subtle, quiet performances that are incredibly powerful because of their quietness. Rickman as Serverus Snape is not as angry this time around but no less evil. Dumbledore is far more grim and serious and we can see the weight of the world on his shoulders. <snip>

Carol responds:

You say that you've read the books. If that doesn't include DH, please don't read on. (I disagree that HBP is clunky, but I'm sure it's a matter of taste.)

Anyway . . . .

Snape "evil"? Have you forgotten that both book and movie Snape saved Harry from Quirrell in SS/PS and that movie Snape protected HRH from the transformed Lupin (Book Snape conjured stretchers to get them off the grounds) in PoA?

Now, granted, *Harry* thinks that Snape is evil, especially after overhearing his conversation with Draco (who is also supposed to think that Snape is in league with the Death Eaters), but Snape (in the books and in the films I've seen so far, 1-5) is depicted as sinister and sarcastic but at the same time ambiguous and mysterious. And, of course, filmgoers who haven't read the books are supposed to *think* he's evil (even to putting him in the starring role in posters of the bad guys), but unless the film fails entirely as a precursor to DH Part 2, there must be some hints that he's not what he seems to be and that both Harry and Draco (not to mention Narcissa and Voldemort) are mistaken as to where his loyalties lie.

Aside from saving Draco and (apparently) removing the curse from the opal necklace, are there any hints that Dumbledore might be right in trusting Snape?

Carol, assuming that many film viewers have not read DH and will need some sort of hint to prepare them for the revelations in "The Prince's Tale" portion of DH2





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 21:31:41 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 21:31:41 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h429t9+f3h0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42nnt+6ihv@eGroups.com>

Joann:
> 3. Mr. Weasley telling Harry about the vanishing cabinet. 
>
Carol responds:

What? Mr. Weasley tells Harry about *the Vanishing Cabinet*? I thought it was bad enough (as I gathered from the trailer) that Mr. Weasley told Harry that Voldemort has chosen Draco Malfoy for a mission. He can't possibly know that. Only Snape and Dumbledore (and Narcissa and Bellatrix) know it, and none of them are telling anybody. But not even they know about the Vanishing Cabinet, which is Draco's "plan" for doing the "job" that Voldemort assigned him.

Of course, Mr. Borgin (in the book) is helping him fix it (under coercion) and Voldemort and the DEs that Voldemort orders to invade hogwarts as back-up for Draco find out about it eventually, but neither Snape nor Dumbledore knows about the Vanishing Cabinet, so it's impossible that Mr. Weasley would know about it.

And if Harry knows about it, wouldn't he know exactly what Draco is doing in the Room of Requirement? No point in hanging around trying to catch him, just go straight to Dumbledore. But, then, DD would have to know about it, too, because he'd have told Mr. Weasley! Or better yet, just entered the RoR and Vanished the Vanishing Cabinet.

The whole point of the Vanishing Cabinet plot is that DD and Snape know that Draco is planning to kill DD but don't know how, and they think they've taken all possible precautions against getting DEs into the castle as back-up for Draco, who won't dare try to kill DD without them. And, of course, Harry is trying and failing, just as Snape has, to figure out Draco's plan.

Carol, hoping that the filmmakers haven't messed up *that* badly!




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 21:32:18 2009
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 14:32:18 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HP6 - GROSS - in perspective
Message-ID: <868720.66824.qm@web63401.mail.re1.yahoo.com>


Brian:
> After the outstanding results of the
> first day and night, the results for the first few days,
> while good, aren't the spectacular success some in this
> group have wanted to portray.
> 
> The important 3 day weekend US takings were $79.5 million
> an increase of only 3 1/2% on Order of the Phoenix ($77m)
> two years ago, while overall takings for all movies
> increased b over 10% in last year alone.
> 
> And to quote the New york Times... "It should be noted that
> many people interested in going to the movies over the
> weekend didn't have much choice but to see "Half-Blood
> Prince." A huge number ? 4,325 theaters ? showed the
> film, many on multiple screens, and Hollywood got out of
> Harry Potter's way almost entirely; the only other movie to
> open over the weekend was the Fox Searchlight romance "(500)
> Days of Summer," in 27 theaters.
> 
Sheryll:

I think that really needs to be put into perspective. It is not at all uncommon for large releases to be shown on multiple screens. In fact, in theatres with more than half a dozen screening rooms, it's the norm. I've seen new hit films open in as many as 4-6 out of 12 screens in a single theatre. In those theatres, there will at least 6-8 other movies shown during the opening week the new film, so it's misleading as all get out to imply that moviegoers don't have any choices. Maybe not a big choice in films opening that week, but not in what's actually playing. For example, I have 2 multiplexes that I sometimes visit. The one in the west end of the city is showing 10 movies on 12 screens (HP has 3), the one in the east has 11 movies on 12 screens (HP has 3). Yes, that last one sounds impossible but some movies are down to 1 or 2 screening per day and are sharing screening rooms. :)

Brian:
> In other words, once the fanatics had all gone in the first
> 24 hours, giving WB their headlines, the full 3 day weekend
> results were rather less spectacular even with the advantage
> of no competition and much greter hype and pre-launch
> promotion than I remember for any previous HP film.
> 
> To be fair to Warner Brothers (why?) their 5 day results
> showed an increase of around 13-14% compared to OOP two
> years ago and they lacked the income from IMAX.
> But even this hardly warrants the headline "The boy
> wizard's box office powers are stronger than ever."
> 
Sheryll:
Actually, I went before opening night. My daughter won us tickets to a preview screening and we took advantage of it. Sure, she's not a kid anymore but how many parents are going to turn down an opportunity for their child to take them out for an evening. 

Brian:
> Perhaps the boycott by many fans with principles (we AREN'T
> fair-weather fans as one poster here called us) made an
> impact after all.

Sheryll: 
I object to being refered to as unprincipled and think name-calling has no place on any of the HPFGU lists, so asking you to refrain from doing so in future posts.

As to the numbers you give, 3 1/2% increase in box office for the 3 day weekend and 13-14% increase for the first 5 days indicates that those intending to boycott the first week/opening night have had no impact whatsoever. If less than 10% of the increase came over the 3 day weekend, that tells me that the other 10% comes from those who went on the Wednesday and Thursday. Not much of a boycott, IMO.

Brian:
> 
> Although Warner Brothers have probably ruined some things
> in the seventh book by the inept way they adapted the sixth,
> I really hope that they give us two incredible and
> spectacular films to finish the series and do justice to the
> books and their incredible base of loyal fans.
> 
Sheryll:

We're in agreement there! I'd love to see two incredible and spectacular films to finish things off. Not holding my breath, though. <vbg>

Sheryll



      __________________________________________________________________
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From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 20 22:05:09 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 22:05:09 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h42nnt+6ihv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42pml+551h@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
>
> Joann:
> > 3. Mr. Weasley telling Harry about the vanishing cabinet. 
> >
> Carol responds:
> 
> What? Mr. Weasley tells Harry about *the Vanishing Cabinet*? I thought it was bad enough (as I gathered from the trailer) that Mr. Weasley told Harry that Voldemort has chosen Draco Malfoy for a mission. He can't possibly know that. Only Snape and Dumbledore (and Narcissa and Bellatrix) know it, and none of them are telling anybody. But not even they know about the Vanishing Cabinet, which is Draco's "plan" for doing the "job" that Voldemort assigned him.
> 
> Of course, Mr. Borgin (in the book) is helping him fix it (under coercion) and Voldemort and the DEs that Voldemort orders to invade hogwarts as back-up for Draco find out about it eventually, but neither Snape nor Dumbledore knows about the Vanishing Cabinet, so it's impossible that Mr. Weasley would know about it.
> 
> And if Harry knows about it, wouldn't he know exactly what Draco is doing in the Room of Requirement? No point in hanging around trying to catch him, just go straight to Dumbledore. But, then, DD would have to know about it, too, because he'd have told Mr. Weasley! Or better yet, just entered the RoR and Vanished the Vanishing Cabinet.
> 
> The whole point of the Vanishing Cabinet plot is that DD and Snape know that Draco is planning to kill DD but don't know how, and they think they've taken all possible precautions against getting DEs into the castle as back-up for Draco, who won't dare try to kill DD without them. And, of course, Harry is trying and failing, just as Snape has, to figure out Draco's plan.
> 
> Carol, hoping that the filmmakers haven't messed up *that* badly!
>



Carol:
> What? Mr. Weasley tells Harry about *the Vanishing Cabinet*? I thought it was bad enough (as I gathered from the trailer) that Mr. Weasley told Harry that Voldemort has chosen Draco Malfoy for a mission.

Joann: No, the voice you heard in the trailer is Remus. He's just repeating what Harry is telling him. Remus tells Harry he doesn't think it's likely. He also tells Harry to trust Snape because Dumbledore does.

As for the vanishing cabinet, Mr. Weasley just tells Harry that the  object Harry saw Draco looking at at B&B was a vanishing cabinet. 

Joann 




From va32h at comcast.net  Mon Jul 20 22:37:58 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 22:37:58 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h42nnt+6ihv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h42rk6+fjvg@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
> What? Mr. Weasley tells Harry about *the Vanishing Cabinet*? 

<snipped book exposition>

va32h:

Carol, if you actually see the movie, you will see that there is nothing "bad" going on. 

In the scene, Harry asks Mr. Weasley if Mr. Weasley has received Harry's letter. Mr. Weasley says yes and that he researched the item that Draco was investigating at Borgin and Burkes and that it's a Vanishing Cabinet. He then explains what a Vanishing Cabinet is (ie that you go inside and disappear for awhile) and says that they were all the rage during the first war. 

And yes, I know there is nothing in canon saying that Vanishing Cabinets were all the rage in the first war, but as with every other film, the screenwriter adds things and takes liberties. 

In any case, all Mr. Weasley is saying is that he knows what the thing in B&B is, which is certainly plausible given that he's raided B&B in the past as part of his job for the Ministry. 

va32h




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 20 22:50:49 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 18:50:49 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h42ku8+p80n@eGroups.com>
References: <h42jh5+5aqd@eGroups.com> <h42ku8+p80n@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <004f01ca098c$87492670$95db7350$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of eggplant107
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 4:44 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood
Prince

 

  

Md:
> In both book and film Snape knows Draco is to
> kill DD, the how is the only question.



eggplant10
No, in the movie all Harry knows 

????

 

Read the quote you included, where I state "Snape knows" now read your
response where you argue what "Harry knows" and note that Harry and Snape
are two different people.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 20 22:58:24 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 18:58:24 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h42rk6+fjvg@eGroups.com>
References: <h42nnt+6ihv@eGroups.com> <h42rk6+fjvg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <005401ca098d$96079b00$c216d100$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of va32h





va32h:


And yes, I know there is nothing in canon saying that Vanishing Cabinets
were all the rage in the first war, but as with every other film, the
screenwriter adds things and takes liberties. 



::::::::::::::

I recall Rowling stating at some point that she thought during Voldemorts
first reign wizards would have had such items as a fast means of escape.
There are a LOT of things Rowling thought of but didn't put in to the books,
but did and does discuss with Kloves. I know he works VERY closely with her
on accuracy and continuity. One can only presume ideas like that are either
hers or agreed upon by her.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From va32h at comcast.net  Mon Jul 20 23:07:49 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 23:07:49 -0000
Subject: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
Message-ID: <h42tc5+qrjt@eGroups.com>

Spoilers for the movie...if you haven't seen it.



The Good:

The Lavendar/Ron romance was hilarious, and kudos to the actress playing Lavendar, as she really went for it and played her crazy role to the hilt.  

Luna's Gryffindor hat, in all it's glory. 

All the humor really - Rupert Grint did a terrific job as Ron high on love potion.  

The Ginny/Harry romance: this was both good and not so good. I think JK Rowling is dreadful at writing romance, so the Harry/Ginny relationship in the books was just a big old mess.  I much prefer the subtle way it's handled in the film to Harry's raging chest monster.  But...


The Not So Good:

Sometimes it's *so* subtle as to be non-existent. The scene where Ginny feeds Harry a tart at Christmas, which I gathered was supposed to be a flirtation, just fell flat for me. I also wish that Harry had kissed Ginny instead of vice-versa.  But then I have to remember that movie-Harry doesn't have the same sorts of issues as book-Harry. 

It's always annoying when the filmmakers cut things, especially when they go and add things...the whole drama at the Burrow seemed unnecessary...I get that they are trying to establish that no one is safe, etc. but then once the gang gets to Hogwarts everyone runs around willy nilly as if it were any other year, so what was the point of establishing all this supposed great danger?

The Ridiculous:

We all know Tom Riddle is a raging psycho, but he's also supposed to be a charming sycophant.  Child Tom Riddle is so blatantly a sociopath that he might as well have it stamped on his forehead. He doesn't make eye contact; he speaks in monotone...it's too much of an anvil.  And it makes Dumbledore look positively stupid that he allowed this blatantly disturbed boy into Hogwarts.  And you'd never believe that Clearly Crazy Tom could charm Slughorn, or Hepzibah Smith, or the fledgling Death Eaters, either. 

Dumbledore's hand injury:  I swear, they just sprinkled a little black dust on Gambon's hand. THIS is supposed to be a fatal curse?

The ending:  Lots of problems here.  Seemed pointless that Draco worked so hard to get the DEs into Hogwarts if they weren't going to do anything once they were there.  Having Harry merely hide instead of being frozen and invisible is a huge boo boo for me, as it is totally OOC for the impulsive Harry to just stand there (although it is a nice touch that he finally trusts Snape just once before being utterly betrayed). 

Now - the big reveal of the HBP was a complete failure.  There is no drama, no energy in the scene at all - Harry and Snape exchange what, one curse apiece and then Snape strolls over calm as can be and says "I'm the Half Blood Prince". Blink and you'll miss it!

And on an entirely different note: am I just crazy or was there a lot of homoerotic subtext surrounding the whole issue of Slughorn and his "collecting"?

va32h




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 20 23:23:46 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 19:23:46 -0400
Subject: The big End Reveal, what all 6 films are missing.
In-Reply-To: <h42tc5+qrjt@eGroups.com>
References: <h42tc5+qrjt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000f01ca0991$21a85bb0$64f91310$@com>

I think if I can pick one thing left from the books that just changes
everything in the movie going experience is the big reveal at the end of the
books. Each book ads layer on top of layer of questions that are revealed in
the end, the Rowling does a character debriefing, an epilogue at the end of
each book that wraps it up and pulls it together. For me ALL the films
lacked the suspense and mystery of the books and mostly they all end
abruptly after the final action sequence. 

 

But, tomorrow I'm watching the Watchmen for the first time, extended on
blu-ray!!! So I'll forget about HP for 3 hrs!

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 02:40:29 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 02:40:29 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h42ku8+p80n@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h439qt+qvbh@eGroups.com>

Eggplant wrote:
> <snip> And even in the book all Harry knows is that Snape is to finish Draco's task if he fails; he figures that task must be something bad but he isn't sure exactly what it is. 

Carol responds:

In the book, Harry doesn't know that Snape is supposed to finish the task if Draco fails because Snape doesn't reveal that to Draco. All he says is that he made an Unbreakable Vow promising Draco's mother that he would protect him.

Carol, who thinks that Harry would have been a lot more worried and upset (and so would Draco) if Snape had revealed that key provision




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 02:47:40 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 02:47:40 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h42pml+551h@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h43a8c+spdi@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> > What? Mr. Weasley tells Harry about *the Vanishing Cabinet*? I thought it was bad enough (as I gathered from the trailer) that Mr. Weasley told Harry that Voldemort has chosen Draco Malfoy for a mission. <snip>
> 
> Joann: 
>No, the voice you heard in the trailer is Remus. He's just repeating what Harry is telling him. Remus tells Harry he doesn't think it's likely. He also tells Harry to trust Snape because Dumbledore does.
> 
> As for the vanishing cabinet, Mr. Weasley just tells Harry that the  object Harry saw Draco looking at at B&B was a vanishing cabinet. 

>
Carol again:

Thank you! I was starting to be really concerned for a moment. Darn those misleading trailers. <grin> And you're right; now that I think about it, that *was* Lupin's voice, though I think we hear Mr. Weasley in the part about bad times bringing people together or tearing them apart. (Could be wrong; I need to watch it again.)

Carol, who has posted too often today and had better stop for the night




From bgrugin at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 04:41:23 2009
From: bgrugin at yahoo.com (bgrugin)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 04:41:23 -0000
Subject: The Acting in HBP (and Kelley's welcome)
In-Reply-To: <h42kvi+5e7v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h43gtj+hgra@eGroups.com>

> VJH wrote:
> > Agreed that Emma is much improved in HBP. Her eyebrows are under control now. <snip comments on Rupert's acting that I agree with>
> 
> Carol responds:
> What about her high-pitched voice (suggesting hysteria) and her tendency to talk too fast? (Bear in mind that I still haven't seen the film and can't judge for myself except from clips that seem to show that she hasn't overcome these faults. IMO, of course.)
> 
> Carol, who thought that Rupert was delightful in "Driving Lessons" and thinks that he's the best actor of the three young leads
>


MusicalBetsy here:
I noticed that Emma was definitely talking slower this time.  I could understand everything she said easily.  I thought the acting was superb, really from everyone.  Tom Felton was fabulous, and I really enjoyed Jim Broadbent.  And Jessie Cave was great!




From juli17 at aol.com  Tue Jul 21 05:25:05 2009
From: juli17 at aol.com (julie)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 05:25:05 -0000
Subject: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h42tc5+qrjt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h43jfh+kbc9@eGroups.com>

va32h wrote: 
> 
> Dumbledore's hand injury:  I swear, they just sprinkled a little black dust on Gambon's hand. THIS is supposed to be a fatal curse?

Julie:
I don't recall any indication in the movie that the injury was
a fatal curse. Of course it wasn't stated directly in the HBP
book either, but Dumbledore's blackened and shrivelled hand
was alluded to much more, and he was extremely weak on the
Tower, sliding down the wall and so on, so it was a strong
assumption that his unhealable hand had a part in his demise.
In the movie it doesn't seem to be a factor at all beyond the
that initial scene. 
As the writer and producers are fond of moving scenes from
the books between movies when it serves to better provide
context (with reason in some cases), it would have made a
lot of sense to include more background about Dumbledore's
hand. Like a mention of how Snape was unable to heal it or,
better, unable to "stop" it (implying that the damage will
progress)--something that would give the movie audience the
idea that perhaps Dumbledore is ailing, even slowly dying.
Instead movie!Dumbledore seems hale and hearty all the way
to the end, except for a few brief moments while he is 
drinking the cave potion. 

Julie, who also noticed Dumbledore's penchant for ambiguous
comments, in the HBP book in particular, was largely absent
in the movie.





From va32h at comcast.net  Tue Jul 21 14:12:27 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 14:12:27 -0000
Subject: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h43jfh+kbc9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h44icb+dpb8@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "julie" <juli17 at ...> wrote:

> Julie:
> I don't recall any indication in the movie that the injury was
> a fatal curse. Of course it wasn't stated directly in the HBP
> book either,

va32h:

No, but we all know from DH that the curse was indeed fatal, as Snape tells Dumbledore he has a year left to live, at best. 

DH had already been published by the time this film was made, so the screenwriter, director, and makeup people certainly should have known about it. 

va32h




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 17:06:47 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 17:06:47 -0000
Subject: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h42tc5+qrjt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h44sj7+srec@eGroups.com>

My first post, so hopefully I sound smart :)


--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "va32h" <va32h at ...> wrote:
>
> Spoilers for the movie...if you haven't seen it.
>
> The Good:
>
> The Lavendar/Ron romance was hilarious, and kudos to the actress playing Lavendar, as she really went for it and played her crazy role to the hilt.
>
> Luna's Gryffindor hat, in all it's glory.
>
> All the humor really - Rupert Grint did a terrific job as Ron high on love potion.
>
> The Ginny/Harry romance: this was both good and not so good. I think JK Rowling is dreadful at writing romance, so the Harry/Ginny relationship in the books was just a big old mess.  I much prefer the subtle way it's handled in the film to Harry's raging chest monster.  But...
>


Rupert is very good at comedy and did a great job with the romance and the quidditch.

I think they did quite a good job with the Harry/Ginny romance.  The viewer was provided clear evidence that Ginny had matured and was confident enough to be friends with Harry.  The supper party was scene was nice, but they could have thrown in a Ginny encounter at the Christmas party just to firm everything up more.
I was definitely suprised when Ginny initiated the kiss and in the Room of Requirement, but it worked.  It was a good "I know you like me and I still like you even now that my little girl crush has worn off" kiss.


> The Not So Good:
>
><snip>
>
> It's always annoying when the filmmakers cut things, especially when they go and add things...the whole drama at the Burrow seemed unnecessary...I get that they are trying to establish that no one is safe, etc. but then once the gang gets to Hogwarts everyone runs around willy nilly as if it were any other year, so what was the point of establishing all this supposed great danger?
>


A very good point.  I do not see the attack or burning down the Weasley's house as a particularly important contribution to the story.  But it was an interesting way to show off Ginny's bravery and connection to Harry.


> The Ridiculous:
>
> We all know Tom Riddle is a raging psycho, but he's also supposed to be a charming sycophant.  Child Tom Riddle is so blatantly a sociopath that he might as well have it stamped on his forehead. He doesn't make eye contact; he speaks in monotone...it's too much of an anvil.  And it makes Dumbledore look positively stupid that he allowed this blatantly disturbed boy into Hogwarts.  And you'd never believe that Clearly Crazy Tom could charm Slughorn, or Hepzibah Smith, or the fledgling Death Eaters, either.
>

I see what you are saying.  Tom Riddle did come off as pretty disturbing in the flashbacks, but I think that might just be because of the encounters we were being shown.  He probably looked completely normal and charming when he was in charms class or eating lunch with his housemates.  The child Tom Riddle was disturbed, but he was also "the weird kid" at an orphanage.  Not a pleasant experience for a child and definitely one that would draw out some of the darker emotions.  I can believe that Dumbledore expected that Hogwarts would be really good for Riddle and he would grow out of his problems.


> Dumbledore's hand injury:  I swear, they just sprinkled a little black dust on Gambon's hand. THIS is supposed to be a fatal curse?
>

Was the hand supposed to be an obvious indication of a fatal curse?  Harry and the audience not knowing the extent of Dumbledore's illness makes his death that much more shocking and sad.  Sure we all know what was really going on because we have read Book 7, but that does not mean they should give away future insights in the movie just because they can.


> The ending:  Lots of problems here.  Seemed pointless that Draco worked so hard to get the DEs into Hogwarts if they weren't going to do anything once they were there.  Having Harry merely hide instead of being frozen and invisible is a huge boo boo for me, as it is totally OOC for the impulsive Harry to just stand there (although it is a nice touch that he finally trusts Snape just once before being utterly betrayed).
>


Good point.  It seemed the deather eaters were only there to 1) prove they could get in and 2) make sure Malfoy killed Dumbledore.


> Now - the big reveal of the HBP was a complete failure.  There is no drama, no energy in the scene at all - Harry and Snape exchange what, one curse apiece and then Snape strolls over calm as can be and says "I'm the Half Blood Prince". Blink and you'll miss it!
>

Yeah, kind of a let down.  Rickman's performance through the movie was great, but the writer and director just didn't give him enough material in that scene to provide the necessary impact.


> And on an entirely different note: am I just crazy or was there a lot of homoerotic subtext surrounding the whole issue of Slughorn and his "collecting"?
>

I did not catch any homoerotic subtext, but there was a creepy old man subtext.

Thanks,
Richard





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 17:17:35 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 17:17:35 -0000
Subject: The Acting in HBP (and Kelley's welcome)
In-Reply-To: <h43gtj+hgra@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h44t7f+vbjb@eGroups.com>

I agree that the acting in this move with very good.  

Rickman was brilliant.  

Emma was gorgeous and handled all the teen angst/romance stuff better than I expected.  My favorite scene might be the one with Hermione and Harry in the library that seemed to be in all the trailers :)

Rupert and Dan seemed much more at ease in the roles and really filled out more depth for the characters.  

And I thought Bonnie nailed down a pretty solid Ginny as well.

Thanks,
Richard





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 18:37:17 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 18:37:17 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h42rk6+fjvg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h451st+9tjk@eGroups.com>

Caro earlier:
> > What? Mr. Weasley tells Harry about *the Vanishing Cabinet*? 

va32h responded:
> 
> Carol, if you actually see the movie, you will see that there is nothing "bad" going on. 
> 
> In the scene, Harry asks Mr. Weasley if Mr. Weasley has received Harry's letter. Mr. Weasley says yes and that he researched the item that Draco was investigating at Borgin and Burkes and that it's a Vanishing Cabinet. He then explains what a Vanishing Cabinet is (ie that you go inside and disappear for awhile) and says that they were all the rage during the first war. 
> 
> And yes, I know there is nothing in canon saying that Vanishing Cabinets were all the rage in the first war, but as with every other film, the screenwriter adds things and takes liberties. 
> 
> In any case, all Mr. Weasley is saying is that he knows what the thing in B&B is, which is certainly plausible given that he's raided B&B in the past as part of his job for the Ministry. 

Carol again:
I should probably keep my opinions to myself until I see the movie, but IMO Mr. Weasley "researching the item that Draco was investigating" is a big departure from the book and too much for Harry to know. (The viewers will know it, of course, from the Draco scenes). Neither Harry nor DD (nor Snape) should know that Draco is trying to fix a broken Vanishing Cabinet; it's too obvious that he wants to use it to get DEs into Hogwarts.

Besides, Harry doesn't need to be told that there's a big black cabinet in B and B; he hid inside it in CoS (a scene included in the extended version of the DVD), fortunately, not closing the door completely. And book!Harry knows quite well what a Vanishing Cabinet is; the Weasley twins pushed Montague inside the broken one in HBP. That's how Draco figured out that there was a connection between B and B and Hogwarts--or would be, if the broken cabinet were fixed.

Once again, the filmmakers have evidently omitted crucial information and substituted, well, flimsy, inadequate, illogical explanations from characters who couldn't know that information, anyway, not to mention that the explanation seems to be provided way too soon.

Wheter or not Mr. Weasley has raided B & B on occasion, he wouldn't suspect a Vanishing Cabinet of being a Dark object, and the VC in B&B would not have been moved, so Mr. Weasley couldn't possibly know that Draco has been "investigating" it. Mr. Borgin, under threat of being attacked by Fenrir Greyback if he doesn't cooperate, is unlikely to provide a Ministry official with that information, and Draco didn't take Borgin's Vanishing Cabinet with him. He's planning to use it as a portal to the other one once it's fixed.

There are liberties and liberties, if you know what I mean. The whole added Burrow scene sounds worse and worse the more I hear about it, and I'm not happy about the changes to the tower scene, either. IOW, I can understand (though I don't like) the bit about Harry and DD side-along Apparating from DD's office to the cave (and, presumably, back again, though how Harry would know to go to the Astronomy Tower rather than DD's office, I have no clue) because they wanted to eliminate Madam Rosmerta's role. (And, it seems, we now have no explanation for the poisoned mead, either, unless Draco mentions his charmed coins in the dialogue with Dumbledore, which I assume is also greatly curtailed. Another omission that I don't like but can understand is the elimination of the Dursleys (though the flirtation with a Muggle waitress is completely out of character for a Harry still in mourning with his godfather and not at all confident of his ability to deal with those mysterious beings called girls.)

So, yes, some changes (mostly omissions) are necessary or at least understandable in converting a book to a film, but Mr. Weasley's telling Harry about the cabinet is just too much. Or so it seems from my perspective as someone who has not yet seen the film.

Carol, who wishes that she could temporarily Obliviate her memories of the book as she watches the film to see whether the adaptation works







From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 18:50:21 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 18:50:21 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <005401ca098d$96079b00$c216d100$@com>
Message-ID: <h452ld+f8tb@eGroups.com>

va32h:
> 
> 
> And yes, I know there is nothing in canon saying that Vanishing Cabinets were all the rage in the first war, but as with every other film, the screenwriter adds things and takes liberties. 
> 
md replied:
> 
> I recall Rowling stating at some point that she thought during Voldemorts first reign wizards would have had such items as a fast means of escape. There are a LOT of things Rowling thought of but didn't put in to the books, but did and does discuss with Kloves. I know he works VERY closely with her on accuracy and continuity. One can only presume ideas like that are either hers or agreed upon by her.

Carol responds:

Maybe so, but that doesn't explain how Mr. Weasley would know what Draco was "investigating." *Borgin's* cabinet would still be in its usual place, and Borgin would hardly risk retribution by the DEs or Greyback or Voldemort himself by explaining what Draco was doing there, not to mention that he'd be in serious trouble with the Ministry as an accessory to the intended crime (he wouldn't know about the murder, but he knows that Draco is working for Voldemort and up to no good) if he revealed that information.

I have no problem with Mr. Weasley knowing what a Vanishing Cabinet is. (So does Book!Harry by this time.) I have a problem with him knowing that that's what Draco was looking at. Harry himself has been in Borgin and Burke's, hiding in that same cabinet, and, ironically, his view of Draco is blocked by that very cabinet when he spies on him in B&B. Mr. Weasley has no way--none--of knowing that Draco was "investigating" that cabinet.

BTW, I'm afraid to ask, but how do the filmmakers handle the Hand of Glory? I'm assuming that they just left it out.

Carol, who understands that a film adaptation can't be wholly faithful to the book but nevertheless expects the changes to be logical and convincing




From va32h at comcast.net  Tue Jul 21 19:04:27 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:04:27 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h452ld+f8tb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h453fr+7on9@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
> Carol, who understands that a film adaptation can't be wholly faithful to the book but nevertheless expects the changes to be logical and convincing
>


va32h:
Having read all your other posts in this group, I seriously suggest you not see the movie at all.  You are probably going to hate it. 

NOTHING that you are expecting is in there. 

It's interesting - as with every other HP film, it wasn't until I left the theater that I even realized it had been over two hours long.  The filmmakers, I think, greatly  underestimate the willingness of this sort of audience to sit through a long move. 

But then again, the longer the movie, the less showings one can fit in the day and the bottom line is always $$$$. 

But Carol, honestly - none of that stuff, the coins, the Hand of Glory, Madam Rosmerta, the Dark Mark over the Astronomy Tower - none of it is even mentioned. 

I look at the films as "a series of dramatized scenes from the book" rather than any attempt to recreate the story on screen. 

We saw it with people who had not read the book and they had no clue what was going on. 

va32h




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 19:14:07 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:14:07 -0000
Subject: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h43jfh+kbc9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4541v+rmct@eGroups.com>

Julie wrote:
> I don't recall any indication in the movie that the injury was a fatal curse. Of course it wasn't stated directly in the HBP book either, but Dumbledore's blackened and shrivelled hand was alluded to much more <snip>

Carol responds:

In the book, it's clear that it was a terrible (and potentially fatal) curse. Dumbledore gives himself a little too much credit and Snape not quite enough, but nevertheless it's clear to a reader a little more astute and much less anti-Snape than Harry that Snape has saved DD's life:

Dumbledore: "The ring, Harry. Marvolo's ring. And a terrible curse there was upon it too. Had it not been ? forgive me the lack of seemly modesty ? for my own prodigious skill, and for Professor Snape's timely action when I returned to Hogwarts, desperately injured, I might not have lived to tell the tale. However, a withered hand does not seem an unreasonable exchange for a seventh of Voldemort's soul. The ring is no longer a Horcrux." (HBP23)

Exactly what "prodigious skill" Dumbledore displayed (possibly getting himself back to Hogwarts despite being "desperately injured," destroying the Horcrux with the Sword of Gryffindor in that condition, and casting a Patronus to summon Snape?) is not clear, but Snape's "timely action" is obviously (as we later learn) confining the curse the DD's hand as he gives him a restorative potion. (Obviously, he also had to determine what kind of curse was on the ring and remove it; otherwise, he couldn't have stopped the curse and DD couldn't have worn the broken ring when he visited Slughorn.)

Anyway, DD "might [would] not have lived to tell the tale" if it weren't for Professor Snape's "timely action," knowledge of the Dark Arts, and skill as a healer, points that Book!Dumbledore also makes with regard to Katie Bell. (I suppose that the book just has Snape remove the curse from the opal necklace without saving Katie's life by, again, stopping or slowing the curse so that she can be healed at St. Mungo's.)

So is there no hint at all, other than Snape's saving Draco, that he's saving all the lives he can ("How many people have you watched die, Severus?" "Lately, only those whom I could not save"--quoted from memory from "The Prince's Tale" in DH).

It seems to me that they've made Snape seem wholly evil rather than ambiguous, but there ought to be hints for the attentive viewer that DD's trust in Snape is justified, just as there were in the books.

Carol, now fearing that "The Prince's Tale" will be badly shortchanged in DH2






From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 19:17:35 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:17:35 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h451st+9tjk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4548f+k55k@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:


> ... they wanted to eliminate Madam Rosmerta's role. (And, 
> it seems, we now have no explanation for the poisoned mead, 
> unless Draco mentions his charmed coins in the dialogue with 
> Dumbledore


zanooda:

I suppose he poisoned the mead himself :-). From what I heard, he gave that cursed necklace to Katie himself, so why not the mead :-)? I also heard that not everything we saw in the trailers is in the movie, including Snape's "it's over" line. I wonder if it's true. Not that I care about this particular line, just curious. I'll be able to see the movie only next week, maybe even later...




From harriedwith2angels at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 19:26:20 2009
From: harriedwith2angels at yahoo.com (Doreen)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:26:20 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h451st+9tjk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h454os+hg2i@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
>
> 
> Carol again:
> I should probably keep my opinions to myself until I see the movie, but IMO Mr. Weasley "researching the item that Draco was investigating" is a big departure from the book and too much for Harry to know. (The viewers will know it, of course, from the Draco scenes). Neither Harry nor DD (nor Snape) should know that Draco is trying to fix a broken Vanishing Cabinet; it's too obvious that he wants to use it to get DEs into Hogwarts.
> 

Respectfully, I think it makes a lot of sense to not form opinions on the movie until you have seen it for yourself.  

In the book Mr. Weasley searched the Malfoy's home after Harry expressed his concerns to Mr. Weasley, so I feel the movie is demonstrating the same idea that Mr. Weasley doesn't just ignore Harry's concerns, but in this case it is by visiting B&B.

When Mr. Weasley and Harry discuss the vanishing cabinet it is described as a place to hide or disappear in for awhile.  It is not described as a means of transport.  When Draco tells Dumbledore about the cabinets when they are on the tower, Dumbledore replies, "Oh, it had a twin." The way I interpreted this is that in the movie world the cabinet can only get you from a to b if it had a twin, and that having a twin was not the norm.  This is why I think Mr. Weasley and Harry were not concerned about the cabinet earlier.  They didn't realize that a. the cabinet had a twin, and b. the twin was somewhere at Hogwarts.  Thus, in terms of the movie logic it all made sense to me.

Also, although the movie shows deatheaters entering B&B, it never shows the owner or any employees being threatened by Fenrir(sp) or anyone else.

I hope I am explaining this well, and with enough detail and accuracy. I only saw the movie once.  For what it's worth, none of the movies can compare to the books for me, but I have found movies three through six entertaining.





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 19:29:36 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:29:36 -0000
Subject: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4541v+rmct@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h454v0+6hei@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
>
> Carol responds:
> 
> It seems to me that they've made Snape seem wholly evil rather than ambiguous, but there ought to be hints for the attentive viewer that DD's trust in Snape is justified, just as there were in the books.
> 

I am in the frustating position of having recently seen the movie twice, but with a suprisingly foggy memory of the book.  I am going to begin rereading the whole series this weekend, because I think the movies are becoming more strongly ingrained in my memory than the books.  And we all know there are considerable differences.  

As to Snape's character in the movie.  The filmakers definitely dropped out some conversations and actions, but the beauty of film is we get facial expressions :)  In my opinion, Alan Rickman conveys the inner turmoil with his fine acting.  Harry is perhaps more in doubt of Snape's efforts in the movie version, but the audience gets treated to some clear ambiguity and unease coming off Snape.

Thanks,
Richard






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 19:34:58 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:34:58 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h453fr+7on9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h45592+bqr9@eGroups.com>

va32h:
> Having read all your other posts in this group, I seriously suggest you not see the movie at all.  You are probably going to hate it. 
> 
> NOTHING that you are expecting is in there. 
><snip>

> But Carol, honestly - none of that stuff, the coins, the Hand of Glory, Madam Rosmerta, the Dark Mark over the Astronomy Tower - none of it is even mentioned. 
> 
> I look at the films as "a series of dramatized scenes from the book" rather than any attempt to recreate the story on screen. 

Carol responds:

Actually, I intend to watch and enjoy the movie, particularly the performances of Alan Rickman and Tom Felton. (I also like Rupert Grint and am glad that he's something more than a comic sidekick in this film.) I don't mind the changes to Cormac McLaggen; the filmmakers probably handle the whole romantic comedy subplot better than JKR did.

But my concern is with the Snape/Draco/Dumbledore subplot, which is really the heart of the book. Snape is the Half-Blood Prince, after all, so the book is about his relationship with Harry on two levels.

As I said, he needs to remain ambiguous. Yes, it should look as if he's betrayed Dumbledore's trust as he did in the book, but there should be hints that all is not as it seems. And the scene on the tower seems to be stripped of its power, its believability, and its pathos. (Harry needs to be frozen under the Invisibility Cloak, unable to act; Dumbledore needs to be weak, helpless, and obviously dying. How will they make Snape's agreeing to kill him believable in DH if he wasn't already dying from the ring curse?)

va32h: 
> We saw it with people who had not read the book and they had no clue what was going on. 

Carol responds:

See, that's my concern. They need to understand the story, not be given incomplete and inaccurate explanations that will cause problems for the faithful adaptation of DH. (the whole point of making it in two parts, aside from profits, is to include everything crucial to the plot. And if they've left out or altered key elements in HBP (as in OoP and PoA), they're causing difficulties for themselves and the viewers.

BTW, did the filmmakers make young Lucius, young Severus, and young Regulus cronies of Tom Riddle's at Hogwarts in the Slughorn memory? If so, any viewers who remember that Tom Riddle was at Hogwarts fifty years before Harry (mentioned in the CoS film as well as the book) must wonder how Snape and Malfoy could be so well preserved. (Yes, Alan Rickman is actually 65 or something, but Snape looks fortyish, as does Malfoy (one of the few adult actors who's the right age for his character.)

Carol, who has enjoyed the other films (except maybe OoP despite their departures from the books) but wonders how those Muggles, erm, nonreaders of the books, can follow the plot at all with all these alterations





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 19:36:48 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:36:48 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4548f+k55k@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h455cg+du3m@eGroups.com>

zanooda:
> 
> I suppose he poisoned the mead himself :-). From what I heard, he gave that cursed necklace to Katie himself, so why not the mead :-)? I also heard that not everything we saw in the trailers is in the movie, including Snape's "it's over" line. I wonder if it's true. Not that I care about this particular line, just curious. I'll be able to see the movie only next week, maybe even later...
>
Carol:

We should see it together. Planning to be in Tucson anytime soon? <grin>

Carol, glad to know that she's not the only one who hasn't seen it yet




From va32h at comcast.net  Tue Jul 21 19:44:54 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:44:54 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h45592+bqr9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h455rm+nbr8@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
>
> Actually, I intend to watch and enjoy the movie, particularly the performances of Alan Rickman and Tom Felton. (I also like Rupert Grint and am glad that he's something more than a comic sidekick in this film.) I don't mind the changes to Cormac McLaggen; the filmmakers probably handle the whole romantic comedy subplot better than JKR did.

va32h: Rickman's screen time is negligible. 


> But my concern is with the Snape/Draco/Dumbledore subplot, which is really the heart of the book. Snape is the Half-Blood Prince, after all, so the book is about his relationship with Harry on two levels.

va32h: This is less than a subplot. It's a blip. The revelation that Snape is the HBP is very brief, is delivered with so little energy (and with so little reaction from Harry) that most of the people I was with did not even note it's significance.



> BTW, did the filmmakers make young Lucius, young Severus, and young Regulus cronies of Tom Riddle's at Hogwarts in the Slughorn memory? If so, any viewers who remember that Tom Riddle was at Hogwarts fifty years before Harry (mentioned in the CoS film as well as the book) must wonder how Snape and Malfoy could be so well preserved. (Yes, Alan Rickman is actually 65 or something, but Snape looks fortyish, as does Malfoy (one of the few adult actors who's the right age for his character.)

va32h:  The memory lasts but seconds onscreen, and none of Riddle's classmates are named. 


As it's own separate entity, closely tied to the books, but not really a part of that story, the films are good. But looking for a faithful chapter by chapter adaptation is just asking for disappointment. 

va32h





From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 21 19:55:06 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 15:55:06 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h451st+9tjk@eGroups.com>
References: <h42rk6+fjvg@eGroups.com> <h451st+9tjk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <006901ca0a3d$25f6e220$71e4a660$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol

Besides, Harry doesn't need to be told that there's a big black cabinet in B
and B; he hid inside it in CoS (a scene included in the extended version of
the DVD), 

 

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::;;

 

What extended version??? I have the 2 disk fancy, slipped case release and
the blu-ray (had the hd-dvd as well a while ago) never seen an extended
version.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 21 19:56:49 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 15:56:49 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h453fr+7on9@eGroups.com>
References: <h452ld+f8tb@eGroups.com> <h453fr+7on9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <008301ca0a3d$62a035f0$27e0a1d0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of va32h



the Dark Mark over the Astronomy Tower - none of it is even mentioned. 
:::::::::::::::::::::::;;

Bellatrix cast the dark mark and then Mcgonagal and the students undo it.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 19:50:42 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:50:42 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h45592+bqr9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4566i+s5q4@eGroups.com>


> va32h:
> > We saw it with people who had not read the book and they
> > had no clue what was going on.
>
> Carol responds:
> See, that's my concern. They need to understand the story,
not be given incomplete and inaccurate explanations that
will cause problems for the faithful adaptation of DH. (the
whole point of making it in two parts, aside from profits,
is to include everything crucial to the plot. And if they've
left out or altered key elements in HBP (as in OoP and PoA),
they're causing difficulties for themselves and the viewers.
>

Richard:
In my opinion, anyone that has watched the previous five
movies can enjoy and understand this movie just fine.
There are differences, both large and small, from the
book but it doesn't hamper itself with a lot of gaps or
inconsistencies.  If someone watches this movie without
having read the books OR watching the movies, they will
be confused and they should be :)

Carol:
> BTW, did the filmmakers make young Lucius, young Severus,
and young Regulus cronies of Tom Riddle's at Hogwarts in
the Slughorn memory? If so, any viewers who remember that
Tom Riddle was at Hogwarts fifty years before Harry
(mentioned in the CoS film as well as the book) must wonder
how Snape and Malfoy could be so well preserved. (Yes, Alan
Rickman is actually 65 or something, but Snape looks fortyish,
as does Malfoy (one of the few adult actors who's the right
age for his character.)
>

Richard:
The flashbacks were limited and very focused on Riddle.  We
were not introduced to any of his classmates directly.






From va32h at comcast.net  Tue Jul 21 22:28:30 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 22:28:30 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <008301ca0a3d$62a035f0$27e0a1d0$@com>
Message-ID: <h45fee+pge6@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:
>
>  
> 
>  
> 
> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of va32h
> 
> 
> 
> the Dark Mark over the Astronomy Tower - none of it is even mentioned. 
> :::::::::::::::::::::::;;
> 
> Bellatrix cast the dark mark and then Mcgonagal and the students undo it.
> 


va32h:

Yes, after Dumbledore is dead.  But there is no Dark Mark cast over the Astronomy Tower as a lure for Dumbledore and Harry, which makes their appearance there - and Draco's knowing where to find them - inexplicable in the context of the film. 
> 
> md
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>





From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 21 23:15:48 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:15:48 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h45fee+pge6@eGroups.com>
References: <008301ca0a3d$62a035f0$27e0a1d0$@com> <h45fee+pge6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000c01ca0a59$2ebc2610$8c347230$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of va32h





va32h:

Yes, after Dumbledore is dead. But there is no Dark Mark cast over the
Astronomy Tower as a lure for Dumbledore and Harry, which makes their
appearance there - and Draco's knowing where to find them - inexplicable in
the context of the film. 
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Snape was on the tower before Harry got there, if I hadn't read the book I
would presume Snape told Draco to go there and wait. In the context of the
film, that makes perfect sense and is how I presumed the film was suppose to
work.

The dark-mark as a lure was not possible once they took brooms out of the
equation, they no longer had to go to hogsmead first, they wouldn't see the
dark-mark, they wouldn't rush to the tower. Technically, the dark-mark is
supposed to be cast AFTER someone is killed, so using it as a lure made no
sense. 

As  for Draco, well, how did he know they'd be there in the book??? Also how
do you cast the Dark Mark only over the astronomy tower? I think this was a
conundrum that Rowling wrote which wasn't filmable as written. But the Dark
Mark, as you suggest, does not lead Draco to the tower in book or film. In
the end, Draco has to simply know somehow they are gone and will come back,
most likely judging from the conversation between DD and Snape (the fact
that they have one) it's a set-up for Draco to be there. That makes sense to
me and the film covers enough ideas to make it seem plausible. 

It's the 'no one challenges the death eaters' thing and Harry not petrified
that ruins the scene.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 21 23:14:16 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 23:14:16 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h3u039+dsc0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h45i48+rkkt@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "kennyg1864" <kennyg1864 at ...> wrote:
>
> kennyg1864, who agrees about Cissy's hair, and wonders why Cissy wasn't made as "Aryan" as Lucius or Draco, and thinks their family portrait must suffer as a result :P
>

I do not know why Narcissa had the funky two-tone hair in the movie.  It was kind of distracting.  But regardless, she should not be as "Aryan" as Lucious or Draco.  Draco is supposed to have a strong resemblance to his father, just like Harry does James.  But Narcissa is a black and they are not a blond hair and blue eyes family.   

Thanks,
Richard





From sartoris22 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 00:30:09 2009
From: sartoris22 at yahoo.com (sartoris22)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 00:30:09 -0000
Subject: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h44sj7+srec@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h45mih+rhck@eGroups.com>

The Ridiculous:
> >
> > We all know Tom Riddle is a raging psycho, but he's also supposed to be a charming sycophant...
> 
> I see what you are saying.  Tom Riddle did come off as pretty disturbing in the flashbacks, but I think that might just be because of the encounters we were being shown.  He probably looked completely normal and charming when he was in charms class or eating lunch with his housemates.  The child Tom Riddle was disturbed, but he was also "the weird kid" at an orphanage.  Not a pleasant experience for a child and definitely one that would draw out some of the darker emotions.  I can believe that Dumbledore expected that Hogwarts would be really good for Riddle and he would grow out of his problems.
> 

sartoris22:

I agree--Riddle was an outcast child who learned charm as a way to get what he wanted, which makes his portrayal in the book all the more chilling. According to the sixth book, Riddle holds down a respectable job and does it well so that he can hunt down objects of the founders to use for horcruxes. He charms that silly witch then frames the elf for her murder. After he gets what he wants, he vanishes. My one regret in the portrayal of Riddle in the film  is that we don't get enough scenes of his handsome charm, which would make his transformation into the the serpentine Voldemort even more gripping. 

 By the way, I still don't know how I feel about the sixth film. I'll have to see it again. My favorite remains the third film, and the one I like least, the fifth film. I don't know where to put the sixth film. It seemed disjointed to me, somewhat clumsily stitched together. It was the first film in which I didn't get the sense of the trio as a unit. I suppose Yates wanted to foreshadow the seventh film, in which I think he plans to play up the jealous, disgruntled Ron. Nothing else seems to explain the weird last scene, in which he foregrounds, literally, Harry and Hermoine's unity. Funnily enough, even though Ron has scenes with Harry, it seemed as if Ron was in a separate film. That is one reason I plan to see the movie again. I left the first viewing feeling somewhat disoriented by the experience.





From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 00:46:17 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 00:46:17 -0000
Subject: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h42tc5+qrjt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h45ngp+n8gt@eGroups.com>

> va32h

> The Good:
>   
> The Ginny/Harry romance: this was both good and not so good. I think JK Rowling is dreadful at writing romance, so the Harry/Ginny relationship in the books was just a big old mess.  I much prefer the subtle way it's handled in the film to Harry's raging chest monster.  

Joann:
After hating H/G in the book, I didn't mind them in the movie so much. It still doesn't make sense to me, and there is not much chemistry between DR and BW but it's still loads better than the book. The film makers must have thought H/G lacked a little in the book too, or they wouldn't have added so much/changed almost every scene of theirs. 

 

> The Ridiculous:
> 
> We all know Tom Riddle is a raging psycho, but he's also supposed to be a charming sycophant.  Child Tom Riddle is so blatantly a sociopath that he might as well have it stamped on his forehead. He doesn't make eye contact; he speaks in monotone...it's too much of an anvil.  And it makes Dumbledore look positively stupid that he allowed this blatantly disturbed boy into Hogwarts.

Joann: 
Well, remember how the sorting hat had barely touched Draco's head before being declared a Syltherin?  And everyone certainly knew who his father was. It doesn't seem there is any condition to getting into Hogwarts apart from being able to preform magic.









From kennyg1864 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 04:09:02 2009
From: kennyg1864 at yahoo.com (kennyg1864)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 04:09:02 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h45i48+rkkt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h463cu+ti7t@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:

> I do not know why Narcissa had the funky two-tone hair in the movie.  It was kind of distracting.  But regardless, she should not be as "Aryan" as Lucious or Draco.  Draco is supposed to have a strong resemblance to his father, just like Harry does James.  But Narcissa is a black and they are not a blond hair and blue eyes family.   
> 
> Thanks,
> Richard

>From the Lexicon:

Narcissa (Black) Malfoy 

APPEARANCE
Eye color: blue eyes (GF8).
Hair color: blonde (GF8). 

kennyg1864, who reflects that for this movie, the makeup department could have loaned her Jason Isaacs' wig, since Lucius was in Azkaban :P




From kennyg1864 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 04:35:20 2009
From: kennyg1864 at yahoo.com (kennyg1864)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 04:35:20 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h451st+9tjk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h464u8+mtbs@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> Carol again:

> Besides, Harry doesn't need to be told that there's a big black cabinet in B and B; he hid inside it in CoS 

If we're sticking to "movie canon", in CoS he hid inside an black Egyptian sarcophagus.  It may or may not have been a VC, but it wasn't referred to as such in the movie.  The CoS sarcophagus looked way different from the HBP VC, but heck, within "movie canon" Hagrid's Hut moves around, so who knows if it's supposed to be the "same" VC.

But even if it was a VC, *Harry* didn't know what it was at the time of CoS, other than a place to hide while Lucius sold off dark objects he didn't want in Malfoy Manor, even hidden.


> (a scene included in the extended version of the DVD)

I believe you mean "additional scenes"; there isn't an extended version per se, at least not on the released DVD.

kennyg1864, who suddenly has a great idea for profitable-but-illegal DVD's

and who wonders if the "THAT one is not for sale" object was the diary





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 15:36:52 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 15:36:52 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h463cu+ti7t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h47bmk+fa9s@eGroups.com>

> Richard Shepard" wrote:
> 
> > I do not know why Narcissa had the funky two-tone hair in the movie.  It was kind of distracting.  But regardless, she should not be as "Aryan" as Lucious or Draco.  Draco is supposed to have a strong resemblance to his father, just like Harry does James.  But Narcissa is a black and they are not a blond hair and blue eyes family.   
> > 
> > 

kennyg1864 wrote:
>
> From the Lexicon:
> 
> Narcissa (Black) Malfoy 
> 
> APPEARANCE
> Eye color: blue eyes (GF8).
> Hair color: blonde (GF8). 
> 
> kennyg1864, who reflects that for this movie, the makeup department could have loaned her Jason Isaacs' wig, since Lucius was in Azkaban :P
>

Thanks for the clarification KennyG.  Looks like I whipped out a response without thinking it through fully.  I still think Draco is supposed to look like Lucius, whether or not Narcissa was "Aryan" as well.  Do you think Narcissa and Bellatrix looked like possible sisters?

Thanks,
Richard





From CatMcNulty at comcast.net  Wed Jul 22 16:06:41 2009
From: CatMcNulty at comcast.net (Cat)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 16:06:41 -0000
Subject: DH Epilogue - The Final Good Bye!
Message-ID: <h47deh+2m30@eGroups.com>

In the final scene of Deathly Hallows (The Movie) I wish that they would have JKR make a cameo appearance. On Platform 9 3/4, dressed like a typical witch, surrounded by steam, seeing Jessica off to Hogwarts and glancing at her literary child Harry. Maybe a nod of recognition as she turns to disappear in the steam.
I can just visualize it as a wonderful closure to a fantastic adventure!

The reason I included Jessica and not the rest of the family is because they were both there at the beginning of Harry Potter's literary life and IMO it would be a lovely way to say good-bye.




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 16:34:51 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 16:34:51 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h45ngp+n8gt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h47f3b+m906@eGroups.com>

> > va32h
> 
> > The Good:
> >   
> > The Ginny/Harry romance: this was both good and not so good. I think JK Rowling is dreadful at writing romance, so the Harry/Ginny relationship in the books was just a big old mess.  I much prefer the subtle way it's handled in the film to Harry's raging chest monster.  
> 
> Joann:
> After hating H/G in the book, I didn't mind them in the movie so much. It still doesn't make sense to me, and there is not much chemistry between DR and BW but it's still loads better than the book. The film makers must have thought H/G lacked a little in the book too, or they wouldn't have added so much/changed almost every scene of theirs. 
> 


Richard:

It has been a while since I read all the books so I forget some of the details, but I have never understood why so many people seem to be against the Harry/Ginny pairing.  It might just be because I am a hopeless romantic, but I was expecting/hoping to see both Ron/Hermione and Harry/Ginny get together from about book 4 on (Ron and Hermione probably even earlier but definitely in Goblet of Fire).  And the school romances are one area that I think the movies have consistently done a good job.  

There were definitely changes in the movie from the book, but I thought the overall feeling and build-up of the romantic angst was the same.  Well, I guess the fact that the movie Harry/Ginny relationship only makes it to the kiss, where in the book they have a first magic kiss and then are together as a couple for several weeks before the end of the term is a big difference, but hopefuly they can address that by starting the first DH movie with a clearly deeper relationship between them.  We don't need all the strained internal dialogue (and the scaley beast of teenage male hormones) because we have actual actors, and I think the few interactions Harry and Ginny have in the movie are sufficient to make it clear to the audience the feelings of both parties.  And the on screen interactions between Ron and Hermione pretty clearly reveal to the audience that Hermione is right there at the cusp of killing Ron for being the biggest dolt in the universe just like she was in Golbet of Fire :)  

And, of course, we have the scene with Harry and Hermione on the steps which clears up the Harry/Ginny, Ron/Hermione, and Harry/Hermione relationships for the teenage boys in the audience that still haven't figured it out because they are dense like Ron :)  

I definitely liked the way they changed the infirmary scene to bring a quicker resolution to Ron/Lavender.  And the dormitory scene with Ron and Harry talking about nice skin was hilarious.  

I will willingly admit that I hope they go completely overboard to make the Ron/Hermione thing heat up in DH1&2 :)  

Thanks,
Richard






From montavilla47 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 17:29:05 2009
From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 17:29:05 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <000c01ca0727$cbc89680$6359c380$@com>
Message-ID: <h47i91+tqcq@eGroups.com>


> Montavilla47:
> Plus, we then get one of those scenes where other actors have to *tell*
> us what happened. It reminds me of that clumsy moment in PS/SS when
> we learn that Harry made the Quidditch team from Nearly Headless Nick.
> 
> 
> 
> md:
> We know Harry is on the Quidditch team because McGonagall
> Marches him over to Wood and announces she's found him a seeker, hardly from
> Nearly Headless Nick.

Montavilla47:
Right.  But right after, I believe, Harry gets that lesson from
Oliver Wood about the different types of balls, we get this totally
unnecessary moment where Nick is says to some random ghost 
girl, "Did you hear that Harry Potter was put onto the Gryffindor 
Quidditch team?  I always knew that boy would make good!" (Or
words to that effect, I don't remember them exactly.)

It was completely unnecessary, since, as you say, we already
got that information when McGonagall told Wood that she'd 
found him a seeker, and then we had a whole scene where 
Harry learns how to play Quidditch.

Which makes the line unnecessary and clumsy exposition.

> 
> Montavilla47:
> In the film, Harry has no reason *not* to take Snape's orders. There's
> hardly
> any tension between the two of them, and the key conflict for Harry (Snape 
> telling Voldemort the prophecy) is never revealed.
> 
> 
> 
> md:
> 
> Harry and Snape had "tension" since the first film, that doesn't have to be
> new to the movie. Also, Harry heard Snape and Draco, he knows of the
> unbreakable vow, he knows Snape must stand by Draco, so yes, he has TONS of
> reasons not to trust or listen to snape.

Montavilla47:
It doesn't have to be new, but it has to be there.  And it isn't.  Not to
point that it was in the book.  We miss all the great Snape/Harry 
moments.  We don't get Snape walking Harry up to the castle and
making him humiliate himself by walking into the Great Hall a 
bloody mess.   We don't get Harry showing Snape up in class.  
We especially don't get the confrontation between them when 
Snape calls Harry a liar and a cheat, or the dramatic information that
Snape caused Voldemort to target Harry's family.

Sadly, in DH, that drama goes nowhere, so perhaps it was wise
of the film makers to drop it, but had that not been the case, they
would have cut out a major dramatic development.  






From va32h at comcast.net  Wed Jul 22 18:07:53 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 18:07:53 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h47f3b+m906@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h47khp+hnqc@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:

> 
> It has been a while since I read all the books so I forget some of the details, but I have never understood why so many people seem to be against the Harry/Ginny pairing.  


va32h:

I am not against the Harry/Ginny pairing, I just don't think Rowling wrote it very well - I don't think she wrote any of her romantic relationships very well.

Somewhere around book 5, Ginny just became Perfect Girl - beautiful, smart, athletic, sassy, etc.  As with most "perfect" characters, she's pretty two dimensional.  Harry's attraction to her, as described in book 6, seems to be all about her long bouncy hair and the fact that she doesn't cry all the time, like Cho did. 

Probably pretty typical for a teenage romance, but if I'm supposed to believe that Harry and Ginny are a Love for the Ages, I need a little more than that. 



> I will willingly admit that I hope they go completely overboard to make the Ron/Hermione thing heat up in DH1&2 :)  
> 

va32h:

Oh I agree.  I could not understand why DH began with Ron/Herimone *still* not together when HBP seemed to have settled the matter between them. 

The HBP film left things a little more nebulous between Ron & Hermione, but I do hope they get together at the beginning, not the end.  Watching them bicker for six movies is quite enough. 

va32h




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 19:06:31 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 19:06:31 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h47khp+hnqc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h47nvn+spto@eGroups.com>

> Richard Shepard wrote:
> > 
> > It has been a while since I read all the books so I forget some of the details, but I have never understood why so many people seem to be against the Harry/Ginny pairing.  
> >
> 
> va32h:
> 
> I am not against the Harry/Ginny pairing, I just don't think Rowling wrote it very well - I don't think she wrote any of her romantic relationships very well.
> 
> Somewhere around book 5, Ginny just became Perfect Girl - beautiful, smart, athletic, sassy, etc.  As with most "perfect" characters, she's pretty two dimensional.  Harry's attraction to her, as described in book 6, seems to be all about her long bouncy hair and the fact that she doesn't cry all the time, like Cho did. 
> 
> Probably pretty typical for a teenage romance, but if I'm supposed to believe that Harry and Ginny are a Love for the Ages, I need a little more than that. 
> 

Richard:

I see what you are saying.  I guess I never thought of it as Harry suddenly liking her just because she was prettier and more popular.  In my opinion, Harry has always liked her.  First as Ron's little sister, then as a friend and teammate.  I always thought it was inevitable she would be a standout considering her personality and family (think Bill and Charlie not just Ron :)).  We get a slightly warped impression of her in the first couple of books because she is always different around Harry.  Her all of the sudden becoming "perfect girl" in book 5 was not that weird for me.  Being a fourth year means she is finally half way done with Hogwarts and is therefore an "upper classwoman".  It is hard to be popular when you are a newbie.  I think the crucial thing to remember about Ginny in books 5 and 6 is that she is changing less than Harry's image of her is changing.  Harry is being forced think about her as Ginny Weasley the smart, pretty, funny girl that is only one year younger than him, instead of Ron's little sister.  Mostly this is just Ginny being Ginny with more confidence then she had when she was younger.  But we also know that Hermione counselled her to stop fixating on Harry and spread her wings and let herself get noticed for being herself.  Considering Hermione is "the brightest witch of her age" it is not suprising it worked out even better than either of them would have expected :)
And don't forget Mrs. Weasley's obvious preference for the Harry/Ginny and Ron/Hermione pairings.  I don't think anyone is going to mess with that woman :)


> > Richard:
> > 
> > I will willingly admit that I hope they go completely overboard to make the Ron/Hermione thing heat up in DH1&2 :)  
> > 
> 
>
> va32h:
> 
> Oh I agree.  I could not understand why DH began with Ron/Herimone *still* not together when HBP seemed to have settled the matter between them. 
> 
> The HBP film left things a little more nebulous between Ron & Hermione, but I do hope they get together at the beginning, not the end.  Watching them bicker for six movies is quite enough. 
>

Richard: 

That is a good point.  They should have a good opportunity to solidify both relationships before the horcrux hunting begins if they take advantage of the Burrow scenes and the wedding.


Thanks,
Richard





From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 22 19:12:25 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 15:12:25 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] DH Epilogue - The Final Good Bye!
In-Reply-To: <h47deh+2m30@eGroups.com>
References: <h47deh+2m30@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001f01ca0b00$59105ab0$0b311010$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Cat
The reason I included Jessica and not the rest of the family is because they
were both there at the beginning of Harry Potter's literary life and IMO it
would be a lovely way to say good-bye.

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

 

I would find it distracting, not like Stephen King writing himself into the
last two books of the Dark Tower, but still distracting.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From montavilla47 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 19:19:04 2009
From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 19:19:04 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h42kns+nvhm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h47on8+s28m@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
>
> Carol earlier:
> > > Interestingly, she's read the books (unlike Michael Gambon and, of all people, Alan Rickman!).
> 
> Lizzie responded: 
> > Whenever I read that quote from Gambon's interview, I feel compelled to jump to Alan's defense!  He has indeed read the books; admitted as much from the beginning and in a recent interview talked about reading DH. <snip>
> >
> Carol responds:
> 
> That's what I thought, too, until I read the Gambon interview. Now I'm not so sure that Gambon is mistaken (or joking, as you suggest). Surely, if Alan Rickman had read HBP, he would object to the way the tower scene is handled in the film.
> 
> Of course, if Gambon *is* joking, it's very irresponsible of him to make such misleading statements.
> 
> Do you by any chance have a link to that Rickman interview stating that he's read the books? If so, I'd greatly appreciate it if you'd provide it.
> 
> Carol, not knowing what to believe at this point and wondering why Rickman would agree to such an illogical, out-of-character scene if he has indeed read the books
>

Montavilla47:

But you could say the same for the writer and the director.  Presumably, they've
read the books, too!  Wouldn't they object to such a scene?

I just think you're putting a lot of responsibility on the actors.  They can 
protest, but it wasn't Alan Rickman or Michael Gambon who staged that 
scene.  It certainly wasn't either of them who designed a honkin' big 
set element in the middle of the tower that prevented the actors from
actually seeing each other--thus making any kind of dramatic eye
contact impossible.





From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 22 19:20:05 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 15:20:05 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h47i91+tqcq@eGroups.com>
References: <000c01ca0727$cbc89680$6359c380$@com> <h47i91+tqcq@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002901ca0b01$6b8cc1a0$42a644e0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of montavilla47





It was completely unnecessary, since, as you say, we already
got that information when McGonagall told Wood that she'd 
found him a seeker, and then we had a whole scene where 
Harry learns how to play Quidditch.

Which makes the line unnecessary and clumsy exposition.
//////////////////////////////////

I didn't see like that at all. It was "the whole school is talking about it"
and the scene with Nick is just him passing through as the camera pans. 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 22 19:21:49 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 15:21:49 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h47khp+hnqc@eGroups.com>
References: <h47f3b+m906@eGroups.com> <h47khp+hnqc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002e01ca0b01$a96aebf0$fc40c3d0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of va32h




va32h:

Oh I agree. I could not understand why DH began with Ron/Herimone *still*
not together when HBP seemed to have settled the matter between them. 

The HBP film left things a little more nebulous between Ron & Hermione, but
I do hope they get together at the beginning, not the end. Watching them
bicker for six movies is quite enough.

::::::::::::::::::::::

I think JKR was thinking "how can they be a couple, with no parents around
for months and not be sleeping together, oh! I know, I won't make them a
couple yet!."

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 22 19:18:11 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 15:18:11 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h47f3b+m906@eGroups.com>
References: <h45ngp+n8gt@eGroups.com> <h47f3b+m906@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002401ca0b01$2743fb80$75cbf280$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Richard Shepard



Richard:

It has been a while since I read all the books so I forget some of the
details, but I have never understood why so many people seem to be against
the Harry/Ginny pairing. 

/////////////////////////////////////////////////////

I don't know anyone "against" it, I personally think that KJR didn't really
bring the relationship to light very well. I thought Harry was a complete
ass with Cho, I'm sorry but Teen-aged boys do know how to talk. I don't
think Harry and Ginny had enough interaction, we are told they are dating
but we don't see them dating, it's just "Harry and Ginny spend time
together, Harry has feelings, DD dies, Harry breaks it off."

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 21:21:50 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 21:21:50 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h47i91+tqcq@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h47vte+3i2m@eGroups.com>


> 
> Montavilla47:
> Right.  But right after, I believe, Harry gets that lesson from
> Oliver Wood about the different types of balls, we get this totally
> unnecessary moment where Nick is says to some random ghost 
> girl, "Did you hear that Harry Potter was put onto the Gryffindor 
> Quidditch team?  I always knew that boy would make good!" (Or
> words to that effect, I don't remember them exactly.)
> 
> It was completely unnecessary, since, as you say, we already
> got that information when McGonagall told Wood that she'd 
> found him a seeker, and then we had a whole scene where 
> Harry learns how to play Quidditch.
> 
> Which makes the line unnecessary and clumsy exposition.


Joann:

This reminds me of POA, when Harry and Hermione are riding Buckbeak after Harry casts the kickass patronus.  He is explaining how it was *himself* he saw across the pond, not his dad. Duh! In the movie, she was right there and it was obvious!




From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 21:35:11 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 21:35:11 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h47khp+hnqc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h480mf+s98l@eGroups.com>


> va32h:
> I am not against the Harry/Ginny pairing, I just don't think Rowling wrote it very well - I don't think she wrote any of her romantic relationships very well.
 
Joann:
I agree. She is brilliant in every other aspect of the books, but fails miserably with the romance.

> va32h:
> Somewhere around book 5, Ginny just became Perfect Girl - beautiful, smart, athletic, sassy, etc.  As with most "perfect" characters, she's pretty two dimensional. 
 
Joann:
She also had a little bit of a nasty streak in her too(in the book). I'm glad they left that out of the movie.

> va32h: 
> Probably pretty typical for a teenage romance, but if I'm supposed to believe that Harry and Ginny are a Love for the Ages, I need a little more than that. 
 
Joann:
I'm sure H/G is a thing of beauty in Rowlings head, she just for got to write it out for us! 


> va32h:  
> Oh I agree.  I could not understand why DH began with Ron/Herimone *still* not together when HBP seemed to have settled the matter between them. 

Joann:
I think in the book she didn't want to have to deal with them as a couple being alone together in tents and such. They *are* childrens books after all.

I 'm not a huge R/H fa., In the movies, I don't see much chemistry between RG and EW. It's too bad actually. But we all know you can't create chemistry. It's there or it isn't.





From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 21:48:17 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 21:48:17 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <002401ca0b01$2743fb80$75cbf280$@com>
Message-ID: <h481f1+i093@eGroups.com>

> md wrote:
 I personally think that KJR didn't really
> bring the relationship to light very well.  I don't
> think Harry and Ginny had enough interaction, we are told they are dating
> but we don't see them dating, it's just "Harry and Ginny spend time
> together, Harry has feelings, DD dies, Harry breaks it off."
> 

Joann:
I really don't like H/G but even I would have liked them to have had at least *one* conversation about their new relationship after the kiss. The focus is on how Ron is going to take it. After Rons approval we get a paragraph four lines long saying they go for a walk, then Rowling promptly skips a head a few weeks! They never said *one* word to each other! People waited for six books for this and this is what we got? 




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 21:59:30 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 21:59:30 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h481f1+i093@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h48242+kohp@eGroups.com>

> > md wrote:
> >
>  I personally think that KJR didn't really
> > bring the relationship to light very well.  I don't
> > think Harry and Ginny had enough interaction, we are told they are dating
> > but we don't see them dating, it's just "Harry and Ginny spend time
> > together, Harry has feelings, DD dies, Harry breaks it off."
> > 
> 
> Joann:
> I really don't like H/G but even I would have liked them to have had at least *one* conversation about their new relationship after the kiss. The focus is on how Ron is going to take it. After Rons approval we get a paragraph four lines long saying they go for a walk, then Rowling promptly skips a head a few weeks! They never said *one* word to each other! People waited for six books for this and this is what we got?
>


That is a good point.  There was no reflection or even enjoyment about the fact that it finally happened.  From Harry's point of view it was just getting to go out with the girl he liked, but Ginny had been dreaming about this at least since he saved her in the Chamber of Secrets.  And the readers!  

They did a pretty good job of kindling this romance with the HBP movie.  Hopefully they will illustrate the intervening time and have a strong "break-up" in the next movie.  All the kids are getting better at the actual "acting" stuff, so I bet they will be able to pull off some convincing romance and heart ache even if they are all just close-as-siblings-friends in real life.  

Thanks,
Richard





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 22:05:16 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 22:05:16 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
Message-ID: <h482es+ukkp@eGroups.com>

They are something like half-way through filming Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, so what exactly do we know about the movie so far?  Have there been enough director/actor comments to definitely say any of the favorite scenes will or will not be in the movie?  

Examples:
Do we know if there will definitely be a wedding?  
Will we get to see all the Weasleys?  They cut out every appearance of Bill and Charlie so far, and minimized Percy.  
Do we know if they are going to tackle the broom chase/fight on Harry's birthday?  


Thanks,
Richard





From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 22:18:37 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 22:18:37 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h48242+kohp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4837t+k62a@eGroups.com>


> > Joann:
> > I really don't like H/G but even I would have liked them to have had at least *one* conversation about their new relationship after the kiss. The focus is on how Ron is going to take it. After Rons approval we get a paragraph four lines long saying they go for a walk, then Rowling promptly skips a head a few weeks! They never said *one* word to each other! People waited for six books for this and this is what we got?


>Richard
> That is a good point.  There was no reflection or even enjoyment about the fact that it finally happened.  


Joann:
It's funny, I just thought how the HBP movie did the same thing. They never talked to each other about or after the kiss. 

 
> They did a pretty good job of kindling this romance with the HBP movie.  Hopefully they will illustrate the intervening time and have a strong "break-up" in the next movie.  All the kids are getting better at the actual "acting" stuff, so I bet they will be able to pull off some convincing romance and heart ache even if they are all just close-as-siblings-friends in real life.  

Joann:
It won't be a "break up" scene as they aren't dating, but a "why we can't be together" scene. 

Also, as Ginny hid the diary, I'm assuming she'll be the one to know where the diadem is. Then they will have that adventure together, while H/R go to the CoS off camera.





From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 22 22:35:52 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 18:35:52 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h47vte+3i2m@eGroups.com>
References: <h47i91+tqcq@eGroups.com> <h47vte+3i2m@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001201ca0b1c$c562b250$502816f0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of coolbeans3131





Joann:

This reminds me of POA, when Harry and Hermione are riding Buckbeak after
Harry casts the kickass patronus. He is explaining how it was *himself* he
saw across the pond, not his dad. Duh! In the movie, she was right there and
it was obvious!

//////////////////////////

But, Harry had not been able to produce a full patronus, the point he was
making was that he KNEW he COULD do it because he realized he HAD done it,
he wasn't telling her he had done it, he was telling her how he knew he
could. What he was explaining was why he suddenly decided to jump forward
and cast a spell he hadn't been able to in the past. To me, big difference.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 22 22:40:28 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 18:40:28 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h48242+kohp@eGroups.com>
References: <h481f1+i093@eGroups.com> <h48242+kohp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001701ca0b1d$69d42b70$3d7c8250$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Richard Shepard





They did a pretty good job of kindling this romance with the HBP movie.
Hopefully they will illustrate the intervening time and have a strong
"break-up" in the next movie. All the kids are getting better at the actual
"acting" stuff, so I bet they will be able to pull off some convincing
romance and heart ache even if they are all just close-as-siblings-friends
in real life. 
/////////////////////////////////

If JKR had not been such a phenomenon an editor would have sent the book
back and said "make this relationship work, or get rid of it." I think the
last three books suffered from Rowling not getting enough feedback from her
publishers and trying to keep the length from getting out of hand while
including all the plot stuff she wanted while completing the books on time.

I, personally, would be up for all 7 books revised with all the plots she
left out (like Stephen Kings "The Stand") and all winding paths of the
secondary characters, and . some H/G story!!!

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From juli17 at aol.com  Wed Jul 22 22:44:43 2009
From: juli17 at aol.com (julie)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 22:44:43 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h45592+bqr9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h484or+4i10@eGroups.com>


> Carol responds:
> 
> But my concern is with the Snape/Draco/Dumbledore subplot, which is really the heart of the book. Snape is the Half-Blood Prince, after all, so the book is about his relationship with Harry on two levels.
> 
> As I said, he needs to remain ambiguous. Yes, it should look as if he's betrayed Dumbledore's trust as he did in the book, but there should be hints that all is not as it seems. And the scene on the tower seems to be stripped of its power, its believability, and its pathos. (Harry needs to be frozen under the Invisibility Cloak, unable to act; Dumbledore needs to be weak, helpless, and obviously dying. How will they make Snape's agreeing to kill him believable in DH if he wasn't already dying from the ring curse?)
> 

Julie:
This is the main problem with the movie, IMO. I enjoyed it on some
levels, but the whole Half-Blood Prince part of the story is barely
there, and Snape's revelation comes off as rather irrelevant ("The
Half---oh, yeah, the book from the first part of the movie, I'd
already forgotten about it."). The Tower scene is very much
lacking in power and pathos, which is inexplicable to me in a
movie adaptation. Why take the most powerful and emotional scene
in all the books (IMO) and reduce it to something much less, when
the usual choice for movie adapations is to keep and even enhance
these kind of scenes that resonate strongly with the audience?
I was on the edge of the seat while reading this scene in the book,
but in the movie it was quite a letdown. All the characters
were much more subdued in the movie version, despite the efforts
of the actors. I wanted to see Dumbledore obviously weakened,
Snape furious and conflicted, Harry horrified and enraged by his
powerlessness to act. But it isn't there.

As for the relationship between Harry and Snape, it has barely 
existed on any level in the movies, missing most of the acts of
animosity (Snape's gross unfairness to Harry in class, Harry's 
blame of Sirius's death on Snape, Harry invading Snape's memories,
etc) from the books. Nothing really changes in HBP, and some of it
was even cut apparently (part of the confrontation between Harry
and Snape at the end was cut, including a comment about Lily's
eyes from Snape, and Harry's "Fight back, you coward!"). 

Which is why in the movie I did find Harry's willingness to 
let Snape by without interfering in context. After all, Dumbledore
ordered Harry not to interfere, and given that Harry showed 
little hesitation in force-feeding Dumbledore the potion in the
cave (as opposed to his anguished doubts in the book), and the
lack of extreme animosity and loathing between Harry and Snape
in the movies, it didn't seem out of character that Harry would
wait as he'd been told, at least until he heard Snape's "Avada
Kedavra."

Even while (trying) to ignore the books and view HBP within the
more restrictive context of the movies, HBP doesn't work completely
and sacrifices a lot of its dramatic potential by shortchanging
the Dumbledore/Draco/Snape/Harry story and interaction in favor
of the romance angle and the addition of scenes not really 
related to either angle (the cafe and Burrow scenes). So you go 
forewarned, Carol. At least the acting is uniformly well done!

Julie 




From juli17 at aol.com  Wed Jul 22 23:02:26 2009
From: juli17 at aol.com (julie)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 23:02:26 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h455cg+du3m@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h485q2+c54o@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
>
> zanooda:
> > 
> > I suppose he poisoned the mead himself :-). From what I heard, he gave that cursed necklace to Katie himself, so why not the mead :-)? I also heard that not everything we saw in the trailers is in the movie, including Snape's "it's over" line. I wonder if it's true. Not that I care about this particular line, just curious. I'll be able to see the movie only next week, maybe even later...

Julie:
The "It's over" line is not in the movie. From what I hear there
were quite a few memorable lines inexplicably cut from the movie,
including Harry and Dumbledore's mutual "I'm not worried, I'm with
you" comments, several lines during Harry and Snape's confrontation
at the end ("Fight back, you coward!" and "You have your mother's
eyes."), and a brief conversation between Luna and Sanguini at 
Slughorn's party. I assume they will be on the DVD as deleted 
scenes (at least I hope so!).

Julie





From juli17 at aol.com  Wed Jul 22 23:10:46 2009
From: juli17 at aol.com (julie)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 23:10:46 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h482es+ukkp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4869m+emid@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:
>
> They are something like half-way through filming Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, so what exactly do we know about the movie so far?  Have there been enough director/actor comments to definitely say any of the favorite scenes will or will not be in the movie?  
> 
> Examples:
> Do we know if there will definitely be a wedding?  
> Will we get to see all the Weasleys?  They cut out every appearance of Bill and Charlie so far, and minimized Percy.  
> Do we know if they are going to tackle the broom chase/fight on Harry's birthday?  
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> Richard
>

Julie:
I do know they've already built a Shell Cottage set and are
filming there. I'm not sure if this will be Bill and Fleur's
home, given we haven't seen Bill in the movies (and he wasn't
attacked by Fenrir in the HBP movie; in fact, it wasn't even
clear in the HBP movie that Fenrir was a werewolf). I suppose
it could be Lupin and Tonks home instead? Though I'd love to
see Bill and Fleur.

I can't imagine a scene full of the potential hilarity of the
Seven Potters, as well as the visual pyrotechnics of the broom
fight, will be left out of DH! (Though the vast potential of
the Tower scene in HBP was mostly squandered...)

Julie




From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 23:18:07 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 23:18:07 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <001201ca0b1c$c562b250$502816f0$@com>
Message-ID: <h486nf+hnea@eGroups.com>


> > md
> But, Harry had not been able to produce a full patronus, the point he was
> making was that he KNEW he COULD do it because he realized he HAD done it,
> he wasn't telling her he had done it, he was telling her how he knew he
> could. What he was explaining was why he suddenly decided to jump forward
> and cast a spell he hadn't been able to in the past. To me, big difference.


Joann:
I agree, it's just that they took the scene right out of the book, without accounting for they change they made. they just should have changed the wording accordingly. Just a small gripe about a very good movie.




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 22 23:19:19 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 23:19:19 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h482es+ukkp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h486pn+63kl@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:

> Do we know if there will definitely be a wedding?


zanooda:

Yes :-). I even remember reading somewhere that it will be filmed very soon. We know the actors were cast to play Bill, Muriel and Doge, and Fleur and Krum are returning. The wedding it is :-)! Although if the Burrow was burned down in HBP, I don't know where they will hold it...

  
> Will we get to see all the Weasleys?


I haven't hard anything about Charlie yet, and I think there is no point in bringing him in for the last two movies. The rest of them will be there.

   
> Do we know if they are going to tackle the broom chase/fight 
> on Harry's birthday?  


Do you mean "Seven Potters"? It was not on Harry's birthday :-). No news yet about this chase, but they seem to have transformed the scene with the Snatchers into a chase too. The Trio are first chased through the forest by the Snatchers and only then captured :-). 

About Harry's birthday - Bill Nighy is playing Scrimgeour. Arrr, Davy Jones :-)! I hope we'll hear something about little/young Lily and Snape soon.





From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 22 23:49:22 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 19:49:22 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h486pn+63kl@eGroups.com>
References: <h482es+ukkp@eGroups.com> <h486pn+63kl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001501ca0b27$09921880$1cb64980$@com>

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0926084/fullcredits#cast

 

No Charlie listed.

 

md

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of zanooda2




I haven't hard anything about Charlie yet, and I think there is no point in
bringing him in for the last two movies. The rest of them will be there.




 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From thedossetts at gmail.com  Thu Jul 23 04:10:56 2009
From: thedossetts at gmail.com (rtbthw_mom)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 04:10:56 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h455rm+nbr8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h48nsg+3of7@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "va32h" <va32h at ...> wrote:
>
> --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67@> wrote:
> >
> > 
> 
> As its own separate entity, closely tied to the books, but not really a part of that story, the films are good. But looking for a faithful chapter by chapter adaptation is just asking for disappointment. 
> 
> va32h
>

AMEN.  The movies, while intended to stand alone, just don't.  I saw SS before ever reading the book, and that movie arguably follows its book better than any of the successive movies, and barely understood it (and was actually negatively impacted by all the book fans' reactions to it.  Didn't enjoy at all the extended ending, which was obviously there just to make the book fans happy: most of it wasn't needed from a movie standpoint.)

One more comment on Narcissa: didn't like what they did with her at all.  My impression from the books (travelling now, no books, can't quote canon) was that of the three sisters, Narcissa was the most beautiful; hence the name, varying from a name of a constellation.  But I wasn't impressed, visually, by the actress.  She was NOT Narcissa Malfoy for me.  

I was also not happy with the Unbreakable Vow scene.  In my head, their hands, *clasped*, were wrapped around each other, sort of pointing up (don't ask me why, this is how I imagined it.)  They looked like they were shaking hands to me.  Oh well.  I guess the film version could be seen as accurate - I just liked my way, better!

Having said that, I did enjoy the movie *as a representation of a few of the best scenes from the book.*  I'm waiting for the miniseries, 10-20 years from now, to really enjoy it on screen (sort of like the BBC production of Pride and Prejudice.  It's my favorite screen version!)






From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 23 04:57:09 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 00:57:09 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h48nsg+3of7@eGroups.com>
References: <h455rm+nbr8@eGroups.com> <h48nsg+3of7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000f01ca0b52$093ce510$1bb6af30$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of rtbthw_mom





Having said that, I did enjoy the movie *as a representation of a few of the
best scenes from the book.* I'm waiting for the miniseries, 10-20 years from
now, to really enjoy it on screen (sort of like the BBC production of Pride
and Prejudice. It's my favorite screen version!)

////////////////////////////////////////////

No! Not BBC!!! I can't stand the lousy production, regardless of how
faithful the adaptations are, all the ones I've seen are shot on video, the
production values are extremely low and if they have to have special effects
they are distracting at best. They spent $200,000,000 to make HBP, the BBC
couldn't afford that for the entire series, they'd be lucky to spend 10% of
that. 

 

The better plan would have been to film 4 -5 hour films, release them all at
2:45 in the theaters, then capitalize on that extra footage on DVD and Cable
TV sales later. WB really dropped the ball there. Lord of the Rings and
Watchmen proved that the fans will be there to buy those extended editions.
After all, I was never upset with LOTR in the theaters because I knew most
of what was "missing" was coming on DVD in six months. 

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 23 05:09:02 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 05:09:02 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h4837t+k62a@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h48r9e+evuk@eGroups.com>

> > > Joann:
> > > I really don't like H/G but even I would have liked them to have had at least *one* conversation about their new relationship after the kiss. The focus is on how Ron is going to take it. After Rons approval we get a paragraph four lines long saying they go for a walk, then Rowling promptly skips a head a few weeks! They never said *one* word to each other! People waited for six books for this and this is what we got?
> 
> 
> >Richard
> > That is a good point.  There was no reflection or even enjoyment about the fact that it finally happened.  
> 
> 
> Joann:
> It's funny, I just thought how the HBP movie did the same thing. They never talked to each other about or after the kiss. 
> 

Richard:

True, but they rushed the timeline in several places, and I was not sure how much time was supposed to have transpired.  They didn't talk after the kiss, but they also didn't say something silly like several weeks of hanging out and snogging transpired until...


> > They did a pretty good job of kindling this romance with the HBP movie.  Hopefully they will illustrate the intervening time and have a strong "break-up" in the next movie.  All the kids are getting better at the actual "acting" stuff, so I bet they will be able to pull off some convincing romance and heart ache even if they are all just close-as-siblings-friends in real life.  
> 
> Joann:
> It won't be a "break up" scene as they aren't dating, but a "why we can't be together" scene. 
> 
> Also, as Ginny hid the diary, I'm assuming she'll be the one to know where the diadem is. Then they will have that adventure together, while H/R go to the CoS off camera.
>


Richard:  

Who knows if they will be dating or not when DH opens :)  
A summer of lovin' would sure make the separation more heartbreaking.  
You mean since Ginny head the Advanced Potions textbook in the Room of Requirement?  That is an interesting thought.  Ginny could definitely be the key to helping Harry find the diadem in the movie.  
Considering the kind of changes they have felt comfortable with making for the last six movies, it will be interesting to see what changes they think will make the story flow well on screen and showcase the characters in the right way.  


Thanks,
Richard






From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 23 05:12:32 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 05:12:32 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <001701ca0b1d$69d42b70$3d7c8250$@com>
Message-ID: <h48rg0+4dki@eGroups.com>

Child Of Midian wrote:
>
> 
> If JKR had not been such a phenomenon an editor would have sent the book
> back and said "make this relationship work, or get rid of it." I think the
> last three books suffered from Rowling not getting enough feedback from her
> publishers and trying to keep the length from getting out of hand while
> including all the plot stuff she wanted while completing the books on time.
> 
> I, personally, would be up for all 7 books revised with all the plots she
> left out (like Stephen Kings "The Stand") and all winding paths of the
> secondary characters, and . some H/G story!!!
> 


That sounds like a great idea.  I suspect Rowling has no interest in editing and republishing her crazily successful seven book series...  So maybe you could clean them up for us :)

Thanks,
Richard





From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Thu Jul 23 05:33:06 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 05:33:06 -0000
Subject: A Harry Potter miniseries (was: Two WTF moments in the movie)
In-Reply-To: <000f01ca0b52$093ce510$1bb6af30$@com>
Message-ID: <h48smi+d5j2@eGroups.com>

 rtbthw_mom  
 
> I'm waiting for the miniseries, 10-20 years from
> now, to really enjoy it on screen

Yes someday that will happen, but not today, special effects are too expensive, but they're getting cheaper and better every day. Perhaps they can get Daniel Radcliffe to play Snape, or Voldemort.

 Eggplant








From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 23 05:39:48 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 01:39:48 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <h48rg0+4dki@eGroups.com>
References: <001701ca0b1d$69d42b70$3d7c8250$@com> <h48rg0+4dki@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000901ca0b57$fe7d5f50$fb781df0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Richard Shepard




That sounds like a great idea. I suspect Rowling has no interest in editing
and republishing her crazily successful seven book series... So maybe you
could clean them up for us :)

Thanks,
Richard

//////////////////////////////

 

You never know, in say, ten years? She's always talked about plot lines for
Dean, Seamus and especially Neville as well as other Ron and Hermione
stories that she started leaving out from the first book. As a writer I can
tell you that it's very hard to decide how far to branch a novel off. I
think just like the movies she became more and more streamlined into Harry's
story (except the part when he falls in love with the mother of his future
children!!!) and I think it would be interesting to see it as more of the
ensemble piece and I think it actually focuses more on Harry that way
because the reader's involvement with the wizarding world is stronger so the
stakes for Harry to succeed feel even stronger.


Just saying, you never know. and then there's the idea that a publisher may
wave $$$ to get it the option.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 23 14:19:02 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 14:19:02 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h486pn+63kl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h49rgm+5hrc@eGroups.com>

> > Richard:
> >
> > Do we know if there will definitely be a wedding?
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Yes :-). I even remember reading somewhere that it will be filmed very soon. We know the actors were cast to play Bill, Muriel and Doge, and Fleur and Krum are returning. The wedding it is :-)! Although if the Burrow was burned down in HBP, I don't know where they will hold it...
> 

Richard: 

They are a pure blood wizarding family with a eight adult wizards.  IF they can not repair a little fire damage I will be very annoyed :)


> > Richard:
> >
> > Will we get to see all the Weasleys?
> 
> 
> I haven't hard anything about Charlie yet, and I think there is no point in bringing him in for the last two movies. The rest of them will be there.
> 

Richard:  

We should get to see Charlie because he is freakin' cool.
And since The Weasley's are presented as the "good" pure-blood wizard family, and both Hermione and Harry are destined to join it, I would think it is important for us to get to see the whole horde.


> > Do we know if they are going to tackle the broom chase/fight 
> > on Harry's birthday?  
> 
> 
> Do you mean "Seven Potters"? It was not on Harry's birthday :-). No news yet about this chase, but they seem to have transformed the scene with the Snatchers into a chase too. The Trio are first chased through the forest by the Snatchers and only then captured :-). 
> 
> About Harry's birthday - Bill Nighy is playing Scrimgeour. Arrr, Davy Jones :-)! I hope we'll hear something about little/young Lily and Snape soon.
>

Richard:

I don't know why I said it was on Harry's birthday.  But still, it was only a couple of days before his birthday :)  
The "Seven Potters" broom chase/fight should definitely be in the movie.  It could be a real WOW way to start the first film.  And just like in the book it would reinforce the danger to anyone who is near Harry, which will make the split with Ginny and committment of Hermione and Ron more meaningful.  

Thanks,
Richard





From HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com  Thu Jul 23 14:23:05 2009
From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com (HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com)
Date: 23 Jul 2009 14:23:05 -0000
Subject: New poll for HPFGU-Movie 
Message-ID: <1248358985.98.46174.w8@yahoogroups.com>


Enter your vote today!  A new poll has been created for the 
HPFGU-Movie group:

Which Harry Potter movie is your favorite (1-6)? 

  o Sorcerer's Stone 
  o Chamber of Secrets 
  o Prisoner of Azkaban 
  o Goblet of Fire 
  o Order of the Phoenix 
  o Half-Blood Prince 


To vote, please visit the following web page:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-Movie/surveys?id=12927612 

Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are 
not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups 
web site listed above.

Thanks!

 






From CatMcNulty at comcast.net  Thu Jul 23 16:09:13 2009
From: CatMcNulty at comcast.net (Cat)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:09:13 -0000
Subject: DH Epilogue - The Final Good Bye!
In-Reply-To: <001f01ca0b00$59105ab0$0b311010$@com>
Message-ID: <h4a1v9+ao9e@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:


> I would find it distracting, not like Stephen King writing himself into the
> last two books of the Dark Tower, but still distracting.
>> 
> md
>
>
Cat responds:

(Well ... Agreed, the shared acknowledgement nod would be too much) But Jo as an extra on the platform...as a parent saying good-bye to her child? I really don't think that it would be distracting at all! Just a very brief and VERY subtle moment. I know as a fan I would like to see it.
Something not even noticeable until the second or third time you see the film.

I do agree about the Stephen King's appearances in the movies made from his books...he is about as subtle as a 18-ton truck in the living room. But subtle like the "Nina" in a Hirschfeld or Alfred Hitchcock in one of his movies.

I still would like to see it!

Cat 
 






From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 23 17:04:44 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 17:04:44 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h49rgm+5hrc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4a57c+fcvv@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:

> We should get to see Charlie because he is freakin' cool.


zanooda:

I just meant to say that Charlie doesn't do much in DH, so I'm not sure they would want to introduce him. Personally I would be glad to see him. Do you have some actor in mind :-)?


> Richard:

> The "Seven Potters" broom chase/fight should definitely be 
> in the movie. It could be a real WOW way to start the first film.


zanooda:

Don't forget that it would be also funny - different characters transforming into Harry... :-).  





From joeydebs at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 23 17:02:24 2009
From: joeydebs at yahoo.com (Debi)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 17:02:24 -0000
Subject: DH Epilogue - The Final Good Bye!
In-Reply-To: <h4a1v9+ao9e@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4a530+6v7a@eGroups.com>

<snip>
> Cat responds:
> 
But Jo as an extra on the platform...as a parent saying good-bye to her child? I really don't think that it would be distracting at all! Just a very brief and VERY subtle moment. I know as a fan I would like to see it.
> Something not even noticeable until the second or third time you see the film.

Debi:

You mean something like Peter Jackson in LotR? - he made a short cameo in each of the three films but they weren't instrusive at all. It sounds like a nice idea if played right.




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 23 18:04:16 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 18:04:16 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4a57c+fcvv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4a8n0+emq5@eGroups.com>

> Richard wrote:
>
> > We should get to see Charlie because he is freakin' cool.
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> I just meant to say that Charlie doesn't do much in DH, so I'm not sure they would want to introduce him. Personally I would be glad to see him. Do you have some actor in mind :-)?
> 


Richard: 

I guess I am coming from the "Why not have him in the movie" point of view.  If they are doing the wedding they should have a Charlie.  He is the best man, and a Weasley wedding without all the Weasley's present doesn't make a lot of sense anyway.

I am not familiar with many redheaded actors (actresses yes, but that is a different topic :)), but Simon Woods would probably be a pretty good choice.  I saw him in Pride & Prejudice and Cranford and he was really good in both.


> > Richard:
> 
> > The "Seven Potters" broom chase/fight should definitely be 
> > in the movie. It could be a real WOW way to start the first film.
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Don't forget that it would be also funny - different characters transforming into Harry... :-).
>

Richard: 

I meant WOW in the broadest sense.  Amazing, suprising, funny, scarry, etc...  It is a very nifty word :)


Thanks,
Richard





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 23 18:09:19 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 18:09:19 -0000
Subject: DH Epilogue - The Final Good Bye!
In-Reply-To: <h4a1v9+ao9e@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4a90f+g9fj@eGroups.com>

> Cat responds:
> 
> (Well ... Agreed, the shared acknowledgement nod would be too much) But Jo as an extra on the platform...as a parent saying good-bye to her child? I really don't think that it would be distracting at all! Just a very brief and VERY subtle moment. I know as a fan I would like to see it.
> Something not even noticeable until the second or third time you see the film.
> 
> I do agree about the Stephen King's appearances in the movies made from his books...he is about as subtle as a 18-ton truck in the living room. But subtle like the "Nina" in a Hirschfeld or Alfred Hitchcock in one of his movies.
> 
> I still would like to see it!
> 

Richard:

A background cameo as just another parent sending their child off to Hogwarts would be very nice.  I do not think it would be distracting.  I do not recall the ages of all of Rowling's children, but I bet they would all want to be in the scene somehow.

The Twilight author Meyers had a tiny cameo in the first movie, and it was cute without being at all distracting.  Just an extra doing something normal.  

Thanks,
Richard







From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 23 19:59:16 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 19:59:16 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers))
In-Reply-To: <000901ca0b57$fe7d5f50$fb781df0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4afek+gk0b@eGroups.com>

> Richard wrote:
> 
> That sounds like a great idea. I suspect Rowling has no interest in editing
> and republishing her crazily successful seven book series... So maybe you
> could clean them up for us :)
 

md wrote:  

> You never know, in say, ten years? She's always talked about plot lines for
> Dean, Seamus and especially Neville as well as other Ron and Hermione
> stories that she started leaving out from the first book. As a writer I can
> tell you that it's very hard to decide how far to branch a novel off. I
> think just like the movies she became more and more streamlined into Harry's
> story (except the part when he falls in love with the mother of his future
> children!!!) and I think it would be interesting to see it as more of the
> ensemble piece and I think it actually focuses more on Harry that way
> because the reader's involvement with the wizarding world is stronger so the
> stakes for Harry to succeed feel even stronger.
> 
> Just saying, you never know. and then there's the idea that a publisher may
> wave $$$ to get it the option.
> 

A very convincing scenario/argument you put forward.  I am not a writer (at least not since the creative writing classes in college), so I do not really have any idea how tempting or not the idea of reworking a completed series would be.  I certainly wouldn't mind reading whatever she wanted to put out as revisions.  The more backstory and side adventures the better.  And I would certainly love to see more Ron, Hermione, and Neville since those are my three favorite characters.

Thanks,
Richard





From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 24 00:56:04 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 00:56:04 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
Message-ID: <h4b0r4+g328@eGroups.com>

Hello all!

I was thinking of the Deathly Hallows movies, and realize there are many problems to overcome. Some are the film makers doing and some J K Rowlings.

The way the book is written, there are some issues with filming.

1. There's all the poly juice potion scenes. It seems as though they shot some scenes at the ministry and there were three "strangers" that will been H/R/H. It may be difficult in the film to adjust to these people and keep track of them. More problematic is the scene at Godrics Hallow. There is no way we will see two strangers here. We've waited all this time for Harry to visit GH and his parents graves. We need the emotional impact of Dan Radcliffe acting this out. Will H/H just show up there as themselves? (I hope they leave the 7 Harrys and Bella/Hermione ones in though)

2.The trio will NEED to apparate in the film, many times. It's never been mentioned they learned. Filmgoers know Harry has never apparated because of his reaction to doing it with Dumbledore. Will Hermione teach them at the very beginning to do it?

As for some of the many ways the filmakers have boxed themselves in

1. Sirius mirror-no show
2. Phineas Nigellus portrait-no show
3. No mention of the prophecy being overheard in Ootp or that it was Snape who overheard and told about it in HBP
4. No mention of Harry inheriting 12 GP or Kreacher
5. No sign or mention of Dobby since CoS
6. No Bill or mention that he's marrying Fleur (though that does seem to be in the movie) and the Weasleys house burning down!


There are more, and I have some ideas about these, but it will have to wait for another time. I need to put the kids to bed. What do you all think?

Joann










From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 24 02:59:13 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 22:59:13 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4b0r4+g328@eGroups.com>
References: <h4b0r4+g328@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of coolbeans3131

. Sirius mirror-no show
2. Phineas Nigellus portrait-no show
3. No mention of the prophecy being overheard in Ootp or that it was Snape
who overheard and told about it in HBP
4. No mention of Harry inheriting 12 GP or Kreacher
5. No sign or mention of Dobby since CoS
6. No Bill or mention that he's marrying Fleur (though that does seem to be
in the movie) and the Weasleys house burning down!

There are more, and I have some ideas about these, but it will have to wait
for another time. I need to put the kids to bed. What do you all think?

Joann

 

?///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////?

 

What it tells me is that they will be making DH a very, very simple film. 

 

I saw a preview special that showed DD in the Dursely's in HPB but it was
not in the film. I presume that scene would have covered Sirius's will. They
can certainly go to 12GP without stating it belongs to Harry. Snapes role in
the prophecy and his relationship with Lilly with simply vanish, it will
come down to the one memory of DD telling Snape that Harry must die by
Voldy's hand in the end and it will be played off as nothing more than Snape
relaying DD last order. Dobby should have brought the gilly-weed in GOF and
he should have been around in OOTP and HBP as an 'extra' as only a single
line "now that he's free, Dobby works at Hogwarts" for an explanation. Don't
need to mention Fleur and Bill in HBP, the wedding will happen in DH as both
Bill and Fleur are in the film and there's no reason to include Fleur
without the wedding. I do not know if Ted Tonks will happen in DH though,
nor Harry, the 17 yr old, being the godfather becomes the parent for Ted
before he's even 18. 

 

Everything in the films has been "simplify, simplify, simplify" completely
loosing the "put-the-clues-together" parts of the books. My favorite parts
of re-reading the books is putting all the pieces together from book-to-book
and films lack that.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From valerie.flowe at verizon.net  Fri Jul 24 03:58:44 2009
From: valerie.flowe at verizon.net (Valerie Flowe)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 23:58:44 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: DH Epilogue - The Final Good Bye!
In-Reply-To: <h4a90f+g9fj@eGroups.com>
References: <h4a90f+g9fj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <17595103d476d5b26d7f53c266f544f8@verizon.net>

Richard:
A background cameo as just another parent sending their child off to 
Hogwarts would be very nice. I do not think it would be distracting. I 
do not recall the ages of all of Rowling's children, but I bet they 
would all want to be in the scene somehow.
The Twilight author Meyers had a tiny cameo in the first movie, and it 
was cute without being at all distracting. Just an extra doing 
something normal.

Valerie:
I love it! Maybe her daughter could even be holding some Harry Potter 
books in her hand...hehe! Well perhaps that would be a bit much.
How about...Harry & Ginny wave goodbye to their kids and all the 
parents start to walk away as the train pulls away from the platform. 
The camera sweeps through the train, into the dining compartment, up to 
a woman seated at a table with her back to us, familiar blond hair and 
zooms over her shoulder to a close-up of a hand (Jo's) with a quill 
writing a flourishing "The End".




From valerie.flowe at verizon.net  Fri Jul 24 05:03:29 2009
From: valerie.flowe at verizon.net (Valerie Flowe)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 01:03:29 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com>
References: <h4b0r4+g328@eGroups.com> <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com>
Message-ID: <e5a18b02a7775248c4853900224f386f@verizon.net>


coolbeans3131:
>  What it tells me is that they will be making DH a very, very simple 
> film.
> <snip> Snapes role in the prophecy and his relationship with Lilly 
> with simply vanish, it will
>  come down to the one memory of DD telling Snape that Harry must die by
>  Voldy's hand in the end and it will be played off as nothing more 
> than Snape
>  relaying DD last order.

Valerie: ACK!!! So how will they explain the animosity that Snape had 
towards Harry all these years?! Was he merely jealous that Harry was 
considered special as 'The boy who Lived'? No! He was in love with 
Harry's mother who was his only childhood friend. Then she dumps him 
for his arch-nemesis James, who, along with Sirius, torture him 
mercilessly! That was such an important revelation in Book 7.

coolbeans3131:
> Dobby should have brought the gilly-weed in GOF and
>  he should have been around in OOTP and HBP as an 'extra' as only a 
> single
>  line "now that he's free, Dobby works at Hogwarts" for an explanation.

Valerie: Well I heard that Kreacher, for sure, is coming back in Movie 
7. But no mention of Dobby. I just don't think it would have the same 
impact if Kreacher gets killed instead of Dobby! Even if he does cook 
and clean for him at Grimmauld Place! I'd rather have Dobby come back, 
than Kreacher.

I know that JKR fleshed out many characters in her books, but I think 
I'd rather have read of Lupin and Tonks' wedding and their cute little 
shell cottage, as I had more emotions invested in those characters than 
Bill & Fleur.

I also heard on Pottercast, from Yates, I believe it was, that it will 
be the trio in the Epilogue and not some older actors. Yay!





From valerie.flowe at verizon.net  Fri Jul 24 05:05:25 2009
From: valerie.flowe at verizon.net (Valerie Flowe)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 01:05:25 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The
 Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h486pn+63kl@eGroups.com>
References: <h486pn+63kl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <248b9379897f9181b7d8d4cd05181f60@verizon.net>


On Jul 22, 2009, at 7:19 PM, zanooda2 wrote:
> About Harry's birthday - Bill Nighy is playing Scrimgeour. Arrr, Davy 
> Jones :-)! I hope we'll hear something about little/young Lily and 
> Snape soon.

Valerie:
OMG!!! So awesome! I've been waiting all these years for Bill Nighy to 
be included in the Potter films! I thought he would've made a fantastic 
Voldemort.




From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 24 05:52:10 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 01:52:10 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <e5a18b02a7775248c4853900224f386f@verizon.net>
References: <h4b0r4+g328@eGroups.com> <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com> <e5a18b02a7775248c4853900224f386f@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <00b701ca0c22$e6fbbf40$b4f33dc0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Valerie Flowe




Valerie: ACK!!! So how will they explain the animosity that Snape had 
towards Harry all these years?! 

/////////////////////////////////////////////////

They've played off the idea that Snape hated James and transferred that to
Harry as Snape's key issue in the films. I personally do think the whole
"Snape's got issues, hated James, hates Harry now" thing is really enough
for his actions in the film. He's kind of like a fight-trained pit-bull who
DD rescued from Voldy but has to keep a tight leash on to keep him from
attacking. I think that one-dimension concept is really all we are going to
get from the films.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 24 06:58:46 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 02:58:46 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <e5a18b02a7775248c4853900224f386f@verizon.net>
References: <h4b0r4+g328@eGroups.com> <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com> <e5a18b02a7775248c4853900224f386f@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <00ef01ca0c2c$35c77980$a1566c80$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Valerie Flowe
I know that JKR fleshed out many characters in her books, but I think 
I'd rather have read of Lupin and Tonks' wedding and their cute little 
shell cottage, as I had more emotions invested in those characters than 
Bill & Fleur.



:::::::::::::::::::::

 

The Shell Cottage is Bill and Fleur. That's where HRH stay after Malfoy
Manor, where Dobby is buried. Tonks is supposed to stay with her parents
with the baby, but goes and fights at Hogwarts in the end. Or was I high the
last time I read the book?

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 24 11:53:07 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 11:53:07 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <e5a18b02a7775248c4853900224f386f@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <h4c7b3+rquu@eGroups.com>


 
> Valerie: Well I heard that Kreacher, for sure, is coming back in Movie 
> 7. But no mention of Dobby. I just don't think it would have the same 
> impact if Kreacher gets killed instead of Dobby! Even if he does cook 
> and clean for him at Grimmauld Place! I'd rather have Dobby come back, 
> than Kreacher.


Joann:
There are pictures at the  Leaky Cauldron of filming, and Dobby is definitely in. They are burying him. Even without Sirrius mirror, Dobby did used to live at the Malfoys. I'm sure they will come up with a reason for Dobby to show up there.

Joann




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 24 18:16:15 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 18:16:15 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4c7b3+rquu@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ctpf+dofe@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "coolbeans3131" <coolbeans3131 at ...> wrote:

> There are pictures at the  Leaky Cauldron of filming, 
> and Dobby is definitely in.


zanooda:

Yeah, all those pictures were also here on the list, but I can give the links again. Hermione carrying Dobby's body:

http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php?album=158&pos=171


Someone (I don't know who this is) holding Dobby doll (so it's definitely not Kreacher :-)):

http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php?album=158&pos=236


Here is Shell cottage for everyone who didn't see it yet:

http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php?album=158&pos=133


 
> Coolbeans3131 wrote:

> I'm sure they will come up with a reason for Dobby to show up there.


zanooda:

Maybe they will add a scene at the beginning showing Dobby working for Aberforth at the Hog's Head? And Harry can simply find the piece of the mirror at 12 Grimmauld Place when they are hiding there, or something like that :-).





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 24 21:20:17 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 21:20:17 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4ctpf+dofe@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4d8ih+aaqc@eGroups.com>

> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Here is Shell cottage for everyone who didn't see it yet:
> http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php?album=158&pos=133
> 

Well, these two shots certainly make me think it will be Bill and Fleur's cottage and Bill will have the facial scars.  

http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php?album=158&pos=232

http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php?album=158&pos=233


I don't think it will be too hard for the filmmakers to work in most of the details they have left out thus far in the movies.  They just can't contradict anything they explicitly changed.  

Thanks,
Richard





From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 24 22:48:02 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 22:48:02 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4d8ih+aaqc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ddn2+t3co@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:

> Well, these two shots certainly make me think it will be 
> Bill and Fleur's cottage and Bill will have the facial scars.  


zanooda:

Yeah, that's Bill all right :-). Funny, I always thought that Fenrir injured Bill with his teeth because of all this talk about him being bitten, but on these photos the wounds seem to be from nails (or claws, whatever)...




From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Fri Jul 24 23:02:27 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 23:02:27 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4b0r4+g328@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4dei3+m36p@eGroups.com>

 "coolbeans3131" Wrote:

> There's all the poly juice potion scenes.
> It may be difficult in the film to adjust
> to these people and keep track of them. 

The movie makers might want to leave the voices alone and just use other actors for video not audio.

> More problematic is the scene at Godrics Hallow.
> There is no way we will see two strangers here.
> We've waited all this time for Harry to visit 
> GH and his parents graves. We need the emotional
> impact of Dan Radcliffe acting this out.

Yes I agree. Perhaps they could forget poly juice and just use the invisibility cloak; the characters could take it off when they figure it's safe. I think that could work.

> I hope they leave the 7 Harrys

The 7 Harrys is in, the director said so in a interview. By the way they've cast someone to play "Mrs. Granger" but not "Mr. Granger". I don't quite understand what that's all about. 

> and Bella/Hermione ones in though

Yes, seeing very moral and very rational Hermione pretending to be cruel and crazy Bella would be a hoot. I'll bet Helena Bonham Carter would enjoy it too, a great actress pretending to be Hermione (a poor actress) pretending to be Bella. I don't think Hermione could act her way out of a paper bag; this is no criticism of Emma Watson who I think is a very fine actress. I think Emma Watson could realistically play an evil character, but Hermione playing evil would only lead to giggles.  Hermione has many wonderful attributes but acting is not one of them. 
 
> The trio will NEED to apparate in the film, 
> many times. It's never been mentioned they learned.

I don't see that as a problem, when people get older they learn things.

> As for some of the many ways the filmakers have
> boxed themselves in:
> 1. Sirius mirror-no show

I'm sure the writers can find another way for Harry to signal to Aberforth that they are in trouble. I noticed that they changed the actor playing Aberforth from the man we very briefly saw in Order of the Phoenix. The new actor is Ciar?n Hinds, he's the fellow who played Julius Caesar in the highly praised HBO miniseries "Rome". It sounds like the role of Aberforth will not be a minor bit part. I like that.

>2 Phineas Nigellus portrait-no show

No problem, I never liked Phineas much anyway.  

>3. No mention of the prophecy being overheard in Ootp
> or that it was Snape who overheard and told about it in HBP

It's still not too late for that; it could be in DH part 1.
I hope so anyway.

>4. No mention of Harry inheriting 12 GP or Kreacher

And no need to. I mean, even though they're making 2 movies out of it you're still going to have to cut out some stuff from that large and wonderful book. And remember, it cost well over a million dollars a minute to film this stuff.

>5. No sign or mention of Dobby since CoS

Because after CoS Dobby hasn't had a lot to do, until book 7 that is. If Dobby's funereal isn't in the movie there will be riots in the streets. The movie makers aren't idiots, they know this.   
 
> No Bill or mention that he's marrying Fleur 

Plenty of time for that.

> the Weasleys house burning down! 

The book does mention an order member's house burning down and many others being terrorized; I suppose the movie makers felt it was better to show rather than tell. They have a point.

Actually the movie makers nearly boxed themselves in really really really badly! Originally in the script for Half Blood Prince at the end Harry was given Dumbledore's wand as a keepsake; but then, just in the nick of time, book 7 came out. After that the movie makers figured maybe that wouldn't be a very good idea after all. They dodged a bullet!

 Eggplant 




 




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 25 19:31:10 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 19:31:10 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4dei3+m36p@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4fmhu+rha9@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "eggplant107" <eggplant107 at ...> wrote:

> Perhaps they could forget poly juice and just use the 
> invisibility cloak; the characters could take it off 
> when they figure it's safe. I think that could work.


zanooda:

You are absolutely right, there is no need for Polyjuice potion in Godric's Hollow. In fact, there was no need for it even in the book, it's just Harry and Hermione didn't know it :-).


> By the way they've cast someone to play "Mrs. Granger" but 
> not "Mr. Granger". I don't quite understand what that's 
> all about.


zanooda:

I don't know why there is no Mr.Granger, but do you think Mrs.Granger's presence means that they intend to show how Hermione changed her parents' memories?









From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 25 19:49:23 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 19:49:23 -0000
Subject: DH filming
Message-ID: <h4fnk3+6ukm@eGroups.com>

I just saw some new pictures from DH shooting, of Hagrid and Harry doubles (I suppose) on Sirius's bike. I have no idea how reliable this site is, but they are interesting pics, so I thought I'll give you the link anyway. So if the pictures are false, it's not my fault, I warned you :-). Funny that Hagrid drives on a freeway (or whatever it is called over there :-)) against the flow of traffic...:-).

http://www.oclumencia.com.br/galeria/thumbnails.php?album=921




From brian at rescueddoggies.com  Sat Jul 25 22:59:12 2009
From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian)
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 19:59:12 -0300
Subject: DH filming
Message-ID: <4A6B8E40.4080401@rescueddoggies.com>

Freeway = Motorway



From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 15:21:12 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 15:21:12 -0000
Subject: DH filming
In-Reply-To: <h4fnk3+6ukm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4hs98+pncs@eGroups.com>

"zanooda2" 

> I just saw some new pictures from DH shooting, of Hagrid and Harry doubles (I suppose) on Sirius's bike. I have no idea how reliable this site is, but they are interesting pics, so I thought I'll give you the link anyway. So if the pictures are false, it's not my fault, I warned you :-). Funny that Hagrid drives on a freeway (or whatever it is called over there :-)) against the flow of traffic...:-).


Joann

They are shooting with them weaving through traffic on "muggle" streets. Interesting. My bet is that at some point they will take off into the skies (at least I hope so).




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 20:23:34 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 20:23:34 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <006901ca0a3d$25f6e220$71e4a660$@com>
Message-ID: <h4ie06+rqtl@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> 
> Besides, Harry doesn't need to be told that there's a big black cabinet in B and B; he hid inside it in CoS (a scene included in the extended version of the DVD), 
 
md wrote: 
> What extended version??? I have the 2 disk fancy, slipped case release and the blu-ray (had the hd-dvd as well a while ago) never seen an extended version.

Carol again:
I watched CoS on ABC Family, which showed (I think) all five previous films right before HBP came out. The cut scenes were added back in to CoS, including the one of the Malfoys in Borgin and Burkes). PoA also included scenes cut from the theatrical and DVD versions, including Sir Cadogan taking the Fat Lady's place. I didn't watch SS, GoF, or OoP, so I don't know whether any of them included cut scenes. I imagine that the scene with Snape and Karkaroff during the Yule ball was included in GoF (it's in the cut scenes on the DVD), but it was too late at night to stay up to watch it.

Carol, whose two-disk, non Blu-Ray, CoS DVD set also includes that B&B scene




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 20:30:21 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 20:30:21 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4566i+s5q4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4iect+2nkp@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> > BTW, did the filmmakers make young Lucius, young Severus, and young Regulus cronies of Tom Riddle's at Hogwarts in the Slughorn memory? If so, any viewers who remember that Tom Riddle was at Hogwarts fifty years before Harry (mentioned in the CoS film as well as the book) must wonder how Snape and Malfoy could be so well preserved. <snip>
> 
> Richard:
> The flashbacks were limited and very focused on Riddle.  We were not introduced to any of his classmates directly.
>
Carol responds:
Well, that's a relief, I suppose. But I thought that this film was supposed to show a glimpse of young Lucius Malfoy and, much more important, give us a glimpse of Regulus Black, who was omitted from the tapestry discussion in the OoP film.

Carol, still trying to find someone who wants to see the film with her and almost (almost!) resolved on going alone to a matinee performance for the sake of cheap tickets




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 20:54:39 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 20:54:39 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h463cu+ti7t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ifqf+qk53@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "kennyg1864" <kennyg1864 at ...> wrote:
>
> --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj@> wrote:
> 
> > I do not know why Narcissa had the funky two-tone hair in the movie.  It was kind of distracting.  But regardless, she should not be as "Aryan" as Lucious or Draco.  Draco is supposed to have a strong resemblance to his father, just like Harry does James.  But Narcissa is a black and they are not a blond hair and blue eyes family.   
> > 
> > Thanks,
> > Richard
> 
> From the Lexicon:
> 
> Narcissa (Black) Malfoy 
> 
> APPEARANCE
> Eye color: blue eyes (GF8).
> Hair color: blonde (GF8). 
> 
> kennyg1864, who reflects that for this movie, the makeup department could have loaned her Jason Isaacs' wig, since Lucius was in Azkaban :P
>
Carol adds:

The Lexicon gets this information straight from the books. In GoF, where we first see Narcissa, we find out that she is blonde and would have been good-looking if not for her sneer. And in "Spinner's End" in HBP, her blonde hair and tear-filled blue eyes are emphasized. Her features resemble those of the once-beautiful Bellatrix, but her coloring contrasts markedly with her sister's. (Apparently, Andromeda is somewhere in between, with brown hair rather than black or blonde and a more marked resemblance to Bellatrix.)

Anyway, it always seemed to me that Narcissa's beauty is one of the reasons that Snape took the Unbreakable Vow. Of course, he already knew that both DD and LV wanted him to kill DD, but that didn't mean he had to bind himself with a darkly magical vow that would kill him if he broke it, and he would have protected Draco in any case. I think he pities her and wants to prevent her from doing something drastic. The scene where she throws herself on his mercy, falling on her knees and kissing his hands and looking up at him with tears in those big blue eyes, appealing to Snape's power and his ability to help Draco in a way that she can't, is, IMO, supposed to make her look like a helpless maiden appealing to a powerful knight, part feminine wiles manipulating his masculine instincts and part genuine desperation. He could have refused her, risking Bellatrix's scorn and leaving himself free to break his promise to Dumbledore. Instead, he allows himself to be bound with ropes of fire, perhaps hoping that she'll only ask him to watch over and protect Draco. Once she adds that final provision, about the only thing he can hope for is that they can prevent Draco from bringing in DE back-up long enough for DD to die from the ring curse.

Of course, none of that will come through in the film, regardless of whether Narcissa is blonde and beautiful or looks like Cruella Deville.

Carol, who hopes that it's at least clear in the film that Snape wants to protect Draco, whatever else they've snipped or changed






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 21:01:52 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:01:52 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h464u8+mtbs@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ig80+os8v@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> > (a scene included in the extended version of the DVD)

kenny wrote:
 > I believe you mean "additional scenes"; there isn't an extended version per se, at least not on the released DVD.

Carol responds:
Yes and no. As I explained in another post, I meant the extended version as shown on TV (which I assumed was included in the later versions of the DVD). It's in the cut scenes on my old two-disk version. I guess the extended version DVDs will come out as a set after DH2.

> kennyg1864, who wonders if the "THAT one is not for sale" object was the diary
>
Carol responds:
The diary? I don't understand. Tom Riddle bought the diary in a Muggle shop fifty years before CoS, and Harry destroyed it with the Basilisk fang at the end of both the film and the book. I'm sure that it refers to the Vanishing Cabinet, the only object that there are two of.

Carol, not sure whether you're referring to CoS or HBP here or whether you mean the book or the film




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 21:19:51 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:19:51 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h47nvn+spto@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ih9n+5tjo@eGroups.com>

Richard: 
> 
> That is a good point.  They should have a good opportunity to solidify both relationships before the horcrux hunting begins if they take advantage of the Burrow scenes and the wedding.

Carol responds:

Ron still needs to be a bit unsure of himself. Yes, he'll hug Hermione to comfort her now (DD's funeral in the HBP book) instead of pulling away in terror, and he holds her hand when they're at 12 GP in DH, but he's still afraid to kiss her, mostly because he's still insecure and still envious of Harry. The Horcrux senses his insecurities and intensifies them to the point that he actually leaves Harry and Hermione (and, having been kidnapped by Snatchers, can't come back until the Deluminator shows him the way after Hermione speaks his name.) Those insecurities are brought to life before his eyes after Harry opens the Horcrux and we see Horcrux!Harry and Horcrux!Hermione kissing. Once Ron finds the courage to destroy the Horcrux with the Sword of Gryffindor (which he has earned the right to use by rescuing Harry and retrieving the sword under conditions of "need and valor"), he literally and figuratively destroys his insecurities. Of course, he also has to wait for Hermione to cool down and forgive him before he kisses her for the first time. Once he's opened the Chamber of Secrets, allowed her to destroy a Horcrux, and expressed genuine concern for House-Elves, it's finally time. IIRC, *she* kisses him, indicating that it's okay to kiss her any time he likes (preferably after Voldemort is destroyed) and eventually propose to her.

Anyway, my point is that the love relationship between Ron and Hermione can't be fully resolved until Ron gets over his insecurities and fully understands that Harry and Hermione are like a sister and brother and that it's him, Ron, whom Hermione loves.

Carol, who thinks that the filmmakers would be complete idiots not to play the Horcrux!Harry and Hermione scene to its full potential




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 21:25:14 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:25:14 -0000
Subject: DH Epilogue - The Final Good Bye!
In-Reply-To: <001f01ca0b00$59105ab0$0b311010$@com>
Message-ID: <h4ihjq+jkqk@eGroups.com>

Cat wrote:
> The reason I included Jessica and not the rest of the family is because they were both there at the beginning of Harry Potter's literary life and IMO it would be a lovely way to say good-bye.

md: 
> I would find it distracting, not like Stephen King writing himself into the last two books of the Dark Tower, but still distracting.

Carol:

Or Peter Jackson munching a carrot in Bree. OTOH, his children are adorable, and I like the scenes with them (listening to Bilbo's troll story in Fellowship and as terrified children of Rohan in Two Towers).

In any case, I don't think JKR would ever agree to appear with just one of her children if she appeared at all. (Wasn't the youngest referred to as HBP's "twin"--not that that's applicable to DH?)

Carol, forgetting which scenes PJ appears in in the other two LOTR films




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 21:39:33 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:39:33 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h47on8+s28m@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4iiel+2f88@eGroups.com>

> > Carol responds:
> > 
> > That's what I thought, too, until I read the Gambon interview. Now I'm not so sure that Gambon is mistaken (or joking, as you suggest). Surely, if Alan Rickman had read HBP, he would object to the way the tower scene is handled in the film.
> > 
> > Of course, if Gambon *is* joking, it's very irresponsible of him to make such misleading statements.
> > 
> > Do you by any chance have a link to that Rickman interview stating that he's read the books? If so, I'd greatly appreciate it if you'd provide it.
> > 
> > Carol, not knowing what to believe at this point and wondering why Rickman would agree to such an illogical, out-of-character scene if he has indeed read the books
> >
> 
> Montavilla47:
> 
> But you could say the same for the writer and the director.  Presumably, they've
> read the books, too!  Wouldn't they object to such a scene?
> 
> I just think you're putting a lot of responsibility on the actors.  They can 
> protest, but it wasn't Alan Rickman or Michael Gambon who staged that 
> scene.  It certainly wasn't either of them who designed a honkin' big set element in the middle of the tower that prevented the actors from
> actually seeing each other--thus making any kind of dramatic eye
> contact impossible.
>
Carol responds:

But other actors, for example, Patrick Stewart and Ted Levine in the making of the 1998 "Moby Dick," objected to scenes in the screenplay that seemed to conflict with the original story, and the director and screenwriter listened to them (though the film was still not sufficiently canonical, IMO.)

Rickman, et al, could have spoken up right after reading the screenplay, before those sets were constructed. And JKR, in particular, should have objected. I think we can be pretty sure that *she* read the book, or at least remembered what she'd written in the manuscript.

*Somebody* should have indicated that the whole business of Snape already being there, Harry hiding under some platform without his IC and without being petrified, and Snape and DD both being calm, with DD hardly affected by the potion, was A) out of character and illogical and B) much less emotionally powerful than the original scene.

Why take something absolutely brilliant and terrifying and heart-rending and make it blah?

But the point of my post was that I don't know whether to believe Gambon or not. Has Rickman read the book or hasn't he?

I would not have kept her mouth shut had I been one of the actors involved in this apparent travesty (I know; I know. I haven't seen the film yet, but I'll be very surprised if that scene makes me feel anything remotely resembling the grief and fury and sense of betrayal--not by Snape but by JKR--that I felt on first reading that scene, or the dim hopes that were aroused when Snape saved Harry from the Crucio, another scene that they've apparently decided to drop.)

I hate change for change's sake, and the *only* rationale I can see for this whole fiasco is omitting Madam Rosmerta's involvement for simplicity's sake. 

Carol, hoping that the whole series will be remade in ten years or so by someone who *gets* the story and knows what's important and should be retained




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 21:48:21 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:48:21 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4837t+k62a@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4iiv5+lsnv@eGroups.com>

>> Joann:
> It won't be a "break up" scene as they aren't dating, but a "why we can't be together" scene. 
> 
> Also, as Ginny hid the diary, I'm assuming she'll be the one to know where the diadem is. Then they will have that adventure together, while H/R go to the CoS off camera.
>
Carol responds:
Diary? I think you must mean the HBP's potions book. (I suspect you're right about the way they'll handle the DH scene, which gives Harry one more person to rescue after Crabbe idiotically casts the Fiendfyre spell.)

Carol, wondering why everyone keeps mentioning diaries




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 22:04:10 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 22:04:10 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h485q2+c54o@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ijsq+6dch@eGroups.com>

Julie:
> The "It's over" line is not in the movie. From what I hear there were quite a few memorable lines inexplicably cut from the movie, including Harry and Dumbledore's mutual "I'm not worried, I'm with you" comments, several lines during Harry and Snape's confrontation at the end ("Fight back, you coward!" and "You have your mother's eyes."), and a brief conversation between Luna and Sanguini at Slughorn's party. I assume they will be on the DVD as deleted scenes (at least I hope so!).
> 
> Julie
>
Carol responds:

They had *Snape* saying "You have your mother's eyes"? that's Slughorn's line in the book. (Someone says it in almost every film and book, but never Snape.) but cutting "fight back, you coward!" after putting it in the previews is just pathetic! (I almost said "stupid," but I'm trying to be civil to absent opponents, especially since I haven't seen the film yet.) But, yes, thank goodness I'm forewarned. I can just imagine my reaction if I'd seen the film without reading the reviews and posts on this list first, I'd probably have demanded my money back.

Why, even if you're going to add superfluous scenes and make inexplicable changes, not retain memorable lines from the book that bookreaders will expect and look forward to? It makes no sense to film them and then cut them. I think they're trying to force us to pay for the extended-version DVDs.)

Carol, who *will* buy the DVD just to see the deleted scenes, all the while wishing she could turn the whole lot of them into frog spawn




From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 22:05:59 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 22:05:59 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4iiv5+lsnv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ik07+jg0b@eGroups.com>


> Carol responds:
> Diary? I think you must mean the HBP's potions book. (I suspect you're right about the way they'll handle the DH scene, which gives Harry one more person to rescue after Crabbe idiotically casts the Fiendfyre spell.)
> 
Joann:
Yes, I meant HBP book, lol.

BTW, did anyone else find it strange the way H/G and Draco entered the RoR? They never showed  them entering just standing before a wall or a wall hanging and then all of a sudden being inside. it just struck me as strange. (shrug)






From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 22:10:53 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 22:10:53 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4ifqf+qk53@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ik9d+k99l@eGroups.com>


> Carol:
> Anyway, it always seemed to me that Narcissa's beauty is one of the reasons that Snape took the Unbreakable Vow.

Joann:
I've never imagined that Snape took the unbreakable vow for any reason other than to keep playing double agent. I don't think he would do something that drastic because he felt sorry for Narcissa. Snape turned out to not be all bad, but he was hardly a prince charming. He had a soft spot for one person, and one person only. Lily Potter.

> Carol, who hopes that it's at least clear in the film that Snape wants to protect Draco, whatever else they've snipped or changed

Joann:
It was.





From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 22:13:55 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 22:13:55 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4ijsq+6dch@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ikf3+8vfh@eGroups.com>


> Carol responds:
 
> Why, even if you're going to add superfluous scenes and make inexplicable changes, not retain memorable lines from the book that bookreaders will expect and look forward to? It makes no sense to film them and then cut them. I think they're trying to force us to pay for the extended-version DVDs.)

Joann;

I was watching the deleted scenes (of all the films) on youtube, and noticed a lot of them were Snape scenes. I will never understand some of the decisions made (shaking head)





From md at exit-reality.com  Sun Jul 26 22:24:14 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 18:24:14 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4ik9d+k99l@eGroups.com>
References: <h4ifqf+qk53@eGroups.com> <h4ik9d+k99l@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002101ca0e3f$d34f0460$79ed0d20$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of coolbeans3131




I've never imagined that Snape took the unbreakable vow for any reason other
than to keep playing double agent. I don't think he would do something that
drastic because he felt sorry for Narcissa. Snape turned out to not be all
bad, but he was hardly a prince charming. He had a soft spot for one person,
and one person only. Lily Potter.

> Carol, who hopes that it's at least clear in the film that Snape wants to
protect Draco, whatever else they've snipped or changed



/////////////////////////////////

Snape took the vow because he'd already promised to kill DD, he promised DD
he'd do it. So by taking the vow he could fulfill his promise to DD plus
earn brownie-points with Voldy, remove all suspicion from Bellatrix and any
other death eaters. That vow was a win-win for Snape, no matter what
happened he'd do exactly what each side wanted.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From va32h at comcast.net  Sun Jul 26 23:43:20 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 23:43:20 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4ih9n+5tjo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ipmo+bi85@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
> Ron still needs to be a bit unsure of himself. Yes, he'll hug Hermione to comfort her now (DD's funeral in the HBP book) instead of pulling away in terror, and he holds her hand when they're at 12 GP in DH, but he's still afraid to kiss her, mostly because he's still insecure and still envious of Harry. 

<snipped book summary?

va32h:

Seriously, there's no need to summarize the entire book, Carol. We are all here because we are fans, we know what happened in the book. 

My point was that I thought what JKR did in the book was wrong.  Ron had ALREADY moved past all these insecurities and that I thought JK Rowling made a lousy and lazy choice in regressing Ron's character. He ALREADY worked out all his insecurities both about Harry (during the TriWizard Tournament in GoF) and about himself (during the endless Quidditch saga of OoTP).

To go back to that well in HBP, resolve it, and then go back AGAIN, is absolute character assasination on JKR's part.  

I hate pretty much every single word in Deathly Hallows but I particularly hate the way JKR destroyed Ron. She took too many cues from the screenwriters, I think.  Book Ron - the Ron we knew for 5 1/2 books at least, would NEVER have left Harry in the forest. 

That was such a stupid, lazy, choice of Rowling's --- I nearly flung my book across the room in disgust when I read it. 

Perhaps I am feeling especially tetchy today as I am watching the movie marathon on ABC Family and it has just struck me yet again what a wonderful series this was ONCE, and how Rowling destroyed it with the steaming pile of garbage known as Deathly Hallows. 

That is one book that can only be improved by the filmmakers, because God knows they couldn't possibly make it any worse. 

va32g




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 26 23:52:56 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 23:52:56 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h48rg0+4dki@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4iq8o+qvjp@eGroups.com>

Child Of Midian wrote:
> >
> > If JKR had not been such a phenomenon an editor would have sent the book back and said "make this relationship work, or get rid of it." I think the last three books suffered from Rowling not getting enough feedback from her publishers and trying to keep the length from getting out of hand while including all the plot stuff she wanted while completing the books on time.
> > 
> > I, personally, would be up for all 7 books revised with all the plots she left out (like Stephen Kings "The Stand") and all winding paths of the secondary characters, and . some H/G story!!!
> > 
> 
Richard responded:
> That sounds like a great idea.  I suspect Rowling has no interest in editing and republishing her crazily successful seven book series...  So maybe you could clean them up for us :)

Carol:
I don't know about filling in the plotholes, which would be rather difficult for someone other than JKR (unless you like fanfic). I'm not even sure that I want to know what JKR herself thinks happened offpage, especially with Harry and Ginny. (Well, maybe Dumbledore's mother's funeral; I'd love to see the brawl in which Albus got his broken nose. I don't want to know what Snape did as a DE, though. I'm happy thinking that reporting the Prophecy was his worst deed.)

But I'm tempted to buy a spare set of paperbacks (preferably the slightly more authentic British versions), annotate them, and mail them to JKR or her publisher as a gift, pointing out everything from typos like "miniscule" for "minuscule" to inconsistencies like Ron's somehow knowing about Draco's hand of Glory or the Potters already being under the Fidelius Charm just after Harry's first birthday in DH when it doesn't occur until a week before Halloween in PoA. Honestly, *someone* should point out all the places where her inconsistencies distract the reader. I do that for the clients whose works I copyedit (I don't correct the discrepancies; I just query them), but I suppose everyone's too afraid to criticize "famous J. K. Rowling" (as Snape would call her). After all this time, she still doesn't understand what fans mean by "the missing twenty-four hours" in SS/PS.

Carol, hoping that JKR will spend a few pounds on a remedial math course (and maybe a course in logic, too)




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 00:14:18 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 00:14:18 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h49rgm+5hrc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4irgq+pub7@eGroups.com>

Richard wrote:
<snip> 
> The "Seven Potters" broom chase/fight should definitely be in the movie.  It could be a real WOW way to start the first film. 
 
Carol responds:

They can't start DH with the Seven Potters scene because they have to show supposed DE Snape leaking important information (and I know they've cast Charity Burbage, whose death shows LV's agenda before Harry's wand attacks his and he goes off on his Elder Wand binge). I think Bellatrix's vendetta against her niece for marrying a werewolf also comes up. And, of course, LV has to borrow Lucius Malfoy's wand as a means of avoiding the Brother Wands effect, the first step in the Elder Wand subplot.

But, yes, they have to have the Seven Potters scene, in which both Hedwig and Mad-Eye get killed (I suspect that Umbridge will have his eye stuck in her door later just as in the book). I don't know whether they'll have Snape accidentally Sectumsempra George's ear, but it will certainly add to the excitement and pathos (and the illusion that Snape is evil) if they do. And Harry has to get from the Dursleys' to the Weasleys' somehow. (Presumably, as you said somewhere, it will have been magically restored, though only five of the eight adult Weasleys will have been at home to do it and I doubt that Ron would be much help.) I hope they show Harry's good-bye to the Dursleys', complete with Dudders' apology, but they probably won't.

Alan Rickman will have only about four scenes, not counting "The Prince's Tale," which I'm sure they'll abridge (sigh), so they need to make the most of the few they have, especially after short-changing him in the film that was supposed to be about Harry and the HBP. By "need," I mean that the Snape subplot is crucial to the story as a whole, and WB would be foolish not to make the most of Rickman's popularity. And they have two films rather than one to get the story right this time.

Carol, wondering if disappointing box office results for HBP will motivate Yates, et al., to stay closer to the book this time




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 00:28:14 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 20:28:14 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4ipmo+bi85@eGroups.com>
References: <h4ih9n+5tjo@eGroups.com> <h4ipmo+bi85@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000c01ca0e51$219eb730$64dc2590$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of va32h





That is one book that can only be improved by the filmmakers, because God
knows they couldn't possibly make it any worse. 

va32g

///////////////////////////////

I'm going to disagree. 

And as a writer, I hope you never read one of my books because an author
can't custom cater the book to each fan.

md

3 time DH reader.

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 00:38:35 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 20:38:35 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4iq8o+qvjp@eGroups.com>
References: <h48rg0+4dki@eGroups.com> <h4iq8o+qvjp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001101ca0e52$935d68c0$ba183a40$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol
But I'm tempted to buy a spare set of paperbacks (preferably the slightly
more authentic British versions), annotate them, and mail them to JKR or her
publisher as a gift, pointing out everything from typos like "miniscule" for
"minuscule" to inconsistencies like Ron's somehow knowing about Draco's hand
of Glory or the Potters already being under the Fidelius Charm just after
Harry's first birthday in DH when it doesn't occur until a week before
Halloween in PoA. Honestly, *someone* should point out all the places where
her inconsistencies distract the reader. I do that for the clients whose
works I copyedit (I don't correct the discrepancies; I just query them), but
I suppose everyone's too afraid to criticize "famous J. K. Rowling" (as
Snape would call her). After all this time, she still doesn't understand
what fans mean by "the missing twenty-four hours" in SS/PS.



//////////////////////

 

First, you should check some things yourself, like Merriam Webster:

 

variant of    MINUSCULE

usage The adjective minuscule is etymologically related to minus, but
associations with mini- have produced the spelling variant miniscule. This
variant dates to the end of the 19th century, and it now occurs commonly in
published writing, but it continues to be widely regarded as an error

 

Second, be aware that after the 3rd book they hired someone to do nothing
but maintain consistency in the books.

 

Third, Stephen King went back and re-wrote large portions of "The
Gunslinger" so it would be consistent with the later books and acknowledges
errors in the series, Tolkine worked for 50 years to get everything strait
in LOTR and his son was still editing the three books after his death. This
is not a phenomenon that exist only in Potterville. 

 

Chances are latter editions of the books will catch things that are really
an issue. It's mostly likely that POA for example will be altered to match
DH because time-lines where cemented after POA.

 

Mostly, I have to say, for bob's sake, get over it. I don't think the
average person studies the books that closely that any of the glaring
inconsistencies you point out actually taint the experience for the average
reader. 

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 00:42:35 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 20:42:35 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4irgq+pub7@eGroups.com>
References: <h49rgm+5hrc@eGroups.com> <h4irgq+pub7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001601ca0e53$22cdaf60$68690e20$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol


Carol, wondering if disappointing box office results for HBP will motivate
Yates, et al., to stay closer to the book this time



 

////////////////////

 

You mean that it made ? a billion dollars world-wide in five days breaking
box office records? Or that it made ? of a billion dollars in 2 weeks in the
U.S. alone? 

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 01:16:00 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 01:16:00 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4iv4g+8909@eGroups.com>

md:> 
> What it tells me is that they will be making DH a very, very simple film. 
> 
Carol responds:
I'm sure they would have done that if it were only one film, but the whole point of making it two films (apart from money) was to make it as faithful as possible to the book--to include as much as possible, I mean, and, please, please, no added scenes.  

md: 
> I saw a preview special that showed DD in the Dursely's in HPB but it was not in the film. I presume that scene would have covered Sirius's will. They can certainly go to 12GP without stating it belongs to Harry. 

Carol:
Or provide that tidbit in dialogue. It's important, I think, that we know that Kreacher is "Master Harry's" house-elf and has to obey him. They're bringing in Mundungus, IIRC, and it would be a pity not to have Kreacher hit him on the head with a saucepan. And they're definitely including Regulus. It only makes sense that we'd get Kreacher's transformation as well. (They also need Phineas Nigellus' portrait. How they'll get around that, I don't know.)

md:
Snapes role in the prophecy and his relationship with Lilly with simply vanish, it will come down to the one memory of DD telling Snape that Harry must die by Voldy's hand in the end and it will be played off as nothing more than Snape relaying DD last order.

Carol:
Good God, no! If it weren't for Snape's love of Lily, Harry wouldn't even *be* the Prophecy Boy. LV's promise to Snape to spare her gave Lily the choice to live that made her sacrifice possible (gave it magical power, I mean). And why on earth would Harry (who obeyed Snape in the HBP film only to see him "murder" Snape) act on that single memory with no proof that Snape was DDM from the moment that LV targeted Lily? Snape has to have a motive, and Lily is it, not to mention that she's the reason he has a doe Patronus. The filmmakers missed the boat by not making Snape more central in HBP (and making it clear in OoP that he sent the Order to the MoM). Now "The Prince's Tale" is all they have to make up for being remiss. I agree that it will be curtailed; some memories, such as Petunia on Platform 9 3/4 and James and Sirius being brats on the train, will be cut and others shortened, but Snape/Lily is absolutely central to the whole story. JKR will never agree to cutting "The Prince's Tale" to a single memory.

md:
 Dobby should have brought the gilly-weed in GOF and he should have been around in OOTP and HBP as an 'extra' as only a single line "now that he's free, Dobby works at Hogwarts" for an explanation.

Carol:
I agree that Dobby should have brought the gillyweed in GoF. It was completely out of character to have Neville steal it (as he must have done since Snape indicates that its missing, along with the Polyjuice ingredients). I suppose that they can work their way around that, maybe having the characters wish that they had Dobby rather than Kreacher at 12 GP. I'm more concerned about their not having Sirius mention his DE brother in the tapestry scene in OoP. That was a "sirius" oversight, especially given RAB at the end of HBP. (*DH* was almost ready to come out when OoP appeared in theaters. The writer and director *must* have known that he would be important; how could they not guess that he was Regulus?

md:
> Don't need to mention Fleur and Bill in HBP, the wedding will happen in DH as both Bill and Fleur are in the film and there's no reason to include Fleur without the wedding. 

Carol:
Still, they should have had Bill attacked by Fenrir Greyback, if not in the fight with the Order that they inexplicably cut (it would *not* have duplicated what happens in DH, which is on a much larger scale), then in the added attack on the Burrow, which *does* duplicate what happens in DH but would be somewhat justified if it included that attack. (Bill seems to be lightly scarred in the Shell Cottage scenes, but nothing like what I pictured from HBP, the book.) 

md:
> I do not know if Ted Tonks will happen in DH though, nor Harry, the 17 yr old, being the godfather becomes the parent for Ted before he's even 18. 
> 
Carol:
I think they'll have Ted Tonks just because his conversation with Dirk Cresswell and the two Goblins is almost the only source of news for HRH and tells them, among other things, that Snape has sent the (supposed) Sword of Gryffindor to the DEs for safekeeping. It sets up the later scene with the real sword and provides a hint (Snape's "cruel" detention, sending Neville, Ginny, and Luna to work with Hagrid in the Forbidden Forest) that Snape is on the good side. If DH were a single film, they'd cut him, but I think he'll be in the two-film version. They may skip Andromeda, though.  

md: 
> Everything in the films has been "simplify, simplify, simplify" completely loosing the "put-the-clues-together" parts of the books. My favorite parts of re-reading the books is putting all the pieces together from book-to-book and films lack that.
> 
Carol:
I agree that all the films (except the first, which was about the mystery of the Sorcerer's/Philosopher's Stone and why "Snape" wanted it, have skimped on the mystery element (though the question of who put Harry's name in the Goblet of Fire and why does loom in the background of that film). But I think and hope that DH will be different. It should have bits about Dumbledore's past (though not in as much depth as in the book--for example, Harry has to find GG's portrait in Bathilda's house and drop it, providing Voldemort with the clue he needs to find the identity of the boy who stole the Elder Wand from Gregorovitch (who will definitely be in the film, as will the young GG). It also needs all the Snape scenes (with some memories condensed and others eliminated).

In my view, it has to include the opening DE meeting, the Seven Potters scene, the wedding, the confrontation with Rowle and Dolohov in the Muggle cafe, the flight to 12 GP, Kreacher's tale (complete with Regulus), Mundungus telling them about Umbridge and the locket, the MoM scene in which they Stun her and take the locket, Yaxley nearly catching Hermione and forcing them to go into hiding on the prolonged camping trip, Ron's struggle with the locket Horcrux and his departure, Godric's Hollow and Bathilda Nagini (I think HH will be under the Invisibility Cloak, no Polyjuice Potion involved), the memory of Voldemort killing the Potters, LV finding GG's photo, Harry's broken wand, the doe Patronus with Ron's return and his destruction of the locket Horcrux, Xenophilius Lovegood, the Snatchers, Malfoy Manor, Wormtail dying literally by his own hand, Dobby rescuing Harry and friends and being killed, Shell Cottage (maybe Lupin making Harry Teddy's godfather; why not?), Polyjuiced Hermione and the Gringotts break-in, Harry's vision of Voldemort's fury as he finds out about it and LV's search for the Horcruxes, Aberforth (how they'll deal with the mirror fragment is anybody's guess) and Portrait!Ariana, Neville and the DA, the "sacking" of Snape, the diadem and Fiendfyre, Snape's last scene with Voldemort and the attack by Nagini; Snape's amazing last bit of wandless magic, leaking multiple memories, not just one; Harry's visit to the Pensieve (curtailed); Fred's death and the first part of the battle of Hogwarts; Harry's walk to his "death" with his loved ones, Harry's willing self-sacrifice, "King's Cross" with Dead!DD, the battle of Hogwarts resumed (possibly with Slughorn and the House-Elves reinforcing the good guys), Bellatrix's battle with Molly, Harry's confrontation with LV, hopefully with some taunting and Snape's public vindication thrown in; the final spells, Expelliarmus and AK, and the epilogue.

I may have missed some crucial elements (Rita Skeeter's biography of DD has to fit in somewhere and we should get a glimpse of DD as ruthless manipulator in Snape's memories), but those are the scenes that strike me as crucial, and from what I've read, most of them will be in there. 

Carol, thinking that the screenwriter and director have done themselves a (and viewers) a great disservice by changing and cutting so much material in the earlier films (especially HBP and OoP) and hoping that they'll make up for it in DH




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 01:19:38 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 01:19:38 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <001601ca0e53$22cdaf60$68690e20$@com>
Message-ID: <h4ivba+10ebl@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> You mean that it made ? a billion dollars world-wide in five 
> days breaking box office records? Or that it made ? of a billion 
> dollars in 2 weeks in the U.S. alone? 


zanooda:

But this weekend that guinea pigs movie took the first spot from HBP  :-). HBP had a 61% drop from its opening weekend, which is a lot. It still does well though, you are right about that :-).




From ckc at rochester.rr.com  Mon Jul 27 01:42:40 2009
From: ckc at rochester.rr.com (CK Campbell)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:42:40 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <001101ca0e52$935d68c0$ba183a40$@com>
References: <h48rg0+4dki@eGroups.com> <h4iq8o+qvjp@eGroups.com> <001101ca0e52$935d68c0$ba183a40$@com>
Message-ID: <5D8629A1B4E44B418DA63369CE02653C@ckc>

 
What missing 24 hours?

Carolyn (ckc)




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 01:50:06 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:50:06 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4iv4g+8909@eGroups.com>
References: <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com> <h4iv4g+8909@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000601ca0e5c$911987b0$b34c9710$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol




md:
Snapes role in the prophecy and his relationship with Lilly with simply
vanish, it will come down to the one memory of DD telling Snape that Harry
must die by Voldy's hand in the end and it will be played off as nothing
more than Snape relaying DD last order.

Carol:
Good God, no! If it weren't for Snape's love of Lily, Harry wouldn't even
*be* the Prophecy Boy. LV's promise to Snape to spare her gave Lily the
choice to live that made her sacrifice possible (gave it magical power, I
mean). 

That's not the way they played the prophecy in the film, there's no mention
it was ever Harry or Neville, so in the film it's not an issue. In the films
it's Harry from the start and that's it, so they can ignore all the Snape /
Lilley stuff. It won't be there.



Carol:
I agree that Dobby should have brought the gillyweed in GoF. It was
completely out of character to have Neville steal it (as he must have done
since Snape indicates that its missing, along with the Polyjuice
ingredients). I suppose that they can work their way around that, maybe
having the characters wish that they had Dobby rather than Kreacher at 12
GP. I'm more concerned about their not having Sirius mention his DE brother
in the tapestry scene in OoP. That was a "sirius" oversight, especially
given RAB at the end of HBP. (*DH* was almost ready to come out when OoP
appeared in theaters. The writer and director *must* have known that he
would be important; how could they not guess that he was Regulus?

Bartey Crouch Jr. stole the gilleyweed and gave it to Neville, he was steal
the ingrediants for Polyjuice potion the entire time and DD says "now we
know who's been stealing from your stores, Severus" and Snape flashes Harry
a look, burning mad to have DD confirm Harry had not stolen from him.

They will have them hide out at 12GP in DH, Hermione will go into the room,
look at the tree "R A B!!!! HARRY, RON COME QUICK!!! I know who RAB is!!!"
they will likely then find the locket in RAB's room or something stupid like
that, thus negating a search for it and shortening the films.



md:
> Don't need to mention Fleur and Bill in HBP, the wedding will happen in DH
as both Bill and Fleur are in the film and there's no reason to include
Fleur without the wedding. 

Carol:
Still, they should have had Bill attacked by Fenrir Greyback, if not in the
fight with the Order that they inexplicably cut (it would *not* have
duplicated what happens in DH, which is on a much larger scale), then in the
added attack on the Burrow, which *does* duplicate what happens in DH but
would be somewhat justified if it included that attack. (Bill seems to be
lightly scarred in the Shell Cottage scenes, but nothing like what I
pictured from HBP, the book.) 

Bill has scars in the scenes for the shell cottage, two really deep gnashes
in his cheek and a bunch of little ones.


Carol, thinking that the screenwriter and director have done themselves a
(and viewers) a great disservice by changing and cutting so much material in
the earlier films (especially HBP and OoP) and hoping that they'll make up
for it in DH





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 01:53:12 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:53:12 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4ivba+10ebl@eGroups.com>
References: <001601ca0e53$22cdaf60$68690e20$@com> <h4ivba+10ebl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000b01ca0e5d$00228490$00678db0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of zanooda2


zanooda:

But this weekend that guinea pigs movie took the first spot from HBP :-).
HBP had a 61% drop from its opening weekend, which is a lot. It still does
well though, you are right about that :-).



////////////////////////////////

 

"Camp-out" & "midnight showing" films always drop HUGE the second week
because the opening numbers (4500 screens in the US!!!) are just too big to
match. If it had made OOTP money in 5 days the drop for the second week
would have been more like 45% and then they'd be screaming about how strong
a film it is only to drop 45% its. Dollars and cents wise it's doing
phenomenal business, to use percentages really skews the figures.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 01:59:02 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:59:02 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <000601ca0e5c$911987b0$b34c9710$@com>
References: <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com> <h4iv4g+8909@eGroups.com> <000601ca0e5c$911987b0$b34c9710$@com>
Message-ID: <001901ca0e5d$d16cdb40$744691c0$@com>

This is a re-post, I highlighted my new comments as I realized they look
like Carols comments on original reply.

 

md

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Child Of Midian
Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2009 9:50 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Problems with the DH movie

 

  



From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com <mailto:HPFGU-Movie%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com <mailto:HPFGU-Movie%40yahoogroups.com> ]
On
Behalf Of Carol

md:
Snapes role in the prophecy and his relationship with Lilly with simply
vanish, it will come down to the one memory of DD telling Snape that Harry
must die by Voldy's hand in the end and it will be played off as nothing
more than Snape relaying DD last order.

Carol:
Good God, no! If it weren't for Snape's love of Lily, Harry wouldn't even
*be* the Prophecy Boy. LV's promise to Snape to spare her gave Lily the
choice to live that made her sacrifice possible (gave it magical power, I
mean). 



>>>>>>>>>>>>That's not the way they played the prophecy in the film, there's
no mention
it was ever Harry or Neville, so in the film it's not an issue. In the films
it's Harry from the start and that's it, so they can ignore all the Snape /
Lilley stuff. It won't be there.

Carol:
I agree that Dobby should have brought the gillyweed in GoF. It was
completely out of character to have Neville steal it (as he must have done
since Snape indicates that its missing, along with the Polyjuice
ingredients). I suppose that they can work their way around that, maybe
having the characters wish that they had Dobby rather than Kreacher at 12
GP. I'm more concerned about their not having Sirius mention his DE brother
in the tapestry scene in OoP. That was a "sirius" oversight, especially
given RAB at the end of HBP. (*DH* was almost ready to come out when OoP
appeared in theaters. The writer and director *must* have known that he
would be important; how could they not guess that he was Regulus?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Bartey Crouch Jr. stole the gilleyweed and gave it to Neville,
he was steal
the ingrediants for Polyjuice potion the entire time and DD says "now we
know who's been stealing from your stores, Severus" and Snape flashes Harry
a look, burning mad to have DD confirm Harry had not stolen from him.

>>>>>>>>>>>>.They will have them hide out at 12GP in DH, Hermione will go
into the room,
look at the tree "R A B!!!! HARRY, RON COME QUICK!!! I know who RAB is!!!"
they will likely then find the locket in RAB's room or something stupid like
that, thus negating a search for it and shortening the films.

md:
> Don't need to mention Fleur and Bill in HBP, the wedding will happen in DH
as both Bill and Fleur are in the film and there's no reason to include
Fleur without the wedding. 

Carol:
Still, they should have had Bill attacked by Fenrir Greyback, if not in the
fight with the Order that they inexplicably cut (it would *not* have
duplicated what happens in DH, which is on a much larger scale), then in the
added attack on the Burrow, which *does* duplicate what happens in DH but
would be somewhat justified if it included that attack. (Bill seems to be
lightly scarred in the Shell Cottage scenes, but nothing like what I
pictured from HBP, the book.) 

>>>>>>>>>>>.Bill has scars in the scenes for the shell cottage, two really
deep gnashes
in his cheek and a bunch of little ones.





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 02:30:23 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 02:30:23 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <5D8629A1B4E44B418DA63369CE02653C@ckc>
Message-ID: <h4j3fv+h8jn@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "CK Campbell" <ckc at ...> wrote:
>
>  
> What missing 24 hours?
> 
> Carolyn (ckc)
>
Carol responds:

"The missing twenty-four hours" is the way those of us on the main list refer to the twenty-four hours that Minerva McGonagall spent sitting around in cat form at 5 Privet Drive waiting for Dumbledore to show up. During that time, the WW (Wizarding World) is already celebrating Voldemort's defeat and Harry's survival (with a rather callous disregard for the murders of James and Lily). 

Hagrid supposedly goes to Godric's Hollow before the Muggle police show up, digs Harry out of the rubble, and comforts Sirius Black, who has shown up on his motorcycle. Sirius then lends or gives him the motorcycle and flies with Harry to the Dursleys, where he arrives nearly twenty-four hours after the Potters were killed at midnight Halloween night.

So the question is, what were Hagrid and Dumbledore doing all that time? Why didn't Hagrid arrive on the early morning of November 1 rather than making McGonagall wait a whole day for him? And how did he manage to tell her he'd be at the Dursleys, anyway. Did he take Harry back to Hogwarts for a day?

Anyway, readers have mentioned those twenty-four hours to JKR, and she seems completely puzzled.

Carol, with apologies for her many recent posts (the result of being unable to post the last few days while she met a deadline)




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 02:38:40 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 22:38:40 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4j3fv+h8jn@eGroups.com>
References: <5D8629A1B4E44B418DA63369CE02653C@ckc> <h4j3fv+h8jn@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002401ca0e63$5a523a90$0ef6afb0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol
Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2009 10:30 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance


Carol responds:

"The missing twenty-four hours" is the way those of us on the main list
refer to the twenty-four hours that Minerva McGonagall spent sitting around
in cat form at 5 Privet Drive waiting for Dumbledore to show up. During that
time, the WW (Wizarding World) is already celebrating Voldemort's defeat and
Harry's survival (with a rather callous disregard for the murders of James
and Lily). 

Hagrid supposedly goes to Godric's Hollow before the Muggle police show up,
digs Harry out of the rubble, and comforts Sirius Black, who has shown up on
his motorcycle. Sirius then lends or gives him the motorcycle and flies with
Harry to the Dursleys, where he arrives nearly twenty-four hours after the
Potters were killed at midnight Halloween night.

So the question is, what were Hagrid and Dumbledore doing all that time? Why
didn't Hagrid arrive on the early morning of November 1 rather than making
McGonagall wait a whole day for him? And how did he manage to tell her he'd
be at the Dursleys, anyway. Did he take Harry back to Hogwarts for a day?

Anyway, readers have mentioned those twenty-four hours to JKR, and she seems
completely puzzled.

///////////////////////////////

I just listed to the Audiobook (decided to load them to my mp3 while I'm
working on our house.) First of all, McGonagall  is there from morning to
night, not 24hrs. She is not there to meet Hagrid or DD, DD plainly states
that he is surprised to see her there and asks why she's not off
celebrating. McGonagall has no idea he is leaving Harry there and she has no
reason other than her own abject curiosity for being there.

The real flaw is that the Muggle police never show up, according to DH,
because they can't see the house!!!. 

The 24hrs is the time of the attack, wording of the attack getting out, DD
summoning Hagrid, Hagrid going, finding Harry, meeting Sirius, traveling to
the Dursely's.

I see no missing 24hrs.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 02:39:27 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 02:39:27 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <001901ca0e5d$d16cdb40$744691c0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4j40v+lg82@eGroups.com>

md wrote:
>
> This is a re-post, I highlighted my new comments as I realized they look like Carols comments on original reply.

Carol responds:

Thanks for doing that. I did think that other posters might be confused by the missing attributions, and I'm glad you realized it, too.

Carol, appreciating the courtesy after the testy tone of several recent posts, mine among them 




From brian at rescueddoggies.com  Mon Jul 27 02:47:20 2009
From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 23:47:20 -0300
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridicu
Message-ID: <4A6D1538.5010207@rescueddoggies.com>

JKR could even invest in a calender so that every year doesn't start on 
Monday 1st September!

And as for the comment that they can't make the DH movies even worse 
than the books...  That sounds like a challenge for them which I'm sure 
they'll live up to (unfortunately)

A nice set of films if you never read the books and aren't interested in 
the intricate story...

Brian



From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 03:26:05 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 23:26:05 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridicu
In-Reply-To: <4A6D1538.5010207@rescueddoggies.com>
References: <4A6D1538.5010207@rescueddoggies.com>
Message-ID: <003201ca0e69$f99f92e0$ecdeb8a0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Brian



JKR could even invest in a calender so that every year doesn't start on 
Monday 1st September!

And as for the comment that they can't make the DH movies even worse 
than the books... That sounds like a challenge for them which I'm sure 
they'll live up to (unfortunately)

A nice set of films if you never read the books and aren't interested in 
the intricate story...

Brian

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

I never caught the Monday part.

I don't understand the hate towards DH, other than the tedious camping I
really enjoyed it. I think she lost it with Voldy's defeat, I think we
excepted six books to suddenly combine into a final, cumulative epic finish
and it seemed contrived and half-thought out. It seemed like Harry wins from
shear, dumb luck (as McGonagal) puts it. 

I think Kloves started off right with PS and COS and I think those longer,
more complex films would have been continued if CC hadn't made the first
films feel so slooooooooooooooooooooooooooow.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 03:45:34 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 03:45:34 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <001901ca0e5d$d16cdb40$744691c0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4j7su+pptl@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:


> they will likely then find the locket in RAB's room or 
> something stupid like that


zanooda:

LOL! Fortunately it doesn't seem the case, because they confirmed that Umbridge will be in the movie. They even shot some outside-the-Ministry scene with HRH transformed into the three Ministry workers. So it seems that Umbridge will have the locket.



> Bill has scars in the scenes for the shell cottage


zanooda:

I still think that now Bill will have to get his injuries during the wedding attack, I don't see any other way...






From valerie.flowe at verizon.net  Mon Jul 27 04:23:25 2009
From: valerie.flowe at verizon.net (Valerie Flowe)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 00:23:25 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <00ef01ca0c2c$35c77980$a1566c80$@com>
References: <h4b0r4+g328@eGroups.com> <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com>
 <e5a18b02a7775248c4853900224f386f@verizon.net>
 <00ef01ca0c2c$35c77980$a1566c80$@com>
Message-ID: <3009aac2c8e60d9d9b97bd5aef72e457@verizon.net>


On Jul 24, 2009, at 2:58 AM, Child Of Midian wrote:
> <snip>
> Tonks is supposed to stay with her parents
>  with the baby, but goes and fights at Hogwarts in the end. Or was I 
> high the
>  last time I read the book?
>
Valerie:
I know...what WAS Tonks thinking running off and leaving her newborn?! 
I know, I know, she was a bad ass Auror. But still, I hate that poor 
little Teddy was an orphan who never knew his parents. Still not happy 
that JKR killed both of them off, and in such an off-handed way (Oh 
yeah, and Tonks & Lupin were lying there dead too)  :-(




From valerie.flowe at verizon.net  Mon Jul 27 04:36:48 2009
From: valerie.flowe at verizon.net (Valerie Flowe)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 00:36:48 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4d8ih+aaqc@eGroups.com>
References: <h4d8ih+aaqc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3a825adb70f08cfa0cc3e4700b07ac55@verizon.net>

On Jul 24, 2009, at 5:20 PM, Richard Shepard wrote:
>  > zanooda:
>  > Here is Shell cottage for everyone who didn't see it yet:
>  >  
> http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php? 
> album=158&pos=133
>
>  Well, these two shots certainly make me think it will be Bill and  
> Fleur's cottage and Bill will have the facial scars.
> http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php? 
> album=158&pos=232
> http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php? 
> album=158&pos=233
>  I don't think it will be too hard for the filmmakers to work in most  
> of the details they have left out thus far in the movies. They just  
> can't contradict anything they explicitly changed.
>  Thanks,
>  Richard

Valerie:
Yay!!! So happy that Dobby is in! The shell cottage looks terrific! I  
thought that 'Bill' was Ron's stunt double, in those shots of them  
driving to the set. He's a good lookin' Weasley, even WITH scars!  :-)
I'm so glad that they decided to make HP7 into 2 movies. That way they  
won't need to cut the story into little quickly edited scenes with much  
of the content simplified or deleted altogether.




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 04:55:56 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 00:55:56 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <3009aac2c8e60d9d9b97bd5aef72e457@verizon.net>
References: <h4b0r4+g328@eGroups.com> <000901ca0c0a$be432c40$3ac984c0$@com> <e5a18b02a7775248c4853900224f386f@verizon.net> <00ef01ca0c2c$35c77980$a1566c80$@com> <3009aac2c8e60d9d9b97bd5aef72e457@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <000601ca0e76$8717e3a0$9547aae0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Valerie Flowe




Valerie:
I know...what WAS Tonks thinking running off and leaving her newborn?! 
I know, I know, she was a bad ass Auror. But still, I hate that poor 
little Teddy was an orphan who never knew his parents. Still not happy 
that JKR killed both of them off, and in such an off-handed way (Oh 
yeah, and Tonks & Lupin were lying there dead too) :-(

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>..

I was very flustrated (yes, I made that word, I'm a wordsmith, see?) by the
way she killed off characters by simply stating they were dead. As a writer
I find it lazy and stupid, as a teacher I hand it back and say "make it make
sense to the reader." When Sirius got killed it was "Harry is reckless,
Sirius is reckless, this was bound to happen and it changes the way Harry
perceives his own actions." When DD got killed, it seemed inevitable and is
latter explained very cleverly so that it really makes sense to the reader.
Plus, Harry had to do it on his own and DD's death was a plot solution that
was well thought out and fit logically with the story and characters. Now,
move on to the final battle, the only deaths that make sense are Bellatrix,
Grabbe and Voldy!!!  Snapes death is something I CANNOT VISUALIZE making any
sense (a floating snake in a bubble suddenly floats towards him, and bites
him and he knows several seconds in advance it is coming and does nothing???
Tonks and Lupin just die at random, two of the most skilled with a new born
baby and young marriage to fight for just die? WTF?

 

I've been defending DH, but you just reminded me how much some of it really
didn't work. I think as a cap to 6 great books, it seemed very poorly
thought out in the end.

 

md 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 04:59:21 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 00:59:21 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <3a825adb70f08cfa0cc3e4700b07ac55@verizon.net>
References: <h4d8ih+aaqc@eGroups.com> <3a825adb70f08cfa0cc3e4700b07ac55@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <000e01ca0e77$012046b0$0360d410$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Valerie Flowe
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 12:37 AM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Problems with the DH movie

 

  

On Jul 24, 2009, at 5:20 PM, Richard Shepard wrote:


Valerie:
That way they 
won't need to cut the story into little quickly edited scenes with much 
of the content simplified or deleted altogether.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

 

Yeah, but two 2:30 ? 2:45 films or two 1:30 ? 1:45 movies? Will they make a
5 to 5 ? hr film in two parts? Or a 3 ? 3 ? film in two parts? 

 

Personally, I think they needed three 3hr films and four 5 ? 6 hr films in
two parts.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From montavilla47 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 05:42:47 2009
From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 05:42:47 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h4iiel+2f88@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4jeon+hmia@eGroups.com>

> > > Carol responds:
> > > That's what I thought, too, until I read the Gambon interview. Now I'm not so sure that Gambon is mistaken (or joking, as you suggest). Surely, if Alan Rickman had read HBP, he would object to the way the tower scene is handled in the film.

> > Montavilla47:
> > I just think you're putting a lot of responsibility on the actors.  They can 
> > protest, but it wasn't Alan Rickman or Michael Gambon who staged that 
> > scene.  It certainly wasn't either of them who designed a honkin' big set element in the middle of the tower that prevented the actors from
> > actually seeing each other--thus making any kind of dramatic eye
> > contact impossible.
> >
> Carol responds:
> 
> But other actors, for example, Patrick Stewart and Ted Levine in the making of the 1998 "Moby Dick," objected to scenes in the screenplay that seemed to conflict with the original story, and the director and screenwriter listened to them (though the film was still not sufficiently canonical, IMO.)

Montavilla47:
Whether or not an actor is listened to if they object is going
to depend on their clout, their relationship to the director/
producers, and the cost of making any change.


Carol:
> Rickman, et al, could have spoken up right after reading the screenplay, before those sets were constructed. And JKR, in particular, should have objected. I think we can be pretty sure that *she* read the book, or at least remembered what she'd written in the manuscript.

Montavilla47:
We have no idea when the actors received their scripts.  They
might have been at an early reading of the first draft--or they 
might not have seen it until a few weeks before their scenes
were shot.  In which case, the sets would have been already been
designed and probably nearly built.

It's even less likely that an actor is going to have any say over 
the cut of a film.  In the cutting, lines may be cut, or even entire
scenes.

We know that there was a first draft reading of the script, 
because JKR wrote her famous note to Steve Kloves that 
"Dumbledore is gay" on her script during it.  But I don't know--
and I doubt any of us on the list know whether or not any
actors were present for that reading.

And JKR should have objected if she had a problem.  I'm 
sure she's obligated to insist on changing the script because 
of *our* feelings. :)

Carol:
> *Somebody* should have indicated that the whole business of Snape already being there, Harry hiding under some platform without his IC and without being petrified, and Snape and DD both being calm, with DD hardly affected by the potion, was A) out of character and illogical and B) much less emotionally powerful than the original scene.
> 
> Why take something absolutely brilliant and terrifying and heart-rending and make it blah?

Montavilla47:
Alas, I can't answer that question.  I will say that, on a second viewing, I
did find Rickman quietly compelling in that scene.  It's really Harry who
suffers the most from the change.

But, in the filmmakers' defense, the scene as written was always going 
to present problems.  Harry is petrified in the beginning of the film, and 
it's not exactly emotionally riveting when you see him.  In order for the 
scene to work, you need to feel Harry's frustration at being unable to 
act.  In order to convey that cinematically while he's immobile *and* 
invisible would be quite difficult!

Carol:
> But the point of my post was that I don't know whether to believe Gambon or not. Has Rickman read the book or hasn't he?

Montavilla47:
I couldn't tell you.  I don't remember seeing any interviews 
either way.  

Carol:
> I would not have kept her mouth shut had I been one of the actors involved in this apparent travesty (I know; I know. I haven't seen the film yet, but I'll be very surprised if that scene makes me feel anything remotely resembling the grief and fury and sense of betrayal--not by Snape but by JKR--that I felt on first reading that scene, or the dim hopes that were aroused when Snape saved Harry from the Crucio, another scene that they've apparently decided to drop.)

Montavilla47:
The Crucio moment is there.






From montavilla47 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 05:47:41 2009
From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 05:47:41 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4ik07+jg0b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4jf1t+lj9i@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "coolbeans3131" <coolbeans3131 at ...> wrote:
>
> 
> > Carol responds:
> > Diary? I think you must mean the HBP's potions book. (I suspect you're right about the way they'll handle the DH scene, which gives Harry one more person to rescue after Crabbe idiotically casts the Fiendfyre spell.)
> > 
> Joann:
> Yes, I meant HBP book, lol.
> 
> BTW, did anyone else find it strange the way H/G and Draco entered the RoR? They never showed  them entering just standing before a wall or a wall hanging and then all of a sudden being inside. it just struck me as strange. (shrug)
>

Montavilla47:

Yes, I found it extremely strange.  I wondered if people would be
confused about how they kept getting from a dead end in the hallway
to a cluttered room.

It was also strange that sometimes the Unicorn tapestry was there  
and sometimes it was just a bare wall.




From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 06:36:08 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 02:36:08 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h4jeon+hmia@eGroups.com>
References: <h4iiel+2f88@eGroups.com> <h4jeon+hmia@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001001ca0e84$86a5b880$93f12980$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of montavilla47





Montavilla47:


But, in the filmmakers' defense, the scene as written was always going 
to present problems. Harry is petrified in the beginning of the film, and 
it's not exactly emotionally riveting when you see him. In order for the 
scene to work, you need to feel Harry's frustration at being unable to 
act. In order to convey that cinematically while he's immobile *and* 
invisible would be quite difficult!



>>>>>>>>>>> 

But we "see" HRH under the cloak all the time in the films. The entire scene
could have been shot by focusing on Harry's eyes, I think just cutting away
quickly back and forth to a close-up of him petrified to make the audience
feel the helplessness as events unfold would have worked. I think seeing the
physical release of Harry from being petrified and his realization that he's
on free because DD is dead could have been very powerful.

I think they played to the audience as if we are simple folk, I think they
played the film for a PG rating as well judging from the cop-outs with the
secumsumpsra (however it's spelled) and the inferi looking like Gollum
rather than Night of the Living Dead.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 15:08:39 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 15:08:39 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h4jeon+hmia@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4kftn+gpto@eGroups.com>

> Montavilla47:
>
> We have no idea when the actors received their scripts.  They
> might have been at an early reading of the first draft--or they 
> might not have seen it until a few weeks before their scenes
> were shot.  In which case, the sets would have been already been
> designed and probably nearly built.
> 
> It's even less likely that an actor is going to have any say over 
> the cut of a film.  In the cutting, lines may be cut, or even entire
> scenes.
> 
> We know that there was a first draft reading of the script, 
> because JKR wrote her famous note to Steve Kloves that 
> "Dumbledore is gay" on her script during it.  But I don't know--
> and I doubt any of us on the list know whether or not any
> actors were present for that reading.
> 
> And JKR should have objected if she had a problem.  I'm 
> sure she's obligated to insist on changing the script because 
> of *our* feelings. :)
>


Richard:

After reflecting on those last few scenes with Snape, I think there has to be deleted scenese on the DVD.  Not only do I think it would have bothered the cast if the scenes were so abbreviated in the script, but they really didn't feel complete when i was watching it on screen.  I bet they were written and filmed longer and then cut in editing.  







From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 15:31:36 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 15:31:36 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4ipmo+bi85@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4kh8o+34d5@eGroups.com>

> > Carol wrote:
> >
> > Ron still needs to be a bit unsure of himself. Yes, he'll hug Hermione to comfort her now (DD's funeral in the HBP book) instead of pulling away in terror, and he holds her hand when they're at 12 GP in DH, but he's still afraid to kiss her, mostly because he's still insecure and still envious of Harry. 
> 
> <snipped book summary?
> 
> va32h:
> 
> Seriously, there's no need to summarize the entire book, Carol. We are all here because we are fans, we know what happened in the book. 
> 
> My point was that I thought what JKR did in the book was wrong.  Ron had ALREADY moved past all these insecurities and that I thought JK Rowling made a lousy and lazy choice in regressing Ron's character. He ALREADY worked out all his insecurities both about Harry (during the TriWizard Tournament in GoF) and about himself (during the endless Quidditch saga of OoTP).
> 
> To go back to that well in HBP, resolve it, and then go back AGAIN, is absolute character assasination on JKR's part.  
> 


Richard: 

Hmmmm, I hear you but I do not completely agree.  I, like everyone else, was frustrated with the continued lack of a Ron/Hermione relationship through DH, but I do not see it as lazy regressive writing.  

Goblet of Fire is where Ron finally deals with Harry's fame, and realizes that no only does Harry really not like it but it actually kind of sucks.  But this has to do with how close the two boys are as friends.  It does not have anything to do with Hermione.  

Ron gains a lot more confidence in himself in Order of the Phoenix and Half-Blood Prince through Quidditch and his "physical" romance with Lavender.  But again this is about his confidence in himself, and is not necessarily about Hermione.  

I think that Ron considers Hermione too good for him and has always expected Hermione and Harry to end up together because they are both so awesome.  He is just the average bloke that is lucky enough to be their friend and gets to help them out in whatever small ways he can while they save the world.  
And I think this is why it always had to ber Hermione that kissed Ron first.  

So yes, it frustrated me in every book and every movie that Ron is so clueless and does not see the "obvious" signs that Hermione adores him... but I do not think that continued strain in DH was so bad.


va32h:
>
> I hate pretty much every single word in Deathly Hallows but I particularly hate the way JKR destroyed Ron. She took too many cues from the screenwriters, I think.  Book Ron - the Ron we knew for 5 1/2 books at least, would NEVER have left Harry in the forest. 
> 
> That was such a stupid, lazy, choice of Rowling's --- I nearly flung my book across the room in disgust when I read it. 
>


Richard:

Hmmm, I agree that it scuffs up Ron's character that he deserted them like that.  First, I think the fact that Ron storms off like that is suppose to reinforce just how strong his feelings about Hermione are.  Second, he probably was just going to go cool down and come back pretty quick except he was "detained".  

And we can never lose sight that we are talking about seventeen year olds.  And Ron is the most emotionally immature of the lot, being the youngest boy in a big family.  Even if Ginny is younger than him, I would call Ron the baby of the family.

Thanks,
Richard






From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 15:57:07 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 15:57:07 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4ik9d+k99l@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4kioj+9o6i@eGroups.com>

> > Carol:
> > Anyway, it always seemed to me that Narcissa's beauty is one of the reasons that Snape took the Unbreakable Vow.
> 
> Joann:
> I've never imagined that Snape took the unbreakable vow for any reason other than to keep playing double agent. I don't think he would do something that drastic because he felt sorry for Narcissa. Snape turned out to not be all bad, but he was hardly a prince charming. He had a soft spot for one person, and one person only. Lily Potter.
>


Richard:

I do not think Snape was swayed by Narcissa's beauty, but he probably was affected by the love and fear of a mother for her only son.  He might even be afraid that Narcissa will do something foolish like get herself killed by Voldemort trying to protect Draco... just like a certain Mrs. Potter :)  

But all in all, the unbreakable vow was not much of a risk for Snape.  He probably would have tried to protect Draco anyway.  And he was already going to kill Dumbledore anyway as well.





From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Mon Jul 27 16:20:06 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 16:20:06 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4iq8o+qvjp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4kk3m+c68g@eGroups.com>

 "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> I'm tempted to buy a spare set of paperbacks [
]
> annotate them, and mail them to JKR or her publisher
> as a gift, pointing out [
]  the Potters already
> being under the Fidelius Charm just after Harry's
> first birthday in DH when it doesn't occur until
> a week before Halloween in PoA.

I could be wrong but I don't think DH mentions the Fidelius Charm in that scene, nor does it specify just how long "just after" is.

> inconsistencies like Ron's somehow knowing about
> Draco's hand of Glory 

Be sure to put that one at the end of your list inconsistencies
(that and the one about Voldemort and his dissatisfaction with the Elder Wand), otherwise the publisher will stop reading and just assume you're someone so desperate to find plot holes you find them even when they don't exist. 

> everything from typos like "miniscule" for "minuscule"
> [
] Honestly, *someone* should point out all the
> places where her inconsistencies distract the reader.
 
I don't think that distracted many readers, in fact I wouldn't be terribly surprised if you weren't the only human being on this planet who noticed that typo. 

 Eggplant






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 19:08:43 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:08:43 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <000601ca0e76$8717e3a0$9547aae0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4ktvr+4n9c@eGroups.com>

md wrote:
> 
> I was very flustrated (yes, I made that word, I'm a wordsmith, see?)

Carol: 

Actually, a large number of people have used that "portmanteau word," to borrow Lewis Carroll's term (flustered plus frustrated). It's  perfectly intelligible--no need to apologize or claim credit for it.

md:
> by the way she killed off characters by simply stating they were dead. As a writer I find it lazy and stupid, as a teacher I hand it back and say "make it make sense to the reader." <snip>

Carol responds:
True, it's generally better to show than to tell, but JKR was hampered here by Harry's point of view. Snape's memories were more important to the story, and some deaths had to occur while he was viewing them. At least the film version will have the advantage of multiple points of view and should show at least one of them (Lupin?) being killed. BTW, perhaps Tonks is motivated by more than a desire to show her stuff as an Auror and be with her beloved Remus; her father, Ted Tonks, is killed earlier in the book, so she may want revenge, and Auntie Bellatrix has been trying to kill her all year for "polluting" the family by marrying a werewolf. It must have been hard for her to sit at home while Remus fought, and she certainly could not have anticipated that both of them would be killed. Nor would she have abandoned Teddy if his loving grandmother Andromeda has not been there to watch him. 

As for Lupin, JKR originally intended Mr. Weasley, the book's only fully functional father, to accompany Harry to his "death" along with his parents and godfather but changed her mind and decided to sacrifice the Lupins to show Teddy as a happy, much-loved orphan at the end of the last book.(Earlier in the book, Harry wanted Lupin to stay home and protect his family rather than accompany him and his friends, but now the danger has shifted to Hogwarts and it's a real battle, not a Horcrux hunt. I'd say that circumstances have changed. But, yes, it's a shame that we're not shown Tonks' motivations and she looks like a love-crazed, overprotective wife, and we're not shown their deaths. JKR's focus was on Harry's and Snape's stories, not those of supporting characters.)

I do agree that parts of DH, especially the Elder Wand subplot, should make more sense to the reader than they do. I'd give examples, but that's a discussion for the main list.

md wrote:
> Snapes death is something I CANNOT VISUALIZE making any sense (a floating snake in a bubble suddenly floats towards him, and bites him and he knows several seconds in advance it is coming and does nothing??? <snip>

Carol responds:
Snape's death scene upset me greatly, but not because I had trouble visualizing it. Apparently, Voldemort doesn't want to kill Snape with the Elder Wand because he thinks that Snape is its master and it might refuse to kill him. At any rate, JKR doesn't want him to be AK'd because he wouldn't be able to perform his last bit of wandless magic with the memories or look into Harry's eyes if he were killed instantly.

Instead, she has Voldemort force Snape's head into Nagini's bubble, where Nagini bites his neck and then LV lets him fall out of the bubble and leaves him there to bleed to death. As for why Snape does nothing, he could have saved his life through an act of cowardice, screaming out that Draco is the true master of the wand, but he remains silent, protecting Draco to the last. And his fear, as I read it, is not of death--he's been risking his life for seventeen years, after all, even making an Unbreakable Vow that would have killed him had he broken it--but of failure. His mind, as we can see from his repeated "let me talk to the boy," is on Harry and the message he has to give him. Unless he somehow senses that Harry is present, he must sense that he's failed in his final mission for DD and fear that Voldemort will win the battle because Harry will try to fight rather than sacrificing himself. Snape's mind is preoccupied, not with saving himself, but with Harry. And though he raises his wand, he doesn't use it, knowing that the soul bit in Harry's scar will keep LV from dying and that he must face Harry. Snape is more helpless in this situation than he's ever been in his life, and he's in despair, feeling that Voldemort has won the battle. Once he sees Harry, he takes action instantly, using his last strength to release every memory connected with himself and Lily or himself and Dumbledore that will help Harry understand why he has helped him and persuade him to do what he has to do.

Carol, who would much rather that Snape had lived but who can visualize that scene all too clearly




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 19:23:27 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:23:27 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <001001ca0e84$86a5b880$93f12980$@com>
Message-ID: <h4kurf+rkae@eGroups.com>

md:
> I think they played to the audience as if we are simple folk, I think they played the film for a PG rating as well judging from the cop-outs with the secumsumpsra (however it's spelled) and the inferi looking like Gollum rather than Night of the Living Dead.

Carol responds:

Sectumsempra, created from the Latin words "sectum" = "cut" and "sempra" = "always."

As for the PG rating, that seems very odd to me given the PG-13 rating of the previous two films. This one should have been darker given that the characters are older and it's the run-up to the final confrontation in DH, not to mention the horror of certain scenes in the book: Sectumsempra, the cave, the "murder" of Dumbledore. Evidently, they wanted to make the film fun--and funny--by playing up the romance, love potions, and Quidditch angle at the expense of the Half-Blood Prince and the darker elements. Not a decision I would have made, as I'm sure everyone knows by now.

Carol, who hopes to get a laugh or two out of the film since she doesn't expect any tears or terror 




From montavilla47 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 19:26:07 2009
From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:26:07 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h4jeon+hmia@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4kv0f+vhiv@eGroups.com>

> Montavilla47:
> And JKR should have objected if she had a problem.  I'm 
> sure she's obligated to insist on changing the script because 
> of *our* feelings. :)
> 

Montavilla47:

Just to correct myself, that second sentence should read:
"I'm  *not* sure she's obligated to insist on changing the 
script because of our feelings."




From taguem at jmsearch.com  Mon Jul 27 19:39:16 2009
From: taguem at jmsearch.com (Michelle Tague)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 15:39:16 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS
In-Reply-To: <483799.55318.qm@web59811.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
References: <483799.55318.qm@web59811.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <08dc01ca0ef1$f21685f0$d64391d0$@com>

I?m very late in my readings here
but I was really upset that they had Snape


silence Harry on the tower
 I mean, that gives the illusion that he?s a good


guy
but we don?t know that til the end of the DH!

 

Other than that I really had no hard core gripes about the movie
 it could
have been longer ;-)

 

Michelle

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Lady of Imladris
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 11:32 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS

 

  

I liked it and I'll probable go and see it several times. 

Love,Red

--- On Wed, 7/15/09, Steve <bboyminn at yahoo.com <mailto:bboyminn%40yahoo.com>
> wrote:

From: Steve <bboyminn at yahoo.com <mailto:bboyminn%40yahoo.com> >
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry Potter - GROSS
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com <mailto:HPFGU-Movie%40yahoogroups.com> 
Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2009, 1:55 PM

Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince is gross, grosser than
any previous movie.

It is so gross that it took in ??22 million at the first night
Wednesday midnight showing, beating 'The Dark Knight's Wednesday
gross of US$18 million. Of course, that is just USA gross intake.

Look like another blockbuster.

Steve/bluewizard 

------------------------------------

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From md at exit-reality.com  Mon Jul 27 19:41:40 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 15:41:40 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4ktvr+4n9c@eGroups.com>
References: <000601ca0e76$8717e3a0$9547aae0$@com> <h4ktvr+4n9c@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002e01ca0ef2$43496b40$c9dc41c0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 3:09 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Problems with the DH movie

 

  

md wrote:
> 
> I was very flustrated (yes, I made that word, I'm a wordsmith, see?)

Carol: 

Actually, a large number of people have used that "portmanteau word," to
borrow Lewis Carroll's term (flustered plus frustrated). It's perfectly
intelligible--no need to apologize or claim credit for it.



>>>>>>>>>>>>>Um, joking. 
md:
> by the way she killed off characters by simply stating they were dead. As
a writer I find it lazy and stupid, as a teacher I hand it back and say
"make it make sense to the reader." <snip>

Carol responds:
True, it's generally better to show than to tell, but JKR was hampered here
by Harry's point of view. Snape's memories were more important to the story,
and some deaths had to occur while he was viewing them.

>>>>>>>>>>>She's abandoned Harry's POV in other chapters, she easily could
have written 4 - 5 short chapters and intercut them with Harry's direct
storyline. In HBP we don't even get Harry until the third chapter.

As for Lupin, JKR originally intended Mr. Weasley, the book's only fully
functional father, to accompany Harry to his "death" along with his parents
and godfather but changed her mind and decided to sacrifice the Lupins to
show Teddy as a happy, much-loved orphan at the end of the last book

>>>>>>>>>>Yes, well, considering how things went for the last two orphans I
don't think we needed number three. What I wanted from Rowling was a damned
good explanation how these two wizards who have lived and fought through so
much where finally taken down just when they had more than ever to live for.
Why she did it doesn't concern me so much as the off-handed way in which she
did it.

I do agree that parts of DH, especially the Elder Wand subplot, should make
more sense to the reader than they do. I'd give examples, but that's a
discussion for the main list.



>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I see flash-backs in DH. I think that they will have to show
things like Draco disarming DD and so-forth so the viewer can make sense of
how things come together.


md wrote:
> Snapes death is something I CANNOT VISUALIZE making any sense (a floating
snake in a bubble suddenly floats towards him, and bites him and he knows
several seconds in advance it is coming and does nothing??? <snip>

Carol responds:
Snape's death scene upset me greatly, but not because I had trouble
visualizing it. Apparently, Voldemort doesn't want to kill Snape with the
Elder Wand because he thinks that Snape is its master and it might refuse to
kill him. At any rate, JKR doesn't want him to be AK'd because he wouldn't
be able to perform his last bit of wandless magic with the memories or look
into Harry's eyes if he were killed instantly.



>>>>>>> If it would have been "Voldemort reached out suddenly and seemed to
grab Snape with a long, invisible arm. He jerked forward, was struck by
Nagini and fell to the ground like a wet rag" then I could have seen it.
Instead it was written like Snape just stood there (like Harry now under the
tower!) and waited for the snake to bite him.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Mon Jul 27 19:50:11 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:50:11 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie.
In-Reply-To: <h4ktvr+4n9c@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4l0dj+g53a@eGroups.com>

 "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> As for why Snape does nothing, he could have saved his
> life through an act of cowardice, screaming out that
> Draco is the true master of the wand, but he remains
> silent, protecting Draco to the last. 

I have no reason to believe Snape knew Draco was the master of the Elder Wand, no reason to think Snape knew more wand lore than Tom Riddle Junior. Even Ollivander and Dumbledore said there was much about this they didn't understand. In there final confrontation Harry wasn't certain he was the Master and wasn't certain he'd survive, so this is how I'd like it to play out in the movie:

"So it all comes down to this, does that wand in you hand know I defeated its last master? Well to tell the truth I don't know enough wand lore to know for sure, I don't think anybody does, but a wand won't kill its master, so the question you have to ask yourself is: do I feel lucky today? Well do you Junior? Come on make my day!" 

 Eggplant






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 19:52:24 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:52:24 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4kh8o+34d5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4l0ho+m1ia@eGroups.com>

Carol wrote:
> > >
> > > Ron still needs to be a bit unsure of himself. Yes, he'll hug Hermione to comfort her now (DD's funeral in the HBP book) instead of pulling away in terror, and he holds her hand when they're at 12 GP in DH, but he's still afraid to kiss her, mostly because he's still insecure and still envious of Harry. 

va32h responded:
> > 
> > Seriously, there's no need to summarize the entire book, Carol. We are all here because we are fans, we know what happened in the book. 

Carol responds:
Sorry about that. I suppose I'm too used to the main list. OTOH, not everyone on this list is thoroughly familiar with the books, and I like to support my points with evidence. You're free to skip my posts if you think they're too detailed, and I do realize that I overdid it with too many of them coming back to this list after being absent for two or three days.

va32h: 
> > My point was that I thought what JKR did in the book was wrong.  Ron had ALREADY moved past all these insecurities and that I thought JK Rowling made a lousy and lazy choice in regressing Ron's character. He ALREADY worked out all his insecurities both about Harry (during the TriWizard Tournament in GoF) and about himself (during the endless Quidditch saga of OoTP). <snip>

Carol responds:

I understand your feelings. I had the same reaction in HBP when he was insecure about Quidditch all over again and needed to think he was drinking Felix Felicis to play well after having shown everyone how well he could play in the "Weasley Is Our King" segment of OoP. Character development sacrificed to plot (but also intended, I think, to show Ron's insecurity as longterm and not easily remedied by one success).

va32h:
> >
> > I hate pretty much every single word in Deathly Hallows but I particularly hate the way JKR destroyed Ron. She took too many cues from the screenwriters, I think.  Book Ron - the Ron we knew for 5 1/2 books at least, would NEVER have left Harry in the forest. 
> > 
> > That was such a stupid, lazy, choice of Rowling's --- I nearly flung my book across the room in disgust when I read it.

Carol responds:

I nearly flung my book across the room after "The Sacking of Severus Snape"! But that aside, I don't think it was character assassination. JKR is doing two things with that scene, showing the power of the Horcrux (Harry has already suffered somewhat similar reactions to his scar in OoP, where he's uncharacteristically angry and irritable; it seems to me that he can deal with the locket Horcrux better than Ron can because he has his own Horcrux in his scar) *and* to lead up to the powerful scene in which Ron first proves himself a true Gryffindor by rescuing Harry and retrieving the sword and then quite literally confronting his demons and destroying them, literally and figuratively, with the Sword of Gryffindor, after which he becomes the Ron he always was--brave and funny and loyal, but now fully aware that he loves Hermione and she loves him. It's a rite of passage, a symbolic growing up that simply would not have worked if he were already fully mature and self-confident.

Please understand that I'm not summarizing again here; I'm interpreting--and explaining why I don't think her treatment of Ron is character assassination at all; instead, it's preparation for a key scene. And, of course, Ron would never have left the tent if it hadn't been for the Horcrux and would never have "deserted" Harry and Hermione if he hadn't been kidnapped by Snatchers and unable to return before they changed their location and concealed the tent from him with their defensive spells.

Carol, who hates the whole Elder Wand subplot, especially Snape's death, and the manipulative side of DD revealed in DH




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 19:57:45 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:57:45 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4kioj+9o6i@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4l0rp+ktil@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:
>
> > > Carol:
> > > Anyway, it always seemed to me that Narcissa's beauty is one of the reasons that Snape took the Unbreakable Vow.
> > 
> > Joann:
> > I've never imagined that Snape took the unbreakable vow for any reason other than to keep playing double agent. I don't think he would do something that drastic because he felt sorry for Narcissa. Snape turned out to not be all bad, but he was hardly a prince charming. He had a soft spot for one person, and one person only. Lily Potter.
> >
> 
> 
> Richard:
> 
> I do not think Snape was swayed by Narcissa's beauty, but he probably was affected by the love and fear of a mother for her only son.  He might even be afraid that Narcissa will do something foolish like get herself killed by Voldemort trying to protect Draco... just like a certain Mrs. Potter :)  
> 
> But all in all, the unbreakable vow was not much of a risk for Snape.  He probably would have tried to protect Draco anyway.  And he was already going to kill Dumbledore anyway as well.
>
Carol responds:

Was he? He clearly didn't want to do it, as indicated in three scenes that I've listed elsewhere. The Unbreakable Vow forced his hand--do it or die. That took remarkable courage and loyalty on his part, IMO, not to mention ruthlessness and indifference to the risks *he* was taking on Narcissa's. You don't make an Unbreakable Vow without risking your life. That's the whole point. It's a binding magical contract, a promise that you keep or die.

Carol, noting that the scene also adds to Snape's ambiguity and raises the tension to a whole new level, at least in the book




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 20:14:03 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:14:03 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4kk3m+c68g@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4l1qb+msee@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> > everything from typos like "miniscule" for "minuscule" [
] Honestly, *someone* should point out all the places where her inconsistencies distract the reader.
>  
> I don't think that distracted many readers, in fact I wouldn't be terribly surprised if you weren't the only human being on this planet who noticed that typo. 

Carol:
Oh, I don't think I'm the only human being on this planet who still knows how to spell. One or two English teachers must have noticed it, and the copyeditor should have caught it. It's spelled correctly in PoA but misspelled in SS/PS and CoS. I didn't notice that particular word in GoF, and I'm still rereading OoP (again) while I wait for someone to Apparate to Tucson to watch the film with me. (Seriously, I can't find anyone who wants to see it with me, and I hate to go to movies alone.)

Regarding DH, there *is* a discrepancy between the date of the letter, which is just after Harry's birthday and therefore very early in August, and the date of the Fidelius Charm as mentioned in PoA (a week before Halloween). And although the FC isn't specifically mentioned, DD has already borrowed James's Invisibility Cloak, which Dead!DD later tells Harry he borrowed a week before their deaths.

I'd mention a discrepancy I just noticed in OoP regarding Harry's detentions, but, as you say, nobody cares about it but me. IMO, both the copyeditor (if there was one) and the consistency editor did a lousy job in all the books, and the developmental editor should have indicated that the Elder Wand subplot was not entirely clear and consistent and should have been more fully worked out. As someone (md?) implied, JKR had a little too much clout and was a little too sure that her books were already perfect by the time she wrote the third or fourth one. Certainly, it was exhausting work and she was pressured by deadlines, and she may have been in a hurry to finish the last one and wrap it all up. She's human, and human authors need equally human editors to catch what the author's eyes simply can't. (If you know your own creation too well, it's hard to see the flaws and inconsistencies in it; that's why authors need other sets of trained eyes to fix or point out problems that they can't see.)

Carol, who also finds JKR's dangling modifiers distracting





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 20:27:26 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:27:26 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie.
In-Reply-To: <h4l0dj+g53a@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4l2je+jjto@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> 
> > As for why Snape does nothing, he could have saved his life through an act of cowardice, screaming out that Draco is the true master of the wand, but he remains silent, protecting Draco to the last. 

Eggplant: 
> I have no reason to believe Snape knew Draco was the master of the Elder Wand, no reason to think Snape knew more wand lore than Tom Riddle Junior. <snip>

Carol responds:
Tom Riddle, unlike Snape (a Dark Arts expert), didn't grow up in a Wizarding household. Snape would at least be familiar with the Elder Wand from Tales of Beedle the Bard, as Ron was. Voldemort knew only what Ollivander told him. And Snape certainly knew that Draco had Disarmed DD. He becomes very pale when he hears that LV has taken that wand from Dumbledore's tomb. That seems to be the moment when he hears his death knell.

That aside, how do you account for Snape's unwillingness to defend himself if he isn't protecting Draco? Do you agree with the part of my post that you snipped? 

Carol, just curious




From d2dmiles at yahoo.de  Mon Jul 27 20:50:03 2009
From: d2dmiles at yahoo.de (Miles)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 22:50:03 +0200
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie.
References: <h4l2je+jjto@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <C4CE2FABF3B447DE9CD693581C043195@miles>

> Eggplant:
>> I have no reason to believe Snape knew Draco was the master of the
>> Elder Wand, no reason to think Snape knew more wand lore than Tom
>> Riddle Junior. <snip>
>
> Carol responds:
> Tom Riddle, unlike Snape (a Dark Arts expert), didn't grow up in a
> Wizarding household. Snape would at least be familiar with the Elder
> Wand from Tales of Beedle the Bard, as Ron was. Voldemort knew only
> what Ollivander told him. And Snape certainly knew that Draco had
> Disarmed DD. He becomes very pale when he hears that LV has taken
> that wand from Dumbledore's tomb. That seems to be the moment when he
> hears his death knell.

Miles
I know it's a bit unfair to shout "it happened offpage", but I think in this 
case we can be quite sure that Voldemort has read many books about wizardry, 
and quite certainly about wandlore as well. He was supposed to be the most 
brilliant student Hogwarts ever saw (at least since Dumbledore), and we all 
know that pure talent is not enough even in the magical world.

Unlike Harry, who wouldn't touch a book unless he is forced to do by a 
teacher, and even then would try to skip parts of it and ask someone to tell 
him the essentials (Hermione), Voldemort does not need to ask Ollivander for 
what is written in books, but for the kind of knowledge only the Loremasters 
have.

Voldemorts main problem is not knowledge, it is his impression that magic 
will always work in his favour, and his arrogance towards all possible 
outcomes of magic that would work for his enemies: Lily's sacrifice, priore 
incantatum, wand ownership... I think if he would have been asked in a (very 
theoretical) examination, he would have been able to describe and explain it 
thoroughly. 





From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Mon Jul 27 21:11:56 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 21:11:56 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4l1qb+msee@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4l56t+3l4e@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:

> > everything from typos like "miniscule" for "minuscule" 
 
It's time to face reality, there is no consensus on the proper spelling of this word; in fact the Lexicographers at the Oxford English Corpus say miniscule actually outnumbers minuscule, by a ratio of about 55% to 45%. I agree that whatever spelling it should be consistent throughout the entire series but I'll bet that has something to do with differences in the British and American editions.

> I wait for someone to Apparate to Tucson to watch the film with me.

I would but I don't have my license yet, I spenched one toenail last time; but for heaven's sake see the movie! And when you do, go in with the understanding that however good it is the movie will never EVER be as good as the book, however it can still be very enjoyable if you don't keep a mental check list while watching it of every time it deviates from the book. In fact it's best to pretend you never read the book, although I know that can be hard. I really wonder what the movies would look like to somebody who never read the books.

> the developmental editor should have indicated that 
> the Elder Wand subplot was not entirely clear and consistent
> and should have been more fully worked out. 

As I've mentioned before, the Elder Wand subplot does indeed contain a plot hole, but certainly not the one you're talking about.

> there *is* a discrepancy between the date of the letter,
> which is just after Harry's birthday and therefore very
> early in August, and the date of the Fidelius Charm as
> mentioned in PoA (a week before Halloween).

I don't have the book handy but are you saying there is an actual DATE on the letter? I sure don't recall that.

> although the FC isn't specifically mentioned, DD has
> already borrowed James's Invisibility Cloak, which
> Dead!DD later tells Harry he borrowed a week before
> their deaths. 

Did Dead!DD specifically say "a week"? By the way, I take anything Dead!DD says with a grain of salt because I'm not sure if the information came from Dumbledore or Harry's imagination.

 Eggplant 







From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 21:33:05 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 21:33:05 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4l0rp+ktil@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4l6eh+m4dr@eGroups.com>

> > > > Carol:
> > > > Anyway, it always seemed to me that Narcissa's beauty is one of the reasons that Snape took the Unbreakable Vow.
> > > 
> > > Joann:
> > > I've never imagined that Snape took the unbreakable vow for any reason other than to keep playing double agent. I don't think he would do something that drastic because he felt sorry for Narcissa. Snape turned out to not be all bad, but he was hardly a prince charming. He had a soft spot for one person, and one person only. Lily Potter.
> > >
> > 
> > Richard:
> > 
> > I do not think Snape was swayed by Narcissa's beauty, but he probably was affected by the love and fear of a mother for her only son.  He might even be afraid that Narcissa will do something foolish like get herself killed by Voldemort trying to protect Draco... just like a certain Mrs. Potter :)  
> > 
> > But all in all, the unbreakable vow was not much of a risk for Snape.  He probably would have tried to protect Draco anyway.  And he was already going to kill Dumbledore anyway as well.
> >
> Carol responds:
> 
> Was he? He clearly didn't want to do it, as indicated in three scenes that I've listed elsewhere. The Unbreakable Vow forced his hand--do it or die. That took remarkable courage and loyalty on his part, IMO, not to mention ruthlessness and indifference to the risks *he* was taking on Narcissa's. You don't make an Unbreakable Vow without risking your life. That's the whole point. It's a binding magical contract, a promise that you keep or die.
> 
> Carol, noting that the scene also adds to Snape's ambiguity and raises the tension to a whole new level, at least in the book
>


Richard:

I overstated that a little.  I did not mean to say that pledging an unbreakable vow was some sort of throw away decision.  I think he felt bad for Narcissa and wanted to shut up Bellatrix.  But I had the impression that he had already promised to kill Dumbeldore before the scene at Spinner's End.  So yes, I do not think he vowed to do anything he was not already going to do.  It just took it to a hightened level.  

I still contend you get all the ambiguity you need from Snape thanks to Alan Rickman's performance in his limited presence in the film.  Go watch the movie.  You won't be THAT dissappointed :)  






From kempermentor at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 22:47:15 2009
From: kempermentor at yahoo.com (kempermentor)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 22:47:15 -0000
Subject: DH: the seven potters
Message-ID: <h4lapj+h0bp@eGroups.com>

Apparently, Hagrid and Harry will be dodging Death Eaters on Britain
streets rather than her skies.

Here's a link.
<http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php?al\
bum=158&pos=350>

Using Yahoo's rich text beta, so if that doesn't work:
http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/displayimage.php?alb\
um=158&pos=350


Kemper



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From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Mon Jul 27 23:51:13 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 23:51:13 -0000
Subject: DH: the seven potters
In-Reply-To: <h4lapj+h0bp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4lehh+tj46@eGroups.com>

 "kempermentor" wrote:
>
> Apparently, Hagrid and Harry will be dodging Death Eaters on Britain
> streets rather than her skies.
his message have been removed]
>
Joann:
Well, they start on the streets anyway. I'm assuming they will take to the skies at some point. We have seen the motorcycle fly in the first movie.(with the same driver) It would be ridiculous to stay on the street. How would they ever get to the burrow? (or wherever they go in the movie) Maybe they (those trying to get Harry to safety) think that the death eaters won't even consider that Harry would be "driven" away.




From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 28 00:57:35 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:57:35 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4l1qb+msee@eGroups.com>
References: <h4kk3m+c68g@eGroups.com> <h4l1qb+msee@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <008801ca0f1e$65706260$30512720$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 4:14 PM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Fictional plot holes (was: The Romance)

 

  

Carol earlier:
> > everything from typos like "miniscule" for "minuscule" [.] Honestly,
*someone* should point out all the places where her inconsistencies distract
the reader.
> 
> I don't think that distracted many readers, in fact I wouldn't be terribly
surprised if you weren't the only human being on this planet who noticed
that typo. 

Carol:
Oh, I don't think I'm the only human being on this planet who still knows
how to spell. One or two English teachers must have noticed it, and the
copyeditor should have caught it. It's spelled correctly in PoA but
misspelled in SS/PS and CoS

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

:::RAISES HAND:::

I'm an English Teacher!!! And hey, guess what, teaching English and being a
pro-speller does not go hand-in-hand.

Also, remember that they stopped editing so close between UK and US versions
after POA. And since many consider "miniscule" to be just find, it's
possible one editor with your sensibilities changed it when another, like
me, left it! MS Word, btw, doesn't correct either spelling and
Merriam-Webster says both are find, so loosen up! It's not Nukular or
anything!

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 00:57:19 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 00:57:19 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie.
In-Reply-To: <C4CE2FABF3B447DE9CD693581C043195@miles>
Message-ID: <h4lidf+mfjd@eGroups.com>

Miles wrote:
> I know it's a bit unfair to shout "it happened offpage", but I think in this case we can be quite sure that Voldemort has read many books about wizardry, and quite certainly about wandlore as well. He was supposed to be the most brilliant student Hogwarts ever saw (at least since Dumbledore), and we all know that pure talent is not enough even in the magical world.
> 
> Unlike Harry, who wouldn't touch a book unless he is forced to do by a teacher, and even then would try to skip parts of it and ask someone to tell him the essentials (Hermione), Voldemort does not need to ask Ollivander for what is written in books, but for the kind of knowledge only the Loremasters have.

Carol:
It's clear to me that he's never heard of Beedle the Bard. Grindelwald sneers at him for his ignorance. At most, he may have heard rumors of the Elder Wand under its nicknames (e.g., the Death Stick) and asked Ollivander about it.

Miles: 
> Voldemorts main problem is not knowledge, it is his impression that magic will always work in his favour, and his arrogance towards all possible outcomes of magic that would work for his enemies: Lily's sacrifice, priore incantatum, wand ownership... I think if he would have been asked in a (very theoretical) examination, he would have been able to describe and explain it thoroughly.

Carol responds:

We know from CoS that Tom Riddle spent his school years researching exactly two things--the location of the Chamber of Secrets and learning how to make Horcruxes. All he cared about was being the Heir of Slytherin, attracting followers, and immortality. I don't deny that he was naturally brilliant, but I doubt that he was a swot like Hermione (or, to all appearances, the young Snape). Somehow, I can't picture him sitting in a book-lined room studying, in contrast to Snape, who must have spent a lot of time reading in Spinner's End. Those books weren't his father's, and probably not his mother's, either. When Tom Riddle had the chance, he simply used his natural brilliance and power to kill people and transplant memories to frame others for his crimes. (He could already do controlled wandless magic, such as moving objects and making animals obey him and hurting people when he was eleven years old. The brilliant Tom Riddle study other people's magic? Not unless it was how to create, say, an Inferius.) And once he'd murdered Hepzibah Smith and stolen the future Horcruxes from her, he disappeared, not to read but to "consort with the Darkest of our kind," as DD put it.

Carol:
He seems to have run across some particular kinds of Dark Magic as he was trying to find out how to make a Horcrux. Consequently, he knew about the Philosopher's Stone and the ancient potion, with the accompanying unusually long incantations, that Wormtail makes in the graveyard. But the potion that created the rudimentary body that we see in GoF, Nagini's venom combined with unicorn blood, seems to be his own invention, as were the spells he invented to supplement it.

It's true that we know very little about what Voldemort did during his lost years, but what we do know points to active experimentation rather than reading and study.

Carol, suspecting that Tom Riddle, despite his natural brilliance, was not an intellectual




From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 28 01:34:01 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 21:34:01 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Problems with the DH movie.
In-Reply-To: <h4lidf+mfjd@eGroups.com>
References: <C4CE2FABF3B447DE9CD693581C043195@miles> <h4lidf+mfjd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <009e01ca0f23$7c6dc0c0$75494240$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol





Carol, suspecting that Tom Riddle, despite his natural brilliance, was not
an intellectual

//////////////////////////////

Intellectual's a vague word. Anyone who studies a subject to mastery is
definitely an intellectual. Just because you're tactile and not a book
learner doesn't change anything, Einstein was Dyslexic - he didn't read
books either! Tom riddle studied exactly what he wanted to know and he
wanted to know everything about magic that he could ever find useful - his
downfall, he didn't learn what he didn't think he would need to know.

 

I certainly think he's intellectual, very learned, certainly a master in his
field of study.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 04:24:35 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 04:24:35 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie.
In-Reply-To: <h4lidf+mfjd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4lui3+5q38@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
>
> Miles wrote:
> > I know it's a bit unfair to shout "it happened offpage", but I think in this case we can be quite sure that Voldemort has read many books about wizardry, and quite certainly about wandlore as well. He was supposed to be the most brilliant student Hogwarts ever saw (at least since Dumbledore), and we all know that pure talent is not enough even in the magical world.
> > 
> > Unlike Harry, who wouldn't touch a book unless he is forced to do by a teacher, and even then would try to skip parts of it and ask someone to tell him the essentials (Hermione), Voldemort does not need to ask Ollivander for what is written in books, but for the kind of knowledge only the Loremasters have.
> 
> Carol:
> It's clear to me that he's never heard of Beedle the Bard. Grindelwald sneers at him for his ignorance. At most, he may have heard rumors of the Elder Wand under its nicknames (e.g., the Death Stick) and asked Ollivander about it.
> 
> Miles: 
> > Voldemorts main problem is not knowledge, it is his impression that magic will always work in his favour, and his arrogance towards all possible outcomes of magic that would work for his enemies: Lily's sacrifice, priore incantatum, wand ownership... I think if he would have been asked in a (very theoretical) examination, he would have been able to describe and explain it thoroughly.
> 
> Carol responds:
> 
> We know from CoS that Tom Riddle spent his school years researching exactly two things--the location of the Chamber of Secrets and learning how to make Horcruxes. All he cared about was being the Heir of Slytherin, attracting followers, and immortality. I don't deny that he was naturally brilliant, but I doubt that he was a swot like Hermione (or, to all appearances, the young Snape). Somehow, I can't picture him sitting in a book-lined room studying, in contrast to Snape, who must have spent a lot of time reading in Spinner's End. Those books weren't his father's, and probably not his mother's, either. When Tom Riddle had the chance, he simply used his natural brilliance and power to kill people and transplant memories to frame others for his crimes. (He could already do controlled wandless magic, such as moving objects and making animals obey him and hurting people when he was eleven years old. The brilliant Tom Riddle study other people's magic? Not unless it was how to create, say, an Inferius.) And once he'd murdered Hepzibah Smith and stolen the future Horcruxes from her, he disappeared, not to read but to "consort with the Darkest of our kind," as DD put it.
>


Richard:  

Interesting point of view.  I have always assumed that Voldemort was very bright and very well studied, just a little too specialized and a little too overconfident.  

True, he never studied anything as deeply as the dark arts and the whole immortality thing, but he was the top student at Hogwarts.  Just doing what he had to do to be the top student must have involved reading a lot of books and becoming quite good at lots of different things.  He just dropped everything he didn't find useful as soon as he could.  






From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Tue Jul 28 06:33:58 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 06:33:58 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie.
In-Reply-To: <h4l2je+jjto@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4m64m+v716@eGroups.com>

 "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> Tom Riddle, unlike Snape (a Dark Arts expert),

I think Tom Riddle was a bit of a Dark Arts expert too.

> didn't grow up in a Wizarding household. Snape would 
> at least be familiar with the Elder Wand from Tales
> of Beedle the Bard

Most wizards were familiar with those tales and nearly all thought they were just kid's stories. Even if he thought they were true (unlikely, Snape doesn't seem the type) it would tell him nothing about the intricacies of wand lore, nobody fully understood that; and remember, Dumbledore said Harry and Voldemort's relationship was pushing magic into new and unexplored directions. 

> how do you account for Snape's unwillingness to defend
> himself if he isn't protecting Draco? 

Well how do you account for it? If Snape attacked Voldemort and won Draco would be protected, if he attacked and lost Draco would be no worse off. Snape was very powerful but he knew he was no match for Voldemort, he had no chance, so he tried persuasion not confrontation. It didn't work. 

 Eggplant





From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Tue Jul 28 06:42:21 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 06:42:21 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie.
In-Reply-To: <h4m64m+v716@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4m6kd+flja@eGroups.com>

And besides, if Snape knew Draco was the master of the Elder wand he had nearly a year to defeat him in battle just as Harry did (no need to kill him), then Snape would  become the master of the wand just as Dumbledore wished; but Snape was no more knowledgeable of wand lore than anybody else. He had no idea.

 Eggplant  





From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Tue Jul 28 07:02:26 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 07:02:26 -0000
Subject: DH: the seven potters
In-Reply-To: <h4lapj+h0bp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4m7q2+nj5o@eGroups.com>

In the Seven Potters part of the movie I think it would be interesting if when Harry was embarrassed when the others were changing cloths he had said out loud what JKR tells us was going through his mind, "Hey, treat my body with a little more modesty". 

If Harry had said that, I think it likely Ron or Fred or George or somebody would have said what we were all thinking about our hero at that moment, "I don't see what you're so worried about Harry, you're hung like a horse".  

And yes, the fact that Hermione and Flur were among the six fake Potters is a bit kinky, but I didn't write it, JKR did.

 Eggplant





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 13:54:12 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 13:54:12 -0000
Subject: DH: the seven potters
In-Reply-To: <h4m7q2+nj5o@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4mvu4+qdtn@eGroups.com>

> Eggplant107 wrote:
>
> In the Seven Potters part of the movie I think it would be interesting if when Harry was embarrassed when the others were changing cloths he had said out loud what JKR tells us was going through his mind, "Hey, treat my body with a little more modesty". 
> 
> If Harry had said that, I think it likely Ron or Fred or George or somebody would have said what we were all thinking about our hero at that moment, "I don't see what you're so worried about Harry, you're hung like a horse".  
> 


Richard: 

Funny!  They should definitely make Harry's thought a vocal comment for the movie.  Ron would never say something like that in front of Hermione, but Fred and George would :)  

After Hermione has transformed into Harry, Ron should smack her on the butt.  When she protests he can say "For luck!  Guys do it to each other all the time" 







From montavilla47 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 15:47:24 2009
From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 15:47:24 -0000
Subject: DH: the seven potters
In-Reply-To: <h4mvu4+qdtn@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4n6ic+bkk8@eGroups.com>

> > Eggplant107 wrote:
> >
> > In the Seven Potters part of the movie I think it would be interesting if when Harry was embarrassed when the others were changing cloths he had said out loud what JKR tells us was going through his mind, "Hey, treat my body with a little more modesty". 
> > 
> > If Harry had said that, I think it likely Ron or Fred or George or somebody would have said what we were all thinking about our hero at that moment, "I don't see what you're so worried about Harry, you're hung like a horse".  

Montavilla47:
But what if he isn't?  Will they have to CGI it?





From cbeesus at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 16:14:30 2009
From: cbeesus at yahoo.com (cbeesus)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 16:14:30 -0000
Subject: HBP
In-Reply-To: <h4kurf+rkae@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4n856+fafm@eGroups.com>

md:
> > I think they played to the audience as if we are simple folk, I think they played the film for a PG rating as well judging from the cop-outs with the secumsumpsra (however it's spelled) and the inferi looking like Gollum rather than Night of the Living Dead.
>
> Carol responds:
>
> Carol, who hopes to get a laugh or two out of the film since she doesn't expect any tears or terror

Lynne Responds:
I don't post much but just wanted to say I thought the inferi were pretty scary.  I knew it was going to happen but I still jumped.  Also I know it's not a popular thought but sometimes in the books I get a little tired of the dark and go looking for the funny.  I know in the OOP I was so happy that Harry got over his mad much quicker than he did in the books - I thought get over it already.

Lynne





From va32h at comcast.net  Tue Jul 28 16:46:56 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 16:46:56 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4kh8o+34d5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4na20+vg2i@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:

 
> I think that Ron considers Hermione too good for him and has always expected Hermione and Harry to end up together because they are both so awesome.  He is just the average bloke that is lucky enough to be their friend and gets to help them out in whatever small ways he can while they save the world.  

va32h:

Oh no, I disagree very much here!  The movie version of Ron certainly comes off that way, but that's because Steve Kloves keeps giving his lines to Hermione and the director's seem hell-bent on making Ron a buffoon. 

But Ron from the books - at least from the early books - is a crucial part of the Trio.  He won the chess game, which is no "small way" of helping, and he's the one who sacrificed himself so that Harry could continue. 

In Chamber of Secrets, it's Ron who comes up with the idea to rescue Harry from the Dursleys, stands up for Muggleborns, tries to curse Malfoy to defend Hermione's honor (and only fails because of his malfunctioning wand, not because he's incompetent), faces up to his great fear of spiders.  In PoA, Ron's the only one who notices Hermione's crazy schedule and figures out how impossible it must be, and he's the one who stands up for Harry in the Shrieking Shack, even though he's injured. 

Ron is the only member of the trio with any true knowledge of the magical world too - which is frequently quite important. 

Ron was a terrific character until Steve Kloves came along, and unfortunately, Rowling seemed to have forgotten what "her" Ron was like and went with the Kloves version (ptui!)

But then Harry was a better character too, in those early books. By DH, Harry and Ron have both become useless lumps that Super!Hermione! has to drag around with her. 

va32h






From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Tue Jul 28 16:52:44 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 16:52:44 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <002401ca0e63$5a523a90$0ef6afb0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4nacs+k3uj@eGroups.com>

Carol responds: 
> "The missing twenty-four hours" is the way those of us on the main 
> list refer to the twenty-four hours that Minerva McGonagall spent 
> sitting around in cat form at 5 Privet Drive waiting for Dumbledore 
> to show up. <snip>
> 
> Hagrid supposedly goes to Godric's Hollow before the Muggle police 
> show up, digs Harry out of the rubble, and comforts Sirius Black, 
> who has shown up on his motorcycle. Sirius then lends or gives him 
> the motorcycle and flies with Harry to the Dursleys, where he 
> arrives nearly twenty-four hours after the Potters were killed at 
> midnight Halloween night.
> 
> So the question is, what were Hagrid and Dumbledore doing all that 
> time? Why didn't Hagrid arrive on the early morning of November 1 
> rather than making McGonagall wait a whole day for him? And how did 
<snip>


md:  
> I just listed to the Audiobook (decided to load them to my mp3 
> while I'm working on our house.) First of all, McGonagall  is there 
> from morning to night, not 24hrs. 
<snip> 
> The 24hrs is the time of the attack, wording of the attack getting 
> out, DD summoning Hagrid, Hagrid going, finding Harry, meeting 
> Sirius, traveling to the Dursely's.
> 
> I see no missing 24hrs.


SSSusan:
Speaking as one who placed great significance on the "missing 24 hours" and had a theory about what was taking place during it, I actually think that the items you've described would not really take up 24 hours, especially if we focus on Harry's retrieval and subsequent delivery.

I do agree, though, that the 24 hours doesn't mark the amount of time McGonagall is waiting at the Dursleys' house; it marks the amount of time from the attack to when Hagrid arrives with Baby Harry.

For me, the significance of the time span is that news -- and wizards -- travel FAST in the wizarding world.  We know the attack broke the Fidelius Charm, so that there wasn't a delay in the murders and people like DD discovering that they had happened.  We know the Order members had quick means of commucation -- such as their talking patronuses [patroni?] -- which meant summoning Hagrid could have taken place in a matter of moments.  And we have no reason to believe that it would take Sirius' magic motorbike 23 or 24 hours to make that flight to Little Whinging from Godric's Hollow (especially since Hagrid seemed to be flying at a clip quite equal to those on brooms or thestrals on the night of the Seven Potters).  

Given the instant breaking of the FC, the quick method of communication among Order members and the fast transport we see in the WW, I think it was quite understandable that fans were VERY curious about what was going on between the discovery of the Potters and Harry's delivery to Privet Drive.  

Let's just say that a lot of us had a lot of fun imagining what kinds of things DD, Hagrid, et al. might have been doing during this time.  My own theory was called DRIBBLE SHADOWS and begins in post #128717 at Main. ;)  

To hear that JKR wasn't aware of any gap was a bit startling!

Siriusly Snapey Susan





From missygallant2000 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 17:02:29 2009
From: missygallant2000 at yahoo.com (Missy)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 17:02:29 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <000c01ca0727$cbc89680$6359c380$@com>
Message-ID: <h4nav5+m5ug@eGroups.com>

> Montavilla47:
> The problem of Slughorn watching stupidly as Ron is dying is a holdover from
> the book. He was no more helpful then. 
> 
> Harry finding the bezoar is a logical problem in the film, since we haven't 
> heard about that trick since PS/SS, and we don't have Harry reading that 
> fun, snarky little tip in the Potions book. And, it takes him forever to
> find
> it, unlike in the book, when he was able to go straight to it.
> 
> Plus, we then get one of those scenes where other actors have to *tell*
> us what happened. It reminds me of that clumsy moment in PS/SS when
> we learn that Harry made the Quidditch team from Nearly Headless Nick.
> 
> 
> 
> md:
> 
> In the book we have the narrators guidance, and we KNOW that Harry knows to
> look for the beazor, in the film we do not have these things so the scene
> makes no sense. We know Harry is on the Quidditch team because McGonagall
> Marches him over to Wood and announces she's found him a seeker, hardly from
> Nearly Headless Nick.
> 
Technically- this is not true.  In HBP- a scene or two before the poisoning, Harry goes to see Sluggy at the end of a class and Sluggy is mentioning bezoars.  It doesn't help much- but at least it was mentioned before.




From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Tue Jul 28 17:05:41 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 17:05:41 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4kioj+9o6i@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4nb55+cq5i@eGroups.com>

Carol:
> > > Anyway, it always seemed to me that Narcissa's beauty is one of the reasons that Snape took the Unbreakable Vow.
 
Joann:
> > I've never imagined that Snape took the unbreakable vow for any reason other than to keep playing double agent. I don't think he would do something that drastic because he felt sorry for Narcissa. Snape turned out to not be all bad, but he was hardly a prince charming. He had a soft spot for one person, and one person only. Lily Potter.

Richard:
> I do not think Snape was swayed by Narcissa's beauty, but he probably was affected by the love and fear of a mother for her only son.  He might even be afraid that Narcissa will do something foolish like get herself killed by Voldemort trying to protect Draco... just like a certain Mrs. Potter :)  

SSSusan:
I never thought Snape was swayed by her beauty, either.  

What I objected to in this scene -- besides the skunk hair -- was that Narcissa was supposed to be crying, begging, pleading, on her *knees* imploring Snape.  Instead, we saw someone who was, other than tears rimming her eyes, a pretty cool cucumber.  


Richard: 
> But all in all, the unbreakable vow was not much of a risk for Snape.  He probably would have tried to protect Draco anyway.  And he was already going to kill Dumbledore anyway as well.

SSSusan:
I've gotten to watch the scene three times now, and while the first one was kind of wasted on being stunned by the skunk hair, and the second on noticing that Narcissa wasn't acting as described in the book, the third time I really watched Alan Rickman.  (Yes, yes, I watch him closely always, but I mean I extra-focused. ;))  

Anyway... I thought Rickman did a fabulous job of showing with his eyes and face that he knew it was really the moment where his fate was sealed.  Yes, I agree that he probably would have watched over Draco somewhat and yes, he'd already talked to DD and knew what DD wanted him to do, but adding in the Unbreakable Vow meant that -- for two reasons now [the UV and the promise to DD] -- he was REALLY locked in to that fate.  The knowledge seemed, to me, to be written on his face before he uttered that last "I will."

Siriusly Snapey Susan






From missygallant2000 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 17:11:14 2009
From: missygallant2000 at yahoo.com (Missy)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 17:11:14 -0000
Subject: Two WTF moments in the movie (spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <EC27FF2F187E4B57957F04EC742BDB86@ckc>
Message-ID: <h4nbfi+8n48@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "CK Campbell" <ckc at ...> wrote:
>
> > who agrees about Cissy's hair, 
> 
> Maybe she was going brunette with worry.
> 
> CK
>

I HATE it when that happens.  Yeah agreed it was wrong.




From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Tue Jul 28 17:16:56 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 17:16:56 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <002e01ca0ef2$43496b40$c9dc41c0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4nbq8+d3ba@eGroups.com>

md:
> > by the way she killed off characters by simply stating they were 
> > dead. As a writer I find it lazy and stupid, as a teacher I hand 
> > it back and say "make it make sense to the reader." <snip>

Carol responds:
> True, it's generally better to show than to tell, but JKR was 
> hampered here by Harry's point of view. Snape's memories were more 
> important to the story, and some deaths had to occur while he was 
> viewing them.

md replied:
> She's abandoned Harry's POV in other chapters, she easily could
> have written 4 - 5 short chapters and intercut them with Harry's 
> direct storyline. <snip> 
> What I wanted from Rowling was a damned good explanation how these 
> two wizards who have lived and fought through so much where finally 
> taken down just when they had more than ever to live for. Why she 
> did it doesn't concern me so much as the off-handed way in which she
> did it.

SSSusan:
I totally agree with you, md.

I complete "get" that Fred, Colin, Tonks & Lupin all died because, well, war sucks and JKR's not going to save all the popular ones just so's we can all be happy at the end.  Still, given that Lupin was the only remaining Marauder, the only of Harry's dad's compatriots left in Harry's life, it does seem like we "deserved" to see his death, as opposed to just discovering it as if we're looking down a checklist.

I'm NOT happy that both Tonks & Lupin died, but I'm mostly unhappy that it did feel off-handed. :(

Siriusly Snapey Susan






From va32h at comcast.net  Tue Jul 28 18:38:20 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 18:38:20 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4nbq8+d3ba@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ngis+h718@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "cubfanbudwoman" <susiequsie23 at ...> wrote:
> I complete "get" that Fred, Colin, Tonks & Lupin all died because, well, war sucks and JKR's not going to save all the popular ones just so's we can all be happy at the end.  Still, given that Lupin was the only remaining Marauder, the only of Harry's dad's compatriots left in Harry's life, it does seem like we "deserved" to see his death, as opposed to just discovering it as if we're looking down a checklist.
> 
> I'm NOT happy that both Tonks & Lupin died, but I'm mostly unhappy that it did feel off-handed. :(
> 
>

va32h:

See, I didn't "get" why they had to die at all. Not from any logical standpoint, anyway.  The DE were outnumbered. And Colin doesn't even belong at the battle at all, because he's a Muggleborn and wasn't at school all year  (and yes I know all the fanwanking we can do to get him there, but frankly, I am sick to death of having to do plot gymnastistics to make Rowling's increasingly lazy choices make sense.)

And IMO, the deaths of Tonks and Lupin feel offhanded because they are offhanded. Didn't Rowling say in one of her interviews that she just decided one day that she'd like to have another orphan in the series?

You know a lot of subjects on the list lately - the "missing" 24 hours that JKR didn't realize even existed, the changes with the ending of the HBP film, the changes with ALL the films really, the discussion of whether this actor or that has read the books or why Rowling would allow this or that change to be made....it all boils down to one thing. 

No one involved in the production of these books or movies - including (hell, especially) Rowling, gave as much thought, consideration or interpretation of this series as the readers did.  

va32h






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 18:48:23 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 18:48:23 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4l56t+3l4e@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4nh5n+9hsg@eGroups.com>

Eggplant wrote:
> I don't have the book handy but are you saying there is an actual DATE on the letter? I sure don't recall that.

Carol responds:
It's a thank you letter for the birthday present that Sirius sent Harry and can't have been written more than a few days after Harry's birthday, which we all know is July 31. And she states that DD "still" has James's Invisibility Cloak, so he must have borrowed it sometime in July rather than October.

Carol earlier: 
> > although the FC isn't specifically mentioned, DD has already borrowed James's Invisibility Cloak, which Dead!DD later tells Harry he borrowed a week before their deaths. 


Eggplant: 
> Did Dead!DD specifically say "a week"? By the way, I take anything Dead!DD says with a grain of salt because I'm not sure if the information came from Dumbledore or Harry's imagination.

Carol again:
Here are his exact words: "You have guessed, I know, why the Cloak was in my possession on the night your parents died. James had showed it to me *just a few days previously* <snip irrelevant stuff>. I asked to borrow it, to examine it." (DH Am. ed.)

We know, of course, that Harry's parents died at midnight on Halloween, so he should have received the Invisibility Cloak in October, not August, presumably at the same time he suggested the Fidelius Charm (according to PoA, a week before the Potters died).

I know that some people like filling the plot holes and explaining the inconsistencies, but my explanation is the same as the reason JKR still thinks (according to her website) that DD died in 1996 and Fred in 1997--JKR can't count and doesn't double-check dates and "facts" from earlier books.

Don't get me wrong. I'm still obsessed with the books. I just wish that someone had pointed out the errors and real or apparent inconsistencies before the books were published.

Carol, noting that there's also no logical reason for a letter written five years after Sirius ran away from home to be in his old room in his parents' house




From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 28 19:16:23 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 15:16:23 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: DH: the seven potters
In-Reply-To: <h4n6ic+bkk8@eGroups.com>
References: <h4mvu4+qdtn@eGroups.com> <h4n6ic+bkk8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <015f01ca0fb7$e55c1750$b01445f0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of montavilla47





Montavilla47:
But what if he isn't? Will they have to CGI it?

Um.

 

 

 

If you really want to know..

 

 

 

 

Well..

 

 

Google image search Dan Radcliffe with filters off.

 

md

 

 

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 19:26:47 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 19:26:47 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <008801ca0f1e$65706260$30512720$@com>
Message-ID: <h4njdn+kk3v@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> Oh, I don't think I'm the only human being on this planet who still knows how to spell. One or two English teachers must have noticed it, and the copyeditor should have caught it. It's spelled correctly in PoA but misspelled in SS/PS and CoS
> 
md:
> 
> :::RAISES HAND:::
> 
> I'm an English Teacher!!! And hey, guess what, teaching English and being a pro-speller does not go hand-in-hand.

Carol:
All too true, unfortunately. I know of a second-grade English teacher who couldn't spell herself and encouraged her students to ignore spelling and just write because she was afraid (so she said) that learning correct spelling would restrict their creativity. (I think she was just making excuses. After all, children at that age can still memorize much easier than older children, teenagers, and adults, which is why they can still memorize the multiplication table--if it's taught. These days, at least in one school that I know of, it's on the kids' desks!)

md:
> Also, remember that they stopped editing so close between UK and US versions after POA. 

Carol:
That has nothing to do with it. The incorrect spelling is in the first two books; the correct spelling is in the third. And it's not a question of UK spelling vs. American spelling ("colour" vs. "color"), which would obviously be changed, along with UK punctuation and, occasionally, grammar ("Ministry are" vs. Ministry is") for the American editions, or of British vocabulary ("jumper") being changed to the U.S. equivalent ("sweater"), which is the sort of thing that Scholastic stopped editing so closely after PoA.

md:
> And since many consider "miniscule" to be just find, it's possible one editor with your sensibilities changed it when another, like me, left it! 

Carol:
Many whom or what? Most American publishers require copyeditors to use standard spelling, meaning the preferred or main spelling listed for a particular word in Merriam-Webster's eleventh Collegiate Dictionary, just as they require them to follow the Chicago Manual of Style for hyphenation, punctuation, capitalization, spelling out of numbers, etc. It looks to me like a typo that the copyeditor didn't catch (there are others, but I can't remember them now).

md:
> MS Word, btw, doesn't correct either spelling and Merriam-Webster says both are find, so loosen up! It's not Nukular or anything!

Carol:
It's not a matter of loosening up. I was half-joking when I said "one or two English teachers." I'm actually quite sure that many people besides me (a high school spelling champion, longtime college English teacher with a PhD, and copyeditor) still know how to spell, though I do fear that it's becoming a lost art. 

As for Word, which I use all the time in my work, it's a very imperfect system. The fact that it doesn't consider "miniscule" an error (my Seascape spell check *does* mark it as an error) just indicates that the Microsoft people designed their program for office workers, not editors. Word also marks "yourself" and other reflexive pronouns as errors even when they're used correctly. (Admittedly, it's pretty good at catching passive voice sentences, though.)

As for Merriam-Webster, "miniscule" is listed only as a variant of "minuscule" (it became one because so many people mistakenly associated it with "mini" rather than "minus", but a copyeditor would be required to use the primary spelling, the one with the definition following it. I know because I *am* a copyeditor.

I'm not condemning the whole series because of that particular error. I'm just noting it as an example of things that the copyeditor should have caught (as that particular error was in PoA). He or she also should have caught the dangling modifiers, which start becoming noticeable around GoF. My impression, at least in the later books, is that the editors at all levels became more lax, or more afraid of making or suggesting corrections (British English aside--they were right to leave that as is unless a British term sounds obscene in American English), around GoF--as if they were afraid of the great and powerful Oz, erm, JKR. Of course, tight deadlines may also have had something to do with it. I can see the publishers recommending what is called in publishing "a light edit"--just typos, misused words (e.g. "conscious" for "conscience," not that JKR makes that particular error), and other actual errors. They even left comma splices that, I hope, you would note in your students' essays.

Can we let this drop now?

Carol, perfectly aware that no copyeditor or author is perfect and that all of us, including me, make mistakes




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 19:44:08 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 19:44:08 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie.
In-Reply-To: <009e01ca0f23$7c6dc0c0$75494240$@com>
Message-ID: <h4nke8+mctg@eGroups.com>

> Carol, suspecting that Tom Riddle, despite his natural brilliance, was not an intellectual
> 
> //////////////////////////////
> 
> Intellectual's a vague word. Anyone who studies a subject to mastery is definitely an intellectual. Just because you're tactile and not a book learner doesn't change anything, Einstein was Dyslexic - he didn't read books either! T<snip>
> 
> I certainly think he's intellectual, very learned, certainly a master in his field of study.

Carol:
I meant that he's not a scholar, like Snape, who surrounds himself with books. The post I was responding to suggested that LV spent a lot of time reading, which I don't think was the case.

As you'll note, I didn't deny his natural brilliance or power or his interest in pursuing particular subjects of interest to him (immortality and the Chamber of Secrets) in books if they would help him. He must have consulted the Restricted Section of the library even before he reached NEWT level, probably charming a teacher other than Dumbledore into giving him permission. But he seems to me to have been more interested in practicing magic than in reading about it. And, as I said, unlike Ron, he would not have been familiar with Tales of Beedle the Bard. Even if the orphanage had a library, that book would not have been part of the collection. Like Hermione and Harry, also raised by Muggles, he would not have heard those stories, and I doubt that he'd have consulted a book of children's tales in his quest for glory and immortality.

My point was that, like Einstein in your example, he relied on his own natural abilities and experimentation, not on books, to develop his powers, except in specific instances like those I mentioned.

Substitute "scholar" for "intellectual" and we seem to agree. I would class Hermione and Snape as "intellectuals" in the sense that I was using the term ("scholars," if your prefer) and Voldemort as an expert in his field, Dark Magic, who develops his already substantial powers through ruthless determination and experimentation, consulting books only as needed and not for pleasure.

Carol, doubting that Tom Riddle in his B&B period had a library resembling Snape's 




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 19:44:55 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 19:44:55 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4na20+vg2i@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4nkfn+sr0u@eGroups.com>

> > Richard wrote:
> >  
> > I think that Ron considers Hermione too good for him and has always expected Hermione and Harry to end up together because they are both so awesome.  He is just the average bloke that is lucky enough to be their friend and gets to help them out in whatever small ways he can while they save the world.  
> 
> va32h:
> 
> Oh no, I disagree very much here!  The movie version of Ron certainly comes off that way, but that's because Steve Kloves keeps giving his lines to Hermione and the director's seem hell-bent on making Ron a buffoon. 
> 
> But Ron from the books - at least from the early books - is a crucial part of the Trio.  He won the chess game, which is no "small way" of helping, and he's the one who sacrificed himself so that Harry could continue. 
> 
> In Chamber of Secrets, it's Ron who comes up with the idea to rescue Harry from the Dursleys, stands up for Muggleborns, tries to curse Malfoy to defend Hermione's honor (and only fails because of his malfunctioning wand, not because he's incompetent), faces up to his great fear of spiders.  In PoA, Ron's the only one who notices Hermione's crazy schedule and figures out how impossible it must be, and he's the one who stands up for Harry in the Shrieking Shack, even though he's injured. 
> 
> Ron is the only member of the trio with any true knowledge of the magical world too - which is frequently quite important. 
> 
> Ron was a terrific character until Steve Kloves came along, and unfortunately, Rowling seemed to have forgotten what "her" Ron was like and went with the Kloves version (ptui!)
> 
> But then Harry was a better character too, in those early books. By DH, Harry and Ron have both become useless lumps that Super!Hermione! has to drag around with her. 
> 
> va32h
>


Richard:  

I agree with everything you say about Ron.  He is clever, funny, brave, loyal, insightful, etc... but he is also insecure.  He does not see himself clearly (of course most people don't, including Harry and Hermione).  In my opinion, it is his insecurities that drive all the big moron moments.  We saw what happened when he thought Harry had given him luck potion.  He played amazing quidditch and was snogging a cute girl all in a couple hours :) 

"He is just the average bloke that is lucky enough to be their friend and gets to help them out in whatever small ways he can while they save the world."  This sentence is how I think Ron would describe himself at the beginning of DH.  

The movies may make him out as a slightly bigger buffoon than he is in the book, which is too bad... but that does not change the fact that it is a legitimate aspect of his character.  The locket in DH just magnifies this and it is finally resolved once and for all when he destroys it.  

Maybe we should have a contest to see who can name the most insecurities that each of the three main kiddos exhibits in the series :)  






From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Tue Jul 28 19:54:33 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 19:54:33 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes
In-Reply-To: <h4njdn+kk3v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4nl1p+5rvr@eGroups.com>

 "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> Can we let this drop now?

I don't understand why people write things like that at the END of a long post; they should write it at the BEGINNING, that way they wouldn't have to write a long post. 

 Eggplant




From juli17 at aol.com  Tue Jul 28 20:00:09 2009
From: juli17 at aol.com (julie)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 20:00:09 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie
In-Reply-To: <h4ngis+h718@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4nlc9+91bn@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "va32h" <va32h at ...> wrote:
>
> --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "cubfanbudwoman" <susiequsie23@> wrote:
> > I complete "get" that Fred, Colin, Tonks & Lupin all died because, well, war sucks and JKR's not going to save all the popular ones just so's we can all be happy at the end.  Still, given that Lupin was the only remaining Marauder, the only of Harry's dad's compatriots left in Harry's life, it does seem like we "deserved" to see his death, as opposed to just discovering it as if we're looking down a checklist.
> > 
> > I'm NOT happy that both Tonks & Lupin died, but I'm mostly unhappy that it did feel off-handed. :(
> > 
> >
> 
> va32h:
> 
> See, I didn't "get" why they had to die at all. Not from any logical standpoint, anyway.  The DE were outnumbered. And Colin doesn't even belong at the battle at all, because he's a Muggleborn and wasn't at school all year  (and yes I know all the fanwanking we can do to get him there, but frankly, I am sick to death of having to do plot gymnastistics to make Rowling's increasingly lazy choices make sense.)

Julie:
It's especially galling that two Order members, one an Auror
and one a werewolf (who one would think might be more difficult
to kill than your average wizard) can be so easily killed.
Heck, it took a wall falling on him to kill Fred, and Colin
at least isn't yet a fully-trained wizard. All the DA members
survive, and Neville even kills Nagini, yet they all have much
less experience than Lupin and Tonks. 

But, as you say, it is all about expediency rather than logic.
She wanted Teddy to be an orphan, and maybe to get rid of the
last of the characters from the old Order (Marauder/Snape era)
to clear the way for the "next generation". So she killed off
Lupin and Tonks without even showing how they died, since 
seeing two Order members felled together, apparently unable to
defend themselves, would make little sense to readers anyway!

Julie 




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 20:11:02 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 20:11:02 -0000
Subject: The Problems with the DH movie.
In-Reply-To: <h4m6kd+flja@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4nm0m+cb1o@eGroups.com>

Eggplantwrote:
>
> And besides, if Snape knew Draco was the master of the Elder wand he had nearly a year to defeat him in battle just as Harry did (no need to kill him), then Snape would  become the master of the wand just as Dumbledore wished; but Snape was no more knowledgeable of wand lore than anybody else. He had no idea.
> 
>  Eggplant
>
Carol responds:
Until Voldemort told him that he'd broken into Dumbledore's tomb to steal the Elder Wand, at which point, he finally knew.

"'I sought a third wand, Severus, the Elder Wand, the Wand of Destiny, the Deathstick. I took it from its previous master. I took it from the grave of Albus Dumbledore.'

"And now Snape looked at Voldemort, and Snape's face was like a death mask. It was marble white and so still that when he spoke, it was a shock to see that anyone lived behind the blank eyes."

But what does Snape say, now that he knows what Voldemort is up to, knows, as we see from his face, that Voldemort intends to kill him? He doesn't try to fight; he doesn't present his usual clever, logical arguments or use Legilimency. He begs again to be allowed to go to "the boy"--Harry.

Until that point, Snape has had no idea that Draco was the master of the Elder Wand or that LV was after it or that DD's wand was the Elder Wand. But he understands instantly that LV wants to kill him, which can be for no other reason than that LV thinks he's the master of that wand. Snape, who presumably knows at least some wand lore and certainly knows that Draco Disarmed DD. And then LV actually says, "While you live, Severus, the Elder Wand cannot be truly mine."

At that point, Snape could have saved himself by telling Voldemort that he isn't the master of the wand because Draco Disarmed DD before Snape killed him (obviously, he's not going to admit that he did it on DD's orders), but he continues to protect Draco. He raises his wand but he doesn't use it even though, at that point, LV is not pointing a wand at him.

Why? It can't be because he knows that the wand LV has been complaining about (though it works perfectly well) is more powerful than his own. His wand can cast a perfectly effective Avada Kedavra; after all, it killed Dumbledore, who is just as powerful as Voldemort. It has to be because he knows that *he* can't destroy Voldemort; it has to be Harry because Harry has to sacrifice himself and destroy the soul bit. The most Snape could do would be to vaporize him and delay that necessary confrontation. He doesn't even use Expelliarmus, possibly because he thinks he's been reprieved.

But it's clear that Snape's fear is not for his own life. He fears that he has failed and that Harry will not sacrifice himself willingly, causing Voldemort, somehow, to win the war. And so he uses the last seconds of his life to give Harry the needed memories, not asking for help or trying to recite a spell to stop the bleeding. All that matters is that Harry get those memories--and give him the reward of looking into Lily's eyes.

Carol, expecting that Snape had plenty of opportunities to look into Lily's eyes after they were both dead and she knew the truth




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 20:25:17 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 20:25:17 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4nacs+k3uj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4nmrd+7dgc@eGroups.com>

SSSusan wrote:
> Speaking as one who placed great significance on the "missing 24 hours" and had a theory about what was taking place during it, I actually think that the items you've described would not really take up 24 hours, especially if we focus on Harry's retrieval and subsequent delivery.
> 
> I do agree, though, that the 24 hours doesn't mark the amount of time McGonagall is waiting at the Dursleys' house; it marks the amount of time from the attack to when Hagrid arrives with Baby Harry.
 <snip>
> 
> Let's just say that a lot of us had a lot of fun imagining what kinds of things DD, Hagrid, et al. might have been doing during this time.  My own theory was called DRIBBLE SHADOWS and begins in post #128717 at Main. ;)  
> 
> To hear that JKR wasn't aware of any gap was a bit startling!

Carol responds:

Right! BTW, SSS, great to see you posting! I'm sure I'm not the only one who's missed you.

The whole question is why Hagrid didn't deposit Harry on the Dursleys' doorstep the night of Halloween-November 1 instead of waiting until the next night after the Dursleys were in bed. Maybe it was closer to twenty-two hours than twenty, but, still, why did it take so long? What were DD and Hagrid doing during all that time? Digging Harry out of the ruins and flying to London from Godric's Hollow would have taken at most about five hours. McGonagall should not have had to wait around Privet Drive for a whole day. In fact, Hagrid should have delivered Harry before she even arrived. (Maybe JKR just wanted to show Vernon Dursley reacting to a cat reading a map and "weirdos" in cloaks and didn't think about the time frame--not to mention that November 1 was a workday and McGonagall left all her Transfiguration students without a teacher that day!)

Carol, who was also surprised that JKR didn't even know about the "missing twenty-four hours" and hadn't thought about what DD and Hagrid were doing in elaborate detail






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 20:34:35 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 20:34:35 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h4nav5+m5ug@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4nncr+kbqt@eGroups.com>

md wrote:
> > 
> > In the book we have the narrators guidance, and we KNOW that Harry knows to look for the beazor, in the film we do not have these things so the scene makes no sense. 

Missy responded: 
> Technically- this is not true.  In HBP- a scene or two before the poisoning, Harry goes to see Sluggy at the end of a class and Sluggy is mentioning bezoars.  It doesn't help much- but at least it was mentioned before.

Carol asks:

But why change a scene that works perfectly well in the books, giving us not only the HBP's snide advice about shoving a bezoar down their throats and Harry's "cheek" in presenting a bezoar instead of an antidote, but (possibly) jogs the viewer's memory as it did Harry's to remind us/him of Snape's first lesson? The filmmakers could even present that memory as a b/w flashback. In the book, the HBP/Snape is doubly responsible (though Harry only dimly realizes it) for providing Harry with the information that saves Ron's life. And in the HBP's own movie, the filmmakers leave that out? If they want to provide hints that Snape is on the good side, better to do so that way (as JKR did) than by that altered scene on the tower. And Harry presenting the Bezoar to Slughorn in class instead of doing his work could have been a great suspense/comic moment, too.

Carol, understanding that some cuts and alterations must be made but thinking that the filmmakers missed the boat (again) on this one





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 20:48:12 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 20:48:12 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4nb55+cq5i@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4no6c+fifk@eGroups.com>

SSS wrote:
> I never thought Snape was swayed by her beauty, either.  

Carol responds:
Well, maybe not by her beauty but by her desperation and her helplessness. He treats her (in contrast to Bellatrix) in a surprisingly gentlemanly manner throughout, and surely, he's reminded of Lily dying to save her son--and of his own desperate desire to save Lily. He's in the position of Dumbledore now, and unlike Dumbledore, he asks nothing in return.

SSS: 
> What I objected to in this scene -- besides the skunk hair -- was that Narcissa was supposed to be crying, begging, pleading, on her *knees* imploring Snape.  Instead, we saw someone who was, other than tears rimming her eyes, a pretty cool cucumber. 

Carol:
Another actor/actress who hasn't read the book, I guess. Why go to Snape for help if she's not desperate? 

> SSSusan:
> I've gotten to watch the scene three times now, and while the first one was kind of wasted on being stunned by the skunk hair, and the second on noticing that Narcissa wasn't acting as described in the book, the third time I really watched Alan Rickman.  (Yes, yes, I watch him closely always, but I mean I extra-focused. ;))  
> 
> Anyway... I thought Rickman did a fabulous job of showing with his eyes and face that he knew it was really the moment where his fate was sealed.  Yes, I agree that he probably would have watched over Draco somewhat and yes, he'd already talked to DD and knew what DD wanted him to do, but adding in the Unbreakable Vow meant that -- for two reasons now [the UV and the promise to DD] -- he was REALLY locked in to that fate.  The knowledge seemed, to me, to be written on his face before he uttered that last "I will."

Carol responds:
I still haven't seen the film (I know I'm procrastinating like Harry with his homework!), but I agree with your reading of the Unbreakable Vow. Yes, he'd have watched over Draco, anyway, and, yes, both LV and DD expect him to "do the deed," but now he has no escape. He's literally and figuratively *bound* to do it or die. (Bellatrix is not "the binder" for nothing, at least, not in the book, and the imagery of the ropes of fire twisting around their arms, "[binding . . . their clasped arms, like a rope, like a fiery snake" is terrifying (HBP Am. ed. 37). I'm glad that Rickman, at least, understands the significance.

Carol, intending to watch Snape's face and determined not to be sidetracked by bad casting or costuming in that crucial scene
> 
> Siriusly Snapey Susan
>





From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Tue Jul 28 21:06:22 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 21:06:22 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes.
In-Reply-To: <h4nh5n+9hsg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4np8e+5mo0@eGroups.com>

 "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> It's a thank you letter for the birthday present that Sirius
> sent Harry and can't have been written more than a few days
> after Harry's birthday, which we all know is July 31. And 
> she  states that DD "still" has James's Invisibility Cloak,
> so he must have borrowed it sometime in July rather than October.
> Here are his exact words: "You have guessed, I know, why the Cloak > was in my possession on the night your parents died. James 
> had showed it to me *just a few days previously* 
> <snip irrelevant stuff>. I asked to borrow it, to examine it."

OK you're right. Unless Sirius was very late sending his gift or Lilly very late responding with a thank you letter or both, then that is a plot hole. However a plot hole that can be repaired just by changing one or two words doesn't bother me much. For example: just insert the word "close" into the troubling phrase in the book "The Dursleys were Harry's only living relatives" and then all is well. The same sort of thing would prevent the Slytherin seeker from being in his eighth year in PoA.

In my opinion by far the most serious plot hole in the entire series is Harry deciding not to use the Elder Wand, and wise characters who should know better agreeing that it is a smart thing to do; but even that egregious error could be rectified by changing just a couple of dozen words. This is one time where I really hope the movie makers DEPART from the book!

It's not a plot hole but the biggest flaw in the series is Percy turning out to be a good guy after all, what a colossally boring thing to happen. Here we have a great opportunity and it's completely wasted! Why on Earth did JKR invent Percy? What is his purpose in life? I have absolutely no idea.

Imagine if Harry and the gang didn't get dragged off to Malfoy Manor because of some silly slip of the tongue by Harry but because of Percy's treachery. Wonderful dramatic stuff could ensue, including brother on brother homicide. It doesn't get much better than that. But to accomplish that noble goal you'd have to change many thousands of words. If the moviemakers can pull that off then my respect for them would increase about twenty thousand percent. 
 
By the way, the cliffhanger of Harry and friends being lead away in chains to torture and certain death at the Malfoy Manor is the break point between part 1 and part 2 of the DH movie. 

 Eggplant   
  





From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 28 21:23:44 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 17:23:44 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4njdn+kk3v@eGroups.com>
References: <008801ca0f1e$65706260$30512720$@com> <h4njdn+kk3v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <003f01ca0fc9$b017e6c0$1047b440$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol
Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 3:27 PM

Can we let this drop now?




>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

You mean, after you get the last word?

 

:-P

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 28 21:24:57 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 17:24:57 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Fictional plot holes
In-Reply-To: <h4nl1p+5rvr@eGroups.com>
References: <h4njdn+kk3v@eGroups.com> <h4nl1p+5rvr@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <004401ca0fc9$db402e20$91c08a60$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of eggplant107





I don't understand why people write things like that at the END of a long
post; they should write it at the BEGINNING, that way they wouldn't have to
write a long post. 

Eggplant

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

 

LMAO.

 

By putting it at the bottom of a long post you cement your position as
keeper of the last word.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 28 21:40:05 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 17:40:05 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4nmrd+7dgc@eGroups.com>
References: <h4nacs+k3uj@eGroups.com> <h4nmrd+7dgc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <004901ca0fcb$f8d66ba0$ea8342e0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol





Carol, who was also surprised that JKR didn't even know about the "missing
twenty-four hours" and hadn't thought about what DD and Hagrid were doing in
elaborate detail

__._,>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

THERE WAS NO MISSING 24 HOURS. 

 

What I'm not getting is why you think 

:::

Dumbledore is startled out of bed. 

"The Potters where killed 60 seconds ago by What's His Face, " McGonagall
tells him. "Little Harry survived."

"I'll send Hagrid at once to fetch the baby and meet you all at the
Dursely's in 10 minutes."

:::

 

When what makes sense is, the attack happened. Someone heard the
disturbance, reported it. People went to investigate. After all, only Peter
Pedegrew knew where the Potter's lived! Found Harry, contacted Dumbledore,
dispatched Hagrid, tried to figure out what happened, decided that there may
be old-magic protecting the boy, located the Dursely's. Sent owl to Hagrid
"bring Harry at midnight so no one sees us."  Hagrid does not say he came
directly from Godric's Hollow, it's quite likely he was keeping Harry
somewhere else (Hogwarts? His cabin?)

 

After all, no one knew the Potter's lived there but wormtail. It would take
a while to sort out what happened, find the baby, determine who he was and
what to do with him. Why is that so hard to believe?

 

The last thing that book needed in the beginning was more exposition.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Tue Jul 28 21:48:13 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 17:48:13 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Fictional plot holes.
In-Reply-To: <h4np8e+5mo0@eGroups.com>
References: <h4nh5n+9hsg@eGroups.com> <h4np8e+5mo0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <004e01ca0fcd$1bb9bc70$532d3550$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of eggplant107



Imagine if Harry and the gang didn't get dragged off to Malfoy Manor because
of some silly slip of the tongue by Harry but because of Percy's treachery.
Eggplant 



>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Percy was never bad, just blind. He worshiped authority figures all his life
and followed them blindly. Percy didn't think for himself, he let whomever
was in charge do it. In the end he knew his bosses where wrong and his
family was right the entire time, but his pride kept him from coming back
and admitting it. He returns because he knows that since he knows what the
right thing is, it's finally time to do it. 

As for them being dragged to Malfoy Manor, I thought that was just a plot
device to get them there and getting the wands for the rest of the book to
work. 

Percy was just a Republican in a house full of Democrats, but in the end he
decided to switch sides.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 21:56:39 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 21:56:39 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes.
In-Reply-To: <h4np8e+5mo0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ns6n+3sds@eGroups.com>

Eggplant wrote:
> OK you're right. Unless Sirius was very late sending his gift or Lilly very late responding with a thank you letter or both, then that is a plot hole. <snip>

Carol responds:
The problem with that sort of plot hole is that it makes the already problematic matter of a plausible tiem sequence even more problematic. Of course, the movies don't have that problem (not even the "missing twenty-four hours"), so it's probably best not to discuss it here. 

Eggplant: 
> In my opinion by far the most serious plot hole in the entire series is Harry deciding not to use the Elder Wand, and wise characters who should know better agreeing that it is a smart thing to do; but even that egregious error could be rectified by changing just a couple of dozen words. This is one time where I really hope the movie makers DEPART from the book!

Carol:
And I hope they don't! That sort of thinking got Boromir into serious trouble in LOTR. :-) Seriously, though; I wouldn't call it a plot hole. It's not "a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot" (as Wikipedia defines "plot hole": it's just an ending that you as a reader find unsatisfactory (and I find perfectly sensible, in character for Harry and consistent with the themes of the book, in particular the importance of love and self-sacrifice).

Eggplant: 
> It's not a plot hole but the biggest flaw in the series is Percy turning out to be a good guy after all, what a colossally boring thing to happen. Here we have a great opportunity and it's completely wasted! Why on Earth did JKR invent Percy? What is his purpose in life? I have absolutely no idea.

Carol responds:
Again, it's not a plot hole but a personal preference. Now if Wormtail had been welcomed back by the Marauders . . . .

I rather like pompous, wrong-headed Percy though I'd get tired of his talk about the Ministry and cauldron bottoms rather quickly. We see in GoF when he runs into the water to make sure that Ron is safe (looking younger than usual, probably because he's not playing a man twice his age for a change) that he really cares about his family (he also expresses concern for Ginny in CoS, too, which Ron and Harry dismiss but which I think is genuine--no one else even seemed to notice that she was pale and not herself). In OoP, he gets a promotion (after surviving the interrogation regarding Mr. Crouch) and expects his parents to be excited and proud. Instead, Mr. Weasley suggests that they've only hired him to spy on his family (which, IMO, is only partly true--surely, they can't have overlooked his devotion to the Ministry). Naturally, in the face of distrust from his father and antagonism from his brothers, he shouts all the things he's been holding back all those years and storms out, going back to the only place where his talents appear to be appreciated, the Ministry. (I wonder if there's supposed to be a vague parallel with the young Severus rejected by Lily and joining the DEs for acceptance and a hope of achieving his ambitions.) Percy faces the antagonism of his brothers and Ginny when he comes home for Christmas. He's already aware that he's made a big mistake (or several) regarding Voldemort and Umbridge on the one hand and Harry and DD on the other (he shows up for DD's funeral). In the face of real danger to everyone in his family at the Battle of Hogwarts, he swallows his pride and apologizes, and Fred, of all people, readily accepts his apology. The two brothers actually find a moment of cameraderie, fighting and joking side by side, before Fred dies with his laughter on his lips, and we see Percy's anguish at his death. For me, that's one of the most painfully ironic moments in the book (along with Fred and George's "We're identical!" when they're Polyjuiced as Harry, only to have George lose his ear a short time later).

Obviously, no two readers will agree, but I think Percy is important to the motif of family that runs through all the books. In the long run, he overcomes his own pride and joins his family, finally, after all these years, getting his priorities straight (but still the same old Ministry-loving Percy once *it* gets its priorities straight). So you find it boring; I find it moving. (I find Quidditch boring and a waste of paper, but I'm sure that other people love it.)

Eggplant: 
> Imagine if Harry and the gang didn't get dragged off to Malfoy Manor because of some silly slip of the tongue by Harry but because of Percy's treachery. Wonderful dramatic stuff could ensue, including brother on brother homicide. It doesn't get much better than that. But to accomplish that noble goal you'd have to change many thousands of words. If the moviemakers can pull that off then my respect for them would increase about twenty thousand percent. 

Carol:
Somehow, I don't think brother-on-brother homicide quite fits with the themes JKR had in mind (even Sirius and Regulus end up on the same side, though Sirius never knows it, and Aberforth and Albus work together without ever understanding each other. Albus's anguish in the cave shows that he does love Aberforth, and maybe Aberforth understands that at last in the end.) As for the "silly slip of the tongue," I agree that having the name Voldemort suddenly taboo (as if those who feared to speak it were right all along) is a bit of a deus ex machina in reverse. Coincidence at work, anyway--if they hadn't been kidnapped, they'd never have found out that Bellatrix has a Horcrux in her Gringotts vault. (Good coming out of evil once again.)

Eggplant:  
> By the way, the cliffhanger of Harry and friends being lead away in chains to torture and certain death at the Malfoy Manor is the break point between part 1 and part 2 of the DH movie. 

Carol:
Are you sure? (Chains?) I read that the filmmakers had decided to end DH1 with a cliffhanger but no specifics. Do you happen to have a link?

Carol, thanking Eggplant for getting us back onto the topic of films





From charober at sympatico.ca  Tue Jul 28 22:00:41 2009
From: charober at sympatico.ca (charober at sympatico.ca)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 22:00:41 +0000
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: DH: the seven potters
In-Reply-To: <h4n6ic+bkk8@eGroups.com>
References: <h4mvu4+qdtn@eGroups.com> <h4n6ic+bkk8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <SNT111-W1276A6160D5BE94B09E21B3150@phx.gbl>


> > Eggplant107 wrote:
> >
> > In the Seven Potters part of the movie I think it would be interesting if when Harry was embarrassed when the others were changing cloths he had said out loud what JKR tells us was going through his mind, "Hey, treat my body with a little more modesty". 
> > 
> > If Harry had said that, I think it likely Ron or Fred or George or somebody would have said what we were all thinking about our hero at that moment, "I don't see what you're so worried about Harry, you're hung like a horse". 

 

Charlotte:

LOL Eggplant!  (I tried not to laugh too loudly since I'm in the library as I'm reading and writing these!)  Although that line would be a cute cross-reference to Equus!    I could imagine Fred or George saying it, but not Ron.  (Not to mention the other naughty things Fred and George do, can't name any off the top of my head here.)

Montavilla47:
But what if he isn't? Will they have to CGI it?

 

Charlotte:

Um.....but what if that's going too far?  I don't think that scene actually warrants the full monty.  As if all the Equus hype wasn't enough.. not to mention the sexy cropped photos of Dan.... Uh oh, (grabs lamp and bangs her head a la Dobby) Bad Charlotte!  Bad Charlotte!

 

Charlotte, whose new fave movie in the series is HBP







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 22:04:12 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 22:04:12 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <003f01ca0fc9$b017e6c0$1047b440$@com>
Message-ID: <h4nsks+qh9s@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> Can we let this drop now?
md: 
> You mean, after you get the last word?
>
> :-P

Carol again:

Well, yeah. <blush> You and Eggplant figured me out. (BTW, I keep wanting to mention that Eggplant is Aubergine in Britspeak; just thought that was a cool bit of trivia even though it's completely off-topic.)

Carol, who also needs to get her posts back onto topics appropriate to the Movie List





From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 23:26:49 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 23:26:49 -0000
Subject: DH: the seven potters
In-Reply-To: <SNT111-W1276A6160D5BE94B09E21B3150@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <h4o1fp+if57@eGroups.com>


> Charlotte:
> Um.....but what if that's going too far?  I don't think that scene actually warrants the full monty. 

Joann:
Well, Harry is either naked or striped down to underwear three times in the book. I don't think it's necessary for the movie in any of those occasions. I doubt they're going to take the time to see everyone (seven Harry's) turn into Harry in the movie. It only takes a few lines to describe it in the book, but would take time in the movie. They like to get right to the action. I doubt he'll strip to boxers to jump into the water to get the sword. He'll probably lose his coat and shoes, at the most. And at the end (in halfway heaven) I doubt he'll be naked, then magically find a robe or cloak. He'll already be wearing it. 

I guess the best chance we've got is the seven Harry's. It's great in the books to have some humor before the killing starts. Come to think of it, they might leave it in for that reason. Although, there are other ways to make that part funny, with out the stripping.

 
 
> Charlotte, whose new fave movie in the series is HBP

Joann
Me too!! (although least favorite book)




From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Tue Jul 28 23:28:09 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 23:28:09 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4nsks+qh9s@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4o1i9+qpmr@eGroups.com>


> 
> Carol, who also needs to get her posts back onto topics appropriate to the Movie List
>

You'll probably be able to do that much easier once you've actually *seen* the movie, lol.

Joann




From agdisney at msn.com  Wed Jul 29 01:29:57 2009
From: agdisney at msn.com (Andrea Grevera)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 21:29:57 -0400
Subject: No subject
Message-ID: <BLU109-DS641FB5488000F90E5E908CF120@phx.gbl>

va32h:

No one involved in the production of these books or movies - including (hell, especially) Rowling, gave as much thought, consideration or interpretation of this series as the readers did. 

va32h

Andie here,

I've come to the conclusion that there are 2 Harry Potter worlds.

The very specific written world and then the mess they threw together for the films.  To me the films are something so irreverent to the "real" story that if I wasn't so irrated with them I might actually find them funny.  A parody of what the story really is.

I read the books many times, my son and husband have read them once.  I can't get my daughter to read them even with bribery - so she is my "pure" film critic.  She has no idea what is going on in the movie and I won't give her too much info (still trying to get her to read) but for the most part she walks out completely confused.

While sitting thru the movie my hand movements showed how frustrated I was with all the changes and parts that just left you hanging and the parts that were just stupid or left out. Like Harry calmly following anything that Snape told him to do. No funeral.  Nothing that is true to the story.

I enjoyed the first 2 movies because they were kept close to the real story.  I hate the 3rd movie, expecially the ending.  Granted they only show the one Quidditch match but we know there are more during the year - guess Harry flies around on thin air since the broom from Sirius doesn't show up until the very end.  At that point I realized that the films have a life of their own that have nothing to do with the books.

I saw HBP once - I was going to Philadelphia to see it in IMAX but decided I'll use the money that I would "waste" for something extra in Disneyworld.  Our up coming vacation.

I will probably buy the DVD just to have it but my movie loving days are over.

Thanks for letting me rant a bit.



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From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 02:11:13 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 02:11:13 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4na20+vg2i@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ob41+o7un@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "va32h" <va32h at ...> wrote:

> The movie version of Ron certainly comes off that way, but 
> that's because Steve Kloves keeps giving his lines to 
> Hermione 


zanooda:

I noticed that Kloves did it again in HBP (I finally watched it today). In the book Ron is the first to say at the end that they (he and Hermione) will go with Harry looking for the Horcruxes. In the movie it's Hermione, of course, who says that, while Ron is sitting aside all alone. He doesn't even take part in their conversation. Yes, Kloves definitely seems to have something against Ron... :-).




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 02:12:53 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 22:12:53 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie]
In-Reply-To: <BLU109-DS641FB5488000F90E5E908CF120@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU109-DS641FB5488000F90E5E908CF120@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <005b01ca0ff2$148c9420$3da5bc60$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Andrea Grevera




Andie here,

I saw HBP once - I was going to Philadelphia to see it in IMAX but decided
I'll use the money that I would "waste" for something extra in Disneyworld.
Our up coming vacation.

I will probably buy the DVD just to have it but my movie loving days are
over.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

I think they never found a balance between faithfulness to the books and
really exciting cinema.

The first two films where fairly loyal, but the directing was clumsy, Ron
WHINED endlessly in the second one and both ending?s where clumsy. The first
films just didn?t cut it as exciting films. 

The third film was easily the best made FILM. Yes, the cut A LOT out, but,
what was left was coherent, well acted, well directed and exciting to watch.
Take away all knowledge of the book and POA the film is the only film that
really stands alone and completely works.

The fourth film was not a film, it was episodes of Harry Potter. Felt like
watching five 20-minute episodes of the worlds most expensive TV show.

5 & 6 are entertaining, exciting, funny, but they fail the logic test. 

So what have we learned? Longer films that are close to the books would work
if not directed by Christopher Columbus. Shorter films with less book info
would work (but piss-off fanboys and gals) if they really trim it down so
the film has a single, steady focus like POA.

DH will not really work, because half the mysteries are solved by clues from
earlier books that are not in the earlier films!!! 

BUT, if they make DH 5 ? 5 ? hrs total, it will at least be 90% faithful.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com  Wed Jul 29 02:47:38 2009
From: cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com (Cassandra Wladyslava)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 22:47:38 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood 
	Prince
In-Reply-To: <h4nncr+kbqt@eGroups.com>
References: <h4nav5+m5ug@eGroups.com> <h4nncr+kbqt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <d0874c890907281947h71412946ve96e17ae75b4622b@mail.gmail.com>

Carol asks:

But why change a scene that works perfectly well in the books, giving us not
only the HBP's snide advice about shoving a bezoar down their throats and
Harry's "cheek" in presenting a bezoar instead of an antidote, but
(possibly) jogs the viewer's memory as it did Harry's to remind us/him of
Snape's first lesson? <snip> And Harry presenting the Bezoar to Slughorn in
class instead of doing his work could have been a great suspense/comic
moment, too.
Carol, understanding that some cuts and alterations must be made but
thinking that the filmmakers missed the boat (again) on this one

Cassie Responds:

I think the reason they changed it was because they didn't want to have two
full potions lessons in the movie.  It would've seemed too redundant.  I do
agree that they could've presented the information/reminded us about bezoars
in a much clearer way than they did.  Even Harry just reading that little
notation while he's pouring over the HBP's potions book would've sufficed.


~Cassie~


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From va32h at comcast.net  Wed Jul 29 03:03:10 2009
From: va32h at comcast.net (va32h)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 03:03:10 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4ob41+o7un@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4oe5e+frrt@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "zanooda2" <zanooda2 at ...> wrote:
>

> I noticed that Kloves did it again in HBP (I finally watched it today). In the book Ron is the first to say at the end that they (he and Hermione) will go with Harry looking for the Horcruxes. In the movie it's Hermione, of course, who says that, while Ron is sitting aside all alone. He doesn't even take part in their conversation. Yes, Kloves definitely seems to have something against Ron... :-).
>

va32h:

Kloves is obsessed with Emma Watson.  There's a book called "A Star is Made", written by two casting directors. They helped to cast Sorcerer's Stone and were there when the trio auditioned.  In the book they say that Kloves was smitten by Emma Watson from audition day on and said he wanted to write for her forever. 

va32h




From juli17 at aol.com  Wed Jul 29 03:45:25 2009
From: juli17 at aol.com (julie)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 03:45:25 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <004901ca0fcb$f8d66ba0$ea8342e0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4ogkl+bb5r@eGroups.com>

md wrote:
> 
> When what makes sense is, the attack happened. Someone heard the
> disturbance, reported it. People went to investigate. After all, only Peter
> Pedegrew knew where the Potter's lived! Found Harry, contacted Dumbledore,
> dispatched Hagrid, tried to figure out what happened, decided that there may
> be old-magic protecting the boy, located the Dursely's. Sent owl to Hagrid
> "bring Harry at midnight so no one sees us."  Hagrid does not say he came
> directly from Godric's Hollow, it's quite likely he was keeping Harry
> somewhere else (Hogwarts? His cabin?)
> 
>  
> 
> After all, no one knew the Potter's lived there but wormtail. It would take
> a while to sort out what happened, find the baby, determine who he was and
> what to do with him. Why is that so hard to believe?
> 

Julie:
I don't think it is hard to believe; in fact I think those
of us who wondered about the "missing 24 hours" assume this
is pretty much what went on. Of course it may have taken 
some time to figure out what to do with Harry. And logically
Hagrid probably did take him somewhere, as you posit above. 
And, logically, McGonagall arrived at the Dursleys in the
early morning assuming that Hagrid could show up with Harry
at any time, not because she wanted to hang out as a cat 
all day and well into the night in a Muggle neighborhood.

Which is exactly why quite a few fans thought that maybe
the stretch of time was deliberate on JKR's part, and that
she was going to reference the time period in a later book
and reveal something crucial to the story (rather as she
did with Petunia's "That horrid boy!"). The "missing" time
didn't have to be significant of course, and it ultimately
wasn't. What surprised some is that JKR didn't recall the
length of time, and hadn't conceived in her own mind what
went on during that long day and evening while baby Harry
was "enroute" to the Dursleys.

And I don't see pondering the "missing time" as strange.
JKR said before that she wrote out detailed biographies
about minor characters, like Dean Thomas. So it would be
easy for one to assume she might have penned out a more 
detailed timeline of those first hours after Voldemort's
demise, which were also the first hours after baby Harry
was physically marked and nearly killed (was he trapped
in his crib; did someone/s have to dig him out; was he 
treated, or at least checked over at St Mungo's; and so
on). 

Really, I don't think anyone is on a different page here.
Clearly some time elapsed from Harry being orphaned before
midnight on Oct 31st and being left at the Durlsey's 
doorstep before midnight on Nov 1st. The difference is 
whether we pondered some possible significance of that
elapsed time, or didn't give it a second thought. 

Julie 





From juli17 at aol.com  Wed Jul 29 03:51:48 2009
From: juli17 at aol.com (julie)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 03:51:48 -0000
Subject: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4oe5e+frrt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4oh0k+hl89@eGroups.com>


>
> --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "zanooda2" <zanooda2@> wrote:
> >
> 
> > I noticed that Kloves did it again in HBP (I finally watched it today). In the book Ron is the first to say at the end that they (he and Hermione) will go with Harry looking for the Horcruxes. In the movie it's Hermione, of course, who says that, while Ron is sitting aside all alone. He doesn't even take part in their conversation. Yes, Kloves definitely seems to have something against Ron... :-).
> >
> 
> va32h:
> 
> Kloves is obsessed with Emma Watson.  There's a book called "A Star is Made", written by two casting directors. They helped to cast Sorcerer's Stone and were there when the trio auditioned.  In the book they say that Kloves was smitten by Emma Watson from audition day on and said he wanted to write for her forever. 
> 

Julie:
Is it me, or is that just a little bit creepy?






From siskiou at gmail.com  Wed Jul 29 04:04:17 2009
From: siskiou at gmail.com (Susanne)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 21:04:17 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4oh0k+hl89@eGroups.com>
References: <h4oe5e+frrt@eGroups.com> <h4oh0k+hl89@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <130490216.20090728210417@gmail.com>



Hi,

Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 8:51:48 PM, juli17 at aol.com wrote:

> Julie:
> Is it me, or is that just a little bit creepy?

No, it's not just you, and in the third movie, in
combination with a certain director, it  became
almost embarrassing to watch.

-- 
 
Best regards,
 Susanne                           mailto:siskiou at gmail.com




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 04:09:15 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 00:09:15 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4ogkl+bb5r@eGroups.com>
References: <004901ca0fcb$f8d66ba0$ea8342e0$@com> <h4ogkl+bb5r@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000f01ca1002$5629f610$027de230$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of julie





And I don't see pondering the "missing time" as strange.

Julie 

//////////////////////////

 

Pondering is fine, it was the complaining I didn't grasp.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 04:13:53 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 00:13:53 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance  (was HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoile
In-Reply-To: <h4oh0k+hl89@eGroups.com>
References: <h4oe5e+frrt@eGroups.com> <h4oh0k+hl89@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001401ca1002$fc36f6c0$f4a4e440$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of julie


Julie:
Is it me, or is that just a little bit creepy?

/////////////////////////

I was naturally taken by her (I have two little girls, so I have a soft spot
- and actually my oldest is now the same age as Watson in HP1) she was cute
then, hot now (yes, I'm still a normal male.) 

 

I think having a soft spot for a little girl can be a very natural thing for
man, I can't tell you how defensive I feel towards not only my daughters,
but their friends. During my daughters 7th birthday party they were
listening to Kelly Clarkson, saddening, after life 15 minutes, 10 little
girls started singing "since you've been gone" at the top of their longs in
sync - just got to love little girls. 

 

In a completely innocent, decent way.

 

Really, most of the time, it's not creepy.

 

md 

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 05:08:29 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 05:08:29 -0000
Subject: Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4oh0k+hl89@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4olgd+oiko@eGroups.com>

> > va32h:
> > 
> > Kloves is obsessed with Emma Watson.  There's a book called "A Star is Made", written by two casting directors. They helped to cast Sorcerer's Stone and were there when the trio auditioned.  In the book they say that Kloves was smitten by Emma Watson from audition day on and said he wanted to write for her forever. 
> > 
> 
> Julie:
> Is it me, or is that just a little bit creepy?
>


Richard:

Well, it sounds a little odd, but I am hoping he is not actually creepy about it.  Emma was an adorable little girl, and obviously really bright and precocious.  And she is a GORGEOUS young woman, and certainly just as bright and charming.  I remember one of the interviews where Rupert was asked about having a "crush" on Emma.  His answer was basically, "Well yeah.  Everyone is crazy about Emma." (paraphrased of course :))

It's just too bad for the Ron character.  It does seem that any time Hermione gets a little extra screen time or nifty lines, they are at the expense of Ron.  




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 05:20:58 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 05:20:58 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4ob41+o7un@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4om7q+lqa0@eGroups.com>

> > va32h wrote:
> >
> > The movie version of Ron certainly comes off that way, but 
> > that's because Steve Kloves keeps giving his lines to 
> > Hermione 
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> I noticed that Kloves did it again in HBP (I finally watched it today). In the book Ron is the first to say at the end that they (he and Hermione) will go with Harry looking for the Horcruxes. In the movie it's Hermione, of course, who says that, while Ron is sitting aside all alone. He doesn't even take part in their conversation. Yes, Kloves definitely seems to have something against Ron... :-).
>


Richard: 

I'm almost done rereading HBP, and will then begin fresh with PS to reread the whole series.  Maybe I will see more of this stuff when the books are fresher in my mind, but I certainly didn't feel that Ron was shafted that badly in favor of Hermione in the movies.  Of course Hermione is probably my favorite character and Emma is fun to watch so I might be a poor observer :)  

I am very happy that my little princess is a Hermione-ish kind of girl :)





From lizzy1933 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 06:12:16 2009
From: lizzy1933 at yahoo.com (Lizzie Mae Lilly)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 06:12:16 -0000
Subject: DH: the seven potters
In-Reply-To: <015f01ca0fb7$e55c1750$b01445f0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4op80+7sj0@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:
>
> 
> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of montavilla47 
> 
> Montavilla47:
> But what if he isn't? Will they have to CGI it?
> 
> Um.
>  
> If you really want to know..
>
> Well..
>  
> Google image search Dan Radcliffe with filters off.
> 
> md
> 

If it's the photo I'm thinking of, don't bother:  it's photoshopped.

Lizzie




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 07:13:17 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 03:13:17 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: DH: the seven potters
In-Reply-To: <h4op80+7sj0@eGroups.com>
References: <015f01ca0fb7$e55c1750$b01445f0$@com> <h4op80+7sj0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000401ca101c$0bc7c290$235747b0$@com>



If it's the photo I'm thinking of, don't bother: it's photoshopped.

Lizzie



???????????????????????????

 

Yeah. no.

 

I won't post the link here. Check your off-list mail.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul 29 12:22:00 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 12:22:00 -0000
Subject: Narcissa's hair (HP&HBP spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4no6c+fifk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4pet8+5l1v@eGroups.com>

SSS wrote:
> > I never thought Snape was swayed by her beauty, either.  
 
Carol responded:
> Well, maybe not by her beauty but by her desperation and her 
> helplessness. He treats her (in contrast to Bellatrix) in a 
> surprisingly gentlemanly manner throughout, and surely, he's 
> reminded of Lily dying to save her son--and of his own desperate 
> desire to save Lily. He's in the position of Dumbledore now, and 
> unlike Dumbledore, he asks nothing in return.

SSSusan:
Right, and I'm responding to this specifically as the actress portrayed it/Kloves wrote it/Yates directed it in the film.  In the book, Narcissa would have tugged on many people's heartstrings.  We just did not see that frantic, near-hysterical, desperate mother worried for her son's very life in this performance.


SSS: 
> > What I objected to in this scene -- besides the skunk hair -- was > > that Narcissa was supposed to be crying, begging, pleading, on 
> > her *knees* imploring Snape.  Instead, we saw someone who was, 
> > other than tears rimming her eyes, a pretty cool cucumber. 
 
Carol:
> Another actor/actress who hasn't read the book, I guess. Why go to > Snape for help if she's not desperate? 

SSSusan:
I blame the actress for very little of it.  If she wasn't getting it/doing it right, it's the director's responsibility to make sure she does.  Perhaps it went back to Kloves, though, and the way he described the scene to the actress.

Siriusly Snapey Susan





From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul 29 12:27:35 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 12:27:35 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <004901ca0fcb$f8d66ba0$ea8342e0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4pf7n+10tcf@eGroups.com>

md:
> THERE WAS NO MISSING 24 HOURS. 

SSSusan:
>From your POV, yes, but that's an opinion, not a fact.

md:
> What I'm not getting is why you think 
> 
> :::
> 
> Dumbledore is startled out of bed. 
> 
> "The Potters where killed 60 seconds ago by What's His Face, " McGonagall
> tells him. "Little Harry survived."
> 
> "I'll send Hagrid at once to fetch the baby and meet you all at the
> Dursely's in 10 minutes."
> 
> :::
> 
>  
> 
> When what makes sense is, the attack happened. Someone heard the
> disturbance, reported it. People went to investigate. After all, 
> only Peter Pedegrew knew where the Potter's lived! 

SSSusan:
Totally disagree.  While no one besides Peter knew where they were HIDING, DD most definitely knew the Potters' home was in Godric's Hollow.  *He* lived in GH, too.

And, as I mentioned yesterday, once James & Lily were dead, the Fidelius Charm broke.  At that point, it didn't matter that no one besides Peter had known, because it was instantly clear for anyone to see.  I suspect DD had mechanisms in place for being on the alert if the FC was broken, or perhaps having Order members keeping an eye on possible Potter hideouts.

Siriusly Snapey Susan





From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul 29 12:54:38 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 12:54:38 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4om7q+lqa0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4pgqe+bb4d@eGroups.com>

Richard: 
> I'm almost done rereading HBP, and will then begin fresh with PS to reread the whole series.  Maybe I will see more of this stuff when the books are fresher in my mind, but I certainly didn't feel that Ron was shafted that badly in favor of Hermione in the movies.  Of course Hermione is probably my favorite character and Emma is fun to watch so I might be a poor observer :)  


SSSusan:
When you get to POA in your re-read, Richard, be sure to watch the movie just after.  I think you'll see what folks are saying then.  
Truly, Kloves gave all kinds of stuff to Hermione that belonged to Ron **and** to Harry.  The worst of which, from my perspective, was in the Shrieking Shack, when Hermione yells, "If you want to kill Harry, you'll have to kill us, too!"  That was RON'S line in the book, and there was absolutely no reason to give it to Hermione -- Ron was right there!  

The other thing about PoA is the time-turning sequence.  In the book, Hermione is actually a little befuddled and uncertain at times (something I **loved,** btw, since I love when she comes across as human!), and Harry was actually the one to make most of the decisions and determine their actions.  In the movie, Kloves & Cuaron had her take the lead in it all.  Sigh.  Thus, the Super!Hermione moniker one often sees when people are talking about Hermione as written by Kloves.

Siriusly Snapey Susan





From dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 14:34:36 2009
From: dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com (dumbledore11214)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 14:34:36 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4pgqe+bb4d@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4pmls+g55t@eGroups.com>

> SSSusan:
> When you get to POA in your re-read, Richard, be sure to watch the movie just after.  I think you'll see what folks are saying then.  
> Truly, Kloves gave all kinds of stuff to Hermione that belonged to Ron **and** to Harry.  The worst of which, from my perspective, was in the Shrieking Shack, when Hermione yells, "If you want to kill Harry, you'll have to kill us, too!"  That was RON'S line in the book, and there was absolutely no reason to give it to Hermione -- Ron was right there!  <SNIP>

Alla:

Hated, hated HATED that change. Ron does not get too many chances to shine in the movies as is and Kloves robbed his character of the line  that so effectively shows his devotion to Harry.

And remember **Hermione** of all people explaining what mudblood is in CoS? GRRRRR. Yeah, she is Hermione, she knows everything I got it, could we please see sometimes that Ron who grew up in this world knows some things that she does not?

Sigh.





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 15:41:08 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:41:08 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4pmls+g55t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4pqik+u030@eGroups.com>

> Alla:
> 
> And remember **Hermione** of all people explaining what mudblood is in CoS? GRRRRR. Yeah, she is Hermione, she knows everything I got it, could we please see sometimes that Ron who grew up in this world knows some things that she does not?
> 


Richard:

Oh, I remember that one.  I just watched Chamber of Secrets twice with the kids during the TV marathons in honor of HBP.  Even though I didn't actually remember how that scene went in the book, having Hermione explain a derogatory slang term in the same way she recites textbook definitions of spells didn't seem right.  At least they did change it completely and have Ron not know what it meant :)  





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 15:48:41 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:48:41 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4pgqe+bb4d@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4pr0p+4l1i@eGroups.com>

> Richard: 
> > I'm almost done rereading HBP, and will then begin fresh with PS to reread the whole series.  Maybe I will see more of this stuff when the books are fresher in my mind, but I certainly didn't feel that Ron was shafted that badly in favor of Hermione in the movies.  Of course Hermione is probably my favorite character and Emma is fun to watch so I might be a poor observer :)  
> > 
> 
> SSSusan:
> When you get to POA in your re-read, Richard, be sure to watch the movie just after.  I think you'll see what folks are saying then.  
> Truly, Kloves gave all kinds of stuff to Hermione that belonged to Ron **and** to Harry.  The worst of which, from my perspective, was in the Shrieking Shack, when Hermione yells, "If you want to kill Harry, you'll have to kill us, too!"  That was RON'S line in the book, and there was absolutely no reason to give it to Hermione -- Ron was right there!  
> 
> The other thing about PoA is the time-turning sequence.  In the book, Hermione is actually a little befuddled and uncertain at times (something I **loved,** btw, since I love when she comes across as human!), and Harry was actually the one to make most of the decisions and determine their actions.  In the movie, Kloves & Cuaron had her take the lead in it all.  Sigh.  Thus, the Super!Hermione moniker one often sees when people are talking about Hermione as written by Kloves.
> 


Richard:

Thanks for the heads-up Susan.  I might try watching the film version after I finish each book to maximize my analysis.  That would annoy my wife since we have watched the first three a million times with my daugher, but it's for a good cause :)  

If I am not mistaken, Emma is supposed to be a big fan of the books.  How do you think she feels about Hermione being unnecessarily superfied in the movies?  






From eggplant107 at hotmail.com  Wed Jul 29 16:20:55 2009
From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 16:20:55 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes.
In-Reply-To: <h4ns6n+3sds@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4pst7+8g8p@eGroups.com>

Me: 
>> In my opinion by far the most serious plot hole in the entire >>series is Harry deciding not to use the Elder Wand, and wise >>characters who should know better agreeing that it is a smart thing >>to do; but even that egregious error could be rectified by changing >>a couple of dozen words. This is one time where I really hope the >>movie makers DEPART from the book!

Carol:
> And I hope they don't! That sort of thinking got
> Boromir into serious trouble in LOTR. 

And being Master of the Elder Wand could cause Harry trouble too, but it can't be helped. Besides, an author is not obligated to make her characters happy, her only obligation is to make them interesting. That's why I hope that in the very last scene of the 8 movies they have Harry limping or having a bad hand or something to indicate that the last 19 years haven't been totally uneventful. I wonder if Harry was right and if Aurors live long enough they all start to look like Mad Eye. 

>  It's not "a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that
> goes against the flow of logic

I think a flaw I logic is exactly what renouncing the use of but remaining the Master of the Elder Wand is. Logically it's ridiculous and artistically it's a clich?. And this isn't some small inconsistency in the timeline that really doesn't matter very much, this will profoundly effect Harry's entire future so it's important that it make some sense. The moviemakers could correct that flaw easily and improve on JKR.
   
> I don't think brother-on-brother homicide quite fits
> with the themes JKR had in mind

But what JKR is describing in her last book is a civil war, and in wars of that sort brothers sometimes end up on different sides. I really think that's what she originally intended to do because she set up everything beautifully for it, but then for some reason she lost her nerve. 

We don't need another good Weasley so if the moviemakers don't have the guts to turn Percy evil (they probably don't) then, as he serves no earthly purpose, he should just be ignored. It wouldn't be hard; Percy hasn't even been mentioned much less seen in the last 2 films. 
 
Me:
>>By the way, the cliffhanger of Harry and friends being lead away in >>chains to torture and certain death at the Malfoy Manor is the >>break point between part 1 and part 2 of the DH movie.

Carol:
>Are you sure? (Chains?) I read that the filmmakers had decided to >end DH1 with a cliffhanger but no specifics. Do you happen to have
>a link? 

It was in a magazine interview with David Yates, I read it in a bookshop and didn't buy the magazine. He mentioned it casually as an aside and I think he might have slipped up because I later heard the move company was trying to keep the break point secret.

 Eggplant 





From d2dmiles at yahoo.de  Wed Jul 29 16:27:38 2009
From: d2dmiles at yahoo.de (Miles)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 18:27:38 +0200
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
References: <h4pgqe+bb4d@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3C80813FB8D9473CA1903900C924690F@miles>


> SSSusan:
> When you get to POA in your re-read, Richard, be sure to watch the
> movie just after.  I think you'll see what folks are saying then.
> Truly, Kloves gave all kinds of stuff to Hermione that belonged to
> Ron **and** to Harry.  The worst of which, from my perspective, was
> in the Shrieking Shack, when Hermione yells, "If you want to kill
> Harry, you'll have to kill us, too!"  That was RON'S line in the
> book, and there was absolutely no reason to give it to Hermione --
> Ron was right there!

Miles
I agree that this "character shaping" in the films is annoying. But it's 
just a consequence of the business, and the way the Potter films are made.
The films are no works of art. There's no intention to add depth to the 
story. The films are to entertain people, especially young people/kids. They 
are to be consumable without any stomach trouble, people shouldn't go home 
thinking too much.
Thus, the characters we know from the books are simplified. Hermione is the 
intellectual leader of the Trio. She knows everything, she is energetic, she 
solves the problems that can be solved by thinking or reading. Harry is the 
leader in action. He acts before thinking, he is charismatic and people look 
for him for leadership. Harry is essentially good and cares for "his" 
people. And Ron - Ron is the comedy sidekick.

To give Harry too much doubt, intelligent ideas or too much ckumsiness would 
add some depth to his character, but would make him less recognisable for 
the visitor in the theatres that are no Harry Potter experts. Hermione can't 
be helpless how to find fire for devil's snare in the PS stone, and Ron 
can't tell her what do do - the clear differences between the characters 
would be blurred too much (bad enough Ron has to play the chess game!).

Maybe one reason is that even the very simple characterisation of the Trio 
was barely feasible for the three young actors - I think they all improved 
very much, but none of them was another Haley Joel Osment when they started.

Miles 





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 17:59:07 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:59:07 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes (was:  The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4o1i9+qpmr@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4q2lb+kg34@eGroups.com>

Carol, who also needs to get her posts back onto topics appropriate to the Movie List
> >
> 
> You'll probably be able to do that much easier once you've actually *seen* the movie, lol.
> 
> Joann
>
Carol responds:

This weekend, maybe? I'm trying to gather my courage *and* my powers of persuasion to convince a certain person to watch it with me.

Carol, who will probably be watching the audience almost as much as the film to see whether the "get" it




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 18:10:30 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 18:10:30 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <d0874c890907281947h71412946ve96e17ae75b4622b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <h4q3am+bm99@eGroups.com>

Cassie wrote:
> 
> I think the reason they changed it was because they didn't want to have two full potions lessons in the movie.  It would've seemed too redundant.  I do agree that they could've presented the information/reminded us about bezoars in a much clearer way than they did.  Even Harry just reading that little notation while he's pouring over the HBP's potions book would've sufficed.

Carol responds:

Two full Potions lessons would take either two hours or four, if it's double Potions! I see nothing wrong with parts of two Potions lessons, just enough to show why Harry is failing to comprehend the lesson and resorts to the bezoar (even if they let out the flashback to Snape's first lesson, which would take, oh, fifteen seconds). But imagine the reaction of the film audience to the scrawled words "Just shove a Bezoar down his throat." Wouldn't that arouse their curiosity about the identity of the eponymous HBP and makes Snape's revelation at the end of the story a little less anticlimactic?

BTW, does Harry use any of the Prince's spells besides Sectumsempra (toenail hex, Langlock, Levicorpus, Muffliato)? Or does he just suddenly, out of nowhere, use Sectumsempra?

Carol, hoping that the Prince's spells are at least *mentioned*
>





From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 18:16:59 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 14:16:59 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4pf7n+10tcf@eGroups.com>
References: <004901ca0fcb$f8d66ba0$ea8342e0$@com> <h4pf7n+10tcf@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <009001ca1078$c3dcae20$4b960a60$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of cubfanbudwoman
Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2009 8:28 AM
To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance

 

  

md:
> THERE WAS NO MISSING 24 HOURS. 

SSSusan:
>From your POV, yes, but that's an opinion, not a fact.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

That's not even a logical argument. 

You can say there's 21 hours of time in which JKR doesn't tell us what
happened, but you can't say whether or not 21 hrs is missing is an opinion. 

My point is this, it is a fact that no time is missing, it's only that JKR
didn't explain what happened or why it happened. That's not an opinion,
that's a fact, and it's not from my POV, that's nonsense. 

What's happening here is that some readers are saying that because events
are not explained that's the same as JKR simply having a mind-fart and not
realizing that21hrs disappeared. That's not the case at all, it's not my POV
and it's not an opinion. When we read books we do not get minute-by-minute
explanations, and often, days, months, years go by in books without
explanation of what happened. The fact that the  author choose not to write
what happened does not mean she forgot those moments, or that she left the
reader high-and-dry, only that the events in the story begin for Harry when
he shows up at the Dursely's. It's an entire chapter, an entire different
beginning of the book to explain the 21 hrs from his parents murder until he
arrives at the Dursely's. 

THERE IS NO MISSING HOURS. 

Not an opinion, a fact.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 18:23:35 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 14:23:35 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Fictional plot holes.
In-Reply-To: <h4pst7+8g8p@eGroups.com>
References: <h4ns6n+3sds@eGroups.com> <h4pst7+8g8p@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <009e01ca1079$afd99540$0f8cbfc0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of eggplant107




But what JKR is describing in her last book is a civil war, and in wars of
that sort brothers sometimes end up on different sides. I really think
that's what she originally intended to do because she set up everything
beautifully for it, but then for some reason she lost her nerve. 

We don't need another good Weasley so if the moviemakers don't have the guts
to turn Percy evil (they probably don't) then, as he serves no earthly
purpose, he should just be ignored. It wouldn't be hard; Percy hasn't even
been mentioned much less seen in the last 2 films. 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Percy was not on Voldy's side, EV ER!!! He was on the ministry side as to
not accepting Voldy had returned. Once the ministry conceded Voldy had come
back Percy knew he was wrong, and when the big battle came to be, he came
back to his family.

This is not the Civil War! You might also read some history before evoking
the Civil War and know that most of the brother-killing-brother was due to
South forcing men to fight not so-much as "me and Tom just see things
different, so I put a musket in his eye on the battle field."

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 18:25:11 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 18:25:11 -0000
Subject: Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4olgd+oiko@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4q467+qfvp@eGroups.com>

Richard:
> 
> Well, it sounds a little odd, but I am hoping he is not actually creepy about it.  Emma was an adorable little girl, and obviously really bright and precocious.  And she is a GORGEOUS young woman, and certainly just as bright and charming.  I remember one of the interviews where Rupert was asked about having a "crush" on Emma.  His answer was basically, "Well yeah.  Everyone is crazy about Emma." (paraphrased of course :))
> 
> It's just too bad for the Ron character.  It does seem that any time Hermione gets a little extra screen time or nifty lines, they are at the expense of Ron.
>
Carol responds:

Fortunately for Rupert, they haven't assigned Hermione to play Keeper or snog Lavender Brown! (Granted, neither scene involves speaking lines, but at least he gets screen time.) And, oh, yes, he gets to eat the love-potion-filled chocolates and declare his love for Romilda Vane. (I've seen clips and trailers.) Don't know whether she's assigned any of his lines; in the book, Hermione and Ron aren't speaking half the time, and the rest of the time, their lines aren't really interchangeable. No heroics to assign to her, either, at a guess--their battle with the DEs, left out of the film, is offpage.

Carol, who is definitely not "crazy about Emma"




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 18:27:10 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 14:27:10 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <h4q3am+bm99@eGroups.com>
References: <d0874c890907281947h71412946ve96e17ae75b4622b@mail.gmail.com> <h4q3am+bm99@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <00a301ca107a$2fb31340$8f1939c0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol




BTW, does Harry use any of the Prince's spells besides Sectumsempra (toenail
hex, Langlock, Levicorpus, Muffliato)? Or does he just suddenly, out of
nowhere, use Sectumsempra?

Carol, hoping that the Prince's spells are at least *mentioned*
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

He only uses Sectumsempra, but he reads it in the book on-screen, he doesn't
just pull it out of know where. They Levicorpus was filmed, but I don't
recall it in the film, I saw it in still photos at some point in the last
year. What I do recall was a perfect moment for Levicorpus, I was even
thinking, oh, here it comes, then nothing. I have to see the film again,
though, I don't recall all the details that well after one viewing.

 

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From siskiou at gmail.com  Wed Jul 29 18:45:45 2009
From: siskiou at gmail.com (Susanne)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 11:45:45 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4pr0p+4l1i@eGroups.com>
References: <h4pgqe+bb4d@eGroups.com> <h4pr0p+4l1i@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <14166368.20090729114545@gmail.com>



Hi,

Wednesday, July 29, 2009, 8:48:41 AM, shepardrj at yahoo.com wrote:

> If I am not mistaken, Emma is supposed to be a
> big fan of the books.  How do you think she
> feels about Hermione being unnecessarily
> superfied in the movies?  

IIRC, she enjoyed the "girl power" aspect.
I'm sure it didn't hurt her pocket-book, either.

I think the actors have been a little "corrupted"
in their view of the characters. It comes along
with the job, I suppose, but Rupert seems to
believe that Ron is a wimp, and even JKR's Ron has
changed a bit from the original in the last couple
of books, after the movies came along (imo).

-- 
 
Best regards,
 Susanne                           mailto:siskiou at gmail.com




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 18:49:15 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 18:49:15 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes.
In-Reply-To: <h4pst7+8g8p@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4q5jb+cai2@eGroups.com>

Eggplant wrote:

Percy hasn't even been mentioned much less seen in the last 2 films.

Carol responds:
They did leave him out of GoF, IIRC, because they wanted to simplify the Barty Crouch plot. They didn't have Mr. Crouch Imperio'd or (supposedly) prowling around Snape's office, for example, so there was no need to bring in Percy to take his place at the Yule Ball and the Second Task. I don't remember whether he was present as court scribe at Harry's hearing in OoP, but he was definitely present with Fudge, Umbridge, Kingsley Shacklebolt, and the Auror who keeps getting Confunded in DH (his name escapes me) in the scene where Dumbledore tells them he's not planning to "go quietly" and escapes by summoning Fawkes. (He wouldn't be in the HBP film since they've also left out Scrimgeour, but I see no reason not to bring him back for DH. I know you disagree, but I think the scene with Fred and Percy just before and after Fred dies will leave half the audience in tears.
  
> Me (you = Eggplant):
> >>By the way, the cliffhanger of Harry and friends being lead away in >>chains to torture and certain death at the Malfoy Manor is the >>break point between part 1 and part 2 of the DH movie.
> 
Carol earlier:
> >Are you sure? (Chains?) I read that the filmmakers had decided to >end DH1 with a cliffhanger but no specifics. Do you happen to have
> >a link? 
 
> It was in a magazine interview with David Yates, I read it in a bookshop and didn't buy the magazine. He mentioned it casually as an aside and I think he might have slipped up because I later heard the move company was trying to keep the break point secret.

Carol again:

Thanks. I can't imagine chains--conjured ropes as in the book would be better. But I think they're still keeping the breaking point secret.

Can anyone think of any other cliffhangers? How about Bellatrix hurling that silver knife at Dobby? Or Harry and Ron discovering Luna and Ollivander in the Malfoy's basement? I really can't see breaking it at that early point, though, if they want to keep the focus of the "epic" final film on the battle of Hogwarts.

Another possibility would be leaving them facing the Goblins and the still-chained dragon in Gringotts or having Harry or having them Apparate to Hogsmeade under the Invisibility Cloak only to set off an alarm that alerts the DEs. I like that last possibility. An earlier break, especially when they're captured by Snatchers, leaves too little action for DH1 and too much for DH2. Just my opinion.

Carol, hoping that the article was wrong





From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 18:56:35 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 18:56:35 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes.
In-Reply-To: <h4q5jb+cai2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4q613+oqki@eGroups.com>

Carol, revising a post:

Sorry. I forgot to attribute this quote to Eggplant:

Eggplant (not Carol):
> > It was in a magazine interview with David Yates, I read it in a bookshop and didn't buy the magazine. He mentioned it casually as an aside and I think he might have slipped up because I later heard the move company was trying to keep the break point secret.

Carol, hoping that the missing attribution didn't make the post hard to follow




From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul 29 19:10:25 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 19:10:25 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <009001ca1078$c3dcae20$4b960a60$@com>
Message-ID: <h4q6r1+v1a5@eGroups.com>

md:
> > THERE WAS NO MISSING 24 HOURS. 
 
SSSusan:
> From your POV, yes, but that's an opinion, not a fact.

md:
> That's not even a logical argument. 
> 
> You can say there's 21 hours of time in which JKR doesn't tell us 
> what happened, but you can't say whether or not 21 hrs is missing 
> is an opinion. 
> 
> My point is this, it is a fact that no time is missing, it's only 
> that JKR didn't explain what happened or why it happened. That's 
> not an opinion, that's a fact, and it's not from my POV, that's 
> nonsense. 
> 
> What's happening here is that some readers are saying that because 
> events are not explained that's the same as JKR simply having a 
> mind-fart and not realizing that21hrs disappeared. That's not the 
> case at all, it's not my POV and it's not an opinion. When we read 
> books we do not get minute-by-minute explanations, and often, days, 
> months, years go by in books without explanation of what happened. 
> The fact that the  author choose not to write what happened does 
> not mean she forgot those moments, or that she left the reader high-
> and-dry, only that the events in the story begin for Harry when
> he shows up at the Dursely's. It's an entire chapter, an entire 
> different beginning of the book to explain the 21 hrs from his 
> parents murder until he arrives at the Dursely's. 
> 
> THERE IS NO MISSING HOURS. 
> 
> Not an opinion, a fact.
> 

SSSusan:
md, we're talking semantics on the word "missing" here, it seems to me, not really having a substantive disagreement.  

I'm just saying that there is a long history of people who've been part of the HPfGU universe for years who liked to have fun with theories and what ifs and I wonder if it could bes.  One of those areas where many people had fun was the "missing 24 hours."  The group members *called* it that, which is why it came up over here with that phrase.  

A similar example was the Droobles wrappers that Neville's mom gave him each time he visited them at St. Mungo's.  A lot of people thought there was significance to that and developed some fun & elaborate theories about what that might be.  Turned out they were wrong and, to paraphrase Herself, "It was only ever a mouth organ."

So those are two examples of things that folks in the fandom who were awaiting future installments in the series thought might be significant but found out *weren't* for JKR.  *I* wasn't criticizing her for NOT having made "the missing 24 hours" or "the Droobles wrappers" into something significant; it was just a bummer to find that they weren't.  And then, yes, a SURPRISE that, in the case of the 24 hours, she hadn't thought about how or why fans would've been considering that possibility.  

You are right, of course, that all kinds of things happen off page and yet aren't "missing" in the true sense of the word -- although, lol, you wouldn't believe the discussions that have happened over whether these kids ever shower or brush their teeth [after all, it's never shown or talked about!].  

What I reacted to -- and called your opinion -- is that I read your previous comments as saying, AS ABSOLUTE FACT, that there is no way those hours were missing, as in there was no reason in the world to consider that they might contain something mysterious or significant.  And I was trying to point out why, for many people, it was quite reasonable to think that there was!  They were left unexplained, and it seemed like a goodly chunk of time to a lot of us [that's where the opinion comes in, to me], so it wasn't weird or crazy to have thought there might be some clues there in a series which, at many levels, was a mystery.

Siriusly Snapey Susan,
who doesn't mind having her position challenged or questioned, especially when we're trying to figure out if we're talking about things in the same or different way, but who'd appreciate not having her words called "nonsense"





From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 19:41:49 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:41:49 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4q6r1+v1a5@eGroups.com>
References: <009001ca1078$c3dcae20$4b960a60$@com> <h4q6r1+v1a5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001201ca1084$9d6bb6d0$d8432470$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of cubfanbudwoman




What I reacted to -- and called your opinion -- is that I read your previous
comments as saying, AS ABSOLUTE FACT, that there is no way those hours were
missing, as in there was no reason in the world to consider that they might
contain something mysterious or significant. And I was trying to point out
why, for many people, it was quite reasonable to think that there was! They
were left unexplained, and it seemed like a goodly chunk of time to a lot of
us [that's where the opinion comes in, to me], so it wasn't weird or crazy
to have thought there might be some clues there in a series which, at many
levels, was a mystery.

Siriusly Snapey Susan,
who doesn't mind having her position challenged or questioned, especially
when we're trying to figure out if we're talking about things in the same or
different way, but who'd appreciate not having her words called "nonsense"

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Well, there is no way those hours are "missing" they are simply not covered
in the book. My OPINION is no such thing, it's an ABSOLUTE FACT. Sorry, but
I teach English, I teach reading, those hours are not missing. To classify
them as such there would have to be an instance of two events occurring
directly after each other but the times or dates being out-of-sync with the
amount of time it should take. 

 

For example, had she written "I grabbed him right after it happened and flew
him directly here" yet there was 21 hrs between the two events, then there's
missing hours, now there's something to go, wtf about. 

 

If people are going to argue how the book is writing with language that does
not match their argument, then that is nonsense. It would be like saying
"you don't talk so good."

 

md 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 20:36:03 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 20:36:03 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <3C80813FB8D9473CA1903900C924690F@miles>
Message-ID: <h4qbrj+cggj@eGroups.com>


> Miles

> Thus, the characters we know from the books are simplified. Hermione is the 
> intellectual leader of the Trio. She knows everything, she is energetic, she 
> solves the problems that can be solved by thinking or reading. Harry is the 
> leader in action.

Joann:
I agree, which is why Hermione in PoA bugs me so much. Her picking up Harry and throwing him down the hole in the Whomping Willow and her telling Harry (Harry!) to run when Lupinwolf was coming after them (then Harry falling down and her helping him up). This was way out of character, even by the movies standards.  





From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 20:45:05 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 20:45:05 -0000
Subject: Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4q467+qfvp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4qcch+h6hq@eGroups.com>


> >
> Carol responds:
> 
> Fortunately for Rupert, they haven't assigned Hermione to play Keeper or snog Lavender Brown! (Granted, neither scene involves speaking lines, but at least he gets screen time.) And, oh, yes, he gets to eat the love-potion-filled chocolates and declare his love for Romilda Vane. (I've seen clips and trailers.) Don't know whether she's assigned any of his lines; in the book, Hermione and Ron aren't speaking half the time, and the rest of the time, their lines aren't really interchangeable. No heroics to assign to her, either, at a guess--their battle with the DEs, left out of the film, is offpage.
> 
> Carol, who is definitely not "crazy about Emma"
>

Joann:
The only time it was really evident to me was the very last scene. Harry and Hermione are talking abut Draco, Snape, the locket and Harry not coming back to school. You think Ron isn't even there. Then they show him sitting down on some stairs and watching them. Then Hermione says 'they" are going with him, that he needs "them". I don't think Ron ever says one word. The last shot Ron gets up to watch Fawkes fly away with them. 

I really didn't understand the thought process that the filmmakers used to make Ron seem like an outsider. Even with him not joining in the conversation, why have him so physically separate?!
  




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 20:53:15 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 16:53:15 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4qcch+h6hq@eGroups.com>
References: <h4q467+qfvp@eGroups.com> <h4qcch+h6hq@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000601ca108e$9840bb60$c8c23220$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of coolbeans3131

I really didn't understand the thought process that the filmmakers used to
make Ron seem like an outsider. Even with him not joining in the
conversation, why have him so physically separate?!
.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>..

They're (wrongly) setting up tension for Ron to leave in DH.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 21:31:53 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 21:31:53 -0000
Subject: Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <000601ca108e$9840bb60$c8c23220$@com>
Message-ID: <h4qf49+vfqb@eGroups.com>

> Joann:
> 
> I really didn't understand the thought process that the filmmakers used to
> make Ron seem like an outsider. Even with him not joining in the
> conversation, why have him so physically separate?!
> .>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>..
> 
> md:
>
> They're (wrongly) setting up tension for Ron to leave in DH.
> 

Richard: 

Yeah, that is how I saw that as well.  A visual clue that, though Ron and Hermione are both behind Harry, Ron has some reservations.  But I do not think we are supposed to question Ron's bravery in facing the quest.  His issue is the fear that Hermione likes Harry, emphasized by Hermione holding Harry's hand as they look out over the landscape with Ron awkwardly removed.  





From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul 29 21:34:00 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 21:34:00 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <001201ca1084$9d6bb6d0$d8432470$@com>
Message-ID: <h4qf88+vvpd@eGroups.com>

SSSusan:
> What I reacted to -- and called your opinion -- is that I read your
> previous comments as saying, AS ABSOLUTE FACT, that there is no way 
> those hours were missing, as in there was no reason in the world to 
> consider that they might contain something mysterious or 
> significant. And I was trying to point out why, for many people, it 
> was quite reasonable to think that there was! They were left 
> unexplained, and it seemed like a goodly chunk of time to a lot of
> us [that's where the opinion comes in, to me], so it wasn't weird 
> or crazy to have thought there might be some clues there in a 
> series which, at many levels, was a mystery.
> 
> Siriusly Snapey Susan,
> who doesn't mind having her position challenged or questioned, 
> especially when we're trying to figure out if we're talking about 
> things in the same or different way, but who'd appreciate not 
> having her words called "nonsense"


md:
> Well, there is no way those hours are "missing" they are simply not
>  covered in the book. My OPINION is no such thing, it's an ABSOLUTE 
> FACT. Sorry, but I teach English, I teach reading, those hours are 
> not missing. To classify them as such there would have to be an 
> instance of two events occurring directly after each other but the 
> times or dates being out-of-sync with the amount of time it should 
> take. 
> 
> For example, had she written "I grabbed him right after it happened 
> and flew him directly here" yet there was 21 hrs between the two 
> events, then there's missing hours, now there's something to go, 
> wtf about. 

SSSusan:
Indeed, that would've been something to go "wtf" about.


md: 
> If people are going to argue how the book is writing with language 
> that does not match their argument, then that is nonsense. It would 
> be like saying "you don't talk so good."

SSSusan:
I'm afraid I'm not following what you are saying here, so I can't even respond whether that is what I was attempting to do or not.  I didn't argue that JKR didn't write in a way to include my "argument;" I expressed disappointment that something I'd hoped was going to mean something ended up:  1) not meaning something [just standard fan "shucks!"]; and 2) not even registering on JKR's "Well, yes, I thought about that" meter.

To get back to your other points, I could talk about my having been a high school teacher as well, and the fact that I'm an elected school board member, but honestly, that seems neither here nor there to me.

The main point I was attempting to make was that the phrase "the missing 24 hours" was a long-standing one which has been widely used as a common term at the HPfGU lists; that there was a conception of that time period which was discussed a lot and which existed *with* that phrasing.  

If it had not already been commonly accepted as the means of identifying that time period, perhaps a better term would have been "the *unexplained* 24 hours."  If I'm reading you right, you'd much prefer that... and truth be told, I think it WOULD be a fairer term to have used than "missing."  

But, when I entered this discussion, I was latching onto the old concept/theorizing, not really intending to argue the fact that the word "missing" was the best possible word in the English language to have used.  There simply was *mystery* surrounding that time period, which many of us found intriguing, and we were surprised to discover that JKR did not view it the same way.  

Call it "missing" or call it "unexplained" or call it some other word, it was the rationale for the *possibility* of something significant that could have happened in the time period that I was arguing for, not the terminology.

I've already said that I believe I misread your statement as saying there was no way it was reasonable to have expected something significant could have happened during that time, when I think you were simply saying that "missing" isn't a good way to describe the time period.  So now that we know we weren't talking about the same thing, really, it'd be nice to not have my view (that there was a possibility that something significant could have happened then) be labeled "nonsense."  Fair enough?

Siriusly Snapey Susan





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 21:42:40 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 21:42:40 -0000
Subject: Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <h4q467+qfvp@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4qfog+4m6u@eGroups.com>

> Carol responds:
> 
> Fortunately for Rupert, they haven't assigned Hermione to play Keeper or snog Lavender Brown! (Granted, neither scene involves speaking lines, but at least he gets screen time.) And, oh, yes, he gets to eat the love-potion-filled chocolates and declare his love for Romilda Vane. (I've seen clips and trailers.) Don't know whether she's assigned any of his lines; in the book, Hermione and Ron aren't speaking half the time, and the rest of the time, their lines aren't really interchangeable. No heroics to assign to her, either, at a guess--their battle with the DEs, left out of the film, is offpage.
> 

Richard: 

Rupert has some good stuff in this movie.  I thought he was spot on with the love potion & poisoned wine sequence.  And his quidditch fears turned into success plays better in the movie than the book because we didn't see his first run at quidditch in OotP.


> Carol, who is definitely not "crazy about Emma"
>

Richard:

Well, you are a girl :)  
I don't think her magic twinkling eyes work on girls.





From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 21:59:16 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:59:16 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4qf88+vvpd@eGroups.com>
References: <001201ca1084$9d6bb6d0$d8432470$@com> <h4qf88+vvpd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001501ca1097$d11857a0$734906e0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of cubfanbudwoman



Fair enough?

Siriusly Snapey Susan

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I think we need to argue this further, just to drive everyone else on the
list crazy. 

 

md

 

Who said, English Teacher because my expertise are in grammar are
literature, I wouldn't expect a school-board member or ex-teacher of any
other subject to the same experience and spend the same amount of time
understanding how literature works.

 

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 22:37:55 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 22:37:55 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes.
In-Reply-To: <h4q5jb+cai2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4qj03+qo9g@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> > Eggplant wrote:

> > It was in a magazine interview with David Yates


> Carol, hoping that the article was wrong


zanooda:

I've read an interview with Yates some time ago where he mentioned a possible breaking point, but I don't think it's the same interview that Eggplant saw, because there was no any specifics there (like the chains :-)). He only said that they were filming HRH's capture by the Snatchers, and that the breaking point will be very soon after this scene. From this I gathered that it will be somewhere around Malfoy Manor. Yates then said that it's only for now, and the final decision will be made during editing. Here is the link:

http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2009/6/19/david-yates-snatcher-scene-just-filmed-for-deathly-hallows-talks-split-of-films






From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 22:48:05 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 22:48:05 -0000
Subject: Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance)
In-Reply-To: <000601ca108e$9840bb60$c8c23220$@com>
Message-ID: <h4qjj5+jfmm@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

> They're (wrongly) setting up tension for Ron to leave in DH.


zanooda:

That's what I suspected as well, and you are absolutely right that this is wrong :-). Ron was the first to say that he and Hermione are going to join Harry in his Horcrux-hunting, and all the tension developed much much later. Here they try to show that he had reservations from the very beginning, which is just not true. And, as I said earlier, once more Hermione gets to say Ron's lines :-)!




From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul 29 22:57:11 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 22:57:11 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <001501ca1097$d11857a0$734906e0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4qk47+6von@eGroups.com>

SSSusan:
> Fair enough?

md:
> I think we need to argue this further, just to drive everyone else 
> on the list crazy. 

SSSusan:
Heh.  Nah, it's been a long enough, crazy enough day already for me, thanks. ;)


> md
> 
> Who said, English Teacher because my expertise are in grammar are
> literature, I wouldn't expect a school-board member or ex-teacher 
> of any other subject to the same experience and spend the same 
> amount of time understanding how literature works.

SSSusan:
Maybe not, but I'm not stupid, grammar is an interest of mine, and I think as a general rule posters should give other posters the benefit of the doubt re: understanding the gist of it, you know?  This was just a simple misunderstanding of comments/intention behind comments, it seems to me, not one of us getting or not getting how literature works.  

Siriusly Snapey Susan,
who still wishes there had been something fun hidden behind the "unexplained 24 hours," even if she doesn't think it was a plot error or any such thing that it turned out not to be so








From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 23:06:51 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 23:06:51 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4q6r1+v1a5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4qkmb+r20s@eGroups.com>

SSS wrote:
> Snip>
What I reacted to -- and called your opinion -- is that I read your previous comments as saying, AS ABSOLUTE FACT, that there is no way those hours were missing, as in there was no reason in the world to consider that they might contain something mysterious or significant.  And I was trying to point out why, for many people, it was quite reasonable to think that there was!  They were left unexplained, and it seemed like a goodly chunk of time to a lot of us [that's where the opinion comes in, to me], so it wasn't weird or crazy to have thought there might be some clues there in a series which, at many levels, was a mystery.

Carol responds:

Exactly. "The missing twenty-four hours" is essentially HPfGu code or a catchphrase for what may have happened during that time, just as DDM!Snape was code for the various theories relating to Snape as Dumbledore's man (through and through). And we still don't know why it took so long or how the news got out so fast or even how DD found out about it given that Peter Pettigrew, hadn't told him. (Did he wake up suddenly realizing that he knew where they were and that the Secret keeper must have betrayed them? And when did he tell Snape, or did Snape feel his Dark Mark burning as Voldemort was vaporized and run to DD's office? Many of us used to think that they had hatched the plan of protecting the Dursleys' house with Love Magic together. 

Just as JKR dropped the "awful boy" clue about Snape and Lily in OoP and followed up on it in DH, she dropped the clue about "young Sirius Black" and the flying motorcycle that he lent/gave to Sirius (depending which edition of SS/PS you're reading), to be followed up in PoA. As SSS says, many of us expected additional follow-ups, but JKR never seemed to think that it was odd for Hagrid to keep Harry for the rest of the night and a day and not fly him to the Dursleys till the next night. (How long, I wonder, would it take to fly a motorcyle from Godric's Hollow (which we theorized is in Wales) to Little Whinging, Surrey, by way of Bristol? Anyone ever calculate that?)

> Siriusly Snapey Susan,
> who doesn't mind having her position challenged or questioned, especially when we're trying to figure out if we're talking about things in the same or different way, but who'd appreciate not having her words called "nonsense"
>
Carol responds:

Hear, hear.

Carol, noting that *all* of us are expressing our opinions and none of us is in possession of the full truth or "the facts"




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 23:14:59 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 23:14:59 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4pqik+u030@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ql5j+8bik@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:

> Even though I didn't actually remember how that scene went 
> in the book, having Hermione explain a derogatory slang 
> term in the same way she recites textbook definitions of 
> spells didn't seem right.


zanooda:

In the book Ron not only explains what "mudblood" means (which shows his knowledge of the wizarding world), but he also says that it's a disgusting way to call someone (which shows his convictions). He also says the line that in the movie is said by Hagrid - "if we hadn't married Muggles we'd've died out" :-). 

Another example: when Harry asks if he should have admitted to DD that he had heard the voice in the wall, Ron says: "No. Hearing voices no one else can hear isn't a good sign, even in the wizarding world". Now guess who says this line in the movie? You guessed right, it's Hermione :-)! Every time Ron says something brave or wise, it automatically gets transferred to Hermy, LOL!




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 23:32:01 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 23:32:01 -0000
Subject: Fictional plot holes.
In-Reply-To: <h4qj03+qo9g@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4qm5h+iivm@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "zanooda2" <zanooda2 at ...> wrote:
>
> --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67@> wrote:
> 
> > > Eggplant wrote:
> 
> > > It was in a magazine interview with David Yates
> 
> 
> > Carol, hoping that the article was wrong
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> I've read an interview with Yates some time ago where he mentioned a possible breaking point, but I don't think it's the same interview that Eggplant saw, because there was no any specifics there (like the chains :-)). He only said that they were filming HRH's capture by the Snatchers, and that the breaking point will be very soon after this scene. From this I gathered that it will be somewhere around Malfoy Manor. Yates then said that it's only for now, and the final decision will be made during editing. Here is the link:
> 
> http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2009/6/19/david-yates-snatcher-scene-just-filmed-for-deathly-hallows-talks-split-of-films
>
Carol responds:

Yes, I read the same interview that you linked to, which is why I was trying to think of points that might qualify as "cliffhangers." (the death and burial of Dobby certainly qualifies as a "death or bereavement," as mentioned below:

"Things can change when you edit, of course, but the idea now is that it will be not long after the sequence that we are filming here today. That's what we're experimenting with. We've had three or four different ideas about where to cut off the seventh film. Traditionally, the movies have ended with a death or a bereavement, some sort of passage or arrival. This time we think we will end with more a cliffhanger. Again, though, that's the thought as of this moment."

At any rate, it's "not long after" (not during) the sequence with the Snatchers, so it could be at any point during the Malfoy Manor scene, but most likely the death and burial of Dobby. Imagine a stop-action scene with the knife flying toward Dobby. That would be too upsetting for young viewers, I think. They could leave Harry wondering whether to go after the Elder Wand or let Voldemort take it and concentrate on the Horcruxes, which is really the crux of the book, but it might be hard to make that sufficiently dramatic. Maybe we'll get Dobby's funeral in place of Dumbledore's.

Anyway, I still think that ending it just after the Snatchers or at any point in Malfoy Manor would leave too much to squeeze into the last film and too little action in the first (other than the MoM, Bathilda!Nagini, and the destruction of the locket Horcrux. Adding the Snatchers and Malfoy Manor gives it an exciting climax. (Logically, I suppose the Gringotts break-in can go in the second film because it's the same day as the Battle of Hogwarts--one very action-packed twenty-four hours even if some of the action is off-page.)

Carol, hoping that the filmmakers won't add lengthy scenes at the expense of the book as they've clearly done in HBP




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 29 23:32:28 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 23:32:28 -0000
Subject: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
In-Reply-To: <00a301ca107a$2fb31340$8f1939c0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4qm6c+ts2j@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:


> He only uses Sectumsempra, but he reads it in the book 
> on-screen, he doesn't just pull it out of know where.


zanooda:

Yeah, he even asks Hermione about it first, iirc. He shows her the book and asks something like "do you know this spell"? A little later we are shown the page with the spell again. Do I imagine it or there were small drawings there showing someone being pierced through?



> I have to see the film again, though, I don't recall 
> all the details that well after one viewing.


zanooda:

There was no Levicorpus (but we already saw it in OotP), and I also don't remember other Prince's spells used. Just like you, I can't be 100% sure though :-).




From md at exit-reality.com  Wed Jul 29 23:42:43 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 19:42:43 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4qk47+6von@eGroups.com>
References: <001501ca1097$d11857a0$734906e0$@com> <h4qk47+6von@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000001ca10a6$44aa7dc0$cdff7940$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of cubfanbudwoman

SSSusan:
Maybe not, but I'm not stupid, grammar is an interest of mine, and I think
as a general rule posters should give other posters the benefit of the doubt
re: understanding the gist of it, you know? This was just a simple
misunderstanding of comments/intention behind comments, it seems to me, not
one of us getting or not getting how literature works. 



>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

 

If you're broken down on the side of the road and your looking under the
hood and you think you've got it, then some guy comes along and goes "no,
it's not that, it's this here that's the issue." You might think who is this
guy to tell me, then he says "I'm a mechanic from such-and-such for X-years"
suddenly your view of his opinion on what's wrong with the car changes. So,
for me, to state that I teach English / literature is simply my way of
saying in this particular subject I have added education and experience to
speak on the subject. I accept the same from those with other expertise. I
certainly listen to the mechanic over just some guy who's worked on car.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com  Thu Jul 30 00:19:41 2009
From: cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com (Cassandra Wladyslava)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 20:19:41 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: My Review of Harry Potter and the Half Blood 
	Prince
In-Reply-To: <h4qm6c+ts2j@eGroups.com>
References: <00a301ca107a$2fb31340$8f1939c0$@com> <h4qm6c+ts2j@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <d0874c890907291719v10a0b3f7x50aadf8ee7040563@mail.gmail.com>

Cassie wrote:
>
> I think the reason they changed it was because they didn't want to have
two full potions lessons in the movie. It would've seemed too redundant. I
do agree that they could've presented the information/reminded us about
bezoars in a much clearer way than they did. Even Harry just reading that
little notation while he's pouring over the HBP's potions book would've
sufficed.


Carol responds:
Two full Potions lessons would take either two hours or four, if it's double
Potions! I see nothing wrong with parts of two Potions lessons, just enough
to show why Harry is failing to comprehend the lesson and resorts to the
bezoar (even if they let out the flashback to Snape's first lesson, which
would take, oh, fifteen seconds).

Cassie:

Perhaps they could've had different parts of different potions lessons
showing Harry relying on the HBP's book?  I think they figured the one
potions lesson achieved that.  I'm not saying I agree with what they did,
but I understand it.


Carol continues:

But imagine the reaction of the film audience to the scrawled words "Just
shove a Bezoar down his throat." Wouldn't that arouse their curiosity about
the identity of the eponymous HBP and makes Snape's revelation at the end of
the story a little less anticlimactic?

Cassie:

Actually, now that I think on it, I think the audience would be confused by
my suggestion.  It would definately need more explaination.  "Shove a what
down his throat? Why?"

I'd like to add something else, but as you haven't seen the movie and I
don't know how much you want to know I'll just exchange a knowing look with
the members that have seen the movie ^^;;

Carol:

BTW, does Harry use any of the Prince's spells besides Sectumsempra (toenail
hex, Langlock, Levicorpus, Muffliato)? Or does he just suddenly, out of
nowhere, use Sectumsempra?

Cassie:

As far as I remember Sectumsempra is the only one.  In OotP Levicorpus is
just suddenly, out of nowhere, used (by Luna?).


~Cassie - Wondering if test audiences missed the beazor information in the
movie like she did. ~


> 
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From sherriola at gmail.com  Thu Jul 30 00:33:54 2009
From: sherriola at gmail.com (Sherry Gomes)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:33:54 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4pmls+g55t@eGroups.com>
References: <h4pgqe+bb4d@eGroups.com> <h4pmls+g55t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <79C3C04DC1004C4E95B8AF7A5540733B@Pensieve>

> SSSusan:
> When you get to POA in your re-read, Richard, be sure to watch the movie
just after. I think you'll see what folks are saying then. 
> Truly, Kloves gave all kinds of stuff to Hermione that belonged to Ron 
> **and** to Harry. The worst of which, from my perspective, was in the 
> Shrieking Shack, when Hermione yells, "If you want to kill Harry, 
> you'll have to kill us, too!" That was RON'S line in the book, and 
> there was absolutely no reason to give it to Hermione -- Ron was right 
> there! <SNIP>

Alla:

Hated, hated HATED that change. Ron does not get too many chances to shine
in the movies as is and Kloves robbed his character of the line that so
effectively shows his devotion to Harry.



Sherry now:

And at the end of the POA movie, as Sirius is about to fly off on Buckbeak,
the special tender moment between Harry and his godfather is ruined by
Sirius commenting that Remus is right about Hermione being the brightest
witch of her age, or whatever the exact line is.  He didn't say that in the
book.  That moment is one of my favorites in the series, and specifically in
POA.  and again, the movie makers have to ruin it by making it another
Hermione moment.  I literally had to go back and read the books to remind
myself why I like Hermione, because the movie super-girl version bothers me
too much.  Yet, in the series I like her truly.

Sherry




From Schlobin1 at aol.com  Thu Jul 30 03:59:08 2009
From: Schlobin1 at aol.com (susanmcgee48176)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 03:59:08 -0000
Subject: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h42tc5+qrjt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4r5qc+dvth@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "va32h" <va32h at ...> wrote:
>
>> 
> The Ridiculous:
> 
> We all know Tom Riddle is a raging psycho, but he's also supposed to be a charming sycophant.  Child Tom Riddle is so blatantly a sociopath that he might as well have it stamped on his forehead. He doesn't make eye contact; he speaks in monotone...it's too much of an anvil.  And it makes Dumbledore look positively stupid that he allowed this blatantly disturbed boy into Hogwarts.  And you'd never believe that Clearly Crazy Tom could charm Slughorn, or Hepzibah Smith, or the fledgling Death Eaters, either. 
> 

You are totally 100 percent right on here...

What we have heard about Tom Riddle is that he is a typical sociopath, and he can be totally charming.....and persuasive...he charmed the information about the diadem from the Gray Lady, etc......He LOOKS TOO EVIL...and the best sociopath's do NOT>..

Susan




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 30 04:48:55 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 00:48:55 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HBP: the Good, the Not So Good, and the Ridiculous (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <h4r5qc+dvth@eGroups.com>
References: <h42tc5+qrjt@eGroups.com> <h4r5qc+dvth@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000901ca10d1$0b63a750$222af5f0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of susanmcgee48176




What we have heard about Tom Riddle is that he is a typical sociopath, and
he can be totally charming.....and persuasive...he charmed the information
about the diadem from the Gray Lady, etc......He LOOKS TOO EVIL...and the
best sociopath's do NOT>..

Susan

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

 

Hmmm. Who are the best sociopaths? What do they look like, exactly? I'm
really curious.

 

md

_



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 05:08:32 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 05:08:32 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4ddn2+t3co@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4r9sg+o7mq@eGroups.com>

> > Richard:
> > 
> > Well, these two shots certainly make me think it will be 
> > Bill and Fleur's cottage and Bill will have the facial scars.  
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Yeah, that's Bill all right :-). Funny, I always thought that Fenrir injured Bill with his teeth because of all this talk about him being bitten, but on these photos the wounds seem to be from nails (or claws, whatever)...
>


Richard: 

I just finished rereading HBP.  Here is the description of Bill's injury when Harry sees him.  

"Harry looked over Hermione's shoulder and saw an unrecognizable face lying on Bill's pillow, so badly slashed and ripped that he looked grotesque."
and Madam Pomfrey says "I've tried everything I know, but there is no cure for werewolf bites."

I picture nasty slashes across the face and head (where hair will never grow back) and partially ripped out pieces of neck and cheek with teeth marks.  

A few deep, never-healing slashes across the face seem reasonable as representations of the injury for the movie though.  The actor would probably have a much harder time doing his job if he had enough prosthetics to make his face really disfigured... and it would be really distracting for the whole wedding thing :)






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 16:07:13 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 16:07:13 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4r9sg+o7mq@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4sgfh+c4er@eGroups.com>

Richard wrote: 
<snip book description of Bill's injuries>
> I picture nasty slashes across the face and head (where hair will never grow back) and partially ripped out pieces of neck and cheek with teeth marks.  
> 
> A few deep, never-healing slashes across the face seem reasonable as representations of the injury for the movie though.  The actor would probably have a much harder time doing his job if he had enough prosthetics to make his face really disfigured... and it would be really distracting for the whole wedding thing :)

Carol responds:
In the book, Bill's injuries are invisible at the wedding because of the magic of the Goblin-made tiara that Fleur has borrowed from Auntie Muriel; instead of outshining everyone, she beautifies everyone around her when she's wearing it. I'm quite sure that we won't see *that* tiara, though--it would be too hard (impossible) to duplicate *that* magic.

In the film (DH1), I suspect that he'll be injured offscreen after the wedding. As you say, the filmmakers can't make his injuries too grotesque or he won't be recognizable. I do hope, though, that they don't go for a PG rating again. Even the death of Hedwig will upset the little kids. Both DH films really need to be PG-13.
>
Carol, who read a review of HBP yesterday that claimed the films were *better* than the books--less sprawling and more tightly plotted (to each his own!)




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 30 17:00:21 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 13:00:21 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4sgfh+c4er@eGroups.com>
References: <h4r9sg+o7mq@eGroups.com> <h4sgfh+c4er@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000601ca1137$392cc7f0$ab8657d0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol

.

In the film (DH1), I suspect that he'll be injured offscreen after the
wedding. As you say, the filmmakers can't make his injuries too grotesque or
he won't be recognizable. I do hope, though, that they don't go for a PG
rating again. Even the death of Hedwig will upset the little kids. Both DH
films really need to be PG-13.
>
Carol, who read a review of HBP yesterday that claimed the films were
*better* than the books--less sprawling and more tightly plotted (to each
his own!)

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

My bet is he'll be injured in the wedding attack, on screen, defending
someone because I think the film makers want injuries and death to mean more
than Rowling did. What  sucks is I suppose Fleur will never be a vela and
she won't change into the vela and defend Bill. 

As for the reviewer, well, the MTV, short-attention-span-theater, ADHD crowd
has finally started taking over journalism.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From mike4521daron at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 17:26:12 2009
From: mike4521daron at yahoo.com (Mike Daron)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 10:26:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <14166368.20090729114545@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <295961.99281.qm@web52910.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

hello Susanne,
?? my name is mike daron. ( mike4521daron at yahoo.com )...
?your right about Emma, she does attends to have?some of?Hermione, attitude does show at times.she try to keep it at bay.when you are an actor some of your characters
attend to show up and you try to keep it in. you know...
I do beleive in emma in her magic in acting.
mike daron ..


--- On Wed, 7/29/09, Susanne <siskiou at gmail.com> wrote:


From: Susanne <siskiou at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [HPFGU-Movie] Hermione/Emma Watson (Re: The Romance (was HBP))
To: "Richard Shepard" <HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com>
Date: Wednesday, July 29, 2009, 11:45 AM


? 





Hi,

Wednesday, July 29, 2009, 8:48:41 AM, shepardrj at yahoo. com wrote:

> If I am not mistaken, Emma is supposed to be a
> big fan of the books. How do you think she
> feels about Hermione being unnecessarily
> superfied in the movies? 

IIRC, she enjoyed the "girl power" aspect.
I'm sure it didn't hurt her pocket-book, either.

I think the actors have been a little "corrupted"
in their view of the characters. It comes along
with the job, I suppose, but Rupert seems to
believe that Ron is a wimp, and even JKR's Ron has
changed a bit from the original in the last couple
of books, after the movies came along (imo).

-- 

Best regards,
Susanne mailto:siskiou at gmail. com

















      

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From thedossetts at gmail.com  Thu Jul 30 17:54:56 2009
From: thedossetts at gmail.com (rtbthw_mom)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 17:54:56 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <000001ca10a6$44aa7dc0$cdff7940$@com>
Message-ID: <h4smpg+lnum@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:
>
>  
> 
>  
> 
> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of cubfanbudwoman
> 
> SSSusan:
> Maybe not, but I'm not stupid, grammar is an interest of mine, and I think
> as a general rule posters should give other posters the benefit of the doubt
> re: understanding the gist of it, you know? This was just a simple
> misunderstanding of comments/intention behind comments, it seems to me, not
> one of us getting or not getting how literature works. 
> 
> 
> 
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
> 
>  
> 
> If you're broken down on the side of the road and your looking under the
> hood and you think you've got it, then some guy comes along and goes "no,
> it's not that, it's this here that's the issue." You might think who is this
> guy to tell me, then he says "I'm a mechanic from such-and-such for X-years"
> suddenly your view of his opinion on what's wrong with the car changes. So,
> for me, to state that I teach English / literature is simply my way of
> saying in this particular subject I have added education and experience to
> speak on the subject. I accept the same from those with other expertise. I
> certainly listen to the mechanic over just some guy who's worked on car.
> 
>  
> 
> md
> 
Yes, but an English teacher who makes obvious mistakes in spelling (YOUR looking under the hood????)and grammar (watch those commas) should pay attention to his own errors first, instead of worrying about something he obviously knows little about (the missing 24 hours theory, much talked about here.)  We try hard not to annoy one another here.  SSS seems to be trying NOT to annoy.  Can't say the same about you.

Sorry, elves, but I've had enough.  I'll be skipping your posts from now on, md.

Pat




From siskiou at gmail.com  Thu Jul 30 19:46:52 2009
From: siskiou at gmail.com (Susanne)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 12:46:52 -0700
Subject: Please change the subject line! Re: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4smpg+lnum@eGroups.com>
References: <000001ca10a6$44aa7dc0$cdff7940$@com> <h4smpg+lnum@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <384451585.20090730124652@gmail.com>

If it's arguing about something completely
unrelated to the previous subject, please
change it appropriately, so we (the
ones who are not interested in the argument) know
what to skip! :)

-- 
 
Best regards,
 Susanne                           mailto:siskiou at gmail.com




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 30 19:47:12 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 15:47:12 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4smpg+lnum@eGroups.com>
References: <000001ca10a6$44aa7dc0$cdff7940$@com> <h4smpg+lnum@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002101ca114e$88d3e5b0$9a7bb110$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of rtbthw_mom



Sorry, elves, but I've had enough. I'll be skipping your posts from now on,
md.

Pat

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

 

I guess I'm just a horrible bully.

 

Yours,

 

Draco



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 30 19:51:57 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 15:51:57 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4smpg+lnum@eGroups.com>
References: <000001ca10a6$44aa7dc0$cdff7940$@com> <h4smpg+lnum@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <003201ca114f$326949d0$973bdd70$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of rtbthw_mom



(watch those commas)

Pat



>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

The rules of casual conversation are not the same as the rules of grammar
for narration. The comma's in dialogue can represent any pause or breath
from the speaker, for, example: if I where Snape, I would, have many, many,
commas.

 

Draco, 

 

Evil resident bully.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 20:06:59 2009
From: dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com (dumbledore11214)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 20:06:59 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <3C80813FB8D9473CA1903900C924690F@miles>
Message-ID: <h4suh3+qqc3@eGroups.com>

> Miles
> I agree that this "character shaping" in the films is annoying. But it's 
> just a consequence of the business, and the way the Potter films are made.
> The films are no works of art. There's no intention to add depth to the 
> story. The films are to entertain people, especially young people/kids. They 
> are to be consumable without any stomach trouble, people shouldn't go home 
> thinking too much.
> Thus, the characters we know from the books are simplified. Hermione is the 
> intellectual leader of the Trio. She knows everything, she is energetic, she 
> solves the problems that can be solved by thinking or reading. Harry is the 
> leader in action. He acts before thinking, he is charismatic and people look 
> for him for leadership. Harry is essentially good and cares for "his" 
> people. And Ron - Ron is the comedy sidekick.
> 
> To give Harry too much doubt, intelligent ideas or too much ckumsiness would 
> add some depth to his character, but would make him less recognisable for 
> the visitor in the theatres that are no Harry Potter experts. Hermione can't 
> be helpless how to find fire for devil's snare in the PS stone, and Ron 
> can't tell her what do do - the clear differences between the characters 
> would be blurred too much (bad enough Ron has to play the chess game!).
> 
> Maybe one reason is that even the very simple characterisation of the Trio 
> was barely feasible for the three young actors - I think they all improved 
> very much, but none of them was another Haley Joel Osment when they started.
>

Alla:
I do see your point, Miles. But if you are right, I really really do not like it. I mean yes, obviously movies are made primarily for younger audience, but I mean how much will they complicate characterization if they, OMG will show that Hermione sometimes does stupid things and no, she is not always in charge, etc?

Sarcasm is directed at WB here, not at you of course. But seriously, do they expect that little of their audience that they think it will complicate matters so that kids will not be interested?

So what if Ron besides being the guy who delivers comedy lines shows bravery and devotion to his friends and again OMG wisdom sometimes?

It is not like JKR wrote her stories  for much older audiences initially (yes, yes I know she wrote books for herself, however they were targeted at kids at least initially) and it is not like characterization is THAT complex, you know?

And Harry can do bad things too (oh dear, I know, how complicated). Again, please understand I am not arguing with you, I can see you being completely right, I am sort of arguing with WB LOL.

What would it hurt to give those lines to Ron? Especially if they rightfully belong to him.

And I think especially now Trio can handle some depth added to their characters quite well, but yes I see your point.

Sigh.

Alla





From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 20:55:45 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 20:55:45 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4irgq+pub7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4t1ch+g5qo@eGroups.com>

> Carol responds:
> 
> Alan Rickman will have only about four scenes, not counting "The Prince's Tale," which I'm sure they'll abridge (sigh), so they need to make the most of the few they have, especially after short-changing him in the film that was supposed to be about Harry and the HBP. By "need," I mean that the Snape subplot is crucial to the story as a whole, and WB would be foolish not to make the most of Rickman's popularity. And they have two films rather than one to get the story right this time.
> 

Richard:  

If they do all the necessary flashbacks, we will certainly see young Severus and young Lily.  Do we know who they cast for these parts?  I did not see these characters listed on the IMDB.com page for part I or II.





From gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk  Thu Jul 30 21:00:36 2009
From: gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk (Geoff Bannister)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 21:00:36 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <003201ca114f$326949d0$973bdd70$@com>
Message-ID: <h4t1lk+q8nh@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:
 
> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of rtbthw_mom
 
> (watch those commas)

> Pat

md:
> The rules of casual conversation are not the same as the rules of grammar
> for narration. The comma's in dialogue can represent any pause or breath
> from the speaker, for, example: if I where Snape, I would, have many, many,
> commas.

 Geoff:
True, but the rules of casual conversation, if recorded in writing do expect you to use apostrophes correctly. "Comma's" in your last sentence is neither a possessive or a contraction. The other question is "Where is Snape then"?

Draco,  
> Evil resident bully.

Geoff: 
Hi Draco. Didn't know you were a group member.




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 21:08:23 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 21:08:23 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4suh3+qqc3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4t247+2umc@eGroups.com>

> > Miles:
> > I agree that this "character shaping" in the films is annoying. But it's 
> > just a consequence of the business, and the way the Potter films are made.
> > The films are no works of art. There's no intention to add depth to the 
> > story. The films are to entertain people, especially young people/kids. They 
> > are to be consumable without any stomach trouble, people shouldn't go home 
> > thinking too much.
> > Thus, the characters we know from the books are simplified. Hermione is the 
> > intellectual leader of the Trio. She knows everything, she is energetic, she 
> > solves the problems that can be solved by thinking or reading. Harry is the 
> > leader in action. He acts before thinking, he is charismatic and people look 
> > for him for leadership. Harry is essentially good and cares for "his" 
> > people. And Ron - Ron is the comedy sidekick.
> > 
> > To give Harry too much doubt, intelligent ideas or too much ckumsiness would 
> > add some depth to his character, but would make him less recognisable for 
> > the visitor in the theatres that are no Harry Potter experts. Hermione can't 
> > be helpless how to find fire for devil's snare in the PS stone, and Ron 
> > can't tell her what do do - the clear differences between the characters 
> > would be blurred too much (bad enough Ron has to play the chess game!).
> > 
> > Maybe one reason is that even the very simple characterisation of the Trio 
> > was barely feasible for the three young actors - I think they all improved 
> > very much, but none of them was another Haley Joel Osment when they started.
> >
> 
> Alla:
> I do see your point, Miles. But if you are right, I really really do not like it. I mean yes, obviously movies are made primarily for younger audience, but I mean how much will they complicate characterization if they, OMG will show that Hermione sometimes does stupid things and no, she is not always in charge, etc?
> 
> Sarcasm is directed at WB here, not at you of course. But seriously, do they expect that little of their audience that they think it will complicate matters so that kids will not be interested?
> 
> So what if Ron besides being the guy who delivers comedy lines shows bravery and devotion to his friends and again OMG wisdom sometimes?
> 
> It is not like JKR wrote her stories  for much older audiences initially (yes, yes I know she wrote books for herself, however they were targeted at kids at least initially) and it is not like characterization is THAT complex, you know?
> 
> And Harry can do bad things too (oh dear, I know, how complicated). Again, please understand I am not arguing with you, I can see you being completely right, I am sort of arguing with WB LOL.
> 
> What would it hurt to give those lines to Ron? Especially if they rightfully belong to him.
> 
> And I think especially now Trio can handle some depth added to their characters quite well, but yes I see your point.
> 
> Sigh.
> 
> Alla
>

Richard:

The five hours or so they have to cinamatize Deathly Hallows is a great opportunity to rectify some wrongs done to the characters.  






From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Thu Jul 30 21:09:57 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 21:09:57 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4suh3+qqc3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4t275+9fv1@eGroups.com>

Miles
> > I agree that this "character shaping" in the films is annoying. 
> > But it's just a consequence of the business, and the way the 
> > Potter films are made. The films are no works of art. There's no 
> > intention to add depth to the story. The films are to entertain 
> > people, especially young people/kids. They are to be consumable 
> > without any stomach trouble, people shouldn't go home thinking 
> > too much. Thus, the characters we know from the books are 
> > simplified. Hermione is the intellectual leader of the Trio. 

Alla:
> I do see your point, Miles. But if you are right, I really really do not like it. I mean yes, obviously movies are made primarily for younger audience, but I mean how much will they complicate characterization if they, OMG will show that Hermione sometimes does stupid things and no, she is not always in charge, etc?
> 
> Sarcasm is directed at WB here, not at you of course. But seriously, do they expect that little of their audience that they think it will complicate matters so that kids will not be interested?
> 
> So what if Ron besides being the guy who delivers comedy lines shows bravery and devotion to his friends and again OMG wisdom sometimes?
> 
> It is not like JKR wrote her stories  for much older audiences initially (yes, yes I know she wrote books for herself, however they were targeted at kids at least initially) and it is not like characterization is THAT complex, you know?
> 
> And Harry can do bad things too (oh dear, I know, how complicated). Again, please understand I am not arguing with you, I can see you being completely right, I am sort of arguing with WB LOL.
> 
> What would it hurt to give those lines to Ron? Especially if they rightfully belong to him.


SSSusan:
I, too, think you make a good point, Miles, although I'm still with Alla in how it all makes me *feel.*  

To me, the deal is that it took some effort to CHANGE things so that Hermione got Ron's lines, such as about "mudblood" and the Shrieking Shack "You'll have to kill us!"  And it took some effort to CHANGE things so that Hermione got to be the one taking charge during the TT sequence of PoA.  What I mean is, since it was *written* with Ron doing X and Harry doing Y, there should have been a pretty significant reason that the Warner team elected to make changes so that they were giving X & Y to Hermione.

What you've said about simplifying or distilling the trio down into almost one characteristic could explain it:  the intellectual; the comic; the reckless, impulsive hero.  

And yet.  It wouldn't exactly have *not* made sense to have allowed Ron -- the only one who grew up in the WW -- to explain the mudblood stuff.  And it wouldn't exactly have *not* made sense for Harry to be taking, say, an equal part in the TT decisions.  And it wouldn't exactly be counter to the role of Intellectual for Hermione to occasionally be a little human.  

IOW, if the Warner team felt that doing those things *did* make it too complicated, did move too far away from the super-simplified, narrow role they'd determined each should play, then WOW.  What an insult to the average audience member -- kids included! And a definite disappointment to the many slightly older fans, the savvy kid fans and the read-'em-in-detail fans.  

I guess I'm saying I see Miles' suggestion as plausible; it's just if it's accurate, it's rather ridiculous imo for Warner to have assumed such major league simplification/distillation was necessary.

Bah humbug on them.

;)

Siriusly Snapey Susan,
who, in spite of this negative-sounding post, LOVES the movies overall and watches them repeatedly, just wishes Warner had stayed more true to these three at times






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 21:38:43 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 21:38:43 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <003201ca114f$326949d0$973bdd70$@com>
Message-ID: <h4t3t3+9th2@eGroups.com>

md:
> 
> The rules of casual conversation are not the same as the rules of grammar for narration. The comma's in dialogue can represent any pause or breath from the speaker, for, example: if I where Snape, I would, have many, many, commas.
>
Carol responds:

What about the distinction between possessives and plurals ("comma's" vs. "commas") or the distinction between "were" and "where" (admittedly not related to comma use)?

I see no reason for additional commas in Snape's speeches, BTW. Alan Rickman does tend to pause a lot, but I'd probably use ellipses rather than commas to indicate those pauses if I wanted them to appear in the dialogue. (Ex . . . pelliarmus!") A comma, as I'm sure you know, is not a breath mark but a means of setting off introductory or parenthetical or nonrestrictive elements in a sentence. (No one would be watching your punctuation, grammar, or spelling if you hadn't presented yourself as an authority on those subjects. All of us make typos and other errors on occasion, and, of course, the "rules" for their usage are more relaxed here than they would be in a classroom--or a carefully edited manuscript.)

Actually, all anyone is asking from you is respect for your fellow posters, especially long-time, well-respected HPfGu members like Siriusly Snapey Susan (who also happens to be a List Elf). Any intelligent reader can interpret what he or she reads without a degree in English, and I speak as someone who taught the subject for eighteen years and has a PhD in literature.

Carol, playing McGonagall to your Draco




From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 21:40:11 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 21:40:11 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4t247+2umc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4t3vr+ul5v@eGroups.com>


 
> Richard:
> 
> The five hours or so they have to cinamatize Deathly Hallows is a great opportunity to rectify some wrongs done to the characters.

Joann:

That's assuming that the IIC (idiots in charge) think there are "wrongs" to the characters to rectify. They are the ones who made the conscience decision to change the characters the way the have. I believe they will go forward with *their* visions of the characters, not JRK's or ours. 




From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Thu Jul 30 22:22:46 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 22:22:46 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4t3t3+9th2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4t6fm+290d@eGroups.com>

> Carol responds:
>
> Actually, all anyone is asking from you is respect for your fellow posters, especially long-time, well-respected HPfGu members like Siriusly Snapey Susan (who also happens to be a List Elf). Any intelligent reader can interpret what he or she reads without a degree in English, and I speak as someone who taught the subject for eighteen years and has a PhD in literature.


SSSusan:
Whoops, uh oh!  I think this better stop here.  While I genuinely appreciate the backup, I don't want us to go here!  I'm a big girl, and my elfy status should mean nothing when I'm here as SSSusan. ;)

Respect *is* key, though, and the list rules here state that respect and courtesy are expected, as well as appropriate use of opinion language.  Just speaking as SSSusan, it is definitely appreciated when we all take care to consider how our words might come across in print, since tone is hard to read in this medium.  Most of us humans botch that sometimes, of course, but the effort is definitely appreciated.  

Let's get back to talking about the movies, can we??

Siriusly Snapey Susan





From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 22:54:18 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 22:54:18 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <000601ca1137$392cc7f0$ab8657d0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4t8aq+riht@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:


> My bet is he'll be injured in the wedding attack, on screen, 
> defending someone 


zanooda:

Someone :-)? Bill will defend Fleur, of course :-). Greyback always attacks girls, right? Imagine, the DEs crash the wedding, there is a battle and Fenrir goes straight for the bride... :-).




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 23:10:03 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 23:10:03 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4sgfh+c4er@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4t98b+4q4u@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

> In the book, Bill's injuries are invisible at the wedding 
> because of the magic of the Goblin-made tiara that Fleur 
> has borrowed from Auntie Muriel


zanooda:

How do you figure :-)? To be honest, such an idea never crossed my mind, because there is nothing about it in the book :-). I thought it was simply because Fleur was so happy and so full of love that day... :-).




From zanooda2 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul 30 23:23:44 2009
From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 23:23:44 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4t1ch+g5qo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4ta20+iga3@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj at ...> wrote:

> If they do all the necessary flashbacks, we will certainly see 
> young Severus and young Lily. Do we know who they cast for these 
> parts?


zanooda:

Do you mean little Sev and little Lily (and maybe little Petunia) or only teenage Snape and Lily? I heard absolutely nothing about actors for these parts being cast, but they will be, right? They can't skip Snape's childhood memories altogether,I would be disappointed if they did. Mind you, I'm always disappointed :-), but if I won't get to see little Severus and Lily I will be *really* disappointed, LOL. I wonder if they will bring back the actors for teenage Snape and Lily from OotP, or cast new ones?  




From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 30 23:48:41 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 19:48:41 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4t1lk+q8nh@eGroups.com>
References: <003201ca114f$326949d0$973bdd70$@com> <h4t1lk+q8nh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <007001ca1170$44a9f9c0$cdfded40$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Geoff Bannister




Geoff:
True, but the rules of casual conversation, if recorded in writing do expect
you to use apostrophes correctly. "Comma's" in your last sentence is neither
a possessive or a contraction. The other question is "Where is Snape then"

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

My apostrophe misuse actually stems from a form of dyslexia I have, my mind
automatically favors certain spellings of homonyms and automatically adds
apostrophes when I ad "s" to the ends of words, it's an issue my mind has
with symbols. I only catch my errors after I let the writing sit for a while
and then go back or if I have someone else proofread for me. It only effects
my writing, I'm quite proficient at proofing / grading the writing of
others.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Thu Jul 30 23:51:46 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 23:51:46 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4ta20+iga3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4tbmi+ibb1@eGroups.com>

Richard:
> > If they do all the necessary flashbacks, we will certainly see 
> > young Severus and young Lily. Do we know who they cast for these 
> > parts?
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Do you mean little Sev and little Lily (and maybe little Petunia) or only teenage Snape and Lily? I heard absolutely nothing about actors for these parts being cast, but they will be, right? They can't skip Snape's childhood memories altogether,I would be disappointed if they did. Mind you, I'm always disappointed :-), but if I won't get to see little Severus and Lily I will be *really* disappointed, LOL. I wonder if they will bring back the actors for teenage Snape and Lily from OotP, or cast new ones?
>

SSSusan:
I hope you're right on both counts, Zanooda.  I would also be disappointed if they don't show at least brief glimpses of little Severus & Lily.  And I really liked the actor they cast in OotP as teenaged Snape.

Siriusly Snapey Susan





From md at exit-reality.com  Thu Jul 30 23:59:23 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 19:59:23 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <h4t3t3+9th2@eGroups.com>
References: <003201ca114f$326949d0$973bdd70$@com> <h4t3t3+9th2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <007501ca1171$c33e3110$49ba9330$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Carol




Carol responds:

What about the distinction between possessives and plurals ("comma's" vs.
"commas") or the distinction between "were" and "where" (admittedly not
related to comma use)?

I see no reason for additional commas in Snape's speeches, BTW. Alan Rickman
does tend to pause a lot, but I'd probably use ellipses rather than commas
to indicate those pauses if I wanted them to appear in the dialogue. (Ex . .
. pelliarmus!") A comma, as I'm sure you know, is not a breath mark but a
means of setting off introductory or parenthetical or nonrestrictive
elements in a sentence. 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

I said I taught English and Literature, not grammar and punctuation - those
things are for the elementary schools. I only teach punctuation when I have
to set a student on the right course in their writing. 

My other issue, with homonyms, plurals and apostrophes stems from a form of
dyslexia.

As for the comma, it was an example. And I have been taught from school to
college  (both my English and business degrees) that you can use commas in
dialogue to indicate the speaker's inflection. My example with Snape was
purposefully exaggerated. Your example is an entirely different thing, it's
all one word. Who would put a comma in the middle of a word?

And piss-all to my stating I taught literature, that was not bragging or
talking down, that was simply to say that as someone who studies and teaches
the craft of writing here is why I view this entire theory (21 missing
hours) as nonsense. Nothing more, nothing less. What I love is that I never
said I was a great speller or had perfect punctuation in my post - yet that
is what people toss out there to try and bring me down. Very, very
fourth-grade IMO. No one, after all, actually argued my point to any extent,
just my credentials. Of course, everyone feels perfectly okay saying that
I'm some big-headed windbag for saying what I did for a living, but no one
had issues posting their own degrees or professions!

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 31 00:32:46 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 20:32:46 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4tbmi+ibb1@eGroups.com>
References: <h4ta20+iga3@eGroups.com> <h4tbmi+ibb1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <008901ca1176$6cfaa860$46eff920$@com>



SSSusan:
I hope you're right on both counts, Zanooda. I would also be disappointed if
they don't show at least brief glimpses of little Severus & Lily. And I
really liked the actor they cast in OotP as teenaged Snape.

Siriusly Snapey Susan

>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

There's no one cast for young Snape or Lilly. The way the films have
portrayed Snape as simply hating Harry because of his father, it looks like
they are sticking with that until the end. They have never brought up who
told Voldy about the prophecy or Harry blaming Snape for his parents death.
I don't think the films will ever touch at why Snape was ever a death-eater,
the focus is clearly on Harry's story and what they need to show to tell
that.

md

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 31 01:26:59 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 21:26:59 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4t275+9fv1@eGroups.com>
References: <h4suh3+qqc3@eGroups.com> <h4t275+9fv1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000001ca117e$00559280$0100b780$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of cubfanbudwoman


I guess I'm saying I see Miles' suggestion as plausible; it's just if it's
accurate, it's rather ridiculous imo for Warner to have assumed such major
league simplification/distillation was necessary.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>..

 

I don't think WB had anything to do with it. I think it's Kloves. He
distilled the characters to what he believes are their basic structures,
hero, comic sidekick and well-of-knowledge. It's really a standard way for
screenwriters to think. Everything has to be high-concept in
big-budget-Hollywood. However, I don't think WB really keeps much of a hand
in production. In fact, it was the last three directors that opted for
shorter films when WB was fine with 2:45 run time and fine with GOF, OOTP &
HBP being 6 films!!! It was the directors that made the choices to cut, and
Kloves who made the choice to distill the characters. 

 

I think it's easy to point a mean finger at WB and say it's their fault, but
time and time again what I read is screenwriter and director, not
production.

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 01:36:18 2009
From: dumbledore11214 at yahoo.com (dumbledore11214)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 01:36:18 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <000001ca117e$00559280$0100b780$@com>
Message-ID: <h4thqi+hdta@eGroups.com>


md:
> I don't think WB had anything to do with it. I think it's Kloves. He
> distilled the characters to what he believes are their basic structures,
> hero, comic sidekick and well-of-knowledge. It's really a standard way for
> screenwriters to think. Everything has to be high-concept in
> big-budget-Hollywood. However, I don't think WB really keeps much of a hand
> in production. In fact, it was the last three directors that opted for
> shorter films when WB was fine with 2:45 run time and fine with GOF, OOTP &
> HBP being 6 films!!! It was the directors that made the choices to cut, and
> Kloves who made the choice to distill the characters. 
<SNIP>


Alla:

Well, when I say WB I certainly include Kloves into this  umbrella term, which I use quite loosely.

And if it is a standard way for screen writers to think, well, supposedly this is what Hollywood deems acceptable, right? This is something which Kloves thinks producers will agree with, etc, right?

I mean, the way I see it, it all goes together - producer finds director that will implement his vision, but which will be acceptable for producer as well and same for screenwriter IMO.






From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Fri Jul 31 01:36:45 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 01:36:45 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <000001ca117e$00559280$0100b780$@com>
Message-ID: <h4thrd+scrj@eGroups.com>

md: 
> I don't think WB had anything to do with it. I think it's Kloves. He
> distilled the characters to what he believes are their basic 
> structures, hero, comic sidekick and well-of-knowledge. It's really 
> a standard way for screenwriters to think. 
<snip>
> It was the directors that made the choices to cut, and
> Kloves who made the choice to distill the characters. 
 
> 
> I think it's easy to point a mean finger at WB and say it's their 
> fault, but time and time again what I read is screenwriter and 
> director, not production.
 

SSSusan:
I actually agree with you entirely, md.  It is Kloves I feel is primarily responsible (or "to blame," for those of us who prefer that term).  

When I talked about the "Warner Team," he was definitely part of the team I had in mind.  I should not have lumped him in with them, since he's independent of Warner, and "Warner" as a moniker really does imply the *production* folks.  So, my bad there.  But it was actually Kloves first, and the director secondarily (whether Cuaron, Columbus, Yates or Newell) whom I blame for this distillation, yes.

Siriusly Snapey Susan,
who remembers back when SS/PS and CoS came out and she thought Kloves was fabulous for sticking so faithfully to the text; but then....







From cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com  Fri Jul 31 02:01:15 2009
From: cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com (Cassandra Wladyslava)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 22:01:15 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <007501ca1171$c33e3110$49ba9330$@com>
References: <003201ca114f$326949d0$973bdd70$@com> <h4t3t3+9th2@eGroups.com>
	 <007501ca1171$c33e3110$49ba9330$@com>
Message-ID: <d0874c890907301901mc498e35t7d0b134a8eba5fef@mail.gmail.com>

Md writes:

<snip rant> No one, after all, actually argued my point to any extent,
just my credentials. <snip>

Cassie responds:

Actually, SSSusan took care of that in Message #16747.


~Cassie~


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 02:07:37 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 02:07:37 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4ta20+iga3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4tjl9+hekm@eGroups.com>

> > Richard:
> >
> > If they do all the necessary flashbacks, we will certainly see 
> > young Severus and young Lily. Do we know who they cast for these 
> > parts?
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Do you mean little Sev and little Lily (and maybe little Petunia) or only teenage Snape and Lily? I heard absolutely nothing about actors for these parts being cast, but they will be, right? They can't skip Snape's childhood memories altogether,I would be disappointed if they did. Mind you, I'm always disappointed :-), but if I won't get to see little Severus and Lily I will be *really* disappointed, LOL. I wonder if they will bring back the actors for teenage Snape and Lily from OotP, or cast new ones?
>


Richard: 

Ideally, I would like to see the little kid flashbacks and the teenage flashbacks.  It is very important to understand Snape and it would be very hard for the audience to follow Snape's actions without that information.  Of course, I have no idea if they will do any of it or not.  So far I do not see any information about actors who would be playing these parts.  I believe they are done shooting Part I, and halfway done shooting Part II, so you would think all the information about casting would have leaked out by now.





From juli17 at aol.com  Fri Jul 31 02:07:38 2009
From: juli17 at aol.com (julie)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 02:07:38 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <008901ca1176$6cfaa860$46eff920$@com>
Message-ID: <h4tjla+nu7h@eGroups.com>


> SSSusan:
> I hope you're right on both counts, Zanooda. I would also be disappointed if
> they don't show at least brief glimpses of little Severus & Lily. And I
> really liked the actor they cast in OotP as teenaged Snape.
> 
> Siriusly Snapey Susan
> 
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
> 
> There's no one cast for young Snape or Lilly. The way the films have
> portrayed Snape as simply hating Harry because of his father, it looks like
> they are sticking with that until the end. They have never brought up who
> told Voldy about the prophecy or Harry blaming Snape for his parents death.
> I don't think the films will ever touch at why Snape was ever a death-eater,
> the focus is clearly on Harry's story and what they need to show to tell
> that.
> 
> md
> 

Julie:
I hope you are wrong! That is a big part of the plot, Snape
loving Lily and protecting Harry because of that love. Even
if they left out Snape telling Voldemort the prophecy (not
that there is any need to do so), Snape being remorseful 
about Lily's death and his role in it as a Death Eater
supporting Voldemort could be reason enough that he turned
to Dumbledore and the Light side. Certainly there needs to
be some reason for Snape to have switched and protected 
Harry despite his hatred for Harry's father, and that his
conscience suddenly popped out because Voldemort killed a
baby doesn't really cut it (even though some readers hoped
that would be Snape's reason!). 

I know the two DH movies are being filmed simultaneously,
but I'm sure the scenes are being grouped by what actors 
are in them. That is usually the case, especially with
smaller roles, so the actor only has to take time to be
available for the several weeks his part is being filmed
rather than through the entire shoot. It's quite possible
the younger Snape and Lily roles simply haven't been 
cast yet as they won't be filmed until next year (and I
know Gambon for one has said his scenes won't be filmed 
until after the New Year.)

I fully expect the young Snape and Lily scenes to be cut,
just as young Tom's scenes were cut down to only the two.
But I can't see how the filmmakers would get by with no
young Snape loving young Lily scenes at all. And that was
such a major plot point and reveal in the books that I 
can't see JKR being okay with the Snape loved Lily angle
being dropped from the movie. 

Julie




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 02:11:40 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 02:11:40 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4t8aq+riht@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4tjss+a80a@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "zanooda2" <zanooda2 at ...> wrote:
>
> --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md@> wrote:
> 
> 
> > My bet is he'll be injured in the wedding attack, on screen, 
> > defending someone 
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Someone :-)? Bill will defend Fleur, of course :-). Greyback always attacks girls, right? Imagine, the DEs crash the wedding, there is a battle and Fenrir goes straight for the bride... :-).
>


Richard:

Sounds like a very Hollywood-ish way to do it :)  
I bet it is something just like that.  The way they protrayed Fleur in GoF would fit pretty well with her reacting like a bit of a helpless victim and require Bill to jump in front of her.  





From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 31 02:42:25 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 22:42:25 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <h4thrd+scrj@eGroups.com>
References: <000001ca117e$00559280$0100b780$@com> <h4thrd+scrj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001d01ca1188$89deb9a0$9d9c2ce0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of cubfanbudwoman



SSSusan:
I actually agree with you entirely, md. 

>>>>>>>>>>>> 

You don't have to be so surprised, one spat does not life-long-enemies make
;-D

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 31 02:48:58 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 22:48:58 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4tjla+nu7h@eGroups.com>
References: <008901ca1176$6cfaa860$46eff920$@com> <h4tjla+nu7h@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002201ca1189$73ddd4f0$5b997ed0$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of julie



And that was
such a major plot point and reveal in the books that I 
can't see JKR being okay with the Snape loved Lily angle
being dropped from the movie. 

Julie

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

My question is, if you haven't read the books, don't know the back-story,
how important would it feel to you as a movie-goer. That's where the minds
of the filmmakers seem to be. If I look at just the films, at just what the
films have shown, I see no reason why you have to see Lilly and Snape.

I also think they are going to decide it's too much of a diversion at the
end of the film, in the middle of the climactic battle, to suddenly be like
"here's 10 minutes of how Snape knows Lilly" I would be shocked to see it in
the film, at all.

 

md

_



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com  Fri Jul 31 05:32:36 2009
From: cassandra.wladyslava at gmail.com (Cassandra Wladyslava)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 01:32:36 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The 
	Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <002201ca1189$73ddd4f0$5b997ed0$@com>
References: <008901ca1176$6cfaa860$46eff920$@com> <h4tjla+nu7h@eGroups.com>
	 <002201ca1189$73ddd4f0$5b997ed0$@com>
Message-ID: <d0874c890907302232j245426e2n6b0f8d5da5e8f17e@mail.gmail.com>

md writes:

My question is, if you haven't read the books, don't know the back-story,
how important would it feel to you as a movie-goer. That's where the minds
of the filmmakers seem to be. If I look at just the films, at just what the
films have shown, I see no reason why you have to see Lilly and Snape.
I also think they are going to decide it's too much of a diversion at the
end of the film, in the middle of the climactic battle, to suddenly be like
"here's 10 minutes of how Snape knows Lilly" I would be shocked to see it in
the film, at all.

Cassie responds:

I sort of agree with you. Snape just wasn't developed enough in the movies
for people to care, I think.  Even his and Harry's animosity towards each
other is not present.  I suspect Harry will end up truly hating Snape
because he killed Dumbledore and not because he was the one who revealed the
Prophecy.

I also imagine a sort of direct connection between Snape and Harry before
Snape dies when the memories are revealed.  A departure from canon, yes, but
it would be quicker than having Harry collect the memories, go to DD's old
office, get out the Pensieve, etc...  I also think that, once the audience
understands that Snape was in love with Harry's mother, the "look at me"
part could be a potential tear-jerker.

Just a thought.


I do hope they can work in Snape and Lily's relationship somehow.


~Cassie - who fears the lack of Harry and Snape's relationship in the movies
will weaken if not completely destroy one of her favorite moments from the
epilogue where Harry reveals he's named his son after Severus Snape~


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk  Fri Jul 31 06:42:48 2009
From: gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk (Geoff Bannister)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 06:42:48 -0000
Subject: The Romance
In-Reply-To: <007001ca1170$44a9f9c0$cdfded40$@com>
Message-ID: <h4u3p8+arl5@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

md:
> My apostrophe misuse actually stems from a form of dyslexia I have, my mind
> automatically favors certain spellings of homonyms and automatically adds
> apostrophes when I ad "s" to the ends of words, it's an issue my mind has
> with symbols. I only catch my errors after I let the writing sit for a while
> and then go back or if I have someone else proofread for me. It only effects
> my writing, I'm quite proficient at proofing / grading the writing of
> others.

Geoff:
Point taken.

However, you've highlighted the solution yourself... "let the writing sit 
for a while".

I usually proof read one of my messages three or four times, especially 
if it's a longer one and it is surprising how frequently a typing error will 
slip through on the first couple of checks.

And then, of course, you spot a mistake two seconds after you click 
on "Send"
:-(

Speaking generally, I'm always surprised how often contributors have 
problems with apostrophes. After all, they are used with possessives 
(except its) and contractions such as "I'm" or "they've". Some people 
seem to be related to Data in Star Trek and have problems in this area.
:-)




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 13:04:17 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 13:04:17 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <002201ca1189$73ddd4f0$5b997ed0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4uq4h+bvm5@eGroups.com>

> Julie:
> 
> And that was
> such a major plot point and reveal in the books that I 
> can't see JKR being okay with the Snape loved Lily angle
> being dropped from the movie. 
> 
> 
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
>
> md:
> 
> My question is, if you haven't read the books, don't know the back-story,
> how important would it feel to you as a movie-goer. That's where the minds
> of the filmmakers seem to be. If I look at just the films, at just what the
> films have shown, I see no reason why you have to see Lilly and Snape.
> 
> I also think they are going to decide it's too much of a diversion at the
> end of the film, in the middle of the climactic battle, to suddenly be like
> "here's 10 minutes of how Snape knows Lilly" I would be shocked to see it in
> the film, at all.
> 


Richard:

Even the movie version of Snape is ambiguous and confusing.  I think they will have to give the viewer some insights into his actions, and a couple of flashbacks with Severus and Lily is not only the accurate way to do it but probably the easiest.  And I agree that JKR would probably object if they eliminated that story completely.  

I still have hope that the film makers intend to wrap up the story fairly accurately :)  





From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Fri Jul 31 13:49:21 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 13:49:21 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <001d01ca1188$89deb9a0$9d9c2ce0$@com>
Message-ID: <h4usp1+antq@eGroups.com>

SSSusan:
> I actually agree with you entirely, md. 

 
md:> 
> You don't have to be so surprised, one spat does not life-long-
> enemies make
> ;-D


SSSusan:
LOL.  Must've been that 'actually' I inserted in there. 

I did intend my 'actually' in its "it might not have been clear that I do, but I do" sense, as opposed to its "wow, I'm shocked, but I do" sense. ;)

Siriusly Snapey Susan





From susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net  Fri Jul 31 14:14:32 2009
From: susiequsie23 at sbcglobal.net (cubfanbudwoman)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 14:14:32 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4uq4h+bvm5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4uu88+eh5i@eGroups.com>

Julie:
> > And that was such a major plot point and reveal in the books that 
> > I can't see JKR being okay with the Snape loved Lily angle
> > being dropped from the movie. 

md:
> > My question is, if you haven't read the books, don't know the 
> > back-story,how important would it feel to you as a movie-goer. 
> > That's where the minds of the filmmakers seem to be. <snip>  
> > I also think they are going to decide it's too much of a 
> > diversion at the end of the film, in the middle of the climactic 
> > battle, to suddenly be like "here's 10 minutes of how Snape knows 
> > Lilly" I would be shocked to see it in the film, at all.

Richard:
> Even the movie version of Snape is ambiguous and confusing.  I think they will have to give the viewer some insights into his actions, and a couple of flashbacks with Severus and Lily is not only the accurate way to do it but probably the easiest.  And I agree that JKR would probably object if they eliminated that story completely.  
> 
> I still have hope that the film makers intend to wrap up the story fairly accurately :)


SSSusan:
Oooooh, I really hope you are right, Richard.  NOT having that in the film would likely deprive this Alan Rickman fan of her most desired Snape line of the series:  "Look... at... me...."  

Could they possibly do that??  

Well, yeah, I think they could, given that they left out DD's "I'm not worried.  I'm with you" line.  :(

My *hope* is that the PTB won't see the Snape memories as a diversion or distraction.  I think they could do a couple of the young Lily-young Snape scenes in maybe a minute, and then a couple of the Hogwarts Lily-Hogwarts Snape scenes in maybe one or two minutes more?  Done well, it could easily establish the length and depth of their relationship, as well as Snape's feelings for Lily.  Add in the quick conversations between Snape & DD as Snape confesses the prophecy overhear and makes his pledge and then his revelation about the silver doe patronus, and I think Harry [and the viewer] would get a LOT out of that.

Is that do-able in quick snippets, without taking up 10 minutes or so?  I'd like to think it is so that I can hold onto my hope.  I'm not sure that I fully *wanted* LOLLIPOPS (Snape's love of Lily) to be the reason for Snape's actions in turning away from Voldy and working with DD, but once JKR revealed that it was, it did make sense.  And now that we know it from JKR, I don't want it to be changed or dropped from the films.

Am I whining?  I hope I'm not whining. At least I'm not stamping my foot.  Yet.  ;)

Siriusly Snapey Susan






From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 14:45:24 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 14:45:24 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4uu88+eh5i@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4v024+r3f1@eGroups.com>

> > Richard:
> >
> > Even the movie version of Snape is ambiguous and confusing.  I think they will have to give the viewer some insights into his actions, and a couple of flashbacks with Severus and Lily is not only the accurate way to do it but probably the easiest.  And I agree that JKR would probably object if they eliminated that story completely.  
> > 
> > I still have hope that the film makers intend to wrap up the story fairly accurately :)
> 
> 
> SSSusan:
> Oooooh, I really hope you are right, Richard.  NOT having that in the film would likely deprive this Alan Rickman fan of her most desired Snape line of the series:  "Look... at... me...."  
> 
> Could they possibly do that??  
> 
> Well, yeah, I think they could, given that they left out DD's "I'm not worried.  I'm with you" line.  :(
> 

Richard:

That was a good line, both touching and funny.  I think they did good in HBP with the "After all these years I just sort of go with it" line Harry says to Dumbledore.  And the "Frankly Professor, I have been asking myself that same thing for six years" line Ron says to McGonagall.  Funny, self-aware stuff I like to see in a long series :)


> My *hope* is that the PTB won't see the Snape memories as a diversion or distraction.  I think they could do a couple of the young Lily-young Snape scenes in maybe a minute, and then a couple of the Hogwarts Lily-Hogwarts Snape scenes in maybe one or two minutes more?  Done well, it could easily establish the length and depth of their relationship, as well as Snape's feelings for Lily.  Add in the quick conversations between Snape & DD as Snape confesses the prophecy overhear and makes his pledge and then his revelation about the silver doe patronus, and I think Harry [and the viewer] would get a LOT out of that.
> 
> Is that do-able in quick snippets, without taking up 10 minutes or so?  I'd like to think it is so that I can hold onto my hope.  I'm not sure that I fully *wanted* LOLLIPOPS (Snape's love of Lily) to be the reason for Snape's actions in turning away from Voldy and working with DD, but once JKR revealed that it was, it did make sense.  And now that we know it from JKR, I don't want it to be changed or dropped from the films.
> 

Richard:

I honestly think it is too important an element to eliminate completely, even within the movie universe.  Snape's actions in all the previous movies are still not fully explained.  Dumbeldore's unflappable trust in Snape is not explained.  And Harry discovering that Snape was in love with his Mother and that he had been trying to protect him for the last seventeen years is the only thing I could imagine that would make Harry stop hating Snape.  






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 15:22:47 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 15:22:47 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4t8aq+riht@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4v287+nr9f@eGroups.com>

zanooda:
> 
> Someone :-)? Bill will defend Fleur, of course :-). Greyback always attacks girls, right? Imagine, the DEs crash the wedding, there is a battle and Fenrir goes straight for the bride... :-).
>
Carol responds:

Not always. He prefers children, not necessarily girls. Remember the Montgomery sisters, who are walking around Hogwarts looking sad in HBP (IIRC) because Greyback killed their five-year-old brother? And, of course, it was Greyback who bit Remus Lupin. (Why he chose to attack Bill is unclear; maybe he was jealous of a healthy, handsome Wizard?) He also attacks Harry (an unidentified person casts Petrificus Totalus to save him), and he would have been delighted to have DD for "afters," which I take to be British English for "dessert."

Carol, who thinks that perhaps Greyback *prefers* girls because they're soft and pretty (cf. his words regarding Hermione) and (again perhaps) he takes a perverse pleasure in ruining their beauty before he kills them




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 15:43:02 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 15:43:02 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4t98b+4q4u@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4v3e6+mece@eGroups.com>

Carol earlier:
> > In the book, Bill's injuries are invisible at the wedding because of the magic of the Goblin-made tiara that Fleur has borrowed from Auntie Muriel
 
> zanooda:
> 
> How do you figure :-)? To be honest, such an idea never crossed my mind, because there is nothing about it in the book :-). I thought it was simply because Fleur was so happy and so full of love that day... :-).
>
Carol responds:
No, I'm pretty sure it's the magic of the tiara. After all, it's Goblin-made and Griphook seems to covet it (though not as much as he does the Sword of Gryffindor), and if Goblin-made armor possesses "special properties" (DH Am. ed. 298), it makes sense that the tiara would, too Here's the passage from the wedding:

"Fleur was wearing a simple white dress and seemed to be emitting a strong, silvery glow. While her radiance *usually* dimmed everyone else by comparison, today it beautified everybody it fell upon. Ginny and Gabrielle, both wearing golden dresses, looked even prettier than usual, and, once Fleur had reached him, Bill did not look as though he had ever met Fenrir Greyback" (DH 144, my emphasis).

There are two possible readings: either Fleur has turned on the Veela Charm, which is causing the glow and the beautification, or it's the tiara. But when Fleur turns on the Veela Charm, as when she's trying to get Cedric to ask her to the Yule Ball and Ron idiotically asks her instead, *she's* the one being beautified. And happy though she is with Bill, her beauty never extends to him on any other occasion, and much as she loves him, his scars are visible when they're together. For that reason, I think it's the Goblin-made tiara that's creating this effect. (Why mention it otherwise, unless it's just to put the idea of a tiara or diadem into the reader's mind? It doesn't help Harry in that respect. but JKR has taken care to introduce this particular tiara back in HBP in that great scene where Molly and Fleur are crying in each other's arms.)

Note that Auntie Muriel, watching the ceremony, says (in response to nothing more than Hermione's "Ooooh!") "Yes, my tiara sets off the whole thing nicely" (145). At first, I was mystified by that remark, and then I realized that it must be the tiara, not Fleur's Veela power, that was causing the glow and the beautification.

Carol, who suspects that Auntie M's remark passes over Harry's head or he'd have done a bit more thinking about the magical properties of tiaras



Carol,




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 15:55:21 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 15:55:21 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4ta20+iga3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4v459+101sb@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "zanooda2" <zanooda2 at ...> wrote:
>
> --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Richard Shepard" <shepardrj@> wrote:
> 
> > If they do all the necessary flashbacks, we will certainly see 
> > young Severus and young Lily. Do we know who they cast for these 
> > parts?
> 
> 
> zanooda:
> 
> Do you mean little Sev and little Lily (and maybe little Petunia) or only teenage Snape and Lily? I heard absolutely nothing about actors for these parts being cast, but they will be, right? They can't skip Snape's childhood memories altogether,I would be disappointed if they did. Mind you, I'm always disappointed :-), but if I won't get to see little Severus and Lily I will be *really* disappointed, LOL. I wonder if they will bring back the actors for teenage Snape and Lily from OotP, or cast new ones?
>
Carol:
I think that depends on whether they use the SWM they've already shot, complete with the cut scene with Lily, in which case they'll need the same actors. But if those actors have changed too much in the two or three(?) years since that scene was filmed, or if they decide to make it a bit more like the book version and reshoot it, they'll need new actors. The boy they used for Severus in that scene would be perfect for the twenty-year-old Snape coming to Dumbledore for help, but I'll bet they'll make him a mature adult, indistinguishable from his current self, and use Rickman for that part. After all, they had a thirty-something Lily and a forty-something James in SS/PS (I looked up their birthdates), and even film-goers should know from PoA and OoP that Severus and James are the same age.)

Carol, wishing that JKR had told the filmmakers that the Potters had died at 21 but realizing that it would have been odd to show eleven-year-old Harry seeing parents that age looking back at him from the Mirror of Erised




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 16:05:37 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 16:05:37 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <008901ca1176$6cfaa860$46eff920$@com>
Message-ID: <h4v4oh+jjho@eGroups.com>

md: 
> There's no one cast for young Snape or Lilly. The way the films have portrayed Snape as simply hating Harry because of his father, it looks like they are sticking with that until the end. They have never brought up who told Voldy about the prophecy or Harry blaming Snape for his parents death. I don't think the films will ever touch at why Snape was ever a death-eater, the focus is clearly on Harry's story and what they need to show to tell that.

Carol responds:
In which case, they'll have a hard time explaining Snape's doe Patronus or Harry's motive for looking at the memories (surely memories, plural) that Snape gives him. Hatred for James has always been a red herring; it can't be used to explain Snape's remorse or change of sides. I really hope that the filmmakers recognize his importance and take advantage of the big revelation and its (implied) impact on Harry, who moves from a desire for revenge to understanding and forgiveness as a result.

It *is* unfortunate that the films have shortchanged Snape and his motives, but there's still time to work up to the big reveal, which will provide a nice interlude between battle scenes if they do it right.

Carol, noting that those scenes can be filmed separately from the portions of the film involving the main cast and unconcerned by the omission of those characters' names this early in the production




From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 16:12:36 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 16:12:36 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <000001ca117e$00559280$0100b780$@com>
Message-ID: <h4v55k+m31s@eGroups.com>

md wrote: 
> I don't think WB had anything to do with it. I think it's Kloves. He distilled the characters to what he believes are their basic structures, hero, comic sidekick and well-of-knowledge. <snip>

Carol responds:
One way to test your theory would be to compare the writing of those three characters in OoP, which was scripted by Michael Goldenberg, with the films scripted by Steve Kloves. I don't care much for OoP (too much Umbridge, too little Snape, too much rewriting), so I'm not really prepared to say whether the three are stereotyped in that film. Anyone know offhand whether Hermione also gets Ron's lines in OoP?

Carol, who rather liked Kloves's version of the Ron/Hermione scenes at the Yule Ball but hated his treatment of the first and third tasks (nothing to do with those two characters)




From gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk  Fri Jul 31 16:37:54 2009
From: gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk (Geoff Bannister)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 16:37:54 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4v287+nr9f@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4v6l2+66sg@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:

Carol:
 
> He also attacks Harry (an unidentified person casts Petrificus Totalus to save him), and he would have been delighted to have DD for "afters," which I take to be British English for "dessert."

Geoff:
We've had this discussion on Main or OTC in the past.

The average UK English speaker will accept pudding/afters/dessert interchangeably.






From justcarol67 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 16:42:44 2009
From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 16:42:44 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4tjla+nu7h@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4v6u4+1mhq@eGroups.com>

Julie wrote:
> I hope you are wrong! That is a big part of the plot, Snape loving Lily and protecting Harry because of that love. <snip> Certainly there needs to be some reason for Snape to have switched and protected  Harry despite his hatred for Harry's father <snip>

Carol responds:
I agree completely, for reasons I explained in an earlier post.

Julie: 
> I know the two DH movies are being filmed simultaneously, but I'm sure the scenes are being grouped by what actors are in them. That is usually the case, especially with smaller roles, so the actor only has to take time to be available for the several weeks his part is being filmed rather than through the entire shoot. It's quite possible
> the younger Snape and Lily roles simply haven't been cast yet as they won't be filmed until next year <snip>

Carol:
Exactly.

Julie: 
> I fully expect the young Snape and Lily scenes to be cut, just as young Tom's scenes were cut down to only the two.

Carol:
Not "cut" as in omitted altogether but curtailed, with some scenes cut and others shortened, right? I think the swingset scene in which Severus tells Lily she's a witch is crucial, but they'll probably cut (eliminate) the tree branch, the Hogwarts Express, and all that. And they may use the full version of SWM, which has already been filmed, to cover the teen years. That would leave only the key adult scenes (as I said, I think they'll ignore Snape's age since they've done the same for James and Lily), with his remorse, his promise to protect Harry, his reluctant promise to kill DD, his demonstration of his doe Patronus, and, of course, the Harry - must - let - himself - be - killed - by - Voldemort scene. None of those scenes, in my view, is expendable, though I expect they'll all be condensed. (Remember how they combined the Barty Jr. and Karkaroff scenes in GoF, cutting out Ludo Bagman altogether. I think they'll do something similar in DH2.)

Carol, who thinks that the whole segment will probably take no more than five minutes but ought to be a heart-wrenching and eye-opening interlude

Julie:
> But I can't see how the filmmakers would get by with no young Snape loving young Lily scenes at all. And that was such a major plot point and reveal in the books that I can't see JKR being okay with the Snape loved Lily angle being dropped from the movie. 

Carol:
Exactly. Remember the hype before the DH book came out? It was all about Snape and Snape's motives. (Some betting syndicate even laid odds that Snape would kill Harry, IIRC!) The doe Patronus will require explanation, if nothing else, and that means bringing in Lily.

Carol, noting that although the epilogue will definitely be filmed, Albus Severus hasn't been cast yet, either, and his name will make no sense without "The Prince's Tale"




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 17:46:04 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 17:46:04 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4v3e6+mece@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4vaks+98ki@eGroups.com>

> Carol responds:
> 
> Carol, who suspects that Auntie M's remark passes over Harry's head or he'd have done a bit more thinking about the magical properties of tiaras
> 


Richard:

I suspect Harry was preoccupied with a lovely redhead in a golden dress that looked even prettier than usual :)






From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 31 18:07:23 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 14:07:23 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4v024+r3f1@eGroups.com>
References: <h4uu88+eh5i@eGroups.com> <h4v024+r3f1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <008701ca1209$c0ee0370$42ca0a50$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Richard Shepard

> > SSSusan:

> 
> Could they possibly do that?? 
> 
> Well, yeah, I think they could, given that they left out DD's "I'm not
worried. I'm with you" line. :(
> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

 

I don't recall every second, but I noticed everyone is complaining about
that line being left out. What's funny, is that I think it was Pete Travers,
in Rolling Stone, noted that line in his review of the film as one of the
films defining moments. (I've read lots of reviews, I'll try to find the
exact one and verify it was Travis for sure) So, wtf?

 

md



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From shepardrj at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 18:56:50 2009
From: shepardrj at yahoo.com (Richard Shepard)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 18:56:50 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <008701ca1209$c0ee0370$42ca0a50$@com>
Message-ID: <h4vepi+i692@eGroups.com>

> > > SSSusan:
> > 
> > Could they possibly do that?? 
> > 
> > Well, yeah, I think they could, given that they left out DD's "I'm not
> worried. I'm with you" line. :(
> > 
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> 
> md:  
> 
> I don't recall every second, but I noticed everyone is complaining about
> that line being left out. What's funny, is that I think it was Pete Travers,
> in Rolling Stone, noted that line in his review of the film as one of the
> films defining moments. (I've read lots of reviews, I'll try to find the
> exact one and verify it was Travis for sure) So, wtf?
> 

Richard:

I do not remember hearing that line, but I was not looking for it.  I had forgotten about that particular line until I reread the book.  There were some good lines in the movie, both out of the book and new.  The scene where Dumbeldore says the line in the book is fairly different in the movie.  I wonder if it shows up in a deleted scene that will be on the DVD.  





From lizzy1933 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 19:36:59 2009
From: lizzy1933 at yahoo.com (Lizzie Mae Lilly)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 19:36:59 -0000
Subject: AR has read the books, well, at least DH!
Message-ID: <h4vh4r+itme@eGroups.com>

Here's the link for the interview I was thinking of earlier:

http://rickman.tribe.net

Scroll down and click on:
Alan Rickman interview transcript from the Sweeney . . .

Here's the relevant quote:

Q:  Without any spoilers this film [HBP] does have some Snape's big moment.
AR:  Well, that's a spoiler, isn't it?

Q:  Are you looking forward to that without saying what it is?
AR:  Well, the only thing that I'll say is that for the first time shooting those films, I know what I'm doing and why.

Q:  Have you read ahead?
AR:  That's what I mean by that.

Q:  You've read the seventh book?
AR:  That's what I mean by that [laughs].

Also in the unauthorized bio by Maureen Paton there's a comment that he reads the book before making the movie, but I'd rather not use that book as a source as it's filled with errors and AR loaths it (with good reason).

Lizzy Mae




From gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk  Fri Jul 31 20:31:22 2009
From: gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk (Geoff Bannister)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 20:31:22 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <008701ca1209$c0ee0370$42ca0a50$@com>
Message-ID: <h4vkaq+dej2@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:

SSSusan: 
> > Could they possibly do that?? 

> > Well, yeah, I think they could, given that they left out DD's "I'm not
> worried. I'm with you" line. :(

md: 
> I don't recall every second, but I noticed everyone is complaining about
> that line being left out. What's funny, is that I think it was Pete Travers,
> in Rolling Stone, noted that line in his review of the film as one of the
> films defining moments. (I've read lots of reviews, I'll try to find the
> exact one and verify it was Travis for sure) So, wtf?

Geoff:
I've seen the film twice and, on the second visit to the cinema, I made a 
point of listening for that line. Unless I did the aural equivalent of blinking 
at the wrong moment, I didn't hear it.

I have also just checked on the Pete Travers Rolling Stone review and cannot 
see a reference to the line.




From md at exit-reality.com  Fri Jul 31 20:32:05 2009
From: md at exit-reality.com (Child Of Midian)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 16:32:05 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4vjr5+ngvn@eGroups.com>
References: <008701ca1209$c0ee0370$42ca0a50$@com> <h4vjr5+ngvn@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <00ba01ca121d$f7dbf720$e793e560$@com>

 

 

From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Geoff Bannister





Geoff:
PS to my recent post.

I just checked on the Pete Travers Rolling Stone review and cannot see 
a reference to that line.

>>>>>>>>

Me too, now it's bothering me because I can't find the review . hm. I also
read TIME. off to TIME!

 

md

___



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From sherriola at gmail.com  Fri Jul 31 20:36:38 2009
From: sherriola at gmail.com (Sherry Gomes)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 13:36:38 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <h4vkaq+dej2@eGroups.com>
References: <008701ca1209$c0ee0370$42ca0a50$@com> <h4vkaq+dej2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3E5E06A65F244D04B9CE248772964DD2@Pensieve>

md: 
> I don't recall every second, but I noticed everyone is complaining 
> about that line being left out. What's funny, is that I think it was 
> Pete Travers, in Rolling Stone, noted that line in his review of the 
> film as one of the films defining moments. (I've read lots of reviews, 
> I'll try to find the exact one and verify it was Travis for sure) So, wtf?

Geoff:
I've seen the film twice and, on the second visit to the cinema, I made a
point of listening for that line. Unless I did the aural equivalent of
blinking at the wrong moment, I didn't hear it.

I have also just checked on the Pete Travers Rolling Stone review and cannot
see a reference to the line.


Sherry now:

I am totally blind and love movies.  When I go to a movie, I am completely
focused on the sound and particularly the dialog.  I've been to this movie
twice now, and I have not heard that line ever.  I was listening for it,
because I think it's one of the most tender and defining  lines in the book,
possibly the series.  I'm as sure as I can be that it is not in the movie,
or at least not in this release.  Maybe it was and then was cut and will be
in a deleted scene or something on the DVD.

Sherry





From gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk  Fri Jul 31 20:58:29 2009
From: gbannister10 at tiscali.co.uk (Geoff Bannister)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 20:58:29 -0000
Subject: What do we know about Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows?
In-Reply-To: <00ba01ca121d$f7dbf720$e793e560$@com>
Message-ID: <h4vltl+igss@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child Of Midian" <md at ...> wrote:
 
Geoff:
> PS to my recent post.

> I just checked on the Pete Travers Rolling Stone review and cannot see 
> a reference to that line.

md: 
> Me too, now it's bothering me because I can't find the review . hm. I also
> read TIME. off to TIME!

Geoff:
I think I can see where you got it from - and perhaps misread it. The 
following is, as you suggest, from the review in TIME:

"The deepest kinship, man to boy, is Dumbledore's with Harry. From 
the start, when the dean of wizards puts a protective arm around Harry, 
to the probing trips they take through time and space, Dumbledore is 
Harry's true godfather ? a role into which the great Gambon pours his 
craggy majesty and cello voice. One might wish that their visit to 
Voldemort's cave had the shuddering poignancy it does in the book, 
where a weakened Dumbledore tells his prot?g?, "I am not worried, 
Harry. I am with you." But their scenes together cast a lingering spell.






From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 21:09:39 2009
From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 21:09:39 -0000
Subject: AR has read the books, well, at least DH!
In-Reply-To: <h4vh4r+itme@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4vmij+aqt8@eGroups.com>


> 
> Q:  Are you looking forward to that without saying what it is?
> AR:  Well, the only thing that I'll say is that for the first time shooting those films, I know what I'm doing and why.
> 
> Q:  Have you read ahead?
> AR:  That's what I mean by that.
> 
> Q:  You've read the seventh book?
> AR:  That's what I mean by that [laughs].

> 
> Lizzy Mae
>


LOL! I love Alan Rickman! Of all the actors, he had the hardest job of knowing how to play his character before the books had all come out. Given how popular both book and movie Snape are, I'm surprised how underutilized he's been in the films. I have very little faith that they won't ruin the memory sequence by watering it down too much! (as they did with his HBP revelation)

Joann




From sistermagpie at earthlink.net  Fri Jul 31 22:18:26 2009
From: sistermagpie at earthlink.net (sistermagpie)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 22:18:26 -0000
Subject: Bill's injury (Re: The Problems with the DH movie)
In-Reply-To: <h4v3e6+mece@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <h4vqji+qsr1@eGroups.com>

> Carol responds:
> No, I'm pretty sure it's the magic of the tiara. After all, it's Goblin-made and Griphook seems to covet it (though not as much as he does the Sword of Gryffindor), and if Goblin-made armor possesses "special properties" (DH Am. ed. 298), it makes sense that the tiara would, too Here's the passage from the wedding:
> 
> "Fleur was wearing a simple white dress and seemed to be emitting a strong, silvery glow. While her radiance *usually* dimmed everyone else by comparison, today it beautified everybody it fell upon. Ginny and Gabrielle, both wearing golden dresses, looked even prettier than usual, and, once Fleur had reached him, Bill did not look as though he had ever met Fenrir Greyback" (DH 144, my emphasis).
> 
> There are two possible readings: either Fleur has turned on the Veela Charm, which is causing the glow and the beautification, or it's the tiara. But when Fleur turns on the Veela Charm, as when she's trying to get Cedric to ask her to the Yule Ball and Ron idiotically asks her instead, *she's* the one being beautified. And happy though she is with Bill, her beauty never extends to him on any other occasion, and much as she loves him, his scars are visible when they're together. 

Magpie:
I think the point is that she's so happy on her wedding day that she's showering beauty on others. It's a sweet metaphor for her happiness as a bride using Veela magic as an excuse, imo, not a subtle example of goblin magic. The Ravenclaw tiara isn't known for doing anything magical, just being a Horcrux and being owned. 

I think the tiara's just a nice little detail and Aunt Muriel's line is just a character moment. She's taking credit for Fleur's beauty and responding as if Hermione's naturally impressed by the part of the outfit she provided rather than Fleur herself. I think you were mystified because you wouldn't expect somebody to be that self-centered.:-)

-m




From d2dmiles at yahoo.de  Fri Jul 31 22:25:32 2009
From: d2dmiles at yahoo.de (Miles)
Date: Sat, 1 Aug 2009 00:25:32 +0200
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
References: <h4thqi+hdta@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <1EE45723E3224A4581017DEE76C1E61B@miles>

dumbledore11214 wrote:
> md:
>> I don't think WB had anything to do with it. I think it's Kloves. He
>> distilled the characters to what he believes are their basic
>> structures, hero, comic sidekick and well-of-knowledge. It's really
>> a standard way for screenwriters to think. Everything has to be
>> high-concept in big-budget-Hollywood. However, I don't think WB
>> really keeps much of a hand in production. In fact, it was the last
>> three directors that opted for shorter films when WB was fine with
>> 2:45 run time and fine with GOF, OOTP & HBP being 6 films!!! It was
>> the directors that made the choices to cut, and Kloves who made the
>> choice to distill the characters.
> <SNIP>
>
>
> Alla:
>
> Well, when I say WB I certainly include Kloves into this  umbrella
> term, which I use quite loosely.
>
> And if it is a standard way for screen writers to think, well,
> supposedly this is what Hollywood deems acceptable, right? This is
> something which Kloves thinks producers will agree with, etc, right?
>
> I mean, the way I see it, it all goes together - producer finds
> director that will implement his vision, but which will be acceptable
> for producer as well and same for screenwriter IMO.

Miles
Alla expresses my initial thoughts on this. I think it's standard Hollywood
to simplify things in order to make them digestible for the average
moviegoer. And more, if you remember the American title of Philosopher's
stone, this seems to be a general idea for popular filming and writing. To
blame the author of this franchise to do what authors do all the time for
many Hollywood productions, IMO misses the point. I just saw a short scene
from the Valkyrie film with Tom Cruise as an ad for the DVD, and this one
scene with Cruise as Stauffenberg in the style of a typical action hero is
more than enough for me to be happy not to have seen this film.

> SSSusan:
> IOW, if the Warner team felt that doing those things *did* make it
> too complicated, did move too far away from the super-simplified,
> narrow role they'd determined each should play, then WOW.  What an
> insult to the average audience member -- kids included! And a
> definite disappointment to the many slightly older fans, the savvy
> kid fans and the read-'em-in-detail fans.
>
> I guess I'm saying I see Miles' suggestion as plausible; it's just if
> it's accurate, it's rather ridiculous imo for Warner to have assumed
> such major league simplification/distillation was necessary.

Miles
I totally agree. I think that children do "feel" depth in a film even if
they have problems of understanding everything of it. Not to speak of
grownups - while I agree that switching Philosopher's to Sourcerer's Stone
was and still is an insult to the people "meant" by it, it's a symptom of a
general practice.

Miles, who does not want to blame all Hollywood productions, there are many
fascinating films out there even in the major films





From sistermagpie at earthlink.net  Fri Jul 31 23:09:39 2009
From: sistermagpie at earthlink.net (sistermagpie)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 23:09:39 -0000
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
In-Reply-To: <1EE45723E3224A4581017DEE76C1E61B@miles>
Message-ID: <h4vtjj+sd8p@eGroups.com>

> > SSSusan:
> > IOW, if the Warner team felt that doing those things *did* make it
> > too complicated, did move too far away from the super-simplified,
> > narrow role they'd determined each should play, then WOW.  What an
> > insult to the average audience member -- kids included! And a
> > definite disappointment to the many slightly older fans, the savvy
> > kid fans and the read-'em-in-detail fans.
> >
> > I guess I'm saying I see Miles' suggestion as plausible; it's just if
> > it's accurate, it's rather ridiculous imo for Warner to have assumed
> > such major league simplification/distillation was necessary.
> 
> Miles
> I totally agree. I think that children do "feel" depth in a film even if
> they have problems of understanding everything of it. Not to speak of
> grownups - while I agree that switching Philosopher's to Sourcerer's Stone
> was and still is an insult to the people "meant" by it, it's a symptom of a
> general practice.
> 
> Miles, who does not want to blame all Hollywood productions, there are many
> fascinating films out there even in the major films

Magpie:
Just to throw out one thing about the title change, whether or not it makes it better or worse, but I have heard that the rumor that Philosopher's was changed to simplify it or dumb it down for American audiences isn't true. What they wanted was a title that indicated that the book was about magic/sorcery etc. I think they asked JKR to come up with an alternative title and she chose Sorcerer's Stone--which is pretty good given the options. So it's not that they just changed that word because it was too hard, it was that she went for Sorcerer's Stone rather than Harry Potter and the School of Magic or whatever and they liked that. 

So it was more about the title grabbing the right audience than simplifying in that case. US children's books aren't anti-4-syllable words on principle, iow.

-m





From d2dmiles at yahoo.de  Fri Jul 31 23:30:11 2009
From: d2dmiles at yahoo.de (Miles)
Date: Sat, 1 Aug 2009 01:30:11 +0200
Subject: Hermione/Emma Watson  (Re: The Romance  (was HBP))
References: <h4vtjj+sd8p@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <B86A1D97C4AA4AAB907075F52E9D2AFA@miles>

> Magpie:
> Just to throw out one thing about the title change, whether or not it
> makes it better or worse, but I have heard that the rumor that
> Philosopher's was changed to simplify it or dumb it down for American
> audiences isn't true. What they wanted was a title that indicated
> that the book was about magic/sorcery etc. I think they asked JKR to
> come up with an alternative title and she chose Sorcerer's
> Stone--which is pretty good given the options. So it's not that they
> just changed that word because it was too hard, it was that she went
> for Sorcerer's Stone rather than Harry Potter and the School of Magic
> or whatever and they liked that.
>
> So it was more about the title grabbing the right audience than
> simplifying in that case. US children's books aren't anti-4-syllable
> words on principle, iow.

Miles
But if you know what the philosopher's stone is, you know  it's closely 
connected to wizardry and magic, at least in modern fantasy literature. It 
does not exist, it was a dream of ancient alchemists, and if a story deals 
with an existing PS, it obviously is not a story taken from our world.

So, the preconception behind changing the term was that "philosopher's 
stone" is unknown to the average buyer of fantasy for kids and teenagers. 
And I do hope this is an insult.

Miles