From bgrugin at yahoo.com Mon Jun 1 02:11:39 2009 From: bgrugin at yahoo.com (bgrugin) Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 02:11:39 -0000 Subject: DH actors In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Carol again: And I also thought that it would be harder to make dark eyes blue using contacts than the other way around, MusicalBetsy here: Yes, you're right. I have brown eyes, and once in my college days, I decided to get green contacts (I already wore contacts, just usually not colored ones). But because my eyes were dark, the green contacts just sort of looked rather murky on me. I can't imagine being able to make brown eyes a pretty color of blue without it looking rather ugly. From md at exit-reality.com Mon Jun 1 04:00:32 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Nightbreed) Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 00:00:32 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: DH actors In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000901c9e26d$82a27f90$87e77eb0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bgrugin Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 10:12 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: DH actors MusicalBetsy here: Yes, you're right. I have brown eyes, and once in my college days, I decided to get green contacts (I already wore contacts, just usually not colored ones). But because my eyes were dark, the green contacts just sort of looked rather murky on me. I can't imagine being able to make brown eyes a pretty color of blue without it looking rather ugly. :::::::::::::::::::::; For Voldamort they do about 1/3 of the face with CGI to make the nose flat, I'm sure if they do an entire section of a face like that, they could change the color of DD's eyes the same way. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 1 18:35:41 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 18:35:41 -0000 Subject: DH actors In-Reply-To: <223F227C70EB4E9484D340A1E2230F4F@miles> Message-ID: Carol earlier: > > Obviously, -vitch is not a German ending (it's Russian, right?) but I was thinking of the village that JKR describes and the woman who says "I know not!" and then says something in German. So maybe he's a Russian or Slavic wandmaker who ended up in Germany? > > Miles: > My spontanous thought when reading this for the first time was "oh, he is living in Transylvania". I must admit that this firsth thought was not really logical, but could be the right direction: > > The name Gregorovich comes from a slavic language, so assuming Gregorovich is a Russian, Pole, Bulgarian or whatever, he could live in his home country and still in a village with German speaking people - there are still remains of the German colonies that once were spread all over Eastern Europe and Eastern Central-Europe - for example in Transylvania. > > But, and this was my fault, Romania is not a Slavic country - the name of the country is the origin of its language. The people in Transylvania would speak Romanian, Hungarian or German - but the name Gregorovich wouldn't fit into the language landscape, so to say. > > But it could be much more simple: Gregorovich could easily be an Austrian, a Swiss or German wizard, with immigrated ancestors. I just checked my local phonebook (in a city with 270,000 inhabitants in Germany) and found a Gregorowicz ;). > > Miles, noting that first thoughts usually only become good thoughts when thought out. > Carol responds: Are you by any chance using the British edition, and, if so, does it use the spelling "Gregorovich"? I just checked to make sure that I wasn't making an mistake: the American edition definitely uses the spelling "Gregorovitch." Originally, back in GoF, I assumed that his nationality was the same as Krum's (Romanian or Bulgarian, I forget) because he was Krum's wandmaker, or that he was Russian based on the name and the apparent location of Durmstrang. Then, like you, I thought of Gregorowicz, which would be Polish, but I was thrown off course by the obviously Alpine village with German-speaking inhabitants. (Gregorovitch's English isn't very good, either, but I can't recognize a specific accent or speaking style that might give away his nationality and we don't hear him speaking any language except English.) I checked a site with etymologies for surnames and didn't find Gregorovitch in any form, but I did find Grigorescu, which means "son of Grigore" in Romanian and Grigorov, which means "son of Grigor" in Bulgarian. Zanooda can tell us whether "Gregorovitch" has the same meaning in Russian. As for why he would be living in a German-speaking country, I have no idea. He could be in retirement (maybe Krum bought one of his last wands?) or he could, as you say, be an immigrant or the son of immigrants. I could be wrong, but Dolohov and Karkaroff seem to be former Hogwarts students despite their names, as the Lestranges and Malfoys (whose ancestors are presumably from France) definitely are. Anyway, I was thrown off by the Alpine village and the German-speaking mother, whose only "crime" was to live in Gregorovitch's old house. Come to think of it, that lets out the retirement theory. He must have lived in a German-speaking country *before* he moved to his current house, which may or may not be in the same country. Carol, now going with the immigrant theory as the only one that makes sense From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 1 18:40:48 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 18:40:48 -0000 Subject: DH actors In-Reply-To: <000901c9e26d$82a27f90$87e77eb0$@com> Message-ID: md wrote: > > For Voldamort they do about 1/3 of the face with CGI to make the nose flat, I'm sure if they do an entire section of a face like that, they could change the color of DD's eyes the same way. Carol responds: I suppose that they *could* have done so in previous films if they realized that the blue eyes would be important later, but it's rather too late now--unless Dumbledore (and, by extension, Aberforth) suddenly has twinkly blue eyes in DH that don't match what he had in the other films. And, of course, they'd have to give Teen!Dumbledore's eyes the same CGI treatment. Carol, guessing that the eye we'll see in the mirror fragment will be dark brown From d2dmiles at yahoo.de Mon Jun 1 22:26:12 2009 From: d2dmiles at yahoo.de (Miles) Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 00:26:12 +0200 Subject: DH actors References: Message-ID: <47DE6488DDD4460DB18D5A0B11CC4178@miles> Carol wrote: > Are you by any chance using the British edition, and, if so, does it > use the spelling "Gregorovich"? I just checked to make sure that I > wasn't making an mistake: the American edition definitely uses the > spelling "Gregorovitch." Miles I didn't check the spelling, so probably your spelling is correct and mine is wrong. But if the name Gregorovitch comes from a country using the Cyrillic alphabet, both would be transliterations into the Latin alphabet, usually in a way to match the pronounciation, a bit like phonetic spelling. While there are certain rules how to do it in a specific language, there are still many variations, for example by mistakes made by officials in an immigration office or simply by different languages a name is transliterated into - Gregorovitch for English, Gregorowitsch for German, probably different for French or Italian. > Carol, now going with the immigrant theory as the only one that makes > sense Miles Maybe not the only one that makes sense, but the easiest explanation and therefore the best one, with a nod to William of Ockham. From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Tue Jun 2 04:09:40 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 04:09:40 -0000 Subject: DH actors In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" wrote: > Are you by any chance using the British edition, and, if so, > does it use the spelling "Gregorovich"? zanooda: He is spelled with "-vitch" in both editions :-). I also sometimes spell him with "-vich", because, in my view, "t" is not needed here. Names like this are pronounced with the sound "ch" at the end, so I don't know what "t" is doing there :-). That's why sometimes I just write it how I hear it in my head and forget all about "t" :-). > Carol wrote: > I checked a site with etymologies for surnames and didn't > find Gregorovitch in any form, but I did find Grigorescu, > which means "son of Grigore" in Romanian and Grigorov, which > means "son of Grigor" in Bulgarian. Zanooda can tell us > whether "Gregorovitch" has the same meaning in Russian. zanooda: We have a name Grigori(or maybe it's Grigoriy :-)), and our version of Gregorovitch would be Grigorovich, so they should be connected. I can't explain the connection well, because, as I said, these surnames are not very typical and they don't sound too Russian. If you asked me about "-ov"... :-). But the "-ich" ending usually belongs to patronymics, so it easily can be "son of", although "-ov" also means "son of", so it seems like too much :-). > Carol: > maybe Krum bought one of his last wands? zanooda: That's what he said at the wedding :-). From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Tue Jun 2 19:30:51 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 19:30:51 -0000 Subject: DH actors In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "zanooda2" wrote: Carol earlier: > > Are you by any chance using the British edition, and, if so, does it use the spelling "Gregorovich"? > > > zanooda: > > He is spelled with "-vitch" in both editions :-). I also sometimes spell him with "-vich", because, in my view, "t" is not needed here. Names like this are pronounced with the sound "ch" at the end, so I don't know what "t" is doing there :-). That's why sometimes I just write it how I hear it in my head and forget all about "t" :-). Carol again: Probably because that sound is commonly spelled that way in English. "-Vitch" rhymes with "witch," a word that would certainly have been in the back of JKR's mind. "Itch," "ditch," "hitch," "pitch," and a certain insult that Molly addressed to Bellatrix Lestrange are also spelled with a (superfluous) "t." I think that -vitch, like -vich, is just an alternate spelling of -wicz, and JKR probably wasn't thinking about anything except the sound when she Anglicized it. (BTW, I checked GOF, and it's also spelled -vitch there. For once, the consistency editor was on her toes.) Carol earlier: > > > I checked a site with etymologies for surnames and didn't find Gregorovitch in any form, but I did find Grigorescu, which means "son of Grigore" in Romanian and Grigorov, which means "son of Grigor" in Bulgarian. Zanooda can tell us whether "Gregorovitch" has the same meaning in Russian. > zanooda: > > We have a name Grigori(or maybe it's Grigoriy :-)), and our version of Gregorovitch would be Grigorovich, so they should be connected. I can't explain the connection well, because, as I said, these surnames are not very typical and they don't sound too Russian. If you asked me about "-ov"... :-). But the "-ich" ending usually belongs to patronymics, so it easily can be "son of", although "-ov" also means "son of", so it seems like too much :-). > Carol responds: But -vitch, -vich, -wicz is Slavic, right? I once knew a kid from Poland whose last name was Olesniewicz. (Boy, was I proud of myself at age nine for being able to rattle that one off!) Anyway, English also has several variations of the "son" ending. For example, Johnson, Jennings, and Jenkins all mean "son of John" or "little John" or "descendant of John" ("Jen" is a dimunitive of John). Carol earlier: > > > maybe Krum bought one of his last wands? > > > zanooda: > > That's what he said at the wedding :-). > Carol again: (Slaps forehead.) Thanks. So that's where I got the idea that he'd retired. I was beginning to think that I'd made it up. Retired to, say, Austria or Switzerland, apparently, which might explain why it took Voldemort awhile to find him. Carol, now wondering why we're discussing Gregorovitch's name (as opposed to his casting) on the Movie list and feeling a lot more empathy for JKR's forgetfulness From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Tue Jun 2 21:24:21 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 21:24:21 -0000 Subject: DH actors In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" wrote: > Probably because that sound is commonly spelled that way > in English. zanooda: How about Rod Blagojevich, LOL? Slobodan Miloshevich is also spelled with "-ich", although sometimes they write him "Milosevic", with those small signs over "s" and "c" (this is more correct, of course, but no one would know how to pronounce this :-)). > Carol: > But -vitch, -vich, -wicz is Slavic, right? zanooda: Absolutely. It just seems more Southern Slavic than Russian to me, if you know what I mean. But I'm not an expert :-). > Carol, now wondering why we're discussing Gregorovitch's > name (as opposed to his casting) on the Movie list zanooda: I guess we were trying to figure out Gregorovitch's nationality in order to decide if that Croatian actor was a good fit for him :-). From no.limberger at gmail.com Tue Jun 9 17:02:12 2009 From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger) Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2009 10:02:12 -0700 Subject: FYI: HBP Won't be in IMAX Theaters on Opening Day Message-ID: <7ef72f90906091002l3941ab08p1dae223ef6593ed@mail.gmail.com> Just FYI. If you were planning to see HBP in an IMAX theater on opening day or weekend, you won't be able to. Apparently, IMAX and Paramount have a 4-week exclusive deal for IMAX theaters to show "Transforers 2". This has delayed release of HBP in IMAX theaters to 7/29/2009, but the film will still open on 7/15/2009 in regular theaters. Reference: http://tformers.com/transformers-imax-paramount-agreement-for-revenge-forces-delay-of-harry-potter-release/11743/news.html When I looked at the schedule for the IMAX theater that I had been planning to see HBP at, the week of 7/15/2009 only shows "Transformers 2". -- "Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!" From agdisney at msn.com Mon Jun 15 12:52:05 2009 From: agdisney at msn.com (Andrea Grevera) Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 05:52:05 -0700 Subject: Check out my photos on Facebook Message-ID: <495d514434f054d4b09c1212e3c272d2@localhost.localdomain> Hi hpfgu-movie at yahoogroups.com, I set up a Facebook profile where I can post my pictures, videos and events and I want to add you as a friend so you can see it. First, you need to join Facebook! Once you join, you can also create your own profile. Thanks, Andrea To sign up for Facebook, follow the link below: http://www.facebook.com/p.php?i=1252710804&k=SW1TZXQRW5WM5BBDRFXYQR&r hpfgu-movie at yahoogroups.com was invited to join Facebook by Andrea Grevera. If you do not wish to receive this type of email from Facebook in the future, please click on the link below to unsubscribe. http://www.facebook.com/o.php?k=c0c201&u=1064347506&mid=a04123G3f70a772G0G8 Facebook's offices are located at 1601 S. California Ave., Palo Alto, CA 94304. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Tue Jun 16 17:57:30 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 10:57:30 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Facebook? Message-ID: <160408.74440.qm@web59804.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> If you want to add me in facebook I am on there its just an easy fun way to keep in contact with friends and family. I enjoy it they hae allot of games and fun things to do like quizzes and such.? My name there is Rebekah :) Love,Red --- On Tue, 6/16/09, potioncat wrote: From: potioncat Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Facebook? To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, June 16, 2009, 9:50 AM Speaking of Facebook....can anyone explain the appeal of Facebook? I signed up, mainly because other adults were commenting on my kids' Facebook accounts. But I've yet to post and I've only "friended" my daugther. It seems to me to be a very public diary. And we all know what comes of playing with diaries.... Potioncat ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From agdisney at msn.com Tue Jun 16 18:47:34 2009 From: agdisney at msn.com (Andrea Grevera) Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 14:47:34 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Facebook? In-Reply-To: <160408.74440.qm@web59804.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <160408.74440.qm@web59804.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Sorry about the FACEBOOK email. Didn't mean to do it. ----- Original Message ----- From: Lady of Imladris To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 1:57 PM Subject: Re: [HPFGU-Movie] Facebook? If you want to add me in facebook I am on there its just an easy fun way to keep in contact with friends and family. I enjoy it they hae allot of games and fun things to do like quizzes and such. My name there is Rebekah :) Love,Red --- On Tue, 6/16/09, potioncat > wrote: From: potioncat > Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Facebook? To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, June 16, 2009, 9:50 AM Speaking of Facebook....can anyone explain the appeal of Facebook? I signed up, mainly because other adults were commenting on my kids' Facebook accounts. But I've yet to post and I've only "friended" my daugther. It seems to me to be a very public diary. And we all know what comes of playing with diaries.... Potioncat ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From brian at rescueddoggies.com Wed Jun 17 03:10:29 2009 From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 00:10:29 -0300 Subject: Facebook? Message-ID: <4A385EA5.3040409@rescueddoggies.com> I wouldn't worry too much. I don't THINK you'll meet Tom Riddle on Facebook. Let me know if you do Brian From KAREN-GARY at worldnet.att.net Wed Jun 17 08:35:41 2009 From: KAREN-GARY at worldnet.att.net (Gary Sapp & Karen J.S.) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 08:35:41 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? Message-ID: Just wondering if anyone is still steamed at WB for pulling HBP last fall so they could make more money on a summer release? I haven't seen much discussion of it so I thought I would ask. I plan on staying away that week just on principle, after all I have waited this long-what is a few more days? I think WB should be taken down a peg or two for being such money grubbing toadies. I guess for me it was the timing, they waited until the trailers for the movie had been posted all over the net and then pulled the plug. Seemed very arbitrary and calculating to me. What does everyone here think? From willsonkmom at msn.com Wed Jun 17 12:11:39 2009 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 12:11:39 -0000 Subject: Facebook? In-Reply-To: <4A385EA5.3040409@rescueddoggies.com> Message-ID: Brian wrote: > > I wouldn't worry too much. > I don't THINK you'll meet Tom Riddle on Facebook. > Let me know if you do Potioncat: HP4GU will be the first to know! My computer is so dark and so slow, it's something like a broken vanishing cabinet. So I don't imagine I'll do much on Facebook. Our church youth leader has an account and a lot of the youth make contact that way. I mainly created an account so I could monitor what they were doing. From no.limberger at gmail.com Wed Jun 17 14:04:14 2009 From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 07:04:14 -0700 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7ef72f90906170704k1c4ef9d0mff20654307f894e5@mail.gmail.com> >Gary wrote: >I plan on staying away that week just on principle, after all I >have waited this long-what is a few more days? No.Limberger responds While I respect anyone who decides not to see HBP at theaters on principal due to how WB delayed the opening for the summer, imo, I don't believe that this will have that much of a reduction in revenue for WB from the film. What I do believe may hurt WB is the fact that they totally screwed up when they picked the new date that prevents IMAX theaters from showing the film on opening day due to an exclusive 4-week contract that IMAX has with Paramount to show "Transformers 2" for 4 weeks. This delays the showing of HPB at IMAX theaters by 2 weeks. Ultimately, imo, anyone who decides not to see the film when it opens will eventually see if, either in a theater, on DVD or TV; especially if the reviews are very good. WB knows that HP has a very loyal fan base and that fans want to see the films. This makes any kind of a significant boycott very difficult to establish or sustain. While I was never happy that WB delayed the opening of HBP 8 months, I still plan to see it on opening day; albeit, not an IMAX theater as I had originally planned. -- "Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kempermentor at yahoo.com Wed Jun 17 14:55:30 2009 From: kempermentor at yahoo.com (kempermentor) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 14:55:30 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <7ef72f90906170704k1c4ef9d0mff20654307f894e5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: > No.Limberger responds > While I respect anyone who decides not to see HBP at theaters on > principal due to how WB delayed the opening for the summer, imo, > I don't believe that this will have that much of a reduction in revenue > for WB from the film. What I do believe may hurt WB is the fact > that they totally screwed up when they picked the new date that > prevents IMAX theaters from showing the film on opening day due > to an exclusive 4-week contract that IMAX has with Paramount to > show "Transformers 2" for 4 weeks. Kemper now: I won't see it until a week later, but I'll be paying to see another moive (Bruno or, if it's here, 500 Days of Summer) instead of HBP. I want to see both movies but neither of them need to be seen Sony Dynamic Digital Sound or THX, so I can wait for the DVDs to get to my library. Though, I know WB won't miss my $9.00... unless I can get the posters and lurkers here and at other forums to do the same... BWAHAHABWAHAHAHAHA Kemper From md at exit-reality.com Wed Jun 17 15:50:39 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 11:50:39 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <019d01c9ef63$5d12be40$17383ac0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Gary Sapp & Karen J.S. Just wondering if anyone is still steamed at WB for pulling HBP last fall so they could make more money on a summer release? I haven't seen much discussion of it so I thought I would ask. ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::; 100% not there until second or third week. No way WB should get #1 on opening weekend (they will, because you can't keep kids away and the film will be huge.) Personally I think 2 - 3 weeks at #2 would teach WB a lesson, shame we can't pull that off. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Wed Jun 17 18:16:15 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 11:16:15 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? Message-ID: <317966.5851.qm@web59808.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> I am I consider WB greedy Ferengi If any one watches star trek they will know what I am talking about :) Love,Red --- On Wed, 6/17/09, Gary Sapp & Karen J.S. wrote: From: Gary Sapp & Karen J.S. Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 17, 2009, 1:35 AM Just wondering if anyone is still steamed at WB for pulling HBP last fall so they could make more money on a summer release?? I haven't seen much discussion of it so I thought I would ask. I plan on staying away that week just on principle, after all I have waited this long-what is a few more days? I think WB should be taken down a peg or two for being such money grubbing toadies.? I guess for me it was the timing, they waited until the trailers for the movie had been posted all over the net and then pulled the plug.? Seemed very arbitrary and calculating to me. What does everyone here think? ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Wed Jun 17 18:56:55 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 18:56:55 -0000 Subject: Kloves interview Message-ID: For those who are interested, an interview with Steve Kloves about HBP: http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/herocomplex/2009/06/countdown-to-harry-potter-and-the-half-blood-prince-steve-kloves-talks-up-the-final-moments-between-.html You can also get there via a link from this Leaky article: http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2009/6/17/la-times-interview-with-screenwriter-steve-kloves-on-harry-potter-and-the-half-blood-prince zanooda From ekrdg at verizon.net Wed Jun 17 20:24:05 2009 From: ekrdg at verizon.net (Kimberly) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 16:24:05 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Honestly, I'm not waiting. I'll definitely be there opening night, hopefully at midnight. I understand the principle behind it but I don't think there's anyway they're NOT going to have a blockbuster weekend. Regardless of when I see it they will be #1 so why should I miss it, especially when I've been waiting SO long?! Just wondering if anyone is still steamed at WB for pulling HBP last fall so they could make more money on a summer release? I haven't seen much discussion of it so I thought I would ask. I plan on staying away that week just on principle, after all I have waited this long-what is a few more days? I think WB should be taken down a peg or two for being such money grubbing toadies. I guess for me it was the timing, they waited until the trailers for the movie had been posted all over the net and then pulled the plug. Seemed very arbitrary and calculating to me. What does everyone here think? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.74/2181 - Release Date: 06/16/09 17:55:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Wed Jun 17 21:40:54 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 17:40:54 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <003e01c9ef94$4b05a830$e110f890$@com> They didn't pull it to make "more" money, they pulled it to keep it off their 2008 balance sheet. As a publically traded company, if they make more money one year than the last it's viewed as a "loss" and since Batman made sooooooooooooooooooooooo much last year they decided that 2009 had too weak a slate to equal both Batman and HPB in the same year. They held the movie strictly so 2008 would not be a bigger year than 2009. I won't go opening weekend, it's just a movie and my daughter was all excited to see it in fall and they told a million children to f* - off so they could manipulate their earnings reports. That was just wrong. md From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kimberly Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 4:24 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? Honestly, I'm not waiting. I'll definitely be there opening night, hopefully at midnight. I understand the principle behind it but I don't think there's anyway they're NOT going to have a blockbuster weekend. Regardless of when I see it they will be #1 so why should I miss it, especially when I've been waiting SO long?! Just wondering if anyone is still steamed at WB for pulling HBP last fall so they could make more money on a summer release? I haven't seen much discussion of it so I thought I would ask. I plan on staying away that week just on principle, after all I have waited this long-what is a few more days? I think WB should be taken down a peg or two for being such money grubbing toadies. I guess for me it was the timing, they waited until the trailers for the movie had been posted all over the net and then pulled the plug. Seemed very arbitrary and calculating to me. What does everyone here think? ---------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.74/2181 - Release Date: 06/16/09 17:55:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Thu Jun 18 00:14:33 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 17:14:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? Message-ID: <258959.29309.qm@web59813.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> I'm mad at what they did but that doesn't mean I am gonna boycott it - in fact I took an extra day off so I can go see the midnight showing. I haven't missed one yet and I am not about too Love,Red --- On Wed, 6/17/09, Child of Midian wrote: From: Child of Midian Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 17, 2009, 2:40 PM They didn't pull it to make "more" money, they pulled it to keep it off their 2008 balance sheet. As a publically traded company, if they make more money one year than the last it's viewed as a "loss" and since Batman made sooooooooooooooooooooooo much last year they decided that 2009 had too weak a slate to equal both Batman and HPB in the same year. They held the movie strictly so 2008 would not be a bigger year than 2009. I won't go opening weekend, it's just a movie and my daughter was all excited to see it in fall and they told a million children to f* - off so they could manipulate their earnings reports. That was just wrong. md From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kimberly Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 4:24 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? Honestly, I'm not waiting. I'll definitely be there opening night, hopefully at midnight. I understand the principle behind it but I don't think there's anyway they're NOT going to have a blockbuster weekend. Regardless of when I see it they will be #1 so why should I miss it, especially when I've been waiting SO long?! Just wondering if anyone is still steamed at WB for pulling HBP last fall so they could make more money on a summer release? I haven't seen much discussion of it so I thought I would ask. I plan on staying away that week just on principle, after all I have waited this long-what is a few more days? I think WB should be taken down a peg or two for being such money grubbing toadies. I guess for me it was the timing, they waited until the trailers for the movie had been posted all over the net and then pulled the plug. Seemed very arbitrary and calculating to me. What does everyone here think? ---------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.74/2181 - Release Date: 06/16/09 17:55:00 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Thu Jun 18 01:01:37 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 21:01:37 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <258959.29309.qm@web59813.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <258959.29309.qm@web59813.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000701c9efb0$54e5d200$feb17600$@com> I'm not boycotting it, I'm just not helping them get their opening weekend gross, big corporations need to respect the fans. The movie will be the same movie 1 or 2 weeks later. As far as I'm concerned we missed the midnight showing, back in November! I will also be very, very annoyed in two years, after DH part II is done and they turn around and release special extended editions of all 7 films!!! It's only been rumored, but you know it'll make money so they'll do it. md From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lady of Imladris Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 8:15 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? I'm mad at what they did but that doesn't mean I am gonna boycott it - in fact I took an extra day off so I can go see the midnight showing. I haven't missed one yet and I am not about too Love,Red [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From brian at rescueddoggies.com Thu Jun 18 00:40:25 2009 From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian) Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 21:40:25 -0300 Subject: Facebook? Message-ID: <4A398CF9.5010705@rescueddoggies.com> Hmm Spies R us? If I were younger, that would be enough to make me leave the youth group and go join Voldemort Brian From sartoris22 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 18 13:21:33 2009 From: sartoris22 at yahoo.com (sartoris22) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 13:21:33 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <142bec440c6a586efebfed43ad6d8348@verizon.net> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, Valerie Flowe wrote: > Behalf Of Gary Sapp & Karen J.S. > > > Just wondering if anyone is still steamed at WB for pulling HBP last > > fall so > > they could make more money on a summer release? I haven't seen much > > discussion of it so I thought I would ask. Sartoris22: I was extremely angry that Warner Bros. delayed the film opening, and then I heard that other countries were going to see it sooner than in America, but WB moved the date back to July 15, although I don't know why. Perhaps HP is just too popular for the good of the fans. WB knew that it could delay the movie, and although fans would grumble, they would still go see the movie when it came out. Of course, some fans won't go see the movie, and they should be applauded. I, however, will go see the movie, probably during its first week, if not opening day. I suppose it comes down to suppy and demand--there's only one HP, and the demand is huge. To me, there's really nothing out there that compares to HP. But I will say this--I'm probably looking more forward to reading the responses to the film in this chat room than I am to seeing the film itself. From no.limberger at gmail.com Thu Jun 18 13:20:41 2009 From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 06:20:41 -0700 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <142bec440c6a586efebfed43ad6d8348@verizon.net> References: <019d01c9ef63$5d12be40$17383ac0$@com> <142bec440c6a586efebfed43ad6d8348@verizon.net> Message-ID: <7ef72f90906180620l55322417vfff6c42c888d307a@mail.gmail.com> >Valerie wrote: >I don't have that type of discipline! I've been waiting so darn long >for this movie, I'll be there on Opening Night, and then go and see it >again on IMAX when Transformers goes onward! No.Limberger responds: Me either. Having to wait an additional 8 months to see HBP is more than enough waiting for me. We haven't yet decided whether we're going to go and see it again 2 weeks later at the IMAX once Transformers pulls out. While I understand why people want to wait and not see it opening week as a way to punish WB, I doubt that the total number of people who actually do this will really have any impact on total box office receipts. Also, given that they plan to go and see it later, it means that WB isn't actually going to lose any revenue over it. If I were to delay myself from seeing it, I'd feel I was punishing myself by making myself wait even longer. -- "Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kempermentor at yahoo.com Thu Jun 18 14:40:47 2009 From: kempermentor at yahoo.com (kempermentor) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 14:40:47 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <7ef72f90906180620l55322417vfff6c42c888d307a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: > No.Limberger responds: > While I understand why people want to wait and not see it > opening week as a way to punish WB, I doubt that the total > number of people who actually do this will really have any > impact on total box office receipts. Also, given that they plan > to go and see it later, it means that WB isn't actually going to > lose any revenue over it. If I were to delay myself from seeing > it, I'd feel I was punishing myself by making myself wait even > longer. Kemper now: If everyone who said they were annoyed with WB's decision chose to see the movie by paying to see an alternate movie, WB would be 'punished' or at least have less money then they anticipated. AND... your money go to support other movies/artists that you like. The WB loses revenue. You support a personal fave. It's win/win for you the viewer :) Kemper From md at exit-reality.com Thu Jun 18 14:58:19 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 10:58:19 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: References: <7ef72f90906180620l55322417vfff6c42c888d307a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <002601c9f025$384f3120$a8ed9360$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kempermentor Kemper now: If everyone who said they were annoyed with WB's decision chose to see the movie by paying to see an alternate movie, WB would be 'punished' or at least have less money then they anticipated. AND... your money go to support other movies/artists that you like. The WB loses revenue. You support a personal fave. It's win/win for you the viewer :) Kemper ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: I personally feel that after 8 months, 7 - 14 day is just no big deal. I think it's a shame that so many people are going to pant and submit to WB to get their bone, but big business is the pack leader I guess. Imagine the message it would send if a million fans sat out the first weekend, it would be the fans taking ownership of the property. It wouldn't matter if the film still made $400,000,000, that opening weekend is a huge deal to them, loosing it would make them look like the selfish fools they are. I was really pissed when they delayed the film, but I'm hardly loosing sleep waiting for it come out, and I'll be just fine that first week knowing I haven't seen it yet. Then I'll go to a nice, chill matinee with a smaller crowd and enjoy it more. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From no.limberger at gmail.com Thu Jun 18 15:22:14 2009 From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 08:22:14 -0700 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: References: <7ef72f90906180620l55322417vfff6c42c888d307a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7ef72f90906180822v3939cb6dq570a218dfbe42c2b@mail.gmail.com> >Kemper wrote: >If everyone who said they were annoyed with WB's decision chose >to see the movie by paying to see an alternate movie, WB would >be 'punished' or at least have less money then they anticipated. >AND... your money go to support other movies/artists that you like. >The WB loses revenue. No.Limberger responds: The only way that WB would actually lose revenue on HBP would be if a significant number of fans didn't see the movie until its out on commercial television. Otherwise, a delay in revenue by going to see the movie at a theater 1 to 2 weeks later is still revenue in WB's bank account. Yes, I'm not happy with WB for a number of reasons, not just the 8-month delay in releasing HBP; but I still want to see the film and no one else is ever going to produce one. So, yeah, I'll be seeing HBP opening night because I don't want to wait another 1 to 2 weeks to see it in theaters nor do I want to wait to see it for free on commercial television. -- "Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Thu Jun 18 16:19:59 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 12:19:59 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <7ef72f90906180822v3939cb6dq570a218dfbe42c2b@mail.gmail.com> References: <7ef72f90906180620l55322417vfff6c42c888d307a@mail.gmail.com> <7ef72f90906180822v3939cb6dq570a218dfbe42c2b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <004b01c9f030$a0aabbd0$e2003370$@com> What I love are the people that go to the midnight showing, then complain about how much they hated what the director did to the book then next day. And have done if five times and will still do it three more. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 18 17:50:34 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 17:50:34 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <000701c9efb0$54e5d200$feb17600$@com> Message-ID: "Child of Midian" wrote: > > I'm not boycotting it, I'm just not helping them get their opening weekend gross, big corporations need to respect the fans. The movie will be the same movie 1 or 2 weeks later. Carol responds: I'm not in the least annoyed. I understand perfectly why WB would want larger profits in 2009 than 2008, and I learned the life lesson of deferred gratification many years ago. Sure, it was a disappointment at first, but I didn't lose any sleep over it, and with all the trailers and so forth, I feel as if I've practically seen the movie already. That said, I never go to a big film (HP, LOTR, etc.) on opening day (or weekend). I'll wait about a week until the crowds thin out. md wrote: > I will also be very, very annoyed in two years, after DH part II is done and they turn around and release special extended editions of all 7 films!!! It's only been rumored, but you know it'll make money so they'll do it. Carol responds: Why be annoyed? Of course, they're out to make money. That's what big corporations do. And I'd love to see the films with the deleted scenes included, not just the ones in the extras but the ones we never saw at all. (Snape's task in SS/PS? Was that ever filmed?) I don't have the extended edition of LOTR, but I've seen it and I enjoyed it--and I understand perfectly why those scenes weren't included in the already long theatrical version. Carol, who has other lost causes to fight > > md From md at exit-reality.com Thu Jun 18 18:30:29 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 14:30:29 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: References: <000701c9efb0$54e5d200$feb17600$@com> Message-ID: <007001c9f042$db83de50$928b9af0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carol Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 1:51 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? Carol responds: Why be annoyed? Of course, they're out to make money. That's what big corporations do. And I'd love to see the films with the deleted scenes included, not just the ones in the extras but the ones we never saw at all. (Snape's task in SS/PS? Was that ever filmed?) I don't have the extended edition of LOTR, but I've seen it and I enjoyed it--and I understand perfectly why those scenes weren't included in the already long theatrical version. Carol, who has other lost causes to fight > LOTR was different, they announced before the Theatrical DVD that the extended version was coming, so you knew in three months the Extended version would be out, and it was only 90 days, it's been 6 years since the first HP film. With LOTR you could rent the theatrical if you wanted to see it again right-away because only 90 days later the extended cut was on it's way. I also don't agree with the unabashed support of corporate greed, constantly holding back on customers with releases so that you can keep adding and re-releasing to milk repeat sales is just wrong. The technology to include both a theatrical and extended cut on one DVD has existed since before the first film, both X-Men and T2 used it to great effect. The issue is that they know they are dangling meat before a hungry dog, they keep offering larger pieces to get new tricks. WB is releasing on the extended cut of Watchmen next month, that's a good call. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kempermentor at yahoo.com Fri Jun 19 01:40:22 2009 From: kempermentor at yahoo.com (kempermentor) Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 01:40:22 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <7ef72f90906180822v3939cb6dq570a218dfbe42c2b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: > No.Limberger responds: > The only way that WB would actually lose revenue on HBP would > be if a significant number of fans didn't see the movie until its > out on commercial television. Otherwise, a delay in revenue by > going to see the movie at a theater 1 to 2 weeks later is still revenue in WB's bank account. Kemper now: I see I was unclear. I will go to my local cineplex. I will pay to see Movie X (a non-WB movie); however, I will actually walk into the theater showing HBP rather than the theater showing Movie X. Movie X will be getting my money even though I will in fact be watching HBP. Kemper From no.limberger at gmail.com Fri Jun 19 02:43:46 2009 From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 19:43:46 -0700 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: References: <7ef72f90906180822v3939cb6dq570a218dfbe42c2b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7ef72f90906181943r30a2e8b0k883c4f31a4eb9a53@mail.gmail.com> >Kemper wrote: >I will pay to see Movie X (a non-WB movie); however, I will actually >walk into the theater showing HBP rather than the theater showing >Movie X. >Movie X will be getting my money even though I will in fact be >watching HBP. No.Limberger responds: Well, if the tickets appear identical for Movie X and HPB, that could work. Of course, if HPB is sold out and you manage to get in before someone else who actually bought a ticket, but can't find a seat, who are you hurting then? Personally, I have my doubts as to whether your scheme will work given that the tickets are probably color-coded and there will be an usher checking them. Two wrongs do not make a right. -- "Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kempermentor at yahoo.com Fri Jun 19 03:31:41 2009 From: kempermentor at yahoo.com (kempermentor) Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 03:31:41 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <7ef72f90906181943r30a2e8b0k883c4f31a4eb9a53@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: > No.Limberger responds: > Well, if the tickets appear identical for Movie X and HPB, that > could work. Of course, if HPB is sold out and you manage to > get in before someone else who actually bought a ticket, > but can't find a seat, who are you hurting then? Personally, > I have my doubts as to whether your scheme will work given > that the tickets are probably color-coded and there will be > an usher checking them. Kemper now: I still don't plan on going for a week out due to circumstance. So less likely to take the seat of another ticket holder. The major theaters where I live are all the same with their tickets. There is no color coding. That would be expensive and efficient. I'll buy a ticket. I will walk to the ticket checker who will check the tickets of various movies playing at her/his side of the theater including Movie X and Harry Potter. The person checking the ticket (a youth, typically) will most likely be apathetic to whether I see HBP or Movie X for various possible reasons (hating management, overworked, paid minimum wage or barely above, under-appreciated, tired, stoned, whatever.) No one will check my ticket when I enter the designated theater and if they do, they won't be vigilant (they'll assume I'm showing them the accurate ticket, glance at it, and move on to the next ticket holder.) I'll enter the theater and sit near an aisle, eat some popcorn, drink some water, cheer or boo at some trailers, and enjoy the show. > No.Limberger: > Two wrongs do not make a right. Kemper now: There's only one wrong, and I'm making it right. You can, too. Kemper From brian at rescueddoggies.com Fri Jun 19 02:28:45 2009 From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 23:28:45 -0300 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? You lot of traitors Message-ID: <4A3AF7DD.3000405@rescueddoggies.com> Some of us have principles, unlike WB, who campaiged against piracy with the slogan "what are you teaching your children?" then turned around and taught them that breaking your word is okay if you can make a buck out of it. If enough people have a bit more spine in them, we could really hurt their opening week headlines. 1) DON'T see it in the first week 2) SEE it only once in a cinema (not like the last one which I saw five times). (Let's face it after a few days you can download it from online anway!) 3) TRY to avoid talking about it with your usual enthusiasm afterwards as that would encourage others to see it. 4) BOYCOTT all other WB movies which you are that bothered about but would probably have gone to see. What are you going to teach your children? That fighting for something right isn't worth the trouble? Good lesson. It's thanks to the likes of all of you who will still go in the opening week that big studios get away with treating fans like dirt. Congratulations. You deserve the treatment and lies WB are dishing out. And shame on the sites like mugglenet which are still promoting it. Brian From iluvoz2 at yahoo.com Fri Jun 19 03:37:49 2009 From: iluvoz2 at yahoo.com (*BARB*) Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 03:37:49 -0000 Subject: Harry Potter exhibit Message-ID: Has anyone seen the Harry potter exhibit in Chicago yet? We are going in September and wondered if you loved it or were disappointed with the exhibit? Sorry if this has been discussed already thanks BArb From md at exit-reality.com Fri Jun 19 14:50:31 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 10:50:31 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <7ef72f90906181943r30a2e8b0k883c4f31a4eb9a53@mail.gmail.com> References: <7ef72f90906180822v3939cb6dq570a218dfbe42c2b@mail.gmail.com> <7ef72f90906181943r30a2e8b0k883c4f31a4eb9a53@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <00bb01c9f0ed$4b0bf500$e123df00$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of No Limberger No.Limberger responds: Well, if the tickets appear identical for Movie X and HPB, that could work. Of course, if HPB is sold out and you manage to get in before someone else who actually bought a ticket, but can't find a seat, who are you hurting then? Personally, I have my doubts as to whether your scheme will work given that the tickets are probably color-coded and there will be an usher checking them. ::::::::::::::::::::::; What High Security: Super-Max multi-plex do you go too? When I went to see Star Trek (opening weekend) no one even took and tore our tickets so much as checked them. Color coded? WOW! You've got an imagination!!! They use a heat-sensitive coated paper to "print" tickets, which come pre-printed with the theaters info. They also print the title of the movie on tickets, so color-coding would only be for the illiterate ushers and I don't think they make a habit of hiring children and seniors who can't read. My favorite local theater, the Rave, is a huge horseshoe, once you walk past the ticket-taker and you can just wonder into any theater you want unmolested and unchecked. My other local theater sells tickets outside and 90% of the time doesn't even take the stubs. Color coded? :-D [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Fri Jun 19 14:53:08 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 10:53:08 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? You lot of traitors In-Reply-To: <4A3AF7DD.3000405@rescueddoggies.com> References: <4A3AF7DD.3000405@rescueddoggies.com> Message-ID: <00c001c9f0ed$a933f600$fb9be200$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Brian Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 10:29 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? You lot of traitors Some of us have principles, unlike WB, who campaiged against piracy with the slogan "what are you teaching your children?" then turned around and taught them that breaking your word is okay if you can make a buck out of it. :::::::::::::::: I love the anti-piracy ads on DVD's for 3 yr olds!!!! When I copy a DVD at home it's so that other rental customers can enjoy the original, I don't want to hog it more than 24hrs. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From YasminOaks at aol.com Fri Jun 19 00:09:52 2009 From: YasminOaks at aol.com (YasminOaks at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 20:09:52 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8CBBE89672F1A4F-2B78-147E@webmail-stg-m06.sysops.aol.com> "Child of Midian" wrote: > > I'm not boycotting it, I'm just not helping them get > > their opening weekend gross, big corporations need to > > respect the fans. The movie will be the same movie 1 > > or 2 weeks later. Carol responds: > That said, I never go to a big film (HP, LOTR, > etc.) on opening day (or weekend). I'll wait about a > week until the crowds thin out. Cathy: I think I can understand and accept WB's decision to postpone the movie and honestly I think the anticipation is making this movie the one I am most excited to see. I also have to admit that I am not a crowd person at all. I never go to see any movie the opening week or two or three even, but I think I will be making an exception and ?seeing this movie the first week. :) I had the most wonderful experience in seeing The Order of The Phoenix. I had taken my daughters to the local theatre to see a free movie that they offer on Wednesdays at 10:00 in the morning. Well when we got there I noticed that at 10:30 OOP was playing. So I bought tickets to that instead and honestly there was only one other family in the whole theatre for it. I had no idea it was coming out on a Wednesday, let alone at 10:30 in the morning. I just so happened to be there and that was luck. It was the first time I had ever seen a movie the day it came out and the first showing too. I was very proud of that. I dislike crowds as there always seems to be someone talking throughout the movie. I don't go to the movies often at all and when I do I really want to enjoy it without any interruptions. I have found that if I go during a weekday at an earlier time I can avoid this. Hugs, Cathy From brian at rescueddoggies.com Sat Jun 20 05:13:32 2009 From: brian at rescueddoggies.com (Brian) Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 02:13:32 -0300 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? Message-ID: <4A3C6FFC.1020202@rescueddoggies.com> Brilliant idea. Pay for another film and see HP instead Why didn't I think of that? From lizzy1933 at yahoo.com Sat Jun 20 21:00:55 2009 From: lizzy1933 at yahoo.com (Lizzie Mae Lilly) Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 21:00:55 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: <4A3C6FFC.1020202@rescueddoggies.com> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, Brian wrote: > > Brilliant idea. Pay for another film and see HP instead > > Why didn't I think of that? > Most movie times aren't actually close enough to manage this. After all if we're smart enough to figure this out, the cinema managers have thought of it too. Mostly though they're trying to avoid people watching one movie and then going to another, but it works out the same way. Lizzie From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Sat Jun 20 23:10:07 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 23:10:07 -0000 Subject: Casting news--Runcorn Message-ID: Actor David O'Hara has been cast as Runcorn, the MoM employee whose identity Harry assumes in DH when HRH attempt to steal the locket from Umbridge. I couldn't find out anything on his height, but apparently he has a deep raspy voice. (He's somewhat better looking than I pictured Runcorn as being, but if he's big and mean-looking, he'll do! http://www.harrypotterspage.com/?p=1753 The info hasn't been posted on IMDb yet, but you can find his filmography here: http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0641244/ He once played Bill Sikes in "Oliver Twist," which sounds promising, but he also once played John the Baptist! Carol, not looking forward to seeing Imelda Staunton as Umbridge again! From md at exit-reality.com Sun Jun 21 00:09:02 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 20:09:02 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6? In-Reply-To: References: <4A3C6FFC.1020202@rescueddoggies.com> Message-ID: <001f01c9f204$7c187b60$74497220$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lizzie Mae Lilly Most movie times aren't actually close enough to manage this. After all if we're smart enough to figure this out, the cinema managers have thought of it too. Mostly though they're trying to avoid people watching one movie and then going to another, but it works out the same way. Lizzie ::::::::::::::::::: I used to do it all the time as a kid to sneak into R rated films. They stagger the films, usually 15 - 20 minutes to control the flow of people and prevent 600 people in line for 15 movies all at one time. With the multiplex (the theater in my town growing up had 3 theaters, a large "premier" theater and two smaller ones to phase films out in) and 10 -15 -20 films playing there's always a film starting, always!!! md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Sun Jun 21 04:04:21 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 04:04:21 -0000 Subject: New HBP posters: good guys and bad guys Message-ID: Here's a link to two new posters, good guys and bad guys. http://www.harrypotterspage.com/?p=1842 Rather than making tinyurls to the separate pages, I'll just let you click on the links from there. The good guys are no surprise (Harry in front, Dumbledore to his left, Hermione and Ron in back), but the "bad guys" poster has Snape front and center, with Draco to his right and Bellatrix and Fenrir Greyback to his left. Talk about misleading advertising! But, if it plays right, most viewers who haven't read the books will think that Snape is a murdering traitor but a few astute ones (the Snape fans?) may guess that things aren't always as they seem. Lovely posters, anyway. Carol, who doesn't remember nearly this many posters or TV spots or even trailers for any other HP film From CatMcNulty at comcast.net Sun Jun 21 15:40:34 2009 From: CatMcNulty at comcast.net (Cat) Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 15:40:34 -0000 Subject: Casting news--Runcorn In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" wrote: > > Actor David O'Hara has been cast as Runcorn, the MoM employee whose identity Harry assumes in DH when HRH attempt to steal the locket from Umbridge. I couldn't find out anything on his height, but apparently he has a deep raspy voice. (He's somewhat better looking than I pictured Runcorn as being, but if he's big and mean-looking, he'll do! > > http://www.harrypotterspage.com/?p=1753 > > The info hasn't been posted on IMDb yet, but you can find his filmography here: > > http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0641244/ > > He once played Bill Sikes in "Oliver Twist," which sounds promising, but he also once played John the Baptist! > > Carol, not looking forward to seeing Imelda Staunton as Umbridge again! > According to imdb O'Hara is 5'11". I can so see him as Bill Sikes. John the Baptist not as much. What I remember him from is the "crazy" Irishman in Braveheart. An excellent character actor that can definitely play "dangerous" & "brooding" characters that are "slightly off". He should do quite well. Cat From CatMcNulty at comcast.net Sun Jun 21 16:09:07 2009 From: CatMcNulty at comcast.net (Cat) Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 16:09:07 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps Message-ID: This is sort of prompted by a recent interview with David Heyman. Now that we are reaching the end of the Harry Potter saga I was wondering what you thought of the casting for the series. Heyman commented on how lucky they we're to have gotten Dan, Emma and Rupert as the young leads. And I do have to agree whole heartedly. Most of the casting has been spot on however, there have been a couple of mis-steps IMHO ... Gambon as Dumbledore - It really seemed that he has tried to distance himself from the characterization that was established by Richard Harris AND the BOOKS!!!! (Big Mistake)I really wish they had cast Peter O'Toole. Harris' family campaigned for him and physically, he looks like Dumbledore. In hind-sight, this is not really a mis-step BUT: Oldman as Sirius - He didn't "look" the part as I had envisioned him from the books. I thought he was taller and more handsome. But his characterization won me over. Just IMHO, Cat From willsonkmom at msn.com Sun Jun 21 17:30:15 2009 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 17:30:15 -0000 Subject: New HBP posters: good guys and bad guys In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > The good guys are no surprise (Harry in front, Dumbledore to his left, Hermione and Ron in back), but the "bad guys" poster has Snape front and center, with Draco to his right and Bellatrix and Fenrir Greyback to his left. Talk about misleading advertising! But, if it plays right, most viewers who haven't read the books will think that Snape is a murdering traitor but a few astute ones (the Snape fans?) may guess that things aren't always as they seem. > > Lovely posters, anyway. > > Carol, who doesn't remember nearly this many posters or TV spots or even trailers for any other HP film Potioncat: Well, it isn't the first time they've used "misleading advertising." But we wouldn't want them to give away anything for those who haven't read the books. The trailer for the first movie has a voice over of Hagrid saying "not all wizards are good" to a visual of Snape looking very dastardly. I've forgotten what exactly he was doing, scowling or billowing his robes or some such. Back to the posters, they make a nice pair---and Snape looks wicked (in a good way) But what the heck has happened to his wand? It looks shorter than Umbridge's! Potioncat, glad she can get to a better computer from time to time. From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 22 00:32:12 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 00:32:12 -0000 Subject: New HBP posters: good guys and bad guys In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Potioncat: > > Back to the posters, they make a nice pair---and Snape looks wicked (in a good way) But what the heck has happened to his wand? It looks shorter than Umbridge's! > > Potioncat, glad she can get to a better computer from time to time. > Carol responds: I noticed that Snape's wand looked short, too, especially compared with Fenrir's, but it's probably foreshortening from the angle of the shot. I don't think it looks short in the trailers. But check out his other hand. It looks like he's holding hands with Bellatrix! "Wicked in a good way"? (I'm hearing movie!Fred or George saying "Wicked!" in PoA.) He looks troubled to me--not furious and anguished as he is in the book. BTW, the poster of Snape that I really like is the one where half his face is thrown into shadow. Beautiful! Carol, hoping that someone will give Potioncat a new computer for Christmas From ROBLAMROCK at aol.com Sun Jun 21 21:26:07 2009 From: ROBLAMROCK at aol.com (roblamrock) Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 21:26:07 -0000 Subject: Charity Screening on Wednesday 8th July! Message-ID: There will be a charity screening of Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince at Movie House, Dublin Road, Belfast on Wednesday 8th July. Proceeds are in aid of the Cinema & Television Benevolent Fund. Tickets are ?20 each and go on sale next week sometime. From willsonkmom at msn.com Mon Jun 22 11:50:59 2009 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 11:50:59 -0000 Subject: New HBP posters: good guys and bad guys In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Carol responds:> > "Wicked in a good way"? (I'm hearing movie!Fred or George saying "Wicked!" in PoA.) He looks troubled to me--not furious and anguished as he is in the book. BTW, the poster of Snape that I really like is the one where half his face is thrown into shadow. Beautiful! Potioncat: I really intended to say the poster looked wicked, and yes, as in Ron saying "Wicked!" for "Cool!" You're right, he does look troubled. Actually, it is a pretty good picture of movie Snape. > > Carol, hoping that someone will give Potioncat a new computer for Christmas Potioncat: lol...let's keep our fingers crossed! > From eggplant107 at hotmail.com Mon Jun 22 16:02:16 2009 From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:02:16 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: "Gary Sapp & Karen J.S." wrote: > Just wondering if anyone is still steamed at > WB for pulling HBP last fall sothey could make > more money on a summer release? I confess I just don't understand the moral outrage about this. If somebody spends several hundred million dollars on a movie they will do everything they can think of to maximize their investment; it's a fact of life and you'd do the same thing. As for a boycott, do you really want to discourage future Harry Potter projects? Eggplant From md at exit-reality.com Mon Jun 22 16:24:38 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 12:24:38 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000601c9f355$f0c56d90$d25048b0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eggplant107 I confess I just don't understand the moral outrage about this. If somebody spends several hundred million dollars on a movie they will do everything they can think of to maximize their investment; it's a fact of life and you'd do the same thing. As for a boycott, do you really want to discourage future Harry Potter projects? Eggplant :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: I think "moral outrage" is strong term not used by the "outraged" to my knowledge. I went to the theaters last fall and saw trailers for HBP with a November release date, they let EW run a cover story for HBP as a big FALL film! They told fans the movie would come out in Nov. 2008 since the release of OOTP. The film was ready-to-go, the date was set, the ads in place, the articles printed. Then they pulled it to manipulate their balance sheet. Here's the thing people ARE NOT GETTING, Half Blood Prince will not make one dime more in July 2009 than in Nov. 2008, not one freaking dime. Historically the FALL releases have done BETTER than the summer ones, they fall releases have made MORE MONEY per film average than the summer ones. If they would have said, "the films not ready, we are pulling it for re-shoots and extra effects work, sorry." No one would be mad at WB, but they said "hey our 2008 balance sheets going to show far more profits than we project for 2009, let's move our last big property to next year so artificially decrease our profits and screw with the numbers to keep our stock rising." It's artificial, and fake, what they are trying to do is manipulate their stock price by bouncing HBP to change what year they report the earnings. Further, they get to write-off the expense in a big profit year (say, Dark Knight) so the money they spent on HBP won't even show against the money it earns this year. It's not about more or less money, it's about number manipulation. You know, the crap wall-street does. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Mon Jun 22 16:33:23 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 12:33:23 -0400 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000b01c9f357$29d02160$7d706420$@com> Just wanted to clarify in its own topic that the move for HBP from fall to summer was not to make more money as is commonly stated. Fall: Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) $317,557,891 Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (2005) $289,994,397 Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (2002) $261,970,615 Summer: Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (2004) $249,358,727 Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (2007) $292,000,866 It's also noteworthy that WB isn't thinking this way, regardless of what it hints at, because DH will come 3 - 6 months apart, so only one half could possibly be a summer release. But, as you can see, summer does not equal higher numbers as POA is a summer release with the lowest gross off all the films, SS is the fall release with the highest gross. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From no.limberger at gmail.com Mon Jun 22 18:39:41 2009 From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 11:39:41 -0700 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <000b01c9f357$29d02160$7d706420$@com> References: <000b01c9f357$29d02160$7d706420$@com> Message-ID: <7ef72f90906221139w5bff3a0ete030385f824445ce@mail.gmail.com> >md wrote: >Just wanted to clarify in its own topic that the move for HBP from fall to >summer was not to make more money as is commonly stated. >Fall: >Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) $317,557,891 >Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (2005) $289,994,397 >Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (2002) $261,970,615 >Summer: >Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (2004) $249,358,727 >Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (2007) $292,000,866 No.Limberger responds: I am inclined to believe what someone else wrote elsewhere: that WB moved the movie from 2008 to 2009 because of how much money that WB made on "Batman: The Dark Knight" in 2008. By moving HBP to 2009, revenues from HPB will apply to a different fiscal year for WB. -- "Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From eggplant107 at hotmail.com Mon Jun 22 19:31:49 2009 From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 19:31:49 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: <000601c9f355$f0c56d90$d25048b0$@com> Message-ID: "Child of Midian" wrote: > Historically the FALL releases have done BETTER than the summer ones But this is not a typical summer, due to the writer's strike there are fewer movies than usual and so less competition for Harry. > Half Blood Prince will not make one dime more > in July 2009 than in Nov. 2008, not one freaking dime. You can't know that, and even if true it would just be a bad business decision not a moral lapse. At any rate the idea of a boycott is more than pointless, it's counterproductive for any Harry Potter fan. I want to encourage future Potter projects not discourage them. Eggplant From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 22 19:39:05 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 19:39:05 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <000b01c9f357$29d02160$7d706420$@com> Message-ID: "Child of Midian" wrote: > > Just wanted to clarify in its own topic that the move for HBP from fall to summer was not to make more money as is commonly stated. > Fall: > > Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) $317,557,891 > > Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (2005) $289,994,397 > > Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (2002) $261,970,615 > Summer: > > Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (2004) $249,358,727 > > Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (2007) $292,000,866 > Carol responds: We understand your argument. Some of us simply don't feel the outrage. Sorry. (Corporations do what's best for them. What else is new? I can deal with changed release dates just as I have to deal with changed deadlines in my work--or waiting to buy something till I can afford it or being unable to drive on a certain stretch of freeway because of construction. Delayed gratification, like mean teachers or unreasonable bosses, is a fact of life. No point getting upset about it. Global warming, yeah. Maybe we should try to do something.) Anyway, I understand what you're saying. I just can't get upset about it. And I never go to movies when they first open if I expect a huge crowd. *That* I can't deal with, especially if the crowd is mostly kids! But those figures are interesting from a different perspective. Setting aside summer vs. winter, I wonder why profits for PoA were lowest of all the films. I can understand a fall-off between SS/PS and CoS--it's a sequel, after all, and CoS is the least favorite or second-least favorite of many readers. An those films were only a year apart--not enough time to build up anticipation? But why PoA, which many readers love (and which had enough time for a build-up of anticipation and, I thought, a great trailer)? Was it Cuaron, with his odd changes (Flitwick with dark hair and a mustache as choral director, for example)? Were viewers wanting more of Chris Columbus, who, whatever his failings, was mostly faithful to the books (the cheering for Hagrid at the end of CoS being a notable exception that moviegoers could not have anticipated from the trailers)? Anyway, let's put the stats in order from most money to least, ignoring the release dates: Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) $317,557,891 Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (2007) $292,000,866 Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (2005) $289,994,397 Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (2002) $261,970,615 Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (2004) $249,358,727 Clearly, profits fell off significantly between SS/PS and CoS--to be expected, as I said, though in WB's view, $56 million is a lot of money. Then they fell off again with PoA, but only by $13 million. The difference might have been greater if it *hadn't* been a summer release (kids out of school with more time to see movies, but that's only a guess). Still, I'd have expected PoA to do better with all the flashy special effects. Maybe it lost younger viewers--too much violence for the under-ten crowd? (The basilisk wasn't violent enough? Or maybe *it* made parents decide that the HP films were too scary for their young children?) But then, suddenly, the profits for GoF went up again. Like CoS, it was released in summer, but it made $29 million more (and $41 million more than PoA). That's a significant jump. Could it be that it appealed more to teenagers? Was it marketed more as an action or special effects film? Did the ratings play a role? Or the absence of Cuaron? (Sorry, Cuaron fans, but maybe he was wrong for this franchise?) The waiting period between films was a year and a half, probably ideal. And then we get OoP, the least popular book for many readers (or second after CoS) getting the second highest profits, admittedly only two million dollars more than GoF, probably a statistically insignificant difference, but only $27 million less than the original film and up $3 million from PoA, the least popular film for reasons that I still can't figure out. (Did the shrunken head in the trailer scare everyone away?) To return to OoP, the waiting period was again a year and a half, which seems optimal in terms of viewer anticipation. At any rate, if the trend continues, we can expect HBP (which has been assertively marketed, more so, I think, than any other HP film) to make about the same as or more than OoP. Certainly, those who liked OoP will want to see another film by the same director, and those who liked the book (I think HBP, despite or because of the Snape/DD scene on the tower, is the favorite of many readers) will want to see it. And those trailers really do make it look like a funny yet exciting (and, in places, dark) film that will appeal more to teenagers and adults than to children. Ultimately, I don't think that the delay will make any difference. If anything, more teenagers will have a chance to see it more than once because of the weekday matinees (available to them in summer but not during the school year except during the short Christmas vacation). Anyway, anyone else have theories as to why the profits plummeted for CoS, continued down with PoA, and then started up again for GoF and OoP? I think we should factor in the ratings (PG vs. PG 13), but I don't have them at my fingertips. As for HBP, I think the long waiting period (two years) will actually *build* anticipation--if WB hasn't overmarketed the film to compensate. Have we actually seen too many trailers, tv spots, and posters? Carol, expecting HBP to beat OoP but still fall somewhat behind SS/PS in terms of profits From elfnorc at voyager.net Mon Jun 22 20:30:51 2009 From: elfnorc at voyager.net (elfnorc at voyager.net) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:30:51 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2534.24.56.193.230.1245702651.squirrel@newmail.core.com> Very interesting explanation.? Have you correlated any of this information with release dates of the books? My favorite of all the movies (and the one I saw in the theatre and in IMAX no less) was POA even though it is one of my least favorite books.? For me I liked the idea that it stood more as a movie and not a strict retelling of the books.? The world became more real to me.? It was a more dark movie and a very radical change from the first 2.?? Tina hoping not to stay lurking as much > "Child of Midian" wrote: >> >> Just wanted to clarify in its own topic that the move for HBP from fall >> to summer was not to make more money as is commonly stated. > >> Fall: >> >> Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) $317,557,891 >> >> Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (2005) $289,994,397 >> >> Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (2002) $261,970,615 > >> Summer: >> >> Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (2004) $249,358,727 >> >> Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (2007) $292,000,866 >> > > > Carol responds: > > We understand your argument. Some of us simply don't feel the outrage. > Sorry. (Corporations do what's best for them. What else is new? I can deal > with changed release dates just as I have to deal with changed deadlines > in my work--or waiting to buy something till I can afford it or being > unable to drive on a certain stretch of freeway because of construction. > Delayed gratification, like mean teachers or unreasonable bosses, is a > fact of life. No point getting upset about it. Global warming, yeah. Maybe > we should try to do something.) > > Anyway, I understand what you're saying. I just can't get upset about it. > And I never go to movies when they first open if I expect a huge crowd. > *That* I can't deal with, especially if the crowd is mostly kids! > > But those figures are interesting from a different perspective. Setting > aside summer vs. winter, I wonder why profits for PoA were lowest of all > the films. I can understand a fall-off between SS/PS and CoS--it's a > sequel, after all, and CoS is the least favorite or second-least favorite > of many readers. An those films were only a year apart--not enough time to > build up anticipation? > > But why PoA, which many readers love (and which had enough time for a > build-up of anticipation and, I thought, a great trailer)? Was it Cuaron, > with his odd changes (Flitwick with dark hair and a mustache as choral > director, for example)? Were viewers wanting more of Chris Columbus, who, > whatever his failings, was mostly faithful to the books (the cheering for > Hagrid at the end of CoS being a notable exception that moviegoers could > not have anticipated from the trailers)? > > Anyway, let's put the stats in order from most money to least, ignoring > the release dates: > > Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) $317,557,891 > > Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (2007) $292,000,866 > > Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (2005) $289,994,397 > > Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (2002) $261,970,615 > > Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (2004) $249,358,727 > > Clearly, profits fell off significantly between SS/PS and CoS--to be > expected, as I said, though in WB's view, $56 million is a lot of money. > Then they fell off again with PoA, but only by $13 million. The difference > might have been greater if it *hadn't* been a summer release (kids out of > school with more time to see movies, but that's only a guess). Still, I'd > have expected PoA to do better with all the flashy special effects. Maybe > it lost younger viewers--too much violence for the under-ten crowd? (The > basilisk wasn't violent enough? Or maybe *it* made parents decide that the > HP films were too scary for their young children?) > > But then, suddenly, the profits for GoF went up again. Like CoS, it was > released in summer, but it made $29 million more (and $41 million more > than PoA). That's a significant jump. Could it be that it appealed more to > teenagers? Was it marketed more as an action or special effects film? Did > the ratings play a role? Or the absence of Cuaron? (Sorry, Cuaron fans, > but maybe he was wrong for this franchise?) The waiting period between > films was a year and a half, probably ideal. > > And then we get OoP, the least popular book for many readers (or second > after CoS) getting the second highest profits, admittedly only two million > dollars more than GoF, probably a statistically insignificant difference, > but only $27 million less than the original film and up $3 million from > PoA, the least popular film for reasons that I still can't figure out. > (Did the shrunken head in the trailer scare everyone away?) To return to > OoP, the waiting period was again a year and a half, which seems optimal > in terms of viewer anticipation. > > At any rate, if the trend continues, we can expect HBP (which has been > assertively marketed, more so, I think, than any other HP film) to make > about the same as or more than OoP. Certainly, those who liked OoP will > want to see another film by the same director, and those who liked the > book (I think HBP, despite or because of the Snape/DD scene on the tower, > is the favorite of many readers) will want to see it. And those trailers > really do make it look like a funny yet exciting (and, in places, dark) > film that will appeal more to teenagers and adults than to children. > > Ultimately, I don't think that the delay will make any difference. If > anything, more teenagers will have a chance to see it more than once > because of the weekday matinees (available to them in summer but not > during the school year except during the short Christmas vacation). > > Anyway, anyone else have theories as to why the profits plummeted for CoS, > continued down with PoA, and then started up again for GoF and OoP? I > think we should factor in the ratings (PG vs. PG 13), but I don't have > them at my fingertips. > > As for HBP, I think the long waiting period (two years) will actually > *build* anticipation--if WB hasn't overmarketed the film to compensate. > Have we actually seen too many trailers, tv spots, and posters? > > Carol, expecting HBP to beat OoP but still fall somewhat behind SS/PS in > terms of profits > > Tina In Michigan All it takes to fly is to hurl yourself at the ground and miss. Douglas Adams [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From zpavri at aol.com Mon Jun 22 21:52:34 2009 From: zpavri at aol.com (zpavri at aol.com) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 17:52:34 EDT Subject: Why is half blood prince rated PG Message-ID: Hi Everyone I was just wondering that Half Blood Prince will have some scary scenes. Why is it rated PG instead of PG-13 like HPGOF and HPOOTP? Thanks, Zee **************An Excellent Credit Score is 750. See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221823273x1201398689/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072&hmpgID=62&bcd=Jun eExcfooterNO62) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From agdisney at msn.com Tue Jun 23 01:31:38 2009 From: agdisney at msn.com (Andrea Grevera) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 21:31:38 -0400 Subject: Marquee Message-ID: Andie: I have to ask a question of everyone since my son thinks I'm "seeing" things.? When you look at the Harry Potter title does anyone "see" a face in the P. Actually one half of a face. I've been seeing this since The Goblet of Fire came out and it gives me the creeps. I just want to know if anyone else can see this. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Tue Jun 23 01:38:22 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 21:38:22 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <7ef72f90906221139w5bff3a0ete030385f824445ce@mail.gmail.com> References: <000b01c9f357$29d02160$7d706420$@com> <7ef72f90906221139w5bff3a0ete030385f824445ce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <009901c9f3a3$4bc21840$e34648c0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of No Limberger Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 2:40 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [HPFGU-Movie] HP does not better in the summer than Fall >md wrote: >Just wanted to clarify in its own topic that the move for HBP from fall to >summer was not to make more money as is commonly stated. No.Limberger responds: I am inclined to believe what someone else wrote elsewhere: that WB moved the movie from 2008 to 2009 because of how much money that WB made on "Batman: The Dark Knight" in 2008. By moving HBP to 2009, revenues from HPB will apply to a different fiscal year for WB. -- Heh, heh. That was me too. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Tue Jun 23 01:43:33 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 21:43:33 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: References: <000601c9f355$f0c56d90$d25048b0$@com> Message-ID: <009e01c9f3a4$04cade80$0e609b80$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eggplant107 a boycott is more than pointless, it's counterproductive for any Harry Potter fan. I want to encourage future Potter projects not discourage them. Eggplant ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Well, no, no and um, no. You see, showing support was demanding WB release it on time, showing support is telling WB that these movies aren't numbers in the matrix to the rest of us. What better way to show support than to deny WB their big opening weekend, then see the film later. It tells WB not to f* with the fans, in any circumstance. It should be about art, about creators of art and about fans, not about a balance sheet. That's what the boycott is about. Telling them not to F* with the release date is not discouraging projects, it's discouraging screwing with the fans. It's saying, well be there but you have to hold up your end. And no boycott of an opening weekend will kill or hurt a multi-billion dollar franchise, let's get some perspective here my purple friend. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Tue Jun 23 04:10:05 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 04:10:05 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <2534.24.56.193.230.1245702651.squirrel@newmail.core.com> Message-ID: Tina wrote: > Very interesting explanation. Have you correlated any of this information with release dates of the books? Carol responds: No, I haven't, but that might be a factor, too. Let's see what we come up with (ignoring paperbacks and special editions and just going with the first printing of the hardbacks in relation to the films. PS was published in England in July, 1997, and (as SS) in the U.S. in September 1998; the film came out in fall 2001. That's a significant wait (three or four years), but no one knew that both the books and the films would be an international phenomenon. the wait certainly had no effect on the profits. CoS was published in Britain in July 1998 and in the U.S. in June 1999. the film came out in fall 2002, again a significant wait (three or four years), but the wait from the first film to the second was only one year. I'm guessing that the wait between book and film wasn't all that important because the audience for the CoS film was mostly kids (and parents) who had seen the first film (kids who had started reading the books when they first came out might have thought they were already too old for it!). I'll bet that a large number of adults, at least, came to the books from the films rather than the other way around. PoA was published in July 1999 (Britain) and October 1999 (U.S. Hey, we were catching up! Must have been a rush job for Scholastic, or they had two different copyeditors and proofreaders for Cos and PoA--that's two close together for comfort). The film came out in summer 2004, a really long wait for book readers (five years!). In fact, I remember for the first time, being really eager for a HP film and watching the trailer online. Before that, I'd only really been a fan of the books, five of which were out by that time. GoF was published in July 2000 in both the UK and the U.S. (Scholastic finally realized that they needed to keep up given the popularity of the books, I guess!) GoF the film came out in fall 2005, another very long wait (five years), but by then, the first five books books had a thoroughly established fan base (us!) and those who liked the films were going to watch them regardless. The films probably had their own firmly established fan base overlapping with ours. Maybe that alone made the difference between the profits of PoA and OoP? OoP was published three years after GoF in June 2003 (both countries). There was no film that year--the long book was all there was. OoP the film came out ("obbbviously," as Movie!Snape would say), in summer 2007, four years after the book. And since the profits were so close to those for Gof, I think the same reasoning applies. Both the books and the films had established fanbases, and we were hungry for something new. DH the book was just about to come out. That timing could have been disastrous, but I think it operated in WB's favor--HP mania at its height. HBP was published in July 2005; the film as we all know was delayed from November, 2008, to July 15, 2009. (Yea! Yea! It's almost here! Oops. Sorry. Lost control there.) Compared with our previous waits between book and film, that's not so terrible. Four years is actually typical if my math is right. Sure, it's two years between OoP and HBP, but it would have been two years between HBP and DH1 if the date hadn't been changed. IOW, we'd have had to wait for one or the other, regardless. DH, of course, was published in July 2007, only a short time after OoP, the film, came out. An international period of mourning ensued--sorry, I'm getting silly here. We had no more books and nothing to wait for but the films (I don't count silly stuff like "Tales of Beedle the Bard" and that little anecdote of Sirius and James and the Muggle policemen), which explains our obsession with HBP, the film, and its two sequels (and I, for one, am glad that WB chose to do DH in two parts. It gives us a little longer to obsess). DH1 is scheduled for release in November 2010, two years after the original release date for HBP but only a year and a half after the new one. And that's a *short* three and a half years after the book came out, a record for the HP films. DH2 (being filmed at the same time, LOTR style) is scheduled for release in July 2011, a mere eight-month wait after DH1 and four years after the book. All in all, I'd say that the waiting time between the books and the films (which is relatively consistent) hasn't been much of a factor in the popularity of the films. Ratings might be more important, along with publicity, but that will take more time and trouble to research, and we won't know the results of the media assault of HBP-related footage, photos, posters, and interviews until after the film has had its turn at the box office. On a different note, it looks as if DH 1 will include the "Malfoy Manor" sequence; Dobby, the Snatcher Scabior, and Peter Pettigrew are all in it. I can't tell whether the Shell Cottage sequence, or part of it, will also be included, because Bill and Fleur should also be at their own wedding! At any rate, I'm still betting on the first part ending shortly after Dobby's funeral with Harry's decision to go after the Horcruxes and leave the Hallows. My apologies for the long-winded post, but you asked! Carol, hoping that someone else will theorize as to why Poa was the least profitable film and the profits began to rise again with GoF > > the release dates: > > > > Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) $317,557,891 > > > > Harry Potter > and the Order of the Phoenix (2007) $292,000,866 > > > > > Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (2005) $289,994,397 > > > > Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (2002) $261,970,615 > > > > Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (2004) > $249,358,727 From eggplant107 at hotmail.com Tue Jun 23 04:33:13 2009 From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 04:33:13 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: <009e01c9f3a4$04cade80$0e609b80$@com> Message-ID: "Child of Midian" wrote: > It should be about art, about creators of art and about > fans, not about a balance sheet. You need more than art and fans to make a movie, you need money and lots of it. Of course the Potter movies are not just numbers on a balance sheet to you because you didn't spend a nickel making them; if you had spent several hundred million dollars on a project and your future livelihood depended on it then I imagine you'd also do everything you could think of to minimize the possibility of failure. I was disappointed the movie didn't open in November too but this outrage seems a bit overdone to me. At the very least I have to say that your boycott seems unlikely to reach the heroic stature of something like the 1955 Montgomery Alabama Bus Boycott that started the civil rights movement. > And no boycott of an opening weekend will kill or hurt > a multi-billion dollar franchise I agree it will have absolutely no effect, zero, zilch, nada, goose egg; so remind me again about the purpose of this thing. Eggplant From md at exit-reality.com Tue Jun 23 05:07:19 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 01:07:19 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: References: <2534.24.56.193.230.1245702651.squirrel@newmail.core.com> Message-ID: <00f201c9f3c0$7be9f390$73bddab0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carol Carol, hoping that someone else will theorize as to why Poa was the least profitable film and the profits began to rise again with GoF ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: POA lost the Chris Columbus crowd, and pissed off a huge amount of book fans by cutting far deeper and wider than the first two films. The main loss in revenue was the deterioration of repeat business. Now, here the other half. A lot of people came out for the first film because it was the first, the second one, because they hoped that like the books, the movies would just get better. Instead the second film was slow and the end was weak so people didn't decide the first one was the charm. Now, OTOH, the POA and GOF really showed a change coming in cinematic and storytelling, now the films are more mature, darker, and not just for kids. Suddenly OOTP is big, not only is it good, but it appeals to a broader audience that has grown warm to HP on video and cable. Also, OOTP has a lot of little nudges to the things in the book it couldn't include, it's a very, very dense film and you gain something in repeat veiwings. That's my opinion based on experience (esp. in marketing.) md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Tue Jun 23 05:12:48 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 01:12:48 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: References: <009e01c9f3a4$04cade80$0e609b80$@com> Message-ID: <00f701c9f3c1$406442c0$c12cc840$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eggplant107 > And no boycott of an opening weekend will kill or hurt > a multi-billion dollar franchise I agree it will have absolutely no effect, zero, zilch, nada, goose egg; so remind me again about the purpose of this thing. Eggplant :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Because symbolically opening weekend means everything and the world to the studio. If you kick them in the nuts they can still make babies but the always remember the sting. Your mixing things up completely because first you say "don't hurt the potterverse" then you say " your little boycott can't possibly hurt the potterverse" so which is it, do you think the boycott will hurt or that it's impenetrable. Again, remind me of the logic of your argument? md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From eggplant107 at hotmail.com Tue Jun 23 06:42:17 2009 From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 06:42:17 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: <00f701c9f3c1$406442c0$c12cc840$@com> Message-ID: "Child of Midian" wrote: > first you say "don't hurt the potterverse" Yes I do indeed say that and I assume you agree with me on that point, at least unless I have misjudged you and you are in fact not a Potter fan. > then you say " your little boycott can't possibly hurt > the potterverse" I know for a fact that you agree with me on that point because you said so explicitly in your last post. > Again, remind me of the logic of your argument I'll be delighted to, a boycott won't work and it would be a disaster for Harry Potter fans if it did. I don't know how to be any clearer than that. Eggplant From md at exit-reality.com Tue Jun 23 07:29:56 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 03:29:56 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: References: <00f701c9f3c1$406442c0$c12cc840$@com> Message-ID: <002101c9f3d4$68669760$3933c620$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eggplant107 Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 2:42 AM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. I'll be delighted to, a boycott won't work and it would be a disaster for Harry Potter fans if it did. I don't know how to be any clearer than that. Eggplant :::::::::::: So you think that a film that will make $400 - 500,000,000 dollars worldwide will forever damage the potterverse if it fails to open at #1? You're logic is more than flawed, it's not even a real stone. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From eggplant107 at hotmail.com Tue Jun 23 08:46:00 2009 From: eggplant107 at hotmail.com (eggplant107) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 08:46:00 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: <002101c9f3d4$68669760$3933c620$@com> Message-ID: "Child of Midian" wrote: > So you think that a film that will make $400 - 500,000,000 > dollars worldwide will forever damage the potterverse if > it fails to open at #1? People who finance movies value open day, but they also value movies that have "legs", that is to say, movies that don't suffer a huge drop off after the first week. The movie "Titanic" was the most profitable movie of all time. In its opening week it did well but was nothing extraordinary, however it turned out that the movie had legs up the Wahzoo. So remind me again why the movie makers will panic if you purchase a ticket in the second week not the first. Also remind me why I should be pleased if they did panic. > You're logic is more than flawed, it's not even a real stone. A stone is a noun, logic is a adjective, or at least it should be regardless what those stupid lexographers say. Eggplant From md at exit-reality.com Tue Jun 23 14:38:10 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:38:10 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: References: <002101c9f3d4$68669760$3933c620$@com> Message-ID: <006c01c9f410$3b3c2020$b1b46060$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eggplant107 A stone is a noun, logic is a adjective, or at least it should be regardless what those stupid lexographers say. Eggplant ::::::::::::::: It was a metaphor comparing your logic to a diamond. A flawed diamond has less value, a fake one, none. Logical is an adjective or the verb form "to be" as logic is the thing itself and therefore a noun. I am an English teacher. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Tue Jun 23 17:50:29 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 17:50:29 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Md: > > > You're logic is more than flawed, it's not even a real stone. Eggplant: > A stone is a noun, logic is a adjective, or at least it should be regardless what those stupid lexographers say. Carol responds: As far as this little discussion goes, I agree with Eggplant. However, I have to point out that "logic" is not an adjective. It's what's called an abstract noun: it expresses an intangible concept and has no singular or plural form; the adjective form is "logical." "Stone" is a concrete noun, expressing a tangible concept (with singular and plural forms). You're right, though, that the metaphor is flawed because the concepts aren't parallel and the reader has to figure out the connection between them. (A stone makes a figurative hole in an argument?) And, if it's any comfort, md did use "you're" for "your," so the sentence contains an actual error. (Not that my posts never contain typos. Of course, they do.) With regard to logic, I fail to see why a boycott that won't harm WB should even be attempted. WB won't know the difference. Now, if you (md) want to carry a picket sign stating that you're boycotting HBP, maybe they'd get the point. Heck, you might even be on the local news. Seriously, folks. I don't think anyone is going to convince anyone else in this thread. Carol, who suggests writing a letter to the editor of a nationally circulating magazine or some other more effective means of spreading the word if this cause is so important to you From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Tue Jun 23 17:58:44 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 17:58:44 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: <006c01c9f410$3b3c2020$b1b46060$@com> Message-ID: md: > Logical is an adjective or the verb form "to be" as logic is the thing itself and therefore a noun. > I am an English teacher. Carol responds: "Logic" is a noun (an abstract noun, as I said before) and "logical" is the adjective form. With you so far. But what do you mean by "the verb form 'to be' as logic is the thing itself and therefore a noun"? Sorry, but that sentence doesn't make any sense. It sounds as if you're saying that "to be" (an infinitive, if we want to get technical) is a noun. If you mean that "logic" is "the thing itself" (an abstract concept rather than a tangible object), I agree. But what does "to be" have to do with it? BTW, I had no idea that "stone" in your implied metaphor referred to diamonds. I thought it was something more akin to "stone" in "People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones." Carol, who taught college English for eighteen years From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Tue Jun 23 20:00:53 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 13:00:53 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall Message-ID: <584546.35973.qm@web59813.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> that's what makes it an interesting place this group we all have different?ideas ?on things! Love,Red --- On Tue, 6/23/09, elfnorc at voyager.net wrote: From: elfnorc at voyager.net Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 12:38 PM Wow.? It is amazing they we have practically completely different opinions on the movies.? I thought Columbus kept the words and the story but Azkaban was the first movie that actually captured the magic within the story and told that. Tina > Chris Coloumbus was probable the better of ?the first directors of the > Harry Potterfilms. They are deep and thoughtful and tell teh whole story > unlike some of the others example -? > Prizoner of Azkaban (which felt more like a Harry Potter for dummies > novel).. I felt like the Prizoner of Azkaban movie was the movie that all > the writers/directors/producers forgot. Its like they just read the first > page and said this will be good enough.? > Love,Red > > > --- On Mon, 6/22/09, Child of Midian wrote: > > From: Child of Midian > Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall > To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com > Date: Monday, June 22, 2009, 10:07 PM > > > > > > From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Carol > Carol, hoping that someone else will theorize as to why Poa was the least > profitable film and the profits began to rise again with GoF > > > > ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > > > > POA lost the Chris Columbus crowd, and pissed off a huge amount of book > fans > by cutting far deeper and wider than the first two films. The main loss in > revenue was the deterioration of repeat business. > > > > Now, here the other half. A lot of people came out for the first film > because it was the first, the second one, because they hoped that like the > books, the movies would just get better. Instead the second film was slow > and the end was weak so people didn't decide the first one was the charm. > > > > Now, OTOH, the POA and GOF really showed a change coming in cinematic and > storytelling, now the films are more mature, darker, and not just for > kids. > Suddenly OOTP is big, not only is it good, but it appeals to a broader > audience that has grown warm to HP on video and cable. Also, OOTP has a > lot > of little nudges to the things in the book it couldn't include, it's a > very, > very dense film and you gain something in repeat veiwings. > > > > That's my opinion based on experience (esp. in marketing.) > > > > md > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! > > Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at > HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Tina In Michigan All it takes to fly is to hurl yourself at the ground and miss. Douglas Adams [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Tue Jun 23 20:56:02 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 16:56:02 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <71503.97909.qm@web59807.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <71503.97909.qm@web59807.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <003401c9f445$04b8f200$0e2ad600$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lady of Imladris Chris Coloumbus was probable the better of the first directors of the Harry Potterfilms. They are deep and thoughtful and tell teh whole story unlike some of the others example - Prizoner of Azkaban (which felt more like a Harry Potter for dummies novel).. I felt like the Prizoner of Azkaban movie was the movie that all the writers/directors/producers forgot. Its like they just read the first page and said this will be good enough. Love,Red ::::::::::::::: I thought, when Columbus was announced to direct, what a horrible mistake. Home Alone, bad, Mrs. Doubtfire, horrible. Then I saw SS and thought, yep, I was right, he has no style whatsoever, the story is stagnant, the acting wooden, the camera stiff. As for POA, yeah, abridged but excellent in every way. It was the first film that really bonded non-readers to the films. It's cinematic, stylish, well acted and concentrates on characters as much as plot. I think POA and OOTP are the best of the five. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bgrugin at yahoo.com Wed Jun 24 02:50:24 2009 From: bgrugin at yahoo.com (bgrugin) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 02:50:24 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <003401c9f445$04b8f200$0e2ad600$@com> Message-ID: > Chris Coloumbus was probable the better of the first directors of the Harry > Potterfilms. They are deep and thoughtful and tell teh whole story unlike > some of the others example - > Prizoner of Azkaban (which felt more like a Harry Potter for dummies > novel).. I felt like the Prizoner of Azkaban movie was the movie that all > the writers/directors/producers forgot. Its like they just read the first > page and said this will be good enough. > Love,Red > ::::::::::::::: > > I thought, when Columbus was announced to direct, what a horrible mistake. > Home Alone, bad, Mrs. Doubtfire, horrible. Then I saw SS and thought, yep, I > was right, he has no style whatsoever, the story is stagnant, the acting > wooden, the camera stiff. > > As for POA, yeah, abridged but excellent in every way. It was the first film > that really bonded non-readers to the films. It's cinematic, stylish, well > acted and concentrates on characters as much as plot. I think POA and OOTP > are the best of the five. > > > > md > MusicalBetsy here: I must say that I agree with Red. It was the first film - SS - that made me fall in love with HP. I thought Columbus captured the innocence of the children perfectly. And then when I read the book, yes, I discovered there was so much more to the book than the film. Sure, some things were left out (very small things), but at least nothing was radically changed. BUT in PoA, there were WAY too many things that were non-canon. I HATED the shrunken heads and Flitwick's new look and the kids in muggle clothes. And there was so much important stuff - like the origin of the Marauder's Map - that was left out. In fact, after the movie, I had to explain so much to my husband just so he could understand it. It was a difficult movie to follow if you hadn't read the book - and it shouldn't have to be like that. It IS interesting how we all see things differently, isn't it? I guess that's what makes life interesting. Cheers, Betsy From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Wed Jun 24 03:37:37 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 20:37:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall Message-ID: <280193.24797.qm@web59813.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Thanks Betsy!? I love Home alone, Mrs. Doubtfire (A defiante classic), and my other all time favorite adventures in babysitting!? More so than the other directors Chris has been around a long time and I'd go see a movie of his anytime. Love,Red --- On Tue, 6/23/09, bgrugin wrote: From: bgrugin Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 7:50 PM > Chris Coloumbus was probable the better of? the first directors of the Harry > Potterfilms. They are deep and thoughtful and tell teh whole story unlike > some of the others example - > Prizoner of Azkaban (which felt more like a Harry Potter for dummies > novel).. I felt like the Prizoner of Azkaban movie was the movie that all > the writers/directors/producers forgot. Its like they just read the first > page and said this will be good enough. > Love,Red > ::::::::::::::: > > I thought, when Columbus was announced to direct, what a horrible mistake.. > Home Alone, bad, Mrs. Doubtfire, horrible. Then I saw SS and thought, yep, I > was right, he has no style whatsoever, the story is stagnant, the acting > wooden, the camera stiff. > > As for POA, yeah, abridged but excellent in every way. It was the first film > that really bonded non-readers to the films. It's cinematic, stylish, well > acted and concentrates on characters as much as plot. I think POA and OOTP > are the best of the five. > >? > > md > MusicalBetsy here: I must say that I agree with Red.? It was the first film - SS - that made me fall in love with HP.? I thought Columbus captured the innocence of the children perfectly.? And then when I read the book, yes, I discovered there was so much more to the book than the film.? Sure, some things were left out (very small things), but at least nothing was radically changed.? BUT in PoA, there were WAY too many things that were non-canon.? I HATED the shrunken heads and Flitwick's new look and the kids in muggle clothes.? And there was so much important stuff - like the origin of the Marauder's Map - that was left out.? In fact, after the movie, I had to explain so much to my husband just so he could understand it.? It was a difficult movie to follow if you hadn't read the book - and it shouldn't have to be like that. It IS interesting how we all see things differently, isn't it?? I guess that's what makes life interesting. Cheers, Betsy ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Wed Jun 24 03:40:52 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 20:40:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall Message-ID: <924183.68146.qm@web59805.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> ?And to those who don't know it Chris Columbus has had a hand in the first three Harry Potter movies he is one of the Producers, he even had a hand in Prisoner of Azkaban.? Love,Red http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001060/ Just had to put this in here? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Wed Jun 24 03:51:30 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 23:51:30 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: References: <003401c9f445$04b8f200$0e2ad600$@com> Message-ID: <000601c9f47f$0f9644e0$2ec2cea0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bgrugin BUT in PoA, there were WAY too many things that were non-canon. I HATED the shrunken heads and Flitwick's new look and the kids in muggle clothes. And there was so much important stuff - like the origin of the Marauder's Map - that was left out. In fact, after the movie, I had to explain so much to my husband just so he could understand it. It was a difficult movie to follow if you hadn't read the book - and it shouldn't have to be like that. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: My thing has always been, take the books and never read them and POA is a superior film in every way, shape and form from the first 2. The worse things, I found, with the first two films were the awkward dialogue moments like "there's only one place to well get all this, Diagon Ally" as if they don't go there for back-to-school every year!!! Just really, stupid, talk-down-to-the-audience, moments like that, just things that are so poorly staged, like Hermoine's "booksmarts and cleverness" speech where she gushes on Harry a la Ceaser B DeMIle "Loyalty! Bravery!" I never thought I'd see a ten year old girl swoon like it was 1935! Chris Columbus doesn't get his actors into character and doesn't have an ear for what sounds natural in speaking, he just lets his actors go do what they do without guidance or authority. I you listen to the interviews, the cast was so excited in POA to finally have a director that was forcing them to face and understand their characters as real, breathing people and then become them. I know several non-readers who saw the movie, my then 7 year-old daughter included who didn't need any of it explained. I'll tell you this, if Columbus had made it, it would have lacked any true emotional impact and just been another dull, by-the-numbers regurgitation. IMO. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Wed Jun 24 03:58:35 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 03:58:35 -0000 Subject: Anyone planning on boycotting opening week of HP 6?. In-Reply-To: <003401c9f42e$421dc510$c6594f30$@com> Message-ID: "Child of Midian" wrote: > > While logical is an adverb, Carol responds: You meant adjective, right? md: to be logical can be a verb "to be" as in "to be logical" wherein being logical is also the action. Carol responds: Okay, I see what you mean although "logical" is not an action. "To be" is a linking verb and "logical" in "to be logical" is the predicate adjective. Md: You can be logical or emotional, these are actions. Carol: Well, no. "Logical" and "emotional" adjectives describing mental states. See above on linking verbs. md: You can be coldly logical, where coldly is the adverb modifying the verb logical. Carol: Right. But the adverb is modifying an adjective, not a verb. Carol, with apologies to the List Elves for the OT posts > > > md > From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Wed Jun 24 04:05:39 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 04:05:39 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <003401c9f445$04b8f200$0e2ad600$@com> Message-ID: md wrote: > > As for POA, yeah, abridged but excellent in every way. It was the first film that really bonded non-readers to the films. It's cinematic, stylish, well acted and concentrates on characters as much as plot. I think POA and OOTP are the best of the five. Carol responds: Oh, dear. Well, let's not go into shrunken heads again! also, some of that abridgement omitted important information--like the makers of the Marauder's Map. I wonder how many viewers wondered how Lupin knew not only what the map was but how to work it? (And Harry didn't even think to ask.) Just out of curiosity, what did you think of the hairless werewolf? Not at all scary, IMO. Buckbeak was beautifully done, though, even if they did make Harry enjoy the ride, as he didn't in the book. Carol, who doesn't care much for OoP because there's not enough Snape and way too much Umbridge (didn't like the plot changes regarding Veritaserum, either) From no.limberger at gmail.com Wed Jun 24 15:00:03 2009 From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 08:00:03 -0700 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: References: <003401c9f445$04b8f200$0e2ad600$@com> Message-ID: <7ef72f90906240800k46165d0tef29edef470760a3@mail.gmail.com> >Carol wrote: >Carol, who doesn't care much for OoP because there's not enough >Snape and way too much Umbridge (didn't like the plot changes >regarding Veritaserum, either) No.Limberger responds: OotP is the film that has disappointed me most so far because of how much material was left out. Of the 5 films to date, it is the shortest, yet the 5th book is the longest book. They left out Harry being upset not being selected as a prefect while Hermione, Ron and even Malfoy each become prefects. They left out Umbridge keeping Harry from playing quidditch, his most beloved activity. They left out more of the attempts by students to overwhelm Umbridge, and, yeah, they didn't show enough about Snape. The film could easily have been 20 to 30 minutes longer and been many times better. -- "Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Wed Jun 24 17:04:11 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 17:04:11 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <000601c9f47f$0f9644e0$2ec2cea0$@com> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child of Midian" wrote: > just things that are so poorly staged, like Hermoine's > "booksmarts and cleverness" speech where she gushes on > Harry a la Ceaser B DeMIle "Loyalty! Bravery!" I never > I'd see a ten year old girl swoon like it was 1935! zanooda: But this is from the book :-). "Me! Books! And cleverness! There are more important things - friendship and bravery and - oh Harry - be careful!" Or did you mean not the words themselves, but the way she said all this :-)? I agree with you though that it was the director's job to make the kids' acting look better than it actually was :-). From elfnorc at voyager.net Wed Jun 24 19:08:22 2009 From: elfnorc at voyager.net (elfnorc at voyager.net) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 15:08:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <280193.24797.qm@web59813.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <280193.24797.qm@web59813.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1367.24.56.193.230.1245870502.squirrel@newmail.core.com> I really like all of these movies but I still don't think the first 2 HP moives were the best.? Other people have said it better than I did but I think the phrase "straight forward regurgitation" as just posteb by someone else says it best for me.? I don't need the movie to be an exact replica of the book but I do need it to be alive. Wtih the Devil Wears Prada I actually thought the movie was better than the book. Tina > Thanks Betsy!? > I love Home alone, Mrs. Doubtfire (A defiante classic), and my other all > time favorite adventures in babysitting!? > More so than the other directors Chris has been around a long time and I'd > go see a movie of his anytime. > Love,Red > > > > --- On Tue, 6/23/09, bgrugin wrote: > > From: bgrugin > Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall > To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com > Date: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 7:50 PM > >> Chris Coloumbus was probable the better of? the first directors of the >> Harry >> Potterfilms. They are deep and thoughtful and tell teh whole story >> unlike >> some of the others example - >> Prizoner of Azkaban (which felt more like a Harry Potter for dummies >> novel).. I felt like the Prizoner of Azkaban movie was the movie that >> all >> the writers/directors/producers forgot. Its like they just read the >> first >> page and said this will be good enough. >> Love,Red >> ::::::::::::::: >> >> I thought, when Columbus was announced to direct, what a horrible >> mistake.. >> Home Alone, bad, Mrs. Doubtfire, horrible. Then I saw SS and thought, >> yep, I >> was right, he has no style whatsoever, the story is stagnant, the acting >> wooden, the camera stiff. >> >> As for POA, yeah, abridged but excellent in every way. It was the first >> film >> that really bonded non-readers to the films. It's cinematic, stylish, >> well >> acted and concentrates on characters as much as plot. I think POA and >> OOTP >> are the best of the five. >> >>? >> >> md >> > > > > MusicalBetsy here: > I must say that I agree with Red.? It was the first film - SS - that made > me fall in love with HP.? I thought Columbus captured the innocence of the > children perfectly.? And then when I read the book, yes, I discovered > there was so much more to the book than the film.? Sure, some things were > left out (very small things), but at least nothing was radically changed.? > BUT in PoA, there were WAY too many things that were non-canon.? I HATED > the shrunken heads and Flitwick's new look and the kids in muggle > clothes.? And there was so much important stuff - like the origin of the > Marauder's Map - that was left out.? In fact, after the movie, I had to > explain so much to my husband just so he could understand it.? It was a > difficult movie to follow if you hadn't read the book - and it shouldn't > have to be like that. > > It IS interesting how we all see things differently, isn't it?? I guess > that's what makes life interesting. > > Cheers, > Betsy > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! > > Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at > HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Tina In Michigan All it takes to fly is to hurl yourself at the ground and miss. Douglas Adams [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Wed Jun 24 19:52:17 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 19:52:17 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <1367.24.56.193.230.1245870502.squirrel@newmail.core.com> Message-ID: elfnorc at ... wrote: > I really like all of these movies but I still don't think the first 2 HP moives were the best. Other people have said it better than I did but I think the phrase "straight forward regurgitation" as just posteb by someone else says it best for me. I don't need the movie to be an exact replica of the book but I do need it to be alive. Carol responds: I think that the main problem with the first two movies was the acting by the three kids (Dan, Emma, Rupert)--three unknown, untrained, inexperienced child actors. We have the same script writer as for POA and GOF (also the three not-yet-seen films, but we can't judge by them yet). We also have a brand-new franchise in which no one (script writer, director, producer, set designers, costume designers) is likely to veer too far from the source material. Then we have PoA zooming off in the opposite direction, especially with Flitwick and the CGI device that must not be named, but the costuming and the 1930s setting for Hogwarts came out of nowhere. and what was with those candles that looked like backbones? made Lupin look like a Dark Wizard. The worst part, for me, was letting Harry's Boggart show up, having Lupin whisk it away, and then having him say later that he thought it would turn into Lord Voldemort. Hello, Lupin. You just saw it turn into a Dementor and you saw Harry react to a real Dementor on the Hogwarts Express. Why would you think it would turn into Voldemort after that? They should have handled that scene as it was in the book. (I did think that Gran!Snape was funny, though, even though Snape is my favorite character.) Anyway, sure; the kids are less than brilliant in the first two films. Dan's performance isn't particularly memorable, Rupert emphasizes some words oddly, and Emma is just stiff. Her acting has become more natural, but she's *harder* to understand now (to my American ears) because she speaks so quickly. Rupert is much better now--quite funny and not so exaggerated in his expressions. Dan--well--the only really bad moment (IM)) is the crying in PoA, but that's the script and the director, too. But Hogwarts looked as Hogwarts is supposed to look, and the kids and teachers dressed as they're supposed to dress. No electric trains, Victrolas, or other oddities. the later directors have taken more liberties with the films (the extra-long first task and the completely altered third task in GoF; the substitution of Cho for Marietta and the use of real Veritaserum on all the students in OoP, just to name a few). If I could have the faithfulness to the books of the first two films with the great special effects and improved acting of the last three (and Emma being a little less hysterical and easier to understand), I'd be perfectly happy with the films. Well, almost. There's always something that I would do differently if I were in charge, but I think that's true for all of us. Carol, now wondering if anyone knows where to find the percentage of film profits from DVD sales for each film From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Wed Jun 24 20:37:36 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 13:37:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall Message-ID: <9522.16882.qm@web59813.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Hi Carol I couldn't have said it any better - I don't know if this will help but i looked aroudn for Harry Potter Profit sales http://www.swivel.com/data_sets/columns/1007158 Love,Red - ?(Who is enjoying the debate)? --- On Wed, 6/24/09, Carol wrote: From: Carol Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 12:52 PM elfnorc at ... wrote: > I really like all of these movies but I still don't think the first 2 HP moives were the best.? Other people have said it better than I did but I think the phrase "straight forward regurgitation" as just posteb by someone else says it best for me.? I don't need the movie to be an exact replica of the book but I do need it to be alive. Carol responds: I think that the main problem with the first two movies was the acting by the three kids (Dan, Emma, Rupert)--three unknown, untrained, inexperienced child actors. We have the same script writer as for POA and GOF (also the three not-yet-seen films, but we can't judge by them yet). We also have a brand-new franchise in which no one (script writer, director, producer, set designers, costume designers) is likely to veer too far from the source material. Then we have PoA zooming off in the opposite direction, especially with Flitwick and the CGI device that must not be named, but the costuming and the 1930s setting for Hogwarts came out of nowhere. and what was with those candles that looked like backbones? made Lupin look like a Dark Wizard. The worst part, for me, was letting Harry's Boggart show up, having Lupin whisk it away, and then having him say later that he thought it would turn into Lord Voldemort. Hello, Lupin. You just saw it turn into a Dementor and you saw Harry react to a real Dementor on the Hogwarts Express. Why would you think it would turn into Voldemort after that? They should have handled that scene as it was in the book. (I did think that Gran!Snape was funny, though, even though Snape is my favorite character.) Anyway, sure; the kids are less than brilliant in the first two films. Dan's performance isn't particularly memorable, Rupert emphasizes some words oddly, and Emma is just stiff. Her acting has become more natural, but she's *harder* to understand now (to my American ears) because she speaks so quickly. Rupert is much better now--quite funny and not so exaggerated in his expressions. Dan--well--the only really bad moment (IM)) is the crying in PoA, but that's the script and the director, too. But Hogwarts looked as Hogwarts is supposed to look, and the kids and teachers dressed as they're supposed to dress. No electric trains, Victrolas, or other oddities. the later directors have taken more liberties with the films (the extra-long first task and the completely altered third task in GoF; the substitution of Cho for Marietta and the use of real Veritaserum on all the students in OoP, just to name a few). If I could have the faithfulness to the books of the first two films with the great special effects and improved acting of the last three (and Emma being a little less hysterical and easier to understand), I'd be perfectly happy with the films. Well, almost. There's always something that I would do differently if I were in charge, but I think that's true for all of us. Carol, now wondering if anyone knows where to find the percentage of film profits from DVD sales for each film ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Wed Jun 24 22:40:07 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 18:40:07 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: References: <000601c9f47f$0f9644e0$2ec2cea0$@com> Message-ID: <003901c9f51c$b965b670$2c312350$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of zanooda2 zanooda: But this is from the book :-). "Me! Books! And cleverness! There are more important things - friendship and bravery and - oh Harry - be careful!" Or did you mean not the words themselves, but the way she said all this :-)? I agree with you though that it was the director's job to make the kids' acting look better than it actually was :-). :::::::::::::::::::::::::::: A director should know when a line on paper doesn't play when actually being spoken. Yes, JKR can get away with things on paper that, when actually spoken do not work, or, have to be spoken a specific way. Even Shakespeare in the misguided hands of Leonardo DeCaprio can sound like so much gibberish. Like I said, I've never seen a 10 yr old girl gush and swoon like that. I think, maybe a tired, panting, weary Hermione as supposed to the loud, exaggerated one on screen could have pulled it off. But again, the director has to stop the actor and direct them to what will work, which is why I can't stand CC's mind-candy movies. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Wed Jun 24 23:06:51 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 16:06:51 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall Message-ID: <701119.5868.qm@web59802.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> I think the best books to be written into movies had been LOTR.? J.K should have gotten some tips from Peter Jackson. Now Peter Jackson know how to do movies.? Love,Red --- On Wed, 6/24/09, Child of Midian wrote: From: Child of Midian Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 3:40 PM From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of zanooda2 zanooda: But this is from the book :-). "Me! Books! And cleverness! There are more important things - friendship and bravery and - oh Harry - be careful!" Or did you mean not the words themselves, but the way she said all this :-)? I agree with you though that it was the director's job to make the kids' acting look better than it actually was :-). :::::::::::::::::::::::::::: A director should know when a line on paper doesn't play when actually being spoken. Yes, JKR can get away with things on paper that, when actually spoken? do not work, or, have to be spoken a specific way. Even Shakespeare in the misguided hands of Leonardo DeCaprio can sound like so much gibberish. Like I said, I've never seen a 10 yr old girl gush and swoon like that. I think, maybe a tired, panting, weary Hermione as supposed to the loud, exaggerated one on screen could have pulled it off. But again, the director has to stop the actor and direct them to what will work, which is why I can't stand CC's mind-candy movies. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 00:05:29 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 00:05:29 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Cat" wrote: > Most of the casting has been spot on however, there have > been a couple of mis-steps IMHO ... zanooda: I could never understand what exactly the word "miscast" means :-). Does it mean that an actor for some reason *can't* play a certain character the way this character is supposed to be? In this case I wouldn't call Gambon's casting a mis-step, like you suggest. Right, he was horrible in GoF, but quite all right in OotP. Doesn't it show that he *can* play Dumbledore, just didn't know at first how to do it right :-)? I don't know whose fault this was, the director's or the actor's, but Gambon obviously didn't know how DD is supposed to behave.In OotP he doesn't scream and shake people anymore, and it seems from the trailers that he may be not bad at all in HBP. Now Fleur actress, for example, *can't* play Fleur however talented she may be, because she is rather plain, and, even though Movie!Fleur is not part-Veela, still, boys' reaction to her suggests that she is extremely attractive, when the actress is not. But again, maybe I don't understand the word "miscast" correctly, LOL. Besides, isn't it all very subjective? I'm sure there are people who like Gambon as DD very much :-). From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 00:26:48 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 17:26:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps Message-ID: <237230.72668.qm@web59814.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> You have to realize that Gambon had big shoes to fill, litteraly. You can't get any better than Sir Richard Harris (I hope his soul is at peace where ever he is at). I think for such a short notice in replacing a beloved actor that Gambon did a pretty good job as Albus. I didn't like it at first and almost stopped watching the Harry Potter Franchise all together ?but the more I watched it the more I liked Gambon, he has his own style to Albus which I happen to like.? Love,Red --- On Wed, 6/24/09, zanooda2 wrote: From: zanooda2 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 5:05 PM --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Cat" wrote: > Most of the casting has been spot on however, there have > been a couple of mis-steps IMHO ... zanooda: I could never understand what exactly the word "miscast" means :-). Does it mean that an actor for some reason *can't* play a certain character the way this character is supposed to be? In this case I wouldn't call Gambon's casting a mis-step, like you suggest. Right, he was horrible in GoF, but quite all right in OotP. Doesn't it show that he *can* play Dumbledore, just didn't know at first how to do it right :-)? I don't know whose fault this was, the director's or the actor's, but Gambon obviously didn't know how DD is supposed to behave.In OotP he doesn't scream and shake people anymore, and it seems from the trailers that he may be not bad at all in HBP. Now Fleur actress, for example, *can't* play Fleur however talented she may be, because she is rather plain, and, even though Movie!Fleur is not part-Veela, still, boys' reaction to her suggests that she is extremely attractive, when the actress is not. But again, maybe I don't understand the word "miscast" correctly, LOL. Besides, isn't it all very subjective? I'm sure there are people who like Gambon as DD? very much :-). ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Thu Jun 25 00:29:47 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 20:29:47 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000601c9f52c$0be20de0$23a629a0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of zanooda2 Now Fleur actress, for example, *can't* play Fleur however talented she may be, because she is rather plain, and, even though Movie!Fleur is not part-Veela, still, boys' reaction to her suggests that she is extremely attractive, when the actress is not. But again, maybe I don't understand the word "miscast" correctly, LOL. Besides, isn't it all very subjective? I'm sure there are people who like Gambon as DD very much :-). ::::::::::::::: Well, attractiveness is subject, I happen to think she's a very pretty girl. I don't know why they made it as if all the Beauxbattons (spelling???) girls where Veela like, the little, strut and AHhhhh.. they did coming in to the great hall was nauseating. Regardless, the girl that plays Fleur is not "plain" to all of us. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From elfnorc at voyager.net Thu Jun 25 01:45:05 2009 From: elfnorc at voyager.net (Elfnorc) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 20:45:05 -0500 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <701119.5868.qm@web59802.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <701119.5868.qm@web59802.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4A42D6A1.80802@voyager.net> Here! Here! I never ever thought anyone could bring LOTR to the big screen and he did it. I am still amazed with how those movies came out. Tina Lady of Imladris wrote: > > > I think the best books to be written into movies had been LOTR. > J.K should have gotten some tips from Peter Jackson. Now Peter Jackson > know how to do movies. > Love,Red > > --- On Wed, 6/24/09, Child of Midian > wrote: > > From: Child of Midian > > Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall > To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com > Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 3:40 PM > > From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com > ] On > Behalf Of zanooda2 > > zanooda: > > But this is from the book :-). "Me! Books! And cleverness! There are more > important things - friendship and bravery and - oh Harry - be careful!" Or > did you mean not the words themselves, but the way she said all this > :-)? I > agree with you though that it was the director's job to make the kids' > acting look better than it actually was :-). > > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > > A director should know when a line on paper doesn't play when actually > being > spoken. Yes, JKR can get away with things on paper that, when actually > spoken do not work, or, have to be spoken a specific way. Even > Shakespeare > in the misguided hands of Leonardo DeCaprio can sound like so much > gibberish. Like I said, I've never seen a 10 yr old girl gush and > swoon like > that. I think, maybe a tired, panting, weary Hermione as supposed to the > loud, exaggerated one on screen could have pulled it off. But again, the > director has to stop the actor and direct them to what will work, which is > why I can't stand CC's mind-candy movies. > > md > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ------------------------------------ > > Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! > > Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at > HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 03:41:05 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 03:41:05 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <000601c9f52c$0be20de0$23a629a0$@com> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child of Midian" wrote: > I don't know why they made it as if all the Beauxbatons > (spelling???) girls where Veela like, the little, strut and > AHhhhh.. they did coming in to the great hall was nauseating. zanooda: I didn't get it either :-). It was really annoying :-). The Durmstrang students' entrance was not as funny, but it also was like from a musical, LOL. > md wrote: > Regardless, the girl that plays Fleur is not "plain" to all of us. zanooda: I suppose so :-). I noticed that some actresses that are considered gorgeous here would be thought of as ugly where I come from :-). Maybe different nations have different tastes :-). From kempermentor at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 03:57:09 2009 From: kempermentor at yahoo.com (kempermentor) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 03:57:09 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > md wrote: > > Regardless, the girl that plays Fleur is not "plain" to all of us. > zanooda: > I suppose so :-). I noticed that some actresses that are considered gorgeous here would be thought of as ugly where I come from :-). Maybe different nations have different tastes :-). Kemper now: I'm curious. Will you post a link to pics of hawt youth from both genders from your place of origin? Kemper From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 04:05:44 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 21:05:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps Message-ID: <173971.98989.qm@web59802.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> I agree with ya Zanooda - all nations have various taste in actresses or actors and how they act and look extra. That's why some are more popular in some nations and vic- versa.? I really did NOT care for the casting of Fleur, in the books she's this beautiful blonde with a heavy French accent - she hardly said two words in the movie. Oh well. That why there are books so you can put your imagination to the test. Love,Red > zanooda: > I suppose so :-). I noticed that some actresses that are considered gorgeous here would be thought of as ugly where I come from :-). Maybe different nations have different tastes :-). [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From willsonkmom at msn.com Thu Jun 25 11:30:03 2009 From: willsonkmom at msn.com (potioncat) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 11:30:03 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > zanooda: > > I suppose so :-). I noticed that some actresses that are considered gorgeous here would be thought of as ugly where I come from :-). Maybe different nations have different tastes :-). > Potioncat: There is a cultural component to beauty, but I'm intrigued, would someone be considered gorgeous in one place and actually ugly in another? That's a big difference. Just for fun, can you give us examples? And, I'll second Kemper's request, too. Potioncat From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 17:53:00 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 17:53:00 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <9522.16882.qm@web59813.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Red wrote: > > Hi Carol I couldn't have said it any better - I don't know if this will help but i looked aroudn for Harry Potter Profit sales http://www.swivel.com/data_sets/columns/1007158 > Love,Red - (Who is enjoying the debate) Carol responds: Thanks for the compliment and the chart. It doesn't cover all of GoF or any of OOP, but if you click on "Show whole table," it does give us a bit of new information: the number of weeks the first three films stayed in the box office. SS/PS, 27 CoS, 22 PoA, 24 If we compare profits for all three films at 22 weeks, we have SS/PS $317,048,532 CoS $261,970,615 PoA $246,266,986 After 24 weeks, PoA was nowhere near SS/PS ($249,358,727 contrasted with $317,347,879). That amount was close to what SS/PS had earned after only four and a half weeks (fourth week, $239,659,542; fifth week, $253,269,579). By comparison, CoS earned approximately that amount between the seventh and eighth weeks ($240,307,533 and $252,097,945, respectively). What's really interesting is that PoA started off *ahead* of both SS/PS and CoS, possibly thanks to an intriguing and well publicized trailer easily watchable on the Internet. (Anyone know whether SS/PS and CoS also had Internet trailers?) For the first week, we have SS/PS $90,294,621 CoS $88,357,488 PoA $93,687,367 (GoF was already at an astounding $102,335,066 for the first week, but since the data for it go only until the sixth week, when it was still way ahead of PoA and CoS but falling slightly behind SS/PS, I'm ignoring it here.) But SS/PS more than doubled its profits by the second week, reaching $186,978,513, at which point it was probably impossible to match it. In the second week, PoA was still ahead of CoS, with $157,975,042 compared with 148,358,831, but in the third week, it fell behind, with $190,925,253.00 compared to CoS's $200,159,012. For the next few weeks, the profits were very close, but by the ninth week, PoA was stuck in the 240 million-dollar range and never got out. CoS had passed PoA's high point by the eighth week and SS/PS by the fifth. I have no idea how these figures compare to those for other blockbuster films, but I'm surprised that CoS didn't run a little longer and that PoA ran 24 weeks. Maybe the theaters (or whoever decides these things) kept hoping it would catch up to CoS (obviously SS/PS was unbeatable by that point.) Anyway, I hope I'm not boring anyone. I'm not normally interested in statistics, but these are revealing. "What a falling off was there" for PoA. The chart shows us clearly when, but the question still remains: why? Why did the profits for PoA start off higher even than SS/PS but fall behind CoS and stay there? And why did profits soar again for GoF even though PoA had been a *relative* flop? Had the fanbase grown that much in a year and a half? (BTW, could PoA really have *lost* ten dollars between the ninth and tenth weeks or is that an error in the data?) Carol, guessing that diehard book fans were disappointed in PoA--and possibly parents thought it was too dark for younger kids--but wouldn't the darker elements apply to GoF, too (???) From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 18:19:56 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 18:19:56 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <003901c9f51c$b965b670$2c312350$@com> Message-ID: md wrote: > A director should know when a line on paper doesn't play when actually being spoken. Yes, JKR can get away with things on paper that, when actually spoken do not work, or, have to be spoken a specific way. Even Shakespeare in the misguided hands of Leonardo DeCaprio can sound like so much gibberish. Like I said, I've never seen a 10 yr old girl gush and swoon like that. I think, maybe a tired, panting, weary Hermione as supposed to the loud, exaggerated one on screen could have pulled it off. But again, the director has to stop the actor and direct them to what will work, which is why I can't stand CC's mind-candy movies. Carol responds: A technicality here: Book!Hermione is twelve at this point and Film!Hermione is probably eleven, the same age as Harry. If Emma was still ten at this point (and I haven't checked), the problem may be simply her inexperience and immaturity rather than the line. the point that Hermione is making is important both to an understanding or her as a character and to a central them of the books/films. Hermione is not just any little girl--she's Harry's loyal friend and what the British call a swot. The line is perfectly in character for both the book and film versions of Hermione, but it might have been slightly beyond the talents of Emma Watson at that time. A director can only do so much. (BTW, she *doesn't* swoon [faint]. *That* would have been too much!) OTOH, it's possible that Columbus was aiming at a younger audience than the members of this list. I you're aiming at eleven-year-olds, you're going to create mind candy. Speaking, though, of lines that could fail drastically if played badly, I wonder how the writer/director/actor team will handle "I, the Half-Blood Prince?" If anyone can pull off that line, Alan Rickman can. Carol, who likes the SS film despite flaws in the acting From md at exit-reality.com Thu Jun 25 18:49:45 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 14:49:45 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: References: <003901c9f51c$b965b670$2c312350$@com> Message-ID: <001501c9f5c5$b575d2d0$20617870$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carol Carol, who likes the SS film despite flaws in the acting ::::::::::::::::::::::::: I Don't not like the SS (pr PS as my British blu-ray is titled) since the source material is strong enough to overcome the bad directing. My issue is not just with Hermione's line (which you focused on) since I also mentioned Molly's line in COS as well, I think all the actors where poorly served by Columbus. And don't give me that "younger audience" crap, that's BS in a big way, look at Shrek, Wal-E, The original Star Wars, all sold big to very young audiences with good acting and directing and uncompromised story telling. And, since you brought it up, Hermione, Harry and Ron are 10, 11, & 12 in SS the actors are each about 1 year apart in age with Emma being the youngest and Rupert the oldest. As for a 10 yr old acting, every see the Piano? md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 18:58:14 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 18:58:14 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: zanooda wrote: > > I could never understand what exactly the word "miscast" means :-). Does it mean that an actor for some reason *can't* play a certain character the way this character is supposed to be? In this case I wouldn't call Gambon's casting a mis-step, like you suggest. > > Right, he was horrible in GoF, but quite all right in OotP. Doesn't it show that he *can* play Dumbledore, just didn't know at first how to do it right :-)? I don't know whose fault this was, the director's or the actor's, but Gambon obviously didn't know how DD is supposed to behave.In OotP he doesn't scream and shake people anymore, and it seems from the trailers that he may be not bad at all in HBP. > > Now Fleur actress, for example, *can't* play Fleur however talented she may be, because she is rather plain, and, even though Movie!Fleur is not part-Veela, still, boys' reaction to her suggests that she is extremely attractive, when the actress is not. But again, maybe I don't understand the word "miscast" correctly, LOL. Besides, isn't it all very subjective? I'm sure there are people who like Gambon as DD very much :-). > Carol responds: "Miscast" just means that an actor is cast in an unsuitable role. Imagine Madonna playing McGonagall, for example. Age and appearance have to be appropriate (though makeup and CGI can help to some extent), and, of course, the actor's abilities must also be taken into account. To some degree, it's a subjective judgment. I think that Frank Dillane is miscast as the teenage Tom Riddle--not nearly handsome enough. Regarding Michael Gambon, he was, of course, at a disadvantage stepping into a role that another, much older (and beloved) actor, had handled very differently. It's also hard for a man in his sixties to play a very old man of close to 115, however well preserved. I realize that sixty-plus seems ancient to most children and teenagers, but Gambon's Dumbledore comes across as being about the same age as Dame Maggie Smith's McGonagall, not absolutely ancient like Richard Harris, who was only ten years older but with his frail health seemed more like thirty years older. Gambon is certainly better suited to the action scenes (I loved his escape with Fawkes from Umbridge and Fudge). The costuming department is also partly to blame. He never changes clothes, whereas Book!Dumbledore always dresses flamboyantly. (I always think of Merlin when JKR describes his clothing, except for the blue buckled boots in SS/PS. Don't know where those came from!) The real DD (sorry, I mean Book!DD) would never wear that stupid little hat or a rubber band around his beard like some sort of hippie from the Sixties. Worse, and this part is Gambon's own fault, he has never, as far as I know, read the books. He says that he always plays himself, which is just wrong for anyone attempting Dumbledore. He was actually not too bad in PoA once I got used to him, but you're right that he badly blow the scene in GoF where Harry's name has come out of the hat and he yells at him and shakes him. Dumbledore would never do that to any student. We see him in OoP (the book) reprimanding Umbridge for similar treatment of Marietta. If he'd read the books, he'd know not to do that--and would argue with the director if he insisted on it. (I think maybe that scene was Mike Newell's fault since he also had Fred and George engage in a fist fight instead of pointing at each other and laughing when they step over the age line and grow beards (which, BTW, should have been longer). Anyway, I don't think that Michael Gambon is miscast. He has the energy and twinkle (and occasional sternness or anger) that readers of the books associate with Dumbledore. If we just look at his face, ignoring his age and the stupid beard tie, he actually seems at times like Dumbledore. But he really needs to read the books--all of them--to understand the character and to think of himself *as* Dumbledore rather than as himself *playing* Dumbledore, if that makes any sense. And I really, really hope that someone has explained the real situation between him and Snape--and that Dumbledore is a secretive, manipulative old codger as well as a charming, eccentric, and talented one. (He does, at least, understand that DD is exceedingly clever and powerful. Richard Harris came across as charming, eccentric, and wise but too far past his prime to be powerful.) IOW, in my view, Gambon has the potential to be a very good if not an excellent Dumbledore despite the wardrobe problems, but he certainly didn't achieve that potential in GoF and only touched on it in PoA and OoP. If he'd just read the books and try to be JKR's Dumbledore rather than his own script-based version of the character, he'd do fine. Carol, agreeing that Fleur is miscast (but Robert Pattinson as Cedric was perfect) From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 19:23:33 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 19:23:33 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Potioncat wrote: > Carol's response: I'm not going to talk about a cultural component to beauty, but as long as we're on the topic, here's a funny set of Photoshopped photos of Robert Pattinson, who looks great with his own wild hair (since cut off, apparently) but absolutely absurd with, say, Donald Trump's hair. Here's the link; have fun. http://spoiledpretty.blogspot.com/2009/06/robert-pattinson-is-his-hotness-in-hair.html or http://tinyurl.com/nvpqpo BTW, I'd Google "young French actresses" or "blonde French actresses" to find someone who more closely fits my image of Fleur, who should be exceedingly, almost inhumanly, beautiful, not just slightly pretty, but I'm afraid I'd get a porn site. Anyone ever watch an old film with Brigitte Bardot? http://us.imdb.com/media/rm2006095872/nm0000003 *She* had the right look--in the 1950s! Carol, surprised to discover just how old Brigitte Bardot really is (born 1934) From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 19:50:27 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 19:50:27 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <001501c9f5c5$b575d2d0$20617870$@com> Message-ID: Carol earlier: > Carol, who likes the SS film despite flaws in the acting md: > I Don't not like the SS (pr PS as my British blu-ray is titled) since the source material is strong enough to overcome the bad directing. > Carol responds; Well, liking or not liking is a matter of taste. To each his or her own. :-) As I said, I like it despite the acting flaws, primarily because it's faithful to the book, most of the casting is good, and the costuming and sets are appropriate. md: > My issue is not just with Hermione's line (which you focused on) since I also mentioned Molly's line in COS as well, I think all the actors where poorly served by Columbus. Carol: Sorry about that. I can't recall Molly's line and don't want to lose my post by looking it up. If you could quote it again and provide a link, I'd appreciate it. (It's hard to follow threads on Yahoo and locate the correct post myself.) md: And don't give me that "younger audience" crap, that's BS in a big way, Carol responds: Excuse me, but what have I done or said to deserve that tone. Please have the decency not to call what I or anyone else says "crap" or BS." That's simply uncalled for--and certainly not a reasonable, logical argument that will persuade us to agree with you. (Sorry, List Elves, but there are limits to my tolerance.) md: > look at Shrek, Wal-E, The original Star Wars, all sold big to very young audiences with good acting and directing and uncompromised story telling. Carol: I haven't seen "Wal-E" and haven't watched the original "Star Wars" films since they came out (and I confess that I was mostly watching for Han Solo!). As for "Shrek," sure it's clever, but it's written on two levels, one for kids and one for adults (which the old Bullwinkle cartoons did better, IMO), but it also resorts to body-based humor (thanks, "Lion King" creators, for inventing flatulent cartoon characters!). Admittedly, the HP films and books also use that approach (e.d., "troll bogies") but it doesn't appeal to me. And, of course, both "Shrek" and "Wal-E" are cartoons, so they involve only voice acting--by professionals and, in the case of "Shrek," at least, adults. You can't really compare two different genres. md: > And, since you brought it up, Hermione, Harry and Ron are 10, 11, & 12 in SS the actors are each about 1 year apart in age with Emma being the youngest and Rupert the oldest. Carol: Yes, I know. But you were discussing the unlikelihood of a ten-year-old speaking that line, and I was pointing out that in the book, from which the line originated, Hermione is twelve--and more intellectually developed than the two boys. I wouldn't expect that line from Ginny Weasley, but it fits Hermione just fine. The performance, OTOH, could be improved. md: > As for a 10 yr old acting, every see the Piano? Carol responds: I haven't seen "The Piano" because the story doesn't appeal to me. I have, however, seen ten-year-olds who can act, which appears to be your point. I'm not saying that no ten-year-old can act. I'm saying that Emma Watson at age ten (or eleven, depending on when the scene was filmed) was inexperienced, untrained, and not particularly gifted. She was cute and perky; she looked the part (if you don't mind her not having prominent teeth), but *she* had not yet learned to act. And though she might have received more tips from Columbus, I doubt that even Cecil B. DeMille could have made her into a skilled actress at that point. She's improved, but she's still (IMO only) the least talented of the three main actors. (Someone should tell her to calm down and slow down so that Americans can understand her--a problem that, oddly enough, she *didn't* have in the first two films.) Carol, who would never, ever call another person's point "BS" regardless of how ridiculous I thought it From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 19:53:31 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 19:53:31 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Potioncat wrote: > > > Carol's response: Carol again: Sorry, Potioncat. I didn't mean to snip your whole post! Carol, completely mystified as to who cast the Vanishing Spell on Potioncat's words From md at exit-reality.com Thu Jun 25 20:22:23 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 16:22:23 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: References: <001501c9f5c5$b575d2d0$20617870$@com> Message-ID: <004501c9f5d2$a64bc2d0$f2e34870$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carol Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 3:50 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall Carol, who would never, ever call another person's point "BS" regardless of how ridiculous I thought it :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Guess that's just where you and I differ, I don't mince words and tact can be an afterthought when replying to something I find to be really off-base. Also, just like to point out, that I'm the first person to admit if I say something that's BS. I have no patience for it, especially when I do it. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From s_ings at yahoo.com Thu Jun 25 23:43:56 2009 From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend) Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 23:43:56 -0000 Subject: Admin: Reminder regarding list rules Message-ID: Reminder Memo From: Elfly HQ To: members of the HPFGU-Movie list As you may recall, the List Elves posted a memo a couple months back (http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-Movie/message/16061) asking list member to adhere to the same basic messages posting rules that exist on the other HPFGU groups. It has come to our attention that some members here on the Movie list are still failing to adhere to these rules, especially in regards to top-posting. We would like to remind you once again that your response to a message should go *below* the material you're responding to, not above. We have given more than adequate time for everyone to get used to the new rules. It pains us to note that we may now have to start emailing members individually for rules infractions. We would like to see the list rules complied with by the time the next movie comes out. As this is fast approaching, we will start contacting list members for not following the list rules. Please don't make us consider moderating list members just before we have something new and wonderful to discuss! HPly yours, The List Elves From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Fri Jun 26 04:17:27 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 04:17:27 -0000 Subject: Cultural component of beauty/ was:Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "potioncat" wrote: > There is a cultural component to beauty, but I'm intrigued, > would someone be considered gorgeous in one place and actually > ugly in another? zanooda: Sure :-)! I've read about some tribe where long necks are considered beautiful, and the girls have to wear some kind of rings on their necks from a very young age, so that the neck could grow longer and longer, and as it becomes longer, more rings are added. As a result, their women look like giraffes to us, but the men of this tribe (I forgot where it lives) value the length of the neck and try to take a wife with the largest number of the rings :-). But of course I was not talking about such extremes :-). > potioncat wrote: > Just for fun, can you give us examples? zanooda: Hmm, I was hoping it won't come to the examples, because, you know, we tend to take things like that to heart - what if my "example" turns out to be someone's favorite actress? I don't want to upset anyone. However, since you asked, I'll give you one example: all Russians that I know (in my age category :-)) find Sara Jessica Parker very ugly, and it amazes me every time (and that's often :-)) when I see that she is called "a beauty" or some such word in a magazine. It just takes much more than that to be called beautiful in Russia, you know? At least it was like that when I was young... :-). > kempermentor wrote: > I'm curious. Will you post a link to pics of hawt youth from > both genders from your place of origin? zanooda: Maybe I will, if I find something :-). I haven't been to Russia in 17 years and I have no idea who is *hot* there now. I'll have to find out :-). From no.limberger at gmail.com Fri Jun 26 13:26:41 2009 From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 06:26:41 -0700 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7ef72f90906260626g5380f8cdx728b9233569e220d@mail.gmail.com> >Carol wrote: >Regarding Michael Gambon, he was, of course, at a disadvantage >stepping into a role that another, much older (and beloved) actor, had >handled very differently. It's also hard for a man in his sixties to play a >very old man of close to 115, however well preserved. I realize that >sixty-plus seems ancient to most children and teenagers, but Gambon's >Dumbledore comes across as being about the same age as Dame Maggie >Smith's McGonagall, not absolutely ancient like Richard Harris, who >was only ten years older but with his frail health seemed more like thirty >years older. Gambon is certainly better suited to the action scenes >(I loved his escape with Fawkes from Umbridge and Fudge). No.Limberger responds: IMO, Michael Gambon has done a very good job overall in the role of Albus Dumbledore. As you point out, he had to step into a role left by the late Richard Harris, whose deteriorating health was evident in CoS. There is no way, for example, that Harris (were he alive) would have been able to duel LV in OotP, and the scene that you referred to in GoF where DD escapes Fudge & Umbridge would also have been difficult for him to muster. >Carol wrote: >The costuming department is also partly to blame. He never changes >clothes, whereas Book!Dumbledore always dresses flamboyantly. >(I always think of Merlin when JKR describes his clothing, except >for the blue buckled boots in SS/PS. Don't know where those came >from!) The real DD (sorry, I mean Book!DD) would never wear that >stupid little hat or a rubber band around his beard like some sort >of hippie from the Sixties. No.Limberger responds: I prefer the wardrobe that Harris wore over what Gambon has worn. I don't know what that little thing is wrapped around the beard and the little hat is also a bit odd. >Carol wrote: >Anyway, I don't think that Michael Gambon is miscast. He has the >energy and twinkle (and occasional sternness or anger) that readers >of the books associate with Dumbledore. If we just look at his face, >ignoring his age and the stupid beard tie, he actually seems at times >like Dumbledore. But he really needs to read the books--all of them--to >understand the character and to think of himself *as* Dumbledore >rather than as himself *playing* Dumbledore, if that makes any sense. No.Limberger responds: I totally agree. While Gambon hasn't read the books (and he probably should), he has done an excellent, imo, portraying DD. It was no doubt quite stressful to step into the role left behind by the late Richard Harris, but he found his own way to portray DD that, imo, comes across very close to the DD that we know from the books. -- "Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Fri Jun 26 16:21:25 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 16:21:25 -0000 Subject: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: <004501c9f5d2$a64bc2d0$f2e34870$@com> Message-ID: Carol earlier: > Carol, who would never, ever call another person's point "BS" regardless of how ridiculous I thought it md: > Guess that's just where you and I differ, I don't mince words and tact can be an afterthought when replying to something I find to be really off-base. > > Also, just like to point out, that I'm the first person to admit if I say something that's BS. I have no patience for it, especially when I do it. Carol responds: Yes, we clearly differ. I was taught to be courteous even when I disagreed with someone, and I taught that to my composition students as well. Rudeness, after all, won't persuade others to agree with them--or with you. Labeling a point that you disagree with as "BS" (or "crap" or even "ridiculous" or "absurd") is not an argument or a counterargument. It's merely your opinion stated in a way that the person addressed is likely to find offensive. If I were to label a point of yours as ridiculous, would that convince you that the point was ridiculous? I seriously doubt it. You'd expect a logical counterargument and supporting evidence. After all, you're an English teacher, and you wouldn't, I hope, accept "that's BS" or "that's ridiculous" as a counterargument in a student essay. Carol, who also finds some opinions ridiculous but either ignores them or refutes them From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Fri Jun 26 16:37:51 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 16:37:51 -0000 Subject: Cultural component of beauty/ was:Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: zanooda wrote: > > Hmm, I was hoping it won't come to the examples, because, you know, we tend to take things like that to heart - what if my "example" turns out to be someone's favorite actress? I don't want to upset anyone. However, since you asked, I'll give you one example: all Russians that I know (in my age category :-)) find Sara Jessica Parker very ugly, and it amazes me every time (and that's often :-)) when I see that she is called "a beauty" or some such word in a magazine. It just takes much more than that to be called beautiful in Russia, you know? At least it was like that when I was young... :-). Carol responds: I agree that Sarah Jessica Parker isn't a great beauty (long face and rather long nose), but isn't it nice that a forty-something woman can be a TV star? It's unrealistic to think, as many young Americans do, that all women should be beautiful and that thirty is "old." (Some women, for example Lynda Carter, are still beautiful or at least pretty as they approach sixty, but we shouldn't expect that of the average woman, either.) I wouldn't call SJP "ugly," just closer to "somewhat attractive" than "beautiful." With regard to Fleur, though, "somewhat attractive" (which, IMO, also applies to Clemence Poesy) isn't good enough. She should be stunning, what we Americans used to call "a knockout." Since I'm unfamiliar with French actresses, I have no idea who would be more suitable for the part. But I don't think we have to rely on cultural standards entirely because we have a description--long silver-gilt hair (yeah, I know; they could use a wig for the hair but she would need the coloring of a blonde), big blue eyes, and a willowy build, to begin with. I would expect her to move gracefully, as well. Carol, wondering which French actress others would suggest for the role if it were recast From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Fri Jun 26 16:39:35 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 16:39:35 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" wrote: > "Miscast" just means that an actor is cast in an unsuitable > role. Imagine Madonna playing McGonagall, for example. zanooda: That's what I thought :-). However, it seems sometimes that people use this word to indicate that the actor didn't manage to show a character as it is supposed to be. For example, many viewers wrote that Mrs.Figg actress was miscast, but I think she just didn't play the part right, and these are two different things. Another thing - sometimes a character in the movie is very different from the same character in the book, but only because the director *wanted it* this way, not because he (or the actor) misunderstood the character. For instance, Viktor Krum in the movie is not the same as in the book, but I believe it was the director's decision to change the character. That's why in this case I also can't say that the actor is miscast. > Carol wrote: > I think that Frank Dillane is miscast as the teenage Tom > Riddle--not nearly handsome enough. zanooda: Which one is that :-)? The one from CoS or the one they cast for HBP (no time to check)? The HBP's one doesn't seem to be handsome. I could see him only for a second in the trailer though. > Carol wrote: > Worse, and this part is Gambon's own fault, he has never, as > far as I know, read the books. zanooda: Well, the books are really long, so I don't really blame him :-). I think it's the director's job to make sure that the actors know how to play certain characters. > Carol: > Anyway, I don't think that Michael Gambon is miscast. zanooda: Right, that's what I said :-). He just didn't know for some reason what DD would and wouldn't do. But he *can* play him, IMO. From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Fri Jun 26 17:06:14 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 17:06:14 -0000 Subject: Cultural component of beauty/ was:Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" wrote: > isn't it nice that a forty-something woman can be a TV star? zanooda: Totally nice :-). She is a good actress too :-). But that was not my point. My point is, according to TV and magazines, people here find her attractive, and I don't, and I suspect cultural differences are at fault :-). > Carol, wondering which French actress others would suggest for > the role if it were recast zanooda: I don't know any young French actresses either :-). From the old ones, I used to like Isabelle Adjani, but she is not Fleur's type :-). From md at exit-reality.com Fri Jun 26 17:34:07 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 13:34:07 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: HP does not better in the summer than Fall In-Reply-To: References: <004501c9f5d2$a64bc2d0$f2e34870$@com> Message-ID: <001d01c9f684$4f06a000$ed13e000$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carol Carol, who also finds some opinions ridiculous but either ignores them or refutes them :::::::::::::::::::::::::: If I label a crime a crime it's still a crime, if I label murder a heinous crime committed by a disturbed person I may be dressing things up in modifiers but the facts don't change and I don't care if the murder is bothered by descriptive wording. If I see something that's flat out wrong and I call it wrong I mean that it's wrong, and if I say a wrong statement is labeled as BS then that's what I find it is. If I smell it, I say it so others don't step in it. If I make a wrong statement and someone calls it BS and it turns out it is indeed BS then I simply say woops and admit my error and get on with my life rather than dragging things out to absurd degrees over personally perceived matters of etiquette and protocol. C3P0 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Fri Jun 26 17:39:58 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 13:39:58 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Cultural component of beauty/ was:Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <003b01c9f685$2061e6a0$6125b3e0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carol With regard to Fleur, though, "somewhat attractive" (which, IMO, also applies to Clemence Poesy) isn't good enough. She should be stunning, what we Americans used to call "a knockout." Since I'm unfamiliar with French actresses, I have no idea who would be more suitable for the part. But I don't think we have to rely on cultural standards entirely because we have a description--long silver-gilt hair (yeah, I know; they could use a wig for the hair but she would need the coloring of a blonde), big blue eyes, and a willowy build, to begin with. I would expect her to move gracefully, as well. ::::::::::::::::: Well, in the US big, blue eyes, full, pouty lips, blond hair, slender body usually is the standard of beauty. As a man, I personally think she's hot and if she walked into any club / bar around here she'd be swarmed even if she'd never been on a film or photographed professionally. As Ron put it "you know how I like it when they walk." md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Fri Jun 26 17:41:29 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 13:41:29 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <004001c9f685$56c7d5b0$04578110$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of zanooda2 --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com , "Carol" wrote: > "Miscast" just means that an actor is cast in an unsuitable > role. Imagine Madonna playing McGonagall, for example. :::::::::::::: Madonna could totally pull it off. Now that she's older, puller her hair back tight and let her rip. I could actually see that. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Fri Jun 26 17:45:56 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 10:45:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps Message-ID: <209455.59344.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> ?I have to say Madonna in a harry potter movie would so ruin it - she can sing but who said she can act? cause well she can't. Some singers should just stay singing.Love,Red From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of zanooda2 --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com , "Carol" wrote: > "Miscast" just means that an actor is cast in an unsuitable > role. Imagine Madonna playing McGonagall, for example. :::::::::::::: Madonna could totally pull it off. Now that she's older, puller her hair back tight and let her rip. I could actually see that. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From no.limberger at gmail.com Fri Jun 26 17:50:57 2009 From: no.limberger at gmail.com (No Limberger) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 10:50:57 -0700 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <004001c9f685$56c7d5b0$04578110$@com> References: <004001c9f685$56c7d5b0$04578110$@com> Message-ID: <7ef72f90906261050k7cd5eb7bp1d01dde5751aaa94@mail.gmail.com> >md wrote: >Madonna could totally pull it off. Now that she's older, puller >her hair back tight and let her rip. No.Limberger responds: Madonna cannot act. The only film that I liked her in was "A League of Their Own", in which she had a small part. Madonna in a HP film would likely be a liability. -- "Why don't you dance with me, I'm not no limberger!" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Fri Jun 26 18:23:25 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 14:23:25 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <209455.59344.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <209455.59344.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001c01c9f68b$31ee7d10$95cb7730$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lady of Imladris Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 1:46 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps I have to say Madonna in a harry potter movie would so ruin it - she can sing but who said she can act? cause well she can't. Some singers should just stay singing.Love,Red ::::::::::::: Well, it's a moot point because she's not being offered a part, but she's never really had a good part in a good movie to judge her skills by. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From sistermagpie at earthlink.net Fri Jun 26 18:55:51 2009 From: sistermagpie at earthlink.net (sistermagpie) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 18:55:51 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <001c01c9f68b$31ee7d10$95cb7730$@com> Message-ID: Cabal: > Well, it's a moot point because she's not being offered a part, but she's > never really had a good part in a good movie to judge her skills by. Magpie: She's been in a number of movies and on Broadway once. I think her skills have had a pretty good chance to be shown--though it's maybe subjective how well people think she's done. -m From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Fri Jun 26 22:54:20 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 22:54:20 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <004001c9f685$56c7d5b0$04578110$@com> Message-ID: Carol earlier: > > "Miscast" just means that an actor is cast in an unsuitable role. Imagine Madonna playing McGonagall, for example. md responded: > Madonna could totally pull it off. Now that she's older, puller her hair back tight and let her rip. > > I could actually see that. > Carol again: Can you? I can't. I'd as soon watch Dame Maggie play Madonna? However, zanooda wanted an example of miscasting. I'll try to find one that everyone can agree on. How about Judi Dench as Narcissa Malfoy or Hugh Grant as Wormtail? I was going to say Keira Knightley as Professor Sprout, but that's too extreme, right? No one would ever consider it. Carol, tossing out what she considers to be humorous casting ideas From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Fri Jun 26 23:09:44 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 23:09:44 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Carol earlier: > > > I think that Frank Dillane is miscast as the teenage Tom > > Riddle--not nearly handsome enough. > > > zanooda: > > Which one is that :-)? The one from CoS or the one they cast for HBP (no time to check)? The HBP's one doesn't seem to be handsome. I could see him only for a second in the trailer though. > Carol again: The original (CoS) Tom Riddle was Christian Coulson. He was twenty-four by the time the film came out (probably twenty-three during filming) but he passed for a teenager, not to mention that he was handsome and conveyed the right personality, seemingly quiet and charming but actually dangerous and evil. Frank Dillane (HBP) is closer to the right age, but I have no idea whether he can act. My objection to him at this point is strictly visual; he's very ordinary looking and has a weak chin. Since handsomeness is central to Tom Riddle's personality, I consider him to be miscast. Possibly filmgoers who haven't read the books won't mind, but I think it will take some really strong acting for a boy who looks like any teenager on the street to convey the charm and magnetism that I imagine Tom Riddle exerting over his fellow Slytherins. Christian Coulson is, of course, much too old to play the role now--unless we don't mind actors playing characters half their age. Carol, who also considers Gary Oldman to be miscast as the formerly handsome, thirty-something Sirius Black From md at exit-reality.com Sat Jun 27 00:27:24 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 20:27:24 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: References: <004001c9f685$56c7d5b0$04578110$@com> Message-ID: <006901c9f6be$0b6000f0$222002d0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carol Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 6:54 PM To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps Can you? I can't. I'd as soon watch Dame Maggie play Madonna? However, zanooda wanted an example of miscasting. I'll try to find one that everyone can agree on. How about Judi Dench as Narcissa Malfoy or Hugh Grant as Wormtail? I was going to say Keira Knightley as Professor Sprout, but that's too extreme, right? No one would ever consider it. :::::::::::::::::::: Maybe Judi Dench when she was young enough, she's an amazingly talented acress. Hugh Grant would be too tall and thin, there's simply no way physically he could look the part. I think Slughorn is miscast, he should be 300 - 400 lbs. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From astratrf at gmail.com Sat Jun 27 01:03:40 2009 From: astratrf at gmail.com (astratrf) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 01:03:40 -0000 Subject: Marquee In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hey, me too! ...and my family thinks I'm nuts and that I'm "seeing things"! It's good to know that I'm not alone here! Astra > From agdisney at msn.com Sat Jun 27 01:10:19 2009 From: agdisney at msn.com (Andrea Grevera) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 21:10:19 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Marquee In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hey, me too! ...and my family thinks I'm nuts and that I'm "seeing things"! It's good to know that I'm not alone here! Astra I'm glad someone answered me. I was beginning to think I was the only one. Thanks, Andie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Sat Jun 27 06:15:02 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 23:15:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps Message-ID: <707959.1275.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Fri, 6/26/09, Carol wrote: From: Carol Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, June 26, 2009, 4:09 PM Carol earlier: > > > I think that Frank Dillane is miscast as the teenage Tom > > Riddle--not nearly handsome enough. > > > zanooda: > > Which one is that :-)? The one from CoS or the one they cast for HBP (no time to check)? The HBP's one doesn't seem to be handsome. I could see him only for a second in the trailer though. > Carol again: The original (CoS) Tom Riddle was Christian Coulson. He was twenty-four by the time the film came out (probably twenty-three during filming) but he passed for a teenager, not to mention that he was handsome and conveyed the right personality, seemingly quiet and charming but actually dangerous and evil. Frank Dillane (HBP) is closer to the right age, but I have no idea whether he can act. My objection to him at this point is strictly visual; he's very ordinary looking and has a weak chin. Since handsomeness is central to Tom Riddle's personality, I consider him to be miscast. Possibly filmgoers who haven't read the books won't mind, but I think it will take some really strong acting for a boy who looks like any teenager on the street to convey the charm and magnetism that I imagine Tom Riddle exerting over his fellow Slytherins. Christian Coulson is, of course, much too old to play the role now--unless we don't mind actors playing characters half their age. Carol, who also considers Gary Oldman to be miscast as the formerly handsome, thirty-something Sirius Black *********************************************************************** I think it was kind of a mistake for JK To stick with just English actors I mean there are tons of good American actors for instance- ?Johnny Depp. I'm sure Johnny Deep would have loved to been in a Harry Potter Role.? You know I also consider the actor who plays Remus Lupin aka David Thewlis to be very miscasted - I thought that Ralph Fiennes (He who must not be named) should have been Remus. I considered Remus a handsome man. As fare as Sirius Black I simple adore Gary Oldman he's the most amazing talented actor I can think (bedises Johnny Depp). I think Sirius was a good role for him though they didn't put as much Sirius Black in the movies as they should have. My other questions is why haven't they cast Jeremy Irons? He's another wonderfully talented English actor. I love him in Dungons and Dragons and Die Hard Three and many other roles. Now i could Jeremy Irons as he who must not be named, he would handle that role so well.? Carol - who would you have had play Sirius Black? (I am curious to know)? Love,Red [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Sat Jun 27 06:31:53 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 02:31:53 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <707959.1275.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <707959.1275.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000c01c9f6f0$f64fd220$e2ef7660$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lady of Imladris My other questions is why haven't they cast Jeremy Irons? He's another wonderfully talented English actor. I love him in Dungons and Dragons and Die Hard Three and many other roles. Now i could Jeremy Irons as he who must not be named, he would handle that role so well. Carol - who would you have had play Sirius Black? (I am curious to know) Love,Red ::::::::::::::::::::: Jeremy Irons has a great, menacing baritone / bass voice and Voldamort sounds like a hissing snake, there's, to me, 100% good reason not to cast Irons. After watching Shindler's List I would say Fiennes can nail the part just right and I think he has. I can't think of a good part for Iron's to play. I like Oldman, and I like the way he played Black. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Sat Jun 27 18:02:09 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 18:02:09 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <006901c9f6be$0b6000f0$222002d0$@com> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Child of Midian" wrote: > I think Slughorn is miscast, he should be 300 - 400 lbs. zanooda: I think you are right, but only partly :-). Things like weight are easily fixed (fat suits and things like that), so they *could* make the actor look his part, they just chose not to, for some reason. They can't make him shorter though... :-). I really hope he at least plays old Sluggy well. From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Sat Jun 27 18:09:38 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 18:09:38 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <707959.1275.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, Lady of Imladris wrote: > I'm sure Johnny Depp would have loved to been in a Harry Potter > Role. zanooda: But, what character do you think he could play (hypothetically, of course) :-)?? From md at exit-reality.com Sat Jun 27 18:12:57 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 14:12:57 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: References: <707959.1275.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000e01c9f752$e6666920$b3333b60$@com> --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com , Lady of Imladris wrote: > I'm sure Johnny Depp would have loved to been in a Harry Potter > Role. zanooda: But, what character do you think he could play (hypothetically, of course) :-)? ?:::::::::::::::::::::::: Crabbe. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Sat Jun 27 18:46:23 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 14:46:23 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <000e01c9f752$e6666920$b3333b60$@com> References: <707959.1275.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <000e01c9f752$e6666920$b3333b60$@com> Message-ID: <001601c9f757$91e8fa70$b5baef50$@com> I think worse than any casting was the failure to create a layout of the castle and grounds before the first film was ever made and insist that all directors stick to it. The placement of the Whomping Willow in COS was ignorant considering POA the book was out and CC had read it, it made no sense to have it right next to the castle which is why it was moved for POA, OTOH moving Hagrids hut for POA made no sense, nor did making it different from the original set. The forth book was out by the time the first film was finished, they should have had a complete and thorough topography laid out and maintained consistency. I personally have thought all the actors have taken their roles to heart and made them work, if not immediately, then as the series progressed. I think Umbrige was brilliant and Black was truly brought to life, though Hagrid is by far, IMO the best character jump from book to screen, in fact, I find film Hagrid more entertaining than the book one. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kempermentor at yahoo.com Sat Jun 27 19:26:54 2009 From: kempermentor at yahoo.com (kempermentor) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 19:26:54 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <001601c9f757$91e8fa70$b5baef50$@com> Message-ID: > md: > ... > OTOH moving Hagrids hut for POA made no sense, nor did making it different from the original set. Kemper now: It's been a while since I've watched SS and CoS, but I remember thinking that Hagrid's hut was too close to the castle. I like that in PoA, it's a bit of a trek out from the castle. I like its symbolism: Hagrid as an outsider. It would have worked better in CoS, but... Kemper From md at exit-reality.com Sat Jun 27 20:17:19 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 16:17:19 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: References: <001601c9f757$91e8fa70$b5baef50$@com> Message-ID: <000c01c9f764$45c6da60$d1548f20$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kempermentor I like that in PoA, it's a bit of a trek out from the castle. I like its symbolism: Hagrid as an outsider. It would have worked better in CoS, but... Kemper :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: I liked that in PS & COS that there was the great expanse of the Dark Forest just beyond Hagrid's hut, since they moved the hut the Dark Forest seems to have vanished and in the last three films there's just an expanse of ordinary woods around the grounds. I only cared that they moved the hut because these changes really break the continuity from the first two films to the third one and after. In many respects there's Harry Potter 1 & 2 and Harry Potter 3 through 7 (well, soon enough) rather than one series of films, I think the change in topography visually separates the films by drawing the audience's attention to the differences. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kempermentor at yahoo.com Sat Jun 27 21:18:42 2009 From: kempermentor at yahoo.com (kempermentor) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 21:18:42 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <000c01c9f764$45c6da60$d1548f20$@com> Message-ID: > md: > .... I only cared that they moved the hut because these changes really break the continuity from the first two films to the third one and after. In many respects there's Harry Potter 1 & 2 and Harry Potter 3 through 7 (well, soon enough) rather than one series of films, I think the change in topography visually separates the films by drawing the audience's attention to the differences. Kemper now: It could be said that the books are two series as well with 1-3 and 5-7: 4 either being the end or one series or the start of another though I suspect most people would place it in the second. Kemper From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com Sat Jun 27 23:56:37 2009 From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 23:56:37 -0000 Subject: Harry and Ginny Message-ID: Hello all, I am new to this group. I've been seeing all the trailers and such and the new stuff out today http://tinyurl.com/lvt79l has even more new Harry/Ginny stuff in it. I don't like them together in the books. I hated them when I originally read books 6 and 7, and recently reread all the books, and hoped I'd feel differently. I did fell differently, I felt indifferent. I just don't get them. Nothing happens that would get Harry's attention, and get him thinking about her differently. They barley share any scenes in either HBP or DH. In the movie it seems as though Harry is going to save Ginny at the burrow when it's attacked. Is this near the beginning? Maybe Ginny will kiss Harry as a thank you, and that's what is getting him to see her in a different light. All the scenes I've seen between them so far are added/different from the book. (the kiss, take my hand, the burrow, her feeding him the cookie, her grabbing the book from him, the look across the table). I know a lot of people like H/G in the books. Both of my daughters love them together. I really wish I did, as I feel I'm missing out on something. Maybe the movie will be able to do this for me. Joann From md at exit-reality.com Sun Jun 28 00:52:47 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 20:52:47 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Harry and Ginny In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000901c9f78a$c15217a0$43f646e0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of coolbeans3131 I know a lot of people like H/G in the books. Both of my daughters love them together. I really wish I did, as I feel I'm missing out on something. Maybe the movie will be able to do this for me. Joann :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: I think most of us can agree that JK was wimpy in her writing about Harry & Ginny. She tells us a lot about how Harry feels, but doesn't really show them together like Ron and Hermione. I didn't not buy them as a couple, I just wanted to see what JKR was telling us. Early screening reviews say their relationship is stressed a lot more in the film, hopefully they'll put her in DH a bit more as well. The attack at the Weasely's takes place near the middle of the film, during the holidays, it was added in and does not happen in the book. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From d2dmiles at yahoo.de Sun Jun 28 01:13:06 2009 From: d2dmiles at yahoo.de (Miles) Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 03:13:06 +0200 Subject: Casting mis-steps References: <707959.1275.qm@web59812.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <370C94D49985405B98FCE4F380E11972@miles> > Carol earlier: >>> I think that Frank Dillane is miscast as the teenage Tom >>> Riddle--not nearly handsome enough. Lady of Imladris wrote: > I think it was kind of a mistake for JK To stick with just English > actors I mean there are tons of good American actors for instance- > Johnny Depp. I'm sure Johnny Deep would have loved to been in a Harry > Potter Role. Miles: First, I very much doubt that Depp would have wanted to play in movies that so obviously have not artistic motivation. But that aside, I want to bring back together two discussions, the one about attractiveness of people and cultural influence on that, and the other on bad casts concerning the Harry-Potter-movies. Beauty is not so only a cultural, but also a biological phenomenon. It's basically an important impulse for recreation (that's the function "nature" had to invent beauty) - people perceived as attractive have better chances of reproduction. But since humans are not only driven by nature and (sexual) instincts, but by cultural environment and intellect as well, we can perceive "beauty" on people we are not really interested in (sexually, I mean), and can love people whom we would not think of being physically attractive in the eye of other people. But back to beauty: Physical attractiveness is very much a question of statistics. That means, in a given country people will think of a person as handsome or beautiful, if the person matches the statistical average. With computer programmes it's possible to index faces (and bodies) by many different dimensions, like distance of the eyes, position of the nose, height of the forehead, plus hair and skin colour and so on. The average member of a given society will perceive a face as beautiful when it matches the statistical average of the people. In reality this is (fortunately) very much complicated due to globalization - migration brings in "foreign looking" people, the movies show us people from all over the world, not to speak of multi-ethnical nations like the USA - but still there are patterns of beauty that are different in the countries all over the world, and that finally brings me back to Harry Potter, "miscasts" and British actors. Harry Potter is English, the students in Hogwarts are British and Irish, Rowling herself is English, thus what she describes as "handsome" in her books is "handsome" for Britain. Looking at people from the British Isles, compared to, say, people from France, you'll see differences, not in the individual, but "statistically". The average Briton (of European heritage) will have brighter skin, more commonly reddish or blonde hair, he will have more freckles and so on as the average French (of European heritage). So, what people will think of being a handsome young man will be different in the UK and in France, and again different in Russia, the USA or Germany. For example, when I first saw Robert Pattinson as Cedric in the GoF film, I thought he was not the right man for the job, because I didn't (and don't) think of him as being outstanding handsome. But maybe he is in the eyes of Harry's and his own people? I felt the same way about Christian Coulson as Tom Riddle in CS - he was not only way too old (I HATE it when they cast twens for teenage characters), I thought he is, well, not really handsome. But maybe he is by British standards? To have a British cast does not only make Hogwarts *sound* British, it makes Hogwarts' students *look* British. And I think this is a right decision. If it were for Warner to decide, we would have an O.C. California cast with actors fitting US (and maybe international) taste. Maybe many of us would consider Tom Riddle and Cedric Diggory more handsome - but we would lose much more in terms of atmosphere in the films. Miles, who thinks Jamie Campbell Bower is is a very good choice for Gellert Grindelwald (despite his age), not knowing which country Gellert is supposed to come from From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Sun Jun 28 06:06:17 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 23:06:17 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps Message-ID: <897149.64125.qm@web59811.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> The actor who plays Hagrid really does bring him to life. ?I agree with you?on that. Love,Red --- On Sat, 6/27/09, Child of Midian wrote: From: Child of Midian Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, June 27, 2009, 11:46 AM I think worse than any casting was the failure to create a layout of the castle and grounds before the first film was ever made and insist that all directors stick to it. The placement of the Whomping Willow in COS was ignorant considering POA the book was out and CC had read it, it made no sense to have it right next to the castle which is why it was moved for POA, OTOH moving Hagrids hut for POA made no sense, nor did making it different from the original set. The forth book was out by the time the first film was finished, they should have had a complete and thorough topography laid out and maintained consistency. I personally have thought all the actors have taken their roles to heart and made them work, if not immediately, then as the series progressed. I think Umbrige was? brilliant and Black was truly brought to life, though Hagrid is by far, IMO the best character jump from book to screen, in fact, I find film Hagrid more entertaining than the book one. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------ Remember to snip unnecessary material from posts to which you're replying! Any questions or problems - contact the List Elves at HPforGrownups-owner at yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Sun Jun 28 06:07:39 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 23:07:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps Message-ID: <487933.29863.qm@web59803.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Sat, 6/27/09, Child of Midian wrote: From: Child of Midian Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, June 27, 2009, 11:12 AM --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com , Lady of Imladris wrote: > I'm sure Johnny Depp would have loved to been in a Harry Potter > Role. zanooda: But, what character do you think he could play (hypothetically, of course) :-)? ?:::::::::::::::::::::::: Crabbe. md Not Crabbe - maybe one of the ?more darker villians of He who must not be named. I'm not really familer except for the main ones. Love,Red [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From captainjackswomen at yahoo.com Sun Jun 28 06:10:26 2009 From: captainjackswomen at yahoo.com (Lady of Imladris) Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 23:10:26 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps Message-ID: <917254.12221.qm@web59802.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Fri, 6/26/09, Child of Midian wrote: From: Child of Midian Subject: RE: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps To: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, June 26, 2009, 11:31 PM From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lady of Imladris My other questions is why haven't they cast Jeremy Irons? He's another wonderfully talented English actor. I love him in Dungons and Dragons and Die Hard Three and many other roles. Now i could Jeremy Irons as he who must not be named, he would handle that role so well. Carol - who would you have had play Sirius Black? (I am curious to know) Love,Red ::::::::::::::::::::: Jeremy Irons has a great, menacing baritone /? bass voice and Voldamort sounds like a hissing snake, there's, to me, 100% good reason not to cast Irons. After watching Shindler's List I would say Fiennes can nail the part just right and I think he has. I can't think of a good part for Iron's to play. I like Oldman, and I like the way he played Black. md I'm sure Irons is talented enough to be able to change his voice many othershave, I'm sure its not that hard to do. Love,Red [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com Sun Jun 28 11:40:45 2009 From: coolbeans3131 at yahoo.com (coolbeans3131) Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 11:40:45 -0000 Subject: Harry and Ginny In-Reply-To: <000901c9f78a$c15217a0$43f646e0$@com> Message-ID: md: > The attack at the Weasely's takes place near the middle of the film, > during the holidays, it was added in and does not happen in the book. How can the attack happen near the middle? Wouldn't it have to be Christmas break, and it would be winter? Joann From md at exit-reality.com Sun Jun 28 17:06:50 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:06:50 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <487933.29863.qm@web59803.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <487933.29863.qm@web59803.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <005f01c9f812$d9600c20$8c202460$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lady of Imladris Not Crabbe - maybe one of the more darker villians of He who must not be named. I'm not really familer except for the main ones. Love,Red :::::::::::::::: Yeah, that was a joke, you know, a 40 yr old man playing an 11 year old boy who is not Benjamin Button. As for Irons changing his voice, no, we all have an octave rang which we are physically restricted to. True, we can learn to use the full range of our voice, but we can't extend outside of that range realistically and I don't think him doing Voldemort falsetto would have worked at least as far as being in tune with the book. I couldn't personally think of an actor better suited to play Voldy than the one they have. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From md at exit-reality.com Sun Jun 28 17:08:09 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:08:09 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Harry and Ginny In-Reply-To: References: <000901c9f78a$c15217a0$43f646e0$@com> Message-ID: <006401c9f813$035ec7a0$0a1c56e0$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of coolbeans3131 How can the attack happen near the middle? Wouldn't it have to be Christmas break, and it would be winter? Joann ::::::::::::::::::: I have no idea. I only read the "reviews" of those who say the pre-screen last year when the film was still coming out in fall. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Sun Jun 28 18:12:38 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 18:12:38 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <000c01c9f764$45c6da60$d1548f20$@com> Message-ID: md wrote: > I liked that in PS & COS that there was the great expanse of the Dark Forest just beyond Hagrid's hut, since they moved the hut the Dark Forest seems to have vanished and in the last three films there's just an expanse of ordinary woods around the grounds. I only cared that they moved the hut because these changes really break the continuity from the first two films to the third one and after. In many respects there's Harry Potter 1 & 2 and Harry Potter 3 through 7 (well, soon enough) rather than one series of films, I think the change in topography visually separates the films by drawing the audience's attention to the differences. Carol responds: I agree about the break between HP 1 and 2 and the later films making them seem as if they belong to two different series, but I think that that break would have been noticeable even without the changes in topography because of the Cuaron-initiated changes in costuming and makeup. Those changes, for me (along with the shrunken heads), make PoA particularly jarring when I watch it soon after the first two films. By the way, it looks as if the Quidditch players no longer wear robes in HBP even though the films' costume designers have always had the actors wear pants (trousers) under them. Now they'll just have digitally added cloaks. I guess JKR never considered the difficulty of riding a broom wearing a robe. (Dumbledore will have to manage it in HBP, though.) Carol, wishing that Steve Kloves had used the term "Forbidden Forest" rather than "Dark Forest" in SS/PS, but "forbidden forest" is uncapitalized in the book, so maybe he didn't notice it and invented a name From CatMcNulty at comcast.net Sun Jun 28 18:49:19 2009 From: CatMcNulty at comcast.net (Cat) Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 18:49:19 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps & Set Changes. In-Reply-To: <917254.12221.qm@web59802.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: This thread has been fun & thought provoking. After considering the thoughts & opinions regarding different social definitions of beauty I went on a quest to find Fleur ... as I see her. I whole heartly agree with the disappointment expressed in Posey as Fleur (sorry I don't remember who brought this up initially, else I would give credit where credit is due) I saw a picture of a young Brigitte Bardot http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000003/. Now picture that face with a "long sheet of silver blond hair" ... Fleur? I am sure that they could have found a young Brigitte Bardot look-alike...They found Harry Potter didn't they? Regarding set changes. Child of Midian said: >snip< The placement of the Whomping Willow in COS was ignorant considering POA the book was out and CC had read it, it made no sense to have it right next to the castle which is why it was moved for POA,OTOH moving Hagrids hut for POA made no sense, nor did making it different from the original set. The forth book was out by the time the first film was finished, they should have had a complete and thorough topography laid out and maintained consistency.< IMHO - The director-who-must-not-be-named made lots of irrational changes, added totally irrelevant items, ignored others, and eliminated a lot of important details, ... Sorry, echoes of very old rants... His changing the location of Hagrid's Hut, I think it was moved too far from the castle for no good reason. It was outside the castle and right on the edge of the Forbidden Forest. Great symbology there - Just outside the accepted the formal confines of Hogwarts castle but still within the grounds. And standing as a guard/protector between the Students & staff and the unknown perils that exist in the Forbidden Forest. ALSO, just a silly observastion....How much time did students have between classes? Since after CS, Hagrid's Hut (where Care of Magical Creatures was conducted)was a lonnng way from the castle. Did student's have enough time to make their class? Cat (POA was my least favorite HP movie) From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Sun Jun 28 20:10:15 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 20:10:15 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <370C94D49985405B98FCE4F380E11972@miles> Message-ID: Miles wrote: > > Miles, who thinks Jamie Campbell Bower is is a very good choice for Gellert Grindelwald (despite his age), not knowing which country Gellert is supposed to come from Carol responds: I agree that Jamie Campbell Bower is well cast (he doesn't look twenty or twenty-one), assuming that he can manage a mischievous grin and a merry personality concealing evil intentions. But, please, don't let him sing! Gellert (with an accented second e that I can't recreate from Yahoo) is apparently the Hungarian version of Gerard (Saint Gellert was a martyr drowned in the Danube, according to an etymology website). http://www.behindthename.com/name/gelle10rt And Grindelwald is a village in Switzerland ("wald" is "forest" in German, right? I'm not sure about "Grindel"; one website says that it means "wooden fence"). Maybe he's from Austria, right between Switzerland and Hungary? "Nurmengard" sounds German to me, but apparently it isn't. "Gard" could be an alternate spelling of "garde" (French for "keep" in the sense of fortress, castle, prison?), and "Nurmen" suggests "Nurem" in "Nuremberg." Grindelwald has the blond coloring of the "Aryan" ideal valued by the Nazis. I don't think that's accidental. Somehow, I always thought of him as German, I think because of the vague parallels with Hitler and Nazism, and the timing of his defeat coinciding with the end of WWII. Anyway, it seems to me that JKR's WW is organized rather differently from Muggle Europe. It seems to have a British component, represented by the British MoM and educated by Hogwarts; a French component of which we see only a few Beauxbatons students and their headmistress (oddly misrepresented as all-female in the films), and a Germanic/Slavic component represented by Durmstrang and its students, including the Slavic Krum and the apparently Germanic Grindelwald. (Karkaroff seems Russian, but I'll bet every galleon in my Gringotts vault--all zero of them--that he was educated at Hogwarts. Dolohov also seems Slavic, but as he doesn't have any accent, I'm guessing that his family immigrated to Britain several generations earlier.) Anyway, Grindelwald represents that non-French, non-British Central European component. (Maybe Southern Europe has a separate school in Greece or Italy that we don't hear about. The "Greek chappie" who sold Fluffy to Hagrid might have attended that unnamed fourth school. BTW, making him an "Irish chappie" in the film version makes no sense at all. Haven't Kloves and Columbus ever heard of Cerberus?) Carol, trying to get back to Movie List topics at the end of the post! From md at exit-reality.com Sun Jun 28 21:35:05 2009 From: md at exit-reality.com (Child of Midian) Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 17:35:05 -0400 Subject: [HPFGU-Movie] Re: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: References: <000c01c9f764$45c6da60$d1548f20$@com> Message-ID: <003001c9f838$4d6f5a10$e84e0e30$@com> From: HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com [mailto:HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carol md wrote: > I liked that in PS & COS that there was the great expanse of the Dark Forest just beyond Hagrid's hut, since they moved the hut the Dark Forest seems to have vanished and in the last three films there's just an expanse of ordinary woods around the grounds. I only cared that they moved the hut because these changes really break the continuity from the first two films to the third one and after. In many respects there's Harry Potter 1 & 2 and Harry Potter 3 through 7 (well, soon enough) rather than one series of films, I think the change in topography visually separates the films by drawing the audience's attention to the differences. Carol responds: I agree about the break between HP 1 and 2 and the later films making them seem as if they belong to two different series, but I think that that break would have been noticeable even without the changes in topography because of the Cuaron-initiated changes in costuming and makeup. Those changes, for me (along with the shrunken heads), make PoA particularly jarring when I watch it soon after the first two films. By the way, it looks as if the Quidditch players no longer wear robes in HBP even though the films' costume designers have always had the actors wear pants (trousers) under them. Now they'll just have digitally added cloaks. I guess JKR never considered the difficulty of riding a broom wearing a robe. (Dumbledore will have to manage it in HBP, though.) Carol, ::::::::::::::::::::::: I think tone had to change because of the subject matter, I think visually the change has to happen again, because of the subject matter and I think the muggle clothes makes sense because we keep seeing the kids outside of class and Hogwarts and for gods sake, everyone, let the shrunken heads go, it's like 5 minutes of screen time, let's stop talking like it ruined the film. I just watched POA yesterday (viva la blu-ray) and it remains a excellent film on many levels. md [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bboyminn at yahoo.com Sun Jun 28 21:48:41 2009 From: bboyminn at yahoo.com (Steve) Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:48:41 -0000 Subject: Rupert Grint Interview - Daily Mail Message-ID: If you are a Rupert Grint fan, you'll enjoy this interview. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-1195468/Acting-come-end-Harry-Potter-finishes-Rupert-Grint-magic-stopping.html?ITO=1490 This is probably Rupert most candid and intelligent interviews, and it is accompanied by some great photos of Rupert. He talks about some of the extravagances he has spent his money on. Some of which involves his love of motor sports, or at least cars, that we can assume he inherited from his father. He talks about his future in acting. What it was like to be swept up in the whole Harry Potter mania. And what it was like to meet the First Lady Michelle Obama. Again, informative and intelligent, one of his best interviews. While the interview isn't credited, he or she is obviously very skilled. Steve/bboyminn From d2dmiles at yahoo.de Sun Jun 28 22:50:46 2009 From: d2dmiles at yahoo.de (Miles) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 00:50:46 +0200 Subject: Casting mis-steps References: Message-ID: <839890E25D9D4DFAA297CC3F4763D2DC@miles> Carol wrote: > I agree that Jamie Campbell Bower is well cast (he doesn't look > twenty or twenty-one), assuming that he can manage a mischievous grin > and a merry personality concealing evil intentions. But, please, > don't let him sing! Miles: Yes, that's what I thought when I first saw photographs of him after rumours were afloat about him playing Grindelwald. And there are several photographs of him in a very androgynous style, but I very much doubt Warner will dare to play the gay card. Carol > Gellert (with an accented second e that I can't recreate from Yahoo) > is apparently the Hungarian version of Gerard (Saint Gellert was a > martyr drowned in the Danube, according to an etymology website). -snip > And Grindelwald is a village in Switzerland ("wald" is "forest" in > German, right? I'm not sure about "Grindel"; one website says that it > means "wooden fence"). Miles: Wald is forest, and Grindel (I had to look it up) is Old High German for palisade or stockade. Since I never heard the name Gellert used as a first name in Germany or Austria (google seems to know it as a surname only), he might come from Hungary or any other country with a Hungarian minority. Maybe again Transylvania ;). Carol > "Nurmengard" sounds German to me, but > apparently it isn't. "Gard" could be an alternate spelling of "garde" > (French for "keep" in the sense of fortress, castle, prison?), and > "Nurmen" suggests "Nurem" in "Nuremberg." Grindelwald has the blond > coloring of the "Aryan" ideal valued by the Nazis. I don't think > that's accidental. Miles: No, Nurmen is not German (the city is called Nrnberg in German, "Nrn" probably coming from cliffy). Wictionary knows nurmen as genitive form of the Finnish word for grass. Which would bring us back to Hungary, since Hungarian and Finnish (along with Estonian) are closely related. Wictionary identifys "gard" as a slavic word for town or city. Carol: > Somehow, I always thought of him as German, I think because of the > vague parallels with Hitler and Nazism, and the timing of his defeat > coinciding with the end of WWII. Miles: Yes, this was my initial idea as well. "Gellert Grindelwald" sounds like a name an English author would invent to let it sound German - but I think that would be below Rowling's level. Carol > Anyway, it seems to me that JKR's WW is organized rather differently > from Muggle Europe. It seems to have a British component, represented > by the British MoM and educated by Hogwarts; a French component of > which we see only a few Beauxbatons students and their headmistress > (oddly misrepresented as all-female in the films), and a > Germanic/Slavic component represented by Durmstrang and its students, > including the Slavic Krum and the apparently Germanic Grindelwald. -snip- > Anyway, Grindelwald represents that non-French, non-British Central > European component. (Maybe Southern Europe has a separate school in > Greece or Italy that we don't hear about. The "Greek chappie" who > sold Fluffy to Hagrid might have attended that unnamed fourth school. > BTW, making him an "Irish chappie" in the film version makes no sense > at all. Haven't Kloves and Columbus ever heard of Cerberus?) Miles: We only see Beauxbatton and Durmstrang, but that does not implicate that there is nothing else. If there is a French speaking school in France and an English speaking school in Scotland, there most certainly are schools for other languages as well. The language is crucial - while children from wizard families could be prepared to learn a second language for the wizard school, what about the muggleborns? Additionally, we only see British and Irish students in Hogwarts, all the Beauxbatton students have a French accent, and the ones from Durmstrang a slavic accent. But we know there are wizards in all countries - and they apparently do not attend Hogwarts or Beauxbatton or Durmstrang. Miles From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 29 04:15:22 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 04:15:22 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <370C94D49985405B98FCE4F380E11972@miles> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Miles" wrote: > But back to beauty: Physical attractiveness is very much a > question of statistics. That means, in a given country > people will think of a person as handsome or beautiful, > if the person matches the statistical average. zanooda: That may be true, I don't really know :-). But I was not talking about different beauty types, actually. I don't think that Russian beauty canon is very different from American canon. I just can see that in Russia, to be called beautiful, you must be more beautiful than in America, if it makes any sense to you :-). What they here consider plain, we call ugly, what they call nice-looking, we see as plain, what they see as pretty, we call OK, and what they call beautiful, we consider pretty :-). It's probably because there are so many pretty young women in Russia, you just need more to stand out there :-). Still, cultural differences exist, IMO. For example, in Russia (I'm talking about the time I was young, some 30 years ago) a woman's legs were very important. There was no way a bow-legged girl was considered beautiful, it was a big no-no :-). I don't know how to explain this, it's just the way it was, you couldn't be beautiful without straight legs :-). Here in America, luckily for women, the shape of legs doesn't matter at all. Sometimes I watch shows like "America's next top model", and I see that bow-legged girls, girls with knobbly, crooked legs are called gorgeous. That would be impossible in Russia, at least in Russia like I remember her :-). Don't misunderstand me, I think it's great, just noting the difference here :-). > Miles wrote: > So, what people will think of being a handsome young man will > be different in the UK and in France, and again different in > Russia, the USA or Germany. zanooda: I don't know, it seems to me there won't be much difference in perception of beauty among Europeans (and Americans). Many beautiful people are considered beautiful everywhere :-). > Miles wrote: > For example, when I first saw Robert Pattinson as Cedric in > the GoF film, I thought he was not the right man for the job, > because I didn't (and don't) think of him as being outstanding > handsome. zanooda; Well, to be honest, I don't find him outstandingly handsome either (although I think he has a very interesting face), but I think it has nothing to do with cultural differences, just personal taste :-). And it appears that in this case you and I are in minority ... :-). From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 29 04:27:59 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 04:27:59 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: <839890E25D9D4DFAA297CC3F4763D2DC@miles> Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Miles" wrote: > Wictionary identifys "gard" as a slavic word for town or city. zanooda: No, this is a mistake :-). There is no "gard" in Slavic languages, but there is "grad" - this is an abbreviated form of the word "gorod", which in fact means "town" or "city". It is often used in the names of the towns - Volgograd, Stalingrad, Leningrad etc. :-). From montavilla47 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 29 19:45:00 2009 From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 19:45:00 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Carol again: > However, zanooda wanted an example of miscasting. I'll try to find one that everyone can agree on. How about Judi Dench as Narcissa Malfoy or Hugh Grant as Wormtail? I was going to say Keira Knightley as Professor Sprout, but that's too extreme, right? No one would ever consider it. > > Carol, tossing out what she considers to be humorous casting ideas > Montavilla47: Hugh Grant would be a hoot as Wormtail! True, he's not a blond, but that would be the only drawback. I always imagined Umbridge as being Judi Dench. I so wanted her to play that part--especially if they had left in the cat fight between McGonagall and Umbridge. But, barring that, Imelda Staunton was a great choice. As for Keira Knightley as Professor Sprout--I suppose it would depend on your conception of the part. I don't think Madam Sprout is described much at all, other than being short? Is she even referred to as short? It's not like Keira Knightley can't get muddy. She was very muddy at times in "Pride and Prejudice." From d2dmiles at yahoo.de Mon Jun 29 20:13:08 2009 From: d2dmiles at yahoo.de (Miles) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 22:13:08 +0200 Subject: Casting mis-steps References: Message-ID: zanooda2 wrote: > I don't think that Russian > beauty canon is very different from American canon. I just can see > that in Russia, to be called beautiful, you must be more beautiful > than in America, if it makes any sense to you :-). Miles: Sure, it does. One could make experiments about that (with photographs rated by both a big number of people, and a computer programme), and it would be really interesting to have those experiments in different countries to compare. zanooda: > What they here consider plain, we call ugly, what they call > nice-looking, we see as plain, what they see as pretty, we call OK, > and what they call beautiful, we consider pretty :-). It's probably > because there are so many pretty young women in Russia, you just need > more to stand out there :-). Miles: You are the one living in the USA, not me ;). Maybe it's another attempt to be "positive" towards people in order to work on their self-confidence? >> Miles wrote: >> So, what people will think of being a handsome young man will >> be different in the UK and in France, and again different in >> Russia, the USA or Germany. > > zanooda: > I don't know, it seems to me there won't be much difference in > perception of beauty among Europeans (and Americans). Many beautiful > people are considered beautiful everywhere :-). Miles: If the "mechanisms of beauty" I wrote about in my first mail in this thread do exist in the way I described, then it's not so much suprising to have smaller differences in countries with a majority of "white Europeans". It would be interesting to see if a beauty from Japan or Ghana would be considered beautiful in Russia or the USA. >> Miles wrote: >> For example, when I first saw Robert Pattinson as Cedric in >> the GoF film, I thought he was not the right man for the job, >> because I didn't (and don't) think of him as being outstanding >> handsome. > > zanooda; > Well, to be honest, I don't find him outstandingly handsome either > (although I think he has a very interesting face), but I think it has > nothing to do with cultural differences, just personal taste :-). And > it appears that in this case you and I are in minority ... :-). Miles: I have no problems of being part of a minority ;). >> Miles >> Wictionary identifys "gard" as a slavic word for town or city. > zanooda: > No, this is a mistake :-). There is no "gard" in Slavic languages, but > there > is "grad" - this is an abbreviated form of the word "gorod", which in fact > means "town" or "city". It is often used in the names of the towns - > Volgograd, Stalingrad, Leningrad etc. :-). Miles My quote was incorrect - it's said to be a word from the proto-slavic language, the ancient (and lost) ancestor of the modern slavic languages. I'm neither a linguist nor do I know any slavic language, but it seems to be possible for a tiny "r" to wander from the right to the left of the vowel "a" ;). Miles, whose knowledge of Russian does not exceed ras, dwa or tri words :) From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 29 21:13:41 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 21:13:41 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Miles: > >> Wictionary identifys "gard" as a slavic word for town or city. > > > zanooda: > > No, this is a mistake :-). There is no "gard" in Slavic languages, but there is "grad" - this is an abbreviated form of the word "gorod", which in fact means "town" or "city". It is often used in the names of the towns - Volgograd, Stalingrad, Leningrad etc. :-). > Miles again: > My quote was incorrect - it's said to be a word from the proto-slavic language, the ancient (and lost) ancestor of the modern slavic languages. I'm neither a linguist nor do I know any slavic language, but it seems to be possible for a tiny "r" to wander from the right to the left of the vowel "a" ;). > > Miles, whose knowledge of Russian does not exceed ras, dwa or tri words :) Carol: I still think that "gard" in "Nurmengard" relates to the French (Old French?) term for a castle keep, which would be fitting for a prison. (Anyone familiar with Sir Lancelot's Joyous Gard, formerly Dolorous Gard? and "garde" = "guard" in modern Frendh.) JKR might have had that in mind--or JKR might have been subconsciously thinking of Isengard. Carol, whose knowledge of Russian consists of "da" and "nyet"! (well, okay, I know what a patronymic is ) From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 29 21:00:49 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 21:00:49 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Carol earlier: > > However, zanooda wanted an example of miscasting. I'll try to find one that everyone can agree on. How about Judi Dench as Narcissa Malfoy or Hugh Grant as Wormtail? I was going to say Keira Knightley as Professor Sprout, but that's too extreme, right? No one would ever consider it. > > > > Carol, tossing out what she considers to be humorous casting ideas > Montavilla47 resonded: > > Hugh Grant would be a hoot as Wormtail! True, he's not a blond, but that would be the only drawback. Carol: Was Wormtail blond? All I remember is that he was short and, as an adult, formerly fat (he might have had some skin hanging off him-ugh!). He had a pointy nose and possibly a weak chin. As a kid, he was a "little lump of a boy." So I can't imagine Hugh Grant in the role. He's just too good looking. Montavilla47: > I always imagined Umbridge as being Judi Dench. I so wanted her to play that part--especially if they had left in the cat fight between McGonagall and Umbridge. But, barring that, Imelda Staunton was a great choice. Carol responds: Big difference in age, though. Judi Dench at, say, 50--perfect! Failing that, we can settle for Imelda, who had the right walk and voice but wasn't sufficiently toadlike. Then, again, who'd want her Umbridge to be more repulsive and despicable than she already was? BTW, Sir Ian McKellen is campaigning for more parts for older actresses (with Judi Dench in mind). Both Imelda Staunton and Julie Walters (Molly Weasley) have signed a petition originated by the actors union Equity, presumably at Sir Ian's instigation. Go, Gandalf! http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0001767/news#ni0820477 Montavilla 47: > As for Keira Knightley as Professor Sprout--I suppose it would depend on your conception of the part. I don't think Madam Sprout is described much at all, other than being short? Is she even referred to as short? It's not like Keira Knightley can't get muddy. She was very muddy at times in "Pride and Prejudice." > Carol responds: I thought that Professor Sprout was dumpy and middle-aged (by WW standards)--a squat little witch with flyaway hair and patches on her clothes, according to CoS. A pretty, perky, slender young woman just wouldn't be right even with the patches, IMO. I think that Miriam Margolyes has the right look. Madam Hooch (I forget who played her) was well cast, too. James Potter, OTOH--much too old. Unless, possibly, the parents in the mirror were supposed to be the age they'd be when Harry was eleven--but the Lily protecting Harry and the Lily in the mirror are the same age, that can't be the case. JKR should have said something to prevent that problem. (It's odd that Book!Harry himself didn't notice that his parents looked only ten years older than he was at the time. Even an eleven-year-old can tell a twenty-something from a thirty-something!) I second whoever said that Robbie Coltrane is perfect as Hagrid. I also think that Emma Thompson was brilliant as Trelawney. Too bad she can't come back to drop a few crystal balls on DEs' heads for DH2. Carol, who would have liked to see Keira Knightley as Tonks From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 29 22:57:11 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 22:57:11 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps & Set Changes. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Cat" wrote: > I saw a picture of a young Brigitte Bardot http://www.imdb.com > /name/nm0000003/. Now picture that face with a "long sheet of > silver blond hair" ... Fleur? Oh, Brigitte Bardot used to so beautiful and sexy :-). I've always liked this picture of her: http://david-wray.com/wp-content/uploads/brigitte-bardot.jpg I must say though that there are some irregularities in her face that don't let her, in my eyes, to become a perfect Fleur. Her mouth is a little bit uneven, her nose is kind of turned-up, and she seems to have an overbite (you can see it when she laughs). Actually, I think all these small things make her look even sexier, but Fleur? I'm not so sure. It seems to me that Fleur is this classic beauty with regular features and all :-). Besides, on the pictures where she is not so glamorized, Brigitte Bardot looks more like a country girl (mind you, a very sexy country girl :-)). Also, I never liked her signature heavy make-up, it makes her look, erm, how do I put it politely - *too* sexy :-). That's why I like her black and white photos, where the make-up is not so noticeable, like here: http://www.dkautographs.co.uk/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/bardot.jpg.w300h355.jpg zanooda, who thinks that Fleur's beauty is all natural and perfect and luminous and impossible to show in any movie ... :-). From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 29 23:23:51 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 23:23:51 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Miles" wrote: > I'm neither a linguist nor do I know any slavic language, but > it seems to be possible for a tiny "r" to wander from the > right to the left of the vowel "a" ;). zanooda: LOL! But you know, Wikipedia, for instance, says that "gard" is Germanic (in an article about "grad", BTW :-)). Of course, all the "wiki-" sites can't be considered 100% reliable, but here is the link, just in case (it's in the very first paragraph): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grad_(Slavic_settlement) From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 29 23:37:08 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 23:37:08 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "montavilla47" wrote: > I don't think Madam Sprout is described much at all, > other than being short? Is she even referred to as short? zanooda: Not "short", but "little" :-). She was called "a dumpy little witch" in PS, and "a squat little witch" in CoS. I can't remember anything about her age, but I think that if she was as young (and pretty :-)) as Keira Knightly(sp?)is, we would have known :-). From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Mon Jun 29 23:51:44 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 23:51:44 -0000 Subject: Casting news--Runcorn In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "Carol" wrote: > Actor David O'Hara has been cast as Runcorn, the MoM employee > whose identity Harry assumes in DH when HRH attempt to steal > the locket from Umbridge. zanooda: I stumbled upon this picture on Leaky (it's the Trio heading to the Ministry as Mafalda, Runcorn and Cattermole) and remembered Carol asking about Runcorn actor's height. On this picture he seems shorter than Cattermole :-). They all don't look like I imagined them, but their appearance is not that important, IMO :-): http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt320/LeakyGalleries/Films/Deathly%20Hallows/Behind%20the%20Scenes/On%20Set/2009%20July%20-%20London/dh_onset_londonjuly2009_029.jpg If the link is too long, here is the link to the article itself: http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2009/6/28/detailed-report-of-location-filming-for-ministry-entrance-scene-in-deathly-hallows From justcarol67 at yahoo.com Tue Jun 30 00:40:49 2009 From: justcarol67 at yahoo.com (Carol) Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:40:49 -0000 Subject: Casting news--Runcorn In-Reply-To: Message-ID: zanooda wrote: > > I stumbled upon this picture on Leaky (it's the Trio heading to the Ministry as Mafalda, Runcorn and Cattermole) and remembered Carol asking about Runcorn actor's height. On this picture he seems shorter than Cattermole :-). They all don't look like I imagined them, but their appearance is not that important, IMO :-): > Carol responds: Hm. A witch and two wizards who actually know how to dress like Muggles. I hope they have Ministry robes somewhere even though the men don't even have briefcases and the woman's purse is rather small--otherwise, HRH will have to strip them (and dress like Muggles at the Ministry!). I realize that it isn't very realistic to have them dress in robes in the book with no more Apparition or Floo travel (except for the higher-ups) into the Ministry, but, still, I wish the films wouldn't change so much! they don't even look magical! They don't look like I imagined them, either, but I guess they didn't want to get a big tall guy for Runcorn. It might make Harry's transformation awkward as it did in the book--hard to hide his big feet under the Invisibility Cloak, etc. Carol, who doesn't want the wizards to look like Muggles with wands From montavilla47 at yahoo.com Tue Jun 30 03:56:03 2009 From: montavilla47 at yahoo.com (montavilla47) Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 03:56:03 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Carol earlier: > > > However, zanooda wanted an example of miscasting. I'll try to find one that everyone can agree on. How about Judi Dench as Narcissa Malfoy or Hugh Grant as Wormtail? I was going to say Keira Knightley as Professor Sprout, but that's too extreme, right? No one would ever consider it. > > > > > > Carol, tossing out what she considers to be humorous casting ideas > > > Montavilla47 resonded: > > > > Hugh Grant would be a hoot as Wormtail! True, he's not a blond, but that would be the only drawback. > > Carol: > Was Wormtail blond? All I remember is that he was short and, as an adult, formerly fat (he might have had some skin hanging off him-ugh!). He had a pointy nose and possibly a weak chin. As a kid, he was a "little lump of a boy." So I can't imagine Hugh Grant in the role. He's just too good looking. Montavilla47: It's true that he's good-looking, but to my mind, physical details are less important than the qualities of an actor. I'm not using "qualities" in the sense of excellence, but in the sense of non-physical character traits. I've seen Hugh Grant portray qualities of cowardice and nervousness and he's very funny doing that. Also, Hugh Grant does have a somewhat weak chin. At least I recall him playing characters with weak chins. A pointy nose is easy to create with make-up--and it's easy to do without looking made up. I've never heard anyone say a bad word about the actor who plays Neville Longbottom, but I don't find him at all like Neville physically. Neville is also described as blond and "moon-faced." Starting in POA, Matthew Lewis has been anything but moon-faced. Also, he wears fake teeth as Neville in order to make him look less handsome. But we don't really care what he looks like, do we? He's perfect for the part his acting and that's what's important. A lot of this discussion has focused on how Clemence Poesy is wrong for the part of Fleur because she doesn't "look" stunning enough. My problem isn't so much her looks--she might have benefited from better costuming and a lighter tint to her hair--but that they didn't give her anything to do in the film. As a character, Fleur isn't so much about being beautiful as about being vain and self- centered. With practically no lines or scenes, just how was Poesy supposed to convey that? > Montavilla47: > > I always imagined Umbridge as being Judi Dench. I so wanted her to play that part--especially if they had left in the cat fight between McGonagall and Umbridge. But, barring that, Imelda Staunton was a great choice. > > Carol responds: > Big difference in age, though. Judi Dench at, say, 50--perfect! Failing that, we can settle for Imelda, who had the right walk and voice but wasn't sufficiently toadlike. Then, again, who'd want her Umbridge to be more repulsive and despicable than she already was? Montavilla47: I agree. Judi Dench is old for the part, although I'm sure there were ways to make her look younger. Again, that's done all the time and usually successfully. (Although people complained that Emma Thompson was too old to play Elenor in "Sense and Sensibility," she was still magnificent in the part.) But I don't think we were settling with Staunton. She's a terrific actress, either comic or dramatic. To see her in a dramatic role, I would suggest "Vera Drake," although the subject matter (pre- legal abortions) may be objectionable to some. For comic roles, she was great in "Sense and Sensibility." Carol: > BTW, Sir Ian McKellen is campaigning for more parts for older actresses (with Judi Dench in mind). Both Imelda Staunton and Julie Walters (Molly Weasley) have signed a petition originated by the actors union Equity, presumably at Sir Ian's instigation. Go, Gandalf! > > http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0001767/news#ni0820477 Montavilla47: Good! There are never enough roles for older actresses. And Helen Mirren seems to be playing all of them! > Montavilla 47: > > As for Keira Knightley as Professor Sprout--I suppose it would depend on your conception of the part. I don't think Madam Sprout is described much at all, other than being short? Is she even referred to as short? It's not like Keira Knightley can't get muddy. She was very muddy at times in "Pride and Prejudice." > > > Carol responds: > > I thought that Professor Sprout was dumpy and middle-aged (by WW standards)--a squat little witch with flyaway hair and patches on her clothes, according to CoS. A pretty, perky, slender young woman just wouldn't be right even with the patches, IMO. I think that Miriam Margolyes has the right look. Madam Hooch (I forget who played her) was well cast, too. James Potter, OTOH--much too old. Unless, possibly, the parents in the mirror were supposed to be the age they'd be when Harry was eleven--but the Lily protecting Harry and the Lily in the mirror are the same age, that can't be the case. JKR should have said something to prevent that problem. (It's odd that Book!Harry himself didn't notice that his parents looked only ten years older than he was at the time. Even an eleven-year-old can tell a twenty-something from a thirty-something!) > Montavilla47: See, my objection to Keira Knightley wouldn't be that she was slender or young, but that she comes off (to me) about as warm and maternal as a slab of marble. Zoe Wanamaker played Madame Hooch. Honestly, the players of James and Lily never bothered me. I think it would be more jarring for the audience if they had been played by twenty-year-olds. Of course, it might have started the audience thinking about how young James and Lily really were, which wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing. But I think it would have been confusing, especially for children watching the film to see James and Lily looking more like Harry's older siblings than his parents. Carol: > I second whoever said that Robbie Coltrane is perfect as Hagrid. I also think that Emma Thompson was brilliant as Trelawney. Too bad she can't come back to drop a few crystal balls on DEs' heads for DH2. Montavilla47: I think Robbie Coltrane is amazing as Hagrid. He's amazing in just anything he does. In the late eighties he played Falstaff in Kenneth Branagh's "Henry V." Heh. Looking at the IMDB, I see he was in his late thirties at the time. Here I was thinking he was in his twenties. He's only four years younger than Alan Rickman! > Carol, who would have liked to see Keira Knightley as Tonks Montavilla47: I think that would have been excellent casting. As you can probably tell, I don't much care for Keira Knightley, but I think she would have brought some charisma to that part which would help if they intend to include the Remus/Tonks love story. From zanooda2 at yahoo.com Tue Jun 30 21:45:18 2009 From: zanooda2 at yahoo.com (zanooda2) Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 21:45:18 -0000 Subject: Casting mis-steps In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --- In HPFGU-Movie at yahoogroups.com, "montavilla47" wrote: > I've never heard anyone say a bad word about the actor who plays > Neville Longbottom, but I don't find him at all like Neville > physically. Neville is also described as blond and "moon-faced". zanooda: You mean "round-faced", right :-)? And I don't remember Neville's hair color ever being mentioned :-). However, this is different - the boy *did* look the part when he was cast. You never know with the kids. Who could have predicted that Matthew Lewis would grow up tall and handsome :-)? I'm sure if he was tall, slim and handsome as a kid, many of us (me included) would consider him miscast, even if he played the part as well as he does. He wouldn't be convincing, that's all. Yes, now he has to wear a fat suit and fake teeth, but it's all right. > montavilla47 wrote: > - she might have benefited from better costuming and a lighter > tint to her hair zanooda: Yes, and I also noticed in the pictures that she looks better with her hair hanging down. Why did they make her wear a pony-tail in the movie? > montavilla47 wrote: > With practically no lines or scenes, just how was Poesy > supposed to convey that? zanooda: They do it to all secondary characters, don't they? It's always funny to read how some kid was chosen from thousands others to play some part, and then in the movie he has nothing to play. What's the point in chosing the most talented kid, if he only has two words to say in the movie? Same thing with Fleur: I would have understood their desire to chose talent over beauty if the actress actually had something to play. As it is, *anyone* could have played the role, so why not to find the most beautiful girl France can offer :-)? I wonder how Clemence Poesy will look in DH - she must be closer to 30 now, right? She looked young in GoF though, so I hope it will be OK :-).