From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Fri Jun  1 00:02:37 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 00:02:37 -0000
Subject: King Arthur Books- Howard Pyle
In-Reply-To: <9f626j+noh6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9f6m2t+74mr@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rosmerta" <tmayor at m...> wrote:
> Does anyone care to recommend a King Arthur book that'd make a good 
> read-aloud for a 7-yr-old? He can handle fairly sophisticated stuff 
> (he's heard all the HP books twice now and is reading SS by 
> himself....one.....word...at...a....time) but IIRC The Crystal Cave 
> is too complex (isn't that the one that tells Merlin's story, but 
> backwards?) I remember reading--and loving--The Once and Future 
King 
> but can't remember how old I was or how complex it was 
(wait....maybe 
> *that's* the one that goes backwards?) Any suggestions much 
> appreciated. 
> 
> ~Rosmerta
> whose memory has always been rotten; this is not an age thing!

When we were children, one of my brothers was a King Arthur freak. 
One book in his early Arthur collection was by Howard Pyle and aptly 
titled "The Boy's King Arthur" (IIRC my brother bought his copy at a 
garage sale). You might want to look around to see if the Pyle book 
is still in print.

Milz (who owns only one book about King Arthur--"Idylls of the King" 
by Alfred, Lord Tennyson)




From Belle_Starr_777 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  1 00:36:23 2001
From: Belle_Starr_777 at yahoo.com (Belle_Starr_777 at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 00:36:23 -0000
Subject: Did you ever think . . . 
Message-ID: <9f6o27+fngb@eGroups.com>

Did you ever think . . . 

if Dr. Frank N. Furter were the DADA professor at Hogwarts, the Harry 
Potter series would have been known as . . . 

"The Rocky AUROR Picture Show."  

Apologies,
Belle 




From john at walton.to  Fri Jun  1 00:51:09 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Thu, 31 May 2001 20:51:09 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Mists of Avalon-Mini Series
In-Reply-To: <001b01c0ea26$66f716e0$584e28d1@oemcomputer>
Message-ID: <B73C5F3D.1F4F%john@walton.to>

Saitaina said:

> As for King Arthur for the younger set, I have not found any book in my
> collection for such an age, but then again, my collection is mostly history
> books so there you go.

Perhaps "The Sword In The Stone" would be appropriate? I *believe* the
author is named White...it should be in the "Recommended Reading" document
in the Files Section...but I can't *find* the RR! D'oh! Anyone know where it
is?

--John




From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Fri Jun  1 01:35:05 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 01:35:05 -0000
Subject: Happy Birthday, Simon!
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0105311419370.29770-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>
Message-ID: <9f6rg9+u7b9@eGroups.com>

Happy Birthday Simon! Although a bit late. Hope it was a good one.

Cheers and a toast,

  Kristin




From editor at texas.net  Fri Jun  1 01:46:17 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Thu, 31 May 2001 20:46:17 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: slugs
References: <9f5oq2+3r3g@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B16F3E8.A1520DEF@texas.net>

catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk wrote:

> Just to confirm - yes, it was alive - I felt it move on my tongue. It
> was only a baby (ie. not one of those huge things I find in my
> garden), but I don't think that makes any difference.
>
> The manager was very grateful - I called him over (discreetly) pointed
> out the slug and told him what happened.  He thanked me for not
> causing a big fuss - free meal, and shopping vouchers followed. The
> only people who realised were the people next to us.  But - all
> Londoners beware - it happened in Selfridges.

Catherine, I already thought you were wonderful for spelling your name
correctly and for sharing my excellent taste in older men (Jan is 19
years my senior). But now you have my unbelieving admiration--I have
dealt with many awful things--children sick all over me; cats dropping
half-dead Buicks on me, still crawling, as a thoughtful night-time
snack; diapers so awful they were worse than the rhino enclosure at the
Zoo; even weevils in a Snickers bar. But I don't believe there is any
chance at all that I would not have thrown up on the table in this
circumstance. You are a truly amazing person.

--Amanda, awed (I even almost threw up at the Episode Of A Thousand
Ticks [another story]--maybe I just have a weak stomach?)


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From editor at texas.net  Fri Jun  1 01:53:28 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Thu, 31 May 2001 20:53:28 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Happy Birthday, Simon!
References: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0105311419370.29770-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>
Message-ID: <3B16F598.D1CF6BA5@texas.net>

Jen Faulkner wrote:

> --jen, non-pedantic Latin scholar :)

Really, now, Jen. Many of us role-play, but to claim to actually *be* a
fictional being?

--Amanda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From editor at texas.net  Fri Jun  1 02:03:35 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Thu, 31 May 2001 21:03:35 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Did you ever think . . .
References: <9f6o27+fngb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B16F7F7.4651C26E@texas.net>

Belle_Starr_777 at yahoo.com wrote:

> "The Rocky AUROR Picture Show."
>
> Apologies,
> Belle

I do believe you've trumped the slug discussion. Congratulations. Ugh.

--Amanda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From joy0823 at earthlink.net  Fri Jun  1 02:27:45 2001
From: joy0823 at earthlink.net (- Joy -)
Date: Thu, 31 May 2001 22:27:45 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Mists of Avalon-Mini Series
References: <B73C5F3D.1F4F%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <00e001c0ea42$733a0fe0$a2d30941@mtgmry1.md.home.com>

The Recommended Reading list is in Databases, I think.  I should know more
definitely, I check it just about once a week. <glances at the massive tower
of books on her night table and sighs> I love it!

~Joy~

John wrote:
> Perhaps "The Sword In The Stone" would be appropriate? I *believe* the
> author is named White...it should be in the "Recommended Reading" document
> in the Files Section...but I can't *find* the RR! D'oh! Anyone know where
it
> is?





From mecks at prodigy.net  Fri Jun  1 03:01:23 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Thu, 31 May 2001 22:01:23 -0500
Subject: Book Recommendations (was Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Mists of Avalon-Mini Series)
References: <B73C5F3D.1F4F%john@walton.to> <00e001c0ea42$733a0fe0$a2d30941@mtgmry1.md.home.com>
Message-ID: <025701c0ea47$2505f960$2cb8fea9@hale>


----- Original Message -----
From: - Joy - <joy0823 at earthlink.net>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 9:27 PM
Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Mists of Avalon-Mini Series


> The Recommended Reading list is in Databases, I think.  I should know more
> definitely, I check it just about once a week. <glances at the massive
tower
> of books on her night table and sighs> I love it!
>
> ~Joy~

Reading is fun :o)  (Which is why I don't understand why my brother doesn't
do more of it.  In fourth grade my dad made me read a book and do a book
report on it for every assignment I missed because I was really bad at
turning in homework assignments.  My teacher was concerned that would eat
into times when I should have been doing school work.  I ended up doing one
or two book reports a day.  My teacher was not apparently amused by this.  I
found it entertaining and there is so much of it!  I know my brother doesn't
always have similar tastes but welll mass confusion.  The males in my house
are aliterate and the women a very happily extra literate.)

At any rate, I just wanted to toss in a couple of book reccomendations (with
out having seen the book list).  Eva Ibbotson has two wonderful books that I
read rather quickly and was absolutely delighted with.  Diane Duane also has
a set of Wizard books.  The first in the series is "So You Want to be a
Wizard" and I can't say enough good things about it.  Some one on another
mailing list wrote her and asked her if Tom & Carl were involved as in a
couple and Diane Duane wrote a very nice reply back.  Authors who are
accesible like that, I love them :o)

Oh and for any people who are fans of David Weber and thinking of picking up
"Worlds of Honor 3" or whatever the latest Honor Harrington book is with
about 4 stories in it.  One contraction: Don't.  Really, don't bother.  One
story is one that was/is available on the net and previously posted to
zines.  It deals only proliphery with Honor but more with Tree Cats & Nimitz
and their sentience but it's already on the net.  The second story in there
was basically a rehash of the events of the last book dealing with the feel
of the Peeps and the other two stories in there just didn't impress me at
all.

But I would also like to recommend Lois McMaster Bujold.  I adore her books.
I love them.  They hold a place of honor on my shelfs.  (Okay, actually just
a stack.)  I love her policy regarding fan fiction and I love her personal
history in the fandom community (based on what I've read.)  It's miltary
science fiction of sorts but with a larger focus on people and their
interaction.  It doesn't do long extended tac analysis that David Weber can
go into at times.

Michela Ecks




From kiary91 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun  1 05:27:21 2001
From: kiary91 at hotmail.com (Cait Hunter)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 05:27:21 -0000
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] More promo for the 'other books to read' list
Message-ID: <F28TeU88klUE1HeEuV60001309c@hotmail.com>

YES! That book rocks. Also check out Ender's Shadow (newish, about Bean!).. 
Speaker and the other one, Xenocide, didn't really appeal to me quite as 
much as EG, but they're all a good read. (The sequel to ES is out, but I 
can't remember the title.)


Cait


>From: storm <msmacgoo at one.net.au>
>Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>To: "'HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com'" <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] More promo for the 'other books to read' list
>Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 08:52:37 +1000
>
>Hi everyone -
>
>Well I finally read Ender's Game. Brilliant! I've been so depressed that
>nothing has been able to hold my attention for longer than 20 seconds but I
>read the book in almost one sitting (started on the train on the way to the
>gulag and had to put it down to feign attention to my paid employment. Once
>released ..... whoosh!)
>
>For those of you who don't know on the main list there is a list of books 
>to
>read while you are waiting for OoP to come out. It's well worth checking 
>out.
>Not every one will suit you but they are all worth looking at. Now I just
>*hope* the library has 'Speaker for the Dead'.
>
>Storm - off to the shrink for DRUGS! YEAH! and thence the library.
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Fri Jun  1 08:20:01 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 08:20:01 -0000
Subject: slugs
In-Reply-To: <3B16F3E8.A1520DEF@texas.net>
Message-ID: <9f7j7h+kqpm@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amanda Lewanski <editor at t...> wrote:
> catherine at c... wrote:
> 
> > Just to confirm - yes, it was alive - I felt it move on my 
tongue. It
> > was only a baby (ie. not one of those huge things I find in my
> > garden), but I don't think that makes any difference.
> >
> > The manager was very grateful - I called him over (discreetly) 
pointed
> > out the slug and told him what happened.  He thanked me for not
> > causing a big fuss - free meal, and shopping vouchers followed. 
The
> > only people who realised were the people next to us.  But - all
> > Londoners beware - it happened in Selfridges.
> 
> Catherine, I already thought you were wonderful for spelling your 
name
> correctly and for sharing my excellent taste in older men (Jan is 19
> years my senior). But now you have my unbelieving admiration--I have
> dealt with many awful things--children sick all over me; cats 
dropping
> half-dead Buicks on me, still crawling, as a thoughtful night-time
> snack; diapers so awful they were worse than the rhino enclosure at 
the
> Zoo; even weevils in a Snickers bar. But I don't believe there is 
any
> chance at all that I would not have thrown up on the table in this
> circumstance. You are a truly amazing person.
> 
> --Amanda, awed (I even almost threw up at the Episode Of A Thousand
> Ticks [another story]--maybe I just have a weak stomach?)


Wow!  Thanks Amanda!  I was just about to add my apologies to Amy's 
for the gross subject matter as well!

Catherine




From michelleapostolides at lineone.net  Fri Jun  1 11:35:17 2001
From: michelleapostolides at lineone.net (Michelle Apostolides)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 12:35:17 +0100
Subject: The Philospher's Stone
Message-ID: <002d01c0ea8e$faec0000$2f5c063e@tmeltcds>

Sounds like this is on topic but it's not. TPS is a title of a book by
Peter Marshall about the above mentioned title. However, seeing as it's
 20 in hardback and 9.99 in paperback, I wondered if anyone had read
this book and could tell me if it's worth spending my dosh on ?

Michelle




From msmacgoo at one.net.au  Fri Jun  1 10:13:32 2001
From: msmacgoo at one.net.au (storm)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 20:13:32 +1000
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] More promo for the 'other books to read' list
Message-ID: <01C0EAE3.A4AAB2E0.msmacgoo@one.net.au>

Disaster! The library has Speaker but it is out on loan and after than reserved 
by some other naughty person. Will have to try the other library. Had a look at 
Xenocide but didn't get the first few pages so concluded I needed to read 
Speaker first. (is this right?)

Do I have to finish speaker and xenocide before starting ender's shadow?

Got Matilta (dahl) instead. Quite good. 'nice' ending. Going to read ender's 
game again I think now.

Storm (off to dog school to learn - how to be a dog of course)
-----Original Message-----
From:	Cait Hunter [SMTP:kiary91 at hotmail.com]
Sent:	Friday, June 01, 2001 3:27 PM
To:	HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
Subject:	Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] More promo for the 'other books to read' list

YES! That book rocks. Also check out Ender's Shadow (newish, about Bean!)..
Speaker and the other one, Xenocide, didn't really appeal to me quite as
much as EG, but they're all a good read. (The sequel to ES is out, but I
can't remember the title.)


Cait


>From: storm <msmacgoo at one.net.au>
>Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>To: "'HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com'" <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] More promo for the 'other books to read' list
>Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 08:52:37 +1000
>
>Hi everyone -
>
>Well I finally read Ender's Game. Brilliant! I've been so depressed that
>nothing has been able to hold my attention for longer than 20 seconds but I
>read the book in almost one sitting (started on the train on the way to the
>gulag and had to put it down to feign attention to my paid employment. Once
>released ..... whoosh!)
>
>For those of you who don't know on the main list there is a list of books
>to
>read while you are waiting for OoP to come out. It's well worth checking
>out.
>Not every one will suit you but they are all worth looking at. Now I just
>*hope* the library has 'Speaker for the Dead'.
>
>Storm - off to the shrink for DRUGS! YEAH! and thence the library.
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com


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From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  1 12:18:37 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 12:18:37 -0000
Subject: The Philospher's Stone
In-Reply-To: <002d01c0ea8e$faec0000$2f5c063e@tmeltcds>
Message-ID: <9f816t+nqe4@eGroups.com>

dosh? For the people in the cornpatches of Iowa, can you tell me what 
dosh means? :)
Doreen

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Michelle Apostolides" 
<michelleapostolides at l...> wrote:
> Sounds like this is on topic but it's not. TPS is a title of a book 
by
> Peter Marshall about the above mentioned title. However, seeing as 
it's
> ? 20 in hardback and ?9.99 in paperback, I wondered if anyone had 
read
> this book and could tell me if it's worth spending my dosh on ?
> 
> Michelle




From michelleapostolides at lineone.net  Fri Jun  1 12:26:38 2001
From: michelleapostolides at lineone.net (Michelle Apostolides)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 13:26:38 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: The Philospher's Stone
References: <9f816t+nqe4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <004301c0ea96$1b8d1a40$2f5c063e@tmeltcds>

dosh? For the people in the cornpatches of Iowa, can you tell me what 
dosh means? :)


Money !!

Michelle





From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun  1 12:36:32 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 12:36:32 -0000
Subject: Book Recommendations (was Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Mists of Avalon-Mini Series)
In-Reply-To: <025701c0ea47$2505f960$2cb8fea9@hale>
Message-ID: <9f828g+hvnk@eGroups.com>

Michela wrote:

> In fourth grade my dad made me read a book and do a 
book
> report on it for every assignment I missed because I was really bad 
at
> turning in homework assignments.  My teacher was concerned that 
would eat
> into times when I should have been doing school work.  I ended up 
doing one
> or two book reports a day.  My teacher was not apparently amused by 
this.  

No comment.

Amy




From joannec at hwy.com.au  Fri Jun  1 13:35:27 2001
From: joannec at hwy.com.au (Joanne Collins)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 23:35:27 +1000
Subject: Dating/Marriage
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010601233527.007d3390@mail.hwy.com.au>

>Question to all: Did you know right away that you had met the "Person
>of Your Dreams"? How long before you knew?

I didn't know right away. I was seventeen and Carl was twenty-one, when we
met.

We became friends, and were just *there* in each other's lives for so long,
it was like he'd always been there. I had a bf at the time, and although I
was pretty sure it wasn't going to last forever. The next couple of years,
he dated women I rarely met and we talked about books and movies and things
like that when we were together. We did talk about becoming more at one
point, and he told me to talk to him about it when I was twenty-one (I was
eighteen at that stage).

My bf went to university, and as these things happen, met someone else. We
broke up amicably. At this point I moved out of my parents' house into a
flat with Carl. And we were just flatmates, with separate social lives and
circles of friends, though we overlapped a bit.

I somehow never did get the courage to ask him that question when I turned
twenty-one. A couple of years later, I still don't know how it happened,
the planets probably aligned in the right way, or it was when it was meant
to happen, we kissed. And that was all. Just one kiss, and it changed my
whole perspective on, well, everything. I knew then that he was the person
I wanted to spend the rest of my life with. We decided to wait, not to rush
into anything. I think he was still a bit iffy on the age difference,
though he never told me that. A few weeks later, he had a medical check-up.
The doctor told us that he had a brain tumour, and it was growing. It was
very difficult to know what to do. I wanted us to get married right away,
try to have a family. He wouldn't let me rush things like that. Looking
back, he was right, but I would have married him if he'd let me. We didn't
get the chance. He died eight years ago last January, and even now, I
wonder what he would have thought of a movie or a book (I'm sure he'd have
loved Harry Potter).

I do miss him constantly, but I'm not still in mourning, and I'm not
looking for the same relationship in someone else. What I want is a
relationship that makes me feel like I felt with him, but not the same. I
know that I can't recreate the relationship I had with him, but I know I
can find one that will be as fulfilling as that one was. And if I don't, it
wasn't meant to happen.

Joanne.

-- 

Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty
years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the
Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's
not a threat. Now, that's a fact. I'll fuckin' kill you. Chuckie (Ben
Affleck) Good Will Hunting





From joannec at hwy.com.au  Fri Jun  1 13:11:23 2001
From: joannec at hwy.com.au (Joanne Collins)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 23:11:23 +1000
Subject: LOTR movies
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010601231123.00803830@mail.hwy.com.au>

>Ian Holm is going to play Bilbo, actually.  Elijah Wood is playing 
>Frodo, and I don't mind that at all.  He is about the right age, and 
>the images I have seen so far do not contrast too much with my own 
>image of Frodo.  

Elijah Wood is very young (I don't think he's twenty yet). Is Frodo a young
character? That would make sense.

>Tall and tall...  As I recall it, men are supposed to be of taller 
>stature than elves nowadays; I am absolutely positive one of 
>Tolkien's writings (either in the Silmarillion, Unfinished Tales or 
>one of the History of Middle-Earth-books) has a reference going on 
>the order of "in the old times, when the Elves were young and strong, 
>and as tall as Men are now".  It's all part of the elves growing 
>weary of this world, I think.  I picture the height-relationship 
>between men and elves as generally being 9:10.

Sounds rather interesting. I have The Silmarillion somewhere or other, I
think. Like many of us, I have an overcrowded bookshelf.

>I have seen a picture of Legolas (a still from the new trailer), and 
>from what I can see, he does have the long hair, but they have 
>completely avoided making him feminine, a far as I can tell (the 
>above-mentioned comic-book had less luck in that regard; you'd have 
>had to read the books beforehand to realise that those were in fact 
>male characters).

I believe this role may be the one played by Viggo Mortensen, Sean Bean or
Hugo Weaving (I know the actors, not the characters, and these are three of
the ones who could get me into the theatre alone). I don't think any of
these actors could look feminine if they tried, or at least without a
*very* long session in make-up and wardrobe.

>I note also that they have given Arwen a more active role in the 
>movie, apparently replacing Glorfindel in rescuing Harry at the fords.

There's a Harry in LOTR? Arwen is to be played by Liv Tyler, who is
actually my main reason for seeing the movie. I have liked her since seeing
Armageddon. I read an interview with her in which she said something about
her character being mentioned only in the appendix of the first volume(?)
and that the screenwriter brought her into the main narrative.

I also read something online that said that casting her was an 'insult'. I
didn't go back to *that* page!

Joanne.

-- 

Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty
years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the
Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's
not a threat. Now, that's a fact. I'll fuckin' kill you. Chuckie (Ben
Affleck) Good Will Hunting





From bohners at pobox.com  Fri Jun  1 15:18:13 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 11:18:13 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: LOTR movies
References: <3.0.6.32.20010601231123.00803830@mail.hwy.com.au>
Message-ID: <019b01c0eaae$15fa2ce0$9198e2d1@rebeccab>

> Elijah Wood is very young (I don't think he's twenty yet). Is Frodo a
young
> character? That would make sense.

Frodo's not that young -- about the human equivalent of thirty -- but
Hobbits look younger than they are (people often mistake them for children)
so it's not an issue.

> >I have seen a picture of Legolas (a still from the new trailer), and
> >from what I can see, he does have the long hair, but they have
> >completely avoided making him feminine,

> I believe this role may be the one played by Viggo Mortensen, Sean Bean or
> Hugo Weaving

No, Legolas is played by Orlando Bloom.  Viggo Mortensen plays Aragorn (a
man, not an elf), Sean Bean plays Boromir (also a man), and Hugo Weaving
plays Elrond, who is half-elf, half-human.

I think they almost made the elves *too* macho, myself.  I imagined them
being thinner, with finer (though certainly not feminine or "cute")
features... ah, well.  I'll wait and see.

> There's a Harry in LOTR?

*chuckle*  No.  That should have been Frodo.

> Arwen is to be played by Liv Tyler, who is
> actually my main reason for seeing the movie. I have liked her since
seeing
> Armageddon. I read an interview with her in which she said something about
> her character being mentioned only in the appendix of the first volume(?)

Not quite true.  Arwen is mentioned more than once in the trilogy and even
appears briefly "on screen" as it were, but her role is quite tiny.  The
appendix to which Liv is referring is the story of Aragorn and Arwen, which
apparently is being worked into the main plot to give Arwen more screen
time.

I have no idea whether Liv Tyler can act, not having seen her in anything,
but she is very lovely and perhaps the most truly elf-like actress in the
film.  The pictures I've seen of Cate Blanchet as Galadriel don't quite work
for me -- she reminds me too much of Buttercup in THE PRINCESS BRIDE.
However, it's hard to get a good picture of a character just from still
photographs, and she might be just fine on film.
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun  1 17:24:55 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 17:24:55 -0000
Subject: Myers-Briggs  Prayers
In-Reply-To: <MABBJPGEHBDBAKHGIBPOOEFGDMAA.klaatu@primenet.com>
Message-ID: <9f8j57+qe98@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Sister Mary Lunatic" <klaatu at p...> 
wrote:

> These are the prayers of the different psychological types 
> according to Myers-Briggs Personality system

I love these. They are FUNNY!! But they ALL apply to me, and probably 
ALL apply to EVERYONE, not just one type each.




From tmayor at mediaone.net  Fri Jun  1 19:02:00 2001
From: tmayor at mediaone.net (Rosmerta)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 19:02:00 -0000
Subject: King Arthur Books
In-Reply-To: <9f626j+noh6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9f8or8+9bq2@eGroups.com>

Thanks much for everyone's suggestions including (once and future?) 
lurker Mystril. I will now drag off to our teeny-tiny library and see 
if they have any of these. 

Jen, I read The Crystal Cave a long time ago but sure don't remember 
anything even vaguely sexual; maybe it's time to read it again <g>? 
Ender (or anyone else) if you have any more opinions on The Dark Is 
Rising, I'd love to hear them. I've seen the series mentioned but 
don't know anyone who's actually read any of the books... 

~Rosmerta




From mystril at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  1 19:29:40 2001
From: mystril at yahoo.com (mystril at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 19:29:40 -0000
Subject: King Arthur Books
In-Reply-To: <9f8or8+9bq2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9f8qf4+pitk@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rosmerta" <tmayor at m...> wrote:
 Jen, I read The Crystal Cave a long time ago but sure don't remember 
> anything even vaguely sexual; maybe it's time to read it again <g>? 
> Ender (or anyone else) if you have any more opinions on The Dark Is 
> Rising, I'd love to hear them. I've seen the series mentioned but 
> don't know anyone who's actually read any of the books... 
> 
> ~Rosmerta

I've read The Dark is Rising books. They're very good, read The Dark 
is Rising before Over Sea, Under Stone (which is supposedly the first 
book of the series). I think I mangled the second title, though. 

They are kind of complex, but in a good way. Definitely not too 
complicated for a 7 year old with a mom to explain things to him. I'm 
thinking on the complexity level of Wrinkle in Time, but in a 
different style. 

I like them much better than the T.A. Barron books, which I don't 
recommend until he gets desperate for King Arthur-related reading 
material. 

As far as sex in Crystal Cave, I wanted to say that it's more implied 
than actually occurs, but there's at least the issue of Arthur's 
conception to deal with, besides the idea of the catamite. The 
beginning of Hollow Hills is also good for kids (IIRC), in the same 
way that The Sword in the Stone section of Once and Future King is. 

My first King Arthur stories were in a Reader's Digest Best Loved 
Book. Between me as a kid and my mother as a kid, that section is 
falling apart. 

Planning a bookstore run this weekend for a few of the recommended 
books from the HP4Grownups database, 

mystril







From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  1 19:44:07 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 12:44:07 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Dark Is Rising
In-Reply-To: <9f8or8+9bq2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010601194407.75260.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Rosmerta <tmayor at mediaone.net> wrote:
> Ender (or anyone else) if you have any more opinions on The Dark Is 
> Rising, I'd love to hear them. I've seen the series mentioned but 
> don't know anyone who's actually read any of the books... 

Ooo, I have an opinion Rosmerta! I re-read the series awhile ago (maybe
five years) and still loved it. In some ways it's similar to Harry
Potter. Young boy (12?) finds out that he's a unique member of a unique
group and is sent on a quest. I won't go into it much more than that so
that nothing is spoiled (unless you want me to) but it is a splendidly
well-written book, in my opinion. Very classic writing, symbolism,
familiar battle of Evil against Good. 

The first book was always my favorite (I have it and have re-read it
often enough that it's falling apart). I haven't re-read the others
recently but liked them as well. And I've always been zonkers about the
running poem throughout it. Even memorized it once. 

"Fire upon the mountain shall find the harp of gold
Played to wake the sleepers, oldest of the old
Power from the Greenwitch, lost beneath the sea
All shall find the light at last, silver on the tree"

<grin> That's the last stanza of it (I can't believe that I can
remember that poem but can't remember people's names!). 

I must admit that I don't know how well the Dark Is Rising series is
similar to the King Arthur legend. When I read, I tend to read purely
for pleasure and not for analysis. It's a terrible habit that I can't
seem to break out of. I keep meaning to reread the *entire* series
again, especially since I'm older. But from what I can remember, the
series is wonderful; I highly suggest it.

~Amber
(Who rambled on for quite awhile...but I remember reading this series
in awe when I was in elementary school; it's one of my "happy"
memories!)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Don't ya just hate crappy homepages?...well, here's another!

"This body is dying. I can feel it rotting all around me. 
How can anything that is going to die be real? How can it
be truly beautiful?"
 - Peter S. Beagle "The Last Unicorn"

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From ender_w at msn.com  Fri Jun  1 20:17:23 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 16:17:23 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dark Is Rising
References: <20010601194407.75260.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <000501c0ead7$df6ceda0$56421e3f@satellite>


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Amber 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, June 01, 2001 3:44 PM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dark Is Rising



  --- Rosmerta <tmayor at mediaone.net> wrote:
  > Ender (or anyone else) if you have any more opinions on The Dark Is 
  > Rising, I'd love to hear them. I've seen the series mentioned but 
  > don't know anyone who's actually read any of the books... 

  Ooo, I have an opinion Rosmerta! I re-read the series awhile ago (maybe
  five years) and still loved it. In some ways it's similar to Harry
  Potter. Young boy (12?) finds out that he's a unique member of a unique
  group and is sent on a quest. I won't go into it much more than that so
  that nothing is spoiled (unless you want me to) but it is a splendidly
  well-written book, in my opinion. Very classic writing, symbolism,
  familiar battle of Evil against Good. 

  I agree with Amber.  It is a very well written series of books that I still read now and then even though I'm well into adulthood (I'm even writing a fanfic).  another similarity to Harry Potter is that even though the books are, for the most part, set in our own, mundane, modern day world, they have an enchanting otherworldliness about them that makes one feel as if one is escaping into a fantasy world.  The series is not so much similar to the stories of King Arthur as it is that the events are related to the events of Arthurian legend.  Actually, I read the series before I knew anything about King Arthur and now that i am more familiar with the legends, I wish that Cooper had used them more in her stories.  In fact, one of the reasons i'm writing a fanfic is because I have a strong desire to bring the two worlds together.
  I would reccomend them to kids because they are about kids and are written on such a level that kids will understand the stories, yet will be challenged as far as making inferences, understanding character relationships and otherwise using their imaginations.  no sex, no profanity and very little violence.

  ender




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no  Fri Jun  1 20:26:35 2001
From: pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no (pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 20:26:35 -0000
Subject: King Arthur Books
In-Reply-To: <9f8or8+9bq2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9f8tps+22cf@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rosmerta" <tmayor at m...> wrote:
> Thanks much for everyone's suggestions including (once and
> future?) lurker Mystril. I will now drag off to our
> teeny-tiny library and see if they have any of these. 

I know that Rosemary Sutcliffe (dead 1995, I believe) has authored 
several books based on the Arthurian legends, including a trilogy.  I 
only read one, and it is a considerable while since I did so (as I do 
not own a copy myself, it had to be remote-ordered from another 
library), but I recall that it was up to her usual superb standard.  

One of her books on Arthur is called _Sword At Sunset_, and is 
described by reviewers at the Amazon-site as NOT being a children's 
book (but Amazon-customers are giving it rave reviews).  Most of her 
books are however suited for children, though seven may be at the 
lower end of the age-spectrum.  I fondly recall her _The Chronicles 
of Robin Hood_; compared to it, all other books on Robin Hood were 
pale copies.  She makes everything spring alive in a unique fashion, 
and is a master of bringing histrical authenticity into her novels.  
According to one online bookstore, she wrote more than 50 historical 
novels for children.

The following books by Rosemary Sutcliff are about the Arthurian 
saga, and meant for a juvenile audience:
_The Lantern Bearers_ (prequel to _Sword at sunset_)
_The Sword and the Circle : King Arthur and the Knights of the Round 
Table_
_The Light Beyond the Forest_
_The Road to Camlann_

The latter three constitute the above-mentioned thrilogy.  I hope 
this is useful.

> Jen, I read The Crystal Cave a long time ago but sure don't
> remember anything even vaguely sexual; maybe it's time to read
> it again <g>?  Ender (or anyone else) if you have any more
> opinions on The Dark Is Rising, I'd love to hear them. I've
> seen the series mentioned but don't know anyone who's actually
> read any of the books... 
> 
> ~Rosmerta

I have read The Dark is Rising-sequence.  It is, in some ways, not 
unlike Harry Potter, and is set in England, sometime during the 70s 
or leate 60s.  It is not a retelling of the Arthur-saga as such, but 
it is heavily interlaced with it.  I enjoyed it very much.  One of 
the main characters lives in a family not unlike the Weasleys, I 
might mention.

The reading-order favoured by most people seems to be the 
chronological order of events: _Under Sea, Under Stone_; _The Dark is 
Rising_; _Greenwitch_; _Grey King_; _Silver on the Tree_.  I have 
only read them in Norwegian, however, and _The Dark Is Rising_ was 
published before _Under Sea, Under Stone_ in Norway.  That is thus my 
preferred reading order.  There are currently three Yahoo!Groups 
dedicated to her books, onbe with less than five members, one with 
around eight, and one with 38 members.  The latter can be found at 
http://groups.yahoo.com/groups/susancooper

Best regards
Christian Stub?




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Fri Jun  1 22:37:55 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 22:37:55 -0000
Subject: Dark Is Rising
In-Reply-To: <20010601194407.75260.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9f95g3+b88v@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> 
> --- Rosmerta <tmayor at m...> wrote:
> > Ender (or anyone else) if you have any more opinions on The Dark 
Is 
> > Rising, I'd love to hear them. I've seen the series mentioned but 
> > don't know anyone who's actually read any of the books... 
> 
> Ooo, I have an opinion Rosmerta! I re-read the series awhile ago 
(maybe
> five years) and still loved it. In some ways it's similar to Harry
> Potter. Young boy (12?) finds out that he's a unique member of a 
unique
> group and is sent on a quest. I won't go into it much more than 
that so
> that nothing is spoiled (unless you want me to) but it is a 
splendidly
> well-written book, in my opinion. Very classic writing, symbolism,
> familiar battle of Evil against Good. 

It's similar to but quite different than HP.  Similar in that Will is 
11 when he first discovers his specialness, there's much the same 
good vs evil thread running through it as well, and there's also a 
group of children who band together.  It's different in that there's 
not the characterisation that JKR is famous for (well, in this 
household at least). We don't actually get to *know* the characters 
as well as we do Harry & Co.
> 
> > I must admit that I don't know how well the Dark Is Rising series 
is
> similar to the King Arthur legend. When I read, I tend to read 
purely
> for pleasure and not for analysis. It's a terrible habit that I 
can't
> seem to break out of. I keep meaning to reread the *entire* series
> again, especially since I'm older. But from what I can remember, the
> series is wonderful; I highly suggest it.
> 
> ~Amber
> (Who rambled on for quite awhile...but I remember reading this 
series
> in awe when I was in elementary school; it's one of my "happy"
> memories!)
> 
> The series is very much about King Arthur, but it's pretty well 
disguised.  It's in 'The Grey King' that it really becomes evident.  

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker (who owns these books & re-reads them every two years)
> =====
> http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
> Don't ya just hate crappy homepages?...well, here's another!
> 
> "This body is dying. I can feel it rotting all around me. 
> How can anything that is going to die be real? How can it
> be truly beautiful?"
>  - Peter S. Beagle "The Last Unicorn"
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
> a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/




From john at walton.to  Fri Jun  1 22:43:26 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 18:43:26 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising
In-Reply-To: <9f95g3+b88v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <B73D92CE.2017%john@walton.to>

Buybuybuy readreadread -- The Dark Is Rising sequence (5 books) is my
favorite modern fantasy of all time. (More than HP. Scary, huh?) Read them
ALL, as soon as you can. Read them in order, though, so they make sense. My
personal favorite is the second book -- "The Dark Is Rising" itself.

Elatedly,

--John




From ender_w at msn.com  Fri Jun  1 23:27:02 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 19:27:02 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising
References: <B73D92CE.2017%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <002001c0eaf2$5e509b20$a60a1b3f@satellite>

The Grey King has always been my favorite, I think because I identify with Bran very much because I have disabilities.  Not that being an albino (which Bran is) is a disability, but it causes some of the same social unpleasantness in his life as my disability has caused in mine.  I also...well, I guess I should put a spoiler space before this for those who haven't read it yet...
s
p
a
c
e
t
h
e
f
I
n
a
l
f
r
o
n
t
i
e
r

I've also always been fascinated with royalty throughout history and especially with the theme of the hidden or misplaced heir, which Bran is, being the only son of Arthur.  

ender
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Walton 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, June 01, 2001 6:43 PM
  Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising


  Buybuybuy readreadread -- The Dark Is Rising sequence (5 books) is my
  favorite modern fantasy of all time. (More than HP. Scary, huh?) Read them
  ALL, as soon as you can. Read them in order, though, so they make sense. My
  personal favorite is the second book -- "The Dark Is Rising" itself.

  Elatedly,

  --John


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor 
       
       

  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com



  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From tmayor at mediaone.net  Sat Jun  2 00:39:18 2001
From: tmayor at mediaone.net (Rosmerta)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 00:39:18 -0000
Subject: Dark Is Rising
In-Reply-To: <B73D92CE.2017%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <9f9cjm+fghh@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., John Walton <john at w...> wrote:
> Buybuybuy readreadread -- The Dark Is Rising sequence (5 books) is 
my
> favorite modern fantasy of all time. (More than HP. Scary, huh?) 
Read them
> ALL, as soon as you can. Read them in order, though, so they make 
sense. 


But what *is* the right order? This book club we belong to is 
offering The Dark Is Rising and one other--I think Greywitch--as if 
those were the first two, but that doesn't seem to be the order they 
were written in......and some people seemed to think it's best to 
read them *out* of order, with "Dark" going first??

~Rosmerta
diligently taking notes to make sure she gets this all right




From bohners at pobox.com  Sat Jun  2 00:51:30 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 20:51:30 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising
References: <9f9cjm+fghh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <033201c0eafe$4c103fe0$9198e2d1@rebeccab>

> But what *is* the right order? This book club we belong to is
> offering The Dark Is Rising and one other--I think Greywitch--as if
> those were the first two, but that doesn't seem to be the order they
> were written in......and some people seemed to think it's best to
> read them *out* of order, with "Dark" going first??

In chronological order, they run like this:

OVER SEA, UNDER STONE
THE DARK IS RISING
GREENWITCH
THE GREY KING
SILVER ON THE TREE

However, I personally found OVER SEA, UNDER STONE to be disappointingly
mundane and even rather boring the first time I read it (ah, the ignorance
of youth) -- it didn't read to me like a fantasy novel at all.  If I hadn't
had a friend breathing down my neck and practically *forcing* me to read THE
DARK IS RISING, I'd never have realized how great the series really was.

After I'd read through the rest of the books, I went back and re-read OVER
SEA, UNDER STONE with a new appreciation, and decided that I did like it
after all, now that I understood the background and had some reason to care
about what was going on.  But if I were doing the whole thing over again, I
would read THE DARK IS RISING first, and save myself the trouble.
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From bohners at pobox.com  Sat Jun  2 00:52:24 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2001 20:52:24 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising
References: <B73D92CE.2017%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <033301c0eafe$4d13a620$9198e2d1@rebeccab>

> Buybuybuy readreadread -- The Dark Is Rising sequence (5 books) is my
> favorite modern fantasy of all time. (More than HP. Scary, huh?)

I have noticed that on FF.net there is a very serious dearth of decent DARK
IS RISING fanfic.  Fix that, will you?  There's a good chap.
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Sat Jun  2 02:11:24 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 02:11:24 -0000
Subject: Help on British weights
Message-ID: <9f9i0c+1siq@eGroups.com>

Hello all, 

I'm hoping some sweet British person can help me out.  In 1980, how 
was birth weight recorded?  I know weight was/is measured in stones, 
but since a stone = 14 lbs., I don't quite think that would work.  

Thanks in advance~

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Sat Jun  2 02:21:49 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony AKA AngieJ)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 02:21:49 -0000
Subject: Barbara's fanfic...
Message-ID: <9f9ijt+ma6u@eGroups.com>

'Tis the season for me to read fanfic, I guess... last year between 
May and September I did little else while I was online, even before I 
knew groups like HP4GU existed!

I've found another great one that's highly underappreciated IMHO.  If 
I'm not mistaken, the author, "Barb LP" is none other than HP4GUer 
Barbara Purdom.  

Here's a link... you might have to c&p, but it should do the trick...

Harry Potter and the Psychic Serpent
http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=288212

Very good fic--16 chapters already posted--and when I was done, Barb 
had *my* brain twisted into a pretzel... a feat I thought 
impossible.  Read--very few fanfics make me want to launch into a 
deep discussio about them, and Barb's has just had that effect on me.

--Ebony AKA AngieJ (who has "Personal Risks" up next on her long must-
read list... and is greatly anticipating it!)




From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun  2 02:41:36 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 02:41:36 -0000
Subject: Brit Slang Question
Message-ID: <9f9jp0+9f8k@eGroups.com>

Okay, it is a cliche that 'knock up' has quite different meanings 
in US and UK. In US usage, we can say that a girl is knocked up, 
meaning that she's pregnant, and we can also say that So-and-so is
the man who knocked her up. In "Rumpole of the Bailey", the slang 
for being pregnant was 'up the spout', but what is the transitive 
verb form? Suppose (back in March of 1999) someone was speaking 
of the contest for first baby of the Millennium and someone tried to 
translate his remarks for someone of the intelligence level of 
Crabbe: "He said, go home and [impregnate] your wife."




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Sat Jun  2 03:02:53 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 03:02:53 -0000
Subject: LOTR movies
In-Reply-To: <019b01c0eaae$15fa2ce0$9198e2d1@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <9f9l0t+t27d@eGroups.com>

Joanne wrote:

> > Elijah Wood is very young (I don't think he's twenty yet). Is 
Frodo a
> young
> > character? That would make sense.

Rebecca wrote:

> Frodo's not that young -- about the human equivalent of thirty -- 
but
> Hobbits look younger than they are (people often mistake them for 
children)
> so it's not an issue.

Frodo is 33 (hmm, never picked up on the Jesus connection before).  
Hobbits don't live much longer than humans--Bilbo is unusual in 
reaching "eleventy-one," 111--so even if they look childlike, Elijah 
Wood seems pretty young.

Now, I think Alan Rickman is perfect, but I mean PERFECT, for Snape, 
and he's 20+ years too old, so I am far from consistent on this issue. 
 If the kid can act, and I haven't seen him in anything since he was 
about 10 so I don't know, then great and I won't complain.  Heck, I'm 
bordering on ecstatic about Daniel Radcliffe and he doesn't look a 
thing like Harry.

Amy Z
very happy about Ian Holm, who definitely isn't 111




From Schlobin at aol.com  Sat Jun  2 04:30:21 2001
From: Schlobin at aol.com (Schlobin at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 04:30:21 -0000
Subject: King Arthur Books- Howard Pyle
In-Reply-To: <9f6m2t+74mr@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9f9q4t+p2oe@eGroups.com>


> 
> Milz (who owns only one book about King Arthur--"Idylls of the 
King" 
> by Alfred, Lord Tennyson)

You have Tennyson but not Mallory? Hmmm




From Schlobin at aol.com  Sat Jun  2 04:43:23 2001
From: Schlobin at aol.com (Schlobin at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 04:43:23 -0000
Subject: Dark Is Rising
In-Reply-To: <9f9cjm+fghh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9f9qtb+ua7g@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rosmerta" <tmayor at m...> wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., John Walton <john at w...> wrote:
> > Buybuybuy readreadread -- The Dark Is Rising sequence (5 books) 
is 
> my
> > favorite modern fantasy of all time. (More than HP. Scary, huh?) 
> Read them
> > ALL, as soon as you can. Read them in order, though, so they make 
> sense. 
> 
> 
> But what *is* the right order? This book club we belong to is 
> offering The Dark Is Rising and one other--I think Greywitch--as if 
> those were the first two, but that doesn't seem to be the order 
they 
> were written in......and some people seemed to think it's best to 
> read them *out* of order, with "Dark" going first??
> 
> ~Rosmerta
> diligently taking notes to make sure she gets this all right


MOST people have read The Dark is Rising first.

But in fact there is a prequel. Over Sea, Under Stone.
The prequel is probably for younger children.

I would guess The Dark is Rising is for 10 year olds. 

Susan Cooper's books are really children's books (literate bright 
children, but children) whereas JKR's books are in a way, but not 
really (the Philosopher's Stone comes closest.... They are wonderful 
and outstanding, and have a strong Arthurian theme.

Here is the order.

Over Sea, Under Stone
The Dark is Rising
Greenwitch
The Grey King
Silver on the Tree

When the Dark comes rising, six shall turn it back;
Three from the circle; three from the track;
Wood, bronze, iron; water, fire, stone;
Five will return and one go alone.

Iron for the birthday, bronze carried long;
Wood from the burning; stone out of song;
Fire in the candle-ring, water from the thaw;
Six Signs the circle, and the grail gone before

Buy them now; read them often.

I also love the Crystal Cave and the Hollow Hills, and the first part 
of the Once and Future King.

Susan









From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Sat Jun  2 09:22:01 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 09:22:01 -0000
Subject: Help on British weights
In-Reply-To: <9f9i0c+1siq@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fab7p+fnqh@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., pbnesbit at m... wrote:
> Hello all, 
> 
> I'm hoping some sweet British person can help me out.  In 1980, how 
> was birth weight recorded?  I know weight was/is measured in       
> stones, but since a stone = 14 lbs., I don't quite think that would 
> work. 

lbs and ozs. 





From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Sat Jun  2 10:40:41 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2001 11:40:41 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Brit Slang Question
References: <9f9jp0+9f8k@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002401c0eb50$91899d80$153770c2@c5s910j>

Rita asked:

> Okay, it is a cliche that 'knock up' has quite different meanings
> in US and UK. In US usage, we can say that a girl is knocked up,
> meaning that she's pregnant, and we can also say that So-and-so is
> the man who knocked her up. In "Rumpole of the Bailey", the slang
> for being pregnant was 'up the spout', but what is the transitive
> verb form? Suppose (back in March of 1999) someone was speaking
> of the contest for first baby of the Millennium and someone tried to
> translate his remarks for someone of the intelligence level of
> Crabbe: "He said, go home and [impregnate] your wife."

You want a polite answer, I imagine?

First of all, I think 'he knocked her up/got her knocked up' can have that
meaning in the UK, but has probably been borrowed from the US.

Not to downplay the importance of "Rumpole of The Bailey" as a yardstick of
British behaviour ("up the spout" is certainly a possibility), there are a
number of less than flattering ways to express this: "up the duff", "in the
club" [from in the pudding club...duff also being a word for pudding], "a
bun in the oven", "in the family way", "preggers".  As it usually applies to
getting unmarried girls pregnant, there is also the euphemism "he's got her
into trouble".

When it comes to a verb form, I can't think of a direct example that
suggests impregnate.  You'd have to say "he put her in the club" or "he got
her up the duff".   That is, if you wanted to be loutishly insensitive about
it...

Neil

________________________________________

Flying Ford Anglia

"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
squashed, as though it had run headlong into a brick wall"
["The Leaky Cauldron", PoA]












From old_wych at yahoo.com  Sat Jun  2 12:29:47 2001
From: old_wych at yahoo.com (old_wych at yahoo.com)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 12:29:47 -0000
Subject: LOTR movies
In-Reply-To: <9f9l0t+t27d@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fam7r+59de@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Frodo is 33 (hmm, never picked up on the Jesus connection before).  

Is there a branch of LOON for LotR? If so I'm a member... Frodo is 33 
at the time of Bilbo's party. The main action takes place some 17 
years later when Frodo is 50. It's stated that this is getting 
towards middle age for hobbits. Hobbits do have a bit longer life 
expectancy that humans. Living to 100 or beyond is fairly common. 
(Otho Sackville-Baggins, Bilbo's nasty relative, is said to have died 
at the "disappointing" age of 102.) Bilbo himself is still alive at 
the ripe old age of 131, thus surpassing the Old Took (formerly the 
longest-lived hobbit on record), but this is due to the Ring's 
influence.

So do I think Elijah Wood looks too young? No. From the stills I've 
seen, the hobbits all look good and pretty much the way I imagined 
them.

Anne





From ender_w at msn.com  Sat Jun  2 12:56:04 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2001 08:56:04 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising
References: <B73D92CE.2017%john@walton.to> <033301c0eafe$4d13a620$9198e2d1@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <000c01c0eb63$63f58ba0$d3421e3f@satellite>

Hey,I'm workin' on it, but it's gonna take some time...and some beta readers...anyone want to volunteer?

ender 
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, June 01, 2001 8:52 PM
  Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising


  > Buybuybuy readreadread -- The Dark Is Rising sequence (5 books) is my
  > favorite modern fantasy of all time. (More than HP. Scary, huh?)

  I have noticed that on FF.net there is a very serious dearth of decent DARK
  IS RISING fanfic.  Fix that, will you?  There's a good chap.
  --
  Rebecca J. Bohner
  rebeccaj at pobox.com
  http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor 
       
       

  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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From joannec at hwy.com.au  Sat Jun  2 08:00:52 2001
From: joannec at hwy.com.au (Joanne Collins)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 18:00:52 +1000
Subject: Dating/Marriage
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010602180052.007f2470@mail.hwy.com.au>

Rachel, how awful for you.

>So, basically, what I'm saying is, age has nothing to do with it.  My 
>parents married when my mom was 18 and my dad was 21.  And 
>they just celebrated their 32 anniversary.  My grandparents married 
>at 18 and they've been married now for 55 years.  You just never 
>know.

You don't know, and you can't know if you don't try.

>*whew!*  Sorry I rambled.  And sorry I put all that out there.  
>Sometimes when I talk about it, I tend to ramble because it's still 
>very very painful to talk about.  

Rambling tends to be what happens with the painful subjects. I think it's
because you *can't* condense them, you have to put out how you feel about
it all. IMHO, anyway.

>I've not dated anyone since, I've 
>destroyed a friendship with a really great guy because he wanted 
>to date and thought sickened me.....it's been awful.

*hug*

Time. It's a cliche, but time really is all that will help. I learned that
the not so easy way.

Joanne.

--

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/diversefic

http://www.livejournal.com/users/joanne_c

"You know you're famous when people start saying you're gay." Hunt Block.
"I gotta go see about a girl," Good Will Hunting
Jen's stalker
Official Commodus Concubine #1
Hagen's mistress
Founder of the Coalition For A Towel-Free Buck (CFTFB)
Founder of the Coalition For A Shirt-Free Chris (CFSFC)
Official Ray Vecchio Buttermilk Purveyor
Spike's Personal Happy Meal #6
Official LitD Brendan Slut #4
Half of the Dazed & Confused Duo with Margret
Jordan's godmother.




From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun  2 16:50:45 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 16:50:45 -0000
Subject: Brit Slang Question
In-Reply-To: <002401c0eb50$91899d80$153770c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9fb5h5+j9no@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> 
> When it comes to a verb form, I can't think of a direct example
> that suggests impregnate.  You'd have to say "he put her in the
> club" or "he got her up the duff".   That is, if you wanted to be
> loutishly insensitive about it...

It's actually Malfoy Sr speaking to Crabbe Sr, so being loutishly 
insensitve IS the goal. Otherwise I would have settled for 'he put 
her in the family way'. I'm thinking that Crabbe Sr isn't smart 
enough to figure out 'he put a bun in her oven'.




From gypsycaine at yahoo.com  Sat Jun  2 21:33:12 2001
From: gypsycaine at yahoo.com (Denise R)
Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2001 17:33:12 -0400
Subject: Attn: Kindred Spirits!
Message-ID: <00a401c0ebab$a157e180$10ccfea9@ameritech.net>


Tonight, in our area (NE Ohio) the PBS is showing AoGG!

Yeah!

:)

(Channel 25 out of Cleveland--unfortuneately, I get more fuzz than show, but I'll try!)

********************
The most likely way for the world to be destroyed, most experts agree, is by accident. That's where we come in; we're computer professionals. We cause accidents.
- Nathaniel Borenstein
********************



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From john at walton.to  Sat Jun  2 21:48:21 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 17:48:21 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising
In-Reply-To: <033201c0eafe$4c103fe0$9198e2d1@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <B73ED765.20EF%john@walton.to>

Rebecca J. Bohner said:

> OVER SEA, UNDER STONE
> THE DARK IS RISING
> GREENWITCH
> THE GREY KING
> SILVER ON THE TREE

Attention please to those of you living in Connecticut and South London.
"Greenwitch" is pronounced GREEN-witch and not GREN-itch. This has been a
test of the Emergency Pronunciation Network. If this was a REAL
Pronunciation Emergency, you would have heard a loud rendition of "My Tart
Will Go On" by Sealion Dyeon.

> I have noticed that on FF.net there is a very serious dearth of decent DARK
> IS RISING fanfic.  Fix that, will you?  There's a good chap.

I hear and obey. ::collapses:: Seriously, though, I do have some ideas, but
I'm working 8-6 all summer, helping learning-disabled kids to read, so the
Idea Factory might be a little short of work :)

--John




From kiary91 at hotmail.com  Sun Jun  3 00:37:32 2001
From: kiary91 at hotmail.com (Cait Hunter)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 00:37:32 -0000
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: King Arthur Books
Message-ID: <F301N3qljWwY0VnkB4l00014614@hotmail.com>

TDIR is one of my favorite kid serieses- I pull it out and read it 
periodically simply because it's so enjoyable. It can be a little bit 
confusing at parts (or so I seem to remember, I read the books for the first 
time in 3rd-4th-5th grade), but that's about the only drawback to them.

Also, Lloyd Alexander's Prydain books, and there's a neat Taliesien story 
called "A String in the Harp" which is probably out of print, as it's a 
rather old title.

Cait (and corgis), devourer of Welsh mythology stories


>From: "Rosmerta" <tmayor at mediaone.net>
>Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: King Arthur Books
>Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 19:02:00 -0000
>
>Thanks much for everyone's suggestions including (once and future?)
>lurker Mystril. I will now drag off to our teeny-tiny library and see
>if they have any of these.
>
>Jen, I read The Crystal Cave a long time ago but sure don't remember
>anything even vaguely sexual; maybe it's time to read it again <g>?
>Ender (or anyone else) if you have any more opinions on The Dark Is
>Rising, I'd love to hear them. I've seen the series mentioned but
>don't know anyone who's actually read any of the books...
>
>~Rosmerta
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From bohners at pobox.com  Sun Jun  3 00:49:48 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2001 20:49:48 -0400
Subject: FF:  Wildly Enthusiastic Fanfic Recommendation
References: <9f9ijt+ma6u@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <020301c0ebc7$1d969140$498f23cf@rebeccab>

I have just found an HP fanfic that thrilled me to the core.  If you are
searching for a story that really reads as though JKR had written it --
style, pacing, spirit, sensibility, characterization -- and that picks up
where GoF left off, look no further.  Hie thee to FF.net and read "Harry
Potter and the Heir of Slytherin" by DrummerGirl at
http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=259754 .

There are 20 chapters so far, but they're fairly short ones, and since it's
written in JKR's style it practically reads itself.

Trust me on this one.  It's great.
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From ender_w at msn.com  Sun Jun  3 01:07:14 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2001 21:07:14 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising
References: <B73ED765.20EF%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <001301c0ebc9$898dcf60$52e7183f@satellite>


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Walton 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2001 5:48 PM
  Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Dark Is Rising


  Rebecca J. Bohner said:

  > I have noticed that on FF.net there is a very serious dearth of decent DARK
  > IS RISING fanfic.  Fix that, will you?  There's a good chap.

  John answered:

  I hear and obey. ::collapses:: Seriously, though, I do have some ideas, but
  I'm working 8-6 all summer, helping learning-disabled kids to read, so the
  Idea Factory might be a little short of work :)

  --John


  John? You write and teach LD kids?  Are you single?  Just kidding.  I'm a writer and a special ed. teacher as well.  I am writing a TDIR fanfic.  any interest in beta reading?  Actually, I have an intense class starting in a few days so I probably won't even have anything to be read until August, but i thought i'd ask.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Sun Jun  3 02:30:51 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 02:30:51 -0000
Subject: Weasley Casting
Message-ID: <9fc7gr+aasl@eGroups.com>

Hi everybody,
I've been wondering about the casting of the whole Weasley clan, and 
had a few questions, some of which I've already answered...

First I wanted to know who was playing Ginny. Well I found her 
picture here

http://www.pfd.co.uk/scripts/get.py/actors/?actors%20Bonnie%20Wright

Did everyone else know about this and I'm just painfully slow? She 
look good for the part though as far as looks go I have a friend who 
will always be Ginny in my minds eye.

Secondly,who played the twins?They don't have a large part in PS/SS, 
but they must have been cast. However this information seems 
nonexistent. Anyone know? I was also wondering whether they hired a 
real set of twins for the part or one person to do both parts. 
Somehow I bet it's the latter, but I haven't actually seen this 
anywhere.

Scott




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Sun Jun  3 02:39:51 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 02:39:51 -0000
Subject: LOTR movies
In-Reply-To: <9fam7r+59de@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fc81n+uvj4@eGroups.com>

Anne wrote:

> Is there a branch of LOON for LotR? If so I'm a member... Frodo is 
33 
> at the time of Bilbo's party. The main action takes place some 17 
> years later when Frodo is 50. 

Aargh, please don't revoke my LOON membership!  (I need it for a post 
I'm about to make to the main list.)  You know, I had 50 in mind, but 
I looked up the birthday party, said "oops, wonder where I got that 
from, he's only 33," and wrote that.


Bilbo himself is still alive at 
> the ripe old age of 131, thus surpassing the Old Took (formerly the 
> longest-lived hobbit on record), but this is due to the Ring's 
> influence.

Exactly.  He's stretched out.

 
> So do I think Elijah Wood looks too young? 

I now definitely do.  But I'm actually more concerned that he'll look 
too tall . . .

Amy Z




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Sun Jun  3 02:48:52 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 02:48:52 -0000
Subject: Dark is Rising/King of Shadows
In-Reply-To: <9f8or8+9bq2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fc8ik+2ng4@eGroups.com>

Rosmerta wrote:
 
> Ender (or anyone else) if you have any more opinions on The Dark Is 
> Rising, I'd love to hear them. I've seen the series mentioned but 
> don't know anyone who's actually read any of the books... 

Hi, Rosmerta!  I finished the series last month and posted my thoughts 
on the series at msg. 2910, which started a thread like the one you've 
just read.  I do recommend them highly despite my criticisms.  I'd 
love to hear more from John on why they're the best ever.

On a related (but totally unrelated to King Arthur) note, I just 
finished listening to a much more recent book by Susan Cooper and 
absolutely loved it.  I couldn't wait to hop back in the car (I don't 
bring the tapes inside.  The exception was Thanksgiving break, when I 
could spend 5 days doing no work, so I brought in HP 2-4 and lay on 
the couch day and night, headphones on, munching clementines, 'til I 
reached the end).  It's called King of Shadows and it's about a boy 
who goes to the new Globe in 1999 to play in a boys' Shakespeare 
company and is transported to 1599, where the Lord Chamberlain's 
Men are rehearsing for a performance in the =new= new Globe, as in, 
when it was first built, and he finds himself playing Puck to 
Shakespeare's own Oberon and having Shakespeare as a mentor.  If you 
love theater and Shakespeare it is a must-read.

I can't say it's a must-listen, because the accents are atrocious.  I 
picked it up and said, "ooh, Susan Cooper" and then "hey, and it's Jim 
Dale, too, so much the better" (pauses to acknowledge retching noises 
emanating from St. Andrews).  Well, Jim Dale may have a talent for 
accents, but his Greenville, South Carolina is godawful.  The book is 
a read-out-louder's nightmare, featuring kids from all over the US, 
grownups from all over England, and 16th-century speakers who are 
supposed to sound something between a modern West Country and modern 
southern U.S. accent.  (The accents are significant, too, because the 
reason Nat blends in as well as he does in Elizabethan England is that 
certain Southern U.S. accents =are= supposedly the closest modern 
equivalent to the way Shakespeare would have talked.  Cooper must've 
seen The Story of English on PBS, same as I did.)  To make things 
tougher on the listener's ears, it's in first person, so Jim is doing 
his non-South Carolina accent almost all the time.  Yikes.  However, 
it's a tribute to the book that I still couldn't stop.

Amy Z




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Sun Jun  3 02:59:30 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 02:59:30 -0000
Subject: Weasley Casting
In-Reply-To: <9fc7gr+aasl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fc96i+3jqs@eGroups.com>

Insanus Scottus wrote:

> Did everyone else know about this and I'm just painfully slow? She 
> look good for the part though as far as looks go I have a friend who 
> will always be Ginny in my minds eye.
> 
> Secondly,who played the twins?They don't have a large part in PS/SS, 
> but they must have been cast. However this information seems 
> nonexistent. Anyone know? I was also wondering whether they hired a 
> real set of twins for the part or one person to do both parts. 
> Somehow I bet it's the latter, but I haven't actually seen this 
> anywhere.

Nope, it's a real set of twins (well, real brothers anyway . . . I 
assume they're twins).  I can't remember their names, but the info is 
on hpgalleries.com.

Thanks for the Ginnylink!

Amy Z




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Sun Jun  3 03:04:36 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 03:04:36 -0000
Subject: Dark Is Rising
In-Reply-To: <B73ED765.20EF%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <9fc9g4+6h0n@eGroups.com>

Rebecca wrote:

> > I have noticed that on FF.net there is a very serious dearth of 
decent DARK
> > IS RISING fanfic.  Fix that, will you?  There's a good chap.

John wrote:

> I hear and obey. ::collapses:: Seriously, though, I do have some 
ideas, but
> I'm working 8-6 all summer, helping learning-disabled kids to read, 
so the
> Idea Factory might be a little short of work :)

Make 'em your beta-readers and knock out two Chasers with one Bludger 
(I've been looking for a less gruesome version of "kill two birds with 
one stone"--whaddaya think, sirs?).

Great work, John.  I hope it goes well.

Amy Z




From Krazy4Quidditch at hotmail.com  Sun Jun  3 03:06:47 2001
From: Krazy4Quidditch at hotmail.com (Krazy4Quidditch)
Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2001 23:06:47 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Weasley Casting
References: <9fc7gr+aasl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <OE6SeWJmvzUZvKkxBYk0000959b@hotmail.com>

Hi, 
It looks like the twins are probably really twins!
James Phelps (Fred Weasley)
Oliver Phelps (George Weasley)
http://www.hpgalleries.com/moviegallery6.htm

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Scott 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2001 10:30 PM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Weasley Casting


  Hi everybody,
  I've been wondering about the casting of the whole Weasley clan, and 
  had a few questions, some of which I've already answered...

  First I wanted to know who was playing Ginny. Well I found her 
  picture here

  http://www.pfd.co.uk/scripts/get.py/actors/?actors%20Bonnie%20Wright

  Did everyone else know about this and I'm just painfully slow? She 
  look good for the part though as far as looks go I have a friend who 
  will always be Ginny in my minds eye.

  Secondly,who played the twins?They don't have a large part in PS/SS, 
  but they must have been cast. However this information seems 
  nonexistent. Anyone know? I was also wondering whether they hired a 
  real set of twins for the part or one person to do both parts. 
  Somehow I bet it's the latter, but I haven't actually seen this 
  anywhere.

  Scott


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor 
       
       

  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Sun Jun  3 03:16:19 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 03:16:19 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: King Arthur Books
Message-ID: <F25LoygXLsxpTljBOh800007ed8@hotmail.com>

> > Milz (who owns only one book about King Arthur--"Idylls of the
>King"
> > by Alfred, Lord Tennyson)

Susan wrote:
>You have Tennyson but not Mallory? Hmmm
>


As an Anne fan, I prefer the Tennyson to the Malory.  Then again, I just 
like Tennyson's work.  ;-)

I think I was actually introduced to Camelot via the Time-Life "The 
Enchanted World" series--anyone else remember that?  There were several 
books--coffee table sized with fantastic illustrations and sidenotes--my 
grandparents purchased "Dragons", "Fairies and Elves", "Ghosts", "Witches 
and Wizards", and "Legends of Valor" for my uncle (and I feel like I'm 
forgetting one) when I was around 6... he was 18 and not all that 
interested.  I remember *devouring* the books every time I spent the night 
over my grandparents' house... and most recently re-read them when I spent 
Christmas and New Year's with grandma.

I've considered asking for them.  I know my grandmother would gladly give 
them to me--I've inherited a great deal of my uncle's old books--but I'm a 
little hesitant.  When I was a kid, I was a little afraid of those books.  
It's almost as if I felt the magic they described was real... and the ghosts 
and demons and dragons would come get me if I slept in the same room.


--Ebony (who just purchased *The Mists of Avalon* today and can't wait to 
read it)
_________________________________________________________________
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From kiary91 at hotmail.com  Sun Jun  3 03:36:01 2001
From: kiary91 at hotmail.com (Cait Hunter)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 03:36:01 -0000
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dark is Rising/Kids' Arthur books
Message-ID: <F155bspaNd7exBBXT1l0000a2b0@hotmail.com>

One I really enjoyed, and hadn't seen mentioend was Anne McCaffery's "Black 
Horses for the King"- as a AM fan *and* a horse person, I really enjoyed 
them. Anyone else read this? (I'm hoping for a sequel, but doubt one will be 
forthcoming.)


Cait (and corgis, who just watched Crufts and barked at the TV)
_________________________________________________________________
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From kiary91 at hotmail.com  Sun Jun  3 03:37:34 2001
From: kiary91 at hotmail.com (Cait Hunter)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 03:37:34 -0000
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dark is Rising/King of Shadows/Susan Cooper
Message-ID: <F149asSmz6UuEhjJ8uT0000bb7d@hotmail.com>

She also has a children's book called "The Boggart" which is really neat, as 
well! ^_^



Cait (and corgis), who forgot to put that in the last email.
_________________________________________________________________
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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Sun Jun  3 04:23:24 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2001 21:23:24 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Cool A.I. Site
Message-ID: <20010603042324.58534.qmail@web14505.mail.yahoo.com>


I don't know how many people in this list like computer philosophy, but
I have a small interest in it. My interest has grown larger especially
because of the upcoming movie A.I.

Anyways, just wanted to tell people to go to the official movie site:

http://aimovie.warnerbros.com/

Once you get past the opening trailer part, there's a neat chatbox
function at the bottom of the screen. It seems that they've developed a
sort of ELIZA program for the internet. It's really neat to play with
it and ask questions. Some of the answers from the computer are
*really* interesting. 

So that's it. Sorry for the interruption!

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From Belle_Starr_777 at yahoo.com  Sun Jun  3 05:38:08 2001
From: Belle_Starr_777 at yahoo.com (Belle_Starr_777 at yahoo.com)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 05:38:08 -0000
Subject: I saw Viktor Krum . . . 
Message-ID: <9fcig0+ph2n@eGroups.com>

At a wedding today in Southern Indiana, I glanced up at one of the 
guests and kept staring. 

He was tall and thin, about 18ish, kind of loping along slouch-
shouldered. Dark eyebrows, and his dark hair was cut short, except 
for across the top where it was slightly longer, dyed blond and curly.

["(he) was thin, dark and sallow-skinned, with a large curved nose 
and thick black eyebrows. He looked like an overgrown bird of prey. 
And it was hard to believe he was only eighteen."]

I think it was the way he moved more than this actual physical 
appearance, but the moment I saw him, I knew I was looking at Viktor 
Krum! (OK, with a dye job.)

I pointed him out to the mother of the bride (and one of my best 
friends to get into trouble with) and explained that he looked like 
the Seeker on the Bulgarian National Quiddich team. "That's 
from 'Harry Potter'," I added.

Christine miled. "Yes, I'm going to read those books as soon as Mom's 
done with them."

FYI -- "Mom" is in her late 70s and has all 4 lined up to read as 
soon as she's finished unpacking from moving halfway across the 
country. I think my friend will be as fascinated with the series as I 
am. Can you say, "One more way for Kim and Christine to get into 
trouble"? Of course you can! *evil grin*

Belle




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Sun Jun  3 08:18:55 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 08:18:55 -0000
Subject: Weasley Casting and other stuff
In-Reply-To: <9fc7gr+aasl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fcrtf+59rm@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Scott" <insanus_scottus at y...> wrote:
> First I wanted to know who was playing Ginny. Well I found her 
> picture here
> 
> http://www.pfd.co.uk/scripts/get.py/actors/?actors%20Bonnie%20Wright
> 
> Did everyone else know about this and I'm just painfully slow? She 
> look good for the part though as far as looks go I have a friend   
> who will always be Ginny in my minds eye.

Yep. I knew about that and sorry I forgot to tell the group - exams 
got in the way.

She looks to be right for the role.


Everywhere I look at the moment there seems to be a Mists of Avalon 
discussion.

And on the discussion of potraits I feel I have to mention that I sat 
my exams under a painting of some former King of England.


Simon




From msmacgoo at one.net.au  Sun Jun  3 10:18:41 2001
From: msmacgoo at one.net.au (storm)
Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2001 20:18:41 +1000
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dark is Rising/King of Shadows
Message-ID: <01C0EC6A.6CE96EE0.msmacgoo@one.net.au>

Rosmerta wrote:
 
> Ender (or anyone else) if you have any more opinions on The Dark Is 
> Rising, I'd love to hear them. I've seen the series mentioned but 
> don't know anyone who's actually read any of the books... 

Amy Z (is that Zee or Zed?) said:
On a related (but totally unrelated to King Arthur) note, I just 
finished listening to a much more recent book by Susan Cooper and 
absolutely loved it. 

I just read King of Shadows and loved it too - Fantastic hey!

I tried the Boggart books and just could not get into them. 

Opps this is a 'me too' post

storm




From catlady at wicca.net  Sun Jun  3 12:23:30 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Catlady)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 05:23:30 -0700
Subject: Quidditch Through the Ages
Message-ID: <3B1A2C41.9BBF22DB@wicca.net>

In 1269, Chief of the Wizards' Council Barberus Bragge (sounds like a
Slytherin name to me) fined Modesty Rabnott ten Galleons (allegedly
equivalent to some 6666 Galleons today, which is allegedly worth some
$33000 today) for rescuing the poor Golden Sniglet birdie from a
Quidditch game. In her letter to her  sister Prudence, Modesty wrote:
"Chief Bragge would have lost my vote if I'd had one." Someone suggested
that this indicates that females didn't have the vote in 1269, altho'
Elfrida Clagg (apparently female from the name) was Chief of the
Wizards' Council in 'the middle of the next century'. I propose that
there wasn't a gender distinction in voting, but there was a property
requirement, and Modesty didn't have enough property/wealth to be a
voter. There is a long history of property requirements for voting.

Does anyone think that the Malfoy family has a traditional fan or
ownership relationship with any of the pro Quidditch teams, and which
one? Suppose Draco didn't inherit a family tradition of rooting for some
particular team, would he be a supporter of a team or merely a fan of
some good player(s)? If a fan of a team, which team? I thought maybe
Falmouth Falcons, because of their reputation for playing dirty and
because their name can be spoonerized Malfouth. Maybe Montrose Magpies
because they are the winning-est team and start with M.

--
          /\ /\
           + +     Mews and views
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston

                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((





From old_wych at yahoo.com  Sun Jun  3 13:48:33 2001
From: old_wych at yahoo.com (A B)
Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2001 06:48:33 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] LotR Movie
In-Reply-To: <991562384.1407.54614.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010603134833.27662.qmail@web5204.mail.yahoo.com>


(Me):> So do I think Elijah Wood looks too young? 

Amy: I now definitely do.  But I'm actually more
concerned that he'll look 
too tall . . .


As ususal, I thought of something I should have
mentioned in that other post after I'd gone off-line.
It's OK if Frodo looks young. Due to the Ring's
influence, he retains a youthful appearance, and the
other hobbits find that strange. FotR, Chapter 2, "The
Shadow of the Past": "As time went on, people began to
notice that Frodo also showed signs of good
'preservation': outwardly he retained the appearance
of a robust and energetic hobbit just out of his
tweens."
Since hobbits come of age at 33 (and humans at
anywhere between 17 and 21, depending on the society)
a 20 year-old human actor won't be too youthful, IMO.

As for looking too tall, I have no idea. I think
they're doing some special effects to make the hobbits
and Gimli look shorter. It will be interesting to see
what they do with Merry and Pippin after they've had a
few Ent-draughts!

Anne (who wouldn't dream of revoking your membership
in LOON, since she suspects you've read HP as often as
she's read LotR)


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From joannec at hwy.com.au  Sun Jun  3 11:47:40 2001
From: joannec at hwy.com.au (Joanne Collins)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 21:47:40 +1000
Subject: Belated Happy Birthday Simon!
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010603214740.007c9100@mail.hwy.com.au>

A belated but heartfelt happy birthday wish, Simon. I hope your exams went
well.

*hugs*
Joanne.

-- 

Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty
years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the
Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's
not a threat. Now, that's a fact. I'll fuckin' kill you. Chuckie (Ben
Affleck) Good Will Hunting





From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Sun Jun  3 19:06:52 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 19:06:52 -0000
Subject: Shrek and HP Trailer
Message-ID: <9fe1sc+s8l3@eGroups.com>

Last night, my son and I went to see Shrek. (my idea)

I don't remember when I laughed so hard, and for so long, and so many 
times! I was in tears! It really helps to have a fairy tale, disney 
movie, been to Disney World background to watch Shrek. My son said 
that I laughed a few more times than anyone there.

Before the movie started, during the previews, the Warner Bros. logo 
came up. All I could think was, "Yeah, right. I should be so lucky!"
Then ... "tinkle tinkle tinkle" ... John Williams, *oh* *so* 
recognizable  music (for those of us who have played the HP Trailer 
1,000 times!) started to play! I sat bolt upright! I was so excited 
that I almost could not sit still!! I believe that I said, "Oh my 
God!" about 17 times! It was fantastic! And when Alan Rickman came 
on, I almost dumped my popcorn! Where is the pause and rewind button 
when you need one? I could have watched it over and over and over ... 
well, I am sure you all know what I mean. A great time was had by 
all. We talked about the movie and the trailer all the way home, 
laughing almost as hard as we did during the movie!

Doreen, who can't wait for the HP movie now, and who wants to see 
Shrek a couple more times too. A definite must buy video!




From john at walton.to  Sun Jun  3 19:19:26 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 15:19:26 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Shrek and HP Trailer
In-Reply-To: <9fe1sc+s8l3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <B74005FE.21B7%john@walton.to>

Doreen Rich said:

> Last night, my son and I went to see Shrek. (my idea)
> 
> I don't remember when I laughed so hard, and for so long, and so many
> times! I was in tears! It really helps to have a fairy tale, disney
> movie, been to Disney World background to watch Shrek. My son said
> that I laughed a few more times than anyone there.

It's SOOOOO good! I went to see it for the second time on Friday night after
work, and I laughed just as much as I had the first time around. It's just
hilarious! Of course, all my friends have agreed that I am Donkey, even
though all the Scottish people in St Andrews speak exactly like Shrek. Kudos
to Mike Myers for the accent, which only slips when he says "Really really?"
 
> Before the movie started, during the previews, the Warner Bros. logo
> came up. All I could think was, "Yeah, right. I should be so lucky!"
> Then ... "tinkle tinkle tinkle" ... John Williams, *oh* *so*
> recognizable  music (for those of us who have played the HP Trailer
> 1,000 times!) started to play! I sat bolt upright! I was so excited
> that I almost could not sit still!! I believe that I said, "Oh my
> God!" about 17 times! It was fantastic! And when Alan Rickman came
> on, I almost dumped my popcorn! Where is the pause and rewind button
> when you need one? I could have watched it over and over and over ...
> well, I am sure you all know what I mean. A great time was had by
> all. We talked about the movie and the trailer all the way home,
> laughing almost as hard as we did during the movie!

You lucky thing you! I was so hoping that the trailer would be shown before
the movie, but 'twas not to be. I guess I'll have to go see Atlantis (not to
mention Dr Dolittle 2) in the hope of seeing the trailer.

Surely movie theaters could make vast amounts of money by charging a buck or
two just to watch the trailer 10 times or so...

> Doreen, who can't wait for the HP movie now, and who wants to see
> Shrek a couple more times too. A definite must buy video!

I'm SO going to get the DVD version of Shrek -- my lovely Cube can play
them, and there're always loads of great Bonus Features.

Plus I just LOVE the soundtrack.

Everyone go see it! Shrek's great!

--John




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Sun Jun  3 19:52:36 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2001 12:52:36 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Shrek and HP Trailer
In-Reply-To: <9fe1sc+s8l3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010603195236.61025.qmail@web14507.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Doreen Rich <corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Last night, my son and I went to see Shrek. (my idea)
> 
> I don't remember when I laughed so hard, and for so long, and so many
> times! I was in tears! It really helps to have a fairy tale, disney 
> movie, been to Disney World background to watch Shrek. My son said 
> that I laughed a few more times than anyone there.

<grin> Great movie, isn't it? Wonderful Fractured Fairy-tale. I
especially love the ending scene. <starts dancing around like a maniac>
And the dragon. And the...er...genitalia references to the Prince's
castle. <starts giggling>

It's definitely one that I'm going to get on video. Even though the
ending was obvious from a mile away, it was funny enough to make me not
even care. "Shrek, Shrek, he's our man, if he can't do it no one can!"

~Amber
(Who is the BIGGEST sucker for anything remotely fairy-tale-ish)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com  Sun Jun  3 20:36:17 2001
From: Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com (Aberforth's Goat)
Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2001 22:36:17 +0200
Subject: New List: HPFGU-Germany
References: <B7400104.21AD%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <00ce01c0ec6c$d6e1f6d0$5772023e@shasta>

ATTN: CROSSPOST to Main List, Chatter List and Announcement List!
------------------------------

Hi All!

Anyone who lives in the German-speaking part of Europe is warmly invited to
stop by the HPFGU-Germany list for a mug of Bavarian beer, a Zrcher
Bratwurst, and a generous slab of Viennese Sachertorte. (Not to mention
whatever delicacies Italian and French German-speakers eat: Tagliatelle with
Snails and Sauerkraut, anybody?)

With a bit of luck, we may be able to get up a meet or two!

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-Germany

Aberforth's Goat (a.k.a. Mike Gray)
_______________________

"My own brother, Aberforth, was prosecuted for practising
inappropriate charms on a goat. It was all over the papers,
but did Aberforth hide? No he did not! He held his head high."




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Sun Jun  3 20:45:58 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Simon)
Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2001 21:45:58 +0100
Subject: Thanks
Message-ID: <LOBBLGEGEBLNEOFHCDINAEFJDKAA.simon.branford@hertford.ox.ac.uk>

Hello

I would just like to take a quick moment to say thanks to all of those who
wished me a Happy Birthday. It was greatly appreciated and cheered me up after
what can only be described as two disastrous exams (sorry Amy - it appears you
need to spend some more time at Hogwarts improving your wand technique).

Once again thanks.


Simon
--
"Insanity is inherited. You get it from you kids." - Anon
---------------------------------------------------------------------------




From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Sun Jun  3 20:58:37 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 20:58:37 -0000
Subject: King Arthur Books- Howard Pyle
In-Reply-To: <9f9q4t+p2oe@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fe8dt+uf64@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Schlobin at a... wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Milz (who owns only one book about King Arthur--"Idylls of the 
> King" 
> > by Alfred, Lord Tennyson)
> 
> You have Tennyson but not Mallory? Hmmm

Tried reading various Arthurian novels but I could never get into 
it. "Idylls" probably appealled to me because I like Tennyson.

:-)Milz




From rja.carnegie at excite.com  Sun Jun  3 21:10:50 2001
From: rja.carnegie at excite.com (rja.carnegie at excite.com)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 21:10:50 -0000
Subject: The Philospher's Stone
In-Reply-To: <002d01c0ea8e$faec0000$2f5c063e@tmeltcds>
Message-ID: <9fe94q+dkhg@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Michelle Apostolides" <michelleapostolides at l.=
..> wrote:
> Sounds like this is on topic but it's not. TPS is a title of a book by
> Peter Marshall about the above mentioned title. However, seeing as it's
> ? 20 in hardback and ?9.99 in paperback, I wondered if anyone had read
> this book and could tell me if it's worth spending my dosh on ?

Haven't read it, but this _is_ the Internet, after all, let's have
a look:

(Well, firstly there seem to be several people called "Peter Marshall
writing books - but I think this is the right one:)

http://www.grahamhancock.com/library/purchase.php?bookID=24

> This book comes highly recommended from us at Graham Hancock.com!

Oh dear. ;-)  (wink at those who recognise name "Graham Hancock")

(Btw, no reviews in the past 3-4 months at amazon.co.uk.  Amazon.com
offers "The Philosopher's Diet" and "The Marshall Plan for Novel Writing")

The same page quotes:

> "An intriguing read by an accomplished storyteller, and it is much to
> Marshall's credit that he never quite loses touch with reality. He has 
> researched the subject thoroughly
The Philosopher's Stone taps into a
> popular myth of today... inspirational."
> John Emsley, Sunday Times

Me: "Never quite loses touch with reality" is (1) faint praise and
(2) rich coming from the Sunday Times, UK home of AIDS-is-not-a-virus,
the Hitler diaries and I forget what other nonsense - cold fusion?

> "Suspend your disbelief and turn to Peter Marshall's new book...
> a wide-ranging, comprehensive overview of an incredibly complex
> subject that has far greater significance than most of us realise.
> In an easy, accessible manner he traces the history, explains the
> symbols, clarifies the texts and highlights crucial characters...
> fascinating."
> Janet Gleeson, Daily Mail

Me: For Harry Potter I suspend my disbelief.  For this, perhaps not.

> "Marshall finds enlightenment in alchemy's arcana... ranging from
> the mystic resonances of the Great Pyramid in Egypt to how to have
> inspirational sex."
> Lisa Jardine, New Statesman
> 
> "A mystical tale that taps into the wisdom of the ancients - and,
> make no mistake, the result is a tour-de-force in alternative
> literature. Not only a wonderful travel book... even those with
> only a passing interest in eastern philosophy will warm to this
> journal of impossible possibilities, such are the skills of this
> seasoned storyteller."
> John Phillpott, Worcester Evening News

Shrug.  If it's your bag - more at grahamhancock.com - then it's
also your ?9.99.  And I wish you the very best of luck with the
inspirational sex. ;-)

But what would David Icke make of it all?

Robert Carnegie
Meretricious!





From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Sun Jun  3 22:06:40 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2001 15:06:40 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Quidditch!Ron...
Message-ID: <20010603220640.5540.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>


I'm asking this question here as opposed to the main list because the
questions isn't *really* about canon, more about fanon...and I didn't
want to bring the Wrath of the Moderators down upon my head.

I've read several fics where Ron becomes Quidditch-Master. Whether he's
Beater, Chaser, Keeper (although never Seeker...), he's wonderfully
good at it. I find this extremely odd. I mean for the first four books
I haven't seen *any* evidence that Ron is a good Quidditch player. And
you'd think it would've surfaced by now...

Of course, I might've missed something (I'm always eternally "missing"
things). Can anyone help out the confused? Anyone have any logic for
Ron being a Quidditch player? It's not really that important, just
something that has bothered me a bit...

~Amber
(Who's pumped that the Tony Awards are on tonight...)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Sun Jun  3 22:51:36 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 22:51:36 -0000
Subject: Quidditch!Ron...
In-Reply-To: <20010603220640.5540.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9fef1o+gvl7@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> 
> I'm asking this question here as opposed to the main list because  
> the questions isn't *really* about canon, more about fanon...and I 
> didn't want to bring the Wrath of the Moderators down upon my head.
> 
> I've read several fics where Ron becomes Quidditch-Master. Whether 
> he's Beater, Chaser, Keeper (although never Seeker...), he's       
> wonderfully good at it. I find this extremely odd. I mean for the  
> first four books I haven't seen *any* evidence that Ron is a good  
> Quidditch player. And you'd think it would've surfaced by now...

There is at least one fic with Ron as a very good Seeker - points at 
Ebony ;)


> Of course, I might've missed something (I'm always  
eternally "missing"
> things). Can anyone help out the confused? Anyone have any logic for
> Ron being a Quidditch player? It's not really that important, just
> something that has bothered me a bit...

Well part of this stems from Ron having two brothers who are very 
good Seaters and one who was a Seeker "who could have played for 
England if he had not gone off chasing dragons'. Charlie was also 
Quidditch Captain. So the idea is that this talent runs in the family 
and Ron will also be good at the sport.

Simon




From HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com  Sun Jun  3 22:54:16 2001
From: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com (HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com)
Date: 3 Jun 2001 22:54:16 -0000
Subject: New file uploaded to HPFGU-OTChatter 
Message-ID: <991608856.25566.72759.f6@yahoogroups.com>


Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the HPFGU-OTChatter 
group.

  File        : /Member Pics/AmandasTrio.JPG 
  Uploaded by : editor at texas.net 
  Description : Amanda's kids: Kasia (5), Tomek (4), Michael (1.5), and all 3 on the couch 

You can access this file at the URL

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-OTChatter/files/Member%20Pics/AmandasTrio.JPG 

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit

http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

editor at texas.net
 







From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Sun Jun  3 23:18:03 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 23:18:03 -0000
Subject: Weasley Casting
In-Reply-To: <9fc7gr+aasl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fegjb+ghq0@eGroups.com>

I'm quite upset now I've seen this picture.  Ginny is one of my 
favourite characters ( at least, I don't object to her and will rise 
to her defense, unlike most of the members of the main list).  This 
actress seems very hard faced.  I always imagined Ginny as someone 
who looked incredibly soft and feminine, but who is in reality very 
strong.

Catherine

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Scott" <insanus_scottus at y...> wrote:
> Hi everybody,
> I've been wondering about the casting of the whole Weasley clan, 
and 
> had a few questions, some of which I've already answered...
> 
> First I wanted to know who was playing Ginny. Well I found her 
> picture here
> 
> http://www.pfd.co.uk/scripts/get.py/actors/?actors%20Bonnie%20Wright
> 
> Did everyone else know about this and I'm just painfully slow? She 
> look good for the part though as far as looks go I have a friend 
who 
> will always be Ginny in my minds eye.
> 
> Secondly,who played the twins?They don't have a large part in 
PS/SS, 
> but they must have been cast. However this information seems 
> nonexistent. Anyone know? I was also wondering whether they hired a 
> real set of twins for the part or one person to do both parts. 
> Somehow I bet it's the latter, but I haven't actually seen this 
> anywhere.
> 
> Scott




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Mon Jun  4 00:36:09 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 00:36:09 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Quidditch!Ron...
Message-ID: <F73DLf4bg5XmllgYBr4000018ec@hotmail.com>

Amber wrote:

>I've read several fics where Ron becomes Quidditch-Master. Whether he's
>Beater, Chaser, Keeper (although never Seeker...), he's wonderfully
>good at it. I find this extremely odd. I mean for the first four books
>I haven't seen *any* evidence that Ron is a good Quidditch player. And
>you'd think it would've surfaced by now...

I totally agree, and this is one of the reasons why I think the Ron I'm 
writing in fanfic is OOC in certain ways.  He doesn't pay enough attention 
to detail in canon to be a tremendous Seeker.  But of course, all that could 
change.  Neither do I think Ron'll end up a filthy rich celeb icon married 
to a glamorous Hermione.  But I wasn't going for the reasonable 
extrapolation--I was being a cheeky genie, fulfilling the Erised dreams of 
an adolescent boy.  Proving Pippin's hypothesis--that although the Mirror of 
Erised shows us our deepest desires, what we desire most is not necessarily 
best for us.

I've also read fics in which Ginny's a really good Quidditch player.  Hmm...

--Ebony AKA AngieJ

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From heidit at netbox.com  Mon Jun  4 02:50:43 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (heidi)
Date: Sun, 03 Jun 2001 22:50:43 -0400
Subject: Hay on Whe (was Re: [HPforGrownups] God, I Love Rumors... (WAS: Re:  interview)
References: <9fdskv+b4l6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B1AF783.C23EDE63@alumni.upenn.edu>

A question about nothing inflamatory about your post - have you *been* to Hay on Wye? My husband & I are complete bibliomaniacs and were thinking of going later this year or next spring - is it as wonderful as the travel mags suggest?

I am moving this question to HP4GU OT Chatter, where it's an appropriate question...(and Robert, if you're not a member yet, I hope you join!)

rja.carnegie at excite.com wrote:

>
> I have no idea where (who?) Ann Arbor is, whether it's America's
> Hay-on-Wye or whatever, and I also strongly suspect that I'm
> generally more gullible than most folks.




From Schlobin at aol.com  Mon Jun  4 04:00:57 2001
From: Schlobin at aol.com (Schlobin at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 04:00:57 -0000
Subject: King of Shadows
In-Reply-To: <9fc8ik+2ng4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9ff15p+bckb@eGroups.com>

I agree that this is an outstanding book...a very detailed,
rich, textured picture of Shakespearean England

Susan




From catlady at wicca.net  Mon Jun  4 05:12:44 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 05:12:44 -0000
Subject: Quidditch!Ron...
In-Reply-To: <20010603220640.5540.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9ff5cc+n9mc@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:

> I've read several fics where Ron becomes Quidditch-Master. Whether
> he's Beater, Chaser, Keeper (although never Seeker...), he's 
> wonderfully good at it. I find this extremely odd. I mean for the 
> first four books I haven't seen *any* evidence that Ron is a good 
> Quidditch player. And  you'd think it would've surfaced by now...

There's no evidence in canon yet that Ron is a good Quidditch player, 
but also no evidence that he isn't. There is evidence that he adores 
Quidditch (as well as the evidence that Simon mentioned that he has 
several brothers who are very good Quidditch players). We see him 
playing in a pick-up game at home with his horrible old Shooting 
Star. We don't see him playing in pick-up or intra-House league games 
at school because Harry is the POV and Harry was paying attention 
only to inter-House Quidditch. But Ron loves Quidditch so much that 
Ron must have played in at least pick-up games whenever he could 
borrow time and a decent broomstick (maybe from Fred or George when 
they were doing something else). But we weren't watching so we don't 
know if he did good.

We don't see him play on the House Team because he isn't on the House 
Team -- that doesn't say anything about how well or badly he would do 
in try-outs, because the Gryffindor team hasn't HAD any try-outs -- 
Oliver, Fred, Greg, Katie, and IIRC Alicia were already on the team 
before Ron came to school, Angelina (or maybe I have Angelina and 
Alicia confused) was added for Ron's first year, but apparently that 
was arranged at the end of the year before. Harry was given the 
Seeker position before there were any try-outs. So all the positions 
are filled until Oliver graduates, and the team members (apparently 
with no interference from their House Master) seem to have decided 
not to allow competition for any position that is already filled.

In fourth year, there was no Oliver but there was no inter-House 
Quidditch either, so still no try-outs. In fifth year, will JKR come 
up with another excuse to eliminate Quidditch? If not, the Gryffs 
will need a new Keeper, a new Captain, and maybe some Reserves. I 
thought there would be Quidditch in 4th year and expected that Fred 
and George would be chosen co-Captains. But now that I expect there to 
be Quidditch in 5th year, I expect Harry to be chosen Captain by his 
team-mates (6 in favor, the only vote against is Harry's own) as they 
like him and he won them the Cup in 3rd year and he's old enough and 
the twins are busy with Weasley's Wizard Wheezes ... will they be so 
busy that it will interfere with their Quidditch as well as their 
marks? 

So if the writer likes Ron and wants to give him a little happiness, 
she (I, in unposted fragment) lets him win the try-outs for Keeper 
and be a good one, turn pro after graduation. That tall long-limbed 
physique seems to me to be good for a Keeper. Of course, with him 
playing at the same time as Fred and George, he can't borrow their 
broomsticks. He will need a decent broomstick of his own. Will he 
allow Harry to pay for it if it is presented as a necessity for the 
sake of the team? With a reminder that the Slytherins were all given 
good broomsticks by Mr. Malfoy back in second year, and that Harry 
was given his Nimbus by McGonagall for Gryffindor's sake? 

If the writer wants to turn up the pressure on poor Ron, to see how 
he'll deal with it, (s)he makes him lose in the try-outs, beaten by 
Muggle-born (but tall and sports-mad) Dean Thomas or a girl or a 
younger student or -- a girl who is younger AND his very own sister! 
He's too young to drown his sorrows, so what does he do when he 
receives this news? Pull out his wand and explode a few things?  




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Mon Jun  4 08:48:39 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 08:48:39 -0000
Subject: Hay on Whe (was Re: [HPforGrownups] God, I Love Rumors... (WAS: Re:  interview)
In-Reply-To: <3B1AF783.C23EDE63@alumni.upenn.edu>
Message-ID: <9ffi17+rqoq@eGroups.com>

Forgive me for jumping in here, but I have visited Hay on Wye several 
times and I love it.  It is a bibliophile's paradise - as many, if 
not more, bookshops than Charing Cross Road and its environs.    The 
only problem is, practically every time I have been there it has 
rained.  There are also pros and cons to going during the festival 
(was a couple of weeks ago) - great for booksignings, readings etc. 
but very difficult to find somewhere to stay and very crowded - not 
easy to get down to some serious browsing.

Catherine

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., heidi <heidit at n...> wrote:
> A question about nothing inflamatory about your post - have you 
*been* to Hay on Wye? My husband & I are complete bibliomaniacs and 
were thinking of going later this year or next spring - is it as 
wonderful as the travel mags suggest?
> 
> I am moving this question to HP4GU OT Chatter, where it's an 
appropriate question...(and Robert, if you're not a member yet, I 
hope you join!)
> 
> rja.carnegie at e... wrote:
> 
> >
> > I have no idea where (who?) Ann Arbor is, whether it's America's
> > Hay-on-Wye or whatever, and I also strongly suspect that I'm
> > generally more gullible than most folks.




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Mon Jun  4 08:53:17 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 08:53:17 -0000
Subject: Quidditch!Ron...
In-Reply-To: <9ff5cc+n9mc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9ffi9t+6k8e@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rita Winston" <catlady at w...> wrote:

 That tall long-limbed 
> physique seems to me to be good for a Keeper. Of course, with him 
> playing at the same time as Fred and George, he can't borrow their 
> broomsticks. He will need a decent broomstick of his own. Will he 
> allow Harry to pay for it if it is presented as a necessity for the 
> sake of the team? With a reminder that the Slytherins were all 
given 
> good broomsticks by Mr. Malfoy back in second year, and that Harry 
> was given his Nimbus by McGonagall for Gryffindor's sake? 


Just one tiny, nitpick.  Isn't keeper the one position when it isn't 
necessary to have a really good broom?  I don't know how far apart 
the three baskets are at each end - but I would have thought that the 
keeper sticks close to one small area, doesn't need the same speed as 
the Chasers or Seeker, and if he is good, can tell which basket the 
chaser is going for and get there in plenty of time to cover it.

Catherine




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun  4 11:44:12 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 11:44:12 -0000
Subject: Happy (wee bit belated) Birthday, Mecki!
Message-ID: <9ffsac+ap9p@eGroups.com>

::Amy the Birthday Elf appears, wearing an expression of the deepest 
self-loathing and a torn, ash-smeared pillowcase, and begins to sing 
tunelessly and accompany herself on percussion (oven door)::


Happy Birthday to you, (slam)
Happy Birthday to you, (slam)
Happy Birthday, dear Mecki, (slam bang)
Happy Birthday to you!


::staggers off, holding ears::


Mecki, I do hope yesterday was a wonderful day for you.  Happy happy!

Amy Z
 




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun  4 12:01:51 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 12:01:51 -0000
Subject: Quidditch Through the Ages
In-Reply-To: <3B1A2C41.9BBF22DB@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <9fftbf+jug0@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Catlady <catlady at w...> wrote:
> In 1269, Chief of the Wizards' Council Barberus Bragge (sounds like 
a
> Slytherin name to me) fined Modesty Rabnott ten Galleons (allegedly
> equivalent to some 6666 Galleons today, which is allegedly worth 
some
> $33000 today) for rescuing the poor Golden Sniglet birdie from a
> Quidditch game. In her letter to her  sister Prudence, Modesty 
wrote:
> "Chief Bragge would have lost my vote if I'd had one." Someone 
suggested
> that this indicates that females didn't have the vote in 1269, 
altho'
> Elfrida Clagg (apparently female from the name) was Chief of the
> Wizards' Council in 'the middle of the next century'. I propose that
> there wasn't a gender distinction in voting, but there was a 
property
> requirement, and Modesty didn't have enough property/wealth to be a
> voter. There is a long history of property requirements for voting.

Possible.  Or maybe it goes by degree of magical ability?  Makes as 
much sense as only letting property owners vote . . . yeesh, by that 
standard I still wouldn't be able to vote.

Also, in the US there were women in Congress (well, =A= woman) before 
women were given the vote nationally, since it was a state-by-state 
thing up to that point and in Wyoming, women had the vote and the 
voters sent a woman to Congress.  So maybe Modesty was in a place 
where women didn't have the vote.  Then, too, women can be elected 
even if they can't vote.  Or maybe wizarding society, once it allowed 
women to vote, zoomed up to full equality much faster than Muggles 
have done.

This seems kind of on-topic . . . are we being bad?  <g>

Amy Z




From fyregirl at cfl.rr.com  Mon Jun  4 12:02:20 2001
From: fyregirl at cfl.rr.com (M. Barnett)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 12:02:20 -0000
Subject: Geographically challenged...
Message-ID: <9fftcc+54g6@eGroups.com>

Um, I have a fairly decent grasp on world geography, I can tell you 
where most countries, etc are.  But what and/or where is a Hay-On-
Wye?  I know what a Wye is ... we use it in firefighting, but why 
does it have hay on it?

Michelle <---educated in the american school system for waaaaay too 
long!




From fyregirl at cfl.rr.com  Mon Jun  4 12:03:09 2001
From: fyregirl at cfl.rr.com (M. Barnett)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 12:03:09 -0000
Subject: I could be  a moron....
Message-ID: <9fftdt+2f8c@eGroups.com>

did I even spell it right?

Michelle :)




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Mon Jun  4 12:20:14 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 12:20:14 -0000
Subject: Geographically challenged...
In-Reply-To: <9fftcc+54g6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9ffudu+gtoj@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "M. Barnett" <fyregirl at c...> wrote:
> Um, I have a fairly decent grasp on world geography, I can tell you 
> where most countries, etc are.  But what and/or where is a Hay-On-
> Wye?  I know what a Wye is ... we use it in firefighting, but why 
> does it have hay on it?
> 
> Michelle <---educated in the american school system for waaaaay too 
> long!

Hay-on-Wye is situated on the England/Wales border and as the name 
suggests is also by the river Wye. The following gives a map of the 
UK pinpointing Hay-on-Wye: http://www.hay-on-
wye.co.uk/htib/direction.htm

More information on the town is available ont eh rest of the site 
mentioned above (http://www.hay-on-wye.co.uk/).

HTH

Simon




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun  4 12:22:34 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 12:22:34 -0000
Subject: The Philospher's Stone
In-Reply-To: <9fe94q+dkhg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9ffuia+jb9q@eGroups.com>

Robert wrote:
 
> > This book comes highly recommended from us at Graham Hancock.com!
> 
> Oh dear. ;-)  (wink at those who recognise name "Graham Hancock")

::feels left out::  Who he?  Is this one of Marshall's pen names?


> >  "never quite loses touch with reality."

I think I will adopt this as my personal motto.  It has a noble yet 
practical ring to it.  "Amy: she never quite loses touch with 
reality."

Amy Z




From fyregirl at cfl.rr.com  Mon Jun  4 12:46:08 2001
From: fyregirl at cfl.rr.com (M. Barnett)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 12:46:08 -0000
Subject: Geographically challenged...
In-Reply-To: <9ffudu+gtoj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9ffvug+a0r3@eGroups.com>

Pardon me, sir, but would you be able to tell me what is special 
about this town?  (I don't say this in a demeaning manner or 
anything,) I'm just wondering why it is often talked about.

thanks,

Michelle :)




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun  4 12:48:20 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 12:48:20 -0000
Subject: Quidditch!Ron...
In-Reply-To: <9ffi9t+6k8e@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fg02k+hovu@eGroups.com>

Catherine wrote:

> Isn't keeper the one position when it isn't 
> necessary to have a really good broom?  I don't know how far apart 
> the three baskets are at each end - but I would have thought that 
the 
> keeper sticks close to one small area, doesn't need the same speed 
as 
> the Chasers or Seeker, and if he is good, can tell which basket the 
> chaser is going for and get there in plenty of time to cover it.

I would think you'd need a broom that is quick on reverses, braking 
and such--goalies have to have great reflexes and the broom will have 
to be able to follow them.  

I can see Ron as Keeper for the same reasons Rita gave.  But physical 
characteristics aside, I was just reading an interesting interview 
with Scott Garlick, goalie for the Tampa Bay Mutiny (=soccer, home of 
the incomparable Carlos Valderrama, for those who care), and he was 
saying goalkeeping is 60-70% mental.  So does that make Ron more or 
less likely to be a good Keeper?

To your question, Amber, I agree with Simon (Quidditch talent runs in 
the Weasley family, so why not in Ron?) and Rita (he hasn't had a 
chance to try out yet, at least not for the first string), but I'd add 
a third reason why ff writers love to posit a Quidditch!Ron:  they are 
only slightly less sick than Ron of Harry getting all the attention.

Hey, if Ron has been harboring dreams of trying out for Keeper, add 
that to the mix of why he's so damn pissed at Harry in GF.  He's 
actually ticked off about the Tournament itself 'cause it cancelled 
Quidditch just when Ollie had vacated the position.

Amy Z




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 13:02:14 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 06:02:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Quidditch!Ron...
In-Reply-To: <9ff5cc+n9mc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010604130214.61572.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>


Thanks Simon, Rita, and Ebony for your responses. I suppose that I
*can* see some evidence for Quidditch!Ron. Since most of his brothers
do play and are good at it, it would make sense that he might as well.
And even though there's no solid evidence for, there's also no evidence
against.

I am *such* a horrendous reader; I don't pick up on obvious things at
all. Like the order typo out of Voldie's wand. Completely missed that.
Or the time-travel problems with the time-turner. Or the population of
Hogwarts problem. Or The Kiss at the end of GoF. It goes on and on and
on... 

~Amber
(Who has never been a "careful" reader and when you couple that with a
bad memory...it's a wonder that I ever did well in Literature class)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 13:27:08 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 13:27:08 -0000
Subject: Geographically challenged...(was Hay-on-Wye)
In-Reply-To: <9ffudu+gtoj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fg2bc+ltb2@eGroups.com>

It sounds like a deli sandwich to me. *weg*

Happy Belated Birthday Simon!

I thought of you last night, when I noticed that in my Ebay Email 
directory, I had listed a "Howart's Tee-shirt". (that *was* you who 
did that, correct?)

Doreen, who probably thinks of deli sandwiches cuz she has not had 
breakfast yet.

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Pigwidgeon" <pigwidgeon at i...> wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "M. Barnett" <fyregirl at c...> wrote:
> > Um, I have a fairly decent grasp on world geography, I can tell 
you 
> > where most countries, etc are.  But what and/or where is a Hay-On-
> > Wye?  I know what a Wye is ... we use it in firefighting, but why 
> > does it have hay on it?
> > 
> > Michelle <---educated in the american school system for waaaaay 
too 
> > long!
> 
> Hay-on-Wye is situated on the England/Wales border and as the name 
> suggests is also by the river Wye. The following gives a map of the 
> UK pinpointing Hay-on-Wye: http://www.hay-on-
> wye.co.uk/htib/direction.htm
> 
> More information on the town is available ont eh rest of the site 
> mentioned above (http://www.hay-on-wye.co.uk/).
> 
> HTH
> 
> Simon




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Mon Jun  4 13:34:03 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 13:34:03 -0000
Subject: Geographically challenged...(was Hay-on-Wye)
In-Reply-To: <9fg2bc+ltb2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fg2ob+r84j@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Doreen Rich" <corn_patch_witch at y...> 
wrote:
> It sounds like a deli sandwich to me. *weg*

With all that Hay in it would it be very edible?


> Happy Belated Birthday Simon!

Thanks


> I thought of you last night, when I noticed that in my Ebay Email 
> directory, I had listed a "Howart's Tee-shirt". (that *was* you who 
> did that, correct?)

Yep, that typo was done by me.


> Doreen, who probably thinks of deli sandwiches cuz she has not had 
> breakfast yet.

Nor have I. I decided to by pass breakfast, since I had a lie in, and 
move straight onto a mid morning snack and then lunch. Else I have to 
say I had chocolate cake for breakfast.


Simon




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Mon Jun  4 13:39:08 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 13:39:08 -0000
Subject: Geographically challenged...
In-Reply-To: <9ffvug+a0r3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fg31s+pia8@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "M. Barnett" <fyregirl at c...> wrote:
> Pardon me, sir, but would you be able to tell me what is special 
> about this town?  (I don't say this in a demeaning manner or 
> anything,) I'm just wondering why it is often talked about.

Sorry - forgot to answer that part of the question.

The town has many bookshops and is home to a literary and arts 
festival (this years finished a couple of days ago). The festival is 
fairly famous.


Simon




From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 14:04:41 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 14:04:41 -0000
Subject: Geographically challenged...
In-Reply-To: <9fg31s+pia8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fg4hp+ufov@eGroups.com>

Here is a link to Hay-on-Wye info:

http://members.aol.com/hayweb/hay.htm

Sir Pigwidgeon ... *weg*

Doreen, who has been in a delightful mood ever since watching Shrek


--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Pigwidgeon" <pigwidgeon at i...> wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "M. Barnett" <fyregirl at c...> wrote:
> > Pardon me, sir, but would you be able to tell me what is special 
> > about this town?  (I don't say this in a demeaning manner or 
> > anything,) I'm just wondering why it is often talked about.
> 
> Sorry - forgot to answer that part of the question.
> 
> The town has many bookshops and is home to a literary and arts 
> festival (this years finished a couple of days ago). The festival 
is 
> fairly famous.
> 
> 
> Simon




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun  4 15:40:47 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 15:40:47 -0000
Subject: Geographically challenged...(was Hay-on-Wye)
In-Reply-To: <9fg2ob+r84j@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fga5v+npt8@eGroups.com>

Doreen wrote:

> > It sounds like a deli sandwich to me. *weg*

Simon wrote:
 
> With all that Hay in it would it be very edible?

"I love my love with an H," Alice couldn't help beginning, "because he 
is Happy.  I hate him with an H because he is Hideous.  I fed him 
with--with--with Ham-sandwiches and Hay."  --Through the Looking-Glass

Simon:

>I decided to by pass breakfast, since I had a lie in, 
and 
> move straight onto a mid morning snack and then lunch. Else I have 
to 
> say I had chocolate cake for breakfast.

Ah, the old "relabel the meal" ploy.  "This isn't breakfast, it's a 
very very late dessert."

Amy Z




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Mon Jun  4 15:43:13 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 15:43:13 -0000
Subject: Summer Movies & The HP trailer
Message-ID: <9fgaah+6gf2@eGroups.com>

Glad you saw the HP trailer Doreen! I haven't seen it, and I haven't 
seen Shrek either for that matter. Shouldn't another trailer be out 
soon.

I basically never go to the movies, but I did this weekend. I saw 
Moulin Rouge, and I absolutely *loved* it. It got mixed reviews 
though I think it was amazing. And extremely different. 

The scenery was beautiful and the anachronistic music worked 
suprisingly well. Then again I'm a sucker for musicals and love 
stories. Besides Ewan can really sing (any HP casting ideas?), and 
Nicole was good, but she didn't have the power of a well trained and 
well experienced voice.

I laughed and cried and felt just, well *good* after leaving. So yes 
I'm recommending it, and no I'm not any relation of Baz Luhrmann. :-)

And the song "Lady Marmalade" was *not* featured into the movie 
except for about two minutes of can-can, but it was pleasantly devoid 
of Lil' Kim. 

Did anyone else see it what did you think?

Scott





From jenP_97 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 16:42:56 2001
From: jenP_97 at yahoo.com (Jennifer Piersol)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 16:42:56 -0000
Subject: Quidditch!Ron, foiled again?
In-Reply-To: <20010604130214.61572.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9fgdqg+tj6b@eGroups.com>

Question:

Since Ginny will be a fourth year in the next book, and everyone is 
arguing for Weasley family quidditch talent, what if... What if Ron 
and Ginny try out for the same position (let's say that Ron had it in 
his head forever, but Hermione and/or Fred/George convince Ginny to 
give it a go), and *Ginny* gets it, not Ron?  

Jen (who loves to stir up trouble)

Ps.  Sorry for the on-topic post... just following a thread.

;)





From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Mon Jun  4 17:06:15 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 17:06:15 -0000
Subject: Quidditch!Ron, foiled again?
In-Reply-To: <9fgdqg+tj6b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fgf67+trfp@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Jennifer Piersol" <jenP_97 at y...> wrote:
> Question:
> 
> Since Ginny will be a fourth year in the next book, and everyone is 
> arguing for Weasley family quidditch talent, what if... What if Ron 
> and Ginny try out for the same position (let's say that Ron had it 
in 
> his head forever, but Hermione and/or Fred/George convince Ginny to 
> give it a go), and *Ginny* gets it, not Ron?  
> 
> Jen (who loves to stir up trouble)
> 
> Ps.  Sorry for the on-topic post... just following a thread.

Well I have been thinking about writing the Quidditch summary (up for 
discussion in a couple of weeks time) and so have many thoughts on 
the subject, but will be saving them for my summary. I do not want to 
haev discussed everything in advance!

The above idea is brought up in a piece of fanfic I read recently - 
but I cannot remember anything else about it. So I pose a different 
question:

Has fanfic run out of possible ideas? Or are there still different 
possibilities that have yet to be explored?



Simon




From michelleapostolides at lineone.net  Mon Jun  4 17:20:04 2001
From: michelleapostolides at lineone.net (Michelle Apostolides)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 18:20:04 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: The Philospher's Stone
References: <9fe94q+dkhg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <011201c0ed1a$9922c820$03337bd5@tmeltcds>

Haven't read it, but this _is_ the Internet, after all, let's have
a look:

> "Marshall finds enlightenment in alchemy's arcana... ranging from
> the mystic resonances of the Great Pyramid in Egypt to how to have
> inspirational sex."
> Lisa Jardine, New Statesman
Shrug.  If it's your bag - more at grahamhancock.com - then it's
also your 9.99.  And I wish you the very best of luck with the
inspirational sex. ;-)

I'll pass on ths inspriational sex bit. I'm not going to lay out a
tenner on a paperback until someone onlist somewhere - not some
newspaper reviewer - has read or knows a live person who has read the
book. A tenner for a paperback ? Yeah right !


Michelle





From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun  4 14:10:48 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 14:10:48 EST5EDT
Subject: Shrek and Moulin Rouge
Message-ID: <5FC0AD7F8D@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

I saw Shrek on the 26th.  Hilarious.  I want a pink dragon!!!  :-)  I 
was worried, though, because usually I don't care for Mike 
Myers/Eddie Murphy humor.  It was WONDERFUL!  I laughed so 
hard my side ached the next day.  Absolutely recommend it.

I'm seeing Moulin Rouge tonight.  I was down visiting my sister-in-
law this past weekend at Fort Campbell, Kentucky (my brother is 
stationed in Kosovo right now) and she wasn't in "the mood" to see 
a movie so this is the first time I've not seen a movie that I was 
VERY excited to see on the weekend it opened.  I called my 
friends who did see it the next day and asked 'Was it good?!  Was 
it good?!"  She said "Hmmm....I lost the bet.  I figured you would 
have called before noon on this one."  Ha ha.  SOOO eager to hear 
my beautiful Ewan singing.  *sigh*  Yay.

Glad to hear more of you are seeing the trailer now.  Especially in 
the theater.  TOTALLY different from seeing it on your computer.

OH!  I got my mom reading book one now.  She's REALLY 
enjoying it and HATES the Dursleys.  :-)

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

Oh, the thrill of the chase as I soar through the air
With the Snitch up ahead and the wind in my hair
As I draw ever closer, the crowd gives a shout
But then comes a Bludger and I am knocked out.

"I don't know who Jim Henson is but I've heard he has his hand in a 
lot of things around here." - Kermit the Frog, 1972



From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 18:12:36 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 11:12:36 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: HAPPY  BIRTHDAY MECKI
Message-ID: <20010604181236.11396.qmail@web13706.mail.yahoo.com>

HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO YOU!
HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO YOU!
HAPPY BIRTHDAY DEAR MECKI,
HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO YOU!!!!

THIS MAKES HOW MANY????

SCHNOOGLES TO MECKI,

FROM WANDA THE WITCH AND HER MERRY BAND OF
MUGGLES(WIZARD WANNABES)

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 18:15:56 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 11:15:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Amy's Children
Message-ID: <20010604181556.76868.qmail@web13704.mail.yahoo.com>

They are so beautiful and so cute!
I remember when mine were little. Now they are a
pre-teen and a teen!
Amy they are really special and thank you for sharing
some of your greatest treasures!
Happy Days to you all,

Wanda

__________________________________________________
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a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun  4 15:07:09 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 15:07:09 EST5EDT
Subject: Find your Hobbit name
Message-ID: <60B1DF43C7@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

Found this site.  Thought it was cute.  It's to find out what your 
Hobbit name is.  :-)

http://www.chriswetherell.com/hobbit/default.asp


Rachel Bray
or
Tigerlily Boffin of Whitfurrows  :-)

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

Oh, the thrill of the chase as I soar through the air
With the Snitch up ahead and the wind in my hair
As I draw ever closer, the crowd gives a shout
But then comes a Bludger and I am knocked out.

"I don't know who Jim Henson is but I've heard he has his hand in a 
lot of things around here." - Kermit the Frog, 1972



From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun  4 15:09:30 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 15:09:30 EST5EDT
Subject: Find your Hobbit name
Message-ID: <60BBB81CF5@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

Well, not sure the first time I hit "Send" it actually went.  So here it 
is again.

I found this site.  It's cute.  Find out what your Hobbit name is:

http://www.chriswetherell.com/hobbit/default.asp


Rachel Bray
or
Tigerlily Boffin of Whitfurrows



From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Mon Jun  4 19:12:23 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 19:12:23 -0000
Subject: Amy's(!?!) Children
In-Reply-To: <20010604181556.76868.qmail@web13704.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9fgmin+4arb@eGroups.com>

Wanda  wrote:
"They are so beautiful and so cute! I remember when mine were little. 
Now they are a pre-teen and a teen! Amy they are really special and 
thank you for sharing some of your greatest treasures!"

--Amy! I didn't know you had children. :-) Seriously Amanda they are 
adorable (they really are!), though I can only imagine what they are 
like when the camera is put down. ;-)

Scott
Thinking back to John's horrible April Fools Joke, and Amanda's idea 
that the best punishment would be for him to take care of her kids 
for a month...





From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Mon Jun  4 19:38:17 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 15:38:17 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Find your Hobbit name
References: <60BBB81CF5@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <3B1BE3A8.971E904D@sympatico.ca>

Tee Hee, well my Hobbit name is...are you ready for this? I wasn't....

Olo Chubb

lol, I'll try not to be offended...I wonder if it's telling me I need to
loose a few pounds...

Rachel Bray wrote:

> Well, not sure the first time I hit "Send" it actually went.  So here
> it
> is again.
>
> I found this site.  It's cute.  Find out what your Hobbit name is:
>
> http://www.chriswetherell.com/hobbit/default.asp
>
>
> Rachel Bray
> or
> Tigerlily Boffin of Whitfurrows
>
>                    Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
  [Check out great fares at Orbitz!]

>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

--
"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 19:41:27 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 12:41:27 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Sorry Amy and Amanada
Message-ID: <20010604194127.33920.qmail@web13702.mail.yahoo.com>

My big mistake!!! No joke! They are beautiful!
Amy I have no doubt if you have children or plan to
have children they will be beautiful too.
I just wanted to comment on them and I just didn't
check if the A was for Amy or Amanda, my muggleness
shows itself to much.
Soryy you two for my muggle mistake, but the kids are
so huggable you just want to get the old tickle bug
going.
Happy times with them!

Wanda the Witch who hangs her head in embrassment! 

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 19:47:51 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 12:47:51 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <3B1BE3A8.971E904D@sympatico.ca>
Message-ID: <20010604194751.84702.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>


<giggle> Mine's Lobelia Bulge of Great Smials. Guess I need to slim
down as well...

~Amber
(Who's wondering where "Smials" is and what makes it so "Great"...)

 --- Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca> wrote:
> Tee Hee, well my Hobbit name is...are you ready for this? I
> wasn't....
> 
> Olo Chubb
>
>And Rachel's was:
> >
> > Rachel Bray
> > or
> > Tigerlily Boffin of Whitfurrows


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 19:49:32 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 12:49:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Hobbit Name
Message-ID: <20010604194932.46783.qmail@web13701.mail.yahoo.com>

Well I checked it out too!
Wanda Mallett in Hobbit is Ruby Smallburrows of
Sandydowns! 

My maiden name is Wanda Barker,and in Hobbit, are you
ready for this? Ruby Burrows of Sandydowns!

I did the boys too.

William is Bungo Smallburrows.
James is Fosco Smallburrows.
Roy is Samwise Smallburrows!

And we all live in Sandydowns!

Wanda the witch of Revere 

__________________________________________________
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a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Mon Jun  4 20:09:56 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 21:09:56 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Find your Hobbit name
References: <60BBB81CF5@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu> <3B1BE3A8.971E904D@sympatico.ca>
Message-ID: <002001c0ed32$53dcc960$963570c2@c5s910j>

Jamieson said:

> Tee Hee, well my Hobbit name is...are you ready for this? I wasn't....
>
> Olo Chubb
>
> lol, I'll try not to be offended...I wonder if it's telling me I need to
> loose a few pounds...

Hmmm.... I came up as 'Olo Maggot of Loamsdown' (strange that, as my real
address is on Loampit Hill).  I think I'd rather be called Chubb than
Maggot!

Neil







From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Mon Jun  4 20:25:49 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 20:25:49 -0000
Subject: Corny Remus Lupin Joke 
Message-ID: <9fgqsd+1osj@eGroups.com>

Remus Lupin comes home one day from a long day at Hogwarts School.

"How was work, dear?" his wife asks.

"Listen! I don't want to talk about work!" he shouts.

"Okay. Would you like to sit down and eat a nice home cooked meal?" 
she asks nicely.

"Listen!" he shouts again. "I'm not hungry! I don't wanna eat! All
right! Is that all right with you? Can I come home from work and just 
do my own thing without you forcing food own my throat? Huh?"

At this moment, Remus started growling, and throwing things
around the apartment in a mad rage.

Looking out the window, his wife sees a full moon and says to herself,
"Well, I guess it's that time of the month."

I know ... it is corny ... but so am I ... it's an Iowa thing
Doreen





From lj2d30 at gateway.net  Mon Jun  4 21:32:11 2001
From: lj2d30 at gateway.net (Trina)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 21:32:11 -0000
Subject: Hobbit names
Message-ID: <9fguor+f80q@eGroups.com>

I turned out to be Bramblerose Danderfluff of Willowbottom.  

Excuse me, I must go wash my hair...

Trina




From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Mon Jun  4 21:45:09 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 21:45:09 -0000
Subject: Find your Hobbit name & Happy B-Day Mecki
In-Reply-To: <60BBB81CF5@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <9fgvh5+5rsa@eGroups.com>

Hi all, 

  My Hobbit name is Esmerelda Cotton of Overhill. I guess I fared 
better than Jameison and Neil. 

BTW Happy belated Birthday Mecki. Hope it was a good one.

Cheers, 
        Kristin 

       or 
  Esmerelda Cotton of Overhill




From pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no  Mon Jun  4 21:48:42 2001
From: pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no (pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 21:48:42 -0000
Subject: Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <002001c0ed32$53dcc960$963570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9fgvnr+mcuo@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> Jamieson said:
> 
> > Tee Hee, well my Hobbit name is...are you ready for this? I
> > wasn't....
> >
> > Olo Chubb
> >
> > lol, I'll try not to be offended...I wonder if it's telling
> > me I need to loose a few pounds...
> 
> Hmmm.... I came up as 'Olo Maggot of Loamsdown' (strange that,
> as my real address is on Loampit Hill).  I think I'd rather be
> called Chubb than Maggot!
> 
> Neil

This mean I am not the only "Maggot of Loamsdown", then!  But then, 
Severus Snape, Oliver Wood and Stan Shunpike are all "Maggots of 
Loamsdown" as well (see below).

Actually, I couldn't get it to take my name as such; it apparently 
has problems with anything else than a-z.  The below is what I got 
for myself, with three different transcriptions of my last name.

Christian Stuboe	Popo Maggot of Loamsdown 
Christian Stubo		Popo Danderfluff 
Christian Stube		Popo Maggot of Loamsdown 

Another things is that I cannot believe that, with so many Harry 
Potter-obsessed people (like myself) on this list, that no-one tried 
to run certain other names through the list.  Anyway, here goes:


Sorted by common names:

Harry Potter		Minto Danderfluff 
James Potter		Fosco Danderfluff 
Lily Potter		Pearl Danderfluff 
Ron Weasley		Marroc Grubb 
Fred Weasley		Drogo Grubb 
George Weasley		Ponto Grubb 
Percy Weasley		Lardo Grubb 
Ginny Weasley		Cora Grubb
Charlie Weasley		Grigory Grubb
Bill Weasley		Todo Grubb
Molly Weasley		Lila Grubb
Arthur Weasley		Bulbo Grubb
Hermione Granger	Sweetpea Toadfoot of Frogmorton 
Neville Longbottom	Dimple Chubb-Baggins of Pincup 
Seamus Finnegan		Longo Hardbottle 
Dean Thomas		Till Boffin of Needlehole 
Lee Jordan		Dimple Brandybuck of Buckland 
Oliver Wood		Orgulas Maggot of Loamsdown 
Parvati Patil		Beryl Sandydowns 
Padma Patil		Flora Sandydowns 
Lavender Brown		Marigold Gamgee-Took of Bywater 
Sirius Black		Longo Proudfoot 
Cedric Diggory		Fard Millstone of Bywater 
Amos Diggory		Mungo Millstone of Bywater 
Remus Lupin		Fard Brandybuck of Buckland 
Albus Dumbledore	Mungo Bracegirdle of Hardbottle 
Minerva McGonagall	Primula Hamwich of Buckleberry Fern 
Sibyl Trelawney		Lobelia Bulge of Great Smials 
Rubeus Hagrid		Fard Danderfluff of Willowbottom 
Gilderoy Lockhart	Minto Goodbody of Frogmorton 
Severus Snape		Longo Maggot of Loamsdown 
Alastor Moody		Bulbo Bulge of Hobbiton 
Igor Karkaroff		Griffo Broadbelt of Buckland 
Bartemius Crouch	Moro Frumblefoot of Bywater 
Fleur Delacour		Molly Took of Great Smials 
Viktor Krum		Falco Overhill of Nobottle 
Ludo Bagman		Sancho Gamgee-Took of Bywater 
Stan Shunpike		Mungo Maggot of Loamsdown 
Vernon Dursley		Todo Millstone of Bywater 
Petunia Dursley		Flora Millstone of Bywater 
Dudley Dursley		Lotho Millstone of Bywater 
Piers Polkiss		Milo Boggy-Hillocks 
Cornelius Fudge		Mungo Bracegirdle of Hardbottle 
Draco Malfoy		Fastolph Bulge of Hobbiton 
Vincent Crabbe		Mongo Bumbleroot of Fair Downs 
Gregory Goyle		Minto Danderfluff of Willowbottom 
Blaise Zabini (m)	Togo Frumblefoot of Bywater 
Blaise Zabini (f)	Polly Frumblefoot of Bywater 
Pansy Parkinson		Zelda Sandydowns 
Millicent Bulstrode	Autumn Chubb 


Sorted by hobbit-names (Gamgee-Took listed with Took):

Dean Thomas		Till Boffin of Needlehole 
Piers Polkiss		Milo Boggy-Hillocks 
Cornelius Fudge		Mungo Bracegirdle of Hardbottle 
Albus Dumbledore	Mungo Bracegirdle of Hardbottle 
Remus Lupin		Fard Brandybuck of Buckland 
Lee Jordan		Dimple Brandybuck of Buckland 
Igor Karkaroff		Griffo Broadbelt of Buckland 
Sibyl Trelawney		Lobelia Bulge of Great Smials 
Alastor Moody		Bulbo Bulge of Hobbiton 
Draco Malfoy		Fastolph Bulge of Hobbiton 
Vincent Crabbe		Mongo Bumbleroot of Fair Downs 
Millicent Bulstrode	Autumn Chubb 
Neville Longbottom	Dimple Chubb-Baggins of Pincup 
Harry Potter		Minto Danderfluff 
James Potter		Fosco Danderfluff 
Lily Potter		Pearl Danderfluff 
Rubeus Hagrid		Fard Danderfluff of Willowbottom 
Gregory Goyle		Minto Danderfluff of Willowbottom 
Bartemius Crouch	Moro Frumblefoot of Bywater 
Blaise Zabini (m)	Togo Frumblefoot of Bywater 
Blaise Zabini (f)	Polly Frumblefoot of Bywater 
Gilderoy Lockhart	Minto Goodbody of Frogmorton 
Ron Weasley		Marroc Grubb 
Fred Weasley		Drogo Grubb 
George Weasley		Ponto Grubb 
Percy Weasley		Lardo Grubb 
Ginny Weasley		Cora Grubb
Charlie Weasley		Grigory Grubb
Bill Weasley		Todo Grubb
Molly Weasley		Lila Grubb
Arthur Weasley		Bulbo Grubb
Seamus Finnegan		Longo Hardbottle 
Minerva McGonagall	Primula Hamwich of Buckleberry Fern 
Stan Shunpike		Mungo Maggot of Loamsdown 
Severus Snape		Longo Maggot of Loamsdown 
Oliver Wood		Orgulas Maggot of Loamsdown 
Vernon Dursley		Todo Millstone of Bywater 
Petunia Dursley		Flora Millstone of Bywater 
Dudley Dursley		Lotho Millstone of Bywater 
Cedric Diggory		Fard Millstone of Bywater 
Amos Diggory		Mungo Millstone of Bywater 
Viktor Krum		Falco Overhill of Nobottle 
Sirius Black		Longo Proudfoot 
Parvati Patil		Beryl Sandydowns 
Padma Patil		Flora Sandydowns 
Pansy Parkinson		Zelda Sandydowns 
Hermione Granger	Sweetpea Toadfoot of Frogmorton 
Fleur Delacour		Molly Took of Great Smials 
Ludo Bagman		Sancho Gamgee-Took of Bywater 
Lavender Brown		Marigold Gamgee-Took of Bywater 


Best regards
Christian Stub?
(now this should up my obsession rate a bit!)




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Mon Jun  4 22:00:32 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (Parker Brown Nesbit)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 18:00:32 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Find your Hobbit name
Message-ID: <F15eJjt8gsVWDKpzxDP00021006@hotmail.com>




>From: Amber <reanna20 at yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Find your Hobbit name
>Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 12:47:51 -0700 (PDT)
>

I tried it and it wouldn't work for me.  Do you think they think Parker is a 
male's name? <g>

Peace & Plenty,

Parker


'...I can teach you how to bottle fame, brew glory, even stopper death...'  
Severus Snape, Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone

'...I have not been helping Sirius get into the castle and I certainly don't 
want Harry dead.'  An odd shiver passed over his face. 'But I won't deny 
that I am a werewolf.'  Remus Lupin, Harry Potter and the Prisoner of 
Azkaban

'But I'm also--I don't know if anyone ever told you--I'm your godfather.'  
Sirius Black, Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban

_________________________________________________________________
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org  Mon Jun  4 22:54:30 2001
From: aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org (Meredith Wilson)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 15:54:30 -0700 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Find your Hobbit name & Happy B-Day Mec ki
Message-ID: <D8085AFE4BC7D4119EA00090271EDF1503C1D3@MAILSRV>

I ended up with Melilot Loamsdown of Deephallow.  Sent it on to some friends
and ended up with a few Loamsdowns of Deephallow cousins!
 
Meredith

-----Original Message-----
From: Kristin [mailto:Alyeskakc at aol.com]
Sent: Monday, June 04, 2001 2:45 PM
To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Find your Hobbit name & Happy B-Day Mecki


Hi all, 

  My Hobbit name is Esmerelda Cotton of Overhill. I guess I fared 
better than Jameison and Neil. 

BTW Happy belated Birthday Mecki. Hope it was a good one.

Cheers, 
        Kristin 

       or 
  Esmerelda Cotton of Overhill



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From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Mon Jun  4 23:29:59 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 23:29:59 
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
Message-ID: <F85apelViVKn9kdfCes00013b1f@hotmail.com>

Simon wrote:

>Has fanfic run out of possible ideas? Or are there still different
>possibilities that have yet to be explored?
>

What a question, Simon!  *Definitely* the latter.

I've had ideas for fanfics I'd like to see written ever since I learned 
there was such a thing as HP fanfiction... in all the broad fandom 
categories:  MWPP, AU, post-Hogwarts, you name it.  Just check the PoU list 
archives from Summer 2000 for my musings:  "I wish I could read a fanfic 
about..."  In fact, if anyone wants to write a fanfic and just doesn't have 
any ideas, *e-mail me*.  Among the plot bunnies I have floating about are a 
couple for Sirius and Snape (an espionage-type gen deal--I stink at writing 
mystery), an action-adventure kidfic for Harry and Friends in an AU Year 1, 
and one centered wholly around Hagrid and Maxime written in an almost 
picture-book format (meaning I'd want companion illustrations).  I have a 
zillion Harry Potter ideas I'd love to get off my hands.  None of them are 
even remotely anything like the fic I'm currently writing.

Why haven't I written them?  They simply are not my stories to tell.  Every 
writer has their own forte, and over the past decade I've noticed a definite 
pattern in my work.  I'd love to *read* the above fics, but I cannot *write* 
them.

Anyone who has been cursed with the label "writer" never suffers from idea 
famine.  As a teacher, I find lessons in all of life... as a writer, I see 
stories absolutely everywhere.

The problem for anyone who writes (and not just fanfic--people who write, 
period) is never a lack of ideas but a lack of time and/or inclination.  
Most professional writers I've worked with say that they have no lack of 
ideas, but certain ones are more pressing than others.  For me that means I 
write snippets of things here and there, just to keep my quill sharp, while 
actively writing the story that *demands* to be written.  Plot, characters, 
settings, and everything else just come gushing out... which is why I think 
that while one can teach the craft of writing, the spark that ignites it has 
to be intrinsic.

To me, the fanfiction that interests me most explores possibilities that JKR 
most likely will not.  That is why I *abhor* snobbery in the HP fanon world 
in all its forms--even the 11 year old writer who misspells every other word 
in her 1 K fic has a place among us.  I don't like everything on ff.net, 
disagree with certain interpretations of canon, and there are certain types 
of fics I find extremely boring... but I have recommended fics I feel are 
nothing to write home about to readers who I know like their cup of tea 
served that way.

The most thrilling thought is that this is just the beginning (unless WB, 
Bloomsbury, or Scholastic shuts us down--right now we have JKR's blessing).  
After Book 5, there'll be an entirely different set of possibilities to 
contemplate.  Same with Book 6--and even when the series is done, there'll 
be fanfics written about what could have happened, or even what *should* 
have happened.

BTW, I am THRILLED to be teaching high school Creative Writing next year. I 
just came from a meeting downtown... my new school was just selected for a 
Pen/Faulkner Writers-in-Residence grant sponsored by Ford Motor Company.  
That means that *six* times next year, a number of *really* famous pro 
novelists will be teaching half-day classes in fiction to my creative 
writing students.  People like Maxine Hong Kingston, Frank McCourt, Amy 
Tan... and the writer confers with the creative writing teacher before and 
afterwards... *faints from happiness*  Just had to share.  I'm so excited 
about this.  It's been a success in D.C. and elsewhere... thank goodness to 
Ford for bringing it to Detroit.

Which begs another question.  How many OT-Chatter members are aspiring 
creative writers?  Narrow is the road that leads to publication, and few are 
they that find it... how has *your* journey been?  Please share your tales 
of triumph and tribulation... both are part of the writer's lot.

I'll save my story for another post, as this is already getting quite long.

--Ebony AKA AngieJ
_________________________________________________________________
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From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 00:10:09 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 17:10:09 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <9fgvnr+mcuo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010605001009.47374.qmail@web13703.mail.yahoo.com>

You certainly chalked it up more than a little bit!
Wow, what a list! You must have had a lot of time on
the old keyboard today! What a fun thing to to do, I
will have to print this out to show my husband and the
boys. We love The Hobbit!  Thank you for giving us
something fun to read out loud tonight!

Wanda the Witch of Revere and Her Merry Band of
Muggles



--- pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward"
> <neilward at d...> wrote:
> > Jamieson said:
> > 
> > > Tee Hee, well my Hobbit name is...are you ready
> for this? I
> > > wasn't....
> > >
> > > Olo Chubb
> > >
> > > lol, I'll try not to be offended...I wonder if
> it's telling
> > > me I need to loose a few pounds...
> > 
> > Hmmm.... I came up as 'Olo Maggot of Loamsdown'
> (strange that,
> > as my real address is on Loampit Hill).  I think
> I'd rather be
> > called Chubb than Maggot!
> > 
> > Neil
> 
> This mean I am not the only "Maggot of Loamsdown",
> then!  But then, 
> Severus Snape, Oliver Wood and Stan Shunpike are all
> "Maggots of 
> Loamsdown" as well (see below).
> 
> Actually, I couldn't get it to take my name as such;
> it apparently 
> has problems with anything else than a-z.  The below
> is what I got 
> for myself, with three different transcriptions of
> my last name.
> 
> Christian Stuboe	Popo Maggot of Loamsdown 
> Christian Stubo		Popo Danderfluff 
> Christian Stube		Popo Maggot of Loamsdown 
> 
> Another things is that I cannot believe that, with
> so many Harry 
> Potter-obsessed people (like myself) on this list,
> that no-one tried 
> to run certain other names through the list. 
> Anyway, here goes:
> 
> 
> Sorted by common names:
> 
> Harry Potter		Minto Danderfluff 
> James Potter		Fosco Danderfluff 
> Lily Potter		Pearl Danderfluff 
> Ron Weasley		Marroc Grubb 
> Fred Weasley		Drogo Grubb 
> George Weasley		Ponto Grubb 
> Percy Weasley		Lardo Grubb 
> Ginny Weasley		Cora Grubb
> Charlie Weasley		Grigory Grubb
> Bill Weasley		Todo Grubb
> Molly Weasley		Lila Grubb
> Arthur Weasley		Bulbo Grubb
> Hermione Granger	Sweetpea Toadfoot of Frogmorton 
> Neville Longbottom	Dimple Chubb-Baggins of Pincup 
> Seamus Finnegan		Longo Hardbottle 
> Dean Thomas		Till Boffin of Needlehole 
> Lee Jordan		Dimple Brandybuck of Buckland 
> Oliver Wood		Orgulas Maggot of Loamsdown 
> Parvati Patil		Beryl Sandydowns 
> Padma Patil		Flora Sandydowns 
> Lavender Brown		Marigold Gamgee-Took of Bywater 
> Sirius Black		Longo Proudfoot 
> Cedric Diggory		Fard Millstone of Bywater 
> Amos Diggory		Mungo Millstone of Bywater 
> Remus Lupin		Fard Brandybuck of Buckland 
> Albus Dumbledore	Mungo Bracegirdle of Hardbottle 
> Minerva McGonagall	Primula Hamwich of Buckleberry
> Fern 
> Sibyl Trelawney		Lobelia Bulge of Great Smials 
> Rubeus Hagrid		Fard Danderfluff of Willowbottom 
> Gilderoy Lockhart	Minto Goodbody of Frogmorton 
> Severus Snape		Longo Maggot of Loamsdown 
> Alastor Moody		Bulbo Bulge of Hobbiton 
> Igor Karkaroff		Griffo Broadbelt of Buckland 
> Bartemius Crouch	Moro Frumblefoot of Bywater 
> Fleur Delacour		Molly Took of Great Smials 
> Viktor Krum		Falco Overhill of Nobottle 
> Ludo Bagman		Sancho Gamgee-Took of Bywater 
> Stan Shunpike		Mungo Maggot of Loamsdown 
> Vernon Dursley		Todo Millstone of Bywater 
> Petunia Dursley		Flora Millstone of Bywater 
> Dudley Dursley		Lotho Millstone of Bywater 
> Piers Polkiss		Milo Boggy-Hillocks 
> Cornelius Fudge		Mungo Bracegirdle of Hardbottle 
> Draco Malfoy		Fastolph Bulge of Hobbiton 
> Vincent Crabbe		Mongo Bumbleroot of Fair Downs 
> Gregory Goyle		Minto Danderfluff of Willowbottom 
> Blaise Zabini (m)	Togo Frumblefoot of Bywater 
> Blaise Zabini (f)	Polly Frumblefoot of Bywater 
> Pansy Parkinson		Zelda Sandydowns 
> Millicent Bulstrode	Autumn Chubb 
> 
> 
> Sorted by hobbit-names (Gamgee-Took listed with
> Took):
> 
> Dean Thomas		Till Boffin of Needlehole 
> Piers Polkiss		Milo Boggy-Hillocks 
> Cornelius Fudge		Mungo Bracegirdle of Hardbottle 
> Albus Dumbledore	Mungo Bracegirdle of Hardbottle 
> Remus Lupin		Fard Brandybuck of Buckland 
> Lee Jordan		Dimple Brandybuck of Buckland 
> Igor Karkaroff		Griffo Broadbelt of Buckland 
> Sibyl Trelawney		Lobelia Bulge of Great Smials 
> Alastor Moody		Bulbo Bulge of Hobbiton 
> Draco Malfoy		Fastolph Bulge of Hobbiton 
> Vincent Crabbe		Mongo Bumbleroot of Fair Downs 
> Millicent Bulstrode	Autumn Chubb 
> Neville Longbottom	Dimple Chubb-Baggins of Pincup 
> Harry Potter		Minto Danderfluff 
> James Potter		Fosco Danderfluff 
> Lily Potter		Pearl Danderfluff 
> Rubeus Hagrid		Fard Danderfluff of Willowbottom 
> Gregory Goyle		Minto Danderfluff of Willowbottom 
> Bartemius Crouch	Moro Frumblefoot of Bywater 
> Blaise Zabini (m)	Togo Frumblefoot of Bywater 
> Blaise Zabini (f)	Polly Frumblefoot of Bywater 
> Gilderoy Lockhart	Minto Goodbody of Frogmorton 
> Ron Weasley		Marroc Grubb 
> Fred Weasley		Drogo Grubb 
> George Weasley		Ponto Grubb 
> Percy Weasley		Lardo Grubb 
> Ginny Weasley		Cora Grubb
> Charlie Weasley		Grigory Grubb
> Bill Weasley		Todo Grubb
> Molly Weasley		Lila Grubb
> Arthur Weasley		Bulbo Grubb
> Seamus Finnegan		Longo Hardbottle 
> Minerva McGonagall	Primula Hamwich of Buckleberry
> Fern 
> Stan Shunpike		Mungo Maggot of Loamsdown 
> Severus Snape		Longo Maggot of Loamsdown 
> Oliver Wood		Orgulas Maggot of Loamsdown 
> Vernon Dursley		Todo Millstone of Bywater 
> Petunia Dursley		Flora Millstone of Bywater 
> Dudley Dursley		Lotho Millstone of Bywater 
> Cedric Diggory		Fard Millstone of Bywater 
> Amos Diggory		Mungo Millstone of Bywater 
> Viktor Krum		Falco Overhill of Nobottle 
> Sirius Black		Longo Proudfoot 
> Parvati Patil		Beryl Sandydowns 
> Padma Patil		Flora Sandydowns 
> Pansy Parkinson		Zelda Sandydowns 
> Hermione Granger	Sweetpea Toadfoot of Frogmorton 
> Fleur Delacour		Molly Took of Great Smials 
> Ludo Bagman		Sancho Gamgee-Took of Bywater 
> Lavender Brown		Marigold Gamgee-Took of Bywater 
> 
> 
> Best regards
> Christian Stub
> (now this should up my obsession rate a bit!)
> 
> 


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From aichambaye at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 00:14:38 2001
From: aichambaye at yahoo.com (aichambaye at yahoo.com)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 00:14:38 -0000
Subject: Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <20010605001009.47374.qmail@web13703.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9fh89e+jlje@eGroups.com>

I'm Prisca Broadbelt of Buckland - And I don't think it's half bad! 
Prisca is nice, actually.

Christian - THANKS for the HP Hobbit names, I got a big kick out of 
them.

Heather M., leaving tomorrow on a jet plane for Brussels.






From ender_w at msn.com  Tue Jun  5 00:31:35 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 20:31:35 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
References: <F85apelViVKn9kdfCes00013b1f@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <008b01c0ed56$e13b3ca0$ebe8183f@satellite>

Hi, Ebony and everyone else,
I agree totally with what you said.  I'm a writer and sometimes the ideas crowd my head so much I can't bear it.  I want to write every idea that crosses my mind and I can't.  not only don't I have time, but I have chronic illnesses that limit my energy.
The program at your school sounds very impressive.  I'm jealous.  I teach at a private school for children with dyslexia.  My mom and I (both of us are writers, though she's had a bit more professional success), teach writing at the school.
I'm in the process of writing some HP fanfic as well as a fanfic for Susan Cooper's the Dark is Rising Series.  I also wrote an X-Files fanfic some years ago that was published in an amateur fanzine.
As far as original work goes, I've been working on two screenplays.  One is nearly finished and the other is in the beginning stages.  Outside of that, most of my original writing is usually done only for the benefit of my students.

ender
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Ebony Elizabeth Thomas 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Monday, June 04, 2001 11:29 PM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)


  Simon wrote:

  >Has fanfic run out of possible ideas? Or are there still different
  >possibilities that have yet to be explored?
  >

  What a question, Simon!  *Definitely* the latter.

  I've had ideas for fanfics I'd like to see written ever since I learned 
  there was such a thing as HP fanfiction... in all the broad fandom 
  categories:  MWPP, AU, post-Hogwarts, you name it.  Just check the PoU list 
  archives from Summer 2000 for my musings:  "I wish I could read a fanfic 
  about..."  In fact, if anyone wants to write a fanfic and just doesn't have 
  any ideas, *e-mail me*.  Among the plot bunnies I have floating about are a 
  couple for Sirius and Snape (an espionage-type gen deal--I stink at writing 
  mystery), an action-adventure kidfic for Harry and Friends in an AU Year 1, 
  and one centered wholly around Hagrid and Maxime written in an almost 
  picture-book format (meaning I'd want companion illustrations).  I have a 
  zillion Harry Potter ideas I'd love to get off my hands.  None of them are 
  even remotely anything like the fic I'm currently writing.

  Why haven't I written them?  They simply are not my stories to tell.  Every 
  writer has their own forte, and over the past decade I've noticed a definite 
  pattern in my work.  I'd love to *read* the above fics, but I cannot *write* 
  them.

  Anyone who has been cursed with the label "writer" never suffers from idea 
  famine.  As a teacher, I find lessons in all of life... as a writer, I see 
  stories absolutely everywhere.

  The problem for anyone who writes (and not just fanfic--people who write, 
  period) is never a lack of ideas but a lack of time and/or inclination.  
  Most professional writers I've worked with say that they have no lack of 
  ideas, but certain ones are more pressing than others.  For me that means I 
  write snippets of things here and there, just to keep my quill sharp, while 
  actively writing the story that *demands* to be written.  Plot, characters, 
  settings, and everything else just come gushing out... which is why I think 
  that while one can teach the craft of writing, the spark that ignites it has 
  to be intrinsic.

  To me, the fanfiction that interests me most explores possibilities that JKR 
  most likely will not.  That is why I *abhor* snobbery in the HP fanon world 
  in all its forms--even the 11 year old writer who misspells every other word 
  in her 1 K fic has a place among us.  I don't like everything on ff.net, 
  disagree with certain interpretations of canon, and there are certain types 
  of fics I find extremely boring... but I have recommended fics I feel are 
  nothing to write home about to readers who I know like their cup of tea 
  served that way.

  The most thrilling thought is that this is just the beginning (unless WB, 
  Bloomsbury, or Scholastic shuts us down--right now we have JKR's blessing).  
  After Book 5, there'll be an entirely different set of possibilities to 
  contemplate.  Same with Book 6--and even when the series is done, there'll 
  be fanfics written about what could have happened, or even what *should* 
  have happened.

  BTW, I am THRILLED to be teaching high school Creative Writing next year. I 
  just came from a meeting downtown... my new school was just selected for a 
  Pen/Faulkner Writers-in-Residence grant sponsored by Ford Motor Company.  
  That means that *six* times next year, a number of *really* famous pro 
  novelists will be teaching half-day classes in fiction to my creative 
  writing students.  People like Maxine Hong Kingston, Frank McCourt, Amy 
  Tan... and the writer confers with the creative writing teacher before and 
  afterwards... *faints from happiness*  Just had to share.  I'm so excited 
  about this.  It's been a success in D.C. and elsewhere... thank goodness to 
  Ford for bringing it to Detroit.

  Which begs another question.  How many OT-Chatter members are aspiring 
  creative writers?  Narrow is the road that leads to publication, and few are 
  they that find it... how has *your* journey been?  Please share your tales 
  of triumph and tribulation... both are part of the writer's lot.

  I'll save my story for another post, as this is already getting quite long.

  --Ebony AKA AngieJ
  _________________________________________________________________
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From find_sam at hotmail.com  Tue Jun  5 00:40:35 2001
From: find_sam at hotmail.com (find_sam at hotmail.com)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 00:40:35 -0000
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process...
In-Reply-To: <F85apelViVKn9kdfCes00013b1f@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9fh9q3+3qn9@eGroups.com>

Ebony Elizabeth Thomas wrote: A very thought provoking post, as usual!

> Anyone who has been cursed with the label "writer" never suffers 
> from idea famine.  (snip) as a writer, I see stories absolutely 
> everywhere.

Ah, yes. This can be both a blessing and a curse, though! I find 
story ideas almost everywhere I look. Not just ideas for plots, 
either - but ideas about the way characters interact with each other, 
the way things should look, etc. An interesting game (well, 
interesting for me, anyway <g>) I play with myself during dull 
lectures consists of me absent mindedly describing the lecture hall, 
the lecturer, etc. Most of the time I don't even do it consciously - 
it's halfway through the game I realise I'm doing it.

> The problem for anyone who writes (and not just fanfic--people who 
> write, period) is never a lack of ideas but a lack of time and/or 
> inclination. 

Definitely true. I'm writing a fic at the moment (not fanfic, but an 
original), and I found that when I was plotting it I actually had to 
ditch ideas simply because I couldn't wrangle them into the plot. In 
this way, having a fertile mind is also a curse, because I hate to 
waste a good plot turn or something of that sort.

> Plot, characters, settings, and everything else just come gushing
> out... which is why I think that while one can teach the craft of
> writing, the spark that ignites it has to be intrinsic.

Are you saying that you have to *want* to write if you want to write? 
In my somewhat limited obeservations, I think that many people can 
write reasonably well if they commit themselves to it. I remember 
last year I read a very wide selection of 'answers' to the Creative 
Writing section of an exam, and most of them were original and 
entertaining. But whilst most of the candidates *could* write, most 
of them wouldn't spend much of their spare time doing it. 
It's simply not a part of them. Personally I think that skill is the 
most important aspect of being a writer, but the skill is wasted if 
you don't have the determination to write and the willingness to keep 
writing. </ramble>

> Which begs another question.  How many OT-Chatter members are
> aspiring creative writers?  Narrow is the road that leads to
> publication, and few are they that find it... how has *your*
> journey been?  Please share your tales of triumph and 
> tribulation... both are part of the writer's lot.

I would love to be a published author some day, even if the only 
people who read my books are my friends and family! I haven't had 
anything published, though, owing almost entirely to my youth (or 
maybe it's just because I'm not as good as I think I am <g>). I have 
self-published some of my stuff on ff.net, and it's certainly a 
novelty to see it on the Net!

Sam, who's never found any of the 'How To Write' books very good.

PS: Ebony, I love the idea about the illustrated book about Hagrid 
and Madam Maxime. Is there any illustrated HP fanfiction anyone knows 
about?




From klaatu at primenet.com  Tue Jun  5 00:52:11 2001
From: klaatu at primenet.com (Sister Mary Lunatic)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 17:52:11 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <002001c0ed32$53dcc960$963570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <MABBJPGEHBDBAKHGIBPOOEMDDMAA.klaatu@primenet.com>

How come I came out as boring "Lily Toadfoot" (of nowhere in particular) and
my sister (using her married name) came out as "Rosie-Posie Deepdelver of
Brockenborings" -- I protest the fiendish programming that pegs me
(accurately, I admit) as of lackluster fame and achievement. LOL!  I love
these websites.

SML




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Tue Jun  5 01:21:26 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 01:21:26 -0000
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
In-Reply-To: <F85apelViVKn9kdfCes00013b1f@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9fhc6m+3jhe@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Ebony Elizabeth Thomas" <ebonyink at h...> 
wrote: 

A very thought-provoking post (as usual)!

I started writing poetry at 5.  It was a parody of a Beatles song, 
called 'Oh, Help, Baby, Baby, Give Me Back My Liver'.  

I wrote my first serious poem at 7, after my sister was still-born, 
and progressed to plays, short stories, and the Great English Novel 
(I know I'm American--it was an accident of birth).  I also write 
lyrics. I am published (The Jesse Stuart Creative Writing Workshop) 
In fact, I'd never *not* been able to write, until 9 years ago & a 
depression that lasted until I discovered fanfiction.
I was searching for stuff to read to tide me over until the next 
installments of all my favourites, found some *horrid* fic (probably 
written by 11 year olds), and I mentally told myself that I could 
write better than that.  And I started writing again & now I can't 
stop.

I carry notebooks around with me everywhere.  If I see something that 
intrigues me, or get an idea, I write it down.  Right then and there. 
(those memo thingys would work the same way--please don't write and 
drive!) That way, I don't forget ideas.  
> 
> BTW, I am THRILLED to be teaching high school Creative Writing next 
year. I 
> just came from a meeting downtown... my new school was just 
selected for a 
> Pen/Faulkner Writers-in-Residence grant sponsored by Ford Motor 
Company.  
> That means that *six* times next year, a number of *really* famous 
pro 
> novelists will be teaching half-day classes in fiction to my 
creative 
> writing students.  People like Maxine Hong Kingston, Frank McCourt, 
Amy 
> Tan... and the writer confers with the creative writing teacher 
before and 
> afterwards... *faints from happiness*  Just had to share.  I'm so 
excited 
> about this.  It's been a success in D.C. and elsewhere... thank 
goodness to 
> Ford for bringing it to Detroit.

Oh, Ebony, I'm *so* envious!  What a wonderful chance to rub elbows 
with some of the best. (Not that I've ever read their works--just 
noticed them on the bestseller lists)  I've been in that situation 
before & have found it very stimulating.  It's been my experience 
that *most* famous writers are really nice, down to earth, and 
incredibly supportive.  

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker
> 
> > --Ebony AKA AngieJ
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Tue Jun  5 01:24:35 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 01:24:35 -0000
Subject: Hobbit Names
Message-ID: <9fhccj+qe8r@eGroups.com>

I'm Wisteria Goodbody of Frogmorton.

Hmm.  Definitely *not* me at all, although I do love Wisteria.  
:Wonders if she should now try the *male* names:

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker




From msmacgoo at one.net.au  Tue Jun  5 03:10:34 2001
From: msmacgoo at one.net.au (Snuffles MacGoo)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 03:10:34 -0000
Subject: Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <002001c0ed32$53dcc960$963570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9fhija+ikmj@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> Jamieson said:
> 
> > Tee Hee, well my Hobbit name is...are you ready for this? I 
wasn't....
> >
> > Olo Chubb
> >
> > lol, I'll try not to be offended...I wonder if it's telling me I 
need to
> > loose a few pounds...
> 
> Hmmm.... I came up as 'Olo Maggot of Loamsdown' (strange that, as 
my real
> address is on Loampit Hill).  I think I'd rather be called Chubb 
than
> Maggot!
> 
> Neil

well I'm having a hell of a day and I don't know that being 'Camellia 
Maggot of Loamsdown' is going to improve it :-) 

camellia (aka Storm, maybe Camellia is better <g>)




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Tue Jun  5 03:18:57 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 03:18:57 -0000
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
In-Reply-To: <F85apelViVKn9kdfCes00013b1f@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9fhj31+igti@eGroups.com>

--Wonderful post Ebony! I completely agree about writing; I've always 
desperately wanted to be a writer, but I just can't seem to weave 
stories like so many of you can.

I wish that I had the option of taking a creative writing class, but 
I don't. There's interest among teachers and a few students, but only 
a few. I hope that once again one is put into place in our school 
system, but I'll be gone by then. I've never learned to plot or craft 
my words. It's not pushed in our schools. Heaven help you if you 
can't right good comparative analysis or essays though. And don't get 
me wrong they're important, but not nearly as hard a craft as good 
fiction. My English teacher and I would debate this, and usually I 
would win, characterisation *is* harder than supporting a thesis IMO.

The first series of chapter books I ever remember reading were the 
Boxcar Children. Does anyone remember those. I would constantly be 
thinking up fanfiction though at the time I had no idea that's what 
it was. I would be sitting in math class or in the hall on the way to 
lunch, but in my mind I would be traveling to some exotic country and 
solving mysteries, untangling enigmas with these fictional characters 
that I'd taken under my wing and allowed to blossom into with life in 
my mind.

My friends and I would pretend we were animals in the jungles of 
Africa, that we were teachers, or the owners of a multi-national 
banking corporation. We would be a family surving the harsh life of 
the prairie, or orphaned children put out of our homes by fire, 
trying to survive on the street. I have a wonderful imagination, and 
I prize right up there with my family, my friends, my health...  

Oh sure I have so many ideas that my mind is constantly swimming, but 
there they stay.  

I want to share the stories that are swiming before my eyes; the 
memories that just won't go away. I want to tell the story of the 
lonely little girl in the New York theatre, all alone in her private 
box, and leaning over waving at the crowd. To craft her privledged 
existence; see if she can face tragedy, and dare her to survive.

I want to reach into the violinist on the side of the street, the 
acrobat, the simple beggar, and make people understand why they're 
there. I want to see them as more than someone asking for money; to 
feel their soulful music. I want to experience it, and to share the 
joy and the tears with others.

I want the world to walk down a wet Florentine street with me, and 
coming upon the square, rounding the corner, hear the lucid music of 
the clanging bells in the Campanile and duck past the rain washed 
marble facade of the breath-taking Duomo. 

I want their hearts to hang in suspension as a loved one literally 
falls out from under them. Flying over the cold concrete stairs and 
landing with a crack on the cold concrete floor. Have their hearts 
pound as they climb into a New York ambulance, afraid for my 
grandmother's life. Spending an afternoon in a dirty hospital in a 
rather seedy section of the city, transporting to larger hospital for 
the night, the priest blessing her. The cold and lonely night and 
splashing through puddles of standing water in the dark in Central 
Park. Realising she's ok.

In my wildest dreams they would connect with my most treasured 
experiences. Sneezing as a friend dabs stage make-up thickly over my 
eyes. Taking deep breaths as I wait for my cue. Hitting each note 
with perfect tone, quality, and depth as I smile at the actors and 
actresses around me. The standing ovation, the glory, the pride.

The simple pleasures of a good book, a quiet afternoon, and a little 
music. The joys of laughing, and crying, with friends.

I could go on and on ad infinitum but I'm sure you've had quite 
enough. What I'm trying to say is that for all the ideas, 
experiences, thoughts, and joys, that I possess there are words but 
not context. There's no story, just a regular life. How can I make my 
life something worth reading about. How do I encorporate it with my 
dreams, and my *very* active imagination? That's what I hope to find 
out some day. That's why I dreamed of being a writer as a kid, and 
it's why that hope still glimmers as I grow older and find more and 
more responsibility and expectation on my shoulders.


Hmmm this seems a *really* pointless post, and I could just hit 
delete, but for some reason I'm going to post it anyway. Hope I 
didn't bore you.

Scott




 




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 05:00:44 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 22:00:44 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <MABBJPGEHBDBAKHGIBPOOEMDDMAA.klaatu@primenet.com>
Message-ID: <20010605050044.19695.qmail@web14602.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Sister Mary Lunatic <klaatu at primenet.com> wrote:
> How come I came out as boring "Lily Toadfoot" (of
> nowhere in particular) and
> my sister (using her married name) came out as
> "Rosie-Posie Deepdelver of
> Brockenborings" -- I protest the fiendish
> programming that pegs me
> (accurately, I admit) as of lackluster fame and
> achievement. LOL!  I love
> these websites.
> 
> SML

If I use my current name, I'm plain Lobelia Chubb.
If I use my maiden name, I'm Lobelia Underhill of
Frogmorton - much better (I'm with Jamieson on the
'Chubb', is someone trying to tell me something?).
If I were to take Andy's name, I would be Lobelia
Grubb of Little Delving.
Hmmmm... tough choice. Well, anything but 'Chubb'.

Sheryll, who also loves this kind of site

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
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From kiary91 at hotmail.com  Tue Jun  5 05:40:43 2001
From: kiary91 at hotmail.com (Cait Hunter)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 05:40:43 -0000
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Find your Hobbit name
Message-ID: <F18fyGQmGtjNh258ctl00015cb8@hotmail.com>

Mine was Bramblerose Tighfield of Tookbank, which I quite liked... ^_^
My brother was Lotho Tighfield of Tookbank... Dad was Sancho or Fosco 
(depending on if I used his given name or his name that he uses) Tighfield 
of Tookbank. Mom was Lobelia Hamwich of Buckleberry Fern  with her maiden 
name and Tighfield of TOokbank with our family name.


Bramblerose (Cait) and Ruby (Wenna) and Moro (Bou)


>From: "Neil Ward" <neilward at dircon.co.uk>
>Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Find your Hobbit name
>Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 21:09:56 +0100
>
>Jamieson said:
>
> > Tee Hee, well my Hobbit name is...are you ready for this? I wasn't....
> >
> > Olo Chubb
> >
> > lol, I'll try not to be offended...I wonder if it's telling me I need to
> > loose a few pounds...
>
>Hmmm.... I came up as 'Olo Maggot of Loamsdown' (strange that, as my real
>address is on Loampit Hill).  I think I'd rather be called Chubb than
>Maggot!
>
>Neil
>
>
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 06:10:24 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 06:10:24 -0000
Subject: Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <60B1DF43C7@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <9fht4g+9msb@eGroups.com>

Mine is Iris Proudneck of Longbottom ... I wonder if I am related to 
Neville?

Doreen


--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rachel Bray" <bray.262 at o...> wrote:
> Found this site.  Thought it was cute.  It's to find out what your 
> Hobbit name is.  :-)
> 
> http://www.chriswetherell.com/hobbit/default.asp
> 
> 
> Rachel Bray
> or
> Tigerlily Boffin of Whitfurrows  :-)
> 
> Rachel Bray
> The Ohio State University
> Fees, Deposits and Disbursements
> 
> Oh, the thrill of the chase as I soar through the air
> With the Snitch up ahead and the wind in my hair
> As I draw ever closer, the crowd gives a shout
> But then comes a Bludger and I am knocked out.
> 
> "I don't know who Jim Henson is but I've heard he has his hand in a 
> lot of things around here." - Kermit the Frog, 1972




From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 06:14:31 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 06:14:31 -0000
Subject: Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <002001c0ed32$53dcc960$963570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9fhtc7+9mt8@eGroups.com>

OMG!! That one made me spit tea on the monitor!!! HA HA HA 

Doreen, who is quite content with her Iris Proudneck of Longbottom 

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> Jamieson said:
> 
> > Tee Hee, well my Hobbit name is...are you ready for this? I 
wasn't....
> >
> > Olo Chubb
> >
> > lol, I'll try not to be offended...I wonder if it's telling me I 
need to
> > loose a few pounds...
> 
> Hmmm.... I came up as 'Olo Maggot of Loamsdown' (strange that, as 
my real
> address is on Loampit Hill).  I think I'd rather be called Chubb 
than
> Maggot!
> 
> Neil




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Tue Jun  5 09:45:36 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 09:45:36 -0000
Subject: Hobbit names
Message-ID: <9fi9o0+c670@eGroups.com>

Well, if I use my married name (Coleman), I get Daisy Knotwise of 
Michel Delving, which is pretty cool, but if I use my maiden name, 
I'm Daisy Boggy Hillocks!

I know which one I'll be sticking to!

Catherine




From bohners at pobox.com  Tue Jun  5 12:14:57 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 08:14:57 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Hobbit names
References: <9fi9o0+c670@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <01cc01c0edb9$31cb17a0$b339acce@rebeccab>

> Well, if I use my married name (Coleman), I get Daisy Knotwise of 
> Michel Delving

Goodness, Catherine, you must be my sister-in-law!
--
Lila Burrows
(nee Lila Knotwise of Michel Delving)




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 13:10:26 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 06:10:26 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Find your Hobbit name
In-Reply-To: <9fgvnr+mcuo@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010605131026.44907.qmail@web14507.mail.yahoo.com>


--- pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no wrote:
> Sibyl Trelawney		Lobelia Bulge of Great Smials 
> Fleur Delacour		Molly Took of Great Smials 

Darnit! Why am I living in the same place as Sibyl and Fleur? And why
do Sibyl and I have the *exact* same name? Bleh, I want different HP
characters living in my home! I want a new name!

Let me tell you if Fleur and me lived in the same town, one of us would
probably have to leave. And I'm convinced *I* would be the one to boot
her out. "Zee leetle boy." Double bleh! Hit the streets sister...

If you can't tell, I'm not overly fond of Miss Fleur Delacour.

~Amber
(Who's pouting a bit right now...)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 13:18:54 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 06:18:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Inspirational writing books...
In-Reply-To: <9fh9q3+3qn9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010605131854.47418.qmail@web14507.mail.yahoo.com>


--- find_sam at hotmail.com wrote:
> Sam, who's never found any of the 'How To Write' books very good.

<grin> Ah, you shouldn't have said that! Now you get to hear my
recommendations!

I have two "writing" books that *never fail* to get my fingers itching
for a pencil or keyboard. The first is called "Zen in the Art of
Writing" by the illustrious Ray Bradbury. It's a relatively short book,
frequently hilarious, and tremendously uplifting. It's less of a book
on How To Write and more of an inspirational "get your butt in the seat
and do it". And trust me, you will want to run to your computer/notepad
and frantically write!

The second is an older book and from what I can tell, a classic. It's
called "Becoming a Writer" and its by Dorothea Brande. It was published
in the 20's or 30's I think. The language is a bit antiquated (she
actually refers to "moving pictures" at one point) but the concepts are
solid. She explains the temperment of a writer, why writers don't
write, and a believable regimen to at least start on the path to
writerhood. It gave me a bit of insight into my methods at least.

Try them out. The very worst that could happen is that you loathe the
books and fling ripe tomatoes at me. (Actually, that's not so bad for
you and pretty awful for me...)

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 13:45:49 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 06:45:49 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
In-Reply-To: <F85apelViVKn9kdfCes00013b1f@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <20010605134549.64018.qmail@web14502.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Ebony Elizabeth Thomas <ebonyink at hotmail.com> wrote:
> BTW, I am THRILLED to be teaching high school Creative Writing next
> year. I just came from a meeting downtown... my new school was just
> selected for a Pen/Faulkner Writers-in-Residence grant sponsored by
> Ford Motor Company. That means that *six* times next year, a number
> of *really* famous pro novelists will be teaching half-day classes in
> fiction to my creative writing students.  People like Maxine Hong
> Kingston, Frank McCourt, Amy Tan... and the writer confers with the
> creative writing teacher before and afterwards... *faints from
> happiness*  

Bah, where was this when I was in high school? Ebony, this sounds like
a wonderful program and I am green with jealousy (actually
emerald...the same color as Harry's eyes). Although, I was thrown to
see the words "thrilled to be teaching high school" in a sentence. My
mom had some *horrendous* experiences teaching grades 9-12. Thank god
she's teaching elementary right now. But with Creative Writing, you
should be teaching students who *want* to learn. Anyways, much luck
with that; tell us how it goes!  

> Which begs another question.  How many OT-Chatter members are
> aspiring creative writers?  Narrow is the road that leads to
> publication, and few are they that find it... how has *your* journey
> been?  Please share your tales of triumph and tribulation... both are
> part of the writer's lot.

I am and I'm not. I blow hot and cold about this issue. At times I'm
certain that I won't ever get anything published because I don't have
anything creative or original in me, just regurgitation. Other times I
think I might get one piece published, a piece that manages to hold my
pure voice. I have no desire to be a professional writer, though. I'd
rather write exactly what I want to and not satisfy the desires of a
market. Which means my chances are practically nil.

My journey has been a very lonely, bumpy road. Right now I'm writing
more than I have ever in my life because I'm out of school. It's great,
but I would trade one of my toes at the very least for a Real Life
Writing Group to be a part of. Feedback is the most precious and
helpful thing to any writer and live useful feedback is doubly
precious.

No successes in getting anything published. Unless you count a horribly
written poem that got published in a struggling poetry magazine. I
shudder every time I look at it. I submitted some truly trite fantasy
stories to the Marion Zimmer Bradley Fantasy Magazine (not being
published anymore since MZB died) which recieved some polite
rejections. Until she passed away, my goal was to have something
published in her mag. Alas, now that's a goal that will never see
fruitation.

Gah, listen to me babble like a brook. Just smack me, I'll take the
hint and clam up.

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 14:42:03 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 14:42:03 -0000
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
In-Reply-To: <9fhj31+igti@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fir3r+jmer@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Scott" <insanus_scottus at y...> wrote:
> I could go on and on ad infinitum but I'm sure you've had quite 
> enough. What I'm trying to say is that for all the ideas, 
> experiences, thoughts, and joys, that I possess there are words but 
> not context. There's no story, just a regular life. How can I make
> my life something worth reading about. How do I encorporate it with
> my dreams, and my *very* active imagination? That's what I hope to
> find out some day. That's why I dreamed of being a writer as a kid,
> and it's why that hope still glimmers as I grow older and find more
> and more responsibility and expectation on my shoulders.

I don't know if you're truly asking for advice, but I'll throw some 
your way. Write all your thoughts, memories, experiences in a journal 
of sorts. Doesn't have to make sense, but make sure you write the 
feelings, words down. Maybe not now but someday you might discover a 
character and a plot that takes your brain by storm. You can 
incorporate those past thoughts into the personality of your 
character.

Stories are made up of regular life, in my opinion. Injecting your 
view on things makes the characters more real and identifiable.

> Hmmm this seems a *really* pointless post, and I could just hit 
> delete, but for some reason I'm going to post it anyway. Hope I 
> didn't bore you.

No, Scott, it was a wonderfully romantic post. I sighed in all the 
right places (especially the ones mentioning the theatre - there's 
nothing like the theatre). It was a tremendous pleasure to read.

~Amber





From jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu  Tue Jun  5 15:12:22 2001
From: jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu (Jen Faulkner)
Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 11:12:22 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: moving pictures (was Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Inspirational writing books...)
In-Reply-To: <20010605131854.47418.qmail@web14507.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106051059400.16870-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>

On Tue, 5 Jun 2001, Amber wrote:

> in the 20's or 30's I think. The language is a bit antiquated (she
> actually refers to "moving pictures" at one point) but the concepts are
> solid. 

Amber, I couldn't help giggling when I read this part, 'cause it
reminded me of a Latin textbook we used in high school that was
published in the 30s or 40s (the school board didn't believe in buying
new Latin books, since "the language hadn't changed").  Under one
illustration of Romans at the baths, it had the caption: "The ancient
Romans went to the baths for entertainment, much as we today go to the
moving pictures."

Our class found that rather amusing. *g*

(<rant>And Latin may not have changed since 1940, but Latin pedagogy
certainly has.  We didn't always even have enough copies of the books,
and in some cases we were using photocopies of texts that my teacher had
typed herself.  But luckily our math and science books were new at least
every other year, you know, to keep up with the exciting new fields of
high school math and science.  Grrr.</rant>)

--jen, hoping to go to the moving pictures today (Moulin Rouge!) :)


"Will you be the one I've wanted, will you read my mind?
Will you ask me where I hurt, and heal me with your eyes?"
			--melissa ferrick

jen's fics: http://www.eden.rutgers.edu/~jfaulkne/
jen's LJ: http://www.livejournal.com/users/lysimache/





From bray.262 at osu.edu  Tue Jun  5 12:26:18 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 12:26:18 EST5EDT
Subject: *sniff*  No relatives...no neighbors....
Message-ID: <7603945017@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

I'm so LONELY in my Hobbit world!  I can't believe there hasn't 
been any Boffins or folk from Whitfurrows.  :-(  But I've loved seeing 
all the different names.  Glad I passed the link to the list and 
everyone has enjoyed it.

Saw Moulin Rouge last night.....and I'm seeing it again tonight after 
work.  EXCELLENT!  AWESOME!  WONDERFUL!  THRILLING! 
BEAUTIFUL!  HILARIOUS!  EYE CANDY!  TOE-TAPPING!  WOW! 
....um....RADICAL!....er....NEAT!

Ok, I'm running out of words.  But you get the idea.  Ewan is 
fantastic....total babe.  Beautiful voice, too.  And the Like A Virgin 
part had me crying, I was laughing so hard.

Anyway, enough of my gush because I'm sure someone will go see 
it and say "Um...no...actually, it sucked."  :-)  Oh well.



Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

Oh, the thrill of the chase as I soar through the air
With the Snitch up ahead and the wind in my hair
As I draw ever closer, the crowd gives a shout
But then comes a Bludger and I am knocked out.

"I don't know who Jim Henson is but I've heard he has his hand in a 
lot of things around here." - Kermit the Frog, 1972



From heidit at netbox.com  Tue Jun  5 16:26:50 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 12:26:50 -0400 
Subject: some people want to fill the world with silly love songs!
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F917D@miaexch1>

 

Anyway, enough of my gush because I'm sure someone will go see 
it and say "Um...no...actually, it sucked."  :-)  Oh well.  

 
Yes, actually, that's what my husband said. he really really hated it. He
wanted to walk out 10 minutes into it, and left for a few minutes during the
Like A Virgin scene. He thinks it's worse than anything I've ever made him
see, and I've made him see *both* Xanadu and Girls Just Wanna Have Fun
(which did stay a future oscar winner, but was still pretty lame).
He couldn't take the anachronistic use of the music, and thought the
dialogue from the songs was silly and didn't like the camera technique. He
did, however, appreciate the sets.
I admit, though that the facial similarities between the Duke and David
Spade were occasionally off-putting, and I did think that 
a
n
d
y
o
u
c
a
n
t
e
l
l
e
v
e
r
y
b
o
d
y
in the final scene in the Moulin Rouge, Ewan should've whipped out his
lightsaber and layed seige to all who ever hurt his Satine :) I really
almost expected it - or at least a wink & nod to it. Was I asking for too
much?



From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Tue Jun  5 17:00:15 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 13:00:15 -0400
Subject: Hobbit Website
Message-ID: <3B1D101E.7B081E35@sympatico.ca>

Hello All,

Would anyone be able to give me the webiste for finding your Hobbit
name? I want to send the url to my Mum...I think she would get a kick
out of it...

Thanx
Hugs to all
Jamieson

--
"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams





From joannec at hwy.com.au  Tue Jun  5 09:46:54 2001
From: joannec at hwy.com.au (Joanne Collins)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 19:46:54 +1000
Subject: LOTR movies
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010605194654.007e6c70@mail.hwy.com.au>

Rebecca wrote:

>Frodo's not that young -- about the human equivalent of thirty -- but
>Hobbits look younger than they are (people often mistake them for children)
>so it's not an issue.

Sounds about right to me, then.

>No, Legolas is played by Orlando Bloom.  

Ah, a friend of mine mentioned him the other day, said he was cute *g*.

>Viggo Mortensen plays Aragorn (a
>man, not an elf), 

I can't wait to see him in this movie. I have only recently discovered him
as an actor, and I really think he's very good.

>Sean Bean plays Boromir (also a man), 

Sounds interesting.

>and Hugo Weaving
>plays Elrond, who is half-elf, half-human.

Ah, a mixed breed, as they say.

>I think they almost made the elves *too* macho, myself.  I imagined them
>being thinner, with finer (though certainly not feminine or "cute")
>features... ah, well.  I'll wait and see.

Well, if Hugo were an elf, I'd wonder...my favourite movie of his is
Priscilla, Queen Of The Desert.

>> There's a Harry in LOTR?
>
>*chuckle*  No.  That should have been Frodo.

I see *g*.

>Not quite true.  Arwen is mentioned more than once in the trilogy and even
>appears briefly "on screen" as it were, but her role is quite tiny.  

Ah, I see.

The
>appendix to which Liv is referring is the story of Aragorn and Arwen, which
>apparently is being worked into the main plot to give Arwen more screen
>time.

That's what the interview I just read with her said.

>I have no idea whether Liv Tyler can act, not having seen her in >anything,

I think she can, and very well, but I'm prejudiced because I like her
anyway. If you're looking for something that she has been in, I really like
her in Inventing The Abbotts. I like her in Armageddon too, but a lot of
people aren't into the action thing, though I think there's more to it.

>but she is very lovely and perhaps the most truly elf-like actress in the
>film.  

Yes, I would agree with that, she is rather elfin. That is a good thing.

>The pictures I've seen of Cate Blanchet as Galadriel don't quite work
>for me -- she reminds me too much of Buttercup in THE PRINCESS BRIDE.

Cate doesn't quite strike me as the elfin type, but the two movies I've
seen her in didn't really give one an idea (The Talented Mr Ripley, in
which she doesn't have a large role, and The Gift).

>However, it's hard to get a good picture of a character just from still
>photographs, and she might be just fine on film.

That's true.

Amy Z wrote:
>
>Frodo is 33 (hmm, never picked up on the Jesus connection before).  

Intriguing...

>Hobbits don't live much longer than humans--Bilbo is unusual in 
>reaching "eleventy-one," 111--so even if they look childlike, Elijah 
>Wood seems pretty young.

Hmmmm, perhaps.

>Now, I think Alan Rickman is perfect, but I mean PERFECT, for Snape, 
>and he's 20+ years too old, so I am far from consistent on this issue. 

I think we can all be inconsistent on these things. There are a couple of
my favourite actors making movies based on books I've read, and in both
cases I'm not sure I see it.

> If the kid can act, and I haven't seen him in anything since he was 
>about 10 so I don't know, then great and I won't complain.  Heck, I'm 
>bordering on ecstatic about Daniel Radcliffe and he doesn't look a 
>thing like Harry.

I've never seen him in anything that I remember, but I've heard good things
about him.

>very happy about Ian Holm, who definitely isn't 111

When I first read this, I thought the 111 was ill.

Joanne.

-- 

Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty
years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the
Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's
not a threat. Now, that's a fact. I'll fuckin' kill you. Chuckie (Ben
Affleck) Good Will Hunting





From tmayor at mediaone.net  Tue Jun  5 18:22:37 2001
From: tmayor at mediaone.net (Rosmerta)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 18:22:37 -0000
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
In-Reply-To: <F85apelViVKn9kdfCes00013b1f@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9fj81d+5itu@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Ebony Elizabeth Thomas" <ebonyink at h...> 
wrote:
> BTW, I am THRILLED to be teaching high school Creative Writing next 
year. I 
> just came from a meeting downtown... my new school was just 
selected for a 
> Pen/Faulkner Writers-in-Residence grant...

Ebony, you're a lucky girl. I'm familiar with this program (mostly 
through reading Poets & Writers) and it's supposed to be fantastic.

 
> Which begs another question.  How many OT-Chatter members are 
aspiring creative writers?  

Eh. Sore spot. I've known since I was about 12 that I wanted to write 
fiction, but now I'm not so sure. I *did* write an essay about not-
writing, and I got that published on Salon awhile ago. Is that what 
they mean by "meta-fiction"--writing about not writing? <g> 

~Rosmerta




From rja.carnegie at excite.com  Tue Jun  5 20:24:58 2001
From: rja.carnegie at excite.com (rja.carnegie at excite.com)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 20:24:58 -0000
Subject: Hay on Wye
In-Reply-To: <9ffi17+rqoq@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fjf6q+8u1g@eGroups.com>

I'll just add that I'm here (sometimes), but I haven't been to
Hay-on-Wye but of course I've heard all about its bookshops
and its literary festival - which put it on the map, really.
There are imitators...

As for the bookshops, with the bibliomanic state of my household
already I don't think I _dare_ go to Hay-on-Wye.  Even rare visits
to Whitby (I've a sister there) are dangerous in that respect.

I listen a lot to BBC Radio 4 (it's online if non-British want
to sample it at www.bbc.co.uk/radio4), and over the weekend in
question it seemed that everyone on the station was going to
the Hay-on-Wye festival, or had already been.  It comes across
almost as an intellectual Ascot.

Robert Carnegie
Meretricious!  (and top-posting, when in Rome as they say)

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., catherine at c... wrote:
> Forgive me for jumping in here, but I have visited Hay on Wye several 
> times and I love it.  It is a bibliophile's paradise - as many, if 
> not more, bookshops than Charing Cross Road and its environs.    The 
> only problem is, practically every time I have been there it has 
> rained.  There are also pros and cons to going during the festival 
> (was a couple of weeks ago) - great for booksignings, readings etc. 
> but very difficult to find somewhere to stay and very crowded - not 
> easy to get down to some serious browsing.
> 
> Catherine
> 
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., heidi <heidit at n...> wrote:
> > A question about nothing inflamatory about your post - have you 
> *been* to Hay on Wye? My husband & I are complete bibliomaniacs and 
> were thinking of going later this year or next spring - is it as 
> wonderful as the travel mags suggest?
> > 
> > I am moving this question to HP4GU OT Chatter, where it's an 
> appropriate question...(and Robert, if you're not a member yet, I 
> hope you join!)
> > 
> > rja.carnegie at e... wrote:
> > 
> > >
> > > I have no idea where (who?) Ann Arbor is, whether it's America's
> > > Hay-on-Wye or whatever, and I also strongly suspect that I'm
> > > generally more gullible than most folks.




From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 20:28:10 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 20:28:10 -0000
Subject: Hobbit names
In-Reply-To: <9fi9o0+c670@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fjfcq+sans@eGroups.com>

Gee Boggy Hillocks does a right good job describing me at age 54! LOL

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., catherine at c... wrote:
> Well, if I use my married name (Coleman), I get Daisy Knotwise of 
> Michel Delving, which is pretty cool, but if I use my maiden name, 
> I'm Daisy Boggy Hillocks!
> 
> I know which one I'll be sticking to!
> 
> Catherine




From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Tue Jun  5 20:36:56 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 20:36:56 -0000
Subject: Hobbit Website
In-Reply-To: <3B1D101E.7B081E35@sympatico.ca>
Message-ID: <9fjft8+bvba@eGroups.com>

Here ya go Jamieson

http://www.chriswetherell.com/hobbit/default.asp

Doreen


--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve 
<crowswolf at s...> wrote:
> Hello All,
> 
> Would anyone be able to give me the webiste for finding your Hobbit
> name? I want to send the url to my Mum...I think she would get a 
kick
> out of it...
> 
> Thanx
> Hugs to all
> Jamieson
> 
> --
> "I don't need parents.
> All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
> - Calvin and Hobbes
> 
> In the beginning the Universe was created.
> This has made a lot of people very angry and been
> widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams




From rja.carnegie at excite.com  Tue Jun  5 20:52:53 2001
From: rja.carnegie at excite.com (rja.carnegie at excite.com)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 20:52:53 -0000
Subject: The Philospher's Stone
In-Reply-To: <9ffuia+jb9q@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fjgr5+t5m1@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Robert wrote:
>  
> > > This book comes highly recommended from us at Graham Hancock.com!
> > 
> > Oh dear. ;-)  (wink at those who recognise name "Graham Hancock")
> 
> ::feels left out::  Who he?  Is this one of Marshall's pen names?

Not as far as I know.

(insert rant warning)

  He's one of those odd people
like Erich von Daniken - the type who believes (or
claims to believe) that they've detected the secret
behind human history that no one else knows.
Most of them have funny ideas about pyramids, for
some reason.  The most meretricious coincidence
that looks like evidence supporting their hypothesis
(say, that each of the products in the nine times table
adds up to nine) delights them; devastating critical
demolition of their arguments is like water off a
duck's back.

When these people are interested in religion, they
count the words and letters in the Bible or the other
holy book of their choice - or they're L. Ron Hubbard.
When they're interested in politics, they see America's
government subverting personal freedom to build a
communist-fascist state.  When they're interested
in machinery, it's perpetual-motion machines that are
fuelled by air or water.  And in ancient history,
the pyramids are practically bound to come into it
somewhere.  (For European mediaeval history, it's
the Knights Templar, the Holy Grail, the corpse of Christ.)

The Internet is full of 'em, but they keep spilling out
into real life, too.  Newspapers love them because they're
just so much more _fun_ than serious scientists or scholars
with better- developed critical faculties.  And they almost
always have a book to sell.

(rant over, tries to look nonchalant) Since you asked...

In this particular case, www.grahamhancock.com
is the helpfully provided primer on his ideas.

I myself was briefly impressed by a text on pyramidology
which I read when much too young to have a proper
discriminating judgment of it.  However, the results
of the science experiments with the little cardboard
pyramids provided weren't at all impressive - although
I don't remember if that's why I lost interest.

Looking over this, I could simply have said,
"He's one of those pyramid freaks", and you'd probably
have got the sense of it.  But some people seem to
consider me an ornament online, which is far more
flattering than any kudos that I get in real life,
and anyway I can get away with it when I say my magic word -

Robert Carnegie
Meretricious!





From SKTHOMPSON_1 at msn.com  Tue Jun  5 20:55:40 2001
From: SKTHOMPSON_1 at msn.com (Kelley)
Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 20:55:40 -0000
Subject: Hobbit Name
In-Reply-To: <9fjft8+bvba@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fjh0c+2i3v@eGroups.com>

I ended up as Lila Gamgee-Took of Bywater.  Since the spelling of my 
name is the 'masculine', I checked to see who I'd be if I were male, 
and that is Marmadas G-T of B.  So, Kathy, does this mean we're 
related?

Kelley-Lila  




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Wed Jun  6 00:16:08 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 00:16:08 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
Message-ID: <F265YILoygXLsxpTljB0000ce7c@hotmail.com>

Hi, everyone!

Thanks for the responses on this topic... it's one that is *really* close to 
my heart, even more so than shipping and the HP fanfic world (j/k).

Ever see Mr. Holland's Opus?  That just may end up being my boggart... you 
find so *many* Mr. Hollands here... people who once upon a time had dreams 
of their own, and either by choice or by circumstance left them to collect 
dust on life's shelf in order to  teach generations how to dream for 
themselves.  You see something of this on the faces of veteran 
teachers--imagine spending your entire adult life building houses for 
others, and in the end, not having one of your own.

Ender wrote:
"As far as original work goes, I've been working on two screenplays.  One is 
nearly finished and the other is in the beginning stages.  Outside of that, 
most of my original writing is usually done only for the benefit of my 
students."

Teachers like you, Ender, deserve shiny platinum medals and a six-figure 
salary... I know that I am not called to work with children who have special 
needs in an educational setting.  Informally I can (all of my aunt's four 
children are autistic--I babysit for her and her husband), but I don't think 
I'd be able to do it in the classroom.

Good luck on your screenplays, BTW!  I took a screenwriting class in college 
for my theatre minor, but dramatic writing makes me itch--the conventions 
are a bit different than for regular fiction.

Sam wrote:

"This can be both a blessing and a curse, though! I find
story ideas almost everywhere I look. Not just ideas for plots,
either - but ideas about the way characters interact with each other, the 
way things should look, etc. An interesting game (well,
interesting for me, anyway <g>) I play with myself during dull
lectures consists of me absent mindedly describing the lecture hall,
the lecturer, etc. Most of the time I don't even do it consciously -
it's halfway through the game I realise I'm doing it."

Exactly... in my experience, writer-types are daydreamers.  This is why 
people who get bored easily fascinate me... I can get impatient, but never 
bored... there's always an idea to think out... a plot that will not leave 
you alone... and then people and places and situations are just so darn 
*interesting*... some people just DEMAND their own stories, y'know?  Just 
change names to protect the innocent... ;-)

Sam, have you ever had what I call a "paper jones"?  This has happened to me 
several times... all of a sudden, you get what LMM fans know from the Emily 
novels as "the flash", and you *have* to write.  It's a craving equal to 
hunger, or thirst, or an actual biological need... and my problem is that 
while I *always* have a pen on me, I never... have... any... blank... paper. 
  I've written on envelopes, on credit cards, on theatre programs... once at 
the doctor's office it happened, there was no paper *anywhere* to be had, so 
I actually BOUGHT A DOUGHNUT just so I could get the paper bag... I gave the 
pastry to my little sister and carefully ripped the bag to maximize the 
writing surface.  I keep that bag on my computer desk just to remind myself 
that I am actually certifiable and it's only by the grace of God that I'm 
not in the nuthouse for Obsessive Wannabe Writers.  ;-)

Sam:
"I love the idea about the illustrated book about Hagrid
and Madam Maxime. Is there any illustrated HP fanfiction anyone knows 
about?"

Starling's illustrated Draco Dormiens and Draco Sinister for Cassie, along 
with other fanfics... but what I'm talking about is actual, picture-book 
like stuff... like Maurice Sendak or Ezra Jack Keats.  HP fanfic for our 
littlest readers... the story I had in mind would feature Hagrid, the 
Hogwarts gamekeeper and his journey to the Land of the Giants.  "He came 
from a land where he was very big, and everyone else was very small.  Now he 
was in a land where everyone was very big, and *he* was very small."  (Since 
he's half-giant.)

Parker wrote:
"I carry notebooks around with me everywhere.  If I see something that 
intrigues me, or get an idea, I write it down.  Right then and there. (those 
memo thingys would work the same way--please don't write and drive!) That 
way, I don't forget ideas. "

LOL about the writing and driving!  Your notebooks are a great idea!  Carole 
suggested this to me when I first thought about writing fanfiction but 
complained about a lack of time during the school year... so now I have a 
five-subject notebook and two stenos devoted to my HP AU alone (and also 
random other stuff I jot down--grocery lists, kids whose parents I need to 
call when I get home, etc.)

The problem with notebooks is people finding them.  Until last fall, I lived 
with other people my entire life, and never, ever (did I say *ever*?) even 
had my own bedroom.  And for some reason, the snooper in question, whether 
sister or cousin or freshman college roommate, ALWAYS found the scenes I 
wanted no one to read!

But I must say that the near-total lack of privacy I had growing up helped 
me as a writer--it was due to my mother's and my aunt's EXTENSIVE snooping 
that I learned I wasn't as horrible of a writer as I thought.

Scott wrote:
"My English teacher and I would debate this, and usually I
would win, characterisation *is* harder than supporting a thesis IMO."

Oh, heck yeah.  I used to debate with my college professors--I thought then, 
and still think that the large majority of lit crit is crap--and I'm a grad 
student in English *learning* crit!

The reason why Creative Writing isn't taught extensively IMO is because 1) 
the creative process as art is not understood, 2) most of us in English 
education don't bother to read research, and 3) quite frankly, most English 
teachers are *not* creative writers themselves and have no interest... which 
is why I was able to pick up the course as a rookie teacher... as a 
colleague said, "It's one thing to read good poetry, but it's quite another 
to read *bad* poetry by a student who's just doing it for a grade."  I quite 
disagree, but to each his/her own, I guess.

As for the rest of your post, Scott, I can truly relate.  Here's a quote 
from Madame Bovary to keep close to your heart always--"No one can ever 
express the exact measure of his needs, his conceptions, or his sorrows, and 
human speech is like a cracked pot on which we beat out rhythms for bears to 
dance to when we are striving to make music that will wring tears from the 
stars."  We writers' task is to go beyond the veil, then describe what we 
see.  Imagine Shakespeare speaking through Macbeth, trying to express the 
utter brevity of life in the Great Scheme of Things.  Imagine the apostle 
John, trying to describe exactly *what* he saw in his Revelation.  (A few 
years ago I muttered to my best friend in Sunday School, "If this book 
doesn't have ENOUGH 'like untos'... WHAT did the man SEE?"  My best friend, 
also an English major and crazier than I am:  "Yeah, it's not like John had 
a thesaurus..."  :::severe, you-are-being-sacrilegious! look from the 
teacher:::  :::Eb and Shani shut up:::)

Back to the topic.  Scott, your post was just great... and if you wish to 
ramble more, e-mail me.  ;-)

Amber wrote:
"My journey has been a very lonely, bumpy road. Right now I'm writing more 
than I have ever in my life because I'm out of school. It's great, but I 
would trade one of my toes at the very least for a Real Life Writing Group 
to be a part of. Feedback is the most precious and helpful thing to any 
writer and live useful feedback is doubly precious."

Well, yes... and they serve two important functions:  1) they encourage you 
to keep writing--you're not in this alone and 2) you get some sort of 
feedback on your work.  The encouragement is a good thing, but all feedback 
is not created equal.... in my experience, most writer's collectives and the 
like tend towards one extreme or the other... either too much praise or too 
much harsh criticism.  Neither is good.

In college, with my best friend's help I started a writer's collective.  It 
was quite successful--we had popular readings, coffeehouse events, and even 
published an anthology.  Since then, I've not found a group I'm comfortable 
in... I was working with another aspiring novelist about a year ago, but our 
styles didn't mesh.

Fanfic writing online is valuable practice.  But at the same time, I think 
writers would do well to remember that it is *not* their own writing--it's 
more like extended writing practice and feedback.  The danger is to pour so 
much creative time and energy into your fanfic that your original material 
gets neglected (yes, I'm preaching to myself right now--I finished a final 
edit of a MS late last fall and haven't touched it since I began writing 
TiP).

On the flip side, I've met some really great people online... and have 
gotten feedback on my original fiction from reader-editors whose opinion I 
respect.

Amber, you may want to combine the best of both worlds--there are a TON of 
writer's groups online.  It's just a matter of finding the right one for 
you.

Rosmerta wrote:
"I'm familiar with this program (mostly through reading Poets & Writers) and 
it's supposed to be fantastic."

Oh, good!  I was so afraid there was a catch somewhere--in education there 
usually is.  Glad to hear this.

"I've known since I was about 12 that I wanted to write
fiction, but now I'm not so sure. I *did* write an essay about not-
writing, and I got that published on Salon awhile ago. Is that what
they mean by "meta-fiction"--writing about not writing? <g>"

LOL!  We all have our dry season, Rosmerta--sometimes the fountain of ideas 
slows to a mere trickle.  And we all know that breaking writer's block is 
like resisting Imperius (that's the FIRST thing I thought of in the back of 
my mind while reading GoF!)...

Every single pro writer I've ever talked to says that despite being blocked 
or it being a great day to do anything else but stay cooped up in your 
house, you *must* make time to write on a daily basis.  I'm not a pro yet, 
but I'm not so sure I agree.  I'd be more inclined to suggest to students 
that engaging in some stage of the writing process everyday is 
valuable--drafting is only one step of several.

So even if this is your dry season, don't worry about it!  The tide of ideas 
will turn in your favor once again... if you really want it.

A final thought--if I could give one gift to writers, it would be the gift 
of perseverance.

--Ebony AKA AngieJ
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Wed Jun  6 00:59:16 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 00:59:16 -0000
Subject: Amy's(!?!) Children
In-Reply-To: <9fgmin+4arb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fjv94+6517@eGroups.com>

Scott wrote:

> --Amy! I didn't know you had children. 

Me either!  Boy, people complain an awful lot about childbirth--I 
didn't feel a thing!

Nope, they're not mine, but I'll take 'em.  They are adorable, 
Amanda.  Thanks for sharing.

Amy Z





From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Wed Jun  6 01:11:44 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 01:11:44 -0000
Subject: The Philospher's Stone
In-Reply-To: <9fjgr5+t5m1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fk00g+c8b4@eGroups.com>

Thanks for the rant, Robert--it was very enjoyable.  From now on, 
whenever I encounter pyramid freaks and their ilk (and they are 
ubiquitous, aren't they?) I'll privately refer to them as Graham 
Hancocks. 

Amy Z
who thinks the 9 tables are totally cool without any supernatural 
elements whatsoever--math IS magic!




From nethilia at yahoo.com  Wed Jun  6 02:22:59 2001
From: nethilia at yahoo.com (Nethilia De Lobo)
Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 19:22:59 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... 
In-Reply-To: <991734146.509.71273.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010606022259.14237.qmail@web14605.mail.yahoo.com>


> Which begs another question.  How many OT-Chatter
> members are aspiring 
> creative writers?  Narrow is the road that leads to
> publication, and few are 
> they that find it... how has *your* journey been? 
> Please share your tales 
> of triumph and tribulation... both are part of the
> writer's lot.

Very Aspiring. I'm currently a creative writing major
(yes, they exist! =D) I've been writing since I was
really little, but I never kept a steady character
till 1989, when I invented Debbi Duckling, and she's
been around ever since. Copywrited and everything.

As for fanfiction, I have only actively pursued Harry
Potter and Pokemon. But I love to write anything, any
genre. I'm currently writing a novel, and if I could
ever find a publisher, I would run with it and sell
it. (not a child's book, though I have many of those.
Liberal cursing and sexual situations, both
lesbian/gay and straight.) I have an account on
Fanfiction.net as Nethilia, though I haven't posted a
lot up there recently. *shrug* 

I hope I can get published, I would love to be a
professional writer. 

--Neth

=====
--Nethilia de Lobo--
**Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus.**

http://www.geocities.com/spenecial
Spenecial.com. Two girls. One Website. Total Chaos.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From lj2d30 at gateway.net  Wed Jun  6 03:21:31 2001
From: lj2d30 at gateway.net (Trina)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 03:21:31 -0000
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
In-Reply-To: <F265YILoygXLsxpTljB0000ce7c@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9fk7jr+cb77@eGroups.com>

Ebony wrote:

> 
> Exactly... in my experience, writer-types are daydreamers.  

I have a very rich inner life, so I am never really bored.  I do a 
mental character sketch of the people around me, or spin fancies 
about them, make up completely new stories to entertain myself.  I 
don't necessarily write them down later, but I've had the fun of it 
in the first place.

> Sam, have you ever had what I call a "paper jones"? <snip>   I've 
written on envelopes, on credit cards, on theatre programs... once at 
> the doctor's office it happened, there was no paper *anywhere* to 
be had, so 
> I actually BOUGHT A DOUGHNUT just so I could get the paper bag... 

I have a Taco John's napkin with an essay on decadence and comfort I 
wrote in college while eating a very large ice cream concoction.  I 
copied it onto "real" paper later, but tucked the original into 
Volume 5 of my journals for safekeeping...
 
> Parker wrote: "I carry notebooks around with me everywhere.  If I 
see something that intrigues me, or get an idea, I write it down.  
Right then and there. (those memo thingys would work the same way--
please don't write and drive!) That way, I don't forget ideas. "
> 
[Ebony] LOL about the writing and driving!  Your notebooks are a 
great idea!  Carole  suggested this to me when I first thought about 
writing fanfiction but complained about a lack of time during the 
school year... so now I have a five-subject notebook and two stenos 
devoted to my HP AU alone (and also  random other stuff I jot down--
grocery lists, kids whose parents I need to  call when I get home, 
etc.)

I used to carry little memo books in my pocketbook in high school to 
record my day as it happened (with private shorthand in case it fell 
into the wrong hands, after all I *did* describe teachers and fellow 
students!)  I got out of the habit in college, but now have picked it 
up again.  Perhaps I should have used it last night when I had a very 
interesting dream that seemed like a story about to happen (involving 
false witches and incantations, if you want to know). Dreaming in 
verse in fact... 


My problem is that what I imagine in my head sounds, well, stupid 
when I put it down on paper and I quit, even though I know I 
shouldn't.  Or I lose the train of thought when an outside 
interuption happen... And then there are days when the words pour out 
like water from a pitcher and I have found the elusive random word...

Trina





From Schlobin at aol.com  Wed Jun  6 04:49:25 2001
From: Schlobin at aol.com (Schlobin at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 00:49:25 EDT
Subject: Narnia
Message-ID: <48.16acbe39.284f1055@aol.com>

from the NY Times


Marketing 'Narnia' Without a Christian Lion


By DOREEN CARVAJAL

 

or more than a half century, "The Chronicles of Narnia" captivated
children with tales of Aslan, a tawny lion who ruled a wintry
Narnian kingdom of dwarfs, fauns and occasionally errant English
schoolchildren.

 Mixing fantasy with Christian allegories and imagery, the author
C. S. Lewis, one of the 20th century's most influential
interpreters of Christianity, created a saga that spanned seven
novels, beginning in 1950 with "The Lion, the Witch and the
Wardrobe," which have sold more than 65 million copies in more than
30 languages.

 Now, borrowing a page from a literary upstart named Harry Potter,
the Lewis estate and its publishers have started shaping a
marketing makeover of Aslan and assorted Narnian habitu?s to expand
readership and extend the brand.

 They have struck deals to license plush Narnian toys. The series
publisher, HarperCollins, revealed plans to create new Narnia
novels by unidentified authors, to the outrage of some devoted
readers. (What next? "Narnia Barbie in a school uniform?" asked one
fan in a Lewis electronic forum.)

 Most striking of all, they have developed a discreet strategy to
avoid direct links to the Christian imagery and theology that
suffused the Narnia novels and inspired Lewis.

 "They're turning Narnia into a British version of Mickey Mouse,"
said John G. West, co-editor of The C. S. Lewis Readers
Encyclopedia and an associate professor of political science at
Seattle Pacific University. "What they've figured out is that Harry
Potter is a cash cow. And here's a way they can decompartmentalize
the children's novels from the rest of Lewis. That's what is so
troubling. Narnia is a personal creation, and they're turning it
into a corporate creation."

 The publishing strategy surfaced in a HarperCollins memo.
"Obviously this is the biggie as far as the estate and our
publishing interests are concerned," wrote an executive from
HarperSanFranciso, an imprint of HarperCollins involved in the
Lewis publishing program. "We'll need to be able to give emphatic
assurances that no attempt will be made to correlate the stories to
Christian imagery/theology."

 The memo was written in connection with the development of a
public television documentary about the life of Lewis. The
producer, Carol Dean Hatcher, had negotiated contracts to create an
illustrated companion book and teaching video for Zondervan
Publishing House, the Christian publishing arm of HarperCollins.
Zondervan was also poised to donate about $150,000 for the
production.

 HarperCollins and its publishing arms were in the midst of
ambitious expansion plans for Lewis's works. They repackaged nine
classic titles, organized two Web sites (www .cslewisclassics.com
and www .narnia.com), developed an essay contest and asked
contemporary authors to write new forewords. By the fall of 2003
they expected to publish simpler picture books for younger children
and a new Narnia novel.

 The negotiations over the documentary unraveled, Ms. Hatcher said,
amid pressures from the publisher and the estate to eliminate
references in the script to Christian imagery in the Narnia series.

 "I was appalled," said Ms. Hatcher, who is still trying to
produce the documentary, "C. S. Lewis: An Examined Life," with
Oregon Public Broadcasting as the presenting station. "I think
there are ways to approach C. S. Lewis and Narnia that have nothing
to do with religious background. However, it is astounding to
minimize that part of this; it's like doing a video biography of
Hank Aaron and refusing to acknowledge he was a baseball player."

 For its part, the Lewis estate insists that there is no calculated
plan to reshape the author's image. Simon Adley, managing director
of the C. S. Lewis Company, noted that the publishers had
successfully increased sales of Lewis's "Mere Christianity," an
adult title that explains and defends Christianity.

 "It's fatuous to suggest that we're trying to take the Christian
out of C. S. Lewis," Mr. Adley said. "We wouldn't have made the
effort that we have with `Mere Christianity' if we felt that way.
It's just crazy. I suppose you could get a little depressed by
this. I'm trying to get more people to read."

 But the response from Harper Collins was more ambiguous. Lisa
Herling, a spokeswoman, issued a written statement noting that Ms.
Hatcher had revealed "confidential in-house correspondence that was
part of the incomplete process" involving Ms. Hatcher's projects.

 "One of the issues the correspondence addressed was whether the
project would appeal to the secular as well as the evangelical
market," Ms. Herling wrote. "The goal of HarperCollins is to
publish the works of C. S. Lewis to the broadest possible audience
and leave any interpretation of the works to the reader."

 As a series, the Narnia books are valuable property for
HarperCollins, which recently acquired the rights to publish all of
Lewis's works.

 Lately, the Narnia series has flourished anew because of the Harry
Potter halo effect on young readers searching for something else to
read. In the last two years, sales have increased 20 percent
annually.

 That renewed attention brought new focus on an author untouched by
marketing and image-making. Born in Belfast, Northern Ireland,
Clive Staples Lewis was a professor of medieval and Renaissance
English whose Oxford literary circle, the Inklings, included J. R.
R. Tolkien.

 In Lewis's imaginary kingdom, the inhabitants are fauns, talking
animals and children who find their way into a secret land by means
of a hidden door in a wardrobe. Some plot lines are allegories for
Christian themes. Aslan is the Christ figure, the "Son of the Great
Emperor Across the Sea," who defeats the devil figure ? the White
Witch ? through his death and resurrection.

 Since Lewis's death, two movies, both called "Shadowlands," have
explored his life. One starred Anthony Hopkins as the writer and
examined his late-blooming relationship with and marriage to Joy
Davidman Gresham, an American poet and Jewish atheist who converted
to Christianity. Her sons, David and Douglas, ultimately inherited
the copyrights to their stepfather's works after the 1973 death of
Lewis's brother, Warren.

 A blunt-spoken, nondenominational Christian preacher, Douglas
Gresham lives in Ireland, where he runs Rathvinden Ministries, a
country home on 20 acres near Dublin. His brother, David, has
played a less active role in the estate and, according to Mr.
Gresham, lives in India and has embraced Judaism.

 With Mr. Gresham as an adviser, the estate for years generally
rejected requests to create sequels or spinoffs to the Narnia
series. But that policy shifted as the C. S. Lewis Company took a
more active role in managing the copyrights. The company is led by
Mr. Adley, formerly a marketing executive at Scholastic, which
publishes J. K. Rowling's Harry Potter series in the United States.

 In May Mr. Gresham posted a message in an electronic forum for
Lewis fans.

 "What is wrong with trying to get people outside of Christianity
to read the Narnian chronicles?" he asked, adding, "The Christian
audience is less in need of Narnia than the secular audience, and
in today's world the surest way to prevent secularists and their
children from reading it is to keep it in the Christian or
Religious section of the bookstores or to firmly link Narnia with
modern evangelical Christianity."

 HarperCollins is still developing the new Narnia novels and has
not announced potential authors. Mr. Adley, of the C. S. Lewis
Company, said they would not publish an eighth volume in the
series. But they will "fill in the gaps" with the reappearance of
some existing characters.

 "Increasingly, we've found that working in the marketplace we're
competing against new stuff," he said. "The whole children's market
is geared toward anything new. You can only keep rejacketing
something a certain number of times, and in the end you have to
produce something new." 



From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Wed Jun  6 05:02:01 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 01:02:01 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Narnia
References: <48.16acbe39.284f1055@aol.com>
Message-ID: <3B1DB949.EEF17AF4@sympatico.ca>



Schlobin at aol.com wrote:

For more than a half century, "The Chronicles of Narnia" captivated

> children with tales of Aslan, a tawny lion who ruled a wintry
> Narnian kingdom of dwarfs, fauns and occasionally errant English
> schoolchildren.
>
> Mixing fantasy with Christian allegories and imagery, the author
> C. S. Lewis, one of the 20th century's most influential
> interpreters of Christianity, created a saga that spanned seven
> novels, beginning in 1950 with "The Lion, the Witch and the
> Wardrobe," which have sold more than 65 million copies in more than
> 30 languages.

Can you believe it? I didn't think the books were remotely Christian...I
just thought they were good. I grew up on those books, and have recently
re-read "The Lion, The Wich and The Wardrobe" and nothing struck me as
vaguely Christian. Go figure...

Hugs
Jamieson

--
"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From mystril at yahoo.com  Wed Jun  6 11:43:20 2001
From: mystril at yahoo.com (mystril at yahoo.com)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 11:43:20 -0000
Subject: Narnia
In-Reply-To: <3B1DB949.EEF17AF4@sympatico.ca>
Message-ID: <9fl50o+vdhv@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve 
<crowswolf at s...> wrote:
> 
> 
> Schlobin at a... wrote:
> 
> For more than a half century, "The Chronicles of Narnia" captivated
> 
> > children with tales of Aslan, a tawny lion who ruled a wintry
> > Narnian kingdom of dwarfs, fauns and occasionally errant English
> > schoolchildren.
> >
> > Mixing fantasy with Christian allegories and imagery, the author
> > C. S. Lewis, one of the 20th century's most influential
> > interpreters of Christianity, created a saga that spanned seven
> > novels, beginning in 1950 with "The Lion, the Witch and the
> > Wardrobe," which have sold more than 65 million copies in more 
than
> > 30 languages.
> 
> Can you believe it? I didn't think the books were remotely 
Christian...I
> just thought they were good. I grew up on those books, and have 
recently
> re-read "The Lion, The Wich and The Wardrobe" and nothing struck me 
as
> vaguely Christian. Go figure...
> 
> Hugs
> Jamieson
> 

When I read _The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe_ as a kid, I 
didn't have the foggiest idea that they were Christian, but I didn't 
read the entire series. As an adult, I bought the set for the day 
when I have my own kids and reread them -- then, I definitely noticed 
the Christian allegory. Especially in "The Last Battle," which I 
found that I didn't like as much at the others. 

I don't like what they are doing to the Narnia books, it doesn't show 
respect to either the people who have loved the books for years or 
the author, who had a message he wanted to share and now it is 
getting muddled by the marketing. 

I was a little upset when I first saw all the Harry Potter 
merchandizing too. A lot of it is just awful, but the next round 
looks a little nicer. 

I'm not always such a crank when it comes to a separation of toys and 
books, but I have that nervous hesitation that something I care about 
is going to be messed up by marketers who have never read the books. 

~mystril




From nethilia at yahoo.com  Wed Jun  6 12:27:04 2001
From: nethilia at yahoo.com (Nethilia De Lobo)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 05:27:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Narnia (contains spoilers if you've never read it)
In-Reply-To: <991821376.1701.7760.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010606122704.62493.qmail@web14602.mail.yahoo.com>


> Can you believe it? I didn't think the books were
> remotely Christian...I
> just thought they were good. I grew up on those
> books, and have recently
> re-read "The Lion, The Wich and The Wardrobe" and
> nothing struck me as
> vaguely Christian. Go figure...
> 
> Hugs
> Jamieson


There's a lot in the first book alone. That whole Lion
(of Judah) who is innocent of all fault having himself
killed for something he didn't do, the women crying
over his dead body, his  resurrection and conquering
of the White Witch, the promised land he lives in with
his father the Emperor over the sea, blah blah blah.
When I was younger I sort of saw the allusions, but
when I got older I could see the Christianity oozing
from the books. It didn't diminsh the series for me.
Can't see why they would rewrite them. >< 

I've read and own all seven, but I'm gonna invest in a
set of hardback copies. My poor seven paperbacks are
ruined from repeated reading and some dropping in a
tub...

--Neth, who is monotheistic/Christian but not uptight
about it. 

=====
--Nethilia de Lobo--
**Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus.**

http://www.geocities.com/spenecial
Spenecial.com. Two girls. One Website. Total Chaos.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Wed Jun  6 12:34:01 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 12:34:01 -0000
Subject: Narnia
In-Reply-To: <48.16acbe39.284f1055@aol.com>
Message-ID: <9fl7vp+u88a@eGroups.com>

from the NYT:

>  They have struck deals to license plush Narnian toys. The series
> publisher, HarperCollins, revealed plans to create new Narnia
> novels by unidentified authors, to the outrage of some devoted
> readers. (What next? "Narnia Barbie in a school uniform?" asked one
> fan in a Lewis electronic forum.)
> 
>  Most striking of all, they have developed a discreet strategy to
> avoid direct links to the Christian imagery and theology that
> suffused the Narnia novels and inspired Lewis.

My dad reported this to me with great horror the other day.  Now that 
I read the article, it isn't as bad as I feared.  From what he'd said, 
I thought they were actually rewriting the original 7 books to tone 
down the Christian connection.  I was getting ready to chain myself to 
the steps of Canterbury Cathedral.

The additional books are depressing, but I doubt they will ever come 
close to the artistry of the original.  This has been done with lots 
of books (Oz e.g.) and in my admittedly limited experience, the fans 
usually say "they're okay, but they're not Baum," or "Lewis," or 
whomever, and that's that.  

As for marketing, well, same old same old.  I don't much like it, 
either with HP or with Narnia, but I don't worry about it damaging the 
experience of reading the books--mostly because the art is always so 
atrocious, IMO.  Anyone remember the animated LWW from about, I don't 
know, 20 years ago, where Aslan looked like a great yellow grasshopper 
bounding around the countryside?  It would take a real artist to 
convey the majesty of Aslan in plush velvet.    

I think the marketers really need to relax.  The Lewis estate must be 
the envy of children's writers everywhere--the books have been 
unqualified hits for 50 years, and not just among "evangelicals" (half 
the evangelicals I hear on Christian radio wouldn't allow their kids 
to read Narnia--it doesn't toe the correct theological line--but 
anyway...)  Growing up in a devout Jewish home, I gulped the Narnia 
books down without knowing or caring that they were Christian 
allegories.  My parents had to point out the Christian imagery to me. 
 I got that there was something more about Aslan but I thought he was 
supposed to be God.  "Well, Jesus," said my dad, and I was shocked.  I 
kept reading, though--we all loved them, parents and kids, which is 
why my parents bought them for us in the first place.  Do they really 
think that there is no secular audience for Narnia?  Or are they just 
being greedy?  Fifty years of steady sales and a sudden increase of 
20% aren't enough--we need MORE MONEY!

Amy Z




From ender_w at msn.com  Wed Jun  6 13:14:36 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 09:14:36 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
References: <F265YILoygXLsxpTljB0000ce7c@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <000f01c0ee8a$a3cea3e0$84eb183f@satellite>


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Ebony Elizabeth Thomas 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, June 06, 2001 12:16 AM
  Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)


  Hi, everyone!

  Thanks for the responses on this topic... it's one that is *really* close to 
  my heart, even more so than shipping and the HP fanfic world (j/k).

  Ever see Mr. Holland's Opus?  That just may end up being my boggart... you 
  find so *many* Mr. Hollands here... people who once upon a time had dreams 
  of their own, and either by choice or by circumstance left them to collect 
  dust on life's shelf in order to  teach generations how to dream for 
  themselves.  You see something of this on the faces of veteran 
  teachers--imagine spending your entire adult life building houses for 
  others, and in the end, not having one of your own.

  Ender wrote:
  "As far as original work goes, I've been working on two screenplays.  One is 
  nearly finished and the other is in the beginning stages.  Outside of that, 
  most of my original writing is usually done only for the benefit of my 
  students."

  Ebony answered:
  Teachers like you, Ender, deserve shiny platinum medals and a six-figure 
  salary... I know that I am not called to work with children who have special 
  needs in an educational setting.  Informally I can (all of my aunt's four 
  children are autistic--I babysit for her and her husband), but I don't think 
  I'd be able to do it in the classroom.

  Good luck on your screenplays, BTW!  I took a screenwriting class in college 
  for my theatre minor, but dramatic writing makes me itch--the conventions 
  are a bit different than for regular fiction.

  Thanks for the encouragement!  I just sent the first screenplay off to my toughest and best critic...mom.  Unfortunately she's busy with her own work right now, she's working on a graduate degree in "creative non-fiction."  She's been writing really cool stories about growing up in the 40's and 50's in a big Irish Catholic family.




  Scott wrote:
  "My English teacher and I would debate this, and usually I
  would win, characterisation *is* harder than supporting a thesis IMO."

  Ebony replied:
  Oh, heck yeah.  I used to debate with my college professors--I thought then, 
  and still think that the large majority of lit crit is crap--and I'm a grad 
  student in English *learning* crit!

  The reason why Creative Writing isn't taught extensively IMO is because 1) 
  the creative process as art is not understood, 2) most of us in English 
  education don't bother to read research, and 3) quite frankly, most English 
  teachers are *not* creative writers themselves and have no interest... which 
  is why I was able to pick up the course as a rookie teacher... as a 
  colleague said, "It's one thing to read good poetry, but it's quite another 
  to read *bad* poetry by a student who's just doing it for a grade."  I quite 
  disagree, but to each his/her own, I guess.


  My mom and I have had a longstanding feud with a few other teachers at our school who don't believe that "creative" writing is important at all and would, frankly, like to see it banished from the curriculum altogether.  "Creatvie writing" is defined by them as stories with characters.  As we try to explain, all writing is creative to some degree and giving kids the chance to be creative is not going to turn them all into novelists and leave them totally unprepared for highschool and college research papers. It is going to teach them to use their words, their vocabularies, and their ideas in new and different ways.  Even in a research paper, one needs to know how to use words to convey information in a way that interests the reader and, more importantly, doesn't plagiarize your sources.  
  My mom actually heard one of our writing teachers teach the students a particular outlining technique, prefacing it with "This is good for people who hate to write, like I do."


  ender


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Wed Jun  6 09:05:58 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 09:05:58 EST5EDT
Subject: Narnia
Message-ID: <8AAD571811@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

What kills me is that everyone says the book is all Christianity.  
There's SOOO many other things going on in those books than 
Christian allegories.  There's Norse, Druid, there's even some 
Greek mythology.  Also, I was raised Christian and I didn't catch 
ANY Christian references until I was in my early teens after having 
read the series many, MANY times.  And I'm supposedly 
RELATED to him (VERY distantly) and I never caught it (ha ha).  
(My maiden name is Lewis. My grandparents are from Swansea, 
Wales.)

Anyway.....interesting article.  I'd hate to see this happen just like I 
hate seeing all this Harry stuff popping up with it's crappy artwork 
(IMVHO from someone who can barely scribble a stick-figure). I 
would like to see a live action movie sometime if it was done right.  
I can't imagine how a CGI Aslan would be.....or fauns, talking 
beavers, tree spirits, giants, etc., etc., etc.  Perhaps that's why it 
hasn't been done yet.  It would become too bloody expensive!
:-)

Oh, and the article is wrong (if I read it correctly).  They don't get 
into Narnia JUST by a wardrobe, for goodness sakes.  There were 
several ways all the kids got in.  But I digress.....



Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

Oh, the thrill of the chase as I soar through the air
With the Snitch up ahead and the wind in my hair
As I draw ever closer, the crowd gives a shout
But then comes a Bludger and I am knocked out.

"I don't know who Jim Henson is but I've heard he has his hand in a 
lot of things around here." - Kermit the Frog, 1972



From pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no  Wed Jun  6 13:50:11 2001
From: pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no (pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 13:50:11 -0000
Subject: The Philospher's Stone
In-Reply-To: <9fjgr5+t5m1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9flcej+m25t@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., rja.carnegie at e... wrote:

[snip]

> (insert rant warning)
> 
>   He's one of those odd people like Erich von Daniken - the
> type who believes (or claims to believe) that they've detected
> the secret behind human history that no one else knows.  

[snip]

> When these people are interested in religion, they count the
> words and letters in the Bible or the other holy book of their
> choice - or they're L. Ron Hubbard. 

As in Torah-code?

> When they're interested in politics, they see America's
> government subverting personal freedom to build a communist-
> fascist state.  

I thought that was the job of the United Nations?

[snip]

> (For European mediaeval history, it's the Knights Templar, the
> Holy Grail, the corpse of Christ.)

Not to mention the Ark of the Covenant.  These people pop up ever so 
often on Discovery Channel as well; one chap runs around Europe and 
the Holy Land chasing Templars carrying "San Greal" (or was it "Sang 
Real"?); another oaf runs around Europe, the Holy Land and half of 
Ethiopia looking for Templars hiding the Ark.

> The Internet is full of 'em, but they keep spilling out into
> real life, too.  Newspapers love them because they're just so
> much more _fun_ than serious scientists or scholars with
> better- developed critical faculties.  And they almost always
> have a book to sell.

I am presuming you do not know Norwegian (or Swedish, or Danish)?  If 
you do, however, you should look at 
http://www.chembio.ntnu.no/users/ystenes/sproyt/

It is a site run by a Professor of Chemistry at NTNU (Norwegian 
University of Science and Technology), and its name (Spr?ytvarsleren) 
means "Nonsense-alert".  He debunks and corrects all sorts of 
scientific nonsense in Norwegian media, from mere miscalculations 
from a journalist who doesn't know how to add, to cases of blatant 
fraud and sensationalism (the DU-case, the alleged population-
explosion, etc.)..

A classic case was a newspaper-article on the installation of a 
segregated smokers' room in a cafeteria in Oslo.  If the numbers in 
the article on the ventilation-system had been correct, there would 
have been a constant force 12 storm blowing through the cafeteria, as 
well as emissions of several tons of nicotine per day...

[snip]

> Robert Carnegie
> Meretricious!

Best regards
Christian Stub?
who also used to read von D?niken once, but now prefers Rowling, 
Kerr, and Tolkien




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun  6 15:57:10 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 15:57:10 -0000
Subject: Narnia
In-Reply-To: <48.16acbe39.284f1055@aol.com>
Message-ID: <9fljsm+2fnu@eGroups.com>

--In my fifth(?) grade English/Language Arts class we read "The Lion 
the Witch and the Wardrobe", and I'm pretty sure at the time no one 
really caught on to the Christian symbolism. However to try and 
downplay it doesn't make sense. This isn't a case of readers taking 
Christian symbolism from the work. It's a case of the author writing 
a story that is cleary meant to be a Christian allegory by his own 
intentions.

As for marketing, I don't frequent Christian bookshops so I'd never 
really noticed that the books were being marketed as Christian books. 
I've seen them in Children sections of Barnes & Noble, not the 
Religion & Christianity sections. I do understand though the idea of 
no marketing them this way (if indeed they were). What I *don't* 
understand is the idea that the Christian overtones in the actual 
work should be downplayed as if it doesn't exist. 

Overall marketing is generally a bad thing. The idea of a plush Aslan 
is as bad as the tacky HP stuff that has flooded the market. Then 
again while I'm sure everyone probably shares that view we all own it 
anyway...

Scott




From aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org  Wed Jun  6 16:07:33 2001
From: aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org (Meredith Wilson)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 09:07:33 -0700 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] *sniff*  No relatives...no neighbors....
Message-ID: <D8085AFE4BC7D4119EA00090271EDF1503C1E2@MAILSRV>

Don't worry, Rachel, I saw it too and loved it.  I've been trying to find a
time to see it again!
 
Mer

Anyway, enough of my gush because I'm sure someone will go see 
it and say "Um...no...actually, it sucked."  :-)  Oh well.



Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements






From fyregirl at cfl.rr.com  Wed Jun  6 16:59:23 2001
From: fyregirl at cfl.rr.com (M. Barnett)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:59:23 -0000
Subject: On a completely random sidenote....
Message-ID: <9flnhb+p8hk@eGroups.com>

I just wanted to say to Steve Van Der Ark (are there really all those 
spaces?) that you rock!  I've been playing on the Lexicon the past 
few days and the amount of information you have on there is 
absolutely amazing!  I can't imagine the amount of work that went 
into it!  

Thank you for your dedication to all us nutjobs out here that can't 
get enough HP!

Michelle :)




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Wed Jun  6 18:00:07 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 18:00:07 -0000
Subject: More than you ever wanted to know about lupines and wolfsbane
Message-ID: <9flr37+2lp3@eGroups.com>

Amanda wrote on the main list:

>Plus Texas bluebonnets are lupines, which I think are
>so-called because wolfsbane is in that family (this may be legend; I
>never checked it out, but the association did help the tip-off). 

I went out and looked at the wolfsbane in the garden.  No lupines, 
sadly--they're one of my favorite flowers, a state of affairs that 
predates my discovery of HP--but lupines have very distinctive star-
shaped leaves so I thought I might notice a resemblance.  Looked 
similar enough that I looked up aconite and lupinus on the web and 
found that they are not in the same family.  The info is from the 
University of Waterloo (Ontario) Dept. of Environment and Resource 
Studies.

Aconite is in the family Ranunculaceae (buttercup family, crowfoot 
family, spearwort family)

Lupines are in the family Fabaceae [Leguminosae] (bean family, pea 
family, pulse family) (pulse=legumes, fellow USans).  

BTW, both of these plants are toxic.  Do not eat.  My search 
generated a lot of "plants toxic to your bird" sites, plus Monk's 
Hood is the title of an Ellis Peters mystery featuring, IIRC, poison 
from that plant.

Now here's another question:  according to the song "Gulf Coast 
Highway," Texas is "the only place on earth bluebonnets grow."  Are 
bluebonnets exactly the same thing as blue lupines?  (The list of 
species and varieties on that website didn't include bluebonnets.)  
Here in Vermont blue, purple and pink lupines grow wild.  

And they are in season right now . . . ah, that wonderful, slim 
window of time when the lupines have begun to bloom and the lilacs 
are not yet faded . . .

Happily,
Amy Z




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Wed Jun  6 18:03:05 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 18:03:05 -0000
Subject: The Philospher's Stone
In-Reply-To: <9flcej+m25t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9flr8p+96v7@eGroups.com>

Christian wrote:

He debunks and corrects all sorts of 
> scientific nonsense in Norwegian media, from mere miscalculations 
> from a journalist who doesn't know how to add, to cases of blatant 
> fraud and sensationalism (the DU-case, the alleged population-
> explosion, etc.)..

The population isn't exploding?  Please explain.

Amy Z




From bbennett at joymail.com  Wed Jun  6 18:33:11 2001
From: bbennett at joymail.com (bbennett at joymail.com)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 18:33:11 -0000
Subject: silly love songs/Moulin Rouge
In-Reply-To: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F917D@miaexch1>
Message-ID: <9flt17+jod@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Tandy, Heidi" <heidit at n...> wrote:
> Yes, actually, that's what my husband said. he really really hated 
it. He wanted to walk out 10 minutes into it, and left for a few 
minutes during the Like A Virgin scene. He thinks it's worse than 
anything I've ever made him see, and I've made him see *both* Xanadu 
and Girls Just Wanna Have Fun (which did stay a future oscar winner, 
but was still pretty lame). >

But did he think it was as bad as Highlander II? That and The 
Avengers are the two worst movies ever made, IMO <g>.

I thought Moulin Rouge was brilliant. The cinematography was 
outstanding, the staging was innovative, the singing was great, and I 
completely believed the love story. I was "sucked in" - a requirement 
if I'm to gush about a movie. I'm hoping this movie triggers a return 
of the musical, which I think has been gone for far too long. I want 
to see it again, and I haven't paid to see a movie twice in years.

My good friend, however, thought the movie tried to hard, the love 
story was lame, and the songs were laughable; she yawned most of the 
way through. If nothing else, at least it's a movie that inspires a 
reaction other than "it was okay". Everyone I know who's seen it 
either thought it was fabulous or beyond weird.

B

p.s. BTW, Heidi, I freaking love the soundtrack to Xanadu :)







From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Wed Jun  6 18:52:00 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 18:52:00 -0000
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
In-Reply-To: <9fhc6m+3jhe@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9flu4g+q0cj@eGroups.com>

Parker Wrote:

> I carry notebooks around with me everywhere.  If I see something 
that intrigues me, or get an idea, I write it down.  Right then and 
there. (those memo thingys would work the same way--please don't 
write and drive!) That way, I don't forget ideas.  


I bought a micro cassette recorder that I carry in the car with me 
that way I can dictate any ideas that pop into my head.  It's much 
safer than writing and driving. <VBG>  Anyway I started doing that 
because I always had some really good ideas in my head driving to or 
from work but then couldn't remember them when I got home to write 
them down.

As for the creative process.  I hadn't done much writing in the last 
10 years or so until I discovered HP and the fanfiction relm. After 
discovering this wonderful world it got me back into writing and I'm 
currently writing a HP fic. I also signed up for a creative writing 
class over the summer.  Maybe someday I'll actually publish something 
in the real world. 

BTW Ebony I think that is so cool that you'll get to meet and discuss 
writing with people like Frank McCourt, I just loved Angela's Ashes 
and 'Tis.  I wish they had had classes like that when I was in school.


Cheers,

      Kristin





From pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no  Wed Jun  6 21:10:05 2001
From: pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no (pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 21:10:05 -0000
Subject: The Philospher's Stone
In-Reply-To: <9flr8p+96v7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fm67d+geo9@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Christian wrote:
> 
> He debunks and corrects all sorts of 
> > scientific nonsense in Norwegian media, from mere
> > miscalculations  from a journalist who doesn't know how to add,
> > to cases of blatant fraud and sensationalism (the DU-case, the
> > alleged population-explosion, etc.)..
> 
> The population isn't exploding?  Please explain.
> 
> Amy Z

What I am referring to is the oft recurring myth that the world's 
population *will* double within the next 30 (sometimes 50) years.  
However, recent prognosises indicate that there is a 64% probability 
that the world's population never will reach 12 billion people.  Even 
by the most pessimistic prognosis, there will be at least 60 years 
until a doubling occurs.  

The book _State of the World_, published 1994 by Worldwatch 
Institute, estimates that the world's population will stabilise on 
11.5 billion.  

Of course, this doesn't mean that there will not be problems, since, 
while the population seems to have stabilised, or even begun to 
stagnate, in the industrialised part of the world, Africa can expect 
its population to have tripled by the time its population  stabilises.

If you want to, I will try to find further sources for these 
prognosises.

Best regards
Christian Stub?




From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Wed Jun  6 22:26:12 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (Laurin York)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 15:26:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Conspiracy Theories (was The Philospher's Stone)
In-Reply-To: <9flcej+m25t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010606222612.54094.qmail@web14702.mail.yahoo.com>

 
> > (For European mediaeval history, it's the Knights
> Templar, the Holy Grail, the corpse of Christ  

A pretty good novel about these types of conspiracy
theories is Foucault's Pendulum, by Umberto Eco
(author of The Name of the Rose). 

One caveat: evidently, neither Eco nor any of his
editors--in Italy or any other country where
translations have been sold--is capable of correctly
adding 666 to 1344, thus getting 2010, not 2000 as in
the book.  If you can overlook the bad math, it's kind
of a fun read...teaches you not take these things too
seriously.

Laurin
(unlurking)


__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
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From slayer_style at yahoo.com  Thu Jun  7 00:07:19 2001
From: slayer_style at yahoo.com (Laura)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 00:07:19 -0000
Subject: New Harry Potter Site
Message-ID: <9fmgjn+l08m@eGroups.com>

On June 3rd, 2001, Midnight at Hogwarts opened.  It is a new Harry 
Potter website that is informative, unique, and attractive.  Please 
visit it.

http://www.geocities.com/midnight_hogwarts





From find_sam at hotmail.com  Thu Jun  7 02:19:58 2001
From: find_sam at hotmail.com (find_sam at hotmail.com)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 02:19:58 -0000
Subject: Fanfic Ideas and the Creative Process... (was Quidditch!Ron)
In-Reply-To: <F265YILoygXLsxpTljB0000ce7c@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9fmoce+hals@eGroups.com>

Ebony Elizabeth Thomas wrote:

> Sam, have you ever had what I call a "paper jones"?  

I do feel urges to write, but they're not usually so strong that I 
buy a doughnut to satisfy the craving <g>. I tend to have 'flashes' 
when I'm lying in bed trying to sleep, which is why I keep a notepad 
next to me pretty much all the time. 

Sometimes I won't write anything but draw a picture. A picture is 
worth a thousand words, or so they say! A drawing can sometimes be 
more valuable than writing, because often I can draw ideas faster 
than I can write them down.


> Notebooks are a great idea!  

Definitely agree! I absolutely hate having an idea or hearing a quote 
of some sort but forgetting it later on. A friend of mine gave me one 
of the hardcover Harry Potter notebooks for my birthday and I use 
that to jot down anything interesting that pops into my head. 
Notebooks are a writer's best friend! <g>

> Fanfic writing online is valuable practice.  But at the same time, 
I think 
> writers would do well to remember that it is *not* their own 
writing--it's 
> more like extended writing practice and feedback.  The danger is to 
pour so 
> much creative time and energy into your fanfic that your original 
material 
> gets neglected (yes, I'm preaching to myself right now--I finished 
a final 
> edit of a MS late last fall and haven't touched it since I began 
writing 
> TiP).

This is one of the reasons why I don't write fanfic. If I have an 
idea I consider good, I'd rather invest it in an original fic than in 
fanfic. Having said that, though, there are lots of good ideas that 
could only come about in the world of fanfic.

I still love the idea about an illustrated Hagrid picturebook 
(illustrated picturebook? Tautology, much?). I've scribbled a 
cartoony looking Hagrid; if anyone wants to see him say so and I'll 
scan the pics and post them online.  

> Sam




From Schlobin at aol.com  Thu Jun  7 02:43:57 2001
From: Schlobin at aol.com (Schlobin at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 02:43:57 -0000
Subject: Narnia/rant
In-Reply-To: <9fl50o+vdhv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fmppd+blq8@eGroups.com>

Those who find my views too strident can skip this post, because this 
one is going to be a doozy...!
*
*
* Strident space!
*
*
*
*
*

Well, I was totally appalled when I first read the article.

First, books, movies etc. should try to be true to the spirit of the 
original works...

Second, I am appalled at marketers -- enough already! Yes, I would 
love a fuzzy, plush Aslan for my kids, but not at the cost of dumbing 
down the message, which is Lewis' message.

Third, you cannot separate C.S. Lewis from his religion, nor should 
we!
I think the Christian allegories are very apparent in the Narnia 
Chronicles, but I read the Lion of Judah and I also read Mere 
Christianity and Surprised by Joy, and probably more significantly 
Out of the Silent Planet, Perelandra and That Hideous Strength. Lewis 
was a very strong Christian and felt very deeply about his faith.

That doesn't mean the plush Aslan has to have a bottom that you push 
that says "I'm really Jesus" or anything, but to try to disconnet the 
stories from the faith that inspired it feels wrong to me.

Of course, all the Inklings (I even read Taliesin Through Logres) are 
heavily influenced by many sources and I find their works very, very 
pagan, and as a pagan, I like that. But Lewis and Tolkein (despite 
singing Viking songs in the original while drinking beer) were 
Christians, and their Christianity was a major influence on their 
work. To deny that is to deny reality, and to be disrespectful of 
authors who (imho) have given us a wonderful and rich tradition.

I was appalled (I'm appalled a lot) when the film version of the 
Hobbit had Bilbo calling on God, when God was never mentioned in the 
books. That's wrong. Tolkein was also a Christian, and maybe he felt 
that his books would be more accessible (perhaps lead people to God) 
if God were not explicitly mentioned. It made me really angry.

So does the idea that Lewis' books should be "separated" from 
Christianity. I gather that one of Lewis' stepsons is a radical 
Christian minister and wants to separate the books from the radical 
religious right (those who oppose HP). I can understand that, but if 
I were to talk with him, I would suggest to him that rather than 
separate the books from Christian ideology, he should explain what 
Christianity means to him (and my guess is that bigotry and 
intolerance are left out of his version of Christianity).

So, anyway, I hope for communities that can honor and embrace many 
traditions publicly (rather than having no religions/cultures 
traditions mentioned) rather than having a sterile environment where 
no one's beliefs can be mentioned.

For example, in our shelter/agency, we try to celebrate all the 
winter holidays (Christmas, Chanukah, Solstice, Kwanzaa), lunar 
holidays such as Ramadan and Tet, and whatever other holidays we can 
come up with. This allows people who observe those holidays to 
celebrate them, and sends the message that all traditions will be 
honored. We also try to respect those who embrace no spiritual 
traditions, and understand that they may have a particularly 
difficult time when most people are celebrating some holidays.

Rant, rant, rant

susan






From editor at texas.net  Thu Jun  7 02:49:54 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 21:49:54 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Amy's(!?!) Children
References: <9fjv94+6517@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B1EEBD2.951BEE98@texas.net>

Amy Z wrote:

> Boy, people complain an awful lot about childbirth--I
> didn't feel a thing!

Actually, me neither---one of the main reasons I advocate epidurals...

> Nope, they're not mine, but I'll take 'em.

Oooooh, be very, very careful what you put down in writing. Especially
since I know you know how to feed them well....

> They are adorable,
> Amanda.  Thanks for sharing.

Well, I've been griping about them for so long I thought you ought to
get some kind of payback. Glad you liked the pics.

--Amanda (who's been Mandy, Mandie in her blonder days, Mandolabar, and
Bar, but not Amy yet)


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun  7 02:51:03 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 19:51:03 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Harry Potter website
Message-ID: <20010607025103.6596.qmail@web13704.mail.yahoo.com>

After reading Laura's post, I checked out the website
she recomends. Well it was a fun site that I am glad
she has shared with the group! My family and I will
have another fun site to explore about Harry Potter's
world! Midnight at Hogwarts is very interesting and it
is worth checking out.

Wanda the Witch of Revere, Massachusetts 

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From editor at texas.net  Thu Jun  7 03:10:19 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 22:10:19 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Narnia
References: <48.16acbe39.284f1055@aol.com>
Message-ID: <3B1EF09B.16A0113A@texas.net>

Schlobin at aol.com wrote:

> from the NY Times
>
> Marketing 'Narnia' Without a Christian Lion

(article snipped)

I had seen the following on TownHall.com, dealing with the same thing.
It's a conservative site, and quite a conservative bent, but I thought
it was interesting. I wonder why the estate is agreeing to this.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/billmurchison/wm20010605.shtml

--Amanda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From TTTIGERESS at AOL.COM  Thu Jun  7 03:18:29 2001
From: TTTIGERESS at AOL.COM (TTTIGERESS at AOL.COM)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 23:18:29 EDT
Subject: HELP WITH ALL Harry Potter websiteS
Message-ID: <37.163035db.28504c85@aol.com>

I RECENTLY HAD AOL CRASH AND BURN... AND I LOST ALL MY HARRY POTTER SITES... 
COULD YA'ALL HELP ME?

TIGGER
STILL NOT SHOUTING.. JUST STUCK IN CAPS..



From editor at texas.net  Thu Jun  7 03:19:16 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 22:19:16 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Narnia
References: <9fl50o+vdhv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B1EF2B4.8525DEAA@texas.net>

mystril at yahoo.com wrote:

> I'm not always such a crank when it comes to a separation of toys and
> books, but I have that nervous hesitation that something I care about
> is going to be messed up by marketers who have never read the books.

Don't feel bad! I get mad when I see those Calvin decals on cars, or
Calvin T-shirts (of Calvin and Hobbes) because I know that the creator
never approved any merchandising at all--a decision I applauded--and I
hate to see the stuff misrepresented. It's a sore point. And after an
author or artist dies, who's left to safeguard *their* vision of their
work? I'm all for the estate of Victor Hugo, trying to stifle that Les
Mis II book! You go, guys!

--Amanda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From gypsycaine at yahoo.com  Thu Jun  7 03:36:05 2001
From: gypsycaine at yahoo.com (gypsycaine at yahoo.com)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 03:36:05 -0000
Subject: I've found
Message-ID: <9fmsr5+dkqm@eGroups.com>

an interesting site!

I don't know, it could be a member in here, but since I thought it 
kewl, I figured I'd share it!

Someone has a good eye, and likes Harry!


http://elfwood.lysator.liu.se/loth/a/l/alicey/alicey.html

:)




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun  7 08:22:19 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 08:22:19 -0000
Subject: Conspiracy Theories (was The Philospher's Stone)
In-Reply-To: <20010606222612.54094.qmail@web14702.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9fndjr+d5fb@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Laurin York <lyorkus at y...> wrote:
>  
> > > (For European mediaeval history, it's the Knights
> > Templar, the Holy Grail, the corpse of Christ  
> 
> A pretty good novel about these types of conspiracy
> theories is Foucault's Pendulum, by Umberto Eco
> (author of The Name of the Rose). 
> 
> One caveat: evidently, neither Eco nor any of his
> editors--in Italy or any other country where
> translations have been sold--is capable of correctly
> adding 666 to 1344, thus getting 2010, not 2000 as in
> the book.  If you can overlook the bad math, it's kind
> of a fun read...teaches you not take these things too
> seriously.
> 
> Laurin
> (unlurking)

One of my favourite novels!  I love the bit close to the beginning 
when they are trying to access the files on the computer, and are 
trying to find the password.  Strange humour, I know, but it 
appealled to me!

Catherine




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun  7 08:54:05 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 04:54:05 -0400
Subject: Hermione, names, twins
Message-ID: <F21Jm2ZBNCogiwHsqhA0000ac16@hotmail.com>

Some main-list replies I wanted to make that are largely in the drifting-OT 
and/or smartass-remark category:

Re: Hermione's sexual orientation, Catherine wrote:

>I just can't see Hermione as being the slightest bit that way
>inclined.  Reason:  well, she wasn't in the least bit affected by the
>Veela/and Fleur, was she?

Maybe Fleur just isn't her type.  Arrogance is a major turn-off.

Re: the Weasleys' dinstinguished names:  Robert noted the prevalence of 
royal names.  Virginia is a royal name also, no?  I assume the name predates 
Elizabeth I, but the state Virginia was named for her, not, IIRC, for the 
Virgin Mary (it was established, albeit abortively, by Walter Raleigh).

I doubt Ron was named for Ronald Reagan ::sighs of relief from liberals, 
disappointment from conservatives::.  Reagan wasn't elected until Ron was 8 
months old, unless we make Ron 10 when he started Hogwarts, in which case he 
would have been born 6 weeks into the Reagan presidency, a perfect time for 
enthusiastic conservatives around the world to name their child for Reagan.

Robert wrote:

>I suppose that two sets of (identical?) twins, in different
>years in the school, isn't statistically unusual.

Uh-oh, here comes the number of students debate . . .

Parvati and Padma are identical; I don't believe we learn this 'til GF 12 so 
you are to be excused <g>.  Twins are born in 1 out of 78 births (prior to 
fertility drugs), IIRC.  Fraternal (sororal?) twins are much more common 
than identical, but I don't know what the proportions are.  If only one out 
4 sets of twins are identical, it's still statistically likely that a school 
of 280 (the low-end guess) would have two sets of identical twins, if my 
math serves (the latter is highly doubtful).

>Nevertheless,
>I wonder if JKR has something special planned for all of them...

Comedy of Errors comes to Hogwarts?

Amy Z
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun  7 09:51:07 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 09:51:07 -0000
Subject: Newsflash: bluebonnets are lupines
In-Reply-To: <9flr37+2lp3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fniqb+ntep@eGroups.com>

I know the suspense was killing you all, so I thought I'd post that 
Texas bluebonnets are a species, or rather a few species, of lupine.  
And I can see why the songwriter raved about them, because they are an 
incredible deep blue such as you seldom see in flowers; the lupines 
I've seen are a paler, more common blue.  It wasn't just Regional 
Pride Gone Overboard, not that Texans are =ever= guilty of such a 
thing. . .

;-)
Amy




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun  7 09:55:30 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 09:55:30 -0000
Subject: population
In-Reply-To: <9fm67d+geo9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fnj2i+35fn@eGroups.com>

Christian wrote:

> What I am referring to is the oft recurring myth that the world's 
> population *will* double within the next 30 (sometimes 50) years.  
> However, recent prognosises indicate that there is a 64% probability 
> that the world's population never will reach 12 billion people.  
Even 
> by the most pessimistic prognosis, there will be at least 60 years 
> until a doubling occurs.  
> 
> The book _State of the World_, published 1994 by Worldwatch 
> Institute, estimates that the world's population will stabilise on 
> 11.5 billion.  
> 
> Of course, this doesn't mean that there will not be problems, since, 
> while the population seems to have stabilised, or even begun to 
> stagnate, in the industrialised part of the world, Africa can expect 
> its population to have tripled by the time its population  
stabilises.
> 
> If you want to, I will try to find further sources for these 
> prognosises.


Not necessary, thanks, Christian.  I just wanted to know if I could 
stop worrying about overpopulation, and unfortunately you have 
confirmed that I can't.  

;-P
Amy Z




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun  7 10:03:29 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 10:03:29 -0000
Subject: Narnia/rant
In-Reply-To: <9fmppd+blq8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fnjhh+d0cg@eGroups.com>

Susan wrote <eloquent rant>

I agree with you 100%.  I just have more faith than I usually do that 
the books will be unsullied.  Don't ask me why.  I just look at the 
past 50 years and the deep love that people of all faiths have for 
these books--whose specific religious message may be lost on children 
but is obvious when those children reread them 10 years later--and I 
think, "marketing, bad movies and knockoff noves come and go, but some 
glorious things will persevere ever."

> That doesn't mean the plush Aslan has to have a bottom that you push 
> that says "I'm really Jesus" or anything, 

ROFL!  Oh lord, don't give them any ideas!

>But Lewis and Tolkein (despite 
> singing Viking songs in the original while drinking beer) were 
> Christians, and their Christianity was a major influence on their 
> work. To deny that is to deny reality, and to be disrespectful of 
> authors who (imho) have given us a wonderful and rich tradition.
> 

>I gather that one of Lewis' stepsons is a radical 
> Christian minister and wants to separate the books from the radical 
> religious right (those who oppose HP). I can understand that, but if 
> I were to talk with him, I would suggest to him that rather than 
> separate the books from Christian ideology, he should explain what 
> Christianity means to him (and my guess is that bigotry and 
> intolerance are left out of his version of Christianity).

Yes, yes, yes, me too, me too, me too.

Amy Z




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun  7 10:12:34 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 10:12:34 -0000
Subject: Narnia/later variations
In-Reply-To: <3B1EF2B4.8525DEAA@texas.net>
Message-ID: <9fnk2i+l977@eGroups.com>

Amanda wrote:

And after 
an
> author or artist dies, who's left to safeguard *their* vision of 
their
> work? I'm all for the estate of Victor Hugo, trying to stifle that 
Les
> Mis II book! You go, guys!

This reminds me of something I meant to post last week.  Fanfic 
writers in particular will be happy to hear that _The Wind Done Gone_ 
(_Gone with the Wind_ from an African-American POV, which had gotten 
quashed in court by the Mitchell estate) lives again.  Sorry I didn't 
post this when I first saw the article, as I no longer have the link, 
but I'm sure you can find it easily.

That was just spinning off your thread, Amanda, not disagreeing with 
you.  I do agree strongly that knockoffs are A Bad Thing.  Though I 
can't judge without reading it and the original, _The Wind Done Gone_ 
sounds like a serious use of past literature, not an attempt to make a 
buck off someone else's effort and success.  Looking at a story from a 
new POV or with some other twist is a fine literary tradition, rich 
with possibility (Updike's _Roger's Version_, on _The Scarlet Letter_, 
comes to mind as a recent example), and I wouldn't want to see it 
quashed.

Amy Z




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun  7 13:12:15 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 13:12:15 -0000
Subject: Hermione, names, twins
In-Reply-To: <F21Jm2ZBNCogiwHsqhA0000ac16@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9fnujf+ivaq@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Some main-list replies I wanted to make that are largely in the 
drifting-OT 
> and/or smartass-remark category:
> 
> Re: Hermione's sexual orientation, Catherine wrote:
> 
> >I just can't see Hermione as being the slightest bit that way
> >inclined.  Reason:  well, she wasn't in the least bit affected by 
the
> >Veela/and Fleur, was she?
> 
> Maybe Fleur just isn't her type.  Arrogance is a major turn-off.

I know I didn't express this particularly well (and I think I was 
being a bit smart-Alec anyway), but what I was trying to say is that 
the majority of the men (heterosexual men) were attracted by, 
entranced by and bewitched by, the Veela.  I wasn't specifically 
thinking of Fleur in Hermione's case, but I was wondering if lesbian 
women would be affected by the Veela in the same way as Heterosexual 
men.  Is it a sexual thing, or a gender thing?

The other thing I was wondering - are all Veela female?  Do they have 
to mate with men in order that their species/race/whatever, survive?  
In which case, perhaps they do only attract men?  Any clues?

Catherine, who's wondering if this is going back on topic?



"And you could ask your parents if they know who Flamel is," said 
Ron. "It'd be safe to ask them."

"Very safe, as they're both dentists," said Hermione.
(One of my favourite lines - not often does Hermione get the smart 
one-liners!)




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun  7 17:11:29 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 10:11:29 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Amy's(!?!) Children
In-Reply-To: <3B1EEBD2.951BEE98@texas.net>
Message-ID: <20010607171129.7205.qmail@web13701.mail.yahoo.com>

I didn't mean to mix you two up! But they are
beautiful and wish lots of happy times ahead with
them! My boys grew to fast for me! James is 12 and
William is 13 and my oldest is yikes!!! He will be 28
next January!

Love every monute with all of them, and wish the same
for you!

Wanda the (MIXED-UP) Witch at times!

  
--- Amanda Lewanski <editor at texas.net> wrote:
> Amy Z wrote:
> 
> > Boy, people complain an awful lot about
> childbirth--I
> > didn't feel a thing!
> 
> Actually, me neither---one of the main reasons I
> advocate epidurals...
> 
> > Nope, they're not mine, but I'll take 'em.
> 
> Oooooh, be very, very careful what you put down in
> writing. Especially
> since I know you know how to feed them well....
> 
> > They are adorable,
> > Amanda.  Thanks for sharing.
> 
> Well, I've been griping about them for so long I
> thought you ought to
> get some kind of payback. Glad you liked the pics.
> 
> --Amanda (who's been Mandy, Mandie in her blonder
> days, Mandolabar, and
> Bar, but not Amy yet)
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
> 
> 


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From chl0525 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun  7 19:12:53 2001
From: chl0525 at hotmail.com (chl0525 at hotmail.com)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 19:12:53 -0000
Subject: Special Editions in the UK
Message-ID: <9fojnl+q1cm@eGroups.com>

I want to purchase the UK editions of the HP books. I see on the 
Amazon.com UK websight that there are several different editions of 
each of these books. I am curious as to the difference between the 
Standard (ie, not childrens, large print or adult) editions of these 
books and the "Special" editions. I can see that they have different 
artwork but are there any other differences?

I appreciate your help.

Michelle  - an american





From maginker at yahoo.com  Thu Jun  7 19:28:54 2001
From: maginker at yahoo.com (maginker at yahoo.com)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 19:28:54 -0000
Subject: Too many twins?
In-Reply-To: <F21Jm2ZBNCogiwHsqhA0000ac16@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9foklm+r47v@eGroups.com>

> Robert wrote:
> 
> >I suppose that two sets of (identical?) twins, in different
> >years in the school, isn't statistically unusual.
> 
> Uh-oh, here comes the number of students debate . . .
> 
> Parvati and Padma are identical; I don't believe we learn this 'til 
GF 12 so 
> you are to be excused <g>.  Twins are born in 1 out of 78 births 
(prior to 
> fertility drugs), IIRC.  Fraternal (sororal?) twins are much more 
common 
> than identical, but I don't know what the proportions are.  If only 
one out 
> 4 sets of twins are identical, it's still statistically likely that 
a school 
> of 280 (the low-end guess) would have two sets of identical twins, 
if my 
> math serves (the latter is highly doubtful).
> 
> 

Hello, I thought that I would chime in on this being that I am one 
half of fraternal twins.  I have a twin sister.  I live in a small 
town of less than 5oo people, and our school, was an elementry and 
middle school combined.  When I was in 3rd grade I beleive, in my 
school of about 100 students there were 6 sets of twins.  Two of them 
were identical, and the other four were fraternal.  The place were I 
work, with about 20 employees, has two people with twins.  Me, and 
another, with an identical twin.

So, I do not believe it is impossible for two sets of identical twins 
to be in one school.  


Bryce




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Thu Jun  7 16:44:40 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 16:44:40 EST5EDT
Subject: Twins
Message-ID: <AA53857829@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

In my school (both grade and high school) there were at one point 
6 pairs of twins (school system of about 12,000 students) and 2 
sets of triplets.  I think at one point there was a set of quads but 
one of them died very young (if memory serves, he was 4 or 5 
years old and got hit by a car) so they were considered triplets 
once they started school.

Did anyone have identical twins at their school that did "twin" jokes 
on people?  We had a set like that.  They were several years 
younger than me but they had this great reputation of pulling 
pranks on teachers until they figured out their small itty-bitty 
differences (Todd had a cluster of freckles across his nose, Ted 
didn't have any freckles).  They were SO funny.....and sooo good 
looking.  Except for the hair differences, I would have sworn that 
JKR had met them when she developed the twins (Todd and Ted 
had coal black hair).

Anyway...

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun  7 21:40:27 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 21:40:27 -0000
Subject: Special Editions in the UK
In-Reply-To: <9fojnl+q1cm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9foscb+daep@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., chl0525 at h... wrote:
> I want to purchase the UK editions of the HP books. I see on the 
> Amazon.com UK websight that there are several different editions of 
> each of these books. I am curious as to the difference between the 
> Standard (ie, not childrens, large print or adult) editions of 
these 
> books and the "Special" editions. I can see that they have 
different 
> artwork but are there any other differences?
> 
> I appreciate your help.
> 
> Michelle  - an american

There was a thread about this a while back, but I couldn't be 
bothered to find the relevant messages, so....

There are currently three editions in the UK.  There is the normal 
chidren's addition, which come in soft and hard covers, apart from 
Goblet of Fire which isn't in paperback yet.  These are the 
originals, with the more extensive artwork on the front and back 
covers.

The deluxe editions are cloth bound hardbacks with ribbon markers and 
gold on the page edges (can't remember the technical term).  They are 
lovely books, but have one disadvantage in that they show only a 
detail of the artwork shown on the front cover (the same artwork as 
in the normal edition), and the backcover is not illustrated.

Finally, there is the adult's edition.  This was supposedly brought 
out so adults reading on the train would not be embarrassed about 
reading what looks like a children's book.  The content is exactly 
the same, but the covers look as though they are black and white 
photographs, and the lettering is slightly more modern.  I think they 
are only in paperback, but I am not 100% sure on this.

Hope this helps.

Catherine




From michelleapostolides at lineone.net  Thu Jun  7 23:10:29 2001
From: michelleapostolides at lineone.net (Michelle Apostolides)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 00:10:29 +0100
Subject: West Wing Season 2 ( possible spoiler if not yet seen ) 
Message-ID: <00f401c0efa7$0b864660$9c4a7bd5@tmeltcds>

We on UK terrestrial TV have just had the season 1 finale. To see season
2 and get the cliffhanger resolved, you have to either have cable
satellite or digital TV and subscribe to another channel. Not an option
for me.

So would some kind soul in the US please mail me OFFLIST and tell me who
lives and who dies ?

Thanks !!!!

Michelle




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Fri Jun  8 02:17:52 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 02:17:52 -0000
Subject: Harry at the movies (but not the real one...)
Message-ID: <9fpckg+i50s@eGroups.com>

Hmm...interesting title huh? The truth is I'm still stuck on "Moulin 
Rouge" so please bear with me here. (I'm planning to see it again 
when I get the chance.)

Anyway, I've been thinking about what Harry Potter would be like if 
someone like Baz had directed it. Interesting to say the least! Chris 
Columbus still isn't my first choice but...well I don't really have a 
choice.

Anyway this got me to thinking what if Harry Potter were done as a 
musical. They would *have* to hire Caius, Pippin and the other great 
"filksters" as a collaborative team on the music. However if the 
song's lyrics couldn't be totally rewritten, and we had to use actual 
pop music to create the score, what songs would could be used and why?

I'm going to reflect on this and see if anyone responds and then give 
my suggestions...

Scott




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Fri Jun  8 02:45:19 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 02:45:19 
Subject: Generations in the Wizarding World
Message-ID: <F63hXpa695yVQoz18D600008dbb@hotmail.com>

Hello, everyone--not sure if wild speculation is completely on-topic, so I'm 
putting this here at OT.  If it's sufficiently on-topic, I can move this to 
the main list.

Today I read a book, "13th Gen", that got me thinking across generational 
lines.  One of my mother's favorite sayings is "times change, people don't." 
  As true as that may be, I do think that one's place in time affects them 
in some way.

The book outlined the six generations of Americans either born in or 
associated with the twentieth century:  Lost (Fitzgerald and his peers who 
came of age during the "Great War", born prior to 1910), GI (Brokaw's 
"Greatest Generation", born 1910-1930), Silent/Beat Generation (the kids of 
"Grease" and social change reformers, born 1930-1944/5), Boomer (born 
1945-early 1960s... American society has revolved around them and their 
needs for the past 50 years), X (born mid 1960s-1984... the generation 
everyone loves to hate), and Millenial (1985-present... the Generation of 
Promise).

While concerned mostly with my generation, X (although I think that we 
younger Xers have a lot more in common with millenials than our cynical 
older brothers and sisters), the book commented on the character of social 
trends that shaped the general collective consciousness of the persons 
coming of age in these great waves.

Which got me to thinking about Harry Potter.

What generations are identifiable in the series?

A problem is that we don't know some characters' ages.  They are not given 
an age in canon, nor has JKR given any indication of how old they are in 
chat.  For instance, we have no idea of the age of Karkaroff, or Lockheart, 
or Narcissa Malfoy (although canon does give us clues for what is not 
expressly spelled out).

The fact that wizarding lifespans are twice as long as ours must be figured 
in.  I speculate that Dumbledore, at 150, is part of the current generation 
of senior citizens in the wizarding world, while Minerva is in the midst of 
midlife at 70.  Lucius Malfoy's age is questionable (for some reason, I 
can't help but feel he's a bit older than MWPP/Snape), and we know that 
Arthur and Molly Weasley are a bit older than MWPP/Snape as well.

We do have clear indications of two generations in this world, and we know 
about the events that defined or are defining their coming of age.

I'm in the middle of a PS/SS re-read, and as Heidi told me some months ago, 
the year during with Voldemort began his rise to power is *right there in 
canon*... circa 1970.  Since JKR has given Snape an age of 34/35 in GoF (I 
need to check the Lexicon to be sure), this means that by the only method of 
dating we have thus far MWPP/Snape and cohorts were born sometime in the 
late 1950s/early 1960s.

We know that the dark wizard Grindelwald was defeated in 1945.  We 
*currently* know of no other major Dark movement in this milieu between 1945 
and 1970.

>From this, the following could be true:

1)  James, Sirius, Peter, Remus, Severus, Lily, etc. spent their early 
childhood up in a relatively peaceful and optimistic time, whether in the 
Muggle or wizarding world.  Both Hitler and Grindelwald had been long 
defeated by the year of their births.
2)  During this time of peace, one of the finest schools in their world was 
run by the person who helped create this peace in the first place 
(Dumbledore).
3)  Around the time that they received their letters for Hogwarts (1970), 
Voldemort began his rise to power.
4)  The majority of their adolescence (early to mid-1970s) was spent in a 
time of growing uncertainty.  The majority of their young adulthood (middle 
to late 1970s/early 1980s) was spent during a time of terror.
The animagus transformations were performed during this period, as was the 
(unusually?) early marriage of James and Lily.

By the early 1980s, dire tragedy had either ended or marred the lives of 
*all* six of the individuals above.  And this is just *one* sociogram of 
friends/rivals/loves.  At least one of two things is true:
1)  This group was unusually cursed or singled out for persecution.
2)  There's a REASON why *we* may think that Voldemort is simply a comic 
hero, but the denizens of the world he exists in *do not*.  (I think they'd 
know better than we would.)

Thus, you have a generation whose childhood was spent in a peaceful time, 
whose adolescence was spent during a time of unease and unrest, and whose 
young adulthood was nightmarish (perhaps paralleled by the young adult 
experiences of the Greatest Generation).

I think it'd be interesting to compare that generation to Harry's.  For my 
purposes, the boundaries of this "generation" (actually cohort-group) will 
be two Weasleys.  Percy was born around 1975.  Ginny was born around 
1981--most likely before Halloween, given the presumed Hogwarts cutoff date.

These kids were babies, toddlers--none older than preschool, really--during 
the worse years of Voldemort's first go-round.  One speculation that I find 
*very* interesting and have no trouble buying is that Harry's generation is 
a LOT smaller than his parents' in number... which means that Hogwarts 
enrollment during the canon years is way down.

In my fanfiction, I had the narrator (31-year old Angelina) posit that her 
early childhood was spent in a shadow.  This is because I'm not so sure that 
the post-1981 "peace" in this world was anything like the post-1945 "peace". 
  It seems that as the centuries march on here on the Muggle side of things, 
with each war and each atrocity we lose a bit more of our innocence, 
expectation, and optimism... for some reason, I think that perhaps this 
could hold true in this world.

Also the fact that Voldemort's body was never recovered was significant.

"Some say he died.  Codswallop, in my opinion.  Dunno if he had enough human 
in him left to die.  Some say he's still out there, bidin' his time, like, 
but I don' believe it... (m)ost of us reckon he's still out there somewhere 
but lost his powers.  Too weak to carry on."  (Hagrid, SS, Ch. 4)

*That* is what I call a shadow.  People are afraid to say the name 
"Voldemort" for fear that they might invoke him... there's near-universal 
folkloric/magical precedent for that phenomenon.  (Don't know if it's just 
black culture, but even today we'll say "hush, girl, before you speak 
him/her up!" in a half-teasing, half-serious way if the speaker is talking 
about a particularly unpleasant person.)  I can imagine a few foolish 
wizarding mothers of children Harry's age and younger threatening bad 
children with "If you are not good, You-Know-Who will get you."  The 
reluctance of the wizarding-born children in canon to say Voldemort's name 
is telling... if it's all over, where's the fear coming from?

The Muggle-born kids, on the other hand, didn't grow up with this shadow as 
far as we know... and as I know nothing about politics in the UK, I can't 
give the British equivalent of "but they grew up with Reaganomics!"  
However, I'm sure once Dean, Justin, Hermione, and other crossed the 
threshhold into the wizarding world, they learned quick enough.

These kids' adolescence is being and will be defined by what I always think 
of as Voldemort, Again.  Because such things go in cycles, and I can't see 
JKR destroying the entire magical world at the end of this series 
(consistency of theme issue--this is *not* apocalyptic lit), I have a 
feeling that at least their young adulthood will be spent during a time of 
peace.

So for Harry's generation, you have an inversion of terms.  They were born 
into a terrible time, spent early childhood during an uncertain time, had an 
adolescence much like their wizarding parents.

Every school has this poster somewhere:  "Children Learn What They Live."  
There is a difference between these two generations... and that difference 
may help history not repeat itself any more than it already has.

The Marauder generation (just for the sake of a label--I realize that some 
of you nitpicky souls don't like this term used for MWPP/Snape/Lily et. al) 
spent their formative years in a time of peace and optimism.  I'm almost 
certain that no one saw Voldemort coming--and judging from the time span 
involved, even when they saw him coming at first they didn't think it was 
going to be *that bad*.  Our history shows that human beings tend to take 
comfort in denial.  (There are so many parallels between the HP scenario and 
WWII that it's scary.)  That's why Fudge, at the end of GoF has no excuse... 
I am *certain* there was a Fudge in 1970 or 1971.  There always is.

The Trio's generation never had this sort of collective stability.  Framing 
their earliest memories is the irrefutable evidence that *something* 
terrible happened in the time Before.  Neville's parents.  Snape.  Once we 
learn about it, the MWPP tragedy.  And I'm sure we don't know the half of 
it.

I think that these kids will be a lot more vigilant than their parents were. 
  They have Dumbledore on their side--I'm wildly curious about his role in 
the 1970s during Voldemort's first rise to power.  They also have a healthy 
dose of kid/teen cynicism that packs the pages of canon with their wit... 
and I may not be able to recite chapter and verse, but I'm sure that the 
Trio aren't the only kids walking around Hogwarts who have a healthy 
distrust of authority.

Good.  They'll need it.

There are also a few other HP series generations I'm interested in that we 
have no information about yet.  First is the generation between the 
Marauders and the Trio--Bill and Charlie's, who spend their entire childhood 
during Voldemort I and began Hogwarts either during the peak years of it or 
shortly thereafter, then their teen years during the "shadow time" that 
marked the current Hogwarts kids' childhoods.  Their collective formative 
and coming-of-age experiences are a lot different than those of their older 
counterparts (Snape and co.) and their younger sibs (Ron and co.).

The next generation who interests me is the one who had not one, but two 
Dark Mageships affect their lives--I'm thinking about Hagrid, Tom Riddle, 
perhaps the Weasleys on the younger edge of this generation.  (I always 
associate Lucius with this group too--he just *doesn't* seem like he's a 
cohort the Marauders.)  One wonders what it was like growing up (or at least 
being born) during *both* the Muggle war and dealing with Grindelwald at the 
same time.  Did Voldemort, as a young Tom Riddle, ever meet Grindelwald?  
What was Grindelwald like, and how did his version of the Standard 
Diabolical Plan work?

The final generation I'm interested in is the one that we will never see 
from JKR's pen, but who will be utterly fascinating... the Hogwarts kids' 
children, *especially* if they grow up during a relatively peaceful time.  
The potential for generational battles there will be rife.

What do you think?  How do the generations vary as we've seen them in Harry 
Potter?  Is there any variance, or am I just indulging in another blissful 
session of reading into canon what many would say isn't there?  ;-)

Perhaps the question I should be asking is, "Anyone still reading?"  In the 
words of the immortal Eeyore, "Thanks for noticin' me."

--Ebony AKA AngieJ
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 02:55:01 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 19:55:01 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Sheryll"s Birthday June 9th Happy Birthday early wishes
Message-ID: <20010608025501.28654.qmail@web13706.mail.yahoo.com>

Happy Birthday to you
Happy Birthday to you
Happy Birthday to Sheryll
Happy Birthday to you!!

This makes how many candles to blow out?

Wanted to get this out early because, Saturday my Dad
will be over and I didn't want to miss sending a big
Happy Birthday


 I    I      O       O      X XXXXXX
 I    I      O       O      X
 IIIIII      O       O      X   X X X
 I    I      O       O      X       X
 I    I      O O O O O      X X X X X
 
Wanda The Witch and Her Merry Band of Muggles (wizard
wannabes)                 

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
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From gypsycaine at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 03:09:43 2001
From: gypsycaine at yahoo.com (Denise R)
Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 20:09:43 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Loosing the Gateway
In-Reply-To: <991909810.292.59412.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010608030943.59046.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com>

I'm loosing my computer on Saturday.  It'll be gone at least a week--Gateway
doesn't believe in loaners, but I did ask.

Lol.  It works for cars, doesn't it?

That means I shall miss you all both in chat, and in email.  If I bounce,
please, place me on Webview, ok moderators?  I'm on Digest right now....

That's the reason no Chatscripts, btw--computer glitches....

and an ER-Format that didn't work to fix the problem.

Sighs.

At least Gateway's pretty decent and not charging me for the work.

I like warranties.

TTYL!

Dee


=====
********************
The most likely way for the world to be destroyed, most experts agree, is by
accident. That's where we come in; we're computer professionals. We cause
accidents.
- Nathaniel Borenstein
********************

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
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From pbnesbit at msn.com  Fri Jun  8 03:19:21 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 03:19:21 -0000
Subject: Generations in the Wizarding World
Message-ID: <9fpg7p+2hjm@eGroups.com>


Wonderfully lyrical, thought-provoking post, as always, Ebony!

I can only answer this from my Muggle viewpoint, so here goes...

I grew up in the same years as MWPP/Snape.  In my youth, I watched, 
horrified, as uniformed policemen sprayed African-Americans (quite a 
number of them children) with water guns, and set dogs on them.  I 
remember *exactly* where I was when JFK was assassinated. In my 
adolescence, Martin Luther King and Robert Kennedy were assassinated. 
I watched on TV as riots tore apart many of our cities. Also in my 
adolescence, the Viet Nam War escalated, and brothers of people I 
knew were sent over there.  In my young adulthood, I worked with my 
Mum for Veterans' Services and listened to the horror stories of men, 
some barely older than I, who had served over there.  

Today, I am *much* more cynical about the government and its "great 
plans."  I've learned not to entirely trust those who hold great 
power.  I think the same would be true of Sirius, Remus, and all of 
the "old crowd."  They've seen it.  They've been there.  

To me, Dumbledore's speech at the end of GoF is incredibly moving (I 
never can read it without tearing up).  He is warning them about dark 
and difficult times to come.  Preparing them, in a sense, to meet 
what is to come.  

I think they will meet the challenge.  


Peace & Plenty, 

Parker




From find_sam at hotmail.com  Fri Jun  8 06:56:48 2001
From: find_sam at hotmail.com (find_sam at hotmail.com)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 06:56:48 -0000
Subject: Too many twins?
In-Reply-To: <9foklm+r47v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9fpsvg+83m1@eGroups.com>

Bryce wrote:  
> Hello, I thought that I would chime in on this being that I am one 
> half of fraternal twins.  I have a twin sister. 

Me too! Strangers are usually very reluctant to believe we're twins 
because we look absolutely nothing alike. 

> I live in a small 
> town of less than 5oo people, and our school, was an elementry and 
> middle school combined.  When I was in 3rd grade I beleive, in my 
> school of about 100 students there were 6 sets of twins.  Two of 
them 
> were identical, and the other four were fraternal. So, I do not 
believe it is impossible for two sets of identical twins 
> to be in one school.

When I was was in the fifth grade, there were two classes, which 
totalled about sixty students in the year. There were *three* sets of 
identical twins in the year. One twin from one set was called Julian, 
and another twin from another of the sets was called Tina. I don't 
remember the others' names.

In my year 12 class there were at least three sets of fraternal twins 
I can think of, including my sister and me.

> Sam  





From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun  8 07:19:41 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Catlady)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 00:19:41 -0700
Subject: Happy Birthday - Hobbit Name - Lupines - Veela - Geenrations - 
Message-ID: <3B207C8D.C11761F3@wicca.net>

In Sunday 6/3's chat, Dinah started serenading Mecki:
"Happy BIrthday to you / You're a cute witchy-poo"
I don't know if she finished the song, but I made up an ending for it:
"Birthdays are magic / your wish will come true."

The Hobbit Name website returns Blank (no name) if you don't input a
name. So I inputted a variety of names and got:
Rosie-Posie Sandydowns
Tigerlily Hamwich of Buckleberry Fern
Camellia Hamwich of Buckleberry Fern.
Wisteria Deepdelver
Brown in Wisteria Gamgee-Took of Bywater

Amy Z wrote:
>  More than you ever wanted to know about lupines and wolfsbane

When I first read PoA and first saw that name Lupin, I didn't know
whether she was pointing us at a werewolf or at the highwayman, Danny
Turpin, "give me all your lupins", which in turn reminded me that I
don't know why that flower is name after a wolf. So I did some web
searching (and posted my discoveries on Harry Potter Anonymous) and
found a Latin-trivia site that said the Romans named it lupin (white
lupin, used as cattle feed, a different species than here in USA)
because the throat of the flower looks like a wolf's head. I don't know
what the throat of a flower might be.

> Texas is "the only place on earth bluebonnets grow."  Are
> bluebonnets exactly the same thing as blue lupines?

When one is a tourist in Oregon, all the tourist traps sell knick-knacks
carved out of a wood they call 'Oregon myrtle', with little tags
claiming that Oregon myrtle grows only in Oregon. Well, when I stopped
and read all the informational signs and the brochure on HIghway of the
Giants, it said that (I forget the Linnaean name) has common names:
Oregon Myrtle, California Laurel, and Pepperwood.

Catherine wrote:
> The other thing I was wondering - are all Veela female?
> Do they have to mate with [human] men in order that their
> species/race/whatever, survive?

It would be pleasant, altho' never mentioned in Muggle folklore, if the
males of the Veela species were just as beautiful, delicate, and
delicious as the females... altho' I think it more likely that the males
are extremely ugly, look nothing like the females, live in a different
environment (maybe they are the dwarves who mine underground), and get
together with the females only for reproductive purposes, such a general
orgy once or twice a year (Beltane and Samhain?)...

Ebony wrote:
> What do you think?  How do the generations vary as
> we've seen them in Harry Potter?  Is there any variance,
> or am I just indulging in another blissful session of reading
> into canon what many would say isn't there?  ;-)
> Perhaps the question I should be asking is, "Anyone still reading?"

All I can say is your well-written post is thought-provoking.

Parker wrote:
> I grew up in the same years as MWPP/Snape.  In my youth,
> I watched, horrified, as uniformed policemen sprayed
> African-Americans (quite a number of them children) with
> water guns, and set dogs on them.  I remember *exactly*
> where I was when JFK was assassinated.

I was born in November 1957, and am convinced that the Marauders (and
Lily, and Snape) were born in the same summer-to-summer year as me. And
I can't believe that Parker is older than me, so I must have been a very
out of it child.  I didn't know about the Civil Rights stuff when it was
happening. I was in first grade when JFK was assassinated (I saw the
flag at school at half-staff and asked a big knowledgeable sixth grader
why, who told me The President Has Been Assassinated, whereupon I asked:
what is 'assassinated'?). I was 10 when RFK was assassinated -- I had
been stuffing envelopes and ringing doorbells for him (my mother was a
fervent Democrat)...

--
          /\ /\
           + +     Mews and views
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston

                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((





From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun  8 09:48:41 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 09:48:41 -0000
Subject: two Hermiones in a bed
Message-ID: <9fq71p+v360@eGroups.com>

back on the main list, Catherine said:

> I'm being very frivolous here, but in that case
> (looking at the Hermione thing - two in a bed)
> shouldn't Hermione's name be Narcissa?
> BTW:  I just can't see Hermione as being the 
> slightest bit that way inclined.  Reason:  well,
> she wasn't in the least bit affected by the 
> Veela/and Fleur, was she?

This was already brought here from the main list once before, but 
all I saw in that thread was about Veelas, how do gay women react 
to them, etc. Having now reached the original message on the main 
list, I see it also contains that Narcissism thing. My vote is that 
having sex with yourself (NOT the same as your identical twin) is 
more like masturbation than like homosexuality.




From dfrankis at dial.pipex.com  Fri Jun  8 09:56:11 2001
From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com (dfrankis at dial.pipex.com)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 09:56:11 -0000
Subject: OOP release date
Message-ID: <9fq7fr+90dh@eGroups.com>

(copied from main list)
From:  "Saitaina" <saitaina at w...>
Date:  Fri Jun 8, 2001  12:07 am
Subject:  Re: [HPforGrownups] Release Date: (was: SPOILER: "OotP"
(in answer to a question about the source of a January OOP release 
date)

Waldon Books, and the American publishers.  I went about it sorta 
slyly by
having my publisher ask a friend who works for Scholastic if they 
have a
tentative date (the date they mark on they're calendars and hopes 
will be
true) and She gave sometime in January as the current date though, 
she did
say "It could be pushed back due to the movie taking up most of the 
author's
time."

It's been my private belief that Scholastic and Bloomsbury would 
deliberately lower expectations about the release date this time 
around.  JKR came under a lot of pressure when she discovered she 
needed to rewrite GOF against a deadline, and generally gives the 
impression of not liking the hype around the release of the books.

So I reckoned she and the publishers would hide behind the film, 
leading us all to believe in a late Spring date, and then at short 
notice (say 2 - 4 weeks) announce a release date somewhat earlier.  I 
guess WB would prefer for the film to take the first tranche of its 
gross before the fans are distracted by the real thing - so after 
Christmas would be about the right time.

During the run up to GOF release I felt that there was a significant 
chance that JKR would never finish the series because of the way 
things were going.

David, now wondering if Snape would be interested in one of Tony 
Blair's Stakeholder pensions when he retires





From pbnesbit at msn.com  Fri Jun  8 11:11:36 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 11:11:36 -0000
Subject: - Geenrations -Ages
In-Reply-To: <3B207C8D.C11761F3@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <9fqbt8+ud15@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Catlady <catlady at w...> wrote:
> 
> Ebony wrote:
> > What do you think?  How do the generations vary as
> > we've seen them in Harry Potter?  Is there any variance,
> > or am I just indulging in another blissful session of reading
> > into canon what many would say isn't there?  ;-)
> > Perhaps the question I should be asking is, "Anyone still 
reading?"
> 
> All I can say is your well-written post is thought-provoking.
> 
> Parker wrote:
> > I grew up in the same years as MWPP/Snape.  In my youth,
> > I watched, horrified, as uniformed policemen sprayed
> > African-Americans (quite a number of them children) with
> > water guns, and set dogs on them.  I remember *exactly*
> > where I was when JFK was assassinated.
> 
> I was born in November 1957, and am convinced that the Marauders 
(and
> Lily, and Snape) were born in the same summer-to-summer year as me. 
And
> I can't believe that Parker is older than me, so I must have been a 
very
> out of it child.  I didn't know about the Civil Rights stuff when 
it was
> happening. I was in first grade when JFK was assassinated (I saw the
> flag at school at half-staff and asked a big knowledgeable sixth 
grader
> why, who told me The President Has Been Assassinated, whereupon I 
asked:
> what is 'assassinated'?). I was 10 when RFK was assassinated -- I 
had
> been stuffing envelopes and ringing doorbells for him (my mother 
was a
> fervent Democrat)...
> 
> --
>           /\ /\
>            + +     Mews and views
>          >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston
> 
>                      ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
>                      `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
>                      (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
>                     _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
>                    ((('   (((-(((''  ((((



I'm only 6 months older than you, Rita (just celebrated my 44th). 

You were *not* out of it.  I had a very strange upbringing--I'm an 
only child, my parents were older when I was adopted, so I grew up 
with adults.  My father, especially, was a news-hound, so I was 
probably exposed to "real-life" events much more than others my age.

As for the Marauders' ages, I can sorta agree with JKR, but they do 
seem older to me for some reason.  Especially Remus.  I get the 
feeling that he may have been a few years older than the rest.  I 
wish she would just give the ages of people!

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker (who also stuffed envelopes and rang doorbells for RFK--my 
parents were Republicans, but I was not)





From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun  8 11:12:45 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 11:12:45 -0000
Subject: Malfoys' House Elves
Message-ID: <9fqbvd+q1hq@eGroups.com>

Hogwarts has around 100 House Elves. Someone tells us that Hogwarts 
has more House Elves than any other house in Britain. That surely 
suggests that several houses have more than one House Elf each. In 
which case, surely Malfoy Manor would be one of the houses that has a 
great many House Elves. 

The House Elves could do most of the house that would normally, I 
mean Mugglely, be done by various classes of servants -- for example, 
if the Malfoys want each serving platter to float gently around the 
table to visit each person and the serving fork to place some of that 
food onto each person's plate [part of footmen's job], if they don't 
have enchanted servingware to do it, House Elf magic can do it 
without the House Elves being seen. Presumably some combination of 
magic artifact and House Elf magic makes it possible for a porcelain 
figurine on the mantel in the parlor to announce "Dinner is served" 
in a euphonious voice (part of butler's job), so that Malfoys would 
not have to be summoned to table by a dinner-bell like a bunch of 
farmhands.

But how good are House Elves with numbers? Can they receive the bills 
in the [Owl] post, verify that the bills are accurate, and write 
checks to pay them? How good are House Elves with money? Can they owl 
order new cookpots, bedsheets, laundry powder -- ordinary stuff that 
needs to be replenished from time to time? Can they go grocery 
shopping for food? If the House Elves can't do that stuff, I can't 
imagine Narcissa deigning to do it herself, she would need a 
human(like) upper servant, a housekeeper or butler.

Narcissa must be getting tons of owls all the time. Do you think she 
has magic to tell her which messages to throw away unread, which to 
respond to with a form letter of politely negative reply, which to 
respond to with a cheque, which to actually read herself, and what 
new commitments to enter in her datebook? If not, either she has to 
do that work herself or have a human(like) social secretary.





From hamster8 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun  8 11:56:50 2001
From: hamster8 at hotmail.com (hamster8 at hotmail.com)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 11:56:50 -0000
Subject: Generations in the Wizarding World & ToT Spoilers
In-Reply-To: <F63hXpa695yVQoz18D600008dbb@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9fqei2+d2s@eGroups.com>

Eb, I fail to see how you can come up with such incredible, thought 
provoking posts.  So my reply will be mercifully brief, before I get 
an on-topic warning, which would be ironic ...

I agree totally, for one thing ... I just wanted to make a couple of 
points.  Your 'schedule' puts me bang at the end of Generation X (May 
1982).  Can someone detail for me just what Gen X actually is?  I've 
heard it mentioned but cannot put a finger on it.  What do we do?  Why 
are we derided??

You mentioned 'Reaganomics' ... the equivalent for British kids born 
around the same time would be Thatcherism.  But that's politics *slaps 
self*

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S

STOP RIGHT HERE IF YOU ARE READING TIME OF TRIAL AND *DO NOT* WANT TO 
KNOW WHAT IS ACTUALLY HAPPENING!

MORE 

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S

I have put Arthur and Molly as very young kids during the war years 
(sorry, this is a horrible spoiler for ToT.  My Arthur is 3 years old 
in December 1941.  Molly does not appear in the story, but is probably 
about the same age.  Lucius Malfoy is a baby, and has an older brother 
at Hogwarts.  Added to this, Harry's grandparents have just left 
Hogwarts, and are fighting in the Muggle war.  This, of course, puts 
forward my theory that the pre-Marauders generation left having kids 
very late.  I think, personally, that owing to the long wizarding 
lifespan, wizarding folk do leave their kids late.  Except in the case 
of the kids born around the early 80s.  People in the war years in 
Britain married and had kids quite early on, for fear of not getting a 
chance to in the future, I presume.

Just my addition.
Al







From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 12:34:26 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 12:34:26 -0000
Subject: HELP WITH ALL Harry Potter websiteS
In-Reply-To: <37.163035db.28504c85@aol.com>
Message-ID: <9fqgoi+39vs@eGroups.com>

Have you tried typing in, "Harry Potter" in a search engine? That 
should get you quite a few. Or type in "Harry Potter list".

Doreen
--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., TTTIGERESS at A... wrote:
> I RECENTLY HAD AOL CRASH AND BURN... AND I LOST ALL MY HARRY POTTER 
SITES... 
> COULD YA'ALL HELP ME?
> 
> TIGGER
> STILL NOT SHOUTING.. JUST STUCK IN CAPS..




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 13:30:05 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 06:30:05 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Percy!
Message-ID: <20010608133005.49219.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>


Again, I wasn't quite sure if this belonged on the main list since it's
mainly gushing and fanfiction so I thought I'd rather be safe than
sorry and post it here.

I'll be honest, Percy Weasley was never one of my favorite characters.
I always blew him off, thinking he was a puffed-up buffoon. He never
impressed me and I got increasingly annoyed at him, especially in GoF.

Then, after visiting the Sugar Quills site, I visited the two Percy
webpages listed there, "Positively Percy" and "Perfect?". After reading
the material there, my opinion of Percy began to perk up. And then I
read the fanfiction possibilities for him. Well dangit, some of the
stories made me cry. And that is a darn hard thing for fanfic to do. In
fact, no fanfic has previously ever made me tear up.

Needless to say, my view of Percy has changed. There are so many
different explanations for his behavior. It's made me start to think
about *why* he does the things he does and not just dismiss him. And my
heart's softened a bit for the Head Boy.

He's now slid into my "I hope JKR develops his character a bit more"
category along with Neville and Ginny. He could really become a key
player in the further fight against ol' Voldie.

Eh, well, sorry for gushing. I just wanted to tell this to *somebody*
and I don't know anybody who wants to talk about HP seriously...

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 13:36:01 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 06:36:01 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Too many twins?
In-Reply-To: <9fpsvg+83m1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010608133602.88677.qmail@web14503.mail.yahoo.com>


--- find_sam at hotmail.com wrote:
> Bryce wrote:  
> > Hello, I thought that I would chime in on this being that I am one 
> > half of fraternal twins.  I have a twin sister. 
> 
> Me too! Strangers are usually very reluctant to believe we're twins 
> because we look absolutely nothing alike. 

<sigh> I've always wanted a twin. Or an older sibling. Being the oldest
can be a drag sometimes. Oh well, the grass is greener on the other
side and all that.

Out of curiousity, what is it like to have a twin? Is there an extra
closeness that "regular" brothers and sisters don't have? What are the
down sides to it? Are these prying questions?

~Amber
(Who wishes she were closer to her brother, annoying as he is...)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
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From s_ings at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 14:40:34 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 07:40:34 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Sheryll"s Birthday June 9th Happy Birthday early wishes
In-Reply-To: <20010608025501.28654.qmail@web13706.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20010608144034.18145.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Wanda Mallett <witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com> wrote:
<snip much singing from Wanda and the wizard wannabes>
> 
> This makes how many candles to blow out?

Dare I admit this? 42 
Note to Neil: I suspect that I am getting close to
having to admit to middle aged!
> 
> Wanted to get this out early because, Saturday my
> Dad
> will be over and I didn't want to miss sending a big
> Happy Birthday
> 
> 
>  I    I      O       O      X XXXXXX
>  I    I      O       O      X
>  IIIIII      O       O      X   X X X
>  I    I      O       O      X       X
>  I    I      O O O O O      X X X X X
>  
> Wanda The Witch and Her Merry Band of Muggles
> (wizard
> wannabes)                 

Thank you very much.

Sheryll, the only person in her family who does not
get a party

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 14:42:54 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 07:42:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Malfoys' House Elves
In-Reply-To: <9fqbvd+q1hq@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010608144254.12439.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Rita Winston <catlady at wicca.net> wrote:
> But how good are House Elves with numbers? Can they receive the bills
> in the [Owl] post, verify that the bills are accurate, and write 
> checks to pay them? How good are House Elves with money? Can they owl
> order new cookpots, bedsheets, laundry powder -- ordinary stuff that 
> needs to be replenished from time to time? Can they go grocery 
> shopping for food? If the House Elves can't do that stuff, I can't 
> imagine Narcissa deigning to do it herself, she would need a 
> human(like) upper servant, a housekeeper or butler.

Most certainly the Narcissa that we've seen in canon (not that we've
seen much of her, though) wouldn't stoop to do such menial tasks. And
for some reason my gut instinct says that the House Elves wouldn't be
good with money, or at least they wouldn't pay the bills. I can very
much see the Malfoy's hiring a witch or wizard to take care of their
financial matters. Either that or Lucius takes care of them himself.

I imagine that House Elves probably go shopping for food, and stock up
on things. That seems to fit in with the jobs we've seen them do in the
past. However, bill managing doesn't seem to fit in as well, don't know
why. 

> Narcissa must be getting tons of owls all the time. Do you think she 
> has magic to tell her which messages to throw away unread, which to 
> respond to with a form letter of politely negative reply, which to 
> respond to with a cheque, which to actually read herself, and what 
> new commitments to enter in her datebook? If not, either she has to 
> do that work herself or have a human(like) social secretary.

That's some complicated magic! Well, it's entirely possible. Remember
the zooming letters in SS/PS? That seems to indicate that there's a way
to send letters by magic without owls. There'd probably be a way to
receive the letters correctly as well.

I get nervous about the idea of magic responding to letters. It just
doesn't seem like something I would trust to magic to get correct. I
can see trained House-Elf scribes. Or the Malfoys hiring out some
witch/wizard to handle their correspondence. 

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From heidit at netbox.com  Fri Jun  8 15:05:31 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 11:05:31 -0400 
Subject: Abuse in general & in the potterverse, but not really on-topi cally (was [HPforGrownups] Re: FAT)
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F91AB@miaexch1>



> -----Original Message-----
> From: Danette Schardt-Cordova [mailto:captain_debrowe at yahoo.com]
Catherine wrote:
> > As a Brit, I had to step in and say of course it
> > isn't!  Social 
> > services not getting involved with Harry and the
> > Dursleys is 
> > something I have always been amazed about.  Prior to
> > his moving into 
> > the bedroom, poor Harry spent much of his time
> > locked in the cupboard 
> > under the stairs, always had broken glasses, was
> > probably often very 
> > bruised because of the beatings from Dudley and his
> > gang and had 
> > clothes which were obviously too big for him.  I am
> > surprised that 
> > the only thing we hear about Harry's teachers is
> > their complaints 
> > about his strange behaviour.  This leads me to
> > believe that Harry 
> > never complained - probably very introverted and
> > used to keeping his 
> > head down.
Danette wrote:

> I'm afraid I have to disagree with this one from
> personal experience.  The first day that my 5-year-old
> went to school the teacher called Social Services on
> me based on the fact that my daughter had 4-day old
> cat scratches on her arm and a VERY(2+ years old) old
> scar in the middle of her back.  I don't know about
> the UK but in the US system teachers are almost
> fanatical(sometimes) about CPS(Child Protective
> Sevices) and SS and about calling them in for
> "possible abuse".  

I read this post just after reading this article at the Washington Post
website: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A36445-2001Jun7.html
- if you want to read a real-life, real world occurance of
moderate-physical-violence level child abuse regarding a
late-adolescent/junior high school aged child here in the US, you might want
to read this - but only with a box of tissues at your side. 
Yes, they do investigate these days - often - but even when something should
be done, the way the system works, and the complexity of the bureaucracy
sometimes make it impossible for anything good to be done. 



From s_ings at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 15:21:05 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 08:21:05 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Twins
In-Reply-To: <AA53857829@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <20010608152105.29633.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Rachel Bray <bray.262 at osu.edu> wrote:
<snip>
 
> Did anyone have identical twins at their school that
> did "twin" jokes 
> on people?  We had a set like that.  They were
> several years 
> younger than me but they had this great reputation
> of pulling 
> pranks on teachers until they figured out their
> small itty-bitty 
> differences (Todd had a cluster of freckles across
> his nose, Ted 
> didn't have any freckles).  They were SO
> funny.....and sooo good 
> looking.  Except for the hair differences, I would
> have sworn that 
> JKR had met them when she developed the twins (Todd
> and Ted 
> had coal black hair).

We had a set of identical twins in my 12th Grade
chemisty class. One would always sit right behind the
other. Just when the teacher figured out which one sat
where, they would switch seats for the next class!
Drove him crazy, but he had a great sense of humour
and didn't mind too much. I always wondered why other
people couldn't tell them apart, since I never had any
problem.

Sheryll

=====
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From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Fri Jun  8 15:44:17 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 15:44:17 -0000
Subject: Generations in the Wizarding World(and how war affects us)
In-Reply-To: <F63hXpa695yVQoz18D600008dbb@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9fqrsh+o68j@eGroups.com>

<snipe wonderful generations post>
Ebony wrote:
>Perhaps the question I should be asking is, "Anyone still reading?"  
>In the words of the immortal Eeyore, "Thanks for noticin' me."

--Still reading?!?! I think a better question would be whether our 
mouths are still hanging open in awe at the thought provoking nature 
of your always excellent posts! 

I wasn't sure how to respond to your post at first. According to 
those dates I am literally an Xer by a few months (May 1984), but I 
still count myself among the ranks of the Millenials. I've grown-up 
(so far) without the real threat of war. We read about it in the 
history books, but that's about as dry as one of Binns lectures. We 
don't really know the realities of war, and how it affects society. 
How is my generation "lucky", and "unlucky" for not knowing that 
reality? How are we different from other generations? I didn't know 
where to start, so I asked my grandmother.

My grandmother (who lives with us so she's a handy source of 
information) was born in the twenties, and therefore is clearly part 
of "The Greatest Generation". I'm sure that at least the Americans on 
the list have seen the news reports about the D-Day memorial just 
unveiled in Bedford Virginia. Well that's where my grandmother is 
from, and as the story spun on the news she said "I knew those 
people." 

But she also said that for the most part WWII didn't really affect 
her, at least until Pearl Harbour. Sure they had rations and they 
heard the updates on the wireless, but (she was 13/14 at the time) 
how much a reality could the war be to kids who are living thousands 
of miles away? 

What about the Wizarding populations of countries outside or Europe?
(Or outside of Britain. Karkaroff's the only non-brit DE of which we 
know.) How did they deal with VWI? Was it a non-issue? Like Americans 
entering WWII after the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbour, did the other 
nations of Europe ever enter VWI? Hmmm...

Overall I'm glad that I'm living now, but I have friends that range 
from 10-70 so in a sense I do agree with your mother Ebony. We're all 
different according to our experiences and the times we live in, but 
when it comes down to it we're the same people at heart.

Scott





From heidit at netbox.com  Fri Jun  8 15:32:11 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 11:32:11 -0400 
Subject: attribution for sigfiles
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F91AC@miaexch1>

I'm changing my personal email sigfile again from something humerously
political involving Jim Jeffords and aircraft carriers to something I saw in
Carolyn Hax's advice column today - "Some people fear death; I fear
literalists." 
I love this sentence. I wish I had written this sentence. I need to use this
sentence. I will use this sentence. The question is, should I attribute it
to her in my sigfile, which would make it twice as long as it would
otherwise be, or would it be ok to have an html-coded link from the line to
the column in which she said it?
 
 
heidi tandy
Some people fear death; I fear literalists. 
 



From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Fri Jun  8 16:08:12 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 16:08:12 -0000
Subject: Twins facts, Abuse
Message-ID: <9fqt9c+3q5f@eGroups.com>


I'm getting this out of one of the books here at work.
1. Rate of twining in US is 12 per 1000 pregnancies.
2. Identical twins occur at a rate of 4 per 1000 births (source says 
this is "constant", which I assume to be worldwide).
3. Fraternal twins occur at a rate of 8 per 1000 in the US and 4 to 50 
per 1000 worldwide.
4. 2/3 of all twins are fraternal in the US.

So having two sets of twins at Hogwarts isn't that unusual. However 
having two sets of IDENTICAL twins at Hogwarts can be considered 
unusual, since identical twins aren't as common.

Now for abuse.

I work in a physician's office. Physicians, nurses, teachers, day-care 
workers, etc. are 'mandatory reporters'. If they see anything 
"suspicious", they are mandated by law (in the US at least) to report 
it to the local child services. What defines "suspicious"? Well, it's 
rather subjective and it's a judgement call. 

For example, if a child is brought in for an ear infection and the 
doctor sees a bruise on the child's chest, the doctor must examine the 
child for other marks/signs and must also inquire how the child got 
that bruise. If the story doesn't match the injury, that makes it 
highly suspicious. For example, a 2 month old baby with a sunk-in 
skull fracture and the story is "he was sitting up in his crib and he 
lost his balance and fell and hit the slats on the crib". (2 month old 
babies generally don't have the muscle control to "sit up" and sunk-in 
or depressed skull fractures generally takes more force than a child 
bumping his head).  If the story does match the injury, then it 
becomes less suspicious. For example, a 4 year-old with a scrap on the 
heel of his left hand and a scrap on his left knee with the story he 
was running on the sidewalk, slipped and fell down. In this case, most 
doctors I've worked with don't call child services. 

If a "mandatory reporter" doesn't report "suspicious" marks/injuries, 
then that person can be held liable if something adverse should happen 
to the child. So, calling child services for cat scratches may seem 
ridiculous, but for the 'mandatory reporter' it's a case of CYA (Cover 
Your Ass). To an extent, it's also a way of "spreading the 
responsibility around": you reported it to the authorities, the 
authorites researched it and made a decision. If anything happens to 
the child, you can always say "I did what I was supposed to do."

Milz







From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Fri Jun  8 16:41:26 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 16:41:26 -0000
Subject: Malfoys' House Elves
In-Reply-To: <20010608144254.12439.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9fqv7m+aie4@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> I get nervous about the idea of magic responding to letters. It just
> doesn't seem like something I would trust to magic to get correct. I
> can see trained House-Elf scribes. Or the Malfoys hiring out some
> witch/wizard to handle their correspondence. 
> 
> ~Amber


How different is this from the automated replies we can get online?

Catherine




From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 16:46:17 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (Laurin York)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 09:46:17 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Harry at the movies (but not the real one...)
In-Reply-To: <9fpckg+i50s@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010608164617.66729.qmail@web14701.mail.yahoo.com>

I think it's too bad that something like Lori's
Paradigm of Uncertainty doesn't ever stand a chance of
being filmed, because I keep seeing Alexis Denisoff
(Wesley, on the WB's "Angel") as the grown-up secret
agent Harry (especially after seeing the Angel season
finale).

As far as casting the real books, a friend just came
up with the perfect actor to play Mad-Eye Moody when
the fourth book is done: Christopher Lloyd (he keeps
hearing Lloyd's voice when he's reading Moody's
dialogue, and now so do I!).  One has to especially
think of Lloyd's role in Who Framed Roger Rabbit.  I
agree with my friend that it would be perfect!

--Laurin



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From ochfd42 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 17:01:55 2001
From: ochfd42 at yahoo.com (Angela Boyko)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 13:01:55 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Twins
In-Reply-To: <20010608152105.29633.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20010608170155.3701.qmail@web11705.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Sheryll Townsend <s_ings at yahoo.com> wrote:

> We had a set of identical twins in my 12th Grade
> chemisty class. One would always sit right behind
> the
> other. Just when the teacher figured out which one
> sat
> where, they would switch seats for the next class!
> Drove him crazy, but he had a great sense of humour
> and didn't mind too much. I always wondered why
> other
> people couldn't tell them apart, since I never had
> any
> problem.

My mother had an identical twin. I can look at
pictures of them as children and pick out which one is
which, but my brother can't.

It's interesting - people from outside the family
couldn't tell them apart as adults, and one of my
aunts who bore a strong resemblance was suspected of
being a triplet. On the other hand, one of my cousins
didn't even know they were twins because he could
always tell the difference.

Note to future parents of twins: don't name the twins
with names that are very similar, or where one is not
common. My aunt's name was Helen and my mother's name
is Helene (rhymes with serene, lean, etc). Most people
can't pronounce Helene so they call her Helen. And
since Helen died in 1986, it's painful for my mother
to constantly be called by her dead twin's name. It's
easier when Helene is pronounced the French way - it
may be incorrect but it doesn't hurt.

Angela




=====
* * * http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/4439/index.html * * *
               May the Force be with you

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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun  8 17:43:25 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 10:43:25 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Malfoys' House Elves
In-Reply-To: <9fqv7m+aie4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010608174325.72800.qmail@web14507.mail.yahoo.com>


--- catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> > I get nervous about the idea of magic responding to letters. It
> > just doesn't seem like something I would trust to magic to get
> > correct. I can see trained House-Elf scribes. Or the Malfoys hiring
> > out some witch/wizard to handle their correspondence. 
>
> How different is this from the automated replies we can get online?

The email program doesn't read the email it gets, does it? It doesn't
look inside the messages to see what's in them and then decide how they
should be answered. To some extent email can be "sorted" automatically
into folders, but that's just from the subject line. The actual email
can be something totally different.

I know, sounds silly eh? I don't know, if I were a witch I'd just feel
better having a live being (or better yet, ME) looking at my mail,
sorting it, generating replies depending on the content. I just
wouldn't be able to "trust" the magic that much. (I know, I'm insane,
just ignore me...)

~Amber
(Who doesn't use the automated reply function anyways...)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
 - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From mrs_snape at yahoo.de  Fri Jun  8 17:54:02 2001
From: mrs_snape at yahoo.de (Mrs Snape (Dinah))
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 19:54:02 +0200
Subject: Did the 7 dwarves share their undies???
Message-ID: <007d01c0f044$02037fc0$372a07d5@oemcomputer>

This will give my next visit to Eurodisney a slight damper. Have to ask those guys if *they* have clean underwear...

http://www.cnn.com/2001/LAW/06/07/disney.underwear.ap/index.html

~ Dinah ~    (who was tempted to offer up her jacket when she saw all those poor guys walking around in tights before X-mas)

ICQ: 10 44 52 471
YM: bludger_witch

"Sometimes people think that home is a place. It can be a person." 

~ Gabrielle, "Back in the Bottle"


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Fri Jun  8 16:42:17 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 16:42:17 EST5EDT
Subject: Interesting question
Message-ID: <C24A5363CA@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

This was from the daily calendar:

Harry and Ron didn't quite know what to make of Hermione when 
they first encountered her.  Do you think you would be friends with 
Hermione upon first meeting her?

My answer is no.  She came across exactly like the type of kid I 
hated being around.  It would have to take a mutual experience like 
they (Harry, Ron and Hermione) had to make me friends with her.  
Then again, most of the people I grew up with were very Weasley 
twins-ish.  So, Hermione would have REALLY rubbed me wrong 
when first meeting her.

Don't get me wrong.  I'm nuts about her now.  :-)

Have a great weekend.

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun  8 22:33:06 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Catlady)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 15:33:06 -0700
Subject: Happy Birthday - Twins - Hermione - Cho
Message-ID: <3B2152A1.F8BF3660@wicca.net>

Sheryll Townsend wrote:

>Dare I admit this? 42

You are The Answer! and STILL a year younger than me.

> Sheryll, the only person in her family who does not get a party

You get a party here in the egroup! (and maybe cake and candles are
being owled to you even now)

Happy birthday to you,
You're a cute witchy-poo
Birthdays are magic
Your wish will come true

Happy birthday to you,
You're a skilled witchy-poo
No witch is grown-up
Until age forty-two.

Happy birthday to you]
Sexy, wise witchy-poo
Go find a wizard
Who appreciates you

Milz wrote:

> So having two sets of twins at Hogwarts isn't that unusual.
> However  having two sets of IDENTICAL twins at Hogwarts
> can be considered unusual, since identical twins aren't as common.

I suspect that mothers who are Potterverse witches have a much higher
rate of identical twins than Muggle mothers.

Rachel Bray wrote:

> This was from the daily calendar:
> Harry and Ron didn't quite know what to make of Hermione
> when they first encountered her.  Do you think you would be
> friends with Hermione upon first meeting her?

Umm.  I would have admired her knowledge and shared her love of books
(and love of hearing one's own voice), but I was also EXTREMELY shy, and
scared of bossy people. So whether little Rita became friends with
little Hermione would depend on how hard little Hermione reached out to
make friends with me. On the Hogwarts Express in PS/SS, it's clear that
Hermione wanted to make friends but didn't know how... If we had any
classes together, our friendship would have come as a result of both of
us constantly raising our hands to the *sky* but I don't know if we
would have had any classes together, as I would have been a Ravenclaw...

In PoA, at one point someone says Ravenclaw is all on Cleansweep Sevens.
Then Cho is on a Comet 260. This leads me to imagine that she started
the year with a Cleansweep Seven but it was destroyed and her parents
refused to buy her another broomstick so she had to borrow one. As many
of you know, I imagine that her Cleansweep was destroyed in the same
accident as she was injured. I go on to imagine that it was a Quidditch
practise accident.
--
          /\ /\
           + +     Mews and views
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston

                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((





From john at walton.to  Fri Jun  8 22:51:14 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 18:51:14 -0400
Subject: ADMIN: Announcements go on the Announcements List
In-Reply-To: <9fmgjn+l08m@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <B74457DF.25A5%john@walton.to>

[A/N: This post is going only to OT-Chatter as that is where the vile
transgression occurred... ::ominous dong::]

Hear ye, hear ye! Since March, ALL announcement-type messages go to the
HPFGU-Announcements YahooGroup. See helpful note below, with special note to
the last bit.

THINGS WOT GO ON DE ANNOUNCEMENTS LIST

The HPforGrownUps Newsletter (edited by Jeralyn and Ebony) *** ADMIN
messages from the Moderator Team (copies of those posted to the main group)
*** Announcements of chat room sessions *** Announcements of new discussion
summaries posted to the main list *** Plugs of fanfiction (one plug per
chapter by the author) *** Plugs of HP-related events (including regional
Members' meetings) *** Plugs of new HP websites or of new HP information on
other websites *** News releases, with links (this should include things
related to the Warner Brothers' movie) *** Fun HP links, such as Sorting Hat
quizzes *** Alerts to new HP merchandise *** JKR sightings; JKR events (book
signings, tours, TV appearances, chats, etc.) *** Information on HP fan
clubs. 

A friendly reminder from your local purveyor of Rock.




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Fri Jun  8 23:27:57 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 23:27:57 
Subject: Happy Birthday, Sheryll!
Message-ID: <F633YjvkJ3At47sezmF00009d86@hotmail.com>

>Happy birthday to you,
>You're a skilled witchy-poo
>No witch is grown-up
>Until age forty-two.

Although I think I *did* agree with the above theory sometime and somewhere 
(posts, fanfic, chats, IMs... they all blend together after a while), seeing 
it in such a cute form makes me want to whine--and say "I know 42 is 
supposed to be a Perfect Number in math, but can't we switch the numbers 
around and make it 24?"  "No, because 24 messes up the rhyme... but then, we 
wouldn't expect a little kid who was born after everything happened to 
understand that."  "Uh, sorry?"

Sheryll, the best is yet to come... wishing you many happy returns.  :-)

--Ebony AKA AngieJ
_________________________________________________________________
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From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Sat Jun  9 01:25:41 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 01:25:41 -0000
Subject: Interesting question
In-Reply-To: <C24A5363CA@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <9frtul+t8rd@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rachel Bray" <bray.262 at o...> wrote:
> This was from the daily calendar:
> 
> Harry and Ron didn't quite know what to make of Hermione when 
> they first encountered her.  Do you think you would be friends with 
> Hermione upon first meeting her?
> 
> My answer is no.  She came across exactly like the type of kid I 
> hated being around.  It would have to take a mutual experience like 
> they (Harry, Ron and Hermione) had to make me friends with her.  
> Then again, most of the people I grew up with were very Weasley 
> twins-ish.  So, Hermione would have REALLY rubbed me wrong 
> when first meeting her.
> 
> Don't get me wrong.  I'm nuts about her now.  :-)

If I met Hermione on the Hogwarts Express in SS/PS, I would have found 
her to be very irritating with her chatter. Ditto for her chattering 
before the Sorting Ceremony.

After the first Potions class, I would have been very wary about 
Hermione. She would have struck me as a "gunner" and a "throat"; the 
worst combination in student types possible. A gunner is an extremely 
studious student. They don't necessarily have "natural" intelligence, 
but they make up for it with their studying. A throat is short for 
"cut throat", that kind of student who'll do anything to increase his 
standing in the class, including making others appear comparatively 
incompetent. 

So, I wouldn't have liked Hermione after the first couple of days of 
school.

:-)Milz (whose academic life exposed her to "turtles" and "sponges" 
too)




From find_sam at hotmail.com  Sat Jun  9 01:58:17 2001
From: find_sam at hotmail.com (find_sam at hotmail.com)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 01:58:17 -0000
Subject: Too many twins?
In-Reply-To: <20010608133602.88677.qmail@web14503.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9frvrp+1819@eGroups.com>

Amber wrote:
> Out of curiousity, what is it like to have a twin? Is there an extra
> closeness that "regular" brothers and sisters don't have? What are 
the
> down sides to it? Are these prying questions?

As far as my experience as being a twin goes, it's just like having a 
regular brother or sister. It might be different with identical 
twins, though. My sister is more of a friend than an actual sister, 
though, because we share the same group of friends.

Actually that reminds me of a funny story... when I was about 16, my  
twin sister and I were getting a lift home with a friend and the 
friend's parents. My sister and I told the parent that we lived 
together - unfortunately the parent didn't grasp the fact that we 
were twins and actually though that we were *living together*, in the 
non family context!

And when we went to get our drivers' licences, the driving instructor 
asked Amy (my twin) if I was her boyfriend. Amy replied, 'No!' with a 
suitable amount of disgust <g>

I can't really think of any downsides of being a twin. Like everyone 
else, I've always wished that I had an identical twin! Sometimes I'd 
prefer it if I had a twin brother rather than a twin sister, though, 
but everything thinks that sort of thing.

> Sam

" 'I think it was a bit of an overreaction,' said the serpent. 'I 
mean, first offense and everything. I can't see what's so bad about 
knowing the difference between good and evil, anyway.' "
>  - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

PS, Great sig, Amber... I love that book!




From find_sam at hotmail.com  Sat Jun  9 02:02:14 2001
From: find_sam at hotmail.com (find_sam at hotmail.com)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 02:02:14 -0000
Subject: ADMIN: Announcements go on the Announcements List
In-Reply-To: <B74457DF.25A5%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <9fs036+megv@eGroups.com>

John wrote:
> Since March, ALL announcement-type messages go to the
> HPFGU-Announcements YahooGroup. 

What?! All announcements on the Announcements List? What a load of 
dragon dung... next you'll be telling us that all off topic messages 
are to be posted on the OT List! *grumbles*

> Sam, the Ironic




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Sat Jun  9 04:18:40 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 00:18:40 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Sheryll"s Birthday June 9th Happy Birthday early  wishes
References: <20010608144034.18145.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3B21A3A0.B61E7166@sympatico.ca>

HAPPY BIRTHDAY SHERYLLLL!!!!!!!!!!!! (I have your birthday card for you,
wanna come get it?)

Sheryll Townsend wrote:

>
> --- Wanda Mallett <witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> <snip much singing from Wanda and the wizard wannabes>
> >
> > This makes how many candles to blow out?
>
> Dare I admit this? 42
> Note to Neil: I suspect that I am getting close to
> having to admit to middle aged!
> >
> > Wanted to get this out early because, Saturday my
> > Dad
> > will be over and I didn't want to miss sending a big
> > Happy Birthday
> >
> >
> >  I    I      O       O      X XXXXXX
> >  I    I      O       O      X
> >  IIIIII      O       O      X   X X X
> >  I    I      O       O      X       X
> >  I    I      O O O O O      X X X X X
> >
> > Wanda The Witch and Her Merry Band of Muggles
> > (wizard
> > wannabes)
>
> Thank you very much.
>
> Sheryll, the only person in her family who does not
> get a party
>
> =====
> "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and
> taste good with ketchup."
>
> __________________________________________________
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>
>
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--
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All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

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This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Sat Jun  9 11:23:15 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 04:23:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Sheryll"s Birthday June 9th Happy Birthday early  wishes
In-Reply-To: <3B21A3A0.B61E7166@sympatico.ca>
Message-ID: <20010609112315.59897.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca>
wrote:
> HAPPY BIRTHDAY SHERYLLLL!!!!!!!!!!!! (I have your
> birthday card for you,
> wanna come get it?)
> 

Great, I'll be right over! Hmmm... it's 7:15 a.m.,
hmmm...you've been working nights. Okay, I'll wait til
you get up!

Sheryll, who's husband made her carrot cake, but
didn't frost it yet and has now gone off to work for
the next 12 hours (he didn't tell me about the change
in his work schedule until this morning) - well, at
least he remembered the birthday

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

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From rja.carnegie at excite.com  Sat Jun  9 13:24:53 2001
From: rja.carnegie at excite.com (rja.carnegie at excite.com)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 13:24:53 -0000
Subject: Narnia
In-Reply-To: <9fl7vp+u88a@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9ft835+4lm0@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> from the NYT:
> 
> >  They have struck deals to license plush Narnian toys. The series
> > publisher, HarperCollins, revealed plans to create new Narnia
> > novels by unidentified authors, to the outrage of some devoted
> > readers. (What next? "Narnia Barbie in a school uniform?" asked one
> > fan in a Lewis electronic forum.)
> > 
> >  Most striking of all, they have developed a discreet strategy to
> > avoid direct links to the Christian imagery and theology that
> > suffused the Narnia novels and inspired Lewis.
> 
> My dad reported this to me with great horror the other day.  Now that 
> I read the article, it isn't as bad as I feared.  From what he'd said, 
> I thought they were actually rewriting the original 7 books to tone 
> down the Christian connection.  I was getting ready to chain myself to 
> the steps of Canterbury Cathedral.
> 
> The additional books are depressing, but I doubt they will ever come 
> close to the artistry of the original.  This has been done with lots 
> of books (Oz e.g.) and in my admittedly limited experience, the fans 
> usually say "they're okay, but they're not Baum," or "Lewis," or 
> whomever, and that's that.  

I see _The Horse and his Boy_ as kind of an "extra" story, anyway.
I was about to say "because it isn't about the Narnian royal family",
but then I remembered - not to spoil - where they come in later,
after all.

The other day I freaked out Usenet alt.fan.harry-potter just
by suggesting that a successful Harry Potter film could lead
to a Saturday morning television cartoon series of "original"
stories.  I guess that the same goes for Narnia - i.e., that
it would freak you out, too.

I want to express an idea about how important it may be
for any story, but particularly fantastic stories for children,
to have a moral foundation of some sort.  It won't quite come.
Some of us, reading Narnia as adults, keep doing double-takes
as Christian bits turn up.  I think JKR is subtler, I won't argue
whether she's as clever - but Harry Potter's adventures aren't
such obvious pure morality plays.

Robert Carnegie
Meretricious!





From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Sat Jun  9 14:00:15 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (Laurin York)
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 07:00:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Narnia
In-Reply-To: <9ft835+4lm0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010609140015.19857.qmail@web14701.mail.yahoo.com>

  
> The other day I freaked out Usenet alt.fan.harry-
> potter just by suggesting that a successful Harry 
> Potter film could lead to a Saturday morning 
> television cartoon series of "original" stories.  I 
> guess that the same goes for Narnia - i.e., that
> it would freak you out, too.
>   
> Robert Carnegie
> Meretricious!
> 

I think JKR would never permit such a thing, but it's
not a totally unfounded fear.  One example of this is
the book Jumanji, which is a fairly short picture-book
for children by Chris Van Allsburg.  It was expanded
into a movie with Bonnie Hunt and Robin Williams which
bore only a passing resemblance to the brief book. 
After that, a cartoon Jumanji show was licensed which
is now in syndication.  I have no idea what Van
Allsburg was thinking, except that people who write
and illustrate children's picture books probably don't
make very much money.  The board game alone probably
makes him some nice pocket change.

But--the animation is horrible-looking and bears no
resemblance whatsoever to Van Allsburg's fabulous
illustrations, plus his original moral is completely
lost. I wince whenever my nieces and nephews watch it.
 (If I were their mom, however...)

Luckily, JKR is fairly well-off now; I think the real
danger to Harry Potter may come decades in the future,
when JKR's daughter may have control over his
fate...but for now, I trust Rowling and have high
hopes for the movie. 

--Laurin


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From mecks at prodigy.net  Sat Jun  9 14:18:36 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 09:18:36 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Narnia
References: <20010609140015.19857.qmail@web14701.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <016401c0f0ef$13a67560$2cb8fea9@hale>


----- Original Message -----
From: Laurin York <lyorkus at yahoo.com>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2001 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Narnia


> I think JKR would never permit such a thing, but it's
> not a totally unfounded fear.  One example of this is
> the book Jumanji, which is a fairly short picture-book
> for children by Chris Van Allsburg.  It was expanded
> into a movie with Bonnie Hunt and Robin Williams which
> bore only a passing resemblance to the brief book.
> After that, a cartoon Jumanji show was licensed which
> is now in syndication.  I have no idea what Van
> Allsburg was thinking, except that people who write
> and illustrate children's picture books probably don't
> make very much money.  The board game alone probably
> makes him some nice pocket change.

Actually, another example would be Redwall by Jaques something.  I've seen
the cartoons on PBS and they are often introed by the author.  The animation
wasn't that bad for it and it was still entertaining (though I have no idea
how close they are to the original.)

Michela Ecks




From rja.carnegie at excite.com  Sat Jun  9 14:33:01 2001
From: rja.carnegie at excite.com (rja.carnegie at excite.com)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 14:33:01 -0000
Subject: Hermione, names, twins
In-Reply-To: <F21Jm2ZBNCogiwHsqhA0000ac16@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9ftc2t+mlbv@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Re: the Weasleys' dinstinguished names:  Robert noted the prevalence of 
> royal names.  Virginia is a royal name also, no?  I assume the name predates 
> Elizabeth I, but the state Virginia was named for her, not, IIRC, for the 
> Virgin Mary (it was established, albeit abortively, by Walter Raleigh).

Well, maybe I should have checked.  www.babyname.com (which
I've been warned not to trust, of course, but never mind that)
says that "[Virginia] was first spelled Verginia, and was the
feminine form of an ancient Roman clan name, Verginius.
Over time its spelling changed due to its association with
the Latin term virgo, meaning ''maiden.'' This meaning has
driven the use of the name ever since.  In 1587, it was
the name given the first baby born to English colonists in
the New World, Virginia Dare.  Both the baby and her home
colony were named for Elizabeth I, the Virgin Queen of
England" - abortively, as you say: no one knows what
happened to the colony.

Ronald was where I was stuck and struggling ;-)

> >I suppose that two sets of (identical?) twins, in different
> >years in the school, isn't statistically unusual.  Nevertheless,
> >I wonder if JKR has something special planned for all of them...
> 
> Comedy of Errors comes to Hogwarts?

Not _quite_ what I had in mind - although mistaken identity
and impersonation stories can be fun.  However, there's
Polyjuice Potion for that, if we want it.

I didn't have anything concrete in mind - only whether
there were two sets of twins available just by "chance",
or whether JKR wanted to have them available later on
for some reason, morbid or otherwise.  The concensus
seems to be for reasonable chance.

Robert Carnegie
Meretricious!





From rja.carnegie at excite.com  Sat Jun  9 14:38:58 2001
From: rja.carnegie at excite.com (rja.carnegie at excite.com)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 14:38:58 -0000
Subject: two Hermiones in a bed
In-Reply-To: <9fq71p+v360@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9ftce2+ooar@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rita Winston" <catlady at w...> wrote:
> back on the main list, Catherine said:
> 
> > I'm being very frivolous here, but in that case
> > (looking at the Hermione thing - two in a bed)
> > shouldn't Hermione's name be Narcissa?
> > BTW:  I just can't see Hermione as being the 
> > slightest bit that way inclined.  Reason:  well,
> > she wasn't in the least bit affected by the 
> > Veela/and Fleur, was she?
> 
> This was already brought here from the main list once before, but 
> all I saw in that thread was about Veelas, how do gay women react 
> to them, etc. Having now reached the original message on the main 
> list, I see it also contains that Narcissism thing. My vote is that 
> having sex with yourself (NOT the same as your identical twin) is 
> more like masturbation than like homosexuality.

I agree, but I didn't think the main list needed to know it.
It's a form of sexual experimentation that doesn't involve
anyone else - a major drawback for those of us without
Time-Turners.  However, I think that not only lesbian turn-ons,
but everyone's turn-ons, are different, anyway, although I'm no
expert - Contest #5 notwithstanding.

I was just itching to post a reference to what Woody Allen said
in _Annie Hall_ - I /did/ resist the temptation, didn't I?

Robert Carnegie
Meretricious!





From john at walton.to  Sat Jun  9 14:57:54 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 10:57:54 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: ADMIN: Announcements go on the Announcements List
In-Reply-To: <9fs036+megv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <B747B1B2.274A%john@walton.to>

find_sam at hotmail.com said:

> What?! All announcements on the Announcements List? What a load of
> dragon dung... next you'll be telling us that all off topic messages
> are to be posted on the OT List! *grumbles*

You'd be surprised at how many people don't realise that ANNOUNCEMENTS go on
the HPFGU-ANNOUNCEMENTS list, and OT and CHATTER messages go on the
HPFGU-OTCHATTER list.

--John, Moderator With Lack O'Subtlety
________________________________

John Walton -- john at walton.to

Current...
Movie: Shrek. 11/10!
CD: Shrek Soundtrack ::grin::
Song: "Hallelujah": Rufus Wainwright (from Shrek soundtrack)
________________________________




From mrs_snape at yahoo.de  Sat Jun  9 15:03:22 2001
From: mrs_snape at yahoo.de (Mrs Snape (Dinah))
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 17:03:22 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: ADMIN: Announcements go on the Announcements List
References: <B747B1B2.274A%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <008901c0f0f5$55cfa820$1b2907d5@oemcomputer>

John's sig line:
>Current...
>Song: "Hallelujah": Rufus Wainwright (from Shrek soundtrack)

This song is my crucible right now. It's on 24/7 and even if I have the
CD-player off I can't get it out of my head.... Just too lovely.

And in haven't even seen the movie cause it's not been released yet :-(

D**



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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Sat Jun  9 16:22:21 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony AKA AngieJ)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 16:22:21 -0000
Subject: A Wizarding Superstore?  Help!
Message-ID: <9ftift+u8mr@eGroups.com>

Hey, OT-Chatters...

I haven't bothered picking your brains like this since the help you 
guys gave with "Christmas Dinner in England" and "Truths in the 
Wizarding World".  (Well, with "break-up songs", but I won't need 
that just yet.  I was just asking for future reference.  ;-))

Six months later, I need your help again!

If there was a wizarding version of the American superstore (Super 
Wal-mart, Super K-Mart, Meijer's, etc.), what would it sell?  I'm 
trying to make a list of departments here...

And before you say "this would never happen--this world is too 
traditional--they wouldn't like it" rest assured that this conflict 
of interest is being exploited as a source of tension.

So what would be sold there?  I'm thinking the establishment (can't 
give you the name yet, it'd be a spoiler if you're reading TiP) 
wouldn't be as glossy and plate-glassy and brand spanking new as the 
Targets that are gobbling up greenspace in metro areas... it'd be 
more like the great catalog stores of the past like Eaton's and Sears 
Roebuck... more of the feel of a general store to the nth power when 
one steps inside.

Jana and I were making a list of items that one could purchase there 
the other night... "broomstick clippers", "robe 
fasteners", "squirtberries by the pint", "Boswell's Best Bundimun 
Scouring Agent" ("my own invention", as the White Knight says), and a 
few others.

Can you think of anything else?  It could be something you've always 
wanted to pick up at what my grandmother still calls the "ten-cent 
store", but couldn't possibly get on the Muggle side of things.  
Since I'm not so sure that *all* magic food can be spontaneously 
generated (although I *do* hear the argument that the Weasleys may 
have starved to death otherwise), I'll throw in a grocery department 
to boot.  The only thing is, these people seem to eat the same things 
that Muggles do--how does magic make grocery shopping easier?  

Any help you can provide with this will be appreciated... and duly 
acknowledged.

--Ebony AKA AngieJ




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Sat Jun  9 16:39:57 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 16:39:57 -0000
Subject: A Wizarding Superstore?  Help!
In-Reply-To: <9ftift+u8mr@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9ftjgt+rla9@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Ebony AKA AngieJ" <ebonyink at h...> wrote:
> Jana and I were making a list of items that one could purchase     
> there the other night... "broomstick clippers", "robe 
> fasteners", "squirtberries by the pint", "Boswell's Best Bundimun 
> Scouring Agent" ("my own invention", as the White Knight says), and 
> a few others.
> 
> Can you think of anything else?  

Well how about things like off the peg robes, rather than the  
traditional made to measure stuff that you would get in Madam 
Malkin's.


Simon (giving this some thought)




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Sat Jun  9 17:47:39 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 10:47:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Here is another HAPPY BIRTHDAY To SHERYLL
Message-ID: <20010609174739.21201.qmail@web13707.mail.yahoo.com>

HAPPY BIRTHDAY SHERYLL
AND HAVE A GOOD TIME TODAY!!!!

TOOK A FEW MINUTES AWAY FROM THE OLD CAULDRON AND HAD
TO SEND OUT MORE WISHES TO YOU FROM ALL OF US MUGGLES
ENYOY YOUR CARROT CAKE!!!

Wanda

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From mrs_snape at yahoo.de  Sat Jun  9 17:49:02 2001
From: mrs_snape at yahoo.de (Mrs Snape (Dinah))
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 19:49:02 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] A Wizarding Superstore?  Help!
References: <9ftift+u8mr@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <00e801c0f10c$79a60980$1b2907d5@oemcomputer>

Well, there are the different target groups... 

I'm sure many girls are intersted in "101 spells to make you irresistible" and "Magical Way to the Best Make-Up". Those not only include books with tips, but I'm sure companies have research departements that invent constantly new spells. How would you sell new spells... 1) in books, 2) potions and creams with magical ingredients in jars, 3) maybe you need a magical mirror and similar...

Then there's always "Make life easier". Self-sweeping brooms, boxes that you just pop-up and swirl your wand over and you have the perfect birthday-cake with candles and icing, and maybe dancing and flashing numbers that indicated the age of...

Can't think of more at the top of my head...

~ Dinah ~    

ICQ: 10 44 52 471
YM: bludger_witch

"Sometimes people think that home is a place. It can be a person." 

~ Gabrielle, "Back in the Bottle"


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun  9 20:39:29 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Catlady)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 13:39:29 -0700
Subject: 1960s - Weasley Names - wizarding superstore - Age 40
Message-ID: <3B228980.E6603990@wicca.net>

John, you never reply when I tell you that Araminta is NOT a 1960s name,
it's an 1860s  name. As you're writing a time-travel story, were Minty's
parents influenced by their visit to EIGHTEEEN-sixty?

I suspect the short names by which we know the Weasleys are in most
cases their given names, not nicknames. (I heard that there was a club
named The Society of the Unbroken Name, for people who hated to be
called by a nickname, when three people I knew said they had joined it.
Their birth certificates said Vicki, Tony, and Tony, not Victoria,
Anthony, and Antoinette. That is evidence that some parents give
'nicknames' as given names.)

For Ron, we have evidence that his name IS Ronald, as Dumbledore said
"Ronald Weasley, who has always been overshadowed by his brothers". That
completely ruins any theory of the names being in alphabetical order
because Ronald does NOT begin with H.

(How convenient it would have been if we could have said that Ron is
short for Heron. I once had a theory of alphabetical order of
consonants: Bill, Charlie, D. Percy, Fred, George, Heron, Jennifer
Juniper. To do it with consonants, you have to start with Arthur and
assume a dead Weasley for letter D, but you get the advantage of calling
Ginny "Imogen" or "Iphigenia". Hey, the latter fits her plot in CoS: the
rescued sacrifice!)

The same evidence, what Dumbledore says: "I believe your friends Misters
Fred and George Weasley were responsible for trying to send you a toilet
seat" shows that Fred isn't Frederick.

My own guess is that Bill is short for Bilius, possibly named after
Uncle Bilius who died when he saw a Grim, Ron is Ronald, and the rest we
know by their given names.

Ebony wrote:

> If there was a wizarding version of the American superstore
> (Super Wal-mart, Super K-Mart, Meijer's, etc.), what would it sell?

I've already invented a business named Kitchen Witchery, founded by
Pansy Parkinson's grandfather, and now run by her aunt,

(Pansy's father, in my world, started his own business that he likes
better: a hot-shit nightclub on Seezon Alley (hi, Heidi!) and a resort
hotel)

which makes enchanted gourmet cookware and kitchenware. The business has
several classy retail specialty shops (in Hogsmeade, Diagon Alley,
southern France, Paris, Italy) and also wholesales to classy restaurants
and hotels. Super Wiz-Mart could sell cheap imitations under the name of
Parkerson and Kitchen Witchy-poo.

The other night. I thought Kitchen Witchery might also make tableware:
the enchanted serving platter that wafts around the table from diner to
diner, the enchanted serving fork that puts food from the platter onto
the plate of the diner whose turn it is, the enchanted wine carafe that
can be programmed to cut down on the refills of people who are starting
to have too much fun...

The superstores have a garden section. Imagine the Herbology plants
carrying on in a store. And potions to make vegetables grow faster or
bigger, and self-weeding mulches, and numerous anti-gnome gimmicks: that
sings out of key whenever a gnome is around, but unfortunately gnomes
are tone-deaf and not chased off...

I invented another business. Comfort & Joy was founded almost two
hundred years ago by two sisters, Alexandra Powers Comfort and
Wilhelmina Powers Joy, who started by making shampoo potions that were
both effective and pleasant-scented.

They started by brewing the potions in Billie's kitchen and selling them
at witches' tea parties in Allie's house, increased their product line,
built a factory with employees and an attached retail shop (at which
time they had to name it) to compete with all the wizarding shops they
wholesale to, and left the business to their children, who further
diversified the product line.

The Comfort & Joy brand-name product Heal-Quick has become the generic
name for enchanted bandages-- which are enchanted not only to adhere, to
somewhat adjust their size and shape to fit better, and to come off
PAINLESSLY, but to be sterile, microbicidal, and promoter of speedy,
scarless healing.

Ebony wrote:
> Although I think I *did* agree with the above theory sometime and
somewhere

In TiP (was it episode 9?), when Angelina visits the Diamond Dinosaur
and reflects that  -"-everyone knows that witches are at their best
between 40 and 60-"- . I enjoyed sharing your fantasy that wizarding
folk fancy ripe minds as well as ripe figures, but I also noted that
wizarding folk age slower than Muggles, and between 40 and 60 for
witches might be like maybe between 25 and 35 for Muggles. Still a
pleasant contrast to our dominant culture's notion that women are only
attractive from 18 to 25.

>  "No, because 24 messes up the rhyme... but then, we
> wouldn't expect a little kid who was born after everything
> happened to understand that."

We have to make a different rhyme ... four-and-twenty candles, one per
blackbird baked into a cake?

I am bothered by so many people nowdays thinking that I was around when
things were happening. AROUND, yes, but not INVOLVED: I've mentioned
that I didn't know what 'assassinated' meant when JFK was assassinated,
and I never noticed the Civil Rights thing while it was going on (I feel
so humbled by my older friends who did go to register voters in
Mississippi). I can add that I never heard of Woodstock while it was
happening, not until I saw the movie in a revival house, and didn't
realize that the Watts riot were in the same city whose suburb I was
living in.

When you young people are old and tired and can't keep up with all the
changes that keep going on -- can't recognize the names of FAMOUS
musicians and actors and athletes -- have no idea how the new features
on the cell phone work, then you will be envious of the young people who
are up to date with all this stuff.
--
          /\ /\
           + +     Mews and views
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston

                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((





From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun  9 20:42:52 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 20:42:52 -0000
Subject: some stuff that came in the e-mail
Message-ID: <9fu1oc+71lc@eGroups.com>

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Harry Pottersong (was edress for Steve Mac)
Date: 08 Jun 2001 22:17:43 GMT
From: msminlr at aol.comstatic (Margaret Middleton)
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Newsgroups: rec.music.filk
References: <ZgnT6.1579$1Z3.138501 at newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>

>> Harry Potter
>> ttto 'Little Boxes' by Malvina Reynolds
[by SteveMac]

<snip lyric>

I saw a T-shirt this past weekend that came from BigDogs, with a 
spoof book cover on it of "Harry Pawter and the Gobble-it of Fur", by 
"J R Growling".  The guy had got it last summer; does anyone know if 
they still have that one in stock? I'd be willing to reimburse the 
purchase price plus mailing costs (if we couldn't arrange a fannish 
transfer).

--------------------------------------------------------------------

I also received a spam:

> I saw you're a member of a Harry Potter fan club, so I wanted to
> tell you about a book I've just written titled "The Magical Worlds
> of Harry Potter". It's all about the myths, legends, and 
> fascinating facts that JK Rowling uses so briiliantly - - from 
> alchemists to unicorns, from basilisks to veela.
> You can see sample pages from the book at its website: 
> http://www.magicalpotter.com








From editor at texas.net  Sat Jun  9 21:02:36 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 16:02:36 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Sheryll"s Birthday June 9th Happy Birthday early  wishes
References: <20010608144034.18145.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3B228EEB.474A12A2@texas.net>

Sheryll Townsend wrote:

> Sheryll, the only person in her family who does not
> get a party

You can have half of the one we just got finished with for Kasia.
There'd be plenty left for her.

Happy Birthday from the exhausted mother of a proud new *six* year old,
Tammy Faye Lewanski, off breaking in her new makeup kit

--Amanda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From john at walton.to  Sat Jun  9 21:03:33 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 17:03:33 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] some stuff that came in the e-mail
In-Reply-To: <9fu1oc+71lc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <B7480765.27A7%john@walton.to>

Rita Winston said:

>>> Harry Potter
>>> ttto 'Little Boxes' by Malvina Reynolds
> [by SteveMac]

Rita -- I'd love to see the Filk that you snipped. Any chance of sending it
over?

--john

________________________________

John Walton -- john at walton.to

Current...
Movie: Shrek. 11/10!
CD: Shrek Soundtrack ::grin::
Song: "Hallelujah": Rufus Wainwright (from Shrek soundtrack)
________________________________




From john at walton.to  Sat Jun  9 21:28:38 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 17:28:38 -0400
Subject: Kinda ADMINy: Your Email Forwarding Mantra
In-Reply-To: <B7480765.27A7%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <B7480D45.27AE%john@walton.to>

Since I have gotten a great deal of spam in the past weeks, I'd like to post
a valuable reminder/mantra to separate the true stuff from the real spam.

NOW EVERYONE SAY IT WITH ME ...

"I will NOT get bad luck, lose my friends, or lose my mailing list if I
DON'T forward an e-mail. I will NOT hear any music, see a taco dog, or see a
cool pop-up screen if DO forward an e-mail.

Bill Gates is NOT going to send me money, Victoria's Secret doesn't know
anything about a gift certificate they're supposed to send me and Ford will
not give me a 50% discount even if I have forwarded my e-mail to more than
50 people.

I will NEVER receive gift certificates, coupons, or freebies from Coca Cola,
Cracker Barrel, Old Navy, or anyone else if I send an e-mail to 10 people
who don't know who I am anyway.

I will NEVER see a pop up window if I forward an e-mail ...NEVER!!!!

My phone will not MYSTERIOUSLY ring after I forward an e-mail. There is NO
SUCH THING as an e-mail tracking program, and I am not STUPID enough to
think that someone will send me $100 for forwarding an e-mail to 10 or more
people.

There is no kid with cancer through the Make a Wish program in England
collecting anything. He did when he was 7 yrs old. He is now cancer free and
35 years old and DOESN'T WANT ANYMORE POST CARDS, CALLING CARDS or GET WELL
CARDS!

The government does not have a bill in congress called 901B (or whatever
they named it this week) that if passed will enable them to charge us 5
cents for every sent e-mail.

There will be NO cool dancing, singing, waving, colorful flower, character,
or program I will receive immediately after I forward an e-mail. People are
just trying to talk me into doing it to make me look like a fool.

The American Red Cross will NOT donate 50 cents to a certain individual
dying of some never heard of before disease for every e-mail address I send
this to. The American Red Cross RECEIVES donations, they don't donate!

And finally, I WILL NOT let others guilt me into sending things onto my
friends for fear they will think I am not their friend ...  or by telling me
I have no conscience or don't believe in my deity!

If my deity wants to send me a message, I believe the bushes in my yard will
burn or the words will appear to me in a cave before s/he picks up a PC to
pass it along ...  but even if it does come by e-mail, s/he will send me one
at which point I'm SURE I will know it will be from him/her. AND if s/he
does, I'm sure s/he will care enough to delete all those annoying forwards
inside it!

Now, repeat this 4 times to yourself until you've memorized it and then send
it along to at least 5 of your friends before the next full moon or you will
surely be constipated for the next 3 months and all of your hair will fall
out!!!!"

--John




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Sat Jun  9 22:37:08 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 15:37:08 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Interesting question
In-Reply-To: <C24A5363CA@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <20010609223708.99504.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>


i think I would have been friends with her. Quite frankly she is a lot like me and was one of my favorite characters.  However, I'm very goody-goodish.

Melanie



Hey everyone please go to my Harry Potter site at:  http://www.angelfire.com/realm/hogwarts2/index.html

 


 



---------------------------------
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Personal Address - Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Sat Jun  9 23:39:59 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 23:39:59 
Subject: Multiculturalism
Message-ID: <F184IZS2TRqf69aZbLA00018fc9@hotmail.com>

>From the main list...

Rita wrote:
I wrote:
>
> > Forced multiculturalism is not authentic IMO and useless
> > in teaching children how to live. (snip) I really like the way
> > Rowling handles ethnicity--she mentions it, then lets the
> > kids act like all the other kids instead of venturing into
> > dangerous ethnic stereotypes like too many writers do.

Rita wrote:
>IMHO race is a matter of physical appearance and pedigree, while culture is 
>a learned system of thought and behavior. I therefore am disturbed by the 
>modern use of 'multicultural' to mean 'multiracial', as in Crayola coming 
>up with a set of crayons in human skin, hair, and eye colors and naming it 
>the Multicultural pack
>
>I imagine that British wizard-born students are all from the same
>culture, British wizarding culture, regardless of their race, but the
>Muggle-born students might come from different cultures, 'mainstream'
>cultures of region and social class, immigrant and 'minority' cultures.
>
>I don't know about UK, but in US, a writer is in a double-bind: if she
>portrays the black or Asian characters as just the same as the white
>characters except for their appearance and names, she is condemned for
>ignoring their unique African-American or Asian-American culture and
>turning them into Oreos/bananas. But if she tries to show the white,
>black, and Asian characters acting according to their different cultures
>(e.g. the white guests arrive too early for a multi-racial party thrown
>by a black hostess), then she is condemned for stereotyping.
>----

Well, I can't really talk about any other culture besides my own with any 
authority.  But I do know that it *is* stereotyping to suggest that in 
general blacks have a laissez-faire attitude towards punctuality.  <g>  It's 
a variable that definitely varies according to region.

Which brings me to another question.  What *is* an Oreo or a banana?  A 
black kid who speaks correct English and listens to rock music?  An 
Asian-American girl who dates white guys?

Labels are harmful.  Not to mention pointless.  I never knew how pointless 
until I attended a historically and predominantly black university for 
undergrad.  It changed me--and I never actually analyzed that change until I 
started graduate school and a professor pointed out something interesting.

I think I would have agreed with Rita before I spent four years having every 
single idea I had about the cultural and spatial politics of blackness being 
shattered.  I arrived on the campus of Florida A&M University (12,000 
students--huge for an HBCU, midsized for all colleges) *very* arrogant about 
my self-identity as a black woman.  After all, Detroit is statistically the 
"darkest" major city in the U.S.--of course I felt I was an expert on the 
matter.  ;-)

Then I went to school with black kids from all 50 states of the union 
("you're from NORTH DAKOTA?"), what seemed like every island in the 
Caribbean ("what do you mean, you don't identify with American blacks?"), 
and every continent ("you're fluent in Japanese?  And do you mean to tell me 
you've NEVER had soul food?").  I met black kids from England (the 
editor-in-chief of the school newspaper), black kids from C'ote de Ivoire 
who would speak in rapid-fire French before classes, and many, many black 
kids from the South who had their own stereotypes about the great Northern 
cities ("it's not *that* bad up there!  And yes, we do have family 
values!").  I met an Egyptian girl, a devout Muslim, who I talked religion 
and politics with as we waited on the campus shuttle.

I had housemates from Georgia, Delaware, Florida, Massachusetts via Texas, 
and Tennessee--and I *know* that we came from  different contexts, because I 
got made fun of.  Take food as just one example.  I got laughed at for 
mulling cider and crisping cake doughnuts right before Christmas finals.  
And eating oatmeal.  And thinking that a chili dog was a delicacy (it is in 
SE Michigan!).  And making homemade biscuits for breakfast, then drowning 
them in maple syrup instead of gravy.  I won't even get started on music, 
slang, political views, ideas about race relations, and cultural 
subtleties--I was amazed at how many misunderstandings arose because we 
couldn't understand each other!

The result was that I was presented with so many different facets of the 
African Diaspora that my world was opened wide.  White people are not 
assigned to some monolithic identity... they are allowed to be individuals.  
Yet and still we are told that if black does not look and act a certain way, 
then it is not authentic blackness.  I'm sure that members of other "ethnic" 
groups feel the same way.

I like Rita's defs of race and culture... but black culture is so varied 
that it really defies labeling.  As my seminar prof said this winter, "what 
it means to be black in Wichita is a bit different than what it means to be 
black in Newark, which is even more different than what it means to be black 
in Amsterdam."

The reason why a blanket identity has been forced upon blacks is because of 
historic oppression.  Some embrace the stereotypes--for instance, the more 
negative aspects of hip-hop culture.  However, most blacks are neither thugs 
nor the Huxtables.  They're just regular people living regular lives, as 
Tupac says, "trying to make a dollar out of fifteen cents."  You cannot get 
an accurate view of people from the media, from books, or from knowing a 
handful of them... which is why I always tell students I know absolutely 
nothing about East Asian culture.

It seems to me that commonalities among those of African descent become most 
important when dealing with residual issues from the past.  Like racial 
profiling, which is NOT imaginary... when I asked my students to raise their 
hands if they were ever in the car when mom and dad were pulled over by the 
police... *every* single hand flew up.  That is *scary*--I teach in the most 
affluent school in the city of Detroit, where half of our students' parents 
have professional or terminal degrees!

Or the fact that I can get offline after talking to you guys, hop in my car, 
and go to a bookstore that offers great prices but where no one EVER speaks 
to me.  Even at the register.  Even when I say hello.  No, they're not 
deaf-mutes... when certain others enter, they're accosted by a flurry of 
chatter.  Or the change I see on the faces of some whenever I open my 
mouth--this has happened all my life, whether on a job, in the classroom, or 
at a museum.  You can SEE what people think of you by default--and then when 
you open your mouth, it's like, "Oh!"... and you are moved into the 
Exception to the Rule category.  Which I *hate*... neither of my parents 
finished college, but they spoke standard English and taught us to do the 
same not because it was proper English or white English... just because it 
was *English*.

Group think is all well and good, but there comes a point when it serves to 
further oppress those who it is designed to liberate.  This is why the Jesse 
Jacksons and Louis Farrakhans and Al Sharptons fail to inspire the young the 
way hip-hop music does--their tactics are outdated.

--Ebony AKA AngieJ
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From rosewoof at earthlink.net  Sun Jun 10 00:10:20 2001
From: rosewoof at earthlink.net (Rose Woofenden)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 17:10:20 -0700
Subject: Fwd: A.Word.A.Day-argus
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20010609170901.00a371c0@earthlink.net>

You all probably already know this word, but when it came the other day 
from AWAD, I thought of HP.


>Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 00:01:48 -0400
>From: Wordsmith <wsmith at wordsmith.org>
>To: linguaphile at wordsmith.org
>Subject: A.Word.A.Day--argus
>
>argus (AHR-guhs) noun
>
>    An alert and observant person; a watchful guardian.
>
>[From Greek mythology. After Argus, a giant with 100 eyes who was sent to
>watch over Io. He was later killed by Hermes and after his death his eyes
>transformed into spots on the peacock's tail.]
>
>    "Arnold (Schwarzenegger) knew immediately that `Total Recall' needed
>    an Argus-eyed director who could maintain control over complicated visual
>    effects, extravagant futuristic sets, dangerous stunts, etc. -- while
>    also demanding good performances from his actors."
>    Bill Jones, SCREEN GIANT Muscles Parlayed Into Stardom, The Phoenix
>    Gazette (Phoenix, Arizona), Jun 2, 1990.
>
>This week's theme: Words from the names of newspapers.
>Examples: The Evening Argus (Brighton, UK); the Journal Argus (St. Marys,
>Canada); Many US Arguses: 
>http://ajr.newslink.org/cgi/find.cgi?4=argus&3=&2=&1=
>
>............................................................................
>Every saint has a past and every sinner a future. -Oscar Wilde, writer
>(1854-1900)
>
>Looking for a word or quotation previously featured in AWAD? They are all
>archived at http://wordsmith.org/awad/archives.html . For the theme list,
>see http://wordsmith.org/awad/themes.html . Alphabetical listing of the
>words is available at http://wordsmith.org/awad/wordlist.html
>
>Pronunciation:
>http://wordsmith.org/words/argus.wav
>http://wordsmith.org/words/argus.ram




From ender_w at msn.com  Sun Jun 10 01:28:13 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 21:28:13 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] some stuff that came in the e-mail
References: <9fu1oc+71lc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001101c0f14c$9f761b60$9b421e3f@satellite>


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Rita Winston 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2001 4:42 PM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] some stuff that came in the e-mail



  I saw a T-shirt this past weekend that came from BigDogs, with a 
  spoof book cover on it of "Harry Pawter and the Gobble-it of Fur", by 
  "J R Growling".  The guy had got it last summer; does anyone know if 
  they still have that one in stock? I'd be willing to reimburse the 
  purchase price plus mailing costs (if we couldn't arrange a fannish 
  transfer).

  They still sell those as well as one for the Sorcerer's Stone.  The website is www.bigdogs.com

  ender


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From ender_w at msn.com  Sun Jun 10 01:33:48 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 21:33:48 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Kinda ADMINy: Your Email Forwarding Mantra
References: <B7480D45.27AE%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <002301c0f14d$66ac0820$9b421e3f@satellite>

Thank you John!!  How I hate e-chain-mail!!  I've never gotten any through this list or from anyone on this list, but I do get it from friends and family.  Ironically, I do want to send this one to my friends so maybe they'll get the message.  Would you mind if I did?

ender
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Walton 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2001 5:28 PM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Kinda ADMINy: Your Email Forwarding Mantra


  Since I have gotten a great deal of spam in the past weeks, I'd like to post
  a valuable reminder/mantra to separate the true stuff from the real spam.

  NOW EVERYONE SAY IT WITH ME ...

  "I will NOT get bad luck, lose my friends, or lose my mailing list if I
  DON'T forward an e-mail. I will NOT hear any music, see a taco dog, or see a
  cool pop-up screen if DO forward an e-mail.

  Bill Gates is NOT going to send me money, Victoria's Secret doesn't know
  anything about a gift certificate they're supposed to send me and Ford will
  not give me a 50% discount even if I have forwarded my e-mail to more than
  50 people.

  I will NEVER receive gift certificates, coupons, or freebies from Coca Cola,
  Cracker Barrel, Old Navy, or anyone else if I send an e-mail to 10 people
  who don't know who I am anyway.

  I will NEVER see a pop up window if I forward an e-mail ...NEVER!!!!

  My phone will not MYSTERIOUSLY ring after I forward an e-mail. There is NO
  SUCH THING as an e-mail tracking program, and I am not STUPID enough to
  think that someone will send me $100 for forwarding an e-mail to 10 or more
  people.

  There is no kid with cancer through the Make a Wish program in England
  collecting anything. He did when he was 7 yrs old. He is now cancer free and
  35 years old and DOESN'T WANT ANYMORE POST CARDS, CALLING CARDS or GET WELL
  CARDS!

  The government does not have a bill in congress called 901B (or whatever
  they named it this week) that if passed will enable them to charge us 5
  cents for every sent e-mail.

  There will be NO cool dancing, singing, waving, colorful flower, character,
  or program I will receive immediately after I forward an e-mail. People are
  just trying to talk me into doing it to make me look like a fool.

  The American Red Cross will NOT donate 50 cents to a certain individual
  dying of some never heard of before disease for every e-mail address I send
  this to. The American Red Cross RECEIVES donations, they don't donate!

  And finally, I WILL NOT let others guilt me into sending things onto my
  friends for fear they will think I am not their friend ...  or by telling me
  I have no conscience or don't believe in my deity!

  If my deity wants to send me a message, I believe the bushes in my yard will
  burn or the words will appear to me in a cave before s/he picks up a PC to
  pass it along ...  but even if it does come by e-mail, s/he will send me one
  at which point I'm SURE I will know it will be from him/her. AND if s/he
  does, I'm sure s/he will care enough to delete all those annoying forwards
  inside it!

  Now, repeat this 4 times to yourself until you've memorized it and then send
  it along to at least 5 of your friends before the next full moon or you will
  surely be constipated for the next 3 months and all of your hair will fall
  out!!!!"

  --John


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor 
       
       

  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From editor at texas.net  Sun Jun 10 03:12:19 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 22:12:19 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Newsflash: bluebonnets are lupines
References: <9fniqb+ntep@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B22E592.F293B26F@texas.net>

Amy Z wrote:

> I know the suspense was killing you all, so I thought I'd post that
> Texas bluebonnets are a species, or rather a few species, of lupine.
> And I can see why the songwriter raved about them, because they are an
> incredible deep blue such as you seldom see in flowers; the lupines
> I've seen are a paler, more common blue.  It wasn't just Regional
> Pride Gone Overboard, not that Texans are =ever= guilty of such a
> thing. . .

Let's see, Texans' options on things to be proud of....

heat
scorpions
stickers/sandspurs/other malignant plant life
heat
black widow spiders
brown recluse spiders
Tex-Mex food
rattlesnakes
bluebonnets
mesquite bushes (whoops, sorry, we call them "trees")
one, count 'em, *one* natural lake (Caddo, for the curious)
heat
Aggies
fire ants
killer bees

...what would *you* pick? (yeah, I'd go for the food, too, but you don't
paint big landscapes featuring fajitas and beans, ya know?)

--Amanda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Sun Jun 10 04:02:14 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 21:02:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Moulin Rouge...
Message-ID: <20010610040214.24555.qmail@web14505.mail.yahoo.com>


Well, I finally saw Moulin Rouge tonight. Brilliant, brilliant,
brilliant, brilliant, brilliant! Absolutely frickin' marvelous!

I must admit I had my doubts. I knew it was a love story and I tend to
*loathe* love stories with an all-consuming passion. However, I wanted
to see it because of the costumes, the sets, and the music. From the
veeeery beginning, I fell in love with it. And I didn't mind the love
aspect of it at all. The story was wonderfully well done. I loved the
camera work, loved the atmosphere, loved the dancing, the songs. I
already want to see it again and I rarely want to see movies twice in
the theatre.

And Ewan McGregor! <swoons> I want to find my own bohemian, penniless,
love-worshipping, romantic writer/singer! They can't be too hard to
find, can they?

~Amber
(Who's probably going to try and get the sountrack tomorrow...maybe
she'll meet her own bohemian in the CD store!)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

"It may help to understand human affairs to be clear that most of the 
great triumphs and tragedies of history are caused, not by people being 
fundamentally good or fundamentally bad, but by people being fundamentally people."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu  Sun Jun 10 04:29:36 2001
From: jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu (Jen Faulkner)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 00:29:36 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Moulin Rouge...
In-Reply-To: <20010610040214.24555.qmail@web14505.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106100015440.7340-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>

On Sat, 9 Jun 2001, Amber wrote:

> 
> Well, I finally saw Moulin Rouge tonight. Brilliant, brilliant,
> brilliant, brilliant, brilliant! Absolutely frickin' marvelous!

I just saw it last night, and I am *so* glad I went to see it!  Wow.  
It was indeed fantastic -- the visuals are simply stunning, if a bit,
well, frenetic.  Ewan is cutey-cute and sings very well (much better
than Nicole, IMO); he could totally do traditional musical theater (has
he?).  His character was so sweet -- the poor thing, you just want to
cuddle him.  The story's a little silly, but it serves to hang the
visuals and music on.  I've made plans to go see it again a week from
Monday, and I never go to see movies more than once in the theater,
either.  I can't wait to go again. :)

Absolutely worth the $8.75.

--jen :)

"Will you be the one I've wanted, will you read my mind?
Will you ask me where I hurt, and heal me with your eyes?"
			--melissa ferrick

jen's fics: http://www.eden.rutgers.edu/~jfaulkne/
jen's LJ: http://www.livejournal.com/users/lysimache/





From catlady at wicca.net  Sun Jun 10 05:07:44 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Catlady)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 22:07:44 -0700
Subject: Multi"cultural" - Poltergeists - Filk Song - Texas Tortures - Starving  Artist
Message-ID: <3B2300A0.CD71E69B@wicca.net>

Ebony wrote this great post on multiculturalism and race, and I feel
guilty that I can't think of anything to add.

I had a thought the other day about poltergeists. It seems to be
generally accepted in this real world that a poltergeist is not a being,
but an effect: all that crashing and banging is caused by unconscious
psychokinesis by a frustrated teen. But if a poltergeist were a being,
as Peeves seems to be a being,  if it were a being that ate frustrated
lust and frustrated anger, that would explain why it hangs around places
with frustrated teens, and it could make all the crashing and banging in
order to enrage the people in order to eat their frustrated (because
what can you do to a poltergeist?) rage.

It actually wasn't me who snipped the HP song, it was my friend who
forwarded the other part to me. I've asked her about the song, but if
she doesn't reply (I can't remember whether she is out of town this
weekend), all I can do is suggest trying rec.music.filk, the origin of
the forwarded e-mail.

Speaking of the forwarded e-mail, Thank You ENDER, I passed your info on
to my friend.

Personally, I think the character should be Ha-i-ry Paw-ter, and be a
cat. Meow.

Amanda,
Southern California has heat, deserts, black widow spiders, brown
recluse spiders,  rattlesnakes, and has recently acquired fire ants and
killer bees. That leaves only scorpions as your claim to fame -- and it
is asserted that the LA suburb which recently adopted the classy name
West Hills used to be named Rancho Escorpion...
      I've been thinking about those Quidditch teams. If Quidditch is so
unpopular in US, it would be logical for US teams to represent a larger
geographical area than in places where it is more popular -- shouldn't
that team be Los Tornados Tejanos rather than the Sweetwater All-Stars?
(SoCal has only tiny miniature tornadoes that can't do worse than tear
the roofs off one or two houses.)

Amber,
It's pretty easy to acquire a starving boho artist/musician/writer of
your own. You just have to financially support him, do his laundry, go
applaud all his shows (that's for a musician), maybe sometimes bail him
out of jail...

--
          /\ /\
           + +     Mews and views
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston

                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((





From catlady at wicca.net  Sun Jun 10 06:36:44 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Catlady)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 23:36:44 -0700
Subject: [Fwd: Fwd:  Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] some stuff that came in the e-mail]
Message-ID: <3B23157C.1E1FAF2F@wicca.net>

Lee Gold wrote:

> Rita Winston wrote:
> >
> > PS, John Walton would like to see the snipped song, is there an easier
> > way than sending him to rec.music.filk or whatever it is?
>
> by Steve Macdonald
>
> Harry Potter
> ttto 'Little Boxes' by Malvina Reynolds
>
> Harry Potter on the bookshelves
> Harry Potter on the movie screen
> Harry Potter Harry Potter
> Harry Potter everywhere
> There's a card game, and some trivia
> Some tshirts and Monopoly
> And it's all just Harry Potter
> And the kids buy just the same
>
> And the children in the houses
> Go to all of their local malls
> And they all buy Harry Potter
> Harry Potter everywhere
> Warner Brothers will be closing
> All of their big retail shops
> Get good deals on Harry Potter
> All the kids buy just the same
>
> All the kids play Harry Trivia
> Harry puzzles, Harry card games too
> Harry Potter, Harry Potter
> Harry Potter everywhere
> Children write in Harry journals
> And read all the Harry books
> Reading's cool now, Harry Potter
> All the kids buy, just the same.




--
          /\ /\
           + +     Mews and views
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston

                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((





From catlady at wicca.net  Sun Jun 10 06:45:23 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Catlady)
Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 23:45:23 -0700
Subject: brit climate question
Message-ID: <3B231783.72145938@wicca.net>

Is there snow on the ground in the vicinity of Chipping Sodbury in late
February?

--
          /\ /\
           + +     Mews and views
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston

                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((





From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Sun Jun 10 08:09:46 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:09:46 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] brit climate question
References: <3B231783.72145938@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <007101c0f184$b6d89c00$bf3570c2@c5s910j>

Rita said:

> Is there snow on the ground in the vicinity of Chipping Sodbury in late
> February?

It's possible.

Neil




From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Sun Jun 10 08:22:00 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:22:00 +0100
Subject: Belated HB to Sheryll
Message-ID: <00a901c0f186$6c538b20$bf3570c2@c5s910j>

I just wanted to be probably the last person to wish Sheryll a very happy
birthday!  I had every intention of doing this yesterday, but fell asleep.
It's my age, y'know...

Sheryll, please join me in my pre-middle-aged determination to have much
more fun in this half of my life than I had in the first half.  We have the
youth and the wisdom to achieve this!  Okay, I'll stop there, or Oprah will
be offering me a slot on her show to plug my new book and $79 self help
'system'.

e-hug and e-kiss

Neil




From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Sun Jun 10 08:45:23 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:45:23 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] A Wizarding Superstore?  Help!
References: <9ftift+u8mr@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <00b401c0f189$b0fc1d20$bf3570c2@c5s910j>

Ebony asked:

<<If there was a wizarding version of the American superstore (Super
Wal-mart, Super K-Mart, Meijer's, etc.), what would it sell?  I'm  trying to
make a list of departments here...

 And before you say "this would never happen--this world is too
traditional--they wouldn't like it" rest assured that this conflict  of
interest is being exploited as a source of tension.>>

I think I know the sort of place you're thinking of.  It screams "cheap,
cheap, cheap!" as you walk through the door, and you can find great bargains
there if you are prepared to risk bumping into your neighbours also
pretending not to be there?

Not so much a superstore (and we do have that sort of thing here), but, in
London, we have a lot of small shops that sell "Everything under a pound" or
"Everything for 50p".     They stock the sort of thing I imagine Wal-mart
might stock: a mixture of tea-towels, huge packs of plastic pegs, hideous
china ornaments, cheap nail polish, no-brand batteries, novelty mirrors,
remaindered books, Barbie rejects, fake flowers, chipped crockery, drill
bits, sponges, noxious perfume, multipacks of nylon underpants, leaky pens,
torches, bin liners, garden furniture, plastic machine guns, soap dishes,
music boxes... that sort of thing.   That doesn't directly answer your
question, of course, but I'm sure you could translate some of those horrors.

Neil
________________________________________

Flying Ford Anglia

"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
squashed, as though it had run headlong into a brick wall"
["The Leaky Cauldron", PoA]

Check out Very Frequently Asked Questions for everything
to do with this club:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/VFAQ.htm







From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Sun Jun 10 10:00:24 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 10:00:24 -0000
Subject: Joy of Texas
In-Reply-To: <3B22E592.F293B26F@texas.net>
Message-ID: <9fvgfo+ig0v@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amanda Lewanski <editor at t...> wrote:
> Amy Z wrote:
> 
> > I know the suspense was killing you all, so I thought I'd post 
that
> > Texas bluebonnets are a species, or rather a few species, of 
lupine.
> > And I can see why the songwriter raved about them, because they 
are an
> > incredible deep blue such as you seldom see in flowers; the 
lupines
> > I've seen are a paler, more common blue.  It wasn't just Regional
> > Pride Gone Overboard, not that Texans are =ever= guilty of such a
> > thing. . .
> 
> Let's see, Texans' options on things to be proud of....
> 
> heat
> scorpions
> stickers/sandspurs/other malignant plant life
> heat
> black widow spiders
> brown recluse spiders
> Tex-Mex food
> rattlesnakes
> bluebonnets
> mesquite bushes (whoops, sorry, we call them "trees")
> one, count 'em, *one* natural lake (Caddo, for the curious)
> heat
> Aggies
> fire ants
> killer bees
> 
> ...what would *you* pick? 

Come on, a state (sorry, a Republic--yeah, yeah, Vermont used to be a 
Republic too, it's not that big a deal) whose biggest source of pride 
is being the place where a battle was spectacularly =lost= can surely 
turn sandspurs and brown recluse spiders into an asset!

I see some real marketing potential here.

Texas: Our Ants Will Set You on Fire
Texas: Producing Killer Bugs since 65 Million B.C.
Texas: We Don't Drown in Lakes
etc.

Maybe these things, collectively, are what "Don't Mess with Texas" 
means?

Amy Z
who's never been there.  Got a spare bedroom, Amanda?  I want to see 
if there really is an Alamo Mortuary (obscure reference to an old 
Albert Brooks routine).




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Sun Jun 10 11:00:52 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:00:52 -0000
Subject: Newsflash: bluebonnets are lupines
In-Reply-To: <3B22E592.F293B26F@texas.net>
Message-ID: <9fvk14+ck0a@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amanda Lewanski <editor at t...> wrote:
> 
> Let's see, Texans' options on things to be proud of....
> 
> heat
> scorpions
> stickers/sandspurs/other malignant plant life
> heat
> black widow spiders
> brown recluse spiders
> Tex-Mex food
> rattlesnakes
> bluebonnets
> mesquite bushes (whoops, sorry, we call them "trees")
> one, count 'em, *one* natural lake (Caddo, for the curious)
> heat
> Aggies
> fire ants
> killer bees
> 
> ...what would *you* pick? (yeah, I'd go for the food, too, but you 
don't
> paint big landscapes featuring fajitas and beans, ya know?)
> 
> --Amanda

I'd pick the bluebonnets any day.  But Amanda, you left out something-
-along with the Texas heat comes Texas humidity.  (At least in some 
parts of the state) And another thing for Texas to be proud of:  some 
of the *nicest* people I've met in the course of my job are from 
Texas.  

SC shares some of these things with Texas.  We don't have the Aggies, 
the killer bees, the mesquite bushes, or the bluebonnets, and we're 
blessed with an abundance of lakes and rivers. (most of which are 
natural)  But we do have the heat and humidity.  

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker 

> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Sun Jun 10 11:32:14 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 04:32:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] A Wizarding Superstore?  Help!
In-Reply-To: <00b401c0f189$b0fc1d20$bf3570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <20010610113215.55308.qmail@web14606.mail.yahoo.com>

> Ebony asked:
> 
> <<If there was a wizarding version of the American
> superstore (Super
> Wal-mart, Super K-Mart, Meijer's, etc.), what would
> it sell?  I'm  trying to
> make a list of departments here...
> 
>  And before you say "this would never happen--this
> world is too
> traditional--they wouldn't like it" rest assured
> that this conflict  of
> interest is being exploited as a source of
> tension.>>

Most of these stores also tend to have hardware
departments, so there's a lot to work with there.
Tools that do the job for you, like brushes that will
paint the house, something where you could wave a wand
and get your floors sanded, etc. You could go anywhere
with this department. I think we could something from
this part of the store at our house, which is old and
constantly under renovation (and nothing seems to be
straight, even the floors aren't quite level).

The linens department might include sheets that will
automatically make the beds for you.

Hmmm... how about clothes pegs that will hang the
clothes for you and take them down when they're dry?

Sheryll, wondering why her brain is functioning so
well at 7:30 on a Sunday morning with only 1 coffee
(and decaf at that)


=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From heidit at netbox.com  Sun Jun 10 11:54:25 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (heidit at netbox.com)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:54:25 -0000
Subject: Moulin Rouge...
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106100015440.7340-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>
Message-ID: <9fvn5h+eujr@eGroups.com>

 Jen Faulkner <jfaulkne at e...> wrote:
> On Sat, 9 Jun 2001, Amber wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Well, I finally saw Moulin Rouge tonight. Brilliant, brilliant,
> > brilliant, brilliant, brilliant! Absolutely frickin' marvelous!
> 
> I just saw it last night, and I am *so* glad I went to see it!  Wow. 
 
> It was indeed fantastic -- the visuals are simply stunning, if a 
bit,
> well, frenetic.  Ewan is cutey-cute and sings very well (much better
> than Nicole, IMO); he could totally do traditional musical theater 
(has
> he?).  His character was so sweet -- the poor thing, you just want 
to
> cuddle him.  

I loved this movie, and have offered to go again with my sister in 2 
weeks - and I haven't seen a movie 2 times in the theatres since ANTZ 
- was that in 1998? I also got the soundtrack this week, as a present 
to myself for having such a hellish week, and I haven't been able to 
turn it off in 5 days - my 22 month old loves the Elephant Medley and 
for some reason, Hindi Sad Diamonds and claps when he hears them. 

Of course, none of this has overcome my husband's distate for the 
film, and if he hadn't loved Shrek, which we saw just beforehand, I 
would blame his hatred for the film on the fact that he was developing 
noncontageous viral menengitis at the time :(

But no, he just hated it. Oh well - guess what *I'M* not getting as a 
present for my birthday...?




From john at walton.to  Sun Jun 10 13:20:29 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:20:29 -0400
Subject: Filk: Harry Potter [fwd] (was: some stuff that came in the e-mail)
In-Reply-To: <3B23157C.1E1FAF2F@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <B748EC5D.2823%john@walton.to>

>> by Steve Macdonald
>> 
>> Harry Potter
>> ttto 'Little Boxes' by Malvina Reynolds
>> 
>> Harry Potter on the bookshelves
>> Harry Potter on the movie screen
>> Harry Potter Harry Potter
>> Harry Potter everywhere
>> There's a card game, and some trivia
>> Some tshirts and Monopoly
>> And it's all just Harry Potter
>> And the kids buy just the same
>> 
>> And the children in the houses
>> Go to all of their local malls
>> And they all buy Harry Potter
>> Harry Potter everywhere
>> Warner Brothers will be closing
>> All of their big retail shops
>> Get good deals on Harry Potter
>> All the kids buy just the same
>> 
>> All the kids play Harry Trivia
>> Harry puzzles, Harry card games too
>> Harry Potter, Harry Potter
>> Harry Potter everywhere
>> Children write in Harry journals
>> And read all the Harry books
>> Reading's cool now, Harry Potter
>> All the kids buy, just the same.

Rita, that was hilarious! I've been humming it to myself all morning!
::chortle::

--John

________________________________

John Walton -- john at walton.to

Current...
Movie: Shrek. 11/10!
CD: Shrek Soundtrack ::grin::
Song: "Hallelujah": Rufus Wainwright (from Shrek soundtrack)
________________________________




From john at walton.to  Sun Jun 10 13:24:26 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:24:26 -0400
Subject: US Quidditch
In-Reply-To: <3B2300A0.CD71E69B@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <B748ED4A.2824%john@walton.to>

Catlady said:

> I've been thinking about those Quidditch teams. If Quidditch is so
> unpopular in US, it would be logical for US teams to represent a larger
> geographical area than in places where it is more popular -- shouldn't
> that team be Los Tornados Tejanos rather than the Sweetwater All-Stars?
> (SoCal has only tiny miniature tornadoes that can't do worse than tear
> the roofs off one or two houses.)

I take it to be roughly parallel with the popularity of Rugby in the US --
there're a few teams around the NY area, but they represent a small area and
not a big one -- there's a Manhattan team, and IIRC a Brooklyn team. (Okay,
logic flaw in that Manhattan and Brooklyn have huge populations...but
there's also one in New Canaan, Connecticut (aka Yuppieville) and IIRC
Chappaqua, NY (Clintonville).

Just throwing out some thochts.

--John

________________________________

John Walton -- john at walton.to

Current...
Movie: Shrek. 11/10!
CD: Shrek Soundtrack ::grin::
Song: "Hallelujah": Rufus Wainwright (from Shrek soundtrack)
________________________________




From ender_w at msn.com  Sun Jun 10 13:58:21 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:58:21 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] US Quidditch
References: <B748ED4A.2824%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <002301c0f1b5$69a6fd60$e9e8183f@satellite>

I wonder what the wizarding sport of the US is.  Yes, I know that Rowling invented a rather simple minded American game called Quod (or something like that.  My QTA book isn't handy right now), but as an American, I think there should be some other National Wizard Pastimes; a wizarding game based on baseball, perhaps, or lacrosse.  How about a Wizarding equivalent of NASCAR, complete with racing brooms emblazoned with the logos of corporate sponsors.  Any thoughts?

ender
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Walton 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2001 9:24 AM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] US Quidditch


  Catlady said:

  > I've been thinking about those Quidditch teams. If Quidditch is so
  > unpopular in US, it would be logical for US teams to represent a larger
  > geographical area than in places where it is more popular -- shouldn't
  > that team be Los Tornados Tejanos rather than the Sweetwater All-Stars?
  > (SoCal has only tiny miniature tornadoes that can't do worse than tear
  > the roofs off one or two houses.)

  I take it to be roughly parallel with the popularity of Rugby in the US --
  there're a few teams around the NY area, but they represent a small area and
  not a big one -- there's a Manhattan team, and IIRC a Brooklyn team. (Okay,
  logic flaw in that Manhattan and Brooklyn have huge populations...but
  there's also one in New Canaan, Connecticut (aka Yuppieville) and IIRC
  Chappaqua, NY (Clintonville).

  Just throwing out some thochts.

  --John

  ________________________________

  John Walton -- john at walton.to

  Current...
  Movie: Shrek. 11/10!
  CD: Shrek Soundtrack ::grin::
  Song: "Hallelujah": Rufus Wainwright (from Shrek soundtrack)
  ________________________________


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From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Sun Jun 10 14:33:29 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 14:33:29 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
Message-ID: <9g00fp+tkit@eGroups.com>

http://encarta.msn.com/parents/features/mustreadbooksforkids.asp

No Harry Potter listed. Looking over the list, I read most of them. 
Which brings this to mind. What were your favorite books as a child?
Some of mine were

D'Auliare's Greek Mythology & D'Auliare's Norse Mythology--both of 
them were nicely illustrated. I remember checking these books out of 
the school library non-stop.

Shadow Castle by Cockrell--Another book I checked out of the school 
library non-stop. A nice fantasy tale about a fairies.

The Henry Huggins series and "Ribsy" by Beverly Cleary

The Story of the Treasure Seekers by E. Nesbit---I re-read it when I 
was older and found it really depressing.

Milz










From foxmoth at qnet.com  Sun Jun 10 16:23:02 2001
From: foxmoth at qnet.com (foxmoth at qnet.com)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 16:23:02 -0000
Subject: Favorite books as a child was Re: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <9g00fp+tkit@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g06t6+kin4@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Milz" <absinthe at m...> wrote:
> http://encarta.msn.com/parents/features/mustreadbooksforkids.asp
> 
> No Harry Potter listed. Looking over the list, I read most of them. 
> Which brings this to mind. What were your favorite books as a child?
>

I loved the D'Aulaire Greek mythology too
and
Mrs. Piggle Wiggle (guess *she'd* be in trouble with the Ministry, 
handing out all those magical cures to Muggles <g>)
Mary Poppins
Eloise
All the Oz books I could get my hands on
Fairy tale books illustrated by Dulac (drool!)

Pippin
I loved Tolkien, Narnia and Edith Nesbitt also, but didn't read these 
til I was a teenager, so I don't think they count





From john at walton.to  Sun Jun 10 16:24:52 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:24:52 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <9g00fp+tkit@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <B7491794.283B%john@walton.to>

Milz said:

> No Harry Potter listed. Looking over the list, I read most of them.
> Which brings this to mind. What were your favorite books as a child?

I too loved D'Auliare's Greek :)

The Very Hungry Caterpillar was one of my faves as a small boy. I also had
an enormous collection of Richard Scarry books -- they had exciting things
like yellow diggers and fire engines in!*

*aside: I was given a ride in a fire engine by the local firefighters for
being precocious -- at age 5, a firefighter came to our class and showed us
pictures of all the engines and things. The teacher made some sort of
comment to the fireman like "So, is that a ladder truck then?", and I
crossed my arms and said in my best little boy voice, "No, Mrs Altman, it's
a *pumper* truck!" The fireman was really impressed so I got to go on a
ride. :)

Peter Rabbit was also a great book series -- I even had a Peter Rabbit
plate, mug and bowl from which I insisted I eat my supper every night. It
was broken in the move three years ago and I was really sad.

Babar (all of them) were great -- but I read them in French. "Babar le petit
elephant"... but his story is almost as violent as Bambi's!

Other than that, I had a great collection of the British "Noddy" books, by
Enid Blyton -- they were super, though perhaps a trifle culturally
insensitive (cheating, lying Golliwogs and the like...although I never made
the racial connection as a kid. Heck, my best friend next door's father was
from Guinea-Bissau! It was never going to be an issue). Similarly "Little
Black Sambo", handed down by my dad -- I never made the connection.

When I got older (6-7 or so) I started reading the Famous Five -- a stonking
set of books, again by Enid Blyton, very adventuresome. Just great :)

--John
________________________________

John Walton -- john at walton.to

Current...
Movie: Shrek. 11/10!
CD: Shrek Soundtrack ::grin::
Song: "Hallelujah": Rufus Wainwright (from Shrek soundtrack)
________________________________




From catlady at wicca.net  Sun Jun 10 16:39:19 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 16:39:19 -0000
Subject: A Wizarding 99cent /s/u/p/e/r/store?  Help!
In-Reply-To: <00b401c0f189$b0fc1d20$bf3570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9g07rn+qe2q@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
 
> I think I know the sort of place you're thinking of.  It screams
> "cheap, cheap, cheap!" as you walk through the door, and you can 
> find great bargains there if you are prepared to risk bumping into 
> your neighbours also pretending not to be there?
> 
> Not so much a superstore (and we do have that sort of thing here),
> but, in London, we have a lot of small shops that sell "Everything 
> under a pound" or "Everything for 50p".     They stock the sort of
> thing I imagine Wal-mart might stock: a mixture of tea-towels, huge
> packs of plastic pegs, hideous china ornaments, cheap nail polish, 

Here those are called 99cent stores. People who shop in them aren't 
ashamed to be seen there, being proud either of their frugality or 
their funkiness.  




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Sun Jun 10 16:45:56 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 09:45:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <9g00fp+tkit@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010610164556.8527.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Milz <absinthe at mad.scientist.com> wrote:
> Shadow Castle by Cockrell--Another book I checked out of the school 
> library non-stop. A nice fantasy tale about a fairies.

Hey, I read that book too! In fact, I've got it...it was my
Grandfather's and he gave it to me. According to the cover, it cost 45
cents then! It is a very sweet story, isn't it?

As for favorite children's books...well it depends on age bracket. I
looked at the link you provided and it seemed to list only books for
very young readers (Goodnight Moon, Blueberries for Sal, etc). My
favorite books when I was very young were the Bearenstein (sp?) Bears.
I always wanted to be friends with Sister Bear. And live in a tree.

As for a little older? <looks in her box of children's books>
Charlotte's Web, anything Roald Dahl, Bridge to Terabithia, Where the
Red Fern Grows, Anne Series by L.M.M., The Secret of the Unicorn Queen
series, The Phantom Tollbooth, Narnia series and dozens others. And I
will admit it. I was in love with the Babysitter's Club. Until very
recently, I still had all the books from 1 to about 70-something. And
the special editions. <sigh> You wouldn't believe all the money I spent
on them...

Actually, I've got a question related to this topic. There was a book
that I read when I was a girl in which I can't remember the title or
the author anymore. Maybe someone on the list might know? The books
theme centers around the idea that the stars in the sky are real
beings. Well, one star is murdered and all the evidence in the crime
points to the Dog Star (but of course he was set up!). His punishment
is to be sent to earth in the form of a *real* dog. Does this sound
familiar to anyone? Can anyone help me out?

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

"It may help to understand human affairs to be clear that most of the 
great triumphs and tragedies of history are caused, not by people being 
fundamentally good or fundamentally bad, but by people being fundamentally people."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Sun Jun 10 17:21:29 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:21:29 +0100
Subject: Everyone okay in Texas?
Message-ID: <002101c0f1d1$c9ff8940$143770c2@c5s910j>

I just saw the news about the flooding in and around Houston, TX.  Is
everyone in Texas okay?

Neil

________________________________________

Flying Ford Anglia

"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
squashed, as though it had run headlong into a brick wall"
["The Leaky Cauldron", PoA]

Check out Very Frequently Asked Questions for everything
to do with this club:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/VFAQ.htm




From jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu  Sun Jun 10 17:34:02 2001
From: jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu (Jen Faulkner)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 13:34:02 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: A Wizarding 99cent /s/u/p/e/r/store?  Help!
In-Reply-To: <9g07rn+qe2q@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106101311190.10001-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>

On Sun, 10 Jun 2001, Rita Winston wrote:

> > Not so much a superstore (and we do have that sort of thing here),
> > but, in London, we have a lot of small shops that sell "Everything
> > under a pound" or "Everything for 50p".???? They stock the sort of
> > thing I imagine Wal-mart might stock: a mixture of tea-towels, huge
> > packs of plastic pegs, hideous china ornaments, cheap nail polish,
> 
> Here those are called 99cent stores. People who shop in them aren't
> ashamed to be seen there, being proud either of their frugality or
> their funkiness.?

Oh indeed, though 'round here they're called 'dollar stores', usually,
and they are quite the height (or depths) of funkiness.  There's a
certain note of pride in saying that you bought something there.  
F'rinstance, for the Classics department at Rutgers, we had occassion
twice a year to hold picnics, and what's a picnic without games and
prizes, right?  So off to the dollar store we'd go, and the dep't now
has a great collection of toys, such as a plastic bow and arrow set, a
'discus' (a yellow frisbee with a lovely pic of Hercules and Xena we
glued in the middle)...  and the great prizes we had! -- plastic ponies
(for the winners of 'pin the tail on the October horse'), little vases
(vaguely Greek looking)...  I think we'd spend about an hour in there
every time we would go, just looking at stuff.  And yes, we would tell
anyone who would listen about where they came from. :)

*grins* Some of my kitchen utensils and such even come from the dollar
store (I got several very nice OXO Good Grips things), and, oh, sets of
window clings (important for dorm decorating), and so on.  The one thing
I refuse to buy at a dollar store is food; I did know people in college
who would, and that's just, well, icky.

It's got the mystique of great bargain hunting...  Target (though not
K-Mart, or Wal-Mart, or any of the others) has that sense of funkiness
too.  

--jen :)

"Will you be the one I've wanted, will you read my mind?
Will you ask me where I hurt, and heal me with your eyes?"
			--melissa ferrick

jen's fics: http://www.eden.rutgers.edu/~jfaulkne/
jen's LJ: http://www.livejournal.com/users/lysimache/





From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Sun Jun 10 18:34:19 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:34:19 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <9g00fp+tkit@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g0ejb+jud0@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Milz" <absinthe at m...> wrote:
> http://encarta.msn.com/parents/features/mustreadbooksforkids.asp
> 
> No Harry Potter listed. Looking over the list, I read most of them. 
> Which brings this to mind. What were your favorite books as a child?

Mine are too numerous to mention - I loved all the usual suspects 
which crop up on this list - Susan Cooper, E Nesbit, CS Lewis, 
Tolkein, and perhaps, best of all, LM Montgomery.  Some Enid Blyton 
was good when I was just starting out.
Beverly Cleary - I loved Ramona the Pest - forgotten all about it 
until today.
Historical fiction always interested me - I enjoyed any Arthur books, 
anything by Rosemary Sutcliffe, Michelle Magorian's "Goodnight Mr 
Tom" anything set in the Victorian period.  I probably started 
reading stuff like Georgette Heyer far too young, but I've had an 
obsession going on with the Regency Period ever since.

Some things I have never heard mentioned on this list:
Did anyone ever read Lucy M. Boston's "The Children of Green Knowe" 
and the sequels?  I loved those.  

One of my cousins introduced me to a series of adventure books by 
Willard Price - about 2 teenage brothers whose father owns a zoo and 
they spend all their holidays on animal collecting adventures all 
over the world.  Really exciting, if a little far-fetched (one of the 
books is spent on an old-fashioned whaling ship with a captain who 
still advocates the use of the cat o' nine tails - my least 
favourite).

I haven't heard of many of the books on that list.  Are they 
predominantly by American authors?

Catherine




From jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu  Sun Jun 10 18:57:44 2001
From: jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu (Jen Faulkner)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 14:57:44 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <9g0ejb+jud0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106101437300.10001-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>

On Sun, 10 Jun 2001 catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk wrote:

> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Milz" <absinthe at m...> wrote:
> > http://encarta.msn.com/parents/features/mustreadbooksforkids.asp

<rant>Rrr, I had to use IE to look at it; it wouldn't open with lynx.  I
really hate webpages that aren't text-browser compatible.</rant>

> I haven't heard of many of the books on that list.? Are they
> predominantly by American authors?

I think most of them are, yes.  And they were for much younger kids than
I'd thought they would be -- they're mostly picture books.  (And I think
I have read most of them.)  These books aren't in the same age group
with Harry Potter, really.

I also loved the now oft-mentioned D'Aulaires' *Book of Greek Myths*; in
fact, I loved my copy into bits and pieces -- it fell apart and was put
back together with tape a few times.  

Other picture-type books I liked, hmm, well, the Amelia Bedelia books.  
Dr. Seuss (especially *The Cat in the Hat* and *The Cat in the Hat Comes
Back*, and the animated version of the Grinch).  Lots of the Little
Golden Books (the Poky Little Puppy, Scuffy the Tugboat, my all time
favorite, the Sesame Street one *The Monster at the End of This Book*).  
My Winnie the Pooh book (a Disney edition with lots of pictures).  *Pat
the Bunny*.  My little brother liked the Spot books, and those are
rather nice indeed.  

--jen, who couldn't even begin to face the daunting task of listing all
the older children's books she liked... :)

* * * * * * 
Jen's fics (and other cool stuff):
http://www.eden.rutgers.edu/~jfaulkne/
Snapeslash listmom: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/snapeslash/
Yes, I *am* the Deictrix.




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Sun Jun 10 20:06:37 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:06:37 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <B7491794.283B%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <9g0k0d+kigc@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., John Walton <john at w...> wrote:
> Milz said:
> 
> > No Harry Potter listed. Looking over the list, I read most of    
> > them. Which brings this to mind. What were your favorite books as 
> > a child?
> 
> The Very Hungry Caterpillar was one of my faves as a small boy. 

This is still a favourite of mine. My mum looks after little kids and 
I always enjoy reading it. Worryingly the copy we have at home is 
older than I am - it is nearly (but not quite) a first edition. 
Recently they released it in 25th anniversary limited edition. Might 
have to get myself one.


I also did not really know many of the books on the list, so guess 
they are mainly American.


Simon




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Sun Jun 10 21:06:42 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 14:06:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Starving  Artist
In-Reply-To: <3B2300A0.CD71E69B@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <20010610210642.13194.qmail@web14502.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Catlady <catlady at wicca.net> wrote:
> Amber,
> It's pretty easy to acquire a starving boho artist/musician/writer of
> your own. You just have to financially support him, do his laundry,
> go applaud all his shows (that's for a musician), maybe sometimes
bail
> him out of jail...

Hey, I wouldn't mind that! As long as he would sing to me often, let me
sing with him sometimes (I don't have that great of a voice), write
with me, and if he's a visual artist, draw with me. I'd be more than
willing to financially support him, applaud the shows, and even bail
out of jail. Not the laundry though. He'd have to figure that out on
his own. (Or her...love hits when it does and I'm certainly not one to
limit my possibilities...)

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/2/2001

"It may help to understand human affairs to be clear that most of the 
great triumphs and tragedies of history are caused, not by people being 
fundamentally good or fundamentally bad, but by people being fundamentally people."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
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From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Sun Jun 10 23:35:16 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 16:35:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Favorite books as a child was Re: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <9g06t6+kin4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010610233516.32534.qmail@web10906.mail.yahoo.com>


I really like all the Ramona Quimby books...and I liked "LIttle Women" and "Anne of Green Gables" I loved "Shiloh" but you know what my favorite book was when I was a kid was "Are you there God it's me Margret"

Melanie



Hey everyone please go to my Harry Potter site at:  http://www.angelfire.com/realm/hogwarts2/index.html

 


 



---------------------------------
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Yahoo! Mail Personal Address - Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From tmayor at mediaone.net  Mon Jun 11 00:30:09 2001
From: tmayor at mediaone.net (Rosmerta)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 00:30:09 -0000
Subject: Belated HB to Sheryll
In-Reply-To: <00a901c0f186$6c538b20$bf3570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9g13eh+4a1e@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> I just wanted to be probably the last person to wish Sheryll a very 
happy
> birthday!  

I hate to one-up an admin, but now it's looks like I'M last: Happy 
Birthday Sheryll. Hope you got the cake and, eventually, the frosting.

~Rosmerta




From editor at texas.net  Mon Jun 11 01:23:24 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:23:24 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Joy of Texas
References: <9fvgfo+ig0v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B241D8C.2376CD9@texas.net>

Amy Z wrote:

> Come on, a state (sorry, a Republic--yeah, yeah, Vermont used to be a
> Republic too, it's not that big a deal)

Yeah, but we joined the U.S. voluntarily. See, even then we were
spending too much time in the sun.

> whose biggest source of pride is being the place where a battle was
> spectacularly =lost=

which would be the Alamo, yes? Funny that we market that one, and not
the ones where we kicked butt. Still spending too much time in the sun.

> can surely turn sandspurs and brown recluse spiders into an asset!

Let me know when you figure out a way. I'm just tired of finding them in
the house.

> I see some real marketing potential here.

As in most marketing, a la "no relationship to the real world"? You
might have a point....

> Texas: Our Ants Will Set You on Fire
> Texas: Producing Killer Bugs since 65 Million B.C.
> Texas: We Don't Drown in Lakes

Texas: Water you can club someone with!
Texas: It isn't just for snowbirds anymore!
Argh.

> Maybe these things, collectively, are what "Don't Mess with Texas"
> means?

I sort of classed that with "don't poke wasp nests," and "don't bother
rattlesnakes."

> Amy Z
> who's never been there.  Got a spare bedroom, Amanda?  I want to see
> if there really is an Alamo Mortuary (obscure reference to an old
> Albert Brooks routine).

We'll leave the light on for ya.

--Amanda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From editor at texas.net  Mon Jun 11 01:25:25 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:25:25 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Newsflash: bluebonnets are lupines
References: <9fvk14+ck0a@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B241E05.597D18A8@texas.net>

pbnesbit at msn.com wrote:

> And another thing for Texas to be proud of:  some
> of the *nicest* people I've met in the course of my job are from
> Texas.

Well, we *have* to be nice, it's a survival thing. If we had to worry
about other people, on top of all the other things in Texas that want to
sting you or stick you or ooze nasty stuff on you, there'd be nobody
left.

--Amanda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From editor at texas.net  Mon Jun 11 01:29:05 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:29:05 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Everyone okay in Texas?
References: <002101c0f1d1$c9ff8940$143770c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <3B241EE0.8B1B7049@texas.net>

Neil Ward wrote:

> I just saw the news about the flooding in and around Houston, TX.  Is
> everyone in Texas okay?

My brothers both live in the Woodlands, just north of Conroe, and while their
houses are not themselves flooded, they can't get anywhere because all the
highways are closed. I haven't heard anything else since Saturday morning;
I'm assuming no news is good news.

--Amanda




From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 11 01:31:26 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (Laurin York)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 18:31:26 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106101437300.10001-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>
Message-ID: <20010611013126.21720.qmail@web14703.mail.yahoo.com>

Not sure who said this (accidentally erased it):

> > I haven't heard of many of the books on that
> list. Are they predominantly by American authors?
> 
> I think most of them are, yes.  And they were for
> much younger kids than I'd thought they would be -- 
> they're mostly picture books.  (And I think I have 
> read most of them.)  These books aren't in the same 
> age group with Harry Potter, really.

I was interested to see that my nieces and nephews own
or have read 20 out of the 30.  (Although they grew
out of these books by the age of 5.)  And while most
of them do seem to be American, I seem to remember
some of my favorite books being British: Peter Pan,
Winne the Pooh, The Secret Garden, The Little
Princess, The Borrowers, Bedknob and Broomstick (oh,
anything by Mary Norton!).  

I also read just about anything about witches, magic
or time travel.  (Nothing has changed there.) I
especially liked the Witch Family by Eleanor Estes, A
Wrinkle in Time and sequals by Madeleine L'Engle, and
I STILL like to reread the Jane Langton books about
the Hall family: The Diamond in the Window, The Swing
in the Summerhouse, The Amazing Stereoscope, The
Fledgling...

In fact, I have wondered whether JKR had read the
Diamond in the Window and got her idea for the Mirror
of Erised from that...Read it and see what you think!


--Laurin

(who will use any excuse to get people to read JKR or
Jane Langton)



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From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Mon Jun 11 02:15:41 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 02:15:41 -0000
Subject: Wizard stores/ Starving artists/ Fav. Children's books/ Various things
Message-ID: <9g19kd+bln5@eGroups.com>

Hi everybody! This is the third time I've typed this message (my 
computer keeps messing up.) I've been visiting family for the past 
few days which is always fun. (sigh) Don't get me wrong I love them, 
I really do!, but that house is only big enough for two and there 
were seven of us... :-)

Ebony wanted speculation about wizarding "super"stores, and she's 
certainly got some good ideas. What I want to know is why we can't 
know the name of the store. (Let's see...Lightfoot's? Nah.) Anyway 
what about toys? For instance dolls/action figures that move own 
their own (i.e. Malinda's Cho doll), or toy broomsticks that only fly 
a few feet off the ground (we see these in GoF right?).

I'm still curious about food, b/c I don't think that it's generated. 
I want to know whether, for instance, wine comes from wizarding 
vineyards or muggle ones. What about cheese etc? I'm itching to 
know...I get the feeling no one else is that curious.

Oh Amber shall you take me under your wing? (I can do my own laundry.)
People always ask what I want to be when I grow up, but it sounds 
foolish and impractical to say a "starving artist". As romantic as 
the concept seems to be I don't *want* to starve. :-)

Simon and Catherine wrote that they didn't know many of the books on 
that (young) children's reading list, but truth be told neither did 
I. I'd read about half of them, but some of the others were strange 
to me. 

My favourite picture book had to have been "Harold and the Purple 
Crayon". Long before I could read I had memorised this book. 

Somone mentioned "Goodnight Mr. Tom". This was such a good book. I 
read it years ago, but I remember most of the story. I'd almost 
forgotten about it. Thanks for reminding me, I might just go re-read 
it.

The wizard toys thread reminded me of the "Indian in the Cupboard" 
which were some of my favourites as well. The movie however would 
have been *so* much better if they'd just set it in England. Maybe it 
*was* set in England and I've gotten it mixed up with another book/ 
movie.

Before I could read my mother had read classics like "Tom Sawyer" and 
"The Wizard of Oz" to me. The Oz books that Baum wrote are good, but 
I never could get into the rest of them. (Just like I'm sure no one 
could ever write about Narnia like Lewis did to add to a recent 
thread.)

Heidi I'm glad you are enjoying the Moulin Rouge CD (can you guess 
what I'm listening to right now?) ;-) Did I say I like Moulin Rouge  
Elephant Love Meledoy is by far my favourite track. I'm listening to 
Hindi Sad Diamonds as I type. Sort of loud, but I like Hindi music 
anyway.

Scott







From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Mon Jun 11 02:36:49 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 02:36:49 -0000
Subject: Everyone okay in Texas?
In-Reply-To: <3B241EE0.8B1B7049@texas.net>
Message-ID: <9g1as1+lgbq@eGroups.com>

Neil asked:
"I just saw the news about the flooding in and around Houston, TX.  Is
everyone in Texas okay?"

Amanda responded
"My brothers both live in the Woodlands, just north of Conroe, and 
while their houses are not themselves flooded, they can't get 
anywhere because all the highways are closed. I haven't heard 
anything else since Saturday morning; I'm assuming no news is good 
news."

--Not to mention our own dear list-mom Penny. She hasn't posted in 
the past few days (though this could be due to a not-sleepy baby). 
Hope she's doing fine, and didn't have to literally climb aboard the 
SS H/H. :-)

Seriously though we had floods in eastern NC a few years ago, and 
while I wasn't directly flooded I know how bad it can be. Hope 
everyone's ok.

Let us know Penny!

Scott





From devika261 at aol.com  Mon Jun 11 02:44:17 2001
From: devika261 at aol.com (devika261 at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 02:44:17 -0000
Subject: Favorite books as a child
In-Reply-To: <9g06t6+kin4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g1ba1+sqlv@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., foxmoth at q... wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Milz" <absinthe at m...> wrote:
> > http://encarta.msn.com/parents/features/mustreadbooksforkids.asp
> > 
> > No Harry Potter listed. Looking over the list, I read most of 
them. 
> > Which brings this to mind. What were your favorite books as a 
child?
> >
> 
I loved the Ramona books and most of the other ones by Beverly Cleary 
(The Mouse and the Motorcycle was great).  I also read the Narnia 
books, Charlotte's Web, The Trumpet of the Swan, and Stuart Little by 
E.B. White; the Anne books by L.M. Montgomery; and anything by Roald 
Dahl and Madeleine L'engle.  When I was younger I read Peter Rabbit 
and Babar too, as well as the Berenstein Bears and the usual 
collection of fairy tales. And then when I was about 11, I went into 
this sci-fi craze and read anything I could get my hands on by Isaac 
Asimov and Arthur C. Clarke.  After that I moved on to Michael 
Crichton.  Needless to say, I was a bookworm (and still am, when I 
have the time).
Devika :)  




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Mon Jun 11 02:54:11 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 02:54:11 -0000
Subject: Texas/ British Weather
Message-ID: <9g1bsj+8r8m@eGroups.com>

I've been looking through my closet lately trying to decide if I need 
anything before leaving for England, but I'm not really sure. Simon 
or Al or Dai or somebody told me in the chat a few weeks ago that 
this is supposed to be the hottest summer in England in 30 years. My 
question is how hot is hot. 

Hot here in NC is high humidity and in the 80's or 90's (F). Probably 
not as hot as Texas. Other than airport layovers I've never been, but 
I then I never can get enough of black widow spiders so... ;-) Once 
when I was about 5 or 6 a black widow spider fell out of one of my 
stuffed animals. (Very tramatic experience; don't ask.)

Erm...anyway what is the July weather supposed to be like in England? 
Sixties, seventies? any help?

Scott
Who posted this to OT chatter and not the London list because someone 
else might be wondering too for totally different reasons...I doubt 
it but-




From catlady at wicca.net  Mon Jun 11 04:36:36 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 04:36:36 -0000
Subject: food (was: Wizard stores/ Starving artists
In-Reply-To: <9g19kd+bln5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g1hsk+9lu8@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Scott" <insanus_scottus at y...> wrote:
> 
> I'm still curious about food, b/c I don't think that it's generated. 
> I want to know whether, for instance, wine comes from wizarding 
> vineyards or muggle ones. What about cheese etc? I'm itching to 
> know...I get the feeling no one else is that curious.

I also want to know. If the food is grown by Muggle farmers, 1) do 
the wizarding folk have opinions about organic, pesticides, GM 
food? 2) the product must cross to the wizarding economy at 
some point, and it seems unlikely that someone like Mrs 
Weasley would shop in a Muggle supermarket with Muggle money, 
are there wizarding middlemen who buy the product from Muggle small 
farmers and sell it to wizarding small greengrocer, butcher, etc 
shops?

If the wizarding folk's food comes from wizarding farmers, JKR 
could perfectly well tell us about it, by having Our Heroes 
accompany a school friend home to the famiy farm.




From nethilia at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 11 04:46:45 2001
From: nethilia at yahoo.com (Nethilia De Lobo)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 21:46:45 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Everyone okay in TX?
In-Reply-To: <992225745.1691.19191.l9@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010611044645.86477.qmail@web14608.mail.yahoo.com>


> 
> Neil Ward wrote:
> 
> > I just saw the news about the flooding in and
> around Houston, TX.  Is
> > everyone in Texas okay?
> 
I'm never naming my children Allison.

My house took on some water. Not as much as some
places, only two inches, but enough to make me have to
pick up and dissasemble my comp, lose a couple
matresses we had on the floor, lose a lot of shoes and
clothes and fabric and papers and my Gameboy system
(with all my games), and wander around in the dark
from about 2 am to 6 am because I had to pop the
circuits to unplug everything, else I would have
fried. I did get them back on no trouble though, and
my comp worked fine. (It better have, I stuck the
thing on the highest thing in the house.)

And my mom and sisters were out in it. They slept on
the 59 bridge because they couldn't get off the
freeway. Then they got stuck at Lakewood church. Then,
when the cell phones went out and they were wooried
about me, they ended up driving through water too deep
for the truck and flooded out. So they walked home in
waist deep water to get to me and my mom lost her
shoes. Lucky for us, our truck has nothing
computerized in it and after some draining and
changing of fluids, it should work fine. 

And we were lucky. The houses two blocks down flooded
out and will have to have the drywall gutted, and the
carpet ripped out (we don't have any carpets, just one
rug that I picked up the second I saw the water
getting close). A member of my church had a beautiful
new two story house that is now halfway underwater.
The East side where I once lived is a gianty lake.

But I'm okay. 

--Neth

=====
--Nethilia de Lobo--
**Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus.**

http://www.geocities.com/spenecial
Spenecial.com. Two girls. One Website. Total Chaos.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Mon Jun 11 05:20:31 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 01:20:31 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Favorite books as a child
References: <9g1ba1+sqlv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B24551F.108F97C6@sympatico.ca>

Hello All,

I have to pitch in my vote for favorite book...it would have to be "The
Princess Bride" the Good Parts version by William Goldman. I absolutely
love that book, and I've read it only about twenty times. I never get
tired of it!

Close second is "The Thief of Always" by Clive Barker. It's a childrens
fable, and is an excellent read, if a little quick. It's about a boy who
goes away to the "Holiday House" to get away from the world. At the
holiday house, the four seasons of the year take place daily, and the
night is full of wonders.

I'd reccomend both of them to anyone who wants to stock up on Summer
reading...both excellent, fun reads!!!

Hugs
Jamieson

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams





From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Mon Jun 11 05:29:48 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 01:29:48 -0400
Subject: cus I had nothing better to do...
Message-ID: <3B24574C.B91B6336@sympatico.ca>

Hello Everybody!!!!

Because I was bored, and had nothing else to do, I wrote this. I thought
it would be fun to share with everyone else. Le me state that this in no
way is meant to offend anyone, and that it's supposed to be fun!!!

So, read on, please. And remember, I mean no offense! <g> Oh, and it
should be noted that this has nothing what so ever to do with Harry
Potter and his world. I just thought that everyone needed a bit of good
cheer now and then!!!

Read it whenever you need a boost of confidence! (Or a good laugh,
whichever comes first!)

Hugs,
Jamieson

=======================================================


"___________, THE MASTER OF THE DEMON"

*Simply fill in the blanks with your name, and you will have your very
own story, all about you!!!*


One day, ___________ was helping a group of old people accross the
street when a thought popped into his/her head. "Gosh", _________ said,
"I wonder if I could somehow help the world, and make it a better place?

Surely there has to be a way?"

_________ continued to help the old people accross the street and, after

several of them smiled in happiness at the gesture, continued on his/her

way home. On the way, _________ encountered a small dog. It was all
black, and had a tail tipped in red.

"Why hello there, little puppy." ________ said, "Are you lost?"

"No, looser," the dog said, "I'm wandering around cus I like to."

"You can talk!" ___________ said in astonishment.

"Oh, my, you're preceptive! Are you always this stupid?"

___________ chuckled. "Oh, funny dog, how bout I take you home and give
you some place to sleep? Do you want a name? I think I'll name you
Rodger."

"I already have a name, poophead. It's Lucifer. Maybe you've heard of
it?"

____________ thought a moment in reflection. "Now why would you have the

name of the Devils son?" He/She said at last.

"Cus I AM the son of the Devil, butthead. Now, give me your soul, or
I'll take bite your ankle!!!"

___________ laughed again. "Silly doggy, c'mon now, I'm going to take
you to your new home!"

Lucifer was not impressed. "Listen butt fart, I want your soul, and I'm
going to take it from you!"

"If you were really the son of the Devil," ____________ replied, "why
are you a dog?"

"Becasue I like sniffing other dogs butts! Sheesh, I have to walk around

Earth somehow, don't I? I don't think people would like seeing a
hoof-footed demon walking about, no sir."

"Silly doggy!" ____________ laughed, "C'mon now!"

Lucifer followed closely behind. "Look, don't you get it? I'm Lucifer!
Son of the Devil!!!! I DEMAND RESPECT!!!!"

____________ pouted down at Lucifer. "I think someone is craving some
attention, isn't that right?" and he/she patted Lucifers furry head.

"Stop that!" Lucifer screamed, and with that, he bit _______________s
hand.

_______________, moving with quick reflexes and not really thinking,
picked up Lucifer by his silver spike studded collar, and hurled him in
the direction of the very same old people s/he had just helped across
the street.

Lucifer ended up hiting them like a ten pin bowling ball.

"Oops!" ___________ shouted, "Sorry!"

__________ watched as the old people surrounded the dog, and began
muttering things such as "Oh, what a cute little thing!" or "Oh, isn't
he darling?"

Lucifer was not happy. "Stop that, stop that! I AM THE SON OF
SATAN!!!!!"

"Of course you are dear." replied the old people.

______________, satisfied with a job well done, continued on his/her way

home looking forward to a quiet evening of relaxation and good deeds.


THE END!!!

-----now wasn't that a complete waste of time? Did you laugh? Hope so!
Hugs

--
"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Mon Jun 11 07:47:40 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 07:47:40 -0000
Subject: Texas/ British Weather
In-Reply-To: <9g1bsj+8r8m@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g1t2s+c2t3@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Scott" <insanus_scottus at y...> wrote:
> I've been looking through my closet lately trying to decide if I 
need 
> anything before leaving for England, but I'm not really sure. Simon 
> or Al or Dai or somebody told me in the chat a few weeks ago that 
> this is supposed to be the hottest summer in England in 30 years. 
My 
> question is how hot is hot. 
> 
> Hot here in NC is high humidity and in the 80's or 90's (F). 
Probably 
> not as hot as Texas. Other than airport layovers I've never been, 
but 
> I then I never can get enough of black widow spiders so... ;-) Once 
> when I was about 5 or 6 a black widow spider fell out of one of my 
> stuffed animals. (Very tramatic experience; don't ask.)
> 
> Erm...anyway what is the July weather supposed to be like in 
England? 
> Sixties, seventies? any help?
> 
> Scott
> Who posted this to OT chatter and not the London list because 
someone 
> else might be wondering too for totally different reasons...I doubt 
> it but-

Unfortunately, the weather at the moment is not good - and our 
summers are always very unpredictable, so if I were you, I would come 
prepared for every eventuality.  Hopefully, the temperatures will be 
70s/80s, but you can't rely on this.

NB.  Very important.  An umbrella is essential!

Catherine




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Mon Jun 11 09:33:13 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:33:13 -0000
Subject: Texas/ British Weather
In-Reply-To: <9g1t2s+c2t3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g238p+lq78@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., catherine at c... wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Scott" <insanus_scottus at y...> wrote:
> > I've been looking through my closet lately trying to decide if I 
> > need anything before leaving for England, but I'm not really     
> > sure. Simon or Al or Dai or somebody told me in the chat a few   
> > weeks ago that this is supposed to be the hottest summer in      
> > England in 30 years. 
> > 
> > My question is how hot is hot. 
> > 
> > Hot here in NC is high humidity and in the 80's or 90's (F). 
> > Probably not as hot as Texas. Other than airport layovers I've   
> > never been, but I then I never can get enough of black widow     
> > spiders so... ;-) Once when I was about 5 or 6 a black widow     
> > spider fell out of one of my stuffed animals. (Very tramatic     
> > experience; don't ask.)
> > 
> > Erm...anyway what is the July weather supposed to be like in 
> > England? Sixties, seventies? any help?
> > 
> > Scott
> > Who posted this to OT chatter and not the London list because 
> > someone else might be wondering too for totally different        
> > reasons...I doubt it but-
> 
> Unfortunately, the weather at the moment is not good - and our 
> summers are always very unpredictable, so if I were you, I would   
> come prepared for every eventuality.  Hopefully, the temperatures  
> will be 70s/80s, but you can't rely on this.
> 
> NB.  Very important.  An umbrella is essential!

I think those few warm days a couple of weeks ago was our summer. Now 
all we have to look forward to is rain and more rain. It does go into 
the 90s, but that is not that often and possibly only for those of us 
on the South Coast.

Oxford is fairly cold and wet as places go. I have not been around 
much in the summer but I doubt much changes.


Simon




From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 11 09:44:29 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 09:44:29 -0000
Subject: A Wizarding Superstore? Help!
Message-ID: <9g23tt+aucl@eGroups.com>

> Ebony asked:
> 
> <<If there was a wizarding version of the American
> superstore (Super
> Wal-mart, Super K-Mart, Meijer's, etc.), what would
> it sell?  I'm  trying to
> make a list of departments here...
> 
>  And before you say "this would never happen--this
> world is too
> traditional--they wouldn't like it" rest assured
> that this conflict  of
> interest is being exploited as a source of
> tension.>>
*****************************************************
			
Ebony, 

Feel free to use what you like, change what you don't like. I had fun 
doing this. (the first time, anyway ... got to the bottom and 
accidently closed IE ... so that was from my imagination & now this 
is from memory)

Doreen

*********************************************************************
                Knute's Knut & Sickle Variety Store

Muggle Broooms
No more struggling to get that uppity broom to sweep when you command 
it! Now you can sweep your troubles away with a Muggles Broom. Huge 
shipment just arrived! Apparate on down here and get yours while the 
supply lasts!
***
Krum Scum Scouring Pads
For cauldron cleaning or fireplace scrubbing, these scouring pads are 
fantastic! As soon as all the dark marks disappear, so does the Krum! 
Only one dozen to a customer. No exceptions!
***
Gnome-Be-Gone
(as seen on television's "Gardening With Gilderoy")
Rid your garden of those pesky critters forever! A sprinkle a day 
keeps the gnomes away! (In spite of recent rumors, this does not work 
on husbands)
***
Barty's Bundle of Broom Accesories:
hover helper
flashing turn signals
broom holders, wall & floor models
Wizard Wax for a shinier handle
twig trimmer
grip goo for getting better handle control
***
Flitwick's Flip-Up Spell Organizer
Your favorite spells at the touch of a button! Alphabetize and 
organize your spells in this handy Flip-Up Spell Organizer. No more 
lost incantations or botched brews!
***
G&F Weasley Bros. Exploding Breakfast Cereal
Your kids will get a big bang out of this unique cereal! No snap! 
crackle! pop! boring cereal for your little witch or wizard! Get the 
REAL thing with G&F Cereal. Crispy little bits shaped like wands, 
brooms, and cauldrons, that go, "giggle", "snort", "KABOOM" when 
you add milk.
***
Severus Snape's Potion Repellent
Now you can protect your shoes & robes from cauldron spillage. Just 
one spray from Snape's Potion Repellent and you have instant 
protection from stains and burns. Great for that clumsy student in 
your family.
***
Ernie & Stan's Fake Tattoos
Your kids will be a hit when they peel & stick on these colorful, 
washable fake tattoos! They come 3 in a pack. Collect them ALL! Get 
Dumbledore's Map of the London Underground; Harry Potter's Lightning 
Bolt Real-Looking Scar; Trelawney's Grimm; Riddle's Snake; Lupin's 
Wolf Baying at the Moon; Sirius Black's Dementors (set of 12); and 
the hardest of all to find ... the Golden Snitch or the House Elf 
tattos. Keep looking! 
***
Cho's Chias
Darling little terra cotta critters in a variety of shapes: dragons, 
hippogriffs, unicorns, owls, centaurs, and many more! Just open the 
packet of seed paste, apply, and like magic, your critter will sprout 
green "hair".
***
Bertha's Broom Bloomers
Tired of riding that broom the old-fashion side-saddle way? Sick of 
having your robes fly up in your face? Now you can soar in style and 
comfort with Bertha's Broom Bloomers! Just tie the handy ribbons at 
each ankle and the bottom of the robe becomes leggins. When you 
arrive at your destination, just untie the ribbons and voila! You are 
dressed in a proper robe again. No more crashing into trees. No more 
crude comments from skyward glancing dirty old wizards!
***
Weasley's Witch Hazel Butt Balm
For all those aching that-which-can-not-be-named body parts that 
straddle a broom on a long ride, relief is at hand! Molly Weasley's 
own secret recipe was used to concoct this balm. No Witch household 
should be without it!
***
Magic Moments Mood Enhancing Candles by S. Trelawney

Romantic Rose - for that soon to be lover. Irresistible!

Bedtime ByeBaby - watch their little eyes go shut for the night when 
you light one of these.                         
No more bedtime battles!

Sweet Pea Shopper - Light one of these and when you approach your 
Wizard of the house       for shopping money, he will empty his 
pockets and his wallet, hand over his Diagon Charge Card, and send 
you off with a kiss and a hug!

Green Garden-in-ya - an absolute MUST for decorating the table at 
mealtime! Watch the little wizards and witches dig into those 
vegetables as if they were dessert!
***
Shuffle on down to Knut & Sickle's Shoe Department for the latest in 
Witch & Wizard footwear:

Lupin Loafers
For the casual look in men's shoes, these can't be beat! They even 
have a slot for a shiny new knut in the tongue of the loafer.

Quidditch Seeker Sneakers
Get a pair with your favorite team logo on them or the latest style, 
featuring the Golden Snitch
They come in a variety of colors, including the Hogwarts' House 
Colors. Popular with students, whether they are on the teams or in 
the stands. They can't be beat!

Broom Surfers 
Eagle Claw grippers for great grinding! Terrific for tricks such 
as "owlies" and "stick flips"! Teenagers go hog wild over them!
***
There was a bit more ... hats in a variety of colors & materials
                                     robes in a variety of styles and 
colors
***

If anyone wants to add to my list, be my guest. 
Doreen

********************








 





From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 11 12:31:22 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:31:22 -0000
Subject: Scott IS Ron Weasley
In-Reply-To: <9g1bsj+8r8m@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g2dmq+1j8g@eGroups.com>

Scott wrote:

> Once 
> when I was about 5 or 6 a black widow spider fell out of one of my 
> stuffed animals. 

'Nuff said.  Poor Scott!

Amy Z




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 11 12:44:11 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:44:11 -0000
Subject: US Quidditch
In-Reply-To: <B748ED4A.2824%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <9g2eer+2q5u@eGroups.com>

John wrote:
 
> I take it to be roughly parallel with the popularity of Rugby in the 
US --
> there're a few teams around the NY area, but they represent a small 
area and
> not a big one -- there's a Manhattan team, and IIRC a Brooklyn team. 
(Okay,
> logic flaw in that Manhattan and Brooklyn have huge 
populations...but
> there's also one in New Canaan, Connecticut (aka Yuppieville) and 
IIRC
> Chappaqua, NY (Clintonville).

Also, the teams would likely be (a) where there's a high wizard 
population, which aren't necessarily the same places as the biggest 
Muggle concentrations, and (b) where there's a good remote spot to put 
the field.

It may be that JKR, collector of odd names, just loved the name 
Sweetwater.

Amy Z




From hamster8 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 11 12:45:41 2001
From: hamster8 at hotmail.com (hamster8 at hotmail.com)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:45:41 -0000
Subject: A Wizarding Superstore?  Help!
In-Reply-To: <00b401c0f189$b0fc1d20$bf3570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9g2ehl+ajb1@eGroups.com>


Neil ... "Not so much a superstore (and we do have that sort of thing 
here), but, in London, we have a lot of small shops that sell 
"Everything under a  pound" or "Everything for 50p".     They stock 
the sort of thing I imagine Wal-mart might stock: a mixture of 
tea-towels, huge packs of plastic pegs, hideous china ornaments, cheap 
nail polish, no-brand batteries, novelty mirrors, remaindered books, 
Barbie rejects, fake flowers, chipped crockery, drill bits, sponges, 
noxious perfume, multipacks of nylon underpants, leaky pens, torches, 
bin liners, garden furniture, plastic machine guns, soapdishes,
music boxes... that sort of thing.   That doesn't directly answer 
your question, of course, but I'm sure you could translate some of 
those horrors."

There's one in Brighton called 'Wizard Stores.'  It's signboard has 
all floaty stars and wands and pointy hats on it.  I'll try and get a 
photo to post to the list ... does anybody else suspect the hand of 
Gred n' Forge behind this?

Al





From hamster8 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 11 13:03:33 2001
From: hamster8 at hotmail.com (hamster8 at hotmail.com)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:03:33 -0000
Subject: More products for Eb's Wizarding Superstore!
In-Reply-To: <9g23tt+aucl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g2fj5+h5i7@eGroups.com>

Off the top of my head ...

Dark Lord Cat Scarer.

>From the makers of Gnome-Be-Gone, and endorsed by the team from WWN's 
Herbologist's Question Time comes the Dark Lord cat scarer.  Now your 
lawn will be free of marauding cats, kneazles, and other wee beasties.  
Just stick this stainless steel black 'Lord Voldemort' silhouette in 
your garden, and passing critters will be struck dumb with fear.  Also 
availiable in cerise.

Aerial Camping Stove and Broom Dining Kit.

Tired of landing at a Happy Eater on those long trips down the ABFN?  
Now from the makers of the Self Righting Cauldron, comes the aerial 
camping stove and broom dining kit.  This portable canteen comes 
complete with grill, gas fired hob and even a kitchen sink!  Straps 
handily to any broom handle.  You too can dine in style!  For 2G 5s 
and 6k extra get this sturdy formica topped table, which clips on top 
of your broomstick, and comes complete with a paisley tablecloth, 
candelabra and 'Harry's Wizarding Christmas' centerpiece.  Fully 
endorsed by the Chudley Cannons.  Not compatible with pre-1985 
Cleansweeps or any Firebolts unless you want a nasty accident.

Al lives!





From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 11 13:19:02 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:19:02 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <20010611013126.21720.qmail@web14703.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9g2gg6+i8d8@eGroups.com>

I don't remember too many of the picture books I read, though I did 
love The Snowy Day and everything else by Ezra Jack Keats--the art is 
so beautiful--and I'd put everything by Leo Lionni on the list.  I 
love collages.  

It's really odd how the lists are mostly U.S. authors, and how they 
are unknown in the U.K.  Why don't we read more of each other's 
children's books?  

Books I couldn't get enough of when I was a bit older:

Laura Ingalls Wilder
The Secret Garden, FH Burnett
The Great Brain books, JD Fitzgerald
the Mushroom Planet series, by Eleanor Cameron IIRC
everything by Eleanor Cameron
ditto Joan Aiken
ditto Madeleine L'Engle
the Earthsea Trilogy (now has 2 more books), Ursula LeGuin
The Lottery Rose, Irene Hunt
Sherlock Holmes
The Return of the Twelves--don't recall the author, but it's about a 
  boy who discovers the Brontes' toy soldiers (?) and/or the stories 
  they wrote about them?  Really imaginative and terrific
Mythology of all kinds, though I didn't discover the D'Aulaires `til I 
  was older: Edith Hamilton (Greece), Norse myths  
Bible Stories for Children retold by David Kossof--terrific, lively, 
  humorous retellings & illustrations
Sal Fisher at Girl Scout Camp--don't ask me the author or why I read 
  it so many times, but I loved it
The Moffats series by Eleanor Estes
Half Magic by Edward Eager--it put me onto E. Nesbit, a bit too late
Another series I didn't catch on to until it was too young for me was 
  Beverly Cleary.  I've read a few as an adult and would buy the lot 
  for any child I loved
Narnia
sea stories/mysteries by Howard Pease, which my dad loved as a kid and 
  recommended to me
Mistress Masham's Repose, T.H. White--didn't discover that one `til 
  college & loved it
Chronicles of Prydain by Lloyd Alexander--I just reread half of The 
  Book of Three standing in the children's section of the library and 
  it was every bit as good as I remembered
Cricket magazine, still going strong!

Amy Z




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 11 13:20:19 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 06:20:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Favorite books as a child
In-Reply-To: <3B24551F.108F97C6@sympatico.ca>
Message-ID: <20010611132019.59390.qmail@web14608.mail.yahoo.com>

All these posts had me in the bedroom looking at
children's books! I still have some of the 'Little
Golden Books' from my childhood - granted most of the
covers are now separate from the rest of the book, but
I have about a dozen books. They're very well read,
having gone through my childhood and my daughters. My
favourite (which I don't seem to still have) was 'The
Four Little Puppies', about 4 puppies and their
discoveries of the changing seasons and their own
changes as they got older. I also have a book called
'Giddappy' about a cute little horse with bandaged
knees and who he meets in his walk through the forest.
That one belonged to my uncle (inside incription was
to 'To Harold, Happy Birthday, 1949')and I have no
idea how I ended up with it. 

Nyssa decided (for the sake of room in her bookcase)
to pass all her children's books on to my nephew. He
got a great collection of Dr. Suess and nearly all the
Little Miss and Mr. books (those were her favourites).

I won't even go to what books I read after these
children's books - way too many to list!

Sheryll, eating carrot cake for breakfast


=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
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From dfrankis at dial.pipex.com  Mon Jun 11 14:58:12 2001
From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com (dfrankis at dial.pipex.com)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:58:12 -0000
Subject: Forgotten Dog Star book, favourite childhood reading
In-Reply-To: <20010610164556.8527.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9g2ma4+mf2t@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> Actually, I've got a question related to this topic. There was a 
book
> that I read when I was a girl in which I can't remember the title or
> the author anymore. Maybe someone on the list might know? The books
> theme centers around the idea that the stars in the sky are real
> beings. Well, one star is murdered and all the evidence in the crime
> points to the Dog Star (but of course he was set up!). His 
punishment
> is to be sent to earth in the form of a *real* dog. Does this sound
> familiar to anyone? Can anyone help me out?
> 
> ~Amber

I think it's 'Dogsbody' by Diana Wynne Jones (I haven't checked 
Amazon).  She's written several books with magic in, covering some of 
the same ground about relationship between magic and non-magic people 
as HP.  When my wife read Witch Week she said 'That's where she got 
Harry Potter from' (I'm less sure).

Did anyone read the Jennings series of books by Anthony Buckeridge - 
HP reminds me more of this than any other boarding school stories: 
the sense of humour is similar, and the pupil's view of teachers is 
well done (or seemed so 30 years ago).  AB was an actual boarding 
school teacher.

David




From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 11 16:13:18 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 16:13:18 -0000
Subject: More Wizarding Superstore? Help!
In-Reply-To: <9g23tt+aucl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g2qmu+fq6q@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., > > Ebony asked:
> > 
> > <<If there was a wizarding version of the American
> > superstore (Super
> > Wal-mart, Super K-Mart, Meijer's, etc.), what would
> > it sell?  I'm  trying to
> > make a list of departments here...
> > 
> >  And before you say "this would never happen--this
> > world is too
> > traditional--they wouldn't like it" rest assured
> > that this conflict  of
> > interest is being exploited as a source of
> > tension.>>
> *****************************************************
Additional Knute's Knut & Sickle Variety Store Stuff

Ernie & Stan's Engraving Kit
No more lost umbrellas or wands on the Knight Buses. Put a Dark Mark 
on all your valuable items today! Handy Engraving Kit has complete 
instructions on how to engrave your MOM Sorcerer's Security number 
onto all of your treasured items. Great for marking your student's 
belongings when you send them off to Hogwarts! Works on metal, wood, 
and leather. (not recommended for the flimsy, shallow-bottomed 
cauldrons ... MOM approved cauldrons only)
***
Hermione's Hot Rollers
Pop these rollers into the fireplace to heat. When the magic button 
turns red, they are ready to use Just roll up your hair in them. You 
too can exchange long straight hair for the more fashionable frizzy 
curls look. Endorsed by Hermione Granger, lifetime friend of "The Boy 
Who Lived", Harry Potter.
***
Cauldron Cozies
Just the thing to hide that unsightly cauldron from view when 
unannounced company apparates in! Comes in a variety of colors & 
patterns: 
moonbeam yellow stars & moons pattern
mandrake green leaf pattern
cauldron cream wand pattern
***
Rita Skeeter is at it again!
Read it in our "Witches Wand to Know" tabloids, found at all our 
check-out aisles.

This week's headlines include:

"My Divination Teacher Kept Me After Class ... We Did More Than 
Discuss Tea Leaves!" claims Neville Longbottom. The teaching future 
looks grim for S. Trelawney.

"Hanky Panky in Herbology" ... or ... "Why Do All the Mandrakes 
Resemble Albus Dumbledore?"
(see photo top left ... contributed by a Prof. Sprout) Ms. Sprout 
informed me that she has always been suspicious of AD ... she has 
seen him poking about in her gardens when he thought nobody was 
looking.

"I Was a Teenage Werewolf!"  the real scoop on Remus Lupin, Hogwarts 
Dark Arts Teacher's mysterious monthly disappearances.
***
Doreen











From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun 11 13:06:35 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:06:35 EST5EDT
Subject: Rufus Wainwright
Message-ID: <106B4211230@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

Strange that he did something on the Shrek soundtrack, too.  He 
did my favorite song on the Moulin Rouge soundtrack (well, tied for 
favorite with Fatboy Slim's Because We Can and Ewan/Nicole's 
Come What May).  It's a beautiful song sung in both French and 
English.  I'd not heard of this guy until listening to my soundtrack.

Any fans of his out there that could recommend a good CD?

(by the way.....I've seen Moulin Rouge 5 times now.  Obsession is 
an ugly thing.)


Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From heidit at netbox.com  Mon Jun 11 17:15:49 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:15:49 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Rufus Wainwright & more on Moulin Rouge
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F91DD@miaexch1>

Isn't he lovely? His father is Louden Wainwright III, who had a few hits in
the late 60's & early 70's, and Rufus Wainwright's only had, I think, 2
albums so far. I've only heard of him through recommendations from people on
the Crowded House and Everything But The Girl (pre-house phase) mailing
lists but it was enough to get me to listen to his first cd, which was
released back in 1998. I don't have the new one yet, but I think I'm going
to have to get it, because I cannot turn La Butte Complete off! And to
think, I bought the MR soundtrack for Ewan! Huh!
 
Speaking of Moulin Rouge, VH1 in the US is now playing a video of the
Elephant Love Medley, which is cut directly from the movie - ewan & nicole
singing atop and inside the nifty elephant - it's a great thing to catch,
although I'm sad because I don't want this to be the next song released - I
want Come What May to be a *single* and get played on the radio - although
I've heard it's been tagged as a wedding song, which is, IMHO, not so good,
given what happens to Nicole's character....

-----Original Message-----
From: Rachel Bray [mailto:bray.262 at osu.edu]
Sent: Monday, June 11, 2001 9:07 AM
To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Rufus Wainwright


Real-To: "Rachel Bray" Strange that he did something on the Shrek
soundtrack, too.  He 
did my favorite song on the Moulin Rouge soundtrack (well, tied for 
favorite with Fatboy Slim's Because We Can and Ewan/Nicole's 
Come What May).  It's a beautiful song sung in both French and 
English.  I'd not heard of this guy until listening to my soundtrack.

Any fans of his out there that could recommend a good CD?

(by the way.....I've seen Moulin Rouge 5 times now.  Obsession is 
an ugly thing.)


Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge


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From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun 11 13:52:30 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:52:30 EST5EDT
Subject: Oh...and...um...
Message-ID: <107779A27A4@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

The Roxanne tango thing rocks pretty good, too.  :-)  Both the 
music AND the dancing.  

I guess I just can't pick a favorite song from the Moulin soundtrack 
now.  Oh well.  :-)  I love the Rufus song, the Fatboy Slim song is 
great to blast while driving to work and Come What May is just 
gorgeous....and during Roxanne, Ewan is just emotional that it 
breaks your heart.  

So forget what I wrote a bit ago.  I guess I really don't have a 
number 1 favorite.

Back to listen to the soundtrack again and drive everyone in the 
office nuts while I blast Because We Can.  :-)

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 11 17:54:59 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 10:54:59 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Obsession and Pixie Stix
In-Reply-To: <106B4211230@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <20010611175459.78518.qmail@web14505.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Rachel Bray <bray.262 at osu.edu> wrote:
> (by the way.....I've seen Moulin Rouge 5 times now.  Obsession is 
> an ugly thing.)

Wow! Five times? Dang, that's a lot! Are there Moulin Rouge Support
Groups? 

I'm hoping to see it again this weekend with my friend in Ohio. She
hasn't seen it yet. Boy, is *she* in for a treat! I'm just hoping that
I can restrain myself from singing along with the songs...
 
> "Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
> ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
>                        - review of Moulin Rouge
> 

<giggle> Pixie Stix's are evil! They can turn any self-respecting
person into a hyper five-year old! But there's nothing that equals them
if you want a good sugar rush. Now for a caffeine rush, I've heard
Surge is the thing to drink but I haven't tested this myself...

Ferret! <snorts> Anyone else immediately think of Draco the Bouncing
Ferret?

~Amber
(Hrm, a pointless post...thank god for delete buttons!)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/10/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From heidit at netbox.com  Mon Jun 11 17:57:15 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 13:57:15 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter]crack-addicted ferrets - the albino variety
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F91E1@miaexch1>


> "Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
> ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
>                        - review of Moulin Rouge

But I didn't see Draco Malfoy's name in the credits under *editor*...  




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun 11 14:08:49 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 14:08:49 EST5EDT
Subject: my sig line
Message-ID: <107BD362EA8@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

I read the review on Rottentomatoes.com.  I thought it was 
hysterical and very fitting.

I own a ferret so the thoughts of her being crack-addicted with ADD 
on a Pixie Stix high cracked me up.  She's already a spazz on just 
the food I feed her.  :-)  I can't imagine her even more so.

By the way, did you all catch that Ozzy Osbourne was the voice of 
the Green Fairy?



Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 11 18:27:23 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 11:27:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Starving artists, RENT, Indian in the Cupboard
In-Reply-To: <9g19kd+bln5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010611182723.13521.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Scott <insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> Oh Amber shall you take me under your wing? (I can do my own
> laundry.) People always ask what I want to be when I grow up, but it
> sounds foolish and impractical to say a "starving artist". As
> romantic as the concept seems to be I don't *want* to starve. :-)

How about instead of "starving artist" you could say "struggling
artist"? You don't have to starve then but can keep the delicious angst
which seems so romantic!

On a tangent, I've always loved the musical "RENT" and "La Vie Boheme"
is one of my favorite songs from it. "To days of inspiration, playing
hooky, making something out of nothing, the need to express, to
communicate, to going against the grain, going insane, going maaaaad!"
Oh Jonathan Larson, why did you have to leave the world so soon?

> The wizard toys thread reminded me of the "Indian in the Cupboard" 
> which were some of my favourites as well. The movie however would 
> have been *so* much better if they'd just set it in England. Maybe it
> *was* set in England and I've gotten it mixed up with another book/ 
> movie.

Gah, I'd completely forgotten about that book! I believe its got a
sequel to it too, but I remember thinking that it wasn't nearly as good
as the first book. To have a magic cupboard! I must admit that if I had
*had* a magic cupboard, my Strawberry Shortcake and Care Bear dolls
would probably have been stuffed in it post-haste! I never saw the
live-action movie that came out, was it worth seeing? 

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/10/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From mystril at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 11 18:35:01 2001
From: mystril at yahoo.com (mystril at yahoo.com)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:35:01 -0000
Subject: my sig line
In-Reply-To: <107BD362EA8@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <9g330l+u48g@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rachel Bray" <bray.262 at o...> wrote:
> I own a ferret so the thoughts of her being crack-addicted with ADD 
> on a Pixie Stix high cracked me up.  She's already a spazz on just 
> the food I feed her.  :-)  I can't imagine her even more so.
> 
> By the way, did you all catch that Ozzy Osbourne was the voice of 
> the Green Fairy?
> 

And for those of us who don't own ferrets, here's an example of what 
happens: http://sluggy.com/d/991114.html

~mystril




From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Mon Jun 11 18:46:18 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:46:18 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <20010610164556.8527.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9g33lq+ul95@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> 
> --- Milz <absinthe at m...> wrote:
> > Shadow Castle by Cockrell--Another book I checked out of the 
school 
> > library non-stop. A nice fantasy tale about a fairies.
> 
> Hey, I read that book too! In fact, I've got it...it was my
> Grandfather's and he gave it to me. According to the cover, it cost 
45
> cents then! It is a very sweet story, isn't it?
> 

Most people I've talked too never heard of "Shadow Castle". I borrowed 
it like crazy in the 3rd grade. Finally, a cousin gave me an old copy 
from the Scholastic Book club. The words were printed in a dark green 
color and the artwork on the cover was beautiful. Unfortunately, the 
book was a victim of the "great basement flood" of 1984. I recently 
purchased the book from Amazon.com. My only regret about the book is 
that Cockrell didn't serialize it. She left the ending wide open. i 
remember the first time I read it I thought "I wonder what happens in 
the next book."

During my "stranded alone on an island" stage, I read "Robinson 
Carusoe", "Call It Courage" and "Island of the Blue Dolphins". 

Does anyone remember a book from the 1980s that had clues to where a 
gold rabbit charm was buried? It was by an British author. The back 
cover had a photo of the rabbit as it lay in the dirt. I think the 
charm ws eventually found, but not by someone who read the book. Does 
it ring a bell to anyone?

Milz (who definitely helped to finance Scholastic Books as a child) 




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 11 18:57:03 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:57:03 -0000
Subject: Masquerade
In-Reply-To: <9g33lq+ul95@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g349v+3bth@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Milz" <absinthe at m...> wrote:

> Does anyone remember a book from the 1980s that had clues to where a 
> gold rabbit charm was buried? It was by an British author. The back 
> cover had a photo of the rabbit as it lay in the dirt. I think the 
> charm ws eventually found, but not by someone who read the book. 
Does 
> it ring a bell to anyone?

Yes, it was called Masquerade and it was a beautiful and, to my mind, 
faintly creepy book.  I forget the author but he was a jeweler and 
artist more than a writer; I'll never forget the illustration that was 
done all in inlaid wood.  The whole book was a work of art.  My friend 
and I tried to work out the clues but we never got anywhere.  

The person who found the treasure had read the book but hadn't really 
worked out the clue entirely, IIRC.  The author was disappointed.

I think he did a second one, didn't he?

Amy Z




From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 11 19:11:22 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (Laurin York)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 12:11:22 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Starving artists, RENT, Indian in the Cupboard
In-Reply-To: <20010611182723.13521.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20010611191122.59734.qmail@web14708.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Amber <reanna20 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> --- Scott <insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> Oh Amber shall you take me under your wing? (I can
> do my own laundry.) People always ask what I want to

> be when I grow up, but it sounds foolish and 
> impractical to say a "starving artist". As romantic 
> as the concept seems to be I don't *want* to 
> starve. :-)

> How about instead of "starving artist" you could say
> "struggling artist"? You don't have to starve then 
> but can keep the delicious angst which seems so 
> romantic! 

As a struggling artist, I can tell you--not so
romantic!  But there are always ways to cope; like
many singers who have barely a glimmer of a hope of
ever being on stage at the Met, I make a living as a
church/synagogue musician as well as giving private
voice/piano lessons.  I think this is the kind of work
that originally prompted the expression: "Eh.  It's a
living."
 
> On a tangent, I've always loved the musical "RENT"
> and "La Vie Boheme" is one of my favorite songs from

> it.

I also love Rent!  (I keep telling my other musician
friends not to be such a snob about pop and theatre
music!  Opera used to be pop music!) And of course,
the title of "La Vie Boheme" is a play on "La Boheme"
on which Rent was based. (And I love all Puccini. 
Don't get me started...)
 
> The wizard toys thread reminded me of the "Indian
> in the Cupboard" which were some of my favourites as

> well. The movie however would have been *so* much 
> better if they'd just set it in England. Maybe it
> *was* set in England and I've gotten it mixed up
> with another book/movie.
> 
> Gah, I'd completely forgotten about that book! I
> believe its got a sequel to it too, but I remember 
> thinking that it wasn't nearly as good as the first 
> book. [snip] I never saw the live-action movie that 
> came out, was it worth seeing? 
> 
> ~Amber
 
Actually, for his ninth birthday, I bought my nephew
all of the Indian in the Cupboard books (4), and he
loved them!  Then he used his allowance money to buy
the movie and insisted I watch it with him.  It really
was very well done, in spite of losing its British
setting.  It retained the moral struggle the boys went
through over their responsibility to these tiny
creatures who were not just toys, but real people with
real lives.  Oddly, in retrospect, Omri reminds me of
Harry, and Patrick of Ron...
 
 

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Mon Jun 11 20:27:58 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:27:58 -0000
Subject: Obsession (Moulin Rouge)
In-Reply-To: <20010611175459.78518.qmail@web14505.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9g39ke+9boa@eGroups.com>

Rachel wrote:
"(by the way.....I've seen Moulin Rouge 5 times now.  Obsession is 
an ugly thing.)"

--Obession and ugly thing? Nah! Your Harry Potter obession only led 
to consorting with a group of possibly-not-so-sane fanatics...then 
again there's not much wrong with that.

Amber cautioned:
"Wow! Five times? Dang, that's a lot! Are there Moulin Rouge Support
Groups?"

Try http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Moulin_Rouge I joined a few days 
ago but haven been able to catch up, or post much yet. It's actually 
as busy as hpforgrownup's!
 
"I'm hoping to see it again this weekend with my friend in Ohio. She
hasn't seen it yet. Boy, is *she* in for a treat! I'm just hoping that
I can restrain myself from singing along with the songs..."

--I pale in comparison! I've only seen it once. But I'm planning on 
seeing it again this week if possible. The closest cinema where it's 
playing is an hour away so I haven't had the time lately.

I *know* I'll try to sing along with all the songs. I've ditched the 
songs I'm supposed to be working on to sing Moulin Rouge. 

Because we can can can!!!

Scott
(A possibly-not-so-sane fanatic)
Listening to "Because we Can" right now....wait "Sparkling Diamonds" 
just started.






From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Mon Jun 11 20:35:08 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:35:08 -0000
Subject: Starving artists, RENT, Indian in the Cupboard
In-Reply-To: <20010611191122.59734.qmail@web14708.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9g3a1s+mgto@eGroups.com>

Laurin wrote:
"Actually, for his ninth birthday, I bought my nephew
all of the Indian in the Cupboard books (4), and he
loved them!  Then he used his allowance money to buy
the movie and insisted I watch it with him.  It really
was very well done, in spite of losing its British
setting.  It retained the moral struggle the boys went
through over their responsibility to these tiny
creatures who were not just toys, but real people with
real lives.  Oddly, in retrospect, Omri reminds me of
Harry, and Patrick of Ron..."

--There were four? I only remember reading two, but I might have read 
them all. "The Indian in the Cupboard" and...and...I can't remember 
the title "The mystery of the Cupboard" maybe? It was the one where 
the figure of the woman was some relation to him, and it was about 
time travel and she- I don't want to give it away if anyone ever 
reads it.

As a kid I had hundreds of those little figurine things, and so I 
*loved* to dream of making them come to life. 

Scott




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun 11 17:18:01 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 17:18:01 EST5EDT
Subject: For any Ewan fan
Message-ID: <10AE48B6612@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

Here's a site I just adore.  It's got TONS of pictures of Ewan.

Enjoy

http://www.theguardiansofpeace.de/Bilder/Photos_Ewan_McGregor/

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun 11 19:03:49 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 19:03:49 EST5EDT
Subject: Favorite books as a child
Message-ID: <10CA7F722BC@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

One book that I adored (and still have my copy of in my bookcase 
at my apartment) is There's A Monster At The End of This Book.  
It's "by" Grover, from Sesame Street.  It still cracks me up every 
time I read it.

I loved:
Harriet the Spy (still one of my all-time favorite books)
anything by Judy Blume (especially Are You There God?  It's Me, 
Margaret)
The Mouse and His Child
Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of N.I.M.H.
Frog and Toad series
Little Bear series
Madeline series
Where the Wild Things Are
The Great Brain series
anything by Dr. Seuss
Raggedy Ann and Andy and the Camel With the Wrinkled Knees
Narnia Chronicles

That would pretty much sum mine up.  I'm sure there are more but 
those are the ones that really stick out in my mind.

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From john at walton.to  Tue Jun 12 00:33:51 2001
From: john at walton.to (John Walton)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 20:33:51 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Everyone okay in Texas?
In-Reply-To: <002101c0f1d1$c9ff8940$143770c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <B74ADBAF.295D%john@walton.to>

Neil Ward said:

> I just saw the news about the flooding in and around Houston, TX.  Is
> everyone in Texas okay?

Quick update for those of you not on the Mod and FAQ lists:

Penny & family were indeed caught up in the floods, but are just fine and
camping out at the in-laws for now. She is, however, limited to a slow
dialup connection, so she might be a little scarce for the time being.

Penny, if you're reading this, know that we are ALL thinking of you, Bryce
and Elizabeth in what must be a very trying time for you all. (That goes for
anyone else in Houston!)

--John
________________________________

John Walton -- john at walton.to

Current...
Movie: Shrek. 11/10!
CD: Shrek Soundtrack ::grin::
Song: "Hallelujah": Rufus Wainwright (from Shrek soundtrack)
________________________________




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 01:21:42 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:21:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Can't believe it...
In-Reply-To: <9g2ma4+mf2t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010612012142.80596.qmail@web14506.mail.yahoo.com>


I honestly can't believe it. I was looking around on eBay at the
plethora of Harry Potter merchandise, just seeing what was there.
Anyways, did anyone know that there were Harry Potter GUITAR PICKS? No
joke, here's the url:

http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1437458378

Honestly, I was just thinking that I was getting used to the whole HP
merchandise thing and then this comes out of left field.

Eh, well, they look like nice guitar picks at least. Although for
$24.00, I'd choose some other HP item to get...

~Amber
(Who's still shaking her head and muttering...)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/10/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From bkdelong at pobox.com  Tue Jun 12 01:28:37 2001
From: bkdelong at pobox.com (B.K. DeLong)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:28:37 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Can't believe it...
In-Reply-To: <20010612012142.80596.qmail@web14506.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <9g2ma4+mf2t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010611212723.05474820@brain-stream.com>

At 06:21 PM 06/11/2001 -0700, you wrote:

>I honestly can't believe it. I was looking around on eBay at the
>plethora of Harry Potter merchandise, just seeing what was there.
>Anyways, did anyone know that there were Harry Potter GUITAR PICKS? No
>joke, here's the url:
>
>http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1437458378
>
>Honestly, I was just thinking that I was getting used to the whole HP
>merchandise thing and then this comes out of left field.
>
>Eh, well, they look like nice guitar picks at least. Although for
>$24.00, I'd choose some other HP item to get...

Actually, Amber...I think in this case these are homemade. Look at all the 
other picks this guy has:

http://www.coam.net/~picktrader/Picks/

It looks like he just took various cover pictures and had them made into 
picks or did them himself.


--
B.K. DeLong
Editor-in-Chief
The Leaky Cauldron
  an (unofficial) Harry Potter news site
+1.617.877.3271

bkdelong at the-leaky-cauldron.org
http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 01:42:32 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 18:42:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Everyone okay in Texas?
In-Reply-To: <B74ADBAF.295D%john@walton.to>
Message-ID: <20010612014232.5180.qmail@web13701.mail.yahoo.com>

John so called you did mention that! We were getting
worried about Penny and Elizabeth and of course Daddy!
Please pass it along to her that Wanda the Witch and
Her Merry Band of Muggles worried about her and all
the rest of the group down there. I haven't heard from
my Aunt Carol yet! She is in San Antonio. We have been
tuned into the Weather Channel, i hope to her from her
soon.
Please keep us updated. Again thank you for letting us
know.

Wanda, off on her broom to get boys into bed!

--- John Walton <john at walton.to> wrote:
> Neil Ward said:
> 
> > I just saw the news about the flooding in and
> around Houston, TX.  Is
> > everyone in Texas okay?
> 
> Quick update for those of you not on the Mod and FAQ
> lists:
> 
> Penny & family were indeed caught up in the floods,
> but are just fine and
> camping out at the in-laws for now. She is, however,
> limited to a slow
> dialup connection, so she might be a little scarce
> for the time being.
> 
> Penny, if you're reading this, know that we are ALL
> thinking of you, Bryce
> and Elizabeth in what must be a very trying time for
> you all. (That goes for
> anyone else in Houston!)
> 
> --John
> ________________________________
> 
> John Walton -- john at walton.to
> 
> Current...
> Movie: Shrek. 11/10!
> CD: Shrek Soundtrack ::grin::
> Song: "Hallelujah": Rufus Wainwright (from Shrek
> soundtrack)
> ________________________________
> 
> 


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From editor at texas.net  Tue Jun 12 02:37:17 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:37:17 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
References: <9g2gg6+i8d8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B25805C.90A99782@texas.net>

The Phantom Tollbooth.

--Amanda

Amy Z wrote:

> I don't remember too many of the picture books I read, though I did
> love The Snowy Day and everything else by Ezra Jack Keats--the art is
> so beautiful--and I'd put everything by Leo Lionni on the list.  I
> love collages.
>
> It's really odd how the lists are mostly U.S. authors, and how they
> are unknown in the U.K.  Why don't we read more of each other's
> children's books?
>
> Books I couldn't get enough of when I was a bit older:
>
> Laura Ingalls Wilder
> The Secret Garden, FH Burnett
> The Great Brain books, JD Fitzgerald
> the Mushroom Planet series, by Eleanor Cameron IIRC
> everything by Eleanor Cameron
> ditto Joan Aiken
> ditto Madeleine L'Engle
> the Earthsea Trilogy (now has 2 more books), Ursula LeGuin
> The Lottery Rose, Irene Hunt
> Sherlock Holmes
> The Return of the Twelves--don't recall the author, but it's about a
>   boy who discovers the Brontes' toy soldiers (?) and/or the stories
>   they wrote about them?  Really imaginative and terrific
> Mythology of all kinds, though I didn't discover the D'Aulaires `til I
>
>   was older: Edith Hamilton (Greece), Norse myths
> Bible Stories for Children retold by David Kossof--terrific, lively,
>   humorous retellings & illustrations
> Sal Fisher at Girl Scout Camp--don't ask me the author or why I read
>   it so many times, but I loved it
> The Moffats series by Eleanor Estes
> Half Magic by Edward Eager--it put me onto E. Nesbit, a bit too late
> Another series I didn't catch on to until it was too young for me was
>   Beverly Cleary.  I've read a few as an adult and would buy the lot
>   for any child I loved
> Narnia
> sea stories/mysteries by Howard Pease, which my dad loved as a kid and
>
>   recommended to me
> Mistress Masham's Repose, T.H. White--didn't discover that one `til
>   college & loved it
> Chronicles of Prydain by Lloyd Alexander--I just reread half of The
>   Book of Three standing in the children's section of the library and
>   it was every bit as good as I remembered
> Cricket magazine, still going strong!
>
> Amy Z
>
>
>                    Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
  [www.debticated.com]

>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Tue Jun 12 02:49:15 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 02:49:15 -0000
Subject: Masquerade
In-Reply-To: <9g349v+3bth@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g3vvb+3agv@eGroups.com>

Hello All!!!


> 
> Yes, it was called Masquerade and it was a beautiful and, to my 
mind, 
> faintly creepy book.

Odd you guys mentioning Masquerade...I just finished "The Phantom of 
Manhatten" by Fredrick Forsythe. It's the sequel to Phantom of the 
Opera. Creeeeeepy book. ::shiver::

Hugs
Jamieson  




From editor at texas.net  Tue Jun 12 02:57:25 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:57:25 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Everyone okay in TX?
References: <20010611044645.86477.qmail@web14608.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3B258514.C76956FE@texas.net>

Lakewood church? The one in the Woodlands? or another one?

--Amanda

Nethilia De Lobo wrote:

> And my mom and sisters were out in it. They slept on
> the 59 bridge because they couldn't get off the
> freeway. Then they got stuck at Lakewood church.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From klaatu at primenet.com  Tue Jun 12 04:17:55 2001
From: klaatu at primenet.com (Sister Mary Lunatic)
Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 21:17:55 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <3B25805C.90A99782@texas.net>
Message-ID: <MABBJPGEHBDBAKHGIBPOIEGGDNAA.klaatu@primenet.com>

Was anyone horse-crazy when they were kids?  I remember reading all the
Walter Farley horse stories (The Black Stallion, and The Flame), and
Marguerite Henry (Misty of Chincoteague, etc.)...  And any other story that
had horses in it.  Also, my dad used to read to us every night:  Count of
Monte Cristo, Three Musketeers, Grimm's and Anderson's Fairy Tales, and
there was a children's book of King Arthur/Camelot stories that I never got
tired of reading.

SML




From jenP_97 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 04:52:49 2001
From: jenP_97 at yahoo.com (Jennifer Piersol)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 04:52:49 -0000
Subject: Belated HB to Sheryll
In-Reply-To: <9g13eh+4a1e@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g4771+bt24@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rosmerta" <tmayor at m...> wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> > I just wanted to be probably the last person to wish Sheryll a 
very 
> happy
> > birthday!  
> 
> I hate to one-up an admin, but now it's looks like I'M last: Happy 
> Birthday Sheryll. Hope you got the cake and, eventually, the 
frosting.
> 
> ~Rosmerta

Nonono, let ME be the last. ;)  Didn't have computer access over the 
weekend (visiting family, husband went to a Bill Bruford concert, and 
came back with an autographed cd - he was SOOOOOOOOOO happy... ), so 
HAPPY BIRTHDAY, SHERYLL!

Jen




From jenP_97 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 05:13:27 2001
From: jenP_97 at yahoo.com (Jennifer Piersol)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 05:13:27 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <MABBJPGEHBDBAKHGIBPOIEGGDNAA.klaatu@primenet.com>
Message-ID: <9g48dn+4eed@eGroups.com>

I've realized that all the books I loved as a child are slowly making 
their way into my daughter's library... Here are a few...

Frog and Toad (Ginger loves these already)
Little Bear
Dr. Suess
Narnia
L'Engle
Anne books (and all other LMM)
Oz
Louisa May Alcott

Btw, I didn't get into LMM, Baum, and Alcott until I was in 8th-9th 
grade.  But when I got into them, I became obsessed.

Others:

The Little Engine that Could
all things Scarry

My older sisters (20+ years older) bought me a few "collections" of 
standard kiddie-lit - one was primarily nursery rhymes, fables, and 
short "snippets", the other was filled with single chapters from 
award-winning books.

And!  My all-time favorite was _Miss Jaster's Garden_ - and since it 
is sadly out of print, I'm trying to keep Ginger from mangling my old 
copy.  I have to say that it and _Green Eggs and Ham_ are my top two, 
but probably because they're the only books I can remember my mom 
reading to me before she died.


Jen (who can remember reading lots of other things, too - and who 
vividly remembers starting (and finishing!) Heidi during the 10-hour 
drive from Tucson to her hometown - when she was about 10)





From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 12 08:00:01 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:00:01 -0000
Subject: Happy Birthday, Jim!
Message-ID: <9g4i61+7qff@eGroups.com>

Let me be the first to wish Jim Flanagan, devoted listie and Moderator 
of distinction, the best of birthdays!  

::dons Birthday Elf party hat::

If you're on Magical E-Mail Address View, and can read this 
(jamesf at alumni.caltech.edu), feel free to send Jim birthday greetings 
personally.

Many Harry returns,
Amy




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Tue Jun 12 08:00:13 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:00:13 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <9g48dn+4eed@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g4i6d+8jbs@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Jennifer Piersol" <jenP_97 at y...> wrote:
> Jen (who can remember reading lots of other things, too - and who 
> vividly remembers starting (and finishing!) Heidi during the 10-
hour 
> drive from Tucson to her hometown - when she was about 10)

Oh, I forgot about Heidi!  My parents tried to stop me reading it 
after the first time, because it made me cry so much.  From then on 
they called it Weepy!  There was also a television adaptation when I 
was a child, and the music accompanying the opening credits was 
usually enough to set me off.  They still tease me about it now!

Catherine




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 12 08:04:46 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:04:46 -0000
Subject: Can't believe it...
In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.2.20010611212723.05474820@brain-stream.com>
Message-ID: <9g4ieu+qkdc@eGroups.com>

B.K. DeLong wrote:

> It looks like he just took various cover pictures and had them made 
into 
> picks or did them himself.

Which raises the question of why everyone doesn't just do their own 
silkscreening rather than shelling out to WB for Harry Potter 
Whatevers.

But also, isn't it illegal to sell things like this?  They have 
copyrighted material all over them.

Amy Z
who isn't going to turn him in




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 10:49:49 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:49:49 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Must Read Books for Kids/have we passed this on?
In-Reply-To: <9g4i6d+8jbs@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010612104949.49015.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>

Reading all these posts about the books we loved got
me to wondering. How many of us have children and what
are they reading? My daughter is past the children's
book 'stage' (as she refers to it), but it doesn't
stop her from reading them anyway. Her favourites were
the the Narnia books, LOTR, the Hobbit, Charlotte's
Web, The Secret Garden and too many more to list. She
checks books out of the library 17 at a time (that's
their limit if you're under 18)!

Sheryll, shaking her and wondering where her daughter
gets this from (hmmm.... must be her mother!)


=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From s_ings at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 10:50:11 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 03:50:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Must Read Books for Kids/have we passed this on?
In-Reply-To: <9g4i6d+8jbs@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010612105011.27528.qmail@web14608.mail.yahoo.com>

Reading all these posts about the books we loved got
me to wondering. How many of us have children and what
are they reading? My daughter is past the children's
book 'stage' (as she refers to it), but it doesn't
stop her from reading them anyway. Her favourites were
the the Narnia books, LOTR, the Hobbit, Charlotte's
Web, The Secret Garden and too many more to list. She
checks books out of the library 17 at a time (that's
their limit if you're under 18)!

Sheryll, shaking her and wondering where her daughter
gets this from (hmmm.... must be her mother!)


=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 
a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From hamster8 at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 12 11:05:39 2001
From: hamster8 at hotmail.com (hamster8 at hotmail.com)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:05:39 -0000
Subject: Can't believe it...
In-Reply-To: <9g4ieu+qkdc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g4t23+nj15@eGroups.com>

Amy said ...

> Which raises the question of why everyone doesn't just do their own 
> silkscreening rather than shelling out to WB for Harry Potter 
> Whatevers.
> 
> But also, isn't it illegal to sell things like this?  They have 
> copyrighted material all over them.
> 
> Amy Z
> who isn't going to turn him in

Me neither ... anybody up for lobbying Nokia to make Harry Potter 
covers for the 3210 and 3310 mobile phones?  It's an idea that struck 
me yesterday after I saw a BTVS cover kicking around a friend's flat.

I fully intend to have a Co-Ed Naked Quidditch T-shirt made as well, 
possibly for the next London/Oxford meet.

Al
who is pissed off that they didn't let *him* direct the movie




From bohners at pobox.com  Tue Jun 12 12:59:19 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:59:19 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
References: <9g2gg6+i8d8@eGroups.com> <3B25805C.90A99782@texas.net>
Message-ID: <02be01c0f33f$83fa92e0$ae98e2d1@rebeccab>

> The Phantom Tollbooth.

*loud and sustained cheers*
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From mystril at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 13:25:35 2001
From: mystril at yahoo.com (mystril at yahoo.com)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:25:35 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <02be01c0f33f$83fa92e0$ae98e2d1@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <9g558f+mr1s@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner" 
<bohners at p...> wrote:
> > The Phantom Tollbooth.
> 
> *loud and sustained cheers*
> --

I didn't read Phantom Tollbooth until I was a 25-year-old kid, within 
the past year or so. 

But when I was younger, I loved The Bobbesy Twins, Encyclopedia 
Brown, The Great Brain books, Beverly Clearly, Judy Blume, and I was 
obsessed with this book by Avi called Adam's Key. I took it out of 
the school library over and over. 

I remember not liking fantasy very much when I was very very young, 
but I think that was because a lot of the children's fantasy was 
pretty abysmal and I didn't have the skills to tell the good apart 
from the bad. 

-mystril

Now reading: Mulengro by Charles de Lint
Now listening to: Jackson Brown's The Next Voice You Hear
Last movie seen: Shrek





From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 13:58:46 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:58:46 -0000
Subject: Starving artists, RENT, Indian in the Cupboard
In-Reply-To: <9g3a1s+mgto@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g576m+3bpk@eGroups.com>


> --There were four? I only remember reading two, but I might have 
read 
> them all. "The Indian in the Cupboard" and...and...I can't remember 
> the title "The mystery of the Cupboard" maybe? It was the one where 
> the figure of the woman was some relation to him, and it was about 
> time travel and she- I don't want to give it away if anyone ever 
> reads it.
> 
> As a kid I had hundreds of those little figurine things, and so I 
> *loved* to dream of making them come to life. 
> 
> Scott
************************************************
Lynne Reid Banks: Return of the Indian, Secret of the Indian, Mystery 
of the Cupboard, Indian in the Cupboard 

I got these for my son when he was younger and I enjoyed them as much 
as he did. We watched the movie together, too. We still like to "see" 
pictures in the clouds together. (he is sixteen)

Was it not set in England? I thought it was. Or am I just remembering 
tthe English accents? I remember that somebody was visiting 
somewhere. hmmmmm

I used to collect the Disney figures and play out in the back yard 
with them and make "sets" out of rocks and sticks.

Doreen




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Tue Jun 12 10:01:15 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:01:15 EST5EDT
Subject: the new poster
Message-ID: <11B9DA5549C@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

When I saw Swordfish last night (yes...I saw something else other 
than Moulin Rouge!) a guy was looking at the new Harry Potter 
poster (the one with the boats) and said to his 
girlfriend/sister/whatever "Look.  It doesn't look a thing like 
Hogwarts."  I had to smile knowing he had read the books and had 
drawn his own conclusions on what Hogwarts looked like.  I leaned 
over as I was walking by him and said "Doesn't look like what I had 
in mind either."  He turned to look at me and said "Really!  I had 
more towers and more....well....this just isn't it."  And then he 
sighed this big "sad" sigh.  The girl he was with tried to comfort 
him by offering him a Twizzler.

Cute.

On a side note...I just won two Moulin posters (the Ewan and the 
Nicole) on eBay for $15.  Yay!


Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 14:22:11 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (Laurin York)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 07:22:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Heidi (was: 30 Must Read Books)
In-Reply-To: <9g4i6d+8jbs@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010612142211.870.qmail@web14707.mail.yahoo.com>

Okay, this is going to sound weird.  But my best
friend and I used to spend all of our spare time
playing games of "Let's Pretend" with the characters
from Heidi, among other favorite books (but we started
with Heidi, for some reason).  I was Heidi and she was
Goat-Peter.  We also did Tom Sawyer, Oliver Twist, the
Little House books, favorite movies and television
shows...

Little did I know at the time that we were engaging in
a kind of improv-fanfiction!  We freely combined
characters from disparate times and places (Dr. Who
and a time-machine also figured in our play, to
facilitate this).  We got quite melodramatic at times
(don't know how many "death scenes" each of us had)
and gave our imaginations quite a workout!  Probably
had something to do with my studying theatre later,
and then combining that with my love of music and
studying opera.  To think that it all starting with
curling up on my window seat on a summer day when it
was too hot to go outside, and reading Heidi cover to
cover...

--Laurin


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From heidit at netbox.com  Tue Jun 12 14:16:28 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:16:28 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Heidi (was: 30 Must Read Books)
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F91F2@miaexch1>

Ha! this was one I *never* did - I guess when one is named after the book,
one doesn't need to act it out - one just rereads it as often as possible. 
 
Wonder if my son Harrison (yes, named after the HP books, sorta) will do the
same thing?

-----Original Message-----
From: Laurin York [mailto:lyorkus at yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 10:22 AM
To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com <mailto:HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>

Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Heidi (was: 30 Must Read Books)


Real-To: Laurin York Okay, this is going to sound weird.  But my best
friend and I used to spend all of our spare time
playing games of "Let's Pretend" with the characters
from Heidi, among other favorite books (but we started
with Heidi, for some reason).  I was Heidi and she was
Goat-Peter.  We also did Tom Sawyer, Oliver Twist, the
Little House books, favorite movies and television
shows...

Little did I know at the time that we were engaging in
a kind of improv-fanfiction!  We freely combined
characters from disparate times and places (Dr. Who
and a time-machine also figured in our play, to
facilitate this).  We got quite melodramatic at times
(don't know how many "death scenes" each of us had)
and gave our imaginations quite a workout!  Probably
had something to do with my studying theatre later,
and then combining that with my love of music and
studying opera.  To think that it all starting with
curling up on my window seat on a summer day when it
was too hot to go outside, and reading Heidi cover to
cover...

--Laurin


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From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 12 14:37:01 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:37:01 -0000
Subject: Heidi (was: 30 Must Read Books)
In-Reply-To: <20010612142211.870.qmail@web14707.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9g59ed+k28e@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Laurin York <lyorkus at y...> wrote:
> Okay, this is going to sound weird.  But my best
> friend and I used to spend all of our spare time
> playing games of "Let's Pretend" with the characters
> from Heidi, among other favorite books (but we started
> with Heidi, for some reason).  I was Heidi and she was
> Goat-Peter.  We also did Tom Sawyer, Oliver Twist, the
> Little House books, favorite movies and television
> shows...

My best friend and I used to do this too.  Plus very humorous, at 
least we thought, versions of fairy tales and such, e.g. The Billy 
Goats Gruff (her back porch made a perfect bridge--I can't remember a 
thing about what we did with this but we used to laugh 'til we were 
sick) and Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs Minus Six.

Amy




From heidit at netbox.com  Tue Jun 12 14:39:43 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:39:43 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F91F4@miaexch1>

As Jen & Sheryll pondered - yes, all the books I loved are finding their way
into Harry's library, with some allowances for his being a boy, and
therefore, not likely to fully appreciate Eloise :) (but other traditionally
*girl* books like the little house series, Heidi and the Madeline books are
part of his library already).
In fact, I did a major search through bookstores to find the *exact* version
of The Little Engine That Could for him - I wanted the one with the pictures
of the lollypops that I loved - not the modern one with the CG pictures.
Yik!
He's got 3 Shel Silverstein poetry books and knows to say "WINS!" and jump
into my arms at the end of Hug O'War, we've just ordered The Monster At The
End Of The Book, and it's not bedtime if we don't read Goodnight Moon.
And I draw the elephant eaten by a snake with regularity - it's the only
animal I can draw well! - so he's getting familiar with The Little Prince.
My scandinavian stories - Snipp Snapp & Snurr, and Flicka Ricka & Dicka (one
of the SSS books has them going on a swim - and the intro says, "This is a
very old story with old illustrations and children should not think that the
way they swim, without a lifeguard or in fact any adult standing by and
watching, is safe" - AARGH!)
Some fairytales, like The Little Lame Prince and Peter Pan - long versions,
both - and animal stories like Black Beauty
Phantom Tollbooth, of course!
 
And for later on, a ton of our elementary school & junior high favorites are
on the shelves waiting for him - including 2 sets of Lois Duncan books. 
 
But on my bookcases, I still have a number of shelves dedicated to my
childhood reading - the good stuff - I've eliminated all but one of the
Sweet Valley High books - including:
All of A Kind Family series
All the Frances Hodgson Burnett books
Mallory Towers series
Noel Steatfeild's SHOES books (all of them!)
Beverley Cleary's Teenager-aged books, including Sister of the Bride and
Fifteen 
All my Little House books (although only The Long Winter is vintage 1970's
And some random books from the Scholastic Catalog Book Sales in elementary
school, like Journey to America, Baked Beans for Breakfast, What's For Lunch
Charlie and my first introduction to scotland - Searching for Shona.
 
And if anyone else ever read a book about 2 kids from an orphanage (which
they spelled backwards, as Eganahpro) and a boy who lived on a boat, running
away across the everglades, please let me know. I think the word Nautilus
factors into the title somewhere, somehow, but I don't really know *how*...



From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 14:47:21 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 07:47:21 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Must Read Books for Kids/have we passed this on?
In-Reply-To: <20010612104949.49015.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20010612144721.16996.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>


Well, 

I am always telling my  cousin to go and get certain books at the library.  She is now reading the Harry Potter series (she's 12).  She has also read and loved the anne books, charlotte's web, and Are you there God it's me Margret(she's reading that now).

Melanie



Hey everyone please go to my Harry Potter site at:  http://www.angelfire.com/realm/hogwarts2/index.html

 


 



---------------------------------
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Yahoo! Mail Personal Address - Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From bohners at pobox.com  Tue Jun 12 14:52:38 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 10:52:38 -0400
Subject: [HPforGrownups] Ginny's crush - Newfie (was Sirius trouble)
References: <9g56pd+3tfj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <003f01c0f350$87f3a9c0$6039acce@rebeccab>

> Yeah.  In Ginny's case, she had a whole year to work herself up about
> Famous Harry Potter and the tidbits,

Famous Harry Potter and the Tidbits... sounds like a 60's rock band.  I'm
imagining Ginny in the front row screaming and pulling at her pigtails when
Harry walks onstage...  :)

>> Well, yeah.  Heaven knows Sirius might start singing "I's the Bye"
 at any moment. <<

> ?? I don't get it.  Is this some kind of Newfoundland, the place,
> reference that non-Canadians can only scratch their heads at?

Guess so.  In Canadian parlance, a "Newfie" is a native of Newfoundland.
"I's the Bye" is a classic East Coast folk tune, sung in a very thick
/accent:  "I's the bye that builds the boat / and I's the bye that sails her
/ I's the bye that catches the fish / and takes 'em home to Lizer..."

Sirius may be a Newfoundland dog, but I am quite sure he is not a Newfie.
:)

> "O my America! my new-found-land . . . " (Donne, "To His Dead Sexy
> Animagus Going to Bed")

ROTFL!
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 12 15:24:38 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:24:38 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F91F4@miaexch1>
Message-ID: <9g5c7m+8pap@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Tandy, Heidi" <heidit at n...> wrote:
> As Jen & Sheryll pondered - yes, all the books I loved are finding 
their way
> into Harry's library, with some allowances for his being a boy, and
> therefore, not likely to fully appreciate Eloise :)

I would have thought that misbehaving children of whatever gender are 
irresistible!  Though I never liked Eloise as a child.  I appreciate 
her a lot more now!

Reading all those books to Harry sounds like so much fun.  People 
should offer rent-a-kid to those of us who don't get this opportunity 
very often.

Which reminds me of a picture book that I absolutely love.  It has no 
plot, really.  It's called The Small, Small Pond and both I and my 
favorite child when I worked in day care (shhh, don't tell anyone I 
had a favorite) loved it.  I read it to him almost every day for a 
while there.  Each page was about some different aspect of a pond, but 
they all had a frog, usually sort of hidden--behind something, or 
swimming through the water so that he was kind of faint.  Looking for 
the frog on each page was one of the great pleasures of reading the 
book (naturally the child had each location memorized very quickly, 
which did nothing to diminish the pleasure).

That's why I love Jan Brett's picture books too--there is always 
another story going on in the margins or elsewhere.  E.g. all through 
her "The Owl and the Pussycat," there's a fish under the boat who's 
looking for a mate.  She keeps meeting up with different kinds of sea 
creatures, but finally finds a fish exactly like her.  It's like 
solving a puzzle when you notice the shadow story.

Amy Z




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 15:31:56 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:31:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Heidi (was: 30 Must Read Books)
In-Reply-To: <20010612142211.870.qmail@web14707.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20010612153156.84555.qmail@web10902.mail.yahoo.com>


Little did I know at the time that we were engaging in
a kind of improv-fanfiction!  We freely combined
characters from disparate times and places (Dr. Who
and a time-machine also figured in our play, to
facilitate this).  We got quite melodramatic at times
(don't know how many "death scenes" each of us had)
and gave our imaginations quite a workout!  Probably
had something to do with my studying theatre later,
and then combining that with my love of music and
studying opera.  To think that it all starting with
curling up on my window seat on a summer day when it
was too hot to go outside, and reading Heidi cover to
cover...

--Laurin


Laurin,

I did the same thing!!  It is soo funny to me.  We used to run around creating stories about our favorite characters from Movies, books, etc.  I remember we all used to fight over would be Laura in The little house books..I remember we also liked the Frog Prince...I think it's kind of sad that my major (early childhood education) does not encourage me to use my imagination on a regular basis.  Oh well!



Hey everyone please go to my Harry Potter site at:  http://www.angelfire.com/realm/hogwarts2/index.html

 


 



---------------------------------
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Yahoo! Mail Personal Address - Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Tue Jun 12 15:34:43 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:34:43 -0000
Subject: Can't believe it...
In-Reply-To: <9g4t23+nj15@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g5cqj+s0hk@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., hamster8 at h... wrote:
> I fully intend to have a Co-Ed Naked Quidditch T-shirt made as     
> well, possibly for the next London/Oxford meet.

Sounds like a good idea. Now can we convince someone to design us a 
logo?

I have some comments to make about the meet up at some stage - but my 
brain is not working well enough for me to make these comments now.


> Al
> who is pissed off that they didn't let *him* direct the movie

Some people just show no consideration ;)


Simon




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 15:45:16 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 08:45:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] the new poster
In-Reply-To: <11B9DA5549C@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <20010612154516.26253.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>

Subject:[HPFGU-OTChatter] the new poster [input]   [input]   [input]   [input]   [input]   [input]   [input]  

When I saw Swordfish last night (yes...I saw something else other 
than Moulin Rouge!) a guy was looking at the new Harry Potter 
poster (the one with the boats) and said to his 
girlfriend/sister/whatever "Look.  It doesn't look a thing like 
Hogwarts."  I had to smile knowing he had read the books and had 
drawn his own conclusions on what Hogwarts looked like.  I leaned 
over as I was walking by him and said "Doesn't look like what I had 
in mind either."  He turned to look at me and said "Really!  I had 
more towers and more....well....this just isn't it."  And then he 
sighed this big "sad" sigh.  The girl he was with tried to comfort 
him by offering him a Twizzler.

That reminds me of the time that I first saw the cast of Sorcerer's/philosopher's stone.  I hat to admit I was unimpressed with Emma *hermione* and I complained about the casting decision.  However, now I am accepting this casting decision and I'm sure she will do a wonderful job.  It's sad though because often the picture you have in your mind dissappoints you when you see the movie production.

Melanie



---------------------------------
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From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 12 15:50:29 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 15:50:29 -0000
Subject: Quidditch t-shirts
In-Reply-To: <9g5cqj+s0hk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g5do5+dskl@eGroups.com>

Al wrote:

> > I fully intend to have a Co-Ed Naked Quidditch T-shirt made as    
 
> > well, possibly for the next London/Oxford meet.

Pig wrote:
 
> Sounds like a good idea. Now can we convince someone to design us a 
> logo?

Don't those shirts always include some kind of cute saying:  "Co-ed 
Naked Lacrosse: Rough, Tough, and in the Buff" sort of thing?  How 
about "Totally Bare Up in the Air" or "Where the Seekers are 
Starkers"?

In all seriousness, I'd buy a plain old (not "co-ed naked"--co-ed is 
fine, naked sounds a bit chilly) Gryffindor or Ravenclaw Quidditch 
t-shirt in a flash.  Did I hear someone say not too long ago that such 
a thing exists?

Amy
far, far away from any WB stores




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Tue Jun 12 11:53:19 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:53:19 EST5EDT
Subject: Quidditch Shirts
Message-ID: <11D7BCF0F73@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

Yep, they exist.  You can get all four of the houses team shirts.  I 
wish they would make them like hockey jerseys, though.  :-)  But 
they're really well made and the emblems look fabulous.

Co-Ed Naked Quidditch.....Bare in the Air....

I think this list should have those made!!!!!!!!  Then on the sleeves or 
the back we could have the website for the group or something.

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From heidit at netbox.com  Tue Jun 12 15:55:06 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:55:06 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Quidditch t-shirts
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F91FB@miaexch1>

The co-ed naked quidditch shirt comes from my fanfic, Surfeit of Curses
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Paradise/files/A%20Surfeit%20of%20Curses/
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Paradise/files/A%20Surfeit%20of%20Curses/>
) - if you're really ANTIfanfic, don't read the next 3 paragraphs:
[Draco] decided a summoning charm might be the least draining way to rouse
her. He focused all his energy on her blanket, and Accioed it from around
her body. She spun around for a moment, clutching for the cover, then jumped
to her feet. At that moment, Draco realized what a big mistake he'd made.

She was wearing a long shirt that said Co-ed Naked Quidditch - Gryffindor
Team in letters that flashed in alternates of red and gold, with a pair of
green knee socks. The shirt had obviously been washed often, because parts
of it were nearly diaphanous. 

She looked horrified to see him. 

<okay, fanfic inclusion over>

We set up a poll over on HP_Paradise for people to vote on what they want to
have as the tagline - if you join you can vote at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Paradise/surveys?id=661832
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Paradise/surveys?id=661832>  - (you can
join to vote & then quit, if  you don't want to be exposed to fanfic :)

	Four balls, no limits 	
	He'll seeker, they'll chaser, we'll beater 	
	Chasing balls around the pitch 	
	Get the snitch or die trying 	
	
We like to score 
 
I do like the "We're all bare & in the air" tagline too, but I can't add it
on to the poll because I'll lose all the votes - vote for OTHER if you want
that one, ok?
 
On the REAL merchandise issue, Warner Bros has a gym bag for the Gryffindor
House quidditch team too, which I use for my gymstuff. I love it, but I
think the other women at the gym look askance at it. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Amy Z [mailto:aiz24 at hotmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 11:50 AM
To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Quidditch t-shirts


Real-To: "Amy Z" Al wrote:

> > I fully intend to have a Co-Ed Naked Quidditch T-shirt made as    

> > well, possibly for the next London/Oxford meet.

Pig wrote:

> Sounds like a good idea. Now can we convince someone to design us a 
> logo?

Don't those shirts always include some kind of cute saying:  "Co-ed 
Naked Lacrosse: Rough, Tough, and in the Buff" sort of thing?  How 
about "Totally Bare Up in the Air" or "Where the Seekers are 
Starkers"?

In all seriousness, I'd buy a plain old (not "co-ed naked"--co-ed is 
fine, naked sounds a bit chilly) Gryffindor or Ravenclaw Quidditch 
t-shirt in a flash.  Did I hear someone say not too long ago that such 
a thing exists?

Amy
far, far away from any WB stores



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From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 16:45:34 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (Laurin York)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:45:34 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] the new poster
In-Reply-To: <20010612154516.26253.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20010612164534.79160.qmail@web14704.mail.yahoo.com>

 
> That reminds me of the time that I first saw the
> cast of Sorcerer's/philosopher's stone.  I hat to
> admit I was unimpressed with Emma *hermione* and I
> complained about the casting decision.   
> 
> Melanie
> 
What I noticed is that in the (now) famous picture of
the lead trio, Harry is the tallest one.  Hopefully
they'll put lifts into the shoes of the boy playing
Ron, or he'll have a growth spurt or something....

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From mecks at prodigy.net  Tue Jun 12 17:09:53 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:09:53 -0500
Subject: List T-Shirts (was Re: Quidditch Shirts)
References: <11D7BCF0F73@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <3B264CE1.F8102182@prodigy.net>

Rachel Bray wrote:
> 
> Yep, they exist.  You can get all four of the houses team shirts.  I
> wish they would make them like hockey jerseys, though.  :-)  But
> they're really well made and the emblems look fabulous.
> 
> Co-Ed Naked Quidditch.....Bare in the Air....
> 
> I think this list should have those made!!!!!!!!  Then on the sleeves or
> the back we could have the website for the group or something.

You know, if some one on list made something like that tied into this or
the main list, I'd probably be willing to cough up $20 or so for one....
:o) (CafePress makes shirts and I've heard they are rather good in
quaility...)  but hockley type shirts with a made up quiditch team for
Harry Potter for Grown Ups would be killer ;o)


-- 
Michela Ecks - mecks at prodigy.net - Textual Poacher - Spastic Hale Girl
"Babylon 5 was last of the Babylon stations. There would never be
another. It changed the future and it changed us. It taught us that we
have to create the future or others will do it for us. It taught us
that we have to care for one other, because if we don't, who will? And
that true strength sometimes comes from the most unlikely of places.
Mostly though, I think it gave us hope that there can always be new
beginnings, even for people like us." - Susan Ivanova



From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 18:47:08 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:47:08 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Must Read Books for Kids/have we passed this on?
In-Reply-To: <20010612105011.27528.qmail@web14608.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20010612184708.45200.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com>

My boys and I love all the books you have mentioned
here!
We do a lot of summer reading together. We will
probably see if our library has all 5 of The Dark is
Rising.
They are into R.L. Steine Goosebumps, Ghosts of Fear
Street and that sort of thing. They read with me Black
Beauty and Oliver Twist!!
Some boys don't like to read which I have learned from
the Teachers. But I haven't given up on my two! Thank
Goodness for JK Rowling and her Harry Potter Books!

Wanda(the witch) Mallett 

--- Sheryll Townsend <s_ings at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Reading all these posts about the books we loved got
> me to wondering. How many of us have children and
> what
> are they reading? My daughter is past the children's
> book 'stage' (as she refers to it), but it doesn't
> stop her from reading them anyway. Her favourites
> were
> the the Narnia books, LOTR, the Hobbit, Charlotte's
> Web, The Secret Garden and too many more to list.
> She
> checks books out of the library 17 at a time (that's
> their limit if you're under 18)!
> 
> Sheryll, shaking her and wondering where her
> daughter
> gets this from (hmmm.... must be her mother!)
> 
> 
> =====
> "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou
> art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail -
> only $35 
> a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
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From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 12 18:51:04 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:51:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Happy Birthday to Jim!
Message-ID: <20010612185104.10337.qmail@web13703.mail.yahoo.com>

Happy Birthday to one of our moderators!
May you get what you wish for today!
Enjoy today all day!

Wanda the Witch and Her Merry Band of Muggles wish you
all the best today!

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From hettick.1 at osu.edu  Tue Jun 12 18:56:37 2001
From: hettick.1 at osu.edu (Heather Hettick)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:56:37 -0400
Subject: Favorite books as a child
In-Reply-To: <992300725.2586.23953.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <NDBBLGKHGLCIANICKAJCMEMNDDAA.hettick.1@osu.edu>

My favorite books my Mom used to read was Black Beauty and the Winnie the
Pooh books.  She also read us lots of Dr. Seuss and  the basic little Golden
books.  We had a whole collection of Disney books on records with books you
follow along with too.

When I first started reading, I read all the Flip books and Beatrix Potter
books - I liked animal stories.  The only non animal story I really remember
is one about a red steamshovel that I liked a lot when I was small.  I liked
Judy Bloom books too and the Ramona the Brat stories.  I went through a
stage of trying to read classics and I really enjoyed most of the Mark Twain
books.  I never really got into the Nancy Drew/Hardy Boys books which were
quite popular with kids my age but read a few when visiting people who had
them just for something to do. (My husband actually liked them as his
favorite books as a kid, but he's the sort of person who prefers to read car
magazines and auto parts catalogs for entertainment now.)

As I got older, I read mainly horse books.  The Walter Farley Black Stallion
books and books by Margarite Henry.  Then I branched off into dog books like
the Big Red books, Jack London, Farley Mowat and other animal stories.
Charlotte's Web, Mrs. Frisbee and the rats of NIMH and Wind in the Willows
are favorites that I still own.  I read Watership Down for an English class
and liked it so much that I read more stuff by Richard Adams and the Plague
Dogs was one I liked even more.

When I was 13, my family moved to Sicily with the US Navy, and I met my best
friend, Betsy.  She introduced me to the Narnia books, Susan Cooper books as
well as some really great nonfiction books by Gerald Durrell and I read all
the James Herriot books that the tiny base library had. We also read lots of
comic books, mainly the DC superhero ones.

In later High School, I started reading a lot of Isaac Asimov and Agatha
Christie and still enjoy mysteries quite a bit but not most Sci Fi - Dick
Francis and P.D. James are my favorite mystery authors now.  I also read
just about every book that Ayn Rand wrote before I graduated high school.

My daughter just turned 3 and my favorite book to read to her right now is
Stellaluna.  She's quite fond of Madeline and Winnie the Pooh.  The Sara
Boynton books are pretty fun to read to small kids and I could memorize most
of them after a couple reads with all the rhyming - and so could she.  She
likes Dr Seuss quite a bit too.

Heather Hettick





From pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no  Tue Jun 12 19:30:40 2001
From: pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no (pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:30:40 -0000
Subject: Jennigs at School; Surge
In-Reply-To: <9g2ma4+mf2t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g5ql0+lcjh@eGroups.com>

JENNIGS at School; Surge (was Forgotten Dog Star book, favourite 
childhood reading AND Obsession and Pixie Stix)

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com, David 
<dfrankis at dial.pipex.com> wrote:

[snip]

> Did anyone read the Jennings series of books by Anthony
> Buckeridge - HP reminds me more of this than any other
> boarding school stories: the sense of humour is similar, and
> the pupil's view of teachers is well done (or seemed so 30
> years ago).  AB was an actual boarding school teacher.
> 
> David

Oh yes, yes, YES!  In an absolutely wonderful rewrite into Norwegian 
by Niels Reinhardt Christensen, whereby JENNIGS became STOMPA (for 
STein Oscar Magel-Paus Andersen).  These books have quite the 
following in Norway (oddly enough, as boarding-schools are most un-
Norwegian).  They were even made into a series of at least four 
movies, and there was a large number of radioplays for Children's 
Hour on Norwegian Radio (a programme that is roughly 70 years old, 
and still going strong with older children (a term open to personal 
definition, depending on whether or not you like the radio-plays)).

Two questions:
1.   Where did Jennigs' parents go off to?  In the Norwegian 
editions, they are in USA, but I would suspect that in the original 
they would be in Singapore or Hong Kong.

2.   What does Jennigs stand for?


--- Amber <reanna20 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Now for a caffeine rush, I've heard Surge is the thing to
> drink but I haven't tested this myself...

[snip]

Would Surge happen to be a vaguely yellowy-greenish, semi-opaque 
carbonated concoction of sundry artificial ingredients and additives 
and generous quantities of caffeine, produced by the Coca Cola 
Company, and contained in bottles with hideous green and orange 
labels?  (And did I just make it sound more like a form of chemical 
waste than a beverage?)  It is known as Urge in Norway.  Coca Cola 
apparently used Norway as a test-market for the product, and then 
decided to change the name (and possibly image) a bit for the 
international market.  Norway got to keep the product as Urge, 
though.  I do not know about caffeine-rushes; I seem to be immune to 
both sugar- and caffeine-rushes, and I was mightily puzzled the first 
time I heard of them.

> ~Amber
> (Hrm, a pointless post...thank god for delete buttons!)

Best regards
Christian Stub?
"I will see your pointlessness and raise you one more!"




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 12 19:48:37 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:48:37 -0000
Subject: Favorite books as a child
In-Reply-To: <NDBBLGKHGLCIANICKAJCMEMNDDAA.hettick.1@osu.edu>
Message-ID: <9g5rml+j8fb@eGroups.com>

Heather H. wrote:

>The only non animal story I really remember
> is one about a red steamshovel that I liked a lot when I was 
small.  

Is that Mike Mulligan and His Steam Shovel?

I loved that one and was really happy just a couple of weeks ago to 
walk into a bookstore and see that it's still in print.

She was more an animal than a machine--she had a name (Mary Ann 
IIRC), a face, and feelings.  So it's not surprising that it was your 
one non-animal story!

Amy Z




From aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org  Tue Jun 12 20:14:37 2001
From: aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org (Meredith Wilson)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:14:37 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Favorite books as a child
Message-ID: <D8085AFE4BC7D4119EA00090271EDF1503C21A@MAILSRV>

Boy oh Boy... favorite books as a kid... I've definitely seen similar
choices among the list, no surprise there!

When I was a kid:
Francis Hodgeson Burnett (I had a thing about orphans as a kid, and she
really helps out with that...)
Narnia
L'engle
All of Roald Dahl's stuff (Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, etc.)
All of the Beverly Cleary Ramona books
Judy Blume
Bobbsey Twins
Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of N.I.M.H.
Shel Silverstein books
This weird poetry book called Beastly Boys and Ghastly Girls that I got from
the library over and over... I'd love to find that one to have
I also used to love to get the Time-Life books about fantasy from the
library.

Younger than that:
Any Dr. Suess
Madeleine
Mike Milligan
Never Tease a Weasel (not to be confused with Weasley...)
Silvia the Sloth
Ferdinand

I still love kids' books.  My dream job is elementary school librarian. :)

Mer




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 12 21:23:31 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 21:23:31 -0000
Subject: Re [SPfor Grownups] Flying
Message-ID: <9g618j+lbok@eGroups.com>

Scott wrote:

> --I can think of two good parallels for flying. One is PE which 
> students are required to take in their first year of High School, 
and 
> is optional thereafter. 

You lucky thing.  We had to take it every year.

A parallel from my own high school experience would be swimming.  Our 
h.s. had a pool, and everyone needed to take at least one quarter of 
swimming.  I believe that the general idea was that no one should 
graduate from high school without this very basic life skill--good 
idea if you ask me (and one of the few instances where the curriculum 
seemed to be designed by someone who looked at life, looked at 
school, and tried to make school a decent preparation for life--I got 
a very good high school education, but it was mostly in spite of the 
official structures, not because of them).

I can't recall whether flying was optional.  My impression was that 
it was required--it just didn't take place during the usual classroom 
hours.

Amy




From joym999 at aol.com  Tue Jun 12 22:12:49 2001
From: joym999 at aol.com (joym999 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 22:12:49 -0000
Subject: 30 Must Read Books for Kids
In-Reply-To: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F91F4@miaexch1>
Message-ID: <9g6451+sjf5@eGroups.com>

> And if anyone else ever read a book about 2 kids from an orphanage 
(which
> they spelled backwards, as Eganahpro) and a boy who lived on a 
boat, running
> away across the everglades, please let me know. I think the word 
Nautilus
> factors into the title somewhere, somehow, but I don't really know 
*how*...

I read that book!  They called themselves *nahpros* instead of 
orphans, and they run away and befriend the boy on the boat, whose 
father eventually adopt them.  The boy on the boat is in some kind of 
trouble and they help him.  I loved that book!  Unfortunately, I am 
useless here as I can not remember the title either.

--Joywitch




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 13 01:15:11 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 01:15:11 -0000
Subject: Favorite books as a child
In-Reply-To: <D8085AFE4BC7D4119EA00090271EDF1503C21A@MAILSRV>
Message-ID: <9g6eqv+lqpo@eGroups.com>

Ahh my favourite books. I commented shortly on this thread earliar, 
but today I ran across old reading lists and got new inspiration. 

The Boxcar Children Mysteries
Anything Roald Dahl 
"The Castle in the Attic" and its sequel (can't remember the title.)
"Little Women"
"Little Men"(Even though Laurie and Jo should *obviously* have gotten 
together) :-)
"Walk Two Moons" by Sharon(?) Creech
"The Diary of a Young Girl" by Anne Frank
"The Eternal Spring of Mr. Ito(?)"
"A Tree Grows in Brooklyn" By Betty Smith
"Tom Sawyer" by Mark Twain
"The Wizard of Oz"
"The Indian in the Cupboard"
"Ginger Pye"
"To Kill a Mockingbird" by Harper Lee


This are books I read anywhere from the 2nd to 7th(?) grade, but they 
are still just a few...

Scott






From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 13 01:40:52 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (Laurin York)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:40:52 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Jennigs at School; Surge
In-Reply-To: <9g5ql0+lcjh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010613014052.17388.qmail@web14706.mail.yahoo.com>

  > Would Surge happen to be a vaguely yellowy-
> greenish, semi-opaque carbonated concoction of 
> sundry artificial ingredients and additives and 
> generous quantities of caffeine, produced by the 
> Coca Cola Company, and contained in bottles with 
> hideous green and orange labels?  (And did I just 
> make it sound more like a form of chemical waste 
> than a beverage?)     

Sounds like another version of Jolt! which is another
version of Mountain Dew, both of which were very
popular with friends of mine in college when they were
pulling all-nighters (or trying to stay awake in class
AFTER pulling an all-nighter).  I think they're about
1000% caffeine, or something...

--Laurin

(who was glad that bedrest was required before
voice-major recitals, not staying up all night...)



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From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 13 01:42:31 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 01:42:31 -0000
Subject: Wizarding Internet
Message-ID: <9g6ge7+6h5v@eGroups.com>

On the main list Rebekah wrote:
"About the wizards internet...any ideas on what it could be? For 
those who *don't* know, JKR was asked in a chat if Harry was ever 
allowed to use internet on Dudley's PC. JKR said there was something 
better the wizards had, better and more fun than the internet. I 
can't *possibly* imagine what it could be though."

--Blasphemy! Obviously Jo doesn't know what she's saying. :-) 
Something more fun than the internet? Never! Then again she isn't a 
member of this list and I doubt she reads to much fanfiction...

Scott
Who can't fathom life without a computer.




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 13 02:51:57 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 02:51:57 -0000
Subject: assumptions of race
Message-ID: <9g6kgd+55fn@eGroups.com>

The recent disussions about how JKR uses race in her books got me 
thinking. I think that JKR has neither forced race or ignored it. I 
don't see Cho or Padma or Angelina or anyone as being a "token" of 
their race. Rather I see them as being an obvious part of British 
Wizarding Culture. Diversity of race is a fact that should be 
embraced but often isn't. If one of them was the main focus of the 
books (like in TiP) then the different views and cultures would be 
much more important, but because it's not that apparent to Harry it 
isn't for the reader either.

 But sometimes race *isn't* clearly defined in a book, and we're left 
to  draw our own conclusions. (I can't think of a good example now, 
but I *know* I've read books like that.)

So my question is what do we assume when race isn't given? The race 
of the author? Our own race? It's not always a clear cut question.

Scott




From mecks at prodigy.net  Wed Jun 13 03:26:21 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 22:26:21 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] assumptions of race
References: <9g6kgd+55fn@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B26DD5D.88FB50A4@prodigy.net>

Scott wrote:
> 
> So my question is what do we assume when race isn't given? The race
> of the author? Our own race? It's not always a clear cut question.

I've been reading the thread on the main list with some interest... but
in answer to that question, I tend to assume the person is white because
I'm white and that's the easiest way for me to picture people...  (Which
is one of those things that if you translate this to the net, the
results may suprise you.  My best friend on the net for five years and I
met about a year ago...  I knew he had brown hair and brown eyes but it
never occurred to me to ask "Are you black?" and he didn't tell me so
there was some initial shock.)

And even when race is mentioned in some cases, it's hard to adjust
preconcieved thoughts and translate them into mental images.   I know in
the Honor Harrington books that the Queen (I just forgot her name. 
Elizabeth?) is dark skinned (it's in the future and not sure on the
wording there) as is Michelle Henke but with few exceptions in that
series, I'm not capable over over riding my cultural programming and
turning them into a different color/ethnicity...

And this all sounds probably some what arrogant and offensive.... dah
:o(  Just never really thought much about it before.

-- 
Michela Ecks - mecks at prodigy.net - Textual Poacher - Spastic Hale Girl
"Babylon 5 was last of the Babylon stations. There would never be
another. It changed the future and it changed us. It taught us that we
have to create the future or others will do it for us. It taught us
that we have to care for one other, because if we don't, who will? And
that true strength sometimes comes from the most unlikely of places.
Mostly though, I think it gave us hope that there can always be new
beginnings, even for people like us." - Susan Ivanova



From yael_pou at hotmail.com  Wed Jun 13 07:51:35 2001
From: yael_pou at hotmail.com (yael oren)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:51:35 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] assumptions of race
References: <9g6kgd+55fn@eGroups.com> <3B26DD5D.88FB50A4@prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <OE57C98Bi89QtpfTYSl0001024f@hotmail.com>

> So my question is what do we assume when race isn't given? The race
> of the author? Our own race? It's not always a clear cut question.

Usually, when I read a character's description, they remind me of someone
else and I adopt the race of that someone for the character as well. This
can cause quite a confusion. For instance, before Harry was cast in the
movie, I always pictured him as half Chinese. It went well with the unruly
black hair.

As for the minor characters, the ones that don't have any description, I
just don't think about it. I know this lacks some imagination, but I never
"see" them at all, and thus, don't need to give them a race.

I did have a bit of a surprise when an e-pal of mine sent me a picture.
Being a bit Prejudiced, I'm afraid, I assumed that a Jazz player from
New-Orleans, who's stories often have a theme connected to bigotry, was
black. I was in a bit of a shock to see a Dumbledore-type person smiling at
me from the photo.

At another occasion, I assumed that a kid who wrote to me about my
FanFiction was a girl. I assumed wrong, and I think I offended him a little.

Thanks, yael



From s_ings at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 13 12:38:18 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 05:38:18 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Favorite books as a child
In-Reply-To: <D8085AFE4BC7D4119EA00090271EDF1503C21A@MAILSRV>
Message-ID: <20010613123818.62529.qmail@web14604.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Meredith Wilson
<aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org> wrote:
> Boy oh Boy... favorite books as a kid... I've
> definitely seen similar
> choices among the list, no surprise there!
> 
> When I was a kid:
> Francis Hodgeson Burnett (I had a thing about
> orphans as a kid, and she
> really helps out with that...)
> Narnia
> L'engle
> All of Roald Dahl's stuff (Charlie and the Chocolate
> Factory, etc.)
> All of the Beverly Cleary Ramona books
> Judy Blume
> Bobbsey Twins
> Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of N.I.M.H.
> Shel Silverstein books
> This weird poetry book called Beastly Boys and
> Ghastly Girls that I got from
> the library over and over... I'd love to find that
> one to have
> I also used to love to get the Time-Life books about
> fantasy from the
> library.
> 
> Younger than that:
> Any Dr. Suess
> Madeleine
> Mike Milligan
> Never Tease a Weasel (not to be confused with
> Weasley...)
> Silvia the Sloth
> Ferdinand
> 
> I still love kids' books.  My dream job is
> elementary school librarian. :)
> 
> Mer
> 
The problem with working in a library is that there's
never enough time to read the books!

Has anyone read Dennis Lee's books of children's
poetry? Alligator Pie, Nicholas Knock, ...darn, can't
remember the rest of the titles. Very funny stuff.
Nyssa also had a book of poetry titled 'I'm Mad At
You', but it got lost somewhere and we've never been
able to find it again. Anyone heard of this/know who
the author is? I'd love to find a copy for my niece
and nephews.

Sheryll

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 13 12:41:19 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 05:41:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] assumptions of race
In-Reply-To: <9g6kgd+55fn@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010613124119.54103.qmail@web14503.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Scott <insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> So my question is what do we assume when race isn't given? The race 
> of the author? Our own race? It's not always a clear cut question.

I have the same answer that Michela Ecks wrote: I automatically assume
my race if there's no indication otherwise. I know that I rarely know
the race of the author, unless they have a picture on the book
somewhere and I happen to look at it.

However, this changes with setting. If I'm reading a book set in China,
Japan, Africa, etc, I assume the characters are of the same race as
those countries. Names are also a clue (like Cho Chang). 

But if the setting is in an undefined place, and the name isn't
anything specific, then I assume my race. 

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Wed Jun 13 11:34:40 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Simon)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:34:40 +0100
Subject: No! Film and merchandise stuff
Message-ID: <LOBBLGEGEBLNEOFHCDINKEOJDKAA.simon.branford@hertford.ox.ac.uk>

Hello


I was visiting the Leaky Cauldron news site
(http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/) this morning when I ran across an article
(http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2001_06_10_archive.html#4046790) saying
that Celine Dion had recorded a song for the film, written by the duo
responsible for My Heart Will Go On. I feel I may have to go off and kill
myself. I can imagine little worse than a song similar to the Titanic theme
playing out as the film ends. The confidence that I was finally getting about
the films production and the feeling that we may actually get a decent film
has now totally evaporated. I am not at all happy.


Continuing on with information from that site (which I feel I may have to
rename the bearer of bad news!) there was an article
(http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2001_06_10_archive.html#4037003) about a
trading card game. There have been many comments on this group about the hair
colour of Hermione being too blonde in the pictures done by Warner Brothers. I
feel that most of the WB pictures look positively ok when compared to these.
How much blonder is Hermione, who has brown hair in the books, going to get?
The WB pictures at least seem to have her with light brown hair but these
latest pictures seem to have her as an outright blonde.


Does anyone get the impression I am not in a good mood?


Simon
--
Acalculia (akal-kule-ah) an inability to solve mathematical calculations
(Miller-Keane Medical Dictionary, 2000)
WELL, MATHS, said Death dismissively. GENERALLY I NEVER GET MUCH FURTHER THAN
SUBTRACTION (Thief of Time - Terry Pratchett)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------





From mrs_snape at yahoo.de  Wed Jun 13 07:39:26 2001
From: mrs_snape at yahoo.de (Mrs Snape (Dinah))
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:39:26 +0200
Subject: Playing make-believe (was: Heidi )
References: <20010612142211.870.qmail@web14707.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <034401c0f3e1$e7b0f8e0$d62a07d5@oemcomputer>

Laurin wrote:
>Okay, this is going to sound weird.  But my best
>friend and I used to spend all of our spare time
>playing games of "Let's Pretend" with the characters
>from Heidi, among other favorite books (but we started
>with Heidi, for some reason).  I was Heidi and she was
>Goat-Peter.  We also did Tom Sawyer, Oliver Twist, the
>Little House books, favorite movies and television
>shows...

<g> Me and my best friend did this with the "Winnetou" books (do you know those books over there in the US? Cheey, unreal and even fake, but hold that certain "Wild West" romantic.) Hmmm... StarTrek was another favorite of ours, as well as the Three Musketeers. No children's books, though, only stables full of make-believe horses, inspired by those books. Oh, and the new version of the Mission: Impossible series, which was one of the few decent Programmes we had at that time.

Now, please don't try to come after me and put me in the loony bin, but I still do it sometimes. Especially if I'm writing something and have problems with the Dialogue I tend to "act out" the scene.

~ Dinah ~    

ICQ: 10 44 52 471
YM: bludger_witch

"Sometimes people think that home is a place. It can be a person." 

~ Gabrielle, "Back in the Bottle"


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 13 15:55:18 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 15:55:18 -0000
Subject: No! Film and merchandise stuff
In-Reply-To: <LOBBLGEGEBLNEOFHCDINKEOJDKAA.simon.branford@hertford.ox.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <9g82d6+fgti@eGroups.com>

Simon wrote:
"I was visiting the Leaky Cauldron news site (http://www.the-leaky-
cauldron.org/) this morning when I ran across an article 
http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2001_06_10_archive.html#4046790) 
saying that Celine Dion had recorded a song for the film, written by 
the duo responsible for My Heart Will Go On. I feel I may have to go 
off and kill myself. I can imagine little worse than a song similar 
to the Titanic theme playing out as the film ends. The confidence 
that I was finally getting about the films production and the feeling 
that we may actually get a decent film has now totally evaporated. I 
am not at all happy."

--Did you have to ruin my day? I have nothing against Celine Dion, 
"Titanic", or "My Heart Will Go On". However I DO NOT WANT IT IN 
HARRY POTTER! Perhaps what's worse is the title- "The Boy Who lived". 
Those of us worried that it would become an over used slogan ad 
nauseum seem to have our worst fears reaslised.

Simon also wrote:
"There have been many comments on this group about the hair
colour of Hermione being too blonde in the pictures done by Warner 
Brothers. I feel that most of the WB pictures look positively ok when 
compared to these. How much blonder is Hermione, who has brown hair 
in the books, going to get? The WB pictures at least seem to have her 
with light brown hair but these latest pictures seem to have her as 
an outright blonde."

--Note to WB: HERMIONE IS NOT BLOND! I just don't understand *why* 
they give her blond hair in the artwork. It's mentioned numerously in 
the books, and by the movie stills we've  seen Emma has brown hair as 
well. I guess the artist didn't bother to read the books OR consult 
with the filming people. BTW, I thought Harry and especially Ron 
looked just as bad.

> Does anyone get the impression I am not in a good mood?

Scott
Who is now in a not so good mood as well, and is more and more 
convinced that we should've handled the movie. ;-)





From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 13 16:51:30 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (lyorkus at yahoo.com)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 16:51:30 -0000
Subject: No! Film and merchandise stuff
In-Reply-To: <9g82d6+fgti@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g85mi+a05a@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Scott" <insanus_scottus at y...> wrote:
> Simon wrote:
> "I was visiting the Leaky Cauldron news site (http://www.the-leaky-
> cauldron.org/) this morning when I ran across an article 
> http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2001_06_10_archive.html#4046790) 
> saying that Celine Dion had recorded a song for the film, written 
> by the duo responsible for My Heart Will Go On. I feel I may have 
> to go off and kill myself. 
  > 
> Scott
> Who is now in a not so good mood as well, and is more and more 
> convinced that we should've handled the movie. ;-)

The line for putting your head in the oven forms to the rear.  I 
thought it was bad enough that "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" was 
ruined by a completely inappropriate American-style pop song at the 
end (especially after all of the wonderful cello music played by Yo 
Yo Ma!), and now you tell me this!  IMNSHO (speaking as a musician 
and composer) the only person who should be permitted to write music 
for film that includes lyrics is Randy Newman. (I'm not counting 
Disney stuff or cartoons--and even then, Newman's stuff--like for the 
Toy Story movies--is head and shoulders above the rest.) It's bad 
enough that all movie soundtracks seem to be composed by John 
Williams, James Horner or Elmer Bernstein (who is the only one of 
them who isn't a hack).

I wonder whether Roald Dahl ever cringed when he heard the song "The 
Candy Man"... or whether he cringed at the fact that the movie became 
a story about Willy Wonka, instead of being about Charlie...

--Laurin

(Who would hate to try to conduct a performance of the Hogwarts 
school song...)






From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 13 16:51:25 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:51:25 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] No! Film and merchandise stuff
In-Reply-To: <LOBBLGEGEBLNEOFHCDINKEOJDKAA.simon.branford@hertford.ox.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <20010613165125.12479.qmail@web14501.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Simon <pigwidgeon at inbox.as> wrote:
> I was visiting the Leaky Cauldron news site and an article was
> saying that Celine Dion had recorded a song for the film, written by 
> the duo responsible for My Heart Will Go On. I feel I may have to go
> off and kill myself. I can imagine little worse than a song similar
> to the Titanic theme playing out as the film ends. The confidence
> that I was finally getting about the films production and the feeling
> that we may actually get a decent film has now totally evaporated. I
> am not at all happy.

Hm, I think I also read this somewhere. Frankly, I'm not surprised. It
almost seems inevitable that they would put a sappy ballad at the end
of the movie. I must say that I groaned when I saw that it was to be
named "The Boy Who Lived". With a title like that, you just know the
song will be awful. At least the song is just at the end of the film,
and not <shudder> somewhere during.

I'm also not too fond of the choice of Celine Dion. I don't mind one or
two of her songs but she's just not really my cup of tea and just
*feels* wrong for the HP movie. Too bad fans of the book weren't
consulted about this sort of thing. Or maybe they were...<shudders
again>

> How much blonder is Hermione, who has brown hair in the books, going
> to get? The WB pictures at least seem to have her with light brown
> hair but these latest pictures seem to have her as an outright
blonde.

Well, the picture of just Hermione seems to be fine hair-wise although
I hate the cartoonish, slightly drunk look on her face. The picture of
Hagrid, Ron, Harry, Norbert, and Hermione though...hmmm. Don't know
quite what to say. Looks like the person who gave the description of
the scene to the artist in question didn't do a good job.

I definitely am not too pleased with the artwork on any of the three
cards. I rather like the coloring job but am not fond of the
poses/facial expressions. But I must say that every person sees things
differently and there is likely to be people out there who love the
look.

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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a year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Wed Jun 13 17:22:27 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 17:22:27 -0000
Subject: No! Film and merchandise stuff
In-Reply-To: <LOBBLGEGEBLNEOFHCDINKEOJDKAA.simon.branford@hertford.ox.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <9g87gj+gd8c@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Simon" <pigwidgeon at i...> wrote:
> Hello
> 
> 
> I was visiting the Leaky Cauldron news site
> (http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/) this morning when I ran across 
an article
> (http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2001_06_10_archive.html#4046790) 
saying
> that Celine Dion had recorded a song for the film, written by the 
duo
> responsible for My Heart Will Go On. I feel I may have to go off 
and kill
> myself. I can imagine little worse than a song similar to the 
Titanic theme
> playing out as the film ends. The confidence that I was finally 
getting about
> the films production and the feeling that we may actually get a 
decent film
> has now totally evaporated. I am not at all happy.


Well, I agree with you and Scott - I'm not in a good mood about this 
either.  I have never been a fan of Celine - her voice is too whiney 
for my tastes, and some of her songs get on my nerves as much as 
nails down a blackboard.

I also don't understand the need for some soppy ballad at the end of 
this film.  It may work for a romantic comedy, but not for a film of 
this scope.  It wasn't necessary for Star Wars, Indiana Jones, ET 
(all of which are John Williams scores as well) and I can imagine it 
ruining the whole atmosphere of the film for me.  I'm hoping that a)
that this is a false rumour or b) that any song by Celine is in 
another context.  If it was CoS, I can imagine her voice coming out 
of Molly Weasley's wireless, but even that is a stretch.  I had 
another thought as well, that considering James and Lily are in the 
film, the Mirror of Erised could be adapted so Harry sees them in 
some green and pleasant Welsh/Celtic environment with Celine's not so 
dulcet tones soaring above them.  Yuck!

On merchandise - there are some things I love - I have sampled Bertie 
Botts EFBs - had great fun with the kids, although we vetoed the 
sardine flavoured one as we are trying to encourage them to eat fish 
at the moment and that particular bean could only put them off.  I'm 
also very attached to my sorting hat bookends, and my Harry at 
Platform 93/4 Desk Clock (Harry's face doesn't look too bad in this 
one).  But, I hate the way Ron and Hermione look.  With Hermione, it 
is partly because I always imagined her to look the way I did at her 
age (although I didn't have her teeth), but with both of them, they 
just look too vacuous and cartoonish - and yes, Hermione's hair is 
wrong.

I was also very disappointed with the Chocolate Frogs.  They could 
have done great collectibles here - with a little help from JKR, 
someone could have used their imaginations and started doing loads of 
wizards and witches, including the characters we know from the book.  
Instead, we get these stupid 3-D cartoon characters of Scabbers etc.  
Scabbers and Norbert just look too cute.  The latter in particular 
looks as though he wouldn't hurt a fly.

Some of the games are great - really beautiful to look at.  Ditto 
some of the jigsaw puzzles, but I have to agree that the majority of 
the stuff available is tacky and don't seem a fair representation of 
the characters/beings we know and love.  I know it is unfair to 
expect them to get it exactly as we would wish, but I think they 
could have done better than this.

OK, you set me off on a rant there, Simon!

Catherine, who is definitely not a fan of Celine Dion!




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Wed Jun 13 20:07:11 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 20:07:11 -0000
Subject: No! Film and merchandise stuff
In-Reply-To: <LOBBLGEGEBLNEOFHCDINKEOJDKAA.simon.branford@hertford.ox.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <9g8h5f+s5hg@eGroups.com>

Simon wrote <various peeved things about merchandise>

I am with you 1000%, Simon (oops, my aculculia is acting up).  Let's 
form a support group/terrorist organization and call it the Pigwidgeon 
Curmudgeons.

Amy Z
who is proud to say she doesn't know how the Titanic theme goes, hates 
everything she's ever glimpsed of that stupid film, and will never, 
ever, ever voluntarily watch a movie by James Cameron

unless he directs one of the HPs...perish the thought




From heidit at netbox.com  Wed Jun 13 20:22:40 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (heidit at netbox.com)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 20:22:40 -0000
Subject: Pigwigeon's Curmudgeons (Was Re: No! Film and merchandise stuff)
In-Reply-To: <9g8h5f+s5hg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9g8i2g+as1l@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Simon wrote <various peeved things about merchandise>
> 
> I am with you 1000%, Simon (oops, my aculculia is acting up).  
Let's 
> form a support group/terrorist organization and call it the 
Pigwidgeon 
> Curmudgeons.
> 

Not an option. I just got the most wonderful book - The Superior 
Person's Book of Words, which has a brilliant selection of words and 
their definitions, with suggested usages of many of the words 
therein, and in so reading, I learned the following:
Curmudgeon, a noun, is defined as "Cantankerous codger. Bother 
curmudgeon and codger apply to men only, and htere appears to be no 
female equivalent. Perhaps grimalkin, an old she-cat or nasty old 
woman, comes closest to it; but it is not really synonymous."

btw - moving ONtopic - the book also defines GUDGEON and MUNDUNGUS. 
An excellent resource for names of people, places or shops in the 
PotterVerse




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Wed Jun 13 22:06:58 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:06:58 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] assumptions of race
Message-ID: <F231OZzHZlJ2HxYHLBQ00015967@hotmail.com>

--- Scott <insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> > So my question is what do we assume when race isn't given? The race
> > of the author? Our own race? It's not always a clear cut question.

Interesting question!  I had to strain my brain to think of the last time 
that I've had absolutely no "racial" or ethnic clues while reading 
something.  I still can't think of a time, really... I do know for some 
strange reason, it didn't surprise me in GoF that Angelina was black.  (I 
was quite surprised that she actually got a date for the Yule Ball, though.) 
  I'd been shocked about Lee, Dean, and Parvati in book 1, then again in 
book 3 that Cho was Harry's first crush.

When I first read SS, with Dean, Lee, and Parvati, I was shocked... and had 
to actively remember that there is a nonwhite population in England. I'd 
known this of course (we had a biracial exchange student from Liverpool 
attend our high school during my junior year), but being quite honest, 
multiculturalism is *not* the first thing that comes to mind when we think 
of England over here.

Going back to the question... not thinking about race and ethnicity is not a 
luxury that some of us have.  <g>  Even my youngest students have their own 
stories about race (usually focused around times when they were with Mom and 
Dad and something bad happened... or playing at a park/swimming at a pool 
and something bad happened... and so on).  Already they are aware that they 
are "different" than the American norm.  When we did Census 2000 lessons, 
and it was mentioned that black Americans are no longer the 
"majority-minority", one of my kids whispered to me, "Do you think they want 
us to all disappear?"

I said, "Let's hope not..." and moved on.  For I honestly didn't know what 
to say.

If it seems that ethnic minorities can be sometimes obnoxious about 
demanding fair representation, it is only because we have been invisible for 
so long... and when we did appear, the voices that represented us were not 
authentic.  Slavery only ended 100-150 years ago in the Western world (and 
continues in certain parts of the world), widespread colonialism only 40-60 
years ago, and de jure segregation only 10-30 years ago.

These institutions were in place for over half a millennium, helping to 
shape the Western world into what it is today.  It'll take generations for 
us to mold the way we deal with each other now into something better IMO.

Back to books...

Usually, I go by the race of the author, since people mostly write what they 
know.  It's usually easy for me to pick up subtle clues.  An easy one is 
blushing... I think it's fair to say that most people of African descent do 
not appear to blush.  (We do, really--the same thing happens--you just can't 
see it!)  If we're fair enough to do so, we almost never say the person in 
question blushed, we invariably say they "turned red" (and in certain parts 
of the South, lighter-skinned blacks are called "redbones" because of this). 
  The way we handle our hair is different, too... the majority of black 
girls don't toss their hair, or fluff it, or do anything to it but leave it 
the heck alone unless we're getting it done... it most likely took a 
Herculean amount of effort to get it like that in the first place. <vbg>

Telling the race of the author is not always easy, but sometimes it is 
easier to tell what the writer is *not*.  A usual clue that an author is not 
of African descent is when they describe our teeth or eyeballs as being 
unusually white, or describe eyes and teeth in contrast to our skin.  Never 
in my recollection do I recall a black writer doing this.  *Especially* not 
the teeth thing... too many uncomfortable echoes of the auction blocks, 
y'know?

Another thing I've noticed is that with white writers and characters, the 
description seems to focus a lot on the hair and eyes (especially in 
romances and women's fiction), whereas a modern black writer describing 
black characters will concentrate on the skin color... whether the 
character's skin is ivory, cafe au lait, toast, cinnamon, honey, golden, 
sepia, mahogany, milk or bittersweet chocolate, or deepest charcoal.  This 
is because one of the purposes of description is to differentiate characters 
one from another... and since most blacks have brown to black hair and dark 
eyes, the hair/eyes convention doesn't do much for us.

There are lots of other subtle clues that one can pick up on.  And white 
writers aren't the only ones guilty of stereotyping... in modern Af-Am lit, 
whites are very often stereotyped as well.  Which is just as wrong.  Not all 
whites are racist.  Not all white families will disown their children if one 
or more of them marries outside of her race.  Not all white women are 
deathly afraid of black men.  Not all whites are punctual, hard-working, and 
play by the book, always ready to blow the whistle.  Not all white cops are 
candidates for the Ku Klux Klan.  Yet these are all common stereotypes 
you'll find in the current bestsellers by black writers.

As a child growing up in a majority-black environment, whenever I read in a 
book that a character was "dark" as opposed to being fair, I automatically 
assumed they were black.  When I learned that this meant only that the 
character had dark hair and eyes, I was a little disappointed.  You see, I'd 
had to image myself out of some of my favorite children's stories!

--Ebony AKA AngieJ
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Wed Jun 13 22:46:49 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:46:49 -0000
Subject: assumptions of race
In-Reply-To: <F231OZzHZlJ2HxYHLBQ00015967@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9g8qgp+freu@eGroups.com>

Ebony wrote:

> When I first read SS, with Dean, Lee, and Parvati, I was shocked... 
and had 
> to actively remember that there is a nonwhite population in England. 
I'd 
> known this of course (we had a biracial exchange student from 
Liverpool 
> attend our high school during my junior year), but being quite 
honest, 
> multiculturalism is *not* the first thing that comes to mind when we 
think 
> of England over here.

I have a theory about this (the "I" and "we" that follow are a white, 
middle-class, hyper-educated, PBS-viewing U.S. woman's perspective):

-England connotes high class.  Even accents we recognize as 
lower-class are so terrifically cool that we like them way better than 
anything the U.S. produces.  But most English accents we hear are high 
class:  movie actors, Masterpiece Theater characters, news 
broadcasters, Monty Python.  In decades past, an upperclass U.S. 
accent was close to a British one--again, something you heard in the 
movies a lot (think Margaret Dumont--or was she actually British and 
I've forgotten?).  If an American wants to imitate someone being 
snobbish, he fakes a British accent.

-Put that together with "black" connoting "lower class," as it does to 
middle-class U.S. whites, and you get a jarring effect when you 
imagine black people with British accents.  Black voices are deemed 
inferior to ours (I blush, and when I blush I really turn red, to say 
it, but it's true); English voices are deemed superior. 

-In most British TV we see, the cast is pretty homogenously white.  
Mystery, Masterpiece Theatre, Monty Python, All Creatures Great and 
Small, all those sitcoms (Are You Being Served, Good Neighbors, To the 
Manor Born, Yes, Minister, Vicar of Dibley, Fawlty Towers, etc. etc.). 
 I'm several years out of the loop, so maybe British TV (or the bits 
of it that come west) has gotten more diverse, but when I was a kid 
watching all that stuff on TV, it was pretty close to lily white.

All of this adds up to an experience of going to London and feeling as 
if everyone who opened his or her mouth, whatever race or ethnicity 
he/she was, could have been straight out of a Monty Python sketch.  
(This was a source of great amusement to my family--the most ordinary 
statement seems comical.  But it also meant a crash course in British 
diversity.)

I've had the same experience going to Israel, where it seemed so 
amazing to me that the Jews weren't all white, as we almost all are in 
the U.S., the only exceptions I knew as a child being a couple of 
African-American and Pakistani kids adopted by a white Jewish woman.  
I knew already, intellectually, that this was because most American 
Jews are European, and that Israel is different, but it was still 
startling--and gratifying in a way that would take another long post 
to explain--to see Jews of all colors and ethnicities.

>  When we did Census 2000 lessons, 
> and it was mentioned that black Americans are no longer the 
> "majority-minority", one of my kids whispered to me, "Do you think 
they want 
> us to all disappear?"
> 
> I said, "Let's hope not..." and moved on.  For I honestly didn't 
know what 
> to say.

This is very sad.  Your students are lucky to have you, Ebony.  I 
don't think there's any way to answer that question, because the 
honest answer is "Some of them do."  I don't know at what age one can 
possibly absorb that ugly truth.

> Another thing I've noticed is that with white writers and 
characters, the 
> description seems to focus a lot on the hair and eyes (especially in 
> romances and women's fiction), whereas a modern black writer 
describing 
> black characters will concentrate on the skin color... whether the 
> character's skin is ivory, cafe au lait, toast, cinnamon, honey, 
golden, 
> sepia, mahogany, milk or bittersweet chocolate, or deepest charcoal. 
 This 
> is because one of the purposes of description is to differentiate 
characters 
> one from another... and since most blacks have brown to black hair 
and dark 
> eyes, the hair/eyes convention doesn't do much for us.

I suspect this is one of the reasons whites have trouble 
distinguishing among Asians, e.g.--when one depends so heavily on hair 
color and texture and eye color to describe people, one loses one's 
eye for other details.  This can come across as very racist ("they all 
look alike"), and sometimes it is; but I've seen this tendency in 
myself even in distinguishing between white people who have the same 
hair and eye color.  I recall one time when I was teaching, I had no 
problem memorizing almost all of my students' names within the first 
week, but I kept mixing up two girls who both had long red hair, 
freckles, and light eyes.  After a couple of weeks, when I knew them 
better, it seemed laughable that I'd mixed them up--they didn't look 
at all alike.  But I only "saw" the hair, eyes, and in the most 
general way, skin color, and those were the same.

You've opened my eyes with your explanation that African-Americans 
tend to describe each other by shades of brown (and how 
lovely--cinnamon, coffee . . .).  I have read this in fiction and been 
made very uncomfortable by it--somehow it's part of my 
white-person-trying-not-to-be-racist mostly-unconscious training to 
not describe people by skin color.  It does make total sense to do so.

Amy Z




From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 13 22:59:37 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (lyorkus at yahoo.com)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:59:37 -0000
Subject: assumptions of race
In-Reply-To: <F231OZzHZlJ2HxYHLBQ00015967@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9g8r8p+pkid@eGroups.com>

It's interesting the way that JKR doesn't use nationality to describe 
characters, but uses shorthand such as simply calling Angelina black 
or saying Lee had dreadlocks (although I did know some students in 
college with dreadlocks who were Jewish and wore their light-brown 
hair in dreadlocks...long story).

In this country, we're so hung up with what to call people: African-
American, Asian-American, etc.  Many times this is just plain wrong.  
My neighbors across the street are from Manchester, England (the mom) 
and the Gambia (the dad) and their son was born here (US).  Only the 
child is technically African-American.  I think the best way to 
describe this family is to say they are of African descent.  What do 
folks say in Britain?  (I should ask my Manchester-born neighbor, I 
suppose.)  I think in books like the Raj Quartet I saw things like 
Anglo-Indian and Anglo-African, but that actually seemed to describe 
people's ethnicity, not that they or their ancestors were born one 
place and they now live in another.  (Plus the Raj Quartet is full of 
derogatory terms for people of color.)

My nephew went to daycare at the local public school and was one of 
the few white children in the class.  His parents didn't think 
anything of it; nor did he.  He still goes to the same school, and 
when he had to do a report for Black History Month in second grade, 
he said he didn't personally know anyone black!  This kid was raised 
so color blind, he considered his friends to be brown, tan, 
coffee...I thought it was great!  After a Herculean effort, my sister 
finally convinced him that his favorite daycare teacher was black and 
he could write about how much he had loved having her for his 
teacher...Sadly, he will never again have the innocence he had before 
having to do that report.  

Rambling done.  Now just waiting for the "race" section to be removed 
from all forms in this country...since we're all part of the human 
race.

--Laurin





From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Wed Jun 13 23:07:03 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:07:03 -0400
Subject: Even worse than the hair
Message-ID: <F184TFur2iz2Mb1s7nl0000165b@hotmail.com>

Some of the drawings of Hermione have her with hair that you could 
conceivably call light brown rather than blond.  Okay, I can handle that.

But her eyes are not blue.  Someone talked to the artist and reported back 
here months ago, and he said sure he read the books and he read that her 
eyes are blue.  He must've been stung by a Billywig at the time 'cause he 
never read any such thing.  We all know that you can be sure you saw 
something in the books and it turns out to have been a figment of your 
imagination, but I wish someone--JKR, an HP-obsessive at WB (if there are 
any), the artist's 10 year old kid, someone--had said to him, "Her eyes are 
BROWN.  Please change them!"

Grrr.

BTW, I had a nice experience with my HP-ignorant spouse this afternoon.  I 
explained the gnashing of teeth occasioned by the Celine Dion news (oh, 
someone please say it's a rumor instead), because long after I'd gotten off 
the net, I kept giggling to myself about Laurin's "the line for putting your 
head in the oven forms at the rear" line and had to share it with him (he 
laughed).  Then I got bold and explained the whole "Boy Who Lived" thing, 
even though it meant I had to explain the whole thing about Voldemort and 
the first chapter of PS/SS, and the fact that this expression comes up in 
fandom but not in the rest of the books, and everything.  He instantly 
understood why it seems so slogan-y and irritating to me, and why it was the 
last straw for The Dion to be singing a song by that title.  One day he's 
going to break down and read the books and my life will be complete.

Amy Z
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 13 23:18:47 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 16:18:47 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Cute story
In-Reply-To: <20010612164534.79160.qmail@web14704.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20010613231847.57664.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>


Today I was watching the school aged children at the daycare center that I work at during the summer.  The boys noticed that I had brought POA to read during my lunch break.  It was really funny becauses they started to talk about Harry with me.  I found it very humorous because we started to discuss who we thought was going to die.  They agreed with me on a lot of the people, they all want Percy dead (poor guy).  But the funniest thing was when this little kids (who could be Harry, he had black hair bright green eyes and pale skin) was like I want Peeves to die.  And I"m like peeves can't die, he's already dead.  They debated with me for a bit...LOL...I said well maybe he will stop haunting Hogwarts....so that was our conclusion.  I don't know it was just funny to me.  

Melanie



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From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Wed Jun 13 23:45:00 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 23:45:00 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: assumptions of race
Message-ID: <F53ZGYmXvmmKtrM0mkh000029de@hotmail.com>

Amy wrote:

>-Put that together with "black" connoting "lower class," as it does to
>middle-class U.S. whites, and you get a jarring effect when you
>imagine black people with British accents.  Black voices are deemed
>inferior to ours (I blush, and when I blush I really turn red, to say
>it, but it's true); English voices are deemed superior.

I think this just may be it... and it's not just to "middle class American 
whites" to which black English connotes lower socioeconomic status.  Many 
middle-to-upper class blacks despise black English... I don't.  If I did, I 
think my family would disown me.  So I'd say the majority of blacks learn to 
be bidialectal.  I am, much to my mother's chagrin--please don't think I 
sound like my posts all the time in RL.  ;-)

The only black character with a British accent I can remember is the butler 
in The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air.

Amy:
>-In most British TV we see, the cast is pretty homogenously white.
>Mystery, Masterpiece Theatre, Monty Python, All Creatures Great and
>Small, all those sitcoms (Are You Being Served, Good Neighbors, To the
>Manor Born, Yes, Minister, Vicar of Dibley, Fawlty Towers, etc. etc.).
>  I'm several years out of the loop, so maybe British TV (or the bits
>of it that come west) has gotten more diverse, but when I was a kid
>watching all that stuff on TV, it was pretty close to lily white.

This is it again for me, Amy... thanks!  I always knew that there are 
nonwhites in Europe--I have relatives who have lived in Germany for nearly 
my entire life.  However, I never thought of people of color (another 
generic term for any nonwhite ethnic group) as being as integrated into 
European culture in any real sense.  Certainly not integrated enough to 
qualify for inclusion in JKR's Harry Potter books.  Perhaps this was due to 
my stereotyping, but I always thought of them as being much more 
marginalized than we are here.

Amy:

>I've had the same experience going to Israel, where it seemed so
>amazing to me that the Jews weren't all white, as we almost all are in
>the U.S., the only exceptions I knew as a child being a couple of
>African-American and Pakistani kids adopted by a white Jewish woman.
>I knew already, intellectually, that this was because most American
>Jews are European, and that Israel is different, but it was still
>startling--and gratifying in a way that would take another long post
>to explain--to see Jews of all colors and ethnicities.

Ooh, another long post, whenever you get the time someday.  :-)  Or e-mail 
me offlist.  Theoretically I believed this, but in actuality my PoV about 
Jews in Israel is similiar to yours, Amy.

Me:
> >  When we did Census 2000 lessons,
> > and it was mentioned that black Americans are no longer the
> > "majority-minority", one of my kids whispered to me, "Do you think
>they want
> > us to all disappear?"
> >
> > I said, "Let's hope not..." and moved on.  For I honestly didn't
>know what
> > to say.

Amy:
>This is very sad.  Your students are lucky to have you, Ebony.  I
>don't think there's any way to answer that question, because the
>honest answer is "Some of them do."  I don't know at what age one can
>possibly absorb that ugly truth.

Even sadder is the fact that they already *know*.  I didn't realize until I 
got home and thought about it that the question was rhetorical.  ;-)

But then again, there's always someone who wants some group that's not like 
them to just go away.  What a sad way to live life, don't you think?

Amy:
>I suspect this is one of the reasons whites have trouble
>distinguishing among Asians, e.g.--when one depends so heavily on hair
>color and texture and eye color to describe people, one loses one's
>eye for other details.

You know, while I don't think that blacks have that much trouble 
distinguishing whites, many blacks do have difficulty distinguishing Asians 
as well.  Because of the attention most of us pay to skin tone, texture and 
color, the fact that many Asians have similar coloring makes this just as 
difficult for us.

And again, whites aren't the only racists on the planet.  The most racist 
people I have *ever* met in real life have been certain upper-class 
blacks... they became the model for Angelina's family in my fic.  ;-)  Now, 
I don't believe they have a cornerstone on racism, but...

Amy:
>You've opened my eyes with your explanation that African-Americans
>tend to describe each other by shades of brown (and how
>lovely--cinnamon, coffee . . .).  I have read this in fiction and been
>made very uncomfortable by it--somehow it's part of my
>white-person-trying-not-to-be-racist mostly-unconscious training to
>not describe people by skin color.  It does make total sense to do so.

Well, the poetic among us use the pretty names.  The masses use "light", 
"dark", "brown"... but you do hear average folks using "cocoa", "caramel", 
and "chocolate".  ;-)

And then there are the ugly slurs, the ugliest of all which the middle to 
lower classes uses as a term of endearment or derision... the word that 
starts with "n" and rhymes with figure, which I never use even when speaking 
nothing but black English.  My lifelong crusade is to get my people to 
understand that for us to say it's all right if *we* use it, but *they* 
can't is the height of hypocrisy... not to mention dead confusing.  I get 
teased a lot, but I don't care.  I hate that word.  :-)

About not wanting to offend:  I've always told my white friends not to try 
so hard... when in doubt, just ask.  I'm just as lost in a roomful of 
Vietnamese or Arabic-speakers, so whenever I meet people, I ask questions.  
(I get this from my mother, who is absolutely *fascinated* by anyone who is 
not a black Detroiter and who will stop strangers in public to interrogate 
them about their country, their background, everything...)  When people are 
asking questions, they are admitting that they don't know everything and do 
not wish to assume.  Believe me, I'll ask you about stuff I want to know 
about *your* culture...

I tell my black friends, on the other hand, to lighten up and recognize when 
a person is trying.  <g>

Thanks for responding, Amy!  Although we come from very different contexts, 
it seems we think a lot alike.  Or perhaps I flatter myself... your posts 
are always so good.  ;-)

--Ebony AKA AngieJ
_________________________________________________________________
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From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 14 01:41:46 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (lyorkus at yahoo.com)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 01:41:46 -0000
Subject: Diversity/Conformity (was: assumptions of race)
In-Reply-To: <F53ZGYmXvmmKtrM0mkh000029de@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9g94oq+c3ot@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Ebony Elizabeth Thomas" <ebonyink at h...> 
wrote:
 
> Many middle-to-upper class blacks despise black English... I 
> don't.  If I did, I think my family would disown me.  So I'd say 
> the majority of blacks learn to be bidialectal.

Actually, that phenomenon is called "context switching" by linguists 
(thought about being a linguistics major for a while in college).  
Linguists adamantly do NOT look down on any kind of dialect.  
Frankly, since I live in the city, I have no problem with many 
dialects of English, but I sometimes think it's weird when I travel 
to Pennsylvania Dutch country and hear someone say, "The car needs 
washed."  (they leave out the "to be.")  Evidently a holdover from 
Pennsylvania German.
 
> The only black character with a British accent I can remember is 
the butler in The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air.

There is at the moment a character on "The Gilmore Girls" who is a 
snooty French hotel concierge, and, coincidentally black.  (This show 
also has some of the few Asian characters on television to day.)

> Amy:
> >-In most British TV we see, the cast is pretty homogenously white.
> >Mystery, Masterpiece Theatre, Monty Python, All Creatures Great and
> >Small, all those sitcoms (Are You Being Served, Good Neighbors, To 
> the Manor Born, Yes, Minister, Vicar of Dibley, Fawlty Towers, etc. 
> etc.). 

Hasn't anyone seen "Chef!"?  It's a hoot, with a lead character who 
is black, as well as several supporting characters.  There is also 
quite a diverse cast on Eastenders, but I don't really watch it just 
because I don't watch soap operas in general, American, British or 
otherwise.

It is odd that there aren't many American shows on these days that 
air on the big networks that have predominantly minority casts.  I 
didn't think it was strange to watch Sanford and Son or Chico and the 
Man or the Jeffersons or Good Times (which dealt with serious issues 
amidst the comedy) when I was growing up, but many things on the WB 
or UPN which have minority casts just don't appeal to me.  I liked 
Roc and Living Color, but they were taken off the air.  Figures.  
(Don't get me started on the good shows Fox has booted...)

And as far as diversity goes (this veers dangerously close to being 
on-topic!) it suddenly occurred to me that singing a school song in 
unison is in its way a kind of forcing conformity down kids' 
throats.    Perhaps JKR is thumbing her nose at that kind of 
conformity by having the Hogwarts school song be whatever each person 
wants it to be!  (Most school songs are dreck anyway; I was stuck 
playing my school song on the piano for 8th grade graduation and it's 
a miracle I made it to high school without slitting my wrists as a 
result.) 

    




From editor at texas.net  Thu Jun 14 02:33:15 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 21:33:15 -0500
Subject: Anyone heard of this?
Message-ID: <3B28226B.EC168129@texas.net>

After a year and a half of therapy, my son's speech therapist says she
thinks he may have apraxia. Anyone out there have any experience with
this? I've found a few sites on the web, but I'm just trying to get a
better "feel" for it.

Thanks,
Amanda




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 14 04:06:12 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 21:06:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Anyone heard of this?
In-Reply-To: <3B28226B.EC168129@texas.net>
Message-ID: <20010614040612.509.qmail@web10906.mail.yahoo.com>


Amanda,

Is that like auditory dislexia....

Melanie



Hey everyone please go to my Harry Potter site at:  http://www.angelfire.com/realm/hogwarts2/index.html

 


 



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From nethilia at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 14 07:49:30 2001
From: nethilia at yahoo.com (Nethilia De Lobo)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 00:49:30 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: The Flooding in Houston
In-Reply-To: <992452813.627.12059.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010614074930.50479.qmail@web14605.mail.yahoo.com>

Lakewood church? The one in the Woodlands? or another
one?

--Amanda
*^*^*^*

Sorry it took me so long to reply, I spent all day
yesterday flying from Houston to Denver and just
checked my HP mail. I'm gonna be at my boyfriend's
place for the next month (I'm making him read all the
books, he hasn't read any of them). 

But about the church, I mean that big one that was on
the TV. It's somewhere on the North side, not quite
Woodlands, I think. TThough at one point my mom was
out in the woodlands trying to get home to me. 

--Neth





=====
--Nethilia de Lobo--
**Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus.**

http://www.geocities.com/spenecial
Spenecial.com. Two girls. One Website. Total Chaos.

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From yael_pou at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 14 09:35:50 2001
From: yael_pou at hotmail.com (yael oren)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:35:50 +0200
Subject: who's going to die; Weatherby (was: Re: Cute story)
References: <20010613231847.57664.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <OE48CVYl4maEqxGGmNN00010c84@hotmail.com>

Since I heard that JKR said that someone is going to die and that it will "half kill her", I kept wondering who it's going to be. At first, I thought (like others) that it'd be Ron. Then, I've heard some rumours about Ginny, and my heart dropped. I really like the cute little girl who has a desperate crash on out hero.

Recently, I had a chance to read sections of the original interview. JKR said that it's going to be some "special admirer of Harry". I think I know who. I have a strong suspicion that it's going to be Hagrid. I'm going to be sorry for him, but it fits his character too well.

As for Percy - I just had an absurd idea. What if Crouch called him "Weatherby" not because he was confused, but because Percy was really using that name for some reason. The name "Weasley" is too well associated with Muggles. What is (despite his red head) Percy was doing some under-cover job in the ministry? He is the perfect spy type. A good spy is not like "James Bond" or "Patrick Kim". A good spy looks and acts like an accountant.

Just a thought.

Is this thread going to be kicked off the list because it's too on-topic? :)

Thanks, yael

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Melanie Brackney 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2001 1:18 AM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Cute story



  Today I was watching the school aged children at the daycare center that I work at during the summer.  The boys noticed that I had brought POA to read during my lunch break.  It was really funny becauses they started to talk about Harry with me.  I found it very humorous because we started to discuss who we thought was going to die.  They agreed with me on a lot of the people, they all want Percy dead (poor guy).  But the funniest thing was when this little kids (who could be Harry, he had black hair bright green eyes and pale skin) was like I want Peeves to die.  And I"m like peeves can't die, he's already dead.  They debated with me for a bit...LOL...I said well maybe he will stop haunting Hogwarts....so that was our conclusion.  I don't know it was just funny to me.  

  Melanie




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 14 11:56:53 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:56:53 -0000
Subject: Changing your looks
Message-ID: <9ga8q5+cuq4@eGroups.com>

Re: that thread on Hermione at the ball on HPfGU.

I like to look pretty as much as the next person, and I admit to a 
weakness for clothes that is frankly a spiritual peril, but whenever I 
hear someone say "I did X (dyed my hair, got a nose job, bought a new 
wardrobe, wore makeup, etc.) for myself, not for anyone else," an 
inner voice says "Oh, really?"  Appearance is almost entirely for 
other people, and the pressure not to look a certain way comes from 
the fact that the people around you don't like that kind of look.  If 
people regularly told you you looked gorgeous without your changing a 
thing about your looks, would you feel the inclination to? 

Looks are such odd, arbitrary things.  Our self-esteem becomes 
dependent on the random cultural beliefs that surround us.  In my 
culture, unlike others in other times and places, fat is deemed ugly, 
so overweight people tend to feel lousy about their looks and 
themselves.  If I lived in a culture that thought red hair was ugly, 
I'd have a whole self-esteem challenge that I don't currently have to 
deal with.  Could I really say that dyeing my hair brown was a purely 
aesthetic, personal choice, when in =this= culture, which thinks my 
hair's a nice color the way it is, I have no desire whatsoever to dye 
it brown?

What we do "for ourselves" has an awful lot to do with what will gain 
us praise and acceptance by others.

Amy Z
donning asbestos, because I have never found an issue that gets people 
as riled up as this one




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 14 12:07:41 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:07:41 -0000
Subject: who's going to die; Weatherby 
In-Reply-To: <OE48CVYl4maEqxGGmNN00010c84@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9ga9ed+8i08@eGroups.com>

Yael wrote:

> As for Percy - I just had an absurd idea. What if Crouch called him 
"Weatherby" not because he was confused, but because Percy was really 
using that name for some reason. The name "Weasley" is too well 
associated with Muggles. What is (despite his red head) Percy was 
doing some under-cover job in the ministry? He is the perfect spy 
type. A good spy is not like "James Bond" or "Patrick Kim". A good spy 
looks and acts like an accountant.
> 

Ooh, I like this because the "Weatherby" joke always strikes me as 
farfetched.  Crouch works with Arthur--how can he get his son's name 
wrong?  If he called him Peter instead of Percy, now, that I could 
understand.

What bothers me is that kids want to see Percy die because they don't 
like him.  It's enough to make me want her to kill Ron, just to teach 
kids that in war, the people you like die, not just the ones you 
don't.  That's kind of the catch, though it might not occur to readers 
in a country whose last war ended with fewer than 50 U.S. dead and 
millions of Iraqi dead.  Maybe they think war is always that weighted 
towards the "good guys."

BTW, to back up the thread a ways, Peeves isn't the same as a ghost.  
No one's quite sure how poltergeists are different, but he's not 
transparent, isn't a proper ghost according to Nick, and as far as we 
know was not formerly a living human.  

There might also be a way for ghosts as well as poltergeists to "die" 
(be dispersed?).

Amy Z
who wants to know more about the Bloody Baron




From dfrankis at dial.pipex.com  Thu Jun 14 13:30:18 2001
From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com (dfrankis at dial.pipex.com)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:30:18 -0000
Subject: Jennigs at School; Surge
In-Reply-To: <9g5ql0+lcjh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gae9a+dbe2@eGroups.com>

Christian Stub? wrote:
> Two questions:
> 1.   Where did Jennigs' parents go off to?  In the Norwegian 
> editions, they are in USA, but I would suspect that in the original 
> they would be in Singapore or Hong Kong.
> 
> 2.   What does Jennigs stand for?
> 

It's many years since I read these books, but I think they just 
stayed at home - you didn't have to be going abroad to send your 
children to boarding school.  I vaguely remember his best friend 
Darbishire's ('My father says...') parents live in Hertfordshire or 
Herefordshire (what a difference a letter makes).

His surname was Jennings.  As was customary at many schools at that 
time, children knew each other by their surnames, though they also 
got nicknames.  It was still thus in my grammar school in the 
seventies.

David, selv f?dt i K?benhavn




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 14 13:53:19 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 06:53:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Changing your looks
In-Reply-To: <9ga8q5+cuq4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010614135319.541.qmail@web14503.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Amy Z <aiz24 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Appearance is almost entirely for other people, and the pressure not
> to look a certain way comes from the fact that the people around you
> don't like that kind of look.  If people regularly told you you
> looked gorgeous without your changing a thing about your looks, would
> you feel the inclination to? 

Maybe yes, maybe no. I know I would love to die my hair both a mixture
of blond and red. I think this not because people have told me my brown
hair is ugly, or I've gotten no compliments on my hair. I just happen
to think a mix of blond and red would look neat/beautiful and I'd love
to try it. Even if people always told me I was beautiful, I think I
would still do it (I won't ever though because of work...if only I was
still in college!).  In that case, I'd say that I was dying my hair
"for myself".

Now if I *did* dye it and many people said it looked horrible...well,
then I'd probably dye it back to brown after awhile. The situation
changes from myself to conforming to how others think. But I'm one of
those people who worry about what others think of me. I *do* know
people who seem to not care a fig about what others think of them or
their appearence. I've always wondered if that was the absolute truth
on the inside. Of course, I'll never know.

> What we do "for ourselves" has an awful lot to do with what will gain
> us praise and acceptance by others.

I most heartily agree. For example, I *hate* wearing make-up. I've
never liked the feel of it, the ritual of putting on the "mask". But I
put it on every workday because all the women at the office wear
make-up and it's practically an unspoken code. In this case, I'm
wearing it to get acceptance. But sometimes I wear make-up when I see
my mother because if I *don't* she tells me I should put some on. In
that case, it's for praise because she'll tell me how pretty I look
with it on.

I do think there's more of an acceptance factor than a praise factor.
In the workplace, it's always about acceptance and keeping your job. In
public, it's about acceptance and not being ostracized. In private with
friends and family, I think it's more about praise. Your friends and
family (if you got strong ties) will always accept you no matter how
you look. But that doesn't mean they'll praise you. And with the
exception of family, everything is always about acceptance first. You
can get friends if they don't accept you.

> Amy Z
> donning asbestos, because I have never found an issue that gets
> people as riled up as this one

Riled up? I have a hard time seeing that happening here, this list
contains some of the most level-headed people I've encounted on email
lists. But if you're worried, you and anyone else who wants to can
climb into my Asbestos-Covered, Flame-Proof Bunker. I had it built
after some Flame Wars on another email list. It's still in good
condition, although I caution you to ignore the scorch marks. In
cyberspace, things can sure get nasty...

~Amber
(Ugh, another rambling, mindless post...somebody take away my
keyboard!)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 14 14:03:38 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:03:38 -0000
Subject: Changing your looks
In-Reply-To: <20010614135319.541.qmail@web14503.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gag7q+9p2l@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> 
> --- Amy Z <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> > Appearance is almost entirely for other people, and the pressure 
not
> > to look a certain way comes from the fact that the people around 
you
> > don't like that kind of look.  If people regularly told you you
> > looked gorgeous without your changing a thing about your looks, 
would
> > you feel the inclination to? 
> 
> Maybe yes, maybe no. I know I would love to die my hair both a 
mixture
> of blond and red. I think this not because people have told me my 
brown
> hair is ugly, or I've gotten no compliments on my hair. I just 
happen
> to think a mix of blond and red would look neat/beautiful and I'd 
love
> to try it. Even if people always told me I was beautiful, I think I
> would still do it (I won't ever though because of work...if only I 
was
> still in college!).  In that case, I'd say that I was dying my hair
> "for myself".

Good example.  Yes, you can definitely try out other looks without 
being motivated by a dislike of the way you look now, or a desire for 
more acceptance/praise.  Hermione's attitude seems to come very close 
to this.

Please don't think I'm so enlightened.  I do dress up for work, even 
though my preferred clothes are old jeans and a sweater.  There are 
expectations . . . I'm happy to say that makeup is not one of them, 
since I hate to wear it.  I have come across a colleague who thinks 
his female colleagues should shave their legs, but the hell with that. 

<g>
Amy




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 14 14:08:05 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:08:05 -0000
Subject: Flamelessness
In-Reply-To: <20010614135319.541.qmail@web14503.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gagg5+v234@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...>
> > Amy Z
> > donning asbestos, because I have never found an issue that gets
> > people as riled up as this one

Amber wrote:

> Riled up? I have a hard time seeing that happening here, this list
> contains some of the most level-headed people I've encounted on 
email
> lists. 

Yeah, I was only kidding.  I don't recall ever getting a harsh 
response from anyone on HPfGU lists, except one person when we got 
into Bible talk, and that was not exactly a surprise.  I love this 
list so much.

Amy Z




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 14 14:25:07 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 07:25:07 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] who's going to die; Weatherby (was: Re: Cute story)
In-Reply-To: <OE48CVYl4maEqxGGmNN00010c84@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <20010614142507.49040.qmail@web10903.mail.yahoo.com>


Yeah Hagrid is a good thought.  Although, many people would argue that Hagrid would be missed too much..I don't really think that he would be..Ron yes, Hagrid..well maybe..

Melanie

 



---------------------------------
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From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Thu Jun 14 14:47:34 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:47:34 -0000
Subject: Anyone heard of this?
In-Reply-To: <3B28226B.EC168129@texas.net>
Message-ID: <9gaiq6+5ib1@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amanda Lewanski <editor at t...> wrote:
> After a year and a half of therapy, my son's speech therapist says 
she
> thinks he may have apraxia. Anyone out there have any experience 
with
> this? I've found a few sites on the web, but I'm just trying to get 
a
> better "feel" for it.
> 

The speech therapist probably discussed this, but talking or forming 
sounds requires coordination of the head and neck muscles (mouth, 
tongue, etc.). Usually, we take for granted that many muscles are 
needed to form sound.

Here's an example. Try reciting the alphabet without moving your 
lips, like a ventriloquist. Lip-movement helps form some sounds 
like 'V' and 'B'; without lip movement, 'B' and 'V' sound like 'E'. 
When you try talking without moving your lips, you'll notice your 
tongue helps form sounds too. 

In apraxia, the person has difficulty coordinating those muscles in 
order to form words and/or sounds. IIRC, sometimes people with 
apraxia also forget how to form sounds. 

Milz




From bbennett at joymail.com  Thu Jun 14 14:58:53 2001
From: bbennett at joymail.com (bbennett at joymail.com)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:58:53 -0000
Subject: Even worse than the hair
In-Reply-To: <F184TFur2iz2Mb1s7nl0000165b@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9gajfd+i225@eGroups.com>

Amy Z wrote:
> Some of the drawings of Hermione have her with hair that you could 
 conceivably call light brown rather than blond.  Okay, I can handle 
that.>

I guess I can too. Although no matter how I rationalize it, 
Hermione's hair isn't that color in my head.

> But her eyes are not blue.  Someone talked to the artist and 
reported back here months ago, and he said sure he read the books and 
he read that her eyes are blue.  He must've been stung by a Billywig 
at the time 'cause he never read any such thing.>

The artist also reported having talked to JKR (about scar alignment, 
I think). Since he got Hermione's eye color absolutely wrong, I have 
a hard time believing such a conversation took place. Not to 
disparage the guy's artistic ability, but IMO, he missed accurately 
interpreting the characters by 180 degrees.

And while I'm on the topic, who told the artist Ron was supposed to 
look like a clueless idiot? 

B






From bbennett at joymail.com  Thu Jun 14 15:22:43 2001
From: bbennett at joymail.com (bbennett at joymail.com)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 15:22:43 -0000
Subject: assumptions of race
In-Reply-To: <F53ZGYmXvmmKtrM0mkh000029de@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9gaks3+34uk@eGroups.com>

Ebony wrote: 
> You know, while I don't think that blacks have that much trouble 
distinguishing whites, many blacks do have difficulty distinguishing 
Asians as well.  Because of the attention most of us pay to skin 
tone, texture and color, the fact that many Asians have similar 
coloring makes this just as difficult for us.>

A professor of mine from college, who had flaming red hair and bright 
green eyes, took a trip to China. While looking at textiles in an 
outdoor market, a Chinese vendor rushed up to her with a package, 
indicating she had left it behind. When she communicated that he had 
mistaken her for someone else, he shook his head with disgust, and in 
broken English, said "You Americans, you all look alike".

I'm from a small, mostly white southern town, I now live in the DC 
Metro, and I continue to find how people deal with differences in 
race fascinating. Thanks for bringing up some interesting points!

B





From dfrankis at dial.pipex.com  Thu Jun 14 16:51:20 2001
From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com (dfrankis at dial.pipex.com)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 16:51:20 -0000
Subject: Do you get... (from main list)
Message-ID: <9gaq28+3tfn@eGroups.com>

Patricia wrote
Do you get...

that suspicious look from your significant other any time you refer 
to the Harry Potter books???  My boyfriend is getting crazy at me 
cause everything I talk about (or so he says) refers to Harry Potter.

He bought the first book for me as a christmas gift and now that I am 
so much into it he thinks he has created a monster.  I must say that 
prior to reading the books (3 times each so far) I was a really 
rational 27 year old accountant ;)

To say that I was never a groupie to anything before is an 
understatement and now I just can't wait for book 5 to come out and 
that November 16th seems so far away (don't look for me on November 
16th cause I will be at the movie theater).

JK Rowling what have you done to me :)  Not that I don't enjoy it, 
right.

Anyways,  I am happy to see that I am not the only rational adult to 
LOVE Harry Potter.

Bye

Patricia


Er...  I've always felt that there's a touch of Groucho Marx about 
HPFGU - anyone daft enough to join in isn't grown up enough to 
qualify.  And as for criticising HP characters such as Snape for 
their obsessiveness...  pots and kettles spring to mind.

David

"I think Mum's got a second cousin who's an accountant, but we never 
talk about him" - Ron Weasley
 





From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 14 17:44:41 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:44:41 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] who's going to die; Weatherby 
In-Reply-To: <9ga9ed+8i08@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010614174441.86635.qmail@web10904.mail.yahoo.com>


BTW, to back up the thread a ways, Peeves isn't the same as a ghost.  
No one's quite sure how poltergeists are different, but he's not 
transparent, isn't a proper ghost according to Nick, and as far as we 
know was not formerly a living human.  

A poltergeist is a child ghost isn't it?  That's always what I thought.  I don't know there is something going on with the ghosts...I was just trying to make it easier for them to understand that in some way he's already dead.  Oh well, anyways, the kids said they would understand Ron's death..but they (like myself) think the book would be boring if he wasn't there.

Melanie



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From lj2d30 at gateway.net  Thu Jun 14 18:25:50 2001
From: lj2d30 at gateway.net (Trina)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:25:50 -0000
Subject: Twins
Message-ID: <9gavje+4s9i@eGroups.com>

At the school I am in, we have 3 sets of identical twins and 2 sets 
of fraternal twins.  We're in a small town and the school is 
Kindergarten - 3rd grade with about 687 students total.  Plus, one of 
the 1st grade teachers has a set of identical twins.

In the town I grew up we had quite a few twins, both identical and 
fraternal.  In my graduating class alone (aproximately 242 kids in 
the class) there were 3 sets- 2 fraternals and a set of identicals.  
And there were a few more in the other 3 classes.  

So I am not all that surprised that Hogwarts (JKR pop 1000 kids) has 
at least 2 sets of twins.  I'm just surprised it isn't more.

Trina




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 14 18:32:11 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:32:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPforGrownups] Has anyone named a child after HP characters?
In-Reply-To: <9gapvf+ea4l@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010614183211.14417.qmail@web14507.mail.yahoo.com>


--- rowanbrookt at yahoo.com wrote:
> I would say that IMO that is fanatical

Brought this over from the main list because I really don't have much
on-topic stuff to say...

I think there are a lot of people whose names come from something
specific. I know my parents named my middle name Abigail after the wife
of second US president, Abigail Adams. And my brother's name Travis
came from a detective novel that my parents were reading at the time.

I don't see anything fanatical about naming someone after a character
in a book or a person in real life. Most of the time I think it's done
because the parent(s) genuinely like the name. I don't think they
expect their child to grow up like the character/person. To expect it
so, that would be ludicrous.

Of course, I don't have a kid so I can't presume to know specifically
the motives behind parent(s) choosing character names for their kids.
But I have a hard time seeing the fanaticism in it. Now the HP4GU list,
that's fanaticism! <runs away before she's pelted with worn-out HP
books>

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
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From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Thu Jun 14 18:37:02 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:37:02 -0000
Subject: [HPforGrownups] Has anyone named a child after HP characters?
In-Reply-To: <20010614183211.14417.qmail@web14507.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gb08e+848f@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> Now the HP4GU list,
> that's fanaticism! <runs away before she's pelted with worn-out HP
> books>

We would not do that to anyone. The HP books are too important for us 
to throw at you.




From heidit at netbox.com  Thu Jun 14 18:31:48 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 14:31:48 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: [HPforGrownups] Has anyone named a chil d after HP characters?
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F9248@miaexch1>

My name is Heidi. I'm named after Heidi - the Spryi book - because my mother
loved the story.
My son's name is Harrison - we call him Harry - because my husband and I
both love the HP books. 
When we chose his name 2 years ago, we had to use an "H" to start the name
(TRADITIONS! Aren't they GREAT?) and we wanted to name him after a book. 
H. Book. Boy.
2 options.
Harry and Holden (after Holden Caufield - Catcher in the Rye)
Holden is just *too* issue-laden - we certainly don't expect Harry to be
anything like Harry - we wouldn't want him to! We're very happy that we
weren't killed by a deranged megalomaniac last Halloween! - but we didn't
want the burden of having a child named after Holden. 
 
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Amber [mailto:reanna20 at yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2001 2:32 PM
To: HP4GU-OTChatter
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: [HPforGrownups] Has anyone named a child
after HP characters?


Real-To: Amber 
--- rowanbrookt at yahoo.com wrote:
> I would say that IMO that is fanatical

I don't see anything fanatical about naming someone after a character
in a book or a person in real life. Most of the time I think it's done
because the parent(s) genuinely like the name. I don't think they
expect their child to grow up like the character/person. To expect it
so, that would be ludicrous.

Of course, I don't have a kid so I can't presume to know specifically
the motives behind parent(s) choosing character names for their kids.
But I have a hard time seeing the fanaticism in it. Now the HP4GU list,
that's fanaticism! <runs away before she's pelted with worn-out HP
books>






From lj2d30 at gateway.net  Thu Jun 14 18:40:12 2001
From: lj2d30 at gateway.net (Trina)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:40:12 -0000
Subject: Newsflash: bluebonnets are lupines
In-Reply-To: <9fvk14+ck0a@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gb0ec+magi@eGroups.com>

 SC shares some of these things with Texas.  We don't have the 
Aggies, the killer bees, the mesquite bushes, or the bluebonnets, and 
we're blessed with an abundance of lakes and rivers. (most of which 
are natural)  But we do have the heat and humidity.  
> 
> Peace & Plenty, 
> 
> Parker 

And the fire ants.  You forgot the fire ants...

Trina, who has never stepped in a fire ant hill and never wishes to...




From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Thu Jun 14 18:46:09 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:46:09 -0000
Subject: J.K. Rowling's fav books
Message-ID: <9gb0ph+nr0r@eGroups.com>

According to the Bloomsbury web site.

  The Complete Chronicles of Narnia  
  Little White Horse  
  The Story of the Treasure Seekers  
  I Capture the Castle  
  Cautionary Verses / New Cautionary Verses  
  
Hmmm...I never read "Little White Horse" nor "I Capture the Castle". 
I'm assuming that "Cautionary Verses" is the book by Hilliare Belloc. 
I love those poems!

Milz 




From klaatu at primenet.com  Thu Jun 14 19:57:15 2001
From: klaatu at primenet.com (Sister Mary Lunatic)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 12:57:15 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] J.K. Rowling's fav books
In-Reply-To: <9gb0ph+nr0r@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <MABBJPGEHBDBAKHGIBPOKEKMDNAA.klaatu@primenet.com>

"I Capture the Castle" is great -- The story is told through a 17-year-old
girl's diary as she records her family's hand-to-mouth existence in a
moldering old castle.  It's written by Dodie Smith.

SML

===============================================
"We shall never have more time. We have, and
have always had, all the time there is.
No object is served in waiting until next week
or even until tomorrow." -- Arnold Bennett
===============================================

-----Original Message-----
From: Milz [mailto:absinthe at mad.scientist.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2001 11:46 AM
To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] J.K. Rowling's fav books


According to the Bloomsbury web site.

  The Complete Chronicles of Narnia
  Little White Horse
  The Story of the Treasure Seekers
  I Capture the Castle
  Cautionary Verses / New Cautionary Verses

Hmmm...I never read "Little White Horse" nor "I Capture the Castle".
I'm assuming that "Cautionary Verses" is the book by Hilliare Belloc.
I love those poems!

Milz


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From meboriqua at aol.com  Thu Jun 14 21:41:13 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 21:41:13 -0000
Subject: Changing your looks
In-Reply-To: <9gag7q+9p2l@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gbb1p+qlub@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
  Yes, you can definitely try out other looks without 
> being motivated by a dislike of the way you look now, or a desire 
for 
> more acceptance/praise.  Hermione's attitude seems to come very 
close 
> to this.


Hello -

This is my first post on the OT list.  This is a topic that I could 
talk about all day, so please bear with me while I try to express 
myself, especially without offending anyone.  

Whenever people talk about beauty, one of the biggest things (no pun 
intended here) to come up is weight.  Weight is something I deal with 
daily, as mine has gone up and down several times.  I am also in an 
unusual situation because I am caught between two worlds who view 
weight very differently.

I grew up in the suburbs where being skinny was the key to popularity 
and beauty.  A good friend of mine was anorexic for a time when we 
were in high school.  Even now, when I am with my family, or with my 
sister and her friends, I am, by far, the heaviest female in the 
group.  I am acutely aware of this and often physically uncomfortable 
with myself because of it.  My sister is around a size 4.  However, 
when I go to work in the Bronx, I am complimented all the time on my 
body.  My students ask me why I want to lose weight.  Why is that?  
It's simple.  When I go to work, everyone around me is African 
American and Latino, where voluptuous women, not sticks, are 
considered beautiful.  I have been told many times by both students 
and colleagues that I have a big butt for a white girl - and they mean 
that with envy and compliments!

It's weird when I am with my family now because everyone is fat free 
and exercise-happy.  Even though I love my family, I feel less 
attractive around them than I do when I am at school.  Now, purely 
from a health perspective, I should watch my diet and exercise more, 
but when I spend so much time around other women with a lot of meat on 
their bones, it's hard to care.  

As far as men go, I get a lot of attention from African American and 
Latino men (my boyfriend happens to be Puerto Rican), but when I 
started to gain weight a few years ago, white men stopped staring at 
me the way they used to.  My point is, isn't it interesting how beauty 
has different definitions in different cultures?  I used to dream of 
being skinny-skinny, but now, as much as I love my sister, she is just 
too damned thin for my tastes.  

Wow, that was a lot!

--jenny from ravenclaw*******************




From ochfd42 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 14 21:53:04 2001
From: ochfd42 at yahoo.com (Angela Boyko)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 17:53:04 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: assumptions of race
In-Reply-To: <9gaks3+34uk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010614215304.54309.qmail@web11706.mail.yahoo.com>

--- bbennett at joymail.com wrote:
 
> A professor of mine from college, who had flaming
> red hair and bright 
> green eyes, took a trip to China. While looking at
> textiles in an 
> outdoor market, a Chinese vendor rushed up to her
> with a package, 
> indicating she had left it behind. When she
> communicated that he had 
> mistaken her for someone else, he shook his head
> with disgust, and in 
> broken English, said "You Americans, you all look
> alike".

I used to teach English as a Second Language. It was
always interesting to hear how the Japanese students
viewed us staff members. Especially the two guys both
named David. One was known as the David who played the
guitar, as opposed to the David with glasses (who
didn't play the guitar). 

I was the short girl with the red hair. ;-)

Angela

=====
* * * http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/4439/index.html * * *
               May the Force be with you

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From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 14 22:15:06 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:15:06 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Changing your looks
Message-ID: <F2677KakfMY1aQz0uej0000ca96@hotmail.com>

No need for asbestos... ;-)

Amy wrote:

>I like to look pretty as much as the next person, and I admit to a
>weakness for clothes that is frankly a spiritual peril...

Me too, me too, me too!  I used to have a thing for shoes, too, but since I 
began teaching I've calmed down with that.  Can't wear three-inch heels and 
be on my feet all day.  ;-)

>But whenever I
>hear someone say "I did X (dyed my hair, got a nose job, bought a new
>wardrobe, wore makeup, etc.) for myself, not for anyone else," an
>inner voice says "Oh, really?"

LOL!  I used to say this all the time when I went through a minimalist phase 
in high school.  "I'm not trying to look cute for anyone," I'd say.  "As 
long as I'm clean and neat..."  But then *I* was dissatisfied with the 
person in the mirror.  I knew I didn't look my personal best.

I remember laughing while reading a Lucy Maud Montgomery book (can't 
remember which book this is in!) the time one of her protagonists, sitting 
in church, gave several parishioners a mental makeover.  I do this all the 
time now... mentally removing persons of certain body types out of Spandex 
and into clothes that are more flattering, doing different things with hair, 
applying makeup correctly.

I've never been as prissy as my mother and younger sisters, but I've always 
enjoyed dressing up.  There's not a whole lot I inherited from my mother as 
far as personality goes, but even being the kid with the third-most fashion 
sense was good enough to make me Designated Dorm Image Consultant in 
college.

Perhaps image *is* entirely for other people, but since I'm a people person 
and always have been, I don't mind much.

>Appearance is almost entirely for
>other people, and the pressure not to look a certain way comes from
>the fact that the people around you don't like that kind of look.  If
>people regularly told you you looked gorgeous without your changing a
>thing about your looks, would you feel the inclination to?

Well, if there weren't any other people in the world, I imagine we wouldn't 
do a lot of things we do for the benefit of others.  :-)  Like taking a 
shower or bath at least once a day, wearing deodorant and anti-perspirant 
(which is *really* a cultural norm--many of the world's people aren't as 
odor-conscious as we are in the US), or wearing makeup.

I wear makeup to work every day simply because I like to wear it.  Not a ton 
of it, either.  I was blessed to have a mom who modeled professionally, so 
yes, when I first began wearing makeup on special occasions in high school, 
you couldn't really tell that I was wearing any... but my face looked a lot 
different.  Day makeup should be very light and tasteful... evening makeup 
can be a bit more dramatic, but ought to complement both you and what you're 
wearing.  And makeup, like scent, should *never* call attention to itself... 
I've helped quite a number of my friends with this sort of thing.

I also make it a point to wear professional clothes that are both 
comfortable and stylish.  During my teacher training, it was impressed upon 
me that I was in a field that often isn't respected as a profession because 
its members aren't conscious of the image they project.  So I make it a 
point to dress appropriately and nicely.  (Yes, I work in a building with a 
heating/cooling system as horrible as that found in any inner-city school 
district site.  There is no A/C... today it was over ninety degrees.  But I 
still believe that I ought to set a good example for my students and dress 
appropriately.)

Another issue involved here is good hygiene.  Yes, there are people who are 
not looks-conscious who are also clean and neat.  However, there is 
something to be said for caring for your hair, skin, and nails not just to 
look good, but for health reasons.  (I'm starting to sound like my mother!  
Eek!)  Certain things are just plain good for your body--regular facials, 
manicures and pedicures, adhering to a regular skin-care regimen and the 
like.  Diet and nutrition are also very important.  So is regular exercise.

I concede that not everyone is going to look like a supermodel.  However, I 
do feel that anyone can look their personal best... and many, many people's 
personal best will render their looks "above average".

I know that people can be *extremely* vain about appearance issues.  But the 
opposite extreme--not caring at all--is equally disconcerting to me.

>Looks are such odd, arbitrary things.  Our self-esteem becomes
>dependent on the random cultural beliefs that surround us.  In my
>culture, unlike others in other times and places, fat is deemed ugly,
>so overweight people tend to feel lousy about their looks and
>themselves.  If I lived in a culture that thought red hair was ugly,
>I'd have a whole self-esteem challenge that I don't currently have to
>deal with.  Could I really say that dyeing my hair brown was a purely
>aesthetic, personal choice, when in =this= culture, which thinks my
>hair's a nice color the way it is, I have no desire whatsoever to dye
>it brown?


Hmm... I know what you mean.  :-)  Beauty in this culture doesn't look like 
me, either.  I've been told I'm tall (5'9" isn't that tall to me, but...) 
and I've been skinny all my life, but that's where my adherence to our 
cultural norms ends.  I have extremely sensitive skin that I've had to 
pamper all my life.  That skin is brown... not exactly the world's most 
fashionable color for women.  ;-)  I also was born with unruly masses of 
thick nappy hair (no, the term is no longer perceived as an insult) in a 
culture which still mostly believes that the crowning glory of most black 
women is pretty darn ugly.  Attitudes are changing quite a bit, but there's 
still a long way to go... hair is an entirely different post, though.  ;-)

Yet in one of my grad seminars last semester, we read a study (can't 
remember the details--will look them up if you want) in which it was shown 
that black American teenage girls have body self-images that are 
significantly more positive than their counterparts of other races.  I think 
that the 1960s Black Arts movement helped this... I'm sure if the survey was 
taken prior to the Civil Rights movement, the numbers would have been 
reversed... my grandmother and my mother both tell us that when they were 
growing up, calling someone "black" was a terrible insult.

Things have changed.  Never in my life have I felt that I was ugly, or 
wanted to change anything about my looks other than my hair (and that was 
only as a child, when my mother and other female relatives had to tug and 
pull in order to braid it--I was thinking about issues of pain rather than 
aesthetics!).

On most days I really like the way I look, and I like the compliments and 
glances I get when I step out of my door, too.  They don't make me or break 
me, but it's always nice to hear positive things about yourself, isn't it?

Disclaimer:  I am a Leo.  <vbg>

--Ebony

<>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><
Ebony AKA AngieJ
ebonyink at hotmail.com

Come join us in Paradise!
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Paradise

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From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 14 22:15:16 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:15:16 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Changing your looks
Message-ID: <F30lcCeFhMEQMsDhF9J0000f32f@hotmail.com>

No need for asbestos... ;-)

Amy wrote:

>I like to look pretty as much as the next person, and I admit to a
>weakness for clothes that is frankly a spiritual peril...

Me too, me too, me too!  I used to have a thing for shoes, too, but since I 
began teaching I've calmed down with that.  Can't wear three-inch heels and 
be on my feet all day.  ;-)

>But whenever I
>hear someone say "I did X (dyed my hair, got a nose job, bought a new
>wardrobe, wore makeup, etc.) for myself, not for anyone else," an
>inner voice says "Oh, really?"

LOL!  I used to say this all the time when I went through a minimalist phase 
in high school.  "I'm not trying to look cute for anyone," I'd say.  "As 
long as I'm clean and neat..."  But then *I* was dissatisfied with the 
person in the mirror.  I knew I didn't look my personal best.

I remember laughing while reading a Lucy Maud Montgomery book (can't 
remember which book this is in!) the time one of her protagonists, sitting 
in church, gave several parishioners a mental makeover.  I do this all the 
time now... mentally removing persons of certain body types out of Spandex 
and into clothes that are more flattering, doing different things with hair, 
applying makeup correctly.

I've never been as prissy as my mother and younger sisters, but I've always 
enjoyed dressing up.  There's not a whole lot I inherited from my mother as 
far as personality goes, but even being the kid with the third-most fashion 
sense was good enough to make me Designated Dorm Image Consultant in 
college.

Perhaps image *is* entirely for other people, but since I'm a people person 
and always have been, I don't mind much.

>Appearance is almost entirely for
>other people, and the pressure not to look a certain way comes from
>the fact that the people around you don't like that kind of look.  If
>people regularly told you you looked gorgeous without your changing a
>thing about your looks, would you feel the inclination to?

Well, if there weren't any other people in the world, I imagine we wouldn't 
do a lot of things we do for the benefit of others.  :-)  Like taking a 
shower or bath at least once a day, wearing deodorant and anti-perspirant 
(which is *really* a cultural norm--many of the world's people aren't as 
odor-conscious as we are in the US), or wearing makeup.

I wear makeup to work every day simply because I like to wear it.  Not a ton 
of it, either.  I was blessed to have a mom who modeled professionally, so 
yes, when I first began wearing makeup on special occasions in high school, 
you couldn't really tell that I was wearing any... but my face looked a lot 
different.  Day makeup should be very light and tasteful... evening makeup 
can be a bit more dramatic, but ought to complement both you and what you're 
wearing.  And makeup, like scent, should *never* call attention to itself... 
I've helped quite a number of my friends with this sort of thing.

I also make it a point to wear professional clothes that are both 
comfortable and stylish.  During my teacher training, it was impressed upon 
me that I was in a field that often isn't respected as a profession because 
its members aren't conscious of the image they project.  So I make it a 
point to dress appropriately and nicely.  (Yes, I work in a building with a 
heating/cooling system as horrible as that found in any inner-city school 
district site.  There is no A/C... today it was over ninety degrees.  But I 
still believe that I ought to set a good example for my students and dress 
appropriately.)

Another issue involved here is good hygiene.  Yes, there are people who are 
not looks-conscious who are also clean and neat.  However, there is 
something to be said for caring for your hair, skin, and nails not just to 
look good, but for health reasons.  (I'm starting to sound like my mother!  
Eek!)  Certain things are just plain good for your body--regular facials, 
manicures and pedicures, adhering to a regular skin-care regimen and the 
like.  Diet and nutrition are also very important.  So is regular exercise.

I concede that not everyone is going to look like a supermodel.  However, I 
do feel that anyone can look their personal best... and many, many people's 
personal best will render their looks "above average".

I know that people can be *extremely* vain about appearance issues.  But the 
opposite extreme--not caring at all--is equally disconcerting to me.

>Looks are such odd, arbitrary things.  Our self-esteem becomes
>dependent on the random cultural beliefs that surround us.  In my
>culture, unlike others in other times and places, fat is deemed ugly,
>so overweight people tend to feel lousy about their looks and
>themselves.  If I lived in a culture that thought red hair was ugly,
>I'd have a whole self-esteem challenge that I don't currently have to
>deal with.  Could I really say that dyeing my hair brown was a purely
>aesthetic, personal choice, when in =this= culture, which thinks my
>hair's a nice color the way it is, I have no desire whatsoever to dye
>it brown?


Hmm... I know what you mean.  :-)  Beauty in this culture doesn't look like 
me, either.  I've been told I'm tall (5'9" isn't that tall to me, but...) 
and I've been skinny all my life, but that's where my adherence to our 
cultural norms ends.  I have extremely sensitive skin that I've had to 
pamper all my life.  That skin is brown... not exactly the world's most 
fashionable color for women.  ;-)  I also was born with unruly masses of 
thick nappy hair (no, the term is no longer perceived as an insult) in a 
culture which still mostly believes that the crowning glory of most black 
women is pretty darn ugly.  Attitudes are changing quite a bit, but there's 
still a long way to go... hair is an entirely different post, though.  ;-)

Yet in one of my grad seminars last semester, we read a study (can't 
remember the details--will look them up if you want) in which it was shown 
that black American teenage girls have body self-images that are 
significantly more positive than their counterparts of other races.  I think 
that the 1960s Black Arts movement helped this... I'm sure if the survey was 
taken prior to the Civil Rights movement, the numbers would have been 
reversed... my grandmother and my mother both tell us that when they were 
growing up, calling someone "black" was a terrible insult.

Things have changed.  Never in my life have I felt that I was ugly, or 
wanted to change anything about my looks other than my hair (and that was 
only as a child, when my mother and other female relatives had to tug and 
pull in order to braid it--I was thinking about issues of pain rather than 
aesthetics!).

On most days I really like the way I look, and I like the compliments and 
glances I get when I step out of my door, too.  They don't make me or break 
me, but it's always nice to hear positive things about yourself, isn't it?

Disclaimer:  I am a Leo.  <vbg>

--Ebony

<>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><
Ebony AKA AngieJ
ebonyink at hotmail.com

Come join us in Paradise!
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Paradise

Visit Schnoogle.com:
http://www.geocities.com/heiditandy/

Get Psyched out...
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Psych

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Thu Jun 14 23:07:29 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 23:07:29 -0000
Subject: What's your name mean??
In-Reply-To: <20010614183211.14417.qmail@web14507.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gbg3h+rscg@eGroups.com>

Hello everyone,,,,

Has anyone thought about what their name means? To start the 
conversation, here's what mine mean:

Jamieson: Jamie's son, next in line of Jamie's, usually represents 
passing  along of power or wealth, usually a name for an Irish 
peasant.

Wolf: animal, lupe, lupin, lou. An animal of mystical powers, Wolves 
were known to have the powers of the God or Goddess. To have a wolf as 
a companion was a great blessing.

Villeneuve: New village.

(Taken from my Mums "Dictionary of Mythology and Theology" by Penguin 
books)

So that means I'm an Irish peasent with Goddesslike powers passing 
through a new village? Why can't I be named something that means: sex 
god, will rock your world? Sigh...

<g>

Hugs!!!!
Jamieson




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 01:04:15 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:04:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Here's another for Danette
Message-ID: <20010615010415.75985.qmail@web13706.mail.yahoo.com>

Happy Birthday to you!
Hope you got everything you wished for on this special
day!
Happy Birthday to you from,

Wanda the Witch of Revere, Massachusetts and Her Merry
Band of Muggles(wizard wannabes)

__________________________________________________
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From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 01:10:46 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:10:46 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??
In-Reply-To: <9gbg3h+rscg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010615011046.79803.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com>

Look up mine in that special book of yours, please?
I know Wanda means to wander or to roam. I don't know
what Jean means and Mallett is French for mallett like
hammer. Could be wrong, but if you can Jamieson, let
us know Jamieson, thank you, and schnoogles to you!

Wanda the Witch in Revere


--- Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca>
wrote:
> Hello everyone,,,,
> 
> Has anyone thought about what their name means? To
> start the 
> conversation, here's what mine mean:
> 
> Jamieson: Jamie's son, next in line of Jamie's,
> usually represents 
> passing  along of power or wealth, usually a name
> for an Irish 
> peasant.
> 
> Wolf: animal, lupe, lupin, lou. An animal of
> mystical powers, Wolves 
> were known to have the powers of the God or Goddess.
> To have a wolf as 
> a companion was a great blessing.
> 
> Villeneuve: New village.
> 
> (Taken from my Mums "Dictionary of Mythology and
> Theology" by Penguin 
> books)
> 
> So that means I'm an Irish peasent with Goddesslike
> powers passing 
> through a new village? Why can't I be named
> something that means: sex 
> god, will rock your world? Sigh...
> 
> <g>
> 
> Hugs!!!!
> Jamieson
> 
> 


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Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more.
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From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 01:28:45 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:28:45 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: My son's Sixth Grade Graduation Next Tuesday!
Message-ID: <20010615012845.75289.qmail@web13702.mail.yahoo.com>

Just wanted to share with the group that my son
William is graduating from Elementary School to Middle
School(junior high)! So Tuesday will be a big day for
all of us! The Lincoln School of Revere, Massachusetts
will be giving a special Banquet for the sixth grade
class, a Luau theme party! This is such a big high for
him! William has ADHD and has worked very hard with
his classes. So this special time we wanted to share
with all our Harry Potter Family out there!

Hugs and Schnoogles to everybody!

Wanda The Witch of Revere, Massachsetts

__________________________________________________
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From landers at email.unc.edu  Fri Jun 15 01:57:20 2001
From: landers at email.unc.edu (Betty Landers)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 21:57:20 -0400
Subject: What's you rname mean?
References: <20010615011046.79803.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3B296B7E.E754FB0@email.unc.edu>

All right, Jamison.  My full name is Betty Sue Landrs.  What does your book
make of that?  I've always wondered what my name means.

Wanda Mallett wrote:

> Look up mine in that special book of yours, please?
> I know Wanda means to wander or to roam. I don't know
> what Jean means and Mallett is French for mallett like
> hammer. Could be wrong, but if you can Jamieson, let
> us know Jamieson, thank you, and schnoogles to you!
>
> Wanda the Witch in Revere
>
> --- Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca>
> wrote:
> > Hello everyone,,,,
> >
> > Has anyone thought about what their name means? To
> > start the
> > conversation, here's what mine mean:
> >
> > Jamieson: Jamie's son, next in line of Jamie's,
> > usually represents
> > passing  along of power or wealth, usually a name
> > for an Irish
> > peasant.
> >
> > Wolf: animal, lupe, lupin, lou. An animal of
> > mystical powers, Wolves
> > were known to have the powers of the God or Goddess.
> > To have a wolf as
> > a companion was a great blessing.
> >
> > Villeneuve: New village.
> >
> > (Taken from my Mums "Dictionary of Mythology and
> > Theology" by Penguin
> > books)
> >
> > So that means I'm an Irish peasent with Goddesslike
> > powers passing
> > through a new village? Why can't I be named
> > something that means: sex
> > god, will rock your world? Sigh...
> >
> > <g>
> >
> > Hugs!!!!
> > Jamieson
> >
> >
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more.
> http://buzz.yahoo.com/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Fri Jun 15 02:15:15 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:15:15 -0000
Subject: Newsflash: bluebonnets are lupines
In-Reply-To: <9gb0ec+magi@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gbr3j+lcu5@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Trina" <lj2d30 at g...> wrote:
>  SC shares some of these things with Texas.  We don't have the 
> Aggies, the killer bees, the mesquite bushes, or the bluebonnets, 
and 
> we're blessed with an abundance of lakes and rivers. (most of which 
> are natural)  But we do have the heat and humidity.  
> > 
> > Peace & Plenty, 
> > 
> > Parker 
> 
> And the fire ants.  You forgot the fire ants...
> 
> Trina, who has never stepped in a fire ant hill and never wishes 
to...

Oops! forgot those.  I think they cover the south.  

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker, who has stepped in a fire ant hill and never wishes to 
again...




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Fri Jun 15 02:30:12 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:30:12 -0000
Subject: What does your name mean?
Message-ID: <9gbrvk+4e63@eGroups.com>

Parker:  Keeper of the park; arose during medieval times, designates 
the keeper of the King's parklands. (English)

Layne:  From the lane (English)

Brown:  A person with brown hair or skin (English)

Nesbit: Nose piece; from the type of helmet (again medieval) worn by 
lowland Scottish soldiers in service to the King (Scottish via French)

Doug's ancestors came from Berwick upon Tweed, which is in English 
hands now (& has been since the 1400s) but changed from Scots-held to 
English-held thirteen times in the wars. 

By the way, you'll notice that I have *four* last names.  And yes, I 
do get mail addressed to Mr Parker Brown Nesbit.

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker






From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 02:52:38 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 19:52:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Richard's comment
Message-ID: <20010615025238.89246.qmail@web13705.mail.yahoo.com>

First of all, yes  your views are to extreme and I am
not going to go further on that.
The world has many beautiful people in it and has all
walks of life! Everybody has feelings and everybody
bleeds!

Reach out and embrace what the world has to offer! I
have met many wonderful and beautiful people with this
group and we all have a love of Harry Potter!

So I think Richard should stick to the subject of
Harry Potter and really get to know this wonderful
Family of fun loving adults and how they all love to
debate on anything Harry Potter! I may not get to
comment as often as I like but I love reading such a
diverse world of comments!

Jamieson, keep those hugs coming we all need love
shared!

Wanda The Witch of Revere, Massachusetts
I love this group and still learning something great
about HP!




- In HPforGrownups at y..., owl_of_hedwig at y... wrote:

> 
> And while we're on the subject of inferiority,
faggots should all be 
> below too. God knows that they were created to be
killed.
> 
> If anyone feels that my views are too extreme, then
so be it.
> 
> Richard.


Um......Okay....

Personally, I feel that the GLBT community is here to
show others how 
to be tolerant, and vise versa. We can all learn from
each other, and 
be happy that we have the world to share with each
other. 

So, why would gays be put here to be killed? Things
like this just 
flabbergast me!

Hugs to all (except Richard!)



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From ender_w at msn.com  Fri Jun 15 03:04:44 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 23:04:44 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??
References: <20010615011046.79803.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <002901c0f547$ee8d61a0$47eb183f@satellite>

One of my cousins had a book of Celtic and Gaelic names (our family is mostly Irish) and she told me that my name, Shanley, means "Child of the hero."  I immediately turned to my dad and told him he must be a hero (well, he is to me!).  It wasn't a little later that I realized the sexistness of my reaction and wondered why it couldn't be my mom who's the hero.  After all, my name is her maiden name.

ender
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Wanda Mallett 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2001 9:10 PM
  Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??


  Look up mine in that special book of yours, please?
  I know Wanda means to wander or to roam. I don't know
  what Jean means and Mallett is French for mallett like
  hammer. Could be wrong, but if you can Jamieson, let
  us know Jamieson, thank you, and schnoogles to you!

  Wanda the Witch in Revere


  --- Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca>
  wrote:
  > Hello everyone,,,,
  > 
  > Has anyone thought about what their name means? To
  > start the 
  > conversation, here's what mine mean:
  > 
  > Jamieson: Jamie's son, next in line of Jamie's,
  > usually represents 
  > passing  along of power or wealth, usually a name
  > for an Irish 
  > peasant.
  > 
  > Wolf: animal, lupe, lupin, lou. An animal of
  > mystical powers, Wolves 
  > were known to have the powers of the God or Goddess.
  > To have a wolf as 
  > a companion was a great blessing.
  > 
  > Villeneuve: New village.
  > 
  > (Taken from my Mums "Dictionary of Mythology and
  > Theology" by Penguin 
  > books)
  > 
  > So that means I'm an Irish peasent with Goddesslike
  > powers passing 
  > through a new village? Why can't I be named
  > something that means: sex 
  > god, will rock your world? Sigh...
  > 
  > <g>
  > 
  > Hugs!!!!
  > Jamieson
  > 
  > 


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 03:41:14 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 03:41:14 -0000
Subject: Thank you 
Message-ID: <9gc04q+6hup@eGroups.com>


I don't know if all the moderators are a part of this list, but I 
want to thank them for dealing with the recent nastiness on the HP4GU 
list with efficiency and grace. All of you are wonderful and I am 
thankful for the job that you carry out. The way things were handled 
just reaffirms my belief that the HP4GU and OT-Chatter lists are 
wonderful places to be.

Again, thank you!

~Amber






From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 03:46:08 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:46:08 -0500
Subject: Wanda sent you a Yahoo! Greeting
Message-ID: <mailman.4.1576049007.5361.hpfgu-otchatter@archive.hpfgu.org>

Surprise! You've just received a Yahoo! Greeting
from "Wanda" (witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com)!

To view this greeting card, click on the following
Web address at anytime within the next 60 days.

http://greetings.yahoo.com/greet/view?FQAS6P8HX43XK

If that doesn't work, go to http://greetings.yahoo.com/pickup and
copy and paste this code:

FQAS6P8HX43XK

Enjoy!

The Yahoo! Greetings Team


-------------------------
Yahoo! Greetings is a free service. If you'd like to send someone a
Yahoo! Greeting, you can do so at http://greetings.yahoo.com/

Plan your next party with Yahoo! Invites - http://invites.yahoo.com/



From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 15 03:47:30 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 03:47:30 -0000
Subject: What's your name mean??
In-Reply-To: <20010615011046.79803.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gc0gi+tid7@eGroups.com>

HHHIIIEEEEEE!!!!!!

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Wanda Mallett <witchwanda2002 at y...> 
wrote:
> Look up mine in that special book of yours, please?
> I know Wanda means to wander or to roam. I don't know
> what Jean means and Mallett is French for mallett like
> hammer. Could be wrong, but if you can Jamieson, let
> us know Jamieson, thank you, and schnoogles to you!
> 
> Wanda the Witch in Revere
> 
> 

According to the theology, Jean is reference to Joan of Arc, to imply 
holy and sainted.....this according to a mythology dictionary though! 
(YOu saintly? never! <g>)

Huggles and snuggles
Jamieson




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 03:54:26 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 20:54:26 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Love this Group
Message-ID: <20010615035426.42282.qmail@web13703.mail.yahoo.com>

There can never be enough said about our groups owner
and her hard working moderators! Amber had the right
idea to thank all of them for all their hard work in
keeping our favorite place to be, a very happy place
to be! All of us thank you for keeping us all in line,
we are like pencils with earsers(you) to clean up our
mistakes!

THANK YOU!

Wanda the Witch of Revere, Massachusetts

__________________________________________________
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Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more.
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From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 15 04:46:15 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:46:15 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: What's you rname mean?
References: <20010615011046.79803.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com> <3B296B7E.E754FB0@email.unc.edu>
Message-ID: <3B299317.9E8D77BB@sympatico.ca>

Okey Dokey,k well, Betty is derived, according to the book, from
Beatrice which means either "...chastised or rampant, depending on the
dirivation of personality..." ???? Okay. Sue is derived from Sophie,
which means Wisdom, and Landers referrs to "...landing roots, finding
your place, home is your comfort..."

That help?

Hugs
Jamieson

Betty Landers wrote:

> All right, Jamison.  My full name is Betty Sue Landrs.  What does your
> book
> make of that?  I've always wondered what my name means.
>
> Wanda Mallett wrote:
>
> > Look up mine in that special book of yours, please?
> > I know Wanda means to wander or to roam. I don't know
> > what Jean means and Mallett is French for mallett like
> > hammer. Could be wrong, but if you can Jamieson, let
> > us know Jamieson, thank you, and schnoogles to you!
> >
> > Wanda the Witch in Revere
> >
> > --- Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca>
> > wrote:
> > > Hello everyone,,,,
> > >
> > > Has anyone thought about what their name means? To
> > > start the
> > > conversation, here's what mine mean:
> > >
> > > Jamieson: Jamie's son, next in line of Jamie's,
> > > usually represents
> > > passing  along of power or wealth, usually a name
> > > for an Irish
> > > peasant.
> > >
> > > Wolf: animal, lupe, lupin, lou. An animal of
> > > mystical powers, Wolves
> > > were known to have the powers of the God or Goddess.
> > > To have a wolf as
> > > a companion was a great blessing.
> > >
> > > Villeneuve: New village.
> > >
> > > (Taken from my Mums "Dictionary of Mythology and
> > > Theology" by Penguin
> > > books)
> > >
> > > So that means I'm an Irish peasent with Goddesslike
> > > powers passing
> > > through a new village? Why can't I be named
> > > something that means: sex
> > > god, will rock your world? Sigh...
> > >
> > > <g>
> > >
> > > Hugs!!!!
> > > Jamieson
> > >
> > >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more.
> > http://buzz.yahoo.com/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
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"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 15 04:46:55 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:46:55 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Thank you
References: <9gc04q+6hup@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B29933F.4B0A458F@sympatico.ca>

Here here! Good show!

<g>

Hugs
Jamieson

Amber wrote:

>
> I don't know if all the moderators are a part of this list, but I
> want to thank them for dealing with the recent nastiness on the HP4GU
> list with efficiency and grace. All of you are wonderful and I am
> thankful for the job that you carry out. The way things were handled
> just reaffirms my belief that the HP4GU and OT-Chatter lists are
> wonderful places to be.
>
> Again, thank you!
>
> ~Amber
>
>
>
>
>                    Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
  [Click for Details]
  Click for Details

>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

--
"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 15 04:47:54 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:47:54 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??
References: <20010615011046.79803.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3B299379.A1CD3D0D@sympatico.ca>

Hey,

Jean is derived from Joan, or Joan of Arc, to mean, taken in the Holy
Spirit. He he he...Sorry, I just think that's funny!

Hugs
Jamieson

Wanda Mallett wrote:

> Look up mine in that special book of yours, please?
> I know Wanda means to wander or to roam. I don't know
> what Jean means and Mallett is French for mallett like
> hammer. Could be wrong, but if you can Jamieson, let
> us know Jamieson, thank you, and schnoogles to you!
>
> Wanda the Witch in Revere
>
>
> --- Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca>
> wrote:
> > Hello everyone,,,,
> >
> > Has anyone thought about what their name means? To
> > start the
> > conversation, here's what mine mean:
> >
> > Jamieson: Jamie's son, next in line of Jamie's,
> > usually represents
> > passing  along of power or wealth, usually a name
> > for an Irish
> > peasant.
> >
> > Wolf: animal, lupe, lupin, lou. An animal of
> > mystical powers, Wolves
> > were known to have the powers of the God or Goddess.
> > To have a wolf as
> > a companion was a great blessing.
> >
> > Villeneuve: New village.
> >
> > (Taken from my Mums "Dictionary of Mythology and
> > Theology" by Penguin
> > books)
> >
> > So that means I'm an Irish peasent with Goddesslike
> > powers passing
> > through a new village? Why can't I be named
> > something that means: sex
> > god, will rock your world? Sigh...
> >
> > <g>
> >
> > Hugs!!!!
> > Jamieson
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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--
"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Fri Jun 15 05:16:26 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 06:16:26 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Love this Group
References: <20010615035426.42282.qmail@web13703.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <014701c0f55a$544d7cc0$da3770c2@c5s910j>

Amber said:

<<I don't know if all the moderators are a part of this list, but I want to
thank them for dealing with the recent nastiness on the HP4GU list with
efficiency and grace.>>

Wanda said:

<<There can never be enough said about our groups owner and her hard working
moderators! Amber had the right
idea to thank all of them for all their hard work in keeping our favorite
place to be, a very happy place
to be! All of us thank you for keeping us all in line, we are like pencils
with earsers(you) to clean up our
mistakes!>>

***

Amber - Yes, the Moderators and List Elves are on this list, although we try
to keep it relatively ADMIN free.  I love the OT list too; someone
invariably says something here to brighten my mood or educate my mind.

On this occasion, it was Moderator Jim and Elf Mom Heidi who dealt with the
offensive poster on the main list.  Thanks to them and to all the list
members who stepped in.  Being a Brit, I was asleep (wearing the hairnet, of
course, to keep my coiffure in place).  Urk - what a thing to wake up to!

Wanda - I'm not sure about that pencil and eraser analogy, although being
made of rubber would sometimes be a big help, it's true... ;-)

Neil
________________________________________

Flying Ford Anglia
Mechanimagus Moderator

"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
squashed, as though it had run headlong into a brick wall"
["The Leaky Cauldron", PoA]

Check out Very Frequently Asked Questions for everything
to do with this club:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/VFAQ.htm










From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 06:05:21 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 06:05:21 -0000
Subject: Hi!
Message-ID: <9gc8j1+m5ru@eGroups.com>

I just thought joining this branch of the Harry Potter for Adults 
Yahoo! Group would be a good idea...I am also a member of the more 
formalized group...I go by "RodeoDangerQueen" "TwilightSwirl" and 
sometimes just "N."  Hi and send me an owl whenver!

All my best,

Natasha




From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 06:14:27 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 06:14:27 -0000
Subject: Wanda sent you a Yahoo! Greeting
Message-ID: <9gc943+begp@eGroups.com>


THANK YOU-THIS IS A VERY LOVELY GESTURE!

N

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., witchwanda2002 at y... wrote:
> Surprise! You've just received a Yahoo! Greeting
> from "Wanda" (witchwanda2002 at y...)!
> 
> To view this greeting card, click on the following
> Web address at anytime within the next 60 days.
> 
> http://greetings.yahoo.com/greet/view?FQAS6P8HX43XK
> 
> If that doesn't work, go to http://greetings.yahoo.com/pickup and
> copy and paste this code:
> 
> FQAS6P8HX43XK
> 
> Enjoy!
> 
> The Yahoo! Greetings Team
> 
> 
> -------------------------
> Yahoo! Greetings is a free service. If you'd like to send someone a
> Yahoo! Greeting, you can do so at http://greetings.yahoo.com/
> 
> Plan your next party with Yahoo! Invites - http://invites.yahoo.com/




From pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no  Fri Jun 15 08:16:28 2001
From: pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no (pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 08:16:28 -0000
Subject: Going offline
Message-ID: <9gcg8s+lvdm@eGroups.com>

I am probably offline for the duration of the summer, so I'll see you 
guys again sometime around the end of August.  

On another note, I think I have you bested for number of Harry Potter-
related list I am subscribed to (25).

Best regards
Christian Stub?




From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun 15 09:18:49 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:18:49 -0700
Subject: Superstore - Happy Birthday - Race - Appearance - Names
Message-ID: <3B29D2F9.9D208E92@wicca.net>

Nethelia, how are you and your family doing? I gather you ran away from
the flood all the way to Denver!

I love all the clever products that DOREEN and AL invented!

Happy Birthday to Jim the Tech Moderator!
Happy Birthday to Danette!

Scott wrote:
> So my question is what do we assume when race isn't given?
> The race of the author? Our own race? It's not always a clear
> cut question.

Michela Ecks wrote:
> I tend to assume the person is white because I'm white and
> that's the easiest way for me to picture people...

Yael wrote:
> Usually, when I read a character's description, they remind me
> of someone else and I adopt the race of that someone for the
> character as well.

Amber wrote;
> I know that I rarely know the race of the author, unless they
> have a picture on the book somewhere and I happen to look at it.

I agree with all the above people. I usually find myself assuming that
people are white, including the author, but sometimes a character
reminds me of someone, which must be why I keep seeing Hermione as a
light-skinned black. I often feel guilty because the default assumption
that people are white is racist, but on the other hand, when I hear
about street criminals or welfare recipients, I assume them to be white,
not just prosperous people.

Ebony wrote:
> whereas a modern black writer describing black characters will
> concentrate on the skin color... whether the character's skin is
ivory,
> cafe au lait, toast, cinnamon, honey, golden, sepia, mahogany, milk
> or bittersweet chocolate, or deepest charcoal.

> As a child growing up in a majority-black environment, whenever
> I read in a book that a character was "dark" as opposed to being
> fair, I automatically assumed they were black.  When I learned that
> this meant only that the character had dark hair and eyes, I was a
> little disappointed.

Amy Z wrote:
> I have read this in fiction and been made very uncomfortable
> by it--somehow it's part of my white-person-trying-not-to-be-racist
> mostly-unconscious training to not describe people by skin color.

What Amy said! I was very relieved to read Ebony's remark (her whole
post was fabulous) because I keep being afraid that I'll be thought
racist for describing people as 'light-skinned black' (above) or 'two
milk chocolate girls' (sisters in an unposted chapter of my fic --
Slytherins of color! is that racist of me?). I wish I understood better
which color is named by each of those lovely mostly-food words, because
almost everyone I know and almost everyone I see around is some shade of
tan or olive, whether they're East Asian (which I wish we were still
allowed to call "Oriental") or South Asian or Latino or Armenian or
Ashkenazi Jewish or light-skinned black... As many exceptions are
less-pale blacks as are more-pale whites.

In line with the above, I can't deal with describing a person as 'dark'
whose skin is pale, no matter how dark hiser hair and eyes are.

Amy Z wrote:
> Appearance is almost entirely for other people, and the pressure
> not to look a certain way comes from the fact that the people
> around you don't like that kind of look.  If  people regularly told
> you you looked gorgeous without your changing a thing about
> your looks, would you feel the inclination to?

Ebony wrote:
> Well, if there weren't any other people in the world, I imagine
> we wouldn't do a lot of things we do for the benefit of others.  :-)
> Like taking a shower or bath at least once a day, wearing deodorant
> and anti-perspirant

I disagree that changing one's appearance BECAUSE of other people is
doing it FOR other people -- that is, just because our ideas of what
looks nice comes from our culture, ie people, doesn't mean that we do it
because we want people to admire our looks. Anyone who saw me in person
would know that having my appearance admired is not a priority to me: I
am hideously ugly, grossly fat, bad skin and no make-up, hair messy,
thinning, and currently messily pinned up on top of my head to reduce
the heat on my neck, even tho' I look DOUBLE hideous with my hair up...
No shaving anywhere, flat shoes (usually sandals) and all my clothes
count as casual -- lately I mostly wear a lot of tank tops (yes, to go
to a professional job in an office). Because my highest priority is
comfort, and the biggest part of comfort is dealing with the miserably
oppressive heat (such as 70 degrees F) that always makes me sweat so
much that when I was in high school and wore make-up, it always melted
and ran down my face.

Another part of comfort is taking a lot of baths and showers and
shampoos (and brushing my teeth), because they are pleasant in
themselves and also because the alternative, being dirty, is very
uncomfortable and ITCHY.

 But I wear a lot of jewelry (more than anyone but me thinks looks good)
because **I** like to look at it, and I buy (and wear when the weather
is cool enough) many pretty clothes such as Ren Faire garb and tye-dyed
muu-muus and so on, because **I** like them even tho' everyone who sees
me wearing them thinks I'm very eccentric. And I would like to put a
bright blue streak in my hair because I LOVE BLUE (but I don't because
bright blue would clash with my brown hair: that is an appearance
decision based on what other people would think).

Angela wrote:
> Especially the two guys both named David. One was known as
> the David who played the guitar, as opposed to the David with
> glasses (who didn't play the guitar).

Long ago, I lived in New York City, and hung out with a group of friends
who were mostly native New Yorkers and mostly white. Two of the group
were Eric the Flute (hotshit computer programmer who was a classical
flautist) and Eric the Brush (MFA painter who had some kind of clerical
job).

Jamieson wrote:
> Betty is derived, according to the book, from Beatrice which

Betty is derived from Elizabeth, which means woman (isha) of the house
(beth) of God (El) in Hebrew.

> Beatrice which means either "...chastised or rampant,

Beatrice means 'blessed' in Latin, like beatified,

> Sue is derived from Sophie,

Sue is derived from Susan, which is Shoshana, which is Hebrew for 'lily'

> Jean is derived from Joan, or Joan of Arc, to mean, taken in the Holy
Spirit

Jean and Jeanne are French for John and Joan/Jane -- all derived from
the Hebrew name Jonathan, whose meaning I forget. Margaret Murray, THE
WITCH CULT IN WESTERN EUROPE, a long ago book about how the British
monarchy preserved the Pagan religion of Europe, said that Medieval
witches often had names that began with that JN, in honor of the Basque
god Janicot...

          /\ /\
           + +     Mews and views
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston

                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((






From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 10:01:58 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 03:01:58 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Going offline
In-Reply-To: <9gcg8s+lvdm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010615100158.18596.qmail@web13704.mail.yahoo.com>




Have a fun time and a safe one!
Wanda the Witch of Revere, Massachusetts and Her Band
of Merry Muggles




--- pengolodh_sc at yahoo.no wrote:
> I am probably offline for the duration of the
> summer, so I'll see you 
> guys again sometime around the end of August.  
> 
> On another note, I think I have you bested for
> number of Harry Potter-
> related list I am subscribed to (25).
> 
> Best regards
> Christian Stub
> 
> 


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more.
http://buzz.yahoo.com/



From madhuri567 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 10:53:03 2001
From: madhuri567 at yahoo.com (Madhuri)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 10:53:03 -0000
Subject: What's your name mean??
In-Reply-To: <9gbg3h+rscg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gcpef+v190@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve" 
<crowswolf at s...> wrote:
> Hello everyone,,,,
> 
> Has anyone thought about what their name means? 

I've researched what my name means a lot. I've researched my family's 
names! We all have Sanskrit names, which are usually very symbolic 
and deep, and it's a lot of fun to find out what they mean. 

My name literally means 'Nectar'. But it is probably a reference to 
the Hindu legend of ambrosia, or the nectar that would make one 
immortal. My name also means 'jasmine', 'wine' and 'sweetness'. 
Cute. :)

But the real reason I like my name so much is that my namesake 
happens to be a *very* popular and *very* talented film actress here 
in India. ;)

Madhuri




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 15 11:08:20 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:08:20 
Subject: What's your name mean?/Naming kids for book characters
Message-ID: <F118mvjkO22ZhCl8aii000014df@hotmail.com>

Hey, everyone!

Here's the meaning of my name:

Ebony:  a type of hardwood, black, but the name itself means "dark strength"

Elizabeth:  consecrated to or set apart for God

Thomas:  twin

As far as naming children for book characters, I've known I was going to 
name my first daughter for my mother (Susan) and my favorite childhood book 
character (Anne) ever since I was a little girl:  Suzanne.

--Ebony AKA AngieJ
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From tabouli at unite.com.au  Fri Jun 15 11:35:56 2001
From: tabouli at unite.com.au (tabouli at unite.com.au)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:35:56 -0000
Subject: J.K. Rowling's fav books
In-Reply-To: <9gb0ph+nr0r@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gcrus+fi3n@eGroups.com>

> Hmmm...I never read "Little White Horse" nor "I Capture the 
Castle". 

Ooo, my first post to the OT list!

"The Little White Horse" is lovely, though given the frequent racial 
discussions on this and the main list, I warn you that the Black Men 
are the bad guys in the story, and "blackness" in general gets a bit 
of a bad press.

I tend to take the "read it in the context of the values of the time" 
view on these issues.  I confess (she says, conscious that she's 
wading in perilous waters here) to a certain irritation with people 
who loudly denounce works written decades ago for not upholding 
current values regarding feminism, multiculturalism and so forth.  I 
mean, sure, note that the attitudes expressed in the books would be 
considered sexist, or racist, or whatever by today's standards, but 
don't denounce the writers for not anticipating shifts in values 
which occurred 50 years after their time.  Please.

Now you mention it, I can see the influence of Hilaire Belloc in 
JKR's work...

Tabouli




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Fri Jun 15 11:41:44 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:41:44 -0000
Subject: Going offline
In-Reply-To: <9gcg8s+lvdm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gcs9o+e25m@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., pengolodh_sc at y... wrote:
> I am probably offline for the duration of the summer, so I'll see 
you 
> guys again sometime around the end of August.  

Have a good summer, Christian.  See you in August.
> 
> On another note, I think I have you bested for number of Harry 
Potter-
> related list I am subscribed to (25).


> 
> Best regards
> Christian Stub?


I've got you beat on the number of HP-related lists I subscribe to.  
I'm on 31. (gasp!)

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker




From tabouli at unite.com.au  Fri Jun 15 12:36:13 2001
From: tabouli at unite.com.au (tabouli at unite.com.au)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 12:36:13 -0000
Subject: Colourful musings
In-Reply-To: <3B29D2F9.9D208E92@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <9gcvft+jaio@eGroups.com>

Aargh, this is the third time I've started this post, I keep on 
pressing some button which makes my message vanish!  Apologies if the 
button I accidentally pressed was send and you're hearing this stuff 
for the third time...

Anyway, as I keep trying to say, I'm always fascinated by the 
physical cues people of different race use to distinguish people from 
each other.  Being half-Chinese and half-white (Anglo/Celt mix) which 
a lot of exposure to Asians from a range of countries, I've never had 
any trouble telling Asians apart.  However, after living in China for 
a few months, strange things started happening to my perceptions...

I confess, with some embarrassment, that I discovered that my 
(Japanese) then boyfriend's TV's cable channel had the Australian 
soap opera Neighbours, and did something I'd never have done back 
home in Australia: started watching it!  To my amazement, I realised 
that all those foreigners Really Did All Look The Same!  They all had 
light hair, pink skin, round eyes and big noses!

It was all quite disturbing.

Another curious thing was the way the Chinese responded to me.  In 
1994, when I was in China, most of the locals I met had never seen a 
Eurasian before, and found it very hard to believe that my mother was 
Chinese.  "You look COMPLETELY foreign!"  they would exclaim.  One 
friend mentioned my "yellow" hair, which I found more bizarre yet.  
*Yellow*??  Like most Eurasians, my hair is dark brown, with a slight 
reddish tinge, dark enough that a lot of Caucasians insist that it's 
black.  When I pointed this out, she said that though my hair was 
only a little bit yellow, it was of course yellow, because all 
foreigners have yellow hair.  Made me wonder what the connotations of 
the word "huang" (usually translated as "yellow") are for a native 
Mandarin speaker.

In Australia, on the other hand, about 70% of people (including a lot 
of Chinese people!) are convinced I'm Mediterranean (usually Greek, 
as I live in Melbourne, which has a large Greek population.  People 
address me in Greek and Italian on the streets!).  The remaining 30% 
are divided between those who immediately see the Asian blood and 
can't *think* how anyone could miss it, and those whose theories span 
the globe from Tunisia to Russia to the Pacific Islands.

Another China anecdote along race lines is my sadly botched attempt 
at heroism in the Beijing General Post Office.  So there I was, 
sending parcels home, by this time comfortably using Mandarin after 
about 6 months in the country.  Lo and behold, some *black 
foreigners* came into the post office!  (btw, I'm assuming 
that "black" is an appropriate adjective: please correct me if this 
offends anyone).  Now, as all mainland Chinese know, all foreigners 
speak English, so the post office staff valiantly dug out their 
broken English (the level of English spoken in China in 1994 when I 
was there was poor, as a rule, except for students specialising in 
English at university, for whom it was quite incredibly good: I 
assumed one student I met was American).

Alas, within minutes, it became clear to me (if not the post office 
staff) that these particular foreigners were from French speaking 
Africa, and spoke next to no English, and no Chinese whatsoever.  
Now, French was my best subject in high school, and prior to coming 
to China I spoke French much better than Chinese.  On hearing the 
poor "foreigners" conversing together in dismayed French I felt a 
surge of trilingual pride and strode up to them to offer my services 
as a French to Chinese translator.  I opened my mouth to explain, and 
my French turned into Mandarin in mid-sentence!  Worse still, the 
only way I figured out that this was what had happened was by the way 
the relieved and pleased expressions on their faces suddenly turned 
to blank incomprehension as I spoke.

O dear.

I struggled on, and this happened again and again until I realised 
that I had no link in my brain between French and Chinese, and the 
only way I could do the job was to go via English.  Eventually I 
succeeded in helping them post their letters, but it was a long haul, 
and I don't think they were up for hiring me as their interpreter for 
the day...

Tabouli




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Fri Jun 15 13:16:34 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:16:34 -0000
Subject: Hi!
In-Reply-To: <9gc8j1+m5ru@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gd1ri+9nfv@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., rodeodangerqueen at y... wrote:
> I just thought joining this branch of the Harry Potter for Adults 
> Yahoo! Group would be a good idea...I am also a member of the more 
> formalized group...I go by "RodeoDangerQueen" "TwilightSwirl" and 
> sometimes just "N."  Hi and send me an owl whenver!
> 
> All my best,
> 
> Natasha

Welcome Natasha!  Now I know who "TwilightSwirl" is.  Why wouldn't 
you reveal yourself in chat last Sunday??

Catherine (catorman)




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Fri Jun 15 10:01:59 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 10:01:59 EST5EDT
Subject: The meaning of my name; Richard
Message-ID: <1AA24D5529@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

First off.....that comment from Richard was shocking.  Never in my time 
being on this list have I ever read anything so hateful....so cruel.....so 
uncompassionate and sad.  I'm rather speechless and though I am not a 
lesbian, I feel like I've been slapped in the face.  I mean....I guess in my 32 
years of life, being raised in a Christian household...it never dawned on me 
that God created things for the sheer purpose of killing them.

Anyway......

Rachel means "Lamb of God"

My parents made up my middle name Malon so there's not meaning in it 
except I'm relieved I wasn't named Moonbeam or Starburst (parents were 
hippies...I was also born in 1969, a time several of my peers got REALLY 
weird names when they were born).

My maiden name is Lewis and when I was in England with the youth choir 
in 1988, Lord (forgot his name) approached me when we were done with our 
concert in Salisbury and said that he noticed my last name was Lewis and 
did I know about the connection of Lewis and the British.  I said that I 
wasn't aware of anything more than it being a very Welsh surname and that 
my family was from Swansea.  He then told me the following:

L- London
E- England
W- Wales
I- Ireland
S- Scotland

I thought that was charming.



Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 14:16:36 2001
From: Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com (Aberforth's Goat)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:16:36 +0200
Subject: Ron's Double Stars in Ron's Fav Film?
References: <9gd1ri+9nfv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <00df01c0f5a5$ca75a350$c871023e@shasta>

Has anyone else skratched his head (or backside) in amazement at Rupert
Grint's new movie project?

Title: Thunderpants.

Synopsis: Directed by Borrowers director Peter Hewitt, the film charts the
unlikely fortunes of Patrick Smash and his finesse at focused flatulence.
Smash and his friend Alan Allen (Grint) dream of fame and stardom, a dream
first realised when Smash uses his 'gift' to win a non-assisted flight
competition. Going on to fill in an opera singer's high notes with his
arse-oriented symphony, Smash inadvertently causes the singer's death and
finds himself sentenced to death for the crime. But can even prison stand in
the way of this anally obsessed youth's dream of becoming an astronaut?
[Taken from the Leakey-Cauldron.org, which got this bit from Empire Online.
See http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/2001_05_27_archive.html#3887795 ]

If that movie has a single fan, it'd have to be Ron himself! I hope this
poor kid hasn't end up pigeonholing himself as the "Ron Show-Me-Uranus
Weasley" for the rest of his acting career ...

Baaaaaa!

Aberforth's Goat (a.k.a. Mike Gray)
_______________________

"My own brother, Aberforth, was prosecuted for practising
inappropriate charms on a goat. It was all over the papers,
but did Aberforth hide? No he did not! He held his head high."




From Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 14:05:09 2001
From: Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com (Aberforth's Goat)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:05:09 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Going offline
References: <9gcg8s+lvdm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <00de01c0f5a5$ca528af0$c871023e@shasta>

Have a good one Christian, and see you in August!

BTW, you're in Sweden, aren't you?

Baaaaaa!

Aberforth's Goat (a.k.a. Mike Gray)
_______________________

"My own brother, Aberforth, was prosecuted for practising
inappropriate charms on a goat. It was all over the papers,
but did Aberforth hide? No he did not! He held his head high."




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Fri Jun 15 10:15:25 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 10:15:25 EST5EDT
Subject: ...sorry.....
Message-ID: <1ADB422C8E@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

I'm a bit behind on the HP4GU canon list (what can I say?  I read 
the off-topic list first. *blush*) so I just now saw that the Moderators 
booted him, blah, blah, blah.

So sorry for bringing it back up in that last post.  It just really 
floored me.  I mean, I sat here....just....stunned over that comment 
about gays.  Looking over his other posts, I'm SURE he was not 
serious and was trying to fire everyone up.  I mean....I pray he was 
not serious.  How can there be that much hatred in a person that 
reads Harry Potter?  I guess I put us Harry fans on a higher 
pedestal than most.  I hope that's not wrong to assume.

Later.

(PS...I've seen Moulin Rouge 8 times now.  I think it will be the 
reason I finally buy a DVD player.)

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Fri Jun 15 15:11:52 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:11:52 -0000
Subject: Hiliare Belloc Re: J.K. Rowling's fav books
In-Reply-To: <9gb0ph+nr0r@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gd8jo+cal8@eGroups.com>

I just reserved a copy of "I capture the castle" at my public library 
today. So I'll see how it goes. My library doesn't carry "Little White 
Horse"..hmmmm.

tabouli wrote
"Now you mention it, I can see the influence of Hilaire Belloc in 
                 JKR's work..."

Yes, his influence does come through in the Potter books. I can see a 
similar dark humor of "Jim, who ran away from his nurse and was eaten 
by a lion" and "Matilda who liked to tell lies and perished miserably" 
 creeping into the Potter books. 

Milz




From michelleapostolides at lineone.net  Fri Jun 15 15:54:17 2001
From: michelleapostolides at lineone.net (Michelle Apostolides)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:54:17 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Ron's Double Stars in Ron's Fav Film?
References: <9gd1ri+9nfv@eGroups.com> <00df01c0f5a5$ca75a350$c871023e@shasta>
Message-ID: <000201c0f5be$643bb5c0$4540063e@tmeltcds>

I saw an interview with Rupert G on the making of Thunderpants - it was
on Newsround. He came accross as someone who was trying to sound all
mockney. I.e. a mock London accent. This may have been to do with the
fact that his hair was all curly on top and he was wearing horrible old
fashoined boffin specs and a bow tie and suit.

Urgghhh.

Michelle




From hfakhro at nyc.rr.com  Fri Jun 15 17:49:44 2001
From: hfakhro at nyc.rr.com (hfakhro at nyc.rr.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:49:44 -0000
Subject: Terry Pratchett recommendations?
Message-ID: <9gdhro+ndvf@eGroups.com>

Hi everyone -- as part of my never-ending reading list, I was looking 
to get some Terry Pratchett books (on the recommendation of an 
acquaintance) but I don't know where to start! Does anyone have any 
suggestions about the reading order, or at least the first book? I 
understand there are the discworld series and others, so which series 
should I begin with? The person who recommended them told me not to 
read them in the order in which they were published, so I'm confused.

Thanks in advance!




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 15 19:23:15 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony Elizabeth Thomas)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:23:15 
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Hiliare Belloc Re: J.K. Rowling's fav books
Message-ID: <F272cU6xfPTeip68V8z00001358@hotmail.com>

>tabouli wrote
>"Now you mention it, I can see the influence of Hilaire Belloc in
>                  JKR's work..."


Milz:
>Yes, his influence does come through in the Potter books. I can see a
>similar dark humor of "Jim, who ran away from his nurse and was eaten
>by a lion" and "Matilda who liked to tell lies and perished miserably"
>  creeping into the Potter books.


Hilaire Belloc was one of the first British writers I ever read as a child!  
My grandfather owned "Cautionary Tales" and "More Beasts for Worse 
Children"... does everyone have a favorite?  Mine has GOT to be "Rebecca, 
who slammed a door and perished miserably"... I first read "Cautionary 
Tales" when I was about four or five and was going through a door-slamming 
and string-and-paper-eating phase.  (Don't ask.  *Please* don't ask.)  HB 
scared me half to death... I was just getting an idea of what death and 
dying actualy *were*, and reading CT didn't help.

I also can see a faint parallel between JKR and HB's bestiaries.

But Belloc influence doesn't bode well for children like Dudley, Draco, etc. 
  I hope she's not to take a page out of HB's book and let something bad 
happen to them to prove a point.

--Ebony
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 15 19:51:39 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony AKA AngieJ)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:51:39 -0000
Subject: Historical Imagination (was Re: J.K. Rowling's fav books)
In-Reply-To: <9gcrus+fi3n@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gdp0b+osl8@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., tabouli at u... wrote:
> "The Little White Horse" is lovely, though given the frequent 
racial discussions on this and the main list, I warn you that the 
Black Men are the bad guys in the story, and "blackness" in general 
gets a bit of a bad press.

LOL!  We really don't talk about race and ethnicity all the time on 
these groups, quite the contrary... this sort of thing comes and 
goes, just like shipping, Number of Hogwarts Students, and Snape-is-a-
vampire.  ;-)  

The connotation of black/dark=bad is found in most English-language 
stories... don't know about other languages.  I do a lot of reading 
by writers from the African Diaspora, and I quite enjoy it, but if 
that's all I ever read I think I'd be unbalanced.  (Although I am 
glad that I grew up in a time when I could read Ezra Jack Keats, 
Virginia Hamilton, Walter Dean Myers, and Mildred Taylor along with 
my steady diet of Judy Blume, Beverly Cleary, Madeleine L'Engle, and 
Katherine Patterson.)

> I tend to take the "read it in the context of the values of the 
time"  view on these issues.  I confess (she says, conscious that 
she's wading in perilous waters here) to a certain irritation with 
people> who loudly denounce works written decades ago for not 
upholding > current values regarding feminism, multiculturalism and 
so forth.  I > mean, sure, note that the attitudes expressed in the 
books would be > considered sexist, or racist, or whatever by today's 
standards, but > don't denounce the writers for not anticipating 
shifts in values > which occurred 50 years after their time.  Please.
>

Thank you!  Isn't this called "historical imagination"?  At least, 
that's what my AP American History teacher told us on the first day 
of class back in '93--she was white, we were a very racially mixed 
group who found the majority of the first 2/3s of our textbooks 
offensive.  So she made what you said, Tabouli, her very first 
lesson.  It worked... we had lots of fun in her course, for she was 
an *excellent* teacher.  

Hmm.  There's a pretty bad racial slur on the last page of what might 
have been one of my favorite Lucy Maud Montgomery books.  I still own 
the book, but I must confess I've never re-read it... it spoiled the 
entire novel for me.  My historical imagination is woefully deficient-
-I *always* get extremely angry when watching movies about black 
history (I cried and threw things all evening after 
watching "Rosewood"--my roots are in Florida)--so I think I agree 
with the spirit of "read it in the context of the values of the time" 
more than I do the letter.  A bigot in 1701, 1801, and 1901 pisses me 
off just as much as a bigot in 2001.

But some people go too far IMO.  My best friend from middle school, 
who is biracial, told us one day when we were in sixth grade that her 
parents TOSSED OUT her Little House on the Prairie series when they 
found out about the minstrel show.  Never mind that minstrelsy is 
part of America's cultural history... no study of the development of 
the American theatre is complete without touching upon it.  Never 
mind that the doctor who helped save Laura's family when they were 
sick in Indian Territory was a black man... and LIW wrote this detail 
in long before it was "PC" to do so.  

I think I agree with you, Tabouli.  I'd rather my children read about 
the past and understand both its glory and its sordidness, than to 
grow up ignorant of the trends that have influenced where we are at 
this point in history.

--Ebony AKA AngieJ




From mecks at prodigy.net  Fri Jun 15 20:13:22 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:13:22 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Terry Pratchett recommendations?
References: <9gdhro+ndvf@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <012b01c0f5d7$a21f2de0$2cb8fea9@hale>


----- Original Message -----
From: <hfakhro at nyc.rr.com>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 12:49 PM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Terry Pratchett recommendations?


> Hi everyone -- as part of my never-ending reading list, I was looking
> to get some Terry Pratchett books (on the recommendation of an
> acquaintance) but I don't know where to start! Does anyone have any
> suggestions about the reading order, or at least the first book? I
> understand there are the discworld series and others, so which series
> should I begin with? The person who recommended them told me not to
> read them in the order in which they were published, so I'm confused.

I'd reccommend starting with "Good Omens" which he co-wrote with Neil Gaiman
as it helps to acclimate you to his style plus it's a pretty kick ass book
:o) (It's also the book that introed me to pratchett.)

I would skip the Color of Magic which is the first Discworld book because
Prachett's style isn't that finely tuned in that one...  I liked Equal Rites
best of all the ones he's written but I like Granny in that and how he
handles feminist type issues.... but Discworld doesn't really require
starting in any particular place :o)

Michela Ecks - Spastic Hale Girl - :o)
http://writersu.s5.com/ micecks on aim




From ochfd42 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 20:01:50 2001
From: ochfd42 at yahoo.com (Angela Boyko)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 16:01:50 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??
In-Reply-To: <9gbg3h+rscg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010615200150.87659.qmail@web11702.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca>
wrote:
> Hello everyone,,,,
> 
> Has anyone thought about what their name means? 

Angela means "Messenger of God". My middle name, Rose,
I just interpret to mean the flower.

Boyko is a Ukrainian name, but I don't know anything
more than that. There is a theory that it was changed
from something else when my grandfather came to
Canada. Boyko is found extensively in the prairie
provines of Canada, so it is an actual name and not
one the Immigration officer came up with.

Angela

=====
* * * http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/4439/index.html * * *
               May the Force be with you

_______________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca



From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 15 21:12:16 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:12:16 -0000
Subject: Terry Pratchett recommendations?
In-Reply-To: <012b01c0f5d7$a21f2de0$2cb8fea9@hale>
Message-ID: <9gdtng+mm4o@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Michela Ecks" <mecks at p...> wrote:

> 
> I'd reccommend starting with "Good Omens" which he co-wrote with 
Neil Gaiman
> as it helps to acclimate you to his style plus it's a pretty kick 
ass book
> :o) (It's also the book that introed me to pratchett.)
> 

Good Omens is an AMAZING book!!! I've read it four times!!!! Also, 
pick up a copy of Carpe Junglum (sp) It's the first discworld book to 
star vampires, and it's really quite funny..

also, Neverwhere and Stardust, by Neil Gaimen, are equally AMAZING!!!

Hugs
Jamieson




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 15 21:16:44 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:16:44 -0000
Subject: Fanfic to Read...
Message-ID: <9gdtvs+k7hr@eGroups.com>

Hello Everyone, hope you can help....

Well, on the reccomendation of friends, I've finished the following 
fanfics, completely or up to what has been written....

PoA
ToT
Show that Never Ends
Snitch!
DD
DS
A Sirius Affair

quite an impressive list for someone who doesn't normally have time to 
read fanfiction, but it's been boring at work lately, what can I 
say....

But, here's where you guys come in...what else is out there? Are there 
some mroe kick butt fanfics that I should read to feed my HP 
obsession?

Help!!!

Hugs
Jamieson

 




From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 21:18:45 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:18:45 -0000
Subject: Hi!
In-Reply-To: <9gd1ri+9nfv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gdu3l+vfjh@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., catherine at c... wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., rodeodangerqueen at y... wrote:
> > I just thought joining this branch of the Harry Potter for Adults 
> > Yahoo! Group would be a good idea...I am also a member of the 
more 
> > formalized group...I go by "RodeoDangerQueen" "TwilightSwirl" and 
> > sometimes just "N."  Hi and send me an owl whenver!
> > 
> > All my best,
> > 
> > Natasha
> 
> Welcome Natasha!  Now I know who "TwilightSwirl" is.  Why wouldn't 
> you reveal yourself in chat last Sunday??
> 
> Catherine (catorman)

I find myself alternating between secrecy and openness from day to 
day and sometimes hour to hour!  Usually I keep to myself...for the 
most part...but it also depends on my mood...

I like this less formal arena!  I will probably say hello again to 
the group as a whole soon and see what happens.

N ;)






From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 21:35:01 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:35:01 -0000
Subject: Send Me An Owl, Whenever!
Message-ID: <9gdv25+4ksv@eGroups.com>

Hi again everyone...just wanted to openly extend an invitation to you 
all to send me an owl so that I can get to know the group better...in 
the online sort of way.  Hope all is well whether or not you are in 
London, Berlin, Paris, New York, Los Angeles, Miami, or even Godric's 
Hollow!

Magically yours,

Natasha




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 15 21:42:43 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 21:42:43 -0000
Subject: New Yahoo Group
Message-ID: <9gdvgj+hujs@eGroups.com>

Hello Everybody!!!!!


I've started a new yahoo group: Penny_Dredfule group at Yahoo! 

This group features the fanfic "Penny Dredfule-The Muggle
Wizard" by yours truely. It is a group for those who want to promote 
their "slash" fiction, or fiction that has GLBT, homosexual or lesbian
story lines and content. 

Anyone who wants to join can do so!!
And anyone who wants to post a fic is welcome to do so as
well! This is a group that takes pride in their work, and
encourages everyone to keep writing....otherwise, how can we
all feed our obsessions? 

To learn more about the Penny_Dredfule group, please visit
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Penny_Dredfule

To start sending messages to members of this group, simply 
send email to
Penny_Dredfule at yahoogroups.com

If you do not wish to belong to Penny_Dredfule, you may 
unsubscribe by sending an email to 
Penny_Dredfule-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

To see and modify all of your groups, go to
http://groups.yahoo.com/mygroups


Regards,

Jamieson
Moderator, Penny_Dredfule





From joy0823 at earthlink.net  Fri Jun 15 21:54:05 2001
From: joy0823 at earthlink.net (- Joy -)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:54:05 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Fanfic to Read...
References: <9gdtvs+k7hr@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <01b701c0f5e6$005f4260$0566fea9@cp124541b>

Jamieson and other fan-fic lovers,

Here's everything I'm in the progress of reading (or have read) and adore...
all are available at www.fanfiction.net.  I'm such a total fan fic addict,
and I can never resist recruiting people to some of my favorite stories, so
forgive me if I go overboard.  In no particular order... <takes a deep
breath>

A Sirius Affair
A Surfeit of Curses
Draco Dormiens
Draco Sinister
Harry Potter and the Song of Time
Krum Do I Love
Not Quite Paradise
The Paradigm of Uncertainty
The Show that Never Ends
Trouble in Paradise
The Letter
The Importance of Being Ron
Penny Dredfule <grins>
We'll Always Have Paris
The Potion Master's Apprentice
Personal Risks
Slytherin Pride
Dark Days are Coming
After the End

Okay, so I read a lot... no making fun of me ; )

There was one more story-in-progress I wanted to mention, but it seems to
have disappeared and I can't remember the title.  It was by Glitterpixie,
was D/G, involved Draco having a daughter, and had McGonagall stuck as a
cat.  Does anyone know which one I'm talking about?  It's going to drive me
crazy if I can never find out what happened.

At any rate, I hope this helps!

~Joy~

http://www.geocities.com/joy0823
Last Movie Seen: "All the Pretty Horses"
Now Reading: "Dead Even" by Brad Meltzer





From mecks at prodigy.net  Fri Jun 15 22:15:29 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:15:29 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Terry Pratchett recommendations?
References: <9gdtng+mm4o@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <004401c0f5e9$1d758500$2cb8fea9@hale>


----- Original Message -----
From: Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 4:12 PM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Terry Pratchett recommendations?


> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Michela Ecks" <mecks at p...> wrote:
>
> >
> > I'd reccommend starting with "Good Omens" which he co-wrote with
> Neil Gaiman
> > as it helps to acclimate you to his style plus it's a pretty kick
> ass book
> > :o) (It's also the book that introed me to Pratchett.)

> Good Omens is an AMAZING book!!! I've read it four times!!!! Also,
> pick up a copy of Carpe Junglum (sp) It's the first discworld book to
> star vampires, and it's really quite funny..

I read on Cinescape a while back that they were making it into a movie at
long last...  *crosses fingers* I can't remember the details but I think it
was in the development stages in February (development as in the script is
being written) and does any one have any details?  I've heard so many
stories about a possible movie...

> also, Neverwhere and Stardust, by Neil Gaimen, are equally AMAZING!!!

I never particularlly liked Neil Gaiman.... I've read both and I just found
myself intensely loathing the style his stuff is written in and just ug, not
my thing.

Ummm....  I want to to do another author plug.  "A Wizard's Dilemma" (sp)
hit the shelves about a week and a half ago if you're a fan of Diane Duane's
wizard's series.  It's pretty good stuff :o)

Michela Ecks




From hfakhro at nyc.rr.com  Fri Jun 15 22:10:05 2001
From: hfakhro at nyc.rr.com (hfakhro at nyc.rr.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:10:05 -0000
Subject: Fanfic to Read...
In-Reply-To: <01b701c0f5e6$005f4260$0566fea9@cp124541b>
Message-ID: <9ge13t+uu03@eGroups.com>

Thanks Jamieson and Michela for your Pratchett recommendations! I 
wanted to add to the list of fanfic recommendations the works by 
Blaise (can also be found on ff.net) - they deal mainly with MWPP and 
Snape, the author seems to be a huge fan of Remus Lupin so if you're 
into that, they're pretty good.




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 22:22:14 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:22:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: What's your name mean?/Naming kids for book characters
In-Reply-To: <F118mvjkO22ZhCl8aii000014df@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <20010615222214.72813.qmail@web10903.mail.yahoo.com>


As far as naming children for book characters, I've known I was going to 
name my first daughter for my mother (Susan) and my favorite childhood book 
character (Anne) ever since I was a little girl:  Suzanne.

--Ebony AKA AngieJ
_________________________________________________________________


Suzanne is my middle name....I like it I'm named after my godmother...(middle atleast).  I think melanie means dark..or black....I'm not sure I"ve heard Mysterious too.



---------------------------------
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Personal Address - Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 15 22:59:36 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 22:59:36 -0000
Subject: I love you gifts(This is a long post)
Message-ID: <9ge40o+iii1@eGroups.com>

Hello everybody...

Well, your friendly neighbourhood Jamieson feels like crying at the 
moment, and I need to get it off my chest....It's really REALLY off 
topic, but I'd love you guys even more if you read it all the way 
through. I need someone to listen, if they could be so kind....

I was out shopping with my partner Mitch this afternoon. I picked up a 
new book ("Bride By Surprise" by Muriel Jensen...it's a romance. Yes, 
their fluffy, but I love em!). 

But we're in a clothing store, and I was looking at a pair of pants 
that I thought were really neat. It went like this:

Mitch: Try the X-Large
Me: Goodness, have I gotten that big?
Mitch: Yep. You have. You used to be thin, and now look at you.

Needless to say, I just sort of shrugged that off. Kind of like, yeah, 
Okay, whatever. 

So, from there, I went to work. Now, for months and months and months, 
he's been promising to buy me the collectible figureine of Hermione. I 
dropped loads of hints about it today. Thing is, I buy him lots and 
lots of what I call "I Love You Gifts". Just a little something to 
show Mitch that I love him.

So, I phone him, and the conversation went like this:

Me: Hey sexy, did you buy me a present, ha ha ha?
Mitch: No. Why would I do that?
Me: What? 
Mitch: Well, it's not a practical gift. I believe in buying practical 
things.
Me: But you never buy me anything. 
Mitch: My point exactly. You have un-practical tastes. And I don't 
want you buying those pants, by the way.
Me: the blue ones with the red stripe?
Mitch: Yes.
Me: Why?
Mitch: cus you'll look fat in them.
Me: But I haven't even worn them yet! I'm buying them tomorrow!
Mitch: Well, whatever. You're the one whos fat, not me. I'm only 
telling you this for your own good.
Me: (practially in tears, and at work) Fine. I'll pick up the pants, 
and the *(&(^%^%#$% $#@!#%&&$%*^ $%(&*()&*^ )&)**&  **&&^^%%#! !@#%$% 
figure myself tomorrow. 
Mitch: Well, I'll just go and buy it for you now.
Me: Don't f*****g bother, I'll get it myself.
Mitch: Now you're being unreasonable.
Me: I have to get back to work.
Mitch: I love you.
Me: --click--

Can anyone see why I'm upset here? He is a Leo, and wants to be in 
control of the situation, but that's ridiculous! 

Thanx to all who've read this through to the end...I just needed to 
get it off my chest, so I don't break down into tears at work right 
now!

Sigh, I feel better.
Jamieson




From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Fri Jun 15 23:17:19 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:17:19 -0000
Subject: Hiliare Belloc Re: J.K. Rowling's fav books
In-Reply-To: <F272cU6xfPTeip68V8z00001358@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9ge51v+82fc@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Ebony Elizabeth Thomas" <ebonyink at h...> 
wrote:
> >tabouli wrote
> >"Now you mention it, I can see the influence of Hilaire Belloc in
> >                  JKR's work..."
> 
> 
> Milz:
> >Yes, his influence does come through in the Potter books. I can see 
a
> >similar dark humor of "Jim, who ran away from his nurse and was 
eaten
> >by a lion" and "Matilda who liked to tell lies and perished 
miserably"
> >  creeping into the Potter books.
> 
> 
> Hilaire Belloc was one of the first British writers I ever read as a 
child!  
> My grandfather owned "Cautionary Tales" and "More Beasts for Worse 
> Children"... does everyone have a favorite?  Mine has GOT to be 
"Rebecca, 
> who slammed a door and perished miserably"... I first read 
"Cautionary 
> Tales" when I was about four or five and was going through a 
door-slamming 
> and string-and-paper-eating phase.  (Don't ask.  *Please* don't 
ask.)  HB 
> scared me half to death... I was just getting an idea of what death 
and 
> dying actualy *were*, and reading CT didn't help.
> 
> I also can see a faint parallel between JKR and HB's bestiaries.
> 
> But Belloc influence doesn't bode well for children like Dudley, 
Draco, etc. 
>   I hope she's not to take a page out of HB's book and let something 
bad 
> happen to them to prove a point.
> 

 I grew up in a household where folk tales, fairy tales (as 
non-sanitized as possible) and fables were staple bed-time stories. 
Naturally, alot of the stories were editorialized with "they used to 
do this a long, long time ago" or "they wouldn't be able to do 
something like that now, but.." or "now don't YOU go that!" and "what 
soandso is very kind; soandso is a good person". "Cautionary Tales" 
was also heavily editorialized. 

I think the Draco-ferret and the ton-tongue toffee incidents are 
Belloc-ish in the vaguely cautionary tale: don't fight dirty and don't 
be greedy.

Milz




From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 23:30:48 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (lyorkus at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:30:48 -0000
Subject: who's going to die; Weatherby
In-Reply-To: <9ga9ed+8i08@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9ge5r8+ij21@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:  
> BTW, to back up the thread a ways, Peeves isn't the same as a 
ghost.  
> No one's quite sure how poltergeists are different, but he's not 
> transparent, isn't a proper ghost according to Nick, and as far as 
we 
> know was not formerly a living human.  
> 
> There might also be a way for ghosts as well as poltergeists 
to "die" 
> (be dispersed?).
> 
> Amy Z
> who wants to know more about the Bloody Baron

Peeves is definitely the ghost of a human.  A poltergeist ("geist" is 
the German word for "spirit" or "ghost") is supposed to be the ghost 
of an adolescent.  The rebellious or mischievous nature of the 
poltergeist supposedly has something to do with a combination of the 
nature of the person's death (there's unfinished business this person 
never got around to, he/she is upset about that) and the basic 
instability of a teenager's personality.  As a result, this ghost is 
having a hissy fit for eternity.

What is surprising is that there aren't MORE poltergeists at 
Hogwarts, since it's about a thousand years old and students have 
clearly died at the school before (what about those Triwizard 
Tournament fatalities?).  In fact, Moaning Myrtle is pretty close to 
being a poltergeist herself, what with her antics in the out-of-order 
bathroom, going into the lake to see Harry during the second task, 
and spying on him while bathing in the prefects' bathroom.  Peeves 
seems to have more gusto than her, however.

Maybe we'll find out about Peeves' demise sometime in the future, as 
we did with Myrtle.  We already know a little about Nick's botched 
beheading.  The Bloody Baron would be another good one to know.  I 
admit to being confused about the Fat Friar, however.  Why is he 
haunting Hogwarts?  Was it built on the ruins of a monastery a 
thousand years ago?

--Laurin

(I've probably asked more questions than I've answered!)




From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 23:40:44 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (lyorkus at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 23:40:44 -0000
Subject: What's your name mean??
In-Reply-To: <20010615011046.79803.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9ge6ds+2r40@eGroups.com>

Laurin/Laura/Laurel come from the (bay)laurel tree, which is what 
Daphnis (as in Daphnis et Cloe) was turned into in Greek mythology, 
so the Greek equivalent is Daphne (a name I have sometimes gone by in 
the past).
  




From ochfd42 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 15 23:44:51 2001
From: ochfd42 at yahoo.com (Angela Boyko)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:44:51 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Changing your looks
In-Reply-To: <9ga8q5+cuq4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010615234451.50615.qmail@web11703.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Amy Z <aiz24 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Re: that thread on Hermione at the ball on HPfGU.
> 
> I like to look pretty as much as the next person,
> and I admit to a 
> weakness for clothes that is frankly a spiritual
> peril, but whenever I 
> hear someone say "I did X (dyed my hair, got a nose
> job, bought a new 
> wardrobe, wore makeup, etc.) for myself, not for
> anyone else," an 
> inner voice says "Oh, really?"  Appearance is almost
> entirely for 
> other people, and the pressure not to look a certain
> way comes from 
> the fact that the people around you don't like that
> kind of look.  If 
> people regularly told you you looked gorgeous
> without your changing a 
> thing about your looks, would you feel the
> inclination to? 

No need to don the asbestos as I present my point my
view. :-)

I have dyed my hair, more out of a need for me to feel
good about my appearance. Nobody ever said, "Angela,
your hair is mousy brown", or "Angela, you're 28 and
you have a grey hair!". I tried a temporary rinse for
red and loved how it looked on me.

But yes, people commented on the change and it made me
feel good about myself. I'm 35 and have grown to
accept the grey hairs, but I still like red hair on me
than brown. Livens up my appearance.

I have also had plastic surgery - but it was most
emphatically for myself. I had a breast reduction a
year ago, I went from overflowing a DD bra to snugly
fitting a B cup. The relief from neck and back pain is
hard to describe in words, but it was well worth it. I
actually grew an inch in height as my posture
improved. Over 7 pounds was taken off (in total, not
each!)

Now, you could surmise that I did it for others
because I was tired of being known for huge knockers,
but really, I like to think people like me for how
bright and funny I am, than my breasts. I have a lot
of online friends that have never seen a picture of
me. And only two people questioned my desire to
undergo the surgery - everyone else was supportive. 

So I did it for me. Should I get involved with a man
who has a problem with the surgery - well, I think
that's a good indication that he is not a man I would
not want to get intimate with if he can't accept my
reasons for doing it. I actually held off on it for
years knowing it could hamper my chances of
breastfeding - but when I found myself 33 years old
and still childless, I decided to go for it. I didn't
want to be 43, still in chronic pain, wishing I did it
years ago. Should the mythical Mr Right ever appear,
we can take turns bottle feeding. ;-)

Angela

=====
* * * http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/4439/index.html * * *
               May the Force be with you

_______________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca



From devika261 at aol.com  Sat Jun 16 00:18:52 2001
From: devika261 at aol.com (devika261 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 20:18:52 EDT
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What does your name mean?
Message-ID: <107.15011e6.285bffec@aol.com>

Hi everyone!
I know that my first name, Devika, comes from the Sanskrit root meaning 
"goddess."  Not bad, IMO :)  My middle name is Sandalee (which, personally, 
I'm not very fond of, even though people tell me it's pretty...).  I was 
convinced that my parents made it up, but they tell me that they named me 
after a friend they had with that name.  Anyway, I've never found a 
definition for it anywhere.  Maybe you could help me?
Thanks a lot :)
Devika Sandalee Lal



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Sat Jun 16 00:25:16 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 20:25:16 -0400
Subject: ADMIN:  How to fight a troll
Message-ID: <F164LsxpTljBOh8s4KW00000d79@hotmail.com>

Amy Elf tremblingly steps into the vacated DADA position, picks up a piece 
of chalk, and says:

There are three simple steps to fighting a troll, class.  However, they 
require will power and presence of mind.

1.  Ignore it
2.  Ignore it
3.  Ignore it.

Many witches and wizards find it helpful to take several deep breaths and 
chant the catchy little incantation,

"Bigots feed on hate like junkies feed on drugs.
Without it they shrivel like salted slugs."

(This works well with pompoms, by the way.  Try it out at your next match 
against Slytherin!)

Your magical moderators may take a few hours to notice the presence of a 
troll and perform the Banning Charm.  In the meantime, please do not feed 
the troll.

Amy Z
hastily offering her resignation before the DADA jinx can catch up with her
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com




From saitaina at wizzards.net  Sat Jun 16 00:25:39 2001
From: saitaina at wizzards.net (Saitaina)
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:25:39 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] ADMIN:  How to fight a troll
References: <F164LsxpTljBOh8s4KW00000d79@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <003101c0f5fa$dff55400$634e28d1@oemcomputer>

Aw pouts.  I was just starting to like you as DADA professor! :)  Lovely
lesson dear.

Saitaina
----- Original Message -----
From: Amy Z <aiz24 at hotmail.com>
To: <HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com>; <HPfGU-OTchatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 5:25 PM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] ADMIN: How to fight a troll


> Amy Elf tremblingly steps into the vacated DADA position, picks up a piece
> of chalk, and says:
>
> There are three simple steps to fighting a troll, class.  However, they
> require will power and presence of mind.
>
> 1.  Ignore it
> 2.  Ignore it
> 3.  Ignore it.
>
> Many witches and wizards find it helpful to take several deep breaths and
> chant the catchy little incantation,
>
> "Bigots feed on hate like junkies feed on drugs.
> Without it they shrivel like salted slugs."
>
> (This works well with pompoms, by the way.  Try it out at your next match
> against Slytherin!)
>
> Your magical moderators may take a few hours to notice the presence of a
> troll and perform the Banning Charm.  In the meantime, please do not feed
> the troll.
>
> Amy Z
> hastily offering her resignation before the DADA jinx can catch up with
her
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
>
>
>       Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
>       Click for Details
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Sat Jun 16 00:35:08 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:35:08 -0000
Subject: ADMIN:  How to fight a troll
In-Reply-To: <003101c0f5fa$dff55400$634e28d1@oemcomputer>
Message-ID: <9ge9js+tgo3@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Saitaina" <saitaina at w...> wrote:
> Aw pouts.  I was just starting to like you as DADA professor! :)  
Lovely
> lesson dear.

We list elves may be slavish, but we is not dumb.  I knows a dangerous 
assignment when I sees it, sir.

Back to baking eclairs,
Amy "Allergic to Troll Boogers" Z




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Sat Jun 16 00:37:21 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 00:37:21 -0000
Subject: ADMIN:  How to fight a troll
In-Reply-To: <F164LsxpTljBOh8s4KW00000d79@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9ge9o1+d3qs@eGroups.com>

Hello Everyone!!!!


--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Amy Elf tremblingly steps into the vacated DADA position, picks up a 
piece 
> of chalk, and says:
> 
> There are three simple steps to fighting a troll, class.  However, 
they 
> require will power and presence of mind.
> 
> 1.  Ignore it
> 2.  Ignore it
> 3.  Ignore it.
> 

I loved it!!!! It's also very true for real life too, no matter what 
the bad situation is!!!

Hugs
Jamieson




From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun 16 01:23:25 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:23:25 -0000
Subject: Fanfic to Read...
In-Reply-To: <9gdtvs+k7hr@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9geced+5ruh@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve" 
<crowswolf at s...> wrote:

> But, here's where you guys come in...what else is out there? 
> there some mroe kick butt fanfics that I should read to feed my HP 
> obsession?

I second the recommendation to read everything by Blaise (with the 
possible exception of PoA from Snape's PoV). Also on ffnet, there 
are stories by Katie Bell about Lily's school friend who married 
Sirius back before all that bad stuff. Also on ffnet, there are FUNNY 
stories by our own Alicia-Sue Spinnet. 

On ffnet, look at the Author Profile pages of the writers you like 
and check out the Favorite Authors and Favorite Stories which they 
list.

Stories on the Diagon Alley web site 
http://pages.nyu.edu/~amw243/fiction.html

Four stories about Sirius after PoA pauses at Remus's cottage, 
three on ffnet:
MOONY AND PADFOOT by Blaise
THE BOUND BY THE MOON ARC by Rebecca the Great
LOVE IN THE RUINS by GrimSlasher (read the famous Boys' Own Camping 
Adventure
"Full Moon" by Gillian at                  
http://www.corplink.com.au/~gillianm/HarryPotterSlash.htm
more slashfic at http://www.ravenswing.com/keelywolfe/ .  

If you run out of things to read, you could read my stories in my 
folder in the files section of HPff....                 --




From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun 16 01:43:29 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 01:43:29 -0000
Subject: Poltergeists (was: who's going to die; Weatherby
In-Reply-To: <9ge5r8+ij21@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gedk1+t7pu@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., lyorkus at y... wrote:

> Peeves is definitely the ghost of a human.  A poltergeist ("geist"
> is the German word for "spirit" or "ghost")

As in Zeistgeist, the spirit of the era, as in saying that 1848 and 
1968 shared a Zeitgeist of rebellion.

> is supposed to be the ghost of an adolescent.  The rebellious or
> mischievous nature of the poltergeist supposedly has something to  
> do with a combination of the nature of the person's death (there's 
> unfinished business this person never got around to, he/she is 
> upset about that) and the basic  instability of a teenager's   
> personality.  As a result, this ghost is having a hissy fit for 
> eternity.

I just about entirely disagree. There may be some folklore in Germany 
that a poltergeist is the ghost of a dead adolescent, but 'psychic 
researchers' in the English speaking world generally agree that a 
poltergeist is not a being at all, but rather all those things are 
being thrown around by the unconscious psychokinesis of a living but 
frustrated adolescent. 

As Peeves seems to quite clearly be a Being, I suppose that 
poltergeists in the Potterverse are Beings and not just a 
manifestation of a troubled teen-ager. If the kind of being that a 
poltergeist is, is the spirit of a dead person, then 1) judging from 
the other ghosts we've seen, it would look something like what it had 
looked like at the moment of death, and 2) Nearly Headless Nick 
wouldn't have said that Peeves isn't a real ghost. "My dear Friar, 
haven't we given Peeves all the chances he deserves? He gives us all 
a bad name and you know, he's not really even a ghost -- I say, what 
are you all doing here?"

Another opportunity for my new theory: as the Poltergeist is a Being 
(in the Spirit division), therefore the reason it is often found in 
households with frustrated adolescents is not that it was created by 
the adolescents. So maybe the reason is that it feeds on frustration, 
and hangs out where the teen-ager produces a steady food supply. The 
talk about poltergeists and frustrated adolescents usually mentions 
frustrated lust, but if the poltergeist feeds on frustrated anger 
and other kinds of frustration, then maybe the reason it does so 
much damages and harrasses people so much is IN ORDER to make the 
people feel angry and frustrated. So that the poltergeist can eat 
their anger and frustration.






From coriolan at worldnet.att.net  Sat Jun 16 05:02:49 2001
From: coriolan at worldnet.att.net (Caius Marcius)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 05:02:49 -0000
Subject: Poltergeists (was: who's going to die; Weatherby
In-Reply-To: <9gedk1+t7pu@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gep9p+66vv@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rita Winston" <catlady at w...> wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., lyorkus at y... wrote:
> 
> > Peeves is definitely the ghost of a human.  A poltergeist ("geist"
> > is the German word for "spirit" or "ghost")
> 
> As in Zeistgeist, the spirit of the era, as in saying that 1848 and 
> 1968 shared a Zeitgeist of rebellion.

But neither year matched the sublime counter-rebellion of 1989 ("89" 
being, as Vaclav Havel noted, "68" upside-down.)

  - the counter-revolutionary CMC




From mrs_snape at yahoo.de  Sat Jun 16 11:37:48 2001
From: mrs_snape at yahoo.de (Mrs Snape (Dinah))
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:37:48 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: ADMIN:  How to fight a troll
References: <9ge9o1+d3qs@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <003201c0f658$c64d8d20$1e2907d5@oemcomputer>

> Amy Elf tremblingly steps into the vacated DADA position, picks up a
piece > of chalk, and says:
> > There are three simple steps to fighting a troll, class.  However,
they > require will power and presence of mind.
> > 1.  Ignore it
> 2.  Ignore it
> 3.  Ignore it.

That's what I always tell myself because I know I'll get very scathing and
insulting - really don't know where that temper comes from (want the truth?
from my Mum, but don't tell her - oh, btw, she had also a few very... ahem,
helpful (?) things to say about that guy - If the white race is superior,
how come there are guys like him existent??? <g>). I'm glad that I slept
through the "fun" due to permanent bed-lodging due to sickness and
time-zones... and it seems like Bohoo! ate most of the worst mails. It also
ate some of the Admin messages... I hate Bohoo!

Dinah (off to bed again)



_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 16 14:35:55 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 07:35:55 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Changing your looks
In-Reply-To: <20010615234451.50615.qmail@web11703.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20010616143555.7113.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Angela Boyko <ochfd42 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> I have dyed my hair, more out of a need for me to
> feel
> good about my appearance. Nobody ever said, "Angela,
> your hair is mousy brown", or "Angela, you're 28 and
> you have a grey hair!". I tried a temporary rinse
> for
> red and loved how it looked on me.
> 
> But yes, people commented on the change and it made
> me
> feel good about myself. I'm 35 and have grown to
> accept the grey hairs, but I still like red hair on
> me
> than brown. Livens up my appearance.

I can very much relate to this. I started going grey
at 21, not unusual in my mother's family. She started
getting grey hair at 18, her sister at 16. At first it
was a novelty, then something to blame my daughter
for. At 30, however, it got boring - grey and brown.
So.... I decided to dye it. I had red curly hair as a
child, so I went in the direction of reddish brown. I
love it and have dying my hair ever since, always the
same colour. Most people who haven't know me for long,
well anyone who hasn't known for more than 12 years,
think this is my natural hair colour. Since that
covers pretty much most people, I guess I'm sure that
I'm doing this for myself. No one to impress, as they
don't know my real colour (not even my husband has
seen it, though he obviously knows I dye my hair!).

> 
> I have also had plastic surgery - but it was most
> emphatically for myself. I had a breast reduction a
> year ago, I went from overflowing a DD bra to snugly
> fitting a B cup. The relief from neck and back pain
> is
> hard to describe in words, but it was well worth it.
> I
> actually grew an inch in height as my posture
> improved. Over 7 pounds was taken off (in total, not
> each!)
> 
> Now, you could surmise that I did it for others
> because I was tired of being known for huge
> knockers,
> but really, I like to think people like me for how
> bright and funny I am, than my breasts. I have a lot
> of online friends that have never seen a picture of
> me. And only two people questioned my desire to
> undergo the surgery - everyone else was supportive. 
> 
> So I did it for me. Should I get involved with a man
> who has a problem with the surgery - well, I think
> that's a good indication that he is not a man I
> would
> not want to get intimate with if he can't accept my
> reasons for doing it. I actually held off on it for
> years knowing it could hamper my chances of
> breastfeding - but when I found myself 33 years old
> and still childless, I decided to go for it. I
> didn't
> want to be 43, still in chronic pain, wishing I did
> it
> years ago. Should the mythical Mr Right ever appear,
> we can take turns bottle feeding. ;-)
> 
> Angela
> 
I had plastic surgery myself, when I was 12. I used to
have ears that stuck straight out. The surgery was my
12th birthday gift from my parents (a financial
sacrifice I greatly appreciate, knowing now how little
they could afford to do this). When I was 12 I was the
skinniest person I knew, the tallest (I'm 5'9" and
have been that height since I stopped growing at age
12), wore glasses and had ears that stuck out. Not a
cute image I'm conjuring up, is it? The teasing was
merciless ('four -eyes', 'beanpole', 'giraffe',
'Dumbo'), you name it, I heard it. They only thing
that could be changed was my ears, so that's what we
did. Now, I had never cried and complained to my
parents. This was something they noticed on their own
and offered to do. I *do* have amazing parents, don't
I?

Sheryll, who adores her parents, even though she and
her mother would kill each other if left in a room
alone too long (we're too much alike)

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more.
http://buzz.yahoo.com/



From joannec at hwy.com.au  Sat Jun 16 08:48:50 2001
From: joannec at hwy.com.au (Joanne Collins)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 18:48:50 +1000
Subject: Favorite books as a child
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010616184850.007ede20@mail.hwy.com.au>

I'll have to answer this, late as I am.

The first books I remember reading were some adaptations of the fairy
tales. Cinderella and whatnot.

Then one day I was introduced to chapter books by someone suggesting that I
read a Bobbsey Twins book.

Books I loved as a child:

Bobbsey Twins
Sue Barton nurse books by Helen Dore Boylston (I wanted to be a nurse for
so long)
Cherry Ames nurse books (*g*)
Nancy Drew
Trixie Belden
Enid Blyton's books. Sometimes the mysteries, sometimes the 'toys coming to
life', sometimes the school stories.
Also various other kid-type books.
Oh, I remember loving a couple of books called the Hamlyn Book Of Queens
and the Hamlyn Book Of Princesses (I had a fascination with royalty, too)
Little House books
Little Women
Just about every horse-related kid's book that existed
Heidi and the sequels
And I remember reading a book about Helen Keller when I was young that
affected me deeply.

Joanne. 


-- 

Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty
years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the
Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's
not a threat. Now, that's a fact. I'll fuckin' kill you. Chuckie (Ben
Affleck) Good Will Hunting





From joannec at hwy.com.au  Sat Jun 16 15:21:31 2001
From: joannec at hwy.com.au (Joanne Collins)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 01:21:31 +1000
Subject: Celebrity worship annoying? (was: Re: Colin/Dennis Crevey)
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010617012131.007edbe0@mail.hwy.com.au>

This post was on the main list, but I think my reactions are more
appropriate to this list. I hope this is the right thing to do.

>*grins* Yeah, I find anyone who worships celebrities and such annoying and
>brainless. Colin annoys me because he idolizes Harry, and everyone knows my
>position on the fame of Harry Potter. Go Snape! *EG* 

I know that the 'teenybopper' phase is annoying, but how many of us can
honestly say that we don't have a crush on one (or more *g*) celebrities
because we find them attractive and interesting and enjoy a movie with them
in it or the music they make? And that's one of the reasons I like Colin.
He's a fan, like us :). It's also why I liked Arthur in Velvet Goldmine.
Well, that and the fact that he's played by Christian Bale, who is one of
the celebrities who I find interesting, etc.

Joanne.

-- 

Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty
years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the
Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's
not a threat. Now, that's a fact. I'll fuckin' kill you. Chuckie (Ben
Affleck) Good Will Hunting





From joannec at hwy.com.au  Sat Jun 16 15:48:50 2001
From: joannec at hwy.com.au (Joanne Collins)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 01:48:50 +1000
Subject: No! Film and merchandise stuff
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010617014850.007edbe0@mail.hwy.com.au>

saying
>that Celine Dion had recorded a song for the film, written by the duo
>responsible for My Heart Will Go On. I feel I may have to go off and kill
>myself. I can imagine little worse than a song similar to the Titanic theme
>playing out as the film ends.

Oh, dear lord, no!

I'm a Celine Dion fan, but if it's *anything* like *that* *song*...*Joanne
shudders*. That song that did at least three (the only ones I know for
sure) better songs out of a Best Song Oscar. That song that I have to skip
over on the CD it's on. That song that doesn't tell a story, just tells
emotions.

The one minor bright spot...just because the song *title* is The Boy Who
Lived doesn't necessarily mean that that line will be a huge part of it.
It's rare, but sometimes a song will have the title in the first line or so
and it won't come up again later, with the chorus being different. The only
example I can think of offhand is the Bananarama song Shy Boy, (apologies
for the 80s pop ref, but it's the one that came to mind) where the title is
in the first line, but doesn't appear later in the song.

But I don't think that duo could be subtle enough.

Joanne, thanking The Powers That Be that Faith Hill did the song for Pearl
Harbor. I mean, I'd rather have her or Trisha Yearwood do the song for
Harry Potter.

--

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/diversefic

http://www.livejournal.com/users/joanne_c

"You know you're famous when people start saying you're gay." Hunt Block.
"I gotta go see about a girl," Good Will Hunting
Jen's stalker
Official Commodus Concubine #1
Hagen's mistress
Founder of the Coalition For A Towel-Free Buck (CFTFB)
Founder of the Coalition For A Shirt-Free Chris (CFSFC)
Official Ray Vecchio Buttermilk Purveyor
Spike's Personal Happy Meal #6
Official LitD Brendan Slut #4
Half of the Dazed & Confused Duo with Margret
Jordan's godmother.




From Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com  Sat Jun 16 16:42:18 2001
From: Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com (Aberforth's Goat)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 18:42:18 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] I love you gifts(This is a long post)
References: <9ge40o+iii1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <004801c0f683$4e9aa440$c871023e@shasta>

God Jamieson!

Just reading that hurt like hell. I'm rail thin, hetero and a baptist
pastor, but ... no matter what you are, love can be a wrecking ball some
times. Don't have any good advice, but I will pray for you. According to my
world view, God thinks you're great. (And I happen to like your posts ...
;-)

Baaaaaa!

Aberforth's Goat (a.k.a. Mike Gray)
_______________________

"My own brother, Aberforth, was prosecuted for practising
inappropriate charms on a goat. It was all over the papers,
but did Aberforth hide? No he did not! He held his head high."




From foxmoth at qnet.com  Sat Jun 16 18:18:11 2001
From: foxmoth at qnet.com (foxmoth at qnet.com)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 18:18:11 -0000
Subject: I love you gifts(This is a long post)
In-Reply-To: <9ge40o+iii1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gg7t3+uhhq@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve" <
crowswolf at s...> wrote:
	Ohh, Jamieson, I wanted to cry just reading that...please accept a 
schnoogle from a listie who loves your posts...sometimes love makes no 
sense at all.
Pippin





From editor at texas.net  Sat Jun 16 18:37:42 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:37:42 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??
References: <9gbg3h+rscg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B2BA775.8F5043B0@texas.net>

Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve wrote:

> So that means I'm an Irish peasent with Goddesslike powers passing
> through a new village? Why can't I be named something that means: sex
> god, will rock your world? Sigh...

Because "Alan Rickman" and "James Mason" are taken, dear.

--Amanda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From editor at texas.net  Sat Jun 16 18:41:51 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 13:41:51 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??
References: <20010615011046.79803.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3B2BA86F.40DC839C@texas.net>

Wanda Mallett wrote:

> Look up mine in that special book of yours, please?
> I know Wanda means to wander or to roam.

Wanda's Polish in extraction, I'll try to find the site, but a princess
Wanda is a Polish heroine of the way-pre-written-history times who flung
herself into a river rather than marry a German. Looks like you've been
reading modern "baby name books" with dubious research behind them.

--Amanda, part-German who married a Pole quite happily


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu  Sat Jun 16 19:16:37 2001
From: jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu (Jen)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:16:37 -0000
Subject: Celebrity worship annoying? (was: Re: Colin/Dennis Crevey)
In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20010617012131.007edbe0@mail.hwy.com.au>
Message-ID: <9ggbal+rvvj@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Joanne Collins <joannec at h...> wrote:
> 
> I know that the 'teenybopper' phase is annoying, but how many of us 
can
> honestly say that we don't have a crush on one (or more *g*) 
celebrities
> because we find them attractive and interesting and enjoy a movie 
with them
> in it or the music they make? 

Not me, certainly! *g*  I have (had) crushes on lots of celebrities 
(and fictional characters).  (Current faves?  Jill Hennessy (Claire, 
from Law&Order), Sarah Michelle Gellar, Angelina Jolie (going to see 
*Tomb Raider* today! *g*), just to name a few.)  And there's nothing 
wrong with that.  It's perfectly healthy, a good outlet for fantasy.  
It's fun...  

Problems, yes, can occur, when it goes 'too far' -- stalking, or 
inability to form a real life relationship ('cause nothing compares 
to the crush) -- but celebrities aren't the only ones to inspire that 
sort of pathological devotion.

So since I have my own obsessions, I generally tend not to be annoyed 
by others', even when I don't quite 'get' them.  I am more patient 
about it now, though, than when I was a teenager -- for a lot of 
reasons, I found the whole celebrity crush thing my friends were into 
very, *very* annoying.  But now, even the teenybopper kind doesn't 
really bug me anymore.  Harmless, good for learning how to develop 
proper romantic feelings...

> And that's one of the reasons I like Colin.
> He's a fan, like us :). It's also why I liked Arthur in Velvet 
Goldmine.  
> Well, that and the fact that he's played by Christian Bale, who is 
one of
> the celebrities who I find interesting, etc.

Arthur? *shakes head*  He's so... boring!  Every time he was on 
screen, it was less Curt/Brian time.  And more Curt/Brian can only be 
a Good Thing. :)  Disclaimer: I also don't get the Christian Bale 
thing, so that's probly part of my lack of Arthur interest. *g*  JRM, 
however...  He's one of those boys who's prettier than I am... :)

And I like Colin, too.  He's sweet, floofy bunny cute, harmless...  I 
think his crush on Harry is adorable. 

--jen :)

"Will you be the one I've wanted, will you read my mind?
Will you ask me where I hurt, and heal me with your eyes?"
                        --melissa ferrick

jen's fics: http://www.eden.rutgers.edu/~jfaulkne/
jen's LJ: http://www.livejournal.com/users/lysimache/




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Sat Jun 16 19:44:14 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:44:14 -0400
Subject: Penny Dredfule-Yahoo Group
Message-ID: <3B2BB70E.A29BE493@sympatico.ca>

Hello Everyone!!!

Just wanted to remind everyone about my group that I created...

Hugs and Happy Vibes,
Jamieson

Welcome to the Penny_Dredfule group at Yahoo! Groups, a
free, easy-to-use email group service. Please
take a moment to review this message.

This group features the fanfic "Penny Dredfule-The Muggle
Wizard". It is a group for those who want to promote their
"slash" fiction, or fiction that has GLBT, homosexual or lesbian
story lines and content.

Anyone who wants to join can do so!!
And anyone who wants to post a fic is welcome to do so as
well! This is a group that takes pride in their work, and
encourages everyone to keep writing....otherwise, how can we
all feed our obsessions?

To learn more about the Penny_Dredfule group, please visit
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Penny_Dredfule

To start sending messages to members of this group, simply
send email to
Penny_Dredfule at yahoogroups.com

If you do not wish to belong to Penny_Dredfule, you may
unsubscribe by sending an email to
Penny_Dredfule-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

To see and modify all of your groups, go to
http://groups.yahoo.com/mygroups


Regards,

Jamieson
Moderator, Penny_Dredfule



--
"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams





From mecks at prodigy.net  Sat Jun 16 20:59:04 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:59:04 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Celebrity worship annoying? (was: Re: Colin/Dennis Crevey)
References: <9ggbal+rvvj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <023501c0f6a7$2e5d1f40$2cb8fea9@hale>


----- Original Message -----
From: Jen <jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2001 2:16 PM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Celebrity worship annoying? (was: Re:
Colin/Dennis Crevey)


> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Joanne Collins <joannec at h...> wrote:
> >
> > I know that the 'teenybopper' phase is annoying, but how many of us
> can
> > honestly say that we don't have a crush on one (or more *g*)
> celebrities
> > because we find them attractive and interesting and enjoy a movie
> with them
> > in it or the music they make?
>
> Problems, yes, can occur, when it goes 'too far' -- stalking, or
> inability to form a real life relationship ('cause nothing compares
> to the crush) -- but celebrities aren't the only ones to inspire that
> sort of pathological devotion.

This reminds me....  About a year ago, I went to New York with one of my
best friends to meet my long time net friend.  We went to see "The View"
because we're all fans of that show.  (Technically, I'm a huge fan of
Meridith Viera and the rest strike me as annoying, inspid, etc.)  Right
where the View is filmed, one of the soap opera produced by ABC is filmed.
The soap stars came out and had their pictures taken with fans and talked to
fans.  We walked a block away and we saw a woman who looked about 30 fanning
her face, looking giggly on the phone with some one.  Her teenage daughter
(I assume to the person was her daughter) was near by and looking equally
stunned.  The woman was going on and on and on about how she met this soap
star and touched him and how exciting it was, etc.

Later that day, my friends and I went to Times Square and we saw the lovely
building where "TRL" is filmed with its masses and masses of people...  And
each indivudally looked a lot like that 30 year old woman....

Which leads me to the conclusion that this really isn't a teeny bopper
obsession thing :o)  It's an all around person thing... that every one does
and adults, because they have money and greater access to certain places,
can be just as bad or worse.  (There is a story about adult women bidding to
get Robert Duncan McNeil ,who played Tom Paris on Voyager, to take his shirt
off at a convention...  but I won't go into details.)

For my own self, I have a healthy obsession with Pierce Brosnan...  I drove
5 hours to Canada to see "Grey Owl" and in 1999, I maintained a web page
with information on him...  I've a nice little fantasy about doing him...
but that's as far as my obsession will go because I wouldn't want to meet
him because no one really matches up to their fantasy image...  (Nor, should
they really...)

Michela Ecks




From heidit at netbox.com  Sun Jun 17 01:30:54 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (heidit at netbox.com)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 01:30:54 -0000
Subject: Article About Apostrophes
Message-ID: <9gh18e+aqu9@eGroups.com>

Since I know so many of us here are somewhat FANATICAL about grammar 
and punctuation, I thought those members of Nitpicker's Anonymous 
(Yes, that *was* deliberate) might enjoy the article at the New York 
Times' site - 
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/06/16/world/16ENGL.html?searchpv=nytToday 
(registration is *free*).
As the article begins 
They jump out everywhere at John Richards, silent
              testaments to the declining standards of our
              time.

              Just four blocks from his house, for instance,
              is the Print Xpress copy shop, with its sign
              offering to print "menu's."

              That's just the beginning, Mr. Richards said
              recently, his Brezh nevian eyebrows beetling
              indignantly as he conducted an annotated tour
              of the neighborhood, on the outskirts of this
              busy Lincolnshire town. There was Sweeney
              Todd, "the modern mans barber shop." There
              was a store featuring "ladies fashions" and a
              pub whose weekly current events board was titled, 
shockingly, "whats on."

              "It's irritated me for years and years," Mr. Richards, 
75, a retired copy editor and  reporter for various local newspapers, 
said of public apostrophe misuse ? the rampant absence of apostrophes 
that are needed, the presence of those that are not.




From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Sun Jun 17 02:28:06 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 02:28:06 -0000
Subject: Looks in General (was Re: Changing your looks)
In-Reply-To: <20010616143555.7113.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gh4jm+qtif@eGroups.com>

Angela wrote:
"I can very much relate to this. I started going grey
at 21, not unusual in my mother's family. She started
getting grey hair at 18, her sister at 16. At first it
was a novelty, then something to blame my daughter
for. At 30, however, it got boring - grey and brown."

--I don't find this hard to believe as I'm seventeen and already 
greying! It's not very noticable yet though.:-) My father and 
(paternal) grandmother both had grey/white hair early in life; so did 
my (maternal) great-grandmother so I'm not that suprised. Anyway...

Hermione's change for the Yule ball didn't bother me, but I don't see 
her as unattractive to begin with (to tell the truth I'm quite taken 
with her. She needs to be a year or two older but...). 

I may be a teenage boy and we aren't the group most known for keeping 
up our looks, but I'd like to pride myself that I do. I'm also not 
the most handsome person, but that doesn't mean that I don't want to 
look nice, and I'd be lying if I said I don't enjoy other people's 
compliments.

The most important thing is to be happy and comfortable about one's 
own appearance. I find that if I'm satisfied it doesn't matter 
whether I get compliments or not, and that's much more important.

Scott





From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Sun Jun 17 02:55:50 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony AKA AngieJ)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 02:55:50 -0000
Subject: Celebrity worship annoying? (was: Re: Colin/Dennis Crevey)
In-Reply-To: <023501c0f6a7$2e5d1f40$2cb8fea9@hale>
Message-ID: <9gh67n+qla5@eGroups.com>

Jen and Michela's posts on this were very cool!  

Colin in canon annoys me.  Celeb worship bothers me because it's 
dangerous to put mere human beings up on pedestals... too often they 
end up unwittingly desecrating their own temples.  Within my own 
religion, I get annoyed when people say their faith has been shaken 
by some uberpastor or another who was caught doing something naughty--
now I do believe that ministers ought to walk worthy of their calling 
(as all Christians should) but I personally think the faith-shaking 
is largely the fault of the folks shaken for deifying a fallible 
human being.  (Even the angel who John attempted to worship in 
Revelation stopped him from doing so.) 

For similiar reasons, the media hype over the Clinton/Lewinsky 
scandals made my teeth hurt just as much.  I'm so tired of the public 
demanding of their dignitaries and entertainers what they often do 
not do themselves.  We scream about the specks in the eyes of those 
in the public view and are quite content with the boards in our own.

I don't think celebs are any more degenerate than the rest of the 
population.  They're not a special class of people.  They're just 
people whose talents and/or fortune thrust them into the spotlight.  
Why should we demand they be role models for children?  The question 
we ought to ask is why aren't *we* role models for them?

People put on pedestals more often than not fall off.  Gravity, 
baby.  Didn't you see the first *Survivor*, where the final 
contestants actually had to *stand* on one of those things?  It's 
extremely uncomfortable for living flesh and blood to be a picture-
perfect statue, and yet this is what we demand that our notables be.  
And then when they fall down, we become like spectators of the games 
in old Rome, demanding their blood... when all they did was succumb 
to the laws of physics... or of human nature.  Whichever you prefer.

I don't think I've ever gone through a true celeb-worship phase, but 
in high school my closest girl friends *all* had HUGE celeb crushes 
that were serious.  One friend was in love with rapper Kid from Kid 
N' Play (the light-skinned one with the high-topped fade that made 
his head look like a pencil eraser), another was in love with Deion 
Sanders, and the third was sweet on Rick Fox back when he played for 
the Boston Celtics (he's now an L.A. Laker and married to 
singer/actress Vanessa Williams).

During our teen years, I was dragged to concerts and basketball 
games, involved in schemes to get us backstage with or without 
passes, etc.  We succeeded in meeting each of the above famous guys 
and quite a few others. 

I say "dragged" because I never crushed easily, and almost never on 
folks I didn't know.  My crushes always were on guys I knew and who 
knew me.  Even when I've met famous people, I haven't been all that 
impressed.  This is because my parents demystified celebrities and 
dignitaries quite unceremoniously... whenever we exclaimed over a 
movie star or singer or even President Reagan, we were told "he/she 
goes to the bathroom, sleeps, eats, drinks, picks his nose, and farts 
just like anyone else breathing--and after their 15 minutes, they'll 
be just like anybody else again".  

We were never allowed to think that celebs were like the peri of 
Persian myth, perfect creatures who subsist on the scent from 
perfumed flowers and thus never need to eat, drink, or excrete.  I 
used to *hate* when Mama or Daddy would say this, but after a while I 
believed it.  So when I finally got the chance to meet some of these 
folks, I guess I felt a little let down because I was usually less 
than thrilled.  *Where* was the magic?  After all, these people 
*were* called stars, right?

As a teacher, I've had a few local and national celebrities' kids in 
my classes.  Most of these kids are NOT qualified for a TAG program--
their parents are just too cheap to pay for private school and use 
their connections to wiggle their children in and deny spots to other 
poor and truly bright kids whose parents don't know the entire school 
board or the mayor.  These "star kids" are as a rule badly behaved 
and poor students... they could all use a dose of Hillaire 
Belloc's "Cautionary Tales", and then a lot of love, because often 
their parents don't spend a lot of time with them.  It's so sad.

Now that I think about it, in all of my fiction writing there's a 
critique of fame and the famous hidden somewhere.

But even I'm not immune to getting weak in the knees over certain 
ones... there is always some famous guy who I sigh a little over 
before shaking my head and telling myself to get real.  Right now 
it's Boris Kodjoe, an actor-model of African-German heritage.  He's 
cameoed in several movies, and just landed a permanent gig in the 
spinoff series for my absolute favorite grown-up movie of the 
1990s, "Soul Food" on the Showtime cable network.  He is simply 
*gorgeous*... from what I've seen of him in interviews and on his 
self-maintained website, it's not just skin deep either.  

Now, *he* doesn't eat, sleep, or excrete.  Impossible.  ;-)

--Ebony AKA AngieJ




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Sun Jun 17 04:25:36 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 00:25:36 -0400
Subject: HP Awards...
References: <9gh1mi+bie3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B2C313F.CBC25CC8@sympatico.ca>


Hello Everybody!!!

Well, as some of you may or may not know, the Harry Potter Fanfiction
Awards are now on. Nominations have begun!! And I'm one of the judges!!

We are now reading nominated fics, so here comes your part!

Anyone can nominate a fic, as long as the author is given their due
credit!

This is done through email, and only one fic per email.You can include
all the chapters in one email.

In the subject line, indicate the catagor/ies which the story falls
under like this:

HP- and the catagory

Best Comedy/Parody    C/P

Best Thriller         TH

Best Dramatic/ Angst  D/A

Best Romance        R

Best songfic/videofic    S/V

Best crossover     X

Best Series            SE

Best One Shot        OS

Best Poem            P

So that the subject line would look like this: HP-P, etc, etc.

Please note that these are the only codes that will be accepted.

In the text portion of the email, please put the following:

Name of author:
Email address of author: (for contact purposes only)
Title:
Warnings: (if there is adult content in the story.)
Brief Summary: (1-3 sentences will do!)
URL Attachments: (the fic! <g>)


For attachments only, only .doc and .txt are accepted.

Send to: hpawards at yahoogroups.com

(sorry for all the complication. It's only for organizational
purposes!!!)


That's all she wrote!!!! Hugs to all, and get nominating!!!

Jamieson




From yael_pou at hotmail.com  Sun Jun 17 08:34:01 2001
From: yael_pou at hotmail.com (yael oren)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 10:34:01 +0200
Subject: Attachments (Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] HP Awards...)
References: <9gh1mi+bie3@eGroups.com> <3B2C313F.CBC25CC8@sympatico.ca>
Message-ID: <OE6AmEaJswFCHOzyfyz00001da8@hotmail.com>

  For attachments only, only .doc and .txt are accepted.

Jamieson, dear, you've got the right idea, not accepting any .exe attachments or such, but Word macro virus can travel on '.doc' files. I wouldn't take those either. '.txt', as far as I know, is perfectly safe.

Thanks, yael


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Sun Jun 17 07:50:57 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 08:50:57 +0100
Subject: Homosexuality (from the main list)
References: <3B2C0B83.521D9011@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <00ad01c0f702$537efb80$6a3570c2@c5s910j>

I wrote:

<<It will always be an issue until people stop assuming heterosexuality as a
default.>>

Rita noted:

<Umm, Neil, I want there to be gay characters in HP for the sake of realism
and political correctness and more possible ships, but the famous Kinsey
statistic that 10% of people are pretty much homosexual and 90% of people
are pretty much heterosexual implies that assuming any newly met person is
heterosexual will be right 9 out of 10 times -- a probability rate high
enough that it will probably stay the default assumption. A higher
probability rate than the assumption that any undescribed person mentioned
in a fiction or a news article is white, which was discussed recently on
OT.>

Since it is the default case, you're right to say that heterosexuality will
probably stay the default assumption, and that is why - coupled with shades
of prejudice - homosexuality will probably always be an issue.  My point was
to question that assumption, the one that decides "everyone is heterosexual
unless they tell me otherwise".  Apart from lesbians and gay men, some
people define themselves as bisexual; some have homosexual experiences, but
still define themselves as straight; and some prefer not to have their
sexual orientation labelled in conclusive terms.  That's quite a spectrum...

Neil
________________________________________

Flying Ford Anglia

"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
squashed, as though it had run headlong into a brick wall"
["The Leaky Cauldron", PoA]

Check out Very Frequently Asked Questions for everything
to do with this club:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/VFAQ.htm






From yael_pou at hotmail.com  Sun Jun 17 09:12:33 2001
From: yael_pou at hotmail.com (yael oren)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 11:12:33 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality (from the main list)
References: <3B2C0B83.521D9011@wicca.net> <00ad01c0f702$537efb80$6a3570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <OE61bCdUg07MJJQ873T0000167d@hotmail.com>

  Neil: "[SNIP]  Apart from lesbians and gay men, some
  people define themselves as bisexual; some have homosexual experiences, but
  still define themselves as straight; and some prefer not to have their
  sexual orientation labelled in conclusive terms.  That's quite a spectrum..."

Back in the dark days when every non-straight person was released from army service, I knew a guy who was kicked out for being multi-sexual.

Thanks, yael


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From mecks at prodigy.net  Sun Jun 17 10:54:22 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 05:54:22 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality (from the main list)
References: <3B2C0B83.521D9011@wicca.net> <00ad01c0f702$537efb80$6a3570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <004b01c0f71b$df55e560$2cb8fea9@hale>

Parts of this swing back to HP and on topicness though not sure how
appropiate it is for the main list.  Give me a nudge and I'll x-post it
there.

----- Original Message -----
From: Neil Ward <neilward at dircon.co.uk>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2001 2:50 AM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality (from the main list)


> I wrote:
>
> <<It will always be an issue until people stop assuming heterosexuality as
a
> default.>>

Huh.  Real life experince has been teaching me lately that the default
assumption has become homosexuality as the default, especially when it's two
young males or two young females out together in public or when it's a guy
with some femine characteristics.

Examples...  My best friend was walking out of Tattered Covers in Denver one
day with one of her friends.  Two women outside looked at them and commented
on how many gay teenager girls there were these days and how they were
everywhere.  My friend wasn't holding hands with her friend, they weren't
engaged in any sort of activity that I could broadly define as relating to
homosexuality other than both of them being female... yet the default
assumption was that they were lesbians.  (Neither of them are.)

Another example...  I'm a college student and live at home.  Both my parents
live at home with me as does my brother and my 19 year old sister.  My mom,
my dad and my brother watch HGTV because they generally enjoy it.  The
default assumption is that most males on HGTV who are interior decoraters
are gay... and they like to point that out.  With my dad and brother, it's
generally something derogatory like "That one's a fag." which generally
pisses me off.  If I say anything, the default assumption for my brother and
sister is that because I'm defefending them, I'm gay.

Another example...  I was a huge fan of survivor.  I hung out on several
message boards and chatted on and off-line with a bunch of people about
Survivor.  After it was found out that Richard Hatch was gay, fans watched
the second one with any eye out wondering who CBS picked as the honorary gay
person.   If 10% of the population was gay and CBS made an effort to pick
one gay person, it's strange that by the time most of the speculation was
done, that 1/4 of to 1/2 of the cast was suspected of being gay by the
fans...  I've heard rumors of and accusations of gayness for Kimmie, Alicia,
Jeff, Colby, Mike, Mitchell, Jeri, Amber...  It gets to the point where I
just want to take those people and slap them across the head and ask those
fans why the hell they care.  (This would tie back nicely to Ebony's post on
celebrity worship.)

Another example... Rumors start that some one in Hollywood that some leading
male actor is gay.  Half to three quarters of Hollywood men are than assumed
to be gay... even when they only indicate one person is gay.

My experinces have been, of late, that the default assumption has been that
people are gay.

> Rita noted:
>
> <Umm, Neil, I want there to be gay characters in HP for the sake of
realism
> and political correctness and more possible ships, but the famous Kinsey
> statistic that 10% of people are pretty much homosexual and 90% of people
> are pretty much heterosexual implies that assuming any newly met person is
> heterosexual will be right 9 out of 10 times -- a probability rate high
> enough that it will probably stay the default assumption. A higher
> probability rate than the assumption that any undescribed person mentioned
> in a fiction or a news article is white, which was discussed recently on
> OT.>

Hmmm...  Okay, I don't agree with that one in ten number for several
reasons... The first being that I'm in college and that sort of thing people
can be pretty open with and the numbers proportionally I would assume to be
much higher than the norm.  Even if given that number as true, I don't think
that those ten people left are all going to be openly gay because they have
reasons to be in the closet...

But, let's get back to challenging that...

The Kinsey number was based on a study done circo 1943 if I recall
correctly.  The information I assume is some what dated especially as our
knowledge of sexuality gets redefined to include bisexuality and homosexual
experinces outside homosexuality, possible genetic causes for being gay,
etc.

The Washington Post ran an article on March 31, 1993.  It says in an extract
that:

[quote]
"the one-in-ten figure is routinely cited in academic works, sex education
materials, government reports and the media.... But there long has been much
evidence that the 10% estimate is far too high. Surveys with large samples
from the U.S., Canada, Britain, France, Norway, Denmark and other nations
give a picture of homosexuality experience rates of 6% or less, with an
exclusive homosexuality prevalence of 1% or less.

"The most comprehensive example is the continuing survey conducted by the
U.S. Census Bureau since 1988 for the National Center for Health Statistics
of the Centers for Disease Control.... the data strongly suggest that the
prevalence of even incidental homosexual behavior is less than 2% for
men.... a general population estimate for homosexuality would fall below
1.5%...."
[/quote]

This article cites a study that was done in 1989 by National Opinion
Research Center at the University of Chicago.  With a nationwide sample of
1,537 individuals, the study found that of sexually active adults 19 and
older, 1.2% of females and 1.2% of males had homosexual relations in the
previous year.  0.5% to 0.7% percent of the sample claimed to have had
exclusively homosexual partners.

The article also quotes a study done out of Canada.  It says  that5,514
first-year college students under age 25 were part of nationwide cluster
random sample. This revealed 98% were heterosexual, 1% bisexual, 1%
homosexual.

There are several other examples I could pull out but that given, I think
the 10% number is seriously flawed and the real answer is probably no more
then 2 or 3% of the population is homosexual.

That said, I don't see the need for a gay character for several reasons....
Numbers and realism having little to nothing to do with it.  Assuming for
the moment that most people's experinces and encounters with people who are
homosexual occur in an academic environment or on the net, than yes, maybe
it could be mentioned but only to serve the story.  Would Harry Potter, in
the story as read, be served by the introduction of a gay character or could
te inclusion of such a character actually distract from other plot
intracisies and issues being dealt with already such as race and violence?
I think the inclusion of such a character, especially for the general mass
audience of Harry Potter, may be very distracting and may dictate the story
away from where it was intended to go.  (That is unless JK has it in mind.
All indications I've seen about Harry Potter growing up and developing
romantic feelings... not once have I heard it rumored that the relationship
is with another male.)

I don't see the inclusion of such a character adding realism to the
story.... because in reality, how "real" is magic?  How believable is magic?
Realism stops at the door and reality becomes a suspension of disbelief.
Does JK write the story well enough, has she mastered her character well
enough so that we can suspend our disbelief in magic and a whole realm of
other things that aren't real?  I think so.  Thus, things like gay
characters, while adding potential "realness" aren't needed to create a more
"real" situation.

> Apart from lesbians and gay men, some
> people define themselves as bisexual; some have homosexual experiences,
but
> still define themselves as straight; and some prefer not to have their
> sexual orientation labelled in conclusive terms.  That's quite a
spectrum...

Oh very much so...  I define myself as bi-sexual because I'm attracted to
women.  If the opportunity arose with the right person, I wouldn't mind
having a romantic relationship with another female.  Several women appear on
my list of people I drool for.  My experinces though have all been
heterosexual... and I'm very much attracted to men. I use the bi-sexual
label because it's hard to define exactly what that is to me... and in real
life situations, it isn't something you always want to share.  There are
slights whether people are concious of them or not.  I told my suitemates
last fall that I was attracted to women and the bathroom door in our suite
was always locked... even though there was a stall door to the shower and
toilet because as one of them told me, they were afraid I'd check them out.
Go figure.

Michela Ecks




From mrs_snape at yahoo.de  Sun Jun 17 11:00:24 2001
From: mrs_snape at yahoo.de (Mrs Snape (Dinah))
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 13:00:24 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality (from the main list)
References: <3B2C0B83.521D9011@wicca.net> <00ad01c0f702$537efb80$6a3570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <017901c0f71d$3b2274c0$072c07d5@oemcomputer>

Slow as always, but something occured to me while watching telly...

Neil wrote:
<<It will always be an issue until people stop assuming heterosexuality as a
default.>>

Most recent example: They have a new, very summery advert from an ice-cream
company here. It shows a beautiful beach and a huge Sailing Ship that is
decorated with pink small windmills and yellow shalws that fly in the wind.
On the ship a party is going on and it's the most ecclectic crowd I've ever
seen on TV. One guy, tattoed from head to toe, with a baby in his arms, the
typical beach shots with people snuggling in hammocks and so on. When they
first showed it, there was also one scene that showed a man and a woman from
the back, chasing over the beach sans clothes (their white butts in stark
contrast to their tan <g>) and a scene with two women kissing. I saw that
version about three times.

Then the nakedness and the kissing was cut out and replaced with more
"harmless" shots. Obviously it didn't do for the imagie of an ice-cream
company whose main clients are the kids begging their parents for sweets.
Still I think it's rather sad because I thought showing such a versatile
groups of people having fun together without having to worry about making a
political statement with it was a great idea...

And with all the nakedness going on on TV (sex sells, after all), those two
butts weren't really a novelty <g>

Dinah


_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com  Sun Jun 17 12:29:23 2001
From: corn_patch_witch at yahoo.com (Doreen Rich)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 12:29:23 -0000
Subject: I love you gifts(This is a long post)
In-Reply-To: <9ge40o+iii1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gi7r3+agso@eGroups.com>

Oh ... Jamieson ... you just described a day in my marriage from 
hell! *shudder*

My ex was like Mitch. The only word I can think of to describe them 
both is, "CRUEL"

I spent seven years, like you, "buying him lots of 'I love you gifts' 
and always waiting for a drop of thoughtfulness from him. 

Like you, I was insulted, degraded, humiliated, and hurt. I was also 
in a constant state of confusion and depression.

Now I am divorced and much happier. If you do decide that you are 
overweight ... and you do lose the weight just to please him ... then 
he will just find a new "fault" to control you with. What was it 
before this, dear?

My heart goes out to you. Go buy yourself an "I love you" gift. Cuz 
you are a beautiful person and you deserve it. Shame on Mitch for 
hurting you. 

Doreen, who spent most of this letter backspacing out nasty comments




From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Sun Jun 17 13:10:55 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 14:10:55 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality (from the main list)
References: <3B2C0B83.521D9011@wicca.net> <00ad01c0f702$537efb80$6a3570c2@c5s910j> <004b01c0f71b$df55e560$2cb8fea9@hale>
Message-ID: <002101c0f72f$09a36280$293670c2@c5s910j>

I wrote:

<<It will always be an issue until people stop assuming heterosexuality as a
default.>>

Michela commented:
<<<
Huh.  Real life experince has been teaching me lately that the default
assumption has become homosexuality as the default, especially when it's two
young males or two young females out together in public or when it's a guy
with some femine characteristics.  Examples...
- My best friend was walking out of Tattered Covers in Denver one day with
one of her friends.  <snip>
- The default assumption is that most males on HGTV who are interior
decoraters are gay...<snip>
- 1/4 of to 1/2 of the [Survivor] cast was suspected of being gay by the
fans... <snip>
- Rumors start that some one in Hollywood that some leading male actor is
gay.<snip>
>>>

I do take your point, Michela.  However, the difference in the above
examples is context, which provides more information (even if the
conclusions are in error).  In the first example, two girls are seen
together walking out of a bookshop; in the second, men are seen in a
profession that appears to attract gay men; in the third and fourth, we see
the celebrity gossip machine in motion.  Incredibly slight evidence, you
might say, but providing a different context nonetheless.

I wasn't saying that everyone has the default assumption that people are
heterosexual, but indicating that this assumption by many is part of the
reason homosexuality remains an issue.  Of course people take cues from the
context of a situation, and that context can affect a 'default' assumption.
If I were in  gay club, for example, I wouldn't assume that most of the men
and women around me were straight; I'd assume the opposite.  That's the
nature of a default: it is assumed in the absence of any information that
tells you otherwise.

****
Michela also presented some evidence that challenged the Kinsey figures:

<<<
<snipped cited details>  There are several other examples I could pull out
but that given, I think the 10% number is seriously flawed and the real
answer is probably no more then 2 or 3% of the population is homosexual.
>>>

I agree that Kinsey appears to have overestimated, as that fits with later
research I've seen.  I think the figure is perhaps closer to 4% for men and
2% for women.  Speaking from personal experience and things I've read
(dangerously vague citations, I know), women seem to regard sexual
orientation much more loosely and more openly than men, and are perhaps more
inclined to define themselves as bisexual or bicurious than lesbian.  I know
quite a few lesbians who were married to men before settling on a lesbian
'identity', but I can't recall many men who've done the equivalent (again,
this could be the tendency of men to be more closed about their sexual
identity).  I know one man who told the nation he was gay in the 70s and who
now has a wife and two kids... his views on sexual orientation issues, not
to mention the tabloid press, are very interesting... but I digress.

In London, I've heard, and it seems to me to be the case, that the
lesbian/gay population is larger than elsewhere, as gay people naturally
flock to big cities with a cosmpolitan mix of people.  I've lost count of
the number of gay people of other nationalities I've met in London; they
seem to come here because they can lead a much less restrictive life than
they can in their own country, if only by putting some distance between them
and their parents.

I won't comment further on the likelihood of LGBT characters in HP, other
than to agree with the point that JKR seems to be addressing prejudice by
analogy, and to repeat my assertion that she is not obliged to write
anything she didn't intend to write, not matter how cool it might be.

Neil (who will shut up about this now...)
________________________________________

Flying Ford Anglia

"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
squashed, as though it had run headlong into a brick wall"
["The Leaky Cauldron", PoA]

Check out Very Frequently Asked Questions for everything
to do with this club:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/VFAQ.htm





From catlady at wicca.net  Sun Jun 17 13:18:22 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 06:18:22 -0700
Subject: Homosexuality
Message-ID: <3B2CAE1E.A4533374@wicca.net>

On the main list:

find_sam wrote:

> From my own understanding and observations, very few
> homosexuals come out in highschool.

When I said 'a gay character', I didn't necessarily mean that one of the
students goes through agonies of worry about hisir sexual orientation.
There ARE grown-ups... I once suggested the possibility that Alastor
Moody's paranoia became so extreme after his beloved was killed by a
curse meant for him (perhaps the one that took off his leg) and he
blamed it on himself (survivor guilt) for not being careful enough, and
one of adults who knew him in those days could just mention "he was much
more relaxed before Satyrius was killed" (some clearly male name) and a
kid could say "Who was Satyrius?"

> It'd be like her dropping in references to the Bible
> simply to please the God Squad

I am the opposite of the God Squad, but I find the complete absence of
any reference to religion in HP a bit jarring. Some of the Brits on the
list say that it seems normal to them, being as how there is less
religion in UK than in US, but I really think that in these
life-and-death situations, SOME people would pray.  I have NEVER been a
Christian, but Christian religious faith, of a vaguely Anglican variety,
keeps creeping into my fanfic, for example, after Cedric's death, his
mother is devoutly praying to God "please teach me to accept your will"
and Molly Weasley is surprised to find herself praying "God, if you
exist, please help me comfort poor Annie Diggory"

> didn't Kinsey actually say something more along the lines
> of '10% of people are definitely hetero, 10% are definitely
> homo, and the other 80% are somewhere in between'?

I 'm not sure either, but I think he did, which is why I said 'pretty
much homosexual' and 'pretty much heterosexual'.

on this list,

Neil wrote:

> Since it is the default case, you're right to say that
> heterosexuality will probably stay the default assumption,
> and that is why - coupled with shades of prejudice -
> homosexuality will probably always be an issue.

I am convinced that if/when the prejudice goes away, it will no longer
be an issue. For example, the vast majority of people in the world, and
in USA, especially Los Angeles, have brown eyes and brown or black hair,
but mentioning that someone is a blue-eyed blonde is not an issue.

> My point was to question that assumption, the one that
> decides "everyone is heterosexual unless they tell me
> otherwise".

I've seen the "How dare you assume I'm heterosexual?" bumper sticker,
and I confess I dislike it. "How dare you assume that Katie Bell is
white?" (when she isn't described at all IIRC) stirs my conscience. "How
dare you assume that Katie Bell is heterosexual?" leads me to answer, in
an annoyed tone of voice, "When I see her wearing a pink triangle
button, I'll change my assumption." If you think that's evidence that
I'm a bigot, tell me so.

> Apart from lesbians and gay men, some people define
> themselves as bisexual; some have homosexual experiences,
> but still define themselves as straight; and some prefer not
> to have their sexual orientation labelled in conclusive terms.
> That's quite a spectrum...

"Quite a spectrum"... See my reply to find_sam just above your name.

Michela Ecks wrote:

> The Kinsey number was based on a study done circo
> 1943 if I recall correctly. (snip) There are several other
> examples I could pull out but that given, I think the 10%
> number is seriously flawed and the real answer is probably
> no more then 2 or 3% of the population is homosexual.

If the assumption that J. Random Person is heterosexual is right 98% of
the time rather than 90% of the time, that makes it all the more likely
to remain the default assumption. If it is the default assumption, which
you argued against.

--
          /\ /\                                          ___  ___
           + +     Mews and views                       ( @ \/ @ )
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston        \ @  @ /
                                                          \ () /
                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._             \  /
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)       \/
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((





From ender_w at msn.com  Sun Jun 17 13:28:10 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 09:28:10 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality (from the main list)
References: <3B2C0B83.521D9011@wicca.net> <00ad01c0f702$537efb80$6a3570c2@c5s910j> <004b01c0f71b$df55e560$2cb8fea9@hale>
Message-ID: <004401c0f731$5b223300$99e7183f@satellite>


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Michela Ecks 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2001 6:54 AM
  Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality (from the main list)


  Parts of this swing back to HP and on topicness though not sure how
  appropiate it is for the main list.  Give me a nudge and I'll x-post it
  there.

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Neil Ward <neilward at dircon.co.uk>
  To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
  Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2001 2:50 AM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality (from the main list)


  > I wrote:
  >
  > <<It will always be an issue until people stop assuming heterosexuality as
  a
  > default.>>

  Huh.  Real life experince has been teaching me lately that the default
  assumption has become homosexuality as the default, especially when it's two
  young males or two young females out together in public or when it's a guy
  with some femine characteristics.

  <snip of some examples>

  I found this to be so in many cases as well, cases in which one person or another was deemed "gay" simply because he or she had not dated anyone of the opposite sex recently (this often happens to celebrities who aren't as open about their lovelives as the public would like).  I haven't seriously dated any ment recently and one of my closest friends made a statement along the lines of "We'll accept any boyfriend you choose...or girlfriend."  And i'm thinking "Where did that come from?"
  I haven't dated any men recently, but i haven't dated any women either, so why was homosexuality assumed in this case?  
  I have a problem with the public's need to impose sexual labels.  It seems that everyone needs to be pigeonholed.  there's no room for the grey areas that Neil alluded to.  As Michela said, rumors fly about celebrities all the time, especially those who do their best to keep their love lives private.  Kevin spacey never mentions his love life so he *must* be gay.  Michael Stipe stated in a magazine article years ago that he is bisexual, but people still talk about his sexuality as if it's a huge, intriguing mystery.  Dave Matthews had dated the same woman for nine years, recently married her and is now expecting twins, and there are still fans posting on the DMB message board asking if Dave is gay.
  I have my own opinions about sexuality that I don't want to get into on this or any other list, but i'll say it loud and proud: I hate labels!  Let people decide for themselves if they want to love someone of the opposite sex or the same sex.  Who are we to place that label on them?
  I hope I didn't offend anyone.  i'm not the best "orator," and what shows up on paper can sometimes be even more confused than what it was in my mind.  If any of this is offensive, please let me know gently and i'll be happy to clear up any misunderstanding.  (gee, that should probably be my sig line.)

  ender
  putting away the soapbox now





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Sun Jun 17 13:33:27 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 09:33:27 -0400
Subject: Attachments (Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] HP Awards...)
References: <9gh1mi+bie3@eGroups.com> <3B2C313F.CBC25CC8@sympatico.ca> <OE6AmEaJswFCHOzyfyz00001da8@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <3B2CB1A7.9BB1597F@sympatico.ca>

Hello jello,


yael oren wrote:

>   For attachments only, only .doc and .txt are accepted.
>
> Jamieson, dear, you've got the right idea, not accepting any .exe
> attachments or such, but Word macro virus can travel on '.doc' files.
> I wouldn't take those either. '.txt', as far as I know, is perfectly
> safe.
>
> Thanks, yael
>

Well, not my idea. It's the person who set it up, (Faye) I'm just the
messanger. I used MS Word attachments, so they seem to work fine. Either
way, as long as we get some neat stories to read!

Hugs
Jamieson

--
"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Sun Jun 17 13:49:50 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 09:49:50 -0400
Subject: I Love You Update
References: <9gi7r3+agso@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B2CB57E.EEC64E8D@sympatico.ca>

Hello

For those of you who have read, and responded, to my eairler post about
I love you gifts, thanx. It means a lot to me that all of you (most whom
I haven't met) are reaching out to me. It warms the heart well to be
surrounded by good people.

Anywho, I took some of your suggestions. I told him that I want I love
you gifts, not as a material pocession thing, but a token of his love.
He said he understood that, but Harry Potter was hardly romantic.

Anyway, we got in a big fight, as I told him that, if it makes me happy,
it's a good gift. I mean the guy got me a picture frame for my birthday,
for crying out loud, but at least it was something. But he told me I
wasn't being logical. Has someone been watching too much Star Trek? I
thik so.

So the end result is that he'd now going to buy me something cus I told
him to. (thanx yael!). I'm sure he's buying whatever it is due to the
fact that he loves me to some degree, but it's mainly cus I told him to
buy something.

But we're at a resturant last night, and I order a coke. He says "You
don't want that." And me, being the repressed person I am, order a water
with lime instead. Then when the candies come at the end of the meal,
there are the two candies you get? and I'm like "yayee! Candy!!"

"You don't need those." he says. I sit there, contemplating what to do.
When it occurs to me. I take the candies, stick them in my pocket, and
throw my glass of water at him. I get up, order a coke to go, and go
home. He came home very VERY apologetic. He he he. He even went out and
bought me a nice bottle of wine. Yay!

So with luck, I will soon have a backbone. And I just wanted to thank
everyone for telling me to buck up. It helped.

Hugs
Jamieson




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Sun Jun 17 14:23:13 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 10:23:13 -0400
Subject: Bonds of Fate Chapter One
Message-ID: <3B2CBD51.FE816622@sympatico.ca>

Hello Everyone!!!

Sorry for the cross post!

Just wanted to tell everyone that the first chapter of Bonds of Fate,
the sequel to Penny Dredfule, has now been uploaded!!!

You can find it on the HPFanFiction group in the files section under
Bonds of Fate.

Or you can find it in the Penny Dredfule Yahoo group under the files
section.

Ooorrr, you can find it on fanfiction.net. You can find it under my
author name (Jamieson) or under the title (Bonds of Fate)

Hugs to one and all,
and lotsa happy vibes!!!

Jamieson

--
"I don't need parents.
All I need is a recording that says, 'Go play outside!"
- Calvin and Hobbes

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been
widely regarded as a bad move. - Douglas Adams





From joannec at hwy.com.au  Sun Jun 17 09:28:22 2001
From: joannec at hwy.com.au (Joanne Collins)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 19:28:22 +1000
Subject: The posts about racial issues got me thinking about this again
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010617192822.007d8380@mail.hwy.com.au>

Though I think it was Ebony's mention of the butler from The Fresh Prince
Of Bel Air that got me rethinking this.

A few months ago, I saw the movie The Legend Of Bagger Vance. Loved the
movie, Matt Damon was as wonderful as he always is, Charlize Theron was
beautiful and Will Smith was wonderful as the title character. I also
learned more about golf than I ever thought I'd find interesting.

Recently I read the book the movie was based on. For once, I didn't care
for the book as much as for the movie, mainly because I really liked the
character Charlize Theron played in the movie and in the book she was a
cipher, and also there were some things in the movie that weren't in the book.

However, as a slash fan, I did happen to notice a few scenes in which the
slash subtext, though very subtle, was also very clear to someone looking
for it (admittedly probably very much in the eye of the beholder, but
that's what subtext *is*).

The same slash subtext was not lacking in the movie, it was non-existent.

And I started to wonder...the book *dealt* with the racial thing. The movie
didn't even *mention* it at all. The setting is the US South after World
War One.

And I can't help wondering, would the removal of even the subtle slash
subtext perhaps be racially motivated? It's particularly clear in the first
meeting with the character of Vance. In the movie he appears out of the
blue, in the book he was a part of Rannulph Junah's life from before the
beginning and that first scene was one of the ones with subtext.

Just a thought that probably has no basis in more than my imagination. But
when we are talking about actors who have made extremely slashy movies in
the past, I have to wonder.

Joanne.

-- 

Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty
years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the
Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's
not a threat. Now, that's a fact. I'll fuckin' kill you. Chuckie (Ben
Affleck) Good Will Hunting





From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Sun Jun 17 14:56:07 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 15:56:07 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality
References: <3B2CAE1E.A4533374@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <003001c0f73e$01ccb5c0$373770c2@c5s910j>

Did I say I'd shut up?  Ooops!  It must be a full moon or something...

Rita said:

<<I've seen the "How dare you assume I'm heterosexual?" bumper sticker, and
I confess I dislike it. "How dare you assume that Katie Bell is white?"
(when she isn't described at all IIRC) stirs my conscience. "How dare you
assume that Katie Bell is heterosexual?" leads me to answer, in an annoyed
tone of voice, "When I see her wearing a pink triangle button, I'll change
my assumption." If you think that's evidence that I'm a bigot, tell me so.>>

Unless it's not clear, I'm not on a "How dare you...?" soapbox about this.
Personally, I wouldn't say "how dare you assume Katie Bell is heterosexual?"
any more than I would conclude that you, Rita, are a bigot.  I would say,
"we don't know very much about Katie Bell, so why should we assume anything
about her," or I might say, "Katie Bell is such a sketchy figure at the
moment she could be black to one person, and a lesbian to another person and
that's just fine".

Rita also said, in response to my point:

<<"Quite a spectrum"... See my reply to find_sam just above your name
[references to 'pretty much' one thing or another].>>

I was expanding on the point that homosexuality alone is not the definition
of non-heterosexuality (which ties into Ender's point about labels).  For
the record, Kinsey reported 37% of males and 13% of females as having
instances of at least one homosexual experience that resulted in orgasm
during their lives, but, obviously, a much smaller number actually defined
themselves as homosexual, as follows:

10% of males were "predominantly homosexual between the ages of 16 and 55"
8% of males were "exclusively homosexual for at least three years between
the ages of 16 and 55"
4% of white males had been "exclusively homosexual after the onset of
adolescence up to the time of their interviews"

2 to 6% of females, aged 20-35, were "more or less exclusively homosexual in
experience/response"
1 to 3% of unmarried females aged 20-35 were "exclusively homosexual in
experience/response"

I guess this is where I picked up my recollection that approx. 4% of men and
2% of women are gay.

***

Ender said:

<<I haven't seriously dated any ment recently and one of my closest friends
made a statement along the lines of "We'll accept any boyfriend you
choose...or girlfriend."  And i'm thinking "Where did that come from?"
  I haven't dated any men recently, but i haven't dated any women either, so
why was homosexuality assumed in this case? >>

They didn't assume homosexuality, they simply allowed for the possibility,
which is refreshing.  I think that's a wonderfully supportive thing for a
friend to say.  If you were gay, wouldn't you feel that you could confide in
that friend and that they would love you just the same?  If you weren't,
would you really feel offended by the fact that your friend allowed for it?
Fear of rejection by friends and family is a really big deal for some gay
people.

Ender also said:

<<Michael Stipe stated in a magazine article years ago that he is bisexual,
but people still talk about his sexuality as if it's a huge, intriguing
mystery.>>

Not any more. He recently announced that he is gay.  He probably got fed up
of all that pointless tittle tattle. Great new album, BTW. <g>

Neil
________________________________________

Flying Ford Anglia

"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
squashed, as though it had run headlong into a brick wall"
["The Leaky Cauldron", PoA]

Check out Very Frequently Asked Questions for everything
to do with this club:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/VFAQ.htm






From ender_w at msn.com  Sun Jun 17 16:25:13 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 12:25:13 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality
References: <3B2CAE1E.A4533374@wicca.net> <003001c0f73e$01ccb5c0$373770c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <002501c0f74a$17264b00$2c690f3f@satellite>


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Neil Ward 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2001 10:56 AM
  Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality



  Ender also said:

  <<Michael Stipe stated in a magazine article years ago that he is bisexual,
  but people still talk about his sexuality as if it's a huge, intriguing
  mystery.>>


  Neil responded:
  Not any more. He recently announced that he is gay.  He probably got fed up
  of all that pointless tittle tattle. Great new album, BTW. <g>

  Ender, playing devil's advocate:  Is he though?  He is in a long term relationship with a man, but does that automatically change him from bisexual to gay?  I'm not saying that to be argumentative.  i'm just curious to know if settling into a monogamous relationship means settling into an either hetero- or homosexual label (ew!  the "L"  word!)
  You have good taste in music, Neil.  


  ender


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Sun Jun 17 23:28:33 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 00:28:33 +0100
Subject: Michael Stipe (was Homosexuality)
References: <3B2CAE1E.A4533374@wicca.net> <003001c0f73e$01ccb5c0$373770c2@c5s910j> <002501c0f74a$17264b00$2c690f3f@satellite>
Message-ID: <001001c0f785$4e661d80$aa3570c2@c5s910j>

Ender, on Michael Stipe:

 <<Ender, playing devil's advocate:  Is he though?  He is in a long term
relationship with a man, but does that automatically change him from
bisexual to gay?  I'm not saying that to be argumentative.  i'm just curious
to know if settling into a monogamous relationship means settling into an
either hetero- or homosexual label (ew!  the "L"  word!)>>

Me again:

In answer to your latter question, I doubt that bisexual identity vanishes
if you happen to choose one sex or the other for a relationship (IMO).  As
for Mr Stipe, he said he was gay, whatever he meant by that.  I'm not sure
that he was ever really bisexual in the real or sense of the word.  In the
world of celebrity, 'bisexual' is often a euphemism for gay, and a label
leaked by publicists, either to dampen down homosexuals or spice up
heterosexuals.  Allegedly... <g>

Neil
________________________________________

Flying Ford Anglia

"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
squashed, as though it had run headlong into a brick wall"
["The Leaky Cauldron", PoA]

Check out Very Frequently Asked Questions for everything
to do with this club:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/VFAQ.htm











From nethilia at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 00:01:35 2001
From: nethilia at yahoo.com (Nethilia De Lobo)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 17:01:35 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Names/Races/Hermione at the Ball/appearances
Message-ID: <20010618000135.38675.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>

About my name's meaning: You want the real one, yes? 

Tasha: variant of Natasha, Russian for Natalie,
meaning born (on Christmas). I missed by two months
and ten days.  Teshawn. I don't know. It's my older
cousin's first name, that's where I got it.  Metcalf:
I think it's English for the man who either killed
cows or lived near where they were kept/killed.
Ramsey: Scottish, probably something about rams/sheep.


Races in Stories: 

I have to say I'm one of those people who mentions
skin color in many stories of mine. It could be
because I'm black, but I doubt it. The first thing I
always get out of the way when talking about a
character is gender, hair color, eye color, and race.
Then again, I also tend to write in many biracial
characters, which results in my mocha girls with olive
green eyes and auburn-brown hair and the dark haired
blue almond-eyed boys. (I like dark hair with light
eyes, which is why I think Harry is adorable). And
then there's my furries--whoo. lion/tigers,
raccon/mice, etc... I think mixed people are
beautiful. I like them so much i'm engaged to one.
(That's not the main reason, mine you. It's a fringe
benifit.)

Hermione at the ball/appearances:

I'm guilty of the same thing she does. I look blah
almost all the time, and then when I dress up, it
shocks people. My senior year of High school, I went
to a formal dance in full dressup (long formal
burgundy velvet dress with side slit, lipstick and
mascara [don't wear the rest and only wear that when
either super formal or gothic makeup]and hair
perfectly done)and no one in my class recognized me
(and there were only 123 of us in the whole graduating
class). Once I went to a work party at my old job and
no one recognized me--and then I was only semi-formal
(green sweater, palazzos, heeled sandals, and hair
down and curled).  

As for looking nice for other people, forget it. My
boyfriend thinks I'm beautiful even when I'm wearing a
set of sleeping boxers and my Aggie shirt, with messy
hair and sleepy eyes. And if he thinks I'm cute then,
who else do I need to impress, right? I don't perm my
hair anymore (it's now extremely fuzzy after a
year-plus of no perms), I don't do my nails often, and
the only jewelry I wear is the opal ring and necklace
my boyfriend gave me, my ying-yang ring, and at
occasions a pair of silver loops. 

And yes, a lot of this is old topics, and all of this
is very long, but I've been trying to figure out this
eevahl puzzle that looks like puzzle pieces but isn't.
>< 

--Neth



=====
--Nethilia de Lobo--
**Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus.**

http://www.geocities.com/spenecial
Spenecial.com. Two girls. One Website. Total Chaos.

__________________________________________________
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From tmayor at mediaone.net  Mon Jun 18 01:02:46 2001
From: tmayor at mediaone.net (Rosmerta)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 01:02:46 -0000
Subject: really lazy question re: release dates
Message-ID: <9gjjvm+2uto@eGroups.com>

I know this is really a beastly selfish request since I can look this 
info up somewhere close by (is it in Announcements?) but does one of 
you super-informed people know readily when the HP movie is supposed 
to be released and/or the most accurate best-guess on when OoTP is 
due (I know there was some recent controversy on this last point)? 

~Rosmerta, who actually wants to know for work reasons, but realizes 
if she starts rummaging through archives and such, the night will be 
lost. 




From tmayor at mediaone.net  Mon Jun 18 01:08:01 2001
From: tmayor at mediaone.net (Rosmerta)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 01:08:01 -0000
Subject: REM (was Re: Homosexuality)
In-Reply-To: <003001c0f73e$01ccb5c0$373770c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9gjk9h+uhqg@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote: 
[Stipe] recently announced that he is gay.  He probably got fed up
> of all that pointless tittle tattle. Great new album, BTW

Neil, *is* it good, worth buying good? I am a big REM fan from way 
back (hey, I even kind of liked UP, which sank like a stone last 
year), but I read a bad review of the new album and haven't been 
blown over by the single they put out first in the States (that sugar 
one).

~Rosmerta




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 01:30:11 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 18:30:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] really lazy question re: release dates
In-Reply-To: <9gjjvm+2uto@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010618013011.66957.qmail@web13706.mail.yahoo.com>

  November 16, 2001

It is even on the movie trailer, and everybody will be
there on NOVEMBER 16, 2001 FOR OPENING DAY, YEAH!!!
You will get plenty of replies on this!

Wanda the Witch of Revere,Massachusetts Off to read
more emails




--- Rosmerta <tmayor at mediaone.net> wrote:
> I know this is really a beastly selfish request
> since I can look this 
> info up somewhere close by (is it in Announcements?)
> but does one of 
> you super-informed people know readily when the HP
> movie is supposed 
> to be released and/or the most accurate best-guess
> on when OoTP is 
> due (I know there was some recent controversy on
> this last point)? 
> 
> ~Rosmerta, who actually wants to know for work
> reasons, but realizes 
> if she starts rummaging through archives and such,
> the night will be 
> lost. 
> 
> 


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From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 01:31:56 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 18:31:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Homosexuality 
Message-ID: <20010618013156.8339.qmail@web13705.mail.yahoo.com>

 
 

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From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 01:39:23 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 18:39:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Oooops!!!!!!
Message-ID: <20010618013923.69046.qmail@web13709.mail.yahoo.com>

Sorry Neil, I hit the wrong key which is a usaull for
me and my stupid fingers!!
Neil if your happier about yourself, so am I! I am
happily married and have great kids and we have always
taught not to judgfe anybody of who they are. Your
alright in what you do and be proud as to who you are,
I love this group and everybody in this group are very
smart adults and I'm still learning from all these
posts about so much of the world of HP and and that is
including you! Your posts help me a lot!

Hold your head high and keep on teaching this group
about friendship and understanding of many thnings HP
and of course muggles and there typing mistakes!

Thank you Neil for being there for all of us out here
who still reminders of what we should be doing and
what not to be doing!

Wanda the Witch of Revere, Massachusetts

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From phoenixfeather36 at aol.com  Mon Jun 18 02:12:09 2001
From: phoenixfeather36 at aol.com (phoenixfeather36 at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 02:12:09 -0000
Subject: percentage obsession
Message-ID: <9gjo1p+uruc@eGroups.com>

I just took the obsession quiz, and I discovered that since joining 
HP4GU in May, I've gone from 49% to 59% obsessed with Harry Potter!  
Aren't you all so proud of me?  I guess it would be higher, except 
that I'm not into the whole fanfiction thing (sorry!).  Anyway, I was 
wondering just how obsessed everyone else is.  I see references to 
the quiz occasionally, but not too often, and I guess I am still 
fairly new to this group, even though I've been here a month now.

And while I'm posting, I would just like to add that I really love 
this group.  I think it's a great way to discuss HP, and it's 
definitely helping me pass the time until book 5.  It's also good to 
know that there are people who are just as obsessed, if not much more 
obsessed, with these books as I am.  I also think the moderators are 
doing a great job, and I would like to commend them on the way they 
handled the past few "trolls" on the list.  

Anyway, keep those discussions going!  I look forward to reading my 
emails every day!

Devika :)




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 18 10:33:10 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 06:33:10 -0400
Subject: Lasch
Message-ID: <F136lxwbXsfgGRzRrNb0000bb0f@hotmail.com>

Rita wrote:

>I think friendship probably starts with enjoying each other's company 
>(which would be why
>Christopher Lasch, in the only one of his books that I ever read (it was
>LOATHSOME) condemned friendship as being a form of 'narcissism', as
>opposed to hanging out with and helping relatives or neighbors whom
>detest but hang out with and help out of duty -- talking about
>'enjoyment' DOES make it sound like hedonism).

Oy vey.  Does Lasch think =everything= is narcissistic?  He's been on my 
"must read" list for years now, but this snippet is a major turnoff.

No s*** friendship is about enjoyment.  Heck, let's jump right into the 
hedonist pool and say that it's about pleasure.  I spend time with friends, 
as opposed to spending time fixing my neighbor's screen door, because I like 
them and take pleasure in their company.  "Pleasure=hedonism" and "things 
done primarily for oneself=narcissism" both seem like very sloppy philosophy 
to me, the kinds of statements that would have gotten me acres of marginal 
comments from the prof (not complimentary ones) if I'd tried them out in a 
paper for philosophy class.

Kant started all this trouble when he pointed out that doing something 
meritorious that you don't personally enjoy is better than doing something 
meritorious that you like doing anyway.  Lesser minds shouldn't get a hold 
of ideas like that.

Amy Z
feeling curmudgeonly, but not half so curmudgeonly as Lasch
_________________________________________________________________
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From s_ings at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 13:38:10 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 06:38:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality
In-Reply-To: <003001c0f73e$01ccb5c0$373770c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <20010618133810.48763.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Neil Ward <neilward at dircon.co.uk> wrote:
> Ender said:
> 
> <<I haven't seriously dated any ment recently and
> one of my closest friends
> made a statement along the lines of "We'll accept
> any boyfriend you
> choose...or girlfriend."  And i'm thinking "Where
> did that come from?"
>   I haven't dated any men recently, but i haven't
> dated any women either, so
> why was homosexuality assumed in this case? >>
> 
> They didn't assume homosexuality, they simply
> allowed for the possibility,
> which is refreshing.  I think that's a wonderfully
> supportive thing for a
> friend to say.  If you were gay, wouldn't you feel
> that you could confide in
> that friend and that they would love you just the
> same?  If you weren't,
> would you really feel offended by the fact that your
> friend allowed for it?
> Fear of rejection by friends and family is a really
> big deal for some gay
> people.

I agree with Neil here, it's refreshing and, in my
experience, unusual to have friends/family have
display this supportiveness. Though I do, I know the
rest of my family is very homophobic (a fact I
discovered when they went positively ballistic after
seeing me on television raising the rainbow flag over
City Hall at our Pride Festival 2 years ago). A few
months ago my daughter was bemoaning the fact that she
didn't have a date for one of her school dances. My
response? Don't you have a boyfriend you can go with?
A girlfriend? Her response? Mommmmmm!!!! 

I've had interesting experiences since deciding to
volunteer with our festival. I've had the local GLBT
paper consider writing an article about me after my
election to the festival's Board of Directors (from
the point of view of: why is 'that' person on the
Board and what do we care what 'they' think). The
article was never written as we let them know that a
reverse-discrimination lawsuit would be pending if
they did. I've had women try to pick me up in bars
even though I insist to them that I'm straight. I had
someone apologise for outing me as straight. The woman
who nominated me to Board told me I was being very
brave when I said I would accept. She said people
would assume I was a lesbian simply by virtue of
working with the GLBT comminity. My response? I told
her people looked at the fact that she had 5 children
and assumed she was straight (she was married before
coming out, very common among lesbians here).

I'm rambling at this point, I know. I'm also biting my
tongue and trying not to simply fling down on paper
how I feel about working with the GLBT community at
this point. It has been a less than pleasant
experience, but one that has nothing to do with
peoples sexual orientation and everything to do with
personalities - so I will shut up and go do laundry or
whatever I am avoiding by checking my email.

Sheryll, definitely not working with Pride next year
(though I have said that in the month preceding the
festival for the last 4 years!)


=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

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From ender_w at msn.com  Mon Jun 18 13:55:02 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 09:55:02 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] REM (was Re: Homosexuality)
References: <9gjk9h+uhqg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002101c0f7fe$4a2582a0$24eb183f@satellite>

Rosmerta,
It depends on what you like.  I read in a review that the album went back to REM's "earlier days."  Having been a fan since the late 80's, I took "earlier days" to mean the Document, or Life's Rich Pageant era, so I was a little wierded out when I first heard the new album, which sounds nothing like those other two.  It's more like Out of Time and Automatic for the People: dreamy and moody.  Don't buy it if you're looking for something to pump you up while driving to work.  It's more of a reflective, thoughtful piece...good to listen to if you're writing.

Neil,
thanks for clearing up Stipe's label issue.  I must not have read the article closely enough.

ender
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Rosmerta 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2001 9:08 PM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] REM (was Re: Homosexuality)


  --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote: 
  [Stipe] recently announced that he is gay.  He probably got fed up
  > of all that pointless tittle tattle. Great new album, BTW

  Neil, *is* it good, worth buying good? I am a big REM fan from way 
  back (hey, I even kind of liked UP, which sank like a stone last 
  year), but I read a bad review of the new album and haven't been 
  blown over by the single they put out first in the States (that sugar 
  one).

  ~Rosmerta


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From naama_gat at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 18 13:48:03 2001
From: naama_gat at hotmail.com (naama_gat at hotmail.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:48:03 -0000
Subject: Lasch
In-Reply-To: <F136lxwbXsfgGRzRrNb0000bb0f@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9gl0qj+bpph@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Rita wrote:
> 
> >I think friendship probably starts with enjoying each other's 
company 
> >(which would be why
> >Christopher Lasch, in the only one of his books that I ever read 
(it was
> >LOATHSOME) condemned friendship as being a form of 'narcissism', as
> >opposed to hanging out with and helping relatives or neighbors whom
> >detest but hang out with and help out of duty -- talking about
> >'enjoyment' DOES make it sound like hedonism).
> 
> Oy vey.  Does Lasch think =everything= is narcissistic?  He's been 
on my 
> "must read" list for years now, but this snippet is a major turnoff.
> 
> No s*** friendship is about enjoyment.  Heck, let's jump right into 
the 
> hedonist pool and say that it's about pleasure.  I spend time with 
friends, 
> as opposed to spending time fixing my neighbor's screen door, 
because I like 
> them and take pleasure in their company.  "Pleasure=hedonism" 
and "things 
> done primarily for oneself=narcissism" both seem like very sloppy 
philosophy 
> to me, the kinds of statements that would have gotten me acres of 
marginal 
> comments from the prof (not complimentary ones) if I'd tried them 
out in a 
> paper for philosophy class.
> 
> Kant started all this trouble when he pointed out that doing 
something 
> meritorious that you don't personally enjoy is better than doing 
something 
> meritorious that you like doing anyway.  Lesser minds shouldn't get 
a hold 
> of ideas like that.
> 
> Amy Z
> feeling curmudgeonly, but not half so curmudgeonly as Lasch


Funny. It was a point I kept getting entangled with as a child (I was 
always rather philosophically minded). If a good deed gives pleasure 
to a good person and a bad deed gives pleasure to a bad person, 
what's the difference between being a good or a bad person? (since 
they both simply do what feels good to them).
As a mature, wise (yeah, right) person, I now know that that is 
preciesly the difference between good and bad people - good people 
feel good doing good, bad people don't. 
That Kantian accounting system you quote is the kind of thinking I 
really hate now. Instead of making people feel good about themselves 
it twists them into guilt ridden conscience pickers. Not surprising 
really that one century later we get Nietzsche.

Naama




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 14:28:48 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 07:28:48 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Historical Imagination (was Re: J.K. Rowling's fav books)
In-Reply-To: <9gdp0b+osl8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010618142848.21848.qmail@web14608.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Ebony AKA AngieJ <ebonyink at hotmail.com> wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., tabouli at u... wrote:
> > I tend to take the "read it in the context of the
> values of the 
> time"  view on these issues.  I confess (she says,
> conscious that 
> she's wading in perilous waters here) to a certain
> irritation with 
> people> who loudly denounce works written decades
> ago for not 
> upholding > current values regarding feminism,
> multiculturalism and 
> so forth.  I > mean, sure, note that the attitudes
> expressed in the 
> books would be > considered sexist, or racist, or
> whatever by today's 
> standards, but > don't denounce the writers for not
> anticipating 
> shifts in values > which occurred 50 years after
> their time.  Please.
> >
> 
> Thank you!  Isn't this called "historical
> imagination"?  At least, 
> that's what my AP American History teacher told us
> on the first day 
> of class back in '93--she was white, we were a very
> racially mixed 
> group who found the majority of the first 2/3s of
> our textbooks 
> offensive.  So she made what you said, Tabouli, her
> very first 
> lesson.  It worked... we had lots of fun in her
> course, for she was 
> an *excellent* teacher.  

This is basically a 'me,too'. I confess to owning (and
enjoying) several original Bobbsey Twins books and
such. I'm sure the author didn't know that times would
change and people would be condemning the way some of
the characters are portrayed.
> 
> Hmm.  There's a pretty bad racial slur on the last
> page of what might 
> have been one of my favorite Lucy Maud Montgomery
> books.  I still own 
> the book, but I must confess I've never re-read
> it... it spoiled the 
> entire novel for me.  My historical imagination is
> woefully deficient-
> -I *always* get extremely angry when watching movies
> about black 
> history (I cried and threw things all evening after 
> watching "Rosewood"--my roots are in Florida)--so I
> think I agree 
> with the spirit of "read it in the context of the
> values of the time" 
> more than I do the letter.  A bigot in 1701, 1801,
> and 1901 pisses me 
> off just as much as a bigot in 2001.

I watched 'Rosewood' when it first came out on The
Movie Network (it never made it into the theaters in
Ottawa). My best friend had told me it was an
incredible movie and said it made her feel 'ashamed to
be white'. I had read an article somewhere about the
movie, that interviewed some of the people who lived
through the events depicted and it was the article
that originally sparked my interest in seeing the
movie. 

I'll add a 'me, too' to your last statement above. I
remember saying at an AA meeting once that I always
thought I wasn't prejudiced, until I realised that I
despise narrow-minded people.
> 
> But some people go too far IMO.  My best friend from
> middle school, 
> who is biracial, told us one day when we were in
> sixth grade that her 
> parents TOSSED OUT her Little House on the Prairie
> series when they 
> found out about the minstrel show.  Never mind that
> minstrelsy is 
> part of America's cultural history... no study of
> the development of 
> the American theatre is complete without touching
> upon it.  Never 
> mind that the doctor who helped save Laura's family
> when they were 
> sick in Indian Territory was a black man... and LIW
> wrote this detail 
> in long before it was "PC" to do so.  
> 
> I think I agree with you, Tabouli.  I'd rather my
> children read about 
> the past and understand both its glory and its
> sordidness, than to 
> grow up ignorant of the trends that have influenced
> where we are at 
> this point in history.
> 
> --Ebony AKA AngieJ

Well said, Ebony. I encourage Nyssa to read both the
good and the bad. She has developed a fascination with
reading about concentration survivors and intends to
visit Dachau when my mother takes her to Europe for
graduation next year. All stemming from reading Anne
Frank's diary. 

Sheryll, rambling again, but wanting to agree with
what Ebony said so eloquently

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more.
http://buzz.yahoo.com/



From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun 18 10:29:28 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 10:29:28 EST5EDT
Subject: The new trailer is out!
Message-ID: <3D3702F8@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

It's with Atlantis.

I haven't seen it yet.  But my boss (a big Harry fan) said it's 
wonderful.

Hmmm....guess when I see Moulin Rouge tonight (8 times so far) 
I'll be sneaking into the beginning of Atlantis.  

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From lrcjestes at earthlink.net  Mon Jun 18 14:39:38 2001
From: lrcjestes at earthlink.net (Carole Estes)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 10:39:38 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] The new trailer is out!
References: <3D3702F8@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <005601c0f804$82daaa20$e143d63f@oemcomputer>


----- Original Message -----
From: "Rachel Bray" <bray.262 at osu.edu>


> It's with Atlantis.
>
> I haven't seen it yet.  But my boss (a big Harry fan) said it's
> wonderful.
>
> Hmmm....guess when I see Moulin Rouge tonight (8 times so far)
> I'll be sneaking into the beginning of Atlantis.
>

No fair!  I went to see Atlantis this weekend and it wasn't shown.  We also
did not get the HP trailer with Shrek as some have said.  Is there anyway I
can find out what movies the trailer is being shown with nationwide?  Has
anyone else in new england seen the trailer with any movie recently (I never
did get to See Spot Run).

carole





From heidit at netbox.com  Mon Jun 18 14:42:13 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 10:42:13 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] The new trailer is out!
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F9297@miaexch1>

Normally, the guys at trailertalk.50megs.com update to let people know what
new trailers are coming out - and last time, it was available on the HP WB
site as well, but isn't now. I'm trying to find it, for
www.the-leaky-cauldron (I'm an editor) but no luck so far. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Carole Estes [mailto:lrcjestes at earthlink.net]
Sent: Monday, June 18, 2001 10:40 AM
To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] The new trailer is out!


Real-To: "Carole Estes" 
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rachel Bray" <bray.262 at osu.edu>


> It's with Atlantis.
>
> I haven't seen it yet.  But my boss (a big Harry fan) said it's
> wonderful.
>
> Hmmm....guess when I see Moulin Rouge tonight (8 times so far)
> I'll be sneaking into the beginning of Atlantis.
>

No fair!  I went to see Atlantis this weekend and it wasn't shown.  We also
did not get the HP trailer with Shrek as some have said.  Is there anyway I
can find out what movies the trailer is being shown with nationwide?  Has
anyone else in new england seen the trailer with any movie recently (I never
did get to See Spot Run).

carole



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From Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 14:52:10 2001
From: Aberforths_Goat at Yahoo.com (Aberforth's Goat)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:52:10 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality
References: <20010618133810.48763.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <008101c0f806$412a5740$5000a8c0@shasta>

Err, sorry for parading my ignorance, but what is "GLBT"? 

Baaaaaa!

Aberforth's Goat (a.k.a. Mike Gray)
_______________________

"My own brother, Aberforth, was prosecuted for practising
inappropriate charms on a goat. It was all over the papers,
but did Aberforth hide? No he did not! He held his head high."




From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Mon Jun 18 16:00:37 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:00:37 -0000
Subject: 'Gormenghast' UKer's opinions
Message-ID: <9gl8j5+ojm4@eGroups.com>

My local public television station will broadcast the 
BBC's 'Gormenghast' series next month. From what I gather, it's a 
fantasy-LOTR like series. Did anyone here watch it on the BBC? If so, 
how was it?

Milz




From mecks at prodigy.net  Mon Jun 18 16:30:19 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 11:30:19 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality
References: <20010618133810.48763.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com> <008101c0f806$412a5740$5000a8c0@shasta>
Message-ID: <3B2E2C9B.64E80B69@prodigy.net>

Aberforth's Goat wrote:
> 
> Err, sorry for parading my ignorance, but what is "GLBT"?
> 
> Baaaaaa!

Gay Lesbian Bisexual Transgendered (or Transvesite.  My memory fails on
the last one.)

-- 
Michela Ecks - mecks at prodigy.net - Textual Poacher - Spastic Hale Girl
"Babylon 5 was last of the Babylon stations. There would never be
another. It changed the future and it changed us. It taught us that we
have to create the future or others will do it for us. It taught us
that we have to care for one other, because if we don't, who will? And
that true strength sometimes comes from the most unlikely of places.
Mostly though, I think it gave us hope that there can always be new
beginnings, even for people like us." - Susan Ivanova



From bray.262 at osu.edu  Mon Jun 18 12:39:03 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 12:39:03 EST5EDT
Subject: OK...my bad (was new trailer)
Message-ID: <265C04F38@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

I just talked to a friend of mine that saw Atlantis in the AMC across 
town and said he DIDN'T get the Harry preview.  *sigh*  Sad.  I 
guess I have to make sure I sneak into the one that my boss went 
to.

So, sorry guys.  I just assumed it was running with all of the 
Atlantis.  :-(

*throwing myself down to the ground and begging forgiveness....and 
finding my lost yellow highliter under my desk!  Yay!*

Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Mon Jun 18 16:43:23 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:43:23 -0000
Subject: 'Gormenghast' UKer's opinions
In-Reply-To: <9gl8j5+ojm4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9glb3b+r62p@eGroups.com>

Milz wrote:

<<My local public television station will broadcast the 
BBC's 'Gormenghast' series next month. From what I gather, it's a 
fantasy-LOTR like series. Did anyone here watch it on the BBC? If so, 
how was it?>>

I didn't see it, unfortunately.  The critics seemed disappointed with 
it, but there's no accounting for critics.  I wouldn't say it's LOTR-
like, but, from the clips I've seen, 'a Dickensian acid fantasy'...

Richard Griffiths (Vernon) and Zoe Wannamaker (Hooch) were both in 
it. 

Here's a fairly informative link:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/gormenghast/std/index.shtml

Neil





From bohners at pobox.com  Mon Jun 18 17:37:22 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:37:22 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: 'Gormenghast' UKer's opinions
References: <9glb3b+r62p@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <04bd01c0f81d$5a6851a0$26b9e2d1@rebeccab>

<<My local public television station will broadcast the BBC's 'Gormenghast'
series next month. From what I gather, it's a fantasy-LOTR like series. Did
anyone here watch it on the BBC? If so, how was it?>>

I never saw the adaptation (I'm actually afraid to see it, lest I become
enraged and throw things at the screen), but I have read the books.  They
are... um... wow.  Indescribable?  Absolutely nothing like LOTR, except in
the sense that the author has created a very vivid and powerful fantasy
world which, if you have the patience to wallow through Mervyn Peake's
labyrinthine prose, can swallow you whole.

The Gormenghast books (TITUS GROAN and GORMENGHAST; I don't count TITUS
ALONE because not only is it nowhere near the standard of the first two, but
it doesn't take place at Gormenghast, and nearly all the characters you knew
and cared about from the first two books are absent) are bewildering and
hilarious and terrifying and heartbreaking by turns.  Steerpike may be the
most riveting anti-hero in modern fantasy literature.  (The miniseries
adaptation got the colour of his hair wrong, not to mention making him a
great deal more physically attractive than he is in the books... these are
the kinds of changes that make me nervous, but one of these days I know I'll
cave and sit down to watch it anyway.)

There is no obvious magic in the world of Gormenghast, but there is plenty
of odd ritual and tradition.  Gormenghast is very similar to Hogwarts in
that it is a colossal, rambling, ancient edifice where it is incredibly easy
to get lost and there are unexpected rooms and corridors everywhere you
turn.  The names of the characters -- Prunesquallor, Sepulchrave, Fuchsia --
have a somewhat Rowlingesque flavour.  Oh, and there are LOTS of owls...
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Mon Jun 18 18:28:28 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 18:28:28 -0000
Subject: The new trailer is out!
In-Reply-To: <005601c0f804$82daaa20$e143d63f@oemcomputer>
Message-ID: <9glh8c+ijtr@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Carole Estes" <lrcjestes at e...> wrote:
> 

> No fair!  I went to see Atlantis this weekend and it wasn't shown.  
We also did not get the HP trailer with Shrek as some have said.  Is 
there anyway I can find out what movies the trailer is being shown 
with nationwide?  Has anyone else in new england seen the trailer 
with any movie recently (I never did get to See Spot Run).
> 
> carole


Hi all,

  I haven't seen Atlantis yet, however I'm with Carole on the Shrek 
trailers. I went to see it 2 weeks ago and no HP trailer :( I guess 
we aren't getting it yet here in The Land of Enchantment. Maybe it 
will show up in the Atlantis trailers. BTW I really liked Sherk I 
thought Eddie Murphy was really funny. 

 Cheers,
        Kristin
 
Who is trying to catch up after being in San Fran all last week.




From janet at cloudmap.com  Mon Jun 18 19:36:19 2001
From: janet at cloudmap.com (janet at cloudmap.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 19:36:19 -0000
Subject: 'Gormenghast' UKer's opinions
In-Reply-To: <9gl8j5+ojm4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gll7j+de5e@eGroups.com>

Well, I haven't worked up the nerve to read the novels but did
watch the miniseries last year on BBC America. Apparently a number of 
significant details were changed (certain characters' fates, 
appearances, natures, and so on), much to the chagrin of fans. There 
were some parts of the program that intrigued me but ultimately it 
was disappointing.

I guess it could be termed a gothic fantasy, but not
"fantasy" as in 
LOTR or HP. Gormenghast isn't a magical world but it is
imaginary. 
The castle and its citizens were a haunted lot, not by ghosts but by 
the past itself. Bewildering rituals governed the way of life 
although their meanings seemed to have long since been forgotten.

There are a few genuinely funny scenes in the miniseries as well as 
several nightmarishly horrific episodes. Much of it is quite bizarre. 
Every character appears to be suffering some degree of madness. The 
claustrophobic sense of decay and doom that hung over the castle 
definitely disturbed me. In short, even as a truncated and 
bastardized adaptation, its far stranger and more unnerving than 
typical American fantasy television.







From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 19:49:05 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 19:49:05 -0000
Subject: Clues: Up Your Chances to See New Trailer Soon
Message-ID: <9gllvh+4mq3@eGroups.com>

Hey all,

Generally, when a movie is released, the movie's studio wants to 
promote its other projects.  Harry Potter is (as most of you know 
already) a Warner Brothers studio release.  Therefore, you are most 
likely to see Harry Potter trailers during the previews to Warner 
Bros. movies (there is some chance that non-WB movies will be willing 
to include the trailer during previews regardless).  With word out 
now that the second trailer is to be released in July, I am going to 
bank on the July 4th release of CATS AND DOGS (WB Studios) as the 
film to "watch" for the new trailer.  Then again, the EXACT DATE IN 
JULY that the trailer will be out was not provided, but even if CATS 
AND DOGS doesn't have the trailer at first, they may "attach" it 
later in the month (especially considering that CATS AND DOGS is the 
ONLY WB release in July according to what I've seen).

A.I. (Artificial Intelligence) is also a Warner Bros. release, due 
out at the VERY end of June.  Perhaps they will sneak in the new 
trailer for HP and the SS at that point, or shortly thereafter and 
attach it to that film.  (I believe the exact date for A.I. is June 
29th).  I think CATS AND DOGS is the more logical choice because of 
the "audience" they're going to attract.  After CATS AND DOGS, I 
don't think there will even be another WB release until mid-August!

So, I think it will be the movie about the two rival animal groups 
that will provide the best first chance to see trailer #2 for HP and 
the SS.  Trailer #3 is due in the fall.  I will get a more exact 
month for that if I can...and I will get any other info that I can on 
some other current WB studio releases that may eventually attach the 
second HP trailer to their previews.

Still, CATS AND DOGS is "what is probably is."

Anyone with information on the new trailer being shown in July before 
the start of a NON-WB film...please drop us a note ASAP.  Thanks.

N ;)




From saitaina at wizzards.net  Mon Jun 18 19:53:18 2001
From: saitaina at wizzards.net (Saitaina)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 12:53:18 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: The new trailer is out!
References: <9glh8c+ijtr@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <004401c0f830$53030780$5d4e28d1@oemcomputer>

As with most, the trailer was not seen with Shrek or Atlantas by me nor any
others in the Cinima 7 theatre.  But the main trailer (that everyone's
downloaded) was seen by me on A Knight's Tale.  If there's a new one I
haven't heard about it being shown around here.  Most trailers through are a
reginal thing, they are chosen by the theatre.

----- Original Message -----
From: Kristin <Alyeskakc at aol.com>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, June 18, 2001 11:28 AM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: The new trailer is out!


> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Carole Estes" <lrcjestes at e...> wrote:
> >
>
> > No fair!  I went to see Atlantis this weekend and it wasn't shown.
> We also did not get the HP trailer with Shrek as some have said.  Is
> there anyway I can find out what movies the trailer is being shown
> with nationwide?  Has anyone else in new england seen the trailer
> with any movie recently (I never did get to See Spot Run).
> >
> > carole
>
>
> Hi all,
>
>   I haven't seen Atlantis yet, however I'm with Carole on the Shrek
> trailers. I went to see it 2 weeks ago and no HP trailer :( I guess
> we aren't getting it yet here in The Land of Enchantment. Maybe it
> will show up in the Atlantis trailers. BTW I really liked Sherk I
> thought Eddie Murphy was really funny.
>
> Cheers,
>         Kristin
>
> Who is trying to catch up after being in San Fran all last week.
>
>
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From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 20:42:38 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 20:42:38 -0000
Subject: The new trailer is out!
In-Reply-To: <004401c0f830$53030780$5d4e28d1@oemcomputer>
Message-ID: <9glp3u+9kad@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Saitaina" <saitaina at w...> wrote:
  But the main trailer (that everyone's
> downloaded) was seen by me on A Knight's Tale.  If there's a new 
one I
> haven't heard about it being shown around here.  Most trailers 
through are a
> regional thing, they are chosen by the theatre.
> 

Good points from "Saintaina"....a theatre is also MORE likely to show 
a given trailer IF they are going to be showing the movie (see if you 
can't ask someone around the theatre in question whether they are 
picking up HP AND THE SS or not)...and yes, it's a regional decision 
usually involving this factor.

I'm glad you brought up the KNIGHT'S TALE issue.  #1  This movie is 
NOT from WARNER BROS. in any way shape or form.  #2  I went to see A 
KNIGHT'S TALE a few weeks into its release and did NOT see a Harry 
Potter trailer before the start of the film.  I have seen SEVERAL 
movies since then...Shrek, Pearl Harbor, Evolution to mention a few 
and have NOT seen a Harry Potter trailer at ALL...I've only seen it 
on the net)...However, I have friends who have seen it in my 
hometown.  So I guess it's just my luck.

I'm seeing Atlantis NEXT Saturday and I may catch Dr. Doolittle as 
well.  I will keep you posted.  

Cheers,

N ;)





From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 21:45:09 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 21:45:09 -0000
Subject: The new trailer is out!
In-Reply-To: <004401c0f830$53030780$5d4e28d1@oemcomputer>
Message-ID: <9glsp5+n09i@eGroups.com>

Here's a "math formula" to try and gauge which movie in July will 
almost certainly have the Harry Potter trailer (#2) preceiding it.

Warner Bros. Film Being Shown AKA the main feature+ Theatre showing 
WB film that is planning to show Harry Potter in November + the 
audience type seeing the main feature and a strong degree of 
similarity with the projected Harry Potter audience type=

Strong chance that you will see HP and the SS Trailer before the main 
feature

BTW the only WB Film released recently that is in the TOP TWELVE is 
SWORDFISH (sorry I couldn't get the indentity of the studio that 
distributed "What's The Worse Thing That Could Happen").  Perhaps 
SWORDFISH will eventually carry the new trailer...but I don't see too 
much similarity between the overall audience type that SWORDFISH 
attracts and the type that will see HP AND THE SS (although I'm sure 
there are some exceptions and there are people who will be interested 
in BOTH features). Then again, with the shortage of WB films during 
these weeks...who knows?

I'm still banking on (and have my fingers crossed for) CATS AND 
DOGS...and plan to catch that film anyhow.

N





From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 21:46:48 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 21:46:48 -0000
Subject: The new trailer is out!
In-Reply-To: <9glsp5+n09i@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9glss8+71tk@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., rodeodangerqueen at y... wrote:
> Here's a "math formula" to try and gauge which movie in July will 
> almost certainly have the Harry Potter trailer (#2) preceiding it.
> 
Sorry about the typo on PRECEDING.

N




From saitaina at wizzards.net  Mon Jun 18 22:43:03 2001
From: saitaina at wizzards.net (Saitaina)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 15:43:03 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: The new trailer is out!
References: <9glss8+71tk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <007b01c0f848$09d71c00$5d4e28d1@oemcomputer>

Small thing to note, the movie theatre I frequent often hypes movies well in
advance.  Tomb raider or example had a poster last december or somewhere
around there.  I went today to see Evolution (no hp trailer sadly though
several for other movies that gave me a laugh but anyway), and while I was
examining the teaser posters I saw, from across the room, a familiar owl and
envelope.  I thought it was quite funny that while they've only shown the
trailer on one movie so far, they have the teaser poster in a very prominent
location.  Acording to the theatre manger, they will be adding more of the
hp teaser posters along the theatre walk way in the coming monthes leading
to a hall filled with hp posters.  I just thought it was funny of them to do
this when the movie is still monthes away, but then I'm used to over
advertising with Cinima 7.

----- Original Message -----
From: <rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, June 18, 2001 2:46 PM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: The new trailer is out!


> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., rodeodangerqueen at y... wrote:
> > Here's a "math formula" to try and gauge which movie in July will
> > almost certainly have the Harry Potter trailer (#2) preceiding it.
> >
> Sorry about the typo on PRECEDING.
>
> N
>
>
>       Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 23:02:18 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:02:18 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: I saw 'Atlantis'...
In-Reply-To: <265C04F38@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <20010618230218.86908.qmail@web14501.mail.yahoo.com>


...and all I can say is bleh. I must say that I was sorely and
completely disappointed. In my opinion, it's one of the WORST Disney
movies to come out in quite awhile. Why you ask? Well, here ya go...

spoiler space
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*

The story, to begin with, was way too long for an hour and a half
movie. I remember thinking about a third of the way into the movie that
it was moving veeeery fast. Because it moved so fast, no enough time
was spent on the various parts of the story. Second, the character
development was LOUSY. Awful. We never get to know any of the
characters at all. The requisite "bad guy" turned into a bad guy way
too late and didn't seem real at all. Third, can we say plot hole? Plot
holes everywhere! The biggest was at the part where Kida (as the
Atlantis power source) was herded into the metal container. If she
currently is a powerful being, why was she complacently going along?
When Milo "frees" her, she explodes into power but why didn't she do
this before? And if she has so much power, nothing should be able to
hold her. And lastly, I must say that I wasn't pleased with the
animation. It was okay, but nothing special. The triangle fingernails
really bugged me for some reason.

I must awknowledge that I had high expectations for this film and the
extreme disappointment might stem from that. But I still feel that this
is one of Disney's worst films. Did anyone who saw it like it? Maybe
I'm just way off base. My dad and bro saw it with me and liked it okay.
They thought I was crazy...maybe I am?

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
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From saitaina at wizzards.net  Mon Jun 18 23:04:18 2001
From: saitaina at wizzards.net (Saitaina)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:04:18 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] I saw 'Atlantis'...
References: <20010618230218.86908.qmail@web14501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <00b101c0f84b$20eccf40$5d4e28d1@oemcomputer>

I rather liked the movie.

1

2

3

4

5

6

7

8

9

10

9

8

7

6

5

4

3

2

1

Granted the plot was under developed and it moved way to fast, but I thought
it was okay.  The square finger tips bothered me but maybe that's because
I'm picky.  I think you're over reacting a bit on the Kida thing, it's the
way Disney is...has to be a damsel to rescue or some such.


----- Original Message -----
From: Amber <reanna20 at yahoo.com>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, June 18, 2001 4:02 PM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] I saw 'Atlantis'...


>
> ...and all I can say is bleh. I must say that I was sorely and
> completely disappointed. In my opinion, it's one of the WORST Disney
> movies to come out in quite awhile. Why you ask? Well, here ya go...
>
> spoiler space
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
>
> The story, to begin with, was way too long for an hour and a half
> movie. I remember thinking about a third of the way into the movie that
> it was moving veeeery fast. Because it moved so fast, no enough time
> was spent on the various parts of the story. Second, the character
> development was LOUSY. Awful. We never get to know any of the
> characters at all. The requisite "bad guy" turned into a bad guy way
> too late and didn't seem real at all. Third, can we say plot hole? Plot
> holes everywhere! The biggest was at the part where Kida (as the
> Atlantis power source) was herded into the metal container. If she
> currently is a powerful being, why was she complacently going along?
> When Milo "frees" her, she explodes into power but why didn't she do
> this before? And if she has so much power, nothing should be able to
> hold her. And lastly, I must say that I wasn't pleased with the
> animation. It was okay, but nothing special. The triangle fingernails
> really bugged me for some reason.
>
> I must awknowledge that I had high expectations for this film and the
> extreme disappointment might stem from that. But I still feel that this
> is one of Disney's worst films. Did anyone who saw it like it? Maybe
> I'm just way off base. My dad and bro saw it with me and liked it okay.
> They thought I was crazy...maybe I am?
>
> ~Amber
>
>
> =====
> http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
> Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001
>
> "DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY
TO AVOID THE RUSH."
> - N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more.
> http://buzz.yahoo.com/
>
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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 18 23:22:46 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:22:46 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Madness...
Message-ID: <20010618232246.12680.qmail@web14506.mail.yahoo.com>


This past weekend I went back to Ohio to visit my family and friends.
That's why I've been nonexistent for the past three days. While I was
there, I managed to *finally* convince my mom to try the HP books.
Since it's summer, she has the time to catch-up on her reading and
Harry Potter is at the top of her list! Yay!

Although, I must say that I'm not the only one in my family that reads
HP. My dad does, he got GoF for Father's Day! My brother refuses to try
them though, on the basis that they're too popular. 

Unfortunately, though, while my dad likes the series he's not crazy
about it. And the only one of my friends who has tried HP has only read
the first two books and thinks they're "okay". <sigh> So I'm hoping my
mom boards the "HP Is Awesome" train. It'd be nice to have a Real Life
person to talk to who understands the madness.

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more.
http://buzz.yahoo.com/



From phoenixfeather36 at aol.com  Tue Jun 19 00:04:00 2001
From: phoenixfeather36 at aol.com (phoenixfeather36 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 00:04:00 -0000
Subject: I saw 'Atlantis'...
In-Reply-To: <20010618230218.86908.qmail@web14501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gm4tg+114po@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> 
> ...and all I can say is bleh. I must say that I was sorely and
> completely disappointed. In my opinion, it's one of the WORST Disney
> movies to come out in quite awhile. Why you ask? Well, here ya go...
> 
> spoiler space
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *
> 
> The story, to begin with, was way too long for an hour and a half
> movie. I remember thinking about a third of the way into the movie 
that
> it was moving veeeery fast. Because it moved so fast, no enough time
> was spent on the various parts of the story. Second, the character
> development was LOUSY. Awful. We never get to know any of the
> characters at all. The requisite "bad guy" turned into a bad guy way
> too late and didn't seem real at all. Third, can we say plot hole? 
Plot
> holes everywhere! The biggest was at the part where Kida (as the
> Atlantis power source) was herded into the metal container. If she
> currently is a powerful being, why was she complacently going along?
> When Milo "frees" her, she explodes into power but why didn't she do
> this before? And if she has so much power, nothing should be able to
> hold her. And lastly, I must say that I wasn't pleased with the
> animation. It was okay, but nothing special. The triangle 
fingernails
> really bugged me for some reason.
> 
> I must awknowledge that I had high expectations for this film and 
the
> extreme disappointment might stem from that. But I still feel that 
this
> is one of Disney's worst films. Did anyone who saw it like it? Maybe
> I'm just way off base. My dad and bro saw it with me and liked it 
okay.
> They thought I was crazy...maybe I am?
> 
> ~Amber
> 
 
I agree that the plot moved way too quickly for the movie and that 
there were a lot of plot holes.  I went to see it with my younger 
sister and she really liked it.  I'm really not sure what to think of 
it, though.  It was definitely not your typical Disney movie 
(singing, love story, etc.), so I think that has something to do with 
my inability to form an opinion of it.  It just wasn't quite what I 
was expecting (although I'm not sure exactly what I *was* expecting).

Now that I think about it, though, I probably wouldn't be too eager 
to see Atlantis again.  This is in contrast to a lot of other Disney 
movies that I can watch over and over without getting sick of them.  
My only reason for seeing Atlantis again would be to try to pick up 
some details that I might have missed the first time I saw the movie, 
since it did move so quickly, but I really don't think there was that 
much to miss.

Devika  




From phoenixfeather36 at aol.com  Tue Jun 19 00:28:10 2001
From: phoenixfeather36 at aol.com (phoenixfeather36 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 00:28:10 -0000
Subject: Madness...
In-Reply-To: <20010618232246.12680.qmail@web14506.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gm6aq+ahdd@eGroups.com>

Amber:
> Unfortunately, though, while my dad likes the series he's not crazy
> about it. And the only one of my friends who has tried HP has only 
read
> the first two books and thinks they're "okay". <sigh> So I'm hoping 
my
> mom boards the "HP Is Awesome" train. It'd be nice to have a Real 
Life
> person to talk to who understands the madness.
> 

I know how you feel.  I'm trying to get my friends to read HP too, 
but I doubt that any of them will end up as obsessed as I am.  Last 
year, I persuaded one of my friends to start reading SS.  She told me 
that she read the first chapter and then said, "This is pretty good, 
but what am I doing?  I'm reading a children's book!  It's not worth 
my time."
Now first of all, it's utterly beyond my comprehension how anyone can 
read the first chapter of a book, enjoy it, and then decide not to 
finish the book for no other reason than that it "wasn't worth the 
time."  She had plenty of time!
Hmmm...maybe she was a little wary of my book recommendations, 
though.  I told her to read _Jane Eyre_, which is one of my favorite 
books, and she absolutely HATED it.  She told me that she wished Jane 
had gone to India to die!  She had some choice words for Mr. 
Rochester, as well--and I loved him!  Now really, you may not like a 
book, but there's no need to say things like that to someone who 
loves it.  It literally pained me to hear that.

Wow, this has gotten way off the subject.  Can you guess that my 
friend and I aren't as close now as we were last year?  And that I 
may not be very happy about that?  Anyway, back to what I was trying 
to say...

I don't have anyone in my life to talk with about HP, even though one 
of my other friends wants to borrow my copy of SS.  So that's 
promising.  I do have a friend at school who also likes HP, but she 
lives in California (I'm in Pennsylvania), and I won't see her until 
late August.  She isn't exactly obsessed with the books, either.  But 
we have made plans to see the movie together the day it comes out (2 
days after my birthday, yay!).

But that's why I'm glad I have this list.  There are others like me :)

Devika 








From catlady at wicca.net  Tue Jun 19 03:14:48 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 03:14:48 -0000
Subject: Lasch
In-Reply-To: <F136lxwbXsfgGRzRrNb0000bb0f@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9gmg38+o5a9@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> 
> Oy vey.  Does Lasch think =everything= is narcissistic?  He's been
> on my "must read" list for years now, but this snippet is a major 
> turnoff.

I read that one book by Lasch in 1981. It was an old book even then 
(I didn't check the copyright date, but it referred to black people 
as Negroes). Perhaps he later wrote books that were less loathsome, 
because just about no one whom I have told about this book as ever 
believed me. Besides condemning friendship based on liking and/or 
common interests as narcissism, he also condemned civil rights and 
the outlawing of wife-beating as narcissism. The specific context of 
the latter was an explanation that being more concerned with one's  
own legitimate rights than with maintaining the stability of the 
social order is narcissistic. Thus, while obviously educated and 
well-behaved Negroes have a right to apply for jobs for which they 
have the qualifications, their attempts to outlaw the "Whites Only" 
notices on the Help Wanted ads is a threat to the stability of 
society, for which non-narcissistic people would be willing to 
sacrifice their own interests. The same argument about adult women's 
right not to be beaten, but seeking to enforce that right would 
destroy the nature of marriage and therefore all social order.

Remember this was 1981 when I was reading it, not 
1950-something. My reaction to the above blatant nonsense was to 
wonder whether it might be a little NARCISSISTIC for a White Male to 
explain that White Males have the unpleasant DUTY of lording over and 
exploiting all non-whites and females in order to keep society from 
ever changing.




From lrcjestes at earthlink.net  Tue Jun 19 03:12:03 2001
From: lrcjestes at earthlink.net (Carole Estes)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 23:12:03 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: I saw 'Atlantis'...
References: <9gm4tg+114po@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <007101c0f86d$9f5a68c0$f14ad63f@oemcomputer>


----- Original Message -----
From: <phoenixfeather36 at aol.com>


> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amber <reanna20 at y...> wrote:
> >
> > ...and all I can say is bleh. I must say that I was sorely and
> > completely disappointed. In my opinion, it's one of the WORST Disney
> > movies to come out in quite awhile. Why you ask? Well, here ya go...
> >
> > spoiler space
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> >
> > The story, to begin with, was way too long for an hour and a half
> > movie.

I agree...and a warning...I am a math/science nerd so by labeling the hero a
nerd, no disrespect is intended.

>>Second, the character
> > development was LOUSY. Awful. We never get to know any of the
> > characters at all. The requisite "bad guy" turned into a bad guy way
> > too late and didn't seem real at all.

Yeah...the bad guy and gal were very predictable and the loyal crew that
accepts the nerd and agrees to forego fortune for principle was also very
predictable.


>>Third, can we say plot hole?
> Plot
> > holes everywhere! The biggest was at the part where Kida (as the
> > Atlantis power source) was herded into the metal container. If she
> > currently is a powerful being, why was she complacently going along?
> > When Milo "frees" her, she explodes into power but why didn't she do
> > this before? And if she has so much power, nothing should be able to
> > hold her.

And how come she was able to detach from the crystal, and where did the
giants come from just in the nick of time to protect the city from the lava
flow, and how come once their energy source was removed the rest of the 8000
yo people didn't die like kida's father, and you're telling me after 8000
years Kida has not been married and had children and suddenly falls for the
linguistic geek (no offence to any linguistic geeks out there...I did like
that touch).

And why oh why does disney NOT put clothes on their heroines.  Why must they
be sex goddesses?

>>And lastly, I must say that I wasn't pleased with the
> > animation. It was okay, but nothing special. The triangle
> fingernails
> > really bugged me for some reason.

Its like half the film was drawn in the style of Hercules, which was
appropriate for Hercules, but was too stylistic for a turn of the century
Linguistic geek.  Yeah I was bugged by the square fingers and triangular
nails as well.  And the overexagerated physical characteristics of nearly
all the characters.   And don't get me started on the geologist!

> > They thought I was crazy...maybe I am?
> >
> > ~Amber

No you are not crazy.

> I agree that the plot moved way too quickly for the movie and that
> there were a lot of plot holes.  I went to see it with my younger
> sister and she really liked it.

My 8yo liked it, but I think he was wowed by the action and the machinery.
He isn't bothered with plot and character development..he likes Digimon!

> Now that I think about it, though, I probably wouldn't be too eager
> to see Atlantis again.  This is in contrast to a lot of other Disney
> movies that I can watch over and over without getting sick of them.
> My only reason for seeing Atlantis again would be to try to pick up
> some details that I might have missed the first time I saw the movie,
> since it did move so quickly, but I really don't think there was that
> much to miss.

Right, you feel bombarded with imagery, but then came away feeling amazingly
unsatisfied.

carole
Disney film critic extrodinaire (due to the fact that I have seen most of
them lots and lots of times)





From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 19 05:11:13 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 05:11:13 -0000
Subject: Some Agreement on Speculation
Message-ID: <9gmmth+ocfn@eGroups.com>

Hi,

A website called "The Unofficial Harry Potter Movie Site" reports 
that the second trailer will indeed be out by July and THEY ALSO 
SPECULATE, without any explanation, that it will be "most 
likely...CATS AND DOGS" that will be the movie the trailer precedes.

This website also mentions the third trailer will be due in September.

N




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 19 14:59:00 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 07:59:00 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Homosexuality
In-Reply-To: <3B2E2C9B.64E80B69@prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <20010619145900.4110.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Michela Ecks <mecks at prodigy.net> wrote:
> Aberforth's Goat wrote:
> > 
> > Err, sorry for parading my ignorance, but what is
> "GLBT"?
> > 
> > Baaaaaa!
> 
> Gay Lesbian Bisexual Transgendered (or Transvesite. 
> My memory fails on
> the last one.)

Nothing wrong with your memory, Transgendered is
correct.

Sheryll, token straight girl in a GLBT organisation

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
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From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Tue Jun 19 15:21:33 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 15:21:33 -0000
Subject: 'Gormenghast' UKer's opinions
In-Reply-To: <9gl8j5+ojm4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gnqlt+c4da@eGroups.com>

Well, I've never read the books so I won't have any inaccuracy 
disappointments (like the last Anne of Green Gables movie). I'll try 
watching the series to see how it's like. From the information on the 
BBC site, it seems interesting enough.

Milz (who's public tv station is 3 years behind in the 'East Enders' 
and who spent most of last evening reading the East Enders section of 
the BBC site.)




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 19 15:24:40 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 08:24:40 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: I saw 'Atlantis'...
In-Reply-To: <007101c0f86d$9f5a68c0$f14ad63f@oemcomputer>
Message-ID: <20010619152440.6023.qmail@web14503.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Carole Estes <lrcjestes at earthlink.net> wrote:
> > spoiler space
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > *
> > 
> > Second, the character development was LOUSY. Awful. We never get
> > to know any of the characters at all. The requisite "bad guy"
> > turned into a bad guy way too late and didn't seem real at all.
> 
> Yeah...the bad guy and gal were very predictable and the loyal crew
> that accepts the nerd and agrees to forego fortune for principle was
> also very predictable.

It wasn't that so much. I think what bothered me more was the fact that
the bad guy turned out to be a raving lunatic when he showed no sign of
it before in the film. Up until the bizzare fight on the flying
contraptions, Rourke (aka Bad Guy) seems like a level-headed, calm guy.
But then, all of a sudden, he's got a crazy glint in his eye and is
acting like someone gone insane. I didn't buy it because we don't see
any predisposition in the film beforehand. It would've been more in
character if he'd acted more cool and collected during the fight.

Perhaps Disney's mistake was that they were trying to "surprise" the
audience with a "surprise" villain. We don't see Rourke conspiring with
his henchmen, we don't see any outbursts of anger. So for him to
suddenly lose it doesn't ring true (at least to me). 

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Tue Jun 19 15:35:34 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 15:35:34 -0000
Subject: Simpson's Treehouse of Horror XII and HP (spoilery)
Message-ID: <9gnrg6+qba1@eGroups.com>

This was e-mailed to me by a friend. I'm not too sure about the source 
so take it as you will.

------- Start of forwarded message -------
                  2001-06-18 09:27:05 CST

                  Ananova reports the following:

                       The Simpsons' annual Halloween episode will
include a Harry Potter spoof.

                       Every year the show features three separate
stories in its Treehouse of Horror
                       edition.

                       In Wiz Kids, the children are tutored in the 
fine
art of transforming frogs into
                       princes at the Springfield Elementary School 
for
Wizards.

                       Treehouse of Horror XII will also spoof 2001: A
Space Odyssey.

                       It will feature House of Whacks, in which a Hal
9000-style home automation
                       computer takes a fancy to Marge and decides to
dispose of Homer in the
                       process.

                       In another segment called Curse of the Dummy,
Homer becomes Death incarnate
                       following a gypsy's curse.

                       There's no word on when the episode will be 
shown
in the UK.

------- End of forwarded message -------

I wonder if the kids will be using Latin terms for these frog 
transfigurations. I guess it would be "Regis Filius", which the 
writers would probably change to "Regis Philbinus" or something like 
that.....

Milz




From mecks at prodigy.net  Tue Jun 19 15:58:18 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 10:58:18 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Simpson's Treehouse of Horror XII and HP (spoilery)
References: <9gnrg6+qba1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <022601c0f8d8$a96b9bc0$2cb8fea9@hale>


----- Original Message -----
From: Milz <absinthe at mad.scientist.com>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2001 10:35 AM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Simpson's Treehouse of Horror XII and HP
(spoilery)


>
> I wonder if the kids will be using Latin terms for these frog
> transfigurations. I guess it would be "Regis Filius", which the
> writers would probably change to "Regis Philbinus" or something like
> that.....
>
> Milz

I'm trying to wrack my memory but I wouldn't be surprised if they did spoof
something related to Harry Potter.  I know this season (2000-2001), the show
has mentioned Harry Potter.  The mention was in an episode where I believe
Ned Flanders was reading to Tod and condemned the book as promoting
witchcraft & satanism or something like that....

Michela Ecks




From ochfd42 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 19 16:05:16 2001
From: ochfd42 at yahoo.com (Angela Boyko)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 12:05:16 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Harry Potter Lego
Message-ID: <20010619160516.67875.qmail@web11704.mail.yahoo.com>

I was looking at the Lego pamphlet that came with a
new set (women's soccer team, woo hoo!) and there was
an ad for future movie related Harry Potter Lego!
Sadly, no pictures or details, just a shot of the owl
carrying the Hogwarts letter.

I'm all kinds of excited, I love Lego and HP. I
already know that I will not be sharing this set with
my five year old nephew. He bothers me by attaching
wheels to a Star Wars landspeeder, I will not be able
to stand him declaring that Harry is one of the bad
guys, or whatever his imagination makes him say!

Angela


=====
* * * http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/4439/index.html * * *
               May the Force be with you

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From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Tue Jun 19 16:46:05 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 16:46:05 -0000
Subject: Simpson's Treehouse of Horror XII and HP (spoilery)
In-Reply-To: <022601c0f8d8$a96b9bc0$2cb8fea9@hale>
Message-ID: <9gnvke+ll0e@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Michela Ecks" <mecks at p...> wrote:
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Milz <absinthe at m...>
> To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at y...>
> Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2001 10:35 AM
> Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Simpson's Treehouse of Horror XII and HP
> (spoilery)
> 
> 
> >
> > I wonder if the kids will be using Latin terms for these frog
> > transfigurations. I guess it would be "Regis Filius", which the
> > writers would probably change to "Regis Philbinus" or something 
like
> > that.....
> >
> > Milz
> 
> I'm trying to wrack my memory but I wouldn't be surprised if they 
did spoof
> something related to Harry Potter.  I know this season (2000-2001), 
the show
> has mentioned Harry Potter.  The mention was in an episode where I 
believe
> Ned Flanders was reading to Tod and condemned the book as promoting
> witchcraft & satanism or something like that....
> 
> Michela Ecks

It was something like Ned reading "and Harry Potter and all his demon 
worshipping friends all went to hell." and Rod and Todd say "yay!" 

But if they dedicate a segment of the show to a Harry Potter spoof, I 
think they'll REALLY spoof Harry...Principal Skinner like Dumbledore, 
Mrs. Krabbappel like Snape, Lisa as Hermione (natch!), Milhouse as 
Ron, etc. It'll be interesting to see how far they go.

Milz




From aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org  Tue Jun 19 17:06:31 2001
From: aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org (Meredith Wilson)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 10:06:31 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] No! Film and merchandise stuff
Message-ID: <D8085AFE4BC7D4119EA00090271EDF1503C241@MAILSRV>

Well, I was looking at the cards, and the one at the bottom with Fluffy her
hair looks blond-ish, but I think that's reflecting light.  The one of her
with the spells (in the middle) definitely has brown bushy hair, and I like
it quite a bit!  Definitely better than the WB stuff...

Meredith

>How much blonder is Hermione, who has brown hair in the books, going to
get?
>The WB pictures at least seem to have her with light brown hair but these
>latest pictures seem to have her as an outright blonde.



From lj2d30 at gateway.net  Tue Jun 19 17:12:29 2001
From: lj2d30 at gateway.net (Trina)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 17:12:29 -0000
Subject: A few random thoughts...
Message-ID: <9go15t+j2ll@eGroups.com>

In the midst of a mad cross-stitching frenzy to finish the bibs I am 
making for my cousin's baby shower this Saturday, I will take a few 
minutes to share some recent discoveries.

Yesterday as I was in the bookstore I found a book entitled "Harry 
Potter for Muggles" by HP Publishers.  It was a slim volume that 
explained the world of HP to the common folk.  I perused it and was 
not impressed, notably for the glaring errors.  Hagrid's name was 
misspelled (Rubius) and Ron was described as 'one of the six Weasley 
children'(but in the character list at the end of the book, all 7 
Weasley children were listed).  Each book was briefly summarized and 
then details were given along the lines of "The truth about Peter 
Pettigrew is found out. page 365-367"  However, in the midst of the 
detailed description of CoS it suddenly veered off into PoA.  Were 
the editors even awake?  Also some drawings which made everyone look 
slightly strung out.  A definite Never-Read.

I just finished reading Anna Maxted's novel "Getting Over It", a 
novel in the manner of _Bridget Jones_, although not in diary form.  
Rather funny and touching (it delineates the year after 26 yo Helen's 
father dies) but I prefer Bridget.  In the wake of the misused 
apostrophe thread, I immediately noticed the following error (used 
multiple times) in which Helen refers to a disasterous drunken 
incident:  The Dog's Bottoms Disaster.  Can you spot the mistake?  
<vbg>  Drove me batty as it was mentioned at least three more times 
in the exact same way, especially as two pages prior the 
phrase "dogs' bottoms" was used correctly.  Again, were the editors 
even awake?

What My Name Means:

Okay, a little late, but here goes.

Trina--pure one (Greek, comes from Katherine)
  or   of the sacred kusa grass (Hindi, a recent discovery in a new 
baby name book)

Leigh--from the pasture meadow (Old English)
  or   poetic (Gaelic, fom Laoidheach)

My last name means "an inland river barge" and comes from Scotland I 
believe.

Trina 









From aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org  Tue Jun 19 17:38:17 2001
From: aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org (Meredith Wilson)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 10:38:17 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??
Message-ID: <D8085AFE4BC7D4119EA00090271EDF1503C242@MAILSRV>

My name (Meredith) means Protector of the Sea, which I like because I've
always had a mermaid thing.  My middle name is Morrison (my grandmother's
maiden name and my aunt's middle name) which I assume means son of Morris.
Hale is my maiden name which means 'healthy' like 'hale and hearty' and
Wilson I guess means 'son of Wil.'  Being my married name, I don't know
quite as much about it, but if anyone has insight, I'd love to know. :)
 
Meredith

Has anyone thought about what their name means? To start the 
conversation, here's what mine mean:





From aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org  Tue Jun 19 17:47:41 2001
From: aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org (Meredith Wilson)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 10:47:41 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] I love you gifts(This is a long post)
Message-ID: <D8085AFE4BC7D4119EA00090271EDF1503C243@MAILSRV>

Jamieson, that's terrible.  First of all, your partner should never bug you
about your looks, in my opinion.  Be it weight or whatever.  My personal
rule of thumb is keep your mouth shut about other people unless it's
something they can immediately fix (like spinich in your teeth).  I'm hard
on myself sometimes about my size, but if my husband was, I'd be forced to
kick his butt from here to Timbuktu.  It's none of his business, and if he's
with me because of my stunning good looks, (which he wouldn't be because I
don't have stunning good looks...) I wouldn't want him to be with me at all.
 
And I love you gifts are great, and I also have a problem with people who
won't buy you what you want just because it's impractical or even because
they don't like it.  If you like it, it should be good enough for them
because you like it.  Anyway, enough of my rant... sorry you're upset.  I
hope it works out.
 
Meredith

-----Original Message-----
From: Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve [mailto:crowswolf at sympatico.ca]
Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 4:00 PM
To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] I love you gifts(This is a long post)


Hello everybody...

Well, your friendly neighbourhood Jamieson feels like crying at the 
moment, and I need to get it off my chest....It's really REALLY off 
topic, but I'd love you guys even more if you read it all the way 
through. I need someone to listen, if they could be so kind....

I was out shopping with my partner Mitch this afternoon. I picked up a 
new book ("Bride By Surprise" by Muriel Jensen...it's a romance. Yes, 
their fluffy, but I love em!). 

But we're in a clothing store, and I was looking at a pair of pants 
that I thought were really neat. It went like this:

Mitch: Try the X-Large
Me: Goodness, have I gotten that big?
Mitch: Yep. You have. You used to be thin, and now look at you.

Needless to say, I just sort of shrugged that off. Kind of like, yeah, 
Okay, whatever. 

So, from there, I went to work. Now, for months and months and months, 
he's been promising to buy me the collectible figureine of Hermione. I 
dropped loads of hints about it today. Thing is, I buy him lots and 
lots of what I call "I Love You Gifts". Just a little something to 
show Mitch that I love him.

So, I phone him, and the conversation went like this:

Me: Hey sexy, did you buy me a present, ha ha ha?
Mitch: No. Why would I do that?
Me: What? 
Mitch: Well, it's not a practical gift. I believe in buying practical 
things.
Me: But you never buy me anything. 
Mitch: My point exactly. You have un-practical tastes. And I don't 
want you buying those pants, by the way.
Me: the blue ones with the red stripe?
Mitch: Yes.
Me: Why?
Mitch: cus you'll look fat in them.
Me: But I haven't even worn them yet! I'm buying them tomorrow!
Mitch: Well, whatever. You're the one whos fat, not me. I'm only 
telling you this for your own good.
Me: (practially in tears, and at work) Fine. I'll pick up the pants, 
and the *(&(^%^%#$% $#@!#%&&$%*^ $%(&*()&*^ )&)**&  **&&^^%%#! !@#%$% 
figure myself tomorrow. 
Mitch: Well, I'll just go and buy it for you now.
Me: Don't f*****g bother, I'll get it myself.
Mitch: Now you're being unreasonable.
Me: I have to get back to work.
Mitch: I love you.
Me: --click--

Can anyone see why I'm upset here? He is a Leo, and wants to be in 
control of the situation, but that's ridiculous! 

Thanx to all who've read this through to the end...I just needed to 
get it off my chest, so I don't break down into tears at work right 
now!

Sigh, I feel better.
Jamieson



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From mecks at prodigy.net  Tue Jun 19 18:02:45 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 13:02:45 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??
References: <D8085AFE4BC7D4119EA00090271EDF1503C242@MAILSRV>
Message-ID: <029e01c0f8fa$e83d0740$2cb8fea9@hale>


----- Original Message -----
From: Meredith Wilson <aviationoutreachcoord at museumofflight.org>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2001 12:38 PM
Subject: RE: [HPFGU-OTChatter] What's your name mean??


> My name (Meredith) means Protector of the Sea, which I like because I've
> always had a mermaid thing.  My middle name is Morrison (my grandmother's
> maiden name and my aunt's middle name) which I assume means son of Morris.
> Hale is my maiden name which means 'healthy' like 'hale and hearty' and

Gah.  Hale is my real last name.  The jokes where people use the spelling
hail get old really fast.  I went to a catholic elementry school until about
fifth grade and I remember being teasted by my classmates who would rewrite
the Hail Mary as a form of saterization.  "Hale Laura."

As for the name I go by on-line, Michela is derived from Micheal (As is my
middle name, Michelle.  That was intentional.)  and means "of God" if I
remember correctly.  Ecks, I have no clue but I chose it since I pronounce
it X and that letter has a lot of interesting conotations...

Michela Ecks




From hettick.1 at osu.edu  Tue Jun 19 20:59:51 2001
From: hettick.1 at osu.edu (Heather Hettick)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 16:59:51 -0400
Subject: Madness
In-Reply-To: <992906569.2614.6665.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <NDBBLGKHGLCIANICKAJCCEPIDDAA.hettick.1@osu.edu>

I hadn't even heard of the HP books until last fall.  I first heard of them
on a machine knitting list I'm on as people were worried about having a
certain HP sweater pattern taken off the internet because of the copyright
stuff and a lot of people wanted to make them as Christmas gifts for kids
who were into HP.

I needed some good reading for Thanksgiving to stave off boredom at the
in-laws and asked a co-worker for suggestions.  She suggested the HP books
and since our institute had them in the library I started the first one.
The librarian spoke well of them too, so I was encouraged and was actually
reading the third book by Thanksgiving.  Actually, I think I'm a bit more
nuts about HP than the people who originally suggested I read the books.

Since then, I've gotten one of my sisters to read the books and she loves
them.  She moved to Germany and found several other HP fans to borrow the
next three books from and gave me back mine when I visited for her wedding
in April.  I bought the first three books in the British paperback version
and I got my Mom to read the first one on the plane ride back, and she's on
the second one now.  My husband has promised to read the first book at least
before the movie comes out.  He hasn't gotten that far, but we saw the movie
trailer when we took our daughter to see Shrek and I think it helped spark
his interest a little, and she was more excited by the HP movie trailer than
the movie.  She's just 3 and I've only read her the first couple chapters of
the first book, but she loves the cover pictures.  I really need to find
these 3D pop-up books for her.

Heather Hettick




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Tue Jun 19 21:14:40 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 21:14:40 -0000
Subject: Photo
Message-ID: <9gofc1+da93@eGroups.com>

Hello

I can not remember who I told, but in light of the recent comments on 
hair dying, I have finally got around to uploading a more recent 
photo of me.

Blond!Simon is at http://www.geocities.com/hert0661/simon.jpg


Rude comments not appreciated.


Simon




From michelleapostolides at lineone.net  Tue Jun 19 21:14:45 2001
From: michelleapostolides at lineone.net (Michelle Apostolides)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 22:14:45 +0100
Subject: Challenge for LOTR fans
Message-ID: <013b01c0f904$de36e9a0$8f3f7bd5@tmeltcds>

OK, here's one that will make you think.

I could not relate to The Hobbit. Can you please "sell" LOTR in such a
way as to make me want to read it ?

Michelle




From michelleapostolides at lineone.net  Tue Jun 19 21:17:18 2001
From: michelleapostolides at lineone.net (Michelle Apostolides)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 22:17:18 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Photo
References: <9gofc1+da93@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <014101c0f905$39845360$8f3f7bd5@tmeltcds>

> Hello
>
> I can not remember who I told, but in light of the recent comments on
> hair dying, I have finally got around to uploading a more recent
> photo of me.
Was that taken at your graduation ? How did you do ?

You look very innocent with blonde hair. But I think it suits you.

Michelle




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Tue Jun 19 21:46:31 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 21:46:31 -0000
Subject: Photo
In-Reply-To: <014101c0f905$39845360$8f3f7bd5@tmeltcds>
Message-ID: <9goh7n+mobi@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Michelle Apostolides" 
<michelleapostolides at l...> wrote:
> > Hello
> >
> > I can not remember who I told, but in light of the recent        
> > comments on hair dying, I have finally got around to uploading a 
> > more recent photo of me.
>
> Was that taken at your graduation ? How did you do ?

That photo was taken about 15 minutes after I finished my final exam 
(yes I did wear that clothing for exams), which was also my 22nd 
birthday (31st May). My results were not out early this afternoon, 
but should be out sometime late this evening (i.e. by now). I should 
hopefully find out tomorrow morning when I go and read the list 
outside the Exams Schools, this is asuming there have been no 
problems. I will probably graduate in May of next year (I get a 
choice in these things due to the odd way things are organised around 
here).

 
> You look very innocent with blonde hair. But I think it suits you.

Thanks. I think it may also have been a result of the totally asleep 
state I was in by then. I was really not with it. I like it, but feel 
it may be too much of a hassle to do often.


Simon




From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Tue Jun 19 22:55:24 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 22:55:24 -0000
Subject: Photo
In-Reply-To: <9goh7n+mobi@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gol8s+vmdi@eGroups.com>

Hi Simon,

I like your new 'do it looks very nice. I don't see why anyone would 
give you any rude comments. 
  
 Cheers,
        Kristin




From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Tue Jun 19 23:02:33 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 23:02:33 -0000
Subject: Moulin Rouge
Message-ID: <9golm9+2v16@eGroups.com>

Okay so I'm a bit behind the eight ball but I finally saw Moulin 
Rouge today.  

Wow what great visuals. I definately liked it and will probably have 
to see it again because some scenes were a bit overwhelming, 
visually. Of course I love Ewan, such great eyes how could you not 
love him. A definate add to the video collection when it comes out.

Okay enough of my babbling, I'll go back to trying to catch up on 
everything. Being offline for a week sure does get you behind.

Cheers,

        Kristin




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Wed Jun 20 00:21:43 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (Parker Brown Nesbit)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 20:21:43 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Photo
Message-ID: <F6M41NzzBdDA6VzpJxV00006bd3@hotmail.com>




>From: "Pigwidgeon" <pigwidgeon at inbox.as>
>Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Photo
>Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 21:14:40 -0000
>

Ack!  Simon, I couldn't access the site.  And I do so want to see you with 
blond hair...

Peace & Plenty,

Parker


'...I can teach you how to bottle fame, brew glory, even stopper death...'  
Severus Snape, Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone

'...I have not been helping Sirius get into the castle and I certainly don't 
want Harry dead.'  An odd shiver passed over his face. 'But I won't deny 
that I am a werewolf.'  Remus Lupin, Harry Potter and the Prisoner of 
Azkaban

'But I'm also--I don't know if anyone ever told you--I'm your godfather.'  
Sirius Black, Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From meboriqua at aol.com  Wed Jun 20 00:37:33 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 00:37:33 -0000
Subject: Misunderstood Witches
Message-ID: <9gor8d+pqjc@eGroups.com>

A few bad witchy things have gone on recently here in NYC and I 
realized that this is the perfect place to discuss them!  I'm hoping 
you all will get as annoyed and frustrated as I was.

I teach in a school in the Bronx that houses a number of different 
schools (at least five different programs with students ranging in 
grades from 1st through high school).  In the mornings, I often end up 
on the bus with a teacher who teaches 5th grade (I teach in an 
alternative high school on another floor) and we chat.  When I asked 
her what her class was reading, she mentioned the Harry Potter books 
(which are generally too difficult for 5th graders in NYC public 
schools as most of our students are not up to grade level with their 
skills).  Of course, I got excited and asked her if she had read them.  
"I don't really like them," she said (her class, needless to say, did 
not read them).  I asked her, again, if she had actually read them, 
and she said "No, not really."  She then proceeded to tell me that her 
beliefs did not go with the books and she wouldn't feel comfortable 
teaching them.  

Now, that is fine with me.  There are things that I wouldn't feel 
comfortable teaching (can't think of a good example off the top of my 
head), but what she said next was, to me, so ignorant and just, well, 
stupid that I had trouble controlling my temper (which is ugly - trust 
me).  She began to tell me that since the stories were about 
witchcraft, they were bad and preached evil.  She clearly had no idea 
what she was talking about as she hadn't even read so much as the 
first chapter of SS, but she insisted she was right.  I tried to 
explain to her that one of the bigger themes of the stories was the 
struggle of good against evil.  "Well, who is good, then?" she asked.  
"HARRY POTTER is good!" I told her.

Then she told me about how bad witches are and how they all worship 
Satan and blah blah blah.  Nothing I said could convince her that the 
opposite is true (one of my closest friends is a Wiccan, and a nicer 
person you couldn't find).  I wanted to slap her.  It's not worth it 
to repeat the rest of our debate.

Today there is a news story about a teacher who may be fired because 
she is accused of being a witch!  I haven't heard the whole story yet, 
but who cares if she is?  If she worships Satan (which I doubt), then 
she isn't a witch anyway!  If she IS a witch, firing her would be no 
different than firing me because I am Jewish.

I know this is something that has come up before, but it is so sad to 
me that people can close themselves off from history and literature 
like that - all in the name of their "beliefs".  

Sorry for the rant.  I was just curious to know what others thought.  
BTW, I haven't brought up HP with that other teacher.  If it comes up 
again, I'll get too angry so I hope it doesn't.

--jenny from ravenclaw********




From randomnana at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 20 01:49:32 2001
From: randomnana at yahoo.com (randomnana at yahoo.com)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 01:49:32 -0000
Subject: quiz...I'm a little behind!!
Message-ID: <9govfc+b21t@eGroups.com>

Hi-
I was just wondering if anyone knows where I can find the 
infamous "Which character do you relate to" quiz?  I see it mentioned 
on HP4GU all the time, and I want to take it to myself!!
Thanks, 
Natalie-whose name means "Christmas Child" as my birthday is right 
after Christmas




From linman6868 at aol.com  Wed Jun 20 03:17:02 2001
From: linman6868 at aol.com (linman6868 at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 03:17:02 -0000
Subject: Pronunciation of "Animagus"
Message-ID: <9gp4je+md9o@eGroups.com>

The subject heading ought to tell you what I'm on about.  How do you 
pronounce "Animagus"?  I'm asking because I just recently looked up 
the word "magus" in the dictionary and it has a long 'a', as 
in "bagel."  *snerk*  But I'd been pronouncing "Animagus", rather 
awkwardly, with two deep 'a's as in "father."  So what's correct?  Or 
do we know?

Lisa I.




From catlady at wicca.net  Wed Jun 20 04:09:20 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 21:09:20 -0700
Subject: King's X station
Message-ID: <3B3021F0.39DE8288@wicca.net>

Is there an auto rental drop-off at/near King's Cross? 
-- 
          /\ /\                                          ___  ___
           + +     Mews and views                       ( @ \/ @ ) 
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston        \ @  @ / 
                                                          \ () /  
                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._             \  / 
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)       \/ 
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((



From jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu  Wed Jun 20 04:36:51 2001
From: jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu (Jen Faulkner)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 00:36:51 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Pronunciation of "Animagus"
In-Reply-To: <9gp4je+md9o@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106192358580.13564-100000@er4.rutgers.edu>

On Wed, 20 Jun 2001 linman6868 at aol.com wrote:

> The subject heading ought to tell you what I'm on about.  How do you 
> pronounce "Animagus"?  I'm asking because I just recently looked up 
> the word "magus" in the dictionary and it has a long 'a', as 
> in "bagel."  *snerk*  But I'd been pronouncing "Animagus", rather 
> awkwardly, with two deep 'a's as in "father."  So what's correct?  Or 
> do we know?

According to the Scholastic site,
http://www.scholastic.com/harrypotter/books/pronunciation/play.htm, it's
"An-i-MAYJ'us."  

The first a is short (as in 'cat' or 'apple')  due to the short vowel in
the Latin 'animal'.  

Perhaps I'm just being dense, but the long a is baffling me, since
'magus' in Latin has a short a.  (The alpha in Greek 'ma/gos', however,
may be long? *stares at the online LSJ entry: [a^]* But etymologically
I'm sure 'magus' is a Latin and not a Greek borrowing anyway.)  I
suppose there is a connection with the long a of 'mage', since the other
words in the family ('magic', 'magi') have a short a -- French
influence?  Either there is simple analogical change at work (more
likely, IMO) or a different etymological history than 'magic' and
'magi'.

(I'd like to check the OED but I'm away from my computer and so not
able to use Rutgers' OED account.  Anyone?)

I suspect analogical change from 'mage' (or from 'magic' or 'magi') is
also to be counted responsible for the soft 'g', since it would
otherwise be a hard g (coming before a 'u').  Here, I'd be not at all
surprised if the Scholastic site were wrong.

HTH!

--jen :)

"Will you be the one I've wanted, will you read my mind?
Will you ask me where I hurt, and heal me with your eyes?"
			--melissa ferrick

jen's fics: http://www.eden.rutgers.edu/~jfaulkne/
jen's LJ: http://www.livejournal.com/users/lysimache/





From s_ings at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 20 04:45:07 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 21:45:07 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Photo
In-Reply-To: <9gofc1+da93@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010620044507.35676.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Pigwidgeon <pigwidgeon at inbox.as> wrote:
> Hello
> 
> I can not remember who I told, but in light of the
> recent comments on 
> hair dying, I have finally got around to uploading a
> more recent 
> photo of me.
> 
> Blond!Simon is at
> http://www.geocities.com/hert0661/simon.jpg
> 
> 
> Rude comments not appreciated.
> 
> 
> Simon

Blond!Simon looks very good. It suits you.

Sheryll, who can't imagine anyone making rude comments
to Simon

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
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From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Wed Jun 20 07:23:06 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 07:23:06 -0000
Subject: Photo
In-Reply-To: <20010620044507.35676.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gpj0q+kgop@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Sheryll Townsend <s_ings at y...> wrote:
> 
> --- Pigwidgeon <pigwidgeon at i...> wrote:
> > Hello
> > 
> > I can not remember who I told, but in light of the
> > recent comments on 
> > hair dying, I have finally got around to uploading a
> > more recent 
> > photo of me.
> > 
> > Blond!Simon is at
> > http://www.geocities.com/hert0661/simon.jpg
> > 
> > 
> > Rude comments not appreciated.
> > 
> > 
> > Simon
> 
> Blond!Simon looks very good. It suits you.
> 
> Sheryll, who can't imagine anyone making rude comments
> to Simon

Picture now in the groups files section at: 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/Group%
20Members/simon.jpg


Simon




From jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 20 09:29:39 2001
From: jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk (Benjamin)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 09:29:39 -0000
Subject: Photo
In-Reply-To: <20010620044507.35676.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gpqe3+icsk@eGroups.com>


> 
> Blond!Simon looks very good. It suits you.
 
Yes alright.  I admit it, it does look quite good.  Definitely 
tending towards option b. anyway

> Sheryll, who can't imagine anyone making rude comments
> to Simon

Well exactly, he has a deadly bean-bag for a start 

-Ben.

"You have no permission to talk.  Goodbye" (Pine's response to me 
trying to locate an earlier message to find out whether I mean option 
b, instead of a)






From jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 20 09:33:55 2001
From: jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk (Benjamin)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 09:33:55 -0000
Subject: Thought Processes
Message-ID: <9gpqm3+kepl@eGroups.com>


I was sitting in the park yesterday, and found myself thinking in 
words; thought like speech (about dinosaurs for some reason).

This was quite a strange experience for me, because I used to think 
in pictures.  I don't mean photo-like pictures, but sort of semi-
abstract images.

I'll try and explain ? I was working out what to say to a friend of 
mine one time, planned it all out in my mind, sorted exactly what I 
wanted to say, but went and saw him and suddenly realised that the 
result of all my musings was not words, but a triptych of images: if 
nothing happens then the first picture ? if only one thing, then the 
second (both of these fairly morose outcomes) but if two things, then 
the third ? which is great.  It seemed obvious, but how to translate 
this into words I had no idea ("Well, you see, there's sort of an 
orange background
").  Anyway, I ended up waffling for about half-an-
hour, which annoyed both of us no end.  He eventually got the idea ? 
I was just trying to say thanks.

I just wondered ? does this sort of thing happen to anybody else? (I 
mean thinking in completely different ways [being able to think in 
music would be great? Perhaps that's Bach] as opposed to not being 
able to say, "thank you" in an eloquent and non-insulting way).

-Ben.

"...injuries inflicted by vegetables remain unacceptably high..."
-New Scientist




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Wed Jun 20 10:21:33 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 10:21:33 -0000
Subject: Thought Processes and photo
In-Reply-To: <9gpqm3+kepl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gptfd+9j72@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Benjamin" <jaffa276 at y...> wrote:
> "...injuries inflicted by vegetables remain unacceptably high..."
> -New Scientist

Not all that relevant to the rest of the message, but those mange 
tout are deadly ;)


> > Blond!Simon looks very good. It suits you.
>  
> Yes alright.  I admit it, it does look quite good.  Definitely 
> tending towards option b. anyway

I cannot remember what a or b are either and the message has gone 
missing.

 
> > Sheryll, who can't imagine anyone making rude comments
> > to Simon
> 
> Well exactly, he has a deadly bean-bag for a start 

You leave the bean bag out of this.


> -Ben.
>
> "You have no permission to talk.  Goodbye" (Pine's response to me 
> trying to locate an earlier message to find out whether I mean     
> option b, instead of a)

Well I hope you obeyed and have not talked. You may start when it 
says you can ;)


Simon




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Wed Jun 20 10:36:35 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 10:36:35 -0000
Subject: Shoes and shop
Message-ID: <9gpubj+pbn1@eGroups.com>

Hello

Apologies - this may end up a bit of a rant.


I went out shopping this morning to get:
Shoes, black formal
Socks, black 
Stamps 
Disposable camera.

I came back with:
3 pairs of socks
A pair of sunglasses
One black cummerbund

And the friend I went with got three disposable camera (they were on 
special offer).

The stamps I forgot due to me not entering a shop that sold them and 
I decided I would get them later. The shoes is a different problem. I 
have been in nearly all the shops selling shoes in central Oxford. I 
have yet to find a pair that I liked that I could afford. I am fed 
up - have been shopping for 2 hours and cannot eat lunch until I have 
gone out again.

Looks like I have the joy of more shopping this afternoon to look 
forward to.


Simon




From yael_pou at hotmail.com  Wed Jun 20 12:37:13 2001
From: yael_pou at hotmail.com (yael oren)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 14:37:13 +0200
Subject: Shoes and shop; Thought process; Photo
References: <9gpubj+pbn1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <OE24zHYWTeU07me0tEL00000548@hotmail.com>

Simon: "The shoes is a different problem. I 
have been in nearly all the shops selling shoes in central Oxford. I 
have yet to find a pair that I liked that I could afford. I am fed 
up - have been shopping for 2 hours and cannot eat lunch until I have 
gone out again."

I don't blame you. I did the exact same thing a few weeks ago. Very naively, I thought that Reebok would be cheaper in the UK. How wrong I was. Those are extremely expensive, as are all non last-pairs-remaining-sizes-3-and-15. I got me new shoes when I came back here.

Good luck, Simon.

BTW - that blonde hair is cute, but you still look more like Harry than Draco. What is a "bean-bag"? Is that related to everyone in the UK saying our baby girl is "full of beans"? :)

Benjamin: "I just wondered - does this sort of thing happen to anybody else? (I 
mean thinking in completely different ways [being able to think in 
music would be great? Perhaps that's Bach] as opposed to not being 
able to say, "thank you" in an eloquent and non-insulting way)."

What method did you use to think up this mail? :)

Yep. First time I experienced this sort of "conversational thinking" I was seven, and I was abashed when I realised I had just rehearsed convincing my doctor that I was too sick to go to school. At some other stage of my life, I stopped talking almost completely, because I grew tired of needing to translate thoughts all the time.

When I write, I keep seeing everything play, just like a slow-motion movie, and there is music in the background, only it's not exactly music... Can't explain... Augh! Anyway, I think that's the reason my characters keep surprising me with the things they say when they open up their mouths.


Thanks, yael


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 20 11:37:42 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 04:37:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Shoes and shop
In-Reply-To: <9gpubj+pbn1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010620113742.92816.qmail@web14607.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Pigwidgeon <pigwidgeon at inbox.as> wrote:
> Hello
> 
> Apologies - this may end up a bit of a rant.
> 
> 
> I went out shopping this morning to get:
> Shoes, black formal
> Socks, black 
> Stamps 
> Disposable camera.
> 
> I came back with:
> 3 pairs of socks
> A pair of sunglasses
> One black cummerbund
> 
> And the friend I went with got three disposable
> camera (they were on 
> special offer).
> 
> The stamps I forgot due to me not entering a shop
> that sold them and 
> I decided I would get them later. The shoes is a
> different problem. I 
> have been in nearly all the shops selling shoes in
> central Oxford. I 
> have yet to find a pair that I liked that I could
> afford. I am fed 
> up - have been shopping for 2 hours and cannot eat
> lunch until I have 
> gone out again.
> 
> Looks like I have the joy of more shopping this
> afternoon to look 
> forward to.
> 
> 
> Simon

My first thought was to offer you Andy's dress shoes
(which sit in the closet and never get worn). However,
a) no one wants to wear someone else's shoes
b) it's a long hike to come and get them (and a bit of
a swim to boot!)
c) I've never met anyone else who wears a size 13 shoe

The reason I thought of offering them in first place
is because I hate shopping and totally sympathise with
anyone who must spend hours in stores looking for
things.

Sheryll, who is leaving for Toronto in 90 minutes and
is STILL not finished packing

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 20 11:43:39 2001
From: jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk (Benjamin)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:43:39 -0000
Subject: Shoes and shop
In-Reply-To: <9gpubj+pbn1@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gq29b+ehat@eGroups.com>


Really Simon, you mean you've spent the morning going round a 
beautiful city, on a sunny day, with a friend, without any work to do 
what so ever...  

Having said that buying shoes is always a painful experience, 
especially in Oxford.  I have to start looking months before my old 
ones wear out, as no-one sells size 11.5, so have to find a extra 
large 11 or, more usually, a small twelve, which are very rare.  

Surely you have formal black shoes though - for sub-fusc?  Mind you, 
when doing my prelim. exams I had to patch my shoes with a Minstrels 
wrapper (can't revise *and* go shopping)

Go and have lunch, it'll make you feel better (and when you're out 
this afternoon you could get some more hair dye ~ Straw!Simon seems 
to be growing on me, and I was right, it is option b, although 
should've given c as well.) 

-Ben.

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Pigwidgeon" <pigwidgeon at i...> wrote:
> Hello
> 
> Apologies - this may end up a bit of a rant.
> 
> 
> I went out shopping this morning to get:
> Shoes, black formal
> Socks, black 
> Stamps 
> Disposable camera.
> 
> I came back with:
> 3 pairs of socks
> A pair of sunglasses
> One black cummerbund

[snip]




From jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 20 12:09:35 2001
From: jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk (Benjamin)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 12:09:35 -0000
Subject: Beans
In-Reply-To: <OE24zHYWTeU07me0tEL00000548@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9gq3pv+8vnk@eGroups.com>


> 
Yael: BTW - that blonde hair is cute, but you still look more like 
Harry than Draco. What is a "bean-bag"? Is that related to everyone 
in the UK saying our baby girl is "full of beans"? :)
> 

Is he trying to look like Draco? Personally I think it is better that 
he looks like Simon...

Full of beans means jumping up and running around a lot.  You can't 
jump on a beanbag, 'cos it is a fabric sack filled with balls of 
expanded polystyrene which moulds to your body when you sit in it, 
and as such, sadly, doesn't spring.  Of course, if you put your 
daughter into a sack and she continues to jump around a lot, it could 
possibly be contrived to call that a bean-bag. But I wouldn't 
recommend attempting the experiment. 

Simon has one (beanbag) which is multicoloured, onto which I managed 
to bring us both crashing down when I tripped over the corner of the 
bed as I tried to go down stairs to dinner.  However, the deadly-
beanbag reference is actually from an article I read recently
http://www.newscientist.com/feedback/feedback.jsp?id=ns229415
apparently over 1000 people (in the UK) needed hospitalisation due to 
accidents with beanbags last year.  Not to mention injuries from 
vegetables, tea-cosies, pants...

That's really too much information isn't it? The colour of 
embarrassment is plain yellow, though can incorporate black features 
in some circumstances.

-Ben.






From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 20 13:00:27 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 06:00:27 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Thought Processes
In-Reply-To: <9gpqm3+kepl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010620130027.87118.qmail@web14508.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Benjamin <jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> I just wondered  does this sort of thing happen to anybody else? (I 
> mean thinking in completely different ways [being able to think in 
> music would be great? Perhaps that's Bach] as opposed to not being 
> able to say, "thank you" in an eloquent and non-insulting way).

I was sitting here trying to figure out how I think. It's harder than I
thought it would be! <grin>

For the most part, I think in words, sentences, never-ending ramblings.
I will almost always rehearse conversations in my head, with the
conversations going in all different directions. I'm almost certain
this comes from being too dang quiet in Real Life and my mind's frantic
desire to express itself. This is really awful at night when I want to
sleep and my mind won't shut up!

Sometimes, though, I think in pictures. In my mind's eye, I will see
myself performing an action with no babble accompanied with it. If I'm
working on a story, I'll sometimes see the scene vividly (kinda like a
movie). That doesn't happen often though. <sigh> I think it's more
strong visualization and role-playing as opposed to actually
associating colors/shapes as thoughts.

Mostly I think in conventional words though. Nothing nearly so cool as
thinking "Thank You" in pictures or music. Ever in the norm, that's
me...

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Wed Jun 20 14:06:50 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 14:06:50 -0000
Subject: Shoes and shop
In-Reply-To: <9gq29b+ehat@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gqalq+4enn@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Benjamin" <jaffa276 at y...> wrote:
> Really Simon, you mean you've spent the morning going round a 
> beautiful city, on a sunny day, with a friend, without any work to 
> do what so ever...  

The sun has come out now and I am totally worn out and feel like 
going to sleep.


Ben:
> Having said that buying shoes is always a painful experience, 
> especially in Oxford.  I have to start looking months before my old 
> ones wear out, as no-one sells size 11.5, so have to find a extra 
> large 11 or, more usually, a small twelve, which are very rare.  

Sheryll:
> My first thought was to offer you Andy's dress shoes
> (which sit in the closet and never get worn). However,
> a) no one wants to wear someone else's shoes
> b) it's a long hike to come and get them (and a bit of
> a swim to boot!)
> c) I've never met anyone else who wears a size 13 shoe

Well I now have a pair. Oxford is crap for shoe shops. I have a real 
problem finding shoes to fit as my feet are so small (size 6 1/2).


Ben:
> Surely you have formal black shoes though - for sub-fusc?  Mind    
> you, when doing my prelim. exams I had to patch my shoes with a    
> Minstrels wrapper (can't revise *and* go shopping)

I do have a pair for that, but hey are painful. I am going to Queen's 
on Firday (http://www.thequeensball.com/) and to wear my old pair of 
shoes would have been a very painful mistake. Hence the need for a 
comfortable new pair of shoes.


Ben:
> Go and have lunch, it'll make you feel better (and when you're out 
> this afternoon you could get some more hair dye ~ Straw!Simon seems 
> to be growing on me, and I was right, it is option b, although 
> should've given c as well.) 

I've had lunch, got hte shoes and now feel a lot better. Pity no one 
else knows what options a, b and c mean. Else that comment could be 
very funny.


Sheryll
> The reason I thought of offering them in first place
> is because I hate shopping and totally sympathise with
> anyone who must spend hours in stores looking for
> things.

I hate shoe shopping. I am ok with most other things, but finding 
shoes to fit is very very difficult and so I do not like doing so.


Simon




From ochfd42 at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 20 14:38:29 2001
From: ochfd42 at yahoo.com (Angela Boyko)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 10:38:29 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Misunderstood Witches
In-Reply-To: <9gor8d+pqjc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010620143829.64406.qmail@web11708.mail.yahoo.com>

Hmm. as far as my workplace goes, I've been told that
credit cards are evil and our service is diabolical.
:-)

> 
> Now, that is fine with me.  There are things that I
> wouldn't feel 
> comfortable teaching (can't think of a good example
> off the top of my 
> head), but what she said next was, to me, so
> ignorant and just, well, 
> stupid that I had trouble controlling my temper
> (which is ugly - trust 
> me).  She began to tell me that since the stories
> were about 
> witchcraft, they were bad and preached evil.  She
> clearly had no idea 
> what she was talking about as she hadn't even read
> so much as the 
> first chapter of SS, but she insisted she was right.
>  I tried to 
> explain to her that one of the bigger themes of the
> stories was the 
> struggle of good against evil.  "Well, who is good,
> then?" she asked.  
> "HARRY POTTER is good!" I told her.

*sigh* It would be one thing if she had actually read
the books. I prefer an informed argument than the
mindless kind. I once disliked this one girl because
my friend did, way back in my shallow college days. A
mutual friend offered the opinion that perhaps I
hadn't taken the time to really get to know her. He
was right - once I decided to be more open minded and
to see if I was wrong - she turned out to be a lovely
girl. My friend's beef with her became my friend's
beef, not mine.

I know a couple of Wiccans and I don't believe they
are evil. One can be quite unpleasant if someone slams
her favourite sports star, but she'd be that way no
matter what beliefs she practises.

Angela


=====
* * * http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/4439/index.html * * *
               May the Force be with you

_______________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca



From jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 20 15:14:20 2001
From: jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk (Benjamin)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:14:20 -0000
Subject: Hair, Balls
In-Reply-To: <9gqalq+4enn@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gqekc+9vmc@eGroups.com>



> 
Simon: I do have a pair for that, but hey are painful. I am going to 
Queen's on Firday (http://www.thequeensball.com/) and to wear my old 
pair of shoes would have been a very painful mistake. Hence the need 
for a comfortable new pair of shoes.<

Queen's ball looks great and much better than their joint effort a 
couple of years back, wish I was still in Oxford.  The price of it 
though (?70 per person) makes people's grumblings over here about the 
Trinity Ball (?45 Irish (?35 Sterling)) seem a little premature.  Who 
are you going with?

> I've had lunch, got hte shoes and now feel a lot better. Pity no 
one else knows what options a, b and c mean. Else that comment could 
be very funny.<

*rolls eyes* Fine, on your head be it. 

Earlier, judgement on Simon's hair was postponed, pending delivery of 
photo, due to lack of evidence - however, I suggested that there 
seemed to be two options, either:

a) it makes you look like a complete idiot

or 

b) it makes you look drop dead gorgeous

Stupidly I didn't give myself the option of:

c) neither of the above

Thus the ultimate arrival of the photo forces me to the self-imposed 
conclusion that Simon looks drop dead gorgeous.  This obviously 
wasn't well planned at all...

-Ben.

Ps.  I add the disclaimer that ridiculously phrased questions with 
only limited answers available do not, necessarily, give a clear 
indication of the views of the individual concerned.  We can take no 
responsibility for injury or damage, howsoever caused, to persons or 
property... 

Pps. The Oxford Balloon Company's logo is a really good mick-take. 






From jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 20 15:29:47 2001
From: jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk (Benjamin)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:29:47 -0000
Subject: Misunderstood Witches
In-Reply-To: <20010620143829.64406.qmail@web11708.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9gqfhb+anpd@eGroups.com>

Angela Boyko wrote:
[snip] She began to tell me that since the stories
> > were about 
> > witchcraft, they were bad and preached evil.  
[snip]
> I know a couple of Wiccans and I don't believe they
> are evil. One can be quite unpleasant if someone slams
> her favourite sports star, but she'd be that way no
> matter what beliefs she practises.
 
I think that perhaps the most evil person I have known was not a 
witch, but in fact assisted in a Anglican church.  She had a friend 
who was a witch (just "came out of the broom closet") and who acted 
somewhat as a calming and restraining influence.

Not that I'd hold these up as either typical or atypical of either 
form of belief.  It also depends on what is your definition of evil 
really.  The rest just seems to fall back on stereotypes.  

-Ben. Has my solvent dried yet?






From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 20 15:36:14 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:36:14 -0000
Subject: Shoes and shop
In-Reply-To: <9gqalq+4enn@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gqfte+c1d7@eGroups.com>

I'm sure no one cares about my affinity for being bare footed, but I 
just feel like posting this so...

Simon wrote:
> I hate shoe shopping. I am ok with most other things, but finding 
> shoes to fit is very very difficult and so I do not like doing so.

--I agree. The only thing I hate more than shoe shopping is wearing 
shoes. :-) I'll wear sandals/flip flops, but I can't stand socks and 
shoes. Maybe it's just a regional thing, because none of my friends 
do either.

I wonder what type of shoes Hogwarts kids wear? Are there special 
shoes for Quidditch? Is that to ON-topic for this list?

Scott
Whose best pair of heavy leather formal shoes he doesn't want to take 
to England because they are at least 5 or 6 lbs. each and take up 
lots of room (I wear a 12).




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Wed Jun 20 15:36:28 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:36:28 -0000
Subject: Hairy Balls
In-Reply-To: <9gqekc+9vmc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gqfts+pnb4@eGroups.com>

Sorry - couldn't resist making a small alteration to the subject line.

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Benjamin" <jaffa276 at y...> wrote:
> > Simon: I do have a pair for that, but hey are painful. I am going 
> > to Queen's on Firday (http://www.thequeensball.com/) and to wear 
> > my old pair of shoes would have been a very painful mistake.     
> > Hence the need for a comfortable new pair of shoes.
> 
> Queen's ball looks great and much better than their joint effort a 
> couple of years back, wish I was still in Oxford.  The price of it 
> though (?70 per person) makes people's grumblings over here about  
> the Trinity Ball (?45 Irish (?35 Sterling)) seem a little          
> premature.  Who are you going with?

A group of us are going together. As the names will mean nothing to 
the other people around here I will try to remember exactly who in a 
e-mail I may manage to send you later. New College was even more 
expensive (?215 for a double non dinning IIRC).


> > I've had lunch, got hte shoes and now feel a lot better. Pity no 
> > one else knows what options a, b and c mean. Else that comment   
> > could be very funny.
> 
> *rolls eyes* Fine, on your head be it. 

I really should have kept my mouth shut!


> Pps. The Oxford Balloon Company's logo is a really good mick-take.

It is very good.


Simon




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Wed Jun 20 15:45:27 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:45:27 -0000
Subject: Shoes and shop
In-Reply-To: <9gqfte+c1d7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gqgen+su58@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Scott" <insanus_scottus at y...> wrote:
> I'm sure no one cares about my affinity for being bare footed, but 
> I just feel like posting this so...
> 
> Simon wrote:
> > I hate shoe shopping. I am ok with most other things, but finding 
> > shoes to fit is very very difficult and so I do not like doing so.
> 
> --I agree. The only thing I hate more than shoe shopping is wearing 
> shoes. :-) I'll wear sandals/flip flops, but I can't stand socks   
> and shoes. Maybe it's just a regional thing, because none of my    
> friends do either.

I wear flip flop / sandal things a lot of the time. They are much 
more comfortable than shoes and, as I have been a lazy student for 
the last few years, require less socks to be worn. Less socks worn 
means less socks to wash and also less chance for the sock fairy to 
gobble them all up.


> I wonder what type of shoes Hogwarts kids wear? Are there special 
> shoes for Quidditch? Is that to ON-topic for this list?

Possibly it is too on topic for here, but anyway... 
Normal trainers / plimsolls? 



Simon




From jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 20 15:48:30 2001
From: jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk (Benjamin)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:48:30 -0000
Subject: Shoes and shop
In-Reply-To: <9gqfte+c1d7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gqgke+k2h2@eGroups.com>


> --I agree. The only thing I hate more than shoe shopping is wearing 
> shoes. :-) I'll wear sandals/flip flops, but I can't stand socks 
and shoes. Maybe it's just a regional thing, because none of my 
friends do either.<<

Definitely, wearing shoes is very grim.  Unfortunately I work in a 
science lab (and have just managed to shatter slivers of quartz 
everywhere) so not wearing enclosed shoes is not really an option.  
I used to go barefoot around college when I was a young undergrad 
though - but not at weekends because of all the glass from the bar.

I managed to cut my feet in the river once, and putting shoes on 
being too painful I had to walk for miles (well about 3) through the 
city barefooted.  It took hours, literally, to get all the ingrained 
dirt out.  Didn't get my feet infected though.  But I'm not convinced 
this was related to having my cuts washed with beer.

-Ben, who has go on and on far too much today.
 






From dwe199 at soton.ac.uk  Wed Jun 20 20:32:43 2001
From: dwe199 at soton.ac.uk (Dai Evans)
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 20:32:43 -0000
Subject: King's X station
In-Reply-To: <3B3021F0.39DE8288@wicca.net>
Message-ID: <9gr19b+l47a@eGroups.com>

Go to www.hertz.co.uk then select "Worldwide Locations", then search 
for a location in UK - London - Kings Cross. It should come up with a 
list of nearby addresses.

If you need any advice on their range of vehicles, don't hesitate to 
ask. I've driven them all.



Dai

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Rita Winston <catlady at w...> wrote:
> Is there an auto rental drop-off at/near King's Cross? 
> -- 
>           /\ /\                                          ___  ___
>            + +     Mews and views                       ( @ \/ @ ) 
>          >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston        \ @  @ / 
>                                                           \ () /  
>                      ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._             \  / 
>                      `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)       \/ 
>                      (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
>                     _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
>                    ((('   (((-(((''  ((((




From yael_pou at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 21 00:36:12 2001
From: yael_pou at hotmail.com (yael-pou)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 02:36:12 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: King's X station
References: <9gr19b+l47a@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <OE65WUNEnMeQlITT0dw00013e22@hotmail.com>

Does it really matter? There's no barrier between platform 9 and platform 10. Make one up :).

Thanks, yael


  --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Rita Winston <catlady at w...> wrote:
  > Is there an auto rental drop-off at/near King's Cross? 
  > -- 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From tmayor at mediaone.net  Thu Jun 21 01:54:24 2001
From: tmayor at mediaone.net (Rosmerta)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 01:54:24 -0000
Subject: JKR has a beau????????
Message-ID: <9grk4g+kg99@eGroups.com>

on the main list, Amy Z wrote: "[JRK] says her favorite things to do 
in the world are (a) spend time with her daughter and (b) write.  Now 
she has a beau, we may fairly add (c) spending time with =him=;"

>From whence did this information arise???? Normally, I would wish 
someone all the tall dark handsomeness they can handle, but in this 
case, I think her loyal fan base might be better off selfishly 
envisioning a kind of quiet, supportive chap ("great chapter, 
darling, KEEP WRITING") with a spatula and feather duster under one 
arm and a copy of "10,000 Things to Do With Your Grade Schooler" 
under the other. 

Maybe in all these debates we forgot to think about the SHIP that 
really matters, the author's SHIP. It's real-life Hermione finds her 
swain. What if he has red hair and freckles? Dark hair and glasses? 
Greasy hair and a hooked nose? Or....gasp....feathers? All valid 
clues....

~Rosmerta

 




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Thu Jun 21 03:11:23 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 03:11:23 -0000
Subject: JKR has a beau????????
In-Reply-To: <9grk4g+kg99@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9grokr+dn36@eGroups.com>

Hello Everyone!!!!

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rosmerta" <tmayor at m...> wrote:
> on the main list, Amy Z wrote: "[JRK] says her favorite things to do 
> in the world are (a) spend time with her daughter and (b) write.  
Now 
> she has a beau, we may fairly add (c) spending time with =him=;"
> 

I personally think it would be great if JKR was going out with 
someone...hopefully he wouldn't be afraid of her fame. 

She strikes me as a very lonely person. I'm sure she has friends, but 
no one to really love. So, if it's not a rumor, then I'm very happy 
for her. Everyone needs a litle love in their life!

Hugs
Jamieson




From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Thu Jun 21 04:04:04 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 05:04:04 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] JKR has a beau????????
References: <9grk4g+kg99@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <008001c0fa07$36bc5080$c33570c2@c5s910j>

> on the main list, Amy Z wrote: "[JRK] says her favorite things to do
> in the world are (a) spend time with her daughter and (b) write.  Now
> she has a beau, we may fairly add (c) spending time with =him=;"

This may be my fault, for mentioning this beau on the Moderators list.  I'm
sure I read somewhere that JKR has a boyfriend called Neil.  I don't think
it's me...

Can anyone confirm or trash this idea?

Neil
________________________________________

Flying Ford Anglia

"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
squashed, as though it had run headlong into a brick wall"
["The Leaky Cauldron", PoA]

Check out Very Frequently Asked Questions for everything
to do with this club:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/files/VFAQ.htm








From jenP_97 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 21 04:37:21 2001
From: jenP_97 at yahoo.com (Jennifer Piersol)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 04:37:21 -0000
Subject: JKR has a beau????????
In-Reply-To: <008001c0fa07$36bc5080$c33570c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9grtm1+qivi@eGroups.com>

Neil asked about JKR's beau named (possibly?) Neil...

Yes, that's what his name is.  In fact, for a split second, when I 
read about him, I thought... "OUR Neil????"  Notice, I said *split 
second*.  

Other split second thoughts that occurred to me after reading about 
Neil the boyfriend:

"I wonder if he gets to read ahead..."
"Hey... maybe he's just dating her to read ahead!"
"That jerk."
"I hope he's not going to copy the next book, submit it to papers, 
then dump her."
"What a big jerk."
"What if he distracts her from writing?"
"Oh no.  What if they get married, start travelling, and she decides 
she doesn't have time for Harry Potter any more?"
"That *$@#&^% JERK!!"

;)

Jen (who is sincerely hoping that he's 10x better than her ex, and 
that he's cheering from the sidelines: "Come on, just finish the 
chapter and then you can go to bed." )






From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 21 05:03:13 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 05:03:13 -0000
Subject: Some Agreement on Speculation
In-Reply-To: <9gmmth+ocfn@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9grv6h+gk9m@eGroups.com>



My guess that A.I., though I thought it would attract a different 
audience than HP and the SS, would possibly carry the Harry Potter 
trailer since it was so close to the end of July....is apparently 
MORE than speculation....several sources CONFIRM that A.I. will 
indeed carry the second trailer.  A.I. (Artificial Intellience) due 
at the end of June.  I give credit to the HARRY POTTER GALLERIES 
WEBSITE for the confirmations they have posted on their site.
The initial speculation was mine and mine only....I still don't rule 
out CATS AND DOGS...wouldn't be surprised if they both carried it as 
I expect the marketing to become more fierce as the movie release is 
less than 150 days away.

N

I previously wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> A website called "The Unofficial Harry Potter Movie Site" reports 
> that the second trailer will indeed be out by July and THEY ALSO 
> SPECULATE, without any explanation, that it will be "most 
> likely...CATS AND DOGS" that will be the movie the trailer precedes.
> 
> This website also mentions the third trailer will be due in 
September.
> 
> N




From miss_megan at dingoblue.net.au  Thu Jun 21 05:03:23 2001
From: miss_megan at dingoblue.net.au (Snuffles MacGoo)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 05:03:23 -0000
Subject: JKR has a beau????????
In-Reply-To: <9grtm1+qivi@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9grv6r+d2av@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Jennifer Piersol" <jenP_97 at y...> wrote:
> Neil asked about JKR's beau named (possibly?) Neil...
> 
> Yes, that's what his name is.  In fact, for a split second, when I 
> read about him, I thought... "OUR Neil????"  Notice, I said *split 
> second*. 

I think *our neil* could have a lot to add to JKR's plot and general 
ambience. Imagine, Professor Snape in fluffy bunny slippers or 
Professor McGonnagall (I fear I've spelt her name incorrectly) in a 
nice terry robe. 

storm (who has just been told she has 25 days rec leave owed to her. 
I should have a holiday!)




From dfrankis at dial.pipex.com  Thu Jun 21 11:47:14 2001
From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com (dfrankis at dial.pipex.com)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 11:47:14 -0000
Subject: JKR has a beau????????
In-Reply-To: <9grk4g+kg99@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gsms2+i3et@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rosmerta" <tmayor at m...> wrote:
. 
> 
> Maybe in all these debates we forgot to think about the SHIP that 
> really matters, the author's SHIP. It's real-life Hermione finds 
her 
> swain. What if he has red hair and freckles? Dark hair and glasses? 
> Greasy hair and a hooked nose? Or....gasp....feathers? All valid 
> clues....
> 
> ~Rosmerta

Don't worry, the real-life Rita Skeeters got onto this angle straight 
away.  He has dark 'boyish' hair and glasses.  His name is Neil 
Murray.

try 
www.femail.co.uk/pages/standard/article.html?
in_article_id=45613&in_page_id=2

which is an article in the Mail on Sunday 13th May.  Note the classic 
Skeeterisms: 'Friends believe' and 'Speculation grew'.




From dfrankis at dial.pipex.com  Thu Jun 21 12:00:30 2001
From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com (dfrankis at dial.pipex.com)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 12:00:30 -0000
Subject: Simpson's Treehouse of Horror XII and HP (spoilery)
In-Reply-To: <9gnvke+ll0e@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gsnku+mhbo@eGroups.com>


> But if they dedicate a segment of the show to a Harry Potter spoof, 
I 
> think they'll REALLY spoof Harry...Principal Skinner like 
Dumbledore, 
> Mrs. Krabbappel like Snape, Lisa as Hermione (natch!), Milhouse as 
> Ron, etc. It'll be interesting to see how far they go.
> 
> Milz

Mr Burns as Voldemort, Bart as Draco, Milhouse as Harry, Homer as  
Nearly Brainless Nick, Mo as Rosmerta, Marge's sisters as dragons?

David




From bray.262 at osu.edu  Thu Jun 21 08:59:05 2001
From: bray.262 at osu.edu (Rachel Bray)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 08:59:05 EST5EDT
Subject: a train to Washington DC
Message-ID: <15343162A0@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>

I'm leaving tomorrow morning to Washington DC with my mother.  
We're taking the train (which I'm SOOO excited about.  I've only 
been on commuter trains before) and meeting my father in DC (he's 
been there for the past week at a conference).

I'm so excited about this vacation.  I've never been to DC before.  
Sad.  I've been all over the world and I've never been to my own 
country's capital.  Anyway, I'm sure it'll be great fun.  Yes....I'm 31 
years old and going on vacation with my folks.  But what can I 
say?  They're wonderful and I enjoy spending time with them.

Anyway, I'm taking GoF and CoS.  Mom is finishing book 1 right 
now and she'll read CoS on the train.  I'm taking GoF for me so I'll 
have something to keep me busy so I'm not bugging her with "So, 
what do you think of the twins....Hermione.....Hagrid...Draco?"  I'm 
sure she'll appreciate that.  :-)

Hope everyone has a wonderful weekend and following week.  Wish 
I had a good enough laptop to take with me so I can check my e-
mail while I'm gone. (pathetic...yes)



Rachel Bray
The Ohio State University
Fees, Deposits and Disbursements

"Could have been edited by a crack-addicted ferret with
ADD who just downed a half dozen Pixie Stix."
                       - review of Moulin Rouge



From sarahlinks14 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 21 14:02:21 2001
From: sarahlinks14 at yahoo.com (Sarah Bennet)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 14:02:21 -0000
Subject: Fan fiction questions from a newbie
Message-ID: <9gsupd+84jt@eGroups.com>

Hello!

This is my first post since I joined HP4GU last month.  I've been 
catching up on the archives and just enjoying the quality of 
discussions posted here.  I was so excited to find this forum of 
adults who enjoy analyzing every last detail of HP as much as I do!  
And it has introduced ideas that hadn't come to me on my own.  (Snape 
as a vampire? - I'm beginning to see those possibilities.)  Anyways, 
I've enjoyed this group so far, and am looking forward to becoming a 
more active member. 

My question is regarding fan ficton - I thought this would be more 
appropriate for OTChatter than HP4GU.  I have read a number of posts 
that refer to fanfic, whether authored by members or not.  And I have 
read through some of the fanfic recommended in the Files section of 
this group.  But as I am becoming more familiar with 
www.fanfiction.net, I wanted to ask for additional recommendations. 

So, could you please advise me as to which fanfics you prefer, or are 
your favorites?  I'm not looking for any particular style, just a 
good sampling of what's out there.  I'd appreciate any 
recommendations!  Thanks!

Sarah




From heidit at netbox.com  Thu Jun 21 14:11:46 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 10:11:46 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Fan fiction questions from a newbie
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F92CF@miaexch1>

There are a few Yahoogroups you should try to get an overview of some of the
best "for grownups" fanfic. 
Paradigm Of Uncertainty at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ParadigmOfUncertainty
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ParadigmOfUncertainty>  features fanfic from
Lori Summers (Paradigm and Song That Never Ends), Cassandra Claire (Draco
Dormiens & Draco Sinister) and Penny&Carole (A Sirius Affair)
HP_Paradise (shameless self promotion) at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Paradise
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Paradise>  features Ebony's Trouble In
Paradise & Jana's Not Quite Paradise prequel, Al's SNITCH, Rave's Three
Leaves Left & Bryter Later, John Walton's Song of Time, Yael's Krum Do I
Love, Viola's 1940's-time Dreamwalk Blue, The Letter from Dadgrid and my own
Surfeit of Curses and Jane Austen homages
Barb LP's semi-new fic, Harry Potter & The Psychic Serpent is featured at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Psych
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Psych> 
Some ron/hermione shippers seem to be enjoying After the End at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AftertheEnd
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AftertheEnd> 
And if you like slash fics, try
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cassie_and_rhysenn
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cassie_and_rhysenn>  (It's cassie's other
mailing list - and her cohort Rhysenn writes wonderful draco/harry fics) or
the oldest hp-slash list at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hpslash
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hpslash> 
The "anyone can upload their fics" HP fanfic list is
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_FanFiction
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_FanFiction> 
 
It's really hard to find things at ffnet by clicking around these days -
there's over 13000 fics there, many of which are multi-chaptered things - so
recommendations and these lists are excellent ways to find things - although
you never know what you'll stumble over if you visit ffnet. Strange things
lurk in wonderful places!

-----Original Message-----
From: Sarah Bennet [mailto:sarahlinks14 at yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2001 10:02 AM
To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Fan fiction questions from a newbie


Real-To: "Sarah Bennet" Hello!

This is my first post since I joined HP4GU last month.  I've been 
catching up on the archives and just enjoying the quality of 
discussions posted here.  I was so excited to find this forum of 
adults who enjoy analyzing every last detail of HP as much as I do!  
And it has introduced ideas that hadn't come to me on my own.  (Snape 
as a vampire? - I'm beginning to see those possibilities.)  Anyways, 
I've enjoyed this group so far, and am looking forward to becoming a 
more active member. 

My question is regarding fan ficton - I thought this would be more 
appropriate for OTChatter than HP4GU.  I have read a number of posts 
that refer to fanfic, whether authored by members or not.  And I have 
read through some of the fanfic recommended in the Files section of 
this group.  But as I am becoming more familiar with 
www.fanfiction.net, I wanted to ask for additional recommendations. 

So, could you please advise me as to which fanfics you prefer, or are 
your favorites?  I'm not looking for any particular style, just a 
good sampling of what's out there.  I'd appreciate any 
recommendations!  Thanks!

Sarah



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From ochfd42 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 21 14:46:22 2001
From: ochfd42 at yahoo.com (Angela Boyko)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 10:46:22 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Shoes and shop
In-Reply-To: <9gqfte+c1d7@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010621144622.23105.qmail@web11705.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Scott <insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> I'm sure no one cares about my affinity for being
> bare footed, but I 
> just feel like posting this so...

Barefooted is the way to be for me!

> --I agree. The only thing I hate more than shoe
> shopping is wearing 
> shoes. :-) I'll wear sandals/flip flops, but I can't
> stand socks and 
> shoes. Maybe it's just a regional thing, because
> none of my friends 
> do either.

I have wide feet and high arches, so just finding
shoes that fit can be a chore. I have to bring friends
with me when I shop because I am lousy at picking out
shoes with decent quality. I don't know why I even
bother going to Payless, nothing fits me there except
for a great pair of winter boots I found there.

If I could go barefoot all the time I would, but that
does provide a strain on my feet, I need some support
for my heels from time to time (heel spurs).

Angela

=====
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               May the Force be with you

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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 21 15:15:53 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 08:15:53 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Fan fiction questions from a newbie
In-Reply-To: <9gsupd+84jt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010621151554.80325.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Sarah Bennet <sarahlinks14 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello!

Hi Sarah!

> And I have read through some of the fanfic recommended in the Files
> section of this group.  But as I am becoming more familiar with 
> www.fanfiction.net, I wanted to ask for additional recommendations. 
> So, could you please advise me as to which fanfics you prefer, or are
> your favorites?  

Hrm. Since you've read some stuff in the files section, I'm not going
to mention any of them (even though the ones mentioned are fabulous and
you really should read them all right away).

 - "Dark Lord's Support Group" by NeoSapien (a humorfic)
http://members.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=279346

 - anything by Elaryn, here's her author link (humor and seriousfics)
http://members.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=directory-authorprofile&userid=67202

 - "Harry Potter and the Psychic Serpent" by Barbara Purdom (Harryfic)
http://members.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=288212

 - "Potter and the Heir of Slytherin" by DrummerGirl (Harryfic)
http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=259754

 - "Ben Granger and the Legacy of Icarus"(Grangerfic)
http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=308015

And there's more. Tons more. Loads more. But I'm at work right now and
can't spend anymore time trying to search down all the fics that I
love. Besides, I'm sure others will inundate you with fics. But while
I'm at it...

...you could also read *my* fics. Just a warning, the caliber is not as
high as the fics I mentioned above. But if you're bored, you might
enjoy them. All three are in progress.

 - "Hssss" (a humorfic)
http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=306097
 - "Never Is Enough" (a Ronfic)
http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=261597
 - "What A Good Girl" (a Hermionefic)
http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=282601

Hope this helps (and the links work)!

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Thu Jun 21 16:00:25 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 16:00:25 -0000
Subject: a train to Washington DC
In-Reply-To: <15343162A0@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <9gt5mp+l3md@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rachel Bray" <bray.262 at o...> wrote:
> I'm leaving tomorrow morning to Washington DC with my mother.  
> We're taking the train (which I'm SOOO excited about.  I've only 
> been on commuter trains before) and meeting my father in DC (he's 
> been there for the past week at a conference).
> 
> I'm so excited about this vacation.  I've never been to DC before.  
> Sad.  I've been all over the world and I've never been to my own 
> country's capital.  Anyway, I'm sure it'll be great fun.  
Yes....I'm 31 
> years old and going on vacation with my folks.  But what can I 
> say?  They're wonderful and I enjoy spending time with them.
> 
> Anyway, I'm taking GoF and CoS.  Mom is finishing book 1 right 
> now and she'll read CoS on the train.  I'm taking GoF for me so 
I'll 
> have something to keep me busy so I'm not bugging her with "So, 
> what do you think of the twins....Hermione.....Hagrid...Draco?"  
I'm 
> sure she'll appreciate that.  :-)

Bring an umbrella or rain coat with you. They're predicting rain for 
friday. Also, the weather's hovering in the upper '80s and it's 
rather muggy. 

Milz




From bohners at pobox.com  Thu Jun 21 16:02:54 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 12:02:54 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Fan fiction questions from a newbie
References: <20010621151554.80325.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <029e01c0fa6b$c79be020$6d39acce@rebeccab>

Sarah --

All the fics I would most enthusiastically recommend to you (except for
Zsenya and Arabella's wonderful "After the Fall", mentioned in Heidi's
message) are linked from my Author page at FF.net.  You can find my own Year
5 stories "The Potions Master's Apprentice" and "Personal Risks" there too:

http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=directory-authorProfile&userid=44
46

Have fun!
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 21 16:26:36 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 09:26:36 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] a train to Washington DC
In-Reply-To: <15343162A0@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <20010621162636.46059.qmail@web14505.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Rachel Bray <bray.262 at osu.edu> wrote:
> I'm so excited about this vacation.  I've never been to DC before.  
> Sad.  I've been all over the world and I've never been to my own 
> country's capital.  Anyway, I'm sure it'll be great fun.  Yes....I'm
> 31 years old and going on vacation with my folks.  But what can I 
> say?  They're wonderful and I enjoy spending time with them.

<shrug> I don't see anything wrong with that. I'm 21 and might be going
on a vacation next year with my parents. If you get along with them
then why not go on a vacation with them?

I hope you have fun. I went to DC about...er...at least five years ago.
I want to go again sometime because I don't think I was at the age to
really appreciate the history. You'll have to let us know what you see.

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 21 16:44:17 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony AKA AngieJ)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 16:44:17 -0000
Subject: Fan fiction questions from a newbie
In-Reply-To: <029e01c0fa6b$c79be020$6d39acce@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <9gt891+mqk2@eGroups.com>

Hey, Sarah!  You've stumbled upon one of my two favorite topics...

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner" 
<bohners at p...> wrote:
> All the fics I would most enthusiastically recommend to you (except 
for Zsenya and Arabella's wonderful "After the Fall", mentioned in 
Heidi's message) are linked from my Author page at FF.net.  

Isn't the fic called "After the End"?  Also, their ff.net handle for 
that story is SugarQuill, I think...

Speaking of which, a great source for Ron/Hermione romantic 
plot/subplot fiction is http://www.sugarquill.com .  Not really my 
cup of tea, but I visit from time to time--it's an excellently 
designed and maintained site.

I've been reading Harry Potter fanfiction for well over a year now, 
discovering ff.net long before I knew there was a such thing as HP 
online discussion groups for adult fans.  Since then I've read 
thousands of fics... and they run the gamut.

I usually find it most helpful recommend Harry Potter fanfiction by 
author--if I like one thing the writer wrote, usually I like their 
writing, period.  

My personal fanfic reading preferences are post-Hogwarts, H/H, and/or 
Draco-sympathetic... but some of my very favorite authors find those 
positions anathema.  So while I love Heidi's recommendation of 
joining fanfic-centered egroups, I can also tell you about some 
writers whose fics are not necessarily featured on any of them.

These are the authors I most often recommend.  Not all of them are on 
my personal favorites list, but whenever a "Harry Potter Fanfiction 
Best Of..." conversation comes up, these names are often mentioned.

Lori (mystery, post-Hogwarts, H/H... widely considered the fandom's 
best post-Hogwarts fic)
Viola (WWII, young Tom Riddle, McGonagall, Dumbledore)
Alicia/Sue (humor, post-Hogwarts)
Crazy Ivan (humor, post-Hogwarts)
Penny&Carole (Siriusfic, post-Hogwarts)
Cassandra Claire  (Dracofic, AU Hogwarts--Years 6 and 7... widely 
considered the fandom's best Dracofic, and is definitely the most 
read HP fanwriter online)
wotan (light romances, H/G, R/H, and H/H)
Dadgrid (post-Hogwarts, books-are-real scenario, kiddie fic)
rave (MWPP Siriusfic)
George Weasley's Girlfriend (twin-centered fics)
Morrighan (twin-centered and Snape-centered fics)
Al (Dracofics, slash humor)
heidi tandy (Dracofic, alt. PoV Hogwarts--Years 3, 4, and 5)
parker (light romance, H/H)
Amanita Lestrange (humor, wit/parody)
yael (AU Hogwarts, post-canon melodrama)
Sarah Rettger (light romance, F/A)
B Bennett (humor, light romance, R/H and H/G)
Barb LP (Harryfic, AU Hogwarts--Year 5 in progress, 6&7 planned)
Rhysenn (slash and angst, mostly Harry/Draco but not exclusively)
Hyphen (MWPP humor--my *favorite* is "A Rat's Tale:  O Come All Ye 
Faithful)
Blaise (MWPP angst--over a year in the fandom, perhaps some of the 
best Snapefic around)
w&m_law (light romance, D/G)
WolfieTwins (MWPP angst--their *Call of the Wild* is widely 
considered the fandom's best Remusfic)
lone astronomer (excellent Charliefic in progress)
Starlight (perhaps the most UNDERRATED author in HP fandom... her 
*Harry Potter and the Jade Dragon* is the most well-researched fic 
I've ever read, as it is set entirely in China!)

Also worth noting are Zsenya, Arabella, Elanor Gamgee, Thing1, 
Tropical Fishy, R.J. Anderson, Taliafisher, METMA Mandy, RagePoint, 
Camille, Samantha, Rex, and Sirius.  All of them are very good 
writers with quite loyal fan bases.  

I also can recommend writers by category, shipper/slasher preference, 
etc.  This is because last summer I did three things:  1) teach 
summer school, 2) search for an apartment, and 3) read fanfic.  I'm 
almost positive I've glanced at just about every ff.net HP index page-
-I check ff.net's HP section every day just after I finish checking e-
mails.  People complain about the so-called slush pile, but as an 
English teacher, there's a lot I can tolerate.

Glad to see a new convert to the Harry Potter fanfiction world!  Like 
any other fandom, we have our unfortunate camp rivalries (^_^)  but 
we also have a lot of fun.  Welcome!

--Ebony AKA AngieJ




From bohners at pobox.com  Thu Jun 21 17:55:47 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 13:55:47 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Fan fiction questions from a newbie
References: <9gt891+mqk2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <02ce01c0fa7b$6973ebe0$6d39acce@rebeccab>

>> Zsenya and Arabella's wonderful "After the Fall" <<

> Isn't the fic called "After the End"?

Oh, DUH.  No wonder I couldn't find it on FF.net.  I knew that, really.  I
mean, it's not like I didn't just join their list today...

I can only plead getting the title confused with the name of an obscure 80's
pop band.  :)
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From ochfd42 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 21 20:21:25 2001
From: ochfd42 at yahoo.com (Angela Boyko)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 16:21:25 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Fanfic recommendations for a newbie
Message-ID: <20010621202125.549.qmail@web11707.mail.yahoo.com>

I'm not a fan of canon Draco at all, but I am
intrigued by the Draco in Heidi's "A Surfeit of
Curses"

http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=96654

And there's also my satirical take on some of the
supporting cast and what they do when they're not at
Hogwarts:

http://www.fanfiction.net/index.fic?action=story-read&storyid=235266

So far I have chapters for Lucius, Draco, and Dobby.
I'm working on Rita Skeeter right now.

Angela

=====
* * * http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/4439/index.html * * *
               May the Force be with you

_______________________________________________________
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From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Thu Jun 21 21:19:16 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 21:19:16 -0000
Subject: Looking for Willow
Message-ID: <9gtock+spto@eGroups.com>

Hi everyone,

  Do any of you know I might be able to find a copy of the movie 
Willow, DVD or VHS?  My brother was looking for it and can't find it, 
I haven't been able to find it either. I'd like to try and surprise 
him for his birthday. So if any of you might know where I could look 
your help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
    
                  Kristin




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 21 21:58:09 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 14:58:09 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: What to do...
Message-ID: <20010621215809.98074.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>


Erg. I don't know what to do right now. I don't know if I'm even going
to send this email but I need to talk to *someone* and there's no one
else...

I've had this...er...interesting relationship with a boy I know. We
were first friends and then he got it in his thick head that he liked
me more than as friends. So we went out once or twice and then I found
out that he had first been dating one of my friends but then got a date
with me and dumped her quick. She is a really fragile person
emotionally and he really hurt her. So, I said that while we could
still be friends, I didn't want to go out with him.

So a year goes by and we're still friends. Around wintertime, I get
really depressed for reasons that I won't disclose here. Desperate to
make myself feel better, I make the worst choice possible. I call him
up and say that I'd be interested to going out again. Apparently he's
been waiting for this and immediately takes me up on it.

Quite predictably, this doesn't solve any of my problems and
complicates matters. After only about two dates, I break it off again.
We remain the most tenuous of friends because of my stupidity.

Anyways, I graduate from college (he's still earning his degree) and I
move faaaar away. At some point, I send out an email to all my friends
telling them my new address and phone number. I include his email in
the list out of nostalgia and the fact that he was one of my good
friends once.

Well, I hadn't heard a thing from him at all until I got home from work
today. He called me and left a message on my answering machine. He
wants to talk and that is the absolute last thing I want to do. I still
feel badly about "leading him on" and have realized that I don't like
him any more than maybe as a friend. I'm terrified that he's going to
say something stupid like that he still likes me or for some reason
loves me. I don't want to have to tell him that there's no chance. And
even if he just wants to resume our friendship, I don't know if it's
possible.

Should I try and call him back? Should I avoid his phone calls? I want
so badly to ignore him but my sense of duty says that I *have* to talk
to him. I feel stuck in limbo and I *know* I won't be able to sleep
tonight. Advice? Somebody, anybody? If you'd like, you can email me
personally at reanna20 at yahoo.com. 

Terribly sorry for this email, but I need advice and don't have anyone
right now...

~Amber
(Who has ruined more relationships than of anyone else she knows and
can't be trusted to make a rational decision...)
   

=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk  Fri Jun 22 02:13:53 2001
From: insanus_scottus at yahoo.co.uk (Scott)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 02:13:53 -0000
Subject: British Journalism  (was Re: JKR has a beau????????)
In-Reply-To: <9gsms2+i3et@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gu9l1+7qte@eGroups.com>

dfrankis at d... wrote
> www.femail.co.uk/pages/standard/article.html?
> in_article_id=45613&in_page_id=2
> 
> which is an article in the Mail on Sunday 13th May.  Note the 
classic 
> Skeeterisms: 'Friends believe' and 'Speculation grew'.

This article is written in a very Skeeteresque fashion, and so before 
I sound exactly like Molly Weasley I thought I better inquire as to 
the reliability of the Mail. 

Is this article likely to be true, or a tabliod concoction? I know 
nothing of British Journalism (though this is one of my classes for 
the summer so hopefully I will!), excepting the fact that an 
Englishman on the plane next to me said I oughtn't believe to much of 
what I read in the Daily Telegraph (which I was reading at the time.)

I wish JKR very much happiness in her alleged marriage, and if 
nothing else it proves that she *really* has a thing for black haired 
men.  :-)

Scott
Thinking of dying his hair black...






From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 22 02:44:35 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 02:44:35 -0000
Subject: Sirius's Wish
Message-ID: <9gubej+7tkp@eGroups.com>

Hello All!!!!

I've just written, and posted, a very short story called Sirius's Wish
on fanfiction.net. You can find it under my author name (Jamieson).

Also, it's been posted on my Penny Dredfule group, as well as under 
the
file Jamiesons stuff on the HP Fanfiction group.

So, everyone tell me what you think of it!!! I'd love to hear your
comments!!!!

Hugs to all
Jamieson






From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun 22 03:30:29 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 20:30:29 -0700
Subject: Uppity Software - Shoes - Rental Cars
Message-ID: <3B32BBD5.1FA007C2@wicca.net>

Ben quoted:

>"You have no permission to talk.  Goodbye" (Pine's 
> response to me trying to locate an earlier message

Remembering that 'talk' is frequently used to mean 'speak' (and if you
can't speak without permission, how can you speak to ask permission?),
that sounds like a cross between Snape and "you ARE the weakest link". 

> I just wondered  does this sort of thing happen to
> anybody else? (I mean thinking in completely different ways 

I almost always think in words. Sometimes words that I am saying and
sometimes words that I am hearing (but in my own internal voice) and
sometimes (fastest, deepest, most focussed) words that exist (when I
read that focussed, then also the words just exist). When I was young, I
was told that my father and some other people thought in math. I could
not even begin to imagine what that would be like. 

> Having said that buying shoes is always a painful 
> experience, especially in Oxford.   

I am slightly acquainted with one Patrick Brady, originally from the
vicinity of Liddesdale. I think he went to Oxford; he now works at a
research institute in London. I made his acquaintance via a marvelous
rant he wrote about the suppression of the Borderers (Reavers) -- his
people -- and by way of excusing himself for speaking on the politically
incorrect subject of ethnicity, he said the ONLY way he can find shoes
to fit the shape of his feet is to shop in Liddesdale when visiting his
family.

Maybe you need to shop for shoes in a region where people have feet like
yours.

Anyway, what the hell is this alien thought-space where young people are
going to $100/person dances that require formal black shoes (other than
high school prom, that is)? I thought young people went dancing in clubs
and so on, and OLD people (my age) dressed up formal for dinner-dances.

Scott wrote:

> The only thing I hate more than shoe shopping is wearing 
> shoes. :-) 

I would much rather shop for shoes than wear them! If it weren't for the
money, I would LOVE buying dozens of beautiful sexy or funny shoes that
I don't have space to store and end up never wearing.

When I was young, I went barefoot all the time -- carried flip-flops
with me to put on when going indoors(!). Then I went back East to
college and walked barefoot in snow ONCE! (It wasn't intentional: I'd
dashed across the quad from my dorm to the library, then gotten
distracted in the library, then when I emerged, there was snow.... I
still went barefoot when not in snow, ice, nor science lab.... Until I
moved to New York City, first sharing an apartment in Queens. One
barefoot walk to grocery store was sufficient proof that there is more
broken glass splinters and fragments on the sidewalks of New York than
my Los Angeles calluses could protect me from. When I returned to LA
after 4.5 years, I had lost my calluses and had to WEAR my flip-flops
when walking on gravel, asphalt, hot concrete....  But I wouldn't mind
wearing sneakers, Hush Puppy shoes (of the same style as Barry's
Wallabies, not dress Hush Puppies), or my expensive handmade custom-made
moccasin boots from Ren Faire if only my feet didn't get HOT!

> I wonder what type of shoes Hogwarts kids wear

I feel sure it is mentioned in the books that they wear trainers
(sneakers or tennies to us Yanks).

DAI helpfully gave me the URL for Hertz UK -- which offered a drop-down
menu of ten locations in London, but I have ABSOLUTELY no idea where
those locations are! YAEL had the right idea -- it's for a quick mention
in a fanfic (renting a car to carry the kids to King's X for Hogwarts
Express, then leaving them unattended while returning it).
-- 
          /\ /\                                          ___  ___
           + +     Mews and views                       ( @ \/ @ ) 
         >> = <<         from Rita Prince Winston        \ @  @ / 
                                                          \ () /  
                     ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._             \  / 
                     `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)       \/ 
                     (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                    _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,'
                   ((('   (((-(((''  ((((



From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Fri Jun 22 08:49:15 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 08:49:15 -0000
Subject: British Journalism  (was Re: JKR has a beau????????)
In-Reply-To: <9gu9l1+7qte@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gv0qb+5mda@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Scott" <insanus_scottus at y...> wrote:
> dfrankis at d... wrote
> > www.femail.co.uk/pages/standard/article.html?
> > in_article_id=45613&in_page_id=2
> > 
> > which is an article in the Mail on Sunday 13th May.  Note the 
> classic 
> > Skeeterisms: 'Friends believe' and 'Speculation grew'.
> 
> This article is written in a very Skeeteresque fashion, and so      
> before I sound exactly like Molly Weasley I thought I better       
> inquire as to the reliability of the Mail. 

The Mail on Sunday is one of the more reliable tabloids. So normally 
there stories have some element of truth.


Simon







From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 22 12:44:06 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 05:44:06 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Looking for Willow
In-Reply-To: <9gtock+spto@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010622124406.40817.qmail@web14503.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Kristin <Alyeskakc at aol.com> wrote:
> Hi everyone,
> 
>   Do any of you know I might be able to find a copy of the movie 
> Willow, DVD or VHS?  My brother was looking for it and can't find it,
> I haven't been able to find it either. 

Hi Kristin! I haven't looked myself, but you could try www.ebay.com.
It's one of the biggest online auctions. Just search for 'Willo VHS' or
'Willow DVD'. 

Or if you don't like online auctions, you could try www.half.com. It's
a pretty big site where people sell used (or new!) items at a
discounted price. Again, do the same searches as above.

Have you tried www.amazon.com? Or www.bn.com? I believe you could buy
the VHS or DVD online from one of them. I wasn't aware that it's
unavailable.

Does this help?

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/12/2001

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, said Death. JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
- N. Gaiman and T. Prachett, "Good Omens"

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From meboriqua at aol.com  Fri Jun 22 14:04:53 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 14:04:53 -0000
Subject: Dreams
Message-ID: <9gvja5+mbgl@eGroups.com>

Of course, my apologies if this has come up before, but has anyone 
ever had any HP themed dreams?  I've had a few, and my favorite one 
was when I was on the Hogwarts express with Dumbledore.  I also had 
one where I said "Accio something!" and whatever I called for came 
flying into my hand.  I could go on and on, but I'd like to hear 
about other people's dreams.  Please share!

--jenny from ravenclaw***********************************************




From hfakhro at nyc.rr.com  Fri Jun 22 14:23:36 2001
From: hfakhro at nyc.rr.com (hfakhro at nyc.rr.com)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 14:23:36 -0000
Subject: Fan fiction questions from a newbie
In-Reply-To: <9gt891+mqk2@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9gvkd8+goid@eGroups.com>

In addition to the wonderful authors already mentioned, I recently 
discovered Jedi Boadicea: the works can be found on fanfiction.net or 
sugarquill.com and they're really really good. If you're fond of 
Draco, the author just started a Draco diary that's really very funny.




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Fri Jun 22 15:34:22 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 11:34:22 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dreams
References: <9gvja5+mbgl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B33657D.DA33A1FD@sympatico.ca>

Hello All,

I just had a wierd HP dream. Has anyone seen Dancer In The Dark?? Well,
I'm on that train. It doesn't look like it, but I know that I'm on the
train from the movie. So, I'm walking on the carts that the train is
pulling, and they're more like dollies, wide open to the air, sort of
carts where cargo would go.

So, I'm walking on these, wearing these clothese that are red cotton,
flowing behind me. And Hermione is standing in front of me. I approach
her slowly. She has her wand out and waves it in the air. She beginns to
write in the air with it.

The words: You will loose your sight, are written in the air, and all of
a sudden I go blind. I can only hear the things around me. I feel
Hermione approach and she whispers in my ear: "Jamieson, you are the boy
who will die. As there is a boy who lived, so must there be a boy who
dies. The balance of all must be held true.

"I'm not ready to die." I tell her. And I can HEAR her smile. The warmth
of her magic is floating around us. It warms my skin.

"You will be the patron saint of Owls, Jamieson. You will be their
Guardian, their ally. As there is a Guide for each of the sacred
animals, you will be the one of Owls. To become a saint, a patron, the
body must die away to become something more. Something MAGICAL. It won't
hurt, Jamieson. It won't hurt."

"But why can't I see? Why does my sight have to be taken away?"

"For two reasons. It is day is it not? Owls are asleep during the day.
You will see only in the night. But, for the most part, you will see
through the eyes of the owls......."

And then I woke up. I don't know why, but all my dreams are ususally
ones that a shrink would love to pick apart. Anyone have any ideas about
what they hey this one means??

Hugs
Jamieson


meboriqua at aol.com wrote:

> Of course, my apologies if this has come up before, but has anyone
> ever had any HP themed dreams?  I've had a few, and my favorite one
> was when I was on the Hogwarts express with Dumbledore.  I also had
> one where I said "Accio something!" and whatever I called for came
> flying into my hand.  I could go on and on, but I'd like to hear
> about other people's dreams.  Please share!
>
> --jenny from ravenclaw***********************************************
>
>
>                    Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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--
Excuse me, but I just have to explode,
explode this body off me, wake-up tomorrow
brand new, a little tired
but brand new

(Pluto, by Bjork)



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From ender_w at msn.com  Fri Jun 22 16:27:58 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 12:27:58 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dreams
References: <9gvja5+mbgl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <003601c0fb38$4d4546e0$b3e7183f@satellite>

I've always had dreams about flying, but now that I've read Harry Potter, I fly on a broomstick.  I also had another really, really cool dream that I can't go into because I'm turning it into a fanfic.

ender
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: meboriqua at aol.com 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, June 22, 2001 10:04 AM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dreams


  Of course, my apologies if this has come up before, but has anyone 
  ever had any HP themed dreams?  I've had a few, and my favorite one 
  was when I was on the Hogwarts express with Dumbledore.  I also had 
  one where I said "Accio something!" and whatever I called for came 
  flying into my hand.  I could go on and on, but I'd like to hear 
  about other people's dreams.  Please share!

  --jenny from ravenclaw***********************************************


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor 

        Click for Details 
       

  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 22 18:55:54 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 11:55:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dreams
In-Reply-To: <3B33657D.DA33A1FD@sympatico.ca>
Message-ID: <20010622185554.59716.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve <crowswolf at sympatico.ca> wrote:
> "You will be the patron saint of Owls, Jamieson. You will be their
> Guardian, their ally. As there is a Guide for each of the sacred
> animals, you will be the one of Owls. To become a saint, a patron,
> the body must die away to become something more. Something MAGICAL.
It
> won't hurt, Jamieson. It won't hurt."

Ooo! Creepy! If it had been me, I probably would've said "Can't I
become the patron saint of Owls later?" Or maybe not. I might've been
too excited that I was talking to *Hermione* to care much!

I don't know if I've had any HP dreams. It is very, very, very, VERY
rare if I remember my dreams. Most of the time I wake up with no
rememberance. Sometimes I wake up with a ghost of a feeling of what
went on. I know that at least once I've woken up with the feeling that
I was dreaming about something to do with HP. And once in a blue moon
I'll wake up with a complete recollection of the dream. I've never
woken up with the complete recollection of an HP dream.

Perhaps the strangest dream I ever had was where I dreamed I gave birth
to a boy. Considering that I'm not in a relationship, much less
married, it was very odd. However the freaky part was when I went in to
see the baby, he was lying in a pool of plasma and had a full head of
red hair. He looked up at me and said quite clearly "Are you JKF?". I
remember staring at him in horror and astonishment. Then the dream
ended.

If you couldn't tell, my dreams never make any sense. I'm sure if I
dreamed HP, everything would be topsy turvy as well.

~Amber
(Who sincerely wishes that she had cool dreams...)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/21/2001

"Afraid of change, afraid of staying the same
When temptation calls, we just look away..."
- Barenaked Ladies, "What A Good Boy"

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From saitaina at wizzards.net  Fri Jun 22 20:29:47 2001
From: saitaina at wizzards.net (Saitaina)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 13:29:47 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dreams
References: <20010622185554.59716.qmail@web14504.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <004e01c0fb5a$15921ee0$444e28d1@oemcomputer>

I had to share this even though it's a few nights old-

I went to school with Draco Malfoy.  There was this class, and we had to
fill out these papers that asked what we liked about school what we hated,
what our favorite memory was...  I got a hold of Draco's and it was mostly
me on the bad side  (and Harry)  Then I got stuck with Draco, going back to
Malfoy Mannor to get a book from his father's library I needed...and
somehow I ended up teaching him how to play basket ball and ice skate.  Then
the  dream moved on to the future and Becca (a friend of mine's HP roleplay
character), Angelina, and I owned a little Magical WalMart if you will.
You  know, a superstore.  All your magical needs under one roof.  Anyway.
We were waiting for our kids to be dropped off.  (We're all divorced) and
Ron dropped off his son, (mine), Fred or Percy dropped off theres (still
mine and all I saw
was the kid.) then a limo pulled up and Draco dropped off little Lucius.  It
was  weird.  I can clearly remember ever detail of litle Lucius's face, but
the two redheaded tornadoes escape me beyond they're red hair.  Even
Angelina  and Becca's faces escape me, but little Lucius still sticks out in
my mind.

On a side note, one of my ex boyfriends featured in the dream was named
Richard Lupin, (combination of Anita Blake: Vampire Hunter and HP)

Anyway, that's my latest HP dream, if anyone wants to figure it out go right
ahead.






From meboriqua at aol.com  Fri Jun 22 21:35:54 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 21:35:54 -0000
Subject: Dreams
In-Reply-To: <004e01c0fb5a$15921ee0$444e28d1@oemcomputer>
Message-ID: <9h0dnq+bd77@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Saitaina" <saitaina at w...> wrote:
> I had to share this even though it's a few nights old-
  Then I got stuck with Draco, going back to
> Malfoy Mannor to get a book from his father's library I needed...and
> somehow I ended up teaching him how to play basket ball and ice 
skate. 

LOL!  
> 
> Anyway, that's my latest HP dream, if anyone wants to figure it out 
go right
> ahead.

I took a class on interpreting dreams a while ago and it was very 
interesting.  The professor told us that dreams are not necessarily 
filled with standard symbolism - losing a tooth means money (across 
the board for anyone), and so on.  He said that dreams are related to 
two things: what happened to you that day and issues you are working 
through.  Every class he had a different student share, in detail, 
her/his most recent dream and then he asked that student all kinds of 
questions - about her problems, what kind of day she had that day, 
etc.  It was fascinating.

If I sat down to think through my HP dreams, the first thing I can say 
is that since I read the books constantly and talk about them on the 
HP4GU site, HP is on my mind quite frequently.  If I have a scary 
Voldemort dream, Voldemort may not necessarily be Voldemort, but maybe 
I had a bad day or maybe I watched something scary on tv before I went 
to bed... so Voldie pops up in my dream, as a symbol for ME of bad 
things in general.  I hope that made sense.  *Sigh* - it would be so 
much easier to explain this in person.  Okay, here's a better 
example: my boyfriend sometimes has violent dreams about his family 
because he had some very serious (and violent) problems with them for 
a long time.  He dreams that he or someone else hurts or kills a 
family member (usually his mother), and he doesn't feel too bad *in 
the dream*.  This is a way of empowering himself because in reality, 
he felt helpless around his family for a good portion of his life.  
Did I just make this even more confusing? 

Anyway, I thought that professor was right on.  I've become quite good 
at interpreting dreams because of that class.

--jenny from ravenclaw, who almost always re




From sarahlinks14 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 22 23:35:04 2001
From: sarahlinks14 at yahoo.com (Sarah Bennet)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 23:35:04 -0000
Subject: Fan Fiction
Message-ID: <9h0kn8+iddk@eGroups.com>



Wow!  I just wanted to say thanks for all the recommendations!  I 
couldn't believe all the responses.  I can't wait to start tackling 
them.  It looks as though I've got enough reading to last me through 
the summer :-)  Thanks again.  I'll be posting here again soon!

Sarah




From SKTHOMPSON_1 at msn.com  Fri Jun 22 23:39:09 2001
From: SKTHOMPSON_1 at msn.com (Kelley)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 23:39:09 -0000
Subject: Shoes and shop
In-Reply-To: <9gqgen+su58@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9h0kut+olhc@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Pigwidgeon" <pigwidgeon at i...> wrote:
> Less socks worn means less socks to wash and also less chance for 
the sock fairy to gobble them all up. >>>>>

Ah, those are the sacrifices you make to the god of laundrette.  Make 
sure to keep an eye out for infiltration by blue underwear--they're 
notorious for mimicking white handkerchiefs.

Small dog who's not happy with my wash....





From joy0823 at earthlink.net  Fri Jun 22 23:58:08 2001
From: joy0823 at earthlink.net (- Joy -)
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 19:58:08 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Fan fiction questions from a newbie
References: <9gsupd+84jt@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <011a01c0fb77$499ed580$a2d30941@mtgmry1.md.home.com>

Check out a post I made a few days ago that listed most of my favorites...
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-OTChatter/message/4094
I found out the name of Glitterpixie's story since I wrote that message.
It's called When All is Said and Done.  Happy reading!


~Joy~

http://www.geocities.com/joy0823
Last Movie Seen: "Almost Famous"
Now Reading: "Roses are Red" by James Patterson




From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun 23 02:28:12 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 02:28:12 -0000
Subject: Richard (was Dreams
In-Reply-To: <004e01c0fb5a$15921ee0$444e28d1@oemcomputer>
Message-ID: <9h0urs+bsqe@eGroups.com>

I am very envious of *several* list members, as I've never had 
an HP dream!  

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Saitaina" <saitaina at w...> wrote:
> 
> On a side note, one of my ex boyfriends featured in the dream was 
> named Richard Lupin, 

Recently when we were talking about WHY the name 'Harry' (with CMC 
talking about Shakespeare's Henry V and me talking about World War 
Two British soldiers using 'For England, Harry, and Saint George!" as 
a battlecry), the next day it occured to me that there should be a 
major Richard in canon because there is Tom [Riddle] and Harry 
[Potter], where is Dick?




From meckelburg at foni.net  Sat Jun 23 07:38:04 2001
From: meckelburg at foni.net (meckelburg at foni.net)
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 07:38:04 -0000
Subject: Dreams
In-Reply-To: <9gvja5+mbgl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9h1h0s+u1ra@eGroups.com>

-
Hi,
I don't remember too many of my dreams. But one came over and over 
again since I read PS. I was looking into the mirror and I 
recognised myself with my son , my daughter and a perfect copy of my 
daughter. My daughter was a twin, her sister died shortly after her 
birth.I always wake up with a strong mixture of needing to cry and 
feeling happy to see her.
Mecki

-- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., meboriqua at a... wrote:
> Of course, my apologies if this has come up before, but has anyone 
> ever had any HP themed dreams?  I've had a few, and my favorite one 
> was when I was on the Hogwarts express with Dumbledore.  I also had 
> one where I said "Accio something!" and whatever I called for came 
> flying into my hand.  I could go on and on, but I'd like to hear 
> about other people's dreams.  Please share!
> 
> --jenny from 
ravenclaw***********************************************




From madhuri567 at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 23 08:02:55 2001
From: madhuri567 at yahoo.com (Madhuri)
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 08:02:55 -0000
Subject: Dreams
In-Reply-To: <9gvja5+mbgl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9h1iff+rvn8@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., meboriqua at a... wrote:
> Of course, my apologies if this has come up before, but has anyone 
> ever had any HP themed dreams?  <snip>
> 
> --jenny from 
ravenclaw***********************************************

Funny you should bring up this topic, because I had a HP dream just 
last night. I can't remember it too well, but I do recall that Ron 
and Ginny were in it. Ron was holding Ginny's hand and they were both 
running down a corridor. I think they were in some kind of danger 
because Ron kept glancing around and dragging Ginny into the shadows. 
Apparently he didn't tell Ginny why they were running, so she was 
really peeved and Ron kept telling her to shut up. Somehow I can see 
that happening in the books. 
Erk. It gives me the shivers just thinking about it. Not to sound too 
Trelawny-ish, but maybe it was an epiphany?

Madhuri 




From madhuri567 at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 23 08:03:11 2001
From: madhuri567 at yahoo.com (Madhuri)
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 08:03:11 -0000
Subject: Dreams
In-Reply-To: <9gvja5+mbgl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9h1ifv+5kba@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., meboriqua at a... wrote:
> Of course, my apologies if this has come up before, but has anyone 
> ever had any HP themed dreams?  <snip>
> 
> --jenny from 
ravenclaw***********************************************

Funny you should bring up this topic, because I had a HP dream just 
last night. I can't remember it too well, but I do recall that Ron 
and Ginny were in it. Ron was holding Ginny's hand and they were both 
running down a corridor. I think they were in some kind of danger 
because Ron kept glancing around and dragging Ginny into the shadows. 
Apparently he didn't tell Ginny why they were running, so she was 
really peeved and Ron kept telling her to shut up. Somehow I can see 
that happening in the books. 
Erk. It gives me the shivers just thinking about it. Not to sound too 
Trelawny-ish, but maybe it was an epiphany?

Madhuri 




From jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu  Sat Jun 23 17:43:59 2001
From: jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu (Jen Faulkner)
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 13:43:59 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: catullus 85 (was Re: [HPforGrownups] Re: Hogwart's Motto, help!)
In-Reply-To: <20010623103907.59556.qmail@web13802.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106231323160.1023-100000@er6.rutgers.edu>

On Sat, 23 Jun 2001, Alexandra Y. Kwan wrote:

> --- Jen Faulkner <jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu> wrote:
> > [1] As in the poem of Catullus: odi et amo.  quare
> > id faciam fortasse
> > requiris. / nescio, sed fieri sentio et excrucior.

> Translation? <g>

Oh, sorry!  It's a very well known poem, and one of my favorites, and
yes, I should've translated.  I was just trying to cut down on the
amount of otness. :)

"I hate and I love.  Perhpas you're asking how I am able to do this.
I do not know, but I feel it happening, and I am in terrible torment."

--jen :)


"Will you be the one I've wanted, will you read my mind?
Will you ask me where I hurt, and heal me with your eyes?"
			--melissa ferrick

jen's fics: http://www.eden.rutgers.edu/~jfaulkne/
jen's LJ: http://www.livejournal.com/users/lysimache/







From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun 23 18:22:38 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 18:22:38 -0000
Subject: HP Dream I JUST HAD 
Message-ID: <9h2mpe+3g79@eGroups.com>

Ironically, just after posting here that I am envious because I never 
had an HP dream, I fell asleep (while reading a newsmagazine. Bad 
Catlady!) and had one. It was complicated and had a lot of non-HP 
stuff, but I was a houseguest in a beautiful Victorian-style house, 
and in the house across the street lived a beautiful young girl named 
Sharlene (name of a co-worker) who wanted to marry Fred Weasley, and 
one day Charlie Weasley came to visit my hostess in "my" house and at 
some moment she was in the house (in the kitchen fetching 
refreshments, answering telephones, I don't know) so only Charlie and 
I were sitting in the garden, and Sharlene invited herself right 
there to talk to us/Charlie. 

She was very self-confidently telling us that Fred had proposed to 
her (something she had arranged by some crazy scheme involving a 
parade, a fire alarm, and sex, but I don't remember the details) 
and she had accepted, and I volunteered my unrequested and unwanted 
advice "Don't marry *anyone* until you've met their family" and then 
I realised that that was exactly what she was doing. (Stupid Catlady!)

And Charlie, in his warm friendly helpful way, asked her a bunch of 
questions, and the answers all showed her high degree of 1) 
self-confidence and 2) lunacy, and finally Charlie said: "Sounds like 
the two of you will get along together -- Wait a minute. Have you met 
George?"

And then I woke up.




From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun 23 20:54:04 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 20:54:04 -0000
Subject: Blazon (from main list)
Message-ID: <9h2vlc+4aqk@eGroups.com>


--- In HPforGrownups at y..., Danette Schardt-Cordova 


<captain_debrowe at y...> wrote:
> 
> --- Rita Winston <catlady at w...> wrote:
> > 
> > Are a critter's markings allowed to violate the
> > no-color-on-color (azure on sable) rule? 
> 
> Okay time to dust off my rusty herald's skills (I'm
> part of a middle ages re-inactment group).  If the
> critter is normally portrayed in its natural or
> "proper" colors then it is NOT considered a violation
> of the no color on color rule.

Yes, but the Proper badger has black and white stripes rather than 
black and blue stripes. Amanda gave an explanation that I didn't 
entirely understand about how she had chosen the tinctures from the 
text description of Hufflepuff's badger as 'black' rather than from 
the illustration of it as gray.
> > 
> > I want the Snape family to have long ago grabbed themselves
> > invalid arms reflecting their claim to be descended from Salazar
> > Slytherin, and (snip)
> > -- if I said vert, ON a saltire sable, a serpent argent, wouldn't
> > the serpent be small enough to fit entirely on the saltire?
> 
> First yes if you blazoned it that way then the emblazon would show 
> the serpent as entirely on the saltire. 

How can I blazon that the serpent is plopped over the saltire, 
extending onto the field? 

> However here you ARE violating the color on color ruling 

Yes, I did so intentionally in hope that that would make it clear to 
any on-looker that the 'Snape family arms' were just made up (maybe 
in the 17th century? 16th?) rather than earned back in the Middle 
Ages. Maybe I should just make it a black serpent on a green field 
(Slytherin's arms with serpent changed from argent to sable).

Malfoy arms I invented: on an argent backgroup, a green serpent (so 
far, Slytherin with reversed colors) wrapped around a black sword 
and dripping venom on it. 

Mantling: white and black. 

Crest: as I said, I'm dithering whether it is the head of Janus 
crowned with laurel or the masks of Comedy and Tragedy (both 
references to "two-faced") or the Kallisti apple (a reference to a 
very long Malfoy backstory that I made up), but whicheverway it is on 
one of those fancy helms with gilded bars on the grill to show how 
high-class the family is. 

Motto: Watch Your Back.

Supporters: (which they have, for being aristocrats) Dexter, a 
naked man on fire (very detailed illustrations show the look of 
agony on his face, the usual illustrations look more like a flaming 
devil from Hell). Sinister: an Angel (male,blond, blue-eyed, white 
wings, white robes) holding a dagger with which he has just stabbed 
someone in the back.




From goldangl95 at yahoo.com  Sun Jun 24 05:56:54 2001
From: goldangl95 at yahoo.com (goldangl95 at yahoo.com)
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 05:56:54 -0000
Subject: a fanfic archive
Message-ID: <9h3vf6+9vq0@eGroups.com>

some of you might have already seen this posting on various 
groups....i want to start an archive for harry potter fanfiction...so 
that we don't have to depend on fanfiction.net....if you think this 
is a good idea...e-mail me at Goldangl95 at yahoo.com...so that I can 
see if there is enough interest and people willing to help 




From saitaina at wizzards.net  Sun Jun 24 06:06:21 2001
From: saitaina at wizzards.net (Saitaina)
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 23:06:21 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] a fanfic archive
References: <9h3vf6+9vq0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <081801c0fc73$cb9d5be0$0b4e28d1@oemcomputer>

I already own a fanfiction archive for Harry Potter dear.

Saitaina
*****
AIM-AsherJasonAnita or DracoMal

"This is what it's all been about. All the hatred and suffering and fighting and dying...over nothing 
more then the colors that can be  found in a child's crayola box."

"Kids Mess you up...you spend the rest of your life yelling at something you don't  understand."


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: goldangl95 at yahoo.com 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2001 10:56 PM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] a fanfic archive


  some of you might have already seen this posting on various 
  groups....i want to start an archive for harry potter fanfiction...so 
  that we don't have to depend on fanfiction.net....if you think this 
  is a good idea...e-mail me at Goldangl95 at yahoo.com...so that I can 
  see if there is enough interest and people willing to help 


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor 
       
       

  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com



  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Sun Jun 24 10:41:17 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (Parker Brown Nesbit)
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 06:41:17 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] a fanfic archive
Message-ID: <F13eDTFeAxvOg6SY6Xg00004106@hotmail.com>




>From: goldangl95 at yahoo.com
>Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] a fanfic archive
>Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 05:56:54 -0000
>


Yes, I'd be interested in joining with other authors on an archive site.

Don't have experience in setting up or maintaining a site, so can't help 
there.

Peace & Plenty,

Parker


'...I can teach you how to bottle fame, brew glory, even stopper death...'  
Severus Snape, Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone

'...I have not been helping Sirius get into the castle and I certainly don't 
want Harry dead.'  An odd shiver passed over his face. 'But I won't deny 
that I am a werewolf.'  Remus Lupin, Harry Potter and the Prisoner of 
Azkaban

'But I'm also--I don't know if anyone ever told you--I'm your godfather.'  
Sirius Black, Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From mecks at prodigy.net  Sun Jun 24 15:29:50 2001
From: mecks at prodigy.net (Michela Ecks)
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 10:29:50 -0500
Subject: Good Bye & Good Luck
Message-ID: <000c01c0fcc2$84c609c0$2cb8fea9@hale>

Hey,

I've decided to retreat from the Harry Potter fandom, specifically this
mailing list if you're recieving this.  To me plagarism is always wrong and
tolerance of it offensive no matter the rational.  I would ask that if list
mods desub me because I'm about to go out to visit family for the day.

This is mirrored at http://writersu.s5.com/steal.html for your convience.

I feel silly even having to say this but it needs to be said for the odd
person wandering through who is thinking of
writing the next epic tale.

                       Plagarism is wrong. Plagarism is theft. Please read.
                                    by Michela Ecks (Laura Hale)
                                 mecks at prodigy.net or lhale at niu.edu
                                    or michela_ecks at hotmail.com
     Permission is granted to freely distribute this document so long as the
document and credit remains intact.

On the night of June 22, 2001, Cassandra Claire's edopus "Draco Sinister"
and her other stories were removed from fanfiction.net  because one story
had a substantial passage that was lifted from a book by Pamela Dean.  There
were insinutations that she had  incorporated large chunks of dialogue from
Buffy: The Vampire Slayer, Black Adder and Red Dwarf.  These were, too my
knowledge, never fully investigated because the Pamela Dean evidence was
enough to prove that Cassandra Claire had  plagarized.  She was black
listed.

Writers University fulls supports and endorses this.  Writers University
fully supports and endorses any and all fan sites that
aggreesively seek to prevent, stop or punish known plagarists.

I want to endorse this rationally and on my own at Writers University
because I'm, to a degree, being raked over the coals for this  incident.

Let me start this out by saying that I think plagarism is wrong.  Plagarism
is theft.  Plagarism is not right.  Plagarism is immoral
and unethical.  Plagarism in the fannish community is even more deplorable
for several reasons.  The first is that fan fiction exists  only because the
powers that be allow it to exist.  Our fannish activities can stop at any
time if they do not want us to do them.   Secondly, fan fiction is about
writing.  It's about community.  It's about belonging.  Some of us belong by
sending feedback, putting  up a web site, writing fan fiction.  Communities
are small.  If you steal from some one in this fandom, the person in the
other  fandom will know and you'll hear about it.  Plagarizing isn't being
community minded.  It's being incredibly selfish and putting  yourself above
the community.  It's also about giving the community your best that you can
offer.  When you plagarize, you are  not giving the community the best that
you can offer.

There have been several comments in the Cassandra Claire incident that I
will now address in regards to plagarism.  They are that plagarism is okay
because it doen't hurt the original author, that plagrism is okay if you
disclaim it, that fan fiction is inherently plagaristic so plagarism is
okay, that popularity, famousness and creativity can negate the act of
plagarism, that plagarism is allowed, and that sites should not have the
right to pull down material they deem is plagaristic.

Plagarism is not okay because it doesn't hurt the original author.
Plagarism can hurt the author.  Plagarism can also hurt the
fannish community.  Most people do not want to be plagarized and those
you're plagarizing will be hurt.  Copyright law is pretty specific in
regards to plagarism and it states that you cannot plagarize and that
plagarism is NOT protected under fair use.  Plagarism does not need to hurt
the author for it to be wrong.  You can come to my place of residence.  You
can steal my computer.  You can use my computer while I am at the library.
You haven't physically hurt me.  My life won't end.  I might be upset,
irrational and depressed.  I may feel violated especially if years down the
line I learned you did it.  It's still wrong, harm or no harm.  This
argument doesn't bear up to academic scrutinity.  The last time I took an
English class, we were told we were not allowed to plagarize.  This was told
to me in both my creative writing and research oriented English classes.  No
where, when being told this, was the adjoiner added "unless you're not going
to hurt the author."  I'm not sure how to address this further than to say
that there are many things I want to do that wouldn't really hurt people...
that are none the less illegal, unethical and immoral.  Possible feelings of
the author shouldn't really enter into this.  The author shouldn't really
factor into the debate about the behavior's ethical and legal implications
other than knowing if the person had the author's permission to usurp that
passage.

Plagarism is not okay if you disclaim it.  I'm affiliated with Bringers, an
organization dedicated to the education of and the helping of fans.  A while
back, Bringers was going through major reorganization.  They were dedicated
to fixing up the site, re-evaluating their stance and redefiing issues.  One
of the issues brought to the table was the use of disclaimers on the site...
you know the ones:"No infringement intended."  This was deemed not a good
thing.  Why wasn't it viewed as a good thing?  Because the material was
infringetory and it was deliberately so.  Infringement was intended.
Infringement was deliberate.  They knew it; I knew it.  We also knew it was
hypocrtical to deny the infringing as not intended when it was.  The
disclaimers were changed to something similar to "These images were  used
without permission.  The hosting of these images does not signify support of
or affilations with Warner Brothers.  This site is not for profit."  It's a
much better disclaimer.  They are going to list where all images they have
are taken from and the copyright information just to be on the safe side
because it is always better to error on the side of caution.    There have
been incidents where people have used disclaimers...  I'm thinking of an
incident with Chelsea Quinn Yarbro where a fan fiction writer sought
permission to write a Chelsea Quinn Yarbaro derrivative.  Chelsea,
predictably, said no.  The fan proceeded to publish the story anyway with a
disclaimer saying she didn't have (was denied) permission to publish the
story.  Guess who came knocking down here door?  Chelsea Quinn Yarbro.  It
cost the author and the Zine publisher a lot of time, money and frustration.
In regards to plagarism in fan fiction, it shouldn't happen.  People
shouldn't be plagarizing from books and other fan fiction authors.  They
shouldn't excuse their plagarism with a disclaimer.  It doesn't forgive the
act and most disclaimers fail.  Saying you were inspired by a story by story
X by an author whose name you've forgotten and lifting the passage does not
forgive the plagarism.  And really, with authors both pro and fan, how hard
is it to reach out and ask them if you can incorporate their material as
your own?  There are many fannish writers who would be flattered and many
pro authors who would answer you.  Tamora Pierce, Ben Bova, Alan Dean
Foster, Lawrence Watt Evans, David Drake, Diane Duane...  These are just a
few of the many authors who have e-mail addresses and who will answer your
questions.  Ask for permission rather than disclaiming because disclaiming
doesn't negate the act; it just acknowledges that you committed it.

Fan fiction is not inherently plagaristic.  Plagarizing is not okay in fan
fiction.  I don't even know where to begin here.  I've been hearing many
people defending plagarism because they think that fan fiction is inherently
plagaritic.  To me, fan fiction is not the retooling of other people's work
by doing a search and replace to change names and eye colors.  Fan fiction
is original fiction
written by fans of some thing be it a book, television show, movie or video
game.  Stories are derived from, that is they use
characters, setting, people, from the source, other material.  They are not
material rewritten.  Fan fiction is a form of fiction.  Is fiction
inherently plagaristic?  Fan fiction is written by fans.  Unless you're
going to argue that fiction is inherently plagaristic...  I just don't
understand where people are coming from.   Are there similar issues?  Yes.
Fan fiction can often be a copyright
violation.  The type of violation though isn't plagarism.  It's the usurping
of the the rights of copyright owners to control all
derivative works based on their material.  Plagarism and rights to
derivative works are two different things.  Derivative works
possess originallity.  Plagarism does not.  I really can't think of anything
more to say on this subject.

Popularity and the amount of plagarism doesn't negate the act of plagarism.
It isn't an excuse to plagarize.  There are many very famous people who do
very stupid things.  Think Eminem, Charles Downey Junior, Scottie Pippen,
Cal Ripken Jr.  The list of stupid celebs goes on and on and on.  These
celebs all have their day in court.  The police don't say "Sorry Pip man,
you're famous and I know the law says no carrying of concealed weapons but
hey, you're famous so let's just leave this one between you and me eh?"  It
does not work that way.    If the police acted that way, those police might
find themselves up before Personal Affaires, ethics board, the police chief.
They would find those police negligent.  If you do the crime and you're
found guilty, you do the time no manner how famous you are.  Fame doesn't
negate the act.  The person shouldn't be let off the hook because they have
a name or face people recognize.

Plagarism does not equate with creativity.  No matter what some one tells
me, I will not buy into this argument that plagarism is creative.  Plagarism
by definition is the lifting of and theft of other people's creative
property.  It's the taking of other people's creative efforts and sticking
your name on them.  That is what plagarism, in an evironment where it's
fiction that's being stolen, is.  Let me repeat that: plagarism is the
stealing of other people's creative efforts.  Where does originallity of the
author who plagarized come in?  It doesn't.  The parts the author plagarized
are not creative or original.  That credit should be given to the original
author.  On God Awful Fan Fiction's message board, a poster mentioned a
story where the author took line for line a scene from Babylon 5 and plopped
it down in the middle of an X-Files story.  The section was not credited.
The author wasn't creative.  jms, the creator of Babylon 5 was.  The author
recognized this else they wouldn't have stolen the section.  Is an author
creative after they've been caught stealing?  The answer is maybe... leaning
towards no.  The thing is, once you've been caught plagarizing, all your
work becomes circumspect.  Cassandra Claire was caught plagarizing by the
staff at FanFiction.Net and people sing her praises saying how creative she
is. I'm left to sit and stew in my own juices.  I sit and go "No, she isn't
creative.  She stole from other creative people."  I also become
circumspect.  I will not be able to read anything by Cassandra Claire
without asking myself if I'm really reading her own work or if I'm reading
something she's changed, something she's stolen...  something she is passing
off as original fan fiction that isn't original at all.  Cassandra lacked
the creativity, indeed the finnesse, to rework and reword her story so that
you couldn't identify it from the original.  She lacked the creativty to
totally remake and remold an idea of someone else's into an original
Cassandra Claire.  What she didn't wasn't original.  It wasn't creative.
Plagarism isn't creative.

Fan sites are run by fans.  They are owned by fans.  They are operated by
fans.  They are paid for by fans.  Fan sites have every right to pull down
material from their sites and servers that they do not want posted.  They
have the right to yank the material they deem offensive with out telling
you.  It's their perogative.  They don't need a terms of service.  They
don't need to give you warning.  They don't need to tell you that you are
being investigated for plagarism leading to the possible dismissle of your
material from their sites.  They are not legally obligated to.  They don't
have to.  Complaining and bitching about the unfairness of all this and
saying it is wrong of them to do isn't right.  They don't need to be fair.
They don't need to tell you why and explain themselves.  As a matter of
courtesy, it is nice of them to have a terms of service which explains their
policies regarding dismal of  and deletion of accounts.  As a matter of
courtesy, you should in return read the document and follow those rules.
If you want  them to be courtesy, you have to be willing to give it back in
return.  They don't need to be fair.  They don't need to give you  warning.
Picture web sites like houses.  You are invited into the house.  You are
expected to follow the rules.  If you don't, you will be asked to leave.  If
you come to my place of residence and drink all my Diet Coke, I will get
very annoyed and I will demand, being the cheap creature I am, that you go
out to the store and buy me more.  If you trash my house, I'll call the
police.  It's my place of residence and you follow my rules while on it.  If
you have a problem with them, you leave.  The same philosphy applies to web
sites.  If the house rules are no plagarism, you don't plagarize.  It's that
simple.

And it all boils down to, no matter how much you want to rationalize it,
plagarism is theft.  Plagarism is stealing.  Plagarism is
wrong.

                                                                  Last
modified June 24, 2001 10:15am


Michela Ecks - Spastic Hale Girl - :o)
http://writersu.s5.com/ micecks on aim





From gypsycaine at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 25 02:33:34 2001
From: gypsycaine at yahoo.com (Denise R.)
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 22:33:34 -0400
Subject: Prodigal....
References: <993368229.510.46498.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <022301c0fd1f$3b966760$10ccfea9@computer>

Hi guys!  I'm still alive.

Today, I was kidnapped by my mother, so forgive me for not being at chat,
but since I hadn't really announced the return of my computer I wasn't
certain if it would affect much?

My Cheeta's back, and running, and I'm hoping to join you next weekend, all
dependent on Mom again.  (Her birthday is Monday, and she might want us to
remember...usually she wants us to go away, but you never know)

:)

I miss ya all!

Btw, I lost the entire list of HP-ICQ'ers.

:* (

Dee

Glad to be back!



_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From find_sam at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 25 07:16:37 2001
From: find_sam at hotmail.com (find_sam at hotmail.com)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 07:16:37 -0000
Subject: Good Bye & Good Luck
In-Reply-To: <000c01c0fcc2$84c609c0$2cb8fea9@hale>
Message-ID: <9h6ogl+prat@eGroups.com>

As the writer of the post I'm writing to has retired from the HP 
fandom, it seems pointless to reply. But I will anyway... I haven't 
voiced an opinion on the whole Cassandra Claire issue yet, and I 
would like to take my turn.

Michela Ecks wrote:
> Plagarism is wrong. Plagarism is theft. Please read.

Yes, it is. But this is *fanfiction* we're talking about. It's meant 
to be fun. IMO, fanfiction is not a 'serious' genre, although many 
would disagree. I feel this way because it's usually a hobby, unlike 
most professional writing. It's also normally done on a non profit 
basis, so the writers are doing it purely for their own and others' 
pleasure. 

As far as I know, this applies to Cassandra Claire (henceforth known 
as CC, because she has a really long name to type!). She's writing 
for the fun of it. She's not making money of out it. She enjoys 
writing it. I, and many others, enjoy reading it. Yes, in fundamental 
terms, she may have plagiarised. But GET OVER IT! To nitpick 
fanfiction to pieces ruins it for me.


> There
> were insinutations that she (CC) had  incorporated large chunks of 
dialogue from
> Buffy: The Vampire Slayer, Black Adder and Red Dwarf.

IMO, it's not as if CC was passing these quotes off as her own, and 
hoping no one would notice. She's said on numerous occasions, fairly 
specifically, that yes, DD and DS feature lines which are taken from 
the abovementioned TV shows, word for word in some case. Plagiarism? 
Perhaps. But whether it is or it isn't, these one off quotes don't 
detract from the story at all. Personally, I feel they add to it - 
it's fun to be able to recognise a quote from these TV shows. Readers 
of Terry Pratchett, who has many references to pop culture in his 
books, will be familiar with this feeling. It's not so much 
plagiarism - it's more the writer 'winking' at his or her audience. 
The writer knows the references are there, the reader knows they are 
there. Both parties know that the references are not the original 
work/s of the writer. </ramble>
 
 
> Let me start this out by saying that I think plagarism is wrong.  
Plagarism
> is theft.  Plagarism is not right.  

Thanks for repeating that... didn't quite catch it the first time ;)

Plagarizing isn't being
> community minded.  It's being incredibly selfish and putting  
yourself above
> the community.

Okay, I don't know CC at all, but I seriously doubt that, when she 
put the Pamela Dean/Buffy/Red Dwarf et al passages/lines into DD and 
DS, she was thinking 'I'm putting myself above the community.' If she 
had wilfully plagiarised, ie, intentionally tried to pass off the 
works of others as her own, then it would be different. But, IMO, she 
didn't do this at all.

  It's also about giving the community your best that you can
> offer.  When you plagarize, you are  not giving the community the 
best that
> you can offer.

Again, I feel that CC put the references to other works in to build 
on the sense of the community. In a way, a throwaway quote from Buffy 
is sort of an 'are you paying attention?' to the reader. If the 
reader is paying attention, then he or she is rewarded with the 
pleasure of being able to say, 'I recognise that. Aren't I smart? CC 
and I are on the same level'.


> The last time I took an
> English class, we were told we were not allowed to plagarize.

The last time *I* took an English class, my teacher told me to quote 
critics, where relevant, in essays I wrote for my final exam. This 
was fine as long as I acknowledged the critic. To play devil's 
advocate, what is the difference between using a line from Buffy in 
DS and crediting where it came from, and quoting the work of a critic 
and saying where it came from? 

> Fan fiction is not inherently plagaristic.

I'm not sure where I stand on that issue, but I feel that you are 
contradicting yourself by saying this. How is copying 
settings/characters/plots etc different from copying a one liner or a 
passage from a book? 

  > Popularity and the amount of plagarism doesn't negate the act of 
plagarism.
> It isn't an excuse to plagarize.  There are many very famous people 
who do
> very stupid things.  Think Eminem, Charles Downey Junior, Scottie 
Pippen,
> Cal Ripken Jr.  The list of stupid celebs goes on and on and on.

This argument is completely baseless and, IMO, irrelevant to the 
topic at hand. There's a *huge* difference between abusing someone 
with a deadly weapon/taking drugs etc and plagiarism. I totally 
disagree with this as an analogy.

Fame doesn't
> negate the act.  The person shouldn't be let off the hook because 
they have
> a name or face people recognize.

I don't understand what you're trying to say. CC has already been 
punished; she was blacklisted on FF.Net. The only thing her fame, if 
you can call it that, has done is encourage her fans to go ballistic 
over at the PoU board. Maybe there'll be a few petitions and angry 
letters to FF.Net, but I believe - from Cassandra's responses - that 
CC is willing to accept her blacklisting, if FF.Net honestly sees her 
as having plagiarised.

>plagarism is the
> stealing of other people's creative efforts.  Where does 
originallity of the
> author who plagarized come in?  It doesn't.  The parts the author 
plagarized
> are not creative or original.

Hmmm, I'm not sure this is *always* the case. I'm reminded of the 
spoof of the Mona Lisa where she has a moustache. It's essentially 
plagiarised from Leonardo's original work, but it is still an 
original in it's own right. How this applies to the CC issue I'm not 
sure.

Also, by saying 'plagarism is the stealing of other people's creative 
efforts', I think you're contradicting yourself again on the whole 
fanfiction-is-not-plagiarism argument. By writing FF, aren't you 
fundamentally 'stealing' someone else's creative efforts? Where does 
the originality come in when you write a fic about Harry Potter - 
he's JK Rowling's creative effort. Again, I don't really have an 
opinion (yet) on whether or not fanfiction is inherently plagiaristic 
or not, but I don't think you can make allowances for straightforward 
fanfiction and not for other circumstances. 

> Cassandra Claire was caught plagarizing by the
> staff at FanFiction.Net and people sing her praises saying how 
creative she
> is. I'm left to sit and stew in my own juices.  I sit and go "No, 
she isn't
> creative.  She stole from other creative people." 
(snip)
> Cassandra lacked
> the creativity, indeed the finnesse, to rework and reword her story 
so that
> you couldn't identify it from the original.  She lacked the 
creativty to
> totally remake and remold an idea of someone else's into an original
> Cassandra Claire.  What she didn't wasn't original.  It wasn't 
creative.
> Plagarism isn't creative. 

This is just plain silly! Cassandra Claire took a few lines from 
Buffy et al and a few passages from Pamela Dean's books. This 
probably comprises 0.5% of DD and DS *at the most*. You cannot say 
she is not creative because of this; it's incredibly petty. I feel 
that her plots, her mature development of JKR's characters and her 
writing style are all very creative and unique. She is a creative 
writer, and to say she isn't simply because she allegedly plagiarised 
lines and passages from other works is unfair and unjust. I'm not 
saying she *didn't* plagiarise the lines/passages, but to say that 
her entire work is tarnished is not reasonable.

> Fan sites are run by fans...  (snip) They don't need to be fair.

I agree with this. While sites do have an obligation to their fans, 
if a fan is abusing that privelege then, IMO, the fansite should not 
be required to give a warning. Personally I don't think CC has 
stepped into plagiarism territory, but there you go.

My Final Words: 'While Cassandra Claire may have acted outside the 
written law, she did not act outside the spirit of the law'.

Sam, who just finished his longest post *ever* ;)




From heidit at netbox.com  Mon Jun 25 16:25:01 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (heidit at netbox.com)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 16:25:01 -0000
Subject: mvoie casting rumors...
Message-ID: <9h7okt+61a9@eGroups.com>

http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/ is reporting that there are rumors 
that Hugh Grant is being tapped to play Lockhart in Chamber of 
Secrets and Christian Bale is to play Remus Lupin.


I don't want to flood email boxes with the words YAY and PERFECT, so 
I'll just say them once...




From pbarhug at earthlink.net  Mon Jun 25 16:20:48 2001
From: pbarhug at earthlink.net (Pam Hugonnet)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 12:20:48 -0400
Subject: WB Studio Store merchandise
References: <993368229.510.46498.l10@yahoogroups.com> <022301c0fd1f$3b966760$10ccfea9@computer>
Message-ID: <3B3764E0.7F20B969@earthlink.net>

Hi guys, I need a favor and  I thought I'd ask here:

    Does anyone frequent a WB Studio store?  I need somebody to pick up
some merchandise for me, if possible.  I need 8-10 of the black Hogwarts
gift bags; they are 1.50 each and marked down 40%.  I just got some at
my local WB store but none of the others in my area have any.  If you
can help, thanks.  E-mail me off list and we can arrange the transaction
details.

Thanks.
pam






From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Mon Jun 25 16:32:24 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 16:32:24 -0000
Subject: mvoie casting rumors...
In-Reply-To: <9h7okt+61a9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9h7p2o+67n0@eGroups.com>

I agree with you on Hugh Grant.  An excellent example of him going 
from the too good to be true (and you know he is) to being a slimy 
git is in Bridget Jones' Diary.  I think he'd be great.  Christian 
Bale though - a bit younger than I imagined Remus Lupin to be, and he 
looks far too well fed.

Catherine

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., heidit at n... wrote:
> http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/ is reporting that there are 
rumors 
> that Hugh Grant is being tapped to play Lockhart in Chamber of 
> Secrets and Christian Bale is to play Remus Lupin.
> 
> 
> I don't want to flood email boxes with the words YAY and PERFECT, 
so 
> I'll just say them once...




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Mon Jun 25 16:33:58 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 16:33:58 -0000
Subject: Information request - Friends
Message-ID: <9h7p5m+67o9@eGroups.com>

Please could some kind person mail me off list and tell me what 
happened in the series finale of Friends.  I was visiting my parents 
in Greece all last week, and something went wrong with my VCR.

I'd really appreciate this!  Thanks in advance,
Catherine




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Mon Jun 25 16:42:32 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 16:42:32 -0000
Subject: Dreams
Message-ID: <9h7plo+3ad4@eGroups.com>

I've had some vague HP dreams, but some of my others have been 
freaking me out lately.

I had a dream that my parent's dog had been arrested and sent to a 
concentration camp for dogs - when I found her she was really ill, 
and covered in sores and absesses, and needed feeding up.  The next 
day my mother called and just happened to mention that Meg (the dog) 
had had an accident and the wound had festered into an abscess and 
that they had just taken her to the vet.

A couple of weeks ago I dreamt that my mother-in-law was ill and had 
fallen over in the bath.  A couple of days later she called to say 
that she was really ill, and was cancelling a visit she had planned.

This happens all the time.  At Christmas, my husband was planning on 
going up to Northampton to deliver all the family presents.  I was 
going to stay at home, as we were so short of time - but that night I 
had a dream that he fell asleep at the wheel and died in a car crash 
because I wasn't there - so I had to go with him.

Does everyone do this, or am I just wierd?!

Catherine




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 25 16:57:48 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 09:57:48 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] mvoie casting rumors...
In-Reply-To: <9h7okt+61a9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010625165748.42533.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>


Is this true?  Part of me wonders if either of those actors would really be in Harry Potter....although, Hugh Grant would be my choice for Lockhart...and Christian Bale as LUpin( I love Christian to death, and hope with all my heart that it is true...I'm just not going to get my hopes up for it.

Melanie



---------------------------------
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From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 25 17:13:37 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 10:13:37 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: mvoie casting rumors...
In-Reply-To: <9h7p2o+67n0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010625171337.68758.qmail@web10902.mail.yahoo.com>


I agree with you on Hugh Grant.  An excellent example of him going 
from the too good to be true (and you know he is) to being a slimy 
git is in Bridget Jones' Diary.  I think he'd be great.  Christian 
Bale though - a bit younger than I imagined Remus Lupin to be, and he 
looks far too well fed.

Catherine

How old is Christian...like 28 or so?  Yeah that is a bit young...I am guessing if Snape is about 35 (JKR said this in one of her chats, actually several of them) then I would guess that would be about the age of LUpin, Sirius etc.  Not that much younger but still young, I mean he will probably be around thirty by the time the movie would get shot.  He doesn't have the warn down look that I would expect Lupin to have though...far too attractive in my oppinion *not saying Lupin is ugly...but I just can't say that he's suppossed to be as attractive as Christian..

Melanie

 



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From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 25 17:21:04 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 10:21:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: movie casting rumors...
In-Reply-To: <9h7p2o+67n0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010625172104.52399.qmail@web14507.mail.yahoo.com>


--- catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk wrote:
> I agree with you on Hugh Grant.  An excellent example of him going 
> from the too good to be true (and you know he is) to being a slimy 
> git is in Bridget Jones' Diary.  I think he'd be great.  Christian 
> Bale though - a bit younger than I imagined Remus Lupin to be, and he
> looks far too well fed.

<giggle> I rather agree with you. I think that Hugh Grant can pull off
the foppishness of Lockhart quite nicely, if he dies his hair blond.
Christian...I don't know what it is but he just doesn't strike me as
Lupin. He could probably do the part justice, I know he's a great
actor, but he just doesn't fit up with my mind's eye picture. I see
Lupin as this amazingly calm individual and Christian just doesn't seem
to portray calmness.

Of course, I've always slotted Christian with Newsies and American
Psycho. It's hard for me to imagine a young newspaper boy or a
twenty-something psychotic murderer as Remus Lupin. However, Christian
may prove me wrong.

Y'know what? I've just discovered that the Lupin in my mind's eye has
always been portly. That's strange considering that there are many
references to him being underfed. Odd how the mind will continually
ignore fact...guess I need to read PoA again.

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/21/2001

"Afraid of change, afraid of staying the same
When temptation calls, we just look away..."
- Barenaked Ladies, "What A Good Boy"

__________________________________________________
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From bkdelong at pobox.com  Mon Jun 25 17:53:12 2001
From: bkdelong at pobox.com (B.K. DeLong)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 13:53:12 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] mvoie casting rumors...
In-Reply-To: <20010625165748.42533.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <9h7okt+61a9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010625135128.052f4d90@brain-stream.com>

At 09:57 AM 06/25/2001 -0700, you wrote:

>Is this true?  Part of me wonders if either of those actors would really 
>be in Harry Potter....although, Hugh Grant would be my choice for 
>Lockhart...and Christian Bale as LUpin( I love Christian to death, and 
>hope with all my heart that it is true...I'm just not going to get my 
>hopes up for it.

No....all of these a RU-MORS. That's why we bolded them on the Web site. We 
have no confirmations yet...only rumblings.

I promise you'll all know the first second we find anything out for sure.


--
B.K. DeLong
Editor-in-Chief
The Leaky Cauldron
  an (unofficial) Harry Potter news site
+1.617.877.3271

bkdelong at the-leaky-cauldron.org
http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org




From jinxster at cyberlass.com  Mon Jun 25 20:50:23 2001
From: jinxster at cyberlass.com (J. L. Matthews)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 21:50:23 +0100
Subject: In defence of Cassie Claire
References: <993454709.261.93263.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <002401c0fdb8$767a24e0$7c8f7ed4@johnmitt>



> Message: 2
>    Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 10:29:50 -0500
>    From: "Michela Ecks" <mecks at prodigy.net>
> Subject: Good Bye & Good Luck
>
> Hey,
>
> I've decided to retreat from the Harry Potter fandom, specifically this
> mailing list if you're recieving this.  To me plagarism is always wrong
and
> tolerance of it offensive no matter the rational.  I would ask that if
list
> mods desub me because I'm about to go out to visit family for the day.
>
> This is mirrored at http://writersu.s5.com/steal.html for your convience.
>
> I feel silly even having to say this but it needs to be said for the odd
> person wandering through who is thinking of
> writing the next epic tale.

I know she's left the fandom now, but I felt obliged to reply.  If you don't
fancy reading a rant, hit delete now.

If you're still with me, then here's a rebuttal from the odd person writing
the next epic tale (<plug>Slytherin Rising, available on ffnet, or for those
of you boycotting it, Yahoo groups</plug>), who has also borrowed from
various pop culture sources before now, although it must be said, never an
entire scene, the sole exception being dialogue taken direct from the canon,
but I think that's allowed in an HP fanfic, and it is necessary to my
series.

Here goes...

First, withdrawal from an entire fandom b/c an author does something you
don't like is extremely petty to say the least.  If it's the reactions of
others you can't stomach, then if it's a small minority, is it so hard to
ignore them?  And if it's a large percentage, maybe they have a point.  If
you are still reading... grow up.

>                        Plagarism is wrong. Plagarism is theft. Please
read.
>                                     by Michela Ecks (Laura Hale)
>                                  mecks at prodigy.net or lhale at niu.edu
>                                     or michela_ecks at hotmail.com
>      Permission is granted to freely distribute this document so long as
the
> document and credit remains intact.
>
> On the night of June 22, 2001, Cassandra Claire's edopus "Draco Sinister"
> and her other stories were removed from fanfiction.net  because one story
> had a substantial passage that was lifted from a book by Pamela Dean.
There
> were insinutations that she had  incorporated large chunks of dialogue
from
> Buffy: The Vampire Slayer, Black Adder and Red Dwarf.  These were, too my
> knowledge, never fully investigated because the Pamela Dean evidence was
> enough to prove that Cassandra Claire had  plagarized.  She was black
> listed.

As a fan of Blackadder and Red Dwarf, and a casual viewer of Buffy, can I
just state that she did not incorporate "large chunks of dialogue".  She
wrote in a few quotes now and again that are recognisable to anyone who's
seen the programmes in question.  And there were copious disclaimers around
to tell those who didn't know that they were quotes.

Admittedly the disclaimers could have been better.  It's not really enough
to say "look out for Buffy, Blackadder and RD refs" as I've found to my cost
before now.  You've really got to say, either before or after the chapter
concerned, which quotes come from where, and CC never really did this.
Seeing as I've not seen a lot of Buffy, there could be massive chunks of it
in there for all I know.  It hasn't ruined the story for me, although the
discovery that the clinical death and resuscitation of Draco appears to be
based on the last episode of series 1 of BTVS has taken the glow off it
somewhat.  Won't stop me reading though.

> Writers University fulls supports and endorses this.  Writers University
> fully supports and endorses any and all fan sites that
> aggreesively seek to prevent, stop or punish known plagarists.
>
> I want to endorse this rationally and on my own at Writers University
> because I'm, to a degree, being raked over the coals for this  incident.

Why, did you lead the blacklist or something?

> Let me start this out by saying that I think plagarism is wrong.
Plagarism
> is theft.  Plagarism is not right.  Plagarism is immoral
> and unethical.  Plagarism in the fannish community is even more deplorable
> for several reasons.  The first is that fan fiction exists  only because
the
> powers that be allow it to exist.  Our fannish activities can stop at any
> time if they do not want us to do them.   Secondly, fan fiction is about
> writing.  It's about community.  It's about belonging.  Some of us belong
by
> sending feedback, putting  up a web site, writing fan fiction.
Communities
> are small.  If you steal from some one in this fandom, the person in the
> other  fandom will know and you'll hear about it.  Plagarizing isn't being
> community minded.  It's being incredibly selfish and putting  yourself
above
> the community.  It's also about giving the community your best that you
can
> offer.  When you plagarize, you are  not giving the community the best
that
> you can offer.
>
> There have been several comments in the Cassandra Claire incident that I
> will now address in regards to plagarism.  They are that plagarism is okay
> because it doen't hurt the original author, that plagrism is okay if you
> disclaim it,

Point one.  Let us define plagiarism here.  And everyone LEARN TO SPELL IT
CORRECTLY!  It's "plagiarise" if you're using UK English, "plagiarize" if
US.

I've been given to understand it is taking another's work and passing it off
as your own, at least that's how my university always defined it.

Please note second part of that definition.  PASSING IT OFF AS ONE'S OWN.
If you disclaim properly, you are not plagiarising because you are admitting
that bit is not yours.

Now that wouldn't stand up in a court of law, I know.  But we are not pro
writers.  We are not doing this for profit, purely for fun.  By definition
fanfic is plagiarism precisely because you're messing around with other
people's stuff.  If you're already using characters that are not yours, in a
setting that is not yours, with plot elements that are not yours, what on
earth is wrong with borrowing one-liners and quotes that are not yours and
weaving them in?  So long as you state where they're from.  So often, it is
not the idea that is original, but what you do with it.  Taking a line from
one source and weaving it into another situation without it looking
contrived and still retaining the humour does take a fair bit of creativity.

 that fan fiction is inherently plagaristic so plagarism is
> okay,

But it is inherently plagiaristic.  You said earlier that the powers that be
can call a halt to fanfiction any time they want to.  Why do you think that
is?  Well, let's define powers that be.  The courts, publishers, authors,
lawyers, anyone who holds copyright in the work being fanficced.  And the
reason they can call a halt to fanfic is because they view it as theft.  The
Harry Potter fanfic community thrives as much as it does only because JKR
doesn't mind it's existence, and Warner Bros appear to be more interested in
their visuals than the actual stories copyright wise.

> Plagarism is not okay if you disclaim it.  I'm affiliated with Bringers,
an
> organization dedicated to the education of and the helping of fans.  A
while
> back, Bringers was going through major reorganization.  They were
dedicated
> to fixing up the site, re-evaluating their stance and redefiing issues.
One
> of the issues brought to the table was the use of disclaimers on the
site...
> you know the ones:"No infringement intended."  This was deemed not a good
> thing.  Why wasn't it viewed as a good thing?  Because the material was
> infringetory and it was deliberately so.  Infringement was intended.
> Infringement was deliberate.  They knew it; I knew it.  We also knew it
was
> hypocrtical to deny the infringing as not intended when it was.  The
> disclaimers were changed to something similar to "These images were  used
> without permission.  The hosting of these images does not signify support
of
> or affilations with Warner Brothers.  This site is not for profit."  It's

a
> much better disclaimer.  They are going to list where all images they have
> are taken from and the copyright information just to be on the safe side
> because it is always better to error on the side of caution.    There have
> been incidents where people have used disclaimers...  I'm thinking of an
> incident with Chelsea Quinn Yarbro where a fan fiction writer sought
> permission to write a Chelsea Quinn Yarbaro derrivative.  Chelsea,
> predictably, said no.  The fan proceeded to publish the story anyway with
a
> disclaimer saying she didn't have (was denied) permission to publish the
> story.  Guess who came knocking down here door?  Chelsea Quinn Yarbro.  It
> cost the author and the Zine publisher a lot of time, money and
frustration.


You just contradicted yourself there.  You are not saying disclaimers don't
make it OK, you are saying that it depends on the type of disclaimer.
Bringers are still plagiarising according to your definition, they've just
made the disclaimer a more accurate one.

The Chelsea Quinn Yarbro thing is a different case entirely.  Here we have a
writer being officially denied permission to work with the material, and
going against it.  That is not the same as CC's actions, where AFAIK, she'd
never been specifically told by JKR, Joss Whedon, Grant/Naylor and Richard
Curtis to stop using their stuff.

> In regards to plagarism in fan fiction, it shouldn't happen.  People
> shouldn't be plagarizing from books and other fan fiction authors.

Since when has CC taken from other fic authors?

They
> shouldn't excuse their plagarism with a disclaimer.  It doesn't forgive
the
> act and most disclaimers fail.  Saying you were inspired by a story by
story
> X by an author whose name you've forgotten and lifting the passage does
not
> forgive the plagarism.  And really, with authors both pro and fan, how
hard
> is it to reach out and ask them if you can incorporate their material as
> your own?  There are many fannish writers who would be flattered and many
> pro authors who would answer you.  Tamora Pierce, Ben Bova, Alan Dean
> Foster, Lawrence Watt Evans, David Drake, Diane Duane...  These are just a
> few of the many authors who have e-mail addresses and who will answer your
> questions.  Ask for permission rather than disclaiming because disclaiming
> doesn't negate the act; it just acknowledges that you committed it.

If we all asked for permission, there'd be no fanfic.  Do you write fanfic?
Did you ask JKR if you could use her characters?  Of course not?  Did any of
us fic writers ask her?  No.


> Fan fiction is not inherently plagaristic.  Plagarizing is not okay in fan
> fiction.  I don't even know where to begin here.  I've been hearing many
> people defending plagarism because they think that fan fiction is
inherently
> plagaritic.  To me, fan fiction is not the retooling of other people's
work
> by doing a search and replace to change names and eye colors.  Fan fiction

> is original fiction
> written by fans of some thing be it a book, television show, movie or
video
> game.  Stories are derived from, that is they use
> characters, setting, people, from the source, other material.  They are
not
> material rewritten.

*coughs*  Some are.  There's some very good and rather original stuff out
there involving a rewrite of canon.  So far, no one's accused it of being
plagiaristic, precisely because the story's been reworked in a way no one's
done before.  In most cases, it's either AU and the plot's been sufficiently
changed to make it different enough to avoid plagiarism charges, or the
canon plot's in the background and the writer's more focused on other
non-canon events going on in the same time-frame.  You couldn't call it
plagiarism though.

Fan fiction is a form of fiction.  Is fiction
> inherently plagaristic?  Fan fiction is written by fans.  Unless you're
> going to argue that fiction is inherently plagaristic...

Ooh!  A logical fallacy!  I love these!  Please explain to me how that
works?  Fanfiction is not just another type of fiction which just happens to
be written by fans of something.  It's fiction relying on someone else's
work for the basis of a large chunk of its composition.  It's a completely
different world from fiction in general.

I just don't
> understand where people are coming from.   Are there similar issues?  Yes.
> Fan fiction can often be a copyright
> violation.  The type of violation though isn't plagarism.  It's the
usurping
> of the the rights of copyright owners to control all
> derivative works based on their material.  Plagarism and rights to
> derivative works are two different things.  Derivative works
> possess originallity.  Plagarism does not.  I really can't think of
anything
> more to say on this subject.

True enough, but you need to define what plagiarism is instead of saying
what it is not.  Because, lousy disclaimering aside, I don't think CC was
intentionally stealing the work of others.

In a way, she's actually done Pamela Dean a favour.  Who had heard of her
before this?  Not me.  Is she a published author or a fic writer or what?
She's probably had more publicity as a result of this than she's ever done
in her life.

> Popularity and the amount of plagarism doesn't negate the act of
plagarism.
> It isn't an excuse to plagarize.  There are many very famous people who do
> very stupid things.  Think Eminem, Charles Downey Junior, Scottie Pippen,
> Cal Ripken Jr.  The list of stupid celebs goes on and on and on.  These
> celebs all have their day in court.  The police don't say "Sorry Pip man,
> you're famous and I know the law says no carrying of concealed weapons but
> hey, you're famous so let's just leave this one between you and me eh?"
It
> does not work that way.    If the police acted that way, those police
might
> find themselves up before Personal Affaires, ethics board, the police
chief.
> They would find those police negligent.  If you do the crime and you're
> found guilty, you do the time no manner how famous you are.  Fame doesn't
> negate the act.  The person shouldn't be let off the hook because they
have
> a name or face people recognize.

We are not excusing her because she is famous.  We are excusing her because
we still think her work has validity and originality, unauthorised borrowing
aside.

The situations you compare are totally different in nature.  Eminem getting
let off for drug trafficking and gun carrying because of his fame is wrong
because the fame is irrelevant to the matter in hand.

CC's offence, on the other hand, is intimately bound up with her fame and
the reason for it - her writing.  I think you'll find her defendants are not
saying that "but it's Cassie!  You can't do Cassie for plagiarism, she's too
famous!"  Rather, we are saying "We think she was unfairly treated by ffnet,
and we are going to read her work regardless, because we think it's still
original enough for us."

A better analogy would have been the real situation of Eminem getting sued
by his mother for defamatory remarks in his records - Eminem fans still
flock to buy his records regardless.

> Plagarism does not equate with creativity.  No matter what some one tells
> me, I will not buy into this argument that plagarism is creative.
Plagarism
> by definition is the lifting of and theft of other people's creative
> property.  It's the taking of other people's creative efforts and sticking
> your name on them.  That is what plagarism, in an evironment where it's
> fiction that's being stolen, is.  Let me repeat that: plagarism is the
> stealing of other people's creative efforts.  Where does originallity of
the
> author who plagarized come in?  It doesn't.  The parts the author
plagarized
> are not creative or original.  That credit should be given to the original
> author.  On God Awful Fan Fiction's message board, a poster mentioned a
> story where the author took line for line a scene from Babylon 5 and
plopped
> it down in the middle of an X-Files story.  The section was not credited.
> The author wasn't creative.  jms, the creator of Babylon 5 was.  The
author
> recognized this else they wouldn't have stolen the section.

I don't think CC regularly goes out and takes line by line entire scenes
from other works.  When she does quote directly, she usually says that there
are quotes from other fandoms in there, although I do agree she should say
which ones and where they're from.  This incident was probably down more to
oversight than intent and could have been sorted out much more
diplomatically.


Is an author
> creative after they've been caught stealing?  The answer is maybe...
leaning
> towards no.  The thing is, once you've been caught plagarizing, all your
> work becomes circumspect.  Cassandra Claire was caught plagarizing by the
> staff at FanFiction.Net and people sing her praises saying how creative
she
> is. I'm left to sit and stew in my own juices.  I sit and go "No, she
isn't
> creative.  She stole from other creative people."  I also become
> circumspect.  I will not be able to read anything by Cassandra Claire
> without asking myself if I'm really reading her own work or if I'm reading

> something she's changed, something she's stolen...  something she is
passing
> off as original fan fiction that isn't original at all.  Cassandra lacked
> the creativity, indeed the finnesse, to rework and reword her story so
that
> you couldn't identify it from the original.  She lacked the creativty to
> totally remake and remold an idea of someone else's into an original
> Cassandra Claire.  What she didn't wasn't original.  It wasn't creative.
> Plagarism isn't creative.

No.  CC was creative.  Think why DD and DS became so popular.  Had large
amounts been taken from other sources, they would have languished.  But they
didn't.

They have their own plotlines.  A fair few original gags.  And most of all,
character development that is far and away unique.

Who was the first, the very first, to take an evil character from the books
and turn him into one of the good guys?  Cassie.  Who did it without
destroying his personality, and many would say, improved it?  Cassie.  Who
did it convincingly?  Cassie.

Anyone who says CC is not creative has clearly not read Draco Dormiens.  It
inspired me to start writing (among other things).  I can't say my own stuff
doesn't owe a debt to it.  And I doubt I'm the only one.

Right, that's my input on the whole thing.  A word to all writers - if you
decide to reference anything SAY SO.  Don't assume everyone will recognise
the source.  I got stung by that myself once - I got round it by challenging
my readers to spot them, then revealing the answers next chapter.   Seems to
work plus it's fun.

A devoted Draco fan,

J. L. Matthews


"The sun is out, the birds are singing, Slytherin are leading the
championship and
Professor Snape hasn't got a good word to say about anyone. That to me is
normality."

- Deanna Tyler, Slytherin Rising 3






From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 25 21:05:05 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (Laurin York)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 14:05:05 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Movie Casting Rumors/Parallels I just noticed...
Message-ID: <20010625210505.85180.qmail@web14704.mail.yahoo.com>

Hugh Grant does sound like a good Lockhart.  I'm with
the people who think Christian Bale is too young,
though.  Love him to pieces, but not quite right...

Having just watched the X-Men movie on video, I've got
the guy who played Wolverine stuck in my head now for
Lupin.  (He just looked really good done up as a
wolfie type.)  And I noticed a slew of similarities
between the X-Men world and the Harry Potter world:

1. Mutants and Wizards must hide themselves and their
abilities for fear of "normal" people
2. There are two mutants (Magneto and Xavier) who are
dividing up the bad and good mutants (read: Voldemort
and Dumbledore)
3. The "good" mutant leader runs a school for kids who
are mutants (Hogwarts)
4. Magneto seems to have been a youth during WWII and
suffered at the hands of ignorant non-mutants (Riddle
and his family/orphanage experiences)

I noticed some other things, but those seemed the most
significant.  I thought it was pretty neat.  Plus,
Anna Paquin (Rogue in X-Men) would make an awesome
teenage Hermione...

--Laurin

=====
Get Psyched out...
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HP_Psych

A man with a watch knows what time it is.  A man with two watches is never quite sure...

__________________________________________________
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From cassandraclaire at mail.com  Mon Jun 25 22:16:06 2001
From: cassandraclaire at mail.com (cassandraclaire at mail.com)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 22:16:06 -0000
Subject: Cassie's two cents
Message-ID: <9h8d76+n7d9@eGroups.com>



This is not in response to Michaela's post, since I don't see a point 
in responding to that. I just wanted to thank those who have defended 
me (Sam, JL Matthews, and everyone else) and state a little of my 
position, and my thoughts. Not as a defense, really, just as an 
explanation. I've been very quiet about this in general because I 
don't want a flame war. I hope there won't be one.

I am a professional writer, of nonfiction, and I also write my own 
original fiction. I will readily admit that fanfiction, up until 
about last August, was something I knew absolutely nothing about. 
 
I have always seen fanfiction as a venue in which I could do what I 
*could never* do in my own writing-- namely, creating what Minx once 
described as a "pastiche" --- weaving together JKR's world with my 
own plotline, and incorporating bits and pieces of other fantasy 
worlds. Anyone on the PoU list would have seen the discussions that 
follow the release of each chapter -- "Oh, that's the swordfighting 
bit from Zelazny," "Oh, that's the scene from thus-and-such episode 
of Buffy" -- I had never made it any secret that that's what I was 
doing, and since fanfiction is by its nature so derivative, and since 
I have seen so many other fanfics doing similar things -- pulling 
chunks of text from books, rewriting scenes from movies, dozens upon 
dozens of quotes from Buffy and Monty Python and Blackadder and so 
forth (I even had a sort of unofficial quote-nabbing contest going 
with other fanfic writers -- if we found a cool quote we'd claim it 
for our next chapter before anyone else snagged it) it really did 
seem to me that as long as it was disclaimered, it was fine. As long 
as I was clear about what I was doing, it was fine. I used to get 
dozens of emails in which readers sent me sources -- sometimes 
quotes, sometimes whole pages of text from books or plays -- 
saying "Cassie, I think you should have Draco say this" or "maybe you 
could use this description/place/setting." It seemed to me that my 
audience understood what I was doing, or trying to do, with my 
fanfiction, and that as long as I was not concealing this from them, 
it was all right. As for the Pamela Dean section, when it came out 
she was discussed on PoU. People were pointed (not by me) to where on 
the web they could download the complete text of her books( now 
there's copyright infringment for ya.) So I didn't feel as if I were 
trying to conceal anything, in fact I urged people to read her great 
books, which I would not have probably done had I been trying to hide 
what I'd used from her.

I am not saying I don't realize now that I was not correct in my 
assumption that as long as I wasn't hiding what I was doing, it was 
perfectly all right. I'm just saying that's what I thought, and that 
I certainly didn't mean any harm. To anyone.

As for the disclaimer on that section, being inadequate, it was. I 
was lazy when I first posted -- the Pamela Dean books have been out 
of print for years, and what I was working from was a handwritten 
copy of that scene I'd written into a notebook while I was still in 
high school. I actually *wasn't* sure of the author's name, but knew 
that if I posted that, I'd get a zillion responses from readers 
offering the information. I did, and I adjusted the disclaimer 
accordingly. However, when the ff.net chaptering system went up, I 
had to reupload some chapters, and I accidentally reuploaded Chapter 
9 with the inadequate disclaimer, and simply didn't notice. Heidi can 
back me up on that -- she helped with the reuploading. That is 
entirely my fault and I'm not saying it isn't, just reiterating that 
no malice was intended, nor did I *think at the time* that I was 
doing anything wrong. I'm currently rethinking my former position, 
and I do realize I made a mistake, I simply wanted to stress that it 
was a mistake made without malicious intent or disrespect for Pamela 
Dean.

I know some writers have pulled their work from ff.net to show 
solidarity with me. Many others have pulled their work because 
they've done the exact same thing I did -- pulled a chunk of text 
from another book, paraphrased it, and mentioned it in the 
disclaimer. It is easy, with fanfiction being the gray area it is, to 
be confused. Now they don't feel safe. So they've pulled their work. 
More will probably follow. Because they *are* confused. It *is* 
confusing. I've heard from a lot of confused people, so I know. I was 
certainly confused myself, and frankly, still am. Why is it that 
songfics that incorporate huge chunks of copyrighted lyrics, often 
with little to no fic around them, are okay -- even when the actual 
writer of the song is not even mentioned in the disclaimer? Or 
rewriting movie plots and sticking in the Harry Potter characters is 
okay, even when practically no line of dialogue is changed? Or 
writing fanfiction about real people doing things that would 
doubtless horrify them if they ever came across them (here I'm 
thinking of those peculiar Backstreet Boys fics) is okay? It seemed 
to me that things are constantly being done in fanfic that would be 
totally unallowable in fiction meant for publishing, and where the 
line is drawn I am and was honestly confused.

Am I angry with ff.net? It doesn't matter. What they did is 
irrevocable and at this point I would not want it changed. Yes, I 
would have appreciated some sort of email telling me what was going 
on so that I didn't have to learn it from nasty posts in the forum. 
But I consider that an issue not worth pursuing. I'm more interested 
in getting back to writing.


Cassie




From MMMfanfic at hotmail.com  Mon Jun 25 22:16:38 2001
From: MMMfanfic at hotmail.com (MMMfanfic at hotmail.com)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 22:16:38 -0000
Subject: In defence of Cassie Claire
In-Reply-To: <002401c0fdb8$767a24e0$7c8f7ed4@johnmitt>
Message-ID: <9h8d86+fbqa@eGroups.com>

I'm sorry to see Michela go because her vast knowledge in fanfiction 
has helped me to improve my own writing.  I can understand her 
rationale for leaving.  She no doubt feels that the fandom seem to 
condone plagiarism.

(You can't flame me for saying goodbye, right?)
But fanfiction is plagiarism; plagiarism is plagiarism; hence 
plagiarism is fanfiction and it's part of what fanficiton is about.

Your timid Slytherin,

MMM




From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Mon Jun 25 23:06:27 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 23:06:27 -0000
Subject: Looking for Willow (Thanks Amber)
In-Reply-To: <20010622124406.40817.qmail@web14503.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9h8g5j+a6s0@eGroups.com>

Thanks for the help Amber.

  I did check out Amazon and BN, they have a lot of Ron Howard's 
movies but not Willow. Anyway I'll check out Half.com and ebay. Maybe 
I'll dig something up. 

Thanks again,
            Kristin

p.s if anyone else might know of any other options for my quest 
please e-mail me. Thanks.




From wings909 at aol.com  Mon Jun 25 23:50:39 2001
From: wings909 at aol.com (wings909 at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 19:50:39 EDT
Subject: AOL HP Trailer
Message-ID: <114.cb2918.2869284f@aol.com>

AOHell users can use keyword "Harry Potter" to bring up the new trailer on 
Wednesday.  There's also a new picture from the trailer, it's up on 
hpgalleries and leaky-cauldron as well.  We do see that Harry has a pair of 
bright green eyes and he's holding the snitch (I think).  Now if only we 
could see the scar!

Cheers,
Paula

"At that moment, there was a diversion in the form of a small, red-headed 
figure in a long nightdress, who appeared in the kitchen, gave a small 
squeal, and ran out again." The Chamber of Secrets 
    




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Tue Jun 26 01:34:21 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (pbnesbit at msn.com)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 01:34:21 -0000
Subject: Dreams
In-Reply-To: <9h7plo+3ad4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9h8oqt+vhbp@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., catherine at c... wrote:
> I've had some vague HP dreams, but some of my others have been 
> freaking me out lately.


(Dreams snipped)
> 
> > Does everyone do this, or am I just wierd?!
> 
> Catherine

It happens to me quite a lot.  At first, it scared the living 
daylights out of me, but it's been going on so long now, that I've 
learned to trust my dreams.  

I also sometimes (OK, a lot of the time) just seem to 'know' things 
without any warning.  An example:  Doug was asked to resign from his 
job in VA in November.  I knew in June that they were going to do 
it.  When he called to tell me, I simply said 'I know & I've known 
since June that they were going to do this.'  He, needless to say, 
was totally dumbfounded.  

So no, Catherine, you're not weird in my book.  

Peace & Plenty, 

Parker




From Schlobin at aol.com  Tue Jun 26 02:32:04 2001
From: Schlobin at aol.com (Schlobin at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 02:32:04 -0000
Subject: Trailer on AOL?
In-Reply-To: <9gllvh+4mq3@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9h8s75+1dmk@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., rodeodangerqueen at y... wrote:
> Hey all,
> 
> Generally, when a movie is released, the movie's studio wants to 
> promote its other projects.  Harry Potter is (as most of you know 
> already) a Warner Brothers studio release.  Therefore, you are most 
> likely to see Harry Potter trailers during the previews to Warner 
> Bros. movies (there is some chance that non-WB movies will be 
willing 
> to include the trailer during previews regardless).  With word out 
> now that the second trailer is to be released in July, I am going 
to 
> bank on the July 4th release of CATS AND DOGS (WB Studios) as the 
> film to "watch" for the new trailer.  Then again, the EXACT DATE IN 
> JULY that the trailer will be out was not provided, but even if 
CATS 
> AND DOGS doesn't have the trailer at first, they may "attach" it 
> later in the month (especially considering that CATS AND DOGS is 
the 
> ONLY WB release in July according to what I've seen).





I just read on AOL that they will have the new trailer available for 
download by the end of the week....

Susan 



> 
> A.I. (Artificial Intelligence) is also a Warner Bros. release, due 
> out at the VERY end of June.  Perhaps they will sneak in the new 
> trailer for HP and the SS at that point, or shortly thereafter and 
> attach it to that film.  (I believe the exact date for A.I. is June 
> 29th).  I think CATS AND DOGS is the more logical choice because of 
> the "audience" they're going to attract.  After CATS AND DOGS, I 
> don't think there will even be another WB release until mid-August!
> 
> So, I think it will be the movie about the two rival animal groups 
> that will provide the best first chance to see trailer #2 for HP 
and 
> the SS.  Trailer #3 is due in the fall.  I will get a more exact 
> month for that if I can...and I will get any other info that I can 
on 
> some other current WB studio releases that may eventually attach 
the 
> second HP trailer to their previews.
> 
> Still, CATS AND DOGS is "what is probably is."
> 
> Anyone with information on the new trailer being shown in July 
before 
> the start of a NON-WB film...please drop us a note ASAP.  Thanks.
> 
> N ;)




From Schlobin at aol.com  Tue Jun 26 02:39:36 2001
From: Schlobin at aol.com (Schlobin at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 02:39:36 -0000
Subject: Misunderstood Witches
In-Reply-To: <9gqfhb+anpd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9h8sl8+q96c@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Benjamin" <jaffa276 at y...> wrote:
> Angela Boyko wrote:
> [snip] She began to tell me that since the stories
> > > were about 
> > > witchcraft, they were bad and preached evil.  
> [snip]
> > I know a couple of Wiccans and I don't believe they
> > are evil. One can be quite unpleasant if someone slams
> > her favourite sports star, but she'd be that way no
> > matter what beliefs she practises.
>  
> I think that perhaps the most evil person I have known was not a 
> witch, but in fact assisted in a Anglican church.  She had a friend 
> who was a witch (just "came out of the broom closet") and who acted 
> somewhat as a calming and restraining influence.
> 
> Not that I'd hold these up as either typical or atypical of either 
> form of belief.  It also depends on what is your definition of evil 
> really.  The rest just seems to fall back on stereotypes.  
> 
> -Ben. Has my solvent dried yet?


Well, of course, there are probably the same percentage of evil 
witches/wiccans as there are evil Christians/Jews/Muslims/Buddhists, 
etc.

The bottom line is that the witchcraft that is practiced today as a 
spiritual discipline does not embrace evil. Period. It doesn't.

The "know nothings" and "don't bother me with the truth" people make 
me crazy.

I really don't get the "Christian" argument (I put it in quotes 
because I know that the anti HP and even the anti witchcraft groups 
are not representative. Why are they against witchcraft? Because it 
says so in the Bible? 

Now, I can understand being against Satan, and against anyone who 
invokes the powers of evil/Satan.

So, I can understand being against Satanists...I guess there are some 
but I've never met one. And I'm a pagan..maybe the Satanists just 
hang out around Christians -- after all, Satan is a Christian 
construct, not a pagan one...

And I can understand being against witchcraft if one thinks it's 
about evil....

But modern day witches (I'm one) can speak up and say "no, we're 
about nature and the environment, and accountability, and love, and 
pleasure, etc." Of course, we do think sex per se is good, not evil, 
and we don't think you have to be married (all acts of love and 
pleasure are my rituals), so I can understand people having a problem 
with that..

But for gosh sakes! get informed! How can you be against HP, and call 
Harry evil? The HP saga is your basic morality play -- it's all about 
Harry as the enemy of Voldemort the Evil..

Susan




From Schlobin at aol.com  Tue Jun 26 02:42:08 2001
From: Schlobin at aol.com (Schlobin at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 02:42:08 -0000
Subject: Pronunciation of "Animagus"
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106192358580.13564-100000@er4.rutgers.edu>
Message-ID: <9h8sq0+p2vr@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Jen Faulkner <jfaulkne at e...> wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Jun 2001 linman6868 at a... wrote:
> 
> > The subject heading ought to tell you what I'm on about.  How do 
you 
> > pronounce "Animagus"?  I'm asking because I just recently looked 
up 
> > the word "magus" in the dictionary and it has a long 'a', as 
> > in "bagel."  *snerk*  But I'd been pronouncing "Animagus", rather 
> > awkwardly, with two deep 'a's as in "father."  So what's 
correct?  Or 
> > do we know?
> 
> According to the Scholastic site,
> http://www.scholastic.com/harrypotter/books/pronunciation/play.htm, 
it's
> "An-i-MAYJ'us."  
> 
> The first a is short (as in 'cat' or 'apple')  due to the short 
vowel in
> the Latin 'animal'.  
> 
> Perhaps I'm just being dense, but the long a is baffling me, since
> 'magus' in Latin has a short a.  (The alpha in Greek 'ma/gos', 
however,
> may be long? *stares at the online LSJ entry: [a^]* But 
etymologically
> I'm sure 'magus' is a Latin and not a Greek borrowing anyway.)  I
> suppose there is a connection with the long a of 'mage', since the 
other
> words in the family ('magic', 'magi') have a short a -- French
> influence?  Either there is simple analogical change at work (more
> likely, IMO) or a different etymological history than 'magic' and
> 'magi'.
> 
> (I'd like to check the OED but I'm away from my computer and so not
> able to use Rutgers' OED account.  Anyone?)
> 
> I suspect analogical change from 'mage' (or from 'magic' or 'magi') 
is
> also to be counted responsible for the soft 'g', since it would
> otherwise be a hard g (coming before a 'u').  Here, I'd be not at 
all
> surprised if the Scholastic site were wrong.
> 
> HTH!
> 
> --jen :)
> 



Well, I fear I will never trust the Scholastic site -- it's quiz 
stated that Hagrid was in Hufflepuff!

I assumed it would be the Latin pronunciation since JKR uses so much 
Latin

Animagus -- two short as and hard g.......

but I'm often wrong

Susan




From Schlobin at aol.com  Tue Jun 26 03:07:11 2001
From: Schlobin at aol.com (Schlobin at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 03:07:11 -0000
Subject: Mists of Avalon
Message-ID: <9h8u8v+p5bb@eGroups.com>

Is there true there is going to be a made for
tv movie in July?

Susan




From janet at cloudmap.com  Tue Jun 26 03:57:38 2001
From: janet at cloudmap.com (janet at cloudmap.com)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 03:57:38 -0000
Subject: Mists of Avalon
In-Reply-To: <9h8u8v+p5bb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9h917i+99lu@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Schlobin at a... wrote:
> Is there true there is going to be a made for
> tv movie in July?

The last I read, a four-hour mini-series is scheduled to initially 
air July 15th & 16th on cable station TNT. Cast includes Anjelica 
Huston, Joan Allen, Julianna Margulies, & Samantha Mathis.




From yael_pou at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 26 08:56:54 2001
From: yael_pou at hotmail.com (yael oren)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 10:56:54 +0200
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: In defence of Cassie Claire
References: <9h8d86+fbqa@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <OE39KBwpaiw5Y5z4Iss000016f0@hotmail.com>

I'm not sorry at all.

She made an unethical use of the things we said/advertised/published here in a place called "Godawful Fan Fiction". I have a lot of very spiteful things to say about her actions, but, as she's not here to defend herself, I'll refrain from doing so.

Criticism is a very good and helpful thing, and I'm sorry for every critic we lose, but I'm not sorry to be less exposed to sneak attacks now that she's left.

Thanks, yael

  MMM: "I'm sorry to see Michela go because her vast knowledge in fanfiction 
  has helped me to improve my own writing.  I can understand her 
  rationale for leaving.  She no doubt feels that the fandom seem to 
  condone plagiarism."


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From yael_pou at hotmail.com  Tue Jun 26 12:01:36 2001
From: yael_pou at hotmail.com (yael oren)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 14:01:36 +0200
Subject: help: moderator problem
Message-ID: <OE75Cx2TvfzXX4SKJ0X00001ff3@hotmail.com>

Hi,

We're having a strange problem on the HP_Paradise list an the HP_FanFiction list. If anyone knows how to solve this, please let me know.

I've heard a strange complaint recently. Users say that after they try to join the group, they have a "membership waiting for moderator approval" message on their screen every time they go to the list home-page. I must admit, up until now, I thought they were trying to get into the wrong group <G> but this last one caught my attention.

In the "events" page there is a logged event, saying that user xxx "Subscription requested via web"
That user can't be found anywhere - not in the members list and not in the pending list. This specific user has tried this several times, with the same results.

Anyone knows what's going on?

Thanks, yael

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Their  clothes  were  cut  off  the  edge of  the latest
fashion,  which was currently inclining  towards  wide
hats,  padded  shoulders, narrow  waists and pointed
shoes and gave its followers the appearance of being
very well-dressed nails."
      - Terry Pratchett, Pyramids.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Tue Jun 26 13:43:59 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 13:43:59 -0000
Subject: The new trailer
Message-ID: <9ha3iv+s1ko@eGroups.com>

Has anyone seen the new trailer yet?  I've watched it 3 times on 
Realplayer, and although the quality is really bad, I got a pretty 
good idea, as I saw different scenes each time.  

I thought it looks fantastic!  What's more, I think some of them 
sound great as well - particularly Harry and Snape.


I can't wait for the movie now!

Catherine




From heidit at netbox.com  Tue Jun 26 14:42:55 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (heidit at netbox.com)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 14:42:55 -0000
Subject: Hey! I'm a SEER!
Message-ID: <9ha71f+2voc@eGroups.com>

I had a very weird yesterday. Ytesterday, the Supreme Court ruled for 
the plaintiffs in the Tasini case, which involves media companies 
taking articles written by freelancers and including them in 
electronic databases like NEXIS.

As some of you know, when I graduated law school, I worked for the 
New York Times' Electronic Media Company, writing and negotiating 
contracts between the Times companies and their freelancers.

Flashback-

In 9th grade, we had to write papers for English class about what we 
wanted to be when we grew up (I know!) and I wrote about being a 
lawyer. The style of the paper was to write an "alumni notice" for 
the (nonexistant) school newsletter from the perspective of ten years 
later.

I wrote that after law school, I did media law and the first case I 
worked on had just been ruled (in my client's favor) by the Supreme 
Court.

Of course, I wrote that I was repping People magazine, and I was 
wrong about the whole "ruling in my favor thing", and I was also 3 
years off....but I still remember that they teacher wrote that it was 
impossible for someone's first project out of law school to go before 
the Supreme Court.

Oh well.......






From gypsycaine at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 27 02:49:41 2001
From: gypsycaine at yahoo.com (Denise R.)
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 22:49:41 -0400
Subject: Gormenghast
References: <993566642.3433.36003.l9@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <010901c0feb3$d0abe060$10ccfea9@computer>

Comic actor Stephen Fry (Jeeves and Wooster on ExxonMobil Masterpiece
Theatre), a longtime fan of the novels ("I think they're funny"), plays the
narcoleptic Professor Bellgrove.

http://biz.yahoo.com/iw/010620/01028427_2.html

Is this the self-same Stephen who does the audios?

Btw, I've never heard of Gormenghast before.

Anyone want to take a stab at a novice's explanation?

Thanks!

Dee



_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From ebonyink at hotmail.com  Wed Jun 27 03:38:28 2001
From: ebonyink at hotmail.com (Ebony AKA AngieJ)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 03:38:28 -0000
Subject: WB Studio Store Shopping Spree...
Message-ID: <9hbkfk+hk5v@eGroups.com>

Hey guys--

Today I had a very *nice* shopping experience at the Warner Brothers 
studio store.  (Well, besides meeting a really cute guy... but 
anyway...) 

The ENTIRE store here (SE Michigan) is now 50% off all Harry Potter 
merchandise... and a great deal of it is already marked down!  A lot 
of nice stuff is still in ours.  I was able to get the *nicest* 
Gryffindor bathrobe (the navy blue one), one of those 
Gryffindor "double" t-shirts, and the *coolest* Gryffindor Quidditch 
sports jersey.  And paid dirt cheap

There was so much merchandise there that I felt simply overwhelmed, 
and the prices were unbelievable!  So if there's a WB store near you, 
and you're a collector... GO!

--Ebony




From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Wed Jun 27 04:44:16 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 04:44:16 -0000
Subject: Was Shopping Spree...Not all WB stores created equal
In-Reply-To: <9hbkfk+hk5v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hbob0+7qer@eGroups.com>

Hi-

When I was in San Francisco two weeks ago I went into to WB stores, 
one on Fisherman's Warf the other was in the Nordstrom's Center on 
Market Street, to see if they had any cool stuff my store didn't. 

Anyway niether store had anything on sale save for a few regular 30% 
off sale signs.  No where did I see the Going Out Of Business signs 
everything 40% to 60% off that adorn my little WB store back in 
Albuquerque.

Perplexed I asked a clerk at the Market Street store, "Aren't all the 
WB stores going out of business?" She said, "Well they are but we 
aren't closing until October." Go figure.

I guess AOL isn't too hot to get out of retail just yet. They're just 
closing the low volume low profile stores it would appear. So if your 
particular WB store isn't sporting the 40%, 50%, 60% off signs yet be 
glad you have a reprieve. For those of us who are at the 50% and 
beyond stage, snatch up what you can for the cheapest price possible.

I BTW the way got some very nice t-shirts, a Gryffindor Quidditch 
polo shirt, and various collectibles. At 50% to 60% off. Enjoy your 
HP stuff Eb.

Cheers,
       Kristin




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Wed Jun 27 04:46:01 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 04:46:01 -0000
Subject: HP Dream I JUST HAD
In-Reply-To: <9h2mpe+3g79@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hboe9+ecto@eGroups.com>

Anyone else remember a book called "Dreams of Bill" or some such that 
came out sometime during the first Clinton administration?  Someone 
actually compiled a collection of real dreams people had had about 
Bill Clinton.  (Don't give me that look.  They weren't all sexual.  
Some were just plain hilarious.  My dh once had a nightmare about Al 
Gore insisting on singing "Just Like A Woman" at a campaign 
rally . . . but I digress.)  I think we should compile a similar HP 
Dreams collection.

Amy Z




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Wed Jun 27 07:45:17 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 07:45:17 -0000
Subject: Gormenghast
In-Reply-To: <010901c0feb3$d0abe060$10ccfea9@computer>
Message-ID: <9hc2ud+qu1e@eGroups.com>

Yes, it is the self same Stephen Fry.  Gormenghast is based on the 
trilogy by Mervyn Peake.  In order, the books are:
Titus Groan
Gormenghast
Titus Alone

They are basically a kind of Gothic fantasy.  Quite dark, full of 
very strange, eccentric characters, superb descriptions of the 
castle/kingdom.  I have always found Peake's style a little too dense 
and at the same time idiosyncratic for my taste, but don't not read 
it on my recommendation.  For some reason I have always found a 
similarity between the Gormenghast books and Dylan Thomas' Under Milk 
Wood.  Can anyone shed any light on this?

The TV adaptation I thought was excellent - visually very 
imaginative, if a little stylised.

Hope this helps,
Catherine


--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Denise R." <gypsycaine at y...> wrote:
> Comic actor Stephen Fry (Jeeves and Wooster on ExxonMobil 
Masterpiece
> Theatre), a longtime fan of the novels ("I think they're funny"), 
plays the
> narcoleptic Professor Bellgrove.
> 
> http://biz.yahoo.com/iw/010620/01028427_2.html
> 
> Is this the self-same Stephen who does the audios?
> 
> Btw, I've never heard of Gormenghast before.
> 
> Anyone want to take a stab at a novice's explanation?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Dee
> 
> 
> 
> _________________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Wed Jun 27 09:44:02 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 09:44:02 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false!
Message-ID: <9hc9t2+5p43@eGroups.com>

I checked the Leaky Cauldron today, and it mentions that Warner Bros 
have confirmed that there is no truth in the rumour that Celine Dion 
is contributing to the soundtrack.

Phew!  One other thing I can stop worrying about!  I am really 
excited about this film now - Celine Dion was really putting a 
dampener on things!

Catherine




From mystril at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 27 13:23:21 2001
From: mystril at yahoo.com (mystril at yahoo.com)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 13:23:21 -0000
Subject: Butterbeer and Cauldron Cakes...
Message-ID: <9hcmo9+hinb@eGroups.com>

Hi folks, 

As I think this conversation will almost immediately head OT, I 
figured I would post it here. 

What do you think the more interesting foods and drinks in Harry 
Potter taste like? 

Cauldron cakes to me taste like homemade chocolate cupcakes filled 
with various good substances, like cream or rasberry or peanut 
butter, etc, because there has to be something inside the cauldron. 
The closest mundane thing I can think of is Hostess Cupcakes, but 
better. 

I used to think that Butterbeer tasted like hot butterscotch, but my 
fault memory believes that they've mentioned both warm and chilled 
butterbeer. So I was stumped until I was in canoeing in Clinton and 
my boyfriend dragged me to a tea shop for a flavored tea and I had an 
iced-caramel-something-or-other-tea and I decided THAT was butterbeer.

Butterbeer could taste like Guinness for all I know, but I think it's 
sweeter/better than that. 

I think of pumpkin juice as tasting like spiced apple cider, even 
though I know it tastes like pumpkin. 

And Droobles Best Blowing Gum never loses it's flavor or gets 
uncomfortable to chew. 

Any other ideas on this?

~mystril





From meboriqua at aol.com  Wed Jun 27 13:42:19 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 13:42:19 -0000
Subject: HP Dream I JUST HAD
In-Reply-To: <9hboe9+ecto@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hcnrr+107ev@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
I think we should compile a similar HP 
> Dreams collection.>

I like that idea!  See, that's why I started this thread; I though 
others from this site would have had some HP dreams.  I've had three 
that I can remember (already described two).

BTW, where have you been, Amy Z?  I miss your hilarious posts at the 
main discussion site!

--jenny from ravenclaw, whose last day of school is TODAY!***********





From jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Jun 27 15:42:29 2001
From: jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk (Benjamin)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 15:42:29 -0000
Subject: Butterbeer and Cauldron Cakes...
In-Reply-To: <9hcmo9+hinb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hcut5+7kv9@eGroups.com>


> iced-caramel-something-or-other-tea and I decided THAT was 
butterbeer.
> 
> Butterbeer could taste like Guinness for all I know, but I think 
it's 
> sweeter/better than that. 
> 

Better than Guinness? Surely not.  Though it would probably be 
smoother, and less heavy.  In fact I think the only thing stopping it 
from being disgustingly sickening is that it must be fairly light.  
Light ginger beer (the real brewed stuff) but without the 
tang/kick/fire.  If you must compare it to a stout possibly Gillespie 
(a light Scottish thing I tried once [only found it once]) or 
possibly, though I cringe to suggest it, Guinness and Black?


> I think of pumpkin juice as tasting like spiced apple cider, even 
> though I know it tastes like pumpkin. 

But Pumpkin juice? there is no excuse.  How can they drink that stuff?
Pumpkin pie is nice, though when we made it not many people thought 
so, as I recall.

-Ben. Hoping he can have Guinness at his meeting tonight. And not 
butterbeer.





From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 27 16:44:06 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 09:44:06 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Dudley's Hat
Message-ID: <20010627164406.77565.qmail@web14501.mail.yahoo.com>


Okay, I've got a gripe. I was looking at the loverly pictures from AOL
on the leaky cauldron site and the one with Dudley, Vernon, and Petunia
is bugging me. You can find it here:

http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/
(Scroll down a bit to the pictures...if you can't see the one with the
Dursleys, right click on the broken picture and select 'Show Picture')

What is up with that hat that Dudley is wearing? Not that it isn't a
nice hat, it just seems very odd and out of place to me. A bit too
old-fashioned and Sunday-best maybe? It just really jarred me for some
strange reason.

*Is* Dudley supposed to be wearing a hat in the first letter scene?
Can't quite remember, and I'm at work right now. Even if he is, I don't
think I would've put him in that! Or does everyone in England wear hats
like that and I'm just displaying my horrendous ignorance?

Have I gone batty? Does anyone think the hat is okay? Anybody disgusted
with me for bringing up such an insignificant detail...

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/21/2001

"It never happened if there is no memory of it. Human memory is just a record. You can rewrite the record."
- Serial Experiments Lain

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From bkdelong at pobox.com  Wed Jun 27 17:02:51 2001
From: bkdelong at pobox.com (B.K. DeLong)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 13:02:51 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dudley's Hat
In-Reply-To: <20010627164406.77565.qmail@web14501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010627125136.0526cec0@pop.earthlink.net>

At 09:44 AM 06/27/2001 -0700, you wrote:
>*Is* Dudley supposed to be wearing a hat in the first letter scene?
>Can't quite remember, and I'm at work right now. Even if he is, I don't
>think I would've put him in that! Or does everyone in England wear hats
>like that and I'm just displaying my horrendous ignorance?
>
>Have I gone batty? Does anyone think the hat is okay? Anybody disgusted
>with me for bringing up such an insignificant detail...

*sigh* How quickly we forget:

     That evening, Dudley paraded around the living room for the
family in his brand-new uniform. Smeltings' boys wore maroon
tailcoats, orange knickerbockers, and flat straw hats called
boaters. They also carried knobbly sticks, used for hitting each
other while the teachers weren't looking. This was supposed to be
good training for later life.
------

Now, technically the letter doesn't come until the next morning while 
Petunia is dyeing Harry's school clothes and Dudley is walking around 
poking Harry with his Smelting's stick. But they could have merged the days 
together for the sake of a movie...not a big deal.

What concerns me more is that picture of Filch

http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/images/2001/06/trailer2/mgallery43-1.jpg

Notice Hermione, Draco and.....RON? If you recall, Ron was in the hospital 
wing during detention and it was Neville, Draco, Harry and Hermione. While 
Harry isn't in that shot...we know he does show up in the Forbidden Forest 
due to another shot in the trailer.

Another discrepancy is the Snitch. In the new trailer, Harry takes it out 
and we see it fly out of his hand. In the book, Oliver Wood says it's too 
dark to bring it out and they might loose it. Hopefully they will only let 
it fly for a bit before they pick it up and put it back.

I'm guessing since it's a movie....we'll lose a lot of nights and days and 
things will be compressed. I'm "preparing" myself mentally to not be 
disappointed with any changes or minor discrepancies in translating the 
book to film otherwise I could be miserable and I really want to enjoy the 
film for what it is...or will be.

--
B.K. DeLong

The Harry Potter Galleries
http://www.hpgalleries.com/

Editor-in-Chief
The Leaky Cauldron News section
bkdelong at the-leaky-cauldron.org
http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/
+1.617.877.3271






From pbarhug at earthlink.net  Wed Jun 27 17:17:12 2001
From: pbarhug at earthlink.net (Pam Hugonnet)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 13:17:12 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dudley's Hat
References: <20010627164406.77565.qmail@web14501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3B3A1518.3D62EE55@earthlink.net>



Amber wrote:

>
> Okay, I've got a gripe. I was looking at the loverly pictures from AOL
>
> on the leaky cauldron site and the one with Dudley, Vernon, and
> Petunia
> is bugging me. You can find it here:
>
> http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/
> (Scroll down a bit to the pictures...if you can't see the one with the
>
> Dursleys, right click on the broken picture and select 'Show Picture')
>
> What is up with that hat that Dudley is wearing? Not that it isn't a
> nice hat, it just seems very odd and out of place to me. A bit too
> old-fashioned and Sunday-best maybe? It just really jarred me for some
>
> strange reason.
>
> *Is* Dudley supposed to be wearing a hat in the first letter scene?
> Can't quite remember, and I'm at work right now. Even if he is, I
> don't
> think I would've put him in that! Or does everyone in England wear
> hats
> like that and I'm just displaying my horrendous ignorance?

    If you look closely I believe that is his Smetings uniforms:
            "Smeltings' boys wore marron tailcoats, orange
knickerbockers and flat
              straw hats called boaters.  They also carried knobbly
sticks, used for
              hitting each other when teachers weren't looking.  This
was supposed to
              be good training for later life."
                                                            HP/SS
(paperback, p.32)

Looks like they got it dead on.  When the first letter arrives, Dudley
has his Smeltings' stick with him at the breakfast table.  I suppose his
having the uniform on represents some compression of scenes for the sake
of the movie.

drpam


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 27 17:51:14 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 10:51:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dudley's Hat
In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.2.20010627125136.0526cec0@pop.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20010627175114.51098.qmail@web14505.mail.yahoo.com>


--- "B.K. DeLong" <bkdelong at pobox.com> wrote:
> At 09:44 AM 06/27/2001 -0700, you wrote:
> >*Is* Dudley supposed to be wearing a hat in the first letter scene?
> 
> *sigh* How quickly we forget:
> 
>      That evening, Dudley paraded around the living room for the
> family in his brand-new uniform. Smeltings' boys wore maroon
> tailcoats, orange knickerbockers, and flat straw hats called
> boaters. 
> ------

Ah. I had forgotten. Thanks for reminding me. <crawls into hole
determined to memorize the four Harry Potter books so that she doesn't
make a complete idiot of herself again...>

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/21/2001

"It never happened if there is no memory of it. Human memory is just a record. You can rewrite the record."
- Serial Experiments Lain

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Wed Jun 27 18:21:00 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 18:21:00 -0000
Subject: Butterbeer and Cauldron Cakes...
In-Reply-To: <9hcmo9+hinb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hd86c+506f@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., mystril at y... wrote:
> Hi folks, 
> 
> As I think this conversation will almost immediately head OT, I 
> figured I would post it here. 
> 
> What do you think the more interesting foods and drinks in Harry 
> Potter taste like? 
> 
> Cauldron cakes to me taste like homemade chocolate cupcakes filled 
> with various good substances, like cream or rasberry or peanut 
> butter, etc, because there has to be something inside the cauldron. 
> The closest mundane thing I can think of is Hostess Cupcakes, but 
> better. 
> 
> I used to think that Butterbeer tasted like hot butterscotch, but my 
> fault memory believes that they've mentioned both warm and chilled 
> butterbeer. So I was stumped until I was in canoeing in Clinton and 
> my boyfriend dragged me to a tea shop for a flavored tea and I had 
an 
> iced-caramel-something-or-other-tea and I decided THAT was 
butterbeer.
> 
> Butterbeer could taste like Guinness for all I know, but I think 
it's 
> sweeter/better than that. 
> 
> I think of pumpkin juice as tasting like spiced apple cider, even 
> though I know it tastes like pumpkin. 
> 
> And Droobles Best Blowing Gum never loses it's flavor or gets 
> uncomfortable to chew. 
> 
> Any other ideas on this?
> 
> ~mystril

I think in the UK 'cupcakes' are called 'fairy cakes'. But that's what 
I think a cauldron cake is. Maybe not cream filled, but definitely a 
little pound cake type thing with icing. A friend of mine had the 
impression that they were like rice cakes---dry and crunchy. 

Butterbeer gives me the impression that its sort of like cream soda 
(don't know if they have that in the UK), maybe not very carbonated. 

I think of carrot juice when I read pumpkin juice. Carrot juice is 
surprizingly nice, especially if it's freshly made in an electric 
juicer. But your version of it as sort of like spiced apple cider 
seems much nicer.

Milz




From bbennett at joymail.com  Wed Jun 27 19:07:57 2001
From: bbennett at joymail.com (bbennett at joymail.com)
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 19:07:57 -0000
Subject: Dudley's Hat & trailer enthusiasm
In-Reply-To: <20010627175114.51098.qmail@web14505.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9hdaud+j25s@eGroups.com>

BK wrote:
<I'm guessing since it's a movie....we'll lose a lot of nights and 
days and things will be compressed. I'm "preparing" myself mentally 
to not be disappointed with any changes or minor discrepancies in 
translating the book to film otherwise I could be miserable and I 
really want to enjoy the film for what it is...or will be. >

I think you're absolutely right on the scene merging thing, and
I'm sure we can expect more. In order to film everything exactly 
following the book, we'd end up with a 7 hour movie ?
personally, this would not a problem for me <g>, but I'm sure
it'd would be  ridiculously expensive. I'm also
"bracing" myself not to be disappointed if things shift a
bit, BK.  But I have  to say that discrepancies aside, I was overcome 
with a "WOO HOO! They're doing this right!" burst of
enthusiasm as I watched the trailer. I  think the tone of the movie 
feels right, even if some of the details have obviously changed.

<Ah. I had forgotten. Thanks for reminding me. <crawls into hole 
determined to memorize the four Harry Potter books so that she 
doesn't make a complete idiot of herself again...> 

Amber, if failing to remember a not-pivotal detail from one of 4 
novels makes you a complete idiot, then maybe I should stop typing 
and be quiet; I'm lucky I remember last week.

;)
B





From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 00:14:41 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 00:14:41 -0000
Subject: HP Dream I JUST HAD
In-Reply-To: <9hcnrr+107ev@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hdsth+6hhr@eGroups.com>

Jenny, she of Ravenclaw, wrote:

> I like that idea!  See, that's why I started this thread; I though 
> others from this site would have had some HP dreams.  

I love reading other people's dreams.

> BTW, where have you been, Amy Z?  I miss your hilarious posts at the 
> main discussion site!
> 

I've been in rockin' Cleveland, OH, with no e-mail access (proving 
that it can be done).  I just got back and will get back on sometime 
in the next few days--I'm not even going to try to catch up on over a 
week's posts, so I guess I'll just pick a thread that looks good and 
latch on.

I will endeavor to be hilarious when I start posting again, but now 
I'm feeling the pressure.

;-)
Amy




From DaveH47 at mindspring.com  Thu Jun 28 03:48:08 2001
From: DaveH47 at mindspring.com (Dave Hardenbrook)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 03:48:08 -0000
Subject: Shrek and Moulin Rouge
In-Reply-To: <5FC0AD7F8D@lincoln.treasurer.ohio-state.edu>
Message-ID: <9he9do+f7hi@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Rachel Bray" <bray.262 at o...> wrote:
> I saw Shrek on the 26th.  Hilarious.  I want a pink dragon!!!  :-)  
I 
> was worried, though, because usually I don't care for Mike 
> Myers/Eddie Murphy humor.  It was WONDERFUL!  I laughed so 
> hard my side ached the next day.  Absolutely recommend it.

Is Shrek (as the TV ads suggest) a lovable oafish type, like
Hagrid?

                         -- Dave





From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 05:13:21 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 06:13:21 +0100
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting
References: <9hc9t2+5p43@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <006601c0ff91$219c3500$603370c2@c5s910j>

Catherine said:

> I checked the Leaky Cauldron today, and it mentions that Warner Bros
> have confirmed that there is no truth in the rumour that Celine Dion
> is contributing to the soundtrack.
>
> Phew!  One other thing I can stop worrying about!  I am really
> excited about this film now - Celine Dion was really putting a
> dampener on things!

I second that!!  I've been so busy recently that I didn't get a chance to
comment on this before.  The idea of Celine Dion warbling soporifically over
the credits of this film gave me nightmares and daymares.  The only thing
that might conceivably be worse is something 'spooky' from the Backstreet
Boys or a song by Steps (imagine the coordinated dance routine as they
simulate broom riding and wand waving, and the outfits: robes and pointed
hats, complete with glasses and forehead scars...): //shudder//

The Leaky Cauldron and HP Galleries is proving to be the prime source for HP
movie information.  They also reported that Verne Troyer is playing
Griphook, ending the endless (incorrect) speculation about him, and I saw
that Rusty Goffe, who I suggested for Flitwick ages ago, is playing a
Gringott's Goblin.  Character actress, Elizabeth Spriggs is playing The Fat
Lady: another great choice from the casting department, IMO.

Talk of Gormenghast recently, reminds me that June Brown (Dot Cotton from
Eastenders) played Nanny Slagg in that.  I think she'd be great for Mrs Figg
when the time comes.

One (fairly firm) casting rumour I'm not so keen on is Jeff Hordley (sp?)
for Sirius Black.  He plays Cain Dingle in the laughable British soap,
Emmerdale, and his weasly face doesn't fit my image of Sirius at all.  He is
very irritating and not nearly rugged enough for the part.   I'm also not
keen on Hugh Grant for Lockhart, but I like the look of Richard Bremmer, who
seems to be playing Voldemort in some sort of flashback.

Neil















From rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 28 06:53:33 2001
From: rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com (rodeodangerqueen at yahoo.com)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 06:53:33 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting
In-Reply-To: <006601c0ff91$219c3500$603370c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9hek9d+q0m6@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> Catherine said:
> 
> > I checked the Leaky Cauldron today, and it mentions that Warner 
Bros
> > have confirmed that there is no truth in the rumour that Celine 
Dion
> > is contributing to the soundtrack.
> >
> > Phew!  One other thing I can stop worrying about!  I am really
> > excited about this film now - Celine Dion was really putting a
> > dampener on things!
> 
> I second that!!  I've been so busy recently that I didn't get a 
chance to
> comment on this before.  The idea of Celine Dion warbling 
soporifically over
> the credits of this film gave me nightmares and daymares.  The only 
thing
> that might conceivably be worse is something 'spooky' from the 
Backstreet
> Boys or a song by Steps (imagine the coordinated dance routine as 
they
> simulate broom riding and wand waving, and the outfits: robes and 
pointed
> hats, complete with glasses and forehead scars...): //shudder//
> 
> when the time comes.
> 
> Neil and Catherine,

I TOO winced a bit at the idea of Celine Dion doing a ballad that 
gets played during the end credits of the movie.  I can only imagine 
what that "supposed song" sounded like..."supposedly"....it would 
probably go something like...


(Celine Dion singing) The boy who....LIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIVED
                      (ridiculously high note held for               
obscene number of seconds)

(more singing) because the power of love...is the strongest magic one 
can GIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIVE (here's where I change radio 
stations)

well...you get my idea.

I TOO thought (with trepidation) of the Backstreet Boys before 
reading your entry, Neil...but I have to say the imagery you provide 
had me howling with laughter for minutes!!!!!!!!  Yeah, I am just 
shuddering at the thought of a soundtrack with the Backstreet Boys, 
Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera, and Ricky Martin (something that 
sounds like "Shake Your Bon-Bon" placed however briefly somewhere in 
the movie would just make me scream).

If they HAVE to put pop music in at all...let it be mostly 
British/Irish pop and maybe some more "alternative artists" from both 
sides of the Atlantic...but actually, I think it woudl be best if 
they just let John Williams take care of it ALL...however we should 
be prepared for the fact that they're probably going to try to market 
the movie with SOME pop song.

I apologize ahead of time to those I may have offended with my 
opinions...but music, like any art form (literature, film, etc.) has 
the power to provide such a field of grey matter in terms of the 
various feelings it provokes both within us and amongst us.

Sorry about any typos...it's  late.

N ;)















From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 09:12:54 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 09:12:54 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting +Am Psycho
In-Reply-To: <9hek9d+q0m6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hesem+m8vb@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., rodeodangerqueen at y... wrote:

> (Celine Dion singing) The boy who....LIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIVED
>                       (ridiculously high note held for              
 
> obscene number of seconds)
> 
> (more singing) because the power of love...is the strongest magic 
one 
> can GIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIVE (here's where I change radio 
> stations)
> 
> well...you get my idea.

LOL!  I think you have a future in Top 40 songwriting.

> actually, I think it woudl be best if 
> they just let John Williams take care of it ALL...

I can't believe I'm seconding this, but if anything can transform me 
into a John Williams fan, it's the prospect of having Celine Dion 
instead.

Re: casting:  I don't know either of these actors who are the subject 
of PoA rumors.  They *look* right to me (Christian Bale does look too 
well-fed in the hpgalleries.com shot, but other pics of him are more 
Lupinlike--as for Hordley being weasellike, I know nothing of him 
except this one picture) but I looked up their credits and I don't 
think I've seen either in anything.  Is Bale British?  All his credits 
seem American.  I'm just going to have to take Heidi's word on this 
one, because wild horses couldn't make me read American Psycho again, 
much less watch it.  I read part of it for a class, called the 
professor and said I'd have to skip that day's discussion, and 
suffered waking nightmares for weeks.  I can still get ill thinking 
about it.  Bret Easton Ellis is unreadable in the best of 
circumstances, IMNSHO, but when he writes detailed descriptions of 
women being tortured to death, I just put the book down.

Amy Z
now back home and no less opinionated than she was 10 days ago




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 09:16:59 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 09:16:59 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting +Am Psycho
In-Reply-To: <9hesem+m8vb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hesmb+lk2t@eGroups.com>

I wrote:

> Re: casting:  I don't know either of these actors who are the 
subject 
> of PoA rumors.  

Oh yeah, so before I started ranting about Bret Easton Ellis, I did 
have a point in mind.  Y'all who've actually seen them act, can you 
report on whether they're any good?

I think Hugh Grant would be a very funny choice for Lockhart, if he's 
willing to risk the self-parody.  He absolutely must be blond, however 
(which would be even funnier).

Harry, Harry, Harry,
Amy Z




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 11:19:24 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 11:19:24 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting +Am Psycho
In-Reply-To: <9hesem+m8vb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hf3rs+gomb@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> --- In Is Bale British?  All his credits 
> seem American.  

Yes, he is!  IIRC, his first credits were as the boy in Kenneth 
Branagh's Henry V, and he was also in Empire of the Sun, playing the 
expat  English boy who becomes separated from his parents when Japan 
invade Singapore (I think it was Singapore, could be wrong).

I've since seen some shots of him in HP Galleries and other places 
and am revising my opinion - I do think he could make a good Lupin.  
And in the above mentioned films as a boy he looked particularly waif-
like and scrawny.

Catherine




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 11:22:58 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 11:22:58 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting +Am Psycho
In-Reply-To: <9hesmb+lk2t@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hf42i+bgsm@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> I think Hugh Grant would be a very funny choice for Lockhart, if 
he's 
> willing to risk the self-parody.  He absolutely must be blond, 
however 
> (which would be even funnier).
> 
> Harry, Harry, Harry,
> Amy Z

On Hugh Grant, I do think that he has a sense of ridiculous.  Besides 
his role in BJD, another supremely comic moment which springs to mind 
is in Emma Thompson's Sense and Sensibility.  The scene which always 
makes me laugh is when he is reading aloud, with no idea of 
expression, and getting the emphasis all wrong, and is criticised and 
corrected by Kate Winslet.  I can imagine this is quite difficult - 
an actor, acting as though he can't act!  You may think that he can't 
act anyway, but I beg to differ on this point.

Catherine




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 28 12:52:47 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 05:52:47 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Am Psycho and A.I.
In-Reply-To: <9hesem+m8vb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010628125247.97482.qmail@web14506.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Amy Z <aiz24 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> I'm just going to have to take Heidi's word on this 
> one, because wild horses couldn't make me read American Psycho again,
> much less watch it.  I read part of it for a class, called the 
> professor and said I'd have to skip that day's discussion, and 
> suffered waking nightmares for weeks.  I can still get ill thinking 
> about it.  Bret Easton Ellis is unreadable in the best of 
> circumstances, IMNSHO, but when he writes detailed descriptions of 
> women being tortured to death, I just put the book down.

Ugh, I can't believe I read that book on my own volition. I first saw
the movie because my best friend is in love with Christian Bale (she
also is really interested in psychopaths). Well, the movie ended very
unsatisfactorily for me; it ended with too many questions unanswered.
So I read the book to see if perhaps they were answered there. 

And I thought the movie was twisted.

Same with Amy, I had waking nightmares because it was so graphic in
parts. Going to sleep at night for awhile was horrendous. And the book
didn't answer a darn thing!

I refuse to watch horror flicks or read horror novels anymore. After
seeing "The Cell" and not being able to close my eyes because all I
could see was the torture scenes, I told myself that I couldn't take it
anymore. There's a quote somewhere that says the torture Hell can
devise is nothing compared to what people can dream up and do to each
other every day. While I've never been to Hell, I can't help but feel
that this sentiment has some truth to it.

On a completely different note, A.I. opens tomorrow! Woohoo! <does the
robot dance in celebration> Computer philosophy rules!

~Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/21/2001

"It never happened if there is no memory of it. Human memory is just a record. You can rewrite the record."
- Serial Experiments Lain

__________________________________________________
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
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From meboriqua at aol.com  Thu Jun 28 13:00:37 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 13:00:37 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting +Am Psycho
In-Reply-To: <9hesem+m8vb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hf9pl+p5jn@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
 
> I can't believe I'm seconding this, but if anything can transform me 
> into a John Williams fan, it's the prospect of having Celine Dion 
> instead.>

Awwww - does that mean you aren't a John Williams fan?  I hope I won't 
get slammed for this, but when I first heard that he would be doing 
the music for the movie, I was relieved, because I was worried that 
the music would be annoying and too cartoonish.  I'm definitely a John 
Williams fan... and definitely NOT a Celine Dion fan.  

  <Bret Easton Ellis is unreadable in the best of 
> circumstances, IMNSHO, but when he writes detailed descriptions of 
> women being tortured to death, I just put the book down.>

Christian Bale is most definitely British (did you ever see "Empire of 
the Sun"?).  I don't know why he took the role for "American Psycho", 
though.  What a vile and hideous movie.  On that note, why was it 
published, let alone made into a movie?  Misogyny sells, I guess.  
What a shame.

I'm still thinking of Colin Firth for Sirius.  What an intensely 
staring cutie!

--jenny from ravenclaw, who is officially on summer vacation and has 
to speak at her sister's wedding in two days**************




From heidit at netbox.com  Thu Jun 28 14:54:33 2001
From: heidit at netbox.com (Tandy, Heidi)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 10:54:33 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +mov ie casting +Am Psycho
Message-ID: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F93A4@miaexch1>

Amy - welcome home!
Yes, CHristian Bale is british - when he was around 12, he was the lead in
Empire of the Sun, so regardless of how wonderful he could be as Lupin, I
sorta like the idea of someone who was a child actor, and who has lived
through it in at least a seemingly healthy way, being around Daniel, Emma
and Rupert. 
Also, Kenneth Branagh's Henry V and Velvet Goldmine are both british films
(I just *knew* someone from velvet goldmine was going to end up in the HP
films...I just thought it would be ewan macgregor, whose looks in Moulin
Rouge are vaguely sirius-esque...)

-----Original Message-----
From: Amy Z [mailto:aiz24 at hotmail.com]
Re: casting:  I don't know either of these actors who are the subject 
of PoA rumors.  They *look* right to me (Christian Bale does look too 
well-fed in the hpgalleries.com shot, but other pics of him are more 
Lupinlike--as for Hordley being weasellike, I know nothing of him 
except this one picture) but I looked up their credits and I don't 
think I've seen either in anything.  Is Bale British?  All his credits 
seem American.  I'm just going to have to take Heidi's word on this 
one, because wild horses couldn't make me read American Psycho again, 
much less watch it.  




From dwe199 at soton.ac.uk  Thu Jun 28 15:20:59 2001
From: dwe199 at soton.ac.uk (Dai Evans)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 15:20:59 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +mov ie casting +Am Psycho
In-Reply-To: <C8CB3DE988C8D3119BDA00A0C9B3BD4D018F93A4@miaexch1>
Message-ID: <9hfi0r+73f5@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Tandy, Heidi" <heidit at n...> wrote:
> Yes, CHristian Bale is british

He's Welsh actually. Born in Pembrokshire, West Wales.



Dai




From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Thu Jun 28 16:38:59 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 16:38:59 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting
In-Reply-To: <006601c0ff91$219c3500$603370c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9hfmj3+md8b@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> Talk of Gormenghast recently, reminds me that June Brown (Dot 
Cotton from
> Eastenders) played Nanny Slagg in that.  I think she'd be great for 
Mrs Figg
> when the time comes.

I can't agree with you more. I think June Brown would make a 
wonderful Mrs. Figg! Furthermore, when I first read about MacNair I 
pictured  Ross Kent (Grant Mitchell). For Stan Shunpike, I pictured 
Dean Gaffney (Robbie Jackson)

Milz (who devotedly watches the "EastEnders" eventhough we're 3 years 
behind the UK and is just watching the ones with Alex the sexy Vicar)




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 16:44:34 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 16:44:34 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +mov ie casting +Am Psycho
In-Reply-To: <9hfi0r+73f5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hfmti+pr6j@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Dai Evans" <dwe199 at s...> wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Tandy, Heidi" <heidit at n...> wrote:
> > Yes, CHristian Bale is british
> 
> He's Welsh actually. Born in Pembrokshire, West Wales.
> 
> 
> 
> Dai

Dai - are you saying Welsh, not British, or British, but specifically 
Welsh, as Wales is part of the UK/GB.  I'm not being Welshist (my 
father is from Cardiff).

Catherine




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 16:47:31 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 16:47:31 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting
In-Reply-To: <9hfmj3+md8b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hfn33+o2m5@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Milz" <absinthe at m...> wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> > Talk of Gormenghast recently, reminds me that June Brown (Dot 
> Cotton from
> > Eastenders) played Nanny Slagg in that.  I think she'd be great 
for 
> Mrs Figg
> > when the time comes.
> 
> I can't agree with you more. I think June Brown would make a 
> wonderful Mrs. Figg! Furthermore, when I first read about MacNair I 
> pictured  Ross Kent (Grant Mitchell). For Stan Shunpike, I pictured 
> Dean Gaffney (Robbie Jackson)
> 
> Milz (who devotedly watches the "EastEnders" eventhough we're 3 
years 
> behind the UK and is just watching the ones with Alex the sexy 
Vicar)

Neil, that is inspired!  I wonder if Mrs Figg chain smokes too?  OK, 
keeping the soap theme, how about Sarah Lancashire as Rosmerta, or 
perhaps Letitia Dean? Although neither are as attractive as I imagine 
Rosmerta to be, they both have a certain pneumatic quality that would 
appeal to many heterosexual men...

Catherine




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 17:02:59 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 17:02:59 -0000
Subject: PA casting, pneumatic
In-Reply-To: <9hfn33+o2m5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hfo03+r3vg@eGroups.com>

Thanks for the info on C. Bale, Catherine and everyone.  I've 
seen Branagh's Henry V but have no particular recollection of the boy. 
 I agree with Heidi that a child actor who's kept his sanity and 
decency intact (if he has) is a good person to have on set.  Maybe 
they should hire him as Official Mentor if not as Lupin.

Catherine wrote:
 
> Neil, that is inspired!  I wonder if Mrs Figg chain smokes too?  OK, 
> keeping the soap theme, how about Sarah Lancashire as Rosmerta, or 
> perhaps Letitia Dean? Although neither are as attractive as I 
imagine 
> Rosmerta to be, they both have a certain pneumatic quality that 
would 
> appeal to many heterosexual men...

Ooh, please please define pneumatic for me and solve a 20-year 
mystery!  This has been bothering me since I was 12 and read Brave New 
World, where the woman keeps using this adjective for herself, not for 
tires.  The latter is the only definition any person or dictionary was 
able to give me.  

Amy Z
who aspires to one day be known as Amy the Sexy Vicar




From dfrankis at dial.pipex.com  Thu Jun 28 17:35:28 2001
From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com (dfrankis at dial.pipex.com)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 17:35:28 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting
In-Reply-To: <9hfmj3+md8b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hfpt0+l9mu@eGroups.com>

Milz wrote:

> Milz (who devotedly watches the "EastEnders" eventhough we're 3 
years 
> behind the UK and is just watching the ones with Alex the sexy 
Vicar)

Why does anyone in America want to watch EastEnders? It's so 
depressing (like all UK soaps and series - compare Casualty with ER).

David, Ally McBeal, Simpsons, Star Trek fan waiting for the world-
famous UK television industry to justify its fame...




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 17:36:54 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 17:36:54 -0000
Subject: PA casting, pneumatic
In-Reply-To: <9hfo03+r3vg@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hfpvm+rhua@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Thanks for the info on C. Bale, Catherine and everyone.  I've 
> seen Branagh's Henry V but have no particular recollection of the 
boy. 
>  I agree with Heidi that a child actor who's kept his sanity and 
> decency intact (if he has) is a good person to have on set.  Maybe 
> they should hire him as Official Mentor if not as Lupin.
> 
> Catherine wrote:
>  
> > Neil, that is inspired!  I wonder if Mrs Figg chain smokes too?  
OK, 
> > keeping the soap theme, how about Sarah Lancashire as Rosmerta, 
or 
> > perhaps Letitia Dean? Although neither are as attractive as I 
> imagine 
> > Rosmerta to be, they both have a certain pneumatic quality that 
> would 
> > appeal to many heterosexual men...
> 
> Ooh, please please define pneumatic for me and solve a 20-year 
> mystery!  This has been bothering me since I was 12 and read Brave 
New 
> World, where the woman keeps using this adjective for herself, not 
for 
> tires.  The latter is the only definition any person or dictionary 
was 
> able to give me.  
> 
> Amy Z
> who aspires to one day be known as Amy the Sexy Vicar

Well, I guess a polite way of putting it would be to say that it 
describes a substantial inflation of a woman's upper torso!  
Pneumatic, as in pumped up!

(I think!)

Catherine




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 28 18:24:09 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 11:24:09 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Christian Bale info
In-Reply-To: <9hesem+m8vb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010628182409.80881.qmail@web10906.mail.yahoo.com>


I have loved Christian since the first time I saw him in Newsies...

Yes, almost all of his credits appear to be American, he lives in Calfornia currently.  However, he was born in Wales, and still has an English accent that I can see.  He uses a kind of New York accent in most of his American films.  Let me see his more common films that somebody might have seen...that he uses his real accent in...

Little Women (the latest one 94ish)

Portrait of a Lady ( i think his accent is natural in this )

Pochohantus (I spelled that wrong, sorry, natural accent)

I dont' know he is kind of a low profile type guy.  I know that he is often listed however, when discussing high profile movies, I'm not sure if this is because they actually consider him for movies or if he is one of those actors everyone is anxiously expecting to break out soon...so this is why I am trying not to get my hopes up for him and this movie.



---------------------------------
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year!
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From neilward at dircon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 18:33:56 2001
From: neilward at dircon.co.uk (Neil Ward)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 18:33:56 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
Message-ID: <9hftal+lffh@eGroups.com>

Hi all...

I thought I'd steal that trendy, fanfic-style heading to give the 
impression that I know all the latest goss on the latest chapters of 
SoB, BYOB, PTO! and BBQ [Any resemblance to real fanfiction title 
acronyms is purely coincidental. PS: No horses were hurt in the 
writing of this post].

I managed to download the latest HP movie trailer this morning and 
sat watching it repeatedly in an attempt to cheer myself up. It 
worked!  Psychologically, it was a bit like stuffing down a whole 
packet of biscuits instead of "being good" and having just the one 
(have you seen my pneumatic waistline?).  Who wants to be good, 
anyway?  Even Dumbledore has that latent evil streak I used to talk 
about...

I had a funny week this week.  On Monday, at work, I bent over to 
pick up a letter from the floor and split my suit trousers straight 
up the back.  My best suit, too.  My trusty assistant had to run to 
the nearest clothes shop to pick me up a new garment.  She giggled 
all the way there and back, and continued to laugh like a schoolgirl 
every she looked at me slopping round the office in the XXL tracky 
bottoms she'd bought me.  

The rest of the week has consisted of working late, having a 
headache, getting home very late, falling asleep on the sofa, and 
waking up at 5am to the sounds of a repeat of 'Karaoke Challenge' on 
Challenge TV. If I had the courage, the regular, subliminal exposure 
to bad singing might inspire me to pop to my local pub tonight and 
give them my rave version of "Somewhere Over The Rainbow".  I'm a 
coward though...

You can tell I'm at a loose end, can't you?

Question:  To those of you planning to see the HP movie.  Would you 
rather go:

(a) alone, because you want to annotate a copy of the film script you 
bought on e-Bay for 378 dollars?;

(b) with other HP fans, because you can share the experience and show 
off your humungous knowledge to the appreciative people sitting in 
the seats around you?;

(c) with friends or relatives who will have to be bribed with a large 
pizza and several pints and dragged into the cinema by their hair?

Neil    
Flagging Ford Anglia







From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 18:53:48 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 18:53:48 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <9hftal+lffh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hfufs+bl9q@eGroups.com>

Grumpy!Neil wrote,

> I had a funny week this week.  On Monday, at work, I bent over to 
> pick up a letter from the floor and split my suit trousers straight 
> up the back.  My best suit, too.  

Sounds like you've been binging on more than metaphorical 
biscuits.  ;-)

> Question:  To those of you planning to see the HP movie.  Would you 
> rather go:
> 
> (b) with other HP fans, because you can share the experience and 
show 
> off your humungous knowledge to the appreciative people sitting in 
> the seats around you?;

Oh my, we could make ourselves very unpopular, couldn't we?  Why 
don't we all just charter a theater or three or thirty?  That way we 
could hoot, comment, and guffaw to our hearts' content, and maybe 
even take over the projection booth so as to run back the good bits.

Would that I had a true fan (read: at least as obsessed as I am) to 
go with.  If anyone on this list lives within a 20-mile radius of 
Hanover, NH, which is where I assume I will see it, write me!  Serial 
killers need not respond.

> 
> (c) with friends or relatives who will have to be bribed with a 
large 
> pizza and several pints and dragged into the cinema by their hair?

Nope, mainly because the prime candidate for such a relative will be 
working until 9 the night the movie opens and there is no chance I'm 
waiting that long to see it, even if it were worth it to put up with 
his bellyaching.  (Bellyaching in more ways than one, if he's had a 
large pizza and several pints, by which I assume you mean Ben & 
Jerry's. <g>)

So I will be going

> (a) alone, 

even though I don't have a copy of the film script.  (Only $378 on 
ebay, huh?  Hmmm....)

I'll drag the dh there the next day if I can, having had my blissful 
experience alone at least once, possibly twice, possibly three times 
by then.  If the experience wasn't blissful, o' course, I'll tell him 
to skip it.  But I'm not letting him go at all unless he's read the 
book first.  I see this as my main chance to apply some leverage to 
get him to read it.  I've already told him I like the books way too 
much to allow my loved ones to have the movie create their inner 
pictures for them.

If by some miracle he turns into a fan before November 16, I will 
nobly wait 'til the next day to go to the movie so that we can share 
the experience (he will in that case have watched the trailers 30x 
each by then, so we'll be on equal footing).  I might have to be 
chained to the kitchen wall to carry out this plan, but it seems only 
fair reward for his capitulation.

Z!Amy




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 19:42:44 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 19:42:44 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <9hfufs+bl9q@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hg1bk+f14q@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
(Bellyaching in more ways than one, if he's had a 
> large pizza and several pints, by which I assume you mean Ben & 
> Jerry's. <g>)
> Z!Amy

Did you see Miss Congeniality by any chance!

Catherine




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Thu Jun 28 19:45:22 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (Jamieson Wolf Villeneuve)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 19:45:22 -0000
Subject: Miss Congeniality (Was Re: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <9hg1bk+f14q@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hg1gi+89rk@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., catherine at c... wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> (Bellyaching in more ways than one, if he's had a 
> > large pizza and several pints, by which I assume you mean Ben & 
> > Jerry's. <g>)
> > Z!Amy
> 
> Did you see Miss Congeniality by any chance!
> 
> Catherine

I don't know about anyone else, but I LOVED that movie!!!!! It was so 
good, and Sandra Bullock (sp, I'm sure) was great!!!

I saw it three times...anyone who hasn't seen it, go and so so!!! It 
kicks!!!

Hugs
Jamieson




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Thu Jun 28 20:12:26 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (Parker Brown Nesbit)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 16:12:26 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Britcoms (Was: Hooray! Celine Dion rumour false! 
Message-ID: <F17dA6kvAdxaQ6shalx00000ac4@hotmail.com>




>From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com
>Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie 
>casting
>Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 17:35:28 -0000
>

The UK does comedy much better than the US, IMNSHO. To name a few...
As Time Goes By, Are You Being Served, Waiting for God, Monty Python, Fawlty 
Towers...

I like witty repartee, & sophisticated humour.  I've not been able to watch 
US comedies past the first season.

Just my 2 galleons!

Peace & Plenty,

Parker


_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 28 20:19:47 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 13:19:47 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <9hftal+lffh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010628201947.65179.qmail@web14502.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Neil Ward <neilward at dircon.co.uk> wrote:
> Hi all...

<giggle> Hi Grumpy!Neil...

> Question:  To those of you planning to see the HP movie.  Would you 
> rather go:
> 
> (a) alone, because you want to annotate a copy of the film script you
> bought on e-Bay for 378 dollars?;
> 
> (b) with other HP fans, because you can share the experience and show
> off your humungous knowledge to the appreciative people sitting in 
> the seats around you?;
> 
> (c) with friends or relatives who will have to be bribed with a large
> pizza and several pints and dragged into the cinema by their hair?

Indubitably, my first choice is to go with other HPLovers. Second
choice would be friends or relatives with alone falling into a distant
and unappealing third.

However, I just recently moved to Florida. I don't have family here and
don't know anyone except for people at work. And there don't seem to be
any HPLovers at work. So I don't have any HPLovers, friends, or family
near enough to me. Hence, I shall be the person sitting alone, alone,
alone, clutching their SS book...

I'm hoping I make an HPfriend before October but considering my
friend-making skills are nearly nonexistent, I'm not banking on it.

(Ooo, don't I sound pathetic? Depression knows no bounds...)

~Depressed!Tired!Frustrated!Amber


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/21/2001

"It never happened if there is no memory of it. Human memory is just a record. You can rewrite the record."
- Serial Experiments Lain

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 19:40:59 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 19:40:59 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <9hftal+lffh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hg18b+f14m@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> Question:  To those of you planning to see the HP movie.  Would you 
> rather go:
> 
> (a) alone, because you want to annotate a copy of the film script 
you 
> bought on e-Bay for 378 dollars?;
> 
> (b) with other HP fans, because you can share the experience and 
show 
> off your humungous knowledge to the appreciative people sitting in 
> the seats around you?;
> 
> (c) with friends or relatives who will have to be bribed with a 
large 
> pizza and several pints and dragged into the cinema by their hair?
> 
> Neil    
> Flagging Ford Anglia

Poor Neil!  I hope your week gets better (what's left of it).  
Console yourself with the fact that you are not, like me, preparing 
for the imminent arrival of Mother-in-law from hell.  She's not that 
bad, but she's arriving tomorrow, and if she tries to rearrange my 
kitchen cupboards one more time....OK deep breath...

As to your question, probably all of the above.  My step-daughter and 
her children are avid fans, and can't wait, and I am under strict 
instructions to do anything in my power to get them tickets as soon 
as possible.  My dear husband is currently ploughing his way through 
PS.  (He came up behind me the other day and went "Got your conk!".  
His daughter wasn't surprised that the character he seems to relate 
to is Peeves!) and he has said that even if he doesn't get through 
the other books he wants to see the film because he can tell from the 
way the book is written and because of JKR's wonderful descriptions 
that it will translate very well to film.  So that's family.

I can tell you now that I will want to see it on my own as well, 
because if it is good I will want to see it more than once, and will 
probably go whenever I feel like it.

Fans:  Are we going to have an UK/HP fans cinema trip?  But I won't 
talk through it, as that really annoys me.

Catherine




From meboriqua at aol.com  Thu Jun 28 21:14:18 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 21:14:18 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <9hftal+lffh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hg6na+tnoa@eGroups.com>

In September I was running for the bus in the Bronx and my very nice 
red skirt caught on a metal edge of a garbage can and it went 
"RIIIP!".  My thigh was exposed for the world to see.  Luckily I had a 
long enough sweater to tie around my waist and cover the rip.  My 
thighs are for my boyfriend's eyes only (I don't even like looking at 
them).  You have my empathy, Neil.

As for the HP move, I have a close friend who is now reading GoF.  We 
have already discussed seeing the movie together.  She wanted to wait 
until the crowds thin out a bit, but I said "Hell no!".  I usually 
hate opening nights but for Harry Potter I must make an exception.  If 
my friend for some horrible and inexcusable reason cannot make it, 
four of my colleagues promised to read the books this summer, so I 
could conceivably drag one of them with me.  No one has reached my 
level of obsession, though...  Does anyone want to come to New York 
City for the premiere?

--jenny from ravenclaw, who also enjoyed "Miss Congeniality"*




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 21:17:51 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 21:17:51 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <9hg1bk+f14q@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hg6tv+hmce@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., catherine at c... wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> (Bellyaching in more ways than one, if he's had a 
> > large pizza and several pints, by which I assume you mean Ben & 
> > Jerry's. <g>)
> > Z!Amy
> 
> Did you see Miss Congeniality by any chance!
> 
> Catherine

No--does someone in it binge on B&J?

Amy Z

obsession rating: 51%
house: Gryffindor (how'd that happen?  I must've been muttering "Not 
Ravenclaw, not Ravenclaw")
B&J flavor of choice: Mint Chocolate Cookie




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 21:26:07 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 21:26:07 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <20010628201947.65179.qmail@web14502.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9hg7df+80n8@eGroups.com>

Amber wrote:

So I don't have any HPLovers, friends, or family
> near enough to me. Hence, I shall be the person sitting alone, 
alone,
> alone, clutching their SS book...

Amber, this is what I plan to do:

-Line up as early as they'll let me.  If that means 12 hours before 
the theater opens, bring snacks and lawn chair.

-Wear my Hogwarts t-shirt (this is much easier to do in Florida--I'll 
have to wear mine over my parka).  Pink fluffy earmuffs are, of 
course, de rigueur (again, you may want to adjust for local climate).

-Hold my PS up in front of my face and read while in line.  Make 
muttering and "aha" noises and have a highlighter in each hand.  Have 
stack of other HP books next to lawn chair in case of 12-hour wait.

-If necessary, draw a scar on my forehead.

I figure the true fans will find this behavior magnetic, whereas the 
ignorant masses who are just out to see the newest flick will give me 
a wide berth and possibly call 911 from their cellphones ("hello, I'd 
like to have someone committed?").  This is a good way to find 
kindred spirits!

Amy Z




From jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu  Thu Jun 28 21:30:47 2001
From: jfaulkne at eden.rutgers.edu (Jen Faulkner)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 17:30:47 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Miss Congeniality (was Re: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie)
In-Reply-To: <9hg6tv+hmce@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106281719140.26525-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>

On Thu, 28 Jun 2001, Amy Z wrote:

> > Did you see Miss Congeniality by any chance!
> 
> No--does someone in it binge on B&J?

Towards the beginning of the movie, Sandra Bullock is in a bar after a
very bad day, asks for a pint, only to be handed a pint of B&J by the
bartender.

*she says, with her recollection of MC a little shaky*

Personally, I really didn't like the movie.  It wasn't as bad as I
feared it would be, but I do *not* like 'turn the awkward heroine
beautiful' plot, no matter how they're toned down.  (I hate the whole
Hermione and the Yule Ball scene for that reason.)  Benjamin Bratt is
much prettier than she is anyway. *g*  Others' milage may (and obviously
does) vary.

--jen :)

"Will you be the one I've wanted, will you read my mind?
Will you ask me where I hurt, and heal me with your eyes?"
			--melissa ferrick

jen's fics: http://www.eden.rutgers.edu/~jfaulkne/
jen's LJ: http://www.livejournal.com/users/lysimache/





From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 21:39:16 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 21:39:16 -0000
Subject: Miss Congeniality 
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0106281719140.26525-100000@er7.rutgers.edu>
Message-ID: <9hg864+4pio@eGroups.com>

Jen Faulkner wrote:

> Towards the beginning of the movie, Sandra Bullock is in a bar 
after a
> very bad day, asks for a pint, only to be handed a pint of B&J by 
the
> bartender.

Now that's funny!  I'd much prefer the B&J, but then I don't drink.

> Personally, I really didn't like the movie.  It wasn't as bad as I
> feared it would be, but I do *not* like 'turn the awkward heroine
> beautiful' plot, no matter how they're toned down.  (I hate the 
whole
> Hermione and the Yule Ball scene for that reason.)

Mmm, sounds like I might not like it either, for the same reason.

Amy Z
0-time winner of the Miss Congeniality Contest




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 22:13:39 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 22:13:39 -0000
Subject: Challenge for LOTR fans
In-Reply-To: <013b01c0f904$de36e9a0$8f3f7bd5@tmeltcds>
Message-ID: <9hga6j+603n@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Michelle Apostolides" 
<michelleapostolides at l...> wrote:
> OK, here's one that will make you think.
> 
> I could not relate to The Hobbit. Can you please "sell" LOTR in 
such a
> way as to make me want to read it ?

It isn't at all like The Hobbit, which was written for children and 
has a very different tone.  So my first piece of advice would be to 
come to it as if you knew nothing about the author.

OK, why else should a person read LOTR?  

It has amazing creations like Ents and the Ring and Gollum (who is, 
IMO, is the most interesting thing in the Hobbit).  I can't quite put 
this aspect into words, but it parallels some of my favorite things 
about HP: the abundant creativity expressed in things like Dementors, 
moving paintings, Canary Creams, owl post . . .

It creates an entire world, with mythologies, languages, calendars, 
cosmologies, etc. all worked out.  If you love the world-creation 
aspect of fantasy, LOTR offers an inexhaustible resource thanks to 
the publication of many of JRRT's notebooks, early drafts, and other 
sources of background information.

It includes lots of poetry.  (Never my favorite bits, even though I 
love poetry, but for some people they're irresistible.)

It has very subtle and complex characterization.

The writing is terrific--I'm thinking sentence-level here:  the 
descriptions, the dialogue, etc.

The moral questions explored are deep and important, and they are 
treated with the complexity and depth they deserve.

There are great battle scenes.  Not my cup of tea, but perhaps it's 
yours.  They're very well-written.

That's a start.

Warning:  it starts off kinda slowly--as do the hobbits themselves 
(they really take their sweet time while the world is on the verge of 
ending, but there are reasons for that).

Amy Z





From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Thu Jun 28 22:19:24 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 22:19:24 -0000
Subject: Challenge for LOTR fans
In-Reply-To: <9hga6j+603n@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hgahc+dd7l@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> 
> Warning:  it starts off kinda slowly--as do the hobbits themselves 
> (they really take their sweet time while the world is on the verge 
of 
> ending, but there are reasons for that).
> 
> Amy Z

I have to say that the first few chapters of LOTR are my favourite.  
I love the buildup to Bilbo leaving, Frodo taking on his "Quest", and 
most of all, how safe and comforting most of the Shire feels and how 
this begins to erode when the Black Riders start sniffing around.  
The atmosphere in these chapters is fantastic, as it combines what is 
safe and familiar, with a more ominous, darker presence.

Catherine, who is in a rambling mood tonight.




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 22:31:25 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 22:31:25 -0000
Subject: Photo and hair story
In-Reply-To: <9gofc1+da93@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hgb7t+ae73@eGroups.com>

Pigwidgeon wrote:

> Blond!Simon is at http://www.geocities.com/hert0661/simon.jpg

I think it looks great!  What inspired it?

I have never for a moment considered dyeing my hair, which is red in 
a reddish, not a Weasleyish, sort of way.  Then a couple of weeks 
ago, I was standing in bright sunshine with a friend who said 
suddenly, "You have red hair!"  
  "Yes," I said, so testily that I surprised myself, "what color did 
you think it was?"  
  "I guess I usually see you indoors, and I would have said light 
brown," she said.

Well.  I seriously contemplated getting some henna and giving it a 
subtle upgrade so that no one would ever miss the red again.  I had 
no idea I was so attached to the color of my hair until that moment.  
Unbeknownst to me, I'd equated my hair quite a lot with my identity; 
brown is ordinary, red a bit unusual.  Also, the color of my hair is 
the only thing about my looks that invites compliments on anything 
approaching a regular basis.  It was a bit humbling to realize how 
much I give a damn.

Amy Z
who'd better find a way to cope, since the white hairs are starting 
to appear around the edges




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Thu Jun 28 22:35:39 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 22:35:39 -0000
Subject: Challenge for LOTR fans
In-Reply-To: <9hgahc+dd7l@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hgbfr+ua1k@eGroups.com>

Catherine wrote:

> I have to say that the first few chapters of LOTR are my 
favourite.  
> I love the buildup to Bilbo leaving, Frodo taking on his "Quest", 
and 
> most of all, how safe and comforting most of the Shire feels and 
how 
> this begins to erode when the Black Riders start sniffing around.  
> The atmosphere in these chapters is fantastic, as it combines what 
is 
> safe and familiar, with a more ominous, darker presence.
> 
> Catherine, who is in a rambling mood tonight.

That wasn't at all rambly, and I agree with you; I love those 
chapters also.  I just know that it often takes a plot hook to drag 
me into a book, and though LOTR offers one right off (the Ring), it 
could lose a lot of people like me who will be impatient to hear more 
about it.

Amy Z, feeling rambling too




From wings909 at aol.com  Thu Jun 28 22:38:09 2001
From: wings909 at aol.com (wings909 at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 18:38:09 EDT
Subject: Saving the QT trailer...
Message-ID: <f4.bed2f04.286d0bd1@aol.com>

how does one do it?  I've tried everything and can't get it saved!  Any tips??

Cheers,
Paula



From lj2d30 at gateway.net  Thu Jun 28 23:09:53 2001
From: lj2d30 at gateway.net (Trina)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 23:09:53 -0000
Subject: Aack! Damn computer!
Message-ID: <9hgdg1+ja58@eGroups.com>

Y'all, my modem has decided to act of its own accord and short out my 
telephone line whenever the computer is turned on.  Which naturally 
means I can't access the internet or my email (currently on the 
library's 'puter at the moment).  So I'll be offline for a few days 
till Gateway sends me my new modem.  I hope they use Hedwig and not 
Errol...  

In the meantime, y'all *will* keep the traffic here and on the main 
list down to a bare minimum, right?  I'm serious here, really!

Trina, getting behinder and behinder with each moment... 





From ender_w at msn.com  Thu Jun 28 23:50:35 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 19:50:35 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
References: <9hfufs+bl9q@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002801c1002d$21423540$4ceb183f@satellite>


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Amy Z 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2001 2:53 PM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie


  Grumpy!Neil wrote,

  > Question:  To those of you planning to see the HP movie.  Would you 
  > rather go:
  > 
  > (b) with other HP fans, because you can share the experience and 
  show 
  > off your humungous knowledge to the appreciative people sitting in 
  > the seats around you?;

  Oh my, we could make ourselves very unpopular, couldn't we?  Why 
  don't we all just charter a theater or three or thirty?  That way we 
  could hoot, comment, and guffaw to our hearts' content, and maybe 
  even take over the projection booth so as to run back the good bits.


  How many of us are on the list?  the Senator Theatre in Baltimore seats 900.  the rest of y'all can sit in our laps.
  Seriously, are there any HP fans in the Baltimore/DC area?

  ender


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From mystril at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 29 00:27:49 2001
From: mystril at yahoo.com (mystril at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 00:27:49 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <002801c1002d$21423540$4ceb183f@satellite>
Message-ID: <9hgi25+cgsc@eGroups.com>

>   Grumpy!Neil wrote,
> 
>   > Question:  To those of you planning to see the HP movie.  Would 
you 
>   > rather go:
>   > 
>   > (b) with other HP fans, because you can share the experience and 
>   show 
>   > off your humungous knowledge to the appreciative people sitting 
in 
>   > the seats around you?;
> 
Amy Z wrote:
>   Oh my, we could make ourselves very unpopular, couldn't we?  Why 
>   don't we all just charter a theater or three or thirty?  That way 
we 
>   could hoot, comment, and guffaw to our hearts' content, and maybe 
>   even take over the projection booth so as to run back the good 
bits.
> 
ender wrote: 

>   How many of us are on the list?  the Senator Theatre in Baltimore 
seats 900.  the rest of y'all can sit in our laps.
>   Seriously, are there any HP fans in the Baltimore/DC area?
> 

May I request at least one "if anyone converses, I'll kill them" 
viewing? Laughter, tears, hoots, groans, and other expressions of 
feeling are fine. Conversations during films are bad and usually cause 
me to throw popcorn. However, this being Harry Potter - I'll bring my 
secret stash of dungbombs.

-Poingy!Mystril, who plans on dragging her mother (semi-HP fan) to the 
movie the first time, her boyfriend (semi-HP fan) the second, then 
starting in on the bribery for the rest of the universe

PS: Unfortunately, not from the Baltimore/DC area, but I plan on going 
there in August for an anime con







From meboriqua at aol.com  Fri Jun 29 01:06:25 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 01:06:25 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <9hg6tv+hmce@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hgkah+9k0q@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:

> house: Gryffindor (how'd that happen?  I must've been muttering "Not 
> Ravenclaw, not Ravenclaw")
> B&J flavor of choice: Mint Chocolate Cookie

*Sniffs indignantly*  Not Ravenclaw?  And here I was, all set to be in 
your dorm and make snide comments about Snape in Potions when his back 
is turned!

--jenny from ravenclaw, who is starting to think that every time 
ravenclaw is mentioned at the amin site, people are really talking 
about me

B&J flavor of choice:  that depends on the day*********************




From meboriqua at aol.com  Fri Jun 29 01:10:02 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 01:10:02 -0000
Subject: an embarrassing mistake
In-Reply-To: <9hgkah+9k0q@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hgkha+hf8v@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., meboriqua at a... wrote:

> 
> --jenny from ravenclaw, who is starting to think that every time 
> ravenclaw is mentioned at the amin site, people are really talking 
> about me


'Amin' site?  I meant MAIN site!  Excuse me while I shut my ears in 
the oven.  That'll teach me not to try and type with wet nails!

--jenny from ravenclaw, who ain't feeling too smart right now*****




From meboriqua at aol.com  Fri Jun 29 01:20:13 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 01:20:13 -0000
Subject: Photo and hair story
In-Reply-To: <9hgb7t+ae73@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hgl4d+c1o2@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> 
> Well.  I seriously contemplated getting some henna and giving it a 
> subtle upgrade so that no one would ever miss the red again.  I had 
> no idea I was so attached to the color of my hair until that moment.  
> Unbeknownst to me, I'd equated my hair quite a lot with my identity; 
> brown is ordinary, red a bit unusual.  Also, the color of my hair is 
> the only thing about my looks that invites compliments on anything 
> approaching a regular basis.  It was a bit humbling to realize how 
> much I give a damn.>

Hey, join the club!  I've had blonde, black and now red hair; I've 
been dyeing my hair for years.  I've also had very short hair as well 
as extensions that went down to my butt (that was fun).  I think the 
natural color of my hair is quite boring.  

Right now I'm trying to decide how to wear my hair for my sister's 
wedding (I'm the maid of honor).

--jenny from ravenclaw, who's wondering how the Sorting Hat deals with 
vanity as a dominant trait**************************************




From hamster8 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 29 01:25:30 2001
From: hamster8 at hotmail.com (hamster8 at hotmail.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 01:25:30 -0000
Subject: Saving the QT trailer... attack BT Internet with pointy sticks!
In-Reply-To: <f4.bed2f04.286d0bd1@aol.com>
Message-ID: <9hglea+alm9@eGroups.com>

Paula ...

"how does one do it?  I've tried everything and can't get it saved!  
Any tips??"

I *know* it's possible; my room mate saved the first one for me 
(muttering under his breath something along the lines of 'not more 
f*****g Harry Potter' as he did so).  I suggest you go to the 
temporary internet files on your computer, and open it from there, 
though be warned, if you don't clear out your temp files very often 
(like me) you'll have a job finding it.  If you have a Quicktime 
player on your computer, it should be possible to do some kinda 
dragging and saving thing with it.  Unfortunately, I put the first 
trailer in 'My Documents.'  Sorry if that's vague ... I'm a bit 
desperate to do so myself.  *Anybody* out there at 2.26 am prepared 
to help us bewildered technophobes??

Am doubly annoyed tonight because British Telecom saw fit to chuck me 
off the internet just as I was halfway through downloaded my 
Quicktime file, and I've just had to spend a whole hour doing it 
again.  Gnaaargh!

Al
*delurking for the summer ... university is over*
 





From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 29 01:35:19 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 01:35:19 -0000
Subject: watching the movie en masse
In-Reply-To: <9hgi25+cgsc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hgm0n+p09p@eGroups.com>

Mystril wrote:
 
> May I request at least one "if anyone converses, I'll kill them" 
> viewing? Laughter, tears, hoots, groans, and other expressions of 
> feeling are fine. Conversations during films are bad and usually 
cause 
> me to throw popcorn. However, this being Harry Potter - I'll bring 
my 
> secret stash of dungbombs.

If we all went together, we could have at least one silent viewing 
(yes, laughter permitted, but no remarks, shouts of "that isn't how it 
happens!" or poking others in the shoulder triumphantly) and then have 
a second viewing with no holds barred.

Amy Z
idly dreaming here in the middle of nowhere, where I'm lucky to have a 
movie theater at all, never mind companions to watch it with




From hamster8 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 29 01:52:40 2001
From: hamster8 at hotmail.com (hamster8 at hotmail.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 01:52:40 -0000
Subject: Saving Quicktime files for offline access.
Message-ID: <9hgn18+gjgi@eGroups.com>

This is in response to my last post, which was in response to 
Paula's.  I've been fiddling about, and quite by chance, have 
actually managed to do it.  So here's how to do it for PCs running MS 
Internet Explorer.

You NEED to have a Quicktime Player on your PC already (that should 
be obvious).   

Go to 'Tools' on the highest toolbar.  Go down to 'Internet 
Options.'  Once there, click on 'Settings' in the 'Temporary Internet 
Files' box (second one down, between 'Home Page' and 'History')  With 
me?  Good.  Now click on 'View Files.'  This page may take a minute 
to load, depending on just how much content you have stored offline 
(your PC makes a copy of *every* file you view, so if, like me, you 
don't clean out this folder very often, there could well be hundreds 
of files there) ... scroll down (deleting unwanted or morally dubious 
files as you go *vbeg*) until you find the Quicktime movie file.  It 
is called trailer2_aolwb_lo[1].mov (depending on which version you 
have, it could also be called _med or _hi ... but it *will* be 
there).  Now go to 'edit' and 'copy' the file.  *Now* get rid of the 
temporary files page and minimize your internet connection.  Open 'My 
Computer' on your desktop ... and go into 'Program Files' ... open 
the Quicktime folder.  Go to the drop down toolbar at the top, and 
select 'edit' again.  Now click on paste.  It *will* paste the movie 
file into your Quicktime player.  As these files are so large (lo 
quality is more than 10MB) you might want to go back to the temporary 
internet files page and *delete* the stored version ... as it is 
unlikely you'll be needing it again if you actually have a copy.  Now 
play it back, use freeze frame, make Harry and Ron run backwards to 
your heart's content!  Yay!

Al
*v pleased with himself*




From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Fri Jun 29 02:05:14 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 02:05:14 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting
In-Reply-To: <9hfpt0+l9mu@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hgnoq+rj2u@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., dfrankis at d... wrote:
> Milz wrote:
> 
> > Milz (who devotedly watches the "EastEnders" eventhough we're 3 
> years 
> > behind the UK and is just watching the ones with Alex the sexy 
> Vicar)
> 
> Why does anyone in America want to watch EastEnders? It's so 
> depressing (like all UK soaps and series - compare Casualty with 
ER).
> 
> David, Ally McBeal, Simpsons, Star Trek fan waiting for the world-
> famous UK television industry to justify its fame...


I like the EastEnders because it isn't like the generic American soap 
operas and series. I don't know if they show American daytime soaps, 
such as "Days of Our Lives", "All My Children" and "The Young and The 
Restless", in the UK, but these typical soaps are 
very..er
imaginative.  Everyone has loads of money, live in fabulous 
homes and wear the lastest fashions. Many of the major characters have 
died and later come back to life or have gone insane (like homicidal 
totally looney insane) or have suffered from amnesia or have had an 
evil fratricidal twin. I'll admit the EastEnders are kind of grimy and 
have miserable lives in Walford, but it's a refreshing change from the 
flashy 'usual' soaps.

They don't show too many UK series here except the comedies and the 
historical dramas. So I really can't compare them with American 
series. However, there is only one American series that I watch 
faithfully: "Law and Order". I used to watch the "X-Files" 
faithfully too until it got kind of boring. "Ally McBeal" reminds me 
too much of the neurotic women I know. "ER", well, I've worked in a 
real ER before and everytime I see parts of the show I end up yelling 
at the tv "That's not how a REAL ER runs!". The other medical drama 
that was totally ridiculous imo was "Chicago Hope". Most of the other 
US series don't hold my attention, except I'm beginning to like 
"Roswell".

I do like the few British comedies they show here. I think they're far 
superior than some of the more popular American ones (okay, the 
Simpsons are good. Another good one is "Malcolm in the Middle" imho). 

In terms of historical dramas and literature dramatizations, there's 
no question about it imho that the UK puts out excellent ones compared 
to the American ones. 

Milz  





From editor at texas.net  Fri Jun 29 02:43:28 2001
From: editor at texas.net (Amanda Lewanski)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 21:43:28 -0500
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] an embarrassing mistake
References: <9hgkha+hf8v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B3BEB4F.B63728BE@texas.net>

meboriqua at aol.com wrote:

> 'Amin' site?  I meant MAIN site!  Excuse me while I shut my ears in
> the oven.  That'll teach me not to try and type with wet nails!
>
> --jenny from ravenclaw, who ain't feeling too smart right now*****

Jenny, m'love, until you've sent out a message from yourself as Jenyn or
something, you have no room to talk. I've actually signed things
"Amanad" or some such, and not caught it. And I'm in Ravenclaw, too.
Mayhap our minds just work faster than our fingers?

--Amanad NO Adnama whoops Amadna damn Amanda there!


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 29 03:23:25 2001
From: witchwanda2002 at yahoo.com (Wanda Mallett)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 20:23:25 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Britcoms (Was: Hooray! Celine Dion rumour false! 
In-Reply-To: <F17dA6kvAdxaQ6shalx00000ac4@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <20010629032325.76822.qmail@web13702.mail.yahoo.com>

I have to agree with you! I have been watching the
Britcoms for years on the PBS stations. I have my boys
hooked on Red Dwarf and all thones you have mentioned
plus Keeping up Appearances and Vicar of Dibbley, and
Murder Most Horrid! That's where we learned a lot of
British Slang but still get confused with the money,
but the humor is priceless!

Wanda the Witch of Revere, Massachusetts
 
--- Parker Brown Nesbit <pbnesbit at msn.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> >From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com
> >Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
> >To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
> >Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Hooray!  Celine Dion
> rumour false! +movie 
> >casting
> >Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 17:35:28 -0000
> >
> 
> The UK does comedy much better than the US, IMNSHO.
> To name a few...
> As Time Goes By, Are You Being Served, Waiting for
> God, Monty Python, Fawlty 
> Towers...
> 
> I like witty repartee, & sophisticated humour.  I've
> not been able to watch 
> US comedies past the first season.
> 
> Just my 2 galleons!
> 
> Peace & Plenty,
> 
> Parker
> 
> 
>
_________________________________________________________________
> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at
> http://explorer.msn.com
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
> 
> 


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From ender_w at msn.com  Fri Jun 29 10:37:47 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 06:37:47 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
References: <9hgi25+cgsc@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <001201c10087$8f8493e0$30e7183f@satellite>


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: mystril at yahoo.com 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2001 8:27 PM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie

  > 
  Amy Z wrote:
  >   Oh my, we could make ourselves very unpopular, couldn't we?  Why 
  >   don't we all just charter a theater or three or thirty?  That way 
  we 
  >   could hoot, comment, and guffaw to our hearts' content, and maybe 
  >   even take over the projection booth so as to run back the good 
  bits.
  > 
  ender wrote: 

  >   How many of us are on the list?  the Senator Theatre in Baltimore 
  seats 900.  the rest of y'all can sit in our laps.
  >   Seriously, are there any HP fans in the Baltimore/DC area?
  > 

  May I request at least one "if anyone converses, I'll kill them" 
  viewing? Laughter, tears, hoots, groans, and other expressions of 
  feeling are fine. Conversations during films are bad and usually cause 
  me to throw popcorn. However, this being Harry Potter - I'll bring my 
  secret stash of dungbombs.

  AMEN!!  Didn't mean to yell,  but there's a lot of frustration behind that "amen."  I love my friends but they have such an annoying habit of talking and otherwise being nuisances during movies.  I won't even go into a theatre with one particular friends until I see her physically remove her cell phone and leave it on the floor of the car.
  I say, let's save all the deep discussions for when it comes out on video.
  ender




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From meboriqua at aol.com  Fri Jun 29 12:14:29 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 12:14:29 -0000
Subject: Hooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +movie casting
In-Reply-To: <9hgnoq+rj2u@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hhrf5+qpb4@eGroups.com>

Am I the only person on this site who watches "Charmed" religiously?  
If I am, I'm not embarrassed to admit it.  I want to be a trio of 
sisters who have powers, too!

When I get a chance I also watch "Will and Grace" which makes me laugh 
out loud when I am by myself.

I don't watch "ER" but I like to watch "Boston Public" just to see how 
they portray teachers as horny insane pedophiles who stay at school on 
Fridays until ten o'clock at night.  Yeah, right!

--jenny from ravenclaw****************************************




From meboriqua at aol.com  Fri Jun 29 12:21:56 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 12:21:56 -0000
Subject: an embarrassing mistake
In-Reply-To: <3B3BEB4F.B63728BE@texas.net>
Message-ID: <9hhrt4+to4p@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amanda Lewanski <editor at t...> wrote:
> 
> Jenny, m'love, until you've sent out a message from yourself as 
Jenyn or
> something, you have no room to talk. I've actually signed things
> "Amanad" or some such, and not caught it. And I'm in Ravenclaw, too.
> Mayhap our minds just work faster than our fingers?
> 
> --Amanad NO Adnama whoops Amadna damn Amanda there!>

Well thank you, Amanda!  I live in fear of typing my name wrong, not 
catching it when I proof read and seeing the mistake after I pressed 
'send' ::shudder::.  I'm sure now that my fear is out there, a 
dementor will come along and make it happen.

--jeeny from ravnecalw, who wonders why so many people write 
'Dursley's' when talking about all three of them (that one has been 
bothering this English teacher for a long time)*******************




From ender_w at msn.com  Fri Jun 29 12:45:37 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 08:45:37 -0400
Subject: trailer
References: <9hhrf5+qpb4@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000701c10099$66f345e0$30e7183f@satellite>


  i'm posting this here because it's mostly off topic.  i've just gone through the trouble of waiting for the quicktime trailer to download so i can watch it...does anyone know how i can now save it to my computer?  Is it already saved?  Is this a stupid question?

  ender


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From meboriqua at aol.com  Fri Jun 29 13:02:58 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 13:02:58 -0000
Subject: My sister's wedding
Message-ID: <9hhua2+i96l@eGroups.com>

Hello everyone!

Later on today will be the last time I log on until Sunday because my 
sister is getting married tomorrow (insert clever Harry Potter 
reference here) and I literally won't have access to a computer until 
I get back to my apartment.  I was wondering if everyone could please 
not post anything until Sunday so it won't take me three hours to get 
through all the postings.  I'd really appreciate it.  Thanks in 
advance.

Just kidding.

--jenny from ravenclaw, who can stand in front of a classroom filled 
with obnoxious Bronx teenagers and say anything but is very very 
nervous to speak at my sister's wedding on Saturday night****




From wings909 at aol.com  Fri Jun 29 14:09:53 2001
From: wings909 at aol.com (wings909 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 10:09:53 EDT
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
Message-ID: <95.ca0687e.286de631@aol.com>

(b) with other HP fans, because you can share the experience and show 
 off your humungous knowledge to the appreciative people sitting in 
 the seats around you?;

Part B should read this:

(b) with other HP fans, so you can giggle hysterically when you favorite characters show up for the first time, shout out lines from the book along with the characters ("Mr. Potter, our new celebrity" "She needs to sort out her priorities!"), giggle hysterically, yell during the Quidditch matches, and generally be an all around annoyance to the other people in the theatre who will have no idea what on earth is going on.


Not that *I* have any plans of doing anything of the sort...

Cheers, 
Paula



From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun 29 14:17:11 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 14:17:11 -0000
Subject: Wales/ (wasHooray!  Celine Dion rumour false! +mov ie casting +Am Psycho
In-Reply-To: <9hfi0r+73f5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hi2l7+ajr2@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Dai Evans" <dwe199 at s...> wrote:
 
> [Christian Bale]'s Welsh actually. Born in Pembrokshire, 
> West Wales.

Hmm, what do you think, do you think Lily [EVANS] and James and 
Sirius and Remus were all Welsh, how about Peter?




From wings909 at aol.com  Fri Jun 29 14:27:11 2001
From: wings909 at aol.com (wings909 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 10:27:11 EDT
Subject: The Hardest part about downloading the trailer at work....
Message-ID: <120.fe2117.286dea3f@aol.com>

The Hardest parts about downloading the trailer at work are as follows:

1)  Trying to keep the look of disgruntlement off of your face as you realize the time it takes you to d/l the trailer at work is less than the time it takes you to reboot your computer at home. 

2)  Pretending that you aren't doing anything of import as so not to attract the attentions of curious co-workers.

3)  Biting your lips bloody in efforts not to grin, giggle, or do anything potentially embarassing.


Cheers,
Paula



From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun 29 14:26:41 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 14:26:41 -0000
Subject: Grumpy!Neil/Q. about the movie
In-Reply-To: <9hftal+lffh@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hi371+s25i@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:

> I had a funny week this week.  On Monday, at work, I bent over to 
> pick up a letter from the floor and split my suit trousers straight 
> up the back.  My best suit, too. 

Once I was on jury duty, and I was called into the box for voir dire, 
and it was a tight squeeze getting past the other people sitted in 
the audience seats between me and the aisle, and I felt my 
excesively large front snag as I forcibly squeezed past a fellow 
middle-aged woman with an excessively large front. After I sat down in 
jury box, I noticed that my blouse (it was old and beloved and 
'diaphanous from many washings') was ripped all the way across the 
front. And I didn't have a wrap. So I held my purse in my arms 
clutched to my chest as if it were a puppy bear. 

> The rest of the week has consisted of working late, having a 
> headache, getting home very late, falling asleep on the sofa, and 
> waking up at 5am to the sounds of a repeat of 'Karaoke Challenge'

Oh, poor Neil! Feel better. 





From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun 29 14:33:22 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 14:33:22 -0000
Subject: an embarrassing mistake
In-Reply-To: <3B3BEB4F.B63728BE@texas.net>
Message-ID: <9hi3ji+il7u@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Amanda Lewanski <editor at t...> wrote:
> meboriqua at a... wrote:
> 
> > 'Amin' site?  I meant MAIN site! 

I wondered if she meant Admin site.
> 
> Jenny, m'love, until you've sent out a message from yourself as 
> Jenyn or something, you have no room to talk. I've actually signed
> things "Amanad" or some such, and not caught it.

> > --Amanad NO Adnama whoops Amadna damn Amanda there!

I keep typing riat and wisnton and an attempt to correct a magazine 
subscription that thought my name was Winton only turned it into 
Wintson. It's remarkable how my name came out typed correctly for once 
when I tried to type my usual typoes, above.

Jenyn, Adnama, Amadna, all pretty names.....




From dfrankis at dial.pipex.com  Fri Jun 29 15:29:23 2001
From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com (dfrankis at dial.pipex.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 15:29:23 -0000
Subject: an embarrassing mistake
In-Reply-To: <9hgkha+hf8v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hi6sj+7j4m@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., meboriqua at a... wrote:
> --- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., meboriqua at a... wrote:
> 
> > 
> > --jenny from ravenclaw, who is starting to think that every time 
> > ravenclaw is mentioned at the amin site, people are really 
talking 
> > about me
> 
> 
> 'Amin' site?  I meant MAIN site!  Excuse me while I shut my ears in 
> the oven.  That'll teach me not to try and type with wet nails!
> 
> --jenny from ravenclaw, who ain't feeling too smart right now*****

Contest #8: think up a convincing reason why fans of Idi would talk 
about Rowena

David




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 29 15:31:29 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 15:31:29 -0000
Subject: anti-Spielberg and a bit on Columbus
Message-ID: <9hi70h+2mru@eGroups.com>

I having confessed that boggarts turn into Steven Spielberg when they 
see me coming, ***Draco~Malfoy~Lover*** wrote on the main list:

>Why Steven Spielberg? He's a great director! He'd probably do a 
>better job on this film than Chritopher Comlumbus :::mutters darkly 
>about the choice of director:::.

None of the following should be read as an endorsement of Chris "Home 
Alone 2" Columbus, nor, for that matter, a statement that I would 
prefer him to Spielberg as the director of HP.  CC is on serious 
probation as far as I'm concerned. 

Five reasons I don't like Steven Spielberg:

-His chief technique for getting the audience to feel surprise, 
wonder, etc., is to show character upon character gazing in surprise, 
wonder, etc., usually skyward.  This is a fine cinematic approach used 
in moderation, but it wears thin long before SS is done with it, IMO. 
 I caught onto it back at E.T., and it's driven me nuts ever since.  
(I should've caught on earlier.  Shots of people gazing at things take 
up 40% of Close Encounters.)

-Corollary to above:  he's a basically manipulative filmmaker.  I feel 
as if he tugs on every obvious expectation and cliche (I refused to 
see Saving Private Ryan because I couldn't stand one more army flick 
with the squadron of stereotypes--the hick who's ignorant but boy can 
he shoot [all those years of huntin' squirrels 'n' 'possums]).  This 
kind of thing gets my sarcasm engine turned on, as you may have 
noticed.  Now, art is about skillful manipulation, but there are 
artists who make me say "Aha!" and artists who make me say "I'm being 
manipulated."  The great ones are the former; Spielberg is 
consistently the latter.  I also prefer directors who use their powers 
of manipulation toward some lofty purpose, which brings me to . . .

-He has used his considerable talent to make one shallow blockbuster 
after another.  Shallow blockbusters are okay--I rent mostly comedies, 
myself, purely for entertainment and not to change my life--but what 
so irritates me about Spielberg is that he wants recognition as some 
kind of auteur despite basically being a turner-out of entertaining 
bits of fluff.  Case in point:  when he won Best Director for 
Schindler's List (his first directing Oscar), he said something along 
the lines of "at last"; there had been a lot of handwringing about how 
he kept getting passed over.  The only serious film he had made up to 
that point, IMHO, was The Color Purple (never saw it, though I'd like 
to, so I won't venture a judgment; I never saw Schindler's List in 
its entirety, either--the power went out at the movie theater 40 
minutes in, though I did like those 40 minutes).  You would have 
thought that he'd been making masterpieces all these years and been 
ignored.  I liked Jaws, I liked Close Encounters, I even liked E.T., 
but none of them are the kinds of movies I would vote for for Best 
Picture.  (Neither are most of the movies that have won it, 
historically.)  I ask for more than entertainment from a Best 
Director.

-He makes movies for children that are extremely violent.  I loved 
Raiders of the Lost Ark when I was a kid--I think I saw it 5 times the 
week it came out--but now I look at it and realize how many people our 
hero kills along the way.  Dirty Harry, move over.  It really bothers 
me that this stuff is sold as wholesome entertainment.  The 
writer Barbara Kingsolver tells a story about this that is very 
revealing:  a friend of hers told her, "You'll like it, it isn't 
violent at all," and like me, BK watched and counted up the bodies.  
That's the worst thing about that kind of movie--the mayhem is 
presented in such a flip, cartoonish way that we don't even realize 
how much of it there is.

-Rumor had it that he said he'd direct HP only if Haley Joel Osment 
played Harry.  A big raspberry to SS for trying to stack his influence 
against JKR's (anyone know an emoticon for a raspberry?).  No offense 
to HJO, who may be a very talented actor, but he is not British and 
that settles it.  It should have settled it for Spielberg, or at least 
he should have said, "Well, I differ with the author on the necessity 
for a British cast, so I will have to gracefully decline the 
possibility of directing."  As I said, the information that he was 
throwing his weight around is rumor, so do take it with a grain of 
salt.

Ah well, de gustibus non titillandum.

Back to Columbus:  I was heartened by the quote in USA Today where he 
said he wanted to express his darker, less sentimental side in HP.  We 
can only hope so.

Amy Z




From dfrankis at dial.pipex.com  Fri Jun 29 15:44:01 2001
From: dfrankis at dial.pipex.com (dfrankis at dial.pipex.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 15:44:01 -0000
Subject: Britcoms (Was: Hooray! Celine Dion rumour false!
In-Reply-To: <20010629032325.76822.qmail@web13702.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9hi7o1+pghk@eGroups.com>

I'd forgotten the Vicar of Dibley (Amy's role model?), which I really 
like.  I haven't seen Waiting for God or As Time Goes By. The rest 
are old. Of course, so is TNG now.  Patrick Stewart for Mad-Eye 
Moody - the voice is everything.

What I particularly liked about Ally was the interplay between the 
courtroom and the personal issues, mixed with the humour.  Series 3 
(I think it was 3 - Billy dies) was less good because there were 
fewer courtroom scenes.

Are they really called Britcoms in the US?

David, still laughing about 'I can't believe it's not butter'

Wanda Mallett <witchwanda2002 at y...> wrote:
> I have to agree with you! I have been watching the
> Britcoms for years on the PBS stations. I have my boys
> hooked on Red Dwarf and all thones you have mentioned
> plus Keeping up Appearances and Vicar of Dibbley, and
> Murder Most Horrid! That's where we learned a lot of
> British Slang but still get confused with the money,
> but the humor is priceless!
> 
> Wanda the Witch of Revere, Massachusetts
>  
> --- Parker Brown Nesbit <pbnesbit at m...> wrote:
> 
> > 
> > The UK does comedy much better than the US, IMNSHO.
> > To name a few...
> > As Time Goes By, Are You Being Served, Waiting for
> > God, Monty Python, Fawlty 
> > Towers...
> > 
> > I like witty repartee, & sophisticated humour.  I've
> > not been able to watch 
> > US comedies past the first season.
> > 
> > Just my 2 galleons!
> > 
> > Peace & Plenty,
> > 
> > Parker
> > 





From bohners at pobox.com  Fri Jun 29 16:28:58 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 12:28:58 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] anti-Spielberg and a bit on Columbus
References: <9hi70h+2mru@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <0ca801c100b8$9edab3c0$0938acce@rebeccab>

Amy --

I am totally with you when it comes to Spielberg's blockbusters.  I have
given most of them a deliberate miss, and the ones that I haven't skipped
have been prone to every one of the faults you describe.  Which is not to
say I didn't enjoy some of them in spite of that (I have a strange fondness
for HOOK and YOUNG SHERLOCK HOLMES in particular), but I don't like it when
directors try to manipulate my emotions so shamelessly, either.  It just
makes me dig in my heels and determine not to let them succeed.

Spielberg, however, is a director with a split personality.  Three-quarters
of the films he makes are sentimental, overblown eye-candy.  But every now
and then he turns around and delivers a film of exquisite skill and real
emotional and philosophical power, completely free of the excesses,
gimmicks, and conspicuous displays of special effects that you despise.  I
can only say that you NEED to see those films before you can decide what you
really think of Spielberg.

I would personally recommend EMPIRE OF THE SUN to start.  I had no idea
Spielberg was capable of anything great until I saw that film.  After three
wrenching hours of exquisite cinema, my jaw was on the floor.  I literally
could not believe it was the same Steven Spielberg directing it.  I felt the
same way about SCHINDLER'S LIST, which I truly believe is the greatest movie
ever made (and I fervently hope I never have to watch it again).  That film
has to be seen in the cinema for proper effect:  in fact I was appalled at
the thought of it going to video, because I couldn't help thinking it would
lose a great deal of its impact.  But since it is now very unlikely that you
can see it in such a venue, I guess the video will have to do.  (I saw
EMPIRE on video and it didn't keep me from appreciating it, although I now
wish I'd seen it on the screen.)

Both those films left me emotionally wrung-out for a week, but not because
they employed any of Spielberg's usual maudlin tricks.  Indeed, in EMPIRE
one might even say Spielberg turned his own reputation for wide-eyed star
gazing shots on its head, because pretty much any time anybody looks up into
the sky in that film, seriously awful things happen.  And Christian Bale is
incredible as the young protagonist.  (The film also contains what I
consider to be the perfect role for John Malkovich, and certainly the best
acting I've ever seen from him yet; although I don't actually like John
Malkovich, so I may be a bit biased on that point.)

John Williams, too, has a split personality to go with Spielberg's.  Most of
his music (the famous stuff, anyway) seems to be built around the same
musical theme, with a few not-very-interesting variations.  I was quite
convinced the man was a hack with an undeserved reputation, until I heard
his score for SCHINDLER'S LIST and was completely blown away.  It did not
sound like anything I would ever have recognized as Williams music at all.
It was beautiful and wrenching and utterly appropriate for the film.  I own
the soundtrack and listen to it on a regular basis, and when I listen to it,
not once do I find myself thinking, "Oh, yeah, that guy who did the music
for STAR WARS (or SUPERMAN, or any of those others with annoyingly similar
themes)."

So I'm willing to give Williams a chance to outdo himself on HP, although
admittedly it's not likely that he'll pull out all the stops on a
fantastical kiddie film -- he'll probably just go back to his old habits.
But at least I know he can do more -- much, much more -- than I'd ever
anticipated.
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj



----- Original Message -----
From: "Amy Z" <aiz24 at hotmail.com>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2001 11:31 AM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] anti-Spielberg and a bit on Columbus


> I having confessed that boggarts turn into Steven Spielberg when they
> see me coming, ***Draco~Malfoy~Lover*** wrote on the main list:
>
> >Why Steven Spielberg? He's a great director! He'd probably do a
> >better job on this film than Chritopher Comlumbus :::mutters darkly
> >about the choice of director:::.
>
> None of the following should be read as an endorsement of Chris "Home
> Alone 2" Columbus, nor, for that matter, a statement that I would
> prefer him to Spielberg as the director of HP.  CC is on serious
> probation as far as I'm concerned.
>
> Five reasons I don't like Steven Spielberg:
>
> -His chief technique for getting the audience to feel surprise,
> wonder, etc., is to show character upon character gazing in surprise,
> wonder, etc., usually skyward.  This is a fine cinematic approach used
> in moderation, but it wears thin long before SS is done with it, IMO.
>  I caught onto it back at E.T., and it's driven me nuts ever since.
> (I should've caught on earlier.  Shots of people gazing at things take
> up 40% of Close Encounters.)
>
> -Corollary to above:  he's a basically manipulative filmmaker.  I feel
> as if he tugs on every obvious expectation and cliche (I refused to
> see Saving Private Ryan because I couldn't stand one more army flick
> with the squadron of stereotypes--the hick who's ignorant but boy can
> he shoot [all those years of huntin' squirrels 'n' 'possums]).  This
> kind of thing gets my sarcasm engine turned on, as you may have
> noticed.  Now, art is about skillful manipulation, but there are
> artists who make me say "Aha!" and artists who make me say "I'm being
> manipulated."  The great ones are the former; Spielberg is
> consistently the latter.  I also prefer directors who use their powers
> of manipulation toward some lofty purpose, which brings me to . . .
>
> -He has used his considerable talent to make one shallow blockbuster
> after another.  Shallow blockbusters are okay--I rent mostly comedies,
> myself, purely for entertainment and not to change my life--but what
> so irritates me about Spielberg is that he wants recognition as some
> kind of auteur despite basically being a turner-out of entertaining
> bits of fluff.  Case in point:  when he won Best Director for
> Schindler's List (his first directing Oscar), he said something along
> the lines of "at last"; there had been a lot of handwringing about how
> he kept getting passed over.  The only serious film he had made up to
> that point, IMHO, was The Color Purple (never saw it, though I'd like
> to, so I won't venture a judgment; I never saw Schindler's List in
> its entirety, either--the power went out at the movie theater 40
> minutes in, though I did like those 40 minutes).  You would have
> thought that he'd been making masterpieces all these years and been
> ignored.  I liked Jaws, I liked Close Encounters, I even liked E.T.,
> but none of them are the kinds of movies I would vote for for Best
> Picture.  (Neither are most of the movies that have won it,
> historically.)  I ask for more than entertainment from a Best
> Director.
>
> -He makes movies for children that are extremely violent.  I loved
> Raiders of the Lost Ark when I was a kid--I think I saw it 5 times the
> week it came out--but now I look at it and realize how many people our
> hero kills along the way.  Dirty Harry, move over.  It really bothers
> me that this stuff is sold as wholesome entertainment.  The
> writer Barbara Kingsolver tells a story about this that is very
> revealing:  a friend of hers told her, "You'll like it, it isn't
> violent at all," and like me, BK watched and counted up the bodies.
> That's the worst thing about that kind of movie--the mayhem is
> presented in such a flip, cartoonish way that we don't even realize
> how much of it there is.
>
> -Rumor had it that he said he'd direct HP only if Haley Joel Osment
> played Harry.  A big raspberry to SS for trying to stack his influence
> against JKR's (anyone know an emoticon for a raspberry?).  No offense
> to HJO, who may be a very talented actor, but he is not British and
> that settles it.  It should have settled it for Spielberg, or at least
> he should have said, "Well, I differ with the author on the necessity
> for a British cast, so I will have to gracefully decline the
> possibility of directing."  As I said, the information that he was
> throwing his weight around is rumor, so do take it with a grain of
> salt.
>
> Ah well, de gustibus non titillandum.
>
> Back to Columbus:  I was heartened by the quote in USA Today where he
> said he wanted to express his darker, less sentimental side in HP.  We
> can only hope so.
>
> Amy Z
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>




From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Fri Jun 29 17:06:08 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 17:06:08 -0000
Subject: Britcoms (Was: Hooray! Celine Dion rumour false!
In-Reply-To: <9hi7o1+pghk@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hici0+sdv4@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., dfrankis at d... wrote:
> I'd forgotten the Vicar of Dibley (Amy's role model?), which I 
really 
> like.  I haven't seen Waiting for God or As Time Goes By. The rest 
> are old. Of course, so is TNG now.  Patrick Stewart for Mad-Eye 
> Moody - the voice is everything.
> 
> What I particularly liked about Ally was the interplay between the 
> courtroom and the personal issues, mixed with the humour.  Series 3 
> (I think it was 3 - Billy dies) was less good because there were 
> fewer courtroom scenes.
> 
> Are they really called Britcoms in the US?
> 
> David, still laughing about 'I can't believe it's not butter'
> 

Yes, they are called "Britcoms" here in the US. It's a word play on 
"sitcoms" (situation comedies). Mostly they are shown on PBS stations 
(Public Broadcasting System) and are quite popular. PBS is funded 
through individual donations and they frequently have fundraising 
'pledge drives'. My local PBS stations have recently begun showing 
Britcom marathons during these pledge drives.

I like the "Vicar of Dibley" too. I always get a good laugh from the 
programs, especially Jim's "Full Monty" performance, Alice and Hugo's 
wedding when a woman dramatically announces she is married to the 
groom, realizes her mistake and says "Sorry, wrong church. Carry on." 
And I still can't believe that people believe that 'I can't believe 
it's not butter' is not butter.<g>. I also like "Chef". But those 
programs wouldn't make it on the typical American network schedule 
because the quality of the humor isn't what those fancy product 
research groups say Americans like. 

Milz





From jkusalavagemd at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 29 18:10:35 2001
From: jkusalavagemd at yahoo.com (Haggridd)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 18:10:35 -0000
Subject: anti-Spielberg and a bit on Columbus
In-Reply-To: <0ca801c100b8$9edab3c0$0938acce@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <9higas+aksk@eGroups.com>

-- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner" 
<bohners at p...> wrote:
> Amy --
> 
> I am totally with you when it comes to Spielberg's blockbusters.  I 
have
> given most of them a deliberate miss, and the ones that I haven't 
skipped
> have been prone to every one of the faults you describe.  Which is 
not to
> say I didn't enjoy some of them in spite of that (I have a strange 
fondness
> for HOOK and YOUNG SHERLOCK HOLMES in particular), but I don't like 
it when
> directors try to manipulate my emotions so shamelessly, either.  It 
just
> makes me dig in my heels and determine not to let them succeed.
> 
> Spielberg, however, is a director with a split personality.  
Three-quarters
> of the films he makes are sentimental, overblown eye-candy.  But 
every now
> and then he turns around and delivers a film of exquisite skill and 
real
> emotional and philosophical power, completely free of the excesses,
> gimmicks, and conspicuous displays of special effects that you 
despise.  I
> can only say that you NEED to see those films before you can decide 
what you
> really think of Spielberg.
> 
> I would personally recommend EMPIRE OF THE SUN to start.  I had no 
idea
> Spielberg was capable of anything great until I saw that film.  
After three
> wrenching hours of exquisite cinema, my jaw was on the floor.  I 
literally
> could not believe it was the same Steven Spielberg directing it.  I 
felt the
> same way about SCHINDLER'S LIST, which I truly believe is the 
greatest movie
> ever made (and I fervently hope I never have to watch it again).  
That film
> has to be seen in the cinema for proper effect:  in fact I was 
appalled at
> the thought of it going to video, because I couldn't help thinking 
it would
> lose a great deal of its impact.  But since it is now very unlikely 
that you
> can see it in such a venue, I guess the video will have to do.  (I 
saw
> EMPIRE on video and it didn't keep me from appreciating it, although 
I now
> wish I'd seen it on the screen.)
> 
> Both those films left me emotionally wrung-out for a week, but not 
because
> they employed any of Spielberg's usual maudlin tricks.  Indeed, in 
EMPIRE
> one might even say Spielberg turned his own reputation for wide-eyed 
star
> gazing shots on its head, because pretty much any time anybody looks 
up into
> the sky in that film, seriously awful things happen.  And Christian 
Bale is
> incredible as the young protagonist.  (The film also contains what I
> consider to be the perfect role for John Malkovich, and certainly 
the best
> acting I've ever seen from him yet; although I don't actually like 
John
> Malkovich, so I may be a bit biased on that point.)
> 
> John Williams, too, has a split personality to go with Spielberg's. 
 Most of
> his music (the famous stuff, anyway) seems to be built around the 
same
> musical theme, with a few not-very-interesting variations.  I was 
quite
> convinced the man was a hack with an undeserved reputation, until I 
heard
> his score for SCHINDLER'S LIST and was completely blown away.  It 
did not
> sound like anything I would ever have recognized as Williams music 
at all.
> It was beautiful and wrenching and utterly appropriate for the film. 
 I own
> the soundtrack and listen to it on a regular basis, and when I 
listen to it,
> not once do I find myself thinking, "Oh, yeah, that guy who did the 
music
> for STAR WARS (or SUPERMAN, or any of those others with annoyingly 
similar
> themes)."
> 
> So I'm willing to give Williams a chance to outdo himself on HP, 
although
> admittedly it's not likely that he'll pull out all the stops on a
> fantastical kiddie film -- he'll probably just go back to his old 
habits.
> But at least I know he can do more -- much, much more -- than I'd 
ever
> anticipated.
> --
> Rebecca J. Bohner
> rebeccaj at p...
> http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...>
> To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at y...>
> Sent: Friday, June 29, 2001 11:31 AM
> Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] anti-Spielberg and a bit on Columbus
> 
> 
> > I having confessed that boggarts turn into Steven Spielberg when 
they
> > see me coming, ***Draco~Malfoy~Lover*** wrote on the main list:
> >
> > >Why Steven Spielberg? He's a great director! He'd probably do a
> > >better job on this film than Chritopher Comlumbus :::mutters 
darkly
> > >about the choice of director:::.
> >
> > None of the following should be read as an endorsement of Chris 
"Home
> > Alone 2" Columbus, nor, for that matter, a statement that I would
> > prefer him to Spielberg as the director of HP.  CC is on serious
> > probation as far as I'm concerned.
> >
> > Five reasons I don't like Steven Spielberg:
> >
> > -His chief technique for getting the audience to feel surprise,
> > wonder, etc., is to show character upon character gazing in 
surprise,
> > wonder, etc., usually skyward.  This is a fine cinematic approach 
used
> > in moderation, but it wears thin long before SS is done with it, 
IMO.
> >  I caught onto it back at E.T., and it's driven me nuts ever 
since.
> > (I should've caught on earlier.  Shots of people gazing at things 
take
> > up 40% of Close Encounters.)
> >
> > -Corollary to above:  he's a basically manipulative filmmaker.  I 
feel
> > as if he tugs on every obvious expectation and cliche (I refused 
to
> > see Saving Private Ryan because I couldn't stand one more army 
flick
> > with the squadron of stereotypes--the hick who's ignorant but boy 
can
> > he shoot [all those years of huntin' squirrels 'n' 'possums]).  
This
> > kind of thing gets my sarcasm engine turned on, as you may have
> > noticed.  Now, art is about skillful manipulation, but there are
> > artists who make me say "Aha!" and artists who make me say "I'm 
being
> > manipulated."  The great ones are the former; Spielberg is
> > consistently the latter.  I also prefer directors who use their 
powers
> > of manipulation toward some lofty purpose, which brings me to . . 
.
> >
> > -He has used his considerable talent to make one shallow 
blockbuster
> > after another.  Shallow blockbusters are okay--I rent mostly 
comedies,
> > myself, purely for entertainment and not to change my life--but 
what
> > so irritates me about Spielberg is that he wants recognition as 
some
> > kind of auteur despite basically being a turner-out of 
entertaining
> > bits of fluff.  Case in point:  when he won Best Director for
> > Schindler's List (his first directing Oscar), he said something 
along
> > the lines of "at last"; there had been a lot of handwringing about 
how
> > he kept getting passed over.  The only serious film he had made up 
to
> > that point, IMHO, was The Color Purple (never saw it, though I'd 
like
> > to, so I won't venture a judgment; I never saw Schindler's List in
> > its entirety, either--the power went out at the movie theater 40
> > minutes in, though I did like those 40 minutes).  You would have
> > thought that he'd been making masterpieces all these years and 
been
> > ignored.  I liked Jaws, I liked Close Encounters, I even liked 
E.T.,
> > but none of them are the kinds of movies I would vote for for Best
> > Picture.  (Neither are most of the movies that have won it,
> > historically.)  I ask for more than entertainment from a Best
> > Director.
> >
> > -He makes movies for children that are extremely violent.  I loved
> > Raiders of the Lost Ark when I was a kid--I think I saw it 5 times 
the
> > week it came out--but now I look at it and realize how many people 
our
> > hero kills along the way.  Dirty Harry, move over.  It really 
bothers
> > me that this stuff is sold as wholesome entertainment.  The
> > writer Barbara Kingsolver tells a story about this that is very
> > revealing:  a friend of hers told her, "You'll like it, it isn't
> > violent at all," and like me, BK watched and counted up the 
bodies.
> > That's the worst thing about that kind of movie--the mayhem is
> > presented in such a flip, cartoonish way that we don't even 
realize
> > how much of it there is.
> >
> > -Rumor had it that he said he'd direct HP only if Haley Joel 
Osment
> > played Harry.  A big raspberry to SS for trying to stack his 
influence
> > against JKR's (anyone know an emoticon for a raspberry?).  No 
offense
> > to HJO, who may be a very talented actor, but he is not British 
and
> > that settles it.  It should have settled it for Spielberg, or at 
least
> > he should have said, "Well, I differ with the author on the 
necessity
> > for a British cast, so I will have to gracefully decline the
> > possibility of directing."  As I said, the information that he was
> > throwing his weight around is rumor, so do take it with a grain of
> > salt.
> >
> > Ah well, de gustibus non titillandum.
> >
> > Back to Columbus:  I was heartened by the quote in USA Today where 
he
> > said he wanted to express his darker, less sentimental side in HP. 
 We
> > can only hope so.
> >
> > Amy Z
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at y...
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
I think Rebecca is spot on in her analysis of Spielberg.  I too was 
mesmerized by Schindler's List from the first strains of the tango at 
the night club.  How he directed Liam Neeson was masterful.  I agree 
that the cinematography was so pure that is should always be seen on 
the big screen.  She is quite correct in noting the dichotomy betwee 
Spieberg the director of S.L., and Spielberg the director of E.T., et 
al.  If the wrong Spielberg were to show up as the Director of SS/PS, 
we would all suffer.

Haggridd 




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 29 18:20:43 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 18:20:43 -0000
Subject: Killing Claudius (was Killing Sirius)
Message-ID: <9higtr+pg71@eGroups.com>

On the main list, Catlady Rita wrote:

>It must be very convoluted to attribute Hamlet's staying his hand 
from
>killing Claudius to Conscience, as Hamlet's motive was not a 
queasiness
>about taking a human life, but rather was a desire to damn Claudius's
>soul as well as kill his body.

The line "thus conscience doth make cowards of us all" is from an 
earlier scene (Act III, Scene i) and refers not to murder but to 
suicide--the soliloquy is "To be or not to be."  Also, in 
Shakespeare's English "conscience" also meant "reflection, 
introspection," although I think the play on the more familiar meaning 
of "conscience" is intentional.

BTW, I do think Hamlet's conscience plays a role in his reluctance to 
kill Claudius, even though he claims in III, iii that it's revenge, 
not mercy, that keeps him from killing him as he prays.  

Amy Z




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 29 18:26:51 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 18:26:51 -0000
Subject: Spielberg's good twin
In-Reply-To: <0ca801c100b8$9edab3c0$0938acce@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <9hih9b+2e29@eGroups.com>

Rebecca wrote:

> But 
every now
> and then he turns around and delivers a film of exquisite skill and 
real
> emotional and philosophical power, completely free of the excesses,
> gimmicks, and conspicuous displays of special effects that you 
despise.  I
> can only say that you NEED to see those films before you can decide 
what you
> really think of Spielberg.
> 
> I would personally recommend EMPIRE OF THE SUN to start.  

Thanks for the rec.  This is obviously a movie I'm going to have to 
see, especially if Christian Bale is cast in PoA!  

And Schindler's List is on my long list of Movies I Really Have to 
See, even with my peeves with Spielberg.  And with Williams.  I saw 
enough of Schindler to catch the haunting opening theme, which I 
recognized as "Gloomy Sunday" (which Billie Holiday made famous)--is 
it from some classical work, I wonder?

Amy Z




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Fri Jun 29 18:37:45 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 18:37:45 -0000
Subject: Chaplain vacancy
Message-ID: <9hihtp+omks@eGroups.com>

Edis wrote on the main list:

The new Bishop of London (Richard Chartres) gave an interview 
(published in 'the Guardian'  23 Decembere 2000) in which its 
reported he said:

>>> I'd happily supply a chaplain to Hogwarts for next term." <<<

::discards dignity, leaps into air with hand raised::  Me! Me!

D'you suppose he'd appoint a non-Catholic?  Pardon my ignorance; I 
don't know whether the Bishop in question is C of E or RC.  Either way 
I'd have some liturgical brushing-up to do.

Rev. Amy "Willing to sell her theology down river if it'll get her to 
Hogwarts" Z




From jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk  Fri Jun 29 19:04:49 2001
From: jaffa276 at yahoo.co.uk (Benjamin)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 19:04:49 -0000
Subject: an embarrassing mistake
In-Reply-To: <9hi3ji+il7u@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hijgh+pdft@eGroups.com>

 
> > > --Amanad NO Adnama whoops Amadna damn Amanda there!
> 
> I keep typing riat and wisnton and an attempt to correct a magazine 
> subscription that thought my name was Winton only turned it into 
> Wintson. It's remarkable how my name came out typed correctly for 
once 
> when I tried to type my usual typoes, above.
> 

Believe it or not, this was actually part of a plotline in a book by 
a well-respected author.  Well perhaps more characterisation than 
plot, but it just shows that these things can lead to inspired 
stuff.  It even has a perfectly added hint of slash too.

-Ben.  






From meboriqua at aol.com  Fri Jun 29 19:53:18 2001
From: meboriqua at aol.com (meboriqua at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 19:53:18 -0000
Subject: Spielberg's good twin
In-Reply-To: <9hih9b+2e29@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9himbe+b5nf@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
 
> And Schindler's List is on my long list of Movies I Really Have to 
> See, even with my peeves with Spielberg.  And with Williams.  I saw 
> enough of Schindler to catch the haunting opening theme, which I 
> recognized as "Gloomy Sunday" (which Billie Holiday made famous)--is 
> it from some classical work, I wonder?>

Okay, this is really the last thing I write before Sunday when I log 
on after my sister's wedding.  I can't stay quiet when Spielberg is 
the subject.

"Schindler's List" changed my life.  When I say it changed my life I 
really mean it.  I went into that movie one person and came out a bit 
different.  As a Jew, the movie really hit home for me.  I cried not 
only throughout the entire film, but for the rest of the night after 
and when I woke up the next morning, too.  Because of that film, I 
began to volunteer at The Simon Wiesenthal Center and realized that I 
wanted to be a teacher.  I don't know that I would have become a 
teacher (which is one of the best things I decided to pursue) if I 
didn't sit down to watch that movie.  

I had nightmares for well over a year after seeing the movie (usually 
where I was with my sister and we were trying to escape from 
Auschwitz), but I read up on everything Holocaust related anyway.  I 
have met real Schindler's Jews as well as many other survivors of the 
Holocaust.  Meeting someone in person with a number tattoo on her arm 
is a chilling thing indeed, and humbled me quite a bit.  I've had a 
survivor come to my school to speak to my students, something they 
really enjoyed.

I was only able to sit through the movie a second time when it was on 
channel 13 for Holocaust Remembrance Day and my boyfriend wanted to 
watch it as he had never seen it before.  It was not easy to see it 
again, but I did, and even convinced one of my colleagues (who is a 
Black Nationalist and has been known to say not such nice things about 
Jews) to watch it, too.  He was very much affected by it and we talked 
quite a bit about it.

Aside from that, I love everything about Indiana Jones and after 
seeing the first Jurassic Park was actually a bit worried that 
dinosaurs would be waiting for me outside the theater in midtown 
Manhattan.  "The Color Purple" is also a beautifully made film and one 
of my favorites.

I don't go to the movies much and am generally very critical, but I 
cannot criticize Steven Spielberg because he changed my life.  I have 
daydreams of meeting him so I can tell him just that.

--jenny from ravenclaw********************




From jkusalavagemd at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 29 20:09:02 2001
From: jkusalavagemd at yahoo.com (Haggridd)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 20:09:02 -0000
Subject: Chaplain vacancy
In-Reply-To: <9hihtp+omks@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hin8u+8pn8@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Amy Z" <aiz24 at h...> wrote:
> Edis wrote on the main list:
> 
> The new Bishop of London (Richard Chartres) gave an interview 
> (published in 'the Guardian'  23 Decembere 2000) in which its 
> reported he said:
> 
> >>> I'd happily supply a chaplain to Hogwarts for next term." <<<
> 
> ::discards dignity, leaps into air with hand raised::  Me! Me!
> 
> D'you suppose he'd appoint a non-Catholic?  Pardon my ignorance; I 
> don't know whether the Bishop in question is C of E or RC.  Either 
way 
> I'd have some liturgical brushing-up to do.
> 
> Rev. Amy "Willing to sell her theology down river if it'll get her 
to 
> Hogwarts" Z

Rev. Amy, dontcha know that the Hogwarts Chaplain job is only for 
W.R.C.?  Wizarding Reformed Church

Haggridd




From rainy_lilac at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 29 20:34:16 2001
From: rainy_lilac at yahoo.com (rainy_lilac at yahoo.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 20:34:16 -0000
Subject: Jeff Hordley as Sirius??? Noooooooo!!!!
In-Reply-To: <006601c0ff91$219c3500$603370c2@c5s910j>
Message-ID: <9hioo8+bgg2@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Neil Ward" <neilward at d...> wrote:
> One (fairly firm) casting rumour I'm not so keen on is Jeff Hordley 
(sp?)
> for Sirius Black.  He plays Cain Dingle in the laughable British 
soap,
> Emmerdale, and his weasly face doesn't fit my image of Sirius at 
all.  He is
> very irritating and not nearly rugged enough for the part.

I have looked at the photos of him on the net and all I can say is... 
bleh!! He just looks like a cheesy guy with longish hair. No sex 
appeal at all....

Sigh... Why not Gabriel Byrne???

--Suzanne




From catlady at wicca.net  Fri Jun 29 21:47:04 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 21:47:04 -0000
Subject: letter transpositions (was: an embarrassing mistake
In-Reply-To: <9hijgh+pdft@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hit0o+e2t8@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Benjamin" <jaffa276 at y...> wrote:
>  
> Believe it or not, this was actually part of a plotline in a book by 
> a well-respected author.

I looked at a book of Dianne Wynne Jones (right name? Chrestomancy?) 
short stories and one was about a science fiction author who draws 
inspiration from her typoes, so that trying to type the word 'and' 
gave her a character Dan, a spaceport Nad, and a technology ADN. 




From pbnesbit at msn.com  Fri Jun 29 22:59:40 2001
From: pbnesbit at msn.com (Parker Brown Nesbit)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 18:59:40 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Jeff Hordley as Sirius??? Noooooooo!!!!
Message-ID: <F13UQ9cAgjHXwKHvyo30000477c@hotmail.com>




>From: rainy_lilac at yahoo.com
>Reply-To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Jeff Hordley as Sirius??? Noooooooo!!!!
>Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 20:34:16 -0000
>

Gabriel Byrne as Sirius?  YES!!  Someone who agrees with me!

Peace & Plenty,

Parker

Keeper of Remus Lupin's heart
Keeper of Sirius Black's body
Keeper of Severus Snape's soul

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From s_ings at yahoo.com  Fri Jun 29 23:37:43 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 16:37:43 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Trailer on 'Extra'
In-Reply-To: <F13UQ9cAgjHXwKHvyo30000477c@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <20010629233743.66851.qmail@web14604.mail.yahoo.com>

Hello all,

I just got a view of the trailer on the TV show
'Extra'(and thank goodness, as dear hubby has taken
the only computer fit to view it on with him for the
summer!). It was on the Life Network, and will be
replaying at 9 pm (EST). Now, keep in mind I'm in
Canada, so I don't know if this applies to those in
the US. Nyssa and I parked ourselves in front of the
TV, with VCR remote in hand and a tape in said
machine. Now we can watch it multiple times.

Sheryll, who's completely insane as the festival she
works on starts in 7 days!

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Sat Jun 30 00:23:50 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 00:23:50 -0000
Subject: Which Character Are You Most Like? 
Message-ID: <9hj66m+qgmd@eGroups.com>

Hi everyone,

 I stumbled across this site that shows which character you're most 
like. It lists the results #1-#18 I think it was with 1 being who 
you're most like and 18 being who you're least like.(Some of you may 
have already found it) Here's my top 5

1) Remus Lupin - (on the 1st try mind you honest)
2) Hagrid
3) Harry Potter
4) Sirius Black
5) Albus Dumbledore
 
I did try it again changing my answers a bit and came up with:

1) Harry, 2)Remus, 3)Hagrid, 4) Sirius, & 5) Snape.

Thought everyone might want to have fun with this so here's the link 
and enjoy.

http://www.selectsmart.com/FREE/select.php3?client=hpcharacter

Cheers,

    Kristin

p.s. Who was I least like I could only remember the last 3

18) Percy, 17) Hermione and 16) Draco.




From reanna20 at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 01:47:15 2001
From: reanna20 at yahoo.com (Amber)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 18:47:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Which Character Are You Most Like? 
In-Reply-To: <9hj66m+qgmd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010630014715.94000.qmail@web14505.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Kristin <Alyeskakc at aol.com> wrote:
> Thought everyone might want to have fun with this so here's the link 
> and enjoy.
> 
> http://www.selectsmart.com/FREE/select.php3?client=hpcharacter

Wheee! Thanks for the link, Kristin! My top five were:

Hermione Granger 
Gilderoy Lockhart 
Charlie Weasley 
Ginny Weasley 
Bill Weasley 

<dances> Yes, I'm like Hermione! I knew it! Not that the test is a
definitive version or anything, but I still grinned like an idiot when
I saw Hermione at the top of the list. Although, I'm not very pleased
to see Gilderoy as second. I didn't know I was a lying, vain, coward.
And I'd rather replace Charlie and Bill with Percy and Ron (who were my
sixth and seventh). My last three on the list were Voldemort, Harry,
and Sirius. At least I know I'm not destined to become a Dark Lord
(darn!) or a wrongly-accused escaped convict. 

I wonder how much the question "Do you wear glasses" figured into
having Harry high on the list?

~Amber 
(Who most certainly doesn't have pictures of herself on her apartment's
walls but does have too many books and lugs them around with her...)


=====
http://www.the-tabula-rasa.com
Just another crappy homepage...updated 6/21/2001

"It never happened if there is no memory of it. Human memory is just a record. You can rewrite the record."
- Serial Experiments Lain

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From s_ings at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 03:24:25 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 20:24:25 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] watching the movie en masse
In-Reply-To: <9hgm0n+p09p@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010630032425.79253.qmail@web14605.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Amy Z <aiz24 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> If we all went together, we could have at least one
> silent viewing 
> (yes, laughter permitted, but no remarks, shouts of
> "that isn't how it 
> happens!" or poking others in the shoulder
> triumphantly) and then have 
> a second viewing with no holds barred.
> 
> Amy Z
> idly dreaming here in the middle of nowhere, where
> I'm lucky to have a 
> movie theater at all, never mind companions to watch
> it with

Amy, you're not all that far from Ottawa, come up here
and see the movie with us. Jamieson, my daughter Nyssa
(17, old enough to watch quietly the first time
around!), myself, and perhaps fellow listee Patricia
(if she can't find other fans to see it with in
Montreal) are all planning a night at the movies. 

Sheryll, wishing there we enough people here for a
private viewing

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From s_ings at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 03:24:35 2001
From: s_ings at yahoo.com (Sheryll Townsend)
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 20:24:35 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] watching the movie en masse
In-Reply-To: <9hgm0n+p09p@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010630032435.5011.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com>


--- Amy Z <aiz24 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> If we all went together, we could have at least one
> silent viewing 
> (yes, laughter permitted, but no remarks, shouts of
> "that isn't how it 
> happens!" or poking others in the shoulder
> triumphantly) and then have 
> a second viewing with no holds barred.
> 
> Amy Z
> idly dreaming here in the middle of nowhere, where
> I'm lucky to have a 
> movie theater at all, never mind companions to watch
> it with

Amy, you're not all that far from Ottawa, come up here
and see the movie with us. Jamieson, my daughter Nyssa
(17, old enough to watch quietly the first time
around!), myself, and perhaps fellow listee Patricia
(if she can't find other fans to see it with in
Montreal) are all planning a night at the movies. 

Sheryll, wishing there were enough people here for a
private viewing

=====
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/



From jkusalavagemd at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 04:13:28 2001
From: jkusalavagemd at yahoo.com (Haggridd)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 04:13:28 -0000
Subject: Which Character Are You Most Like?
In-Reply-To: <9hj66m+qgmd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hjjl8+fn34@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Kristin" <Alyeskakc at a...> wrote:
> 
> Thought everyone might want to have fun with this so here's the link 
> and enjoy.
> 
> http://www.selectsmart.com/FREE/select.php3?client=hpcharacter
> 
> Cheers,

Thanks for the link, Kristin.  I've been showing it to all my friends. 
My top three characters turned out to be 1. Albus Dumbledore, 2. 
Hagrid (YAY!), and, 3. Charlie Weasley.  And my House is Gryffindor, 
according to the other quiz.  I am just delighted.

Haggridd




From dosser at btinternet.com  Sat Jun 30 09:19:59 2001
From: dosser at btinternet.com (Chris Dosset)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 10:19:59 +0100
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Which Character Are You Most Like? 
References: <9hj66m+qgmd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000001c10146$8777d300$ec31073e@chris>

Hi Guys

Thanks for the link Kristin.  I took the test and it came out thus:

      # 1 Albus Dumbledore 
      # 2 Harry Potter 
      # 3 Rubeus Hagrid 
      # 4 Bill Weasley 
      # 5 Fred/George Weasley 
      # 6 Charlie Weasley 
      # 7 Minerva McGonagall 
      # 8 Remus Lupin 
      # 9 Ron Weasley 
      # 10 Sirius Black 
      # 11 Draco Malfoy 
      # 12 Gilderoy Lockhart 
      # 13 Voldemort 
      # 14 Ginny Weasley 
      # 15 Hermione Granger 
      # 16 Neville Longbottom 
      # 17 Percy Weasley 
      # 18 Severus Snape 


  I did try a couple of other times, but is always comes out as Harry and  Dumbledore first and second in either order.  What do other people come out as?

  Cheers

  Chris

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Kristin 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2001 1:23 AM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Which Character Are You Most Like? 


  Hi everyone,

  I stumbled across this site that shows which character you're most 
  like. It lists the results #1-#18 I think it was with 1 being who 
  you're most like and 18 being who you're least like.(Some of you may 
  have already found it) Here's my top 5

  1) Remus Lupin - (on the 1st try mind you honest)
  2) Hagrid
  3) Harry Potter
  4) Sirius Black
  5) Albus Dumbledore

  I did try it again changing my answers a bit and came up with:

  1) Harry, 2)Remus, 3)Hagrid, 4) Sirius, & 5) Snape.

  Thought everyone might want to have fun with this so here's the link 
  and enjoy.

  http://www.selectsmart.com/FREE/select.php3?client=hpcharacter

  Cheers,

      Kristin

  p.s. Who was I least like I could only remember the last 3

  18) Percy, 17) Hermione and 16) Draco.


  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com



  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk  Sat Jun 30 09:52:41 2001
From: catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk (catherine at cator-manor.demon.co.uk)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 09:52:41 -0000
Subject: Saving Quicktime files for offline access.
In-Reply-To: <9hgn18+gjgi@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hk7h9+qmml@eGroups.com>

Al, thank you so much for posting this.  I spent an hour this morning 
downloading the trailer, and followed your instructions.  It worked.  
The difference in quality between this and Realplayer is incredible.

Thanks again,
Catherine



--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., hamster8 at h... wrote:
> This is in response to my last post, which was in response to 
> Paula's.  I've been fiddling about, and quite by chance, have 
> actually managed to do it.  So here's how to do it for PCs running 
MS 
> Internet Explorer.
> 
> You NEED to have a Quicktime Player on your PC already (that should 
> be obvious).   
> 
> Go to 'Tools' on the highest toolbar.  Go down to 'Internet 
> Options.'  Once there, click on 'Settings' in the 'Temporary 
Internet 
> Files' box (second one down, between 'Home Page' and 'History')  
With 
> me?  Good.  Now click on 'View Files.'  This page may take a minute 
> to load, depending on just how much content you have stored offline 
> (your PC makes a copy of *every* file you view, so if, like me, you 
> don't clean out this folder very often, there could well be 
hundreds 
> of files there) ... scroll down (deleting unwanted or morally 
dubious 
> files as you go *vbeg*) until you find the Quicktime movie file.  
It 
> is called trailer2_aolwb_lo[1].mov (depending on which version you 
> have, it could also be called _med or _hi ... but it *will* be 
> there).  Now go to 'edit' and 'copy' the file.  *Now* get rid of 
the 
> temporary files page and minimize your internet connection.  
Open 'My 
> Computer' on your desktop ... and go into 'Program Files' ... open 
> the Quicktime folder.  Go to the drop down toolbar at the top, and 
> select 'edit' again.  Now click on paste.  It *will* paste the 
movie 
> file into your Quicktime player.  As these files are so large (lo 
> quality is more than 10MB) you might want to go back to the 
temporary 
> internet files page and *delete* the stored version ... as it is 
> unlikely you'll be needing it again if you actually have a copy.  
Now 
> play it back, use freeze frame, make Harry and Ron run backwards to 
> your heart's content!  Yay!
> 
> Al
> *v pleased with himself*




From hamster8 at hotmail.com  Sat Jun 30 11:22:07 2001
From: hamster8 at hotmail.com (hamster8 at hotmail.com)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 11:22:07 -0000
Subject: Which Character Are You Most Like?
In-Reply-To: <9hj66m+qgmd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hkcov+9u2v@eGroups.com>

Now, this quiz was plugged here about 3-4 months ago, and I took it 
then.  But I *had* completely forgotten about it; so I thought it 
might be interesting to see how I come out this time ...

18 Voldemort
17 Bill Weasley
16 Professor McGonagall
15 Sirius Black
14 Hagrid
13 Remus Lupin
12 Charlie Weasley
11 Neville
10 Ginny
9  Fred n' George
8  Snape
7  Lockhart (whu?)
6  Percy Weasley
5  Draco (yesss!)
4  Dumbledore
3  Harry
2  Ron
1  Hermione

Hmm.  Now, perhaps if I change the answers round a bit :-)

Al
*v pleased with his top 5*




From aiz24 at hotmail.com  Sat Jun 30 11:56:35 2001
From: aiz24 at hotmail.com (Amy Z)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 11:56:35 -0000
Subject: Which Character Are You Most Like?
In-Reply-To: <9hjjl8+fn34@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hkepj+g93b@eGroups.com>

Haggridd wrote:

> My top three characters turned out to be 1. Albus Dumbledore, 2. 
> Hagrid (YAY!), and, 3. Charlie Weasley.  

Methinks you have a pet!

Mine are very consistent with the last time.

      # 1 Rubeus Hagrid
      # 2 Albus Dumbledore
      # 3 Remus Lupin
      # 4 Hermione Granger
      # 5 Ron Weasley

Harry fell out of my top five and Hermione moved up.  As this list 
might suggest, I'm still in Gryffindor, even though I continue to be 
unsure whether I would rush into a burning building to rescue a 
friend.  Apparently being an avid reader of nonfiction for pleasure is 
still not enough to make me a Ravenclaw.  Now if they'd asked whether 
I like to read the dictionary, that might have made the difference.

Amy Z
who really does

P.S.  Those who have done this before, didja notice they've added 
Lockhart and Ginny?  Lockhart ranks uncomfortably high for me--#9.  
Shudder.




From lyorkus at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 12:45:41 2001
From: lyorkus at yahoo.com (lyorkus at yahoo.com)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 12:45:41 -0000
Subject: Jeff Hordley as Sirius??? Noooooooo!!!!
In-Reply-To: <F13UQ9cAgjHXwKHvyo30000477c@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <9hkhll+4kbc@eGroups.com>

Have no idea who Jeff Hordley is, but Gabriel Byrne would be dead 
sexy as Sirius!  Patrick Stewart as Moody though...I'd be so sad to 
have his appearance ruined so he could look right!  I think I read 
something on the list a long while back where someone said 
Christopher Lloyd for Moody and ever since then I've thought YES YES 
YES!  Christopher Lloyd!

Also agree about Empire of the Sun.  Amazing, amazing movie.  But it 
wouldn't mean that Spielberg could do HP...just not a good match.  
And I hope Columbus doesn't bollix it up.  For my money, when they 
start making subsequent HP movies (esp. PoA and GoF) I hope they get 
someone to direct like Tim Burton, who would probably add a certain 
dark quality that starts to creep in there.  Columbus could probably 
handle CoS if he is still interested; what with Lockhart and all it's 
very fluffy most of the way through, and Dobby and all.  Doesn't 
really start to get dark until very close to the end, when multiple 
people are in the hospital wing petrified and then Ginny goes 
missing...but I digress.

I agree with someone who said they should have gotten an older kid to 
play Ron so that he'd be tall enough.  And will Dean be tall?  I 
mean, in the book, when they're sorted, it says that Dean is even 
taller than Ron, which implies that he's pretty darn big for an 
eleven year old.  Anyway, since it takes some time to make movies 
(and in some cases for JKR to write her books!) they will probably be 
making casting changes for the kids over the course of the movie, 
with the possible exception of Harry.  They might want to maintain 
consistency there.  So maybe we'll get a better looking Ron and 
Hermione in the future.

--Laurin






From bohners at pobox.com  Sat Jun 30 12:58:45 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 08:58:45 -0400
Subject: Sirius Casting
References: <F13UQ9cAgjHXwKHvyo30000477c@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <0ede01c10164$88163a40$0938acce@rebeccab>

Gabriel Byrne is lovely, but alas, too old for Sirius.  And unlike Alan
Rickman, you can't easily make him look younger (they *did* smooth out AR's
wrinkles a bit, have you noticed?).  His face has too many deep-carved lines
of character -- I think they're delightful, but there's no way you could
mistake Byrne for a guy in his thirties.  Or so it seems to me, anyway.

I've thought of Daniel Day-Lewis, but he's perhaps a little too old by now
as well.  I haven't seen him in anything since LAST OF THE MOHICANS, but he
is incredibly versatile and also incredibly good-looking, which seems to
suit well with my idea of Sirius.  And if you want to know what he looks
like as a jailbird with scraggly hair, there's always IN THE NAME OF THE
FATHER...

But you know, I wouldn't mind seeing a complete unknown (or near-unknown) as
Sirius.  When I watched the recent DUNE miniseries a couple of weeks back,
the fellow playing Duncan Idaho struck me as being a near-perfect Sirius.  I
mentioned this to my husband (who has let me read him all the HP books,
bless him), and he said immediately, "Yeah, I can see that."

The actor's name is James Watson and you can see a picture of him (as Idaho,
but looking very Sirius) at
http://www.sf-fan.de/sf-film/dune/neu/ornithopter_2.jpg .  And oh, he has
the loveliest soft Scottish accent.

Yep, after a second look at this picture I think I'm gonna stick with this
one.  James Watson for Sirius in 2003!  Or 2004!  Or whatever!
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj






From joy0823 at earthlink.net  Sat Jun 30 13:43:27 2001
From: joy0823 at earthlink.net (- Joy -)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 09:43:27 -0400
Subject: DC Movie Gathering?
References: <20010630032425.79253.qmail@web14605.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <002b01c1016a$a4adcfa0$a2d30941@mtgmry1.md.home.com>

Joywitch mentioned something a few days ago on the main list about meeting
at the Uptown Theatre (in DC) for the movie premiere (hmm, I hope she's on
this list, too).  This sounds like a great idea to me!  Is there anyone else
in the area that would be interested?  I'd really like to see if we could
make this idea work.

~Joy~

http://www.geocities.com/joy0823
Last Movie Seen: "Pay it Forward"
Now Reading: "The Summerhouse" by Jude Deveraux




From mystril at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 13:58:37 2001
From: mystril at yahoo.com (mystril at yahoo.com)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 13:58:37 -0000
Subject: AI and the big-screen trailer...
Message-ID: <9hklud+a0qf@eGroups.com>

I went to see AI last night and they showed the trailer for Harry 
Potter. Yay! I wish I could see it that way all the time. 
Interestingly enough, a couple of people left the theatre right after 
seeing the trailer. I was hoping for more hoots and hollers, but there 
weren't.

I think Spielberg could have done a good job on HP, if he had been 
willing to stick to the book. I like the way he does special effects 
because they don't overwhelm the plot, i.e. fewer "hey look, isn't 
this special effect nifty?" shots than most people. Yeah, he still 
does them, especially in Jurassic Park, but as compared it to a few of 
the other special effects movie people, he's almost subtle.

I'd have to third, fourth, or fifth the recommendation for Empire of 
the Sun. It's one of those films that I'll always stop to watch when 
it's on television. And I still mentally see Christian Bale as Jim, 
even though he's all grown up now.  

Btw, someone mentioned Young Sherlock Holmes as being associated with 
Steven Spielberg -- it was actually directed by Barry Levinson and 
written by Chris Columbus. Young Sherlock Holmes was what gave me 
faith that Columbus had the ability to do justice to Harry. 

Oh, and AI, is a Stanley Kubrick movie wrapped up in a Spielberg 
package. My mother yelled at me afterwards for taking her to see it. 
But Jude Law was very good, Haley Joel Osment wasn't bad and Teddy was 
wonderful. 

~mystril





From absinthe at mad.scientist.com  Sat Jun 30 14:32:48 2001
From: absinthe at mad.scientist.com (Milz)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 14:32:48 -0000
Subject: AI and the big-screen trailer...
In-Reply-To: <9hklud+a0qf@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <9hknug+e2pp@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., mystril at y... wrote:

> Oh, and AI, is a Stanley Kubrick movie wrapped up in a Spielberg 
> package. My mother yelled at me afterwards for taking her to see it. 
> But Jude Law was very good, Haley Joel Osment wasn't bad and Teddy 
was 
> wonderful. 

I'm reading mixed reviews on "AI". One local tv news movie critic gave 
it a 1 star out a possible 5 stars...something about being 
disappionted with the ending. <shrugs>

Milz




From ender_w at msn.com  Sat Jun 30 16:50:32 2001
From: ender_w at msn.com (ender_w)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 12:50:32 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] DC Movie Gathering?
References: <20010630032425.79253.qmail@web14605.mail.yahoo.com> <002b01c1016a$a4adcfa0$a2d30941@mtgmry1.md.home.com>
Message-ID: <000b01c10184$c81f7460$4b0a1b3f@satellite>

Where exactly is the theatre?  is it in downtown DC?

ender
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: - Joy - 
  To: HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2001 9:43 AM
  Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] DC Movie Gathering?


  Joywitch mentioned something a few days ago on the main list about meeting
  at the Uptown Theatre (in DC) for the movie premiere (hmm, I hope she's on
  this list, too).  This sounds like a great idea to me!  Is there anyone else
  in the area that would be interested?  I'd really like to see if we could
  make this idea work.

  ~Joy~

  http://www.geocities.com/joy0823
  Last Movie Seen: "Pay it Forward"
  Now Reading: "The Summerhouse" by Jude Deveraux


  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com



  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. 



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From saitaina at wizzards.net  Sat Jun 30 17:18:56 2001
From: saitaina at wizzards.net (Saitaina)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 10:18:56 -0700
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Which Character Are You Most Like?
References: <9hkepj+g93b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <014b01c10188$bf90c340$314e28d1@oemcomputer>

Now I've tried this five times and the awnsers aren't changing so I guess
they are really what I'm most like.  (Any body else see problems with the
drastic diffrances between two of the characters compaired to te other
characters?)

# 1 Ron Weasley
# 2 Voldemort
# 3 Sirius Black
# 4 Draco Malfoy
# 5 Harry Potter



----- Original Message -----
From: Amy Z <aiz24 at hotmail.com>
To: <HPFGU-OTChatter at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2001 4:56 AM
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Which Character Are You Most Like?


> Haggridd wrote:
>
> > My top three characters turned out to be 1. Albus Dumbledore, 2.
> > Hagrid (YAY!), and, 3. Charlie Weasley.
>
> Methinks you have a pet!
>
> Mine are very consistent with the last time.
>
>       # 1 Rubeus Hagrid
>       # 2 Albus Dumbledore
>       # 3 Remus Lupin
>       # 4 Hermione Granger
>       # 5 Ron Weasley
>
> Harry fell out of my top five and Hermione moved up.  As this list
> might suggest, I'm still in Gryffindor, even though I continue to be
> unsure whether I would rush into a burning building to rescue a
> friend.  Apparently being an avid reader of nonfiction for pleasure is
> still not enough to make me a Ravenclaw.  Now if they'd asked whether
> I like to read the dictionary, that might have made the difference.
>
> Amy Z
> who really does
>
> P.S.  Those who have done this before, didja notice they've added
> Lockhart and Ginny?  Lockhart ranks uncomfortably high for me--#9.
> Shudder.
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> HPFGU-OTChatter-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 18:00:28 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 11:00:28 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Which Character Are You Most Like?
In-Reply-To: <9hkcov+9u2v@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010630180028.29188.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>


What amazes me with these lists is how diverse the answers people get are.  I mean in my top 5 I have Ron and Lockhart...How different can these 2 characters be?  HOw can I have Hermione at the top of my list (which she was) and McGonagall at #16...it really doesn't make sense.  And possibly the worst thing I could have recieved on these lists is Harry (15) after Voldemort (14)...I think I am going to throw up now..and again how can I have characters very similar to eachother such as Hermione and Percy (really they are) on the opposite extremes..hermione (#1) and Percy (#18)

Melanie 



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From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 18:10:40 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 11:10:40 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Where is everyone from?
In-Reply-To: <002b01c1016a$a4adcfa0$a2d30941@mtgmry1.md.home.com>
Message-ID: <20010630181040.72285.qmail@web10906.mail.yahoo.com>


I think we should all come up with areas that we live in...maybe the people in the areas can gather to see the movie together.....hmmm....like for instance if anyone else will be in North WEst Ohio during the time of the premiere could meet up at a near by theatre.

 

Melanie, who is still assuming that she will see it at the premiere and not on the 21st for her 21st birthday LOL.....although, maybe go see it again..

 



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From gypsycaine at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 18:41:43 2001
From: gypsycaine at yahoo.com (Denise R.)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 14:41:43 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Dang it!
References: <993918400.1161.52249.l10@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <006f01c10194$4fae5fe0$10ccfea9@computer>

For what appeared to be my first chat home, I was very excited.

Then my brother called a few minutes ago.  "Help~Mom's computer isn't
letting me get beyond Scan Disk--It keeps freezing up!"

Guess where I'll be tomorrow with the slowest modem known to man, and prolly
have to reformat?

Sighs.

Dee



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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun 30 18:59:47 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 18:59:47 -0000
Subject: Sirius Casting
In-Reply-To: <0ede01c10164$88163a40$0938acce@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <9hl7j3+gsea@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner" 
<bohners at p...> wrote:
> Gabriel Byrne is lovely, but alas, too old for Sirius. (snip)
> His face has too many deep-carved lines of character -- I think 
> they're delightful, but there's no way you could mistake Byrne for
> a guy in his thirties.  

I dunno any of these actors, but would a guy in his 30s who had 
*survived* 12 years in Azkaban have a more marked face than usual? 





From catlady at wicca.net  Sat Jun 30 19:07:54 2001
From: catlady at wicca.net (Rita Winston)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 19:07:54 -0000
Subject: Which Character Are You Most Like?
In-Reply-To: <20010630180028.29188.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9hl82a+ba56@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Melanie Brackney <ilovbrian_99 at y...> 
wrote:
> 
> What amazes me with these lists is how diverse the answers people 
> get are.  I mean in my top 5 I have Ron and Lockhart...How 
> different can these 2 characters be?  HOw can I have Hermione at 
> the top of my list (which she was) and McGonagall at #16...it 
> really doesn't make sense.

I took a look at that web site the previous time that a lot of list 
members were playing with it. It looked like there was one 
arbitary question per character, so 'do you have a pet?' makes you 
like Charlie Weasley, even tho' my pets are cats not dragons, and I 
would be constantly whimpering and putting surface anesthestic 
on any dragon burn I had, and I am athletically the OPPOSITE of a 
Seeker who could have played for England....
       One question was 'Do you think about your appearance?' and 
at that time, it was the questionn for Draco Malfoy, and if I 
answered 'Yes, I think about how ugly I am, so I can be careful 
to avoid mirrors', that would not be a resemblance to Draco's or 
Lockhart's or Fleur's vanity! let alone canon-Draco's malice or racism 
or wealth.





From rainy_lilac at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 19:22:24 2001
From: rainy_lilac at yahoo.com (rainy_lilac at yahoo.com)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 19:22:24 -0000
Subject: Sirius Casting
In-Reply-To: <0ede01c10164$88163a40$0938acce@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <9hl8tg+q2gu@eGroups.com>



Omigod!! What a yummy he is!! And a scottish accent, eh?

I agree about GB's age being an issue-- but we are in a qunadary 
because of AR, ren't we. yes, they ahve smooth out his face and he 
now has jet black hair. But anyone playing RL or SB must look like 
they are in the smae age range.

Also with SB and RL I would expect some premature aging. I think in 
PoA RL is described as prematurely grey.

Who was that guy in Rob Roy, Aiden Quin was it? Magnificent blue 
eyes? I wonder how old he is....

--Suzanne




--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner" 
<bohners at p...> wrote:
> Gabriel Byrne is lovely, but alas, too old for Sirius.  And unlike 
Alan
> Rickman, you can't easily make him look younger (they *did* smooth 
out AR's
> wrinkles a bit, have you noticed?).  His face has too many deep-
carved lines
> of character -- I think they're delightful, but there's no way you 
could
> mistake Byrne for a guy in his thirties.  Or so it seems to me, 
anyway.
> 
> I've thought of Daniel Day-Lewis, but he's perhaps a little too old 
by now
> as well.  I haven't seen him in anything since LAST OF THE 
MOHICANS, but he
> is incredibly versatile and also incredibly good-looking, which 
seems to
> suit well with my idea of Sirius.  And if you want to know what he 
looks
> like as a jailbird with scraggly hair, there's always IN THE NAME 
OF THE
> FATHER...
> 
> But you know, I wouldn't mind seeing a complete unknown (or near-
unknown) as
> Sirius.  When I watched the recent DUNE miniseries a couple of 
weeks back,
> the fellow playing Duncan Idaho struck me as being a near-perfect 
Sirius.  I
> mentioned this to my husband (who has let me read him all the HP 
books,
> bless him), and he said immediately, "Yeah, I can see that."
> 
> The actor's name is James Watson and you can see a picture of him 
(as Idaho,
> but looking very Sirius) at
> http://www.sf-fan.de/sf-film/dune/neu/ornithopter_2.jpg .  And oh, 
he has
> the loveliest soft Scottish accent.
> 
> Yep, after a second look at this picture I think I'm gonna stick 
with this
> one.  James Watson for Sirius in 2003!  Or 2004!  Or whatever!
> --
> Rebecca J. Bohner
> rebeccaj at p...
> http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From bohners at pobox.com  Sat Jun 30 19:30:32 2001
From: bohners at pobox.com (Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 15:30:32 -0400
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Sirius Casting
References: <9hl8tg+q2gu@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <100401c1019b$23f67e80$0938acce@rebeccab>

> Omigod!! What a yummy [James Watson] is!! And a scottish accent, eh?

Yep.  It's worth watching the first two hours of DUNE just for him (sadly,
he does not appear in anything after the first two hours).

> Who was that guy in Rob Roy, Aiden Quin was it? Magnificent blue
> eyes? I wonder how old he is....

Aidan Quinn is in his forties now.  Same problem as Gabriel Byrne, I'm
afraid.
--
Rebecca J. Bohner
rebeccaj at pobox.com
http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From jkusalavagemd at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 20:24:23 2001
From: jkusalavagemd at yahoo.com (Haggridd)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 20:24:23 -0000
Subject: Where is everyone from?
In-Reply-To: <20010630181040.72285.qmail@web10906.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9hlchn+qj4j@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Melanie Brackney <ilovbrian_99 at y...> 
wrote:
> 
> I think we should all come up with areas that we live in...maybe the 
people in the areas can gather to see the movie 
together.....hmmm....like for instance if anyone else will be in North 
WEst Ohio during the time of the premiere could meet up at a near by 
theatre.
> 
>  
> 
I work in Lake Charles, Louisiana, so I could travel to a New Orleans 
or a Houston gathering.

Haggridd
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> ---------------------------------
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year!
> http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




From Alyeskakc at aol.com  Sat Jun 30 21:00:46 2001
From: Alyeskakc at aol.com (Kristin)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 21:00:46 -0000
Subject: Where is everyone from?
In-Reply-To: <20010630181040.72285.qmail@web10906.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9hlelu+mqcd@eGroups.com>

Hi-

I live in Albuquerque and I'm not sure anyone here lives close by. 
Anyway if anyone lives in the New Mexico, Colorado, Arizona areas we 
could try to hook up for the premiere.

Cheers,
  Kristin




From crowswolf at sympatico.ca  Sat Jun 30 20:43:52 2001
From: crowswolf at sympatico.ca (*~Jamieson Wolf~*)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 16:43:52 -0400
Subject: Chat tomorrow
References: <9hlelu+mqcd@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <3B3E3A08.EDFF32A7@sympatico.ca>

Hey everyone....

Just to let everyone know, I will not be in Chat tomorrow...Sigh. Yes, I
know your're all saying, "but WHY? Don't you love us anymore?!" <g>

It's cus tomorrow is Canada Day (I live in Ottawa Ontario) and I will be
going to a barbque and then to Parliment Hill for the festivities!!!

I will miss you all, and I hope you all miss moi!

Hugs and Happy vibes,
Jamieson

--
Excuse me, but I just have to explode, explode this body off me, wake-up
tomorrow brand new, a little tired but brand new. (Pluto, by Bjork)

how could i be so immature to think he would replace the missing
elements in me? How extremely lazy of me! (Immature, by Bjork)





From rainy_lilac at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 21:27:26 2001
From: rainy_lilac at yahoo.com (rainy_lilac at yahoo.com)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 21:27:26 -0000
Subject: Sirius Casting
In-Reply-To: <100401c1019b$23f67e80$0938acce@rebeccab>
Message-ID: <9hlg7u+v3op@eGroups.com>


I must disagree! He is only 42-- Gabriel Byrne is 51, which I agree 
is a bit steep, but Quinn is still "in range".

Whatever the case, whoever plays SB MUST have a fair splash of sex 
appeal. Or Warner Bros. will feel the wrath and hear the unending 
howls of thirty-something women like me!!

Sluuuuuuuuurrrrpppp!

Suzanne



--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., "Horst or Rebecca J. Bohner" 
<bohners at p...> wrote:
> > Omigod!! What a yummy [James Watson] is!! And a scottish accent, 
eh?
> 
> Yep.  It's worth watching the first two hours of DUNE just for him 
(sadly,
> he does not appear in anything after the first two hours).
> 
> > Who was that guy in Rob Roy, Aiden Quin was it? Magnificent blue
> > eyes? I wonder how old he is....
> 
> Aidan Quinn is in his forties now.  Same problem as Gabriel Byrne, 
I'm
> afraid.
> --
> Rebecca J. Bohner
> rebeccaj at p...
> http://home.golden.net/~rebeccaj




From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 22:03:47 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 15:03:47 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Which Character Are You Most Like?
In-Reply-To: <9hl82a+ba56@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20010630220347.87779.qmail@web10905.mail.yahoo.com>

I think your right in assuming that.  I am considering putting together a more accurate quiz LOL...or can anyone think of a more accurate one?


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From ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com  Sat Jun 30 22:08:50 2001
From: ilovbrian_99 at yahoo.com (Melanie Brackney)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 15:08:50 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [HPFGU-OTChatter] Chat tomorrow
In-Reply-To: <3B3E3A08.EDFF32A7@sympatico.ca>
Message-ID: <20010630220850.88038.qmail@web10905.mail.yahoo.com>


What time is the chat tommorrow...I was hoping that I could actually make it this week..

Melanie



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From yael_pou at hotmail.com  Sat Jun 30 22:25:45 2001
From: yael_pou at hotmail.com (yael_pou at hotmail.com)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 22:25:45 -0000
Subject: The Hardest part about downloading the trailer at work....
In-Reply-To: <120.fe2117.286dea3f@aol.com>
Message-ID: <9hljl9+l75a@eGroups.com>

Hi,

Sorry about this, you've probably discussed this in detail before, but I was away - where 
do you download the trailer from? I'll be at work tomorrow...

Thanks, yael

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., wings909 at a... wrote:
> The Hardest parts about downloading the trailer at work are as follows:
> 
> 1)  Trying to keep the look of disgruntlement off of your face as you realize the time it 
takes you to d/l the trailer at work is less than the time it takes you to reboot your 
computer at home. 
> 
> 2)  Pretending that you aren't doing anything of import as so not to attract the 
attentions of curious co-workers.
> 
> 3)  Biting your lips bloody in efforts not to grin, giggle, or do anything potentially 
embarassing.
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> Paula




From pigwidgeon at inbox.as  Sat Jun 30 23:31:09 2001
From: pigwidgeon at inbox.as (Pigwidgeon)
Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 23:31:09 -0000
Subject: Chat tomorrow
In-Reply-To: <20010630220850.88038.qmail@web10905.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9hlnft+tf7c@eGroups.com>

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter at y..., Melanie Brackney <ilovbrian_99 at y...> 
wrote:
> 
> What time is the chat tommorrow...I was hoping that I could        
> actually make it this week..

The chat kicks off, officially, at 8 pm BST (British Summer Time) but 
usually a few people have turned up at least an hour before this.

8 pm BST is 3 pm Eastern and 12 pm Pacific.

More information at: 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownupsChatScripts

Please note that the chat takes place at the chat room of the main 
group (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups).



Simon

PS: I probably will not be in to chat either. Too many other things 
to do.