[HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: Detentions

[Shaun Hately]

Reposting this as I have realised it never arrived.

On 2 Jan 2003 at 12:27, Ali Ali at zymurgy.org wrote:

> I wonder how many of you have been fundamentally "shaped" by your 
> school experiences? I am certain that I was. I was deemed to be 
> a "chatterbox". Through both primary and secondary school I was 
> forced to move desk. Sometimes I was simply moved away from my 
> friends, sometimes directly in front of the teacher, and sometimes 
> outside the class. This happened too often and for too many years for 
> it to be a simple teacher/pupil personality clash, yet with some 
> teachers I never got moved and never got told off. But, I am equally 
> sure that nothing positive was achieved. I did well at school, my 
> friends were mostly high achievers, so I was hardly stopping anyone 
> from working. Once moved, I was often so annoyed and humiliated that 
> I did no work. I developed a strong sense of injustice, and became 
> quietly rebellious, organising strikes and other pointless 
> confrontations. I do believe that if I had been dealt with 
> differently, it could have saved me alot of heartache. Now, I veer 
> between being very quiet and non-stop talking, a trait I am sure, 
> developed as a result of my school experience.

I was *very* much shaped by my school experiences - both in a positive way, and in a 
negative way - I attended a lot of different schools - in the primary grades, my father was 
in the Royal Australian Navy and we moved a fair bit as he was posted. Secondary 
grades, the plan was I'd attend only one school - but it didn't work out that way.

I started year 7 - aged 12 - at the local Catholic secondary college. I refer to this school 
today as 'the school from hell'. This place was an absolute *disaster* in terms of 
discipline, etc, and embraced a lot of really trendy ideas. It didn't have any effective 
methods of imposing discipline, or punishing students, it felt bullies were people who 
needed help and understanding (which I agree with to a point - but not to the extent this 
school did where they allowed them to continue to do it to others, because it would have 
been 'judgemental' to stop them). I did have my head stuffed down a toilet and flushed, I 
was attacked by groups of over a hundred students, I would up needing medical 
attention - and when the school *finally* took notice (three quarters of the way through 
the school year) their response was to tell my parents I was 'retarded' (while I was 
getting the highest marks in my year level) and to give me lunchtime detentions for the 
rest of the year because I wasn't safe on the playground, and their policies didn't allow 
them to remove the bullies.

I came out of that school, very much shaped by my experiences - I was suicidal, and I 
would have killed myself rather than go back. I still suffer from the clinical depression I 
developed in that year (though fortunately for me, medication works wonderfully well, so 
if I take my pills, I'm free of it)

It also left me with an absolutely *burning* need to deal with injustice in the education 
system, and bullying in particular.

The following year, I went elsewhere  - my school had insisted I have testing to prove to 
my parents I was mentally disabled - well, what it actually showed was precisely the 
opposite, and with the help of the psychologist I was sent to see, at the start of Year 8, I 
was enrolled in one of Australia's most 'prestigious' private schools - one of those that 
sprang up here in the 1800s as colonial copies of the British Public Schools. For Year 8, 
I went to one of it's two preparatory schools - and it was exactly what I needed.

One of the reasons HP grabbed me when I first picked up Philosopher's Stone was 
because I felt real parallels between Harry's experiences and my own. I always had a 
good homelife so it wasn't a total match. But in a very real sense, I could relate to what 
Harry experienced.

I endured abuse, hatred, because of who I was - and then over a short period of time, I 
suddenly discovered I was different from others in a special way (in my case, I was 
'intellectually gifted' - not as cool as being a wizard), and without much in the way of 
preparation or warning I found myself in what was close to a different world - I was a 
working class kid, from one of the highest crime housing estates in my state, suddenly in 
an educational environment which I'd only ever dreamed of. I loved it. I loved it all. I 
loved my school uniform, with its blazer and tie, I loved the hundred year old buildings 
(bear in mind that back then, Australia had only had European settlement for 200 years - 
so a school that was over 100 years old was *very* old to me). I loved it all.

And the place saved my life. Saved my life, made me able to be happy again. It was - 
mostly - bliss.

The thing is this school had unusually strict discipline and rules - it even still had 
corporal punishment. That's pretty much what I needed - the discipline meant bullying 
was rare, and when it did occur, it was dealt with. It also worked for me - it really helped 
me to develop into a useful person - something I wanted to be, but lacked the self 
discipline at times, to manage without a bit of coercion.

Not saying what I needed was right for everyone - because it isn't.

My point is though, school was able to shape me positively as well - I think, because 
after that year of hell I was lucky enough to wind up in an educational establishment that 
was right for *me*. It wasn't perfect by any stretch - academically I still wasn't getting 
what I needed (although I can't see any school having been able to do that at the time, 
given policies imposed on them from above - it was probably as good as they could 
manage).

> I was perhaps lucky as I did still benefit from my education, but how 
> many little rebels, simply turn away from school and leave without 
> qualifications and perhaps worse still a feeling of alienation from 
> authority? I would like to think that there is a way of harnessing 
> this teenage desire for independence and rebellion rather than just 
> alienation.

Personal view - what's needed is a range of schools, a range of methods - education 
seems to be too hung up on a 'one size fits all' mentality - schools are based on a 
theoretical 'average' child - and everyone's expected to fit more or less into that neat 
box. When there are accomodations made for individual differences, mostly they are 
tacked on as extras, rather begrudgingly.

What's needed - in my humble opinion, of course - is an understanding that not all 
educational methods are right for all kids - and they shouldn't be expected to be. That's 
why this detention article attracted my attention.

It may be that for this girl, detention wasn't a good idea - if she got 11 in 9 months 
(unless the school hands out of a lot of them) that could be a sign that for her, it just isn't 
working. But what's the response - an attempt to get it banned for *all* children.

That's an illustration of the problem I see - something isn't right for one kid - so let's get 
rid of it for all kids. It's the most profoundly stupid attitude I can imagine.

Look elsewhere - take penicillin (or any other antibiotic). It doesn't work for all people, 
some people have adverse reactions to it - but nobody seriously suggests you therefore 
ban its use for everyone.

But that often does seem to be the approach in education.

And nobody seems to care about the possible problems they can create. I've been to a 
school where discipline was non-existant - and it almost killed me - so the idea of court 
rulings that unilaterally remove a disiplinary method from schools worries me greatly.

I was almost killed by a lack of school discipline - and saved by a school that had a lot of 
it, including corporal punishment.

My experiences, applied universally, would indicate to me that we should force all kids 
into regimented systems, old fashioned uniforms and apply liberal doses of the cane.

Obviously, that's not a good idea - for a lot of kids, that would be hellishly, cruelly 
useless. It wouldn't help them, it'd harm them.

There's no such thing (IMHO) as a system that works for *everyone*. And virtually 
everytime schools make a change for the benefit of their students, they only benefit 
some, and harm others.

What we need is a range of methods - so we can help kids like I was, who benefitted 
from discipline and order, and regulation - but also help kids who need the freedom to 
be themselves, to develop into who they want to be. And everyone in between, or at 
right angles or with any other relationship to all those groups.



Yours Without Wax, Dreadnought
Shaun Hately |webpage: http://www.alphalink.com.au/~drednort/thelab.html
(ISTJ)       |email: drednort at alphalink.com.au | ICQ: 6898200
"You know the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in
common. They don't alter their views to fit the facts. They alter
the facts to fit the views. Which can be uncomfortable if you happen
to be one of the facts that need altering." The Doctor - Doctor Who:
The Face of Evil | Where am I: Frankston, Victoria, Australia