Adult readers who are dismissive about Harry Potter

[Tim Regan]

Hi All,

--- In HPFGU-OTChatter Mel wrote:
> I've been in a ladies book group for 5 years


> I chose Azkaban. The whining is deafening.

I think we all empathize with this. And Mel, I think you've chosen 
the right HP book, it's well written, griping from start to finish, 
and has more "Oh my God" moments at the end than any book I've read. 
And, even if they don't enjoy it, it will give them ample fodder for 
intelligent dinner party repartee when the next movie comes out, so 
you are doing them a favor.

But I am nervous about the wholeheartedly pro-Potter tone of our 
responses. It may be that your reading circle is made up of 
insightful and intellectual women who don't like children's fantasy 
books. Let's face it; though we enjoy the books enormously, they are 
not perfect works of art. How have previous book discussions gone? 
Do the other women pose interesting theories about the works under 
review?

You may want to think about the kind of criticism that may arise. 
Here's my guess as to what that might be.

1) Fantasy novels are escapist nonsense.
This one should be easy to counter. Mary Shelly's Frankenstein is 
clearly a great work.

2) Kid's fantasy novels are a waste of time because one gains more 
insight from an adult book.
This one's harder to argue with. You could try the "HP isn't a kid's 
book" which JKR and many people here believe. I don't buy that 
though. Another obvious answer is that good kid's novels give you a 
good read you can share with your kids. I can immerse myself in 
detailed discussions about HP theories with my kids. I cannot do 
that about Tolstoy's War and Peace.

One line of argument you could play with is "why do we read". I 
think that the discussion of books with like minded intelligent 
friends is part of the pleasure of reading. And book club members 
must feel that way. Well, one advantage of popular culture is that 
it is popular! Read JKR and you will never find yourself far from an 
intelligent adult who has read it too and who has an opinion on it. 
That not true of adult writers, A. S. Byatt for example.

3) They are formula books – if you like them you should try Jackie 
Collins
Again, this will be tricky to counter. Many of us on the list think 
that they are formula books; it's just that we cannot agree what the 
formula is! The orphan boy conquers evil doesn't seem unique, indeed 
no single thread through the books seems unique, but JKR's skill is 
in the way she's combined them to provide a gripping and 
unpredictable fantasy.

4) PoA doesn't deal with deep themes.
Do you read any of the books about HP? The Philip Nell one had neat 
little essay questions which we use to do on the main list and which 
might form the basis for some book club discussion. In any case I'm 
sure the main list (especially if you can work your way around the 
crazy search engine) will give you ample stuff to think on.

5) Even if they are deep themes, the approach is trite.
I think this one's harder to counter than the previous point. Some 
of the adult characters are a bit wooden, and the child characters 
are necessarily childlike. It would be interesting to compare the 
treatment of major themes in the books you have already discussed 
with the treatment in PoA (if any themes overlap).

6) The world isn't well thought out, where are the boundaries?
I struggle with this one. If you look at the magic in other kid's 
fantasy books, for example Pullman's Dark Materials or Ursula 
LeGuin's Earthsea books, magic has clear bounds and a clear cost. 
But it's hard to get a sense of that in the Potterverse. In PoA the 
TimeTurner seems particularly misguided, it would be such a useful 
tool that I cannot see why it's use would be restricted to 
additional studies, spies everywhere would use them. Also making 
things, like sleeping bags. Why buy anything? Then there's wizards 
power; why do they cower in hiding from muggles? Why not just 
enslave us? Any one of these questions has many possible coherent 
answers (they've been discussed on the main list) but there are so 
many such issues that one isn't left with a sense that JKR has 
filled out the details of a logically consistent world.

I'm sure you can think of a dozen more criticisms, so good luck 
arming yourself ready for the discussion. Do let us know what 
happens: if you make any converts or if you hear any novel or well 
thought out criticisms.

Cheers,

Dumbledad.