pronunciation

[Carol]

Carol wrote in
> <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPFGU-OTChatter/message/33134>:
> 
> << "Jillous" and "jillatin" and "Milissa"? Or is "silly" "selly" in
> your pronunciation? Reminds me of Potioncat and her ballpoint "pin."
> <Gren. Erm, grin> I'm not trying to be sneppy, erm, snippy, just
> noting that for me, a short "i" and a short "e" are distinct sounds. >>
Catlady responded: 
> I can tell pin from pen, grin from gren, and snip from snep. But not
> silly from selly or jilly from jelly or bilious from belious. Having
> thought about it, I realised this is personal rather than a dialect,
> because my late mother used to get on my case about it all the time,
> insisting that I pronounce some words differently except her
> demonstration of how to say them sounded exactly like the way I
> already said them ...

Carol again:
It must be the "l" that's interfering with your hearing the
difference, just as the "r" interferes with my distinguishing "Sirius"
from "serious." (Note to Melanie: We've discussed this topic rather
thoroughly recently. There's no "sir" sound in "Sirius," if you're
thinking of "sir" as in, "Yes, sir.")

Catlady: 
> Continuing on the subject of people frustrating me: I am certain
that when I say 'thin', the TH sounds a little bit like an F and when
I say 'think', the TH sounds a little bit like an S. I could say words
starting with TH all day and all the 'unvoiced' (is that right?) ones
would sound like one of those two examples. My in-person friends are
driving me mad by insisting that they can't hear any difference in my
two different THs. <snip>

Carol:
Yes, "unvoiced" is right because the voicebox isn't involved in the
pronunciation of an unvoiced "th," only the lips and tongue. It's like
the difference between "t" (unvoiced) and "d" (voiced) or "s"
(unvoiced) and "z" (voiced). You should hear it clearly in "this"
(voiced "th") vs. "thin" (unvoiced "th"). There's no difference
between the "the sounds of "think" and "thin"--unvoiced in both cases.
But try saying "the" with an unvoiced "th" as in "thin." Can't be
done, or, at least, can't be done easily. (If you say the voiced "th"
alone and hold it for awhile, your tongue will vibrate a little.)

Carol, whose tongue is still tingling slightly from a voiced "th" and
is glad no one is around to hear her testing the sounds!