Where do House Elves come from?

[Carol]

bdclark wrote:
 
> > Where do House Elves come from? <snip>

> Sméagol's actual race became part of Sauron's regime while
he spent all those years under the mountain, but with Gollum's action,
he becomes a martyr for his race and they feel they can only serve
Wizards in order to honor his memory
>
> One of the Hobbits (Pip, Merry, or one of their grandchildren,
great-grandchildren) pairs with an elf, and after circumstances, puts
their entire off-spring into the situation that
makes things happen <snip>

Carol responds:

I forgot to answer this part of the original post. Gollum as a martyr
to his "race," assuming that any of the Stoorlike proto-Hobbits who
inhabit that region still remain, could be written as a fanfic, but
considering that he was "shunned by his relations when visible" and
kicked out of his grandmother's home (not to mention that he murdered
Deagol, which he was probably suspected of doing after they both
disappeared), I'm not sure that it would work. But I don't see any
connection between such a story and JKR's House-Elves, especially
since there are only five Wizards (Istari) in LOTR, two of whom are
never seen, two of whom wouldn't want such servants, and one of whom
(well, I won't say what happens to Saruman, just in case there's
anyone on the list who doesn't know.)

As for Merry or Pippin marrying an Elf, it didn't happen. Pippin
married Diamond of Long Cleve, a Hobbit, and named his son Faramir. We
don't have that much information about Merry, but he also took a
Hobbit wife and had a son. However, I *suppose* that one of their
descendants could marry a Wood Elf or even one of the remnant of the
Sindar (not a Noldorin High Elf since all of them have left Middle
Earth). Stranger things have happened, and there's a precedent of
sorts in "The Hobbit." One of Bilbo's Took ancestors married a fairy
wife. IIRC, that accounts for the adventurous streak in the Tooks. But
the Hobbits, whether or not they intermarried with other "races,"
would not become willing servants to Wizards or to humans (Tolkien's
Wizards are Maiar like Sauron and Melian the Maia and even Ungoliant,
the ancestor of Shelob, who was not originally a horrible giant spider.)
 
> bboyminn wrote:

> I suspect that in the Potter world, JKR's goblins are an 
evolutionary blend of the dwarf race and the elf race, though the
dwarf race as a magical race is not really mentioned in the books. 

Carol responds:
I agree that the *concept* of JKR's goblins includes elements of
Dwarves (to use Tolkien's plural) in Norse mythology (small, fierce
people who craft powerful magical weapons and armor--we see this
aspect of them in Tolkien's Dwarves), but I don't see anything that
her Goblins have in common with her House-Elves except small size and
pointed ears. The Goblins are warlike and rebellious and resent the
wand-wielding Wizards. They speak their own language, Gobbledygook.

The House-Elves, in contrast, are generally submissive and happy to
serve humans (not, however, a master that they don't respect). They
seem to have no language of their own and apparently speak only a
somewhat mutilated version of their human masters' language.

Dwarves (or Dwarfs, as in "Snow White ane the Seven Dwarfs") do appear
in CoS, resentfully commissioned by Lockhart to deliver valentines and
forced to dress in silly costumes. (He should have asked the
House-Elves, who would have done it willingly, but JKR was going for
comic effect and presumably didn't want to reveal that Hogwarts had a
staff of some hundred House-Elves too early in the series.)

One huge difference between Tolkien and JKR is that, for him, the
blending of "races" (actually, species), especially Orcs and Men, is
abhorrent (and, for human women forced to mate with Orcs, it would be
unspeakably horrible), whereas for JKR, even a marriage between giants
and Wizards is not objectionable (though giantesses are likely to
abandon their puny half-human offspring), and it appears that Flitwick
has a Goblin ancestor somewhere. (These examples are instances in
which we *really* need to suspend our disbelief. Surely, marriage
partners should be members of the same species, roughly the same size
for practical reasons and able to produce fertile offspring, but JKR
wasn't thinking about logistics or even the unlikelihood that a nice
wizard like Mr. Hagrid Sr. would be attracted to a giantess. If we
think it's hard for Wizards to meet Muggles as potential marriage
partners, how does a Wizard go about finding and marrying a female
giant (or obtaining a license to marry one?) Is it "prejudice" to
consider a Giant or a Troll an unsuitable marriage partner for a Witch
or Wizard? Not in my view. It's common sense.

Carol, who thinks that JKR's goblins are folklore goblins ("an ugly or
grotesque sprite that is usually mischievous and sometimes evil and
malicious," M-W Online) with the intellectual capacity and
armor-creating skills of the Dwarves of Norse mythology