"Nice and" expression question.

[Carol]

Carol earlier: 
> 
> > By, the way, the "and" isn't stated if "nice" comes before the noun:
> > it's "a nice, supple wand"; "a nice, hot drink"; "a nice, easy
crossword puzzle"; etc. So the wand is "nice" (a good wand) *because*
> it's supple, and so forth.
> 
> Geoff:
> It isn't stated because the "nice and x" structure doesn't
necessarily carry the same meaning and hence correspond exactly to
"nice, x".
> 
> For example, to say 'the next move is to insert the power unit nice
and gently" isn't the same as "the insertion of the power unit is a
nice, gentle move."
> 
> We've already suggested that the "nice and x" format is an idiomatic
construct which can be difficult to render in translation.
>
Carol responds:

I'd say that "nice, x" is also idiomatic, with the "nice" having
approximately the same weight and meaning (virtually none) in both
constructions. I see no difference between "a nice, hot drink" and a
drink that's "nice and hot." YMMV.

Carol, well aware that the point is the difficulty of translating the
idiomatic phrase