Sundry responses on Ron

[Amy Z]

No: HPFGUIDX 16465

Cap'n Kathy wrote:

>Actually, when you think about it, it's really astounding how much 
Ron >ISN'T jealous of, considering that he has been painted as such a 
>jealous person. 

O captain, my captain!  I agree 100%.

Catherine wrote: <his mockery of Filch being a Squib>

I don't see it this way.  The passage reads:

"And what on earth's a Squib?" said Harry.
To his surprise, Ron stifled a snigger.
"Well--it's not funny really--but as it's Filch..." he said.  "A Squib 
is someone who was born into a wizarding family but hasn't got any 
magic powers.  Kind of the opposite of Muggle-born wizards, but Squibs 
are quite unusual.  If Filch's trying to learn magic from a Kwikspell 
course, I reckon he must be a Squib.  It would explain a lot.  Like 
why he hates students so much."  Ron gave a satisfied smile.  "He's 
bitter."

What I get from this passage is that Ron hates Filch, but =not= 
because he's a Squib, and in fact Ron wouldn't make fun of someone for 
being one ("it's not funny really--but as it's Filch...").  For all he 
despises Filch, he never throws his Squibness up in his face nor 
refers to it again to the others.  Is there anything else anywhere 
revealing Ron's attitudes toward Squibs that I've forgotten?

Penny wrote:

>Harry dismisses Fudge's assumption on the grounds that it just has to 
do
>with geographic proximity.  Ron, OTOH, is quick to think of her giant
>blood in *support* of Fudge's conclusion. 

You're right.  He hasn't entirely shaken that prejudice.  Others had 
referred to this passage but I didn't remember the specifics.

Re: werewolf prejudices, it's Harry who wrote "aren't all bad" in FB 
(Mike, I have trouble sorting out the writing too--I think JKR did all 
three--but I'm sure this is Harry's).  But I'm sure Ron agrees <g>.  

I stand by my basic point that Ron's prejudices aren't remotely 
comparable to Draco's.  (And by my long-ago assertion that Harry is a 
primo jerk about SPEW--and he doesn't even have childhood prejudices 
to outgrow.  If Hermione is looking for a boyfriend who will respect 
her political views, she'd better look beyond Ron AND Harry unless one 
of them shapes up.)

Penny on Ron's "meanness":

>1.  His fight with Harry in GoF.  His remarks are rather cutting.

Yeah, his remarks are mean, but so are Harry's.  Ron:  "I'm not 
stupid, you know."  Harry:  "You're doing a really good impression of 
it."  Ouch!  This is a knock-down drag-out; both are saying things 
they'll regret.  None of this is to excuse Ron, but to say that if 
we're going to call him mean because of this comment, we have to call 
Harry mean as well.

>2.  (Paraphrasing as no PoA on desk): "It's too bad Scabbers was just
>*eaten,* he really used to love these [whatever the candy/sweet 
was]."
>[And, by the by, this was the same moment when Harry was in the 
process
>of making amends with Hermione!]

Harry's being a lot better than Ron, but he isn't the one whose pet 
got eaten while Hermione makes denials and excuses.  I don't consider 
Ron's comment mean, in any case.  It's immature (he =is= 13); a mature 
response would be to insist upon having a conversation with Hermione 
and really telling her how awful he's feeling.

Hermione, much as I love her, is also very immature when it comes to 
the Crookshanks/Scabbers incident.  She waved off Ron's concern by 
saying Crookshanks would be in her dorm and Scabbers in the boys'.  
Well, Crookshanks did get into the boys' dorm; she didn't keep her 
promise.  And it seems, in evidence that is clear to everyone else, 
that Crookshanks has indeed gotten in again and eaten him up, gulp.  
She refuses to admit that this is what most likely happened, and she 
refuses to apologize for a long time.  They both need to grow up.  
Neither of them is being mean, IMHO.

>Hermione fulfils the role of advisor/helper much better.  Ron seems 
to be 
>there to lighten Harry up when things get too heavy. 

This is definitely true, but we still see aspects of Ron that are more 
sensitive.  The only example that comes to mind from GoF is his 
telling Hermione to drop it when she is challenging Harry about lying 
to Sirius.  I know I've brought this up before, but I just find it a 
very telling moment.  Harry is in real agony about Sirius's having 
endangered himself on his account; Hermione's being a bit legalistic 
("that was a lie, Harry"); Ron sees the emotional picture much 
better, and in a way, in fact, that is supposedly characteristic of 
girls that age but not boys.  I think there are other moments like 
this in GoF, but I can't think of them off the top of my head.

And then there's the 2nd task, by which JKR tells us in no uncertain 
terms that Ron is the most important person in Harry's life.  That 
could, of course, just mean that Harry needs lighthearted 
companionship more than he needs a helper/advisor.

I am sorry to say that Ron is less likable to me in GoF than in the 
other books, =as a person.=  =As a character,= he's more interesting 
than ever before.  He's growing in complexity and I can't wait to see 
how he'll develop next.  (Within two strict limits, of course:  (1) he 
may not become a DE and (2) he may not die.  Got that, Jo?)

Demelza wrote:

>About "normal cat behavior", Hermione owned a cat. Ron owned a rat. 
>"Normal" (maybe "instinctive" is a better term?) cat behavior 
dictates 
>that cats are predators of rats and rodents among other things. 
>Therefore, is it the responsible action of a cat owner to allow cat 
to 
>be near a pet rat and pooh-pooh the fears of the rat owner that the 
>cat is after the pet rat? 

This was written in response to my post saying Crookshanks was 
displaying normal cat behavior, but it takes my post out of context 
(it dates back quite awhile).  It wasn't about whether Hermione was 
responsible or considerate of Ron's pet (she wasn't either, IMO), but 
about her judgment of character:  does Hermione's blindness about 
Crookshanks show a lack of perceptiveness about suspicious characters 
(and specifically, does it show that she's less perceptive than Ron)? 
 I was saying that no, Hermione doesn't get what's going on with 
Crookshanks, but that's understandable because his behavior is normal 
cat behavior, not, as Ron says, an in for Scabbers.  He proves to be 
right and Hermione proves to be wrong; on the other hand, Ron doesn't 
get the whole picture, either; he thinks Crookshanks is doing 
something evil when in fact he's trying to protect them all.

Arabella wrote:

>As for chess, I know there are more references than this and I wish I 
>had time to check through for all of them: "He liked it best when he 
>was with Ron and Hermione and they were talking about other things, 
or 
>else letting him sit in silence while they played chess." - GoF 

CoS ch. 11: Ron and Hermione play (Ron's bishop takes Hermione's 
knight).
PoA ch. 11: Ron suggests chess as a distraction when Harry's obsessing 
about Black.

Aberforth's Goat wrote:

>*I* hereby wager 5 Butterbeers that Ron'll be the next Gryffindor 
quidditch
>captain.

You're on!  I'm betting he'll be Keeper but not captain (I'm holding 
out for one of the Chasers.  Hey, since chat on Sunday, I found a 
Chaser captain in canon:  Marcus Flint).

Lisa, all I can say is a big "me too!" to your "Ron's stubbornness" 
post.  (I have more sympathy for Harry's nastiness in the 
badge-chucking scene, though.  Yeah, he's being an utter jerk, but as 
we know and Ron doesn't, he's been stressed to the breaking point.  He 
has good reason to think Ron's interruption may cost him his life.)  
You really summed up a lot of my thoughts on Ron.  The Ron rhetoric 
has been getting kind of extreme on both sides ("Ron's emotionally 
abusive" on the one ridiculous extreme, "Ron's funny, brave, etc. and 
therefore can't be jealous" on the other) and your post was so 
balanced and reasonable.

Amy Z

----------------------------------------------
 Just then, Neville caused a slight diversion
 by turning into a large canary.
                  -HP and the Goblet of Fire
----------------------------------------------