SHIP: Muddying the pool

[cassandraclaire73]

No: HPFGUIDX 31351

--- In HPforGrownups at y..., "serenadust" <jmmears at p...> wrote:
> 
> I've been trying to figure out a coherent way to make this point, 
and  Dave has done it perfectly.  The relationship between the 3 kids 
has  definitely undergone a gradual shift and now it's obvious that 
Ron  and Hermione have a very different relationship from Harry and 
> Hermione.  Hermione seems to be almost maternal (or if you hate the 
> term "maternal", then big-sisterish) with Harry, constantly fussing 
> over him and fretting about what she thinks he should be doing.  
This   is  obviously somewhat annoying to Harry, but instead of 
telling her to  back off, he just quietly ignores her and refuses to 
even engage her  on whatever topic she's going on about.
> OTOH, Ron can almost never resist arguing with her and she seems to 
> (mostly) thrive on this banter.  As a result, there seems to be a 
> sort of closeness between them, that does not include Harry.  I 
guess  what I'm really trying to say is that in PS/SS, their 
friendship is  all about being with Harry, but in COS JKR gradually 
begins to show a  personal friendship between Hermione and Ron that 
is not Harry- centric, and by GOF whatever is going on between them 
has almost  nothing to do with Harry."

I suppose this is where we all simply diverge in our reading of the 
texts. I see no real indication of a "special" relationship between 
Ron and Hermione that does not include Harry. Nor do I particularly 
see Hermione thriving on her banter with Ron (I don't even see much 
in the way of banter -- if they've ever tossed charming zingers back 
and forth, I must have missed it. Ron makes many amusing comments, 
but most of them are neither directed at Hermione or have much to do 
with her. The "spew" comment being an exception.) I do not see her 
being any closer with Ron at all, in fact it seems to me that all the 
Trio members are close with each other in different ways, but 
probably the closest twosome is Ron -- and Harry. Followed by Ron and 
Hermione and Harry and Hermione being about equally close, in 
different ways.

In GoF, when Ron and Harry fell out, it was Harry that Hermione chose 
to spend her time with. It was Harry she took long walks around the 
lake with. When Hermione and Harry went to Hogsmeade (Harry under the 
Invisibility Cloak) and went into the Three Broomsticks, Ron was 
there, at another table across the way. To him it would have looked 
like Hermione was alone. Did he come over to talk to her or even wave 
and smile? No. If there is a closeness between Ron and Hermione that 
does not include Harry (examples, please) then there is also a 
closeness between Harry and Hermione that does not include Ron, and a 
closeness between Ron and Harry that does not include Hermione, as 
there are in any friendships where the participants are distinct 
individuals with different personalities. It does not therefore 
follow that any two are "close -er."


Am I saying that Ron is not Hermione's friend? Of course not. Do I 
think they are very close in their own way? Yes. But they are no 
closer with each other than Harry and Hermione are with each other. 
It is simply a different dynamic. The beauty of the Trio's friendship 
is that it is so well-balanced. One cannot look at the friendships as 
unequal -- well, one can I suppose, but I'd like to see some canon 
incidences that support this. Ron and Hermione may well be bonded by 
their shared concern for Harry (as Rita once very amusingly posted, 
the only way she could see a Rn/Hermione relationship was if Harry 
died and they were both so depressed they wound up clinging together 
for mutual comfort and naming all their children "Harry Junior"...) 
But Harry and Hermione have plenty of special moments together 
without Ron as well. (The "great wizard" bit in PS, the whole 
sequence at the end of PoA, those long walks around the lake in 
GoF...) If we had ever once heard Harry observe that Ron and Hermione 
seemed to be awfully close, or if Viktor had said to Harry that 
Hermione talked about him *and Ron* all the time, or if Harry ever 
worried that they might leave him out of anything...but that never 
happens.

I find it amusing that when R/H is argued for, it is often argued 
that Ron and Hermione are not nearly as close as Harry and Hermione 
and that therefore a romance is more likely between them, because it 
does not threaten their friendship in the same way. Now it is that 
Ron and Hermione are closer so they must be romantically destined. 
Which is it I would like to know. :D

Cassandra

NB: As for Hermione mothering Harry, I don't think she does that much 
more with him than she does with her nagging of Ron, as Gwen pointed 
out many moons ago on this thread. (I find this whole mothering 
thread amusing, especially in context of Jenny's earlier argument 
that Ron likes Hermione because he is looking for a bossy woman "like 
his mother." Paging Dr. Freud)...We are really just going in circles 
here a bit, but I see Hermione's endless nagging of Ron to be 
something he isn't as more motherly than her protectiveness of Harry.