How Boggarts work (was Why is Lupin afraid of the floating silver orb?)

[caliburncy at yahoo.com]

No: HPFGUIDX 27344

--- In HPforGrownups at y..., cynthiaanncoe at h... wrote:
> Luke Wrote:
> 
> > To Cindy:
> > 
> > Oops, I somehow missed your comment about the lights going out in 
> my 
> > response to Boggarts' abilities to take on the powers of their 
form 
> > counterparts.  Now that puts an interesting spin on things as 
proof 
> > that Boggarts do have some ability to affect physical changes.  
> > Interesting.  I shall have to regroup and reconsider.
> > 
> Luke, you may not have to regroup. I observed how you easily 
> destroyed my whole idea that Lupin sipped wolfsbane potion to avoid 
> transforming in front of the students, so I am the one who needs to 
> re-group.

Right, I meant I needed to regroup and reconsider my point about it 
being possible the boggart could only do psychological things, because 
you had brought up the effect on the lights (albeit for an unrelated 
reason), which would not be psychological.  So it was kind of seperate 
from the wolfsbane potion part.

Therefore we can both regroup and call it square.

My regrouping is to state that I still think we can't necessarily use 
the effect that the boggart has on Harry as conclusive evidence that 
boggarts take on the properties of their form counterparts under all 
circumstances.  There could be some limiting factors that we are not 
aware of.  The difference from my ealier assertions is that I now have 
no specific support for my claims like I did before when it seemed 
likely that the boggart could only harness psychological effects.  Oh 
well.  I think I stated the first time this came up (at a time when I 
was saying much more intelligent things, BTW) that it's also possible 
that boggarts only have as much power as there is fear in their 
target.  Or belief, for that matter.  Such as, the boggart could only 
harm you if you feared/believed it could.  I take as "kind of, sort 
of, not really, okay not at all" evidence of this the fact that Lupin 
tackles the boggart with something along the lines of boredom.

In fact, jenny's (and some others) theory that:

--- In HPforGrownups at y..., meboriqua at a... wrote:
> I'm sure this has been said before, but I always assumed that Lupin 
> didn't transform into a wolf when he saw the boggart simply because 
> he is a powerful and experienced enough wizard to handle it.  
> It's kind of like Harry learning to throw off the Imperius Curse; 
> can't practice and experience help fight boggarts too?  After all, 
> boggarts are not quite real - they are more a copy of what people 
> fear.  Harry reacts to the boggart-as-Dementor because he is not yet 
> accustomed to dealing with boggarts.  He does not yet know the 
> difference between boggarts and Dementors.  Like the Imperius Curse, 
> it is something he must fight psychologically.  Lupin has already 
> done that.
> 
> --jenny from ravenclaw, being rambly ***************

is basically along the lines of this last alternate possibility I 
mentioned, that perhaps boggarts only have this power to the extent 
that they are feared.  That once you could avoid the psychological 
effect of a boggart, they would be basically powerless.  (BTW, I don't 
think you were being rambly at all, jenny).

My point is not that any of these theories is true.  I wouldn't be 
surprised if they aren't.  My real point is just that I'm not sure 
that there aren't alternate ways of interpreting the boggarts apparent 
ability to take on properties of their form counterpart, and how 
across-the-board this ability is.  I guess I just don't like making 
firm conclusions from a single piece of evidence, however telling it 
might be, unless it outright states said conclusion.

Do these guys show up in Fantastic Beasts?  It'd be nice to have some 
more information on how they work.  I'm assuming they don't or someone 
would've cited an entry by now.

> Cindy (wishing people would pretend that it was hard work to destroy 
> her theories)

Your wish is my command.  The next time I nitpick something of yours I 
will be sure to drip some e-sweat on it, so you'll have a clear, 
physical record of the intense amount of mental exertion that was 
required.

-Luke