Humor and Crouch Jr. and Sr. (WAS Future books: Humor element, Voldemort/)

[cindysphynx]

No: HPFGUIDX 34496

Elkins wrote:

> I am resolutely unamused, for example, when Dudley must take the 
fall
> over and over and over again; and when at the end of GoF the 
Gryffs, 
> not content with having already hexed the Slyths into 
unconsciousness 
> on the train, also feel the need to tramp all over their supine 
forms 
> on their way out the door, it doesn't make me feel happy or gleeful 
> or amused, or as if I've just been provided with a feel-good moment 
> to lighten my mood.  

Hmmm.  Was the trio stomping on the Sytherins meant to be funny?  I 
didn't read it that way.  It seemed meant to be pay-back, but not all 
pay-back is amusing, IMHO.  

I had a different issue with that scene.  Bad guys kick their foe 
then they are down and helpless and unconscious.  Good guys do what 
they have to do and move on.  They do NOT curse people just for 
saying something they don't like, stomp them, and then leave them 
there powerless to rescue themselves.  

Contrast the treatment of Draco, Crabb and Goyle on the train with 
the treatment of Krum in the maze.  Krum had used an Unforgivable 
Curse, for cryin' out loud.  Yet Cedric and Harry didn't step on his 
prone body or gloat over him.  Indeed, Harry seemed slightly 
sympathetic to Krum, wondering what on earth possessed Krum to use an 
Unforgivable Curse just to win a contest.

Maybe the train stomp scene is transitional and is designed to show 
that this is an all-out war now?  I hope that's all it is supposed to 
be.

Elkins wrote:

> But I do very much like other types of humor that derive from
> characters' being horribly pained or humiliated or embarrassed or
> abused.  For me, though, in order for such scenes to work, the
> characters have to be active agents.  It makes me laugh to see 
people 
> desperately struggling to extricate themselves from impossible or 
> embarrassing or even potentially lethal situations.  I don't know 
> quite what this is called, but I tend to think of it as the primary 
> comedic attribute of Farce.  

Hmmm.  I'm trying to think of examples of this from canon.  One is 
Pettigrew trying to talk his way out of trouble, as you mention.  
Another is Harry trying to escape from the graveyard.  My reaction to 
both scenes was similar:  I felt kind of sorry for the soon-to-be-
victim, although I was much more emotionally invested with Harry.  

Actually, nothing in the Shrieking Shack struck me as funny.  I think 
there were events that were arguably funny, but I was just too 
interested in what was going to happen to pay attention.  Snape 
getting knocked out is an example.  The rat-like description of 
Pettigrew was another.  I don't think I can appreciate humor in a 
white-knuckle moment like the Shrieking Shack.  It's my loss, I 
guess.  

I think for me to be amused by a character squirming in a tight spot, 
the tight spot can't be a matter of life or death.  That's why, for 
me, the Unexpected Task is a hoot.  That's also why I loved it when 
Moody invited Hermione to leave when she objected to being put under 
the Imperius Curse.   

Elkins again:

> PoA had a lot of nice examples of this form of humor.  I loved, for 
> example, the scene in which Harry desperately tries to give Snape 
> some explanation for why his head might have been spotted in 
> Hogsmeade.  Snape's own dry humor adds tremendously to the comedy, 
of 
> course, as does his malice.

Oh, yes, that was a gem!  Again, Harry was squirming, but there 
wasn't much at stake.  Just the Map and yet another 50 points from 
Gryffindor.  Been there, done that.

Elkins wrote (about a second reading of Harry's name coming out of 
the Goblet:

> It's terrible, but it's also very funny in a black, black way: the 
> second time I read GoF, I found myself giggling out loud all the 
way 
> through that scene.
> 

On a re-read, I was amused by just how brazen Moody is.  He walks 
right in and gives away half of the plot twist, and I didn't believe 
it.  Nope.  I wasn't buying anything Moody said in that scene.  I was 
terribly amused by everything that happened as Harry tried to cope 
with being the fourth Champion.  Again, he squirms, but nothing much 
is on the line except being ostracized.

Elkins wrote:

>As a matter of fact, I *did* identify with young Barty Crouch.  
<snip>  

> --- Elkins, who *is* willing to cut Crouch Sr. some slack, but only
> because he suffered horribly before he died

Really?  Crouch Jr. was kind of a flat-liner for me.  I mean, he was 
great as Moody, but I didn't get a real sense for him individually.  

And now that you mention it, I gather that we are not supposed to 
like Crouch Sr., but I liked him well enough.  I guess we're not 
supposed to like him because he spent too much time at the office, 
and because he gave his son a rather truncated trial.  But he was 
right about his son's guilt, and a fellow has to put in some face 
time to make become Minister of Magic.  

Really, what did Crouch Sr. do to deserve his unfortunate 
transfiguration into a bone, other than show mercy to his no-account, 
good-for-nothing, disgrace-to-the-family-name offspring?

I'll definitely cut Crouch Sr. a break, but not Crouch Jr.

Cindy (who is also feeling parental, and who would take Crouch Jr. to 
the woodshed)