Genre? Or not? (was Re: Wasted Charms & other magical devices (Time Turner))

Sat Jan 5 17:14:55 UTC 2002

No: HPFGUIDX 32831

Since I started this ridiculous thread, I guess I should follow up on at least
*some* of the comments....

If you don't want to read a long email, the summary is this: Rowling is a good
writer (and becoming an excellent one), capable of making even a fairly cliched
device seem new in her world, but she's not always consistent in this ability,
and I still hold that her skill in this area would likely be helped by some
research into how other authors have handled some of the devices she uses, such
as time travel.

I wrote some stuff about how there's good sf & fantasy out there (which other
list members have helpfully backed me up on), and ftah3 (Mahoney) responded:
> 
> Exactly.  Which is part of the reason I also had a smidge of an
> objection to your previous statement that it would have been better
> if Rowling had read more sci-fi-fantasy/had left 'hokey' devices
> alone.  The fact is, the good writers can use certain devices and
> they will *not* be hokey/contrived/full of holes because they are
> talented writers.  In fact, in the hands of a talented writer, the
> most hackneyed idea can become (to hyperbolize) ground-breaking
> literature. 

Wait up a sec-- I agree with this. And Rowling is *becoming* a very good writer,
the kind who could take on these old ideas and make them seem fresh and
interesting. I don't doubt her general ability. But I still say the Time Turner
wasn't her best example. More below....

> 
> I don't like time travel stories, generally.  Even in the hands of
> respected writers, I find them tiresome.  But for some reason, I
> really like Rowling's Time Turner.

<snip of a very familiar-sounding experience with trying to take too many
classes....>

>  I would have loved to give Hermione's
> experience with the Time Turner a try.  And with that introduction,
> the Time Turner became a fresh idea to me.  Also, I felt that the
> contained way in which Rowling used the device kept loopholes from
> spiralling totally out of control; and the loopholes that *could* be
> brought up remained well inside my personal form of 'time structure
> agnosticism' (i.e., is it linear? circular? three dimensional?
> incomprehensible?  who knows... :-P).  I'm rather glad that Rowling
> didn't fall prey to the...hmm, sort of sci-fi/fantasy genre prejudice
> against time travel, nor allow herself to be intimidated by the fact
> that the current stock of genre fiction has a lousy track record in
> dealing with that particular device.  Because I would miss it.
> 

I wouldn't have wanted her to necessarily skip the Time Turner altogether -- it
was an interesting idea, and good character development for Hermione. I actually
like time travel stories well enough, when they're well-done. (Card's
_Pastwatch_ comes to mind.) It's just that more commonly, they are written with
too little thought and care, and I'm afraid I feel this was an example. I've had
some more time to think about this since my earlier post, and here's how I would
explain my point of view now:

Rowling does a really good job with some "cliche" devices, like the invisibility
cloak. She gives a light introduction, is careful to ensure consistent use, has
her consequences thought through, etc., as others have described. But she's
still a little spotty with some other devices, like the Time Turner. I truly do
believe that if she were more familiar with the bumps other science fiction or
fantasy authors have gone through in thinking about time travel, she would have
made this device work a lot better. I don't care if she does the "time is
inevitable & can't be changed" Heinlein method, or the "multiple alternate
worlds" Piper method, or the "paradox destroys reality" Frankowski method, or
the "if you change the past you write yourself out of existance" Card method. Or
she could work up a plausible new theory and stick with that. But quite a bit of
SF effort has been devoted to working out different ways to handle the paradox
problem in time travel stories. Do you have to read every other time-travel
story before you write your own? Not necessarily, but if you don't at least
survey where others have gone before, you have to work an awful lot harder to
make the device convincing to readers who have.

If you don't believe me (after all, I'm unpublished to date), here's a quote
from Orson Scott Card (winner of both Hugo and Nebula awards), from his
excellent book, _How to Write Science Fiction and Fantasy_. Card is talking
about the rules of space travel in this passage, but he goes on to detail the
kinds of rules that one must establish for time travel later in the same
chapter.

--
Why must you establish clearly what the rules of space travel are? So that the
reader understands why the characters are getting so upset -- or why they're
*not* getting terribly puset -- when things go wrong. So that the reader knows
just what's at stake.

And -- not a trivial consideration -- so that the experienced science fiction
reader will recognize your proper use of a standard device and feel confident
that the story is being written by somebody who knows how this is done. Even if
you plan to be rebellious and *not* use standard devices, you still must address
the same issues; the effect on the reader is still reassuring.
--

Rowling has done, I would guess, a fair amount of reading about mythological
creatures such as unicorns and phoenixes, and it looks like she's investigated
the mystical properties of woods in certain cultures, as well. All of this
effort enriches her stories and makes *her* unicorns, phoenixes, and wands more
than just stereotyped cliches. I don't think it's unreasonable to hold her use
of elements like time travel to the same standard. Especially when it was a
major plot element in PoA.

The same thing holds for veritaserum. The question of absolute truthfullness and
how a device that could guarantee it would affect a culture and its legal system
has been explored in any number of SF & fantasy stories (including my own
unpublished short story, "Contagious Truth"). In GoF, Snape threatens Harry with
veritaserum fairly casually, and then we see it used at the end on Crouch/Moody,
but though Rowling makes some remarks about its use being "restricted by the
Ministry," she hasn't given us enough details to make this restriction seem real
or the use of veritaserum by wizards understandable. I'm still hoping that
she'll follow up with more of an explanation of the limitations or drawbacks of
veritaserum in her remaining books. (For that matter, she could patch up the
problems with the Time Turner in a future book, and I'd stop quibbling about
it.)

I'm also still hoping that she'll fix the problem she introduced with the
Portkeys in GoF. She's effectively defined two completely different behaviors:
timed departure and touch-activated departure and return. I'm guessing this
device was written in haste, rather than as a logical error that she wouldn't
have noticed given a bit more time, and I'm just hoping she can patch it up in
the next book. (And I'm willing to wait a little longer for OoP to let her do
so.)

BTW, for those who are interested in reading other well-written school-age
wizard stories, Diane Duane's _So You Want to be a Wizard_ has already been
mentioned, to which I would add Diana Wynne Jones' "Chrestomanci" stories
(particularly _Witch Week_ and _Charmed Life_) and _Archer's Goon_,  Tamora
Pierce's "Song of the Lioness", "Wild Magic", and "Protector of the Small"
quartets, Mercedes Lackey's original "Arrows of the Queen" series (I agree that
her earliest work is her best), Sherri S. Tepper's "End of the Game" series,
R.A. MacAvoy's "Damiano" trilogy, Patrica A. McKillip's "Riddlemaster of Hed"
series, and Robin McKinley's _The Blue Sword_ and _The Hero and the Crown_. Also
worth checking are Garth Nix's _Sabriel_ and Philip Pullman's "His Dark
Materials" series, though I think the first book (_The Golden Compass_) is
significantly better than the other two. You may also like much of Andre
Norton's "Witch World" series. If you're interested in extending to a science
fantasy or science fiction direction, you might also try Anne McCaffrey's
"Harper Hall" trilogy, and possibly James H. Schmitz' _The Witches of Karres_
and "Telzey" series (_The Universe Against Her_, _The Telzey Toy_, and _The Lion
Game_.) Most of these should be fairly easily available through your online book
vendor of choice, or via interlibrary loan. Sadly, I am not yet aware of any
science fiction and fantasy specific online new and used book stores. :(

Elizabeth
(who is seriously considering starting a separate list for discussing these
other children's and young-adult science fiction and fantasy stories in more
detail.)