[HPforGrownups] Re: Lupin, the Moon and the Bewitching Hour

[Andrew MacIan]

No: HPFGUIDX 32974

Greetings from Andrew!

This list is being more thought-provoking by the day. 
I appreciate this....

--- blenberry <blenberry at altavista.com> wrote:

{snip}

> > --- blenberry <blenberry at a...> wrote:
> > 
> > > In this case, how do you explain the
> > > boggart-dementor's effects on 
> > > Harry?  He *knows* it's a boggart.
> > > 
> > > sorry if this has been addressed elsewhere...
> I'm
> > > new :)
> > 

Back to Y'r H'mble C'rr'sp'nd'nt:

> > Not to worry; I'm not excatly one of the Founders,
> > either (interesting joke there, given the
> topic...)
> > 
> > As I said at the end of the paragraph (and it does
> > help to identify the person you're quoting, BTW),
> the
> > question is one of the actual effect of the Moon
> on a
> > were-- Lupin, in this case.  He *knows* it cannot
> *be*
> > the Moon for various reasons, one of the most
> telling
> > being that he must know where and when he is in
> any
> > given lunation (cycle of the Moon).  It has been
> > speculated in both mythological studies and modern
> > magickal theory that a were is, in essence, one of
> the
> > best state-shape clocks in existence for this
> reason.
> > 
> > Thus, Lupin can tell that the boggart knows what
> > frightens him more than anything else, but Lupin
> also
> > knows at his basic level of existence that the
> boggart
> > is nothing but a sham.
> > 
> > Harry, on the other hand, sees the dementor and
> > believes what is in essence the boggart's lie. 
> After
> > all, the effects that are produced are Harry's;
> all
> > the boggart does is to read a person's fears. 
> Thus,
> > all the boggart appears to do is induce the
> fear-state
> > from the target (Harry's) memories and previous
> > experience.
> > 
> > 
> > Clearer?  If not, don't hesitate to tell me so.
> 
> 
> Thanks for your reply, Andrew!  Please accept my
> apologies for 
> quoting you namelessly.

Welcome!  We only learn by inquiry of one form or
another.  As to the citation, I make enough such
bookkeeping errors that I simply mention it to make
sure *I'm* still in synch.
  
> 
> I want to buy that theory, but this still bugs me: 
> if the effect of 
> the boggart-dementor is all in Harry's mind,
> wouldn't the false 
> dementor at the Quidditch game affect him exactly
> the same way? He 
> seems to feel no effects from it at all, although he
> believes it to 
> be a real dementor.

If this is scene I have currently in mind, this is
where Malfoy the Younger and his henchmen (hmmm...rock
band name, anyone? {grin}) dress up as dementors to
try to throw Harry off his game.

If so, then the effect would not be that of a true
dementor, no matter Harry's reaction.  IIRC, he sees
but -doesn't feel- the 'dementor', so he 'throws' a
Patroclus (sp?  Not in my Book of Shadows, obviously!)
that has the result of knocking Malfoy et Cie ass over
tea-kettle.  In this case, with the 'dememtor' not
being a magical creature, the -physical- aspect of the
Patroclus seems to have the most effect.
As I read it, the 'dementor's effect was simply on the
physical plane.  Malfoy's bad intent might have some
form of magical effect, but I don't read that as being
significant.

So...hopefully this is clear.  I appreciate the
challenge to fully think through this problem.  Keep
it up!

Cheers,

Drieux

...who survived, more or less, his first day of
purgatory for this semester....

=====
ICQ # 76184391

'Each game of chess means there's one less
      Variation left to be played;
 Each day got through means one or two less
      Mistakes remain to be made.'
      --'Chess' by Sir Tim Rice

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