Christian culture (was Secular Christmas anywhere?)

[blpurdom]

No: HPFGUIDX 34203

--- In HPforGrownups at y..., Edblanning at a... wrote:
> > I think we just have a language problem; "secular" is the 
> > closest word for describing the Hogwarts celebrations, but it 
> > falls short because it implies a complete separation from the 
> > religious that just doesn't jibe with suits of armor singing "O 
> > come let us adore Him, Christ the Lord."  

Right; secular both is and isn't quite the right term.  There isn't 
really any emphasis on theological issues at Hogwarts; the suits of 
armor are the epitome of paying "lip-service" to the holiday, even 
though some of the carols have religious content.  (But there are 
also a lot of carols with pretty much no religious content, such 
as "Here We Come A-Waissailing" which is mostly about the old 
holiday of Yule and celebration of the new year and mooching from 
one's neighbors, etc.)

> If wizards are are presumed not to, either now or in the past, be 
> religiously Christian, then why should they apparently be even to 
> the smallest extent culturally so? 

But I don't think this IS assumed.  Think of the Fat Friar.  And it 
wasn't all that long ago.  In "Quidditch Through the Ages," JKR 
gives 1692 (the same year as the Salem witch trials) as the year for 
the International Statute of Wizarding Secrecy.  This is a mere 
three-hundred years ago.  Hogwarts had already been around for 
something like seven-hundred years.  

Someone also pointed out that Guy Fawkes was attacking Parliament 
because of the suppression of Catholicism.  What if JKR is drawing 
an analogy between the way Catholics had to sort of go underground 
after Henry VIII proclaimed himself head of the church of England, 
and the way wizards eventually decided it was safer to go 
underground?  A large number of Catholic wizards would be perfectly 
in line with this reasoning--they would have two reasons to hide.  
Added to this is the fact that in the Middle Ages, the Church had 
monks in monasteries involved in astrology and attempts to prove 
that alchemy wasn't a crock, among other things.  Sound familiar?  
Shades of Divination and Nicolas Flamel?

> Many people seem to assume that the wizarding world separated from 
> the muggle world some considerable time ago, this accounting for 
> the lack of familiarity with muggle dress codes etc. The Christmas 
> customs we see at Hogwarts, trees, carols, crackers, 'traditional' 
> Christmas dinner etc mostly date (in the UK) from the 19th century 
> on, long after this assumed break. ( The Christmas tree came from 
> Germany via Prince Albert) I am English, so not fully qualified to 
> comment, but I did spend part of my childhood in Scotland, ( in 
> the late 60s) and, at least in the region where we lived, 
> Christmas was a very low key thing indeed: Hogmanay was the main 
> winter celebration.

You are quite right about the recent advent of these particular 
Christmas traditions, and this is one reason why I don't think the 
wizarding world has been utterly divorced from the Muggle world.  
Remember, Muggle-born witches and wizards are constantly entering 
the wizarding world, bringing their Muggle ways with them, and we 
have canon testimony to the frequent practice of intermarriage 
between wizards and Muggles.  These things may very well have been 
introduced into the magical world by Muggle-born witches and wizards 
within the last hundred years, and because of wizard unfamiliarity 
with Muggle traditions, they were thought to be novel and exciting!  
(And perhaps they were not told of the Muggle connection.)

I'm glad you mentioned Hogmanay!  I'm convinced that this winter 
holiday is the reason for JKR incorporating 'hog' into the names of 
Hogsmeade and Hogwarts!  Very Scottish!

--Barb

Chapter 14 of the Last Temptation is up....Are you tempted?
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