The Prank; Ron's Envy; SHIP: including those "cheezy" love triangle theories

[Penny Linsenmayer]

No: HPFGUIDX 38605

Hi  --

THE PRANK --

Nuria posited a fascinating theory about how the Prank might have occurred:

<<<<Here's my little bit of speculation. I'm not saying it *is* how it
happened, but it's a possibility to explaining Sirius' going a tad too
far: For whatever reason (bad day as you say, or
Misterious_Prank_Backgroun_Yet_To_Be_Unveiled), Sirius gets fed up and
tells Snape off and gives him directions, more or less accurate, more or
les conciously. He's told Snape off, he feels relieved. He doesn't even
recall exactly *how accurate* he was in directing Snape to the Willow.
And most important, he doesn't actually believe that boy whom he
considers a sort of stupid git will go into the whomping willow.
Probably he underestimated Snape's courage to actually go and take a
look.
What canon says  "Sirius thought it would be -er- amusing, to tell Snape
all he had to do was prod the knot on the tree-trunk with a long stick,
and he'd be able to get in after me" (PoA18, page 261 British ed.)
Questions arise...
a. Did Sirius think Snape would find so stupid the 'prod the knot' bit,
that he'd assume it was a joke and wouldn't try it?
b. Where was Sirius when James saved Snape? Could it be he was in the
shack with Werewolf!Lupin intending to eventually keep Snape apart from
Lupin? I'm not sure he was fully aware of Remus' dangerousness when
transformed - since being a dog he only knew the Tame!Werewolf side>>>>>>

I was actually thinking of a similar scenario the other day but never got a chance to post it.  What if, while James was saving Snape, Sirius was actually sitting in detention under the watchful gaze of Professor McGonagall?  As I see it, there are a number of possibilities as to why Sirius wasn't involved in extricating Snape from the dangerous effects of the Prank.  I like what Nuria has suggested too: maybe he was with Lupin (would Lupin even have any memory of this?  I don't think so).   

I agree with whoever argued (sorry, was it Dicey?) that Sirius may not actually be unrepentant about the Prank.  She noted that he might instead simply be too proud or too ashamed to admit he was wrong.  I think this is very much in keeping with Sirius' character and might go a ways toward explaining what I have believed could be an inconsistent characterization of Sirius.  There's just so much we don't know about the Prank.  What did Snape say or do to motivate Sirius to tell him how to follow them?  What were Sirius' intentions?  Who alerted James?  Where was Sirius during James's rescue of Snape?  What, other than forbidding Snape to say a word about Lupin being a werewolf, did Dumbledore do about the Prank?  What does Sirius really think now?  Lots of questions & no answers...

RON'S ENVY --

Naama argued:

<<<I think there is a very significant difference between Ron's reaction 
to Harry's entering the Tournament and his reaction to the leprechaun 
gold. During his Tournament "envy crisis" Ron doesn't acknowledge 
that he is envious of Harry. He wasn't aware himself that his anger 
is not really about Harry entering the Tournament behind his back. In 
fact, if it weren't for Hermione, I'm not sure we would have 
understood what it is really abou.t So Ron was then in denial (so to 
speak).>>>>>>>

I agree that Ron was in denial about his true feelings, but I think it was pretty clear to many readers.  I didn't need Hermione to voice it for me anyway.  The comment about the "photo shoot" said it pretty plainly to me.

<<<<<It's trite, but nevertheless true, that overcoming denial is 
the first step to recovery. We know that Ron finally believed that 
Harry was telling the truth. That and the hints of some pretty 
serious soul searchings (the night Harry meets Sirius in the common 
room fireplace) indicate that Ron did face up to the true sources of 
his anger.>>>>>>>>>>

Now on this point, I'm not so sure.  I don't think it was really & truly until he saw how much danger Harry was in during the First Task that Ron finally saw the light.  That's always been my interpretation.  Now, he may have been going to try & make amends the night he comes down into the Common Room, that's true.  But, I don't think there's any evidence that he's worked through the root cause of his anger at Harry.  At least, there's nothing in the dialogue between them that night in the Common Room or in the tent after the First Task that leads me to believe that he has. 
 
<<<<The way I see it, the leprechaun gold *proves* that he has. His "it 
must be nice to have so much gold.." comment is a clear expression of 
envy - which is a good thing. Doubly good, in fact. Because, first, 
it means that he has faced his feelings, and, secondly, that he can 
voice those feelings. After all, there's nothing wrong with *feeling* 
envy (or anger or hatred or whatever). The wrong thing is to be ruled 
by those passions instead of just,.. well.., feeling them. The 
leprechaun incident clearly shows us that Ron is able to feel envy 
without being possessed by it. So, in this sense, I still stand by 
what I said - Ron has resolved his envy issues.>>>>>>

I think you make a good case that Ron might be making some steps toward coming to grips with his envy of Harry.  But, I think it's too soon to conclude that he's *fully resolved* his issues.  I think I'll wait & see how he reacts at the next big crisis point.  

SHIP: WARNING -- SHIPS IN THE WATER AHEAD -- 

Aldrea argued:

<<<<<<Actually, I don't like Harry and Hermione being a couple.  Harry has 
never thought a single thought about Hermione that wasn't more than 
just friends!>>>>>>

In the words of his creator, from a Scholastic chat in Feb 2000:

Q: Is Harry Potter ever going to fall in love with Hermione or is he going to fall in love with Ginny Weasley? 

A: In Book IV Harry does decide he likes a girl, but it's not Hermione or Ginny. However, he's only 14, so there's plenty of time for him to change his mind. ;-) 

I'm focusing on the "he's only 14 and so there's time to change his mind" aspect, btw.  I emphasize that he's never given Ginny Weasley a second thought either, but there are scores of people hoping he eventually will.  People do change their minds about their friends in terms of romance.  Happens *all* the time in the real world.

In fact, since wizards live much longer lives than muggles (per JKR & her statement that Dumbledore is 150 for example).  Why *would* witches & wizards pair off & marry early?  Wouldn't it be better to have fun & play the field & find the right person ... knowing full well that your biological clock isn't going to begin ticking until your 70s (assuming double the life span, a witch could have babies into her 90s).  

Yeah, I don't think it's set in stone that Harry must end up with Cho since that's the only girl he's ever had romantic interest in so far.  :--)

Aldrea again:

<<<In fact, he's thought thoughts that were LESS than friendly.>>

And Ron hasn't?  <vbg>  

<<<Hey, opposites attract.>>>>>>

Not always.  I personally think the whole "opposites attract" thing is a bit cliched, but that may be because I don't see too much evidence for it happening very often in real life myself (I mean more than just my own personal circumstances ... but family & friends as well).

Michelle said:

<<<<Romance *will* play a part in the books--JKR has said so--but to 
be an important character and plot point like that? My goodness, that 
would take a lot of maneuvering, wouldn't it? I'm sure she could do 
it, but why would she want to? Barf.>>>>>>>

:::waves at Michelle, haven't seen you lately since I haven't been visiting the FictionAlley SCUSA boards::::

Actually, I don't think it would take much maneuvering at all -- there's a perfect set-up as lead-in from GoF.  As for the "why," I think I'll just trust that JKR will continue writing books that I'll love & obsess over (even if that includes things I would find cliched & cheezy, like One Big Happy Weasley Family as an ending).  Since the fact that the kids will be "15 & hormonal" was one of the things she highlighted in the BBC piece in December, I'd say she's planning something.  Remains to be seen how much it will end up being and whether it will be dramatic/angsty or humorous relief or something in-between.  It'd be perfectly plausible to have a love triangle that provides comic relief (rather than drama, angst, and betrayal) for example.  They *are* just 15 -- so miscommunications, raging hormones, noone ending up with their preferred love interest ... gee, that all sounds like perfectly normal adolescent stuff to me.  

<<<Romance looks like it might be a sort of relieving side-plot... like it was in GoF. At least, I hope so. Too much romance would ruin the novels (I'm not here to read 
romance!)... while just enough would make it highly satisfying.>>>>>>>>>>

Ah, that's too bad.  I think JKR has done such a great job so far of balancing all the different plot points; I can't imagine anything she might do that would "ruin" the series for me.  Yeah, I'm just going to leave it in her capable hands.  Worked so far.  <g>

Lexan said:

<<<<You got it, Michelle. The love triangle of Ron-Hermione-Harry is 
remarkably like those angsty-teenage drama on TV, particularly 
Dawson's Creek. I admit that I enjoy watching some of those shows 
for fun, but I don't think it'll be good for HP. Hp is bound to be a 
classic literary series, so I don't think it should be equivalent to 
those soaps, plot-wise.>>>>

Ah, yes.  Acknowledge literary classics have *never* used love triangles.  :::cough:::   Little Women, Jane Eyre, Tale of Two Cities, David Copperfield, Tom Jones, Emma, A Passage to India, Paul Scott's "Raj Quartet" -- just to name a few.  Yeah, great literature never uses anything so silly & cliched as a love triangle.  

I think I'll just trust that JKR will give us realistic adolescence without turning the series into the wizarding world equivalent of Dawson's Creek or a Harlequin romance.  I feel utterly & completely confident that she's capable of this.  

Penny




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