Location of Durmstrang

[pengolodh_sc]

No: HPFGUIDX 44503

--- In HPforGrownups, "Steve" wrote:
> --- In HPforGrownups, "Jesta Hijinx" wrote:
> 
> Jesta Hijinx almost asked but was betrayed by he email
> program 'Where is Durmstrand?'
> 
> bboy_mn replies:
> Just to the right of Finland is my best guess.

Most likely further North, or further West.  From what I remember 
from the Atlas, there are few or no mountains in Finland or East of 
Finland - flat as a pancake, mostly, if you ignore all the sprooce-
trees.  Locations East of Finland also appear to be too landlocked 
for it to be culturally probably with a large ship as mode of 
transportation.  The descriptions of the geographical features of 
Drumstrang require a location that is to the North of Hogwarts, in an 
area with mountains and lakes, and most likely a certain cultural 
connection to seafaring.  Areas that might be suitable will be found 
in the Northern parts of the Scandinavian peninsula, as well as parts 
of the Russian Arctic coast.  

At the end I have included my post on this topic from November 22nd 
2000, in full.  Beware that the language used may give you paper-
cuts.  Two-three weeks after I made this post, JKR held a bookreading 
in Glasgow, where she also answered some questions, including 
locations of Durmstrang and Beauxbatons:

--- In HPforGrownups, "Pam Scruton" wrote:
> Jo thinks that Durmstrang is in northern Scandanavia - the
> very north of Sweden or Norway and that Beauxbatons is
> somewhere near Cannes in the south of France.  She says she
> doesn't know for certain because, of course, the exact
> whereabouts of these schools is a closely-guarded secret to
> which she is not privy!

(the above from post 6494, 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/6494 )

(The below is from my post 22nd November 2000, post 5961, 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/5961 ):

--- In HPforGrownups, Christian Stubø <rhodhry at y...> wrote:
> I spotted a comment some time ago, where somebody
> (Rita Winston) mentioned Latvia as a likely location
> for Durmstrang., and, as the location of the two known
> schools of magic besides Hogwarts has intrigued me for
> some time, I decided to break out my encyclopedia and
> atlas, and I have some random thoughts.  I am no
> expert on the things in question here, but it is a
> start, and this can be improved upon by others more
> knowledgeable in these fields.  I hope I am not too
> unstructured and difficult to follow (it is midnight
> here), as I am reopening a discussion at least 5000
> messages old.
> 
> Unfortunately, we are not told too much about the
> location of Beauxbatons, though the impression seems
> to be given of a palace like to the royal palaces in
> the Loire-valley (decorated tastefully, without
> stuffed k-niggets and poltergeists).  I will assume it
> to be in a relatively mild area, in a chateau akin to
> Chambord or Azay le Rideau (the ultimate Romantic
> Fairytale palaces).
> 
> Of Durmstrang we know as much that it must be quite a
> distance to the North, in a region with lakes (I am
> presuming Viktor Krum knows the difference between
> lakes and fjords) AND mountains, and also with access
> to the sea (I am presuming the ship is an oceangoing
> ship).  This rules out all of Lithuania, Latvia and
> Estonia, as these, between them, do not contain a
> single peak higher than 318 metres (1043ft) - sorry,
> Rita.  In fact, Latvia is no further North than
> Scotland – it edges just North of the 58th Parallel,
> and it is South of all of Norway (save Queen Maud Land
> and the Bouvet Island in Antarctica, and the halfway
> mythical Sjettnan's Isle in the South Pacific). 
> Formally speaking, it was also outside the Holy Roman
> Empire of the German Nation, which stretched no
> further North than the borders of Denmark (at least
> according to my Atlas of History from school, but then
> it labelled Yugoslavia as a NATO-member too...).
> Denmark proper, being even flatter than the Baltic
> states, is all out, the Faeroe Islands are to small,
> and Greenland is too far out of the way for anyone to
> bother going there.  
> 
> Finland has plenty with lakes, but no mountains except
> in the extreme West and North, where there are few
> lakes.  Norway all the way up to the Polar Circle has
> plenty of both, and is plenty dark in the Winter. 
> Sweden likewise has plenty of both along the 62nd
> latitude all the way to the joint between Finland,
> Norway and Sweden.  Unfortunately, the combination of
> lakes and mountains is mostly found inland, a distance
> away from the sea – only in Norway can it be found
> near the sea, mainly on the Western coast between 62°N
> and 64°N, and between 65°N and 66°N.  There is also a
> location near Narvik, at ca. 68°N.
> 
> Besides these, there is a further opportunity, even
> further to the North:  Murmansk Oblatsk (I am not
> certain if `Oblatsk' means county, shire, state or
> something else), on the Kola Peninsula.  It is an
> appropriately barren area, with a number of lakes, and
> a number of proper mountains.  The need to be close to
> the sea, seems to favour a location at the inner end
> of the bay called Kandalakšskaja Guba, in the White
> Sea.
> 
> One could also look at this linguistically.  While
> Durmstrang is a name derived from German (from Sturm
> und Drang, a literary movement advocating the
> abandonment of sense), and seems to indicate a German
> relation, both Karkaroff and Viktor Krum are Slavic. 
> This suggests a closer connection to Russia and
> Eastern Europe than Germany, though that may be a
> later development.  To me, it doesn't not seem
> immediately logical that Slavic students would accept
> learning in German, rather than Russian, for instance,
> when Slavic-speakers certainly are numerous enough to
> justify one or more schools on their own –
> particularly as see have the impression of a historic
> form of antipathy between Slavic and German nations in
> Europe (the Teutonic Order wasn't always nice guys,
> even if Eisenstein overdid things a bit).  Both the
> connection to Germany and the connection to the East,
> reduce the probability of Norway being the location of
> Durmstrang, as Norway at the time Hogwarts was founded
> was primarily oriented towards England, Scotland and
> the West, while Sweden was oriented towards the East
> (essentially Russia was founded by Swedish Vikings)
> and the South (Sweden had an extensive trade with the
> Hansa-Bund).  If Scandinavian students are split
> between the large academies, then it is more plausible
> to me that the Norwegians end up at Hogwarts, with the
> Swedes at Durmstrang, than all of Scandinavia being
> under Durmstrang.  This is also because of the very
> strong influence from Danes and Norwegians in the time
> before William the Conqueror (just look at the
> linguistic parallels – York-Jorvik, church/kirk-kirke,
> husband-husbond, (hus-)wife-(hus-)viv, etc.)
> 
> In the region in question here (Northern Germany,
> Scandinavia, Northern Russia West of the Ural
> Mountains) there are four Language-groups: the
> Finnish-Ugrian (sp?) group (Finnish, Estonian, Sami,
> Hungarian), the Baltic-Slavic group (Lithuanian,
> Russian, most East-European languages), the
> North-Germanic languages (Norwegian, Swedish, Danish,
> Icelandic) and West-Germanic (primarily German in this
> context (but English belongs in this group too,
> according to my source)).  I rather suspect that these
> language-groups, rather than mixing and matching,
> would each tend to itself, education-wise.
> 
> I would rather not see Durmstrang end up in
> Scandinavia, due to a fanfic-project I have, which may
> (or may not) lift off sometime before book V.  I have
> presumed that Norway, Denmark, Sweden and Iceland have
> a joint school somewhere (In Norway, in my case, as I
> am Norwegian, and Norwegian folklore is the only one I
> know much), as the Scandinavian languages are (and
> have always been), very close.  This leaves for me
> only the option of putting Durmstrang in Murmansk
> Oblatsk, probably somewhere near the city of
> Kandalakša, at the White Sea.  I am wondering whether
> to include Finns and Estonians in this, only
> Swedish-speaking Finns or no Finns or Estonians at all
> (with, perhaps, a joint Finnish-Estonian-Hungarian
> Institute (due to the languages being related), of
> course founded by Ilmarinen and Vainamöinen.) , as
> Finland was very strongly tied to Sweden for
> centuries.
> 
> I hope I did not get too boring (again, it is late,
> with the attendant bad effects on my ability to
> structure.  I have to do it at home, however, as that
> is where I have all my books).
> 
> Regards
> 
> =====
> "There are two trillion six-houndred and sixtyfive billion  eight-
houndred and sixtysix million, seven-houndred and fortysix thousand, 
six-houndred and sixtyfour litte devils in the world"
> ---------------------------------------------
> Christian Stubø
> Student of Technology, architectura navalis