Predestination (was Re: prophecy/Firenze)

[annemehr]

No: HPFGUIDX 79201

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Jen Reese" <stevejjen at e...> 
wrote:
> This brings up a major question I have about the prophecy: If one 
of 
> the major themes in the HP series is about choice, then it doesn't 
> follow that the *prophecy* is Harry's one and only destiny.  If 
> that's the case, then Harry's life is predestined and without 
choice, 
> so what would be the point?!?
> 

Annemehr:
I don't have any belief in "predestination" _at_all_, so when I see 
prophecies in literature, I take them as a sort of "news report" in 
advance.  If a prophecy is to be trusted, it does come true in some 
way -- usually an unforseen way.

There is nothing controlling Harry's choices; he is still free to 
make them himself.  Certainly, the fact that he's heard the prophecy 
will have a profound effect on him, but no more so than the deaths 
of Lily, James, and Sirius, or his upbringing with the Dursleys.  
It's still what he *does* about what's happened to him that's 
important.  Furthermore, we are all aware that Voldemort, of *his* 
own free choice, is determined to kill Harry, which makes a 
situation where at least one of them dies very likely to occur.

Jen again:
> If, as Firenze states, even centaurs can be wrong (and they have a 
> much better grasp of "the stars"), then I think the prophecy may 
> tells us more about Harry's past, and the expectations others have 
> placed on him, than about what Harry ultimately decides is his 
> *destiny*.
> 
> Jen

I think these things you mention will certainly have a part in how 
the prophecy works out, but at the time it was made, Harry had no 
past, so it couldn't have been an extrapolation from his past.

I don't think seeing the future equates to causing the future.  I 
also think Firenze is right about prophecies, and that Dumbledore 
and Harry may well be mistaken in their interpretation.  I fully 
expect no one to actually realise it when the prophecy is coming 
true until after the fact -- which means that Harry will be making 
his decisions and doing what seems right as he normally does, until 
it suddenly becomes apparant that Voldemort has been vanquished for 
good.

Unfortunately for us, *we* will probably have a fair idea of when 
the prophecy is about to come true: somewhere fairly near to the end 
of book seven!

Speaking of Firenze, and Mars being bright, I certainly hope Harry 
has the sense to try and talk to Firenze sometime *soon*.  I want to 
know what it is about Mars and what Firenze and Bane were arguing 
about in the Forest in PS/SS.  I'm also hoping that Firenze can help 
Harry deal with Trelawney's prophecy in some way.  Even though, 
before the end of OoP, it begins to look like he was wrong about 
Grawp (though it probably just means a disaster is coming in book 
six).

Annemehr