[HPforGrownups] Re: Sexual Temptation (was: Stereotyping)

[Kathryn Cawte]

No: HPFGUIDX 86740



Nora,
>
> I hate to drag out the old Four Loves discussion that's flowed around
> here before, but...
>
> Why do 'love' and 'sexuality' have to be considered as synonyms? It
> seems to me that we, in our general cultural framework, have great
> difficulty separating the two,
<snipped>
> I have no doubt that Sirius loves/ed both Remus and James.  But that
> doesn't mean he necessarily had sexual feelings towards either of
> them.  He may well could have, but to assume it as a necessary
> consequence of closeness seems actually somewhat retrograde to me.
>
> The one big thing that make me wonder about the Sirius/Remus closure
> is the whole 'thinking he was a spy, and therefore switching Secret
> Keepers without telling him'.  Remus also thought Sirius was the
> spy.  Maybe I'm biased, but you generally don't suspect the Love of
> Your Life Who You Are Oh-So-Close To as the spy.  >

K

'it doesn't mean he necessarily had sexual feelings towards either of them'.
I agree it doesn't but by the same token it doesn't necessarily mean that he
*didn't*. I *specifically* used the word crush when talking about James
because while I agree they loved one another I didn't want to suggest Sirius
was 'in love' - but merely that he had ambiguous feelings about the guy.
Let's just assume for the time being he is gay since there's no way to tell
for sure and I agree it's possible he is and possible he isn't but I don't
want to argue his sexuality right now just back up my argument that he could
have had a relationship with Remus and could have had a crish on James.
Sirius is 16ish in the flashback and therefore just coming to terms with his
sexuality (whatever it is). His best mate is handsome, outgoing, charming
(if you're not a Slytherin), and a quidditch star - he also comes from a
presumably loving family so as well as being his best mate he also has
everything Sirius wants out of life. I'm not trying to argue that Sirius was
in love with him just that from what we know of the situation and from the
clues we see in the Pensieve (James plays to the crown, Sirius plays to an
audience of one - James) Sirius may have been confused to say the least
about his feelings for James. If you add up the love he definitely felt for
the guy, the admiration he probably felt, envy of James' so much better
family life, the hormones that are flooding through his body, and the
burgeoning recognition that girls are all very well but he's not interested
in them 'that way', he may well have at least thought he was in love with
James.

Now to Sirius/Remus - you might not want to suspect the love of your life is
a spy but as  a Member of the Order of the Phoenix and fighter in the war
against Voldemort, not to mention the fact that his best friend and his
family's lives (including his Godson) depended on it he couldn't avoid the
truth no matter how unpleasant or 'unbelievable' it might be. Sirius (and
the others) knew that one of James' close friends was a spy. So Sirius has
three suspects to choose from - himself, his lover, and the 'tagalong'. Well
he knows for a fact he isn't the spy. We've seen how Sirius and Remus
consider Peter to be weak and clinging from the scene in the Shack and the
way the Marauders seem to have treated him as captive audience and
hero-worshipper in the flashbacks - that image doesn't fit with someone who
has been spying on James et al for the best part of a year. It takes a
certain amount of steady nerves and sheer balls to risk being caught by the
Aurors, to risk being caught by the Order and to risk failing Voldemort (who
let's face it doesn't seem overly forgiving of failure). In Sirius' eyes it
isn't possible for Peter to do that, not because he *wouldn't* but rather
because he *couldn't*. That only leaves one option - when you've eliminated
the impossible ... etc etc. So Sirius has no choice but to believe Remus is
the traitor (and vice versa) - the strain of this belief, which presumably
has been growing for the same length of time they've known there is a
traitor, must have put a strain on their relationship (be it romantic of
friendship) and started to drive them apart, so they're talking less, and
the further apart they are the more likely it seems that the other guy must
be the traitor. Now the other 'interesting' fact is that Sirius says he
changed so that he wouldn't betray the Potters - well he seems fairly
certain in the Shack that he would have died to protect them, so why wasn't
he confident of that at the time? Maybe because he thought that the one
person he *might* give in to and betray James for is Remus - which to me is
another indication that he and Remus were possibly closer than friends. Now
I'm not saying this is or isn't how things happened - just that it is a
possible scenario and canon doesn't contradict it (which is imo all that is
necessary for a theory to be viable). Of course we also don't know what
peter was doing during this time - maybe he was helping to plant seeds of
doubt in Sirius' ear and the same for Remus (after all Remus is a Dark
Creature and the ww treats him badly, if Voldemort promised him equality
based on purity of blood regardless of his condition he could turn. Or for
that matter just look at Sirius' family, the apple never falls far from the
tree, and we know Sirius is capable of betrayal he betrayed Remus by nearly
feeding Snape to him .... these aren't my opinions btw just possible
arguments Peter could have used)

K

"The Loudest Noise Comes From The Electric Minerva."