FF: Draco's Crimes & Misdemeanors

[heiditandy]

No: HPFGUIDX 51551

Diana wrote:

> I do not feel sorry for Draco, Crabbe and Goyle one bit.  Have you
> forgotten how evil Draco and company are?  

Evil? Diana's post was one of a few that caused me to want to reiterate
why I just can't see Draco, Crabbe or Goyle as evil - even in the train
scene - as many of the posts of the past few days have more or less
presumed. I have a hard time determining that someone 14 years - and
younger, as Draco was in many of the examples you give below, is evil
without said CHILD actually killing someone in cold blood, or at least
trying to (in other words, 16 year old Tom would've been evil even if
the basilisk hadn't actually killed anyone, but Ginny wouldn't've been
even if the basilisk had managed to kill anyone). Then again, I'm also
not sure that one has to cross the line into evil to be "redeemed", but
that's a post for another time. 

Here's the question, which I pose to the list in general: 

Do insults by an 11 year old smack of evil? 
If you think that they do, then do you also think that insults by Snape
show that he is evil? 
If not, then why not? Or are they something on the "badness level" that
isn't quite as low as evil is?

And, more particularly to Diana, why do you think that Draco actually
knows that Lucius is involved in the petrifications in CoS? 

I look through canon and can't see any reason for Draco to think that
Lucius does know what's going on - just that Lucius wants him to stay
out of it. He even says his father told him to stay out of it. DO you
feel this way because Draco knows that the chamber was last opened after
Lucius' time at Hogwarts? From the somewhat-unguarded conversation in
the dungeons (I say "somewhat" because he's not actually alone at the
time) it seems perfectly clear to me that Draco has no idea what is
attacking the students, or, in fact, that Lucius was involved in the
creation of the instant situation. What in that conversation gives you
the opposite impression? 

What is evil about being attacked by a creature that *really* is too
dangerous to put around a crowd of thirteen year olds, according to
Fantastic Beasts & Where to Find Them, and then complaining to law
enforcement about said attack and creature? We don't actually KNOW that
he did anything else (yes, he should've been paying attention more, but
I cannot believe that you'd allege that not paying attention in class is
*evil). 

We also don't know that he was lying to Rita about Hagrid, Harry or
Hermione. We only know what she reported - and even if you take those
comments as things he actually said... Well, let's put it this way - if
a reporter asked Harry and/or Ron what they thought of Snape, I do
wonder what they would say, and how it would be written up. 

(btw - Diana - you might want to reassess this comment:
> -knows that his father is fully aware of what is attacking students
> in CoS, yet doesn't tell Dumbledore and does nothing to help 
> anyone -  he even complains that his father won't allow him 
> to help the 
> person doing the killing!

Nobody was killed, so there's no way that Draco could've wanted to help
whoever was doing "killings". At this point, what Draco knows is that
last time, someone died - but this time, all he knows is that Dumbledore
has told everyone that the Mandrakes will revive anyone who's petrified
- so it's a bad thing, but not quite the same as death. 

Diana also wrote that Draco...
> -is [more than likely, no solid canon yet] fully aware of the pain
> inflicted upon Harry at the hands of Voldemort; all witnessed by 
> Draco's, Goyle's and Crabbe's fathers

Nope, no canon. None at all. No reason to think that he has any idea
what happened in the graveyard. Do you really think that Lucius wrote it
all into an interceptable letter? Or had a conversation with Draco via
the fireplace, in those few days between the Third Task and the end of
term? Why do you think it's more than likely, when what we actually have
canon support for is quite the opposite - we *know* from CoS that Lucius
tells Draco to stay out of the attacks on the Muggleborns, and we *know*
from GoF that Draco is in the forrest, rather than with the Death
Eaters, during the marauding after the Cup. How does this mesh with your
contention that it's more than likely that Draco's aware of what
happened in the graveyard?

> -tries to get Harry and his friends expelled from Hogwarts
> many times 

Well, many times, they've broken school rules. They're out after hours,
they actually *do* have a dragon, and Harry is in Hogsmeade without a
permission slip. These are not permissible things, and while I do
understand that there can be a differentiation between breaking immoral
rules or breaking rules for the right reasons, I'm not quite sure what
the "right" reason would be to justify Harry's going to Hogsmeade.
Further, reporting a classmate to the teachers can be a tacky, mean,
silly or cruel thing to do - but if the student has *actually* done
something wrong, well, then the reporter can't personally do anything
about it - but the teachers certainly can! If Harry hadn't been in the
wrong, on some level, by being out after hours with Norbert, Professor
McG wouldn't've taken points. How is being a tattletale evil?



Side note about canon: 
> Cedric was more than likely not a
> Muggle- born student either, though canon does not mention 
> his parentage in 
> this regard.

Yes, it does. His father works for the Ministry, so at most he's a
half-and-half, like Seamus. 

I'm combining the next two bits that Diana posted, to give sort of a
transition to the train sequence - she says that Draco...
> -threatens Harry, Hermione and the Weasleys at the
> end of GoF with 
> death.  Draco's not just saying that - he really believes that his 
> father and Voldemort will bring about the deaths of everyone he's 
> talking to in that train car - and he gloats gleefully about it. 
> -gloats about the death of a student who never did him any harm, no 
> evidence of any in canon.  
> -is a raging bigot that advocates the torture, humiliation and death
> of Muggles, Muggle-born wizards and, using his term, Mudbloods
> 
I want to address the train scene, from outside Harry's perspective for
a moment. Diana and many other people have posted here in the past few
days that Draco provoked the trio - and Gred and Forge as well, into
feeling that cursing Draco was reasonable - and I recongize that it does
not seem to have been the intention of any of the individuals to knock
the three out, so I have to say that despite what I'm about to post in
here, I don't think that any of them were unreasonable to throw a curse
at Draco, Crabbe or Goyle. I mean, you hit someone with Jelly Legs, they
can curse you right back. 

But Draco didn't have his wand out, and even beyond that, if you look
only at Draco's words, it's quite clear that everything he's saying in
that scene is actually *true*. I don't think it's fair to say that it
was *definitely* a threat or *definitely* advocacy. Yes, he *really*
does believe that Voldemort (note: he *never mentions Lucius in that
scene) will bring the deaths of Muggle-borns and those who support
Muggles. 

Here's all he says in the train, with the qualifying Harry-perspective
removed:

"You caught some pathetic reporter, and Potter's Dumbledore's favorite
boy again. Big deal." 

"Trying not to think about it, are we? Trying to pretend it hasn't
happened?"

You've picked the losing side, Potter. I warned you! I told you you
ought to choose your company more carefully, remember? When we met on
the train, first day at Hogwarts? I told you not to hang around with
riffraff like this! Too late now, Potter! They'll be the first to go,
now the Dark Lord's back! Mudbloods and Muggle-lovers first! Well -
second - Diggory was the f-"

What in this little speech is untrue? Let's parse it, briefly:

First bit  - he's being dismissive, true. But is this sentence evil? Or
is he actually showing himself in agreement with them about Rita? Is
this a clue that she's misquoted him too?

Second bit - Again, is this sentence evil? Or is he asking them,
possibly unkindly, why they seem to be in denial about the great risk
that all three of them are in - Harry because he's Harry, and Hermione
and Ron because they're his friends, moreso than for any reason. And if
he's asking them, is it *just possible* that he is simply curious?

Third bit - and probably one of the more non-SHIP-debated sections of
GoF... What is he saying that is a definite lie? He thinks Harry's side
will lose - if he was perfectly chipper about this, why does he say
"warned"? To taunt? Oh, possibly. But is it definite? Isn't it possible
- just a little bit possible - that he's again *warning* Harry, Ron and
Hermione of the threat that truly comes to them from the Dark's corner?
Perhaps he is - but also, perhaps, he has to be guarded in how he warns
them, because he's not alone - Crabbe and Goyle are with him, and it's
entirely possible that they tell Lucius what Draco says and does. And it
seems to be common knowledge that Voldemort's targets last time were
muggle-born wizards and witches and those who supported Muggles - so to
say that Mudbloods and Muggle-lovers will be the first ones that
Voldemort will go after is, well, true. 

If you look at it as a warning - badly and quite gittishly given - the
import of it changes - without requiring the reader to actually change
their take on Harry, Ron and Hermione's reaction to his speech. In other
words, he could be honestly warning them - he wasn't threatening to do
*anything* to them at that moment, no matter how you read canon (his
wand was not out) - and the trio's reaction could be quite
reasonable-at-the-time. 

Here's a brief fanfic illustration of how, from Draco's perspective, the
visit to their cabin could've been in warning, not as a threat:

***********************

He heard Hermione again, saying she'd put Rita in a jar. She must've
found her while in her Animagus form, Draco realized. He heard Hermione
say, "I've put an Unbreakable Charm on the jar, you see, so she can't
transform. And I've told her she's to keep her quill to herself for a
whole year. See if she can't break the habit of writing horrible lies
about people."

No, Draco thought. That wouldn't do at all. That would infuriate Lucius
more than learning his son was studying with a Mudblood would. He had to
talk to her, to warn her, to trade his information for her jarred bug.
But to do it with Weasley and Potter there would be unbearable. He
couldn't explain it plainly, he'd have to be oblique. She would
understand. She always did, even when he was being cryptic. 

He pulled his wand from the door, ending the spell, as Greg and Vin
surrounded him, asking what he was going to do. "I need to talk to
them," Draco said. "It's a Prophet thing. Come in with me, or go back to
your poker game." 

Neither of them spoke as Draco slid the door open. 

Draco spoke slowly, buying time to think as he moved a little ways into
the compartment, a nervous smile, which he hoped was ingratiating,
playing on his lips... He said, "You caught some pathetic reporter, and
Potter's Dumbledore's favorite boy again. Big deal." *There are bigger
deals, and you need to think about them*. 

He opened his eyes wide, trying to look as honest and open as he could.
Vin and Greg just looked puzzled. Draco wished they'd left; he could've
said more if they hadn't been there, but however dim they could be in
classes, there was always a risk that they would repeat something he
said - something poorly planned, ill-considered - and tell Lucius. 

I have to get them to focus on the matter at hand, Draco thought. 

"Trying not to think about it, are we?" said Draco softly, looking at
Hermione, then glancing at Potter and Weasley. "Trying to pretend it
hasn't happened?"

"Get out," shouted Potter. 

I will not, Draco thought. You may not want to hear this, but I am going
to make sure that Hermione knows what risk she's taking, being friends
with you. If she had a lower profile, if she wasn't at your side all the
damned time, nobody would notice her, she'd be just another Mudblood
witch who gets good grades. And people could overlook that. They can't
overlook her when she's with you. 

"You've picked the losing side, Potter! I warned you! I told you you
ought to choose your company more carefully, remember? When we met on
the train, first day at Hogwarts? I told you not to hang around with
riffraff like this!" He jerked his head at Weasley and looked at
Hermione with a sort of desperation in his eyes. Please understand what
I'm saying, he thought, staring at Hermione. Just hear me out, make
those annoying friends of your listen. "Too late now, Potter! They'll be
the first to go, now the Dark Lord's back!" And if you don't act more
cautiously, you'll get your friends killed. "Mudbloods and Muggle-lovers
first! Well - second - Diggory was the f-"

Before he could finish his sentence, before he could say that what
happened to Cedric could have happened to any other student, any student
who was at Potter's side, a box of fireworks exploded in the
compartment, and everything went black.

**************************************

> Draco's actions throughout the four books are many times
> reprehensible.  There are a few times when his sneering facade 
> falters, such as when Hermione makes the comment that the Gryffindor 
> Quiddtich team all got in on pure talent, while Draco had his father 
> buy his way onto to their team for one example.  When Harry makes W
> the comment about Draco's mom looking like she's was smelling dung 
> [just before Moody shows up and turns Draco into a ferret], Draco's 
> facade slips there too. 

Right. And when Hermione slaps him, he doesn't respond negatively at the
time, and we have no evidence that he goes to a teacher to complain
either. How does this square with your belief that he's evil? I'm not
even sure that reprehensible applies to many of the things he's done,
such as reporting Harry for breaking school rules (although if he really
did trick Harry into being out after hours for the duel, that would
qualify... But he was *eleven* at the time!)

Irene's post of yesterday matches my take on the situation quite well:

<<Oh dear, now we judge Snape on the basis of Sirius's impressions? 
Sirius, of all people? Can you imaging Harry's portrait painted by 
Draco? How close to reality that would be? But Draco is bad boy and 
Sirius is so ever noble and fair. OK, how about Cedric's portrait as 
painted by Fred and George in PoA?>>

If you're going to walk away from GoF convinced that fourteen (or at
least no more than fifteen) year old Draco is evil, and cite to things
he did as an eleven or twelve year old, do you also feel that Sirius is
evil for being a grown man, and insulting Snape? Or for the insults he
(likely) threw at Snape as a teenager? Or for the Prank itself? 

If you don't, then it's a bit unfair to say that Draco is, at this
moment in canon, evil. 

Snarky. Obnoxious. Bratty. Sometimes sulky (see end of COS). Vengeful. 

Evil? Where?


Btw - Diana, would love to see you submit your fanfic to TheDarkArts.org
Please let me know if you need help wih the fanfic submission process
(http://www.fictionalley.org/submit.html). 

Heidi