SHIP: Another R/H question for Ebony (was Ron and Hermione do TOO banter!)

[Ebony <selah_1977@yahoo.com>]

No: HPFGUIDX 50431

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, Susanne <siskiou at e...> wrote:
> If you are convinced that JKR is writing foreshadowing for
> H/H, and that, while Ron likes Hermione, she doesn't like
> him, I don't understand why you think Hermione would date
> Ron, then.
>
> Even if you believe they are going to break up quickly.



Easily.  :-D

I don't think there is any actual H/H in the books from PS/SS to 
GoF.  I don't think there's any R/H, either.

Hermione would date Ron for a number of reasons, none of which 
necessarily have to be "Hermione likes Ron and only Ron".  One reason 
among many:  her friendship with Ron is changing, and she isn't sure 
how to deal with the change without losing Ron in the process.  So 
she dates him.

> It just doesn't make any sense, unless you think Hermione
> would feel pressured into dating Ron, which I don't see at
> all.
> 
> Hermione has a backbone and no trouble telling Ron what she
> thinks of his behavior, when need be, so I honestly can't
> see her date someone she doesn't want to.

Not necessarily external pressure, no.  Hermione is the author of 
half of her own stress (observe what happened PoA).  She'd do a very 
good job of pressuring herself.  In fact, we see her explaining Ron 
to Harry mid-GoF when the two boys are at odds.

And telling Ron that his behavior is daft and potentially crushing 
Ron are two very different things.

> Do you think Hermione is going to be so angry/distraught
> over Harry not liking her back, that she will turn to Ron?

More than that.  If Hermione likes Harry at this point (and I don't 
think that can be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt), I would imagine 
that she knows that he does not see her that way, likes Cho, and will 
likely never see her that way.  I don't seeing dating Ron as the 
result of anger; I see it as possibly being one of resignation.


> I really don't see Romance taking such a front spot in HP,
> and I truly hope JKR will not change to romance as the main
> plot advancement.

Oh, but any good subplot is nicely tangled in the main threads of the 
narrative IMO.  Romance included.  I don't think much of the 
devaluation of romance and sentimentality in our postmodern society 
anyway... but then again, my specialty is 19th century lit, so I 
might just be mucking about in antiquated ways of thinking.

There are so many non-cliched and non-soap operatic ways to tie in 
romance to the main plot.  Of the OBHWF ships, I actually like H/G 
more because I speculate that it would be more interesting... I love 
Ginny as a character and believe that JKR could convince me of 
Harry/Ginny by Book 7.  OTOH, I doubt if anyone, even JKR, could 
convince me of the plausibility of R/H.  

There are authors whose work I love, but whose romantic subplots I 
loathe.  There are authors who can write great romantic scenes, but 
truthfully stink.  I cheerfully make this distinction all the time in 
my reading.

I like H/H in fanon, but I would be a bit disappointed if I saw great 
lashings of it in OotP.  This is because I am not as much H/H as I am 
totally against R/H.  And unfortunately, too often in this fandom 
being anti-R/H means being labeled as anti-Ron.

> And if things get this tangled, JKR would have to spend
> quite a bit of time sorting out the love life of her
> characters.

Not if those love lives had direct implications for the plot.  I can 
tell you canon-plausible scenarios for Harry/Ginny and Ron/Hermione.  
The former would be fairly interesting.  The latter?  You won't like 
what I'd have too say.

At this point, usually the opposing side will quote JKR's words about 
her upcoming intended romances at me--she did say that the romances 
would be "nothing too gritty".  I don't think she meant that we would 
see happy romances without trouble.  I think she meant we wouldn't 
see anything romantic that was above a PG rating in future books... 
and thank goodness.  Fanon's gotten extreme enough.

So yes, I expect for the romances to have angst.

> Another thing I really don't want to see is Hermione turning
> into the female character every male close to her wants.
> Victor, Neville, Ron, Harry, Draco...

Oh, but I can't give you a full "amen" there.  Sorry.

The latter two boys don't like Hermione at all as of GoF, unless you 
deem Harry's lack of interest or Draco's vicious taunts as "like".

Yet I can make the case that the former three do like her in some 
degree as of GoF.  The case is strongest for Viktor, very convincing 
for Ron, and somewhat convincing for Neville.

That's already three boys.

And she made all of those heads turn and those jaws drop at the Yule 
Ball.

Now, I tend to agree with Susanne's last statement... but I also 
think that there's a sort of shallow satisfaction in going from being 
the girl whom no one wants to the girl who catches the eye of a 
highly desirable (in the eyes of others) guy.


> I have the feeling we'll see just a few more hints in the
> next book, with a few humorous misunderstandings (at least
> some people will see them as funny) and probably more boy
> cluelessness.

Maybe... but they are 15.  I suppose I'd have to visit the UK to see 
what's normal for that age bracket there.

However, with the tone of the next book, and all the 1000 non-
shipping things that I cared about and discussed to death a year and 
a half ago, I think the kids will have to grow up fast.  I don't 
think you'll see quite the same lighthearted tone of mid-GoF ever 
again in this series.

> Once Ron sorts out his feelings, he may even back off
> because of his insecurities, wanting Hermione to find
> someone who can "offer her more".
> He may think he's not "good enough" for her.
>
> Maybe he'll think Harry would be the right candidate, while
> Hermione wants Ron to get over himself and ask her out ;)

This is certainly a possibility.  However, it would necessitate for 
some character development on Ron's part.  I don't see any canon 
evidence that he is capable of such magnamity.

And as for your last statement, I really don't read either Ron or 
Hermione's characterization that way.  If I did, I'd be a happy R/H 
shipper.

--Ebony