[HPforGrownups] Hermione/Snape (OoP and a bit from PS/SS)

[Shaun Hately]

No: HPFGUIDX 70114

On 13 Jul 2003 at 20:30, Robert A. Rosenberg wrote:

> At 09:45 +1000 on 07/13/2003, Shaun Hately wrote about Re: 
> [HPforGrownups] Hermione/Snape (OoP and a bit from PS/S:
> 
> I think someone can be both. There are two aspects of Teaching a 
> Subject - Lecturing (the act of transferring knowledge to the 
> students) and Instruction (The act of interacting with a student by 
> answering their questions [to clarify their absorption/understanding 
> of the subject matter] and asking them questions to test their 
> knowledge of the subject matter).

I agree with this. But I would say that unless a person can do both, 
they can't be described as a good teacher - one or the other may allow 
them to be adequate.
 
> Snipe seems to be good at the former - It is in the interaction with 
> the students that he has problems.  The former is good reason for him 
> to teach, the latter is a reason why he should be restricted to 
> lecturing with someone-else handling the testing and clarification 
> aspects (ie: The so called Lab section). Potions fits into this 
> format since it is not a pure learning course but also has an "Apply 
> that Knowledge" aspect that would allow the off loading of the "Ask 
> for Clarification" and "See if the Students are understanding" aspect 
> of the Course to the Teacher/Instructor who handles the Lab.

Yes, but from what we see at Hogwarts, job-sharing isn't an option - so 
to be an effective teacher there, one needs to be able to do both.

> Part of the teachers behavior is dependent on what subject they are 
> teaching. A PE (Phys Ed/Gym) teacher (or Army Drill 
> Instructor/Sergeant) would be within their "Job Spec" to make fun of 
> an out-of-shape student as a way of motivating them to get into shape.

True to an extent - but irrelevant as Snape is not a physical education 
teacher. I can see no educative value to the comment (I've made it clear 
on previous occasions that I can see a potential educative value to 
other incidents).

> Why not just look at it that Neville needed support and confidence 
> building that Snipe was unable/unwilling to give and it was only when 
> Snipe's presence was removed (at the OWLS) that Neville could perform 
> at an acceptable level. IOW: Snipe's treatment of Neville was CAUSING 
> the failures not Neville's inherent inability to learn or perform. As 
> I've said above (and in prior messages) there is a difference between 
> Teaching (Lecturing) and Instructing (interacting with the Students). 
> Neville needed a good Instructor but was given a Teacher who was 
> unable/unwilling to function as an Instructor.

The thing is, as you say, Neville was apparently able to perform 
acceptably when tested by someone else. This does suggest that he has 
learned something in five years of Snape's classes - and he's learned it 
effectively. That's why I'm not sure what I think of Snape's treatment 
of Neville - it seems to me it may have served a real purpose.

> You are forgetting the aftermath of the incident. She gets her teeth 
> not only restored to their original size but reduced to a more 
> "normal" size. She gives as her reason that she had hang-ups about 
> the size of her teeth, which her parents were unwilling to rectify, 
> so she took matters into her own hands when presented with the chance 
> to have the problem magically corrected. Given her STATED hang-ups 
> about the size of her teeth, her "hiding her face" when they were 
> enlarged is perfectly understandable

Yes, and I agree with that - my point was not that Hermione wasn't 
hiding her face because of her appearance - it was that I do not believe 
her hiding her face is a sign she understand Snape's character 
particularly well (which is what was being suggested). I don't think she 
hides it because she doesn't want Snape specifically to see it - she 
hides it because she doesn't want ANYBODY to see it.

Yours Without Wax, Dreadnought
Shaun Hately | www.alphalink.com.au/~drednort/thelab.html
(ISTJ)       | drednort at alphalink.com.au | ICQ: 6898200 
"You know the very powerful and the very stupid have one
thing in common. They don't alter their views to fit the 
facts. They alter the facts to fit the views. Which can be 
uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that 
need altering." The Doctor - Doctor Who: The Face of Evil
Where am I: Frankston, Victoria, Australia