[HPforGrownups] Re: Deaths in OotP

[Kelly Grosskreutz]

No: HPFGUIDX 70389


> --- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Kelly Grosskreutz"
> <ivanova at i...> wrote:
> THE DEATHS OF HARRY POTTER AND THE ORDER OF THE PHOENIX
> <SNIP>  SIRIUS BLACK- Thinking about this death is what prompted me
> to start this whole project. There are tons of witnesses, so we don't
> have a second-hand report. We watched it happen. However, we do not
> have a body. The body disappeared. So, is he dead?
> Let's take a close look at this scene. Sirius and Bellatrix are
> dueling. Sirius ducks Bella's first red light spell. He taunts her,
> then is hit by a second jet of red light.
>
> <A.G.>  We do not know the color of the second jet of light-many
> assume red because of prior spell, but this is not stated.
>
You're right.  But I still say it was not AK due to my reasons below.

> <KG>
> We see his eyes widen in shock, although the laughter has not yet
> faded. He is still alive at this point. He begins to fall, sinking
> backward through the veil. As he falls through, his expression
> changes yet again, going from the shock we saw a moment ago into
> fear and surprise. This indicates that Bellatrix's spell did not kill
> him, as his face was quickly changing expression the whole time he
> was falling up to the time he disappears. Keep in mind, though, that
> the last expression we do see is fear and surprise, two emotions that
> are commonly connected to the face of a man who has just realized his
> moment has come and death has come for him. This would indicate that
> we see the exact moment that Sirius knows he is going to die, seconds
> before he passes through the veil.
>
> <A.G.>  all fear and surprise indicate is that Sirius was surprised
> that his cousin Bella got the best of him (recall his arrogant
> goading (spp?)); and fear-could be just that "FEAR".  After all if
> Sirius knows he is NOT dead but is passing through the veil-he could
> be afraid of what is on the other side.
>
As I just said in another post, I get the idea that many of the adults knew
what this room was and what the veil meant.  If this is the case, and if
Sirius is one of them, then he knew that he was a dead man.  Otherwise,
wouldn't he see the veil much like Harry does, as nothing to be too
concerned about?  IIRC, all it looks like is an archway with a curtain
hanging from it.  Yes, it is rippling in a nonexistent breeze, but otherwise
it doesn't look menacing.  But yet Sirius is afraid.

> Now, do I think he is dead-YES!  But, we know from Voldemort's claims
> that the dead can be resurrected-he tries to convert Harry by
> promising just that with his parents in COS(?)  We also know that
> communication with the dead is possible: poltergeists, ghosts, seers,
> magical portraits, centaurs, divination, etc.  Too, we know that the
> character of Sirius may return as a voice, a fragment of a dream, a
> vision in a mirror (Erised or otherwise magical mirror) or perhaps
> take form in a spell of protection (like James in Harry's patronus).
> So, I do think JKR being what she is-will use the character again in
> either or both of book 6 and 7.  There are too many mysteries
> surrounding his role the night of the Potter deaths, and his family
> tree for us not to have "visits" of some type from Sirius.
>
I'm sure we'll see more flashback sequences (Oct 31, 1981 sounds good...)
that will have Sirius in them.  Maybe some other forms.  But no ghost, and
definitely no living Sirius.

Kelly Grosskreutz
http://www.idcnet.com/~ivanova