Hogwarts Tuition/Thoughts on Crooked noses: wasWeasley Family

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 73236

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "megalynn44" <megalynn44 at h...>
wrote:
> 
> > bboy_mn:
> > Where in canon do you see anything other than the vaguest 
> > subtle hint that people do pay tuition. 
> 
> Me:
> 
> Um... see my last post from which you are replying. Seriously 
> though, there isn't even a hint that Hogwarts is free.
> 

bboy_mn:

I did, and my question still stands. You ask where is there a hint
that it is free, then you gave me nothing but opinion to support it
not being free.

There is more logical reason for it's lack of mention to support it's
lack of existance, than it's lack of mention supporting the existance
of tuition. 


> bboy_mn:
> I seems like if it was a big deal, it would have been mentioned.
> 
> Me:
> 
> But that's the thing it is NOT a big deal, it's just as normal to
> pay for education as it is for food, clothing, and everything else 
> in life.
> 

bboy_mn:
But it is a big deal. In your life story has the high cost of tuition
ever been mentioned? Tuition is routine and accepted in your life, but
I find it hard to believe the subject has never come up. In fact, I
think you just brought it up.

As far as HP, 'food, clothing, and everything' have come up and their
high cost has been mentioned more than once. So why wouldn't tuition
be mentioned?


> bboy_mn:
> > Alternatives-
> > Maybe the founders of the school combined their fortunes and 
> > gave the school an endowment. 
> > 
> > Then on top of that endowment, alumni support the school by 
> > donations.
> > 
> > It's possible that the 12 Governors of the Board of Governors of
> > Hogwarts are probably the 12 largest donors to the school. 

> 
> Me: As I said before the simplest explanation is almost always 
> the correct one. I go to a State run college. ..edited...
> 

bboy_mn:

And I assume that this is a modern state run MUGGLE school that spends
enough money on just heating and cooling alone to support a small
third world country.


> bboy_mn:
> > 
> > What are the actual expenses for the school? The biggest 
> > expenses are food and staff. Elves work for free. Heat comes from 
> > magical fires or from wood from the forest. The building is 
> > already there; it's made of stone, so how much maintenance does it
> > need. Plus, most  maintenance can be accomplished with magic. So 
> > where are the real expenses that would require the need for 
> >tuition?
> 
> Me:
> You drastically underestimate the cost of making 3 multiple 
> course meals for 1000 people everyday for 10 months out of the 
> year.  

bboy_mn:
Oh, I think I do, and Hogwarts enrollment of 1,000 in all likelihood
is a generalization as to the relative size of the school. I seriously
doubt that the enrollment is a constant 1,000.000000 students at all
times. Given Harry's apparent class size, enrollment is likely down at
this point in time; more like (rough estimate) 600. Admittedly, that
is still a lot of mouths to feed.

Next, I seriously doubt that Hogwarts teachers are pulling down
salaries equal to college professor. I see them more in the small town
 high school teacher price range.


> Labor fees are also always a huge chunk of any businesses costs.
> Maintenence on a house can eat up thousands in a yearly income, 
> ...

bboy_mn:
Sure if you are hiring union construction workers and paying union
wages, and wasting money on ill concieved ideas and poor planning like
most state schools.


> I can't just wave that off as all done by magic, especially since 
> the books clearly show that wizards are bound by money too. 

bboy_mn:
Then I would have to wonder how four witches and wizards managed to
build what is probably the largest castle in the world. I just don't
see the 4 of them out there hauling and chiseling rock. Magic and
available money are the only reasonable explanations.

If the 4 of them had the money to build that castle then they without
a doubt were people of substantial wealth, and it seems very
reasonable that they would have endowed the school with a substantial
fortune. A fortune which, if managed wisely, could have easily
compounded over 1,000 years into a still substantial amount of money.


> But I think it vastly to complicated to say they can go to a school 
> like Hogwarts for free.
> 
>  ~Megalynn

I will amend what I said, by pointing out that Hogwarts is the only
wizarding school in Britain, and therefore, I could see it supported
to some degree by taxes, but it is clear that the Board of Governors
runs the school, and that the 'state' has limited ability to control
the school. Dumbledore reminded Fudge that Fudge did not have the
authority to expell students.

The government interference at Hogwarts was the result of the wizard
government passing law that specifically allowed it to interfer. If it
wasn't for the separation of church and state, the US government could
pass laws that allowed it to interfer in the running of private
religious colleges. Fortunately, we have safeguards against that. So,
it Hogwarts is a 'state' funded school then how come the state has so
little say in how it is run?

Finally, with everything that has been made of the Weasley's being
poor, and all the other expenses they complain about, I simply can't
see them overlooking mentioning school tuition. 

Endowment, donations, magic, and fantasy are the major sources of
funding at Hogwarts.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

bboy_mn