MAGIC DISWASHER, Dumbledore Dead, Pensieve, Head Boys and duty

[Grey Wolf]

No: HPFGUIDX 59294

Pickle Jimmy wrote:
> Dumbledore will be there until the end (MAGIC DISHWASHER) - others 
> will drop like flies, but from what we have so far, JK is a better 
> author than to make such an "obvious" move.
> 
> Just my opinion
> 
> Pickle Jimmy

Err... I'm afraid, Pickle Jimmy, that you're putting ideas into MAGIC 
DISHWASHER that simply are not there. For the record, and to prevent 
people from missinterpreting MD even more, MD *does not* say that 
Dumbledore will live until the end of the books. It does not say he 
will not, either. Because MD does not try to predict the future plots 
of the books, just to explain what has been going on behind the scenes 
so far. To me and to many others it is obvious that Harry is not the 
centre of his universe, there are things, plans, plots, etc that don't 
concern him directly, and many that even when they do, he knows nothing 
about. MD is an attempt to explain what those things are. Predicting 
characters's deaths is outside the objectives and intentions of MD.

Anna "dradamsapple" wrote:
> I'm re-listening to GoF (got a long commute to and from work), and 
> I've just heard the whole 'Harry and the Pensive' section, and it 
> occured to me, that perhaps Dumbledore left the door to the cabinet 
> partially opened hoping that Harry would find the Pensive and 'fall 
> into it'.  Somehow, I get the feeling that he (DD) meant for Harry to 
> find out about Crouch Jr., and Bagman and Snape, and for that matter, 
> what happened to the Longbottoms.  This obviously fuels Harrys' anger 
> towards Lord Voldie.  I know that DD told Harry that he was using the 
> Pensive just before Snape and Mad-Eye and (was it Fudge?) came in, 
> but I think that DD knew that Harry was on his way as well, or at 
> least was hopeful.
> 
> But I'm still lost at the whole "twinkle in DD's eye" after Harry 
> finishes the third task. (I haven't gotten to that part yet on the 
> cd, this time 'round.)  I know that there have been some theories 
> tossed around about DD, and where his loyalties really lie, but I 
> just haven't figured it out yet.
> 
> Anna

Hi, Anna, long time no see!

First, if you like that sort of theories where Dumbledore is arranging 
matters to give Harry especifically an education against Voldemort, can 
I recommend you MAGIC DISHWASHER? It also includes an explanaition on 
the gleam of triumph of Dumbledore's eye, so you get two for one!

Anyway, back to the pensieve. As much as I would like to credit 
Dumbledore for arranging it so Harry would get all that information, it 
doesn't particularly wash, I'm afraid, as you have described it. 
Although Dumbledore seems to know what has been going on in the school, 
I don't think it is feasible to imagine that he could know straight 
away after Harry was pained by the scar that he would be dropping for a 
visit. He tells Harry that he knows about previous occasions through 
Sirius, so it's second hand knowledge. And Harry doesn't tell anyone he 
was going to visit Dumbledore, so unless we assume omniscient powers of 
precognition to Dumbledore, there is no way he can know.

Then, we have the length of the meeting. How long have they been there? 
if it is more than 10 or 15 minutes, then Harry's pain and subsequent 
decision of visiting Dumbledore came *after* the start of the meeting, 
when Dumbledore has already put the pensieve in the cupboard.

Furthermore, the idea of "just in case" rubs me wrong. Harry doesn't go 
to that office all that much - why would he have to that particular 
day? ok, so maybe it's been half open all year, just in case, but 
that's a little too contrived for my tastes.

However, I have a better idea. There is one moment when Dumbledore 
knows Harry is outside the door - when Moody mentions it. At that 
point, Dumbledore, who is a wizard after all, realising Harry is going 
to stay unattended in his office for a while, might have accio'ed the 
cupboard door ever so slightly so he could indeed see all those 
recolections about the trials. Dumbledore has ample time to perform 
that or a similar spell, really, and at that point it is a spur of the 
moment decission to further Harry's knowledge, which is always a good 
thing.

Beth wrote:
> Something that occurred to me as I re-read the books is that James 
> was Head Boy in his day, according to Hagrid, but he and Sirius were 
> also said to have been as much trouble as Gred and Forge. So how 
> does one be a prefect in charge of one's best friend, who loves to 
> cause trouble? How will it be for Hermione if she is made a prefect, 
> yet she knows what kind of bending the rules Harry and Ron do? And 
> wasn't "cool" Bill also a Head Boy? For those of you who know, it 
> isn't exactly like being a resident assistant in college, right? So 
> how much latitude for "coolness" is there?
> 
> Beth 

I think that James became much more "formal" in the last year of 
Hogwarts, when he was made Head boy. But that's sidestepping the 
question, becasue I think we can assume he was also prefect, which 
would've been at the time of the roaming of the marauders (years 5 and 
6). We have, however, a nice piece of canon to go with this matter: 
Sirius tells Peter that any of them would've died before being 
traitors, which I feel is a good description of how the marauders felt. 
So James would've kept the antics of Sirius to himself, or just treated 
them as the twins antics are treated: an entertainement that is useless 
to try and stop.

Beyond that, I think that James was Head Boy due to outstanding 
academic achivements, not because he was particularly saintly. To this 
day, I'm not sure what a Head Boy is suposed to do, but maybe someone 
that's admired and sets a good example in some way is enough. 
Interestingly, the three examples you have mentioned (Percy, Bill and 
James) are very different, except for the fact of all having very good 
grades, so that seems to be the main focus. Their regard of disregard 
for the rules is not as important as being someone of dependable 
abilities.

Hope that helps,

Grey Wolf