[HPforGrownups] Re: OOP: The mirror of Erised

[Jesta Hijinx]

No: HPFGUIDX 59555

You know:

> > Dim the lights.
> >
> > Cue the spooky organ music.
> >
> > Self-fulfilling prophecy...
> >
> > Harry being with is parents....
> >
> > Who says Harry's desire can't come true?
> >
> > Ron can certainly achieve his desires in his life.
> >
> > But Harry can also achieve his desire. True his parent can't come back
> > and join him, but he can go join them. (Sudden loud rushing chord of
> > organ music that slowly fades)
> >
> > What if, in the end, we see the Potter ghost family reunited again in
> > death. (Sudden loud rushing chord of organ music that slowly fades)
>
>
>
>me, digger: [Newbie 1st post, Hi all]
>
>My prediction for OOP is similar. (it might have been aired here before,
>apols in advance if so)
>
>Harry does go to see his parents in the land of the dead, but he does it
>while he is still alive. A portal to the land of the dead is in that
>mysterious room we know he has not yet found. (I think that room is
>something like the mirror of erised, it shows you what you desire, like
>Dumbledore's chamber pots)
>
>The Order of the Phoenix is an honour awarded to those individuals who
>manage to travel to the land of the dead while alive, and sucessfully
>return to the land of the living. So Harry will be able to visit his
>parents, but because they are dead, he won't be able to bring them back
>through the door.
>
This is a fascinating theory - I'd never even thought of this possibility 
before - but it *is* one possible interpretation of the word "Phoenix" in 
this context.

I can't think of any particularly solid reasons why or why not on either 
side; it might be the way JKR decides to write it.  There are certainly 
other myths, legends, tales and epic fantasies that have this sort of 
occurrence in them - I have noted on this list before that, while a fresh 
and clever writer, JKR is not a particularly *original* writer.  Some of the 
theories that get run on the lists occasionally seem very wild and a "reach" 
to me, with no insult intended to the cleverness of the originators nor 
their ability to support their theories with quotes from canon - but I keep 
looking back at Rowling and going, "No, that strays too far from her usual 
complexity level".  She's able to bring in a lot of popular culture and word 
play very cleverly, and that is what I admire most about her; but she's not 
*that* original of a plotter.  The one *real* surprise she gave me was Barty 
Crouch Jr. as Moody - and that was a blow to me, because I liked the real 
wisdom and ability Moody had displayed over the school year (and I keep 
coming back to 'was all that character *really* in Barty Crouch Jr. all 
along - if so, it wasn't very evident in the glimpses we got of his young 
self at his trial - or is polyjuice potion a whole lot stronger than we 
realize?  ;-)  - the last is rhetorical, by the way).

But think about it:  every year, there's a new DADA teacher so far; every 
year, that's been where a bunch of the conflict or change or even bungled 
solutions have occurred.  Most of the other characters thus far are really 
*caricatures* in some way - plot devices.  I refuse to get drawn into too 
deep of an analysis of the Dursleys because I don't believe they're hiding 
any major secrets - they're caricatures, drawn that horrible and bad to be 
something that Harry is happy to get away from.  The professors never really 
change from year to year; they don't even reveal much that's new or 
interesting about themselves.

The major growth and change is with the central three, most particularly 
Harry himself, internally.  Because that's what this story is all about, in 
many different levels, and that's the part that needs the attention and 
detail and depth and word count.  And (yes, watch me bring it back to the 
subject line at last) harry's perennial challenges *have* been getting more 
serious and deadly each year.  She's going to have some doing to cap the 
last one.  Something like travelling to the land of the dead and returning 
when eveyrone thought he was a goner (what if it's *Harry's* faux death JKR 
was having trouble writing???) might be a challenge to cap the ending of the 
last book.  And I could see awarding "the Order of the Phoenix" in that 
case.

I feel compelled to advance another theory, however - mine isn't very solid 
largely because there aren't that many things I get worked up into breaking 
down in the whole series at this point (the "who's a pureblood, who's not" 
argument obviously not being one of those ;-)) - is that my initial thought 
when I read about the Order of the Phoenix is that the Order of the Phoenix 
is like the old legendary one that was supposed to exist in late Roman times 
(I have friends who argue back and forth about whether they've "proved" its 
existence or not and it's not something I follow closely enough to examine 
the evidence, but there is a belief in its existence, which can be enough in 
some cases) - whose main and sole purpose was the preservation of the 
Empire.  It had membership only at the highest levels and the early vestiges 
of that unit of organization of the "cell" where only one or two other 
people knew of your membership and existence, and you in turn only knew of 
two or three others, so as to reduce the possible damage if one member were 
caught or discovered and tortured to reveal knowledge.  They allegedly did 
their work with codes and secret messenger services and occasionally 
authorized assassinations, etc.

it can't be something identical, obviously, since membership has been 
publicly noted; but what if it's something that appears on the surface to be 
some sort of honorarium for scholars, kind of a "fuddy-duddy" circle on the 
outside - but its inner purpose is actually what I said?  What if Harry is 
gradually brought into knowledge of and membership in this circle because of 
who and what he is?  Perhaps his place there is hereditary?  Perhaps it's 
"earned" once he's old enough because they just can't figure out why he was 
able to stand off Voldemort, and they feel they need his help once he can 
handle the truth.  *shrug*

>I bet that Dumbledore, as a most powerful wizard, can do this.
>Conversly, Voldemort, by being in fear of death, and seeking
>immortality, has never attempted it. If Harry can do this, he will gain
>power and knowledge that V will never have, and this will aid him in the
>fight against Voldemort.
>
>digger
>
And to return to your theory, that would fit in well with what's happened so 
far.  As I said, I can see no particular canonical reason either for or 
against it = which means it's as likely as anything I've seen out there so 
far.  :-)

Felinia Beauclerc

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