Dumbledore's awarding of points PS/SS

[darrin_burnett]

No: HPFGUIDX 56972


> Darrin:
> > > >
> He's also sending the message that Ron and Neville's courage, 
> Hermione's cleverness and Harry's honor are worth more than Draco's 
> cunning.
> > > >
> 
> Laura again:
> Isn't that exactly the point I was trying to make?  Let's ignore 
the 
> whole "Why isn't Hermione in Ravenclaw" issue for a minute and 
think 
> about this.  Honor and courage= Gryffindor.  Cunning= Slytherin.  
And 
> Dumbledore is trying to send what message, did you say?

Now I say: (Or, Darrin say, for easier quoting:)

No, I did NOT say Dumbledore was saying "Gryff good, Slyth bad."

I said he was saying, "Harry, Ron and Hermione good, Draco bad."

There IS a difference.

As I said, Harry, Ron, Hermione and earned their points trying to 
keep a powerful magical item from falling into the wrong hands. Harry 
himself clearly states that points no longer matter, because if 
Voldemort comes back, who gives a rat's butt about points? (I'm 
paraphrasing)

Draco's cunning was all about points, and he succeeded. 

Dumbledore, I felt, made a clear distinction. 

Can you imagine Draco, or any Slytherin student we've met so far, 
saying, "I will open myself up for a giant stone chess piece to 
attack and maybe kill me so you can go forward" like Ron did? 

And that's why Ron's deeds are worth more than Draco skulking around, 
trying to get Gryffindor to lose points.

There is another side to the "humiliated Slyths" argument. Harry, 
Ron, Hermione and Neville all took great risks, and, in the case of 
all but Hermione, suffered physical harm for their troubles.

Would it not be an insult to them to just kind of quietly pull them 
aside and say, "well, you won, good show, hope your bruises are 
healing nicely."

> This is exactly my point- Slytherin has a bad rap.  Hagrid 
> incorrectly states that all of the Dark Wizards were from 
Slytherin, and everyone has a negative stereotype against them.  And 
in my opinion, Dumbledore perpetuates this stereotype as much as 
anyone else.
> 
 Sure, some of the Slytherins are nasty- but isn't that the point 
that JKR is trying to make?  

So far, ALL the Slytherins are nasty. Snape, though on the right side 
(apparently), is still a loathsome individual in his personal 
conduct. As for the students who have merited more than a name, we 
have a spoiled rich kid in Draco, bullies, thugs and cheaters in 
Crabbe, Goyle and Flint and a gossipy bitch in Pansy.

The Slytherin Quiddtich team are all portrayed as cheaters and other 
Slytherins, though unnamed, applaud Harry sarcastically after he 
loses points, refuse to stand to honor Cedric Diggory, and make snake 
faces in GoF after Harry is revealed to be a Parslemouth.

At some point, it stops being a stereotype and starts being a trend.

> I'm dying for this stereotype against Slytherin to be gotten rid 
of, and I honestly don't think Dumbledore does much to abolish it, 
> despite his open mind and second chances.

Snape still has a job, doesn't he? Didn't Dumbledore testify on 
Snape's behalf in GoF? Didn't Dumbledore tell Harry not once, but 
twice, that Snape was to be trusted? 

Just as he is judging Snape on his individual merits, I think 
Dumbledore was making a judgement about the conduct of five students, 
Harry, Ron, Hermione, Neville and Draco, not about the houses 
themselves.
 
> Also, why is cunning necessarily a bad thing?  How do you think 
Snape collected information for Dumbledore?  
> 

Again, Draco's cunning is what I was saying Dumbledore was taking 
issue with. When Draco risks his life to switch sides, then he gets 
to be what Snape is. Until then, he is a little brat.

Darrin
-- Thinking that any "good" Slytherin who dares show his face would 
get a Leg-Locker put on him by Draco.