Lily Evans Potter relationship to Voldemort

[darrin_burnett]

No: HPFGUIDX 58055

Ray:

> 
> 1.  You can't read too much into what Lily said to Voldemort in the moments 
> before her death.  Her husband had just been killed, possibly before her 
> eyes, and the killer was advancing on her infant son.  Few people can think 
> clearly in that situation.
> 

Agreed, but the points is that she was speaking, not brandishing her wand 
and not attacking. So, the idea that V-Mort didn't want to kill her and she 
forced his hand is, to me, not one that works.


> 2.  Voldemort was about to kill Harry, but (at least by his own words years 
> later) did not intend to kill Lily.  To build a life-debt out of this pure 
> speculation.  Life-debts have to be pretty rare to have the power we've 
> assumed they have, and others will usually know about them.  Yet nothing 
is  mentioned about it in canon.

Yeah, the V-mort has a life debt to Lily idea is something I really don't see.We 
just really don't know how these things work. The only one we're sure exists is 
between Wormtail and Harry, and as you say later, that doesn't prevent 
Wormtail from conspiring to kill Harry. 


> 3.  "Take me instead" line:  Most mothers will offer themselves in place of 
> their child when the latter is in danger, but my take on this is that Lily 
> was not offering her life, but rather her body.  Lily was, by all accounts, a 
> very attractive woman, and the offer by a mother to "go" with the villain, or 
> "be" with the villain, or even marry the villain (in return for the child's 
> life) is fairly common in fiction.  But as in most cases, the offer is 
> rejected.  Certainly offering something most men would be interested in 
would  be more likely to succeed than asking a Dark Lord to "have mercy".
 
Eh, OK. First, let me say, EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW!

Now, I suppose this works, but obviously, V-Mort didn't have any compunction 
about killing her, which still means the "V-Mort went in there with the idea to 
spare Lily" doesn't entirely work.


> 4.  Why would Voldemort have spared Lily?
>   a.  He wouldn't.  He was going to kill Harry first (well, second after 
> James) and make her watch.  THEN he was going to kill her.  He is, after all, 
> evil.

This one's mine. I think he really was just being efficient. First, kill the main 
threat (V-Mort, being not only elitist, but probably sexist, would consider that 
James), then kill who you came to kill, and then tie up loose ends like Lily.

>   b.  Lily was an heir of Slytherin (see separate (and as yet unwritten) post 
> about heirs) and Voldemort couldn't bring himself to kill a "sister."

But he did. And he didn't seem to try to hard to get over it.

>   c.  Lily was an heir of Gryffindor (see separate (and as yet unwritten) 
> post about heirs) and Voldemort knew he *couldn't* kill her without serious 
> mystical consequences.

You use "an" instead of "the." Hmmmm, there are many, eh? I'm intrigued. 
Again, though, he didn't try too hard not to kill her.

>   d.  Life debt.  OK, it's *possible*, but Wormtail's canon life-debt to 
> Harry didn't keep Peter Pettigrew from conspiring to murder Harry.  Evil, 
> again, you see?
> 

See above.

Darrin
-- Ready to form the fifth Hogwarts house, represented by a chimpunk