[HPforGrownups] House elves and the multi species WW

[manawydan]

No: HPFGUIDX 58211

Jazmyn wrote:

>Wizards do not consider house elves to be humans, thus they could very
>well feel they are possessions, such as livestock or pets. Yes, even
>slaves.  The more evil types, such as the DEs likely consider muggles as
>'animals' too. If it were not for the MoM, muggles would be in constant
>danger from members of the WW who don't share muggle views on slavery or
>  treatment of sentient creatures.

I think that wizards don't consider house elves to be human because they're
not. For me, one of the interesting things about the WW is that it is a
place where there _are_ different humanoid species, some of whom can
interbreed (eg giants and humans) but possibly others who can't.

Ethically, I wonder if we would have done any better in our world if we
weren't the only members of our genus. And I suspect we wouldn't have. We
would probably have treated giants the same way that the WW did (Jack the
Giant Killer, anyone?)

>Yes, its not politically correct by muggle standards to keep intelligent
>creatures as pets, slaves or even as livestock, which is why Hermione is
>more shocked then those raised in the WW.

But I'm still not convinced that house elves _are_ pets, slaves, or
livestock. Though I agree (and Dobby confirms it) that the DEs do regard
them as animals

They are obviously more than animals.

>As for house elves. they appear to be either breed or created by magic
>originally as servants, possibly with the loyalty and slavish attitude
>built in, which is why they are so happy being slaves and so unwilling
>to leave this state. Its against their nature to not be slaves, thus
>creating horrible conflict within them when this is challenged. (i.e.
>Dobby wants to do the right thing, but his programing is creating
>conflict, thus he punishes himself)

Though it's also difficult to consider how a house elf might live in a
"state of nature". Possibly their own evolution was bound up with the
development of the wizard gene in humans and they have evolved so that their
natural state is one of doing housework. It's not that they have to have it
beaten into them as baby elves, I think they are _born_ (or hatched, or
however) hard wired to keep the place clean, do the cooking, and so on.

The WW has regularised this and bureaucratised it (as it has so much else)
perhaps partly to make sure that elves stay safely within the WW and don't
suddenly pop up in muggle houses (folklore suggests that they used to in
days gone by...).

>We should not pretend that the WW is a happy little place, whose people
>are superior to humans in every way. They can be just as evil as
>muggles.. even more so as 'absolute power corrupts absolutely'.  Making

A metaphor perhaps for how we have sometimes treated disabled people in our
own world?

Cheers

Ffred

O Benryn wleth hyd Luch Reon
Cymru yn unfryd gerhyd Wrion
Gwret dy Cymry yghymeiri