[HPforGrownups] Sorting and Character Traits (WAS: Heirs of Ravenclaw & Hufflepuff

[elfundeb]

No: HPFGUIDX 58530

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "David Burgess" <burgess at c...> wrote:

> We've seen enough of Ron to see that, while he is as loyal and down to
> earth, bravery isn't actually his strong suit.  He's not craven, by amy
> means, but his fears do get in the way sometimes.
> 

Several others have already argued that Ron has plenty of courage as exemplified by his willingness to go forth into dangerous situations despite his fears, so I'll just echo that and move on. 
> 
> I don't see Hermione's actions as brave and daring as much as I see them
> as the logical response to a given situation.  She analyzes the situations
> and proceeds with the clearest course of action, in the understanding that
> she is ready to roll.  While that certainly takes courage, it takes far
> more trust in one's intellect.
> 
> Ron, on the other hand, is much more emotional and much less logical.  We
> see it over and over again - The Devil's Snare is the example that
> immediately comes to mind.  

Ah, movie contamination!  In the book, Ron and Harry were equally in its grip and Hermione became flustered and needed the others' assistance to realize she could free them by conjuring a fire (remember the classic line "Are you a witch or not?").  Kloves and Columbus have not been kind to Ron. ;-( 

> My background is professional military, and one of the things that has
> I've noticed over time is that the most effective leaders rely on great
> strategists to come up with their plans, which the leader implements.  I
> see Ron and Harry's relationship evolving the same way.  With one or two
> exceptions, the great Generals have relied on great planners to come up
> with truly great solutions to tactical and strategic problems.  Great
> plans rely on great intelligence.  Hermione is a great correlator of facts
> and information, and provides the intell the rest of the group needs to
> make good decisions. [snip]
> 
> Ron is a terrific lieutenant, but isn't the born leader that Harry is.   I
> still see Ron and Hermione as being in the "wrong" houses (as far as the
> traits of the houses go).

But doesn't this argument confuse bravery with leadership?  Harry is unquestionably an inspiring leader -- he has an outstanding moral compass that show itself best when stressed, an ability to synthesize and draw conclusions from the information provided to him by his lieutenants, and most of all he is extraordinarily calm and resourceful under fire.  

But the dictionary definition of bravery is an willingness to face danger and fear.  None of the three have ever backed down or run away, no matter how frightened.  Harry may be more successful, but that's because he's more resourceful under stress, not because he is more brave.  

You've correctly pointed out that neither Ron nor Hermione have the same leadership skills.  Both on occasion have frozen or become confused under pressure.  Hermione with the Devil's Snare, and she froze when she faced the boggart in the closet at the DADA final; Ron froze in the forest with Aragog, but he did manage to pick up Fang on the way out, and in the DADA final he was confused by the hinkypunk).  Harry, on the other hand, is at his best in such situations.
 

> So, once again, I ask "Are Ron and Hermione in the right houses?"  Now
> that we have that little bit of house name confusion out of the way, the
> real question still stands.
> 
> There are two possible canonical explanations, as far as I'm concerned. 
> [snip]  The
> second (much more palatable, I assure you) is that the Hat is actually up
> on current events and knows what's going on.  It doesn't sort the houses
> based on the students' abilities, but on the "best mix" to protect the
> school, and by extension, the WW.  If this was true, then each of the
> non-Slytherin houses would have a mix of what we would call "true
> Ravenclaws, etc.".  We've seen this before, in the Pettigrew fiasco from
> James and Lily's time at Hogwarts.
> 
Actually, there are many possible explanations for the Sorting Hat's choices.  Since the Sorting Hat contains some of the Founders' brains, I suspect that it knows quite a bit; I've even theorized that it could be omniscient.  However, it's not likely, IMO, that many people could be characterized as *true* [name house].  Most people share, to a greater or lesser degree, characteristics of all the houses.  Hermione has the cleverness of a Ravenclaw, and Ron has the loyalty of a Hufflepuff.  

My theory is that the Hat doesn't simply try to figure out which characteristic is most dominant, or try to get a mix in each house.  Rather, it looks to which house will best help the individual recognize and develop those traits.  Hermione doesn't need any help sharpening her intellect, but she underestimates her own bravery (as in her speech to Harry in PS/SS before she drinks the potion).  Ron has significant fears, the biggest one of which, in my book, is his fear of failure.  What better place than Gryffindor to help him come to grips with that fear?

As for Pettigrew, he hasn't shown himself to be fit for any house to date.  He's not ambitious, or he wouldn't have been content to live as a rat for 12 years, he's unquestionably not loyal, and he's not believed to be clever, either (though he does share some of Harry's resourcefulness, which he employs to further his own selfish ends).   And bravery?  Long ago there was a debate about whether Peter showed bravery by his willingness to cut off his own body parts.  I said those actions didn't count because the alternative was certain death.  But there are three more books to go, and many opportunities left for Pettigrew to demonstrate some bravery.  I think he may surprise us at some point; remember, we think of Pettigrew as a worthless little sycophant, but I don't think James, Sirius and Lupin let him hang around with them out of pity; we just haven't seen his full character to date. Besides, Dumbledore did tell Harry that "the time may come when you will be very glad you saved Pettigrew's life."  

Debbie

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