Wizard government (was wizards and the queen)

[queen_astrofiammante]

No: HPFGUIDX 83993

Debbie wrote:
> The Wizengamot may be the technical equivalent of the judiciary, 
but in fact they appear to function solely as a jury substitute, as 
it's very clear that DMLE, and ultimately Fudge himself, controls 
trial proceedings.  Fudge also seems to control who serves on the 
Wizengamot, since he was able to demote Dumbledore from his position 
as Chief Warlock.

<snip>

> The Daily Prophet refers to the Educational Decrees as "new laws" 
that were "passed" by "the Ministry of Magic".  To me, a "decree" 
sounds more like an edict (or regulation) issued by an executive than 
a piece of legislation passed by a legislature.  Sometimes I think 
this is an example of JKR showing how arbitrary WW government is, but 
it may just be sloppy usage of language by someone who is not 
schooled in the law.  

<snip>

>The Decree was passed at night.  If there was a real legislature 
(and I don't think the International Confederation of Wizards is it 
because the MoM is not an international organization) how much notice 
was given to likely dissenters...  And, very telling, "Wizengamot 
elders Griselda Marchbanks and Tiberius Ogden have resigned in 
protest." Really, there doesn't seem to be time for any real 
legislative process.  Educational Decree No. 24, the one that 
authorized Umbridge to disband all student organizations, was 
apparently issued on a Sunday (the day after the meeting at the Hogs 
Head).  It seems to me that Fudge effectively controls the 
legislature -- even if it exists -- if he can call a session and 
arrange for selective notice in order to pass decrees to increase his 
own power to engage in micromanagement.  The Daily Prophet gave us a 
hint of that when it stated (regarding ED No. 23) that *Fudge* (not 
the legislature) "has used new laws to effect improvements".

Now Astrofiammante again:

Thanks for your very interesting response. What interests me here (as 
so often) is the gap between what is described and what actually 
happens.

When we first hear about the structure of the Ministry of Magic, it 
seems fair to assume it is constituted along the same lines as our 
own government. There's a minister in charge, who seems quite an 
innocuous chap, and a lot of civil servants who work for him. So far 
so good. It's all a bit bureaucratic, but that doesn't seem anything 
out of the ordinary. He must have a certain amount of respectability 
if the Muggle Prime Minister will deal with him.

As the series goes on, we find some of our assumptions are wrong. We 
start to notice sizeable gaps between the expectations set up by this 
familiar situation and the actual experiences of the characters. We 
learn that justice in the wizarding world is not the impartial matter 
that we expect in our own society, despite having the external 
trappings of such justice - a courtroom with a presiding officer, a 
jury in the case of the Pensieve trials.

We have also deduced that Fudge is likely to be ruling by decree than 
by the consent of any sort of wizarding body, despite expectations at 
least on my part that a system constituted with an executive and a 
judiciary would also have a legislature.

What interests me is the question of how this system of government 
developed in the first place. It strikes me that there are a few 
possibilities:

1) There are some discussions going on elsewhere on the board seeking 
to establish how much the wizarding world developed from 
a 'mediaeval' model in the way we understand it from our own history. 
Certainly there are a few traditions, legends and artefacts lying 
about - the story of the founding of Hogwarts, the castle building, 
swords and suits of armour, the existence of a privileged 
aristocratic class. 

Well, the mediaeval model of government was monarchy. Did the 
wizarding world ever have a monarchy of its own? And if not, how was 
it governed? Was there ever any kind of revolution? Or did the 
wizarding population simply come under the auspices of Muggle 
government until, say, an excess of witch- and wizard-burning caused 
it to break away? I have read elsewhere on this board the interesting 
opinion that the wizarding world has shades of a society that never 
experienced an 'age of enlightenment' in terms of the rights of the 
individual. How would this affect the formation, or lack of formation 
of views of things like the right to representation or to universal 
suffrage that we take for granted?

2) The government of the wizarding world was set up on the lines that 
we understand from our own history and it has become corrupted. 
Institutions like a legislative body and an independent judiciary did 
at one time exist, but have been done away with, or have withered 
through apathy and lack of participation. The current system has 
grown up to fill the gaps.

3) The wizarding world saw no reason to bugger about with 
representation and was perfectly content with the concept of an 
oligarchic government run by an appointee like Fudge. Things were 
going along just fine until that nasty Voldemort came along and 
forced him to behave unreasonably. 

- - - - - - - - - -

What elements in the history of the wizarding world may have had a 
bearing on the present form of government? Once again, we are back to 
the biggest fact we know - Dumbledore's defeat of Grindelwald in 
1945. It's hard to believe, given what was happening in Muggle 
history at this time, that the choice of date by JKR was accidental. 
Was the Ministry of Magic system of government put into place to 
overcome the problems caused by the last Evil Overlord to come along, 
but has now become inflexible, corrupted and outlived its usefulness? 
A kind of 'war cabinet' that was never stood down?

What a lot of very entertaining, and fascinating, speculation! Thanks 
again for your very intelligent reply to my original post. 

One thing I am sure of, however. I don't think the wizarding world 
would have much truck at all with interference from the Muggle 
government, as has been discussed in the other 'trouser leg' of this 
thread. I think, if it came down to the wire, wizards would turn out 
to value their autonomy very highly indeed.