What the Sorting Hat REALLY Said, and The Good Slytherin.

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 84899

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "nibleswik" <nibleswik at y...> wrote:
>
> ...edited...
>
> Me (Cheekyweebisom):
>
> ...edtied...
> 
> Now, as to what the hat says in CoS, that's fine. "You would have 
> done well in Slytherin" is not mutually exclusive with "you're a 
> Gryffindor"; in fact, that quote perfectly illustrates my next 
> point -- that the houses overlap. I do not believe there is the 
> harsh division between them that the students like to think there 
> is. This is yet another part of JKR's world that can be applied to 
> the RW. 
> 

bboy_mn:

On a related note; I think it's time to go back to the exact details
of what happened during the sorting ceremony.

-HP and the Sorcerer's Stone; Am PB Pg 130-

Next second he was looking at the black inside of the hat. He waited.

"Hmmmm," said a small voice in his ear. "Difficult. Very Difficult.
Plenty of Courage, I see. Not a bad mind either. There's talent, oh my
goodness, yes -- a nice thrist to prove yourself, now that's
interesting. ...So where shall I put you?"

Harry gripped the edges of the stool and thought, 'Not Slyterin, not
Slytherin'.

- end this part -


Notice that it is HARRY who brings up Slytherin, not the Sorting Hat.
As you will see as the quote continues, the Sorting Hat merely
interogates him as to 'why not Slytherin'.

My observations on the Sorting Hat's observation. The very first thing
that catches the 'eye' of the Sorting Hat is 'plenty of courage'. I
take that to mean that the Hat sees Gryffindor characteristics in
Harry first. Then 'not a bad mind', a reference to possible Ravenclaw
placement. Next, 'a nice thirst to prove yourself' which I take to
reflect ambition amoung other things and relates to possible Slytherin
placement.

- Book Quote Continues -

"Not Slyetherin, eh?" said the small voice. "Are you sure? You could
be great, you know, it's all here in our head, and Slytherin will help
you on the way to greatness, no doubt about that -- no? ...

- end this part -

In a sense, the Hat is saying, 'why not Slytherin?'. It will help you
fulfill your greatness, and help you prove to the world that you are a
great and powerful wizard. It will help you realize your ambition of
proving to people that you are someone.

- Book Quote Continues -

"Well, if your sure --- better be GRYFFINDOR!"

- End Quote -

Harry brings up Slytherin, not the Sorting Hat, and the Sorting Hat
never tries to force or advocate Slytherin. It simple wants to be
clear why Harry doesn't want to be in Slytherin, and wants to make
sure Harry understands that Slytherin could work to his advantage. 

In the end, the Hat goes with the very first characteristic it saw in
Harry; plenty of courage.



> Cheekyweebisom:
>
> I believe the need for unified houses will become greater and 
> greater in the last two books and worry that Harry's stubbornness 
> and hatred of the Slytherins will hurt him. The houses are all 
> different, but, I think, also all the same.
> 
> Cheekyweebisom

bboy_mn:

On this, we definitely agree; at least in basic principle. 

I do have my own theory on it, and it has to do with the DA Club
continuing in the next book as a school-wide club; which means it must
be open to Slytherins. Draco and his gang will initially try to join
the club, but more for the purposes of spying on Harry, looking for
revenge, and attempting to disrupt the club.

When Draco and friends are forced out for bad behavior, a few, very
few, Slytherins will remain behind, and continue on as good students
and good members of the club.

I also think there will be a revelation that some extremely
significant character will was a Slytherin; possibly Sirius and maybe
James. I think that is one of the reasons why JKR is being vague about
the houses of many of the characters in the book. 

Between this and discovering good Slytherins via the DA Club, Harry's
attitude will completely change. I also think that one Slytherin in
particular will stand out. We have frequently discussed this person,
labeling them "The Good Slytherin", and have speculated that it could
be the mysterious Blaise Zambini. So, while the students at the school
will not be united down to the last witch and wizard, the members of
the four houses will be working together toward a common goal; the
defeat of Voldemort. 

Certainly, anyone who is not blinded by a desparate quest for power
and unbridled ambition, must see that a win by Voldemort is the
destruction of the ambitions of everyone but Voldemort's absolute
closest supporters. For the wizard world at large, it means chaos,
physical and economic destruction, depression, and the general break
down of society. The world that was once prosperous with high
potential for all, becomes a hopelessly disfunctional world of
desperation and deprivation. 

You can be extremely ambitions and even ruthless, and still be
reasonably logical and ethical. Only stability brings prosperity, and
prosperity is the true power in the world. I think there are some
clear thinking Slytherins who see this, and they will side with
Dumbledore.

Just a thought.

bboy_mn