Harry Apologize? Was: Pensieves objectivity/DD's integrity

[msbeadsley]

No: HPFGUIDX 79698

<wsherratt3338 at r...> wrote:
> I think [Dumbledore's] plan was a perfectly good one, and it's 
> not exactly his fault that Harry and Sirius thought they knew 
> better and tried something else.  Their plans didn't work out any 
> better than his, so why is he the only one apologizing at the end?  

> Maybe because he's the only one with the guts to admit that he 
> isn't always right and always perfect; it would be refreshing to 
> hear something remotely similar coming from Harry for a change.

<morgan.cole at n...> wrote:
> As a complete neophyte on this list I just wanted to add that after 
> 11 years of teaching high school, if Harry HAD offered an apology 
> in this situation, I would consider it highly unrealistic writing. 
> I don't think most 15-year-olds have the quality of detachment 
> necessary to apologize in a situation like this...I think Harry 
> probably does owe D. somewhat of an apology in return, but D., like 
> any experienced teacher of teenagers, should know better than to 
> expect one.

<gbannister10 at a...> wrote:
> Having read this and the further post on 79661, I couldn't agree 
> more having taught UK teens for 32 years. It is very difficult for 
> a middle teenager to apologise. It isn't cool.... it isn't good for 
> their street cred.... it's very hard emotionally to accept that you 
> are in the wrong. "It wasn't me guv, it was 'im wot did it!"

And it all this goes along with what Phineas Nigellus says from his 
portrait:  "You see, Dumbledore?  <snip>  Never try to understand the 
students.  They hate it.  They would much rather be tragically 
misunderstood, wallow in self-pity, stew in their own--"

*Drama* plays so much better with the hormone soup in which their 
teenaged brains are marinating.  There's no *flourish* in 
apologizing.)

And apologies are somewhat over rated, IMHO.  Lip service and/or 
calculated abasement?  Instead, show through your future behavior & 
conversation that you *got* it.  The satisfaction comes from never 
having to deal with the same sort of crap from the same person over 
again.  [As a matter of fact, something like this was illustrated 
when Harry and Ron made up after the first task in the TWT; Harry 
knew Ron "got" it and no longer needed the apology.]  Especially with 
adults dealing with kids, isn't that what is really underneath, isn't 
that the goal:  your behavior was off, get a clue, grow up.  And in 
Dumbledore's case, I can't see him needing an apology from Harry to 
ease his own hurt feelings; I can't see Dumbledore internalizing one 
iota of Harry's need to lash out.

Furthermore, Dumbledore can't have it both ways:  either he is the 
omniscient (even in the end of OoP he's still doing it:  "...I have 
watched you more closely than you can have imagined--") voice of 
wisdom, experience and reason for Harry (and others), in which case 
one should reasonably assume that he is making decisions based on 
full information (the end of Harry's Occlumency lessons--NOT!), or he 
needs to lose the superiority, detachment, and "the responsibility 
lies on my shoulders" mantle and *discuss* things with members of the 
Order (and other involved persons) rather than just issuing commands 
(via Molly:  "...oh, for heaven's sake, Sirius, Dumbledore said no!"  
She did not say "advised against it," I note.)

Then again, maybe Dumbledore allowed the mystique for the value it 
had in daunting the enemy, then ended up hoisted on that particular 
petard.  He has admitted a "mistake" to Harry; how will that play out 
later on with Harry *and* members of the Order? 

"msbeadsley"