Snape and Harry WAS Re: Pensieves objectivity AND: Dumbledore's integrity

[melclaros]

No: HPFGUIDX 79795

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "msbeadsley" <msbeadsley at y...> 
wrote:
> 
> The *words* can be demanded (and that will result in tremendous 
> success, I'm sure), but the respect the words imply must be 
*earned*; 
> something Snape seems oblivious to or bent on ignoring.

me:
Mea Culpa. Silly me insisting that my own children address their own 
teachers by their titles starting on the very 1st day of school. 
Silly me for Never, ever (are you listening, Sirius?) using the name 
I used for my son's 2nd grade teacher in private or among other 
parents of children in that witch's class to pass my lips in a 
child's presence.
Silly, silly me. Those kindergarten teachers damned well should have 
EARNED the right to be called MISS Espey and Miss (damn i can't even 
remember her name!) Stupid of me to insist that he addrewss the 2nd 
grade nazi as MRS (name witheld--only because if i type it i'll start 
screaming).
But it doesn't surprise me, I took flack for years for being the 
only "Mommy" in the playgroup who insisted her children address EVERY 
adult with a courtesy title until instructed otherwise by THAT adult.



>> 
> And how do you expect the student to remember that this "is STILL a 
> student/teacher relationship" when the teacher side of that pair 
has 
> consistently stepped outside of appropriate behavior *for that 
> relationship*?  

me:
This hardly news for Harry. He'd have had far more trouble keeping 
his teacher/student priority wits about him had Snape suddenly gone 
all warm and fuzzy on him. :::shudders in disgust:::




Snape has behaved like a schoolyard bully, drawing 
> lines in the sand and daring Harry to step over.  (I suppose now 
> you'll say he learned that from James.  No matter; it isn't JAMES 
> he's retaliating against.)

me:
Nope, Snape's a b*st*rd all on his own. I've never claimed otherwise 
despite what I've said to defend him.



> 
> Snape (dam*ed if *I'll* call him by any title) set the tone for 
> what's followed when Harry WAS eleven.
> 

me:
Which is why it never ceases to amaze me why people are always so 
surprised when Snape lives up to his own standards. I could see it if 
he'd suddenly turned bi-polar, but this started on Day One (as 
listees continuously point out to me and others. We KNOW!) What we 
don't know is why, after FIVE years of this Harry (and others) are 
still surprised.



> 
> My understatement alarm (now added to my formerly shrieking dark 
> detectors ^-^) is blaring now.

ke:
Dark alarms, sneakoscopes, I'm sure they're all howling. 



>> 
> The historic wrongs Snape did Harry have not been resolved.  To me, 
> Snape will be a baby-bashing thug until they are.
> 

me: 
"He'd never forgive Snape." I don't have the book here, but you know 
to what I'm referring. Harry has a LOT of reasons to hate Snape. But 
he has very, very few (I'm being generous) to mistrust him. Snape did 
not in any way, shape or form, kill Sirius. If Harry had used his 
head for one minute and gone to Snape OR ingored Snape and used the 
tool Sirius HIMSELF provided him, there's a good chance SB would 
still be sulking around 12 Grimmaud. 
Yup, there are issues here, that is for damned sure. But there's a 
LOT of work to be done on Both Sides.



> 
> No excuse needed.  Just human nature.  


No, no NO! You know what? If my son (13) had come home whining that a 
teacher had tossed him (physically) out of his office, I'd ask 
him "What did YOU do to deserve that?"
If the answer was, "Read his diary the minute he was called out of 
his office on an emergency" you can rest assured a jar of roaches 
would have been the LEAST of his worries. You'd be amazed how fast a 
kid can march when followed by an irate parent. Severus Snape has 
nothing on a p*ss*d off Mom. 
He'd have stood in that office until he'd managed a suitable apology 
and I'd have signed the "referral" papers for his 
detention/suspension right in front of him. 
YES, I have. IRL. Want the details? And it was for nothing like 
reading a diary either.

But this is likely generational. When I was in school if we got in 
trouble we got in trouble again, worse, at home. Now (and I work in a 
school, I see this every day) if a student so much as looks at a 
student cross-eyed (in the student's opinion) we have parent's 
marching into the office with lawyers.

A medicine cabinet is not a diary--and a pensieve is in my mind a 
diary squared.
Inexcusable. Absolutely inescusable. I blame Dumbledore, quite 
honestly. Harry'd never seen a Pensieve before he snooped in DDs. It 
should have been explained then (to the little idiot) that SOME 
people MIGHT consider them PRIVATE.




> 
> "More" fun? Harry didn't even know the name "Snivellus" before he 
> looked in the pensieve;> 



Me
Oh yes he did. Sirius used that name at Grimmaud when the Occlumency 
topic was 1st brought up. Interesting that in all the endless 
comments of the "overgrown teenager Snape" and "arrested development 
Snape" he never resorted to namecalling with "Paragon of Maturity 
Sirius". Even as snarky as he got, he never descended to that level 
IN FRONT OF A STUDENT. Let's talk inexcusable. Sirius, as much as he 
hates Snape, is an adult <snort>. He should NEVER, EVER have used 
that name in front of Harry. If you argue that point I'm going to go 
tell my son what I called his 2nd grade teacher while he wasn't 
around.


> 
> P.S. Possible epiphany tucked in here:  if, as I have read a theory 
> stating, Harry is actually carrying a part of Voldemort around with 
> him behind his scar, could it be that Snape's abuse of Harry is 
> intended as an object lesson (from BOTH perspectives) for that 
scrap 
> of Voldemort 

Me:
That's interesting, but honestly I think if Snape wants to abuse 
Voldemort he's waiting for a really good opportunity to do so 
properly. Hurling roaches won't do. It is possible however that 
he "pours it on"  in front of Harry/Voldy to keep his cover up.


Melpomene, who really can't understand why people keep expecting 
Snape to be nice. I LIKE him and I don't expect him to be nice.