Dumbledore's Philosophy (WAS: MAGIC DISHWASHER: Spying Game Philosophy

[Jen Reese]

No: HPFGUIDX 81187

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "elfundeb2" <elfundeb at c...> 
wrote:
> <<snipped large segment>>
> In fact, one of the reasons I hated chapter 37, The Lost Prophecy, 
> was because I didn't – and still don't – see Dumbledore's decision 
> not to tell Harry about the prophecy sooner as a mistake.  What 
> Dumbledore now sees as a *mistake* was to treat Harry as a human 
> being and not as a weapon.
> <snipped canon quote>
> I think Dumbledore overstates his error here; it is the lament of 
one 
> grieving the loss of Sirius.  The DEs were astonished to discover 
> that Harry did not know about the prophecy, because they cannot 
> conceive that Dumbledore would treat Harry as more than a weapon.  
> Were it not for his and Harry's grief, I don't think he would ever 
> assert that caring for Harry for himself was a mistake, because 
> that's the great divide that separates good from evil.  


Jen:

All I can say is: Amazing...In a few short paragraphs, you've 
explained something that's been bothering me since reading OOTP--how 
to reconcile the Dumbledore who believes "our choices make us who we 
are" with the Dumbledore in OOTP who appears to *orchestrate* Harry's 
life from the moment the prophecy was made. That seemed completely 
contradictory to me: How can Dumbledore buy into this prophecy, a 
form of predestination, when he clearly states in GOF, "it matters 
not what someone is born, but what they grow to be!" 
 
I've always believed so fully in Dumbledore's wisdom and goodness, 
that it never occurred to me he could be wrong when he tells Harry 
about the "mistake" he made! But Dumbledore's grief over Sirius, 
(combined with his inability to protect Harry in OOTP), is making DD 
second-guess ALL his choices re: Harry--talk about a person who 
carries immense loads....sounds like a Phoenix, almost...

Then I had another "aha!" moment reading your next quote:

Debbie:

> I've never been part of the MD camp, and don't get there after OOP, 
> notwithstanding Dumbledore's references to his plan.  See, I think 
> Dumbledore's plan was to keep Harry alive until he gained enough 
> understanding to choose for himself whether to accept the 
> responsibility of being the weapon. <snip>  

>But if a plan to improve the condition of humanity is not combined 
>with a love of those humans as individuals, then people are nothing 
>more than weapons.  Dumbledore won't make Harry his weapon; Harry 
>must choose that for himself.  To be honest, Harry seems to have 
>chosen to be the weapon even without Dumbledore's information.

Jen:

So, instead of raising Harry as the "weapon", Dumbledore has tried to 
protect Harry, given the many constraints of the situation. This idea 
also helps me understand on a deeper level some of the choices 
Dumbledore made early on. For example, we know Petunia's blood 
protects Harry physically, but why would DD sacrifice Harry's mental 
and emotional well-being by leaving him with the Dursley's? Before 
today, I thought, "well that's the best DD could do and the blood 
protection was more important. Harry turned out alright, didn't he?"  
That didn't satisfy me, though!

Now I see Dumbledore *was* protecting Harry psychologically as well. 
Dumbledore knows if Harry stays in the WW he will be "Famous before 
he can walk and talk! Famous for something he can't remember! Can't 
you see how much  better off he'll be, growing up away from all that 
until he's ready to take it?" (SS, p. 13).

"It" in this case does refer to fame, but given the knowledge 
Dumbledore has of the prophecy, "It" also refers to Harry being 
surrounded by the knowledge of why he was marked, asking questions 
before he's ready for the answers, and etc.  He would not be asking 
Dumbledore at 11, "why was Voldemort trying to kill *me*?, but rather 
at a much younger and more vulnerable age. He would know too much, 
too soon and THAT psychological scar could be great, indeed. So in 
choosing between two poor options, Dumbledore made what he felt was 
the best choice at the time. 


OK, enough of my musings...But thanks, Debbie, for your post. It was 
really beautifully written. You're my list-elf, too, so instead of 
worrying for two months about Dumbledore I could have just *asked* 
your opinion!.....I'll know next time :)  Jen