BADD ANGST TBAY, Part II

[Jen Reese]

No: HPFGUIDX 81827

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "bluesqueak" <pipdowns at e...> 
wrote:
> I take it you don't read Agatha Christie [grin]. JKR does, 
> incidentally. Interestingly, the UK adult cover of OOP has a photo 
> of JKR in front of a bookcase containing several Christie mysteries.
> 
> She does a pretty Christie-ish trick in PS/SS, where the villain, 
> Quirrel, is mentioned on a total of 18 pages before he is revealed 
> as the villain. That's 18 pages out of 153 (his first appearance is 
> on page 55 UK paperback). And in over half of those 18 pages, 
> Quirrel only gets a one-line mention. 
<snip>
> 
> Because JKR has shown she *uses* that trick. She puts the 
> distraction in plain sight, and mentions him a lot. [Sirius and 
> Peter Pettigrew, anyone?]


Jen: 
"Putting the distraction in plain sight"--interesting point and 
pretty much irrefutable right now. I happen to love Christie (Mirror 
Crack'd is my fav.) and didn't know JKR reads her, but now that I 
do....hmmmm. I've been surprised by every one of JKR's tricks, except 
Draco being Heir of Syltherin. Even Crouch!Moody telling a roomful of 
people exactly how he put Harry's name in the Goblet at the beginning 
of Book 4 didn't tip me off. (I'm curious if the people in this group 
figured that one out before the end?). 

My only thought: is JKR using this as a *major* plot-device again or 
merely making us think about that possibility? I don't have a feel 
either way, it's a circular argument at the moment. It will certainly 
be the Ultimate trick or Ultimate red herring, depending on the 
direction she takes.


Pip!Squeak:
> Further, Harry's awareness of prejudice and racism is increasing. 
In 
> PS/SS he's hardly aware of it. In CoS he doesn't understand why 
> Hagrid is the perfect scapegoat for Tom Riddle, or why Fudge is so 
> quick to imprison Hagrid in Azkaban. He thinks that Dobby is badly 
> treated because he is owned by the Malfoys. By PoA we are 
introduced 
> to the idea that a werewolf finds it hard to get a job, and that 
> there was a very real doubt that he would be able to attend school. 
> By GoF we see that Rita Skeeter is delighted to 'out' Hagrid the 
> half-giant, and that Madame Maxine is scared to even admit her 
> parentage to another half-giant. We also see that another House elf 
> is badly treated by more than one wizard.
> 
> In OOP the theme is becoming full blown. There is another badly 
> treated House-elf, the Goblin riots of history are becoming present-
> day goblins who feel 'pretty anti-wizard'. The centaurs are so 
> annoyed at humans they consider killing two children who they think 
> are 'using' them. The giants are having genocide practiced on them.


Jen: 
This list generates many different templates that can be cast over 
the series to show this or that development over time, and one could 
certainly be the stages of ethical development. Harry has moved 
through the stage of black/white thinking, and is now in 
the "wrestling" phase of development--what *is* right, who do I 
believe, what kind of person will I be? 

Is the WW showing more evidence of prejudice over time, or is Harry 
becoming increasingly aware of and apalled by what he sees? He could 
be seeing another side of the centaurs and goblins or it could be 
they are feeling an increase in prejudice and hatred and are reacting 
more intensely to their situation. Or a little of both, to muddy the 
waters!

Since I fall on the side of believing WW prejudice has always been 
there, perhaps to greater and lesser degrees over time but always 
present, then Harry is becoming increasingly aware of the ethical 
dilemmas inherent in the WW.  

Most new situations, new people, new ideas appear very one-
dimensional when introduced.  In PS/SS, Dumbledore twinkled, Snape 
swooped and glared, Quirrell was bullied, Mcgonagall toed the line 
and Harry was enchanted by his new-found life in the Wizarding world. 
The "good" guys won and Dumbledore explained everything in the end.

By OOTP, Harry discovers Dumbledore is fallible (and some say a 
liar), Snape reveals another side, Fudge is incompetent AND corrupt, 
McGonagall turned subversive (if only for a moment) and Harry is 
disillusioned by the WW and hardly speaking to Dumbledore.  

The WW is decidedly a very ominous shade of gray at the moment for 
Harry. This life he *chose* when he decided to follow Hagrid out the 
door at the Hut is not what it appeared to be in the beginning. He 
sees this very clearly and doesn't know how to handle it. Yet. 

He can revert back to black/white thinking and go on autopilot, he 
can have others decide for him, or he can continue growing in his 
ability to listen to suggestions and make his own decisions. And one 
decision he has a very big stake in is what to do about Voldemort. 
Unlike most of us, Harry has the power to create a *huge* change in 
the society he lives in.


Pip!Squeak:
>Because sometimes it is the society that is evil, not just the 
>people. In fact,in a bad society, you will find that many, many of 
>the people are perfectly nice, kind people. If JKR is teaching life 
>lessons drawn from the real world, why do you think her lessons have 
>to be about the difference between good and evil people? Why not 
>have a lesson about the difference between the sort of world you 
>want, and the world you've currently got? A lesson about what you 
>should do when you find the society you love has turned to evil?


> Remnant:
> > Since the real world will likely always have  
> > prejudice and evil, why suddenly in two books tell the reader 
that 
> > it's possible for Harry to set everything right in the WW?
> 
>
 Pip!Squeak [on her soapbox]:
> 
> Why must the real world always have prejudice and evil?
> 
> Who told you that?
> 
> What are you supporting when you say that?
> 
> What 'side' do you help when you say 'it's never possible to set 
> everything right'.
> 
> Why must JKR accept that view in her books? 
> 
> It's up to you to stop evil. Full stop. Whether it's a bad guy, 
> singular, bad guys, plural, or bad guys as in an entire society. 
And 
> in fact, in history, you will find examples of people trying to 
stop 
> all three.
> 
> Real life. Real worlds. Real societies. 


Jen: 
You said, "In history, you will find examples of people trying to 
stop all three." *Trying*. And the WW is trying, too. We've seen many 
examples of atrocities in the WW and we've seen shining examples of 
overcoming evil as well. The WW shouldn't be condemned b/c they are 
currently failing to achieve a goal no other society in history has 
been able to get close to, let alone meet. 

Maybe JKR *is* envisioning a WW without prejudice and evil, and she 
will give us a roadmap for the journey. We need it. I just happen to 
think a WW wanting to rid itself of an evil Lord is making a little 
more progess in the right direction than a society giving up on 
itself as irreparably evil. 

A society, like a person, will never learn to change if it self-
destructs every time it fails. Maybe this will finally be the time 
the WW learns to identify the conditions that led to Voldemort in the 
first place--wouldn't that be something? It's not the apocalypse, 
but....it's a start.