The Unforgivables Curses

[cubfanbudwoman]

No: HPFGUIDX 94966

Del wrote:
> > The recent threads about the Cruciatus Curse have gotten me more 
> > and more confused. I've been arguing that using the Cruciatus 
> > curse requires some kind of sadism, but quite a few people 
> > disagree. So now I'm wondering : how do the Unforgivables work 
> > and why are they they called so ?
> > 
> > Do they work like any other curse, or do they require some evil 
> > intent ?
> > 
> > Why give them such a grand name as Unforgivable ? I'm really 
> > bothered by that. <snip> 
> > I used to think that they were called Unforgivable because of the 
> > *intent* of the curser : I thought the successful use of one of 
> > them was a sure sign of an irremediably evil heart.
> > 
> > But as some have pointed out, what about the teachers who 
> > demonstrate the UC to their students ? What about the Aurors who
> > use them on bad guys ? Does the fact that they manage to perform 
> > them signal that their hearts have turned irremediably evil, and 
> > if so, should they still be allowed to teach/chase criminals ?

Kneasy replied: 
> JKR  has come up with an interesting concept and one that most 
> civilised people would agree with. Three actions that are 
> forbidden; to kill, to cause pain and to remove free will. 
<snip> 
> To cast one at a human is to incur immediate incarceration in 
> Azkaban. Yet he [Crouch!Moody] Imperio's almost the entire class.  
> So it seems highly likely that Crouch!Moody told the truth when he 
> says that Dumbledore decided that they should know about the curses 
> early. (Once again DD seems to be able to pre-empt Voldy's ploys; 
> it really does make me wonder if he has the script taped to his 
> bathroom mirror.)

> You can't guard against an AK; Crucio!  we don't know if you can or 
> not and Imperio! you can shake off with practice. But you have to 
> have the spell cast at you to practice throwing it off. The whole 
> point of DADA is defending against Dark Arts and you won't get that 
> from a book. You need the real thing. Seems like a contradiction - 
> go to Azkaban or be defenceless.
 
> The key IMO is intent. Not the intent to throw the spell, but the 
> end towards which the spell is  being used. The spells give the 
> user power over other humans - how is that power being used? For 
> good or ill? Teaching and Aurors - basically good; Bella and Voldy -
> bad.


Siriusly Snapey Susan:
I think you're exactly right, Kneasy, about the intent **towards the 
end of the spell**, not just the intent to throw it.  Kind of like in 
the RW, taking a life in a rage or revenge vs. killing in self-
defense.  

I'm wondering, too, about what Bella told Harry about really having 
to MEAN it for it to work.  Maybe that was true; maybe it wasn't & 
she was toying w/ his confidence.  But maybe it's that it's true *for 
that particular unforgivable*--Crucio!--and not necessarily for all 
three.  It seems pretty likely you'd need to MEAN it for AK as well.  
But maybe Imperio! is easier to cast?  Maybe that's why Crouch!Moody 
[presumably w/ DD's approval] allowed the students to practice 
Imperio! without getting into trouble?  I mean, if it's the one of 
the three curses which we know you can shake OFF w/ practice, maybe 
it's also simpler to cast?

Siriusly Snapey Susan