Why were the sacrifices different? (was: A moral theory of Magic )

[mad_maxime]

No: HPFGUIDX 95295

> Carol wrote:
> > Are you sure that James sacrificed his life in the same way that
> > Lily did? IMO, he died fighting to protect his family (like many
> > another dead wizard, I imagine) but his death doesn't count as a
> > self-sacrifice in the way that Lily's does, since she was
> > apparently wandless (and had to die for the "ancient magic" to
> > work). Not all self-sacrifices protect another person the way
> > Lily's did....
>
> Siriusly Snapey Susan responded:
> I'm sorry, Carol, but I don't get this one at all.  James "died...to
> protect his family" and Lily died to protect Harry.  What is the
> difference?  Why does his not "count"?  
>
> And I have also never understood how folks derive from canon that
> Lily must have been wandless.  Maybe she was; maybe she wasn't.  But
> how exactly does that play into her sacrifice being different or
> more important or whatever than James'?  
>
> I know *DD* stresses that Lily died to save Harry and that *that*
> kind of sacrifice leaves a mark....  But frankly I've never
> understood why it wasn't his PARENTS' sacrifice which BOTH left that
> mark.  Why wasn't James' sacrifice as "worthy" as Lily's?
>
> I do think it's likely that Lily added some kind of charm or
> protection to Harry, in case Voldy should attack him, but did she
> KNOW in advance that she had to die?  If it was all inevitable that
> she had to die for Harry, then why bother to hide at all?  Or am I
> putting too much emphasis on "inevitable"?
> <snip>

Max responds:

In terms of your last question Susan, I think Lily *did* know she had
to die for the ancient charm to work, but that doesn't mean they all
believed dying was inevitable. I think their hope was that hiding
would keep them safe. But, in the worst case scenario, if Voldemort
found his way to Godric's Hollow anyway, they would be prepared. I
believe this plan was set up as a last ditch effort to keep Harry safe.

"Why wasn't James' sacrifice as "worthy" as Lily's?"

This central question is the one that proves to me more than anything
else that Lily did actively conjure the ancient magic making *her
sacrifice* in particular the one responsible for saving Harry. So her
sacrifice wasn't "more worthy", it was simply the one needed to
activate the magic.

As for the wand issue, canon description just seems to make it more
likely that she wasn't holding her wand at the ready to duel Voldemort
when he entered the room (I'm sure she had it on her person or
somewhere close by). Someone who's screaming and pleading - "no, not
Harry... kill me instead" - is *probably* not pointing a wand at
Voldemort.

Also, it just makes more sense in terms of the ancient magic. I
believe someone giving up their life *willingly*, with out a fight, is
a very different kind of sacrifice than someone dying to defend
themselves and their family. This is all just speculation, of course.

Max (who believes, unfortunately, that we won't really find out more
about the night at Godric's Hollow until Book 7! :( )