Harry and wandless magic

[earendil_fr]

No: HPFGUIDX 96767


> Earendil wrote:
> <huge snip> have we ever actually heard of any other wizard 
performing wandless magic? 
> 
> Owlery2003 comments:
> What about Lupin on the train when he conjures a handful of 
> whatever? Of course, he might have used his wand for this, but 
> there's no mention of it . . . 

Earendil:
I checked this scene. I suppose you're refering to the moment in the 
train when Lupin gives chocolate to the children.
There's no mention of conjuring. The children are discussing the 
Dementor and Harry's passing out, until they jump when they hear 
Lupin breaking a bar of chocolate into bits. For all we know he 
could have taken the chocolate from his pocket or bag.
(sorry, can't quote, I only own a French version of PoA, but it's 
midway through chapter 5)

> Owlery2003 comments:
> then there's Harry's "lumos" when 
> he's searching for his wand in the alley when the dementors are 
> after him.

Earendil again:
You're right, I totally forgot about that one. But somehow I never 
really considered this particular one as wandless magic, his wand 
being an inch from his hand when he performs the spell, which is, 
well, an actual spell with an incantation. Up till then, the 
mentions of unquestionable wandless magic had no incantation 
involved. But then again, I could be forgetting something (and I 
wouldn't be surprised if I were)


> Geoff:
> One example comes immediately to mind....
> 
> '"I therefore award ten points to Mr.Neville Longbottom"......
> "Which means," Dumbledore called over the storm of applause, for 
even 
> Ravenclaw and Hufflepuff were celebrating the downfall of 
> Slytherin, "we need a little change of decoration."
> He /clapped his hands/. In an instant, the green hangings became 
> scarlet and the silver became gold; the huge Slytherin serpent 
> vanished and a towering Gryffindor lion took its place.'
> (PS "The Man with Two Faces" pp.221-22 UK edition)

Earendil:
(bangs head on table repeatedly)
I had totally forgotten about that one. It's been way too much time 
since I last read PS/SS.


> Potioncat:
> In OoP in one of the occlumency lessons, Harry does a shield charm 
> that knocks Snape's wand out of his hand.  Snape then performs 
> several charms. One was to repair a broken jar.  It's never said 
> whether he picked up his wand first.

Earendil:
I found the quote:
(OotP, UK ed., p522)
On of the jars behind [Harry] had broken when he fell against it; 
the pickled slimy thing within was swirling in its draining potion.
'Reparo,' hissed Snape, and the jar sealed itself at once.

Since Snape used an incantation, I suppose it's a safe guess to 
think he did pick up his wand before casting the spell. Especially 
since later in that scene, Snape raises his wand to cast a 
Legilimens again, and there's no mention of him picking up his wand 
before that.

Anyway, all these other mentions of wandless magic got me wondering 
about wandless magic and incantations. The way I picture it, 
wandless magic is mostly used insinctively, a defensive reflex in a 
threatening situation for example (even if Dumbledore changing the 
Great Hall's decoration with a clap of his hands contradicts this, 
but hey, he's Dumbledore, one of the most powerful wizards of all 
times, so I'm convinced that even if controlling wandless magic was 
one of the hardest thing to do in the WW, DD would be able to do it)
(now where was I?)(oh right).

Assuming Lupin didn't use wandless magic to conjure chocolate in the 
train, and that Snape didn't use wandless magic either to repair the 
broken jar, that still leaves Harry casting a Lumos while his wand 
is an inch from his hand as an example of wandless magic *with* an 
incantation.

Somehow I had always associated incantation and wand as two 
necessary parts of a spell, and as long as there's an incantation I 
really can't think of it as wandless magic. So I'd like to know what 
you guys think about it. Since there's an incantation involved, is 
it really wandless magic? Or was Harry's wand close enough to his 
hand for him to interact with it and cast the spell successfully?


> Allen wrote:
> I agree that the electric shock to Uncle Vernon is probably not 
Harry
> doing wandless magic.  We will probably never have a cannonical 
proof
> of this, but there are some definate similarities to this scene and
> Harry's fight with Quirrell.
> (snipping quote)

Earendil:
I agree with you about the similarities. And what makes me quite 
sure it wasn't wandless magic is the absence of warning from the 
Ministry (there's quite some time between this scene and the 
Dementors attack, so Harry would have had plenty of time to recieve 
an owl from the Ministry, especially since up till now they have 
always been very quick to send their warnings)


Earendil.