Lupin visiting Sirius in Azkaban

[KathyK]

No: HPFGUIDX 111706

Hi All!

Why wouldn't Lupin visit Sirius in Azkaban?  My answer tends to fall 
in line with most of the other answers.  The first being to ask why 
Lupin would want to visit Sirius at all?  Sirius betrayed them all.  
What else was there to say?  In the Shrieking Shack, Lupin discovers 
that Sirius didn't tell him about the SK switch because Sirius 
suspected Lupin of being the Spy in thier midst.  What if Sirius' 
suspicion all those years ago had already created somewhat of a rift 
between them?  What if Lupin perceived this distancing as further 
evidence Sirius did in fact betray them?  

The other answer has to do with the Ministry.  Even if Lupin wanted 
to, even with Dumbledore's backing, there's no way he's getting into 
Azkaban to see Sirius.  Crouch tossed Black into Azkaban without a 
trial.  We do have Sirius telling the kids in GoF that he wasn't the 
only one Crouch did this to.  I'll bet it was standard practice to 
keep *everyone* away from prisoners they locked up without a 
hearing.  And even if this pure speculation were not the case, we 
still have the fact that Sirius was such a dangerous Death Eater.

Susana said in 111677:

>But, of course, that was what the ministry was afraid of! With all 
the DEs getting away with that excuse, they were NOT letting the 
most hated DE of all escape on 'reasonable doubt'! Solution: he's so 
guilty there's no need for a trial. Lock him up, throw away the key. 
Ministry saves face.<

KathyK:

That's interesting.  It's pretty much in line with what I was 
thinking.  My thought is that it wasn't so much about the Ministry 
saving face (although I'm sure that's part of it) but that Black 
betrayed those fighting against LV and then killed thirteen people 
with a single curse.  He was dangerous not only to those who fought 
against LV but to innocent people who happened to be in his way.  By 
the time Sirius escapes in PoA he is considered to have been LV's 
strongest supporter.  Whether this was something that grew from the 
stories or something that people believed immediately is difficult 
to say.  

It's my belief that Ministry officials were too afraid of Sirius to 
try and get any information out of him.  Why go near such a clearly 
disturbed, dangerous, and guilty man if they could help it?  

So what about Dumbledore?  If anyone could get the truth it would be 
him.  Did he visit Sirius?  He doesn't say he never saw him.  He 
only says he gave evidence Sirius was Secret-Keeper.  Is this a case 
of Dumbledore knowing the truth but keeping it under wraps for his 
own purposes?  I think Dumbledore usually knows more than the rest 
of us and the WW as to what's going on.  But right now I'm not 
inclined to believe he'd let an innocent man go to Azkaban without a 
fight.  (This doesn't mean I haven't thought he was a cold and 
calculating man and doesn't stop me from changing my mind again in 
the future!)

Even if Dumbledore got in to see Sirius in Azkaban, what good would 
have come of it?  According to Fudge and whatever account Stan 
Shunpike heard of the events, after Sirius blew up the street, he 
stood there laughing.  Laughing!  Stan says he went quietly with the 
Ministry after that.  (PoA Chs 3 & 10, US ed. pgs. 39, 208)

We also have Sirius multiple times in the Shrieking Shack:

**********
PoA Ch 17, US ed pgs 341-342:

"You killed my parents," said Harry, his voice shaking slightly, but 
his wand hand quite steady.
Black stared up at him out of those sunken eyes. 
"I don't deny it," he said very quietly.  "But if you knew the whole 
story."

PoA Ch 19, US ed p 365:

"Harry...I as good as killed them," he croaked.  "I persuaded Lily 
and James to change to Peter at the last moment, persuaded them to 
use him as Secret-Keeper instead of me...I'm to blame, I know it..."

and in that same paragraph:

"And when I saw their house, destroyed, and their bodies...I 
realized what Peter must've done...what I'd done..."
**********

Clearly Sirius blames himself for what happened.  And this feeling 
of being the guilty one was likely much stronger when the events of 
Godric's Hollow were so fresh in his mind.  After the man directly 
responsible, the 'weak, talentless thing,' outsmarted him and 
performed some outright scary magic, what else was there to say?  It 
was Sirius' fault he underestimated Peter's ability and 
overestimated Peter's loyalty to his friends.  I also think it's 
safe that at this point Sirius also became a bit unhinged.

Okay, what if Dumbledore did visit him?  Even questioned him?  What 
are the chances Sirius was responsive?  Yes, he could have explained 
his story and that Pettigrew was still on the loose...maybe after 
some time had passed.  But I picture Sirius at the moment to be so 
full of guilt and self-loathing that even if he had the chance to 
clear his name it's likely he wouldn't have taken it.  

And then there is this, from Pippin in 111620:

>As Elkins pointed out in one of her brilliant posts long ago, the
ex-Marauders were all keeping secrets from Dumbledore. It was
easy for the spy, or spies, to take advantage of their old habits of
secrecy and covering up for one another.

After his escape, why did Sirius go after Peter himself instead of
sending an Owl to Dumbledore telling him everything?
Apparently he never thought of it. The old habit of secrecy was
too much engrained. He never really outgrew his schoolboy
ethic--loyalty to your chums above all else. He couldn't speak
without giving Lupin away, too.<

KathyK:

*If* Dumbledore (or anyone else) had questioned Sirius at some 
point, Sirius might not have told him what happened, anyway, if he 
viewed it as his own responsibility to go after Peter or to rot in 
jail because he failed his friends.  Pettigrew betrayed the "loyalty 
to your chums above all else" thing and if Sirius still abides by 
that code even all those years later (going after Peter rather than 
telling Dumbledore what's going on) it's likely what he was thinking 
is that it's not anyone's business but his own that Peter did what 
he did.  

KathyK, who was reading some of Elkins' posts on Peter just yesterday