Here is another from mooseming

[moonmyyst13]

No: HPFGUIDX 120427


--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "mooseming" <jo.sturgess at b...> 
wrote:
> --- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "samnanya" <yswahl at s...> 
wrote:
> > Thank you for setting me straight on that count. The reason
> > that I was pissy and rude was that the original response to
> > the argument (which I should have quoted but did not) was
> > ------------------------------
> > Reread the following pages:
> > *OotP, Page 856 (US)
> > *PS, Page 299 (US)
> > 
> > Harry has cried tears before.
> > {name}
> > ------------------------------
> > 
> > If you read those references there was no mention at all of
> > Harry actually shedding tears.
> > Your reference in PoA (p 178 UK, 240 US) is much clearer,
> > harder, if not impossible, to refute, and would NEVER have 
> > elicited my rude response. I have no problem with logical
> > arguments and am the first to apologise when I am wrong.
> 
> > Snip
> 
> > I also found it interesting that, in the scene you referred
> > to,  Harry had passed out twice.
> > 
> >  After the first time (PoA 177)
> > "'Harry!'
> > Harry jerked back to life.... sitting up and
> > feeling cold sweat trickling down behind his glasses."
> > 
> > After the second time (PoA 178 as you quoted)
> > "'Harry!Harry... wake up...'
> > Lupin was tapping Harry hard on the face.....Harry
> > suddenly realized that there were tears on his face
> > mingling with the sweat."
> > 
> > I wonder why Lupin used that method to revive Harry as 
> > opposed to shaking his shoulders. Would you wake a sleeping
> > person by poking their face? Just a thought.....
> > 
> > 
> 
> Jo here
> 
> I really like Samnanya's theory and hadn't thought about this
> particular aspect before.
> 
> It is difficult because 'close' reading can become 'hair splitting'
> reading and provides an excellent opportunity to turn 'active' 
reading
> into fan fiction!
> 
> However, that won't stop me putting in my twopenny worth!
> 
> I haven't seen the film so I'm not qualified to comment on 
the 'Harry
> no actual tears' scene but ..... close up shots are used with 
extreme
> caution, specifically to highlight a response or emotional, inner
> state, in b/w movies they used glycerine to fake tears and I believe
> still do, I imagine now they could cgi a couple if required, I find 
it
> hard to believe they were simply too lazy to deal with this in POA 
the
> movie.
> 
> So I'm with Samnanya on this one.
> 
> Taking the text and various references to crying, I see no reason 
why
> Harry might be becoming less able to shed tears over time, given 
that
> this is a tale of growth and change and as he becomes more affected 
by
> his inner snake. Also why he might not shed tears when unconscious 
but
> not when conscious, which would explain the Lupin reference.
> 
> By the by I take Lupin tapping Harry's face (specifically not 
poking)
> to mean some sort of reviving charm.
> 
> What I'd like to know is if Samnanya's observation is correct what
> does it mean? In the next book Harry will be dealing with grief, if 
he
> can't shed a tear what difference does this make? Is it simply a
> physical expression of Harry's inner state or does it have plot
> implications as with the Phoenix tears?
> 
> Also is it really true that Snakes don't cry? Like turtles and owls
> (interesting!) they do not have eyelids but does that mean they have
> no tear ducts?
> 
> Snakes lick their eyes so do we have any tongue references!!!!?
> 
> BTW snakes can still kill you when they are dead, because of their
> muscle structure a dead snake still has many of the reflexes it had
> when it was alive.
> 
> Regards
> Jo



see how this one is signed, also?

we may have to go back through these posts and re-visit them.

moonmyyst