Safety at Hogwarts, Dumbledore, Voldemort and other musings..

[Hitomi]

No: HPFGUIDX 90427

lizvega2 wrote:
> Dumbledore states in OOp that Harry must return to the Dursley's 
> only once a year for the charm with Lilly's blood to work. So, 
what 
> happens when he goes to the burrow? Or to Grimmauld Place? Or to 
> Hogwarts? Is the protection applicable in those places as well? 
> 
> Ever since my first reading of PS I never questioned the safety at 
> Howgarts. Hagrid says, (Not one to take too seriously, I 
know : ) ) 
> that Gringott's is the safest place in the world, except maybe 
> Hogwarts. Now, we know there are all sorts of charms protecting 
> Hogwarts from muggles, but what about the rest of the wizarding 
> world?

Hitomi:
This was an interesting post, and it brought up points I've always 
wondered about myself.  We pretty much know Harry is vulnerable when 
he isn't in the Dursleys' house, or isn't at Hogwarts.  Which is why 
DD is having Harry constantly followed, even during Hogsmeade 
weekends.  And is also why he had a guard when he was leaving the 
Dursleys'.  Though I think after his fifth year, DD will have 
someone else follow Harry besides Dung.

 
> In PS- Voldemort's spirit or whatever he was, lived in the school 
> for nearly  a year. Why didn't anyone pick up on that? 

Hitomi:
I wouldn't be surprised if DD did know, he knew everything Harry and 
the trio were up to.  And Voldemort wasn't a huge threat, he was 
relying on Quirrell.  Plus, DD at least knew LV was active, hence 
all the protections around the Stone.  But I think DD knew LV was 
limited in what he could do, not having an actual body and only 
being a spirit.  So whether or not he knew it was Quirrell, as long 
as he watched over Harry and the Stone, he probably figured things 
would be fine.  And he was right, except for he almost fell for that 
fake notice from London, but DD being DD, he figured it out.

 
> In COS- The basilisk is set loose, and Dumbledore and Hagrid are 
> forced out-

Hitomi:
Except DD knew it was LV the whole time, he just couldn't figure out 
how.  Then he learns it was a memory of Tom Riddle, and it makes 
sense.  Plus, the chamber was built into Hogwarts.  Kind of hard to 
keep the basilisk out when it's supposed to be there, at least from 
Salazar Slytherin's point of view, especially since only the Heir 
can awaken it, and only a Parseltongue can actually get into the 
chamber.  And DD left Fawkes, and Fawkes can send messages, which he 
apparently did, because DD showed up that same night.

 
> In POA- Sirius got into the school, the gryffindor tower and the 
> dormitory. Not to mention that he lived on the grounds all year as 
a 
> dog- and the Dementors were stationed right outside!

Hitomi:
Again, Sirius knew things about the school most do not, and he was 
an unregistered animagus, which DD didn't know about.  I doubt DD 
watched the Marauders as closely as he has watched Harry.  The 
Dementors are blind, and they can miss things, otherwise Sirius 
wouldn't have been able to escape Azkaban.  I look at it this way, 
because DD didn't know about Scabbers, either.  DD keeps those 
around him whom he believes will be useful (friends/allies).  He 
brought Lupin there that year, not only as a DADA teacher, but also 
probably due to Sirius' breakout.  Lupin knew Sirius was an 
animagus, and though he didn't tell DD, because he felt guilty, I 
think if Sirius had ever seemed a serious threat, he would have told 
DD.  Lupin knew.  DD made a good judgement about Lupin.  And DD and 
Lupin knew there were things about what happened the night of the 
Potters' deaths that they didn't know, and Sirius only ever attacked 
during Harry's third year when Harry wasn't around.  Until the 
Shrieking Shack.  And that is when Lupin shows up.  Also, I have a 
sneaking suspicion DD knew a lot more about what was going on.  Like 
with the time-turner.  He knew Harry and Hermione were outside 
Hagrid's cabin, he had to have known.  And he purposely distracted 
Macnair.  My only thing is how on earth did he know.  There is a lot 
about DD as of yet unanswered.


 
> In GOF- Mad Eye was a fake, and Rita Skeeter had no trouble, in 
the 
> beginning, of getting on the grounds. She was banned a little way 
> into the TWT, according to Hagrid, but she buzzed in anyway, 
didn't 
> she?

Hitomi:
Again, we're dealing with an unregistered animagus, and Hermione did 
eventually figure it out.  And I doubt DD was seriously concerned 
about Rita, otherwise I think he would have gone to more extreme 
measures of keeping her out.  He basically just officially 
said, "You are not allowed here."  But he didn't really try to 
physically keep her out.  And with Moody, DD did realize it wasn't 
him in the end.  And in that, we're dealing with an active LV that 
no one knew about.  DD probably did panic when Harry and Cedric 
vanished, it wasn't foreseen.  But he figured out LV's entire plot 
on his own, he just wanted Barty Crouch Jr.'s confirmation.  DD 
always knows far more than we do.


> Now, up until Voldemort's resurrection, these incidents serve to 
> remind me that Hogwarts really isn't that safe. We know that 
PEOPLE 
> can't apparate inside the grounds, but Dobby and Fawkes have 
proven 
> that this rule doesn't apply to them. Crouch Sr. got onto the 
> grounds. Madam Maxime and Karkaroff introducted two new ways of 
> getting into Hogwarts. The triwizard cup was a portkey. It seems 
> that people, as long as they're not apparating, can pretty much 
come 
> and go as they please at Hogwarts. Not to mention the fact that 
six 
> underage wizards flew! invisible threstals right out of the 
> grounds......
> 
> Voldemort had to have known that Dumbledore was kicked out of 
school 
> in OOP. If Dumbledore was the reason why LV didn't take the school 
> the first time, AND If people can come and go to Hogwarts, AND 
> knowing now why LV was after Harry in the first place, why didn't 
LV 
> just send a couple of death eaters to Hogwarts to kidnap Harry, 
> after Dumbledore left? Delores would've given directions to the 
> portrait hole without batting an eye.....

Hitomi:
Well, I'm totally with you, in that Hogwarts probably isn't as safe 
as we'd like, but it has to be sort of open, is it a school.  And 
according to Hermione and "Hogwarts... A History," there are 
protections all around the place.  

But getting to your examples, Dobby is a house-elf, I don't think 
the same rules apply, which is why the WW's underestimation of the 
house-elves is dangerous.  Just look at the situation with 
Kreacher.  And Fawkes is... well, Fawkes.  We know the same rules 
don't apply.  Phoenixes are powerful magical creatures, and rarely 
domesticated.  A dragon could probably break into Hogwarts, but it 
isn't likely, considering they can't be controlled.

Crouch Sr. walked onto the grounds, he wasn't a threat, and I highly 
doubt he could have just marched into the school without someone 
noticing.  One of the protections around the grounds could be anyone 
with malicious intent isn't allowed in.  Just a thought.

Maxime and Karkaroff were expected and invited, and I doubt many 
people would willingly go through the lake.  There are some creepy 
things down there, and unless allowed, I doubt many could use that 
method of transportation.  Too dangerous.  I don't think that squid 
is just for show.

The portkey was activated by fake-Moody, who was welcomed and not 
suspected until too late.  Again, though, we're dealing with one of 
LV's schemes, and they usually have merit, unfortunately.

My theory for why LV didn't go after Harry once DD left?  It would 
have been stupid and highly dangerous.  LV was working to get the 
prophecy (to learn how to destroy Harry), his main goal wasn't 
actually Harry himself, and once he figured out he needed Harry to 
pick up the prophecy, why bother fetching him when you can get him 
to voluntarily come?  Which is what LV did.  Besides which, it would 
be a rather blatant sign that he was back if he sent a couple of 
Death Eaters to kidnap Harry.  He was trying to keep his 
resurrection a secret, and Harry isn't completly helpless.  The 
teachers are still there, and I know DD wouldn't have left without 
someway of continuing to look after Harry.  Such as Occlumency, 
which didn't work, but Snape was still there.  The portraits report 
to DD, the house-elves report to DD, and Fawkes can send warnings.  
Plus there's Harry's own abilities and the DA, which seemed to be at 
least mildly affective against the Death Eaters at the end of book 
5.  Plus, LV already tried that last year, and it didn't work.  The 
Order would now be watching for something like that to happen.


> In the MOM- hall of prophesy, Lucius says something along the 
lines 
> of 'the dark lord wondered why you had not come to listen to the 
> prophesy yet' - what he was saying is that Voldemort assumed that 
> Harry knew of the prophesy- if LV thought that Harry knew what the 
> prophesy said- why didn't he just send someone to hogwarts and 
force 
> it out of him?

Hitomi:
Again, same reasons as above.  And I also think LV wanted to hear 
the prophecy in its original entirety.  And he did succeed in 
getting Harry to voluntarily come.  Harry just ended up thwarting 
him again, even if it was an accident.  I think DD has some degree 
of faith in Harry's ability to stay alive.


> Which makes me wonder, what else is keeping LV out of Hogwarts? 
> Would it be easier to take him from the dursley's or Hogwarts?

Hitomi:
Personally, I'd say Hogwarts, if DD isn't around.  And now that 
everyone knows LV is back, LV can use open force without risking 
anything.  If I was DD, I'd probably lock Harry in his aunt and 
uncle's house, and then when the summer was over, follow him around 
everywhere.  And DD has ways of disappearing that we don't know of.  
Like after Umbridge caught the DA, in the Headmaster's office.  
 
> Also, in those 24 hours, or however long it was between James' and 
> Lilly's murder and the arrival of Harry at Privet Drive, what if 
> Dumbledore was putting the necessary 'blood' in all of the places 
it 
> would need to be, to keep Harry safe? Part of his 'plan'?

Hitomi:
I think the "necessary blood" has to be a living person, like 
Petunia and Dudley, but this an interesting theory.

 
> Living quarters/Blood protection for Harry for the next ten years: 
> Lilly's sister
> 
> Living quarters/Blood protection for the seven years at 
Hogwarts: ? 
> Maybe that's why Dumbledore can't leave the school... and we are 
> wondering where he goes in the summer...maybe nowhere.. maybe in 
> order for the charm to work DD has to stay at the school.
> 
> What I'm speculating is, of course, whether or not Harry has blood 
> relatives at Hogwarts/burrow/grimmauld place. 

Hitomi:
Definitely possible, though we know all the Potters are dead (what 
happened to Harry's grandparents anyway?), and the blood has to be 
on his mother's side.  And again, there is a lot about DD and his 
powers that we just don't know.


> Dumbledore says no. Dumbledore never lies. But, I've seen some 
> people post that 'Dumbledore omits certain things'. When Harry 
asked 
> DD in his first year why Voldemort wanted to kill him- Dumbledore 
> doesn't 'basically' tell him the truth- but omit the part about 
the 
> prophesy's existence- he flat out tells him that he can't tell 
him. 
> 
> Dumbledore flat out told Harry that he was delivering him to his 
> mother's last blood relatives. 
> 
> So, what does that do to my theory? Crushes it :) But, it's still 
> fun speculating!

Hitomi:
I agree, it is fun speculating :-)  I also agree with Carol's 
response in which she said DD doesn't necessarily know everything, 
because we know he doesn't.  But there is also a lot about DD and 
Hogwarts we still don't know.  So, I just trust that DD is doing 
everything in his ability to keep Harry safe, but I also think DD is 
putting more trust in Harry himself, one of the reasons he told 
Harry the prophecy - Harry had proved he was long since ready to 
hear it.  And besides, Hermione is usually always right, when she 
isn't emotional.  

In conclusion, I think Harry is safer than we have been led to 
believe.  But again... the war is just about to start.

Oy, that was long!

Ja ne! ~ Hitomi